With The Perrys - Navigating Faith While Playing A Game: A Conversation With BB26 Winner Chelsie Baham

Episode Date: September 8, 2025

Chelsie Baham is not just the winner of Season 26 of Big Brother – she also loves Jesus and was in full-time ministry up until she joined the game last summer.   In “Big Brother,” sixteen strangers are locked in a house for 90 days with cameras and microphones running 24/7 as they compete for a gigantic sum of money. Jackie has watched “Big Brother” since Season 2, and she loves it because of the psychology involved, understanding people’s thoughts and motives as she watches the competition.   The Perrys talk with Chelsie about how ministry – and specifically ministry in California – helped her in the game. And together they hold the tension between our beliefs as Christ followers and the perceived need to lie and manipulate to get ahead in a reality TV game show, which is something Chelsie said she wrestled with every day.   Watch Chelsie on Season 38 of the Amazing Race, premiering September 25 with a cast of Big Brother alums and their family members.   Connect with Chelsie: https://www.instagram.com/chelsiebaham/?hl=en   This Episode is Sponsored By: https://weekendtoremember.com — Register for HALF PRICE till September 15th. This is Weekend to Remember's biggest sale of the year!   https://fieldofgreens.com — Get 20% off and free shipping with code PERRY at checkout!   Subscribe to the Perrys' newsletter: https://withtheperrys.myflodesk.com/zhfus4jx1s Join Preston's discipleship community for men: https://www.patreon.com/PrestonPerry/membership To support the work of the Perrys, donate via PayPal: https://paypal.me/withtheperrys Shop BOLD Apparel: boldapparel.shop Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey guys, hey St. Nade's, how are you? What's good with y'all? You're really pretty. Thanks. I don't really have any small talk in me. I don't know. I just want to admire your beauty real quick. All right.

You're such a small piece of leather, but you so well put together. Did you sleep good last night? You told me you didn't. No, I did not. You want to express why? You want to work through that? I just kind of felt like demons was fighting me all night. You ever, like, wake up?

Was it demons or the men? mattress? So we talked about this. Because it could really be. We talked about it. I love our mattress. And I don't know. I'm not the biggest fan of it. This is the first time.

I think we had three mattresses in our marriage. And this is the first time I feel like I like the mattress and you don't. Well, so to be clear, the reason why we've had three is because we went mattress shopping maybe three or four months ago. I like that mattress. You didn't like that mattress. And so you replaced the mattress two months ago. because we had like a 60 day warranty

because I slept fine on it So I was like Okay, cool I should change the mattress again No, because I just don't I don't even want to go through that So it's like it's cool But I'm also

I'm perpetually uncomfortable Because I have back issues So part of I only sleep well When we go to Europe Because all of those beds are hard Beds have to be like a straight plank of wood For me to sleep good Maybe that's how we was in Nigeria

And we felt like we laid on a brick No, it sounds counterintuitive, but the harder the bed, the better I sleep. Like, it has to be really hard. The bed we have now, it's like firm is just not firm enough. It's not, it's not giving bare back. I need to sleep on the back. But what we probably need, though, we need, we probably need that bed. Well, you know, like, you got and got your own bed in one bed.

Like, I can lean up and you can lean back. Well, that was the original conversation that we were supposed to get. We probably should do that. We need to do this. This is probably the Lord. I think we're beyond the warranty at this. point so we can move back to the spiritual warfare question. Is it the mattress or was it demons? I don't know. I don't know if you have. For me it's the mattress. For you, it might be

the demons. Have you ever woke up and you just felt like you was fighting all night? Yeah, I told you that the other day when I said I had a dream that a dark female figure in black robes came in the kitchen and stood in my face and was intimidating me. Did her breast thing in the dream? And then I was trying to rebuke her and I asked you, was I fighting in my sleep trying to communicate? You are? Yeah. And I said, yeah. And I said, I think you should. have been wearing for me. Jackie be speaking in tongues in her sleep or something. Yeah.

What is it? No, I'm having a dwarfs. It's warfare. So we shouldn't have found it ironic that two weeks later there was public warfare of people who are females saying things to me. Anyway, go ahead. Wow. Yeah.

Yeah. So I just woke up. I just kind of felt like, yeah, somebody beat me up all night. I don't know. My shoulders hurt. I'm like, why did I feel like I was running? You think you, Jacob. You was wrestling an angel.

Oh, no. Anyway, we have Chelsea with us today. How are you doing, Chelsea? Well, so, y'all, it's so fascinating hearing you guys banter. This is a truly married cup. Over a mattress is crazy. Yeah. That's a like thing, though.

Well, I'm chronically single, so I didn't even think that mattresses would be a thing. Because here's the beautiful. You know how Paul says, like, you know, you're anxious for the things in the Lord. And we have to, if ever you want to change out your mattress, you don't have to have no conversation with nobody. Oh, it's the bet. I don't have to ask anybody for anything. Yeah, it's just like you could just get the mattress. that you want to have.

Whatever I want. That's what I'm saying. Sorry. So, I'm asking that. All right. Now, Judge, what you say, your last name? Beham. Bayham.

Yeah. What is that? What country is that from? It's actually German, and I'm not German, and I don't know the storyline behind that. I'm Creel. So something happened back in the day that I probably don't want to dig deep into it. So where are your people from?

Louisiana. Well, you live in. L.A. So who, your grandma? You got some real woke people. Find out what your name is. Your grandma moved from Louisiana? Both.

grandparents on both sides of the family moved from Louisiana to Los Angeles. For what? The railroad roads or something? No, rural. It was like a mass exodus there because it was like gold. I actually don't know. Okay. You should find that out. I should find that out. Yeah. But yeah, German. So Chelsea is the winner of Big Brother. Big Brother!

I tell Jackie how I hate the way they say that all the time. You know that's a real man that says that. He's like an older. He's been there since season one. he's probably in his like 70s and finale he comes up to me he's like hi Chelsea I said Who are you? He said This might ring a bell Chelsea come to the diary room

I said you're the voice of big brother I thought it was like AI or some computer No it's a real guy they're gonna replace that man He just don't know it yet They're gonna replace the man AI It's coming yeah it's gonna come for sure We're gonna replace human beings for all the things He gets up their age

He is But she's not just the winner because I don't like for people to only be seen through the lens of what they've accomplished. But she's a believer in the Lord, Jesus Christ. You know what I'm saying? She's a daughter. You used to be a leader at a church, all the stuff. You're trying to figure out what you're going to be doing, all this stuff.

Like, tell us about yourself. Yeah, so I grew up in the church. Like family were Catholic turned Christian. And at age nine, I just became obsessed with God's word. Like I was in youth ministry at nine years old, leading at 11 years old. So I just became so fascinated with the Word of God and church up into college. I went, played ball in college at a Christian college. And in the middle, like peak of my season, best I've ever played.

