Where Everybody Knows Your Name with Ted Danson and Woody Harrelson (sometimes) - Valerie Bertinelli

Episode Date: May 6, 2026

Actor and TV host Valerie Bertinelli talks to Ted Danson about working with Betty White on Hot in Cleveland, the time she got mistaken for a sex worker, how she met her late ex-husband Eddie Van Halen, why certainty is overrated, unlearning shame, and more.    Visit ValeriesPlace.com, where you can find Valerie’s cooking shows, recipes, a podcast, and other interactive experiences for fans.    Like watching your podcasts?  Visit http://youtube.com/teamcoco to see full episodes.  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

I was like, okay, I got to take care of this shame because it's not doing me any good. Welcome back to where everybody knows your name. Today I'm talking to Valerie Bertinelli. She's an actor and TV host that we've all loved watching over the years. From one day at a time to Hot in Cleveland to her shows on the Food Network. Valerie stars in the upcoming Lifetime movie Love Again airing May 9th. She has a book, too, called Getting Naked. the quiet work of becoming perfectly imperfect.

It's available for purchase now. She is wise and full of depth, and I had the best time talking to her. So let's get to her. Here's Valerie Bertinelli. As we said earlier, we've never met each other. How is that possible? Yeah.

Because you've been doing this how many decades? Well, did some movies and stuff before him, but Cheers started in 82. Yeah. God, one day of time was still on when Cheers came on. Yeah. That's, I don't remember that. Yeah.

That's crazy. Norman Lear? Norman. Your mentor. Yes. I was very lucky that I was able to be that young in a business that harsh, which also has its good moments, but I was protected by Norman and Bonnie and Pat and everybody there. Yeah. So that was really nice.

But that's crazy. I know. I know. It really is. So a lot. Wait, what year was that? Tell me. 75 that we premiered.

Yeah, so it's been 50 years. I love somebody sizably younger than me has a sizably longer career than I do. Sysibly, no. Yeah, yeah. No. How old are you? 78. Oh, okay.

Yeah, 65. I'll be 66. That's sizable. It's not sizable. It's 13 years. Yeah. It's a generation. Yeah, we wouldn't have gone to the same high school.

No. I kind of put that. Well, my first husband was five years older than me, and I never thought that was odd. So five isn't that much. But there will be many similarities in things, you know, shared experiences. Yes, we've worked with a lot of the same people, but have never met. Jimmy Burroughs, you mentioned, I love Jimmy Burroughs. Because I just adore him.

Had you worked with him? Had you worked with him? Multiple times, yes. On which? A couple different pilots. I don't think I ever got to go to series with him in anything, but very, a lot of pilots. Yeah. A lot.

What's a lot? But what I love about Jimmy is because I don't like Please don't kiss my ass That's all I ask Tell me what you want when you want it And where you want it Yeah

Just don't, you know I know what the words are I'm going to stick to the script Because the writers are brilliant And he is that way And if he doesn't like something He doesn't no try that again I know he just

I wish he would blow some smoke sometimes He could be People who don't know him go He's so grumpy He's not grumpy He's not grumpy. He's like a cream puff. Oh, he's the softest little open bleeding heart.

Yeah. When he directed... Don't tell you me I said that though. He doesn't listen to anything I do after cheers. He were, you know, he created me. So that's it. After that, slam the door. But he, I would perform, I realized in hindsight that I performed for Jimmy.

And if Jimmy wasn't there directing, I was almost at a lot of, on how to play Sam Malone. It was literally... Really? I felt like it was at least co-created by Jimmy, my performances. I mean, obviously the show was co-created. Right. But after a while, I mean, it was in your bones, no?

I mean, there was such a ease and a laissez-faire about Sam that was just so easy and fun to watch. After a few years, when I look at the early... I feel like I didn't get it until about the third year because I was playing somebody who was a relief pitcher, very cocky. Relief pitchers go in to save the day. I think Sam was cocky? He was supposed to be. Oh, because you made him so lovable. That was the great part about the writing.

If you were a cocky bar hopping frat brat brat, you loved Sam Malone. If you were very much in the women's movement, you also loved Sam Malone because he was so clearly. off base. So clearly wrong. Anyway, back to you. As one does when you have a podcast and you haven't met somebody or they're not in your life, you binged them. I binged you for the, yeah. I'm sorry. No, it was, I am so glad I did. Let me give a headline for what I, I'm almost in tears by you and your life. My headline for the, for this day in my head, is a phrase my mother used to say to me when people would ask her,

what does she hope for her children? My sister and I said, I hope that they become fully human, which is a big phrase, sounds kind of easy on surface, but fully human. And I feel like after just barely skimming the surface of your book, of your life,

that that is the journey you're on And that's our whole purpose, our life's purpose, is to learn to love, to be, to feel what it is, to be a human. That's how we're so lucky to be here to experience being a human to experience. And I'm just coming to this in these late years is the pain and the challenges and the the difficulties and the that's all a part of the human experience. And without that, the joy. is blunted or numbed. The numb is so, the joy is so much more powerful because of the challenges that we all get to go through. Yeah. One last thing before we start talking. I also want to give a shout out to Drew Barrymore because I watched the show where you, you know, you were, the book was coming out. And I think it was the first time you talked in a big way about the book.

