Witnessed: Fade to Black - Lady Mafia | 2. Luxury Asset

Episode Date: November 8, 2024

Sara dives into the OC’s dark underbelly of dirty deals, high stakes scams, and hustlers. A mysterious new friend starts passing Sara off as his sister, and teaches her how to loan money to desperate people to make big returns, quickly. There’s no turning back now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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I knew what I was walking into when I met Sara. I wasn't about to take her story hook, line, and sinker. I knew she sometimes, well, had trouble keeping her story straight. Sorting fact from fiction felt like sorting grains of rice. Sarah would have me believe that she went in search of love and wealth. And what the hell is wrong with that? But as I began to hear her story, even in the early days, it didn't seem to be quite that simple. I think she liked the thrill too.

She was raised to be competitive, and she didn't want to just win. She wanted to win big. You can have good intentions and find yourself in a hole. A hole that seems impossible to get out of. But I also think people are who they are. Sometimes they're just looking for permission to break bad, to be who they really wanna be. And it takes someone coming into their life

to activate them, to show them the way. For Sarah, that man was the one who introduced her to the world of hard money lending. The guy they gave all that money to. A man by the name of Brian Quinn. From Sony Music Entertainment, this is Lady Mafia. It's a story about going from lawyer to lawless, living high and blowing millions. I'm Michelle McPhee.

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Join the crew. We have to move fast. As they explore the galaxy. We're not alone down here. Don't miss the new Star Wars adventure. Skeleton Crew, two episode premiere December 3rd only on Disney Plus. Sarah met the man who would derail her life in the place where she seems to meet everybody. Fashion Island at the R&D kitchen. It's very masculine. Dark leather, old school Hollywood vibes.

One of Sara's favorites. I went there to meet a girlfriend of mine after, it was probably at three o'clock in the afternoon, and just to meet up for a drink and catch up. It's a circular bar at the center of the restaurant. That's when she saw him. Oh my goodness, it's like a scene out of a casino. The guy at the center of all the activity, a guy named Brian Quinn.

He gets up, starts running around the bar, like just saying hi to everybody, telling everybody, I'm buying everybody drinks. So he literally had the bartender give everybody around. And he's just running around saying hello, saying hello. You know, he has a slicked back hair. He's got like Gucci clothes on. He's short. He's just like the Italian mobster look.

So this bubblegum gangster was treating R&D like his own personal strip club. Sara was immediately drawn to him, His brashness, his confidence. You know, he came to me and he's like, oh I'm gonna buy your drink and I said, you know what, I'm gonna buy my own drink. So I did and after that he was kind of impressed. We started talking, we found out we knew all the same people and so from that, you know, at that that day I said, I know this sounds weird but I'd like to be your friend. The first year or so that Sara and Brian knew each other, they weren't close. So that day I said, I know this sounds weird, but I'd like to be your friend.

The first year or so that Sara and Brian knew each other, they weren't close, but they'd often run into each other. It was R&D, we'd meet at Pelican Hill, the bar there, we'd meet at Fleming's Bar, just basically like the higher end bars we'd always meet up. And slowly but surely, you know, we became close. It's something I started to notice about Sara. She's a girl who likes to live a few drinks deep. Brian Quinn, for his part, is one of those guys that no one really knows what he does. The kind of guy who seemed to have a lot of secrets, but everyone knows his name.

So the one thing about Brad that everybody knows is he just gets hammered drunk and then he starts dancing on bars with his shirt off. Like at Pelican Hill, we're not talking about, you know, strip club, we're talking about Pelican Hill on a bar dancing. Pelican Hill is a resort in the O.C. Oh, Pelican Hill's gorgeous.

It's, you know, it's a creme de la creme. To live in the villa is like 50,000 a month. It's nothing cheap. I've actually been there myself. The rooms are exquisite with private little yards and a sprawling golf course. Very classy. But the restaurant is where the action is. Sitting at the bar at its old school steak housey restaurant, I could definitely pick out the resort guests from the full-time residence by how the Italian bartender was pouring their wine. And yet this was the place where Sarah said

you could find Brian Quinn dancing shirtless on the bar. Who was this guy? He's a riot and a lot, a lot of fun. You just, he kind of feels safe. Like nothing can go wrong when you're with Brian. Sarah saw something in Brian, a freedom she envied, a swagger she wanted. He was like my brother, you know, we became best friends.

