WHOA That's Good Podcast - Finding Friends Who Help Me Follow Jesus | Sadie Robertson Huff | Grace Hackett

Episode Date: July 8, 2026

Sadie sits down with her longtime friend Grace Hackett, Director of Engagement at Love One International, an organization whose mission is to support vulnerable families in Uganda. Grace shares how her family’s adoption story helped inspire Love One’s work in Uganda and opens up about the college season that left her feeling empty until godly friendship helped point her back to Jesus. Sadie and Grace answer listener voicemails about old friendships, staying close to God in college, and surrendering the future.  This Episode is Sponsored By: https://www.ponchooutdoors.com/whoa — Get $10 off and free shipping on your first order when you enter your email! http://primallypure.com — Get 15% off your order when you use code WHOA at checkout! - Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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But per usual, it is about to get so much better because today we have such a special guest on the podcast. this girl has been a friend to me for a long time. How long have we been friends, Grace? Davy always tells me not to talk about years because I always mess them up. Maybe like, when did you get married? I feel like, okay, wait, I got married almost seven years ago. So it was before then. Like eight, maybe eight years?

Eight years. Okay, y'all, we have eight-year friendship happening right now. We have Grace Hackett on the podcast. Grace is an incredible mom, an incredible wife, an incredible friend. She also is a part of running Love One with her family, which is a podcast sponsor that many of you have signed up to be a part of the Love Club. If you don't know what I'm talking about, we'll talk about it in a second, but I have my sweatshirt on. And they're just doing incredible work in Uganda, around the world. Your family's so amazing.

So thanks for coming on the podcast. This is so fun. This is fun and kind of long overdue. I know. So we had your sister, Miller Ann, and Parker. because, you know, one of the things that people love when we talk about the most is dating. And I was thinking about who's like a couple that's done it well. And I just love how honestly they've been on social media.

So we asked them. And then I was like, wait, I cannot believe I have had grace on. This is so weird. So thanks for making the trip down. That's perfect timing. It's been so fun. And I'm just happy to be here. So sweet.

Okay, tell us a little bit about loved one, what you do on a day to day and a little bit about your fam. Yeah, so I'll start with me in my life. I'm married to Davy. I mentioned him a minute ago. I really am so bad with like years and timelines and stuff. I always mess him up and he always picks on me for that. But I'm married to Davey. He's the best. We've been married for eight years. And we have three kids. We have two boys and a girl, crew, Baron Haven. We live in Franklin right outside of Nashville. I'm born and raised there. Davies lived there for a long time. I'm one of eight. kids. So a lot of y'all listening met Miller and Parker on the podcast. She's one of my sisters, like Sadie said. There's five girls, three boys, four of my siblings are adopted for our biological. And we've always said, like I've always told Sadie, like I don't really have anyone else in my life who has so many parallels in our family. Like legit, even down to like Sadie has two brothers that are adopted domestically. I have two brothers that are adopted domestically. Rebecca, join y'all's family later in life. She's from Taiwan. Tuta joined our family later in life. She's from Honduras.

Like, it's pretty wild. I was telling her on her birthday. Like, I don't really have another friend who can relate to the dynamics of my family because that's their lived experience, you know. But that's our family. And then I have a sister Josie Love who was adopted from Uganda. And she was really who the Lord used to put love one on my mom's heart. So when she was, we adopted her when she was three years old and she weighed 12 pounds when she was three when we met her. And it's so crazy because, like, I grew up knowing that. Like, I grew up knowing that she weighed 12 pounds at three. But it wasn't until I became a mom.

I have, like, one of the most vivid memories of my life is weighing crew, my first born on the scale at three months and seeing 12 pounds. And I just remember weeping being like, I was there. I was 13 when she came home. I was in seventh grade or eighth grade. But like to really realize while a three month old weighs 12 pounds and this is how big she was and like then flashing back to holding her being the same size. It was such a profound moment for me. Wow.

And really cool because I work for a loved one. And so just like connect all the pieces in my brain and in my heart. But basically when we met her, my parents genuinely didn't know if she was going to make it. And so they were sitting in these hospitals and my mom's like holding this limp body. because she was just so sick. And they found out at a routine medical exam that she had tuberculosis, malaria, and was HIV positive. And so they were like, what does this look like for us?

And still just, like they prayed about it and still felt like she was supposed to be a part of our family, continued to pursue the adoption, ended up getting her home. And then with proper medical care, just watched how she blossomed into this beautiful, amazing, joyful young woman. You know her.

She's so sweet. 20, you know? I think she just turned 20. Just got her dream job. Yeah, I just got her dream job as a teacher's aide at the school that we grew up at, which crew is at now too. So I'm like, she could be Cruz teachers aid, which is so sweet in a few years. But yeah, my mom just saw the difference that quality medical care made for her.

And I think got everybody got her home and was like, our family's full, but was still having flashbacks to sitting in hospitals in Uganda with these other moms and meeting these other moms who had in rural communities who had extremely, malnourished babies and like we're pretty hopeless. And so she started Love One. We have a rehabilitation center in Uganda for malnourish babies. And so yeah, I work for Love One full time and it's such a gift and like has always, I mean, I've grown up going to Uganda. I've gone almost every year since I was 12. Wow. So just a big part of my heart and really purposeful work to get to do outside of my home and my kids. That's amazing. I cannot wait to go with y'all. I know.

I know. I've been to Uganda but not with you guys and I'm so excited. And it really is so crazy. Like you said, our lives, like we've related on so much. And it's so rare that you have a friend where you have so much in common with from our families to now we've been married around the same time, have three kids. We both have a haven. Like there's just like so many things. But it was really sweet. So how we met was actually mutual friend who's also been on the podcast, Lauren Aiken's. And we went to coffee together because we literally passed each other in the church parking lot and then we saw like she DM me yes yeah and she DM me but I didn't know you had told her to reach out to me or something well I was telling your team before this I it was so funny because

it was like right when Thomas Drette's career was really taking off and um her platform was growing so much and I have a really vivid memory it was interesting talking to your team because I had so many memories come back from like just throughout our friendship um that I'd kind of forgotten about but this is before I met you and we were sitting on her couch and she was like like I just want to talk to someone who God's given a platform to that's like stewarding it really well, but I don't know who that person is. And I remember like brainstorming being like, who is in the public eye that's a believer? And at the time I was watching This Is Us. And I'm like, I think like Chrissy Metz is a believer. I don't know her. That's sweet. I was throwing out names

and she said, what about Sadie? And I had heard your name obviously over the years just like from Doug Dynasty but didn't know you. And I didn't follow you. So I didn't kept up with like your life. you were doing. And when we looked at your page, I was like, wow, she seems amazing. So she DMD that night and y'all got connected. But then what's crazy is so she, and you can say this side if you want to, but she came back to me being like, Sadie's roommates remind me so much of the way she talks about her roommates remind me of how I talk about you and your mom. And at the same time, like around the same time that this was happening, you were living with Sarah, Gracie and Lainey. I met Sarah at Amago Day, and she knew Davy from the belonging.