And God bless her. She hums one of the sweetest notes in show business. You know, it is truly a caring, loving, up, joyful note. That's her. Yeah. She embodies all of that. Yeah. She is purely, though.

Thank you. So do you. And it was fun to watch the two of you who are clearly mates. I adore her. Yeah. Yeah. And it's so strange to be able to be on this, her show. because for the longest time, I was always a very big fan.

And I remember a long, long, long time ago, before even ever after came out, which is one of my favorite movies of hers, maybe even of all. I just was like, I would love to be her mother. And I'm only 15 years older than her, but that's a possibility. Possible?

It's always a possible possibility. I mean, my mom was 17 when she got pregnant. But I just had a feeling, about her that I just, and I was so happy to be right. Because I always, I want to believe the best in people all the time. That's what's kept me in some very stupid relationships, unfortunately. But I don't want to give that part of me up. And for the most part, I've been proven right that people do.

They deserve grace and they deserve because they really are, naturally good. The few times that I've been proven wrong has been incredibly painful, but great lessons. Yeah, and you don't, yes, and you do not want to give that up. Never. Because, no. That's why I keep a tattoo that is just like, keep my heart open at all times. I mean, I listen to my sister pray for political figures that drive me up. That's a hard one. I know. I mean, I'm praying for something, but it ain't, you know, I'm praying for a headline right now.

I know. I don't drink anymore, but I'll open a bottle of champagne. But it's so hard to be, you know. God bless her. I know. I know. She says. But there's something about maybe praying that they'll stop hurting so many people.

Yes. That's the prayer. Yes. Exactly. Okay. Meanwhile, the real work is what you've been doing in life. Really? I mean, we can't control.

everything around us, but you can control what it is. Your own behavior and your own actions, yeah. I don't know where you, do you want to start on the book? I mean, there's so many things to talk about with you. I have been around a very, very long time. Yeah, you're rubbing in my face now. Your career is longer and more. Barely.

I started when I was like 12, so. Yeah. Well, how old were you when you started? Oh, Lord, 23, 23, 24, 20, 20. So, you know, I got 11 years on you. 26. Something like that. More more.

It's going up. Yeah. There's so much to talk about it. It's your acting career. I want to talk about your books. You have food network. Yeah. My digital platform.

I have a digital platform now that I absolutely love. Valerie's place. Yes. That's so smart. Because as you know, it is not easy to sell a show in this day and age. And I like to be creative. I like to stay creative. I love to cook and I love to cook for people.

I love to share recipes and I write cookbooks, but doing it on camera and doing, you know, two minute videos, 20 minute videos, 30 minute videos. Like, I can do that now and share it with people. Okay, we're talking about Valerie's Place.com. Yes, and soon to be an app, soon to be an app. Now, can you put content in there, meaning you can't put episodes of one day at a time? I don't know. We're going to look into that because all of my Food Network shows,

all of the shows Valerie's Home Cooking that was on Food Network for, I don't know, 14 seasons, is on my website. So you can watch all of the old episodes. How wonderful. And was that a legal thing? Yeah, we had to rent them. Gotcha. But why wouldn't they want? It feeds people back to the Food Network. And he owes a lot of money because he bought Warner Brothers. So he didn't want to. Yikes. another conversation.

Not these taking a lot of money off of, I'm not bitter. The way this, you know, business is being manipulated and bought by a bunch of rich men and then they sell it off in pieces. I'm getting long letters of we need to sign on to things regarding that particular merger. Anyway. Sorry, I didn't come in here to rile your goat, if that's an expression. I am an old goat. You are a goat. I'm not a ghost.

Yes, you are. I mean, I've seen your shows. Yes, you are. Leon. DiCaprio, he's been very supportive of everything I've ever done in ocean advocacy. And he once said to me, you're the goat. And I thought, fuck, why would you see that? I am old.

And I kind of walked away depressed. And he was giving me this great compliment. You sound like Merrill Streep, because Merrill Streep was told that she's the goat. And she's like, why is everyone calling me a goat? It's like the greatest of all time here. Just the little chin hairs. Okay. All right.

You notice that I'm just like, I definitely like, squirrel. So I apologize for that. No, that's wonderful. Don't you love that phrase squirrel? Squirrel. Yes. That movie was so good. Oh, Ed.

Oh, Ed. I love that man. Did you work with him? I did. Tell me, I'm sorry, I should know. Ed Hasner. Yeah, but no. Oh, on Hot in Cleveland.

Hot in Cleveland. What a wonderful show that is. All right. Let's talk about Ed. Let's talk about Betty. Jane Leaves, Wendy Malick. I mean icons, all three of them. And it was, I've often said, oh, I hope I get to do another cheers moment or something so that I can really go, oh, this is special and celebrate it.

And you did the same thing. And that was kind of your, I knew. I look where I am and I'm going to soak it all. I knew. And this was a big, like, jump in maturity, I think, for me in knowing this doesn't happen a lot. Okay. It happened with one day to time, which was decades before this. I started hot in Cleveland in 2010.

