Wolf and Owl - S4 Ep 47: The Big Questions & See Through Blinds

Episode Date: November 27, 2025

We’re talking… Tom’s new laptop, clean toilets and dirty tongues, big questions about the natural world, some philosophy on perception, reading books, saying hello to Bill Nighy, a sad encounter on a train, see through hotel blinds and a peeping Tom, being a vegan in prison, appropriate breakfast footwear, showing socks off and skinny jeans fashion. For questions or comments, please email us at [e-mail] - we’d love to hear from you. Instagram - @wolfowlpod TikTok - @wolfowlpodcast YouTube - www.youtube.com/WolfandOwlPodcast Merch & Mailing List - https://wolfandowlpod.com A Mighty Ranga Production For sales and sponsorship enquiries: [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Yo, yeah, what do you want, beak or jaws, feathers or fur, sharp teeth or feet with claws, whatever's preferred, they'll grant you all last request to steady your nerves, then podcast the body parts get severed and serped. Bring your weak shit, wear the wall for now, that ain't just a mistake, that's an awful howler. Both of them are known to pull up at your shows, have the crowd witnessing a murder like they rolled in with a gang of crows. Fuck their censorship, let them see the whole thing. They stay dressed to kill Never sheep's clothing Dark enough to turn the sun to the moon You'll see nothing

All your ears are huff a puff and a Expect killings Red spilling and flesh ripping Impressive in it The death bringing its head spinning Just kidding Every word in his song's about two grown men Dressed up as a bird and a dog

And welcome to the Wolf and Al Hello everybody Hope you well, hope you're really good I'm just filling While Tom Davis still sort of sets up his recording end of things well it's a new laptop I'm on a new laptop

yeah yeah principally this is this is a different journey now for us yeah this is I've had my last laptop just died it was fucking sad man it was so so sad yeah

some memories with that guy yeah yeah what are you going to do with it I don't know I sort of suppose you you can actually give it a way to sort of like you can get it

sort of fixed and give it to sort of like some sort of charity right yeah I would get it cleansed, you know, I'd do a deep clean on it, because how long have you had that laptop for? I've had it for, I think, 10 years, 11 years?

Yeah, I would get them to completely strip it right back to the bare bones, and maybe, I would take How often do you actually clean your laptop, like, I would take it to a church or something, see if they can put some holy water on it or something. Sayance on it. Get a priest to say a prayer

for it, just touch it. Like a candle for it. Just to clean it from its sins, because it It might be like, you know, like the Chucky doll. It's got sort of a spirit of a pervert in it. And it might infect anybody else who uses it. You know, God knows. Who knows what's gone on the Google searches on that little piece of it.

If it got sent to some sort of third world country and start an epidemic of a grot. Yeah. Grumble. How often did you actually like clean your laptop, like wipe it clean? Not that often, actually, I would say. And I think, isn't it right that most laptops are... I've probably just made this up.

Most laptops are less clean than a toilet seat, I believe. Do you know that a toilet seat is the broma of everything that's disgusting, isn't it? Yeah, I think so. I mean, I think it's, you know, hygiene is... But actually the seat isn't that dirty. It's such a horrible offence to the toilet seat. Because the seat, like the pan and the, like, the seat, if you're bum and your ass around it has been showered and cleansed,

like your bum is actually cleaner than your hand yeah I don't know if your bum's cleaner than your hand is it why would your butt like the actual

where the seat goes around the rim of your ass around the out of circumference of your butt right that's not I can't be that dirty no I suppose not

but you are washing your hands during the summer sweat but that's no different than your stomach your back your knee yeah I mean this is disgusting

what disgusting this is disgusting but you're disgusting but yeah you're right no it's not though it was just this is like science yeah I'm just saying

if I'm the toilet seat and everyone's going oh you're like a laptop someone discussing a toilet seat you're like fucking give me a break in man I'm drawing the artist

yeah I mean it wasn't I wasn't saying in an accusatory tone I was just using it sort of a measurement I thought it was a light chat about a keyboard and now you're starting

to get kind of angry I'm just saying the actual the back of the pan the toilet cell I'd say actually like sometimes I think your tongue is one

the most disgusting things um what what more disgusting than your ars no your art yeah your your butt your actual bum hole like your fart piece that's dirty right yeah but your tongue has got all kinds of bacteria from the air and stuff going into it yeah your tongue is yeah your mouth is the input right and your butt's the output right so all the grot and dirt is going to look at i'm actually gonna look this up well you're gonna google it yeah The short answer is it depends on how you... Your mouth and tongue contain a higher and more complex concentration of diverse bacteria than your anal region. So there you go, you're not wrong.

So it's... I'm right. Your mouth is home to hundreds of different species of bacteria. Estimates range from 300 to 700 species. The anal region is certainly host to bacteria, but the microbial environment is typically more specialised. Hmm If dirty amines containing a higher number It's basically your tongue has

Your tongue has got more different types Of bacteria than uranus Uranus is a specialist Your tongue is more a jack-of-all-trades Bacteria-wise But this is in some ways Why I wish I'd sort of concentrated more in science Because I feel like I'd be the sort of person

In the lab Who'd be asking questions Rather than just like fucking going along with stuff do you what experiment do you think you'd be what would you be doing that would lead to these kind of questions do you think well no first of all I'd be going like everyone's having to go at toilet seats mate

let's have a look at tongues versus bounce yeah I think there'd probably be a thing where they're going to don't know why Tom's getting so aggressive about this we're just all scientists trying to figure stuff out and he keeps getting on these like staunch defence he climbed up on the lab desk the other day and started threatening people with the bunsen burner if they didn't stop insulting toilet seats

you know like no but I just look at it wrong And sometimes I just think all of us just, like, my daughter's asking questions now. And I think at some point I stopped asking questions. I just went along with it. I became like a fucking just like a lemming. My daughter asks like, why do dogs bark and why the cat's meow? And I'm just like, I don't know.

