With The Perrys - Homeownership Tips, Generational Wealth and Resisting Greed

Episode Date: February 6, 2023

Ever been intimidated by or skeptical about homeownership and/or real estate investing? Our friend Erika B. is the woman you need to know. We invited her to join us for a discussion about building generational wealth absent of greed, wisdom for first time homebuyers, and the two most common things people lack that block them from unpacking the fullness of homeownership and real estate investing. Learn more about Erika by following her on Instagram at www.instagram.com/erikabrowninvestor/ Subscribe to the Perrys' newsletter: https://withtheperrys.myflodesk.com/zhfus4jx1s Join Preston's discipleship community for men: https://www.patreon.com/PrestonPerry/membership To support the work of the Perrys, donate via PayPal: https://paypal.me/withtheperrys Shop BOLD Apparel: boldapparel.shop Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, St. And Aix. What up with y'all? So you might notice that we are in a different space. Okay. It's because the other venue by which we recorded was our rental property. We'll get into rental property shortly. But we were using it as an Airbnb.

We weren't making no money. And so now we're renting it out to a tenant. And so we took all the furniture from that space and put it in our house. And so I just love that I was able to, you know, reuse some things. But that has nothing to do with what I'm going to ask you. Well, kind of, because it's in the vein of like real estate, you know. But I got to ask you a random question. What's up?

Okay. So remember that time you said you was on the plane and you met this lady and she, she got real, like, hip hop on you? Oh, I thought we was going to say that for Storytime with Preston Perry. We're not having a story time with Preston Perry. Oh, yeah, yeah. okay yeah she did okay you want to tell you yeah yeah yeah she uh got on the plane and uh she was sitting in my seat and then uh i said ma'am you know i think you you in my seat she said my bad but listen listen wait wait wait it gets worse it gets worse and so you know i i mean i mean in first class a lot

because i'm diamond or whatever and so you know a little flex and so my friend joseph solomon got in and he uh he came it was like what's up boy and then you know see she said she looked at him she looked at me and she saw we knew each other and mind you joe's like six eight and so she looked at joe she looked up at joe she said what's up shouted that's so obnoxious she's she's joseph huh but then he said he said he said white people got to be stopped no no he said he said she said she said she said what again i just it was just so awkward because she wasn't even know She was like a soccer mom. Like you can like, it's like, this is so unnatural.

And I don't know if you're trying to connect with us or something like that. But don't ever say what's up, shawdy. So then I got nothing to do with today's conversation. We just. It never does. We was talking about it the other day. And I was like, we have to bring this up because it's so obnoxious and ridiculous. But joining us today, we have Erica Brown.

Erica Brown, the homie. What's the name of your businesses? I feel like I'm supposed to say Erica Brown of something. Erica Brown and Associates. She got like nine businesses. We changed the name. What is it? My name of my team used to be Erica Brown Associates.

What is it? I did not want to be the face of it. So now it was Strife. Okay. But let's say owning it and living it. Okay. That's business one. What's the other one?

Okay. So then we have Strife. Uh-huh. Then we have boast. Okay. Which is the brokerage. Uh-huh. Yeah.

I mean, we have other. businesses that don't have names that are just, you know. Well, integrity solutions is under your, you know what? Yes, yes, integrity solutions. We have affiliates. Right. That's so dope. Affiliates.

You know you made it when you got affiliates. Oh my gosh. Well, she got options. These are my affiliates. She ain't got one LLC. She got S corps and C corps. It's like, how can we be like you? Wow.

So we wanted to bring Erica into our home to talk through just, the concept of like home ownership real estate investment and even generational wealth yes because it's a conversation that all three of us are constantly having all the time and it's like why not like have it out loud no like seriously like as erika is our friend we vacation whatever we're about to go on the vacation with her soon and we talk about these things all the time and i think they're beneficial conversations i feel like we need to have especially anybody at christ do we like well i'm going to be a martyr i'm going to king in and and and be this and be that it's cool but generational wealth is important as well right i'm saying now before we begin i already feel in my shando that there are people like

i'm gonna turn this off because y'all not talking i rebuke you in the name of jesus in the flesh all right for being closed minded to talk even about the concept of generational wealth or even investing can to some ears sound like y'all just greedy and y'all just want money so why is i guess generational wealth and growing and having businesses and doing all that you do like why wow yeah that's a great i mean a great question so for me i look at the opportunity to be able to build generational wealth as a tool um a tool just like um you can have someone who's a contractor and they have a you know they're really good at contracting and building things that's their tool to serve their family and to serve the kingdom so i look at real estate um and the ability to be able to build wealth in real estate um as

