WHOOP Podcast - Advocating For Your Health Using Wearables and AI with Dr. Mia Chorney and Susan Sly

Episode Date: May 13, 2026

In this episode of the WHOOP Podcast, WHOOP SVP of Research, Algorithms, and Data Emily Capodilupo sits down with Renowned Cardiologist Dr. Mia Chorney and AI Entrepreneur Susan Sly to explore how AI is transforming women’s health– specifically for women going through perimenopause and menopause. Drawing from personal experiences and clinical expertise, this episode unpacks why millions of women are dismissed or misdiagnosed throughout their perimenopause and menopause journey. Dr. Mia Chorney and Susan Sly explain the science behind hormonal changes, and how data, wearables, and AI can provide better support and earlier intervention. The conversation highlights the power of combining technology with empathy to help women better understand their bodies, advocate for their health, and avoid suffering in silence.(00:58) Introducing ThePause.ai Co-Founders: Dr. Mia Chorney & Susan Sly(02:21) Susan Sly’s Journey Becoming an AI Tech Entrepreneur & Innovator(06:02) Dr. Mia Chorney’s Move From Cardiology to AI Forward Medicine(09:16) Why So Many Women Get Dismissed: Perimenopause & Menopause Care(13:23) How Can Women Take Control of Symptoms & Care(19:00) The Women’s Health Initiative Study: Why It’s Detrimental To Menopause Health(21:43) Lifestyle Factors To Ease Menopause Symptoms (24:58) The 104 Symptoms of Menopause & The Impact of Nutrient Deficiencies (42:56) Talking With Your Partner: How To Navigate Conversations Around Menopause (48:02) 2 Key Takeaways For Women Experiencing Menopause(51:55) How Does Menopause Affect Men and What Do They Need To Know? Dr. Mia ChorneyInstagramLinkedInSusan SlyInstagramLinkedInWebsiteThePause.aiWebsiteLinkedInSupport the showFollow WHOOP:Sign up for WHOOP Advanced LabsTrial WHOOP for Freewww.whoop.comInstagramTikTokYouTubeXFacebookLinkedInFollow Will Ahmed:InstagramXLinkedInFollow Kristen Holmes:InstagramLinkedInFollow Emily Capodilupo:LinkedIn 

We don't want to see any woman suffer in silence. They say, oh, it's normal to be tired. It's normal to have low libido. No, it's not freaking normal. We think of perimenopause as the fatigue, the brain fog, the night sweats, the hot flashes, the low libido, and all of those symptoms that go on. Women are dismissed. And that is because we get labeled as WWW, whiny women. And we need to change that narrative.

How are you solving this problem? Bring the technology. and the healthcare piece together. Using AI to be able to serve these women so that that woman has a companion when it's two in the morning or she doesn't feel like she can talk to her partner or she's feeling so alone

that there's someone to talk to who gets her to be there with her to comfort her and say, you know what, girlfriend, it's okay. Because so many women go through this, what do people need to know? So I want women to know. Hi, everybody. I'm Emily Capulup.

I'm the loop senior vice president of research algorithms and data. And today I have two friends here with you that I'm very excited for this conversation. So first we have Dr. Mia Chorney. Mia and I actually met in Doha of all places. We were speaking at the same conference and she was talking about this incredible solve she's been working on to help women navigate menopause. And we were just instant besties because I was like, this is such a product that needs to exist. And I think within just like a couple of things. minutes of starting to talk. I'd convinced her to become a Woot member, which you're rocking now.

And we were talking about the incredibly beautiful solution that the pause AI is offering to women navigating menopause and uses AI to make it very, very accessible. And we're excited for you to hear more about what they've built. And then fast forward a couple of months. I was in Davos two weeks ago for the World Economic Forum. And Mia's co-founder, Susan Sly, was there. So we got to spend time together. And we're very excited to have both of them here to talk about all things, AI, menopause, the things you don't know about your body and how AI can help you better understand your body, your health, and things that you might be going through or people you love might be going through or that might be coming up down the road. So very excited to jump into this

conversation. Well, thanks for having us, Emily. And as everyone's listening, it's wonderful to be in Boston. Thank you for your hospitality. The WOOP headquarters are absolutely stunningly beautiful. And jumping into the discussion around women's health, around AI, and especially I want to acknowledge what WOOP is doing in terms of research because there isn't a lot of research happening in this area. And so kudos to you and the Woop team. Thank you. And that means so much coming for you. I think one of the things that I was so excited about when we were talking is you've been shipping AI since before I was born, really pioneering the space when it was not female-friendly. And it's not like lost on me that like when you were in Davos and talking about so many of these

things, we went to a couple like women in AI events and just really, you know, special to be around some of the women that made it so comfortable for me to be a female in AI 20 years later. So thank you for all the pioneering work that you've done. And maybe you want to jump in there. How did you get into this space? Yeah, absolutely. And Davis was fun. And in addition to our shared love of fashion, we held each other up on the icy sidewalks. And I think that spoke volumes about how we bonded. My first foray into AI and into writing code, it started in the 80s, Emily, because I was raised by an amazing single father. My dad, Joe, who passed last year, he worked on the pacemaker and the microprocessor. And so if anyone's listening and you have a pacemaker, my dad is one of the people. you can think. And then when the first hop gun movie came out, my dad took me to it and he said,

see these plans, there are F-14s. He worked with the team on those engines. So it was when I was a teenager in the 80s, I wanted video games. And I was like, Dad, I want some video games. And just like, code them yourself. So I started writing rudimentary code and just very basic logic, word logic games. And then when I was in university, I started when I was 16, super young, I took a job as a research assistant in the criminology department because I had watched silence, I'm like, I'm going to be Jody Foster. And they were working on early facial recognition. And I'll just share with the listeners and the viewers.