And in fact, we shot the ad campaign on my 50th birthday, which is like the best. I love working when I'm on my birthday. But I knew you don't get to work with Betty White every day. I had known Jane for 20 years by that time, and she was a very good friend, and I never got a chance to work with her. Really good actor. Oh, she's so good. And Wendy, who is fucking brilliant at everything she does, and she can play anything. And she lives on a ranch and Topanga with her horses. I mean, she's just like, and she plays these prissy little, I just, I adore these women. So I knew every day when I woke up and went, I get to go to work. I knew to live in that. And I did. I lived in the moment. And I'm so grateful. I still miss it. Yeah.

Do you have Betty White stories? I love our... Betty, oh God, I wish I had... I'll go first. I'll go first. Maybe it'll spurs them. Okay. Animals.

Okay. Animals. She liked them better than humans. Yes. With probably some reason in there. But we, Mary was working with her in the proposal. I love your wife, by the way. Thank you.

God, she's so good. One of my favorite movies is elf, and she is because of her. She's so good in it. Anyway. Love you, Valerie. I love you. Anyone who loves my wife just goes, she's got her voice.

I love her voice. And she can't get arrested doing voice work. What the hell is that about? Anyway. Are people crazy? They're crazy. She's got the most gorgeous voice. Okay.

Let's soothe ourselves with Betty. Yes, let's soothe ourselves again with Betty. So we were in, I can't remember, the North Shore above Boston. But close enough to Boston, we could go to the aquarium. and Betty said, what are you guys doing this weekend? Because she was so active. And I think she and Mary got along great. So we went, well, we have to do something with Betty.

And she said, let's go to the aquarium. So, oh, I was hoping for naps in a lazy day. And off we go. And together, Mary and I draw some attention, not rock-story stuff, but we're recognized as actor. We blended into the background because of, Betty. People adored Betty. She

scampered up and downstairs. We went behind the scenes. We shook hands with every critter. She gets excited. Ah, yeah. Her energy is just She's the one who got the best animal story I have

is we went behind the scenes and there was an octopus. And they were telling the story, the people behind the scenes of the aquarium. They had some very valuable fish in the tank across the aisle. And they would start

disappearing one at a time. And they put cameras in because who the heck is coming in and stealing our valuable fish? And they watched the next night as this octopus waits for the lot. This is absolutely true. Waits for the lights to go off.

A tentacle pushes back its lid to its little aquarium, climbs down, climbs up the other side, pushes it back, takes out of fish, closes it again, goes back into his aquarium and eats the entire fish. Oh, my God. How about that?

Octopal. Oh, see, oh, my gosh. Yes, and sensitive. And there's a reason I can't watch that movie. And then now I think Sally Field has a movie coming out. Beautiful Creatures, Something Beautiful Creatures. I got to read the book. But I just, because then I'll never have Kalamari again.

I know. Can I do one more story? Yes. Jane Fonda. Mary became great friends. She scared the hell out of me, but I love her. Oh, well, she scares the hell out of everybody because there's no quarter. No, she's all. You either jump up and save the world or you're in, you know, and she's right.

And she's right. She's my hero, actually. But she, they're making a book club two in Rome. And the producers think everybody else, I'm Mary's plus one. And we sit down, speaking the chef comes up and it says, this is what we're having in this lovely Italian accent, and then includes octopus for the first course. Up, bolts.

Jane takes him around the corner and just gives them a dressing down and flusters them. I mean, she will go anywhere and do anything to make her point. I love those balls. I know. I want balls like that. Okay. Betty White. Betty.

Ed Asner. Was he a regular? No, no. We had the most amazing guest stars, Carl Reiner. I mean, Carl was her love interest for the first season or two. And he was just, and I was smart enough to get all of their autographs on the cover of the script. So in my hallway of my house, I have so many scripts from Hot in Cleveland, and they've all got people's autographs all over them. Wow. so happy I did that. Of course, now I can't tell who's who, because I should have put a plaque of who, because nobody, I mean, everything, except I can see Carl's. Carl's is very clear. Anyway, because of the scribbly handwriting, you can't tell who's, yeah. What does your autograph look like? Does it look like Ted Danson? It looks like Ted Dant. There's no A-N-S-R-N. I'm pretty good at mine. My legal signature

because my legal name's Edward Bridge Danson, the third. You don't want to just be cashed. So you couldn't. It looks like an art piece. It looks like I can't duplicate it, you know. Each time it's just rude. Don't do it. Anyway.

Did you ever practice your autograph when you were little? No. No? No. Oh, you were planning ahead, were you? I was a baby, so yeah. It's like, oh, this is fun. Okay.

And obviously our handwriting changes through the years. You finished, you finish one day at a time. Mm-hmm. Was that abrupt, by the way, did you get? No, we kind of had a warning because we finished after nine years. And I think Bonnie was tired. I think a lot of people were tired. It was a lot of shows, 200 and something shows.

How many seasons did? 208 out of 209 is what they say you did. Yes, I do. You did, yes. Because there was one episode, we were on high. We were on hiatus, and I was newly married at this time. Pretty newly married. I got married in 81, so this is 18.

Newly married to Edward Van Halen. Edward Van Halen. Who is the father of my son, Wolfgang Van Halen, who is the... Mammoth. Yes. Yes. Yes, my son. I'm so proud of my son.

So they were going to South America, and I wanted to go. And part of it was on one of our hiatuses, and then the other part, I should have been back for work, but I begged them. Can I please go? I can go to South America for two weeks. And I did. So they were great. So there was one episode that I was not in. Right.