They started talking and found out that they had both lived in Rancho Santa Fe, a fancy town where Sarah's parents used to live on a golf course. He knows everybody. You know, everyone said he was a crook, but a lot of people respected him. A lot of people respect him in big business. So I kind of just followed suit. Now Sara said she heard the rumors that Brian was a crook, allegedly, but that didn't stop

her and Gerard from doing business with him. He was a dealmaker. So he was a third party in between two sides of a deal. You know, someone selling something, he'd find the buyer and vice versa. But with public companies. So he was actually, it was a pretty big deal. Sara was looking for excitement and money. How she got there was less important.

And something else about her. she can be taken in by money for sure, but most definitely by personality. Brian's charisma overpowered doubts some people had about whether this guy was a legitimate businessman. It was party time 24-7 when you were around Brian for sure, but make no mistake, he was always wailing and dealing. Brian was looking for investors and Jarrar and Sara were the perfect candidates. She told Brian she was frustrated with being a lawyer. There's a lot of work and not a lot of money, not enough anyways, and so he's like, oh I have a way for you to make a lot of good money. And that is you can fund these loans,

I split the interest half and half with you and the interest is high and it's on these luxury items and the loans are short term. Brian ran a hard money lending business called Luxury Asset Lending. It's like he's a middleman. On the one side are pitiful folks who need to borrow cash quick and are supposed to repay

it. On the other side are people who invest money with Brian and are looking to profit like Sarah and Gerard. So I started with a $50,000 loan, something small, and all got returned fine. And then I did, I put up to a million, I think it was 800,000 total cash in there. Money to burn, liquid cash, willing to take risks. Sarah and Jarar gave Brian cash no less than six times. When you look around at people in the OC, they look like they're living the life. But there are so many desperate people who need to keep up with the Joneses.

I learned very quickly that everyone is very cash poor, and everyone is a con artist in Newport Beach, is also what I found out. So do you think it's like a big facade, the whole... Newport Beach, yes, 100%. I've been trying to track this guy Brian down for over a year now. The guy's a frigging ghost.

When I searched for his business, this hilarious video came up. It reminded me of those cheesy beer ads for the most interesting man in the world. Listen to this rather dramatic video. A Lamborghini drives out some iron gates. Then text comes across the screen. We had a friend of the podcast read it.

Luxury asset lending, discrete and confidential lending on your luxury possessions. Do you love the finer things in life? Luxury asset lending understands your needs. As a yacht cascades past a city backdrop, the pitch continues. We specialize in discrete, short-term financing. Most loans funded within 24 hours. It goes on for another minute,

showing pictures of diamonds, private jets, and of course, the Bellagio fountain. Not to mention, at one point, the video spells the word solely wrong. Sounds trustworthy to me. But what Sara saw in Brian was a confident guy who could work a room and a chance to make massive returns on her money. I mean, if this kept up, she might be able to quit her day job. money. I mean, if this kept up, she might be able to quit her day job. Sarah felt like her relationship with Jara had run its course. After more than 10 years together, she was

ready to move out. But before she did, she called up someone else. Her new friend and big brother, Brian Quinn. I called him one night and said, meet me at, it was Gulfstream in Fashion Island. Sarah showed up at the bar before Brian did and ordered herself a drink. It was a nice place, one of the upscale spots at the mall. It's all just kind of like old American,

very high-end food and drink. There's a whole cigar bar outside at Gulfstream where like all these big players always sit and have cigars and talk business. Sarah was pretty upset. She'd spent a decade with Jarrar and she wasn't really sure what the future would hold for her. She sipped her drink and waited for her friend Brian to show up. He finally did. She started telling him about what was going on with Jarrar, that she might decide to leave him for good. She said she was shaking as she talked.

And he was being a good big brother about it. He said, I got you. Don't you worry about anything. Brian said, why don't you come live with me at my villa in Pelican Hill? Sara was grateful she'd found her soft landing. Sara and Jarrar officially broke up. They did continue to work together on investments and business opportunities, but in love, they went their separate ways. We had money, we both worked, so it wasn't a big deal. I just wanted to rid myself of

him so I signed over the house, the cars, I signed over everything. I had like a couple hundred thousand dollars in my bank account and that was it. I was going on my merry way I didn't care That's not totally true Sara makes herself sound chill about the whole breakup here, but I know for a fact She was heartbroken at least over the dogs Dino and Louie And maybe it was friendly at first but Gerard would eventually request a restraining order against her that painted a different picture. He had a new girlfriend and Sarah was ugly about it according to court records.