And in the middle of practice, I felt like the Holy Spirit say you're not supposed to be here. So I dropped the basketball, ran to my coach's office, and I quit. And she starts crying. She's like, what can I do? Like, give you more money. And I'm like, well. But I end up quitting. I said, I don't think I really know why, but I just feel like God's calling me to quit.

And a week later, a woman that I was interning for, she took me out. She's like, hey, I just sense that you're not supposed to be playing basketball. I said, that's funny. I quit last week. And that was at 17 years old. And from 17 up into two days before Big Brother, I've been in full-time ministry. That's crazy. Yeah.

Wow. So we met Chelsea. Did we meet before the tour? No, that was our first time. So Chelsea was at our L.A. stop of the With the Perry's podcast tour. And it was funny because when the season of Big Brothers started, I'm watching it. And, you know, the first episode, they introduced you to the cast. And they do all the pictures and the run through and all the things.

You got to let people know. because people know, but a lot of people probably don't know that you're a fan. Okay, let me get some, so, okay, let's slow down. Okay. Explain what Big Brother is. Because it's even, because Loki, I put it on threads before the season started. I was like, Big Brothers coming. And somebody was like, what are you talking about?

And I was like, oh, I forgot that people don't know what that. So explain what this is. And then I'll get further context to all the stuff. Yeah. I mean, you should explain. You've been watching it since season two, which is crazy. But I think you could explain. She was like, how old was you nine?

Yeah, it was like 1998, 1999. That's crazy. I was three years old. Oh, my gosh. Anyway. What's your case saying is I'm not loyal and consistent. Yeah, you're loyal. Our whole marriage has been Big Brother.

I have. They should make you the voice. I'm going to pitch that. I love a chick. So Big Brother is they put 16, 17 strangers in a home. you have no technology. You're locked away from the outside world for three months, and you have cameras 24-7 on you,

so at any point, people can log on to Paramount Plus and see what you're doing. They can see you sleep, they can see you eat, all the things. You're miced-up 24-7, and each week the objective is for you to play games to gain power. Whoever gains power puts people on the block, and you basically have to fight to stay in this house each week, and each week the house gets the vote

for who they want to kick out and you're playing for a large sum of money. At the end, you have two people sitting in the final chairs and the jury, people that get kicked out, get to vote for who they believe deserves the win. And so it's 90 days. But the crazy part, what people don't know, you're sequestered before.

So I was stuck in a hotel room for 12 days. Couldn't leave the room. Oh, my gosh. So you kind of go a little bit crazy before you even get on the show. Some people quit before they even make it to the show because psychologically it's difficult to just not leave one room with no phone, no TV, no nothing.

You're sitting in silence all day long. Oh, that's sick a little bit. No, it's bad. Yeah. It's bad. So, yeah, and one person wins at the end, and I find myself winning the game. Yeah.

Wow. And so, and you don't, you have, you said no contact with the outside world. No contact, no phone, no nothing. Yeah. How much money did that? Did you win? $750,000.

Ah, yes. Hey, let me get a $5. Yeah, God. Let me hold some. Yeah. So that's context. So before at the With the Perry's tour, stop. Chelsea came up, said, what's up?

You asked the question about, like, church or something like that. Because she was in VIP. She did. Yeah, she was a VIP. The reason I remember Chelsea is because I said I like your outfit. That's right. That's the reason why I remember you. Because you're swaggy.

I liked the outfit. And then we took the picture. I think you was cool with hop. Yeah. Like it was all these like connections that like cemented you in my mind for some reason. And what's crazy was, I'm going to just say this. The guy who works for me for bold apparel on my clothing line, he grew up with you. That was a hop, Kevin.

They were, we all the youth ministry together. And so like, so like as soon as you walked away, he was like, yo, she's going to be on Big Brother. And I was like. And I literally forgot to tell you. I had not a clue. I forgot to tell her because it was, tour is busy, so I forgot to tell her

because Kevin walked up to me because he does on my merch on tour. And he knew you from L.A. And he was like, yo, that's my friend Chelsea. She's the one of being on the TV show, Big Brother.

And I was like, really? And I totally forgot to tell my wife. I was going to tell Jackie, but I was so afraid to, like, get in trouble. And there was so much going on. I'm like, she's not going to care about that detail. I wish I would have told you. No, I like the surprise.

Because, again, I'm watching, I'm watching the first episode. So the first episode, they run through the cast. They have this really, like, it's like this B-row where they go into the cast house

and you see the thing and your whole storyline was that you're like a pastor or a preacher person, da-da-da-da. And I'm looking. So I went, I somehow, because I think you tagged this in the picture,

and I said, is that the girl that way? Yeah. So I'm going to press it. I said, that's the girl at me. And I was just like, well, like, that's the same. And so it was,

I immediately was going to be locked into that season. Yeah. Just because I'm like, this is so interesting that I met this person who I believe is a believer who is on this show that I love. I'm intrigued to see how she's going to navigate this because honestly speaking, I'm going to be very frank with you. Big Brother is a game that you cannot win unless you manipulate well.

Yeah. One thousand percent. Sneaky, sneaky, sneaky, sneaky. One hundred percent. Let's be clear. Survivor, Big Brother, those are games that you have to navigate social dynamics well. They require some type of craftiness. And so I was just like, huh, I'm going to see what you do.

And you did it. I did it. You did do it. And so what, I guess, what was a part of your process of making this decision to do that? Did you seek commuting? Like, where did that seed start? Yeah, so I never, like, grew up. I watched it for a long time.

I never grew up thinking this is something that I wanted to do. I had a friend who was on Survivor, and she was like, it was my pastor's sister. She was like, hey, you should, she didn't even say audition. She sent me a screenshot of casting calls. So I lifted up my laptop, and I did a four-minute video. Like, what's up, y'all? My name is Chuck.

I'm saying, you didn't think about it? No. You just, you're just one of those kind of people. Yeah, I was just like, they're going to see thousands. thousands of people. They go through over 100,000 videos, and they recruit people. So I'm like, they're probably not going to see it. The worst that can happen is they say no. So I didn't, most people edit their casting video all nice. I literally was like, but you don't see the gap that I'm trying to understand. Yeah, no, there's a, I know. I know. I never thought about it until

January right before the show. Okay. Yeah. How old are you, Chelsea? I'm 28. I was 27 at the time. Okay. Yeah. So didn't think about it. Probably should thought about it a little bit more, but I lifted up my laptop and I did a four minute video and I closed it. I'm like, Lord, if it happens, it happens. If it doesn't, whatever. At the time, I was going through a lot of interesting dynamics at work. I was already processing transition in December before Big Brother. And I felt like the Lord said June.

And I didn't know what that. He just gave me June. I didn't know what that meant. Is it June and I'm changing my role at church? Is it June and I'm leaving my role at church? What's going on? So after I lifted up my laptop did that video, I didn't think about it after a month. I'm like, whatever. I don't care if they call me or not. And I'm at church

and I see like my Apple Watch go off and it's, hey, this is so-and-so from casting. We'll love to hop on a call. They spell my name wrong, because I'm like, this is like somebody messing with me. It's a spam. I'm not answering this. Then 30 minutes later, something told me like, you should just like call back and check. And then it was legit. So I went through the casting process. I sought council, mostly my pastors at the church, and they were, I wasn't able to tell them in the beginning what it was because I'm under NDA. So I'm like, hey, I could be gone for two months or I could be gone for three months or two weeks. I can't say what it is, but it's a TV thing. Immediately my pastors, they've been fans since season three, four. They knew exactly what it was.

