WHOA That's Good Podcast - How to Know When It's Safe to TRUST Somebody | Sadie Robertson Huff & Dr. Henry Cloud

Episode Date: April 12, 2023

"Is it safe to trust this person?" is a question we ALL need to ask of the people we bring into our lives. Sadie is talking with bestselling author and clinical expert, Dr. Henry Cloud about all things to do with trust: earning it, fixing it when it's broken, how to give it and even when to withhold it. Sadie shares a very recent example of why trust is such an important factor when bringing new people into our worlds and why trust and boundaries are SO important to her — she's been hurt by these things in the past! Dr. Cloud encourages us in how we can truly restore trust from past relationships and not bring that into new relationships. Plus, why it's important to give yourself space to evaluate if a person really IS trustworthy. Sadie and Dr. Cloud also speak about the wisdom of Scripture and how it's backed up and aligned with so much of neuroscience, which isn't surprising at all and more proof that our Creator knows everything about us and how we're wired. And don't miss Sadie's story about why she recoiled when Christian tried calling her "Pumpkin" one time.  https://helixsleep.com/sadie — Get up to 20% OFF AND 2 free pillows! https://athleticgreens.com/whoa — Get a FREE 1-year supply of Vitamin D & 5 FREE travel packs with your first purchase! https://www.trymiracle.com/whoa — Get 40% off + 3 FREE towels with code WHOA at checkout! - Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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He's going to be joining us on the podcast today. If you don't know who Henry Cloud is, you're definitely living under a rock. You definitely know his books. He's written over 46 books. If I have that right including the iconic Boundary's book which was actually super huge in my life and his new book which I'm gonna get him to hold up and just a minute because I Took the cover off mine because I was reading it so intently and the cover

I was like I got to get this off second just keep flipping through the pages, but it's called trust and it is so So good we all could use a lesson and trust because it's so important for our lives. So Dr. Henry Cloud welcome to the What's Good Podcast. Please hold up your lovely new book. We are so excited to have you on and talk about it. There it is. There it is. Well thank you for taking the time to be on this podcast. It's good to be with you. You know, wait to hear all the incredible things you have to say, I'm taking notes. Oh, yeah, well, you know what? I think that's a reverse thing.

I'm gonna be taking your notes. I got my pen ready. There have been several times I've been interviewing people, and I forget I'm the interviewer because I'm like, gosh, this is so good. I'm taking it in and I know that this is gonna be one of those episodes. But I was telling him right before he got on that,

when I was about 20 years old, I went to counseling for the first time I had been in an interesting relationship dynamic with someone that I didn't know. Oh, that's a good word. I like that. I like that's an interesting dynamic. Interesting dynamic.

That's good. That's good. It was interesting. And I didn't really realize how unhealthy it had gotten until a couple of my friends had kind of caught it out and then I realized, well, like, this is really unhealthy. I decided to go to counseling because I didn't really know what to do with all of this, you know, all of this weight that it honestly felt like had just all of a sudden dropped and it had been there for a while but just confusing things. So I went to counseling and first thing my counselor did was she recommended the book boundaries. And when I'm home and read it,

listen to the audio tape of it. And it was just a tremendous help in my life and helped me just really start to get out of that relationship in a proper way. And I'm so thankful for that when I look back at that season of my life that was interesting. I'm so thankful for just some of those things that you wrote in that book to help me get out of it. And so thank you for writing that book. I wanna talk for a second about that book because I think it is so important for writing that book. I want to talk for a second about that book

because I think it is so important for people to read. And you were just telling me about your daughters trying to get them to read the boundaries of the shading book. And that was pretty hilarious. So tell me about your daughters. And then also just for a lot of people who are young listening to this podcast,

just the importance of setting those boundaries. Well, when you're a psychologist and you have daughters that turn teenagers, everybody's kind of sticking it to, oh, I got teenage daughters now. Let's see how you do with that, you know what? And so one thing that they would always say to me when they got to be that age, they said, oh, so you got teenage daughters dating now,

you get to tell them to read batteries and dating, and I said, you know teenage daughters dating now you get telling to read batteries and dating and I said, you know my daughter sir So sir but he's like did I get me to copy and I said look you don't have to read this I just want you to hold it between your knees to your 30 and you will you will avoid so many problems you all believe It's true. It's true. That's a good boundary right there. That made me laugh. But out of the series, no, I mean, people who are young don't always think to read books like boundaries. But I think, you know, for some people like me at just 20 years old, I had already been in relationships that had caused me to get to the

point where I realized I really need to set some boundaries. And it was kind of to the point where I was already really hurt. and it was a hurtful situation. But for some people they haven't been in those types of relationships, but how important is it even to read stuff like that to prevent walking into situations where you get in and all the sudden the boundaries just get way crossed? Oh wow, you know you you said something really, really, um, profound actually. You said you had this big weight was on you, you know, it sort of fell in that moment, but then you said, I realized I've been carrying for a while. And sometimes if people don't have good

boundaries, or like we'll talk about today. You kind of trusted the wrong person because there's some things you didn't see It's kind of like a tooth, you know It cavity starts It's not enough to right now. She'll on the other side of my mouth You know, I'll I'll take care of it later, but but it it just takes up more and more of your heart and soul and it gets way to you and then at one point So my says I gotta do something about this. Yeah, this is this is hurting more than it should and that's certainly a big time to do it, but to your point you know if we all look back at our lives