But I think they focused on Glenn Scarpelli, who played my little sort of brother in the show. Right. And I'm glad I did. Although, while I was in, was it Sao Paulo or Rio? That's a lovely thing to be able to question. I don't remember. But it was the early 80s. I don't remember a lot about the 80s.

But I do remember this story. So Ed and Al, his brother. had gone downstairs. And we, Al's wife at the time had said, let's go down and join them. So we go down to join them

and then we're at the bar, whatever. And then the boys go back upstairs. And we said, okay, we'll join you later and we were having fun at the bar. Valerie, her name was his first wife. And I go to the elevator

to go up to the room. And they're like, no, no. Why? What's happening? Why can't we go up? No, no, no. And they were trying to tell us that prostitution,

aren't allowed on the upper floors. And I was like, no, no, I have a wedding room. And at that point, when I was traveling, I wouldn't wear my actual wedding run. I just got, like, fake from whatever movie I did. They would not let me up. I had to leave the elevator, get on the phone, because there were no cell phones in the early 80s, and call Ed in the room and say, can you come down and get me? Because they won't let me up.

They think Valerie and I are prosecutors. And they probably still did, just thought that Ed decided to come back and get this lovely prostitute, go back up to the room. Yes. So I've been mistaken for a prostitute before. Okay. To be polite, a sex worker. Yes, please. Yes.

Do the meet of you and Ed. You were very, very famous, right? Ish. I mean. How old were you when you guys met? I was 20. 20. Okay.

And how did you meet? I'm, okay, my brothers invited me to Shreveport, where my parents live, because my dad worked for General Motors, Shreveport, Louisiana. They were playing at the stadium, local stadium there. And they said, we, know these guys at the radio station, if you come and hand all of the band members, M&Ms, we can get backstage. And I was like, didn't understand a word you just said. Right. Nothing about it, but okay, because it was during the 1980 actor strike during the summer. This was in August of

1980. You were an actor by then. I was doing body heat and we got to rehearse for a full month because of the strike. But go on. Oh, okay. It's interesting what other things happen. So I go to Shreveport, which I go to a lot anyway, because my parents live there and my brother. And we go to the show. First, my brother says, look in the back of your Corvette. I left an eight-track cassette. And you'll see what the guy looks like, you know, what the band looks like. You'll listen to him because they're really good.

I had never heard of Van Halen. I was into Elton John and Linda Ronstad. So I look at it and I'm like, that's a really, that guitar player is really fucking cute. So I'm going. Did you like the music? I thought it was good. Yeah, I like rock and roll, you know. So I really thought, like, he had something magical happening.

Right. Like, I'd never heard anything like that before. And I love Led Zeppelin, but that sounded amazing to me. Anyway, so we go backstage and Ed was, and he is like the epitome of shy. He's like, he is a musician. He's an engineer. He's many things, but a rock star, he is not. He knows how to turn it on.

But, so I met all of the music. them and I loved all of them pretty much. Pretty much. Three of them were very nice to me. And then Ed, I was invited to sit on the side of the stage and Ed kept like winking at me and making eyes at me and he would go over and change his guitars. And we ended up going back to their hotel. Was that nice? Was that?

It was fabulous. I was like I was crushing on this guy, big time. Oh, yeah. Yeah, crushing big time. and I was 20. He was 25. You know, all the libido stuff was happening. All that stuff.

And we went back to the hotel. We talked. We hung out by the outdoor pool. It was a motel, you know, motel six, basically, in Shreveport. And then they had to get on the bus, and they had to go to their next city. And he said he could call me. Yeah. They always leave like midnight, one, two o'clock in the morning.

I don't know why. And I still don't know why, because my son's bus leaves at those times, too. And I still don't know why. I guess maybe I could ask them. But anyway. And then he said he would call me. And I gave him my parents' number in Shreveport because that's where I was going to be. And he didn't call for three days.

And I was getting really, really anxious. And then he finally called and said, I'm in Oklahoma or Baton Rouge. I don't remember. My brother does because he went with me. And then I went out. And then by that time, I was just like, Gaga. And I said, why don't you move in with me? He moved in with me.

I lived off Coldwater Canyon at this point. Here, L.A. Gotcha. And he lived with his parents. because in Pasadena. In Pasadena. Because he was on the road 10 months out of the year. Yeah.

And so then he moved in with me and eight months later we were married. A lot of bus tours were you? A lot of bus tours. Were you on the bus? On lots of times. Yeah. Yeah. But this was a band that each band member had their own bus.

With Wolfie's bus, it's like there's no room for me on the bus because the entire band and the crew is on one bus. Yeah. You know. So it's a very different way of living. That'll change. Yeah, I think so. I think so. So then 10 years later, we had Wolfie, and in between all of that, we had amazing good times and really tragic, scary, hard times.

Because we were both drinking, using drugs in the 80s, and then I stopped, and he didn't. And neither one of us was taking care of our childhood trauma. So we went to therapy. We loved each other dearly, but it just at a certain point, I, at a certain point, I, at, After Wolfie got to a certain age, I thought, I can't do this anymore. Like how old? Wolfie was 10 or 11 when we separated. And it was hard. To this day, Wolfie, the way Wolfie talks about it really, like, breaks my heart.