AI is simply numbers. It's a string of numbers. It's math. It's interpreting how those numbers are laid out. And what we were doing was quantifying crime scenes. So we were saying, okay, this is, I'll get a bit. gory, but how much blood is in this crime scene. So it's coated in blood. That's a 10. There's no blood. It's a 1. And as we began to do that, it allowed us to help law enforcement officers with these early algorithms narrow their search.

And the fun thing we got to do was build the facial recognition database. And we had to have a lookalike database to North America. So I got to fly to the UK for a month and take pictures of strange men. So imagine, there I am. And I was at this time, I was 18. and I'd be in somewhere like Newcastle, and I'd go up to these strange men and be like, can I take your photo? And they're like, what is this for? Because we didn't want to skew the data. So that's when I was hooked about what we could do with AI. But it wouldn't be until I was in my late 40s when I co-founded an AI company and became

the first female CEO to deploy computer vision at scale in the United States that I would come back full circle. It's such an inspiring story, and I'm so sorry for the loss of your father. It sounds like an incredible person. Mia, I want to move to you. I'd love to hear how did you get involved in the space. You're a cardiologist by training, so lots of credibility with menopause, but what was your story? So my story, it's kind of twofold. I will credit my amazing girlfriend, Susan Sly.

She sent me back to school to go and learn AI. So she said to me, if you don't learn AI, you're going to get left behind. So I went to MIT and learned AI in health care, AI and business. And it was one of the greatest moves I ever made because that is where our frontiers is heading. But my story of why I do, what I do is at 32, I went down in the OR. I was the director of the OR. And I remember seeing the staff on the left-hand side. Supposedly, I made it out into the hallway, was chatting with staff, and completely fell back,

cracked my head open and woke up three hours later in ER and they'd called code on me. I was dismissed as a four-month, you know, postpartum woman, she has anxiety. I'm sure she hasn't slept. And so I was unwell. And it took about two to three weeks before I was taken seriously and then I was medevacked out to a large tertiary center and diagnosed with a cardiac condition. So that's propelled me to my passion for a woman's cardiology. And then it propelled me into the love of cardiovascular genetics and functional genomics. Now, how did I ever get involved with Susan Slyne, menopause and perimenopause? That's the leading question, right?

It is because I was seeing these women every single day coming into my office, anxiety, palpitations. and these women were dismissed. They were not receiving guideline care. And so it was my duty to go back to school again and become a menopause certified provider in our country. And so that's why I'm here. During that time, I will share with you at 32, I also ended up sadly needing a total hysterectomy

with removal of my ovaries. So there I was, this 32-year-old woman flung into full menopause the next day, and it is immediate. You're flashing and you're not sleeping. There's no grace period and also received non-guideline care. So every symptom, and I won't go through them, but some of them are horrific, I've experienced those. And so I'm truly here to contribute to the benefit of women's health care and to make a difference.

And yeah, you know, I'm addicted to this. We text all the time. We do. And I'm like, I'm loving the data. So I'm a data girl. So thank you so much for this opportunity to be here truly honored. Well, we're so excited that you're both here. And me, I deeply respect that, like, willingness to continually go back to school and to, you know, pivot. I think lots of people become cardiologists and stop there. But, and not that that's a bad thing at all. But I think so many people resonate with what you're saying as far as, like, the likelihood of women being dismissed, especially with non-specific symptoms, like anxiety or fatigue or trouble sleeping, all these different things. And I'm so sorry. that that happened to you, but also just so deeply respect and find so beautiful that you

channeled that hurt and traumatic experience into creating such a beautiful company that's now benefiting so many women. So I'd love for you to talk about what the pause is doing. Absolutely. You said something, Emily, so I want to throw this in for everyone listening because there's new research that came out last year, and we're all, we love research, the three of us, that women as young as 30 are going into perimenopause. 30. 30. And so I'm currently 53. I have to think about this. I think I'm 53 right now. But I started being symptomatic after I had my fourth child when I was 37. And I thought it was just postpartum. But you know, anxiety, hot flashes, night sweats, couldn't sleep. My mood was up and down. I was

having two week long periods. And that went on for 13 years. And, you know, anxiety, hot flashes, night sweats. And And to me, his point, I was dismissed. I was, my favorite story was one doctor was like, it's all in your head. And he said, my friend just wrote a personal development book. He literally goes to the trunk of his car, gets this book out and is like, here you go. And I went, you realize I do speaking events with Tony Robbins? And I've written seven books. I'm like, what are you doing?

And it just went on and on and on. And part of what there's a French saying, the raison d'être, like your reason for being, our reason for being why the company exists is because we don't want to see any woman suffer in silence. She shouldn't have to go on this journey alone. And the fact that we're using AI as a first line is thinking about it very differently so that that woman has a companion when it's two in the morning or she doesn't feel like she can talk to her partner or she's feeling so alone that there's someone to talk to who gets her. And it's not to replace humans, but that AI to be there with her to comfort her and say, you know what, girlfriend, it's okay. you're not in this by yourself and no, this isn't all in your head. Quick tangent. Like I think like around these reproductive events, women get somatically gaslit.

