Woman Evolve with Sarah Jakes Roberts - Not So Superwoman w/ Janice Omadeke

Episode Date: July 16, 2025

Suffer your way to success, now who said THAT?! In this raw and uncut conversation, SJR sits down with entrepreneur and advocate Janice Omadeke to expose the toxic "Superwoman" myth. You know, the lie that we have to bleed, break, and abandon ourselves just to be loved, seen, or deemed faithful. Chhiiillleee, take that "S" off your chest and hang that cape up! Please believe...you don't have to break yourself to build a beautiful life, sis. God's grace is big enough to uphold your dreams and your boundaries. Now, press PLAY to discern when hard work becomes harmful.

As it relates specifically to forgiveness, how do you do it? You decide to do it. And you have to decide to do it over and over again. It's not a decision you make once. It's one that you make over and over again. When that bitterness creeped in, Lord help me to forgive. My hope is that in sharing some of this,

others don't have to hurt in the same way. They can begin their own practice of self-advocacy and self-care and honoring the gifts that you have internally to really know and to attract what's best for you. We are back with another episode of the Woman Evolve podcast. I am your host, Sarah Dix Roberts. What is going on with you? How's your week been?

I just want you to know that, you know, when you're listening to this, you know, if you're listening to it when it drops, I just feel like you should know that your girl is on the eve of being 37, okay? The birthday is tomorrow and I am stepping into, you know, the grown woman era. It's my time to shine. It's my time to step into, you know, a further dimension of what it means to be an adult out here. I'm going to be 37 and I feel good about it, you know. I can't believe that like I'm actually turning 37 because it feels like, you know, at the risk of sounding like an auntie,

it feels like the whole thing is moving rather quickly, but also that it's been pretty long because, you know, when you think about, you know, you had two marriages, you know, three children biologically, added three children in your life after that. In 37 years, it actually, it's a lot of boxes that have been checked. But that's neither here nor there. I'm excited about it. I feel like for a woman my age that God has allowed me to experience

and be exposed to so many different things, and I'm just grateful for it. And so if you're listening to this, just drop me a little wisdom. What are you learning? about life that is exciting you. What are you learning as you grow when you age? That is defining how you see womanhood evolving how you see womanhood. I will say that I feel like I am tapping to a level of confidence and certainty and just peace that I am grateful for. And so I'm

excited to be spending my birthday eve with you. I hope that this finds you well. I want to know what's going on in your world. Like I said, listen, drop me a note. You know one of the things that I love to do is minding your business. But if I'm not minding your business, I want to hear just your advice and your wisdom, and you can do that by dropping me a message at 214-790-871. Again, that is 214-790-871. Drop me some wisdom, some advice, and let me know what you're learning. And because I am just not asking you all to drop me this, I am not playing any advice. episode, but we are going to play a mind-your-business question that I feel like it's just one that we're going to probably revisit every so often because it's a question that comes up often.

But I want you to hear it directly from my girl's mouth. So let's get into it. Hi, Sarah. So I am calling from Mississippi. My name is Shay. And I'm going through some things within my marriage, more of like a spiritual warfare. My biggest question is, how do you forgive? How do you learn to forgive even when you can't forget?

And how can I move forward whether I stay in my marriage or I let it go? But most importantly, how do you forgive? That's my question. I don't know if you're going to call me back to. gonna call me back or how this works. But that's what I want to know. Thank you. So we've heard it said once, we've heard it said twice.

I'm going to repeat it again, even though it's probably going to get on your nerves. It has been said, forgiveness is not for you. No, forgiveness is not for the other person. It is for you. But you know what, Loki? The petty side of me probably said it the way the petty side of me wanted to say it the first time. forgiveness is not about the other person, it is about you. I did a conversation with Ryan Leak, and I actually think his book is called Unforgivable,

which I actually think that's what it's called. You guys look up unoffendable. Unoffendable. His book is called Unoffendable. And it is super good. It's no offense, none taken. But he talks about forgiveness. and his message on forgiveness and letting go of the fence.