And there was just like all this crazy overlap. I ended up hanging out with them, and then they invited me to Gracie's birthday dinner. So it was like this weird thing because Lauren was telling me, you would love Sadie y'all would be great friends. Y'all need to meet and get together. And then I got invited to Gracie's birthday dinner, not knowing y'all were roommates. At our house? Yeah.

So when I showed up, I was like, we both knew that Lauren had been trying to get us together. Yeah. So that was, yeah, the timing was crazy. And so the Lord. And I just think this serves as a reminder to people listening. Like when you're looking for a community, prayers matter so much because the Lord will just connect you to the right people at the right time. Yeah. And I remember, so Lauren had sent me that damn, but I didn't see it.

And then when I passed her in the church parking lot, it like sparked me to go message her. And I was like, oh, she messaged me. Like it was like, that was the time. That's crazy. Then we went to coffee. And it was so cute because I think she had three kids or two kids or something. Like she just had Willa green maybe was pregnant. to James or just how to A. James. Yeah. And she was like, you're, she's like, this has been

awesome, but like, I'm such a mom right now. I'm so busy. She's like, but you know who you would be best friends with? She's like, Grace. She's like, y'all are the same person. Y'all are so similar, all this stuff. And so then I was like, oh, I got to meet Grace. And then you show up at our house. And I'm like, what are the odds of this? So crazy. And so it's just so sweet how the Lord connects dots like that. I feel like so many of us are in a season of wanting simple beauty routines, right? I mean, I know as moms, we need it to be simple. I still want to look put together, but I don't always want or even have the time for a full makeup production just to get out the door. That's why I'm so excited about this duo from Primely Pure. Their sun serum tinted SPF and their

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Also, love Pramipur's whole philosophy. They're female founded. And they really focus on fewer, better ingredients that support your skin instead of just covering it up. Y'all know, the real ones know from the beginning. I actually pitched myself on this podcast. I was like, sponsor me because I love their stuff. And then they did. And I was so stoked. So thank you all. Now they have something for you guys. Use the code Woe to get 15% off your Primely Pure purchase at Pramily Pure.com. That's primarily pure, P-R-I-M-A-L-L-L-Y-P-U-R-E.com and use the code Woe at checkout for 15% off your order. I know Lauren was a big part of your story, even coming to the Lord, so you want to share a little

bit about your college testimony? Yeah. So I was raised in a Christian household. Like, my parents are the absolute best. I went to a Christian school growing up, and I always believed in God. And, like, I've never gone through a season where I didn't believe in God. But when I was in college, I went to the University of Tennessee. I rushed because that's what everybody does in the South, especially at the SEC schools. And we was just kind of doing the college sorority thing. And I had never, like my parents didn't drink when I was growing up. I'd never really been exposed to alcohol much at all, much less like a healthy relationship with alcohol.

It just wasn't really around. And so I think when I got to college, I just, that's what everybody was doing. Like everyone was going out. they were partying, that was like the social thing to do. And I just fell into like this lifestyle that everybody around me was doing. And it left me feeling really drained and depleted. And for my first years of college, I just looking back, like, I was so insecure. I was just looking for validation and to feel loved and for my identity in all the wrong places.

And I know that's a story, so many people's stories. And it's so interesting because you see people go off and go to college and join a sorority and post the cute bid day pictures and like do all the things. And it looks like this dream that you too can go live and then you get there. And I'm not saying that you can't join a sorority and like find godly community and do it right. I think it's harder than it is to fall into whatever because the majority of people in that world are living this lifestyle. And so yeah, by my sophomore year, I was like looking back, kind of depressed, like not diagnosed, depression, but I just was, it was so dark. Like looking back on it, it just feels so dark. And I remember around Christmas of my sophomore year, like, going

back, I was also in nursing school at the time. I thought that's what I wanted to do. I saw this medical need overseas and I was like, I'm going to be a nurse so I can go fill this medical need. And then kind of realized once I got in a nursing school, like, yes, I can use that degree overseas, but unless I'm going to go move somewhere, like my day-to-day reality as a nurse looks pretty different than that. And when I realized my day-to-day reality, I was like, I don't know if this is what I'm called to. And so, yeah, I remember driving back to Knoxville on after Christmas break and being like, something has to change this semester or like I'm transferring to Belmont. And I think it was, whatever the break is, it's in February, like President's Day weekend or something.

We had a long weekend. And I went on a trip to Haiti with my mom had been becoming friends with Lauren. and I had met her a few times, but that was like really the first time that I spent an extended amount of time with her was in Haiti. And it was a few of us that went down. We built a medical clinic in Haiti years ago, like before a loved one was even loved one. And so we go down to Haiti. We have this trip together and I'm like really grappling with them. I'm supposed to be in nursing school. And I'm talking to Lauren about it because she graduated from UT nursing. And so she really like counseled me through that. Ultimately I ended up leaving nursing school. But when I went, as I got to know her, I just realize, like, you are the type of friend that I've been longing for. Like,

