Wolf and Owl - S4 Ep 6: Caps, Traps and MAFS

Episode Date: February 5, 2025

We’re talking… small caps, the awkwardness of photos and videos, Rom’s first thirst trap, loving Judy Love, how best to deal with over-eating, inferiority complexes, the downfall of MAFS, infectious enthusiasm, the Boyzone documentary, the Stranger Things stage play and Rom’s excessive jumping at horror film shocks. Plus, we answer an email about how best to prepare for life after your kids have left the nest. For questions or comments, please email us at [e-mail] - we’d love to hear from you. Instagram - @wolfowlpod TikTok - @wolfowlpodcast YouTube - www.youtube.com/WolfandOwlPodcast Merch & Mailing List - https://wolfandowlpod.com A Mighty Ranga Production For sales and sponsorship enquiries: [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Bagel. Bagel. Bagel. Bagel. Bagel. Bagel. Bagel. Bagel. Bagel. They'll grant you all last requests to steady your nerves Then podcast the body parts, get severed and served Bring your weak shit, wear the wolf and owler That ain't just a mistake, that's an awful howler Both of them are known to pull up at your shows

Have the crowd witnessing the murder like they're rolling with a gang of crows Fuck their censorship, let em see the whole thing They stay dressed to kill, never sheep's clothing Dark enough to turn the sun to the moon, you'll see nothing All you hear's a huff, puff and a huff expect killings Red spilling and flesh ripping, impressive in it The death bringing its head spinning, just kidding Every word in this song's about two grown men

Dressed up as a bird and a dog Hello and welcome to the Wolf and Owl Ramesh Ranganathan and Tom Davis inside the place Rongo, tell your friend Do you ever put on of baseball cap and then think is it is this too small for my head? Like do I I think you should think that it looks like it looks like if I took the cap off It would like make a hissing noise like a Budweiser. I Might change the cap, you know what you're gonna change it for the podcast. It's small. Okay

Guess this this far instead Yeah, that's good, how are you I'm good man. Oh man, look at that face. Look at that face I hate the wolf in our videos every time I because I Actually think this is like I don't I do not I'm not saying this to get a flurry of messages of support okay I'm not this is not a cry for help and I'm not saying that in a in an angry way I just mean I don't want people to be concerned but you know when we did the fight we did

the photo shoot for war for now and then obviously like loads of photos got taken of me and you got ones on your own as well right you got ones on your own as well that's just because there was five minutes while you were getting you know like when you were getting you asked for foundation or something didn't you say no my head shows because my head look very they said we've got 20 minutes while Tom sort of gets himself prettied up do you want to just do a couple of photos? You turn up beautiful there's work to be done on this mush. Now I'm gonna... my brain's going mad here I don't know if I've had too much caffeine but first of all... Hey just quickly on that I don't mean to

interrupt but if you haven't too much caffeine you know a good replacement go on. Little scoop of manju on some hot water it is delicious and it replaces caffeine it'll give you the same kick same vibe without palpitations no okay I'm not getting palpitations first of all I just might I'm just a bit you know my brains all over place secondly now the wolf and owl the JT who runs the wolf and owl Instagram account is now sharing mandrill Stories, I don't know what's going on here But um, I have been accused tom and I need to live with you because you're my brother my kin

my kiss My lover my husband. Well, you know my everything Um, i've been accused of posting a thirst trap. Oh mate, I've seen it. I did, by the way, I thought it was a fucking amazing picture. See, this is what I, this is still, and I know we've done this so many times, I don't see that as a thirst trap.

I looked at that picture and I was like, that's a fucking great picture. Well, okay, let's dive into it, because basically there's a guy from Cobb's Comedy Club in San Francisco who was just... Well, like genuinely, like you have... Like, yeah, they're so fucking cool.

Anyway, he was taking candid photos as I was wandering around and before pretty much every gig I have a moment where I go, oh God, is this going to be okay? And then he happened to capture that moment. And so I put the photo up with a little caption explaining what's going on. But of course, not of course, I got accused of, I got accused of pretending. First Trappity.

I got accused of pretending it was a moment of reflection when actually it was a moment of Romesh thinks he looks silky smooth, so let's share the photo. Do you know what I mean? Do you have, do you think in this world that we live in now that you have to kind of go, do you think it's better to admit that it is, not first trap, but go, look, I actually felt nice

in this picture, so I put it up rather than, because what you did, you did the same thing I did with the one on the train, right? That is genuine picture taken by Grace. I then put up a, saying what it is, right? That you've done the same thing, right? And you've been a cutie, but the reason out taken by Grace. I then put up a saying what it is, right, that you've done the same thing, right, and you've been acute, but the reason out of all those pictures I put out one is

I thought, that's a nice picture of me, and there's not a lot of them. So I put that picture up, right, and then I got accused of the first thing. So you've done the same thing where that is, he's taken a picture of you in a quiet moment of reflection, you've put that up, but you did look at that picture, and you must have looked at it,

because you look boss in it and gone, fucking hell man, I look good in this picture, I've put that up but you did look at that picture and you must have looked at it because you look boss in it and gone fucking oh man I look good in this picture I want to put it up yeah but to qualify that is true that is I'm not gonna deny any of that you do I wouldn't have put that photo up if I think I thought I looked think like Tom Davis yeah if I thought I looked horrendous wow I show you my, you fucking put on your fucking steel coat, toe cap and absolutely shoe it! Okay, okay, let me have a sip of that. No, no, sorry, sorry, it's the caffeine, it's not, I don't know what's going on, alright?

Anyway, I do think one of the reasons that I thought that photo was alright is because you can't really see my face in it too much. You know, when we were doing the photo shoot, Eamon from Jigsaw who does all the photos and does all the Jigsaw, does all the Wolfing. How amazing is Eamon? Mate, his energy is incredible. I love that guy.

Anyway. If I could bottle that energy and sell it, that's the fucking puzzle there. Well, you've tried, haven't you? You'd call it mandrill what? Mandrill Moon Beast. Mate, mate, mate. That's, that's, yeah.

