WHOA That's Good Podcast - Answering Your DMs w/ Tauren Wells: Superficial Love, Trust, and Being Known

Episode Date: January 27, 2021

Sadie welcomes Grammy-nominated artist Tauren Wells and reveals how he provided a distraction during an awkward but beautiful moment at her wedding. Tauren answers your DMs and offers advice on launching a music career, being well known vs. being known well, how he pursues God through hills and valleys, why good things take time, and the best encapsulation of the Gospel he's ever seen. He also shares the story of how his wife and Tim Tebow inspired him to write "All God's Children," a song about human trafficking. And Christian and Sadie respond to a questionable recommendation about stress in Good and Bad Advice. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I love doing this and it's so crazy how long it took us to finally do this I know I was really excited COVID you had COVID I had COVID I don't know how COVID Lord Jesus I don't know crazy well congrats again to you and your wife Tell her I said hi and excited for y'all for the fourth little boy

Yeah thank you we're gonna send y'all these kids so you can just go through boot camp and you'll be ready for anything Perfect send them over. We isn't help Well, it's your welcome to the podcast so excited No, not as excited as I am I'm so pumped to be on here with you Oh, we are so excited to have you and everyone was also excited because this is the answering DMs one so people were super stoked when they saw that you were gonna be on and all the things So people might not all know this but you actually saying and our wedding

Yeah, huge deal and I don't think so we haven't like got to talk since really that moment because you know the wedding so crazy You go everything is wild but funny story so thank God you were up there singing and you were crushing it during our little moment Cuz so at our wedding Christian and I decided to take communion which was like get it be such a beautiful like Momel and stuff like we're so excited So you come up you start singing we, we go out and take a union. Christian and I both start choking on the bread. And it feels like straight up, like it was like so dry, like put it in our mouth.

So dry. And like we look at each other and I was so glad you were singing, and people were probably distracted by that. And I was like. So funny. That's so funny. I'm always wondering like,

can we not make it a little better? I understand the symbolism that it's supposed to be a bitter, sorrowful thing, but if we could just get a little, just a salting cracker. It would go a long way. I 100% agree. We showed up because we were sitting there joking everybody. It was so funny like Chris I still talk about that because people be like

Tell us the most beautiful moment and it was it was great But secretly we're like coughing in the corner So funny and also y'all are expecting that's so awesome Yes, we're expecting our fourth human It's unbelievable. Yeah, so we have three little boys, seven, four, and three, and our next one is also a boy. Wow. And he's he's doing April. How fun. That's awesome. So we're going to do first week of May. So we're right behind you guys. Yeah. We're expecting our first, not our fourth and a little girl, but we're so. That's awesome. So excited for you guys. We're expecting our first, not our fourth and a little girl, but we're so

excited. That's awesome. So excited for you guys. Thank you. Thank you, you too. Well, let's get into it. What is the best piece of advice that you've ever been given? The very best. This is a difficult question, but I love that you ask it. I had to really go through my mental file, but I went back to the years before my band was signed, and we played at a church in Baytown, Texas, where Leland and Jack Maureen's parents passed her. And we went over to their house, and you know, it was our 15 passenger van and all that and they were just so kind to us but

Leeland's mom is this Texas lady like the quintessential Texas woman and she said, Torrin let me tell you something, you got to keep your head small, your heart big, and your eyes open. Wow. And that always stuck with me throughout my whole journey. Humility, compassion, and vision. Wow. And yeah, good good stuff from Mama Cindy. That's so good.

Head small, heart big, eyes open. I love that it's like What is it clear as full heart can't lose that? I love that such good advice So I recently saw you a passion which was so awesome passion was incredible. It was awesome Thank you to you two you guys it amazing. Thank you. The whole night was insane. It was so good. And I love y'all coming at the end singing your new song, All God's Children. Tim kind of talked about how a little bit of the process of why, but can you kind of tell us that story of why I wrote the song and

where that idea came from? Yeah. Well, my wife was talking about human trafficking a lot over the last few months and she hadn't really before so I was paying attention and But I was also like yeah, I know this is an issue It's been around for a long time but I'm very busy doing other things and Then she sent me one particular video and I watched it and there was no way to move forward in the rest of my everyday life without trying to make some type of difference.