And I had a very similar experience postpartum where I was breastfeeding and my vitamin D was really low and I was tired. And like my doctor for two years was like, oh yeah, new moms are often tired. Ha ha. And then like finally got a doctor who would listen. And like my vitamin D was like 17. It's supposed to be like 50. Yeah, my bad.

But like, it took like, wow, six weeks to feel better and $5 worth of vitamin D. And I was so pissed. And it's just like, and I did the right things, right? I asked the doctor, he's like, you seem healthy, right? And it wasn't going to kill me. But like, as these things are not going to. But like, we condition ourselves to, like, tolerate way too much. Yes.

And primary care physicians are not adequately trained in supporting people through those transitions. And so I'm so sorry that that happened to you. And I think, unfortunately, it is still happening to women today. And like, we absolutely need to solve that. That's probably a topic for another podcast. I think one thing that's so interesting about AI in the way it's going to respond to these moments, like you said, like having a friend 24-7 and the availability is huge. But I think another thing that's really huge is because so many women go through this, they actually are doing something really unhelpful and normalizing it for each other. Because I was complaining to my mom group, you know, and lots of lots of

friends who it's okay to be tired right and everyone's like I'm tired too yeah you know my I'm also like welcome to motherhood yeah I'm also tired I also like don't feel like I'm performing us and then we were all just kind of like commiserating and validating each other and that like feels good in the moment and you're like okay it's not just me but like just because it's normal to have all these things happen to you actually doesn't mean it's inevitable and so I think not only is the beauty of your product that it's this 24-7 availability when your friends are hopefully sleeping and you're going through something but it's also the ability to kind of reset the narrative and stop normalizing all this dysfunction for each other and instead realize that like, yes, it is normal to feel like crap during menopause,

but that doesn't mean that you can't do anything about it. And so Mia, medical doctor, what are some of the things that we can do about it? What do people need to know that they're maybe dismissing or ignoring right now? Well, I want to highlight though. You literally nailed the head on the brain on this. I'm like spinning with what you're saying. First of all, I'm glad you found someone who's taking great care of you. And the first thing I want to say is the average women in pari menopause, menopause goes through five to six providers. So your story is the story across our nation. And we need to change that narrative.

Women are dismissed. You use the words gaslit. That is truly happening. And that is because we get labeled as W.W. Winy women. I want you to know, that's a phrase. Winy women. She's a whiny woman that came in.

But women, 75 to 80% of all women have symptoms, symptoms that are treatable, that if they had the right provider, it could really make a difference. We think of perimenopause as menopause as menopause as the fatigue, the brain fog, the night sweats, you know, the hot flashes, perhaps the low libido and, you know, all of those symptoms that go on. And those are real, weight gain, right? You know, it's real. And still, again, a lot of that stuff can be.

be treated by the right provider. My famous saying, Emily, is those are one sector. Then we have the silent but serious cardiovascular disease. We know that our estrogen loss is contributing to cardiovascular disease. And heart disease is the number one cause of death of women in the U.S. One woman drops dead every 80 seconds. I want everyone on this call to know we have heart day coming up in two days, right? National Woman's heart day. And so we have that. It's in the guidelines, you know, for us to pay attention to that. Then we have osteoporosis. You know, we don't want women breaking their hips and those changes in their health start in perimenopause. Early, we need to be aware of that. Vitamin D, right? Important for our bones. Then we have the symptoms like mental health and wellness.

Alzheimer's is two-thirds greater in women than it is in men. Our brain is so estrogen-rich that there's a lot of research going into there. And then just the lack of treatment, less than five percent, five to six percent, currently in our country are getting correct prescriptive therapy. And again, that's a stunning statistic. So hence the pause, you know, we're here to really make a difference, you know, in so many different ways. But you were right. The symptoms are rampant. The education is low. I'm a certified provider in our country. And there's only one of me to every 30,000 women in our country. Isn't that shocking? Well, it's like, wow. So how many women are going to get dismissed? Do we need other agents to provide support for these women?

The answer is yes. And the stories, Mia hears, some aren't appropriate for the show. Oh, shocking. Emily, and I am so grateful to Mia's point, vitamin D. I used to be a certified holistic nutritionist. So iron, vitamin D, get your sunlight, sleep, meditation, exercise, all of those things, right? You know, in pari menopause, menopause, it's called the zone of chaos. And it is this whole hormone journey.

And anyone watching listening, you think about like a roller coaster, this whole journey that your hormones go through. It's the number one suicide rate for all females. We talked about this in Davos. According to the CDC, are women in menopause in the United States. And we're dying. It's the highest divorce rate. We're in the zone of chaos. yay and then to your point it's like oh it's normal to be tired it's normal to have low libido it's

everyone listening no it's not freaking normal we have so many things to do in our lives right and as you said earlier like we're normalizing it there's a lot of nonsense on tictock instagram like i've seen the craziest stuff like nicotine patches for for like treating perimenopause people are capitalizing on the current state. Right. And well, that's what's so scary about there being such a lack of providers, right? That it creates so much room for influencers that have no relevant degrees to come in because you can't get the appointment.

So you're listening to TikTok. I do want to push back a little bit, though, because for everybody hearing, it is normal. It's just that it's avoidable, treatable, fixable. So it's not inevitable. And like, so I don't want anybody feel these things to think that they're doing anything wrong or then anything is wrong with them. Right. But also you don't have to settle for feeling like this.