as a tool in that way too yeah that's dope i forgot to tell people what you do we talked about her businesses but we didn't say what they was oh yeah yeah okay so sorry what you do Erica so i do a lot of things okay um give us five five okay so i am a real estate investor uh-huh i teach people how to invest purpose-driven like-minded people, a lot of believers, how to invest. I homeschool my kids. Yeah. I am three big boys. I am a co-founder of a brokerage, a purpose-driven brokerage. I help run a landscaping company. I think that's five. Okay, give us six. Give it seven. All right. One more. For the spiritual people. Okay. Go ahead. Oh, yeah, that's true. I'm a team lead of a real estate group. And I mean, of course, I'm a wife.

That's the most important roles. She rounded it out. Her husband is actually one of my closest friends. What's his name? Yeah, they're like BFF. His name's Lawrence. Oh, not you said his real name. Elbe.

Yeah, his name is LB. Yeah, his name is LB, but, you know, his real name Lawrence. I'm going to give, you know, some dignity and respect to the man. Yes. Yes. So in response to what she just said, like, what is the value of wealth building? Or is it even, is it even the same as Greek? Yeah, I think about generational wealth, and I think it's so important because I think a lot of times, one, I think it's, I think it, let me be clear, I don't think that God is calling everybody to be generational wealthy, right? I think we all have different calls or whatever, but I love being connected and friends with believers who don't love money more than they love people, but still have a firm foundation of what they feel like God has called them to do. And so when I go in Erica and Lawrence's home, you know what I'm saying, I see them raising their children, but

enough not to be greedy but to be good stewards, right, of their money. Because I think that's the main thing about generational wealth. Proverbs talks about generational wealth in the sense of that a righteous man will pass down an inheritance to his children with an unrighteous man. His riches will be gone to the, you know, unrighteous or whatever. And really what that passage is talking about is stewardship. Is righteous people who have accumulated wealth, not because they're just chasing money, but they're stewarding what God has given them well and that they're able to pass it down to their loved ones and their loved ones and they can have, you know, seasons of generational wealth. And so I think it's important for us to know that whatever God gives us, we could be generational

wealthy if our heart is right and if we're stewarding our money right for the kingdom of God, right? And then that's automatically going to trickle down to our children and our children's children. And so I see that. I go in their house, I go in Erica and Elbe's house, and I see them, you You know, you know, I see Lawrence, you know, giving that kids, you know, life lessons, but I also see them talking about real estate. I mean, her middle son, like, he likes to talk to me about, like, the stocks that he's investing in. How old is, he's 12? 12. Yeah.

He's like, yeah, I just bought Apple. I'm like, what? And this is important, you know what I'm saying? And so I just think that it's great for us to teach our kids to store the gifts. And when I see her, when I see Eric and L.B. Doing what they're doing. It's a gift and that's stewarded it right. I think some of this is like, it's kind of like we have been given a theology of money

that was primarily all centered around prosperity gospel, right? And so we swung to the other pendulum where we don't actually have a solid understanding or theology of money where we just see money as a resource useful to the world and also the kingdom of God. because you got the dude who uh who used his resources to bury jesus what's his name joseph vera like he was a wealthy man you know what i'm saying like his wealth was able to like be useful for giving jesus a place to like yeah right yeah for three days and i want to just i want to just add joseph erythea you know the gospel only talks about him one time but he's in all four four counts of the gospel but we see like jesus wouldn't have had a proper burial if this rich man then come

to pawning his pilot and say, I want the body of Jesus so I can bury him in this rich tomb. You know what I'm saying? And so we see that's a prime example of God using a man with wealth for the glory of him. And that was that was actually a part of the motivation for us to decide to begin investing and really, you know, build wealth. Like it's crazy because before, you know, I even had, before we even had like a real estate investment or anything like that, I remember consciously having like this just, you know, this moment with God really like,

okay, you know, is this like Lord, you know, if you bring wealth to my family, I don't want to be greedy. I want to be able to steward it well. Like, it's so crazy because it wasn't like I knew there was like opportunity around the corner. I just remember having like a conscious, very like real conversation.

