WHOA That's Good Podcast - The Good, the Bad & the Ugly: How to Navigate Relationships Pt 2

Episode Date: February 17, 2021

Sadie and Ben Stuart get REAL as he joins her to share even more "WHOA" moments about love and relationships. The "Single, Dating, Engaged, Married" author unpacks how infatuation can blind you, the danger of approaching dating with a consumer mentality, and holding people to impossible standards. They go into the right time to confess the good, the bad, and the ugly of past relationships and sins, how to cultivate clear, honest communication, and how to "grip hands and run into God's future together." Then, Sadie and Christian take a call from a listener who wants advice on what to do when trust is broken in a relationship. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I love what you talk about when you kind of touch on that difference between consumer versus companion mentality and dating. So what does that look like? Yeah, that's another big one too. Yeah. I'm asking you all that questions. I have all these questions. I want everybody to know.

Yeah. Well, so consumer mentality, I think there's a tendency, and I saw it in college too, people would start listing. Well, I want them to be tall, but not too tall. I want them to be fit, but not obsessed with this body. I want them to be funny. And we start to like create this list of characteristics, like you'd curate a playlist, but what you created is not a real human, because no one adds to the list their problems. And I want them to be a little disorganized, and I want them to have some issues with anger.

Like you don't add those. So you create a fake person and hold a real person up to an impossible standard. And no one likes that. So you talk to women and they don't like the impossible standard of magazine covers because you go, they, these are Photoshop that don't hold me to an impossible standard. Men don't like it either. Women watch romantic movies and say, why can't you be more like? And you're like, that guy's not even like

that in real life. You know, so it sets you up for disappointment and failure. And then what's crazy about it too is we don't know what we want. That was one of the most fascinating things steady studying it. You know, match.com, the online dating, they realize they tried to create that algorithm of pick the characteristics you want, literally click them and we'll match you with the perfect person. And their matches never worked. And so they studied their algorithm and they realized that algorithms not broken, we're broken, namely what people say they want and who they married, they said there is no correlation between the two. So in college, my friends were like, every single one of my buddies had a checklist.

My girl's gonna look like this and this and this and this. And the girl they married looked nothing like that. So I'm like, you have no idea what you want. So let's all have some humility of going, I don't know. Character matters. But what chemistry will I link up with? Most people I know that have a checklist is usually an idealized version of themselves. That's so true. And you're like, you don't want to marry you, you want to be you. You want to marry someone who compliments you. And it might surprise you. That's true. I love that. You know, it's funny. It's like in a weird way that's kind of like whenever you pick out a wedding dress, it sounds funny, but it's so true for like all my

friends that I know like everybody had this like certain look that they wanted to get and it was like this this this this and it was based up of what they had seen that they like and then everyone goes and you try on the dress that you always thought this is gonna be the one it has everything it checks all the boxes and you're like this looks horrible on me this is not a fit at all. And then you go through a process of trying at different things until the one actually fits you. And normally it's everything you said you would never want. But it fits you.

And so it's like so true for dating and wedding dress shopping that you go in, you think you have this idea based on what you've seen somebody else do, but it has to actually fit who you are. So I love that so much. Well, that's a good word. Fit.

Do we fit? Is there a compatibility? That's a good way to say that. Yeah, that's awesome. You talk about being unequally yoked and I love this quote. You can put a bow on a turd, but he's still a turd. He read it. And I love, I just love that concept that you talk about. So touch on that a little bit about the importance of, you know, not just

finding a turd with a bow on it. Exactly. Yeah, you know, song a songs or song a Solomon in the Bible, you know, it's, it's the book of love. It opens with the woman saying, let him kiss me with the kisses of his mouth. She's so excited. She's like, I want to kiss this guy's face. You know, but you see four people talk.

Her, the man, God, and her friends. And it's good because her friends are not infatuated with this guy. And when you're infatuated, you can lose all sense of healthy evaluation. Her friends say, rightly do the maidens love you. Like her friends weren't infatuated with them,

but they were watching, is this the right guy for her to feel this way about? And they're evaluating his character. And that's what the book says later. Your name is like oil poured out. You have character that's what the book says later. Your name is like oil poured out. You have character that's trustworthy. And infatuation can mess up your evaluation. So you need some people to watch them and say,

hey, how does this person treat people they're not trying to get in bed with? How do they treat kids? How do they treat old people? How do they handle people? They're not trying to impress. And you want to watch their life, do they treat old people? How do they handle people? They're not trying to impress. And you want to watch their life, do they have character? And so, you know, I remember in college,

girls just wanting to get married and they were like, oh, I met him at church, so he must be fine. And you're like, I don't care if he's a church, he could be a monster. I know monsters at church. He owns a Bible. Who cares? That doesn't matter at all. And so, yeah, you can put a bow tie on him. monsters in church. Oh, he owns a Bible. Who cares? That doesn't matter at all. You know?