And she's like, haven't you never asked? And then I'm like, I haven't inquired. I'm not thought about it. I just got, yeah, that's what they're asking meowing to communicate. I mean, that doesn't feel. Yeah, that's what I mean? No, but why a bark and why a meow? Because that's what their vocal chords allow them to do, isn't it?

That's what I'm saying. But that's what they've evolved to do. I mean, I would say, like, if you're going to give an example of a question, don't give a really easy one like that. Okay, here's one for you. Why does rain happen? And ice and snow. I don't even know.

I just like, I don't know. It just happens. Like, the cloud just gets full of water and then it just... These are really simple questions that you're getting stuck on. like the go-to one that people say is why is the sky blue which is yeah exactly yeah yeah but why is there rain I mean that's like yeah but could I just say by the way why the sea's blue because it's a reflection of the sky

right so sorry sorry you sort of stop there like you've got a round of applause on mock the week No, but I know that one if she comes at me with that one. Yeah, okay, yeah. But she's only going to ask you that one. And why isn't the sun yellow because it's on fire. Yeah, okay, good. Right?

I know these things, but I'm like, I've not questioned the universe enough. I've not like fucking stood up and gone, hey, like, I've literally just gone through life. I'm like, it's like I'm in a bubble. Like, and I'm like, oh, the things in my bubble, I know what they are. Do you know that Hops makes beer and I know that you put food like in an oven and it cooks and that's everything, isn't it?

I think pretty much but I haven't like looked out into the wider world and gone to why is this and why's that you know? Why's what's sand not mud? Do you know what I mean? Fucking hell.

Okay. The thing that I would say is Look, I am being facetious. You are asking some, you know, I do think you have a point. At some point we get into a closed mentality where we think we know what we know and we lose our inquisitive mind. And I think you're probably right.

We should probably be more inquisitive. I don't know if sand not being mud is the first, what would be my initial go-to. No, but do you know the thing as well that I realize, aside you, right, and a spatula of others, right? I'm like When and how do you use the word

Spatula would be a good one for you to look up But a lot of my friends are like me You know we'd sit around and like you know You ask me questions about football boxing I'm fucking all over it mate But I'm like Christ I've got to 46 I imagine you and your friends that aren't me Sitting around

It's probably like listening to them sitting around the pool A Love Island Do you mean asking things like I think you're being, I think you're being very kind. Like, do you know, I've had the same conversation with my friends over and over, like, you know, oh, can you name the World Cup team for 966? Or name, oh, God, who's in the world, who's in the team that didn't qualify 994 for England? Why did we qualify?

And we would spend ages dissecting that. And no one's turning around and going, like, I don't know, like, you know, even like the Earth being flat or sort of trying to sort of break down sort of like, how do we even get here? And what happened to the Vikings? Yeah, I mean, it's a weird sequence of questions, I'd say. But I think it had to be even getting here. I was reading a book yesterday, actually. This is, do you know what?

That is the first time I had a conversation with anyone. I was reading a book yesterday. But I was reading a book yesterday. This is fucking mad, right? In the book, it said, first of all, that we, that, I mean this is quite slightly depressing, but it said that we're all going to die and everyone we know is going to die

and the only way that you carry on with your life is by not engaging with that and what you do is you pretend to give your life purpose by doing bits and pieces or whatever and actually none of this matters so it's quite a depressing start to the books I know, I know, I know, I know

but that is the thing if you peel an onion it gets more fucking more sour right? The sweetness is on top yeah, yeah, I guess so Yeah, if you want to say it in a sort of not profound way. But the other thing is, is apparently we're not experiencing the universe. You know, everything we're experiencing is what I'll, you know, like you hear and see things, but you're not actually hearing and seeing them. It's your brain is in like a...

What do you mean? As in like everything you're experiencing is what your body, what your senses are kind of putting together. So we're conforming to, we're conforming to what they want us to be? No, no, no. know, you've just completely misconstrued what I'm saying. What I'm saying is what we're experiencing is not reality. It's a generate, it's a, we've generated it. Your eyes go, okay, this is what this looks like.

And so that's what you're getting. Your ears go, this is what it looks like. And you're completely dependent on the quality of what's coming in in terms of how you form the universe. You know, like sometimes you don't see stuff. Like, you know, like say, for example, one of the examples it gave in the book is like, if you're walking along and it's quite dark. Yeah.

When you see a man stooped over, right? And then you walk closer to that man, and it ends up, it's like a tree stump or something. And he goes, fucking hell, I thought I saw a man. You did see a man. Your brain has gone, oh, that looks like a man, so I'm going to fill it in as a man. And then when you get closer,

because I know it's a tree stump. So you did actually see that thing. So a lot of what you're seeing is like your brain is, your brain is filling in the edges until you get closer and see what it actually is or until you look around. I mean, I'm overly summarizing it probably in an accurate way because I'm thick.

But, you know, that's kind of the just... So they're saying, if you see a tree stump that you think's a man, it was a man until you got close and it turned into a tree stump. It wasn't actually a man, no. But your brain is gone, that's probably a man. And so that's what you're seeing, until you get closer and realize it isn't. And when you're walking up to it, then you're like, it's fight or flight because you think, why's a man stooping over?