And when I thought and what God brought me back to was just thinking about all the people that have been in the position, to have wealth that have helped us over the years. Like there was a time when we moved from from Dallas to Atlanta and me and the kids came first and my husband came later. We were just starting out. We were a brand new, you know, young family didn't have anything or any money.

And we bought a car. We used all of our savings to buy this car. And it turns out the car was a lemon. It was bad. It didn't even like run. So we spent our last bit on this car So and my husband had to get back and forth to work He was still in Texas

And I remember one of our good friends They just had a car That they were able to let him borrow It was like this little two-seater sports car But he's six for You know 200 plus pounds But they were able to allow him To borrow that car so he can get to work

And you know Not many of us who don't have like wealth have a car that you can just let somebody use you know and so in that moment really helped to help to be able to have the space to not be in survival mode to actually take care of his spiritual mental health during that time where we were apart because he was getting ready to move here so it's just so many examples that we've been able to be the benefit of that yeah i think that's dope and i think that's a huge you know um a blessing that you had mostly like believers helping you to help you be in a position that you're in because what I see with you is you teaching people mostly believers

with your cohorts, you know, how to, you know, make a living for themselves. And so like, what if people, what if Christians who was financially able to help you, didn't help you? And now you're in a position. And I think that we, you should talk about your cohorts before this whole thing is over so people can know about it. But that's dope. You know what I'm saying? Because it's, it really is on some like, you know, you got to be honest with your own heart. You know, about, because what money can do is offer like a false sense of comfort and security. So that's usually why we all want to be wealthy is because we don't want to trust. Like we don't want to have to be put in a position where we got to pray and say, hey, like, we don't want daily bread.

We want bread that last. Yeah, we talk about, we've talked about the illusion of success. What we say? You don't remember? I was like, ooh, Jackie, there's an illusion. Go ahead. Tell me about it. What we say?

When you, especially when you become the expert, it's something and you get really good at it and you get so good where you can like consistently rely on your gut and you think that a plus b equals c because a plus b equal c before and so that's you know over over time if you're not careful then you do you know go over to that side where you begin trusting yourself but the lord is faithful hello come now and it helping to remind you hold up yeah yeah you don't control this anyways it's mine that's that's really good and so i i only brought that up to say you know by pursuing the by investing by owning homes by doing all of that stuff like even if it's like even just americans even the way we define wealth also needs to be interrogated yeah but i feel like

us just saying no this is a resource that the lord wants me to use to serve people yeah period in generosity and all the things is a part of that now now that we got all that out the way what what's next home ownership yes that's really really big one thing like you will hear people say is like why should i buy a house if when i buy a house i got to like pay for the landscape and i got to pay for the plummet and if the roof break i got to pray for the like y'all make it seem like it's like all good and well but it actually takes more work so what's the whole like why would i buy a house then right You will still buy a house because it is a long-term investment. It's almost like a built-in savings account that, yes, you have to take care of.

And there's various ways that can help you take care of it, whether it's like home warranties and things like that. But house hacking, having people, you know, renting out rooms and things like that where you can, you know, be able to do it. But over time, your property, if you buy it for, say, $200,000 today in 10 years, you that property may be worth 400,000. So it becomes like a built-in savings account that at some point you'll be able to tap into to provide options for you.

Right? Because I think it's beautiful. One of the reasons why I'm passionate about teaching people is because I feel like I want to be able to help people free up their time, stop trading time for money so that they can actually do the things that God is calling them to do. A lot of us have burdens. and we live with those deep burdens, but because we are so caught up in the rat race of the 9 to 5 and just the routine robotic life that sometimes we have to live, that we don't have the freedom

to actually, you know, nurture that burden that God has given us. And so I've been able to actually take advantage of real estate as a tool to help me get that that freedom so that we can be freed up to do the things that God is calling us to do. Whatever, it looks so different for everyone. That's good. I got a question. Yeah. Like for the people who might be listening who are not homeowners, because I know before we

became homeowners, we had a lot of questions of how do we even pursue this? Yes. So like what do you think are like the first main three steps of somebody who is thinking about being a homeowner and want an owner on a home? What should they, they think about first? So first step is to tell a friend, like talk to someone who has bought a home before and ask them about like their process and their experience. what because a lot of people think that it's like so difficult and once you do it you're like oh