What if we had set those boundaries early and hadn't gone down a certain road with a certain person? You know, that's the deal about what the trust book is about that if you look back, we need like to kind of replay things and have died differently. Well, that's prevention, like you're saying,

it's a big part of this. It's good. I'm so excited to talk about the whole trust book and the whole idea and I have so many questions on it because I do think that you're right. The boundaries conversation and the trust conversation really does bleed and go hand and hand and so I'm excited to talk about that before. Well you know it's true because once you start sometimes you feel something in a relationship or there's a betrayal or it's just a felony or a misdemeanor you know do I go forward or do I not well at that moment usually some boundaries are gonna be required. So they do very much intertwine with each other. You just said something though,

in that the already made me start asking my own questions. You know, I'll write these questions and you know, it has to do with stuff I've learned from the book and stuff, but then you know, you get into the conversation and someone says something and you're like, okay, hold on, we're going a different direction real fast. Because you said a lot of it has to do with like,

maybe you trusted the wrong person. And I think that, you know, sometimes in life, it's really obvious who the wrong people are. And sometimes it's not obvious who the wrong people are. And I think, you know, that's the hard part. And some of the wrong people are really good at kind of, yes. You know, charm, and you up thinking they're the right people.

Oh, yeah. Been there several times in my life. This is why this has led me to your books. But I love how you talk about in the book. There's this question that we are wired to ask ourselves, is it safe? Well, I'm a person who, and I want to get to that, but I'm a person who is like typically a little bit more fearful, have, have struggled with anxiety in the past. And so I'm always asking the question, is this safe? But then what I've found is it's

the people that I've ended up in relationship with that have ended up, you know, having some hurtful things. I didn't ask that question because for some reason, they just actually seemed really safe. And I think that some people, that's like in church scenarios, people do that in. And for me, it was kind of a church situation. Maybe it's someone who is really charming and it just, they seem really awesome. And so, is it always important to ask yourself that question or is that and is that question always something that comes up or do some case scenarios, you know, you just say, oh, this is safe because what I've found is I should have always asked that question. And maybe I did internally, but I just quickly answered it without actually

going through the right steps to realize if it was safe or not. [♪ music playing in background, you'll get so fun whenever summer comes around because there's so many different ways to stay active. We love tennis, obviously, we love swimming, we love going on walks, just being outside, playing basketball, whatever it is. Being healthy and active as a family

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You know, for the last, what hour, maybe minutes, you've been breathing, right? And you hadn't thought about it. Well, the reason is your system is wired at the millisecond of every day to ask the question is in safe and so Your your system is told you they are safe. You just keep reading don't think about it until you smell a few And then I'll send you go You know, what's that? Well We have to ask the question is in safe in relationships and you bring up a good point? Sometimes we automatically check that off because they're a friend of somebody that I know

and they really trust them or are a men of matured or you know they're got a good job or you know they come from a good community or a family or whatever And so we kind of check off a box real quickly, but the other problem with that is sometimes, and in the book, I'll talk about five things you go check out. And sometimes a couple of them look really good. It will hit go then. But we're really not asking the question for the context that I am choosing to take the next step of trust with this person. They might have been safe for one context for good in some way trustworthy, but are they good for the next step? You know, we're friends that do our hire. You know, we're I know of pretty well, but the data, you know,

there's a lot of people that qualify as good boyfriends, but they're not good husband. And so it's really trust. When you get into your heart, you get into your wallet, you get into the significant aspects of your life. You got to ask, is this person going to be able to deliver in all the ways I need them to deliver in the context I'm choosing? So it's a big question. It's good. So I love the five different questions.