Mandrill Moon Beast. It'd be all over the Wolfing hour socials. Mate, I don't think you could get close to to to try and sort of no good He's just so positive and so yeah To be around yeah, he is he is anyway, he asked me what sort of photos I like of myself because he sort of occasionally takes photos and Of me he said you took photos. In fact, he did all the behind the behind the scenes videos, you know from the tour. Yeah, so he did all of those. So,

and I said actually invariably the photos that I tend to like are ones where you can't see my face if I'm looking down or looking across or the light just sits when you just see a sliver. Because anything where my face is front on. Like you're peering in the door. Like you're sort of peering through a little crack in the door? I mean you've managed to make it sound sort of pervy, but yeah. No, no, no, but that's... Yeah, peering through a door, sort of like... Or just peering through like the crack of a window, like that.

Yeah, okay. Both sort of... Pardon the pun, peeping Tom kind of scenarios. But so basically, then I started getting into a chat with him, this is while you're getting your head shaved, about I do genuinely, and it's very difficult for me to talk about it without people starting to feel sorry for me. I hate how I look. And I know that sounds very ungrateful,

because I've got a lot to be thankful for and all that But it's just I don't know if it's like a condition or something like that But just as soon as I see a photo that really sort of features my face I can't give you an example of any photo that I think Looks good or any footage looks good. Just it's just that it's just a bit of a weird thing I don't know if it's like a psychological thing or whatever, but I'm not making it up. It's genuinely... So whenever I see... So the reason that photo I thought I look alright in that, or it's alright to share,

is because I'm sort of looking down. But I think that of... I don't know many people who get Like put pictures up look firstly Really we've got into this quite quite quickly But you're right so so you've put that up right and and so I gig not in San Francisco, but the Hall of Halls of The Tommy Field and Kennington at ABC on Friday night. Hmm By the way, yeah by the way, I followed Judy Love. Mate. Fuck that. Jesus Christ. Whoa whoa whoa whoa. She's incredible.

Judy Love. I adore Judy, she's one of my favourite people in the world. But fuck. Like to say she roofed it, do know that her energy again like her the way she is on state like me it mean you the other week we're trying out you fucking set a high bar you went out you're doing new material and I think much like myself you're doing material and you got you know we used to deviate from it but we're doing material she had such a way of going out and she was doing new material, but she was just so fucking. Oh, man, I was just like, wow, this is it's kind of like a bit of an education. Just watching her.

She was just her. I don't I don't mind. I don't mind. And in fact, I support you complementing Judy Love. What I slightly resent is you sort of throwing me under the bus in order to do so. Well, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, What I slightly resent is you sort of throwing me under the bus in order to do so. Let's look at the narrative of what you just said, right? If comparing you to me, it's throwing you under the bus. You went to see Judy love, right?

Always be good. Yeah, you were blown away, right? You're absolutely blown away by the way she did stuff. And the reason that's put into context is because the week before, you'd seen me doing the immaterial. And actually watching her, relatively speaking, was an education after I'd watched her. No, no, no, no, no.

That's, that's, that's... Okay, let's retract. This is where you are trying to do the soft belly trick because you've given me a kick in. I said last week how incredible you were. You were amazing. I'm not doing a soft belly trick. I don't have a soft belly trick. My point is me and you, right? I was comparing you to me. There's a lot of anxiety in which we have doing new material. You're the same. When I watch you I go this is very similar to how I feel in In the sense of, I can watch you and I know myself,

it's like I can see where I'm trying to find the links to things, I'm trying to think out could this story potentially work, how, you know, and it's, I think it's a lot more, you're a lot more similar to myself in that way. What I say with Judy is it's so much gusto in what she comes out with. When she's doing, yeah, and doing new stuff, you're like say with Judy is it's so much gusto when she comes out with charisma. When she's doing new stuff, you're like, fucking hell, it's like the confidence

that she attacked the stage was like, wow, fuck, this is insane. I've not seen anything like this. And again, behind, we were chatting before, she was very nervous, but the way that she attacked that was a complete I still now will like you probably I shouldn't have compared it to you I compared it I still go out there with a sort of almost cough like oh god this could be awful I still sort of do at least two minutes to the top like you do going this could be shit and saying like look just get ready for the fact this could be absolutely fucking dogshit and I'm sorry if I've wasted your time where she just goes out and is like bang like that you this is gonna be amazing

you're like wow this is fucking what do you mean and that that was my I mean I was deliberately being facetious I mean Judy love Judy you need you need you need pulling down from your your glorified palace anyway my point is so then James Gildered whatever your his pictures yeah he does with yours you on stage I knew how to get your car because Judy got on the main page I got in the stories actually I vote Steve Merchant and Judy all got on the main page I got in the stories which is always a you need to find out who's booking that main page, try and

get in with them somehow. Anyhow, anyhow, I digress. But there's a picture of me and then I got a message last night from someone saying, you need to be kind to yourself. Because, you know, like you, I look in the mirror and feel the same stuff you do. And but then they said, they said, you need to fucking sort yourself out be kind to yourself. I'm a mental health nurse You need to sort of do some work. I was like, I'm not sure if the language here

Feels yeah Tough talking to is what you need. Yeah, you know tough love and then I put up a video of needed, you know, a little bit of a tough love. And then I put up a video of, a short video of me on the treadmill, because I had an awful day of eating yesterday, me and Catherine McGrace went out, ate like insane, so I went on the, put on a sauna suit, went on the treadmill just to try and sort of

be a little healthier, and then someone said, this is very toxic, which I don't kind of get, but yeah. Well, can I tell you why, can I don't kind of get. But yeah, well, it's, can I tell you why? Can I, can I play devil's advocate and say why, why that person said, why I think that person said that is because, um, what you're doing is you are propagating, uh, the notion that you need to punish yourself for eating, you know, like, like, so you had a bad eating day. So now you have to get on the treadmill and put on a sauna suit and sweat it out.

That's not how I intended it to come across. No, no, I know it's not, but, but that is, you know, people have a negative, you know, we're in a, people have a negative relationship with food and What I should have probably done is is said exactly like We went to Wagamama Wagamama's Grace of doors Wagamama's I had a main and I had six or older six sides for me and Katherine and said Katherine made the note That I at least all the four of those sides. I don't have the dessert We're right around the corner. I had a coffee, I had a cinnamon bun. This is after having the dessert at Wagamama's?