Or, you know, it could be looking for trouble. He could be like, or is it like, oh, shit, is that guy injured himself? So then you're like, sort of, you've got an error of... so you're heightened your emotion and then you get there, go, oh, it's just a tree stump, this is all for nothing. No, no, that's not what I'm saying at all. I'm just saying you're really extrapolating this to a point. I'm not talking about it. I'm just saying that your, your, your, your brain is this game, it's probably a, it's like filling it in for you. What it, what it thinks is the most likely thing that is. And then you go, oh, no, it's not. man.

Yeah. Does that make sense? Yeah, kind of, yeah. Welcome to two fucking idiots

try to get deep. No, no, but it feels like, I know that there's some sort of intelligence to that but if I was to

sort of put that, if I was to tell you like, oh yeah, it's because someone clever's told you that. If I went to you, oh yeah,

by the way, you know, you saw that tree stump and you thought it was a man. Well, it was a man until you actually realized it was a tree stump

and then that's your brain filling it in. go, oh, fuck off, you stupid idiot. Because someone clever's told you that, like, you're buying the, you're buying the canteen food even though you want a restaurant meal. You know what I mean?

How does that analogy work? What do you mean? I was expected when you said something a lot more like deep and inside. Right, right, right. When you start showing off about the fact that you were reading a book, right? Yeah.

It's like I expected it to be. like oh fuck wow wow this is what fucking hell like that's what you're getting for like by the way where were you reading the book because you're so busy at the moment i was on the way home from a thing last night and i was reading the book you know on the train oh my god i actually respect you now so much what you mean i always look at people written like i'm always on my phone i look up someone on a you know reading a book on a train do you know bill nigh he reads a book as he walks around london he reads it as he's walking yeah that's quite a nor do you ever see bill night in the street no have you seen him in the street no i've seen it twice

And he's so focused on the book, he's completely, if you shout his name, he doesn't even look up. Why are you shouting his name? Why are you shouting at Bill Nye? What? No, I went, all right, Bill, like that, as I walk past. I don't think you should have done that. Because we're in the same profession, mate. It doesn't matter.

Say what? So what? Colleagues. So what? Well, also, it's Bill Nye, by the way. He's a fucking prince. Can I say the coolest guy I've ever seen in the flesh? He is, like, so fucking sweet.

I reckon, I'm going to say rough estimate at June, since we started doing this podcast, you've said that about 15 people. That's rough estimate. He, mate, do you know he's got it in his contract, by the way, in his film roles now, apparently he has to wear really cool suits? That doesn't surprise me.

What's that new thing he's in? He's got an amazing office. Do you know what I'm talking about? Yeah, I don't know. I've not seen him. But he's just so, like, he's so debonair. And yet he just walks, he's just engrossed in this book. and then like the thought of now if I got on a train

and saw you sort of like sitting there's reading your book I'll be like I don't know there's something about maybe I'll just get a book to go around with me because I think when you see

someone with a book you go in some gravitas that they carry do you know what I mean and by the way I'm not talking before you jump in like I'm going to sit there reading the fucking

the gruffalo on the book as a book I'm like I mean you've even fucked up the insult that's what we're dealing with it so I don't You think you, I just think, oh, yeah. Well, I think it depends what it is.

I'm reading a book on a Kindle, you know, because I don't want to carry loads of books around me. But I think, I don't think that looks that intellectual. I think, you know when you see somebody who's reading like... If you're on a Kindle, it's different. Yeah, I think, but you know when you see somebody reading like, it's like a well-thumbed, looks like a really old edition of a book, and it's like the cover hasn't really got a big picture on it and all that.

That, to me, is like... Yeah. That to me is that, that is intimidating. It's intimidating. It's intimidating, but also, you know, like, when they have to do that thing when they lick their thumb and then they turn the page. Yeah.

And there's a real craft to that. You're going to lend that book that book to somebody discussed in bars so it's going to be covered in all your spittal. I had a really quite an upsetting experience on the train

the other night. I was, um... Oh, no. Well, um, I was on the train, and I don't know how much detail to go into, but basically it was quite clear that there's a sort of guy opposite me must have been like 19, 20 years old, and he looked like, he just looked like a normal, like kid or whatever, I guess,

like young guy, but he was just clearly really fucking upset, like really upset, like something had happened. And it was horrible. And so I was sat opposite him, and, um, I don't know how to explain it, but you know when you read somebody's body language, and I could tell that he's really upset, but also wanted to be left alone. Like, you know, he was keeping himself to himself. It wasn't, there's nothing demonstrative about what he was doing.

It's quite clear he was trying to hide the fact he's really upset, but I could tell that he was. Yeah. And so I was sort of having an internal debate about what to do, and I was thinking, what would I want to do? What would I want somebody sat opposite me to do if I was in this situation? And I sort of think, well, maybe probably left alone. And then I thought, but I don't want him to, you know, he might, fucking, you know, who knows what the situation.