I have great friends that I met in college, but none of us were healthy. Um, I just wasn't around anybody who was living a healthy lifestyle. And I'm not blaming anybody else. Like, that's on me for putting myself in those scenarios, but that just was my reality. Um, and I wish looking back, if there's someone listening that's in that, like, move to a different friend group, like seek out community in your church, seek out community in places that will give you life because I just stayed stuck, I feel like, you know. So it wasn't until I met her and I was like, man, she is, I looked up to her in so many ways and was like, you just are walking with Jesus, but you're real and you're relatable and like, this is what I've been longing for. And also on

top of that, we got to do like travel and serve together, which is such an amazing aspect of friendship when you get to have that with someone, you know, it's just like so deep and meaningful. And so I went back to school, but then my junior year and senior year, I was home a lot. Like my senior year, I was dating and engaged to Davy, who I actually met through her in TR. But it was just a big pivot for me being like, man, this is what I'm longing for, this is the kind of community I'm longing for. And it was the one that I like really started walking with Jesus and like letting him convict me and change things in me that I think I'd kind of been pushing away and ignoring the conviction. because you know when you grow up knowing Jesus like that conviction's there but I just went through a season where I was like I know this is wrong but I'm kind of ignoring it and and then it wasn't until I was legit at rock bottom and I was like I'm so miserable and empty that I made a change so anyways married davy after college we dated all my senior year and got married and then now we're in a small group that we've been in so we got married in August after I graduated or I graduated in August sorry we got married in September of 2018 we joined. our small group in December of 2018 and Lauren and TR and our small group and we've been doing

life in that community since. And she was just such a like a seed and a person that God planted in my life that led to a big pivot, you know? Yeah. It's amazing whenever someone's like walking the walk and you're like, okay, it is possible. Yeah, totally. Because it's like you know, like you said, like if you have known Jesus your whole life, it's like, okay, I know this is the way I want to live, but then you get so far away from it that then you feel like, okay, is anyone actually doing that? Yeah. And then you see someone doing it, you're like, oh, you can do it. And there actually is, like, the fruit of the spirit on their life. And they are, like, genuinely joyful. And they actually have peace. And they actually are content in who they are. And it's like, I really want that.

And so it's so cool because sometimes you get so in the mundane of like life and being around people and watching the same shows, everybody's watching and listening to the same music, everybody's watching, just doing the thing. And you're like, this is not life-giving. You know, I don't actually want my life to look like this. So sometimes it takes that example to go like, oh, okay, I actually can do something better. And then to be plugged in in like a group like that, to be surrounded by such like-minded people. It's funny because then you go the whole opposite way.

And you're like so into, you know, and you're like, I can't believe I used to think this was normal. I can't believe I used to think like depression was just the way I was going to feel, you know. And so just to encourage people listening, like, I hope maybe today serves as a reminder from like two people who've walked each road. It's like, man, there's a life with Jesus. And it is full and it is lifegiving. And it is possible for you. But you do have to change some things up.

Don't just stay in the same routine. It's like don't conform to the pattern of the world. Be transformed by the renewal of your mind. And then like get a new friend group. Do something different. Walk into a new place. And even like with your friend group, I feel like there's so many opportunities too. within a friend group that's living that way

to say like, hey, are we actually happy? Like, you can be the, that, you don't have to, like, leave your friends high and dry. They might be wanting to change too, you know? So having those conversations is important. But it's so cool to hear your story because I know so many people can relate. So many people go to college. And it's like the first year is so hard. And of course, like, you're tempted in so many ways.

You conform in so many ways. And then I think what happens is people think, well, I'm already in it. Like, I've already done this. or I've already gotten to this point. And so you just like keep going on that path, but it's like, no, don't keep going on that path. That's what I love about Christian's story. His first year of college was like, bad.

His first semester was like terrible as far as choices. Choices, you know. And he just went all in down the wrong way. But then it had such a pivot, you know. And it wasn't like a one day thing. It was an overtime thing. But by the end of his college years, he was so on fire for the Lord. We got married.

It was like totally different from year one to your four. And I think that's so inspiring. That's a life with Jesus. Like that's the transformational power of Christ who resurrected from the grave. Like you can change it any time. And so super encouraging to hear. You know, a verse I've been thinking about lately is, I can't remember the reference, but the one that says train up a child in the way he should go.

And when he's old, he will not depart from it. And it's interesting because I was thinking like, I think about my own kids. And my prayer for them is not like, God, never let them depart from the straight and narrow. I always pray like, let them walk with you, let them encounter you, let them know you. But at the end of the day, it's like everyone is going to have times that they're drawn away by the world. And what the prayer is like that you as a parent have established the foundation as a child in the seasons that they depart from it, that they hit those feelings of emptiness, of anxiety, of depression, and then they remember, oh, I've walked with Jesus before, and I know that's where I found peace, and I felt loved,

and I was at rest. And so when they depart, it's like just that they'll come back because that's their foundation of their childhood, you know? So great. Literally, at church just past Sunday, it was Father's Day. And the pastor was talking about how we have such an anxious generation because fathers have not been, like, the protector, like one of the reasons. obviously there's a lot of reasons.

One of the reasons is fathers have not been the strong protector that they're called to be and the present protector they're called to be in a lot of people's lives. And he said, but God is that. But the reason why people are so anxious is like they've forgotten where to go when they're scared. And I was like, that's really a good point because like God is a ever present help in times of trouble. And it's like when you're a condition to know that and like to turn to God. But like there's a generation who doesn't know like God's someone I'm supposed to. turn to whenever I'm scared.

Yeah. And maybe that's from a lack of fatherhood. Maybe it's from a lack of knowing or understanding the Bible or the word. But that's something like I'm really trying to teach our kids now as like being quick to go to God. Like when they're hurt, when they're scared, when they're this. And it's like so that they always know, like that's been a prayer over their life since the day they were born.

Like would you always know how loved you are by God? Would you always know that God's with you? Just so like there's not a day that you can go by that you could truly think you're not loved or that you're alone. You know? And I think so many people think like I'm not loved or I'm alone or I don't know where to go or I feel so anxious. And it's like just knowing, like a deep knowing that no matter how bad it is, no matter what it looks like, that God is with me. Yeah. It was so sweet last night because I don't know if you experienced this in Hotel Monroe, but the storm was crazy. Yeah. It was so crazy. Lightning was crazy. Thunder is crazy and honey was really scared. And so I turned on David, the movie or the TV show. because it was like if the TV wasn't on, like the lightning was like lighting up the room so much and the thunder was so loud. So I was like, I was going to turn on the TV. And I had no idea.