We did in the Wom and Evolve Book Club some years ago, and I really enjoyed the book. And he said something when I was interviewing him about the book that I felt like changed my paradigm about forgiveness. When we think about forgiveness, we think about it in the context of when is my heart going to be ready to release what happened to me? And when my heart is ready to release what happened to me,

then I will walk out forgiveness. What I learned in reading this book is that forgiveness is a disdivness. is a decision, right? We have to decide to forgive. Let's talk about when we decide that we're ready to start making healthier choices for our body. It's not necessarily that it comes to us and we're like, okay, now I'm finally ready. Like, you just get to this point where you realize the only way that I'm going to be healthy is if I make healthier choices. And none of the choices I'm making right now are leading to health. Some of them are leading to disease. Some of them are leading to just stiffness and not

having mobility in my body. And so similarly to when we are making a healthy lifestyle choice for our physical body, when you are making a healthy choice for your spiritual development, for your growth, it is a decision. It doesn't necessarily come when you feel like it. And so forgiveness is a choice that you are going to have to make for yourself. It's not going to be when the person feels like when the person is worth it. It's not going to be when the person says the right things or does the right things. Forgiveness is you making a choice that I am. ready to release this out of my heart and out of my spirit. Now, it can be difficult to forgive when that person is reoffending you over and over again. And so sometimes, in order to experience

forgiveness, you need to distance yourself from the person so that I can forgive you for me because the forgiveness is not because you necessarily deserve it. Now, we can get into how none of us deserve forgiveness and how it's the mercy of God that hasn't given us what we deserve and if the Lord can be merciful towards us, we can be merciful towards others. And all of that is true, but I am telling you, in order to walk and function in mercy, you may need some distance from the person. For me, forgiveness has come down to me forgiving even though I didn't receive certain apologies, forgiving even though I didn't necessarily see or witness the change in behavior. Forgiveness was a part of my personal

mission statement for my life, my personal values and morals for my life. For me, this is what I desire more than anything is I really want to be an imitator of God. So let me take you to the Bible. I take this very seriously just because I truly believe that we were made in the image of God. I do. I think that we came into this world. And though we were made into the image of God, that we have been, you know, conformed to different images. We've been conformed to the image of our pain.

We've been conformed to the image of our shame, conformed to the image of our shame, conform to the image of the culture, and in the process of being conformed to all of these different images, we have lost out on the reality that we were made in the image of God. I've said this scripture once before on this podcast, but I'm going to repeat it. Ephesians 5 and 1, this is Paul talking to the church at Ephesus, and he says, therefore be imitators of God as dear children. If that is your daddy, you need to look like your daddy. So that means, and walk in love, as Christ also has loved us and given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweet-smelling aroma. So my job is to be an imitator of God. If I'm going to be an imitator of God, what is then

required of me? When I begin to think about what is required of me, I realize that I can't walk around with bitterness. God is not bitter. It talks about, I think it's in Isaiah read the whole Bible. You'll find it how for his own sake, he throws away our transgressions. I don't hang on to what you did. I don't hang on to who you used to be because my own holiness will not allow for me to your wickedness, to your disobedience. I see it and I forget it. I see it and I forget it. Okay, so if I'm going to be an imitator of God, Lord, I didn't seen some things out here. I'm having a hard time with the forgetting part. How do I move into this part of forgiving? I make a decision that I want to release this person from the responsibility of taking care of my heart,

of healing what they've done to me, of understanding the impact of their choices and decisions, I am releasing this person from that. I was recently walking through my own forgiveness journey, and I opened up, I was going through a Bible study of Romans, and as I was reading it, and I was just thinking to myself, you know, how this person doesn't deserve my forgiveness, how I just don't want to let it go. The forgiveness, sometimes on forgiveness is like a warm blanket, because it just reminds me, like, you tried it and I won't forget it. Like, you'll never get over on me again. I'll never forget what I saw.