It might be that he just needs a bit of money to get home or whatever, in which case I can help him. You know, I, you know, I was sort of thinking what to do. So then, oh, God, it's so horrible, man. I tapped him because he had headphones on. I tapped him and I said, mate, are you okay? And, oh, God, he like, I don't know how to expect. Do you know when something just stays with you, he, his face. he sort of went into a smile

because he's trying to reassure me and he said, I'm fine, I'm fine, thank you. And then I went, okay, as long as you're sure and he's like, yeah. And that, my brain recorded, as it does everything, but it recorded, you know, like, it recorded that particular image

of him, like, looking clearly upset, but smiling for my benefit to, you know, to sort of say, I'm all right. Yeah, yeah. And it fucking stayed with me for days afterwards, man. like I just I felt so sad that he was so sad I felt you know like and by the way this sounds a bit like I'm making it about myself

but I just was really it fucking sometimes you know when you see somebody upset it just like I don't know man I couldn't shake it I was just like this poor you know in my head I'm like thinking what is it that led him to be so upset in a public space like that I mean then there's part of you thinking I'm you know you wish you wish you wish you

you could have helped him some you know but obviously like the way he communicated was like clearly like thanks for checking but i don't want to be spoken to do you know i mean so it's horrible it's a horrible it's a horrible thing it's horrible thing i felt sorry for him it's an awful feeling that when you feel like helpless yeah yeah and you sort of think i i wish i could help this guy out and but you know who knows who knows he might have just been he might just been really gutted about the fucking they might be listened to the dave album which made me really sad on listen to it. So, you know, who knows?

Yeah. Or he could have been a Tottenham fan. Yeah, yeah. I mean, it was before the game, so it would have been weird. I mean, if he was really upset about what might follow, then yeah, sure. You've just been thinking about all the problems that Tottenham had over the last 20 years. Yeah, yeah, just thinking,

why is Thomas Frank? Why is Thomas Frank? Gaslit us with that PSG performance when he's obviously going to go and play incredibly negatively and not in the Tottenham way. Yeah, yeah, I get it. That could have been what he was upset about. Also, some people just have, like, a sad face.

Yeah, but this wasn't that. I mean, I've got a sad face. Yeah. You've got a sort of like, sort of like, like you smell a sort of bit of dog shit sort of face. Yeah, yeah. I think Lisa and I both share that. So I imagine that when we're at a thing

where people don't really know us, they just want to think, what the fuck is up with that couple? they look so miserable. I constantly just carry a very goofy look that I'm happy with how the world's worked out. Yeah, you've got a great face, I think. No, not if I'm sad.

I've had a week of sadness, like where I felt very low. And you'd never understand. You'd never get, oh, just one thing and another, we've discussed quite a lot of it. I'm not going to go into it now. No, okay, sure. I sort of am trying to pick up my spirits. But, like, yeah, I've felt a week of feeling like,

but then I think people would, Yeah, wouldn't necessarily clock that. It's sort of a strange. By the way, I'm in a hotel at the moment. That's why you're talking with a kind of weird volume, isn't it? You're nervous that you're going to be. Yeah, like, yeah, I don't want to be too loud because they've moved my room. They've moved your room?

Yeah, well, I turned up at this hotel and checked into the room. And it was quite late when I checked in. So I sort of drew the blinds. Woke up in the morning and sort of got out of bed. went to the toilet and the toilet's here and the door for the toilet's there so the sort of toilet looks out of the door and I'm sort of sitting on the toilet

and I look up and I look through the blinds I'm like oh my god the blinds are completely see through right they're like made out of tissue paper I can see out of the block I can see quite clearly and then a gardener walk past while you're on the toilet yeah so I'm looking out of the window out of the blinds

at this gardener and I could make out every sort of like every line and crease of his sort of like face sort of like you know I could read the badge on his on his on his t-shirt right and I'm like oh my god but then I sort of thought maybe and he looks into the window at me and sort of like stare back at him we're sort of staring at each other and I'm like maybe how long did this moment last for I don't know it felt like 25 seconds but it could have been 25 seconds he stared at you on the shitter no no but this is I might I'm staying back at him but I'm like maybe he's just looking at looking at the window because maybe these...

You couldn't figure out if he could see you or not. Yeah, maybe they're like two-way. Yeah. Like one way, so I can see out, but he can't see him in time thing. So I finish going to the bathroom and sort of, I'm a bit paranoid. So I go outside to look back through the window and I could see all my room. I could see everything, right? Through the two windows, I could see. So not only has he been looking into the room, but also like this is like,

sort of 7.30 in the morning and like everyone who's like I sleep with a lamp on because I can't sleep in the dark right? Sure. So everyone who's walked past my window that morning and that night have been able to look into the room and see me sleeping. You know like David Blaine or a sort of

fucking like an animal at the zoo that people have just gone oh good look at him just laying there sleep. Well I mean first of all I think when you're doing one of your little research things that you're moving into I think one of them should be what is a toilet door for and then the other one is

do they really No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. What do you mean, no, no, no, no, no? Can I just say, I think I always crap with the door open. Yeah. Because I don't want to look at a door, I want to look out in the room, and it feels very confined.

I like to look out, make the toilet feel... No, that's where we differ. I see at home, I'm closed doors, I don't want. I like to really be closed off, you know, in the toilet. So I guess we've got different tastes. Really? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, I like it to be sort of like a, I'd love to get into like a, you know, like a chamber if that was possibly, like a tiny, like little.

You'd be terrible in prison, man. You'd be awful in prison because you've got to share a toilet with. It's one of the main reasons I don't commit any crimes is to avoid exactly that situation. But, um, but you've got a shit in front of your cell, mate. No, I know. I get that. That's why I don't want to. It's one of the many reasons why I don't want to go to prison.

If you want some of the others, getting shanked. getting a kettle full of boiling water with sugar in it poured out of my face. Unless you go in there for a really dodgy thing, I don't think any of those things are going to happen to you. I think the worst situation for you will be shit in front of

and also I think the food will be a problem for you. Yeah, what are the vegan options like in a prison? Oh, God. I love the idea of you turn up in prison going, can I have a private bathroom and what's a vegan menu looking like Officer Jackson?