Yeah. You know. And then Ed tried for 20 years to be cancer, and he did a great job. Yeah, he knew for 20 years. And it spread. He kept spreading to different places. Oh, you said he was also smoking, which was hard for you to watch. Oh, I was so angry with him.

At one point, we were still together, and he had surgery to cut off part of his tongue. And the doctor said, you know this is because you smoke, right? And it's like, no, that's not because the doctor's like, and I was like, you better stop smoking. Just stop smoking. I didn't even care about the alcohol anymore. Just stop smoking. It was hard.

It was hard for him. He used a lot of different tools that were soothing, but harmful for his body. A lot of us use different tools in our toolbox for trauma that numb, ignore any kind of feelings we don't want to feel. And it's your brain taking care of you, refusing. And what we don't realize is that our brain can be talked out of shit. We can talk our brains out of stuff if we listen to our emotions

because our emotions and our brains are different. And when we get curious about our emotions like while they're coming up, we can talk it through with our brain. and we can get to another side of it. You still have to go through the uncomfortable feelings. But when you do get through them, you've talked yourself into feeling better because you've actually done the work to feel your feelings.

Don't go too far. Back up for a second. How were you taking care of your creativeness when you guys separated? I knew I had to make money because I didn't want to take money from Ed. We put aside an account for Wool. that both of us with the same amount of money in.

I didn't take any alimony. I didn't take any child support. So I knew I had to work. My wife, Mary, didn't either. There's something very powerful about that. Because I'm an incredibly independent person. And I like to be, to a fault sometimes. But that's okay.

I'd rather err on the side of independence. So you were doing what? What was I was doing touch by an angel at that time? I got a two-year contract for Touched by an Angel. And it was great because we had spent a lot of time in Park City anyway. We had a home up there. And in Old Town, it was just a cute little minor shack that had a bedroom and a half, basically. And if we had gotten picked up for one more year, I would have pulled Wolfie out of his school in California and brought him up there, but we weren't.

and then 9-11 happened, and it was hard to go back and forth through the Burbank Airport. Like, I used to, it was such an easy commute. I would, like, be on an airplane three, four, five times a week just to get home to put Wolfie to bed and then go in the morning and get to the set. Oh, wow. How long a flight? Oh, it's nothing from Burbank to Salt Lake. It's like an hour and 15. You could really do that.

Back then you could. You can't do it anymore. Because you have to give extra time, and that's not even talk about what's not. going on with TSA these days, you know, and the half-partial garment shut down because nobody knows how to govern. But we didn't really go there. We just kind of every once in a while, weren't there? I'm so tired of people not governing.

Jesus, what do we vote for anyway? I know. And no. Okay, you did that for two years. Yes. Are you now writing books yet? I'm writing. No, I didn't start writing a book until I got.

Food Network. No. No? I wrote a book in 2007 after I became a spokesperson for a diet company, which I have a lot of regret about. Because I bought into the whole shaming our bodies and being thin for thin sake and not working on the mental and emotional health on why we overeat and why we use food to numb feelings. So I finally worked on that, you know, the last, I don't know, five years, which has been really helpful. But I'm still like, there's a part of me that is like, I wish I really hadn't done that. Really wish I hadn't.

I wish I hadn't been one of those people. But it also taught me a lot. Wait, how long after you were that spokesperson, did you have that realization? I would say I didn't really have the realization until some of the weight started. to crawl back and I started feeling a lot of shame and embarrassment. I was like, okay, I got to take care of this shame because it's not doing me any good. And I'm walking around full of shame for not what, you know, there's no reason. I need to be proud of every decision I've made. I can regret some and I do. But that's what I knew when I made those decisions. And I would make different

decisions now. So stop being ashamed of that. Did a book come out of that? The book, actually getting naked came out of that. But losing it came out of being a spokesperson and losing weight and feeling so good about myself. Right. Learning to love the way I am today in 2022. Enough already. That book.

That was helpful in getting through my grief of Ed passing. Gotcha. And my mom and my dad passing. That was really for me. I think more a book about grief and learning to live with it. It's more than that, but I think that's the process. I mean, I wrote that book in a basement. I didn't want to see light. I was so sad all the time. I was getting a divorce and it was really hard. This one was. And I'm proud of that book, though, because... You said you wanted to, I'm going to write a book about joy and then

Right, and bumped into grief. Yeah. Yeah. Fascinating. Yeah. To genuinely. Yeah. Isn't that funny?

Yeah. On your way searching for joy, you have to walk through all that grief. I, you know, I won't get into all my stuff, but I had a major stuff, which I started addressing before I met Mary or we wouldn't have even walked down the same hallway. She wouldn't have even seen me, you know. But thank God for you and for her. Oh, yes. You do you feel lighter? Yes, and it's a process that, you know, their little life's humblings are wonderful for you to finally get to that, you know, place.

But what I was going to say is my silhouette, and I don't mean literal, physical, but basically how I probably appeared to people before. I grew up emotionally and stopped being a liar and stopped me. Before I really did the work on myself, it was very similar. But I had, I could not have had a conversation with you. I, for more than two minutes, I would, I, sorry, I have to go get a cigarette. You know what, I have to go pee. Sorry, be right. I could not sit still.