I guess it really wasn't that bad so really talk to someone who's done it and then two take a homebuyers education workshop we did that yeah yeah I remember doing that too because even though I grew up in a home that we owned the the education didn't get passed down to me like my parents had great credit I didn't have good credit I was like what what happened you know so um taking a home by education class which are generally free and they're like you could do them online or you can even do it in one of our website or you can go to your local real estate company and they'll have a home buyers education workshop and that's i think those two things are like the best start to pique your interests and figure out what your next steps are yeah one of the main things i when i've

got married i just always had bad credit you know what i'm saying and jacky was like we go going to get your credit up that was like one of her main goals No this this is this is By bad we mean he didn't have a score Oh okay You gotta put me out there like that I mean we need to be clear Yeah because it's like bad is like a number

You didn't have a number And so it was like I don't even know how to deal With experience saying inconclusive And Fico not having nothing Like it's like what I have bad You're okay But what you got now I'm in the 700

You're in the 700s. That's great. I love how you give out of credit too. That's awesome. It's a pun intended. Yeah. I guess my question is, and this, you know how to stay on this long, but should people allow, like, their credit score or their credit number to, like, really burden them when it comes to becoming home owners? That's because Dave Ramsey, I feel like, credit scores don't be mattering.

I use bad grandma. Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no. I mean, it does matter if you, if you don't have cash, you know. know, you don't have like someone in your family that can just buy you a house for cash, then credit does matter. And statistically, when you have lower credit scores, you pay for more for everything,

not just for a house, you know? And so a lot of times I remember, because for me, it wasn't that I had like horrible bad habits. I just had like two credit cards that I thought in college, they just give it to you. And I thought I didn't know I had to pay it back. it was just like what it's free they ruin my credit you know it's free money so it took some time to get together so um a lot of times when people have bad credit it's almost like they look at it like out of sight out of mind until they need to deal with it you need to deal with it like just because you're not paying attention to it doesn't mean it's not a problem so it's really just

confronting it and pulling your credit score if you go to annual credit report dot com you every every year you get a free credit score and you can pull that report and just have a date with yourself and be honest and pull that report and then okay so okay what do i need to do to move for and a lot of times people sign up for like credit repair programs a lot of times are just scams they are we got scammed yeah so i don't do that 800 dollars yeah don't do that and so because you don't you don't you don't need them the internet has enough tools to teach you how to handle your credit how to you know what's it when you when you remove certain things off of it yes like even just knowing your credit to debt ratio is a game changer like keeping that thing

on 30% yes you have your bills on time and paying the credit cards off and like you said and establishing new credit really is the best way you can build credit by establishing new positive credit okay so probably as we mentioned at the top of this we have a rental property which was something that I think we purchased that house in 2020. That year. Yeah, June 2020. When I was pregnant with. Sage.

August. No, Sage was a baby. August. One of them. So many kids. It's a lot. The reason we did it, which I think I'm sure I've talked to you before is that like a lot of our income comes from ministry.

So whether that's books or events or all the things. And I started to kind of like dialogue with God about. how I wanted to, I didn't want all of my income to be contingent on ministry. And I don't think, I think it's a conscience thing for me where it's like I wanted to have a pure yes. So like, so my yes is because it's a yes, not because I need my rent pay. So I naturally just was like, we need to like invest in something. And so being connected with you and just all and you and you. We was like, let's figure out a way to buy a home.

And the area that we bought the home in and all the things, even though the Airbnb did not work, it's still working. Because we know like in some years, like that house is going to be worth some things. Right. And so I guess for people who already own a home, what would be the benefit or the value of purchasing real estate properties?

Oh, man. That's even, that's great. the value, especially if you purchased your home in the last two years or beyond, then there's a good chance because of the large amount of appreciation or the large amount of ways that the home prices have increased. You have a lot of equity in your home that you could actually use. What's equity? Equity is the amount of money that your home is worth versus how much you owe. So say your home is worth 400,000 and it's worth based on what the other homes around you have sold for. And you actually owe the bank 200.

Then that means that the difference between 400 and 200 is equity. Equity. There we go. So there are different ways. That was a really great way. I've never heard equity like broken down. Yeah, very simple. Very simple.