And that bitterness, that incubating, that pain becomes like a warm blanket for me. And I was reading in Romans 2 while hanging onto my warm blanket and my Bible study of bitterness. And Romans 2 and 1 says, therefore you are inexcusable, oh man, whoever you are who judge, are we talking about me? for and whatever you judge another, you condemn yourself, me? For you who judge practice the same things. I think not. But we know that the judgment of God is accordance to truth against those who practice such things. And do you think this,

oh man, you who judge those practicing such things and doing the same, that you will escape the judgment of God? And so I then had to ask myself, in what ways have I been in need of forgiveness? Maybe I haven't done the same thing that this person has done, but Lord knows I haven't been perfect. And there have been moments in my life where I needed forgiveness. And yet I'm judging someone and living comfortably in unforgiveness, even though I've had these moments myself. Unforgiveness makes us prideful because it says to them that though I have done things I need to be forgiven for, I've never done that thing, or I would have never done it that way, would never do that anymore. And so because I haven't done that thing, I am judging your actions,

judging your character, instead of coming to it from a place of humility and mercy where it's like, you know what? I know what it's like to be caught slipping before. Change behavior allows you maybe access to me again, but your forgiveness is not, your change behavior is not a prerequisite for forgiveness. I don't need you to change in order to forgive you. I need you to change in order to be in relationship with me. But it relates to forgiveness, I can release you from what you did because I know what it's like to be out here slipping and doing something you don't have no business doing, showing up in a way that is not pleasing and acceptable to God or others.

I know exactly how to do that. But I also realize that I need to distance myself so that I can forgive you and so that I can live in such a way that I'm not constantly being impacted by your poor decision making. But no shade on the poor decision making. know what I mean? So I think there's this tension, this balance of creating a boundary from a place of humility, forgiving from a place of humility, and making choices and decisions that allow you to preserve the holiness that you are in pursuit of. If being engaged and connected to a person keeps you from living out the level of purity that makes you an imitator of God, the level of

wisdom required to be made in the image of God, then you have to ask God, how do I navigate this relationship? It's a lot easier when it's a friendship, when it's a relationship that may not be as layered and complex as a marriage, but you need a word from God about how you navigate being in relationship with people that he's still working on. There are some people who are called to be in the struggle with someone while they are being transformed. Do you have the grace for that? Do you want God to give you the grace for that? Those are all things that you got to wrestle out in your relationship with God. But as it relates specifically to forgiveness, how do you do it?

You decide to do it over and over again. It's not a decision you make once. It's one that you make over and over again. When that bitterness creeps in, when that anger creeps in, Lord help me to forgive. I'm choosing to forgive. I'm choosing to release them from the responsibility to take care of me in that way. I am forgiving them for their inability to take care of me in that way.

That is the gift that you offer yourself and others when you choose to forgive. Forgiveness is a choice. I first heard Janice Omadecchi when I was listening to the Brune Brown podcast, when she was sharing her podcast, Unlocking Us and Dare to Lead Weekly, I would tune in religiously in order to hear from the incredible guest and leaders that she would bring on. And when I started hearing Janice story, I earmarked her story and I knew that one day I wanted to have a conversation with her. When I tell you, we only skim the surface of her intellect, of her wisdom, of her strategy as it relates to entrepreneurship and tech. But I believe that this is going to be the first of many conversations.

She is the CEO and founder of the mentor method and enterprise platform that assists companies in retaining and developing diverse talent through mentorship. This is a question that I get all of the time is I want to be mentored. How can I be mentored? And she really created a platform that strategically allows for partnership and mentorship to help those who are aspiring to scale their business, their corporate and professional pathways. And she has been recognized as one of Entrepreneur Magazine's 100 women of influence in 2022 and ranks amongst the first 100 black women to raise over $1 million in C.

lead funding for her first tech company. She is the author of mentorship, Unlocked the science and art of setting yourself up for success. She holds a certification in entrepreneurship from MIT, a certification in strategic management from Harvard University, and has over a decade of leadership experience in Fortune 500 companies. You are going to be blown away by this conversation, child. And let me tell you, I know a queen when I see one. And today we've got one in the building. from a corporate batty to leading that startup life. Help me welcome Janice to the podcast. Janice is the CEO and founder of the mentor method.