Yep, yeah. Then we then got home, had some, yeah, two tins of beans on toast. Of a little nibbly bits, and then I was like, so I should have probably said that what I actually had eaten was a lot of fucking calories And that's why I felt like I need to if you if you if you

Would be kind enough to allow me to play devil's advocate again It still doesn't require you to I think what I think the healthy response to that might be or a healthier response, you know or something that you wouldn't get is that might be or a healthier response, you know, or something that you wouldn't get is the idea is, and I'm not an expert by the way, but you know, you're talking to someone that's just spent 10 minutes ranting about how much he hates his, how he looks. But my response to this is, is that if you, if you have a bad day in what you consider to be a bad day's eating, I think we need to get rid of the idea that it's a bad day. It's a day where you've eaten more than you might have liked.

Oh no, no, no, no. I suppose that's the other thing. It's not like I'm going, I had a lovely day. I enjoyed that food. But then also, I've got a mental thing now of putting on too much, or just not even weight. It's just, I've been unhealthy and I'm kind of dead. But the thing is, it's like you're

Arguably becomes, you know, I'll get it becomes dangerous or damaging if you go I've eaten a lot I've got a jump on the treadmill now and work this off Actually what a healthy way of looking at it. You still want to take action, but you just go out tomorrow I'll probably I'll just be I'll balance out Jim and I might have a lighter day tomorrow eating wise Do you know I mean? Yeah, I mean, today's a Sunday and I'm aware that I will probably have them. Yeah, but then you have two days and then you're on Monday. Yeah. You know, like, I think that's what that person,

by the way, I'm not having a go at you. Also, I should say, by the way, that I enjoy going on the treadmill in a sword or suit. I enjoy, yeah. Well, then the argument is that's how you should have presented it. Yeah, I should, yeah, no, that's what I mean. I've put that out, but I quite enjoy in the evening doing that.

Yeah, me and Catherine were in there together. It was quite a nice thing as a couple to be in, to spend a bit of time together. And I probably should have been a bit more like, oh yeah, actually it's almost like the treat for me. Tom Davis. But the whole thing, by the way, I should say by the way. I haven't even started what I'm about to say.

I said Tom Davis in your ear. Right? Tom Davis. Right? I love you. You're my kiss, my kin, my brother, my brethren, my family, my husband, my love, my everything. Right? I'm not having a go.

But like, it's nothing... You've not done anything wrong. But the thing is, it's like, you know, unintentionally, I guess it's one of those things where people can read it a certain way. And it's a difficult thing of like social media. It's like you, basically you've gone, you're trying to get yourself, and the other thing is, is that we can't,

we're not the finished article. You're learning about your relationship with food and your relationship with exercise like anyone else is, right? The difference is, is like maybe you've got a bit of profile so more eyes are seeing what you're doing. So it's something you have to think about, do you know what I mean?

Like, but you haven't, I don't want you to start beating yourself up about it. You've not done anything wrong. I'm just trying to figure out what that person is getting at. But yeah, no, no, but I'm always interested how like, and it's the same with comedy, right? It's, yeah, and in the world that we live in, you were talking about this the other day when we were having dinner together, of how like, you know, meta and everything that's happening now, we're in a situation where the rules are going to change again and people can say what they, you know, people can be a lot harsher and a lot but how different people will interpret

different things and how we can like for example me saying about Judy I didn't explain that quite well enough and I know you'll be deliberately facetious but in there how I was no but no no but also I was the way when I look at if I listen but I listen back to so I'll yeah, I probably didn't explain that as clearly as I probably, no, no, but my point being- This is gone so badly wrong. No. This has got Ramesh wakes up at 3 a.m.

and thinks about how he talked to Tom, written in the library. No, no, no, no, no, no, don't worry, I'm not that thin-skinned. My point is- Aren't you? No, I am, but yeah, anyway, don't worry. Like, my point being is that everyone can, there was a lot of me and you as well, right, in what we've done in getting fit and getting checked. None of it was a weight thing.

I wasn't like, it was a health thing, right? You said that many times. But there is still a lot of part of me that was bullied or had a piss taken out of me for being overweight through my time as a scaffolder, my time as a, whatever I've done in my life, through whatever sports I played, most of the harshest criticism that I got

from most of my first TV work was being overweight and like, you know, a big fric, whatever. So in that time, you're like, that stuff hits cuts deep. So you it takes a lot for you to go, as you were saying earlier, in how you perceive yourself to go from, oh, okay, that's you're not natural. I don't I don't know anyone. And maybe I'm wrong. But certainly speaking to you is that I can tell you I can go through loads of pictures where I look at your picture and go, fucking, it looks great there, but that's not for me to do. Like I could, you know, and I'm vice versa. I look at pictures and think fucking hell, like,

my, my, my, the other day, well, just, we all came back, me, Grace, and Catherine had been out for a walk, and you know when your ring doorbell pops up, and I saw myself coming down the path with Katherine and Grace, and I thought, oh my God. I look at how Katherine is beautiful, and I'm like, Jesus, how long could she put this

for a tense up before she just goes, I don't know. ["Spring Day in the City"] Ready to make your next big move? Rotman Executive Programs at the University of Toronto offers top tier professional development. Whether you're moving up in your current role or preparing for the next, expand your business acumen, sharpen leadership skills, and gain cutting edge insights from world class Rotman faculty. Accelerate your career with Rotman executive programs. Visit www.uoft.me slash Rotman 2025 to learn more.

That's www.uoft.me slash Rotman 2025. I mean, look, with regards to your, uh, your posting the story about your exercise or whatever, you know, like I said, it can be taken a certain way, but the thing is, it's like you're human and you're, you haven't, there's no bad intention in that. You're trying to exercise because you're worried about your health and like, you know, we've talked about your health concerns and so you're probably thinking, I need to get on there and undo some of this and whether, you know And however right or wrong that is, that's the journey you're taking. I think that people are, we're just trying to fucking find our way through all of this,

do you know what I mean? And so you can't be the finished article. With regards to how you look, I think it's fair to say, I'm not a doctor and I'm not a psychologist, but I think I can diagnose both of us as having some sort of serious psychological issue with our with our With our appearance and I think if I'm being honest where it comes from is what you kind of alluded to is That at school we were considered we ended up being hardwired into thinking that we were a bit like

were considered, we ended up being hardwired into thinking that we were a bit like not great looking or like just looked horrendous. And so then you have a thing where your inbuilt belief is that you don't look good. And it doesn't matter what you see, you've got that belief like programmed into you. Do you know what I mean? And so whenever you see yourself, you go, God, I look horrible. And the other thing is, I don't know if you have this, but like, when you get ready to go out in the morning or whatever, or when you look in the mirror before you're about to go out, right?