What do you think that avoidance is about? It was exhausting to pretend to be me. Oh, oh. Even though the me is pretty similar, I was pretending, you know, faking. Yeah. Until I finally started allowing myself to be as to really go, oh, yeah, I am a dick. Doesn't mean I have to always be a dick, but yeah, oh, I can be mean. I can be dickish.

I can be all these things and addressing them. But then with Mary, always, I'm, you know, the only time we. We have a, if she's wrong, my life, this is going to sound probably patronizing. Do you get excited when she's wrong? A version of that. I am just like, oh, I love you even more. Look, you're wrong. And this is very relaxing for me.

Thank you that you're wrong. If I'm wrong, we have a fight because I know, I'm no, I will not be that person that you are now betraying me. as. No, I'm not that. I can't bear that you, that I'm, oh, that's how you. Oh, fuck. I am, I am, I am that. And once I finally go, yeah, wow. Do you get there faster now? Yes, trust, you know, and no one has ever loved me as wholly. No one has ever witnessed me completely than Mary. So, it's very hard to sit there and go, well, fuck her. You know, I'm like, wait a minute, you're telling me you don't think she loves you to bids him? Yeah. That's the key, isn't it? Yeah. That's how I feel with my family. I mean, I hope I have that with a man one day. I don't know. I've got a, I'm a little,

I'm a lot gun shy after what I've, you know, had to walk through. But I definitely feel that with my son. I feel it with my brothers. I feel it with my girlfriends. I feel so wholly loved for me for who I am, because they see me, all every part of me. They see my jealousy. They see my pettiness. They see my anger. They see all of, and they still love me. Because they also see my kindness and they see my heart.

And they see, you know, they see all of the things that I love and how I like to give love. Yeah. That's, oh, it's such an amazing feeling to feel that. Freeing. Yeah. It's exhausting to be perfect. Oh, there's no such thing. Which I love, I'm sorry.

What is the gutting naked? The quiet work, the quiet work of becoming perfectly imperfect, which to me is my mom's way of also saying fully human. Yeah. And it is a quiet work. It is. The louder it is, the less authentic it is. There are the right people to share this with and the wrong. And I have done both. Same. One is more about tooting my horn of, look at me, I'm getting enlightened. Right. I'll never be enlightened.

I'm always searching. And I think that's the key. It's the people that say they've got it all that, you know, I'm a truth teller or, you know, there's no one more authentic than me. Or I'm like, really? Because I fib sometimes. I lie sometimes. I exaggerate. My wife doesn't lie. Oh, I do that. She exaggerates. Yeah. I can exaggerate. Oh, shit. Yeah. Yeah. That's a better story. Yeah. And I don't know how authentic. What is authentic? I'm the most me I've ever been. But could I be more me? I don't know. I hope so. Because what are you going to do for the rest of your life? This is all I got. Just coast? No. No. No. But I'm always wary of somebody who's, you know, always says, I'm this. I'm this. I'm. that, like, are you?

How do you know? Yeah. How do you know you're a truth teller? You never lie? I hate certainty. Yeah. But there is no certainty. No.

That's the whole thing about being human. I hate the rigidity of my way or the highway. Yeah. I'm going to heaven. You're not. I used to get so mad. I knew somebody in my life. And they said, if you don't declare Jesus as you're born, you know, your savior,

your savior, you will not go to heaven. I mean, how? Yeah, I can continue to do good things, good acts, continue to be a good person with, you know, some sinning here and there. And always ask for forgiveness, always have gratitude. But if I don't just make that declaration, I'm not going to heaven. Well, I don't know. Do I want to...

Jesus was an amazing man from what I understand, from the history I've read about him. He was a phenomenal human being that did beautiful things from the life we know. I mean, I know when he was born and I know when he died. I'm not sure what happened for those 33 years. But he was a great man. Like Buddha was a great man. Like, you know, Paralhansa Yogananda was a good man. But I have to, why do I have to declare him?

There's millions of, like, I don't know how many religions around, they're exaggerating, millions of religions, but maybe there are. So what nobody, so only Christians get to go to heaven? I don't understand that. It doesn't feel very Christian to see that. It doesn't. No. And I'm not, I was born a Catholic.

Kind of Christian. Now I'm just, am I spiritual? Yes. Do I thank the universe all the time? And God, yes. Yes. But I get really stubborn and obstinate. Like, well, no, I'm not going to say it then.

He's not my Lord and Savior because I'm, then I won't go to heaven. Fine. Fuck you. It's a pathless as so many wise people. And is there heaven? I don't know. Is there? I think there's what we're on, this earth plane.

And then there's our energy. and then there's someplace else that none of us remember. But we get to come here and we get to be this. And you'll find out. I will find out at some point, probably within the next 20 years. Your book, Getting Naked, addresses the early trauma you had in your life when you were 11. And how that informed the sexual abuse informed the rest of your life for such a long time. And the work-

Especially the denial and the shame about it. Yeah. Yeah. Which is not ours to carry. And yet we do. Yep. And then the shame morphs into being layered upon shame on shame on shame by doing the things normal people do to test their boundaries to find their autonomy. Like the 80s, me doing drugs and getting married and, you know, going to crazy parties or just.

sitting alone playing Uno doing Coke. It's like, what a weird life. Right. But still things that I was embarrassed about and shameful about. And I didn't want anyone to know until I was like, you know, you're only as sick as your secrets. So when you start to pile on shame, on shame, on the original shame that was never yours, it becomes so convoluted and confusing that you just think you are a bad person. Yep. And it took me a long time to realize, oh, I'm not a bad person. I just some had some bad things happened to me that I dealt with the best I could and the best of my ability as a young child and then as a teenager and then as a, you know, young adult. And now I was an old person or geriatric, I don't know, geriatric, whatever.

