Will Cain Country - Is A.I. The Next Industrial Revolution Or An Economic Dud? (ft. David Marcus & E.J. Antoni, PhD)

Episode Date: June 18, 2026

A.I. is here to stay, but what exactly does it mean for our future? FOX News Digital’s David Marcus joins Will and The Crew to discuss the vision for the future put forth by NVIDIA CEO Jensen Huang in his recent interview with Will, before sharing his thoughts on what exactly it is that European countries lack that causes their residents to be so baffled by America. David and Will also explore the GOP backlash over President Donald Trump’s Iran deal and what a potential alternative could have been. Plus, Economist & The Richard Aster Fellow at the Heritage Foundation E.J. Antoni, PhD sits in with Will to share his predictions regarding A.I.’s impact on the economy of the future, and whether you should be concerned about it replacing your job anytime soon. Subscribe to ‘Will Cain Country’ on YouTube here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Watch Will Cain Country!⁠⁠⁠ Follow ‘Will Cain Country’ on X (⁠⁠⁠@willcainshow⁠⁠⁠), Instagram (⁠⁠⁠@willcainshow⁠⁠⁠), TikTok (⁠⁠⁠@willcainshow⁠⁠⁠), and Facebook (⁠⁠⁠@WillCainNews) Follow Will on X: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@WillCain Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Good morning. The Second Industrial Revolution is upon us. Imagine how it felt in 1905. That might be what it feels like, in fact, in 2026. Plus, if you don't like the deal with Iran, what is the alternative? with David Marcus, an economist, E.J. and Tony. Game Country streaming live at the Will Cain Country YouTube channel, the Will Cain Facebook page. Always here.

Simply follow it, Spotify, or on Apple. Fox News, Digital's David Marcus, joining Tinfoil Pat and Two-A-Day Stan. What's up, Dave? Not much, man. How are you feeling? I'm feeling good. In a world where the World Cup has taken up, the United States of America. In a world where I went to possibly the greatest sporting event of my life in UFC Freedom 250,

in a world where entertainment abounds, I have an announcement for you, Pat, for you Dan, for you, David. I did today perhaps the most athletic thing a human being can do. The type of thing that one attempts for a lifetime, I'm 51 years old, I've been trying to do this, as have the three of you, your entire life. I did it today. I give you a guess. What is something you have been trying to do? You're going to have to think.

You're really going to have to think because every single person listening has been trying to do this as well, okay? Everybody's done it. There's not a single person who hasn't tried this. And everybody fails. Everybody fails. Every time you do it, you fail, you go, man. But today, I did it. This morning, I freaking did it.

Ooh, I don't know. You want to say quit nicotine, but that's not everybody. No. He's already done that before. Dunk a basketball. That's actually interesting. No? No, there's too many people that can do that.

Too many people. This is better than dunking a basketball. This is rarer. I don't even know what it is. So this is a family show, so I'm going to say you try to lick your elbow. No, you're getting, that's better than dunking a basketball. Licking an elbow? Yeah, that's impossible, right?

Is that impossible? It's not impossible. I've seen these people do it. It's hard. You see, okay. And I imagine when I tell you what I did this morning, you're going to lie and say you've done it. And there's going to be one in a hundred out there that say they've done it. I've never seen it done. Or if I have, it's like maybe once or twice, but I don't

recall exactly, but I did this thing. Any more guesses? Big, Big Jep in the chat says, bench press your weight? No. I mean, I can do that even when I'm not trying. When I'm not. Is it related in any way? In a way, it's not swimming. I've always wanted to try that. All right, here's what I did. Okay? I feel like it's going to fall flatter now that I've built it up. Yeah, but you built it up real big, dude.

Did you cure something? This morning. This morning, I caught a fly with my hand. With my hand. For the first time in my life. I would you think about that. Just step back. Don't be a cynic for a minute.

You Mr. Miyaghan. How many times have you swatted at a fly like that? It flies around as close and you go like that. that. And you wonder, did I get it? Did I not get it? You open your hand and it's not there, right? Because they're too fast. You can't get a fly with your hand. Everybody tries it. Everybody has. And I've been trying it for 51 years and I've never caught one. I caught one today. I think the slow clap. How about that? Very well done. I think I've done that before, Will. No, he's lying. Probably like two or three times.

I knew he'd say that. I knew. I knew he'd say it. I know I'm pretty sure. I knew you would. You need to be sure. Yeah. Because when I look at you, I think cat-like reflexes. Yes. Are you going to continue trying now, Will? Or is it over? Like, you've done it? Like, let them go now.

That is a great question, David. Or do I feel like I've unlocked ninja superpower? And now, like, don't mess with me flies. You get in my vicinity. I'm an experienced killer. Do it with chop six now. I have a salt gun. Salt guns are one of the greatest inventions ever, right?

Like, have you guys, do you guys have a salt gun? Mm-hmm. You know what I'm talking about? No. I don't get paid enough to have a salt gun. Connor has one. Oh, dude. Salt gun is 20 bucks at Home Depot probably.

30 bucks at Home Depot. You're like $100. Are they really? Really? They're a glorified Nerf gun. They're a glorified Nerf gun. David, a salt gun. I mean, you got to fly.

I feel like we're in fly season or something in Texas. and you get a fly swatter, and that's great and all, but it does leave a mess. You know, if you get it, and I don't feel like you get it even that often with a fly swatter. A salt gun is a, it's pump action, you know, it's about like yay big, it's got a little, it's about oozy size, maybe. But you just put regular common house salt in it, and when you pump it, it shoots salt out. So it creates like a shotgun spray of salt. and for some reason this gets the flies. They can't see this coming.

And you'll massacre flies wherever you need. Just not like an excuse for people in Texas. Guns will. It doesn't create a mess. They don't splat. They're just kind of dead all of a sudden. You're looking at it and you're like one little piece of salt, pierced it. And you just pick it up and put it in the trash.

Unless you have me. I caught that thing, man. I went like this. And I didn't have to open my fist because it was like right there on the fingertip. I had caught it, like, right where I could see it. And I was like, holy crap. How many people did you show? How many people did you show?

Nobody. I was on my, I was on the pre-call for the Will Kane show, and I had to stop the call down and tell everybody. But then there was a predicament. How do I transfer it to the trash? I had to get a paper towel, quickly put it in the other hand, squish, and then get it in the trash. Because if I opened, he was gone.

I don't know. Riven. I'm super proud. You didn't kill him? I did. I killed it when I did it. But you didn't do it. I did kill it.

I did. Yeah, but you were worried about it. You didn't do it. This isn't money on me. This is like five years ago, me. Yeah. It's like five years ago. Yeah.

All right, David Marcus is with us here today. Oh, lighting bugs are slower. All right. That's no great accomplishment. You can catch a lightning bug like this with two hands going. You know what that? Cumping them. Okay.

I want to talk about this. So I'm going to start here with you, David. On Tuesday, I had a really cool experience for a personal reason in that, you know, David tours of America and has seen a lot. When he comes to Texas, he only goes to Dallas. But, you know, he sees a lot of small towns across America. So I grew up in a small town in Texas, right? When I was growing up, population 30,000. had an industrial base. It was like a blue-collar factory town, but not in the northeastern factory since.

It was a J&J factory, Folgers Coffee Plant, Texas Instruments, and so forth. And then there was a little bit of like quasi-tech that started. I don't even know what they all did. Because Texas Instruments was there, then two or three others popped up. All right, well, about four or five years ago when Biden, honestly, I think I have to give some credit to President Biden on this, He passes the, I think it was called the Chips Act, right, which was going to start bringing back a lot of this stuff from Taiwan to America. Sherman, Texas was selected as a place for all this investment for chips manufacturing. Well, President Trump has continued that with his onshoreing efforts, and NVIDIA went into a $2 billion partnership with this chip manufacturer in my hometown.

Now, this chip manufacturer, I don't know if you guys are interested. this, I think this is pretty fascinating. We're moving into the stage where data is transferred through optics and lasers. It's transferred through light instead of electricity, because it's faster. And so this plant makes optics, and apparently they've been making optics for your iPhone for a long time. That's what they've made. But now with Nvidia, they're getting into, you know, wafers for chips transferring data through light. So Jensen Huang, CEO of Invidia. What is he? One of the world's, is he yet one of the world's richest men? Is he the top ten wizard behind the curtain?