Exactly. Don't settle and don't suffer. So how are you solving this problem? Sure. That's a great question. And to me as point, not everyone will go on hormone replacement therapy. Not everyone can. Going back to the fact we all love data, a lot of the data that

is used to make recommendations. And I even ran into a woman in Switzerland. It's like, my doctor says that HRT is bad. And I'm like, how old is your doctor? Like, 900? Like, what are you talking about? Can we pause for a second? I want to make sure everybody knows about why this myth came from. And what do we now know? They could probably feel my eye roll if they're not watching. If you're just listening, we're all deeply eye rolling. We're going to tell you why. So the women's health initiative study got published back in 2002. And back then, it was one of the largest clinical trials ever done on women. And man, I'm sure we all know it hit time, Vogue.

It was like everywhere. And every woman got terrified to be on hormone replacement therapy. Every provider stopped prescribing. And pretty much all of women's health research had a massive shutdown. And so what happened is now when we look back on that data, we know we were wrong. There was, you know, 25% increase of cancer and cardiovascular disease and breast cancer and all those things you're talking about. And that's from very different medication as well that we use. We don't use prem random prem pro anymore.

But the challenge what the data was, and you know, I again love data is the majority of all of those women were over the age of 60. The average age was 63, 35% of those women were over the age of 70, and they came in with chronic diseases as well. So we know looking back that that data was wrong. Did everybody hear that? Wrong. So people who need to just zoom out one step further. So hormone replacement therapy, which is basically just giving you mostly the estrogen that your body had stopped making during pari menopause and menopause is highly effective at treating these symptoms. So it would become sort of standard of care and very popular.

Then this Women's Health Initiative study comes out in 2002 that basically says, yeah, we know this thing works, but it causes all these cancers. And so basically overnight, these prescriptions disappeared. Women were throwing it out. And cold turkey quitting on hormones. Like nobody was taking these drugs anymore. In hindsight, the analysis was completely invalid. There were really bad conclusions wrong. It was a poorly constructed study.

But yet, because it got so much. press and like just spread like wildfire. Even until today, there are people who are not getting access and, you know, have been told by their parents, don't do this. It like causes cancer. Some of the stunning data, Emily, is did you know estrogen alone actually reduces the risk of breast cancer 40 percent? Wow, we've done a total spin.

Yes, when you add progesterone in a little bit different story, but the data has all shifted. And I love that. Thank goodness we are making some progress with where we're going. But just because a woman has breast cancer does not mean she cannot have hormone replacement therapy. There's many different kinds of breast cancer. And that's another important part for your viewers to know. It has to be estrogen-sensitive breast cancer, and a lot of breast cancers are not estrogen-sensitive, right? They come from different reasons. So thank you for putting – that's a really important point for everyone. This is a big PSA for everyone listening.

Yeah. And to that point, too, when we're looking at – I want to start. with lifestyle because you ask the question and we're here at WOOP, right? The lifestyle is a big ameliorator of a lot of symptoms. If a woman, now again, a PSA, if you're having Coke and Doritos and a whole pizza before bed and you're not sleeping, it doesn't matter if you're on HRT. That's not going to help you. So where the pause comes in is we start with lifestyle interventions and what is ground truth. we know that the CDC recommends 30 minutes of movement every single day. We know that eight to 10 cups of water. We know that meditation, prayer, all of those things. And we build that solid

foundation. And when we're doing those things and we're tracking our symptoms, we can begin to see the correlation. We also know that alcohol is, hey, everyone listening, I love my red wine. Like, I love it. But we also know it's not the best. And especially it does increase the risk of cancers of all kinds for women in this age cohort, but it also is a sleep disruptor, increases anxiety and so forth. So to be able to begin to track those things and to be able to integrate with biofeedback as well, and then have the AI be able to have a conversation with you based on that. So I'll give an example. So our AI, her name is Harmony. She named herself. It's Harmony with an I. Just like the Janet Jackson song, you know, I can't remember nasty. That was it.

But so every time I say it's Harmony with an eye, it's Harmony if not, if you're nasty. But anyway, so Harmony, Harmony and are having a conversation. And her notice is, Susan, your mood is lower. And then we were sharing before we went on air that after Davos, I got really sick. So Harmony was observing my mood. And interestingly enough, I didn't need an immune score because she was going, oh, your mood is going down. And some work that, you know, I hope we get to collaborate on is when we look at the immune system, even immunologists don't know how mood affects the immune system, right? But in my particular case, my mood was going down for a variety of reasons, which we won't get into, but, you know, you and I both know.

And then I got sick. But would I have been sick if my mood hadn't gone down, right? So, but Harmony was able to do that intercept and then I had that notice. And that's why I was saying to you, like, that's why I left Davos a little early so I could go and rest. What's up, folks? If you are enjoying this podcast or if you care about health, performance, fitness, you may really enjoy getting a whoop. That's right.

You can check out whoop at whoop.com. It measures everything around sleep, recovery, strain. And you can now sign up for free for 30. 30 days. So you literally get the high performance wearable in the mail for free. You get to try it for 30 days, see whether you want to be a member. And that is just at whoop.com. Back to the guests. I think menopause sometimes gets oversimplified to, you know, your period stops and you're not fertile anymore. And it's this whole body thing that's going on. And a lot of women become less insulin sensitive. And so you get some of these like metabolic dysfunction symptoms and that can show up in all these interesting ways. as that shifts and so food cravings and preferences and things can shift with that. And you can very easily become like subtly micro and macronutrient deficient just because of sort of energy shifting and all these kinds of things.