He describes a pattern of stalking and threats. And he had plenty of texts to make his case. But when Sarah moved into Brian Quinn's second bedroom at his villa in Pelican Hill, she was 34. She was 34, had some cash, but not much else. Pelican Hill, I think the room started $1,000 a night. So just to put it in perspective, we live there regularly. But there's two bedrooms, it was the bathrooms. I mean, we're talking big tubs, big steam showers, maids coming every day, changing your towels. It was living

the life like really and truly. Sarah said she felt relieved and that Brian was the friend she needed to start her new life. It took my mind off of the divorce, right? So he just had me drinking all the time, partying with him, meeting all these big hoo-hahs everywhere. And it felt impressive. I felt like I was bettering my career. I felt safe with Brian as my brother. She said they drank and ate snacks and charcuterie all day. On top of that, Brian had all this influence and money

that Sarah so clearly craved, and he needed her help. When I moved in with him, he said, oh, can you raise me $10 million for my lending company? And I said, I'll try. I mean, I don't, we'll see, I don't know. And then he just kind of used me for business, but he also was there for me as a friend.

Brian started organizing these investor parties. He'd entertain big shots with deep pockets and everything was about appearances. So that's, it looked successful. He drove a white Rolls Royce. And here's some crazy shit. Sara drove a white Rolls Royce too. I had the Dawn, I had the convertible, and he had the four door. Yeah, so we were like brother and sister, like driving up to places together.

It actually looked, if it wasn't such a shit story, it was cute. Brother and sister showing up at meetings in their matching white Rolls Royces. Can't make this up. We would go to the best nightclub in Los Angeles. Brian would buy the best table in the club. He would actually hire escorts to be sitting at the table. That's what I know. And so it looked like he had a big group of girls around him. Sarah played the part of the conservative lawyer, making sure everything looked professional, under control. He's the part of the conservative lawyer, making sure everything looked professional,

under control. He's the guy, he's the it guy that everybody wants to talk to, everybody wants to be with and or around. Says whatever he pleases, doesn't really give a damn about rules or anyone else.

And these men, they fell for it. I mean, I don't want to say fell for it, but all these guys wanted to do business with Brian because of what he provided. The parties showed these guys that your life could be like this all the time if you toss Brian a few hundred thousand dollars. And so having a lawyer around while these parties were happening was very useful to him.

So Brian's this crazy party animal, right? And then everyone was comfortable with me because I'm like the sister, quote unquote, sitting in the corner, but conservatively dressed. I'd never flaunt anything. Basically keeping people in line saying, it's okay, I'm watching everything. I'll handle anything legal that comes up. I was not sober, but I sounded sober. So I'd answered a lot of the questions.

I was just the go-to for the investors for the business piece. She made the whole thing seem legitimate. In between the escorts and the bar buyouts and the free flowing drinks, people started putting some serious money into Brian's business. They always called me the real deal because I you know, I was always calm, cool, calm collected. In exchange for her help, Sarah got to live rent-free in a $30,000 a month villa

and never paid for anything. Her food, her drinks, everything was always on Brian's tab. And meanwhile, she's also learning the ropes of the hard money lending business. She said she did have to cover for him quite a bit. His girlfriend lived in the villa with him and frequently she would lie to her about where Brian was and what he was doing. She'd also have to do some cleanups after their daily visits to the bar.

Oh yeah, I mean he just, he drinks till he collapses every time. Seems to me, Sara did her fair share of day drinking too. She said, most mornings they wouldn't talk. He'd head out to his office for a few hours and by lunchtime he'd be back in the villa. She'd prepare a charcuterie board with wine and tequila and beer for Brian, hang there for a bit, then hit the Pelican Hill bar.

Brian and I would go drinking Pelican Hill bar after, and I would go drinking at the Pelican Hill bar after, like around five or six o'clock. Brian would get so hammered, he would start dancing on the bar, throwing his shirt up, and it was humiliating. What seemed cute at first was now just messy. She'd apologized to everyone at the bar, tell them she was his sister.