Yeah. He comes to Sherman. And I got to interview Jensen Wong on Tuesday in my hometown. It was a really nice guy, by the way, very personable. And we got to talk about AI and the future of the economy and what it means, David. And we got to talking about, is it dystopia, is it utopia? Is it the second industrial revolution? So listen to this with Jensen Huang.

What is our future? If anyone knows, it has to be you, Jensen Wong. What is our future under AI? It is going to be largely optimistic, largely wonderful. There are some use cases that we have to be extremely careful about. As an all-grade technology, if you look at the progress of technology over the years, electricity, the internet, computers, the automobile. I think we can all accept that in each one of those cases, there are situations and cases where we have to be very careful about. So as the creators of this technology, the industry has to be mindful, thoughtful, rigorous about building and advancing this technology properly. This is the first technology in my generation where we invented a new computer technology where it's easier to access than not. The computer until now has been programmable for about 30 million people in the world. Okay, so here's what we went on and talked about David that I want to talk about with you.

the Industrial Revolution. And I talked about just to Dan and Pat this morning. The way that life changed from 1890 to 1920 was drastic. Like I think if we would have seen life in 1885 and 1925, it was a vastly different world in a hard way to imagine. And I think we can all look back on it and go, it was a great leap forward for humanity in the Industrial Revolution. It surely did not come without headaches. and bumps and so forth. People losing their jobs.

Industry's going out of business. A lot of fear. But on the back ends, you look at that and you go, wow, that was big. I sort of feel like that's where we are right now, David. I feel like life from 2020 to 2050 will look much different than, say, 1950 to 1980 or 1990 to 2020. I just think we're in the Industrial Revolution. We're in it right now. And it's scary.

and there may be a lot of job, you know, creative destruction and the world may feel chaotic. But also, I think we're in what will be a great leap forward. Why on your thoughts, David? Yeah, I mean, I got to be honest, man, I'm a little underwhelmed with the impact that AI has had on our society. And I would push back on comparing either the last 30 years or potentially the next 30 years as being similar to 18. to 1920, I mean, you know, when you talk about the, you know, the telephone and the airplane and driving, and I mean, in terms of the actual impact on how we live our lives, we're both 51. I mean, living in 1990 and living in 2020 is much more similar than living in 1890 and living in in 1920, as far as I can tell. So, you know, we'll wait and see.

I don't know, man. But I think we're at the beginning. David, I think we're at the beginning. And I think you're, what I think, what? I think this is, David, is 1895. I think you're in 1895 or 1900. So what are you got? So what are you anticipating you're going to be able to do in 2060 that, I mean, like, what is it?

What's the equivalent of like, now I can't San Francisco in four hours instead of two weeks. Right. I get it. And I think the answer is I don't know. And they wouldn't have known that in 1905. And that's what's scary about it. That's what's scary. And so, I don't know, I could play the game, right?

I could say robot housekeepers. I could say, you know, who knows? I don't know. That's only solving a need. Dan, you were telling me this morning about a story where AI was creating MRIs for nothing, no price in 60 seconds. You could. Mid Journey started a scan that makes MRIs obsolete,

where it's 10 times less expensive and it takes 60 seconds. It's scanned your whole body. And it's coming out soon. And you can do it in a spot. So, David, I don't know. I don't know. And sometimes I think about this. I'm like, if you step back,

you go, wouldn't it be freaking kind of awesome to be alive in 19, setting aside the World War? Like 1910 and be like, man, you could become a Rockefeller, a Carnegie. Like, if you can just figure out the right way, the world is your oyster. Now, I'm sure that's not how it felt for everybody back then. But I don't know, and I guess those that do know, they'll be the ones that are the Carnegie's and the Rockefellers. Yeah.

And they already own the companies to do it. We may already have them. Their names were musks and Wong. Here's the thing, right? Like, I recently watched gangs in New York with my son. And one of my favorite parts of gangs of New York is the very end, right? when the two graves are there and you see across the Brooklyn Bridge and you see Manhattan grow, right? That's what I'm not seeing.

I'm not seeing this stuff in the plastic of reality, right? That's sort of like Mondrian, the painter talked about the plastic of reality. I'm seeing a lot of this stuff in terms of like I can have a chat buddy or like I can make a weird looking picture. but my day-to-day life and the day-to-day lives of the people that I talk to, I don't, I mean, I'm curious what your guys' experiences are, because I just don't see them being fundamentally transformed by AI. Maybe my sons. So maybe that's different. No, not yet. I think you're right.

Yeah. I think you're right. Not yet. You know, there's something else, and this is going to transition into our next topic, Dave, which you've written about. I just think every morning I have coffee with a buddy, and we inevitably talk about our sons. and, you know, all this different. The hardest, I don't know if it's the hardest thing, but one of the most, I do believe one of the most valuable things in life

that you can become is self-aware. Like, self-awareness is just, I don't know, it's so valuable if you can do it because then you can make changes or appreciate. You can do a lot of things from that position. The world right now is descending upon America, okay? And it is freaking awesome. You and I are soccer fans, David.

We'll get to that part of this in a minute. I can't tell you how much joy I'm getting out of watching these people come to America. I really am, and it's not just on my Internet feed. I see it in Dallas. I saw thousands of Croatians. I saw Japanese. I've seen Dutch. I've seen English.

I've seen them loving Shinerbach beer and raving about Brisket. I've seen them marvel at AT&T Stadium, and they're like, the size, first. but then you know what they're blown away by David? It's freaking air conditioned. It's almost as though we're from the future. And they've been painted this picture that America's terrible. America is that. And they're coming here and they're going, oh, my God.

And it's little stuff like our trucks and things like that and in and out burger. But I just am loving seeing ourselves from the outside that so many Americans, and I don't think just the left, I think the right too, has lost the ability to, to see yourself in a sense of self-awareness and appreciate. Oh, I agree completely. I mean, I do kind of question why the Cowboys need air conditioning. But aside from that, aside from that, yeah, I mean, I wrote about this the other day, and my take was a little different in that what's blown me away is how many of these experiences are road trips.

and how many of these experiences are taking place in what Salina Zito calls the places that you have to drive to? Because those are really the places that are still authentic, right? And not to put too fine a point on it, but the European experience is very much about highly efficient public transportation, right? And it sort of guides you around like where you're going to go. And the American experience. In public health care. Yes. And the American experience is, if I want to get my car at 1 a.m. and drive to Waffa House, I'm going to do that, right?

If I want to take the long way, I'm going to take the long way. If I want to see the roadside attractions, I'm going to see the roadside attractions. And so I think what they're experiencing is real, authentic America. I mean, you know, love it or hate it, like Buckees is authentic. It's real. And so much in Europe now, I think, has become homogenized. And even in our cities, a lot of things are homogenized. So I think these people are seeing a part of the country that's so wonderful.

And I hope more Americans will take advantage of this and be inspired to go do this and so. Let's take a quick break. But continue this conversation with Fox News Digital's David Marcus on Will Kane Country. Visit BetMGM Casino and check out the newest exclusive. The Price is Right Fortune Pick. BetMDM and Game Sense remind you to play responsibly, 19 plus to wager. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, please contact connects Ontario at 1-866-531-2,600 to speak to an advisor. Free of charge.

BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with Eye Gaming Ontario. Cheers to America's 250th birthday. Get 20% off your first purchase at Fox Newswineshop.com with code FNRadio 20. 20% discount excludes wine club offers and cannot be combined with any other promotion. Expires July 31, 21st, 2026. Must be 21 order to order. Please drink responsibly. Welcome back to Will Kane Country. We're still hanging out with Fox News Digitals. David, I see these videos, David, and okay, this is going to support you. But one of the things they keep talking about with America is the variety. They just keep talking about variety, like climate variety, geographic variety, cultural variety. They keep talking about that. Like, America's so big and so much is so different. you know, when we talk about Europe, we actually talk about it not being homogenized, meaning the diaspora of migrants that are coming to Europe and disrupting an existing culture.