Listen, I know you've got vegan items, but you still need a protein element. Sorry. Have you got any legumes or beans or chickpeas? Listen, I know you said the meringue isn't vegan, but are you aware that you can actually whip up something with aqua father from the chip-pid tin? What prison are you going to at this serving marangs? Well, they did pavlova in the prison in Paddington, too, didn't they? Pavlov, it was kind of...

I mean, listen, like, prisons have got... I love the idea of Lisa turning up to visit you and go, oh, how are you getting on, baby, you're okay, yeah? Is it all right? And you're like, Oh, is it all right? What a meringue I've been vegan?

I remember like... I had a dessert in a week. You know, my dad was at a Ford Open prison. Yeah, yeah. So that was like the most relaxed prison you can get. And I think I've talked about this. A couple of weekends, he came home with us. Really?

Yeah. Yeah. Ford is well known for that. Yeah. Like, I'm sorry, friends who went to Ford. Yeah,

so he would like come home with us for the day. And as a kid, and we're going, Dad, you're out. What the fuck's going on now? I'm like,

we're out, man. What? What's going to do you just dropping back? Yeah, then you've got dropping back at Preston. It's fucking wild.

What's the meringue situation like, Dad? So, go back to a toilet situation. I then go to reception. I'm like... There were no curtains in your room? No, no.

Just a blind? Just these oatmeal-like blinds that were sort of like see-through. I then go to see the receptionist and I'm like, hey, I'm a little bit concerned about the fact that people can see into my room and she went, oh, are you staying in blah blah room? And I went, yeah, we've had problems with that before. I said, then put some curtains in there. It's a really nice room, but people can see into my room.

Like, I don't need people to... Did he say it like that with that tone? No, no, no, no, of course. No, no, no. I didn't even say about the curtains. I said, but I said, like, we need to do something about it. It's a lovely room, but I'm a bit, like, worried that people can see in. Like, I was just on the toilet and the gardener looked in.

I was hoping that she didn't go, oh, we've not got a gardener now. I've got to start worrying about ghosts, but she said it was a gardener. Or it could just be a person that you thought was a gardener. I mean, the fact that ghosts... He was definitely a gardener. He was definitely. a gardener. He could be pretending to be a gardener so

that could, you know, that could be a regular thing that he was doing. It's like, oh my God, I don't even think of that. I mean, it's more likely than a ghost, isn't it? The sort of guy that like enjoy it. A fetishist. He's like got a fetish for a guy. Well, I'm just saying it's as. I will say this. I'll say that if anything is going to put his fetish

off at seeing me on the toilet at fucking no, but I imagine you're like sort of the hardcore version of that. Like you're the, you know, if you're into that sort of thing, you're like, you're the crem de la crap, you know, No, no, no, no, no. I think he's looking for something else.

Like, he's looking for, yeah, yeah. I think we both know what he's after. Well, we've just made this whole scenario up, so how do we know anything? What the fuck are you talking about? I'm just saying that, man, I could see by his face, I knew what he was looking for. Well, you thought he was a ghost two minutes ago,

and now suddenly you definitely know what he's looking for. No, but I could say pervert-wise, I'm a good judge of pervert. Right, and I'm like, I know what his kick was. Yeah, I can tell you that. People know their own, don't know. so what did you think is kink wilson it wasn't me he didn't look he didn't look best pleased that i was what he like i mean i've got to be honest with tom this is exactly what the book i was reading was

talking about is this sort of embellishment and you know the addition of you didn't even know when you when you started this story you you actually said we looked at each other for three seconds i wasn't i wasn't sure if you was able to see it since then we've had you assume that it might be a ghost and now you're definitely sure that it was a pervert that you could tell what he was looking for from the way that he looked at you through the window so the whole, I'm just saying, you're fucking one of the most

unreliable, by the way, God forbid, we're talking about me going to prison, that I'm involved in a court case where you've got to be the fucking one of the witnesses in my defence. Story changing six or seven times during the course of a five minute interrogation. I'll stick by my story, but I'm just saying, right,

if he's going to get... We don't know what your story is currently. Right. I'm on the toilet. He's looking through the window. I can see him. I wasn't sure if he could see me. He knows what he can see, right? So in what you're talking about with your book, right, that you're so fucking wanking over, right? You're notking over the book. I literally just... No, right. So look, I've given you a case in which your book is speaking true, right? This is... So you as a lawyer of picking apart this story, I'm sitting there, mate. I'm almost like a cigarette going, go on, fucking smart ass. to fucking rest this case, right?

I'm looking out at him, right? In my head, I'm like, I'm not sure if he can see me. So I'm not making any kind of angle that this guy's a perver, although I take in his face. I'm looking at him, he's looking at me. I then go around and find out he is looking at me. So then I'm like, this guy's the gardener because he's got a leaf blower, right?

That's his job, right? He knows that these blinds are seethrough. So every morning when he turns up, he's like, oh, I wonder who's in the birch room. I wonder who's in there. so he turns up and he's going to have his little morning peak

all of a sudden the fucking the man has become a stump right I know that this guy's now I think there's any stuff why isn't there's a stump but I'll just say right

that I know now where he's at he was like there might be asleep that you know probably it's an unusual delicacy for him seeing someone with a toilet door open taking a dump

but that is what he's got in his you know to take away in his pocket that morning do I mean usually probably someone having a lay in maybe a couple that's what he likes you know what I mean

you know the game changes wrong sometimes you're playing Monopoly sometimes you're playing chess just make sure the pieces are on the board bro and you've done what are your next movie is all right alright fuck here now don't start talking like you've done a mic drop chat

what you said I mean there's so many fucking flaws in what you just said it's unbelievable anyway so this ghost perverts turn up So they moved, they moved your room? So I've moved my room now.