We had never seen this one. It was the minnow extended version of the David TV show. I didn't even know they had that. And it was David in a storm. And there was lightning and thunder and everything. And then Honey goes, how can David not be scared in that lightning? And I said because he knew God was with him. And Honey said,

I wish I was David. And then I was like, but you know what? So cool, honey. Like the same God that David trusted is the same God you trust. And the same God that was in David is the same God that's in you. And it was like such a sweet moment to be like, oh, like I want to be David because I want to be fearless. I want to be David because I want to be brave like that. I want to be David because I want to not be scared in the storm.

It's like, oh, I can be David. And it's kind of a point to you looking at Lauren and being. like, I kind of want to be that, you know? It's like, oh, I can be that. Because the fact does is like she has Jesus in her. Such a cool illustration. You know how there are just certain things that guys in your life end up wearing all the time? Well, that would be poncho outdoors for the men at our family. My dad loves his poncho shirts. Christian wears them pretty much every day. And I love finding something for them that looks nice, but it's still just practical for them to live in. Poncho makes men's outdoor performance shirts that don't look like your average shirt.

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for the listeners to call in. For those who haven't been tracking, we have a woe line. You can call into the wo line, share your heart, ask questions, whatever you want to share. And these episodes have been so special because sometimes whenever you're podcasting, it's like, you know, we're in this room. We're not seeing who we're talking to, but to like hear the voices of the girls who are listening to this. The guys who are listening to this is just so cool. I just want to tell you all the woe line number because it threw it up is 318-58-1-1749. So you can always call it number, ask any questions, and it might be.

featured. But specifically when we have a guest come in like Grace, we'll dive through the different voice mails that you left and anything that resonates where I'm like, oh, she would be awesome to speak into this. So I wanted to hear a little bit about her story and how she can relate to your life. And now we're going to listen to a couple of voicemails. Let us go. I have a question on how to approach old friendship when you're actively developing your faith. Just kind of when I feel like I have a friend that I no longer resonate with in a lot of the areas that I used to, and sometimes I feel like she can hold me back from living my life for God. And I just, I just kind of want to know how you're supposed to approach friendships like that,

because I think that it can be hard. Thank you much. Bye. This is great. Yeah. Like, I feel like in some ways we kind of answered it. I think in my head I kind of have buckets of friendship and I have like my people who when I'm low, when I'm empty, when I need encouragement, like I know that they walk with Jesus and I look to them to fill my cup, to encourage me, to point me back to Jesus. And then I have friends who I love dearly who don't really walk with Jesus and they might not be the people that I'm like going to go to advice for. But I love them. And at the end of the day, like, like when you start walking with Jesus, you're not called to withdraw from all the people in your life that don't know him. In fact, is the opposite. And like you said, Sadie, like, it's such an amazing opportunity for you to actually look at them and say, I have found peace here.

And also people will notice a difference in you. Like, if you've been so empty and anxious and depressed, and then you find Jesus and you meet him and you experience the peace and the joy that he offers you, like, you get to share that with your friends. And so I think it's having an awareness of what roles different, friendships playing your life and what your expectations of your friends are, but definitely staying in that space and bringing what you found into those spaces and being a light in your friendships and to your friends. That is great. I totally agree. I think there is a time and a place for needing to

remove yourself when you're still trying to, you know, shift in your own life. Like if you're still tempted by it, I mean, I think Christian had to go like cold turkey. He had to be like, I am walking away from this curve for a little while while I, you know, get stronger in my faith because Christian knew himself. He was like, I'm going to go back. And he did like so many times until he finally was like, I'm walking away. And so sometimes there's a call to like, okay, I actually have to walk away in order for me to change and not be in this same pattern, same cycle. But then also there's that other element of like witnessing to them of like what God's doing in your life. and being willing to talk about it.

And so I think you kind of have to know yourself and your own boundaries in that space. And when it's time to like fully walk away and when it's time to just stay and be honest and have good conversations. And maybe it's a little bit of both. But I love what you said. I think that's so, so helpful. Also, before we move on, I was also just going to say, I remember my senior year. I was engaged to dating. I was dating in the first semester and engaged the second semester.

and to Sadie's point, like, I came home every weekend. And so for me, because every, I would say to my friends, like, if y'all want to go do something fun, I'll stay in town. But most weekends it was like, well, this dardy is happening on Saturday and we're going to go to this frat house. And so true, like, I knew if I'm here and I'm going to those places, like, it's just not going to be good for me. And so I did remove myself on the weekends, but it was great because my weeks were spent in Knoxville. And like, it's a lot easier to draw a lot of those boundaries. For me, it was during the week when it's like, well, we'll go get dinner and we'll study together and we'll do all these things. But on the weekend, when everyone's like really out partying, I'm going to go home.

That's so good. Because sometimes, yeah, it's like we can be friends in this capacity, but I'm not going to like go to the bar with you. I'm not going to do the things and put myself in the position that I've constantly failed in. It's like, don't do the same thing over and over again. but I think that's such good advice. And I think friendships that are different than you are so valuable, though. So I do think, like you said, it's not like you just need to ditch all your friends that aren't walking with the Lord.

Like, no, it's so valuable. Like, you're the light in that space. Also, like, they mean so much to you. Like, it's good to keep those friendships. It's good for those to remain. It's just that your expectation on what that friendship looks like has to shift a little bit. Yeah, totally. It's great.

Hi, Sadie. My question. is do you have any advice for me as a Christian girl in college? Any tips on how to stay close to God and stay close to him throughout, you know, day-to-day life? And also, if you have any tips for getting in and starting to read the Bible. Thanks. Bye. It's great. It's so funny because, like I said, we already got these voicemails. And then whenever you share with our team, your testimony, they're like, these are perfect. And I think that just goes to show, so many people listening, like these are such common things that girls are going through. I get asked

all the time, how do I say, you know, how do I remain faithful in college? Because the truth is, like, what we've talked about, you're going in and you're tempted all around. It's like, are you going to conform? If you're, you know, if you're not, are you really going to be a part? Are you going to be accepted? Are you going to be loved? Are you going to be weird? Are you going to have friends? It's like all those things come at you. And I didn't go to college, so I didn't experience that. course I've heard so many times from so many friends like the same story when you went into college like having the foundation of faith your whole life did you go in thinking like I'm going to stay strong and then wavered or were you like this is my time to like actually live it up a little bit