What I would argue is what Europeans are experiencing is, and I know freedom can sound trite, but I've actually heard people say that too. Like, there is this sense of freedom because I think that their lives, and I've got to do this with some level of self-awareness. I mean, I've been to Europe several times, so, you know, I can't. judge that trip as the whole culture, but the word you use that I liked is guided. Their life is guided. It's guided by mass transit. It's guided by public health. It's guided by the rules, the barriers, both governmental and cultural, that tell you the path that you're on. And the path

here, both literally and figuratively, is wide open. It's whatever you want. It's whatever you want. Yeah, no, I don't think that's right at all. I mean, I think it's why people kind of. I mean, I think it's why people come here, right? I mean, that ability to just sort of decide, like, you know, I want to up and leave, or I don't, right? Or I want to stay here. I mean, yeah, I do think there's a level of freedom that people see when they come to the United States. And I think you can just see it in people's faces. I mean, you can, it's so funny to me, like, like, when I'm a broad, I always know who's American. Like, aside from, like, the fact that Europeans wear weird sneakers or whatever, like, you can just look at someone's face and you're like, that's an American.

Dude, David, I saw a post this morning. I believe it's the checks have a poster suggesting Americans smile differently because you're targeted. And like an American smile is big and teeth and all that, you know, and it was guiding you to how local smile and it's barely perceptible. Barely perceptible straight line mouth. Yeah. Well, look at, you know, you see, there's one of the viral things is like the Jersey deli guy and like the Scottish people keep going in there to get like Italian subs or whatever. And he's the Simpsons character because Simpson's characters are real. You know, you know, it's, this is how people are.

And you're not going to find that guy in Tennessee, but you're not going to find the barbecue guy in Tennessee in Brooklyn. So, you know, it's amazing. It's amazing. I love that the, so this is my secondary love, that the world, some portion of it, is having its eyes open to what America is. But what I really love about it is, is their ability to remind us of who we are. And that is on two levels. This is back to that industrial age and the economic part of this conversation. Look, folks, we are rich.

We are really, really rich. We really are. Now, we have income disparity. and we have a lot of things, and we have stagnant middle class and lower middle class parts of our economy. But Dan didn't know this. I don't know how this escaped your attention, Dan, when I was talking about AC, air conditioning at AT&T. You didn't know that they don't have AC in their homes, much less a stadium that seats 100,000. Why do they say they're so superior to us?

They don't have ice. More people die every summer in Europe from heat-related. deaths, then we lose, certainly to climate change, you know, or whatever. Well, now, hold on. How about this? Gun deaths. For all the hype about gun deaths, it's not even close to what they lose from lack of AC. Not even close, dude.

Well, they don't have, I have a buddy, and he was hating this, like, Slovenian woman, and I went over to, like, their place one day, and, like, I made a bourbon and ginger, and I opened a freezer, and I'm like, Brad, you don't have any ice. oh, we don't keep ice. What I mean you don't keep? What kind of monsters? Put it in. Somebody comes over.

They can have ice in their drink. He's like, no, Dagmar's not really into ice. I'm like, what even is that? It's so bad. It's just so bad. I like it here. I'll say that. And the other one, you know, back to my point, is cars, right?

I mean, European families don't have three cars. Most of them have one car. Right. It's a completely different way of, thinking about stopping the terror, you know. Then there's the other side, David, and this is the part where we lose, certainly Patrick. So I watched this documentary the other day, David, about Pele. And it said when soccer was born in America.

And, you know, Pele came to America in the 1970s. It was a huge coup for the New York Cosmos to get Pele. He was retired, but they money whipped him. Before Pele, soccer. was barely on the radar at all in America. Meaning like, our parents really didn't know much, didn't know anything about soccer. It wasn't like, even the soccer ball itself wasn't like a universal symbol of sports. You know what I mean?

Pele comes and it totally changes it. And then I'll bet you, did all five of us play soccer when we were kids? Like, every kid played soccer until you're like, what, seven maybe or eight? It's like just what you do. and it became a thing. Obviously, it didn't rise to the level of baseball, basketball, football. And then it kind of died off. And then in 1994, the World Cup comes to America and you see another boom.

And then you get the start of the MLS. And then you get a professional league in America. And it's continued to grow, not at the same rate. What I'm seeing now, I think, and everybody expects this. I'm not making a point that other people haven't made, but this has the prospect to change soccer in America, this World Cup being here. And so far, I think it's living up to its promise. Like, not all my friends are watching the World Cup. It's not that.

But if America continue, this is, even if America doesn't, I think this is going to propel soccer to some level higher than it is today. But if America does do well, I think you're looking at a complete game changer for this sport in this country. I think, I think you're right. Now, look, I think 94 was much more impactful. I remember Pelae coming to the cosmos, and I remember briefly, like, Philly had a team. I forget what their name would. But 94 change up, because I discovered soccer in 1990, completely accidentally, because I was with my parents in Mexico on vacation for three weeks.

It happened to be the three weeks of the World Cup. And I didn't know what the World Cup was in 19. I was 16. What are you? Are you European? How are you on a three week vacation in Mexico? We're Americans here. We don't get off for that long.

What's going on? I don't know. You have to ask my parents. They wanted to, I think it was a two-week vacation and decided to stay. In any event, Mexico wasn't in it that year. They had some violation or something. So everyone's rooting for Argentina. I discover Madadona.

I'd become an intense Argentina fan, which I still am. But, I mean, when I got back, I was like, oh, what about the World Cup? And this is the what? So 94 definitely changed that. MLS has changed that. we've gotten better. As I wrote in my column today, I think the uphill climb for soccer is that the pace really doesn't work well for Americans, that our sports, primarily baseball and football, are really built around the pauses. Most of our time as Americans watching sports happens in our head,

not on the field. So there's a pitch. Now you've got time, okay, that just happened. I wonder what that, Or there's a, you know, second and nine. Oh, okay, they gained five. Now it's third and four. Oh, interesting. Right. And that's all there, whereas soccer is like this dreamlike liminal space. One analogy I use is like we can simultaneously read a book and an article while we're thinking about it, right?

And we're kind of doing both at once and it's a, but if we reach a point where we go, oh, and then we look up and we say, I want to think about that for a minute. That's a completely different mental space. And that's the American mental space for sports. In soccer, we're just starting to get used to this sort of like dreamy, endless, relentless pace, you know? Okay. I love this. I love this. I read this analysis one time.

It's more football than baseball. I don't think baseball fits in this analysis. That football is the perfectly built television sport. It is tailor-made for a television show. It is a bunch of mini-dramas in a game. A series, four downs to get a first down. It has dramatic builds all throughout the game. Oh, no, it's third and eight.

Now we got to get it. And it has this arc that constantly goes up and down, up and down, up and down for us. And that is perfect. It's like a mini-series playing out multiple, right, throughout a game. And then the game itself serves as the larger thematic miniseries. I don't, I mean, you could say baseball, but because of pitch count and so forth. No, baseball was perfect for radio, Will.

And that's when it emerged, right? Yes. Yes. Yes. And baseball has settled. I actually think the pitch clock and the shorter games have helped baseball, I think, because it's settled into too laid back. it doesn't have the drama that it needs consistently throughout.

I think if Americans actually watch soccer, like if Patrick, who doesn't like soccer, actually watched it and gave some time to understanding it, then you would be able to feel the flow of it in a way that is a little more understandable. It's a little bit like abstract art. I will give you that. But when you understand what they're actually trying to do,

you start to see the strategy and you see the buildup. and you can feel the moments coming. And so it does have these rises and falls. That's how I learned. It looks to the, it looks to the non-observer as chaos and nothingness, kicking the ball around, nothing, until you understand what they're actually doing. Theoretically, Dave, the fluid nature of the action should mean you can't turn away. And that should theoretically keep somebody in, as opposed to all the pauses at a baseball game.

I saw all these Europeans going to baseball games, and I did kind of wonder, did they like it? I kind of wondered, did they like it? Because baseball, I don't think my boys play soccer, and one of them can't stand baseball. He thinks it's absolutely boring. And I'm like, well, you haven't watched baseball in a way. Same thing, to get it, to get the drama of baseball.