And so then all of a sudden, you know, you might end up in a place where we were talking earlier about low vitamin D. Well, that's going to make you more likely to get sick, more likely to have low mood. And all these things are like very connected. And yeah, the ability to pull out those patterns for people. It's very whoop. I know that's something that you guys are doing as well. Yeah, we're obsessed with our woops and we're not just saying that.

I'm competing with my whoop age right now. If you can't see, we both have moves on. I have the sport, I have the sport, beyond. One thing that the listeners might find interesting, that me and I are looking at symptoms that no one's talking about right now, which are so fascinating, like cold flashes. So when I was just before I entered menopause, I would get cold flashes. And it was the craziest thing, Emily, it could be. We live in Phoenix.

It could be 116 degrees out, and I'd be in the summer, and I'd be so cold. It felt like ice was in my veins, and I'd be drinking hot tea. I'd go stand outside. I'm still cold. And right now, Dr. Jennifer Burke, who's on our board of medical advisors, she said to me, there's 104 symptoms. 104. So we're looking at, there's one I can't even pronounce, but it essentially means you've lost interest in the things that used to find interesting.

Oh, and Hedonia. Yeah, and Hedonia. Yes, thank you. Thank you. Thank you for asking me. So we're looking at these different symptoms. And of course, it makes a very complex story about perimenopause and menopause or looking even at Straw 10 where there's 10 different potential phases of perimenopause

and menopause. And most technology out there wants you to self-identify. It doesn't work like that, right? You don't just self-identify because there's such a complex. symptom, age, medical history picture that goes into it. What I'd like to talk about is the importance of both types, of user self-report and biometric because, like, my biometrics may say, yes, this is amazing, but maybe I'm not feeling good.

Maybe I had a fight with my husband, maybe, and it's the important for women to know that how you feel is really important. The wonderful thing about biometrics is like, so, me, you know. I was like talking about her immune system score to be able to take what this is happening in here and giving me feedback and saying, it's okay if I take today off work. It's okay if I go to bed early. It's giving myself permission as a woman to feel how I'm feeling if that makes sense. The word I always use is intrinsic bias.

All patients come in with intrinsic bias. Everybody does. And that's okay. We're supposed to, right? When the wheels come off the bus, I'll say I haven't slept for a month or two weeks or but then being able to use self-reported data with their mood, how do they really feel? And then looking at this data, it truly is a game changer in care. One of the things we found really early with Whoop is that there are so many people who have just

been conditioned to not listen to their bodies. Yes. And even like to think that listening to their body is like weak or something like that and do not give themselves permission to do that. And so a huge value add that we didn't entirely expect going into Whoop was like the sort of objective third party giving you permission to back off because like WOOP was originally created in their sort of V1 intended for elite and professional athletes. And we were intentionally going after people who were looking for advice on when to slow down,

not trying to target where sort of the rest of the nascent. wearables market was, which was like, you know, couch to 5K, get, you know, move more, get hit your, like, we were the way other end of people who are at risk of overtraining because they're doing too much. LeBron James and Michael Phelps were like two of our first five members. We found that a lot of collegiate athletes and especially like there were pockets of sports, like men's ice hockey, right? Where it's like, if you said to a coach, I don't feel well, I need to go sit down, you

know, they would call you names that I will not use on this podcast and, you know, tell you basically to like shut up and keep going. Which is what's happening to women in paramedopause and menopause. That's the piece to your point. I used to be a professional athlete and I gave myself an autoimmune disease from over-training because we didn't have any wearables. Well, we had polar heart markers or whatever. But what you just said, Emily, is so profound because women.

are going to social media and they're looking for some kind of like validation of what they're feeling instead of saying I'm going to take what my wearable is telling me and I'm going to acknowledge my feeling because the number of women, the statistic in the workforce right now, according to Mayo, the lack of productivity and the cost to health care is $36 billion domestically, less than 3% of employers provide any perimenopause or menopause benefits, presenteism, absenteeism are so high and women are not feeling well and they don't know what to say. Well, but you know what's crazy is like, you know, the fact that you overtrained is unfortunately like so shockingly common, but you were, I'm guessing, praised the entire time that you were

overtraining for working so hard, right? And told that you're tough and it's positive, positive, positive. And then all of a sudden, oh, she's broken. next. I've made a half marathon every day. And then on Sundays I ran a marathon because Sundays I would train, I'd do a three-hour run. I'd train swim for two hours and I'd bike for five hours every freaking Sunday. We would tell you not to do that.

It didn't exist. It didn't exist. But we actually really early on, we partnered with the Corey Stringer Institute at Yukon. We worked with Dr. Doug Kasa, who's the PI there, to develop our recovery score. and the unfortunate story behind the Corey Stringer was an athlete on the NFL, so professional football player, and he died of a heat stroke during a game,

and he told his coach before he went out and died on the field that he wasn't feeling well, and they told him, you know, shut up and play. And so, of course, his wife sued because many people had heard him say, I don't feel well, right? And so then she donated all the money that she wanted to create this institute,

and they study sudden death in sport. And it's a beautiful research institution. that has, you know, really advanced the field and done really important and incredible work. And, you know, we were really grateful to be able to partner with them. It's like a two-hour drive from here. So they were a really great partner when we were just barely starting. But, you know, just that, that idea that, like, we don't, like, know how to have these conversations, even in the, you know, NFL and these, you know, incredibly, you know, well-staffed circles full of experts and all these things. It's like you're not allowed to listen to your body. And so then, you know, how do we create this objective third party that can