You look at yourself front on, right? So this is how you look at it, is you sort of look in the mirror and you go, okay, I look good. No photo, like no candid photo of you on stage or when the ring doorbell picks you up is seeing you fully front on and posed and ready with your face in a certain expression.

So what happens is, whenever you see any other image of yourself, I mean we get loads of photos taken for us like backstage at gigs and stuff like that. It's always an angle that you go, Oh God. Yeah, but some people celebrate those things. I don't mean this in a harsh way or like, there's people, and I don't think I should name them, but who I look at who are our compadres, our sort of peers, and I look at their pictures that they put up sometimes and I'm like, every

picture they put up, and I know like, every picture they put up, and I know obviously I've gone through it and it's probably, but you go, Christ, they always look good, do you know what I mean? There's a fire. Well, look, if you were to ask me what the cure is for this situation, one cure, you know, there's two options. One cure is that we get ourselves so physically impeccable

that when we see photos of ourselves, we like ourselves so physically impeccable that when we see photos of ourselves, we like ourselves. Yeah, but I don't think that'll ever happen. Well, there you go. That's my answer. That will, I'm telling you now, that will never happen. So the other option is we've got to fix something in our heads. Yeah, but I'm gonna, you know what?

I know we've talked about this sort of stuff in the podcast. I would be interested if there's people who are experts in this, to get someone like when we do We need someone to got one us to basically got one by the way. I'm loving him What do you mean? I just find it like I thought I want to tell you now, right? He's someone who could tell me I look amazing. I know that he's gonna leave down go off I just work with Tom Davis fucking out fat loser. Oh

Why are you saying that I've always felt like very inferior? I will say actually there's a lot of people in our industry that I feel like that around Okay, I had a situation this week where I found myself being like literally thinking if this Situation wasn't on the seventh floor, I'd probably try and jump out the window. I feel so inferior. Number one is there's moments in my life when you're six foot seven and you realize you're six foot seven because everyone else around you isn't much over six one six two and you feel very, you know, gargantuan or whatever. You

feel fucking like it's massive. And there's times in our industry, I don't know, I mean, I'm sure you'd feel like it, I know you well enough, where you feel like, oh my God, like literally, so everyone's waiting for you to go to the toilet and go, what is he doing here? God, why is, why did he invite him?

What's he doing here? What I was saying response to that. And I'm sorry, you know, we do, we do talk about this a lot. So apologies, people who have fed up with us talking about this. Um, but, um, if you've come to a podcast where new, new subjects get broached and you've come to the wrong place, well, we've tried over the last three weeks and to be absolutely crucified online, um, what my, my answer to me being absolutely crucified online.

My answer to that is that people aren't thinking that. And actually, what that is is an inferiority complex that comes from not feeling that you belong in those spaces. Do you know what I mean? It's because I've watched every interview you've done, I think. I saw you on the Jack Mate podcast recently, and you were brilliant on that. But one of the things interview you've done, I think. I saw you on the Jack Mate podcast recently, and you were brilliant on that.

But one of the things that you said was, you were written off as a kid, right? Is that everybody just said this guy's gonna make nothing of himself, right? And you haven't, you've made something of yourself. It's an incredible, like we were talking about it before we jumped on the pod, you're a film star. You're in movies.

You did an amazing. I don't want to start listing your achievements again, but the fact of the matter is that you have made something of yourself. But that hasn't changed your interior belief. And so whenever you are in those situations that your ability and talent have taken you into, you feel like you shouldn't be there. And so then you can't say that out loud.

So then what you start doing is you start projecting on other people that they feel you shouldn't be there. And they don't feel like that. Yes, we don't. They feel like... And look, the other thing is, you're from a working-class background, right? And so...

You will have a paranoia about how you fit in in those conversations. And sometimes, I've been in those situations where people are talking about, I don't know, they're talking about authors, or they're talking about theatre, or they're talking about history or something like that. And you go, I'm well out of my depth in this conversation, right? It was a situation where they were talking and I was very much on the outskirts of the conversation. It didn't matter. They could have been It didn't matter they could have been talking about anything They could be talking about West Ham United or whether fucking like AJ would beat Fury stuff I knew about but I still would have felt so such an outsider in the situation I would have felt but that is that is

That's it on you. It's on me. These things are on us Like one of the best versions of like and and it's a weird thing to reference, right? There's a moment in The Wire where, and it's a mad thing to talk about, but where Stringer Bell is trying to, you know, get Avon almost to go more legit and he's invested money in real estate and everything. And Avon turns around and turns, he says that, you know, you're a man without a country. You're not hard enough for this world and you're not clever enough for that one. And you know that thing of like, where you look and go,

I don't know, you know, in like, I'm fucking, I didn't anticipate we were gonna get this deep today. So you know what you got? I don't, no, but what you got, I don't quite know where you fit anymore. Do you ever feel like that? Yeah, but but yes, I do I do I feel like that a lot but You shouldn't we've got to lose that man, you know It like even the thing was talking about not hating how looking photographs

We've got to lose that the thing about hating how you look when you come down the ring door But we've got to lose that the thing about being in a conversation and you feel like you shouldn't be there We have to lose that and it's's not, we don't know. It's not about changing how we look or changing how we are. It's about changing like our heads. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, but this is a thing that isn't it? Because it's like, even in the situation I'm talking about, and you, you, you,

I'd say, you know me pretty much as well as anyone. Like, but when I go into a room, I don't go in there with that feeling. Then I will act like I think I should act by being really friendly and chatty and nice. And I know I can there's some situations and a lot of situations where that is fine. And I'm not fucking going on not going to be like that anymore. But what I'm saying is there's also situations where you go in and you can feel people go off. Yeah, but I think that's in your head. Maybe it is. Because I don't like it not to be in my head because then what happens is I retract and I feel like literally I go from feeling like, like from being six foot seven to feeling like I'm literally like one of Gracie's fucking Paw Patrol figures.

But the other thing I'm saying, we should probably move on after this, but the other thing I would say is we're not unique in that. It doesn't make us special. Most people doing most things feel like that. Do you know what I mean? So it's just what it is. Everybody's fucking pretending, man. Do you know what I mean?