And it's one of those things where the problem is so big, you know, 40 million men, women, and children and sex slavery and the human trafficking system. And sometimes when something is so big, it's hard to get your head around. It's like, well, how do I get my hands around it? And I was praying and over the course of a couple weeks and I saw that Tim was posting a lot on social media about their human trafficking, their anti-human trafficking efforts. And I didn't know that he was as involved in that as he was.

So I was like, oh, that's cool, Tim's, you know, what a guy, not only is he hosting proms all over the world for kids with special needs, but now he's doing this. And I was like, I need to do something like that. I need to start a movement. I need to start an organization. So I was praying about that.

And then I woke up one morning and it had to just be the Lord speaking to me to let me see past my ego That you don't have to start your own fight. You can join Tim's So I was like, okay, I think so many times our first pivot is like I have to start my own thing Yeah, when so much more Happens in collaboration And so I hit Tim and I'm like, hey bro, my wife and I, we want to help God to put this on our heart.

What can we do? And he said, dude, write a song. And I was like, why didn't I think of that? You know, sometimes what we can offer were so it's what we see last. But that's kind of the genesis of it. That's so good. that's so cool. I love that, because you're right. Like you put this pressure on yourself

that you have to start something, you have to do something. And then a lot of times when you think you have to start it, you actually never end up doing anything, because it's so overwhelming. But there are so many people doing the things out there that you can just partner with or collaborate with or even give to.

So practically for everyone listening, how can we hope out? Because I love how you said, like I knew I need to do something and I saw it on Tim's Instagram. So maybe this is that moment for people who are listening. Like I know I need to do something. What can they do?

Absolutely. Well, the cool thing is with the song, it's available on every streaming platform that there is wherever you like to listen to music You can listen to the song all God's children and 100% of the proceeds from the streams and the merch of This song are going to fuel rescue missions through the Tim T. Bo foundation. So streams break chains And I'm really excited that people who feel overwhelmed by the magnitude of this, it's

as easy as getting in your car and turning on your phone or turning on YouTube, we can do something to make a difference together. So cool, everybody can do that. So go get the song, I'll go to the store, I'm sure you can get it anywhere where you can get songs Says so incredible. So I want to ask you I love it what you're talking about about just like joining something that someone else is doing But you're doing a lot yourself like you are an artist You also preach a lot which you're incredible at both you have a family you do so many things

I'm sure we don't know about I know you've done stuff in secular world and church world with music and just all kinds of different things. Was there ever a time in your life that you limited God to what you could do? And if so, how did you break pasta? Yeah, well, I think that is the constant tension, especially as you do more and more, there is a tendency to drift toward self-reliance and thinking that all this stuff came from me. What I'm trying to always remind myself that my efforts are not really the key. I do have to be engaged and participate, but it's really God's faithfulness that delivers the results. And so I've been trying to remind myself even as the

year we had last year and stepping into year, that my responsibility is movement. I need to have my hands engaged. I need to have my heart engaged, but God's job is fulfillment, that He's going to bring the right things to pass in the right season. What I've struggled with, Sadie, is I'll look at my future and all the things that I want to do. And I'll think of all of the things that I'm going to need to fulfill those things. And I'll take inventory of my life right now and be like, well, I don't have that. I don't have those skills. I don't have that experience.

How am I ever going to do that? neglecting the fact that all I need is what I have for the season that I'm in right now And that God is the one that produces the fruit in it season You know, it's that whole scripture of don't grow weary and well doing for in due season, you will reap a harvest if you don't faint. There's a season for what needs to be produced in our lives. And if we stay connected to the vine, that's just going to happen naturally.

So good. But I'm always fighting that because it's so easy to, to drift into the self like, sufficient sea. Right. You know, Oh, for sure. Same. It was actually cool. You said that because this morning, we were talking to my team was all here and we have a new girl today and we were telling her, you know, just whatever God puts inside of you, just believe that, you know, he can do it through you. And it's kind of like, your job is to move. That movement, his job is the fulfillment.