Yeah, so what's your room like now? And now I've got full curtains, beautiful curtains, really thick curtains. I'm looking at the front of the hotel. It feels mad that they've had this situation come up before and they haven't done anything about it. It's weird strategy. Yeah, but then maybe some people like go in and go, oh, I really like that eyes could be looked upon like a fish and a bottle.

You know what I mean? It's like, no, busy people. Well, I'm saying, I'm basing it on what the facts are, which is the women said that they'd have problems with that room before, and that's what I'm basing. And you're basing on some speculation. Could I also ask you a question? Because you're quite a sort of classy chat.

Where do you stand or wear shoes down for breakfast at a hotel? Well, where do I say I'm wearing shoes? I can't imagine not wearing shoes to breakfast, to be honest with you. In a hotel? Well, this is where, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So what's your take on it?

I've wear my, I just go in socks. Fucking hell. It's breakfast. I don't want to put shoes on before breakfast. I like to go down with my socks. How difficult is it to put some shoes on? No, I'm just saying, but it feels like I don't like it's sitting in shoes having breakfast. I quite like the feeling of being in socks. Like, this is a part of, like, I'm staying here, then, you know, I feel like putting shoes on just feels too much.

If I could, I'd go down in my pajamas, but I know that's frowned upon. I think if everybody was wearing socks at breakfast, it would make me have second thoughts about having breakfast, I think. What? You don't got to eat off their feet. I know, but it's just like... Shoes are dirtier. Yeah, but yeah, I agree. I agree. But I just... First of all, I don't...

Well, actually, you can tell I'm struggling here because now that you've examined it a little bit, I can't give you logical reasons to why I think it's a problem. By the way, you wearing socks, I sort of was being a bit facetious. If you do what you want to do, is up to you. But I'm just saying personally, I wouldn't go down in socks. What I would consider doing, which I have done, is often take slippers to a hotel and go down in my slip slips.

Yeah, but this is what I'm now thinking, maybe I start getting some hotel slippers. And then I get like a nice pair of pyjamas and a little dressing gown that I wear. I don't think pyjamas and a dressing gown is a way to go. If you've got some like... But it's not much different than a tracksoo. Yeah, but just have some lounge wear or something. I mean, I think...

Are you in the... What is loungewear? Isn't loungewear just a tractor you wear? around the house, stroke pyjamas. It's like... T-shirt and joggers. That's what I consider this. Yeah, yeah, but that's T-Sat and joggers.

Like, nice loungeware is literally the cousin of both tracksuits. It's like the second cousin of a track suit and a... Yeah, fine, but that's different to pajamas. Pajamas, when you say pajamas, I'm imagining you coming down like the little kid in the snowman, do I mean? Like stripy pajamas and a dressing... Yeah, but what's... Yeah, what's wrong with that, though?

Also, by the way, if you've got nice pajamas and no one can see them, apart for the bloke who's looking for the window of the... I have pyjamas, but I don't sleep in them, I just put them on when I wake up. Yeah, that's cute. Just for Catherine's benefit, yeah? Yeah. Well, Catherine and Grace, I just like to look nice when I'm right in that house. I kind of think sometimes I like the idea of, well, this has occurred to me now, but it is something I definitely do,

which is like trying to give your kids a nice visage for when they like get older and they're thinking about their memories of their childhood. You know, there's certain snapshots you have of what you did when you were younger. And I think, you know, the idea of sort of sitting around the breakfast table and your dad's in his nice pajamas and stuff like that. That's really nice thing for Grace to sort of look back on when she gets older. Yeah. One of a nice little recollections rather than he's just got a dressing gown on and nothing underneath

when she's trying to enjoy her cocoa pots with this fucking old boy hanging out. So I think it's nice. I think loungeware and slippers to breakfast in a hotel is more than acceptable Yeah You know But I think socks is like

I don't know man Not for me But equally If you think Sometimes I always feel sorry for socks Because they're like No you can have nice socks And you know

Sometimes people will never notice them Yeah I don't feel sorry for them But yeah I understand what you're saying Like sometimes when you buy some really nice socks Yeah You know Then you're sort of thinking, well, this is only, they're only really going to get to show themselves off and I'm sat down.

Or like if you're, yeah, if you're like a sort of like a swara, you know, everyone's standing chat and you're like, oh, bloody, I wish my fucking socks had a chance to sing. Yeah, yeah. Or, you know, you could just sort of quickly, like, you know, you could put your hands in your pockets and sort of as you're talking, just give them a little lift. Give them a little hike and then nod down, but then they look a bit perverse. Yeah. I always think that socks out of like, you know, the films, have you seen the film sing? Yeah, I have many times. You know, the elephant girl who's got a beautiful voice,

but no one believes in it. That's basically socks, isn't it? That was a long old walk. It's wear a pair of socks a length of that walk. It's, it's the Nissan Black Friday event where you can, wait, wait, wait, isn't like a month long now? Nissan Black Friday month? Does that work? Nissan Black Frye Month event.