I used to think this about being a parent. I used to think, God, everybody else knows what they're doing with their kids, and Lisa and I, well, not Lisa, Lisa's incredible, but like, sort of thinking, oh God, I'm just pretending at being a dad and that person knows what it's, and then he talks to these people and everybody's fucking clueless. Do you know what I mean? Like, so it is mad.

It is mad. Speaking of mad, I'd love to discuss with you, and I've not been watching it, but I have managed to get across it. Married at First Sight Australia, I'd love to talk to you about this, because there's a guy in it, and I'm going to bring you up to speed, I don't know how across this series is.

I don't want to say any of it, I'm sort of done with it. There is a guy, this is my first exposure to Married at First Sight Australia. A guy called Tim, is on the latest series, and the first thing I read was a news story saying that Tim has deleted all of his social media

and is distancing himself from everything to do with Married at First Sight because he's worried about how it'll affect his job as a primary school teacher. Right, that's the first thing I read, okay? So then you think, what has happened? Because the guy knew that he was going to be a married at first sight and he knew he was going to be a primary school teacher.

So has he suddenly reflected on what's happened? And this is the breakdown of what's happened. Okay. So Tim is I think 38, 39, right? He is what would I, I would describe him as his build is, he looks like somebody that maybe played rugby at college. Do you know what I mean? He's got that kind of build about him. Do you know what I mean? Tim sounds like a 10.

Well, he's not, I wouldn't say he's a 10, right? What I would say is like, he's somebody like, he's a big guy, you know, big-ish guy, right? You know, and anyway, so he's on his wedding day for married at first sight he sees his bride's come down the aisle her name is Katie and He immediately has a reaction right and in the show They include him walking off with the producer and he clearly he thinks he's off mic but obviously the producer the show have included all of this and

he's saying She's not my type. I normally go for petite blondes And I don't I feel a bit like this is a bit of a stitch up I'm paraphrasing a bit of a stitch up here and I don't feel a spark. I don't feel a spark. She's not my type. She's not my type. And then basically he doesn't find her attractive. And she's when he says she's not his type. Well, is it? Yeah. I mean, the thing is, it's like now he's sort of being,

he's sort of being vilified because people are saying, you know, number one, right? Number one on this. That's on the, number one yes that's on the a lot that's on the producers right I totally agree I could agree with you more no there's no there's no good that can come apart from their ratings that can come and that's a show that's fallen on its ass if I'm gonna show you because there was a time in that show and I've talked a lot about it and I know we know people involved but there was a time when it when that show was being made where you're not naive enough and it's a little bit like

traitors in a sense. Like well you're not naive enough to know that this is reality TV but you're also going and I think traitors still have got a balance but you're also going well there's got to be an engine to this that is about actual people finding love at first sight, getting married, and there's got to be a happy tale to it. And what happened was you had a couple of series that did really, really well, though, all about very, very toxic relationships, all about very fucking the worst kind of things happening, people being awful to each other.

You had stuff about coercive control, you had stuff about fucking violent incidents, whatever. And that was the stuff that was getting headlines. So that's the stuff that they've lent into. It's a bit like Traitors where you watch Traitors and Traitors is a brilliant show. It's one of my favorites. I adore Traitors. But there's an element you go in. There's a lot more reality-esque people in this than were in it. That's inevitable though, isn't it? Because they've seen how big the show's gonna be. Yeah, but also it's interesting to see how well those people do in the mix and what we're talking about sort of leads into that. And like where you've got people who are game players and people who play as in like they like gaming and they like board games and they're like, sort of a strategy, strategy, strategy, fucking hell, and stuff, right?

So that's sort of, you're leaning it, but Married at First Sight is completely toppled over. So in the case that we're talking about here, is that's probably happened numerous occasions where someone has got cold feet in a show called Married at First Sight, where they've gone to the producers, I'm not sure about this.

For them to film that, keep his mic on, there is a very knowing process in what. For them to film that, keep his mic on, there is a very knowing process in what they're doing to air that. Well, I would extend it further than that. I think they knew that was going to be his reaction. Because there have been interviews and stuff with friends of his since then. They do psych tests on these people, right? so they know what he's like and they know how his reaction is going to be so what they so obviously Married at First Sight let's get this out of the way right a lot of they're trying to make a TV they're trying to make an entertaining TV show right so what isn't an entertaining TV

show is a load of perfectly paired people meet each other fall in love and it goes swimmingly we've all seen like Mar, married at first sight, and as viewers, we've gone, oh, they're going to the couple that like each other, this is gonna be boring. I wanna see, I wanna get to the pit where they fucking hate each other, right? Yeah, of course, of course. That's what people are looking for.

So they, I believe, that they have gone, we know that Tim's gonna react like that, and we know that he's gonna kick off, and this is gonna be great for the show. What you're doing by doing that is throwing that woman under the bus. What you're doing is you're saying, we know that he's gonna have a negative reaction.

We know that a negative reaction is gonna be televised because we're putting it in the show, and that's gonna to be great. But she is being spoken about like Tom, you and I have spent the first 20 minutes talking about how we feel about. So imagine if we were on a show like that and then you saw, so you saw cat being taken off. I wouldn't have been completely shocked if she'd done

Which I wouldn't have been completely shocked if she'd done it on the wedding day. And she knew the dinner that was on the table. On your wedding day, you're grinning away, you're going, I'm looking forward to tucking into the wedding breakfast after this. And then you see her being taken away, she's going, oh God, I'm not sure about this. I just don't. There were still elements of me when she turned up on the day that actually that was quite refreshing to think that this wasn't a practical joke that my family and friends had set her up to. But also you have a thing, go on, go on, sorry. No, no, I was just going to say, so I think, you know, Tim is getting absolutely slaughtered.

And there are people, there are people coming out in defense of him saying, look, he's expressed a preference. We can talk about that as long as we want, but the truth of it is that she is a lovely looking woman. A lot of the stuff that I've seen online is like laying into Tim of what he looks like and he obviously thinks he's hotter than he is and all that shit, which I don't think is any better than what Tim's been like about Katie and in fact arguably worse but there people come out in his fence going, you know, he's got he's got a certain taste and Why is he being punished for having a preference?