And like I said, the author of Mentorship Unlocked. I'm so hyped for this episode because we're about to get into the science and art of setting yourself up for success. Not to mention, her receipts are endless. So get ready to rethink your whole career strategy. Okay, so I am wondering, what is one belief that you had to surrender in order? to be who you are today in the process of all of the things that you have achieved and all of the many things that you have done to help really put people in positions of visibility, I recognize that often our greatest struggle are belief systems that are limiting to the dreams and purpose

that we feel like we're called to. And so I'm wondering, what's one of those beliefs that you had to give up? That I was superwoman and I could do everything by myself. and that I was supposed to be this martyr who had to suffer in order to receive reward. I think those are the biggest pieces that I've noticed. I think it stems from being a proud daughter of immigrants, coming from a very traditional family, and oftentimes a bit of that martyrdom, and also coming from a very traditional Christian upbringing,

the church that I was raised in oftentimes put martyrdom. as the currency for God's love. And that translated to me around my productivity and how I built my career, how I engaged in romantic relationships or just friendships, and it just permeated everywhere, but I know that it started early. And that was a belief that I've spent the last four years in deep therapy

and engaging with mentors and thinking about it to really ensure that those limiting beliefs wouldn't continue to follow me into my 30s and late 30s at this point. That's so good. I hear you saying that oftentimes we believe like the cost of success and even the cost of happiness is hurt and pain. Exactly. Or at least the willingness to endure those things. Yes. And then making decisions based on that, like, okay, well, this feels.

terrible and this is toxic and this is awful, whether it's a business partner or otherwise. And I remember at a certain point telling myself, well, that's okay if it is toxic. It's okay if I'm practicing self-neglect. It's okay if this person is constantly abusing my boundaries because I'll be rewarded on the other side if I just stick it out. And sometimes not in those situations and obviously my ability to engage in hard work and have grit and resilience

have led to a lot of my career milestones that I am so deeply grateful for and at the same time not having the filter to understand when those parts of myself that have been gifts from God and gifts to use to help others or to build a business

and continue advancing in my career versus knowing when somebody is using that belief that I had in a way to actually extract from me and not actually contribute to my well-being, that took a lot of learning. How do you find the balance in that? Like, how do you, what alarm goes off for you now when you're like, okay, this is moving beyond grit and into pain or into a sacrifice that has no rest of? reciprocity connected to it. There's a voice in my head and I start hearing certain phrases and words and terms,

almost like those old school word clouds that people would make to track the different trends at an event or something. I would hear self-neglect if I hear that, like a very clear voice that says you're practicing self-neglect. I listen to it. I take time with her. I want to understand what she's seeing and what she's seeing. and what she's hearing, I spend a lot of time going internal in my decision making and how I relate to

people. And I spend a lot of time listening to my body and the different parts of her that show up. I have practiced naming conventions to understand that if certain parts of me start kind of ringing their doorbell more consistently and are constantly showing up in ways that aren't fruitful to my mental health or well-being, that's them saying, hey, you're going in the wrong direction. Or maybe you're practicing optimism and not necessarily hearing the fine print or reviewing the fine print of what this person is saying. But being able to sit back and actually listen to my inner voice and trust her is how I've made better decisions and now understand. because sometimes too, I mean, I might just be tired and thirsty.

Yeah, right. And I'm just not practicing empathy and understanding what this individual is saying to me. But being able to sit back and practice at discernment, I have an incredible therapist. I've had incredible spiritual leadership coaches as well who have helped me parse out what's anxiety, what is actually a message from source and higher power, and just the wisdom to know the difference. but it has taken five years. It'll be five years next month that I've really been practicing and studying

and learning to trust myself. I think that's really the biggest piece is, you know, if you can trust yourself more fully to make the best decisions and to take care of yourself and your inner children, then that decision-making becomes significantly more clear. And the people that will gravitate towards you and want to engage with you

versus being upset with that growth also helps with your decision making and kind of repeating those processes so that your brain learns that it's safe to trust yourself. That's so good. I feel like any time that we are constantly overriding what we know to be our truth

in order to meet someone else's expectation, that we can only override that sensor so many times before we're living outside of that. our own integrity. And I think it's very difficult to be in relationship with people and to be in relationship with our dreams and our work ethic without really being sure about who we are at our core and really being, um, creating a practice of oneness and stillness where we are able to tap in so that we do know that like, okay, I've gone from overriding to throwing myself under the bus. And now life is just riding over me over and over and over again.