I don't know that. I don't know that. I feel like I'm a geriatric taking care of Jerry. I guess at my house because I have five old kids. Wait your turn. Don't go butt into my arena here. Come on. I should take it first. But then I think, and then it comes to, dealing with that shame so that we don't, the tools in my toolbox to deal with shame were eating to numb my feelings or drinking or doing any, sometimes shopping just to not have to feel. And now what I do is, and when I feel a feeling come up. Which don't go away completely. Imprints don't go away.

No. No, you're right. You're absolutely right. It's still there. But when I feel now, I just get curious. It's like, oh, why am I feeling? that. That in itself is being attention, paying attention to the feeling and being curious about it, is not numbing it. The hard part then is doing the next few steps, which is being in a place where

you can actually feel the uncomfortable feeling and hopefully give it a name. And I have noticed this with anxiety that I am able to pinpoint it, where is it in my body? And that when I can pinpoint it all of a sudden just by recognizing it, it starts to dissipate. Just recognizing a feeling that wants to be heard is if you want to give it a visualization, visualize your little person, your little, you know, my young self, just wanting to be heard, just wanting to be, you know, just pay attention to me. I'm in pain. Then that pain starts to dissipate. It's as challenging and as easy as that. Did you have mentors, guides?

Could you have done this all in your own? No. I have some really good therapist. I must say EMDR really put me over the top of it. And tell me, remind me what EM? It's eye movement desensitization reprocessing. Yes. So what happens is, and there's multiple ways that you can do it. And this is for deep trauma that you've sat on for a long time.

It pulls it out in a healthy, non-scary way. You can do either the light that goes back and forth and your eye movement, or I like to use the paddles that had electrical stimulation, and I would put at the motion that I liked it and the strength that I liked it. And then as you're feeling that in your palms or looking at it, you have a skilled therapist walk you through, talk you through some tragic, traumatic, traumatic moments in your life. And I did that. that with mine. And what it does is it pulls the emotion and lets your emotions take a sidecar. Like, just take the shotgun seat and watch me go through this for a little bit and talk my way

through it. So even though I was sobbing and crying, I didn't feel depleted by that. I was more focused on watching what was happening in my life when I felt powerless. And when I was done, 45 minutes an hour later, I opened my eyes and just gushing tears. But I felt freer as opposed to the first time that I ever told someone that I was sexually abused, where I thought, okay, I've said it out loud now, so I'll get better, right? No, that you need to process it. EMDR helped me process it in a way that let my emotions, not take over and just let my analytical mind walk through it.

So I could see that I'm safe, that I'm okay now. And I'm a pretty fucking fantastic human being for having lived through it. And I'm so much stronger than I ever gave myself credit for, not because of the abuse, but because it was already in me that strength that I was able to then process it and get the help that I needed. Mm-hmm. I think they use it with PTSD as well, troops.

Yes. I think it would be incredibly helpful for so many people that come through traumatic experiences. And DBT is another helpful thing, dialectic behavioral therapy started by Marsha Lanahan, who is a brilliant woman who was severely abused, but you can hold two separate. different, dialectically different feelings at the same time. It doesn't make you a bad person, doesn't make you a good person. It just is. And to learn that, that it just is, has made me definitely see that the bad parts of me are just,

it's just another piece of the pie that makes me, me. Because I also have the good shit. Like with everything, with being stubborn means I'm also, I can also hang in there and have strength with being. I can also be jealous of somebody and also appreciate what they're doing and be so impressed by them. I can, you know, I can be petty and want to hurt somebody, but also know that that's not going to make me feel better. Very freeing.

It's so freeing. The last thing that kind of hit me that was very liberating was I had a bit of a health scare. I'm totally fine. But it was like, oh, well, that's real. and it was humbling and, oh, mortality is the real deal. You know, it's not just a rumor. Ted Danson doesn't get a free pass. Love is work, but, you know.

Yeah. And it was like, and I hadn't fucked up in some way. So I couldn't go, oh, Ted. Damn it, if I had only. Yeah, I thought, is no if onlys. Oh, wow. I am. And it was very humbling and calming, and I'm fine.

You know, but it was, I think, the best thing that could have happened to me. And I'm doing some things differently. You know, I am meditating now twice a day with Mary. And it's like, wow, I've always talked about it and lied about it. It's nice. But what it's done from me is the biggest gift of all, be curious about other people. You can be, you can listen and you can be supportive, caring, you can witness them. And I do believe that that's the rest of my life is to be curious and listen.