just say, like, I know you think that you're being really disciplined and tough by doing this, but actually, you know, running a half marathon every day, probably not the right move and actually how much faster and stronger you would get if you allowed yourself to rest and what's happening there. And so I think, like, yeah, giving people that ability to step back and not have to be the one to make the call when that call is something that, like, you know, I think it takes like too many years of therapy to, like, retrust your body and so can, like, come in and kind of support. thought with some objectivity, I think is really important for a lot of people. Because we get this question a lot where people are like, why do I need a wearable to tell

me how I slept? Like, I know if I'm tired or why do I need? And it's like, because actually like we're just really shockingly not in tune with our bodies. And if you are one of those like few enlightened people and know what's going on, great, but most of us are not there. And to your point, combining the wearable data with the 104 symptoms that you get to, hopefully not experience. The Mia and I, as a total aside for anyone listening, me and I get women in their 70s who had no symptoms going in their 50s. And then suddenly in their 70s, now it's vaginal dryness. We just spoke to a gal a couple of weeks ago. Now, night sweats.

Now they're getting these, you know, things coming up that most women would have had 20 years earlier. or no one knows why that's the case. And to be able to take multiple data points and to be able to say, okay, no, it isn't all in my head. There's the feedback I'm getting. And it doesn't matter what age you on just because they say this isn't normal because no one actually knows what's normal for women in menopause, which to me as a earlier point is 40% of our lives.

Mia, I'm wondering if from the doctor perspective, what are the physical, like there's, what you say 100 and 10? 104 symptoms. And counting. Yeah, I'm sure we'll have more. What are the things from just human physiology perspective that even women literally in the throes of this do not understand, that's helpful to understand? How is one little estrogen molecule causing all this chaos?

Yeah. Okay, that's a load of question because that's a really big one. You gave me a big one, Emily. So estrogen is like a master hormone of us. And did you know we have over 50 hormones in our body? 50 to 60. Well, you know all this. And we are not just a single hormone each working independently. They work in a network. And when one goes off the rails, then hormone two will go off the rails. So it lends to a cascade. So it's a really good point. When estrogen, as Susan said, she knows I love calling it the zone of chaos. When one starts to shift, others start to shift. And that can be very conscientious to even things like cortisol, which is really important for stress and anxiety. So then that one goes off. And then perhaps your thyroid goes off. You talked about insulin sensitivity. Yes, estrogen definitely starts to regulate or dysregulate those. So that's how it would describe

that to our listeners. It's not just because estrogen goes down or progesterone goes down. Then it starts a triggering cascade to over 50 to 60 other hormones. And our body, I love to describe it as a recipe book, right? We have 25,000 coated genes, but our genes and our hormones love to be turned on and turned off. And when things get dysregulated, then the cascade begins. And the cake you're baking might turn chocolate instead of vanilla or, you know, vices, you know, hot flashes, cold flashes, everything that's going on. And that's why I love our application. Like, I truly love the philosophy of what we're trying to do in our application, things like when we began the pause technology, when a woman logs on, it was really important to me that she de-identifies. We do not want to know your

name and I don't want to know your exact birth date. I want you to feel 100% confidence to get into the application and use it. I'll be honest with you. A lot of apps ask me, what's my name, what's my birthday, you know, all those things. I don't want to say I'm Dr. Mia Churny and I have vaginal dryness and I have brain fog. But I just wrote your prescription yesterday. Don't worry. I think I got the right dose, right? I want to truly interact to make a benefit for my health. And then Susan talked about once they get into that, they find out what stage a perimenopause or menopause are in. You're in this for 40% of your life from the day you start perimenopause till the day you die, because the symptoms continue to the day we die. And so I want women when they get into the app to know

exactly where are you? Are you an early perimenopause? Are you an early postmenopause? Because the health concerns and the symptomology do differ in those stages. And that is critical, like you were saying, the commiserating that sort of piece. Let women know where are you at. Then Harmony comes in and says, hey, Emily, you know, welcome. Did you know you're in early perimenopause? These could be some of the symptoms you're experiencing an X number of percent of women have these symptoms just like you, right? And then they get into our application. And there's so much, like Susan said, lifestyle pieces that are going in there, right? So you're getting in there. I want my women's symptom tracking. It's really, really important. If you had high blood sugar, you had high blood pressure,

I'd ask you to go home and track, right? So please track your symptoms for me. Track your mood for me. You know, let me see your data on your wearables. Are you really sleeping? You know, we come in with intrinsic bias. I haven't slept for a month. The wheels are off the bus and you look, and perhaps they actually are getting sleep, but other things are going on. I will let you know shout out to whoop again. Susan knows I had 18 wake events a few nights ago. My progesterone went up.

Yeah. Right? So it is really helping guide care with all of the pieces that we're putting in there. And I'll let Susan speak to some of the other pieces within our app. But we've truly thought about how can we benefit the patient, but also how can we benefit the providers and organizations and companies to use the application. So we're truly, you know, serving to improve the wellness. Now, that was a long answer, but I got into the network of hormones, right?

Like, wow, it's a cascade. Yeah. One thing that I think is so smart that you did from a product perspective is that kind of pseudo anonymity that you're offering. Yeah. And I just, so my husband started a company, co-founder, and they're making like a wearable for your toilet. Yeah.

So computer vision, everything that gets flushed down the toilet. And their chief science officer, Dr. Karen Rajan, was saying because he's a gastroenterologist and was saying that, like, colon cancer is something. People literally die of embarrassment. Yeah. Because, like, stage one colon cancer, like, almost 100% survival rate, right? Like, and it's just that people don't want to call up their doctor and, like, talk about poop. So they put off the call, they put it off.