And if it's a God thing that will happen and we were telling her, like, yeah, you come in here and you might see this podcast, Mike and the camera crew and this is a legit thing happening, but two years ago, whenever I was sitting there, which only two team members and I said, we started a podcast and none of us had any idea what we were doing, but no equipment. We didn't even have a microphone,

care nothing. And we're just like, yeah, let's look into that. And now we're here. And so, sometimes God puts a little seat in your heart. I remember, there's this verse, Ecclesiastes 11 talks about it, and it talks about how, like, you know, you can look at the cloud sometimes,

and you know it's gonna rain. This is obviously not exactly what it says, but this is kind of like an idea. So as you can look at a cloud, and you can know it's gonna rain, you can see a tree falling, and know that that's where it's gonna lie. It says, but there are some things that you will not understand how it happens.

Like the way that a baby is born in the mother's womb, it talks about how like those are the things that we don't know. Like God is clearly doing something that we can't wrap our head around. But then it says, but continue to sow your seed in the morning and don't be idle with your hand in the evening. And that is like stuck with me for so long because it's like there are some things in life you can see this might happen because this happened. But there are other things in life that you don't know, you have to trust God. And God's going to blow your expectations. But that doesn't mean you

stop working. That doesn't mean you stop sewing your seat. And then don't be idle with your hands because you could think it's going to happen just like this. And God's like actually reverse, reverse is going gonna happen like this So that's such good advice and I think when you don't limit God to what he can do you do a lot more like for you You know you're doing so many things and and you don't Underestimated I love what you said about seed because Honestly if the Bible talks a lot about seed, but there is nothing exciting about seed. True.

Like the most boring, I mean, I'm not going out and just looking for seeds, okay? Maybe there are people out there, that's your thing. I respect it, okay? But there's nothing really exciting about seed, but faith doesn't just see the seed for what it is now. It sees what it can become. And when you put seed in the right soil, it grows into something more than you can imagine. And we should never disqualify our gifts, our story, our potential, because it just looks like seed.

We shouldn't disqualify our prayers because they seem small when we're praying them, because they are not yet what they're going to be when God fulfills them. So even though the seed isn't super cool or fun, don't underestimate what God can do with it. So good. I love that. I heard Mike Todd talk about seeds one time and he was talking about how like you have to dig in the ground and bury the seed and that's the same thing you do with death. Like you dig in the ground and you bury the person.

But the same place with the seed where it looks like death is like where destiny begins. I was like that's right. That's good. I love that. Well, as people wanted to know, they wanted you to bring it all the way back to what made you pursue music and what did that look like the very beginning way back when? Oh, yeah. Well, I started singing in church when I was nine. That's when my family started going to church. My parents separated when I was young and that sent my dad on a whole faith journey which introduced him to my stepmom and so he changed the whole

trajectory of my life and our kids and their kids by his decision to follow Jesus but I started singing in the church choir. And I loved it. When I was 16, I started playing piano and leading worship in our youth ministry. And it's kind of funny because my youth pastor, who was also my uncle, was like, Torrin, you're a great singer. You're doing good leading worship, but you really need to know how to play an instrument.

So I'm like, okay. So my dad had keyboards and stuff. great singer you're doing good leading worship but you really need to know how to play an instrument. So I'm like okay, so my dad had keyboards and stuff so I was learning how to play the keyboard but I couldn't learn the songs fast enough for the services. So I would just write my own songs because no one knows if you're messing up your own song. So it's like, no, that's how it's supposed to be. So that's how I started songwriting and I loved that. But then I got really invested into the ministry side of student ministry and leading worship where most days after school I would be coming up to the church setting up for our Wednesday night e-services getting

the stage right and this was when like you decorated stages without budgets for lights and stuff so we would have like the alley look with garbage cans tipped over and trash and construction and all that stuff. But I just love the creative side of all that. It was an outlet for me. And seeing my friends come from school, I went to public school, seeing them come and be like, wow, this is like the coolest thing that we've been to. This is, and I saw it affect them and change their hearts. And even to this day, I'm talking with friends