Exactly. And I think I wish that we started teaching the importance of self-parenting and not self-care. Of course, take all the bubble baths you want. Like if that is your self-care, do it. But when I'm referencing self-care, I'm thinking about that self-advocacy and the same nurturing, understanding, sitting down with a cup of tea and saying, tell me everything that you would do with a best friend or you would want a best friend to do for you. You have to. You have to. be able to do that for yourself. And I wish that we taught children that earlier and that we taught young women that earlier. It would have saved me a lot of time. I'm grateful. I mean, the outcome, obviously, is the success that I've received. And I'm grateful for those lessons. But I, my hope is that in sharing some of this, others don't have to hurt in the same way. They can begin their own practice of self-advocacy and self-care by way of just trusting and listening to yourself and honoring the gifts that you have internally to really know what's best for you and to attract what's best for you. I think I know the answer, but I'm going to ask this anyway.

Even though I know, have you ever asked for advice and you just know you're not going to listen to it? Like this is, I'm totally telling you right now, like I'm not ready to listen, but I'm going to ask anyway. How do we, let me ask this properly, I want to know how do we deal with the reality that oftentimes our success is attached to the toxic pattern of pushing ourselves, overriding ourselves, and move to a space of faith that says, I do not have to push so hard, and I still believe that I can find success in life without having to push so hard. Because I feel like it's more difficult to stop pushing and overriding our own needs, our own desires, and to really get in this rhythm of martyrdom for the sake of success and achievement.

And yet I recognize that it creates an unhealthy pattern in my life and in the lives of other people. But I feel like it takes faith to stop and faith to say I can still find contentment. I can still move at the pace that God has assigned to my life without trying to push so hard that I'm straining muscles and anxiety and need all these different things in order is sleep at night because I'm just so weary. If you feel that, that is your body telling you that you are over exhausting and overriding the system and that you have got to take a step back.

And I know what you're talking about. I felt that feeling three months ago in my career and I realized, okay, I am not actually serving my higher purpose. I am not living in a way that God actually wants me to. And it gets to a point, at least for me, where it is so loud and it's screaming at me. And every facet of life almost feels like it's falling away where everything's falling and you can't catch anything fast enough. You know, it feels like you need eight arms and everything is still slipping away. And I think sometimes practicing the wisdom to say, okay, when I hear the message, let me not be stubborn. and actually hear it the first time

instead of waiting for it to call and yell at me and almost push me over when it's told me 20 times before. But I think to answer your question around how do you handle advice that maybe isn't the most fruitful? I think leading with grace is helpful. Establishing your boundaries is helpful. If somebody is giving you advice that you know

is not actually going to contribute, a great way to just engage in the conversation if you want to is just say, well, what do you mean by that? Where is that coming from? And also remember that as rate of intentions that people may have,

they're human, and they're bringing their advice with years and years of experiential scar tissue that led to them thinking that this was the best solution for you. There is no way that people can be as objective as we'd like them.

to be. When you're giving advice, obviously, you want to be as objective, focus on the individual, what is important to them, their metrics that matter, practicing empathy, compassion, active listening, all of the things that make communication so vital and important. But we oftentimes don't check our blind spots around whether or not we're projecting our own experiences into the advice of that person. And I personally do not take the time in a conversation if somebody's giving me less than fruitful advice to dig into sort of their baggage and where that came from. But I will ask them, what makes you say that? And then actually listen to it and then do your own self-work and self-parenting and self-care of just flagging that and saying,

okay, for questions around this particular topic, maybe I shouldn't go to this individual and trust your gut and trust that you'll know not to apply that. And then also take it back for yourself and think about it and say, okay, well, what was it that I didn't like about that advice? Was it the person? Do I just not trust them? That's good to know. Is it that I feel called out and I don't like the mirror that this person just tried to hold up to me and I don't like the woman that I saw in that mirror? That's something to take note of. Is it just that maybe the ego radar when you were coming in, you thought that maybe this person would just amplify you and confirm some of your preexisting notions on the path that you thought you would take. And now that they're giving you advice that maybe highlights the changes that need

to be made and those changes sound hard or scary, you're like, well, you know, but just really be internal and think about the resistance to that change. Sometimes it really is just that person is not your person. And their advice is not going to actually serve you and your intuition is telling you that. And other times it's an indicator of growth that maybe there's just some hesitancy and resistance to because it's new and change can be scary. Change can be so scary and yet without change, we don't experience the growth that is assigned to, I think, our professions, our relationships, even our own self-development. When talking about change, I am reminded of your advocacy for diversity and inclusion in the workplace,

which is certainly an area where we are experiencing conversations about change. And it is not lost on me that even the notion of having diversity and inclusion was changed for the way many organizations were functioning.