And then it's like, at some point you can't put it off anymore. And now it's like, you know, one of the more deadly. I know someone who died of it at age 32. And Jesse was her name. She was an absolute amazing person. And coming out of computer vision to that point is a total segue. But what the AI can detect. And that was always when I was going into like the bleeding edge of AI before chat GPT was a thing.

And people are like, well, what is AI or how can you be going into that? And I said, health care is the bright, shiny spot because the AI will pick up patterns. The AI through computer vision or whether it's auditory or text analysis is going to see patterns other people can't see. And it's going to save lives. And so, shout out to that. I want to say, going back to Mia and the whip, this is really funny. So Mia and I speak first thing in the morning, last thing at night and probably 500 times a day.

And she was like, did you know this is the call in the morning? I had 18 wake events last thing, 18 wake events. That was so funny. And I was like, is it good that she does this or not good, but 18. But I was grateful. Yeah, but I think the point that I wanted to make, not just to shout out thrown, but to bring it back to menopause is that, you know, vaginal dryness is very common. And I think like so many people, the thought of bringing that up to another human face to face and saying, I have vaginal dryness is so cringy. Or whatever that they would rather suffer.

And then like you said, right? Like it kills their sex drives. Husbands get annoyed. Divorce rates go through the roof for more reasons than just lack of sex. But like they start to shut down all these other things because that conversation is terrifying. It is. And, you know, I think one of the beautiful things at AI and there's really beautiful data from Nielsen that like people love using chat GPT. They trust it more than their doctor.

And it's because AI actually like a plus is that it doesn't feel human yet. Right? And it's like we all were like racing to make it human. But the fact that it's like, it feels like much safer than sitting down face to face and saying like I have this embarrassing symptom. And so they don't treat it. And I love that you're sort of giving people away to have these conversations to bring up a scary topic to test it. And I think like one of the things that's really important is, you know, you can almost like practice the conversation with AI. Realize that there's a solve. And then now you can go to your doctor and like know that if I muster up. the courage to say the scary thing. There's a treatment on the other side. And like I think that's really helpful. Even just giving somebody this idea that like, hey, this is fixable. I think it's probably like saving marriages, saving lives, like doing all this good. And I think like, you know, it's horrible that there aren't enough of you to give everybody human to human doctor interactions because I think there's so much value in that as much as I love and I'm pro AI. But I also think there's something really special about creating a safe space to have some of these scary conversations. conversations because I think like so many women are also told that like menopause is the process of like shriveling up and becoming irrelevant and like I just want people to hear that it's not. And then it can be great. Absolutely. And you you brought up Emily about the partner too. So the number one most asked feature we have right now is to be able to take what a women is going through and in the app and share the conversation with her partner. And And that is something we're working on. And then to your point about the pass-off from the app to the provider, to be able to aggregate that symptom profile in a one-pager or to be able to populate an EMR, that's the next thing

that we have coming out in terms of our product roadmap. And when I was in my past AI company, it was myself and four male co-founders. And I was sweating through my suits. So every time I would travel, I was sweating or bleeding. I was like, it was awful. And I felt very alone. And I was also not only very much client facing and doing all of the travel as a CEO, but I felt so alone that I didn't, you know, my husband, Chris, he's not expected to understand it. I would step out of the room. Then the meeting keeps going. I didn't know what to say. And that was where I was in New York, this way. Women in AI event that was being hosted by HPE and NVIDIA. It's a great event. 32 girls, we talk AI, then we drink champagne and we go to a fashion show.

It's like the best event ever. Yes. Well, yes, let's make that happen. And Amy Santucci, I'll send you this show and let's make it happen. Emily gets to be there. And the girls we are all talking about how much sleep we didn't get. And this is the fall of 2023 and hot flashes. And what did you have your hotel room set for?

And even though it was funny, it was heartbreaking because these are senior leaders at some of the biggest hyperscalers in the world. And these are the conversations we're having. And one of the girls was like, Susan, can you solve this with AI? And when I got back from that trip, I called Mia and I said, do you want to start a company? And that's how it happened because Mia is not only my best friend, my sister from another mister. to be able to bring the technology and the healthcare piece together to be able to serve these women. This is really all we think about other than the obvious things like, okay, food or whatever. But it's night and day, constant, constant.

Like, how do we prevent women from not feeling alone, not feeling like this is all in their head? I was in Las Vegas doing an event for a very large hyperscaler, and I was sharing the suicide rate in this woman who was CIA of a massive multi-billion dollar corporation started crying and I said what's going on and she said my mother killed herself when she was in menopause and I feel like not on our watch not on our watch yeah there's um nothing scarier than your body doing things that you don't understand and that nobody's helping you with and you know I think one of the things that you know people complain about Dr. Google or doctor chat GPT and all these things. But it's hard sometimes to imagine living in Boston where we have the best healthcare in the company, literally like steps

from where we're sitting right now, that so many people don't have access to that and don't have access to information. And I think the stat that you shared just about how few people understand this space is a little bit chilling and concerning and all these things. And I don't know if humbling's the right word, but just to think of all the people who had to suffer to get to the place where like people got angry enough to build product and just again like how many lives are being saved and, you know, how much just like unnecessary shame or embarrassment or, you know, self-hate or whatever, like we can just avoid and, you know, therefore like all the mental health and productivity and beautiful things that are being enabled.