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Conditions apply. I do like a bit. That's why I try to wear a little, like, I do a little fold-up on it. our trouser. Yeah, that's a good idea. I mean, sometimes my trousers are of a length that the socks are constantly on display, you know, a little, uh, what they're called, what they called sometimes. It's only when you get excited, though, right? What's it called? You know, when they're like, some of my trousers are like slightly

higher? What's the, what are they called? I can't remember there's a specific ankle swingers. Yeah, but it's not ankle swingers. It's like, there's like a, oh, I can't remember. flood something all my life at school yeah yeah all my life at school I had ankle swingers

because my mom and dad couldn't keep up with the gross butt so mom was like you know you just had to wear a chance like it's I remember sort of like

walking to school and people were going oh oh what you're spending rain mate yeah and that sort of like now they're fashion

like I look at and think I'd have been so fucking drippy as a kid like back then it was it wasn't a look but yeah

well I mean you've sort of stumbled onto something that I find absolutely ridiculous which is you know

us being told every year that a certain fit is fashionable is one of the fucking greatest scams of our world isn't it? This idea

you've got perfectly good clothes you know you've got perfectly good trousers they're fine they're usable they've got many years of wear left in them but you're now

there's some diktat from the fashion industry that says you can't wear that fit a trouser this year because it immediately makes you look out of date

is a fucking joke can I just say by the way I think we're in a situation now where I think that we're past that now, me and you as age-wise. Oh, we are. I would go as far as to say that if we were to suddenly follow a trend, it would look tragic. You and I have an age now where you just go, you wear what you wear. But what I'm saying is this whole thing of like, you know, when you read an article, it goes, this summer's all about these jeans, and you go, fuck off.

Like. You can I have to say, because skinny jeans will come back. And now I'm like, I will not, I know that I won't have to conform. You didn't have to conform the first time There's a little revelation for you So a little tip you can give to grace You don't have to conform to any of this No wait that's one of the things I will part sound

Because I will just show her pictures of me In spray on trousers that I used to wear Like there was no I was almost the worst look at that point in my life For those sorts of trousers But I carried on regardless Yeah And but I got addicted to skinny jeans

that it was almost like they couldn't be skinny enough. I was wearing Juggins for a while. Christ. People with, by the way, I'm reacting like I didn't fall of this. I did wear skinny jeans as well. Not super skinny like that. Not where I felt restricted, but, you know, skinny enough. And people that are built like yourself and me,

and we should not be wearing skinny jeans. We just shouldn't. No. No, but I also think they're just, they don't look good on anyone, really. No, they do. Women, but not men. Some blokes, they do.

Yeah, yeah, I guess. You have to have a very specific physique for that to suit you. And people like us, who essentially built like toffee apples. Yeah. You shouldn't, you shouldn't be doing anything to emphasize a difference between your legs and your body, really.

If anything, you should be going to other way. No, no. I think you can't, I think you can't go wrong with a pair of five-o-o-ones. Yeah. I think it's probably right. You know, I mean, I like nudie jeans. They do that thing where you can send them back or whatever and get them redone or whatever.

It's like environmentally sound of thing. I've never had a pair of nudie jeans. I don't know what I'm talking about this. I've never had nudie jeans. They're good. They're good. I don't think of... I wore jeans for the first time in five months, maybe,

when I was in America on tour. And when you've not worn jeans for a while, the idea of wearing jeans feels so ridiculous. I mean, they're not comfortable, are they? If they get any moisture on them, that takes three years to get out. I mean, they're not a great garment, are they? I do think they

look so nice with some outfits. Sometimes I wear a pair of jeans and I feel like, there's nothing better than pulling a pair of jeans and feel like an elegant cowboy, I think. No, fair enough. By the way, are they mad your electrolytes? Are they mad your electrolytes you're drinking? How do you know

I'm drinking electrolytes? I can see I'm an electrolyte scientist. Yeah, they are Andrew. How are they nice? What flavour? This is watermelon. I think you should do a little advert for me, like a proper little, like a nice little advert for us. Yeah, I know you think that. Like it'll be a nice. Yeah, I know you think that. Obviously you think that. What's that? Is that a quaint that, is that an unusual hot tape from you that you think I should do a free advert for your company? Oh, that's interesting.

You are a quirky type, aren't you? Right. Should we, what should we do? Should we do one email? Just to, one sweet email, baby. One email and then close up. My internet is making this almost untenable. Yeah, go for it, baby. Okay. This is from Anonymous. Hi, you lovely pair. I've been listening to it for years and I really enjoy your podcast. It makes my commutes a whole lot better. I'd really appreciate your perspective on something. I recently found out that my boyfriend occasionally messages someone from his who was intimate with. He didn't tell me this, but I saw a notification on his phone. I haven't seen the messages, so I don't know what they say. When I asked him about it, he said he just checks in on her and her children.

He sometimes chats to the next from school. He's now 29. He also, sorry, he also sometimes chats for the next from school. He's now 29. I'm not sure how to feel about this. Shall I be worried, or is this something I should let go? Any advice would mean a lot. Part of me wants to go through his phone, but I think ignorance is bliss.