Oh, so you're talking about Big Brother. Yeah, yeah. So I couldn't hide it. And they had supported it. They said, yeah, try to make some things work with my role. But it got to the point where I had to make a decision where they couldn't allow three months to go by because my role is so pivotal. So they said if you last passed this amount of time, we're going to have to replace your role. So I was up, I had to pray and fast, Lord, is this something that you want me to do? Because this is like a big deal. And I'm a woman of faith going on a very public platform that deals with manipulation and lying. So, you know, and I'm like, I'm revving my church.

I don't want this to make my church look bad. There's so many, my family looked back on myself. So I prayed and I sought the Lord and he just made it very clear that as June came, I'm like, I think this was the transition that he was talking about. My very last day of work was June 30th and I got picked up for Big Brother. And just through prayer fasting, my community, they said, go for it. We think this is the thing that's best for you, but it came with sacrifice of my job that I loved at the time. So I went and I didn't think, I was like, you know, if I get kicked off two weeks, that's fine.

I went on Big Brother. I like, that's iconic. I did not expect to win this game. I didn't expect you to win. Why? I didn't expect you to win. One, I think the way they introduced you, you were introduced like the church kid. Like you would just kind of be the person who was there to be a moral center for a.

the house. Let's get together and pray one another. Stop fighting. Usually the person who was moral is actually some sort of bring some type of contention in there because they're self-righteous on some level. And so I just thought you would just kind of be around, floating, just having a good time. I knew you would go far when you had the conversation with the guy who said that he had

family who was Christian and he was gay. And the way you handled that conversation, I said, I told you. Yes. I literally told you. I want to just talk about this real quick. Yeah. Because so. You got a vouch for me because I don't be, I'm not, I'm not mixed up.

So here's the thing. So I watch Big Brother with her occasionally. Yes. And so I'm not, I'm typically somewhere watching sports. I'm a sports junkies, right? And so she said, Preston, can you come upstairs real quick? I said, okay. she said, I got under bed with her, she said,

this girl is playing this game. She is playing this game. She is good. Ooh, ooh. And so I said, why is she playing this game? And she just talked about how great your social. The social skills were immaculate. Your social skills were immaculate.

So then I was like, I'm starting to be a fan now. I'm like, you know what I'm saying? So this is a part of why I like Big Brother. I love psychology. I think anybody that watches me or listens to my. teaching or the way I explain I like to get underneath things I like to understand people and why people think and do the things that's why you're a good teacher right like when I get in the Bible I want to understand why Hagar responds that way I want to understand why Peter thinks that way

I want to understand the thing so for Big Brother for me is watching social chess it's understanding why people are making the moves they make so when she had that conversation with the guy and he is confessing these really sense sincere feelings of being abandoned and rejected by his family. One, he just met this girl. So that means that she's created a space where he feels safe to share all of that. But how she responds to him secures that safety. And you don't understand this is a game.

That means he won't vote for her. That's the point. He's not going to vote for her. And so I'm like, oh. Yeah. I'm like, she's a, I'm like, this is great. So even if she don't win a competition, she has a person on her side. But she did that with everybody.

So I guess. You understand what I'm saying? Yeah, for sure. I guess, okay. So I watched the ladder in and I was like, oh, okay. Like even what was cold to me, I wanted to jump to subjects, but what was cold to me is how you made that girl at the end think she was going to win. Don't fast forward.

Okay, no, fast. Okay, okay, okay, wait, wait, wait, okay. Yeah. I guess my question, my question to go with that is, is did your time in leadership with people? Yeah. Oh. Because it was very pastoral.

Yes. Because you didn't affirm his sin. Mm-mm. I said I understand. You didn't affirm his sin. Which is what we do in ministry every single day. And like Big Brother, what people don't realize, it's a microcosm of America. You're having one type of every single person put into a house, which is like my church.

I'm sitting with parents. I'm sitting with grandmother. I'm sitting with all types of people. I've had to learn how to navigate different people who believe differently than I do. So getting a Big Brother, this is like, I've been doing this for the last 10 years. Ministry, then set you up to get a bag.

Y'all was like, oh, this girl is a youth later. And I was. And so I didn't go on Big Brother with the intention or even the thought that ministry would help me. When you're watching the show, you're not thinking like 80% of the show is just living and existing. and only 20% is what you're watching online.

You're stuck with these people. You have nothing else to do but to live. I'm not thinking about that as a fan of the show. So I didn't even expect the strength of growing up in ministry to help me in my game. But it massively did my ability to hear people out to pastor a lot of people in that house through the game and through their personal lives. They don't show this day one. The live feeds are off so we get to be free and say whatever we want. And I recognized one of the girls, she walked outside crying.

We were all, I was leading an actual Bible study night one. There were seven people brought out their Bibles. And one of the guys said, can you lead us? I said, sure. So we're outside. This girl walks outside and she's sobbing. And I saw it. And I'm like, she comes over.

I said, hey, are you good? She said there's a inside everybody's talking about their mothers and how much they love their mom. And she had just lost her mom. Her mom had just passed away. Wow. And with like seven, eight people outside, I said, I don't know what you. your beliefs are. She's, she's agnostic. But do you mind if we pray? So in that moment, like, we're laying hands praying over this girl and people are sobbing. But it is in that moment,

I realized, like, this house immediately trusted me immediately without me really trying. It was just me existing and being. And that unintentionally helped me in the long run. My ability, it's just dealing with people for 90 days. But you know what? I would also suspect that doing ministry in California prepares you for that. 100% because there's a different

development and flexibility and awareness somebody like Southern Christians do have a different linear

approach to ministry sometimes than Christians who like for you to say I don't know what you believe yet will pray

versus I don't know, there was an openness, an open-handedness to the way you welcomed her in, even in light of what she may or may not believe, rather than a kind of legalistic, distant, kind of thing. And what I also love, too, is, you know, I love evangelism. And so, you know, I think what you had the opportunity to do is to display, like, wisdom, gentleness in a setting like that, right? Because even when Jesus sent his disciples out in twos to go evangelized,

he told them to be wisest serpents, Bahamas is dubs. So he's essentially saying, be gentle and be cunning. Discerning how to give the gospel to each. Like the way you give the gospel to this person is not how you're supposed to give the gospel to this person. So sometimes you have legalistic fools

who think they're just supposed to say the same script every single time to the same person. and they're not effective. Yep. And then sometimes you have passive people who don't share truth at all. And what God is actually saying is I actually want you to go into a space and discern and be wise and be cunning, right? And so, well, yeah, so I think that's just dope that you were able to display that

because of your ministry background. Yeah, ministry prepared me heavily for this game for sure. That's fire. Yeah, that was the moment. With chemo. Yeah. And that was early. That was probably like four days into knowing each other.