I think I just went I went into college with a lot of insecurity um I and I think it came from a few different things like I look back and I'm like I never really like I think number one I always long to date someone and like it's natural to think about your life and think like I want to date someone I want to get married I want to be a mom like I you have all these goals for yourself and I look back and I'm like I think I just wanted I wanted to date someone I wanted to have a boyfriend I wanted all these things in my head I was like we're going to get me closer to this life that I knew I eventually wanted but I didn't have I think I was just insecure in that and I was looking for validation and also like over the years my weight fluctuated a lot and I do feel like that was tied to my confidence in different seasons,

like throughout high school and college. And I do feel like I have, I mean, I have a really healthy relationship with like food now. I feel healthy and I'm so grateful for that. But when I look back, I think I just went into college all of that to say like with a, I knew in my head all the things about Jesus and God and I was a Christian. But I think I just went in still searching. Yeah, yeah. And it led me into that lifestyle. That's so helpful. Like what you said still searching, because I think that that's that that's it. Like you can go in a Christian, you can go in a believer, and this is not just for college, this is anything. But if you are not content with who you are in Christ, like, and you will continue to search for what you can find in

the world and how it can fill those holes that you don't have. And that is what leads you other places. And I actually did a message on, I think it's in John 2. It's whenever John the Baptist sees Jesus and he's like, behold, like this is the Messiah. Like this is the one we've been waiting for. And then, you know, the disciples like start following Jesus in that moment. I wish I had my Bible. Do I have my Bible somewhere? Okay. I can't botch this story. This is too good. Okay. Oh wait. I think it's John too. So it says the next day again, John was standing with two of his disciples and he looked at Jesus as he walked by and said, behold, the Lamb of God. The two disciples heard him say this and they followed Jesus.

Jesus turned, saw them following and said to them, what are you seeking? And they said to him, Rabbi, which means teacher, where are you staying? And he said, come and you will see. And this says, one of the two who heard John speaking and followed Jesus was Andrew, Simon, Peter's brother, he found his own brother, Simon, and said, we have found the Messiah. And then it says, he brought him to Jesus. Jesus looked at him and said, you are Simon, son of John, and you will be called Peter. And I love this story so much because they see Jesus. They're like, this is the Lamb of God. They start following him. Jesus stops him and is like, what are you seeking? So it's like, let's establish like, what are you looking for?

then they, you know, say, rabbi, teacher, where are you saying? So it's like, we want to follow you. And then he says, one of the two heard, and it says, they said, we have found the Messiah. So it proves like what they were looking for because they said, we found him. Like we found what we're looking for. And so then they're like, we were dropping everything and following him. And then as they start following him, he turns around and he tells him who he is. You're Peter and, like, gives him his identity.

And I think like that is such a pivotal moment in your life when you ask yourself, what am I looking for and you identify what am I actually searching for? Am I actually searching for love? Okay. Am I really going to find it in sleeping with the sky? Am I really going to find it by getting this person's attention? Am I really going to find? No.

So I'm going to stop following that direction. Okay. What am I seeking? Am I seeking peace? Am I really going to find it by listening to True Crime podcast all day? No. Okay. That should stop following that direction.

It's like, okay, I found the Messiah. I found the one I'm looking for, the one who gives me love, the one who gives me joy, the one who gives me peace. So search is over. I'm following him. And then in following him, I know who I am. Like he identifies you. You're Peter. This is who you are. This is what you're called to do. And then, of course, you see Peter's life completely changed. He goes from being a fisherman to a fissure of man. And he has purpose now and all that he does. And I'm like, this, I love this passage. It's John 1, actually. bless you, John 135. And I just think if you go read that and go follow Peter's story, it's like such a good example of like what it looks like to go all in with Jesus, what it looks like to identify what you're searching for.

And I think it's really important. I think intentional questions to yourself are really important to stop and go like, what am I doing? Because I think we so often don't stop and like check in with ourselves. and that's when things spiral. Because like you look up and you don't even know why you did what you did. I don't even know why.

I didn't actually even want that, you know? So it's like being intentional and asking yourself like, why am I doing this? Why am I going here? Why am I friends with these people? Why am I continuing to go down this path and am I really actually going to find it

at the end of it or do I need to pivot in my relationship with Jesus? Because that's where I'm actually going to find it. Yeah. So when you said that about the identity thing, I was like, you're searching for. I'm like, man, that reminds me. I had this message, I think it was my first message at Passion seven years ago. But it just was like, that's so it right there. That's so it.

If you do this little, what am I looking for? Find it in Jesus. It really will change the way that you walk and you go into places. And of course, that's not just college. That's life. You can be listening to this podcast when you're 50 years old. That's life. Yeah. It's just finding contentment in the Messiah. Yeah. And I think that you can know truth. Like, I knew truth. going into college, I just didn't put my confidence in it. Yep. It's like, and so even if you believe in God and you know the truth, like, is your confidence in body image and how you look? Is it in your relationship status and how much attention you're getting from boys? Is it in your friendships? Like, there's so many other places

you can put your identity. And I think that's where I was. Like, I knew truth, but my confidence wasn't in the truth of who God made me to be. That's really good. That's where a lot of people are. I mean, that's where I was for a long time. And I think that's when you ask yourself that question know, like, is this ever going to satisfy me? Is it ever going to give me what I want? I did the same thing with body image and with eating and all that. And it's like, what am I doing that for? Is it for compliments from people? And it's like you get so in your head about like if people are going to comment on your body or if people are going to comment on your looks. And then they do. And it's so fleeting. Like it's like, that doesn't change me. Yeah. It doesn't make me go, oh, now I'm loved. Now I'm chosen.

Now I look great. It actually just feeds it more to like want to do more, produce more, look better, all this stuff. And so it's so important that you stop and go like, what am I, am I really going to find it in this, you know? Hey, y'all, it's Kelly Clarkson with Wayfair. Ever order furniture online and wonder what if? Like, what if it doesn't hold up? That sofa was four days old. You should have ordered from Wayfair.

With Wayfair, there's no what if. Just style you love and quality you can trust. Visit Wayfair.ca. I think celebrity, like, culture is a really good example of this in fame. Dr. Aiman speaks to this a lot. He's been on a podcast several times, but he's like, he's been, my personal doctor has really helped me a lot. But he's also been the doctor to a lot of very well-known celebrities. And he helps people who got famous at a young age because something happens to your brain where it's like, you know, you get dopamine hits by all these things.