And play it. Yeah. We had a clip from Boston of the Scots going to a baseball game, and they loved it. No, they hated the game. They loved drinking and singing. Yeah. I don't know.

That's what it is. They're like, this is nine innings long. You go there to drink and sing and eat. They hate it. It's part of it. I mean, baseball is math, right? Like, one of the things you notice about soccer, and I mentioned this in the column today as well, is that soccer is very late to the game on stats, right?

Like, now you see heat maps and you'll see, like, different stats, right? But, I mean, going back 100 years, there's more statistics in baseball than an AP math class. Right? And so that's a very different thing in terms of like, you know, it's not odds exactly, but like everything in baseball is completely mathematical. And there's a reason they call soccer the beautiful game because that's the other thing that sometimes happens within the Ebb and flow is that something true, not that

not that Barry Sanders never did anything beautiful, right? But more often in soccer, you see this thing. that goal or no goal is just really physically beautiful, I think more than you see in the other sports. Maybe basketball. Okay, Dave, do you mind to hang out, hanging out for just a minute? You got to go? No, for sure. No, I don't go. Okay. I'm good. All right, I want to talk to you about something. Come on in. E.J. and Tony, chief economist for the Thomas Roe Institute for Economic Policy Studies is joining us now. What's up, E.J.? Good to see you, man. Sit down, enjoying the conversation. We're not talking economics right now, okay? But we will. We're here with

David Marcus as well. Dave, I want to talk about UFC 250 for just a minute, okay, because you hit my radar, okay? I've already talked to the audience about this. I loved it. It's, at first I said it's a top five sporting event that I've ever been to, but I actually think it might be number one. I think it's the best sporting experience I've ever had. And I'd put being on the side of the guidelines at Texas OU. I sat close to floor second row for the NBA finals. Those are in my top five, but this might be number one. I mean, for reasons we don't need to explore, just I had incredible seats. I was next to Shane Gillis.

That final fight was absurd and insane. However, you were posting after UFC 250 how basically upset you were of the one fighter, I think his name is Josh Hokit, I'm not even sure, who after he won, you know, Joe Rogan's interviewing him and he says, Michelle Obama is a man. All right. And why don't you, I don't have your tweet. Do we have it, Dan, you can put up. I don't think you have that. Yeah, you do. Yes, I do. Put it up, Dan. Tell us about your tweet, David. Right. So, you know, it's interesting because this is the kind of thing that, that I would almost always, in the age of Trump,

roll my eyes at and say, whatever, like, you know, this is dumb. There were two reasons that I wasn't, that I didn't feel comfortable doing that. In this case, one is a broader reason and one is a specific professional reason. The broader reason is that I really think it's important that America's 250th birthday be nonpartisan.

You know, we can all imagine if Hillary, if Connolla Harris was president and there was an America 250 event and Jimmy Kimmel was making loose, jokes about Melania Trump, we wouldn't feel welcome. We wouldn't feel like that was for us, and we'd be rightfully upset about it. So that was part of it. The professional part of it was that about a week and a half before, I had written a column attacking the musicians who decided not to appear at the Freedom 250, what's it called the state fair, right? And my reason for attacking

them was that this is a nonpartisan event. I said Freedom 250's not partisan. You guys said you're the ones making it partisan, right? Well, if the producers of Freedom 250 can't stop that from happening at their event, then I gave my readers bad information and I felt like it needed to be corrected. So I would like Freedom 250 to just say, hey, that's on us. We fouled up. This is not going to happen at any of the future events.

All right. Here's what you said. You said the fighter yelling Michelle Obama as a man at an official White House. event to honor America is utterly unacceptable, and the administration should denounce it in no uncertain terms. Yeah. People started pushing back on you like cat. Let me, let me soften that.

You have a second one. Let me just read your second one really quick. You said, this pisses me off. You want to throw out this nonsense at a rally, fine, not an official Freedom 250 event, disgraceful. Yes. So the part that I'll walk back is like, I don't actually think that the important thing is for the administration to denounce this because this wasn't, I mean, ultimately the buck stops at the administration, but this was not the fault of the administration. This was the fault of the producers

of Freedom 250. So that'll walk back a little and say, I think they're the ones who need to address this, not necessarily the administration. But yeah, it did piss me off because I can't blame any Democrat now for saying, I don't want to go to any of these events. And I think that's a shame. What do you think, E.J.? I guess I just don't care. Honestly, at the end of the day, I'm just, and maybe this is me, I can't get outside of my own bubble, but the things I'm concerned about are the price of gasoline, how unaffordable homes are right now. I mean, I'm just so laser focused on those things when people make comments, whether it's a joke, whether they're serious about things like Michelle Obama, I literally just don't care. I find it so irrelevant to all of the very, very pressing things that people genuinely care about in this country and that are really.

really, really impacting folks' lives, mostly in a negative way. Okay, we're going to come back to some of those substantive issues in a moment. But I would disagree because to David's point, it does have the potential to destroy any hope for national unification under whatever banner, under whatever banner, right? And I think that's the point. The banner is important because you're saying this is a banner that is supposed to be about celebrating America's 250th birthday. Here's what I would say. We were in the when I was in the crowd,

and it happens. The general reaction was, whoa. Can't believe he said that. It was just like, whoa. It wasn't, I wouldn't say groans and it wasn't cheers. No laughs?

I don't remember, Dan. It all happened so fast, and there's a lot of stuff going on. I'll tell you this. I don't think he'll mind me saying this, because I think he said it to TMZ. Shane Gillis sitting right behind me, goes, oh, that sucks. Yeah.

Yeah. And I will say I didn't feel that at the moment, and maybe that's because I allowed my worst angels to sit there. And I remember thinking, there's the headline at CNN.com from this entire event, which, by the way, is not what that event was like. That event was amazing. But they just got their, they got the ammo they needed. That's what I felt in the moment. That's the headline at CNN.com. I'll say this, Dave.

My thought was more, and it took a minute for me. to kind of get past the moment. I think Gillis is actually right. That sucks. It sucks on multiple levels. It's objectively not funny. I'm sorry. It's not.

Like, I think I have a pretty damn good sense of humor. I really do. And I think the kind of people that laugh at this, was it Dan, was it you that said it this morning? You're like, or Patrick said jocks. And I was like, no, no. Well, if one of you said jocks first, I'm like, no, that's not true. It's not.

It is a type of, there's a type of person who has, as a mentality who thinks these kind of things are funny. I'm not saying all jocks, but I'm saying like I could see MMA fighters thinking this was funny. I think it is more online troll humor. Like not real humor, not laughing with anyone. It's not laughing with anyone. It's just laughing at the transgressiveness of it.

It's like a shock, just a shock value thing. Yeah. Yeah. And it's so it's not actually funny. Like I don't think if I were. If one of you made that joke right now or I was at a barbecue and somebody made that joke, I don't think I'd laugh. I really wouldn't because I just don't think it's that, it's not funny.

But they wouldn't, but Will, they wouldn't make it at the barbecue, right? Their own, that, that joke only serves a purpose if you're saying it at an inappropriate time, right? That's the joke. The punchline is I'm not supposed to be saying this. Let's take a quick break, but we'll be right back on Will Kane Country. This spring, Denham gets a softer, lighter update. Introducing Old Navy's drapey denim wide leg, a new fit that moves with you.

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Have you guys seen the clip? Have you seen the clip? Well, have you seen the clip of the tennis player? I don't even know what tournament's going on right now. This drops the F-bomb. Have you seen that? He's in a post-match interview, and he drops an F-bomb. And then the reporter's like, please don't do that.