What's your opinion? And that is from anonymous. Tom? that's quite a tricky one that is a tricky one because I do think that I think if he's quite open about the fact he's doing that sort of stuff

I think the fact is that everyone has a past and I think if I think the fact is if he's being open with you that he's messaging them and he's not acting in a suspicious and what feels can I have in way he's just like I'm just checking in on someone from your past

I think sometimes And I might be wrong here, but sometimes too much is thrown on the fact it's, you know, mad or female in a sense. Do you know what I mean? In the fact that if that was a bloke from school that he was friends with, it wouldn't really matter. But just because it's a woman from his past, it feels like, you know, that is, that's a deeper thing. And I think, like, you know, you have friends and if it is simply just a friend from the past or, yeah, or an ex that, you know, he's moved on from. in that sense, but they still sort of have some sort of friendship. I don't think

that's harmful. I think if it feels like it's deceitful and it feels like he's doing it without you your knowledge or he's been protected. I think when it comes to looking through phones as well, I think that's such a dangerous thing. I think it's such a dangerous thing because I think

ultimately, if you ask him to look through his phone, you're essentially going, I don't trust what you're doing. There's not trust there. And I think trust is kind of paramount. relationship and I think if you don't find something or you if you find something firstly and it's something you don't want to see then yeah it's kind of it's a long way back for both of you but if you then go through his phone and you haven't trusted

in the fact that he said I'm not doing anything and this is quite it's a platonic and it's a very sort of like it's not a um you know it's not a sort of sexual relationship it's nothing sort of it's just literally just checking in on someone and you find it just to be that then I think he's then going to, he'll be like, well, yeah, you haven't trusted in what I've said, and I was quite open with you about doing the thing I'm doing. It's a very difficult position because I also understand you need peace of mind. It's a very, yeah, and I think, you're, having been sort of cheated upon, cheated on, a cut of times, and knowing that feeling, like, it kind of is a feeling that I think you kind of know that that's happening. But also then,

I've also been in situations where just having been through that, my own paranoia and my own, you know, sort of anxiety and sort of stuff of the past kicks in a little bit. And you start like, you start catastrophizing and start thinking, oh, this feels the same. So I think if he's been open and quite honest and said that this is all it is, you kind of have to trust in that. yeah i just think you're opening potentially a can of words that you don't need to open if if you go through his phone but um yeah um i hope this has helped i feel like it sort of i'm not sure if it has but anyhow on two you romanski

uh yeah look i think uh don't go through his phone would be my uh advice um i think that i'm not saying that you shouldn't feel the urge to go through his phone but I don't think any good can come from that. I think that, you know, if you do go onto his phone and then you find something, it's not, it's an invasion of privacy, really. And then if you go onto his phone and there's nothing wrong,

then you've done something wrong there and you don't want to have that feeling. And equally, if you find it, if you go through his phone and you find something, it's not a pure way of finding this thing out. look the truth is you know better than we do why do you feel like you want to go through his phone why is it such a big deal that he's getting in touch with his ex

is that because there's an inherent suspicion you've got in yourself because of his other behaviour is he secretive around his phone do you know in your heart of hearts that there's something going on there or there might be something going on you know this and you've got a feeling and whatever that feeling is

you need to speak to him about it and I think you could say to him what you said to us which is I've had the urge to go through your phone because I feel uncomfortable about it and have a chat about it and get it out into the open. The best way for these things is to get out in the open.

The idea of you having this thing and he might be, you know, you having this secret set of anxieties and stuff like that that you haven't talked to him about. I think you just get that out in the open. Put it in the light

and say to him, look, this is a situation. And he might choose to show you the messages. Or he might not. And if he doesn't, then it's up to, you know, I'm not saying that he has to show you the messages, but we're all entitled to privacy in our own relationships.

But I guess what I'm saying is if you open it up and have the chat with him, you will very quickly get an idea from his reaction and how he's talking as to what's really going on, is my feeling on it. But good luck with it. I hope it all goes okay. Tom, could you please do us the honour of taking us out of this episode of The Wolf and Al, my gee? my guy

I want to talk to you about the humble leaf born raised eager doing its best springtime never ever asking for applause summer comes and it thrives sun shining at it

like a solar panel almost for a tree every now and again a squirrel just using it simply as a napkin and then autumn arrives and it's colour shifts time comes and it just down falling towards the floor. Dignity gone, maybe, almost just collapsing from the floor. See, at the end of life, maybe. Settles at the ground amongst his brethren, quiet, peaceful.

But then comes a leaf blower, being blown by a sweet soul, maybe, maybe a pervert who likes looking in at the window in a hotel, that people taking poos and sleeping. The leaf is flung up skyward, dent tumbling into the unknown. Listen closely. Is it afraid? I think not, my friend. Is this the end of its journey? Maybe, maybe not. Maybe it should be used in potpourri or for another fragrance. It's a reminder to us all that sometimes things feel like the end. But it isn't. It's just another gust of wind blowing

us upward. Oh, that's the end. Okay, great. It's really good. Yeah, yeah, good, good. Yeah, I'm trying to be more concise with these and write them, but I'm not sure if it works. No, it's really good.

It's really good. I loved it, the gust stuff. And then you brought you folded in the pervert. And the papery. I've rediscovered the delight that is Jamira Choir recently. Oh, wow. So, J.T., could you play us out with a little bit

of Jamirquite? Love philosophy, please. It would be great. animal pack i apologize for my i'm sure j t will tidy this up a little bit but i apologize for my internet connection that i made at the end of it particularly janky uh but have a great week everybody take care of yourselves laugh laugh laugh and we will see you next time on this little thing that we call the wolf and our podcast boom take care of yourselves thank you uh bye bye solutions ever I had in my mind about you I'm an area seems so true

all the lies you're telling tragically compelling my love and my mother means nothing together so maybe I'm still a love to If you have a problem, opinion, feedback or anything at all, please email us at wolf-alpod at gmail.com. That's wolf-alpod at gmail.com. We'd love to hear from you, mainly because we don't have any content ideas.

Thank you.