But then it's like that part of your brain becomes completely numb to it. because it's like you've gotten so much of it that you actually stopped, like, you don't feel it anymore. So then that leads people to, like, drugs and alcohol is like anything that they just want to, like, feel and experience. And that's, like, a really good example of, like, it will never be enough. Like, there's never going to be enough followers for you to feel like, oh, I'm actually loved because this many people like me. Or there's never going to be, like, enough compliments or enough things. It's like that just never can satisfy you, you know? And so that's why it's so important to stop and be like, what am I doing in this train of thinking with my body or this train of thinking with these people or whatever it is?

Because I think you've seen in celebrities, how could they feel that way? They have all these things. But that just goes to show the things of the world can't satisfy the things of the soul. Like we were created to be satisfied in the Lord alone and the glory of God. So, man, so good. I just feel like so many people are listening to this. is like, if I heard this at 18, I wouldn't even know what to do with it because that was so where I was.

But I think if you are 18 and you're listening to this and you're going, that's so where I am, it really is as simple as stopping right now, listening to this podcast, just stopping. And just connecting with the Lord, God, I don't want to continue to search for the things that I can only find in you. Help me to be satisfied in you alone. And then call somebody. Don't just experience this alone. Like Grace found Lauren and different friends and mentors and her mom.

I know it was so close. Like call your mom. Call your friend. Call a mentor. Call a pastor, a youth pastor. And like talk this out. And don't let it just be done alone because this is the start of walking with the Lord in a really beautiful way. This is such a good conversation.

Shall we go to the next? Hey, Cindy. I am a recent college graduate. to it. I listened to you throughout college, watched All of Duck Dynasty, and I love that your episodes sort of tailor to everyone no matter what guests you have on, but I wanted to know a little bit about feeling lost, about the season I'm in. I don't know exactly where God's leading me. I have a lot of dreams and goals and some opportunities in front of me, but I struggle with trusting the outcome in this. I feel like it's in some ways embarrassing. I know it's not,

but I just can't figure out how to surrender my future fully to God, but I can't see what's ahead. So my question to you is how do you know when to keep pushing towards something versus waiting and trusting? And how can you really feel discernment and know that versus anxiety? Thank you. That's a good question. I wish she was sitting right here because I want to be like, what part makes you feel embarrassed? Do you feel embarrassed that you're not where you wish you were? Do you feel embarrassed that you don't trust the Lord?

Because I feel like that's such a common, like I can relate to that feeling of feeling embarrassed. And a lot of times for me it's like maybe I feel embarrassed because I thought it was going to be better than it looks, you know, or whatnot. So I'm so intrigued by that aspect of the question. But also that idea of like when do you discern when it's just not working, you're supposed to give up or when do you keep plowing the ground? It's a great question. What are your thoughts? I said this to you the other night, but I think sometimes if you're trying to make an initial decision, it's easy to think like there is a right choice and there's a wrong choice and God

has a right choice for me and a wrong one. And it's up to me to figure out which one is which. And if I make the wrong choice, it's going to take me down a terrible path. And I was telling Sadie, our friend Sarah, we were at a women's conference that you spoke at in Franklin years and years ago. and there was a girl in our small group who was trying to figure out where God wanted her to go to college and what her next step was. And she was just like, I don't know which college God wants me to go to. And Sarah said something to the effect of God gives us choice because he loves us.

Like he wants us to have choices. And he's not sitting up there saying one choice is right and one choice is wrong. Like a lot of times both can be right if you're honoring God in whichever choice you make. And so that if you're making an initial decision would be like, it might not be that there's one right and one wrong. It's just like, am I honoring God and I seeking him in whichever direction I'm going? And then I think for when to continue to pursue something and like how do you know discernment in peace, I think to me, well, two things I'll say. One, one of the best books I've ever read is Walking with God, How to Hear His Voice by John Eldridge.

Have you read that? Great book. And it's just really really, practical about like how how to hear from the Lord and how to discern. And one of the things that he talks about like an exercise that he does is that when he's trying to make a decision, he tries on different answers because he asks God about everything. Like should I go on this trip? Should I like he consults the Lord on every decision that he makes. And he talks about how when he's making decisions, he'll like sit with one of the past that he could take. Let's say should I go on this trip. Yes, I'm going to go on this trip. And as he like lets that play out, he thinks, am I getting worked up?

Am I feeling anxious about it? Or do I feel complete peace? And then he tries on the other answer and like sits in that and sits with God and ask him, is this what I'm supposed to do? And then do I feel anxious about it? Do I feel peace? And he said a lot of times like one path as I'm praying into it will give me complete peace. And it's like that's what the Lord says.

Also I think a lot of times people want to hear from the Lord. And so they're looking for him to tell them something or giving them a sign and it's like we have a book you know like he might not ride it in the sky in an airplane or like show you a bumblebee or whatever the thing is that you're looking for but it's like is the decision that I'm making going to lead me to things that are life and do they line up with what he tells me to do in scripture and just using that kind of as your your compass good and I think sometimes we're too in the sky like totally we're so looking for the sign that we're actually just not being practical and I think a lot of decisions are made out of logistics sometimes, you know, and I think that doesn't

mean that the Lord's not in it. I think sometimes the Lord uses that to help you know, you know, okay, this door's closing, this door is opening. One prayer we always pray is God, give us green lights. This is right. Give us a red light. If this is wrong, please don't give me yellow. Like, I don't want the like, I'm not sure. Like either it's like, this is just opening or this is closing. And God has done that. Now, there are times. where I'm like, I'm not sure, Lord, is this you, is this not? And I think what you said is true. I think that God is, God gives us free will. God allows us to make decisions, which is such an honor and a gift that God would entrust us with our life, you know, which is his. And just to go,

okay, God, I think I want to do this. I want to pursue it. And then knowing that like if I walk through the store and that fails, that's not that I did it wrong or that's not that God wasn't in it. or that's not to overthink it in that. It's that I tried and I learned and now I'll take what I learned from this and I'll step into it in a new way. I currently have something where I've started like a dream

with something so long ago. I mean like 10 years ago. I have tried to fulfill this and followed the Lord and listen to the Lord and it's a godly thing and it's a ministry-driven thing. So many times, failed so many times. still plowing the ground for it because I really believe in what I what's on my heart to do. I also find a lot of like joy in it.