You know, no more cursing. She asks him another question, puts the mic in his face, and he repeats the F-word three times. And she goes, okay, okay. And she tries one more time to ask a question, and he does it a third time. And there's an online, culture is like, I love this guy. He's amazing. I'm like, why? It's not funny. There's nothing,

there's nothing like objectively funny about just saying the F word. What are we five? You know, he didn't use it in a punchy way. He's not using it as a good adjective. He didn't, there's nothing funny except for the subversiveness of it in that moment. But the other side, Dave, of this, I just want to say this part is Michelle Obama's a real person. And in the end, she's not a man. You know, this whole big Mike thing, she's not, okay? Just like Bridget McRone's not a man. And you do this thing and it's like there's a real human being on the other side who I disagree with and says terrible things and has terrible ideas for America that I would destroy and attack in every way. But she's also a real human being and that sucks for her.

That sucks. She has kids. Yeah. Yeah. So that's how I thought about it. I wasn't as outraged as you were. And I don't know about denouncements and that kind of thing. But I do walk away from going, that sucks. That sucks. That sucks. I think that's fair. Okay, there's one more topic I want to do before I do some more economic related stuff with EJ, but this is for all five of us. I want to talk for a minute, if you wouldn't mind, about the memorandum of understanding with Iran, okay? And here's why I want to talk about it.

I want to address it from the criticism of the deal of those on the right. I don't care about the criticism of the deal from the left. they would criticize anything. It's not substantive. It's not important. It's the criticism of those on the right. And I have one question. And I don't even know where you are on this, CJ, if you have a position. What's the alternative? What's the alternative? My understanding is, you know, President Trump is not concrete. He's fluid. He wants to make a better deal. He wants to come out at the end of something better than how he went in. What he wants right now is primarily, to get the Strait of Hormuz open, to get gas prices down, to control inflation, and get the economy back on track. That's what he wants. Okay? He also says he wants no nukes for Iran. Okay?

All right. How do you get that? The guys that criticize this deal, for me, seem to imply that there's a better deal to be had. And the problem I have with that is they also tell me that is, that is run. is full of crazies, ideologues, who will never live up to a deal, who are liars. And so I say to you, if that's the party I'm negotiating with, there is no such thing as a good deal. There is no such thing. Vance just said it about an hour ago. That's words on paper. It's words on paper. So don't pretend that there's a good deal versus a bad deal. So if you're criticizing me from a right,

what is your alternative? What do you actually want? And I think what they're not saying out loud, is they want regime change. Okay, you want regime change? Fine, I'm not using that as an aspersion. That's the only way for truly them never to have a nuclear weapon. But then you have to get into, are you willing to pay the price for regime change? That price means a ground invasion.

That price means boots on the ground. That price means an already unpopular war extending out for potentially years. And if that's what you really want, you need to be honest about selling that to the American people. Otherwise, you've bombed their nuclear program back 15 to 20 years, get the straight open, which granted, it was open before the war, and take a deal. There's no better deal. There's only this and full commitment to war. That's what I think about what I'm hearing. E.J. I think that's exactly right. Thomas Sol probably put it best. Life doesn't ask you what you want. Life presents you with options, right? So what is the

alternative is exactly the question everybody should be asking right now. And I agree. I think all the alternatives are worse. I mean, look, we have to get a deal and we have to get it done now. Even if it's not ideal, even if it's not exactly what we want, it still is better than any of the alternatives. We have the Cushing Oklahoma oil facility not terribly far from us here, right? They are basically at what we call tank bottoms, meaning if the oil level there gets any lower, it starts causing operational problems. It can cause damage to infrastructure. This is where you actually run into true supply disruption in the oil market. In other words, a refinery literally runs out of oil and can't make gasoline, diesel, jet fuel. That is when you see prices just go hyperbolic.

Okay. That is when you have, that that is when you really have to consider, you know, like actual recession, deep recession scenarios, cost of living truly exploding. I mean, that that is not a place we want to go to. Okay. And look, again, life does not ask you what you want. The reality is the reality, and we have to deal with the reality as it is. And we also can't, I think, fall into these logical traps of, well, things like the sunk cost fallacy, right? Yes, we have already spent blood and treasure on this war. Tragically, Americans have died.

Yes, that's true. But you don't then say, because of that, we now need to commit to a ground invasion and have thousands more casualties? I mean, it makes absolutely no sense, but I can already hear some folks on the right peddling exactly those kinds of, again, logical fallacies where they say, well, wait, but Americans have died. So they died for nothing? No, that's not what we're saying at all. But you don't throw good money after bad. You don't throw more lives. You don't throw meat into the grinder, essentially, if you can put it so crudely, like they're doing in the Ukraine with Russia. Right. Right. Dave.

Yeah, you know, I have dear friends. who I trust on the right, who have said to me today that, you know, this is the greatest military defeat that the United States has ever had. I have dear friends on the right who I trust who have said to me today that this is the greatest deal since Peter Minouet, you know, bought Manhattan with beads, right? Neither of those things are true. This is probably kicking the can down the road. But I want to go back to the end of last week.

You might recall when the president called into Fox and Friends. and it was unexpected, right? Like, just right at the end of the show, like if you recall, like Trump called. And there was something that he said to them that I had never heard him say before. And I'm going to have to paraphrase, but he basically said,

I would like to take Carg Island. I would like to bomb Iran into submission, but I don't know if the American people will tolerate it. And it hit me because it reminded me a lot of the mass deportation situation where there is a part of Trump's base, There's like, everyone's got to go. We got to be aggressive.

But what Trump wound up seeing, even before Minneapolis, was there was this chunky middle of the country that was, you know, watch and Wheel of Fortune. And suddenly there's Christy Noem on an ad being like, we're coming for you. And they're like, whoa, I don't know that I love this, right? Trump read that and he pulled back. At the end of the day, the only thing that ever constrains President Donald Trump is the disposition of the American public. And that's what I think happened here.

I think the American public reached a point. A month ago, when I was at the gas station in West Virginia, I heard people talking, but boy, this hurts, right? I don't hear anybody talking about, I hope Iran doesn't bomb us tomorrow. And my apologies to all my foreign expert friends, they may be right. I don't know. I'm not a Middle East expert. I am an expert on the disposition of the American population, and they don't want this war right now. So that's the bottom line, I think.

Yeah, they don't. I hear that anecdotally, man, and I'm not talking about from lefties. I'm not talking about from lefties. They don't. It's not popular. Honestly, and I said this this morning, I'm, I think my, you tell me, Dave, you talked about, I think the American people love kicking ass. We love kicking ass for about six weeks. And then if it drags out and it's longer, starting to lose some interest and we're paying some prices.

Now, that doesn't mean we have the incapability of being all in on a war. No, no, no, no. You bomb Pearl Harbor. You've got our attention. You ready to go? We're ready to go. You know? That's defense.

You're just having a hard time selling people that Iran way over there is worth that all-in thing after Iraq and Afghanistan. You know? And by the way, I would love, I don't know if it's bin Dominic or Guy Benson or I don't know who your friends are on the right. that are saying that it's the worst deal or defeat in American history. I would love to ask that question. What is the alternative that you're offering? What is it? Are you offering complete regime change?

Because by the way, here's the other thing about regime change. Even if we do a ground invasion and we win, and we would, we would win. From my understanding, roughly 20% of the population, forget the regime. The population itself is radicalized. Okay. That's not Afghanistan. That's not Iraq. That is lower and there is hope for the future of Iran.

But 20% can cause problems for a long time. That's a potential one hell of an insurgency. Imagine 20% of America, dedicated. What is the alt-right white supremacist group called? I don't even know. That's not fair. I don't know enough about them to know what they're about. So I retract that if it's inaccurate.

Isn't there some? Well, the three-percenter thing? Isn't there a premise that you only need 3% of the population to really change a population or something like that? I can't remember what it is. It's something like that. And I think there's a group called the 3%ers, and I could have totally mischaracterized them, and that wasn't fair. But we're talking 20%, not 30%, I mean 3%. We're talking 20% of Iran.

So I'm just saying the commitment to get the alternative, as I understand it, from Mark Tieson. for example, I don't think you have the American public anywhere close to that commitment. Can I just, can I just add one quick, quick thing to that, Will, which is that, yeah, like, when you talk to Israeli officials about the long range, like, how does this really end? How do we really get peace? It's not through military action. It's through de-radicalization, just as you say, right? The population has to be de-radicalized.