When you walk in the house, you really don't know anybody. You've not met. You meet on camera when you guys see us meet. So early on, people are just pouring their lives out to me. And it's in that moment, I didn't want to keep probably, like, I don't want him to feel uncomfortable because you're being, there's 100 cameras in this house. So I didn't want him to share anything that he wasn't comfortable with. But he kind of just laid it out.

And you're not really thinking they're going to air this on the show. Oh, they did. Yes. I found out, I haven't watched my season back, but I found out. Why ever you watched it? Because I lived it. Like, I don't think I'm ready to watch it yet. It's so exhausting.

But I'll watch it back because people say the edit was pretty dope. But I found out when I went to the diary room, they were like, so tell me about that conversation with chemo. I said, oh. It's actually, the edit was beautiful. Yes. It was a beautiful because it was just, it wasn't. I think I loved it because he was. really honest and vulnerable, you were really caring and sensitive while also not affirming,

but also still loving all at the same time. And I'm aware of we're not seeing the full picture. And like Preston always says, we're seed planners. And so to me, I am a big fan of you created space for further conversation because of how you led him in that moment, right? Now, Good question. Are you the first believer that won, Big Brother? I don't know. I actually do. Yeah, I actually do believe I might be the first believer that won this show.

Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. I have a hard question. Go ahead. I don't want to. I don't want to. Just do it.

I don't want to make you uncomfortable. But I think it's a necessary question. Okay. How did you also navigate your country? conscience when it came to having to manipulate people to get ahead in the game. Yeah. It was a daily struggle for me. And the only way that I was able to navigate it was to compartmentalize in that house.

And say, in the game, if I'm having a game conversation, I am just like any game night. If you're playing with my family, we're going to tear each other down in the after say, like was for dinner. So that's how I viewed Big Brother when it's game talk. Interesting. Because we play Mafia. It's like Mafia in Spades. It's a three-month-long mafia, which we played.

I had the house play Mafia. We play Mafia a lot. Yes, so does my family. So you're cut throat, you're lying. I viewed it as a three-month mafia. I also had them play it so I can navigate and see how people lie. So we play mafia. Yeah, we played mafia at least.

You had the people in the house play Mafia? We played mafia at least two, three times a week in that house. Yeah, and I would just sit there and evaluate when I found out who was mafia. I'm like, okay, that's how you lie. Yeah, so I use that as a tactic. Wow. That's crazy.

But I viewed Big Brother as a three-month-long mafia. And so when I would have game conversations, I'm like, this is purely game. Then when that shuts off, I'm just Chelsea. So 80% is you just living, not necessarily playing. So go ahead. Go ahead. No, go ahead.

Go ahead. I'll ask the follow up. I'm not going to ask no question. I'm just here. No, I think this is a fascinating conversation because I think I have, I have distinguished Big Brother from how I play Spades.

Wow. You get what I'm saying? Yeah. Like I've wrestled with, like I've had people say to me, like, would you go on Big Brother? I'm like, no, because I'll be evil. Like I've said that. Like I know things will come out of me

that I don't want to come out of me. but when it comes to Spades, it's like, yeah, ain't no nice Jackie. Not at all. When it comes to Mafia, ain't no nice Jackie. Yeah. But it's like what, what, I guess you saying that makes me say, what's the difference. Jackie got bad at the mafia. So don't hear us say we're justifying sin.

I want to work this through. Yes. That's what I'm saying. I just remember you got mad at our friends, kids and tried to kick him out of the mafia. You said, y'all, y'all could leave. Do you know why I wanted to kick them out? I said Jackie, they're teenagers. Do you know why I wanted to kick them out?

Because they were making decisions based off their emotions. They wanted to please their daddy. I don't want to play with people that are driven by their emotions. I want to play with people that are driven by reason. So we have a 14-year-old. I want to see you on Big Brother. Y'all making decisions because your daddy in the room and that was making me mad. One of my closest friends, L.B. He and his son.

He was 14. He was like. I went upstairs. I don't care about fireworks anymore. I literally. went upstairs. She got mad. She said,

fireworks were being popped. I was in the bed. I don't care. She was so mad. I was really irritated. That's why I can't play them. I can't play certain games. I said Jackie, he's 14.

No, but the point is he shouldn't play the game because you're too young. But I guess my point is, no, seriously, guys, can we work through? Yeah, we can work through this? How do we apply biblical principles like thou shalt not.

lie to games. I mean, can I, okay. Let's go there. You guys can go all the way there. What are you going to ask? I want you to talk first, because you played the game.

Here's, I truly went in there wanting to play a game. Like, imagine your friends that night, you guys played mafia and you guys just lived together for a month. And every now and then y'all will play mafia. That's how Big Brother feels. You're just in a house with a whole bunch of people

and every now and then you're playing mafia having to manipulate, lie, withhold. That's how the whole thing felt. So that's the only, I'm not saying to justify any type of sin or lying or deceit, but when it comes to games, people do it. It's a game. It's a game.

So go ahead. Go ahead. The reason why I think people help me, Holy Spirit. I think the reason why people fall into legalism is because they look at the commands of God like a rulebook and not a God who sees the intention of a heart. Yeah. God look, this is the reason why the scripture says, man looks at the outer, but the Pharisees, they always say, you did that, you don't understand. But I honestly think if you go into a situation with the intention of everybody right here in this little space is playing mafia, potential to lie not to deceive or hurt you because we're playing the game.

I don't think God is, this is what I just honestly feel. I don't think God is looking at a heart and saying that heart is corrupt. Yeah. It's because I think that's what, because I think real lying comes out of a corrupt heart that wants to deceive, like truly deceive people for our own benefit and gain. But after the game, we're going to, we're going to chill and go eat. Yeah, we're going to not, but not only are we going to chill and go eat, we're all going to reveal to everybody.

Do you think that makes the difference that because everything is documented, it's not as though the deceit won't be uncovered, right? Yeah. You get, you know what I'm saying? So, like, with mafia, when the game is over, we know who the mafia is. I kill you first because you did this.

I made this move because you did this. They can watch your whole season back and see you. made this movie versus when someone is lying and being deceptive. Yes. There is no, the point is to hide. The point is to remain hidden. Right. Are you saying that that's the one of the differences?

Because it's no, it's no different, it's no different than me lying to you because I'm planning your birthday, surprise birthday party in a month. In a month, you're going to realize I was lying for a purpose. I was lying for a reason. I'm not trying to keep you in deception forever. Yeah. It's a game. Go and just live a whole much of people.

And the show is go and play this game. And the objective is only one. Only one. Come here. What you, I want to know what you're thinking. Come here. Brianna been squitting her eyes. It's her mic on.

Brianna is my assistant. Brianna Holmes. Brianna been squinting. She got thoughts. I just want to know what these thoughts are. Well. This is a community conversation. Yes.