And so yeah, you can put a bow tie on a turd, but it's still a turd, man. Like you've got to watch his choice. You've got to watch his decisions. Like, how does he act when things don't go his way? How does he act? Well, I know I know I'm asking so many questions, but like I said, like this is just too good. It's so good. And one of the things that you talk about is clarity. Whenever you are dating someone that it's such a value to bring clarity into the situation. And that was one thing I'm sure Christian might have got from the book, but I was very impressed by,

and honestly, shocked by how much clarity I always had. And I never had to guess, like, whenever you're gonna talk again, because he was like, hey, tomorrow night I'm gonna call you, and then he did. And like, that clarity was so valuable to me. And I remember one night I was on the phone with him,

and it was early on, and I said, oh yeah, okay, it's hot to you tomorrow, and I said, or I don't know, maybe I'll be back out. Like, we don't have to talk. And he was like, what do you mean? Of course, I'll talk to you tomorrow. Like, it was just so funny because out of my insecurity was like, whoops, shit, this is not that.

I was like, bigger. And Christians like, no, of course, it's hot tomorrow. And he just brought so much clarity to my heart. I wasn't, I didn't have to get awkward about it or confused about it or wonder if we were going to talk again or he was gonna ghost me. Like he was so go bring me clarity. And I think that is something that guys

kind of sometimes lack to give and girls too. And also I think it's something that we don't really hold people to anymore as much as we should. Yeah, well, I love hearing that about Christian. I knew I liked that guy, but yeah, I think ambiguity leads to anxiety. And so many of the people you talk to now, if you just bring up the subject of dating,

one of the key words is anxiety. And it's because we don't know the rules anymore. And as flawed as they were in the past, cultures have had dating scripts, oh, this is how this works. You know, like I remember talking with a group in India and they're like, well, when you come a certain age, your parents help you find a mate.

Like they sort of knew this is the steps that happen. Or early in America, a guy would come a call into a girl and sit in the parlor with her and her family. And like, it wasn't perfect, but you at least knew what was coming. And in the world today, we don't have a dating script. And so everyone doesn't know the rules. And I like to tell young

people, that's not your fault. You didn't create that. It is your problem. Society has not given you clarity on here's what to do. So you're like, do I text? Do I call? Do I DM them? Do I like nobody knows? And but what we do know is the Bible says, an honest answer is a kiss on the lips. a way to be kind to someone and care about them is to give them honesty or in the New Testament it says we speak the truth in love we graciously speak the truth to each other and we know that clarity is kindness It was a kind thing for Christian to say to you. I'm interested in you I'd like to spend some time with you now you know and. And I did a bunch of checking in on this with girls too,

just to ask them, I'm on the right track here and all of them, we're like, it's the ambiguity that kills us. And I even asked him questions, like, so should he ask you on a date? Is that word old fashioned? And almost a hundred percent said, no, use the word date,

because at least I know what it is. But when you say, hang out, I don't know what hang out means. And then you're telling your friends, I think it might be a day. I don't know. Or just hang out. I don't know if there's other people. Yeah. Yeah. Am I going to get dressed up and sit on the couch and play Fortnite? Like what? Wait, what is this exactly? But you know, it's funny, because, um, you know, in the past, um, I remember in Texas going to a small town in Texas and they had a dance every Friday night.

And it was expected a young man would ask a girl in town to go to the dance on Friday. And everyone knew this isn't marriage. It's every single week though. This dude's taken a shot every single week. He has to take a shot and he just got better at it because the reps, but young men now don't get near the reps. And so they're awkward, they don't know what to say, it's confusing. So I feel a compassion for young men.

Like, that's why in the book I try to help them. And it's funny, because I'll have a lot of girls come to me now. It's like, he said the exact words in chapter. And I'm like, that's fine, that's a win. That's what I'm saying. I took it. I was like, I'm so glad you said the exact words in chapter. And I'm like, that's fine, that's a win. That's what I'm saying. I took it. I was like, I'm so glad you said the exact words.

Claire and his kindness, we got to help each other. Guys and girls, guys need it too. Guys are just as insecure as girls. And if you can tell him on the front end, I'm not interested, I am. That feels scary, but honesty is better than ghosting. And so it's better to be real. For sure.