And we're not necessarily seeing that in Iran, but look at the state of a foreign. But look at the state of affairs of our relationships with the Gulf states now. They were on our team here. A bunch of them are in the Abraham Accords. So that's a broader picture here where, okay, maybe we haven't succeeded in deradicalizing Tehran. But Saudi's looking a lot better, right? UAE's looking a lot better. This is going to make me sound like a Trump apologist.

Dude, Dave, I think they have the right to claim victory. This is like biggest defeat. if Iran is bombed back 15 to 20 years and the cost of that was two months of higher gas prices and 13 lives and a realignment of the Middle East as you just described with the other countries in the region, I mean, that's a pretty big victory. That's a pretty big victory. Is it not? And the other important thing I think, will, is the fact that it has exposed Iran to a lot of those countries where they have already said, we're now planning on building pipelines to bypass the Strait of Hormuz.

In other words, even if Iran has more control right now over the region than they did before the war, the clock's ticking, right? The writing is on the wall. These countries are now going to bypass any kind of control that Iran has, and eventually they're left with nothing. It's a really good point. Yeah. I don't know how long it takes to build those pipelines a while, because that's a concern. Everyone's like, well, now Iran knows they can shut down the strait whenever they want. And that's, that's a big problem. It takes a while to build those pipelines. It will. It's not going to be done overnight. But again, the clock's ticking. Yeah. Um, okay, Dave, you can bow whenever you want, but I'd love for you to stay if you'd love to stay. Um, I want to talk to E.J. a little bit about some more economic issues and kind of where Dave and I started this conversation. Okay.

We'll get into some specifics. But on a broad level, I interviewed Jensen Wong on Tuesday and CEO of Nvidia. And he was describing our modern economy and the future. under AI is optimistic, largely. And he talked about the Industrial Revolution. And basically got us thinking and talking David and I about what it would have been like to live in 1905. It would have been scary. There had been a lot of job turnover. But at the end of that revolution, you're undoubtedly in a better place. Economically, cost of living, way of life. Do you think we're in that moment right now? I feel like we are in 1900, 1905. I think that's fair. Absolutely. And just as it was scary then, it's scary today because if you're one of the folks who is having a hard time figuring out how to use

this new technology, then the only way you see it is through the one lens of this is a substitute for labor, as opposed to also seeing it as a complement to labor. In other words, I see it as something that's going to take my job and not as something that's going to make me more efficient, allow me to get paid more. It's going to make my life easier, et cetera. But both camps are true, right? It's not as if it's all one or all the other. No. No, it's both. When the automobile became widespread in America, what happened to all the folks who were making carriages, who are making saddles? Their jobs all went by the wayside, but they were all able to find jobs in other industries, including the automotive industry. Yeah, the horse and buggy. I always love that, the buggy whipmaker.

He's out of a job. We got a lot of buggy whipmakers right now. The question is, what do they do? David is a little like that learned a code thing, which became a thing. It's so callous. But the truth of the world is adapt or die. It really is. And that's a hard thing, you know, for the people you talk to, David, and the people that I know. Like, what do you do?

What else do you do? Universal basic income, become like Europe, have a guided life? I don't, again, man, I don't, maybe it's because. because of where I live, and maybe the displacement is a little different, but like, you know, the people I hang out with, you know, who are, now look, maybe driving the truck will be automated, right? The actual moving of the stuff isn't going to be. The, you know, cops are going to be cops. Firemen are going to be firemen. I mean, yeah, like I worry about this economic displacement, but, you know, to the point that you were both making, it also provides new opportunity, right? It also provides

things that you can do. And I kind of need, I don't even understand what the AI part of all this is at this point. I don't accept the notion that this technology is intelligent in any way, shape, or form. I think it's just computing faster. And I don't fully understand why computing faster is supposed to upend everybody's lives. Let's take a quick break, but we'll be right back on Will Cain country. This episode is brought to you by Activia. You might already be eating yogurt, but not all yogurts are created equal. Activia contains over one billion probiotics per serving to survive and reach the gut alive.

When it comes to gut health, Activia is the number one family doctor-recommended probiotic yogurt brand. Choose Activia. Feel good from the inside out. Visitactivia.ca for more details. I get that. I do hear from experts. I saw this. Every human innovation up to this point has been the replacement of muscle. Exactly. And what this represents is the replacement of cognition.

So as we lost the jobs that revolved around muscle, we're now- That's ridiculous. Hold on. That's ridiculous. Hold on. We're now losing the jobs revolving around cognition, which we are, and we will. You'll lose lawyers, paralegals, accountants. You're going to lose a lot of that, man.

That has nothing to do with that. AI, man. That was true. In 1994, I worked in a law firm in Bronxville, New York, and most of my job, this was an old guy who wrote wills, right? Most of my job was to sit at the computer and I would have to go find the book from Massachusetts or the book from Delaware and use the specific language, right? That was mental energy. And I was replaced in 1996 when suddenly like software could do that. So, again, I'm not seeing the leap from that in 1996 to what AI is doing today. I think both of those examples were replacing mental labor. Okay, but you're right.

You're diminishing the thing. You're acknowledging that it's happening, but diminishing that it's happening. So, you know. I just finishing its impact. I've got a staff of a dozen on the Will Kane show, right? this, that. I mean, theoretically, I could write whatever I want with AI in a matter of minutes, right? Not what takes a human being hours. And it would suck. What? And it would suck. I don't know. And you're sure. I don't agree. It depends. It depends. It depends. It depends.

It depends. It depends. It depends. It depends. It depends. It's exactly right. Yeah. This is, this is part of the problem. Some of the misunderstanding around AI. You do have a little vested interest because you're a writer. What I'm saying is, Has AI ever been funny? Have you ever seen AI write a funny joke? That ought to be easy, right? Dave, do you use AI? Do you use it?

I use, I will very occasionally use AI for something like, I don't know, if I'm trying to figure out like the best way to get to an airport. But in terms of research, no, because whatever research I get from AI, I have to double check anyway. The first time I ever use- You're using it like a search engine, and I get that. I started using it as a search engine at first, too. And you're right. Some of the research you have to be careful with. Okay.

I'm going to give you an example. I've done this. I don't do it every day. But I have written on AI. Here's what I do. Okay. I open the app. I put it on the microphone, and I journal verbally.

It's like a dictation device, right? And I will spill out all of my thoughts. If I have a joke, I'll tell the joke. If I do all this, right? And then at the end of it, I'll say, I'd like you to organize it like this. I'm going to go from here to here to here to here, right? And it'll go, okay, in 30 seconds it's done it. Now, is it perfect? No. And I talk to it again. I don't like that. I want you to do it like this. I'm working and talking with it back and forth to get it the way I want. So it's taken the writer out. It's replaced me sitting here doing this. And it sped everything up. Now, I think you're taking it from, does it ever do a joke better than Shane Gillis? no. No, it doesn't do a funny joke. Show me one funny joke that was AI generated. I've never seen one. I've never seen one. I remember, I was talking to my son about this when Kamala was running. And he was like, I bet it can do a funny knock knock joke? And we put it in and they were all awful, right? And I challenged my son. I said, do you think you could write a funny knock knock joke? And he thought about it for a while. And he comes back and he goes, knock knock. I said, who's there? He said Kamala Harris. I said Kamala Harris. I said Kamala Harris. I said Kamala Harris. I said, he said, Kamala Harris.

and he says, I'm sorry, I'm not taking questions right now. Right? That's a funny knock-knock joke. AI can't do that. I'm sorry. It doesn't, that requires a spark of the soul. It requires a spark of human intelligence that artificial intelligence is just never going to have. I'm sorry, Elon.

It's never going to get to. Okay, but you're kind of being a maximalist. I'm not saying it's going to replace everything that human beings do. Just like the Industrial Revolution didn't result in zero unemployment. It's going to take out. a lot of what we do. And it's on this cognition front instead of on the muscle front. Okay.

So now it's, now I will say there are quote unquote experts that I've interviewed a bunch who are much, much more maximalist in their predictions of what it can do in terms of super intelligence, like that it's way outpacing us. And it's going to, and the curve on it is insane. I don't know about all that. I don't know. You know, I'm not a, I'm not buying in, you know, all the way, way more than you, David. But I think that you're, I honestly think you got to use it more.