I mean, you probably, you probably, you look back at some fast, fast boyfriends might have been great, but they weren't husband material. Yeah. No, it's so true. It's so true that you can trust people in one scenario, but not for every scenario. And I think that's a good thing to point out, because yes, I definitely have been in situations like that where even a good friend, but not a good boyfriend, even, you know, it's like, you were a great friend,

but when we started dating, my gosh, that was not something that needed to happen. And so, yeah, you're absolutely right. I love the five questions that you put in, or just the five things to look for in people. I wrote them down, understanding, mode of ability, character, and track record. And obviously, he breaks us down in his book

to get fully understand with that. But I thought, this is so good. And you even wrote about how like this is going to be a manual for people to go back and look at in life. And I was thinking about that just even just with relationships that I have. Oh man, this is such a good tool to use as I think through this. And you use the example of, you know, you finding a doctor that was right to do your knee replacement

and kind of going through this. And I love how like you give yourself the space to ask these questions. And I think that sometimes like, at least for me, I almost have felt guilty at times for like taking the time to evaluate if I trust someone because it makes me look like an un, like I'm not very trust in the Yeah like I'm judgmental or I don't want to be like that

and so then I'm like okay I'm being over dramatic or ridiculous but can you speak to just the person that might feel like that who feels that maybe they feel guilty in a way I was like oh I'm being judgmental and so you know I'm giving myself too much of they don't think I'm trusting. And maybe the other people's even, the person's even saying to them, just trust me, just trust me. How important is it that we do allow ourselves the space to ask ourselves these five things

or even just a space to evaluate the five things? Think about this space you allow yourself between when the doorbell rings. And you first hear it, and you actually open the door. I mean, you take space to go down there and you look through the window and who is this? Have I ever seen them before? Do they have credentials? Are they hearing a God? We always need to take space and then you kind of check it out. You talk to them and maybe, oh yeah, my neighbor said, oh yeah, come on in. So there's a process in trusted people.

And you should never feel guilty about asking the question, is it okay to go the next step? It's an okay to even, somebody's asking you for information. You know, you're out to dinner with somebody, with a group, or there, they're wanting to know something about this and the other, you know, you know what, it's not really something I feel comfortable sharing right now. Talk about another topic. I mean, space is always really, really important to take the next step. And the other thing is a lot of times to your point about feeling guilt. You know, well, say, well, this is a, this person is really

honest and they would never lie to me, I trust him. We trust him to not lie to you. But that's different than trusting them in the way that you're going to have to trust. Yeah. And so that's where we need to start to check off the boxes. You know, just like the first one, which is does this person understand me? And you know, we trust somebody when we feel like this person gets me. They know what hurts me. They know what I like. They know what I don't like.

They know what I'm afraid of. And they're only going to get that hour they're going to ever get that unless they're really listen to me. You know, they're just not talking. So let's say, you know, a lot of your your your listeners and viewers are seeing them and they go out on the date. And you know, maybe a couple days and they really this person is so cool, and maybe a couple of days. And they really, this person is so cool,

they're so charming and fine, that's the other. But if you just taken the first box and ask yourself the question, wait a minute, how much do they ask about me? You know, see, my wife's talked about the Elmer Holder, all of this, and you walk away, and if you really check the end you kind of feel it unknown. But so many other things are sizzly right? It looks good. But people in the days he's

crunched it's because you might be with a really self-centered person. Yeah gosh that's so good. I mean I really wanted to ask that question and the answer is per root because I feel like I went through hiring someone recently who is going to do a lot of work at our house and help out with our kids. I'll say kids because about time a second and you know that's like, thank you. And that's like a really big deal. I mean especially like if someone's gonna watch your kid or be in your house, like you wanna make sure you really trust them. And so it took me like a long time

and a long process of interviewing and calling people who knew her and references and all these different things. And it's like, I wanna make sure like this is a good fit, you know? And then finally, you know, we kinda are almost there to, we had a couple of test days and all the things. And I mean, I know she was feeling that I was really dragging this out. And I was.

And then finally, it was like the last thing. And I said, hey, the last thing, if it would be okay, I would love for my husband to get to go have lunch with your husband. And she goes, she said, okay. And then she goes, man, you for my husband to get to go have lunch with your husband. And she goes, she said, okay, and then she goes, man, you're really trying to make sure we're not crazy, aren't you? And I said, yeah, I kind of laugh, but I was like, actually, yes, I was like, that's my responsibility to make sure that who comes in our home is safe, you know. And I just told her and I said to be honest, you know, I come from that ground where we have a large following and I have seen crazy.

And so I really have to make sure that this is, you know, appropriate and everything. And it was good because I gave her a little understanding as to why, you know, I do take a lot of time and she understood and her and my, our husband's had lunch and it was great and then we hired her. That was like, okay, good. And then I had to shift though. And you're right though, because crazy can get in the door. Sometimes not from the person, but who they're connected to. Oh, so true. Yeah. Like even in the dating world,

do you know their friends? Yeah. Yeah, because you're gonna learn a lot. You see who they're connected to, or you know, crazy gets in the door in a lot of different ways. So, yeah, you said something else, so it's really important. I walked

people to Europe. You said that when you were requiring these, she said, wow, you're really going to, but you said that she was okay with that. All right. Now, how many times in a relationship? So, I say, you know, you you said you were gonna be over at so and so's but but you know after the store that's how you want we're and the immediate response is what you don't trust me well I did until you said that yeah yeah because your person was open the hall, oh, I'm sorry, look at that. Well, yeah, now I was down, you know, and they don't mind being a question because they care about you feeling okay. But that, what are you questioning my integrity?