from high school that were impacted from those years. And I just fell in love with the ministry side. So that led me to Bible college. And I went to Bible college for three years and majored in theology. I minored in music. Wow. And while I was there, I was writing songs and the college every year put out an album. So they got recorded. And I was like, it was the first time I was hearing my music, not just on the piano or the guitar, but

fully produced and people singing and singing it in church. It's just amazing. So, yeah, that's kind of how all that started. I love it. I want to forget the first time I heard Hills and Vales and me and Laney my best friend. We were like, this is so good. And we listened to it like a hundred times.

And it was so funny. So at the time, Lanie and I had just heard it, we were like loved it and then right soon after there was an award show and you know they kind of have your seats where you're gonna sit. So me and Lane goes sit down and then you and your wife are behind us and we're like oh my god. We were star star. I'm not getting we were so fun. We're like that's hilarious. That's hilarious.

We're so excited and people obviously went, that's hilarious. There's so many stories. There's so excited. And people obviously went down to Hills and Valais in your own life. So somebody said, how do you personally keep pursuing God through the hills and valleys of your life? And obviously that song is so good. It has so much meaning behind it. Yeah. Oh, man.

To keep it brief, you know, I was, we have all experienced the highs in the lows of life. I know I certainly have, and I know people have experienced a lot more than me, but just with, you know, my parents, when my wife and I got married, people were upset that we had an interracial marriage and the church that my wife's dad, pastors, had many, many families leave the church when we got married.

And in the midst of that, when we're getting married, it's our first year of marriage, should be the most amazing time of our lives. And we're going through the church turmoil, and then my father-in-law was diagnosed with leukemia. And so that's actually the season that that song really started stirring. And it grew over years and You know, I've realized that there are things that grow and valleys that do not grow on mountain tops

that God actually does some of his best work in our darkest places. And I love how the scripture paints the picture of Jesus as the bright and morning star. He is high and above it all. But in that same set of scriptures, it says that he's also the lily of the valley, that he's not just high above and away from it all, he's actually in our darkest places, growing beautiful things. And so, God is not just the God of the mountaintops and the hills and the successes and the triumphs. He is the God of our struggles, our disappointments, our fractured places,

and he can be trusted because he is with us in and through it all. And that's really the heart behind Hills and valleys. It's reminding people that life is going to happen, and there is going to be some very tough stuff that we will all encounter. But the promise of Jesus and the promise of His presence lets us know that there will never be a day that we have to encounter any of it alone. Yeah, I'm scared. And that's the heart.

It's beautiful. What thanks for sharing that. That's such a good message. And I love how you said that that song kind of started stirring in you years before the song ever came out. And a really hard time of your life. And then years later you put out the song and it's huge and everybody loves it and relates to it because we've all had our heels and valleys and we've seen God in them. What do you say to people? Because our generation has this struggle where we like to put everything out really fast.

And we like everything to happen really fast. But sometimes things just don't happen like that. Sometimes, and a lot of times they don't need to happen like that. So what's your advice on letting something just sit for a little while before it goes out? Yeah.

Well, that's a great, great observation to bring up. John Mayer actually said that the problem with today's young musicians is we write a song and we think we have to post it on YouTube immediately. Like, I literally just wrote it and now it has to go up on social media. And it kind of kills the developmental process because he was talking about, you know, the years and years and years. It was just him and his room with his guitar writing hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of songs and practicing and practicing and practicing I think that

Good things take time Good things take time Jesus does very few instantaneous miracles and scripture. He does very few instantaneous miracles in scripture. He does a few. Sometimes suddenly happens, we love that scripture and acts. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind.

That was the fulfillment of an ancient promise that unfolded from generation to generation to generation, the suddenly took a very long time to set up. Yeah. Wow. And often that's just how God operates. When you look at the creation of the world, we serve a God who could breathe it into existence, who could think it into existence, who could do it all in one day?

but on day one it was evening and it was morning and day two God created and it was evening and it was morning Day three day four Why? Because good things take time. It's great. So, and I'll add to that, can you celebrate that it's good before it's done?