I love that. That's so good. All right, we're nearing the end. We're definitely at the engage part now. But you talk about the importance of communication and confession before marriage. And I think that goes, yes, that is kind of on the same track as clarity, but even more than that,

like confession of things that you've been through your past where you're at now and all those different things. I've had other people come to me and ask me this question, like, say, like, I know you and Christian talk about being real with each other and sharing your story, but when is the right time to do that? And so, when do you think the right time is to share, you know, some of those really real things that maybe you've walked through or are currently walking through in a relationship? Yeah, that's a great question. Well, you know, dating is more about guiding principles than steps. So it's hard to say, well on date six, do it, you know, it's guiding principles.

But you can say date one, not the time to unpack all the broken seer pass. I would say after you're engaged, you should do it before that, you know, because we've counseled couples on an eye where it's the wedding date set and announced and then some really deep syn issues come up that confused the couple and they got a process. And you go, don't put the pressure of a wedding date on top of your still processing together. So I'd say in that dating world, you're getting to know each other enough to say, do I trust

this person? What you're talking about, say, is what everybody wants when they're married is I want someone to know all of me, the best and the worst and love me. That's what we want. We want the security of knowing that. When I wake up, that person loves me and they're not leaving me. They're going to stay. But to have that security, you have to give them honesty and that's scary.

So you have to build enough trust. And I love the way the book of song Assalam-a-Salaam presents it. It presents the heart of this woman like a dev. And up in the cleft of Iraq, it's a fragile bird high up. And the guy doesn't run up and grab the bird and it's not in chapter one, but as they get to know each other over time and start to realize this relationship serious, I could see us getting married. It seems more possible that this is the person, maybe more likely than not, then I do think you get to a point where like the dove leaving the cleft of the rock into the man's hands, I do think there comes a point where you say, let me tell you the good, the bad, and the ugly about my past.

And you will probably both cry. There are some hard things that we have all done and hard things that have been done to us. But if we can hear all that in like Christ, see the worst of each other and say, I forgive you, I love you, I want you. That can be so healing for people.

I strongly encourage that to happen, but you don't want to rush into it because you can needlessly confuse and hurt each other. So it's a tricky balance. And that's where I think wise counsel can help you get some people around that love God and love you that say, Hey, maybe now you're at the point to share with him a little more of your story. It's good. Oh, it's so good. I so glad that you touched on that because that was one of the most pivotal moments of Christiana's relationship in the best way. It was so hard. Yeah. And we did both cry and it wasn't just a one day conversation, but the forgiveness and the

love and just the beauty of that moment, getting to show each other a human version of what Christ would do in a non-perfect way. But still love each other. It was a beautiful thing that I think really made our relationship what it is today. And that's why we can trust and love and feel loved because we know that we're known. And so I just love that. I love how you talk about man's initiation.

And Christian talks about this a lot. This is something that I don't know, really touched him. But you say, you don't just fall out of love. You fall out of trying. And that was really, really good. And so, you know, I think when we start dating, we, we really try hard, right? We're bringing out all the stops. So then there's a point where even the other day actually, it was, it was funny. I was getting my nails done. And I said something that Christian, I was like, oh yeah, like, and then he went,

he's going to get me this real fast and he'll be here and say, and he was like, oh yeah, like, and then he went, he's going to get me this real fast and he'll be here and say, and he was like, oh yeah, you can tell that y'all just got married. You don't do that whenever your 10 years in like us. And I was just like, that's sad because that was just such a little thing, you know? But people do stop trying. And so what's the importance of keeping that, keeping that going, that pursuit?

Yeah, you know what's crazy? Because Donna and I say this to each other all the time and we laugh because we're like, I bet a lot of people would not believe us because it sounds so corny, but we're like, we love each other more now than ever. To the degree that our first year of marriage love was sincere, but so shallow. And that we know each other so much more now and trust each other so much more now. And I can encourage her so much more deeply and more quickly. And we can resolve conflict in such a better way.

And all of that is because we've clocked the hours talking. We've just spent time together. And you know, we, we want some TV, not a lot. It's more common for us to sit on the back porch and talk. I know when I'm at work, when I go home about an hour and night, Donna and I are just going to sit there and talk about our day. And it seems so simple, but when you look and I'm like, I trust her down to the smallest bit of DNA in me, the deepest parts of my bones, I trust Donna fully.

And I have that. And then we'll counsel couples that don't. And you go, what's different? And what you see is it started early in their marriage. They just quit cultivating that communication, pursuing each other, talking through things. And so when you don't cultivate a seed, you don't enjoy the fruit. You want to enjoy fruit, cultivate the ground. And we've cultivated a lifetime of communication.