That's all the best thing I can offer. Curiosity is so magical. Yeah. But you can do that now. Yeah. Without feeling embarrassed? Or like a hypocrite. Yeah. Because you did. You have, and it doesn't mean you have done all the work. It just means, but you have. You have experienced allowing so much more work to do. So much pain to get to the joy and all of that. Yeah. And sometimes it's the first word that comes by,

is freeing to let yourself feel the pain. Your son must be so proud of you. I love him. He is such an amazing human being. I wish that I could take credit for. it. He is beyond, in spite of what Ed and I put that man through, he is such a good human being. He is, I'm so lucky, so lucky. So is he. He's got a good mom and he had a great dad, you know, who had, like, and his dad and his mom had immense flaws, but the one thing we'll be always new is how much we love him. Like unconditionally. That boy can do no wrong in my eyes. That is such a gift, man.

So many people haven't been unconditionally loved. They got born into tough. Yep. Yep. And my parents did the best they could, but they didn't know anything. Mine were confusing. Were they? Yeah.

They loved, but not about love. Yeah. Man, they loved me. Yeah. I felt the love as much as I could from two people grieving from a death. You know, my mom was pregnant with me when my brother died. At age? He was 17 months old.

Oh, that. He drank poison out of a Coke bottle on a farm. Oh. Yeah, devastating. So I was born into a family grieving a horrific death. Some relationships don't think. That's just too much. I don't know how my parents survive.

Yeah. I don't know. But they did. They had three more kids. Wow. That's what you did in the 50s and 60s, I guess. Who do you, I mean, you've got such a moral center that you've fought for over the years inside of yourself.

Who is your kind of moral, do you have a moral compass person out there? No, there's just way too many people. I mean, I can think of Jesus and Paramahansa Yogananda and Buddha and all these people. I didn't know them. So I just read about them. They don't answer my call. They don't. They don't.

And I'm a little annoying trying to get information out of them. You know, I mean, Raphael, you know, Michael the angel, archangel. I don't know. I don't know how to talk to these people. I wish I did. I love people like James Van Praagh and, you know, that can talk. Yeah. The trouble of having conversations like this on both sides of the table is I always after, you know, talking about, you know, growth or whatever, I always walk out the door and step in the biggest pile of karmic poo. invariably. So what is it trying to teach us, right? That's the first thing I always like, oh God, what am I supposed to learn from this shit? Yeah.

What am I supposed to? Did you not teach me this lesson? Did I not get it right? Don't do this to me, please. And that's like, okay, I guess I need it. What would you call like a carmic piece of shit that you get to step into and learn something from? It's me talking about enlightenment and, you know. And the next minute.

screaming at somebody while you're in the car. Hey, you're motherfucker, kind of lawyer. You know, there's something, oh, wait a minute. Maybe I'm not so enlightened. But, you know, we're all trying. We're all doing our best. Yeah. I can't tell you how happy I am to have spent time talking to you.

Really, you are amazing. Thank you. So are you. I'm just making sure you step in some karmic poo. You have no idea what I've fucking been through the last few years. You do not want me to step in any more karmic poo. Can I just have a break for a little bit? Yes, you can.

Okay, just a little bit. And now I'll be ready to learn something again. Just, I need to pause. I mean, I just, yeah. And if you're listening to this, go back and tune in to Drew, the show you did with her. I love her. It really was magnificent. Thank you.

And we get to do it for two more years. I'm so excited. So what does that mean? You go on and do. I travel back and forth to New York, which has been a dream of mine since I was little since. It's bi-coastal. Yes. since Bonnie first brought me to New York when she, when I was 15 or 16, but I want to work in this city.

And I've finally, 50 years later doing it. And what is that, what will that look like? I'll get on an airplane. My miles are racking up. And I will go to a specific hotel and stay there for four days. And then I'll walk to work every morning and walk back. To Drew. To Drew.

And you will be part of every episode? I think I do about 60 or 70. episodes a year. And your baby wick will be what? Just doing the Drew's News and talking about good news in the world and maybe doing some side cooking on the show and doing, you know, going to different places with Ross, doing some cooking at like the food and wine festivals, things like that, doing remotes. It's a blast. Fantastic. I just love it. And then I get to do my own cooking show on Valerie's Place. I get to have a book group and I get to do my own podcast. Can I make of the podcast? Can I buy stocking you? Wow. That's great. It's a lot of fun.

I like staying, I like to rest really hard as well, but I like when I can be active. Yeah. Productive. Yeah. I like being productive. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Valerie, for spending that time with me. It was truly a gift. Her new Lifetime movie is Love Again, and her book is called Getting Naked. You can check out Valerie's work online at Valerie's Place. There's cooking shows, recipes, a podcast, and other interactive experiences for fans. It is available on the app store, Google Play, and Valoriesplace.com. That's it for this week.

Special thanks to Team Coco. If you've enjoyed this episode, please send it to a loved one. Rate and review on Apple Podcasts if you're in a good mood. Once again, you can watch our full-length video episodes on YouTube.com slash Team Coco. See you next time, where everybody knows your name. You've been listening to Where Everybody Knows Your Name with Ted Danson and Woody Harrelson sometimes. The show is produced by me, Nick Leow, our executive producers are Adam Sacks, Jeff Ross, and myself.

Sarah Federovich is our super. supervising producer, engineering remixing by Joanna Samuel with support from Eduardo Perez. Research by Alyssa Graal. Talent booking by Paula Davis and Gina Batista. Our theme music is by Woody Harrelson, Anthony Gen, Mary Steenbergin, and John Osborne.