Who Trolled Amber? - Introducing...We call her Emma

Episode Date: July 1, 2026

Emma is a high achieving, middle class girl from West London. She seems destined for a successful career in banking and a comfortable British life. Until she makes a decision that will come to define her. In 2001 Emma marries Bashar al-Assad - the now infamous dictator of Syria.In the early days, people inside and out of Syria dared to hope. Alongside his beautiful, progressive wife, Bashar promised to modernise the country.But when the Arab Spring reached Syria in 2011, Bashar's regime showed itself for what it really was: a brutal force, willing to capture and kill ordinary Syrians demanding change. And in all the years that a war raged on, Asma stands by her husband. She seemingly ignored the desperate pleas to stop her husband from killing his own people. But what did she really know about the atrocities her husband’s government was carrying out? And what choices did she really have? Some people allege that she actually assisted the regime and cashed in on the war, that she herself is a war criminal. Others say she tried to run away but was trapped, held hostage by a regime who threatened her life and her children. So, who is the real Emma?We call her Emma is a 6 part original series from Tortoise Investigates and The Observer.To binge listen to all episodes today, ad-free, subscribe to The Observer and use the code AUDIO50 to get 50% off your annual subscription.You'll get access to:This series and all our podcasts before anyone elseAd-free listeningPremium newslettersPuzzles from the inventors of the cryptic crosswordExclusive offers from our partners including Mubi and iescapeTickets to join Observer events in our newsroom or onlineOr subscribe to Observer+ on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to listen to all our podcasts, including this one, without any ads.Reporter - Chloe HadjimatheouProducer - Gary MarshallSound design - Karla PatellaPodcast artwork - Lola Williams & Eliza BournerExecutive producers - Jasper Corbett and Basia Cummings Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

I received a British education. What I did have, though, was a Syrian environment within our family. So I was very aware of Syrian values and cultures and traditions. This is Emma, or at least that's how this softly spoken British woman was once known to friends and family. She was a middle-class Londoner with a bright future ahead of her. I remember, like, just laughing really hard with her. She's totally charming and she knows how to light up a room.

In the late 90s, Emma played tennis at the weekends and she was a high-flying banker. But all of that changed when she married the president of Syria and moved to Damascus. There she became known as Asma al-Assad. Her looks, learning and style have made her an icon in Syria. She's been compared to Princess Diana and Jackie Kennedy. Asma Assad is different, the darling of Damascus. She's like a supermodel and he's like a nerd. She and her husband were the face of a new Syria filled with hope.

He is so easy to talk to. You can talk to him about anything and everything. And that's great. It was a long fall from grace to where she is now. Hiding with her husband from the alleged crimes against humanity committed during a brutal 13-year conflict. It is estimated more than 100,000 people disappear. torture and forced disappearances were a family business.

I wondered how this English woman I had met who so believed in the youth of Syria could stand by and not do anything. I really wondered about it. For months now, I've been investigating this mysterious woman and I've been trying to understand how she went from a comfortable life in London to being accused of war crimes on the other side of the world. Because not only did she stand by her, husband throughout the war. Because my conviction didn't tell me otherwise. She's been accused of getting

her own hands dirty in the process. No, she knew exactly what she was doing. She wanted to be the first lady. But what did she really know about the atrocities her husband's regime was carrying out? And what choices did she really make? I got the sense that if she tried to leave, she'd be knocked off or something. I don't think she had a choice. Some of the people I've spoken to think she should face trial, that she profited from the war and that she was intimately involved in the regime.

She sold her soul to the devil in exchange of the month. Others are convinced she's been misunderstood. It seems to me completely at odds with the person that I dealt with in Syria. So who is the real Emma? On new series, call her Emma is coming out on Tuesday, July 7th. To get early and add free access to episodes when the series launches, you can subscribe today wherever you're listening. You can also subscribe

directly on our website at observer.com.uk slash subscribe and use the code audio 50 for 50% off.