And by the way, the amount that I use it is nothing, nothing. There are people using it a ton in better, more efficient, more tailored ways. That's what Wong said. By the way, I said to Wong, what should I tell my son to do? He goes, I don't care. Do whatever you want. But just use AI as you do it. I'm going to stick to read an old books, well.

At the end of the day, at the end of the day, I'm a firm believer. You are not going to be replaced by AI in terms of your work. You're going to be replaced by somebody using AI. So learn to use it. Learn how to maximize its efficiency, how to make yourself as efficient as possible. That's really how you protect yourself. So if we go back to that analogy where this is cognitive versus the jobs where it was physical energy. you're right, replacing muscle. If you're a guy working in a factory during the Industrial Revolution

and you're using hand tools, are you going to be replaced by a power tool? No, you're going to be replaced by a person who knows how to use that power tool and knows how to use it efficiently. And sure enough, that's what happens. So if you trained yourself onto how do I use this power hammer instead of hammering it on hammering a piece of metal on an anvil all by hand. That's how you kept your job. That's how you stayed employed. And by the way, you earned more money as a result of that, not less, because you were so much more efficient. You commanded a higher wage.

How many cigarettes have you smoked in this hour? Four. I've seen you light up four. Yeah, four times. Yeah. The first one compelled me to put a nicotine pouch in. What do you get? You get one milligram.

Is that with the absorption? What is it? One milligram of nicotine per cigarette? Something like that? Maybe two. One of my doctor's science over here? I don't know, man. I just smoke up.

I don't, you know. Ask AI. Let's do it. Hold on. Hold on. Eight to 20. Watch this. What did you say, Dan?

Eight to 20. Did you use AI, Dan? A single cigarette. Eight to 20 milligrams. No, I don't, I don't buy that. I don't buy that. What do you smoke? Marlboro Lai?

Yes. Okay. Hey, one cigarette marlboro light. Tell me the nicotine involved in that and the nicotine absorption as compared to a nicotine pouch eight milligrams. Okay. Now, this is like using it like Google. This is not.

All right. It's done. A single marlborough light is in an eight ounce nicotine pouch. All right. Marlboro light. Nicotine yield. 0.7 to 0.8, Dan, where the pouch, 2.5 to 5.

It's got a 30 to 60% absorption. So I'm getting, out of an 8 milligram pouch, let's call it 4 milligrams, you're getting 0.8 milligrams out of that cigarette. So four cigarettes is one pouch. Did you watch Hunter 5% of smoking crack, Will? Did you watch You can be more efficient, Dave. Not like AI nicotine compared to your hand tool.

No, because your nicotine is steeping in slowly. My nicotine is hitting my lungs immediately and boom. No, there's no, I mean, there's no comparison between the two. I like snoots. Like, if I'm on a plane, like, that's cool. Like, that's all right. There's other ones. What was the bit about crack?

What was it a bit about crack? Hunter Biden didn't interview where he like explained in green. detail like the difference between like snorting cocaine and free basing and how like free basic is so much more more pure and like all this things like you should check it out but no I mean that's the difference is is the absorption um but I don't know man I just like to smoke and when I work I smoke what do you want well I know it gives it's the most um this is a reflection of how addictive it is when I see you smoke it makes me think about nicotine like it looks Yeah, it spreads.

It's why Hollywood wanted to put it in the movies. All right, E.J., real quick, back to the economy. Let's talk about it. So the gas prices have started to come down already. I didn't know we were at such a critical stage, which you just described at Oklahoma. Yeah, we absolutely are. So when President Trump says, by the way, that he said this David yesterday, didn't he say something like, we're really close to economic catastrophe? Yeah, he's right.

He's absolutely right. And I think that's what a lot of people... Kind of wild for him to say that because one would assume the logical conclusion is because of the war, which he's kind of saying, this war has put us on the edge of economic catastrophe. I've got to get out of here. Yeah, I mean, it's true. And I think the reason why he's so comfortable saying it out loud, I'm not trying to put words in his mouth here, but my guess is, again, the reason he's so comfortable with saying it is because everybody knows it. Everybody knows...

The government literally publishes these statistics every single week, whether it's the Cushing Oklahoma facility, whether it's the strategic petroleum reserve, etc. All this data is publicly available. So the whole world knows what is the minimum essentially operational limit for Cushing. Everybody knows where our strategic petroleum reserve is. We have not just government data, but we have private sector data. That, again, is published every single week. So everybody knows the information.

It's out there. Everybody can see what's happening, where we're trending, and everyone knew the clock was ticking. So it's no secret is what I'm getting at Will. Do we have the energy for this AI boom that David doesn't believe is on our doorstep? You know, all these data centers and so forth, do we have the energy for all this? We do. Really? We honestly do.

Okay, so I think one of the things that's confusing some people right now is, yes, AI represents an increase in demand for energy. 100%. That's absolutely true. You're taking all of this previous, you know, cognitive energy, if you want to call it that, that we would normally, I guess, get from eating calories, right? And now you're having a computer do it, and it's going to get that energy from electricity. So, okay, increase in demand there, no doubt about it. What people are not focusing on is the reduction in supply that we've had

because of all this green energy nonsense that was pushed by the Biden administration for four years. We took coal plants offline. We've been preventing nuclear and natural gas plants from getting new permits. I mean, we have done everything we could to hamstring reliable. and cheap energy production in the United States. And what have we been adding to the grid? Solar, wind, not reliable, incredibly expensive. That is what has been driving up utility costs.

And sure enough, before all of these data centers and different things started coming online, before any of that happened, prices were already going up. By the way, Dave, if you notice this, Democrats aren't talking about green stuff near as much as they used to. they're not talking about reducing energy you know there's an old clip floating around of james tallarico right now talking about doing away with fossil fuels i don't think you're going to see a democratic president running on that policy anymore i think if you think so if they recognize the need for energy with ai and all these they're going to have because it's everything we need it all fossil fuels we're i don't know if we're ever going to get real nuclear you also are running into small modular reactors i think are a game changer Are we going to get small modular reactors, really, like with all the regulation involved in that and the build out and how long it takes?

I think it would probably take literally till the end of this administration to clear enough of the red tape out of the way that you can actually start building these things everywhere. But, I mean, all the people who say they don't want a data center in their backyard, fine, now you don't have to. You can put the power and you can scale it down virtually as small as you want. You can put the power right there on site. It can be in the middle of nowhere. Heck, you can build all these things up in Alaska if you. want to where we're cooling them will be an absolute breeze because of the ambient temperature up there right i mean the the the potential here is is not limitless but it is absolutely

incredible will dave on the democrats you think that comes back i think the democrats no i think they've waived the white flag um i feel like i wrote a column about this about a month ago that where they even just sort of came out and said like it was it in the uh autopsy maybe or something But they basically came out and they said, like, this just isn't playing anymore. And I mean, what? Was it was it 2018 when AOC told us we had 12 years to transform society or it's the end of the world? I mean, half that time is up, right?

So in 2028, any Democrat who's on stage next to J.D. Vance or Marco Rubio or whoever it is is going to have to deal with that. And they're going to sound ridiculous if they keep up the Greta Thunberg line. So, no, I think they've given up that game. The data centers, look, I think you just have to convince people that you're taking all of this into account, right? This is a big deal near where I live in Maryland, right? So in Frederick, Maryland, they want to do all of these like data centers and people are voting on it. There's also these power lines, right, that they need to power it.

I just think you need to be upfront with people. And I do, the one thing that I find is popular with people is this idea that the data center, are going to pay for their own energy. That's the biggest concern I hear is that my electric bill is going to go way up because of this. I think if you can assure voters that that's not the case, then there'll be more on board with the data centers. I don't think the climate issue is part of it, really. Another big thing that I think they really should be talking a heck of a lot more about, though, is taxes. These data centers pay so much in taxes to the local municipalities. that people's property taxes, this was the case in Northern Virginia, people's property taxes

have been flat or gone down. I mean, a huge, yeah, a huge draw in certain areas of the country for these things has literally just become people, the awareness that needs to be raised, I guess you could say, in terms of the tax benefit here to folks. Okay, I want to get to a few viewer comments in just one moment, but, and I want you stay, Dave, because there's a comment I want to get to about soccer. Last thing on this, I have a lot of buddies, and I like these kinds of friends. They're contrarian.