Well, yeah, I am. And none of us is above being a question. And we are welcome there. Would somebody use me that response? Big red flag. That's so true. It's a narcissistic entitlement. Yeah. That I'm entitled to your trust. No, trust is our. Wow. So it's a really good 13 year old response, but you know, much older than that would be so good. I'm so glad you said that. I think that is going to help a lot of people because yeah, you're not entitled to that dress. Yo, what is more satisfying than a good night's sleep? It's a total game changer. He like sleep has my back literally with an awesome mattress

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Just go to HelixSap.com slash saty. Again, this is their best offer yet and it won't last long with helix better sleep can start now. Just go to helixleap.com slash saty. I'll tell you a funny story because I had no our listeners, well, this is hilarious.

And I don't think I've ever told this story before, but I was dating this guy and it was pretty brief because of this reason that I'm about to share but he was, you know, a pretty popular person and you know we both weren't known and so you gotta be careful because you know a lot of people be taking your picture and all this stuff keep you accountable. And so we were texting one night and he told me that he was at home and he was studying or whatever. And then later I get tagged on these pictures, an Instagram because people knew we were dating

of him at a club with these girls. And I see this picture and I realize it's tonight and then I see other pictures pop up on his tag pictures you know people's it pictures so I like texted I was like I thought you were you know studying and I see these pictures and he calls me and the first thing he says was he goes pumpkin,, that's literally what he said. He doesn't even call me pumpkin, pumpkin, but that is what came out of his mouth. And big red flag. And like after he said pumpkin, he something along the lines, if you got to do, trust me, like whatever it was.

And then my phone died. And I remember being with my mom and being like, he just literally called me pumpkin, pumpkin, and my phone died. I just think I should never call him back. I don't literally called me pumpkin pumpkin and my phone died. I just think I should never call him back. I don't think I'm gonna plug my phone in. I'm not plugging it in. The phone will remain dead forever. This is just gonna be the end of this relationship.

And of course, I did plug him up, and it ended up, I think I wanna say that was the night we broke up, I can't really remember exactly, but I remember even now I'm married to an awesome trustworthy person, but one day he called me pumpkin spice and I was like, no, we're gonna ditch the pumpkin. The pumpkin can never come back. But it's true, it's like.

You said, yeah, I might be a pumpkin, but you're looking a lot like a jack-a-lantern, it's where you look. Right. That's all I feel. I was like, no. So anyways, it is true though, when people like, you know, you question them or whatever and they start getting offensive and it's like, well, you are actually not where you said

you were. So there's a reason why I would be frustrated and there's a reason why the trust that this moment is broken. And I feel like, you know, that was really cool that she did welcome that in. And I actually thought that was a cool response too, that she's like, I understand, like you're just trying to make sure we're not crazy. And I said, yeah, I mean, that is true. And then she was like, okay, yeah, like I would,

I'll ask my husband that would be great. And that was the thing because I feel the same way that I've noticed just sometimes it's not the person that you're with that invites crazy in But it's the people that they are around and I think that that's right trust and those boundaries come into play because even hiring her and letting her into my home That doesn't mean I let you know my daughter go to Everybody else's home with her, you know, it's like I still have to protect that that space and those people and so I do think like if you are listening to this

and you have not read boundaries, I encourage you to read both of these books because so much of it does intertwine. And the reason why I do take these things seriously is because I have been hurt by these things. It's because I have seen when boundaries get out of place. I have seen broken trust. And for me, I had been in a time of my life.

And I think I want you to speak to this a little bit where I did not trust people. I was not trusting a people. And that was really prohibiting in my life because I wasn't making friends. And I love friends and I love having friends. And I wasn't. And so there had to be a shift in me even with hiring this person as an example. Yes, I can question. I can do this. But then when I decided to trust her, I needed to trust her, you know, and start a relationship an example. Yes, I can question, I can do this. But then when I decided to trust her, I needed to trust her, you know, and start a relationship with her. And, you know, it was the same thing with friendship.