Hang on. So I understand what you're saying, Jackie. Uh-huh. I don't know where I'm, I'm, I'm conflicted. If I'm honest, I'm very conflicted right now. Exactly. So at first, my thought process was like Preston and yours. I'm like, it's a game, so the intention isn't evil.

She's like, ah. But then after hearing what you're saying, I'm like, hmm, well, it is documented. Like, in normal games, you play the game. And once it's done, it's done, it's over. But this is... Everything's documented. Imagine playing mafia and after each round, you bring somebody in a room and you put a camera on them. It's big brother.

It's just mafia. You're not documenting people's thought process. You're thinking it. It's just, you're not thinking it behind a camera. That's true. What's the difference? I'm so complicated. What's the difference?

So where do you land, Brianna? I've never watched Big Brother So I was like on Google Like trying to figure out like what is it about Part of me is like it's a game But the other part of me is like I don't know Yeah

It's still lying It's still lying But I'm like But it's a game But it's a game It's a game It's a game It's attention

Okay Yeah I think this is a good conversation though And I And I, thank you, Brianna. Thank you for featuring on with the peers. I want to, I would like having conversations like this because I think I want Christian to be able to work through these things and be able to say, we know what scripture says to not lie. But we also play games.

Like we play mafia. We play spades. We play monopoly. even monopoly takes some Monopoly requires craftiness if you're going to win You know what I'm saying? Like I'm going to make certain moves

To make sure that you don't get bored walk Yeah period You know what I'm saying? I'm gonna make certain adjust Like that's that's the part of game play And so I don't even have a concrete answer Except to say The Lord tells us not to lie

He has given us games Where people will lie What is the biblical term for what God allows you to lie? The only text in scripture where you see space for that is Rehab or one of the texts in scripture is when Rehab lies to protect spies. Yeah, but that's a biblical term like when God allows you to lie to save a life. I don't know if a game is, that's not a life for death. I know, that's not a life. I'm not trying to compare it to the game, but what I am saying is I think when it comes to lying,

to understand that it's a matter of the heart. It's the matter of the intention of the heart. People are going to hate that you're saying that. But it is. It's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, I'm not justifying sin. I'm not, I'm not, I'm not justifying sin, but we know what you're trying to say. Yeah. Yeah. You're, you're trying to get at.

God looks at heart. You're trying to get at if I, there is a distinction between being purposely deceptive. for the aim of something wicked. Yes. Versus being deceptive for the aim of something neutral. Yeah. It's neutral.

If it's monopoly, it's neutral. If it's mafia, it's neutral. If it's the kids saying, um, Eden, if I tell Eden that we, yeah. That we go into the Walmart,

but we really driving her to Disney World. Like we're just trying to surprise her. I think the differences, I just, I usually don't say things that aren't true. Right? So even when I've planned your parties or when I plan Megan's party or if I've done something for the kids,

I find ways to shield the truth while also not being dishonest. And so I think that might be my wrestle even in your example. I do too, but at the same time, if you are... It's the way I did not expect this conversation to go to this way.

No, but I'm saying, but I'm saying, but what I'm saying is if I'm playing to your birthday party, right, and I don't even know how he got this deep, but if I'm planning your birthday party right and you get on to me or whatever and like I feel like it's going to be ruined, I'm like throwing a little look. Nah, I'm doing this. I'm might doing a little fib. Because I'm not doing it with the intention to like permanently deceive you. I'm doing it with it. So I do think. Yeah, you're trying to throw me off the scent. I'm saying I find quicker ways to throw you off the scent without. You're such a, yeah, I'm an honest person too, but you're like, honest, honest, honest, honest. It's not about being honest. Honestly, if I snitch on myself, it's not even about honesty. I think I think I know more pathways to lead you to a different destination without actually having to directly lie.

Mm-hmm. I just know how to say other things. That isn't even, and that might actually be worse. And I did a little both in the Big Brother house. Like the last week, and we'll get to it, I'm sure. But McKenzie, one of the girls in the final two, she was like, yeah, I don't need to practice of speech. Like, my game speaks for herself. I said, yeah, don't.

Yeah, you're right. Like, don't practice. I think you're fine. And I'm like, I'm going back to study. Like I'm withholding stuff. And so I did a little both. I wasn't the type of player that went and just lied just for the sake of it. If it was a matter of the game, I would.

And there was a line that I wouldn't cross. Like, I'll share this story and this is where it got a little dicey for me. But there was a situation that happened in the house towards me where they shut the lie feeds down for 48 hours. Okay. There was something said to me that was just not good, that they would not publicize on TV and that they protected. I was fine until I wasn't. Because I had dealt with four weeks of just shutting my mouth, withholding all of these things. And I just broke down.

I cried. Went to the upstairs DR. And I talked to an executive. And I said, how do I deal with this person? Because I can blow up on this person. And it'll be a great game move, but it'll be a terrible move as a person. Because this reputation is going to be tarnished. So what do I do in this instance?

I'm hurt. I felt like I need to justify myself and having this conversation. it'll benefit me in this way, but it won't benefit him for multiple reasons. She said this. She said, Chelsea, I'm not going to tell you what to do. But if I know you'd be the person that you are, I would tell you to handle this how you would in the outside world.

She said, take it to the Lord, take it to him. And if that doesn't work, bring somebody else in. She's like, I'm not going to tell you what to do, but you can handle certain situations in this house as you would outside. You just have to discern when to. Wow. And in that moment... The Lord be using don'tkeys, I tell you.

What? So it was a whole moment where 48 hours, they don't show any of this stuff. She's a believer? I don't fully know. I don't fully... I'm sure. Yeah, with her guidance. Oh, scripture.

Yeah. So in that moment, I was like, in that moment, I was like, hmm, this is interesting. Like, this is biblical guidance. And I used it. And it changed this guy's life. He said, you didn't have to forgive me. in the way that you did. Had a whole moment

where we cried, prayed on his bed, like this whole thing. So in the game, there was moments where I had to discern. I can do this and it'll benefit my game,

but it's really going to be a detriment to people's character. So there are certain moments in the game. I did have to step in and let my morality take precedence over the game. 100%.

Even at the final two, I was praying through God. My head was telling me one thing, my heart was telling me the other. And I was outwardly praying in the backyard. God, what do you want me to do? because I want to make a decision that is pleasing to you,

but it's also a game in $750,000 on the line. Money. So I said, what is it that I should do? And I felt that Holy Spirit said, follow your heart. And my heart decision wasn't necessarily the wisest decision to follow. I went to the diary room and the producer is like, I see you wrestling what's going on. And I'm like, I'm in between these two decisions.

They're like, hey, I'm not going to tell you what to do, but I feel like you should just follow your heart on this one. And I'm like, I feel like this is the Lord speaking to me. Didn't know I was going to lose the last one. But I felt like my obedience to listen to the Lord in moments like that to potentially sacrifice. And clarify what you mean by lose what you mean. Like lose the game. The decision that my heart was saying to make, I felt like I could have lost the game by making that decision.