And now two decades in, gosh, it's the best it's ever been. It's amazing. Highly, I highly recommend it. That's so encouraging. See, that is so encouraging because you hear these other couples say stuff like that and you're like, day, I'm kind of scared of 10 years. And so many. Yeah. Yeah. That is so good. I love it. Last question I want to talk to you about is just the quote that you say,

your marriage will be most fulfilling on mission. And it's so funny because Louis makes fun of it. Like he doesn't make fun of me in Christian, but he kind of laughs at us. He says, you know, the only couple of ever met that have a mission statement for your relationship. And because we read the book and we really took that seriously and then our Primera to counselor told us that we should have a mission statement and we were like oh my gosh

This is like our mission, you know, and so we do and it's like stuck with this and apparently on our wedding day We looked at each other and we said like we are the huffs and we are and set our mission statement And so Louis Louis loves to quote our mission statement to us. But I think it is so important. And you're so right. When you have a mission-minded marriage, like there is so much passion and love and oneness and just you're going for it for the same thing. And I just love it.

So can you touch on that as we close about just having a marriage with a mission? Yeah. Well, no one unifies around unity in the world about anything. You don't unify around unity. We all unify around something, you know? And if you look at the strongest teams, like a sports team, they were like, we're going to the Super Bowl. We're gonna win a mission creates that unity, you know, a cause, a strength in community. And it's because God built us that way, you know, he said, you exist for me. That's why Paul told young Timothy,

hey, flee youthful lust, pursue righteousness, along with those who call out to God of a pure heart. He was telling his young protege that, because he's like, that's life, Timothy. Get away from stuff that's picking you apart and ruining you. Run after the beautiful life God made, along with the community, because that's for the way life's meant to be lived, a community on a cause, belonging and mattering. They're the deepest longings of our heart.

And then when you put that in a marriage, hey, I'm not trying to look into your eyes to find meaning. I'm not trying to look into your eyes to find meaning. I'm gripping your hand and we're chasing meaning together. Boy, that's really fun. And I think that's part of why Don and I's marriage is so happy is coming here to DC was not like, well, Ben got transferred because of work

and Don has got to come along. It's not like that. It's like, hey, God called us to each other. God has called us to make a difference for his name is this where God's calling us. And we made that decision together. And being on mission together is so energizing. I strained to find the words to explain it, but I really wish people had it. And the folks you're talking about that are bored. I talked to too many people that are like in their 30s, 40s. I'm like, you're too young to act this old.

I knew 60 years who are fired up because they're on mission together. I mean, Louis and Shelley would be a cause of that. You're a good example of that. So you don't wanna miss that. Yeah, you grip hands and run into God's future together. And I promise you life will be fun. That's awesome.

Come on. Well, I know so many people are so encouraged. Like, whenever I do podcast if people like you, I literally can't stop smiling because I'm like, I'm so excited for everybody to hear this because honestly,

it's the questions people ask me that I'm like, uh, I wish I had the words to say it better and more wisdom to say it, but I do know somebody. Yeah, hold on a minute for this podcast because that is the heart of this podcast that I would ask these people who have influenced me,

these questions and help break it down for all of these college students and you know, our listeners are all ages but primarily that 18 to 25 year old, who just need some guidance and some help and some advice. And so thank you, thank you. Thank you for writing this book. Thank you for preaching on a weekly basis and just getting out the good news and great advice.

And then we appreciate you, Christian and I. I'm so thankful for you and Donna and Y'all's life and ministry. So thanks for this awesome conversation. Hey, thank you. It's honor to be here. We love you guys. We are so thrilled with what you're doing and just could not cheer you on strongly enough and I hope everybody listening gets

and y'all's wake and follows the kind of purposeful living y'all are doing. It's inspiring. Yeah, thank you. I mean, so much. Thank you. Sure thing. I think. Sarah. It's nice to meet you too. I'm from California. Sadie, I actually met you on Dancing With The Stars one time. No way. You were like super sweet, but I just want to tell you before we get started. I'm 19, but seeing you walk through your faith, it really shaped me as a person just without you,

like with Christian background, too. My mom passed away years ago, but it really shaped my morals as a woman too. So, thank you so much. Sarah, that's so cool. Thank you so much for sharing that with me. That truly means so much. And that's so cool that we've actually met.

I love that. I used to get mistaken for you all the time in LA. It was so funny. Oh, that's awesome. Yeah, you had COVID and anxiety and eating disorder and that's literally what I've been going through all year. Wow. So seeing that you went through that in a podcast too, it just, you went through it kind of before me too. So it was nice to have that preparation. Oh, well, I'm glad

I could have been a sister and a friend from afar to you. Yeah, thank you so much. You sit in a great question. Remind us of me and Christiana, addressing what your question was. So when you and your significant other are going through a minor issue and that trust is kind of broken, but it's not big enough to break up over or anything like that. It's just that person didn't follow through on what they were going to say and it hurt you inside. How do you build that trust on both sides back?