You talked to that two things that really go together is, you know, you said, okay, it struggles with anxiety, right? So, when someone has anxiety, that their whole system is a little bit Hyper-Vigilment, you know like this is person gonna might be anxious if I go to that party or go to the other tank That next day up or leave the house or whatever it is and This is why

having a little checklist Can actually be a tool with anxiety because it can it can give you a little safe lane to take the next step. If I know if I know all these things are there and one of the things about you know deal with anxiety and get the over anxiety is you got to take it out of this big subjective everything is scary you know kind of map to be able to object, it will say, everything might be scared, but this little step I can take, because anxiety has always got a component of the cure in taking little baby steps where we felt like, you

know, it wasn't safe. It's good. And the thing about trust is, it's like a coin, you know, there's heads and tails to it. And our trust muscle is not perfect. Okay, so we're going to have false positives. We're going to trust somebody when we shouldn't. But on the other side, to your point, we're going to not trust and not let go when sometimes we really should because that's the only way to be

free. It's good. You know and to scale your life. I mean if you hard somebody to watch you kid and you can't and they are trustworthy and you can't let go, well you're going to be a helicopter mom to the Navy who's watching. Yeah. And now you can't go off and do what you needed to do. Right. When you could be for me. It's right. It's so good. I mean, it's so true. And I've seen it in so many different scenarios in my life. For instance, and maybe you can speak to this, just people's trust you have been broken. And then whenever they're in a new relationship, like, how do you get past the past, I guess, because for me, so when I started dating my husband now,

I really tried to go in, like, you know, trusting and just a new person, because I wasn't a new person that's how we started dating as far as who I was in past relationships, because my life with God had changed me, you know, and so I wasn't't as jealous as I used to be. I wasn't controlling. Like God had renewed so much in me

that I was stepping into this as a healthy person. And we had a really healthy dating life. And this one night, it was, we were, I think, just engaged. And I, he was at his house or whatever and with his family and I saw on my friends that his location was like at this at like bone fish girl,

something like so it wasn't anything bad, it was like bone fish girl. But for me, like it literally made me like get so anxious and I got so upset with him that he didn't tell me that he went to bone fish girl. And he was like, why are got so upset with him that he didn't tell me that he went to Bonefish Grill. And he was like, why are you so upset about this? It's like because you didn't tell me, because I thought you were home. All this stuff. Well, you know, later it kind of comes out that I told him I said, well, I was in a relationship and I've shared a little bit just one example of

where a guy did tell me he was home and turns out he was at the club and girls are taking pictures of him. So when I see both of his girl when I thought it was a house, it doesn't matter what it is, it wasn't the house, you know, and I overreacted though and I put on him what I like my hurt that I experienced from past relationships. And so for people who have had genuine reasons for like trust to be broken in their life, you even tell a story about a guy in an airplane that you saw, maybe you can tell a little bit about that, but how do you work past those broken trust moments

to step into new relationships in freedom and not putting on them what someone else did to you? That's a good question. And there's, you know, we're glad you make the dissation between, you know, past relationships and a new relationship. That's what we,

what we all do is we make maps of the world. Right? That's how you get to the refrigerator. He may map about it, get there, you walk there and not think about it. But sometimes if you've had experiences in your map of the world or men are like this or women are like this, bosses are like this or churches are like this, well that map is going to cause you to hit pause or to not trust.

But then you might be with the best guy in the world But your map is saying no, you know are always questioning you So that's a different scenario than when you're in a relationship and then there's a breach of trust. It's real so you take the first one first and I eat it's really really important. I think it's going to be a significant relationship. You know, you're doing some naughty and kind of hit it down. Maybe we're going to be a thing. Like, I wouldn't want to see who's five and talk to y'all there

and that calls the rift and y'all come here to say, well, she doesn't trust me, you know. You go, well, you know, what I would want to do is, but trust is a relationship. So this is a problem. She's a little hyperventilant. You know, she's questioning everything. And you don't want to be questioned on everything. You want to trust you.

But she's also got some reasons for it. So I want you guys to become trust building partners. And you're each going to play a role in this. And so you're going to tell, hey, I know. You know, you know, you don't have an issue with trust. And I need you to help me. And then you're going to tell him, you know, this kind of thing. Help me with this. And he's're going to tell him, you know, this kind of thing, me, help me with

this and he's not going to be defensive. He's going, yeah, yeah, I know, you know, and here's, here's what happened. And what will make you feel better? What would you like for me to do? And when you start to, to work with each other, then that's a big deal. If you feel like somebody should partner in helping you get over it, instead of pallying about that, popping heads against that all the time, that's a really, really important aspect of this. And that's why you take the little checklist of the five things that it, and you start to ask each other, what do you need in this area for being a field set?

What do you need in this area for being a field set? What do you need in this area? And then against, it gets very specific. You know, fear and anxiety comes out of the part of our brain that's global. So we're, you know, it's subjective. Oh, it's all bad. But it's never all bad. I mean, unless you're going into war, yeah, the guys on the machine, you know,

it's your, they're all bad. But when we're in into war, yeah, the guys on the Toshini, I'd say they're all bad. But when we're in the war of life, there's going guys of backings. And we need the good guys to help us. And so, fear is gonna be gotten over about having some objective little steps to gonna help you take the next step. It's great, such good advice.