Wow. Preach. Wow, preach. Because God called every day good, even though it wasn't the fulfillment of the full vision that was in his heart. He was able to end that day and look around and be like, man, I know I still got fish to put in this water. And I still know I got people to put on this land. But if I'm just looking at the clouds and the oceans, this is good. So great. And in our lives, we have to be able to look at, man, I don't quite have the relationships I want to have. It's not quite where I want it to be, want it to be, but it's good right now.

That is. Yeah. So anyways, I'm like, I reach take like we just went to church. And like that is so good. I've never thought about it like that. That he was able to say it was good before it was done. So many people want to hear that. Like if you're listening to the podcast, stop for a minute and just think about the things in your life that might not be done yet or the you're putting pressure to come out now or be Wherever you think you should be wherever you know, yes, whatever your expectation was for this season or this year of your life And just let God work where you're at. That is so good to learn I love that.

Lastly, I want to talk to you about the song known because that is Christian and I's song. Come on. We got engaged. I was the song we our first dance at our wedding and it just meant so much to us because when Christian and I started dating, I had dated other people before. He had dated other people before. I feel like other people before. Um, I feel like the word, like, love would come out like so soon in relationships. And that's because y'all were dating people in like second grade and third grade. And then y'all got married. Well, that's true. That's, that's a valid, that's valid. But love would come out. And I would be like, there's just like,'s just like I really you don't know me, but then I would feel like

Well now I don't even want to tell you like all the things that are really me because then what if you don't still love me But this is how it was backwards concept so remember when Christian I started dating I told him like I do not want you to tell me that you love me until you know me And I don't want to tell you I know you until I love you until I know you and of course you're always going to continue to get to know someone and there's a lot to get to know and I'm still getting to know Christian and forever will be but the core of wanting to truly know him and like being known by him was super important to me before I said I love you because I love you I think when you know that you're known it takes the pressure off of Feeling like you have to be something other than yourself and I think in the day and age that we live in especially with social media

You are liked by a lot of people and you're not known by any of them You know you're you're seeing your acknowledge Which are not truly like known and so I think the song and the words are so crucial for us to hear, where did that come from in your own life that you felt the need to write this song? And what does that mean to you? Well, there is a quote that stopped me in my tracks by Timothy Keller. And it said, to be loved, but not known not known is comforting but it's superficial. You know this you've posted this before. Yep. To be known and not loved is our greatest fear but to be fully known. This is so good. So good. And truly loved is what it means to be loved by God.

So good. I mean, there is not a better encapsulation of the gospel to me than those words right there. And I was, I am that like not to invoke the enneagram here. No, I love it. I normally do ask people, so please share your enneagram. I am a three. Was a, so you know what I'm saying?

And so it's a lot of performance, achievement, image-driven, image-conscious type things. And you know, it's hard to love me with all of my dysfunction. But that's actually the beautiful thing about Jesus is that he didn't die for the image that we project. He died for who we really are. So before anyone knew me, before anyone liked me, before anyone sang my songs, before anybody invited me anywhere, Jesus invited me in. He knew me. He saw me. He loved me. He treasured me. And that just demands. Scripture says, it's just a reasonable response to worship and to live in this place of worship and

You know my wife and I our story is pretty cool too and I always tell people God used My wife as the greatest expression of God's grace in my life to let me know That I didn't have to be anything more than what I was, that I could bring all of my failure and all my dysfunction and all of my broken pieces that I'm still trying to make sense of, and they are covered in grace. It's beautiful. And that's the heart of that song. And I'll speak to the thing too that you know our generation and

The generation coming up after me We have really bought into the lie that it is better to be well known Than to be known well Hmm, and if you're evaluating them on a scale of Fame versus intimacy. The intimacy is so much more valuable than people celebrating you or knowing your name or you getting a certain amount of followers or filling the blank that the real treasure is to have people that have been given permission to get inside of your heart and Connected in a deeper way and in a deeper place. And it's it's something you can't