I am wondering, what are some of your current thoughts, hopes, fears as it relates to diversity and inclusion in the workplace right now? I can't believe how under attack we are for simply existing. Yeah. I'm still, I'm experiencing in real time with everyone else. The disbelief, the shock. You know, for me personally, I am a proud daughter of immigrants. They came to this country through college scholarships from missionaries that came to the village and supported them. They came from absolutely nothing, working multiple jobs.

both in undergrad and after graduating. My parents didn't even know each other. They have worked so hard to ensure that the world that I have and my siblings have was one where we could be proud to be in this country. And they made sure that we understood where we came from and that the most important thing was to be able to amplify others with the privilege that we have of being born and raised here. the DC area now based in Austin, Texas.

And the idea that having an open heart and wanting to use the privilege of the gifts and like the accomplishments and everything else to amplify others is now seen as a negative. And the idea that everybody can thrive and be themselves and feel free to actually just do good work and work that they're proud of. now have to, again, feel like they have to diminish themselves, just to fit in and be able to take care of their families. It's just, it's mind-blowing to me. It's something that I am trying to reconcile myself.

It's something that I am trying to give comfort to friends, colleagues, neighbors, everybody, because, you know, people know that that's a big area of my career. And I wish I had more answers, but I am also trying to parse this out. And it feels like my head is spinning on a daily basis with the difference in the headlines and the difference of opinions and wanting to hold space. But then also hearing my inner children running around screaming like what's happening in the space that was supposed to be what that was supposed to feel safe for us. It's wild and it's not what we're just not living in the values that I understood this nation to be and what I understood Christianity. to be, and I know that that doesn't have a space in the workplace, but those values persist. And the idea that these values of hatred and bigotry and wanting to silo when it's not necessary,

since these systems are already put in place for majority stakeholders to always thrive, it's just, yeah, it's an entire conversation that we could have, but I just, my heart is heavy, and I'm angry. I feel like I live in an interesting intersection as a woman, as a black woman, as a black woman preacher that I exist within an intersection that I don't often talk about a lot. But when we start having conversations about diversity and inclusion, because of where I am positioned, I hear super conservative Christians who are advocates for the dismantling of. of diversity and inclusion, but also as a woman, a black woman, I'm on the other side of conversations where I hear the need and necessity for us to really create space. And I feel like as much as I want to be a translator and an interpreter, I think it's really rooted in trying to understand the other

viewpoint first, because I don't think that you can really change people's mind until you really understand what it is that they're thinking. And many people find it very difficult to believe that the conversation about diversity and inclusion is not about taking unqualified individuals and giving them unilateral authority and power and roles that they are ill-equipped or unprepared for. I am curious, as you're doing this work, what is it that you feel those who are opposed to diversity inclusion? What is it? that you feel like they're missing as a part of their perspective that would maybe help them to understand

more effectively the plight of those who have felt othered by systems? That the starting line wasn't equitable since birth. And that the opportunities that are oftentimes seen as just a natural occurrence of life aren't actually as natural as they may believe. And that it is a gift to believe that it is a natural occurrence because there are several people who have been taught instead that their definition of natural occurrences are pipe dreams and things that generations have never experienced so they should not even consider

striving for it. And to understand that their comfort is not a baseline for the billions of, of people who are actively seeking opportunities to just get in the room and to learn and to grow and not take away. I think the understanding that education doesn't end once you have whatever diploma, degree certification you go after. It's not about the book smarts when you're at work especially, you are relating to several people on a daily basis with different lived experiences. And if you're unable to practice that empathy and just even 2% more self-awareness to recognize that your definition of life, if you have the privilege of being able to have that view,

is not equitable to what others who are seeking to get into the room have, the ability to have that conversation is a little bit more challenging. I think the last piece I would say is just educate yourselves. I think there is a greater need to improve education and take that ownership of seeking to understand, not just asking the one or two underrepresented people that you know, tell me your lived experience. It is emotionally draining to put that emotional labor on an individual to now be a representation of billions of people. So leverage experts, leverage published authors who have books on the topics in which you're thinking about. If you're curious about race, go to the bookstore, preferably local so that you are supporting a small business and the author simultaneously.