Thank you for the work that you're doing and thank you for being here today to share it with everybody. It's, I think just one of those companies, like I said, Mia, when we met a couple months ago, just a company that you're rooting for because I was like, this is a problem. that when I get there, like, I will be so grateful that you got here, you know, 20 years earlier and solved. And, you know, I'm a mom of a little girl. And, you know, just when I think about all the things that, like, she won't have to deal with because other people are solving. It's just, yeah, grateful personally, grateful for all the little girls who will get there later.

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This is such an important conversation. I'm so grateful for the vulnerability that you brought to it. As people are wrapping up, if you could just wave your magic wand, like what is one thing you can each have a different one thing, but one thing that you really want the listeners to take away and understand about the topic? So my number one thing would be is that if you're seeing a provider and you feel dismissed, next. move on. Please move on and find someone who's going to listen to you. Absolutely.

And just as a provider, if somebody is in that not feeling heard, how can they go about finding a better fit next time? And I think sometimes people worry about getting labeled difficult or doctor shopping or all these things. Like how do you? If you haven't been labeled difficult girls, then you're not doing anything worthwhile in life. I feel like difficult is the badge of honor, in my opinion. Okay, so my number one thing was if you're seeing a provider, that's not a fit for you. My word for you is next. It's really important. You're going to spend 40% of your life to be connected. So my story is a lady came to see me and she is a provider.

And she was told, you got to go see Mia. This is the woman you want to see. So her story is she went to see her practitioner. And the practitioner said to her, are you having sex? And she said, yeah. He says, are you having an orgasm? And she said, yeah. He says, you're fine. And totally dismissed all of the perimenopause symptoms that were going on. So I want women to know that it's real. And it's even real for us as practitioners out there, you know, boots on the ground. Please, you know, next. That's why she came to me next. But you asked me the question about, you know, how do people get connected and how do they find that

right provider, well, I'm happy to announce that the pause technology is launching telehealth. And we are going to have a very robust system. So, you know, when women come into our platform, yes, they're doing all of those pieces, but a lot of women do need care. And so we're going to provide comprehensive care, both from nutrition, sexual health, you know, yes, provider care, I specialize in functional genomics, so women are going to be able to get their genomics, on pharmacogenomics. And so it's going to be that one place that you're going to get a full comprehensive community of care. And so we're very, very excited. And it will be nationwide. Amazing. Congratulations on the upcoming launch. That sounds pretty transformative.

Thank you. Thank you. Yes. And Susan, I'd love for you to answer the same question. Yes. And we can promise that as long as you're having orgasms, but you don't feel well, that none of our providers will dismiss you. So as it aside, But my takeaway very seriously is for anyone listening, if you have a woman in your life who is in her 40s, in her 50s, chances are she's suffering. And be that person. Go out for our coffee, go out for dinner. Ask her how she's really feeling because all of the evidence, all of the data illustrates, it's not good. And I really firmly believe I've had three people in my family commit suicide and I I firmly believe, as I said earlier in the show, that we're here. The three of us are here for a time such as this. And it really and truly is about that one woman who might even be listening right now to the show who's feeling so alone and has the courage to have a conversation with someone. You're not

alone, there are other women going through what you're going through, and you do not have to suffer in silence. This is such a beautiful message. And I want to add one more last thing. I'm going to cheat a little bit. We're here having like girl time, love fest. Many of our listeners are male. What do you wish men knew about that?

I think for me, truly, the question in a serious mode is, you know, we live together. And it's really important as well for men to have some level of support and education. because we don't want to see those divorce rates, those anxiety depression rates. And we do need to solve that issue as well of how we're going to support men to be better educated because, yeah, it's a journey together. And I'll jump in to that, guys, sex is going to change. And it's going to change for you. You might have a little bit of, you know, not as for all as you once were. It's changing for your partner as well. And be creative, play, do something different. But as long as you're trying to move forward, driving with only looking in the rear view mirror, like how things used to be five,

10 years ago, you're setting both of you up to fail. And I would say the onus is 50% on us as women to have the conversation about how we're feeling. And it's also 50% on the guys to have a conversation about how you're feeling and then figure out new ways of doing things. Because Mia and I hear these stories every single day that the intimacy is different, but it's actually even better. Like, you have a toddler, honey, empty nassacks, that's the best. Like, you know, everywhere, anywhere. I really don't care what I say.

I've been in media since I was, like, in my 20s, so I don't care. But it's to be able to play and explore, it's not over. It's a different chapter. Write something fun. That's my message. And one story that I just wanted to. share as we wrap up is that, which is one of my sort of most important whoop moments in terms of understanding what we were building was in 2015 Sam Dancer, who at the time was like a top

10 CrossFit athlete, the peak of CrossFit being very cool. And his wife were both on whoop. And really like burning the candle on both ends, they were both competitive CrossFit athletes. They ran their own gym. And they were on whoop. And they noticed that when they both had red recovery scores, they were bickering. And so they stopped, they basically created this ritual of every morning looking at their recovery scores. And if they were both read, they'd give each other space. And then Sam emailed us and he said, you know, whoop saved my marriage. And so I think like we don't give men enough credit that if we just name, like, it's not that I don't like you. It's just that like, you know, my progesterone's high and I

woke up 18 times last night. I need space. Like you can actually give each other a lot more grace. And men can be a part of this. And men, we can trust men. to meet us halfway. Absolutely. Thank you for having us. Thank you so much, Emily. Truly. Thank you so much.

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That's a wrap, folks. Thank you all for listening. We'll catch you next week on the WooP podcast. As always, stay healthy and stay in the green.