And but I had two confirmations. I'm like, okay, I'm just going to trust the Lord in it. If I have an opportunity to make this decision, I'm going to follow my heart and trust the Lord. with it. And after I won, I felt like the Lord was just waiting, like, are you really going to care about me over this money at the end of the day? And I had that decision to me. Thank God I didn't have to actually make the decision. But there's moments in the house where I had to wrestle with is this game or is this real life? And it's constant juggle of discernment of when to compartmentalize, when to turn it on, when to turn it off. But how the ending played out with the unanimous

vote wasn't just my gameplay. It was a huge testament to my relationship with these people. That still stands to this day. Yeah. Because the interesting nature of Big Brother is they have these games toward the end where basically the last two, three people, they like, the person chooses the person to sit next to them and then the jury votes for that person. So it's, it's like, it's like serious who you decide who sits next to you because like they might vote for the person you choose to sit next to you to win over you. Does it make sense? You know what I'm saying? So it's like that's serious. But I think Chelsea to like get voted like every single person that got voted out in the jury voted for her to win. But mind you, she played all these people. And they knew it.

But she loved all these people. So it's like that's that. So part of, I think, the skill set that she brought to the table. And I'm assuming because you are a believer that your love was genuine and pure, too, for a lot of these people. Yeah. And you were able to navigate them because you had that experience, you know what I'm saying? But at the same time, you're still trying to beat them. 100%. I'm like, I'm going to love y'all, but I'm not losing this game.

And so how much was your love for them a game and pure? Does that make sense? That's a great question. I don't, with certain players, I wouldn't even say it's my love for them, but it's my willing to, my willingness to deal with them. I can imagine. Because you saw the certain characters. Oh, yeah.

The one lady, she was like a. We didn't even go to. So. wasn't necessarily saying like my love was the thing that caused her to vote for me or him to vote for me. I was able to just to deal with those people with grace more than a lot of other people in the house. But other people, my love was actually completely genuine for them. Am I the only one seeing how deeply Christian this is? Mm-hmm.

This is actually like God like like God teaches us how to bear with people. I hear long suffering. A long suffering. I hear bearing. I hear wisdom, being wise as serpents, but harmless as doves. I hear all of the Christian principles that God tells us to implement with people in the world. And it helps you win the game. This is so fascinating. I feel like your experience is such a, I don't think anybody can relate to it.

Truly. I don't think so either. I'm trying to find an example. And it's like, there is no, it's not a nine to five. There's not a, you went on a reality show. Yeah. I want to submit something. And one, as a, where you had to navigate these in.

I want to submit some. It's a conundrum. No, it is. It's still confusing to me to this day. Like, because this, this, like, like, I want to submit this to you. Okay. This can be turned into a book. Yeah.

Because this is a picture of how God sends people out. People always talk about, I'm an apostle. It's like, apostle means someone who is sent. You literally went out into not just the world, but in a very worldly game. And you were able to use Christian principles to make people trust you. I'm telling them to go back to what Jesus told the disciples to be wise. surprits by harmless as doves. He was saying,

yo, in my book, I said the gospel is the most important message that we can ever give. That's why it's important how we give it. And it's important how we give it by the way we allow people to be drawn to us because people don't care what you know until they know that you care. And so you being able to be launched out into the world

to be sent in the way by your pastors or whatever who gave you that permission, they sent you out in the world. And you use godly, principles to make people trust you. She won, too. And she won. She won games. Yeah, I am tied with like the most

HOH wins. So wasn't even just social stuff? Yeah, I played well. Yeah. And that's another thing. Crazy, I wasn't expecting that other. That's another thing. That's another thing I think you told me, if I can remember, you was like, for people to actually win games

and to be trusted by people, you're actually more of a threat. Social and game. But you told me something along the lines. You're actually more of a threat when you win games. Yeah, you are. And the person who wins head of household, you're basically like the king or queen.

Every person that won my season, you can't play the next head of household that next week. They were evicted the next week because of how they handled their power. I was the only person that I won the most. I won four times my whole season. And the only other person that's won is one after me. So, yeah, I had the most.

most like target on my back. Everybody should have came after me. And I was shocked that they didn't. I'm sitting here like. It didn't make no sense. No, it made no sense to me either. You were hidden in the bosom of his way. I'm trying to tell you.

I said, what is going on? If you love people well. Yes. No, they was coming for it though, but sometimes. At the end. They was like, I don't know why y'all not looking at Chelsea. Yeah. They started to look at me towards the end and saw like, I think she's playing all of us.

But there's a lot of players who've played similar games to me and their cast has no relationship with them post the show. So for me, I was like, how are they going to handle? I'm still in relationship heavily with these people who I completely fooled for three months. Have y'all processed through that? Yeah, people had left a show and took the whole game personally, and it has massively affected them. Like, they give us therapist for two years post a show because some people don't, it psychologically don't handle that well.

It's like, you go through it on the show. And not having, like, your safety net. You can't sing. You can't hum in that house. Like, usually when I'm stressed, I'll go worship or, you can't do any of there. Why can't you sing? Copyright issues. Copyright.

Because everything is recorded. Recorded 24-7. Wow. You can't write, right? You can't write, so you bring no writing utensils. So I was studying with Q-tips, like stats. So there's no way to escape, like, or to process in this house. So people get kicked off the show and they're just thrown it.

And then you're thrown into a world where the fan base can be. very evil, like very, very evil. Yeah. That's where a lot of people struggle when they get out the house. How, how, because I've seen where people have left the house and have really had, it's done a doozy on their relationships in life. And so how did you, how was that process of reentering back into your own community? It was hard to me honest because now you're entering back into my community that actually

loves and cares for me. that was like normal. When you have those outliers of people you were kind of cool with, you're now trying to navigate. Are you trying to leach onto me because of this? So now relationships were already sketchy

for me prior to the show. So it's just an added layer where you feel like, you know, are people now leaching onto me because I was on a television show? So that was an interesting dynamic. And even with the house, we have to work with your cast.

We have to work through some, I sat with hours with a lot of cast members who needed to process. Why did this happen? Why did this happen? And I would sit hours with a lot of cast members and have conversations and flush this out and say, that was a game. We're cool now, but my feelings were a little bit hurt in this moment. There was things I said on the show that I regret. There's things that I did on the show that I regret that I had opportunity to go back and apologize for.

So I'm not saying I was perfect in this process, but the values that I owned up to, cast are starting to see it when cameras aren't there. And which still, leaves a level of trust that they all still have for me. Because they see my love is pure and genuine, but I was not about to lose this show. And they knew I was a super fan. But yeah, relationally, it's difficult to get back. They say it takes about two years for you to feel normal back into society.

Does it feel like that? Oh, yeah. Oh, absolutely. It feels weird just reacclimating back into the world. It's like you've been in jail. Yes, like a solitary confinement, but a little bougie. That's what it felt like. They, your food, you're getting through a storage room.