Yeah, that's so good. And that's so real. Honestly, when I saw your question, I was like, this is great because Christian and I went through this. And I love what you said. You know, it's not like a breakup issue, but it is an issue that you have to deal with and take seriously. I think when you're in a relationship and you've already established that you know their

character, they know your character, you're good people, but that doesn't mean you're perfect people. You couldn't be perfect. So you're going to mess up. There are going to be times where you have to humble yourself and say you're sorry. The other person is going to do something that you're like, why. They're gonna be times where you have to humble yourself and say you're sorry, or the other person's gonna do something that you're like, why did you do that? And vice versa.

But I can remember when Christian and I were about six months into our relationship, something happened where it just kind of broke trust a little bit. And it was upsetting and, you know, but it wasn't major, it wasn't something to break up over, but it bothered me and it kinda hurt our trust. And, you know, what it wasn't major, it wasn't something to break up over, but it bothered me. And it kind of hurt our trust. And you know, what we realized in that moment, and I will

say, it wasn't easy, and it didn't all just click like right when it happened. It wasn't like the most pleasant conversation. And we grew a lot in that and learned how to communicate through frustrations and hard times. But one of the things that we realized was really the breakthrough was just our complete honesty with where we were at. Christian with where he was at and why a decision was made that hurt me and me, where I was at and why insecurity was rising and that honesty and that vulnerability,

you know, brought us to a place where we weren't defensive and we weren't still throwing jobs or anything like that. We were just able to listen. And on a human level, relate to where the other person was at. I can relate to him for maybe the mistake that he made and he can relate to me for the insecurity that was rising because of that mistake.

And so for me, I would say that breakthrough really came from that vulnerability to just get past like what actually happened and get to like why it happened. And why it made me feel the way that it did and why I don't want it to ever happen again. And Christian had some advice from the guys perspective. Yeah, that's really good. Yeah, so when something like that happens, I think the biggest thing is, like you said, just complete honesty and transparency and just being able to have a conversation about it and you know, owning your mistakes. And I think after that happens, the thing moving forward, you have to be consistent. And I know that for me, as someone who did that, I think that the biggest lesson that I learned was, you know, you can say, sorry, a hundred times, but if there's no action that follows

behind that, then those are just kind of words. So for me, when I was apologetic about it, there had to be a build that back of trust, and that only came through being consistent and being honest and real. And because if I was honest and real when it would set that that happened, but I wasn't consistent, then there would have been that probably would have ended things. That would have been more of an issue. That would have ended things.

But if you can build that back up through consistency and truly see the integrity of someone, I think that speaks volumes to that. So true, because if somebody does something, they're truly sorry and you begin to see a consistent behavior that isn't like that, then you can know, okay, that's not who you are. That's just a mistake that you made. And I'm going to forgive you because odds are this could be me next month. Like I might do something that's going to upset you. And like I have since this time when we were only dating six months, there have been times I've said things are Christian and things that I've regretted,

you know, that I've had to say, Hey, I'm really sorry. The reason that happened or the reason I said that is because of this. And I understand how that made you feel and I'm really sorry. And then now, I can't just say sorry, I need to fix the way that I speak. And so I think those are some things to get past some of those hard moments.

But I love the yeses question, it's so honest, so real. And I think it's gonna help a lot of people because relationships are hard to navigate and learning how to communicate is a huge part of that. So thank you so much for asking that. And thanks for telling me a little bit of your story. That was beautiful and I just feel so grateful that God has used me in your life in a very significant way.

Yeah, he definitely has. If you're ever in L.A. come check out the church. It's amazing. It's a connection of Bethel, so it's called Presence. Cool, that's awesome. Awesome. Well, thanks, girl, it was great talking to you today.

Thank you. Bye. Bye. Sweet, great question. Great question. So good. Y'all, I love this. I love how whenever y'all are calling and asking these questions

We can just be real we can be vulnerable with y'all and hopefully give you the best of ice that we have to a situation We're not perfect, but we're gonna give you what we've learned and the best way we can and hopefully that not only points you to a better place And whatever relationship you're in or season you're in but hopefully it points you towards Jesus because ultimately all of our advice is stuff that we found in the word, or through prayer, or through just honestly godly mentors and people that we've asked. And so I hope this advice helps you, and I hope that you know that you have a sister and a friend from afar and a brother right here. And a brother from afar. My boo.

Well, we love you guys. Keep calling, keep asking great questions, and we will keep giving the best advice we can. you