I feel like it's so like something that the Lord put in me. Sometimes I've been like, okay, why isn't this working? Lord, you know, if it feels like such a good thing, like why isn't it? It's like, okay, I don't know the why. But I also know that I'm supposed to keep doing it. And so I'll keep doing it. But if my family was dependent on that and like it wasn't working and, you know, like I was losing a bunch of money or it didn't make sense for anybody and like then that would be different. I think that's when you got to go, okay, this actually might be the time to stop because it's putting everyone else in a bad place.

It's not putting anybody in a bad place. You know, we're doing exactly what we need to do in other areas. But it is a dream of my heart. I'm going to continue to plow the ground for it because I actually believe in it. And we kind of talk about something similar that you're doing. and it's like, I don't really know if it makes sense completely. There are some aspects of it. It all makes sense, but I feel so wholeheartedly I'm supposed to do it.

And my husband's for it and my family's for it and my small groups for it. Well, then do it. You know, if everyone around you's going, hey, this doesn't make sense. You're putting me out. I don't think that you're doing the right. Then that might be like the sign to go, okay, I'm not supposed to do this. You know, so I think that's good discernment. And it's like, okay, people around me say this is good.

People around me say this is bad. And it's not just like people around you like noise. It's like your parents, your husband, your family, your small group, ones who love you and are for you. And I think letting them speak in goes a long way. It's kind of hard to answer this question. And I tighten the answer because there's so many complexities. I'm thinking about so many different people who are listening with different ears. I don't want them to hear me say, keep going.

And it's like everyone around them's going, we're trying to tell her to stop. And so you got to listen to the people in your life. give you some solid advice. I think we have one more. Hi, Sadie. This is Ellie. I am a college student who just finished up her first year and I've been listening to your podcast all throughout high school and it has just been very formative in my faith journey.

So thank you. My question today is about this verse. As a father has compassion on his children. So the Lord has compassion on those who fear him. And I feel like I can really accept that part about how the Lord has shows us grace and compassion. But that second part, what it means to fear the Lord is something that I struggle having clarity on. And recently I just have been turning to distractions like social media,

staying up way too late to the point where I feel like it's almost addiction or burden in my life. And I really want to surrender that to the Lord. And I think having clarity on that verse would really help me with that. Thank you. It's really good. You want to speak into it? Yeah, a couple thoughts. One, I just feel like there's such a misconception of what fear is when you fear

God. Because it's not anxiety or like quaking in your boots over God. It's just a deep, deep reverence for who God is and his power and like an awe of him. And so I think so when you read fear, like I substitute it with bad. Yeah. But when I read it, I try to substitute it with like a deep respect and reverence and awe of who God is and what he's capable of and all that he's done. It's really good. Versus like, I'm terrified of you. The other thing I was going to say on the side of scrolling and turn into your phone, we were laughing the other night because I just started the ruthless elimination of hurry by John Mark Comer, literally on the flight here. And I'm like 10 pages in. But literally one of the first things the book says is that the average person grabs their phone or turns their touch of their phone 2,600 times a day.

Which is nuts. And it was so crazy because even, as I was reading on an airplane, like in airplane mode with only my text messages enabled, the whole time it was like, z, z, z, while I was reading. And I'm like, yeah, that tracks, because I've gotten 10 text messages while I've been reading these 10 pages. And my instinct is just to pause what I'm doing and touch it or pick it up. But, I mean, I've heard great things about this book. So maybe reading that could be helpful. But to me, I was just like, man, how quick are we to numb with that when we were talking earlier about like, like, like searching, I think an easy place for anybody, whether you're a mom or in college, like

your phone is a place that people go to like numb out or escape. But in reality, it just adds more stimulation to your life. And so it's so interesting that the place that we go to escape and numb out is actually causing us more stress, anxiety stimulation. But I thought that 2,600 number was crazy and already just reading it. I'm like, man, the whole premise of the book is cutting out hurry in your life and cutting out, like having so much to do and always being stimulated. And that's something that I'm trying to apply in my own life right now. I was thinking about this verse because she was talking about like her phone, speaking of a many times. I took it off here for the moment to look that up. She was talking about like it feels

like it's becoming an addiction. And I've felt that so many times in my life with like whether it's social media or just my phone in general. And I feel like in those times I'm responsible to like delete the app or like change my screen time or be more disciplined. And it's on me to know whenever that is like teeter in the line of almost like idolatry, you know, of like idolizing an app or being distracted or even an addiction. And I love this verse because it's so helpful in times like this. But it's James 417. It says so whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it. for him, it is a sin. And I go back to that a lot because people ask like, okay, well, is this okay, or is it not okay? Or this is a gray area in scripture, this is that. And it's like, yes,

there are like gray areas at times in scripture, but the Holy Spirit is in you to convict. And if the Holy Spirit is convicting you and you are disobedient to the conviction of the spirit, for you, that's a sin. Now, I can stay up on my phone until midnight. In my might not be a sin. You, it might be because the Lord's convicting you with something saying, hey, you're addicted. You need to take time off. And if you're unwilling to like lay it aside and delete it, I think one, that is a lack of fear of the Lord back to the question, back to going to like, okay, do I fear you enough, Lord? Not fear and I'm afraid. Fear and I respect you enough. I love you you enough. I trust your voice to go, I'm going to delete this. It's something I love. It's something

I cling to, but I trust you more than this thing. I fear you more out of respect and love and reverence than I do this thing. And then it's deleting it and taking town with the Lord to get your heart right. And then going back to it in a healthier place. And then if it becomes a pattern again, delete it. Same book in James, but it says, it says, then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin. And sin when it is fully grown, brings forth death.

And I always think about that too because there's like a pattern to sin almost. It's like it starts small. It's conceived. And then it brings like gives birth to death. And I was thinking about like as someone who's like been pregnant. And it's like there's a nine month period. And it's like some of those things start really small. It's like, oh, I'm just on my phone throwing TikTok like everybody else does.