And that's another point of discussion But the thing of it is is the whole thing to me feels a little bit ick. Do you know what I mean? It just feels a bit rank man. Do you know what I mean? It's and everybody's talking about it so arguably it's worked. We're talking about it on the podcast and it's my fault. I've brought it up but no no but the point is if they'd have met, got on, it probably wouldn't have come to my attention. I want to mention it on the podcast. So everything that I'm complaining about, there's happened how it was designed to happen, you know? And what you're saying about the happy cup, but like once you make a deal to

make a show like that, it's like you're in saw mentality, right? So when you're making a horror franchise, like saw in the first one, like you have somebody's fucking head cut off, where it's not good enough for people to come and see the sequel, just have someone's head cut off, how do you make that fucking more horrific? For people to keep coming back, series like, film like number two, three, four, five, they have to keep the things get worse and worse. I don't know how many Saw's there were, but I don't know, at first sight, I feel like series seven, 7 8 and the point is

not enough to see that stuff you've got it's got to feel more and more it's got gory it's got to feel worse it's got to feel harsher it's got to feel nastier it's got to feel man and then that's the that's the deal you make then and probably the last series I watched and me and Katherine were both like there was just no happiness and like you need a little bit of light. Mm. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, yeah, undoubtedly, the things have got to escalate every time. You know, they escalate it in the trailers,

they've got to escalate it in Married at First Sight. You think about Big Brother, that guy that was called Nasty Nick in series one, do you remember, like, from the very beginning? I bet if you went back and watched what he's doing now, you just think, how did this guy get this reputation because I what when the whole country hated him he was Because I demonstrated a bit of strategy What is playing big brother before his time? Yeah, so like yeah, it just is just one of know, I'm gonna kick off my shoes tonight watch the boys

I'm doc. Well, I met with the lovely Jill Scott Last week. I just read a murder coffee. She says hello, but she was going to I think it was like the premiere or press launch the boys and documentary and she loves like loves Boyzone, right and There is something about Somebody's like just heart photo enthusiasm for a thing that I've gone completely addicted. I just love it

I when somebody loves something I just think it's great like you talking about what's the name of that sandwich place you go to? Pull rough pull rough. I could watch you talk about Paul Roth. Paul Roth by the way, he's stepping up, they've had a refurb in the place. Have they? Yeah, we should go, should we go for lunch or what? You should come and see me in Marlborough. I'd love to do that, yeah, I'd really love to do that. I'd love to take you to a sandwich place. He does some fucking beautiful vegan stuff. But anyway, the point is is that Jill was very excited She was gonna meet boys. Oh, and she was absolutely buzzing about it. It was lovely. It's beautiful to say, you know All the boys are in Mikey didn't go

Is there a story behind that? Well, I don't know. I'm not you got what your doctor gets But I know that he's stepped away from fame and stuff. Okay, but have you seen the trailer for it? No Mate, you know what reality shows like that quickly? I mean over kick, but you watch the watch the Kardashians Trailer of the new series of the Kardashians, right or that boys own trailer They're better than actual like film fucking drama trailers now But you think they're enough to get you pumped up to go and fucking attack the day. Yeah, it's saying It was my wedding anniversary last week Tom, oh wow and yeah Thursday I

Took Lisa out to watch well, we went out for lunch, it was very nice. Yeah. Where did you go? Nice place. It's a place called the Curious Pig in the Parlour. It's like a pub just down the road from us. It was very nice, really nice. Great, I'd reckon it's a Robbie Recommend. But we went to watch. It's a Robbie Recommend. Wow. My guy fucking slipping on those fucking Jay-Z cast red gamble shorts. Hello off menu. It's a pop of Dom's old bread. It was nice.

But then last night, we went to watch Stranger Things, the first shadow. Oh, wow. In the theater? In the theater in the theater. Yeah, and I Don't have you heard anything about it. No, but the effects in that show are Unbelievable. Well, you cannot believe what you're seeing About say on screen on the stage is that I'm amazing like amazing's amazing, like amazing what's going on there, right? But it once again highlighted my inability

in a horror situation despite loving it, despite really enjoying it and it being one of my favorite things. I think there's a lot of parallels between horror and comedy in terms of they both give you a visceral reaction. As in, you have a physical reaction to what you're seeing. It makes you do so.

I love stuff like that, where you connect with it. Comedy, you laugh involuntarily. Horror, you get shocked involuntarily. You have a reaction and I love all that. However, my jumping out of the seat and just sort of reacting to what I was seeing, Lisa could not... Barely once she's seen loads of stuff like this and there's something she comments on, she just couldn't believe it. I'm watching, I'm looking around, there's jump scares in it, there's bits of shock and stuff like that. I can't believe people are sat still really. Yeah I feels like it. I was like there's there's a couple of bits where I properly

Like jerks and Lisa looked at me and like started laughing Because of the way that I reacted. Yeah, she's like Stoning in like in the horrors. Oh no, you're a horror thing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Cause I'll be like you, I'll be nervous. Yeah, I'm all over the shop. I went to watch. Like a dog on firework night. Yeah. They had a preview of the conjuring just after COVID.

It's like the new, you know, it's like this big horror franchise. Yeah. I was all over the fucking shop. You're a big horror nut. I didn't know you were a horror nut. I'm not a big, I mean, I like it new, you know, it's like this big horror franchise. I was all over the fucking shop Big I mean I like it I do like I'm not an expert I was soon as I say I'm into horror and people start going Oh, who's your favorite director and what styles you like and then I'm like you on the seventh floor of that building I'm completely out of my debt. Yeah, but I do I do like I do enjoy it. Do you mean I like it? I like being scared You know, what can I tell you? I love it

I love being scared and then somebody taking me in their arms and going it'll be okay Did Lisa's like touch your leg or anything? No, she found the whole thing hugely embarrassing Okay, there was one moment in particular where she she looked at me I would say with incredulity how I I'd reacted to what I just said. Really? Well, I don't know what incredulity means, but I'll use that word. She was incredulous. She was...

Why have you replaced it with another word that you... She was... What's a way of describing incredulity? Disbelief and shock. Okay. In a disapproving way. equidiliter. Disbelief and shock. Okay. So she was almost as horrified as your reaction as you were to the fear. Yeah, she jumped out of her seat at my reaction. She screamed at how her husband looked at her. Oh god, Romesh's reactions were absolutely horrifying. They were terrifying.