Like, you have to, you have to press buttons to be entered into rooms. You feel like a dog. It's the weirdest. It's the weirdest experience. So leaving, like, you shower and you're covered, but, like, there's cameras that could see your, like, neck and up. Like, you're showering. There's one bathroom.

People know when you're, like, pooping. You know what I'm saying? So it was weird. Y'all ain't got one bathroom? Yeah, H-O-H has a bathroom. They can get y'all three bathrooms at least. They could have. They didn't.

Come on. Come, y'all, y'all, y'all got to change that. I think that's a part of the... Come on, man. It's part of the game. It's sort of the, like, psychological turmoil that they're trying to bring you through. I don't want to smell everybody, do-do. Yeah, and we did.

Yeah, you get very close, very fast with these people. You learn their whole lives, but it's hard to reaclimate. You're given therapist because it's like you're stuck in jail. And we didn't, I didn't know that there was a potential assassination attempt. I didn't know of any natural... On who? On Trump. On Trump.

Oh, because you're completely unaware of... of what's happening in the world. So I'm sitting in Finale and Julie is stating this stuff, we're like, what happened? That's crazy. We don't know nothing. We know nothing. So I get out the house and my parents.

I was in London with my past, they're eating food when it happened. We was like, I had no idea until we're sitting in the chairs on national television being told this. I'm like, what happened? So after the show, I only got 10 minutes with my parents before interviews, and they're like spilling everything

that happened in the last three and a half months. And I'm sitting there like, no. Yeah, you're completely isolated. And you go, I left July 4th and I got back October 15th. That's wild, bro. Yeah. Yeah. Yes.

So in the same way that ministry prepared you for the Big Brother House, how do you think God will use the Big Brother House to prepare you now for reentering back into ministry? That's a great question. I'm in the middle of processing that and learning how he's using me. I think now he's given me a platform to reach a lot of non-believers. Whereas before, I'm working for a church. You're really reaching people who already have a basic knowledge of who God is. Now I'm having dinners with people who've played big brother who are atheists, who are agnostic.

So though my platform is different, the mission is still the same. But it's more challenging. Because honestly, working in ministry vocationally was easier than what I'm doing now. Why? Because number one, I was in youth ministry. So it's just like teach them basic fundamentals and have fun. Okay. But as a creative director, I'm just, I'm not really having to deal with people who have completely different worldviews. When they're stepping in the church, they're already, they've come with some level of openness to where they want to hear about the gospel. I'm sitting with people who want nothing to do. Love me want nothing to do with it. How do I balance that? So it's been interesting. to see the Lord just put me now in platforms where this stage is bigger, but who I'm reaching, it's just more, it's more so evangelism, and I wasn't really in that camp before. So I never imagined myself sitting with people who are like, so how do you pray? Like people who have grown up, had no idea, no concept of God or Christianity. I'm introducing that. But I think

the Lord prepared me for post Big Brother before. I had wrestled with, a season in January where I felt like hidden, unseen, very lonely and isolated. And I remember reading a book called Anonymous that talks about the 30 years of Jesus' life before he enters ministry. And I read that and it knocked off a lot of pride in me in that season to say, if nobody's watching what I'm doing in ministry, if nobody's applauding me or saying, good job, am I still content? And when I read that book and I was wrestling through that, I feel like in my hiddenness, when God hiding me was protection at the end of the day.

Because it knocked off premature exposure. And now that I have. Yeah. Yeah, that got to me. I felt that in my chest. And had I been exposed to the platform that I had now without being in my season of hiddenness, I would have left very arrogant rather than great. saying this is only God. That's good.

So he had to hide me before Big Brother. He had to have me go through it before Big Brother. Because now post it, as I'm standing on stage in front of 13 million people, am I going to give God the glory at the end of the day? Or am I going to say it's me? Yeah. So he prepared me before. He prepared me to be hidden so that exposure doesn't get to me.

So now I'm not chasing the lights or the opportunity. I'm chasing an opportunity to introduce people who probably have never heard who God is. I have a lot of, and you saw it on the show, people who have been scarred by the church. Yeah, yeah. Don't want nothing to do with it.

Yeah. But they will sit and have dinner with me. Yeah. And that's been so new. So I think the Lord, yeah, prepared, ministry was a great launching pad for me to deal with people who... That's so beautiful to me.

Yeah. That's so beautiful to me because, you know, throughout the years, I've seen a lot of criticism from people on, line who criticize certain Christians for going in certain spaces. Why are you on at a war show? Why are you on this?

Why are you on that? And one thing that I've always told people is every single time I see people make comments like that, the only thing I see is how un-evangelistic you are. You don't understand evangelism at all. And what's sad is a lot of the Christian church don't understand what it means to be evangelistic, which is the reason why they're so critical of people, Christians who go in certain spaces, and the reason why their minds can't understand it.

Because we're so inward thinking, we're supposed to do this within the church. We almost begin to treat the church kind of like a cult. 100% as if we're supposed to be so inward thinking. And we don't understand how God in his sovereignty and in his wisdom strategically wants to place Christians in unlikely spaces to do unlikely things to bring unlikely people to the to the kingdom of God.

You know what I'm saying? And so like, yeah, sometimes, you know, it's hard. I think the hardest thing about evangelism sometimes is that the criticism of Christians, they just don't understand that God actually sends Christians in spaces to be a light. You know what I mean? But yeah, yeah, that's what it made me think of. And I think that, like, Pope, before the show. show, just my knowledge and my experience with God, I was aware that suffering is part of the

process. So post Big Brother, yeah, I want a large sum of money, but has gone through a lot of turmoil, criticism, and suffering along that process. So it hasn't broken me. I'm like, this is part for the course. So my faith is the thing that's sustaining me post this show. Causing me to not be arrogant, but also causing me to sustain through the criticism because I wasn't well received by everybody. Yeah, I know. I know, girl. So, so yeah, crazy experience, but.

Did you get hate mail from? Death threats. Still to this day. Wow. So to this day. Yeah. Death threats from people who are just mad at you for what? For, I mean, I get mad at me for winning the game, to be honest.

But like death threats going after my race, going after my looks. Like people, yeah, it got really bad online. And to where execs were like, don't, as soon as I got off the show, they're like, don't go on social media. Because there's some things, I had to have some security in certain places that I went to because people, the fan base of Big Brother, people of color aren't necessarily well received. We had our first Black winner, 23 seasons in. Wow. So now our season 26, them seeing a person of color win is already something that they're not used to in the last 20 plus years. You didn't racism, and crept into Big Brother.

Yeah, no, it has. And I didn't deal, I hadn't dealt with that in ministry prior to that. So that was an added layer that I had to deal with post the show that I was well received by most. But that small few, that just felt lower than everything else. But it was bad, like death threats, all of that stuff. For playing a game. Wow. Yeah.

How dare you a black person win our game? It's insane. No, it's bad. That's crazy. If I had. my Bible? Because this is like an NSB.