And she said that seemed to work most days. Her humiliation was a small price to pay for being on permanent vacation. At this point, she was still on the right side of legal. Soon she wouldn't be. She had a problem. She might be living high right now off the coattails of Brian's success,

but she wasn't profiting from any of that. And she certainly didn't have enough dough to invest like the guys who showed up to their investor parties. She needed to find a way to make big money. We're going to be back. Camp in floating tree houses hundreds of feet off the ground? Check. Jump in a big tub of mud on purpose? Call it rejuvenation. We don't care. Just pack your fun pants and let childhood rule your family vacation. Discover why California is the ultimate playground at VisitCalifornia.com.

A courtside legend is born. The Raptor Chicken Nacho Poutine from McDonald's. Our world famous fries topped with seasoned chicken, gravy, stringy cheese curds, tortilla strips, and drizzled with nacho cheese sauce. Get your claws on it. For a limited time only, at participating McDonald's restaurants in Ontario. That's when it hit her. There was a way for her to make a lot of money. Doing a job that requires two things, Sara most definitely had.

A law degree and discretion. I don't have to be a lawyer. I can just be a fixer. A fixer. Let's go ahead and capitalize that F. It's usually typically with a business and we fix the reputation of the business, of the owners. Any litigation going on, we try to control the narrative. Remember Trump's lawyer, Michael Cohen, the man who tried to keep his affair with

Stormy Daniels secret? That's a fixer. I mean, their legalities are that if I can find the loophole, so I am a master of loopholes. If I can find the loophole, I will do that. And I will get things done. She told Brian that's what she wanted to do. And he helped her do it. He set Sarah up with clients at places like the Pelican Club, and his ritzy yacht club called Balboa Bay. We would actually go on, randomly go on a yacht with a guy who, who Brian knew and to talk business and to talk about this whole,

you know, fixing business. And he said, oh, my sister can do this and she can do anything. For the rich people who did hire Sarah, she did all kinds of jobs. Really weird requests sometimes she said. It was also billionaire trust fund boys who were in Orange County and wanted their girlfriend back. And I would literally take their phone and text message the girl for them. I mean, it was that small to millions of dollars

people were trying to keep their public company alive. It sounded like a cross between a personal assistant and an enforcer. Okay, I have a client who had lots of legal issues. So I helped clear up the litigation. And then he had all these issues with investments as well where he wasn't getting paid on them. And he needed basically someone strong to go and bully people

to get what he actually deserved. He did deserve it. He did earn it. So I would go and I would just do negotiations with all these people and bully. I would bully them. I would just straight up lie and say, I'm going to take you to court. I'm calling the FBI on you and boom, you got paid. So it worked out. And then, but those things also turned into, hey, my son got a DUI. Can you fix that? And I would, I absolutely would. Or I need to go meet a senator so I can get this other job done. I would, I absolutely would. Or I need to go meet a senator so I can get this other job done, I would make the meeting

happen. It's about as much as I can say on it because I know that anymore that I get in trouble, yeah. That work, she said, paid exceptionally well. She would have several clients at a time and would bill to the tune of 1,200 bucks an hour. She said she was bringing in about 1.2 million a year. She was finally bringing in the kind of money she wanted to be making. One of my fixing clients, he wanted to go to Las Vegas and he wanted me to go with him because first of all he wanted puppies. I happened to have a puppy owner on my speed dial and I made an appointment and he said, I want to stay there for one or two nights and I want to gamble, you know, a little bit. And so I said, okay, I'll go with you. Let's go. So we stayed at the,

we stayed at Encore Tower Suites. I paid for all the rooms. We drove out to Vegas together. We stopped at the puppy shop first and he chose two dogs out and he put the deposit down. I chose my dog, which is Kula, which I love her to death. Still my dog now. So we go back to the hotel, but he's like, okay, I want, I need a hooker. And I was like, okey doke. Well, I guess that's my job.

So I go online, some website, to look to me to have a good eye on how good looking a girl is and so you know I would set it up and whatever they did and they transacted is on them I didn't transact then when he was done he would meet me for a cocktail at the bar and so you know he I would hold on to his money while he gambled he would drink so much that he would just be tens of thousands of dollars would go in a minute but it turned out that I was there more

to facilitate the strip clubs, the limos in the strip clubs, and I had to talk to the girls at the strip clubs so that they would go home with them. And it became, I was the pimp of the night, essentially. With fixing, Sarah had gone from making questionable investments to taking a full step off the straight narrow path.