You're a teacher too. Look at that. Look at that. And so I can teach you how to very conservatively, say, use some of that 200,000 to then choose a market that you would like to invest in and take a small portion of that money to... And by market, you mean neighborhoods. Yes, neighborhoods, cities, et cetera. Thank you.

And take a small portion of that money to put as a down payment on an investment property that, depending on your goals, can provide you more cash flow or a longer appreciation over time like you guys. are going to be able to do. And you know what gets in the way of people, one, seeing wisdom in that and putting the time in it is two things, is discipline and patience. Because we want, we want quick money. We want, we want quick return.

You know, like, you know, it's like weight loss. We want to take the doo-doos because we want a flat stomach and because we never develop the patients and the discipline to actually have just a good nutritional diet. Right. As soon as we stop doodoo and now we get big again because we never work that muscle. And so that's a terrible example, but I think it's you.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, no. Talk about doodle. Talk about doodle. Yeah. Like, real estate is building wealth and income that takes a long time. It's a long time. And I just love the options that it creates for you. Yeah, talk about that.

Right? Because, you know, as you get older and you don't want to do rental properties or more, you don't want to do Airbnbs no more of your son or daughter, gets out of college and they have a little cash and they wouldn't need a place to stay or whatever. Like you have the options to do so much where you have equity in multiple places. Yeah. So that's actually how we plan to pay for our sons college. So one of our first investment properties, like I'm fine with sharing numbers.

I'm like really open. But one of our first investment properties we purchased for $60,000. And it's a property and now it wasn't like popular then, but I knew that the future development was coming on the belt line. And so now, you know, the property is worth, even today, it's worth like 400, right. And so our son's getting ready to go to school. So he gets ready to go to college. If he needs assistance, say he doesn't get a scholarship or whatever, he needs assistance, I can basically go to that property and either refinance it or get a line of credit off of that property and pay for his school with that, with that equity. And the beautiful thing about it is,

I'm getting rent every month from someone else. So I can redo that over and over again if I want to. So someone else is paying the mortgage. I'm able to take, I'm able to cover the expenses. And then that money is going to continue to grow. The equity is going to continue to grow as well as I'm getting a check every month. Right. And then when my son gets ready to go to college, I can pay his tuition from that property

and do it over and over again. Wow. Over and over again. And so it's like just a cycle that you could take advantage of and be able to pass it on to my kids so that they can have those options too. You're like a walking monopoly game. Yeah, it's really it.

Do not pass gold, collect $200. She's making the brown properties and them orange properties work for that they eventually become borewalk. That's a word. That's a word. But the the The wild thing is the first time I heard about that concept

Is when we lived in Chicago And our accountant is guy named GED He owned these apartment building Or an apartment building that had like maybe I don't know 15 to 20 doors And Lincoln Park And Lincoln Park wasn't that special He bought it when it was the hood

And he just It was so simple he was like Because he was probably in his 70s He was like yeah I bought it in like 1987 and he said all of the rent that I that the the tenants would pay me I used it to pay off the mortgage he was like I never took a dime from what the tenants would give me and he was like now I'm 70 and I can just hang out with my wife and go on ski trips all the time yeah because that entire that entire building is paid off and so now everything that the tenants give me just you know but that's tough but but I was like yikes that's smart but not only not only is he resting but not only that one of the main things that he said he does for like low-key for charity not skiing he helped he was helping believers

to get taxes oh because like that's the way that's the way that's the way we didn't get we didn't wow yeah and so that's the way he wanted to serve the Christian community he was like I don't really need y'all money right and so he was like he was a low-key millionaire at our church nobody knew he was a millionaire and if you you had to ask them because he no I mean I mean he was I mean he was wearing sketchers and like that's how they be

You know what I mean? Yeah, absolutely. But he was like, I want to serve the body of Christ by teaching them financial literacy and helping them with their taxes. And so he was a blessing to us. I just was impressed because like the way I grew up, it's like if the tenants are paying you, that's your money and you need to spend it on yourself. Right.

And so the fact that like he had to wait to the 2000s to actually be able to see the profit. But like now until he dies and whoever he gives that building to, it's there. And I was like, man, that's major. And he's paid it off. And so Lincoln Park is one of the most wealthiest neighborhoods in Chicago and it's multiple units. And he owns the building with no mortgage. Yeah.