I remember whenever I was little just my bedtime routine with my mom and dad. My mom would love to read his books and tuck us in and all the things. It's just the best feeling in the world. Now I get to give that to honey. It really is the best feeling. It's one of the many reasons why I also love Miracle-made cheese. These sheets are so comfy and soft. It is like your mom or dad tucking you in every night. And not let me think about it, these sheets would be a perfect gift for Mother's Day or Father's Day. Miracle Made Sheets are temperature regulating

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go to trymiracle.com slash woe and use the code wo to claim your free three piece tall set and save over 40% off. Again, that's trymiracle.com slashwo to treat yourself today. I love how you mentioned earlier that, you know, we feel safe when we feel understood. And one thing that was really cool for me whenever I read that in the book was that there are two moments in my relationship with the Lord over the past few years that I felt like brought me to a deeper place of faith. And both of those moments were in times where I was, you know, talking to God about something that I was frustrated with.

And as I'm talking to him about my frustration, I realized he went through the same thing when he walked here. You know, like one of the things was I felt betrayed by a friend and I just was talking to God about it. I was upset. And then I just felt like the Lord kind of in response to that said and I didn't hear audibly just felt it said in my heart that he said I understand. I immediately thought about Peter, you know his best friend who then you know denied that he even knew him and then I thought about Judas. So the next level that really betrayed him to the point of death and and when I felt the Lord say, I understand, like, I've been there. I get it.

I felt that feeling that you're feeling. It changed everything for me. Like, I just was, I felt so loved at that moment, so understood in that moment. I was like, man, my God has gone through this. He empathizes with my pain in this moment. And then another time, a couple of years after that, this was actually more recent. And we've talked about um, a couple years after that, this was actually more

recent. And we've talked about this a little bit on the podcast. My daughter went through a really scary, uh, health thing last year. And she ended up being in the hospital. I was really, really scary. And I just, I was crying out to God and just, you know, being very real about the way that I felt about the situation. Had a lot of questions for God about that situation and it's kind of just questioning him and mad and all this stuff. And I felt like in that moment once again, you guys, I understand. And even though I'd heard John 316 my entire life, I knew it backwards and forwards. I preached it on stages with passion and I believe that verse for the first time ever

I heard that verse in the context of wow God as a father gave his son for Like to die on the cross for me like it all the sentences I realized it for the first time and I felt so me. Like it all of a sudden just I realized it for the first time and I felt so understood in my moment a fear that my child was about to go through some suffering and all this stuff. And so I said it to say like feeling understood by God even has made my relationship with God just go to the next level of a relationship. And I love how you know I've heard you say this

and I don't remember if it was an sermon that I heard or if it was in the book, but you were talking about how there are so many things that you'll hear in science that come out and you're like, oh, that's really good or somebody says it and you're like, that's really good and then you're like, oh, wait, Proverbs says that, you know, or, oh, wait, that's actually in the Bible. How many things do you feel that you're teaching that you are teaching other people that people have grabbed onto that really are rooted in scripture or that have come from your own relationship with God. You know, it's really interesting as a, you know, I'm a social scientist, right? But as a clinical psychologist, I get into a lot of the deeper science of neuroanatomy and neurobiology and where our brains work and all that.

And I, the more and more and more and more, that I learned in real and the real science of where things actually were. It would have been, you know, years ago, after going through a lot of training and had a lot of clinical experience Then a web bank read the Bible again with those eyes and my oh my gosh everything did I'm erby It's almost like the person that wrote the Bible understands the brain

Wow, I mean it really and you know, you know get down to the specifics of it I mean, it really, and you know, get down to the specifics of it. Like you're the Psalm 101. You say, I'm not trust. You know, Psalm 101. David says, there's certain kinds of people I'm not going to trust. I'm not going to have anything to do with. And he just lists all the personality disorders, but narcissistic people, judgmental people, people that can't keep a secret and gossip, which means that the desires of people that

are compassionate, non-ist and sacrificial and will serve the relationship. He says, those are the ones that I'm going to dwell with. Those are the ones that I'm going to hang out. They will minister in me. In other words, he knows he can't get by without Trusting people, but he's gonna choose care But then you get down to even more the specifics like like on the understanding thing we can get it or the other You know the rest of the list, but that's the big one It's basically about hearing someone first before you start to talk to him in the hell what is the narcissist to they gaslight well i felt that it didn't hurt what do you tell me that that's not a big deal and they negate how you're feeling yep well proper says he to do response or he who gives an answer