And she knew it. Most of them are shady. That's who needs a fixer typically. Otherwise, you can just use a regular lawyer. They knew they were playing with legal lines, right? They knew what they're doing is wrong. And I would go, I would be by their side to make sure they didn't get caught And we could mitigate all potential liability

The money was good, but it wasn't exactly glamorous work. I had to make the party go But again, I made everybody sign in the A's and I was actually at the strip clubs I had to sit in the which is horrible I had to sit in the strip club in their little whatever, private room to make sure that no one was going to pull anything because I'm a witness, right? So, oh yeah, I had to watch it all. Sometimes, she said, she'd pay one of the strippers a bit extra just to give her a shoulder massage

while she waited for her client to be done. At first, I felt overwhelmed with what am I going to do? And then the second feeling that came over me is, wow, I'm one of the boys at the table who they trust me with these things. I'm going to make their life better and I'm going to become this big, like big deal in everyone's, in Newport Beach, who everybody, you know, pays millions of dollars just to go and hire. just to go and hire. But she said these weren't just rich people paying her a lot of money. They were influential too. Whatever Sara did next, the business positioned her well for her next move.

She thought. I just, I wanted to be the it girl, you know. I wanted to be the, I wanted to have a seat at the boys table and without sleeping around, you know. I wanted to have the career moves that made it happen. I wanted my abilities to help me become the best. And that's what they all saw me as. That everyone called me for everything.

Sarah had 10 projects going on now at any one time. She was trying to build her own empire between learning about hard money lending to fixing to any other business opportunity that came her way. She was comfortable in chaotic situations and it proved to be quite useful. She was you could say her own luxury asset. But Sarah was hungry for more. There's a reason money and vice make great bedfellows. make great bedfellows. Something that fascinates me about Sarah, she doesn't just want money and power.

I realize how corny it is to say this, but she also wanted love. She was always one spinning plate too many. And while things were unraveling with Jirard, she met someone. Oh boy, did she meet someone. It was an afternoon in May 2018 when it all started. Sara was invited by Brian Quinn to a business meeting about a potential investment. It was at the Center Club in Costa Mesa, not far from Newport Beach. The place is now closed,

but Yelp remembers it as a kind of spot that had white napkins, wood paneling, and thick cuts of steak. Like, you get a little slab of cake, and Chef decorates the plate with sauces like he's Jackson fucking Pollock. I met him at a table with Brian Quinn, Joseph Medawar, with my ex-husband, Gerard Jamal, and myself and Cameron.

We met to do a real estate investment deal. Let's go through this list because it's like, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, felon, Yeah, but I'm in there too now, shit. Okay, but I'm in there too now, so shit. Okay, I got a little ahead of myself. Not everyone there was a felon. But the table was pretty stacked. Let me break this table down for you. Seat number one was Brian Quinn, Sara's brother from another mother. At this point, he hadn't been indicted for anything yet. In seat number two was Joseph Medawar, who was already notorious in Hollywood.

He defrauded people of millions to fund a fake television show that was supposedly about the Department of Homeland Security. He got actual senators to read his scripts. Then he pocketed the money that was supposed to be used to make the thing. By this lunch, Medawar was a convicted felon and had already served hard time. You're kind of stunned if you're not used to that world.

You hear this, this convict, right? This guy who's been in federal prison and you just think to yourself, well, he's nice. He never hurt me. Then there's Sarah, who, well, for now, let's just say she's no angel. And her business partner and husband, Gerard, was there. So was the new guy. A man by the name of Cameron Pallavy, Prince Cameron Pallavy.

He looks like a male model, thick, dark hair, green eyes, chiseled good looks. Look up the word smoldering and his picture is right there in the dictionary. And did you know he was royalty? Did he talk about being a prince? Oh yeah, Joseph Madawer made him huge, right? This is the prince of Iran, he's part of our group and he's, you know, he invested all this money into our fun. So Madawar was convincing Sarah that this Prince was an investor in his real estate business. At first I was in awe, right? So I'm a lawyer.