And how can you read that? The letters are so small. I can't. Like, this ain't really my Bible. So I can't find the verse because I know how it is, stuff is positioned. But there's this verse. I put it on threads the other day.

All right, it's Jeremiah 12.5. It says, if you have raced with runners and they have worn you out, how can you compete with horses? if you stumble in a peaceful land, what will you do in the thickets of Jordan? And the Lord gives that to Jeremiah after Jeremiah is complaining about the persecution he's receiving because he's like, amen. Like, this is a lot of chitjatter.

It's like these trials are a bit rough for me. I don't really like it. I'm not a fan. It's a lot. And God in response is like, well, If you race with runners, and that's too much, what's you going to do when it's time to compete with horses? Meaning what you're going through now, it might be hard, but what you're about to go through will be harder, so I'm preparing you. And so I wonder even if the Lord is using the vitriol from your win to even prepare you for your ministry.

Come on now. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's like if you're going through death threats, it's like, oh, that's not like, that's like, and that's not even persecution for Christ. Yeah. That's just for skin color. So imagine, like, that's intense. So to me it means like if that's the worst, y'all God, then like, I can be courageous now

when it comes to what I need to do for the gospel. And so I say go forth. And I will. Yeah. And I will. That's crazy. Yeah. It's something about that

excite me. You said I'm gonna die. Goodness. It's gracious. All right. Over a game? It's crazy. A game?

Over a game is crazy. So what's y'all gonna do when I start telling you all to repent? Wow. And that's something I had to wrestle with. That's that's something I had to wrestle with. I'm like, if they hate me for this, just wait till they fully know what I stand for.

What's the thing y'all be doing? That's what I'm saying, man. Yeah. So I'm excited. I'm glad to know you, Chelsea. I just, I loved, loved watching you play. Thank you. I really, I might watch that season back in place of this one.

I don't know. I don't know what they doing. One day she said, I'm going to put you on the spot. She said, I want to damn her right now. Then she said, did she said, oh, would I look like a fan if I actually remember? Wait, here's the crazy part. As soon as I got out the house, I finally get my phone two days after. My best friend is calling me.

She actually went to the podcast tour. The first thing you said, you were like, I want teeth like, I want teeth like, she had great, perfect teeth. I'm like, what? Who said that? You did. I said that about you? To my best friend. We all took pictures with us in VIP?

Yes, in VIP. So that best friend. That is something you would say. That is something she was saying. So that best friend, she was the first person I called. She was like, girl, didn't tell me anything other than Jackie watched your season. I said, of course. I said, I knew she watched Big Brother, but I didn't think she would tune.

And she was like, no, she, like, wanted you to win. That's the first thing I heard getting up Big Brother House. And I died because I've been a fan. I've been following y'all, both of y'all since P4CM when y'all came to speak at my church, abundant living in Rancho. Oh, that big, big church? Yeah, that's where you got proposed that? What are you proposed that? Did you propose there?

A big one. It's like 3,000-some people. Yeah. Oh, wow. Yeah. That's where I work before. That's why I proposed that. Wow.

That's right. Yeah. Oh, that's a big church. So I've been following your guys' stuff since P4CM days. Just like 2011? Yes. Oh, my gosh. With Ezekiel genetics.

I was probably like, I was 14. Oh. I feel so old. So yeah. I feel so old. So when she told me all, Jackie, Jackie was a fan, I was like, praise God, because she could either love me or hate me. I wouldn't go hate you, girl.

I wouldn't go age you. I was like, yeah, it just, I, yeah, I told, I was told, I was talking to the person. And I was like, I really feel like a fan, but I was, I was, I was praying for you afterwards. And so that's why I was so glad to see you at X. Yeah. Because I was just like, I was thinking about the warfare that you were probably enduring. During it, I was thinking about the lack of community that you had, how drained and tired that would be just as a human to not have your people, to not have music, to not have. to not have just normalcy, to not have church, to not have sermons,

and then to be pushed back out into the world with winnings, with money, with fame, with celebrity. And then I was like, that's just a lot. So I just was praying that the Lord would come for you and comfort you and feel you and surround you and secure you and do all the things. And so I really, really am glad to see that the Lord has sustained you in light of all the stuff, you know, because the devil is just, he's a loser. But the Lord keeps his people.

Yeah, thanks for praying. You guys were, Axe was like a safe place for me right out. I went seven days after I got out the show. Yeah, you was fresh off. I was fresh out. And I needed it very badly. Yeah, I was not well. And being thrust into that space immediately, I found like I found my North Star.

And hearing that you told me that you were praying for me when I got out the house. And I'm like, Lord, what in the world? of all the bad things that are happening post-a-show, like aside from the money, I didn't get the check months later, so I was still broke. I worked in ministry before, okay? Bank account was low, close to the negatives.

That's all I was saying. Praise God I won, like, because it would have been real rough. But to hear somebody like you guys, and you specifically, that was praying for me post-a-show. I'm like, what are the odds that that's the way that the Lord connected you and I? And that alone gave me enough to say, okay, I'm not hated.

If Jackie Hill Perry is texting me and not, you know, telling me to go, like, repent because you're an evil human, then, you know, I'm okay. That's good. Well, before we leave, I do hear Lent to just pray for her. Can we do that? Yes, of course. Okay, let's pray. The Heavenly Father, Lord, we thank you, God, for this podcast. We thank you, God, for just giving us the insight into the big brother home through the life of one of your children.

And so, God, we just thank you, God. for sending your people all over the world, even in Big Brother houses to be alight. And God, we just pray for the relationships that Chelsea has built through this game. We pray, God, that you would just continue to cultivate those relationships, to nourish those relationships, that a lot of those relationships will come to bear fruit and repentance and lifelong friendships. And, God, we just pray for her. We pray, God, for her mind.

You are the God of her mind. You are the God of her heart. And so God, I just pray, God, that whatever affects that the game might have on people after this game, that it will not be the same for your daughter that you, God, the God that can heal or deliver from anything would be the source of her peace, would be the source of all comfort. And I just pray God against the attacks on her life. The devil is a liar and there is no truth in him. And so I pray against every evil attack, every demonic attack, every lie, every evil person that has raised their head up and raised their mouth against her in judgment. I pray God that you shall show to being wrong. And I just pray God that you will send a body of believers to love on her and to support her.

And whatever mission that you have for her to do after this, I pray God that you will go before her because if you go before her, nothing can be against her. And so, God, I pray God, that you will equip her for the work of ministry, that you will equip her for the work of, to be an evangelist or teach her, whatever it is. God, I pray God, that you will equip her and that you will send people to assist her and love her. We thank you. We love you. We believe you for all. Jesus, name we pray. Amen.

Thank you so much. Bye, y'all. Peace. With the Perrys is produced by the Perrys with support from Amanda Reed and Channing McBride. Video recording and audio production by Matthew Baxter. Xavier Fairley, edited by the team at Tread Lively, artwork by hop, and music by swoop. Thank you for listening. Now go with God.