I think the scariest, it was so frightening. What? What? Strange things they were terrifying. I sat next to him just to see. It was so frightening, what, what? Strange things, no, that I'm married to him. I think the most horrifying, terrifying thing is looking next to me and seeing what a pussy I've married. You hope it's a nightmare, but then you wake up and he's still there next to you. And you realise you're living that nightmare. He was so terrified. He wet the bed that night. He was so scared That's not that doesn't happen just after stranger things Tom how much of it can we just talk about how?

Like well you're doing What do you mean? How much longer you gonna do the podcast for just be honest? How much longer are you going to do the podcast for? Just be honest. Let's get this out of the way. Let's get this out of the way. This is the thing that I adore this podcast. This is the only thing that I do that I feel like I'm being myself and I couldn't just be me.

I don't do like this sort of stuff. I genuinely feel like this is a virtual thing. It's going to get to a point where this is going to. This is going to. Are you telling me that there's a day that comes that I'm more successful than you and that's where packing you are more successful than me You're the successful one Tom Tom We're both successful. They were both successful guys. We've come a long way the point is my point is I adore you

You know, I adore you. You're at my you're you're my thing. Okay, baby I think we should put an end date on this. No way. If I win an Oscar, then we'll do four episodes after, or if you win an Oscar. Fine. First of all, or if you win an Oscar. As a fucking... Basically, you threw that to me as a sop,

like a fucking watching dog at the table while you have dinner. Or if you win a Grammy for your album, I don't know. Oh, God. Okay. Both equally as likely outcomes, by the way, can I just say. By the way, I will say, I love doing this. It's my favourite thing. Yeah, but it can become a thing. I get more satisfaction from people coming up to me in the street talking about this than I do anything else. Shall we do an email?

Let's do a sweet sweet email, boy. This is from the Red Panda. Dear Wolf Al and of course Swan. Full disclosure, Swan has not been on email duties recently. So I don't want to listen anymore I think she's listening, but she's become a lot less forthcoming with her comments on what's been discussed. So Let's see if she references this then I know that she's still listening but it's what you can't do I don't even do this to care. I can't say to Lisa you listening to the podcast. No, no, no, it's unbearable that that is Even for me a level. Yeah

Okay for both of us as I sit here catching up on the pods at 38,000 feet on my way home from three weeks away with work in Asia I wanted to reach out and ask your advice as the animal agony uncles My other half my amazing fiance, the bear, is a huge fan of yours and we listen to your pods together. Wolf, we even came to see one of your gigs and we loved it. Well, thank you so much for coming to see me on, so obviously I don't do stand-ups,

so that's why you missed that. He puts up with holding the house together with my electric mix of animals. While I regularly travel long haul for work doing the career of a lot. Electric or eclectic? I think, well, they've said electric during the career. Electric or eclectic? I think, well they've said electric but I think they mean eclectic. So congratulations Red Panda on being corrected by the wolf.

I truly couldn't live without my bear. I need your sweet sweet advice. Next year we get married, second time for us both. A blended family, been together for nine years. Four bear cubs between us but none together we have fur and feather babies instead i've seen that's in reference to the eclectic mix of animals cat or a dog and some sort of bird i guess oh hello sherlock somebody very nice very nice work the bear has been and is the most phenomenal human putting up with my insane career working all hours as an engineer

And he spends his time teaching tiny humans in a school. It makes him even more epic. There's a level of patience I can't even imagine. He's always telling me wolf to just Listen, I don't want to read too much of this but I've started to get a feeling that that the breadpanda might be a bigger fan of one of us than tubba Don't go too deep on that. He's always telling me, Wolf, to just do me. But as I get close to 50, I literally have zero idea of who me is. One of the bear cubs is an adult at 21, definitely grizzly university bear. The other three closely follow at 13 and 16. At what point does it appear selfish to start

planning our life with no bear cubs at home without it looking or feeling selfish The daddy bears kids are many miles from us and we spend time with them in school holidays as teen cubs They have their own lives and increasingly say I want to approach the serious subject of what we do next a five-year plan But I'm not sure how to do without him feeding under pressure because I want him to understand that this is not about cub Abandonment help. I'm my selfish poured pal or what's the best approach? Tom Davis, what do you think? Well, I think it's a After yow after hearing the majority of this podcast. It's probably You realize that we've got the lesser clue than you seem to have so I would say that

As even as new parents and with a three year old, me and Catherine, we, you know, listening to one they're talking about going out with Lisa, it's having that date night, we're like, a point in the moment where Grace has been quite unwell, and she's sleeping in our bed and you know, which is, you know, part of parenting, but me and and Catherine we were just talking last night about us making sure that we're still doing stuff for each other for us together you know we'll go out friends individually or whatever but we we need to make sure that we really keep an eye on us as as a as a couple doing things and also making little plans of like let's have a try and

have a night away here or go to the theatre or go to the cinema or go for some dinner and make sure that we don't lose sight of that. I think your kids aren't far away in age, apart from 21 year olds. Romas's kids are getting older, so I suppose that's more applicable to him in a sense. But I think you've, as a couple, always got to keep an eye on where you're at. That's very difficult as well in the sense of, I don't know what it's like to have older children, but even just life stresses with moving house, we're trying to

sell a house. We're dealing with estate agents, which is a whole other episode. It'd be lovely to have meeting an estate agent who wasn't either a prick or a liar. That would be a real... If there was any estate agents out there I would love to just just meet just for my own faith in humanity just to meet one that's not even lying to you With a smile or just being an absolute prick. That'd be a fucking joy. I don't know if that's such a thing, but I might be being too general. It just might be my experience, but I've dealt with a lot of them over the last fucking 15 years I've not met one who didn't turn out to be an absolute

I'm sure there are lovely ones I'm sure I've not come into fucking any kind of contact with them anyhow. Let's try and keep this on keep this on track big guy. So yeah so I think I also think it's making having some fun in planning those next those next steps, those next moves, making it feel like you're doing those things together, but also including them. I think as well, everyone I talk about

whose kids go to university, they come back from university and there's a whole nother bond there. So there's a whole nother, you know, they almost not feel like you're equivalent because they're still your kid, but there's a moment where they feel like you're a little bit closer to yourself with them. So, look, I've really gone man house. I think it is an important thing for you to plan those next steps. I think

you do you, but when I say you do you, I mean that as you as an entity. The two of you coming together to do you. I feel very, very disingenuous giving you advice when I feel at the moment I've probably got my life less together than you have but keep on doing your keep on being amazing. Your life is very together Tom and I'm worried about you now you're feeling like a bit down on yourself and you shouldn't you're a wonderful human being. Red Panda I'm not sure if you want any advice from me because you've sort of got what you've came for but I will talk if that's okay. I don't think there's anything selfish in what you're talking about. I get very worried about Lisa because she is more so than I a a parent to our children. And I say that because we are in a very kind of,

we're in a situation where I work and Lisa, you know, Lisa's at home much more than I am. And I get very worried that her whole life is looking after the kids. And that is wonderful and rewarding. And our children are incredible. And I love them very much. Obviously, these are all obvious things that I'm saying.