I don't know these types of guys and I'm, I'm kind of, I'm in shock. I don't even understand everything they're saying. I'm Googling words as they're talking. I don't know what, you know what EBITDA is at the time. And so yeah, I was just taken aback by the pizzazz of it all. EBITDA, earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation, and amortization. Basically they're talking about how profitable a business could be. We're all sitting around table and we're discussing the details of the real estate

fund and I start asking some questions. Brian asks questions and that's when Joseph Medawar had introduced us to the head of the fund to try and help them and work through their issues. But with Cameron, he was there just eating chips. He kept eating tortilla chips, like one after another and not saying anything and drinking rosé wine. His whole role was to just sit there and be like the Prince of Iran. After the meeting, Sara would go and crunch the numbers. They didn't add up. So Sara called up the Prince, asked him about the deal.

I said, but this guy has been in prison and you know, what's going on? And he told me the truth. He said I didn't invest. He didn't invest? Sara had seen her fair share of scammy business opportunities at this point. What she couldn't quite figure out was this man, Cameron Pahlavi, smoking hot, a prince to the former Shah of Iran. Sarah's dad is from Iran.

To meet a descendant of the Shah is a big, big deal. The Shah was supported by the US but overthrown in 1979 and replaced by the Islamic Republic. Cameron was the last Shah's grand nephew. The Pahlavi family has been living in exile from Iran since Cameron was five years old. So what was this Shah's grand nephew doing at this country club pitch meeting? What he told Sarah was baffling.

He said he was just lending the whole operation an air of credibility. cooperation, and air of credibility. Sarah was still married, but that didn't stop her from thinking about Cameron. Who was this mysterious, tortilla chip-eating prince? As Sarah left her home drawer, she called Cameron crying. And the two ended up getting together at a hotel lobby bar in Beverly Hills. We did a two hour dinner at John George in Beverly Hills. And I felt something. I can't explain it. And to this day, I wish I never did. But I felt the connection of some sort.

And we just we hit it off. He just kissed me good night on the cheek. He paid for the dinner and I went home that night. It Was that the last dinner you ever paid for? Yes. Great question, Michelle. Yes. Yeah. Because I paid for everything else. But Sarah wasn't worried about the tab. Sparks were flying as Jean-George in Beverly Hills. He's actually like a very respectful, very classy person who we just started talking about everything and we clicked. There was a moment of like, wow, this is, he's cute and you know, we're getting along really well. And soon, Sarah, the daughter of an Iranian immigrant, and Cameron, a descendant of the

Shah, were an item? Next time on Lady Mafia. Sarah was dead set on keeping her new man, his good looks and pedigree. She wanted to help him, support him, and prove that she was enough. I always felt like I was never good enough because he's like this prince, right? So he's had every supermodel girlfriend in the world and I'm like, what do you like about me? But that's fine. I always tried to prove I was enough to him. Her desperation would cloud her judgment, and she ended up making a deal for Cameron

that would jeopardize everything. Unlock all episodes of Lady Mafia ad free right now by subscribing to the Binge Podcast channel. Not only will you immediately unlock all episodes of this show, but you'll get binge access to an entire network of other great true crime and investigative podcasts all ad free. Plus on the first of every month, subscribers get a binge drop of a brand new series. That's all episodes all at once. Search for the binge on Apple podcasts and hit subscribe at the top of the page. Not on Apple? Head to GetTheBinge.com to get access wherever you listen.

Lady Mafia is an original production of Sony Music Entertainment. It was hosted and reported by me, Michelle McPhee. Odelia Rubin is our lead producer. Jonathan Hirsch wrote this episode with a little help from me. Catherine St. Louis is our story editor. Shara Morris and Jonathan Hirsch wrote this episode with a little help from me. Katherine St. Louis is our story editor. Shara Morris and Jonathan Hirsch are our executive producers. Sound design and mixing by Scott Somerville. Theme and original music composed by Hansdale Shi. We also use music from Epidemic Sound and Blue Dot Sessions. Our associate producer is Zoe Culkin.

Our fact checker is Fendel Fulton. Our production manager is Tamika Balans-Kolasny. Special thanks to Steve Ackerman, Emily Rosick, Jamie Myers, and Allie Kilts. There are pivotal moments in life where a chance meeting alters who you are and what you believe. I'm Pam Goldstein. My moment was when as a nurse I met Holocaust survivors. Their harrowing experiences with the Nazis permanently altered my worldview.

They taught me how forgiveness and strength of character can unite souls and help them overcome evil. I invite you to read my memoir, Still the Soul Survives, available on Amazon or my website, PamelaGoldstein.com.