before he listens is a fool and it's a folly and a shame. You know, I was talking about that one day at a leadership event. The importance of listening first before you persuade and this guy wants to tell me, he says, you know, I'm the lead hostage to gochiatr for the FBI. So, my guy's got a bomb strap to him in a bike with 20 hostages. I'm the guy they send in. He said, we don't go in and start telling them, you know, dude, this is just a bad idea. You don't want to do this. There we go in. He said, I get the name, but tell me your name. The damage says, so tell me, how do we get here? What's going on? And they just start to have the person feel like trying to understand you where you're coming. I got to try to persuade you anything. I'm going to try to get you

to put the bond out right now. And I just want to understand you to what how we get here was going on. And so the science is fascinating. It's exactly what Proverbs says, that we have mirror neurons that start in infancy. You know, a baby calms down because they see and they feel like, um, understands why they're crying, spine it to. Your wired neurologic, but what happens is, when we feel some money's input, their care first, even if they disagree.

Even if they disagree, our system begins to let go, and it begins to calm down and begins to open up. So the science is embedded in these little verses in the Bible. It's exactly what that's this. Same site to person that wrote the Bible, understands the bright, in the heart and how I work. That's the coolest thing ever. That's so cool. I mean, I don't know if you've already written a book like this, but your next book should

be about how all the science and the scriptures align because that's really fascinating. I am actually writing that book right now. I really, well, I'll tell you what it is. And you know, you always have a working title and I got a five publishers to stick with this title or not. But it's called To My Friend. The stuff about God we never talked. And I'm writing it. I have so many friends that aren't, you know, they are people that say, and they don't never really looked into it or maybe they kind of, whatever, but they know that I am. But for some reason, they're still my friend because I'm

one of those crazy Christians, right? And they all think we're all does. And I know you think it starts with, I know you think I'm one of those crazy, but you're still my friend, but we've never really talked about, I want you to know why. Believe in and part of it's my own story, the miracles that I've seen God do. miracles that I've seen God do. But part of it is, you know, as a clinical psychologist, the more I studied everything from both dysfunction and how it's healed, all the way to thriving and what makes people happy and thrive. It's like reading the Bible. When I go read the, you know, the brain journals, it's like reading the Bible. When I go read the, you know, the brain journals, it's like reading the Bible. It's a...

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See Academy.com slash just coming with you for details. That is so cool. Well, I cannot wait for that book personally because that sounds absolutely amazing. And I started noticing that a little bit just in reading where when we actually, my mom and I just talked about this in a podcast recently, because we were talking about Brunei Brown's book,

which I love her book. And I think it was dear to lead maybe that. No, I think it was the one. What's the what's the main one? Oh, man, I can't I can't think of I'll tell them ahead, but you know, her book that's all about shame and it she did the Ted talk that was massive about it. And she has this quote and it's talking about how like gratitude defeats fear. And this whole thing about gratitude defeating fear. And I thought that is so good. And then one day I was reading the Bible and it talks about, you know, bringing your anxiety to the Lord. This is like with thanksgiving and all the stuff. And I was like, man, that is like the same thing. I get it like bringing. How about that? Yeah, like it's crazy. And so it is so cool.

You hear these things and it's like, wow, that's so good. And then you're in the Bible and you're like, this is exactly what it says. Like I love that. That the creator knows the brain. He knows how we're wired because he created us. And so that is just so cool.

So I just released this book, trust right? And so when it first comes out, which was last week Right before that, you know, the reviewers get it. They did this review on And they said all of these really positive things about its practical and you know, though people find something to use and And then right in the middle of it, they said, and it was kind of negative. They go other than the random Bible verses that's in here for a hearing, those who are re, I'm not saying the exact words, but they kind of, and so I got to, you know, get it.

They don't get it. That's where it ran down. It's this slide. It's high random. Yeah, it's kind of verse in there, for example it says he lists as before or he gives an answer for it or stands as a fool Or you know about competencies abilities character and the things you're required for trust Every now and then I code over or something you know, and it's not random

What I think it's so it's so crazy and so funny that that would be random because what I love about using And I don't know if that's the word they use but but something like that's like what are the wild the Bible verses So rainbow why is this here? But I think that that's so cool because to me what what that does even in reading a book like this and seeing scripture in it is It anchors it and like this truth that is unchanging right like if because the Bible is true and God is the same God yesterday forever we read the Bible and we know that this is something like it's crazy the same thing that they said thousands of years ago can still be applied to us today and we still get the same results and the outcome whenever that is in our life.

And I think like that's what makes me feel so much have so much confidence in the Bible and I find even so much confidence in living a life that's based off the Bible because I'm like man this has been true for a long time and today's day it, man, there's a new idea every day, you know, out on the news and a theory, new method, a new quote unquote, truth and all these things. But that'll change tomorrow. And then the next week and I'll get this proven a year from now and blah, blah. And so when you have rooted in scripture, it's like, man, there's a confidence to this. Like, I know that this is going to stand the test of time. That this really is leading towards life. And so I think that that's going to stand the test of time. That this really is leading towards life.