Well, then nine months later you're doing the same thing. And now you're anxious. You've seen things you shouldn't have seen. You're following people you shouldn't follow. You've compared yourself so much. and all of a sudden, what started as this little thing that was conceived now is producing out of me insecurity, it's producing out of me anxiety, it's producing out of me. I haven't prayed in nine months because I've just been watching TikTok. I haven't met with the Lord. That was a sermon,

Ben Stewart preached that I love so much about our phones. And he was talking about how we've lost our all because you can't be in awe of something when you're distracted. And it's like if I'm constantly checking my phone, like, how can I be in all of the glory of God? Like, how can I be in the presence of the Lord? And in the presence of the Lord is where you gain the fear of the Lord, the reverence of the Lord, the respect of the Lord, because you see the Lord, you know? And so I think a lot of our lack of fear is our lack of reverence, our lack of knowing God. But fear of the Lord is so important because I think the fear of the Lord helps you with your decision making, helps you stay confident in who you are, where you're at.

I mean, for me, if it's like fear the Lord, fear of man, if I didn't fear the Lord, I would crumble to the opinion of man every single day on social media. Through podcasting, I would not say the things I say. I would not lean into the things I lean into because I'd be like, oh, people are not going to like that or that's not going to be very popular or whatever. But because I fear the Lord, I can walk in the path the Lord has laid for me. So I think this is a really important conversation because I think fear the Lord is a essential part of a walk with the Lord. But I do think you're right that when we hear fear,

we associate it with negative things and we go, what? I shouldn't be afraid. Yeah. It's not fear and you're scared like the verse says. There's compassion and there's grace. It's fear and that you just, it's like the awestruck wonder of God. Yeah. And that changes everything about your walk with God. Yeah. There's a verse two in Proverbs. It's Proverbs 2412. And it says, once our eyes have been open we can't pretend we don't know what to do for god who weighs our hearts and keeps our souls knows that we know and holds us responsible to act whoosh sheesh literally been one of my favorite verses throughout my life that is great 24 17 12 well um that was so good say it again it says uh once our eyes have been open we can't pretend we don't know what to do for god who weighs

our hearts and keeps our souls, knows that we know and holds us responsible to act. And that applies, I think, for things you're convicted to and convicted about and things you're called to, you know. Like, he could be convicting you to put your phone up. He knows that you, he knows that you're convicted, because he convicted you, and then he holds you responsible to act. Same as if he calls you to something. It's like, he weighs your heart and keeps your soul. He knows that you know, and he holds you responsible to act. It's great. Oh, that was so good. this is a good one to end on. This is a Bible study and I love it. Thanks, Grace, for coming on the podcast. Thanks for answering great questions and being a great friend. Of course. Awesome.

Okay, we're back. We are so back. We had to come back because I left out a crucial question. Grace, what's the best piece of advice you've ever been given? Well, we were laughing because literally when you asked Millerian to come on the podcast, I said, what are you going to say for the best piece of advice you've been given? And she said, I'm going to give the advice that you gave me. me, which is don't take criticism from someone you wouldn't take advice from. And as soon as she said it, I was like, ooh, that would have been mine. And I don't know who told me that. But thankfully, I've had a little bit of time to think about it. And the one that I've landed on, it's so hard to pick like a best piece, but something we say a lot is clear as kind. Yes. And I would add to that, and I think you can be clear and kind. And I was thinking, as I was thinking about it,

I had this flashback, and you might not even remember this, but there was one Sunday when y'all, I think it was when you were living in Nashville, or maybe it was, you were back visiting, but we were at church at T.B. Co. and y'all were there. And there was a girl that I think maybe y'all had hung out with that weekend, who was also at church, and we had lunch plans afterwards. And this girl came up and was talking to us, and I was like, she said, what are y'all doing after this? And I was like, well, we're getting lunch and kind of out of just, like, obligation. I was like, you're welcome to join. And in my heart of hearts I was looking forward to just getting lunch to the four of us, like me, you, Davy, and Christian. But I just felt kind of obligated in that moment to invite her, which not that inviting

people to do things is bad. But you reached out to her after and said, like, hey, we've really been looking forward to just having time as couples with the Hackett's. We love you. We were so glad to see you this weekend. But we're just going to go to lunch with them. We'll catch up next time I'm in town. And honestly, I was like, wow. I remember doing that. And that makes it. I was like, what? But that is funny. But it was so good because you said it in such a loving way that it really stuck out to me because I'm like, why? I feel the same way. Like I wanted to get lunch the four of us. So why did I say you should come? I mean, obviously you can do things like that to be kind. But I just loved the way that you handled it. And you were like so clear, but you were so kind in the way that you did it. And I just think that advice like clear is kind. And you can be clear and kind. Spans across. all situations like in your marriage. I remember we went to dinner with some friends and she was like, if I, like it means a lot to me when my husband tells me that I look pretty like my love language just words of affirmation, which is mine too. She was like, but I can't always just expect him to

say what I want him to hear. Like I have to be clear and communicate. So literally sometimes I'll be like him be like, if you think I'll look pretty, will you tell me that I like pretty tonight? And that stuck out to me or like in friendships being clear in your communication, in your workplace, being clear in your communication. Because if you're not clear and you don't, if you're not clear, it leads to resentment. Yeah. And if you're not kind, it leads to friction in the conversation.

So I'm like, clear is kind and you can be clear and kind. That is so good. I actually, that's so funny that you reminded me of that story because I don't necessarily remember that, but I do, I can see me doing that. But because I always say that. I'll always say clear is kind and kind is clear. And I think that it is so important to be clear with people

and it's the kindest thing you can do because it is the worst to me when you find out someone was not clear to you and then you find out like they set all the stuff behind your back and I'm like, why don't you just tell me? I would have just loved so much more if you would just would have told me face to face.

I stand by that. And sometimes that makes four hard conversations because it's like to be clear, I have to be honest, but at the same time, I can do that lace in like so much kindness and genuinely mean it. And I think like I've seen people do that for me in my life

and I'm like so grateful every time you're like, thank you so much for just telling me. And that totally makes sense or that's cool. And so that's cool that you brought that out because I stand by that. We say that in our office all the time. Like, there's kind of clear. Me and Steph say that you to each other all the time. So that's funny.

I love that.