And it's just all profit. I love it. And there's, and you definitely, it's definitely a loan game. And then the beautiful thing is that you do have small kind of nuggets that you can take advantage of now, even though, like, the greater reward will be later. So, like, I take off the month of December. And so I taken off work, not working. I remember last year I took off and my son was just like, you're not working. So what's how we're going to how we're going to make money?

And I showed them my email. And I was like, deposit, deposit, deposit. And so this is the value of real estate is that I can take off the month and, you know, be with my family and I have to worry about work and things are taking care of. And you are providing housing for people. Providing housing is so important. And it's like one of the most important things in our life, you know, where we lay our head at night, you know, it can really change someone's life. So I think it's a great thing to do.

I do want you to shout out what you do online, like what your classes and stuff like that and tell people your Instagram and tell people how they can stay connected to you. Because I do think that a lot of times we don't look at the work that you're doing as ministry. But like, man, like what if you, what if God is using? I don't think what if God is using people like you to help believers be freed up to do more ministry because they're more financially free to do so. And so talk about your cohorts and talk about why you started them and then talk about how people can can get connected to your online. Yeah, absolutely. It was really interesting because I was working with. So I'm a licensed agent here in Atlanta.

And so I have been investing on my own and a part of, or my family, we've been investing. And so a part of the process of being an agent and us, you know, picking up properties over time is we would use the income that I made as an agent to then reinvest in real estate. And so I have friends just being like, oh, wow, how do you do that? How do you do that? So I started helping friends over time. And then I had a lot of friends come to me like one time and they were like, hey, can you teach us? And just because of all the things I mentioned that I do, there's like no way that I can teach everybody individually. So then that's when a good friend of mine came up and said.

So you should do like a cohort or some type of like group program where you can teach people all in one time. So the cohort was birth out of really wanting to help people and an efficient way. And so what it is is it's a 12 week program where I walk people through in a group of I develop a curriculum that teaches them how to invest in various ways. And it goes all the way to property management. also we have one-on-one time so that I can help them develop a specific strategy based on their personal situation now the beautiful thing about the cohort that's even more amazing than what I just mentioned that I had no idea what's going to be a factor was the community aspect I mean I have it's really it's interesting because we have like this that we have this group of like-minded

people lots of believers lots of like first-gen immigrants lots of just purpose-driven people people who are like I know that there's something more. I know that there's a, you know, a better way to help my community come in one place. And the building of community that has taken place has been something that I did not, you know, anticipate. A lot of people don't have other people in their life that they can have these conversations with. I think we're special where our group, like we have these conversations all the time, but most people don't. Most people, they're the only ones and their group talking about these things. So the cohort has provided a place for people to find other like-minded people

who aren't greedy, who are, you know, about things that are bigger than themselves, come together and learn. And so it's really been a, we have our first in-person retreat tomorrow. Oh, wow. So I have people flying all over. Busy B. So we have people flying all over that I'm going to meet in person for the first time tomorrow. So for the person.

listening, how can they get connected to them? So I would say to follow me on Instagram first is Erica B-E-R-I-K-A-B-Investor. And then if you go to my link tree, you can go to my website. You can join my waiting list for my cohort. All my links are there. Shoot me a DM. Yeah, there's a waiting list. I only launch four times a year.

Okay. So holl at me. I help you. Well, thank you, Erica Brown for joining us. And I just, I want to just quickly add. I know it's a lot of Christians who listen to our podcast. And I think the topic of money we talked about it, but the topic of money could get funny. And I just want us to know that money is not the root of all evil.

The love of money is the root of all evil. And so I think that if you love money more than you love God and people, I think that's something that you have to take to the Lord to allow the Lord to deal with something in your heart. But at the end of the day, I think that God isn't calling us all to be rich, but he is calling us all to be wise stewards. and how can we steward our money and our possessions in a way that glorifies him. And so some of us, God is calling us to be more wealthy than others, but it's all for the glorification of him. And so we wanted to have Eric on because I feel like she does that.

Right. She does that well. She does that well. And so, yeah, just wanted to just read the cloisiesties and you'll be there. Yes. Over and over. All right. All right, y'all.

Bye. Peace. 30 Minutes with the Perrys is a production of Ivy Media podcast. Edited by Angie Elkins, video recording and audio production by Kim Powell, artwork by hop and music by swoop. Join us on Patreon for early access to With the Perry's episodes and other exclusives. You've got two options. You can go to wwwpatryon.com forward slash with the Perrys,

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