But your life, you should not feel selfish in doing things that don't involve them or are not about them. At the end of the day, you would do anything for your kids. I would do anything for my children. But it's not healthy for them to think that our existence is solely for their benefit. You are there for them whenever they need you and you look after them and you care for them and you do anything for them. But at the same time, they need to know that,

I think it's healthy for them to know that you, and you don't have to explicitly tell them, I think it's healthy for them to know that you're doing things, and you're doing your own thing as well. Do you know what I mean? Because at the end of the day, kids grow up and they will not give as much of a shit about you as you want them to because they go on and lead their own lives and they should do they should go on and

Do their thing and they should not feel that they You know, they should be free to live their own lives. And you know, I think about this is like my kids are getting older and they're becoming more and more independent and when they move out, I don't want them to ever feel like they have to more and more independent and when they move out I don't want them to ever feel like they have to see us. I'd love them to and I want them to look forward to seeing us. I don't want them to feel like it's an onerous thing but I want them to feel like they can live their own lives. The point I'm trying to make is that we're all living our own lives. As

much as we love each other, as much as we care about each other, you've got your own lives to lead, and you and your other half have got your own lives to lead. And I don't think there's anything selfish in planning what you might do, having a plan, thinking about what you might do. It doesn't mean you're not gonna be there for the kids. But I think it's reasonable to go, what are we gonna do?

What are our lives going to look like? I think that's a totally sensible thing to think about. What I would say is, the thing that slightly is an alarm bell for me is, you know, who am I? Because I think the whole sense of what your identity is, I think is a really difficult one. And, you know, when COVID happened and people weren't able to socialize

and they weren't able to work, there was a lot of psychological impact on people because people started to forget what, they didn't know what their identity was. What am I, if I'm not a teacher, or if I'm not a, if I'm not an engineer, or I'm not a whatever, what actually am I? Who am I?

And the truth is we're not our jobs and we're not parents. We are people that do our jobs and we're people that do parenting. That's not your identity. And truth is, you don't need to, I think trying to figure out who you are in life is a difficult one. Who you are in life is a question

that isn't really able to be answered, I don't think. I think you are just who you are and you're just trying to look for contentment. So don't, what I would say to you is, and I've kind of gone sort of all over, all around the houses here, is that it's totally reasonable to plan your life, figure out what you want to do,

but don't do that as a way of finding out who you are. It's too difficult, that is something, you're not going to get a satisfactory answer. All you've got to do is just sort of look for How do I what sort of things do I like doing? How do I do more of those? What do I enjoy doing? Do I want to spend more time with my other half on holiday or traveling or whatever and then find those things and do those Things but if you're looking for it to answer the question, who am I that that is a question that is very difficult to answer

Anyway, I hope that's useful. I'm going to be honest with you, not sure there's any value in that advice that I gave, but I imagine that you look... I enjoyed it, man. That was beautiful. Right, Tom, please, could you do us the honour of giving us your venerable wrap up for the episode? Yeah, hey. This week I was in a park and I sat on a bench. Not just any bench, but there was a little plaque on it. A memory of Ron and Sue. Who were Ron and Sue? Well, more than just the bench, But what a bench place there. So their favorite place to sit was the bench there

before they died, it was a bench to put there in their memory. Did they walk through that park every day? Did they take time to think? Maybe they hugged, maybe they kissed. Maybe it was the thing that they talked most about to their loved ones. What did you do today, Ron and Sue? Went to the park, obviously.

Had a stroll through. Hey, we're gonna put a paint bench there when you pass. Ha! You're kidding. What an amazing thing. Truth of the matter is the legacy that Ron and Sue have left behind is bigger than just a bench. But for a stranger sitting there it eased my suffering just for a second. I took the weight off, not just my feet but my mind, and just for a few seconds I wasn't thinking about my problems. I was thinking to two people I'd never met and a bond that they shared that would be there for eternity. Well for as long as that park's there and it's not sold to a real estate mogul who turns it into flats. My point is this, sometimes the things we leave behind are the things we don't even think of.

Careful moments, sweet, sweet conversation, a laugh, a joke, maybe some sadness, maybe just sitting next to someone on a bus who goes, huh, that guy stunk of beer, I wonder if he'd just been to the gym. We don't choose the things that people remember us by, but what we can choose is to make the moments in which we see people happy ones. Be gracious, be decent, and may we all have a bench in a park with their names Ablazoned on it even if those names are a blazoned in spray paint graffiti

It's just a memory, baby Okay, it was a weird ending but I've got to say one of the best ones you've ever done I actually think it's really great life advice So well done really proud of you. I I actually think it's really great life advice So well done really proud of you. I Have recently been getting into sort of like eight a lot of 80s music. Well, and I came across a song From years ago that I absolutely love and it's man Tronics got to have your love. So JT. Can you please play us out with that?

Photos are coming very soon we've been sent a couple of them. I feel like two glamour models have been sort of like talked into a kiss that they weren't sure about. But see what you guys think. Yeah see what you guys think. I mean it was it was on the wolf and our whatsapp it was received with Many laughing emojis. Yeah, I say that we've chosen it wasn't as cool as we thought it was gonna be No, I don't I didn't think it was gonna be cool Whether it's humiliating is another question, but listen, that's not enough. That's up to you. So Please let us know what you think. My mom's trying to call me now. So I've dropped her call and she's called back twice since then. Well make sure you give her a sender of my notes.

I will do. I will do. Thank you so much for listening guys. We will speak to you very soon. Take care of yourselves. Love you. Peace out. If you have a problem, opinion, feedback or anything at all, please email us at wolfalpod.gmail.com. That's wolfalpod.gmail.com. We'd love to hear from you, mainly because we don't have any content ideas. Thank you.