They're not in politics. They're in finance. And I like a contrarian in finance. I do because I think we're herd animals, and I think, you know, we're irrational in masses and this kind of thing. And so I like the Warren Buffets of the world that go, hmm, you know, which way is the tide moving? Maybe I should think about the other way. And I have quite a few buddies that like, this AI thing, man, the cap-ex, the amount we're spending on this. It's insane and it can't last forever.

And what if this is all, what if David's right? And you know what? We had our little debate, but what if he's right? Like, the projections of what this is going to be are way overboard. And we've made all this expenditure. Like, what do you think the chances are that a lot of these businesses, like a lot of the first telecom businesses, like a lot of the first, every business, go belly up? That this is actually a huge bubble that we're living in, a huge economic bubble, right? now. I don't think Dave needs to be right or wrong to justify the fact that so much of the

CAP-X that we have seen is just this kind of incestuous reinvestment from one of these companies to another where so much of the MAG-7 is just sending money to another member of the MAG-7. I mean, it's absolute nonsense. So I agree. There's definitely a bubble here. You are seeing a lot of these small startups where they just throw AI into their name or somewhere in their business plan and people decide to pour cash into them? Absolutely. I have no doubt you're going to see something very similar to, as you said, what we saw with the dot-com bubble, right? That being said, it's still a transformative technology. None of that, I think, takes away from the incredible power that this tool is now giving, is now giving to humanity. I think both can be true in other words.

Yeah. And we can't keep up this level of capital expenditure forever. I mean, this, at some point, this comes to an end and the economy has to transition into something that actually makes money. Right. And the earnings from these companies, I mean, forget blowout earnings. The earnings from these companies would have to be just absolutely staggering, truly eye-watering numbers to actually justify the stock prices that we're seeing right now. At the end of the day, the only thing that really justifies a stock price is future earnings. Right. And it's just not there. Investors, I think, are basically buying big bags of hope to a certain extent. Again, I'm not saying the technology is not transformative.

I'm not saying these companies aren't going to make a lot of money. I think they will, but not quite, I think, the level that a lot of folks are anticipating. All right, I want to get to a few comments here from the viewers. First one, because, Dave, we were talking about this. And this one, it makes me a little mad. Okay. All right. I hope you're still watching.

You want a bomber. You want a bomber? Soccer has also had an uphill climb of nobody being able to take a hit. Americans like violence. Soccer is for children because no mom wants their baby boy to be hurt. I'll just add Kayla here. Soccer is like tennis, in my opinion. If the way you played them, you tend to watch them more often.

In the way, if you played it, you tend to watch it more often. That's fair. Second one, Kayla. You want a bomber. Okay. This is nonsense. Yeah. Soccer is not only a contact sport. There's there's contact sports and there's combat sports, right? Soccer is more physical and violent than basketball. I have no problem saying that. No problem. Okay. It's close, but I would argue that soccer is more violent than basketball.

Yeah. It's not the level of football. That's fair. What people make the mistake of believing is the guys that fall to the ground acting like they got shot by a sniper are a bunch of wussies and they can't take a hit. And by the way, I watch the NBA? I mean, it's all over the air. Exactly. Exactly. Now, listen, I have a son and I get a little per-

stepping back for a three and now I'm having a heart attack, you know, like. Totally. I have a son who one month ago, and I have a little, so it gets a little personal, had five staples. in his head from soccer. Five staples came back to play in the next day from a head-on-head collision. And what you're mistaking is that those guys rolling around on the ground acting like they got shot and then they're up and playing in a minute isn't them being wusses. It looks like it, it bothers me too. I don't like it. It's incentive. They are doing that so that the ref will give them the call that they want. The problem in the sport is the incentive.

if you have to fix the refs and then the players will stop doing it. But like any human being, you'll do something. Like, I hate it. I have told my boys, you do not lay on that ground unless you can't get back up. You never get taken off the field unless you literally can't play.

But I've also told my son, you take a dive in the box. If a guy hits your ankle, you go to the ground. Why? You get the call for the penalty shot. That's what you do. So in the U.S. West game, this happened.

This is where I'd argue soccer's better than basketball. Do you see the fate, the guy got, the American player got a yellow card, and then the refs went back and looked at it on video, and they showed he never touched him, and the guy flailed and flopped, and then they switched the yellow card to simulation. They called mischaracterization or something. Simulation. Yeah, whatever.

They call it simulation. They gave to get the diver the yellow card. That was a great move. I'd love to see that in the NBA. Right? That's a technical. And so what is this an example of? The blessings of technology. Being able to do things like instant replay.

See, AI is going to save us. I'm telling you. Yeah, except that Argentina would only have two world cup. That's right, the hand of God. David, don't you agree? I mean, soccer is not as violent as football, not as violent as rugby, not as violent as hockey, but it is a body-to-body contact

banging. Do me a favor. If you're out there and you doubt me, go look up Erling Holland versus Liverpool's centerback. Oh, what's... Saliba, William Saliba, I believe. And look at their physical battle.

It's a mauling on each other. You know, they're both six foot four. It's incredible. It's very physical. Somebody, some, like, some guy, you know, who's a great athlete running as fast as he can stomping on your foot with studs, I mean, think about how much it hurts when you stub your toe at night. Right? I mean, when those guys are rolling around grabbing their foot, like imagine Diego Maradona stomping on your foot and all there is is a little

piece of leather with studs. That hurts, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I think your characterization is wrong. Lady in agriculture says to EJ's point, what will you see will be people moving to hands-on jobs that require physical labor unless office or thinking jobs? But like you said, well, anybody knows. Okay, this is an interesting point because Jensen Wong actually made this. You're actually going to see a boom in physical jobs through this, blue collar trades, at least in the short term, at least in the short term.

Electricians, plumbers, we need them. We need them real bad right now. Yeah. And one of the things you see with not just AI, but any of these disruptive technologies, is because people spend so much less in those sectors. In other words, it now costs me way less for things like legal services because a law firm can rely on AI so much. So the cost goes down. I spend less there. I now have more money in my budget. What do I do? I spend that money elsewhere. And so you end up seeing an increase in demand for all kinds of other products and services throughout the economy. And that will raise employment in those. different sectors as they have to produce more to meet that increase in demand. Again, this is what happens every single time we get one of these disruptive technologies. And so many of the jobs that we're going to see created, they haven't even been invented yet. Before that smartphone, how many people worked as app developers? Right. Right. The jobs don't even exist yet. All right. And then finally, to where we started the show today, Photo Crazy says, I had a

boyfriend that could catch a fly at least two out of ten times that he tried. Deb Robinson said, I caught one once with needle-nosed pliers. I was shocked as anyone. Why? Patriot boy mom says, sorry I will, but I've done that. I caught a fly this morning, E.J., with my hand. You really? You know, my late grandfather used to be able to do that.

He could just, like Mr. Miyagi, just reach out and grab the fly. My theory is, no, everybody says it, and they swipe at it, and they miss, and I did it. I freaking did. It's like one in the World Cup. You have plans for tonight to celebrate? The fly is already at the taxidermist. Is that right? It's mounted and just put it right next to a lot.

Write that joke, AI. Write that joke, AI. That would have been badass. I should have got that flyed taxidermied. See this? Caught him once with my hand. All right, David Marcus hung out with us for about an hour and 20 minutes, which I truly appreciate and always love him hanging out. It's David Marcus at Fox News Digital.

Thank you so much for being with us. Thanks for having, man. You guys have a great day, and everyone enjoy the World Cup. All right, E.J. and Tony, economist at the Thomas A. Rowe Institute for Economic Policy Studies and the Richard Astor Fellow at the Heritage Foundation. Thank you for hanging out as well, man. It's been fun. Thank you for having me. All right, that's going to do it for us today. Make sure you follow us to Spotify or Apple, and we'll see you again next time.

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