And so I think that that's so cool. And that's what's like so encouraging that someone like you who is so wise and taking so much time to study these things and write these things is anchored in a solid faith. So I'm going to ask you a question last that I'll always normally ask my guess first. So we're going to do this in reverse. Typically, everyone that comes on the words, good pie gas. I always ask the question, what's the best piece of advice you've ever been given? But I wanted to ask you at last, because you know, the whole point of asking this question to people who are on this podcast is y'all are people who give so much advice.

Like I have received so much advice from you without even knowing you, but I know there are probably people who speak into your life that we don't know that have been pivotal voices in your life. And so obviously it's a loaded question. It's hard to say the best piece, but what's a piece of advice that someone gave you that has really stuck out to you? Well, I can get to the someone part of it, but when you're saying the best piece of advice for you said person. It was actually a Bible. It changed my life. It's good.

It was I was in college and I hit bottom. I had I was an athlete and had an injury and lost my ability to play and was gone to college for playing. I was really, really depressed and just broken up with my girlfriend. Really, really depressed and it was like, you know, I'm sending my dorm and I'm going, how do you make this stuff for? How do I find what I was supposed to do? How do you pick the right career? How do I find what I was supposed to do? How do you pick the right career? How am I going to make a living?

How do you find the right girl? Hey, they're worried about us. And I hadn't, you know, I kind of had one foot in and one foot out with thine up into that point. And I've been in my ballroom since I'd been in college. Halfway through it. It's sitting in my dorm room, I'm really depressed. Now look up on the bookshelf and I see my mom.

And I don't know why, but I assume maybe there's something in there. So I go pick it up, open it up. It just randomly falls to Matthew 6, verse 33. And it kind of literally sort of chopped out of me and it says, seek first the kingdom of God in his righteous and then all these things shall be added to you as well. And I said, all these things, be added to you as well. It's said, all these, you mean all this stuff I'm worrying about, like how do you find what you're supposed to do and write a relationship

and read or get an undeprised all the asking to associate Gowood for God first? I mean, it's like, Rathallic, I mean, does he actually do anything? I thought he was up there in scab and then we would Really And so I put it down at watchhouse campus and I Went to an empty church and I said I don't know if you're there or not, but if you do I really need oh

And nothing happened. I remember is the loliest moment ever because I jumped out of the play and the shoe didn't open. I was got a thought of you It's app like on TV. Nothing happens. I'm like, you know, call me Or go back to my dorm room in the phone. It's a fraternity brother. He says, I don't know why I'm thinking of you right now to buy you. You're the last person I would think of But we're starting to bolster. There you go. What's the much?

And that's where it all started. And the advice there was, look, whatever we're trying to figure out, see God first. And all that stuff will get added, because we've got to be going down a road where all that stuff lives. That's great. We're going down a road where good relationships don't live in that direction, fulfilling, focusing, career, being underpriced.

That lived in that direction. So he's going to go out and that's by far the best piece of the screen. I love that so much. That's so cool because it is so true. Like to when you hear these answers that people like yourself give you really can see that that advice led them down the path that they're on.

And I see that's amazing. And thank you for sharing that. Well, I am so excited for people to hear this podcast for everyone listening. Don't forget to go get your copy of Trust today. If you hold it up again there. Yes, hold it up. It's an awesome cover.

So I hate to talk about. I gotta read the subtitle. I gotta read the subtitle because that's where people are going to see where they are. It's about trust, but it's his, when do you give it? When's it safe to trust somebody? What I need to live for? When do it withhold it? Come see in this and I should withhold it. How do we earn it? There's the only way we're going to have good relationships is we're earning in those relationships. And the fourth one is how to fix it when it gets broke.

There's a lot of people that go out through the trails or somebody that let them down. They got to figure out, is this worth shaping or I do a walk? Or do I take the next step? And there's a process to figure that out so you not fly at one. That's great. Gosh, it's so good. I know the subtitle is so great. The whole book is amazing.

It's a must read for everybody. It'll help you through so many different things in life. Whether you've already gone through some reasons to not trust people or whether you're walking into it. You're like, how do I even know when to give it? How do I even know how to do all these things? It's an incredible book that I know you guys are gonna love and learn so much from.

At the same time, like I mentioned, he has so many other books as well. So if you're just not getting started on the journey of reading Dr. Henry Caudi of a lot to look forward to, but thank you so much for taking the time. Not only to be on this podcast and invest in all of our listeners, but also to write these incredible books. I look forward to the next book

and all the things that you're working towards and just really appreciate you and the work that you do. Well a lot of clients keep being a good voice out there and I know you will. Thank you so much. you