Replace with anything else. Nope. Just been your whole life trying come on. So good You know right after you were just preaching about the good thing, I was like, should I ask him one more question because he just nailed that. And I'm glad I did, because you just nailed it. Like you just preaching. It's so cool, because it's an overflow of who you are and the scripture that you know

and even the family that you have. And you can tell that all comes to such a genuine place. So thank you for sharing your heart, your advice, your stories with us. Of course. It was so good. Everybody go get all God's children help out. I guess really by just listening to the song,

that is a practical, easy way to help out. So everybody go listen to the song, to learn again, thank you so, so much. It's been so fun talking. Thank you. Thank you for having me on. I don't know when all of a sudden I just felt like I needed to talk about welcome back to the segment of the podcast What is that from? Oh, you know what it's from any part of the details now like like You like the time of the hour when Larry sings a silly song. That's literally what I'm channeling right now I hope y'all can connect with that because I I did watch your details

But I've known that this just felt like a fulfillment of my childhood dream, to say something like that. Okay, really happy about it. Anyways, moving on, we're not gonna dwell on the moment. All right, Christian, good about advice. Let's hear it. Always choose to love others first. Great advice. It's like the best advice you can give, because Jesus said.

That's one of the top two commandments that Jesus gave us. Love neighbors, your stuff. Yeah, boom. Love a girl with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength. Can't go wrong with that. So love that. All right, let's see. Be wherever your feet are.

Don't live in the past or the present. That's good advice. I know that sometimes I can look at my life in moments that I'm either hopeful for the future or dwelling in the past. I can kind of lose sight of where I'm at now. So I think that's really good advice. I love being in the present moment.

I love being here right now in this podcast. You too. My feet are down on this rug. I'm loving it. I'm not thinking about whatever I'm doing later. What I'm doing yesterday. I feel content. I feel good for happy.

I love that. No, I agree. And it's hard to do that at times. It's so easy to look to the future or dwell in the past. But when you can surrender the pain of the past or even the highs of the past and look for, and also look forward to the future and not spend your whole life anticipating the future

and just be in the moment, I think that's whenever you truly start living. Yeah, it was even us now with our daughter like I'm so hopeful for the future of that, but I'm also like just so content now with where we're at. Yeah, that's so true. That's so sweet. Like this is such a good season, it's such a sweet season. Yeah.

And what's preparing us for the next one. Yeah, it's preparing for the next one. Everything in life is like that. It's always preparing you for the next. So every stage of it is important. Where does in the season we're not having a pivot? Christian, Christian and my dad always like fun of all of our church worlds, worlds, our church words that we say, like season and pivot and I can't think of anything. They come every year. They're just going to be

in here this year. I can't wait for the 2021 church world of the year. Let's see what's the next question. All right. Stress is a choice. Hmm. I don't year. That's a question. All right, stress is a choice. I don't know, that's interesting because I don't know that it's a choice because if it was a choice, I don't think I would choose it. But. Wow, that was like just another realm of wisdom. Well, it's true because I would not choose to be stressed

but I oftentimes feel stressed. So I don't think it's a choice. Yeah, that's true. Is it a choice to choose not to be stressed, but I oftentimes feel stressed. So I don't think it's a choice. Yeah, that's true. Is it a choice to choose not to be stressed, perhaps? Well, I think it's a choice to like, it's a choice to like how you want to approach that. Yeah. Sometimes I'm stressed, I can either like shut down,

or if I'm stressed I can be like, okay, let's do it, let's get it done. Yeah, there is a choice that comes in the midst of stress to say I'm going to no longer be stressed and choose to trust God. But I think getting to the point of stress to say, I'm going to no longer be stressed and choose to trust God. But I think getting to the point of stress is not always a choice sometimes life happens and throws you a curveball and sometimes you get stress and then in that moment you have a choice to get out of it. Yeah, I was actually just about to say word for word for word. I was. Yeah, I know you. That was so good.

Thanks for saying good and bad bye. So so well it's good podcast, Instagram and on the L.O. sister app. We love you guys and look forward to seeing you more. Yup. you