But get the books. Start educating yourself. Go to the known experts so that you can actually learn at that level, the historical content. of where this is coming from, the implications of it, understand how it's going to impact people around you, and maybe people you don't know, but there is, you know, those nine degrees of separation is very, very true. And really taking time to educate yourself from trusted experts, not just, you know, somebody you see on TikTok, like a real trusted expert rooted in a strong understanding of how it impacts the world would be my recommendation there. I love that. I love that recommendation because what you said about our education doesn't end when the

textbook closes when we take those final exams. But to really see the world as an opportunity to learn what life is like through other people's experiences, I think it is a perfect segue into the passion that you have for mentorship. And I want to talk, man, I have 18,000 questions to ask you about mentorship. I want to ask you how important it is to have a mentor that understands where you're coming from, but also to have mentors that may not necessarily look like you, sound like you, but have the ability to open up the world to you in a way that you may not otherwise have access to. It is important to diversify your board of mentors, the same way it's important for you to.

to diversify your assets if you can. Period. You know, you wouldn't put all of your eggs in one basket. And I tell people all the time, you know, if you look at the most successful entrepreneurs, when they're setting up their teams and their boards, they don't go to just one person for every single aspect of what makes their business operate. And your career and who you go to for mentorship is the exact same thing, whether it's in your career or not. I think it's important to diversify. You should have mentors that are related to your career and your personal life. I think it's important to have mentors who can really see you and just jump in and understand because they've had similar experiences to you. That is very important. That feeling of being seen and seen quickly

is a lifesaver. And you also want to make sure that you are diversifying the pool of thoughts that are contributing to your growth so that maybe there's a blind spot that you haven't paid attention to you. And because this particular mentor is the exact same or similar experience, maybe they're also not aware of that. And you want to ensure that you're keeping an open mind and expanding your knowledge and understanding of yourself with as much information as possible. And then again, going back to trusting yourself.

But it's very important to have a diverse set of mentors just to make sure that you're getting that breadth of information. Can you tell me about one piece of advice a mentor gave you that completely changed your outlook on life or one particular aspect of your life? The importance of negotiation and that everything is a negotiation that doesn't require wielding an axe.

I always like to tell people, you know, my first foray into understanding negotiation came from scandal and how to get away with murder and that magical time of Thursday night TV. That magical time, like Thursdays have not been the same. I missed the popcorn and wine. Yes, exactly. It was incredible.

And I felt so seen. However, if you were trying, to translate a script into defense contracting as a 25-year-old, there's a gap, right, between what you're seeing that feels good and is inspiring and reality when you're in that position. And so one of my first mentors, I remember telling her about a situation at work and I was just so frustrated by it. It's actually why I started the mentor method in my first business, but she was the first person who reminded me that every conversation is a negotiation because one person has an objective or a goal that they'd like to engage in.

You have yours. So how can you either try to meet in the middle or figure out the best solution from that? How are you actually presenting your case? Whether it's, hey, where do you want to go to dinner? do you want chicken, do you want steak? If that person wants steak and you want pizza, that's technically a negotiation where now you need to discuss. Well, I would really like pizza because I worked out five days

and today's my cheat day and I don't want as much red meat, whatever it is, but actually having those conversations with people. That's a negotiation. And so she taught me the importance of communicating with grace and trying to communicate with compassion and empathy

and seeking to be the bigger person where applicable so that you actually do get the outcomes you want versus kind of going in guns blazing and that individual isn't able to actually then meet you in a more fruitful space when you're engaging in that. I really like that because I feel like for women who have found themselves unable to be assertive or they have found themselves more comfortable

being kind of behind the scenes, playing the demure role, and often denying, like, the room and opportunities because they would have to come off forceful and they don't want to, you know, rub anyone the wrong way. I feel like what you're saying is a real, a happy medium between, like, I want to understand where you're coming from. I want to have empathy. But I also want to create space from my thoughts, my opinions, my desires in this negotiation as well. I want to know like how do you give yourself permission to do that to show up and advocate for yourself but to still function in kindness and empathy because I feel like for many women it feels like if I'm not like this sweet nice little girl then I have to be this bad boss that is like coming in

flipping tables and neither one of them feel completely organic to who I am how do we marry those I would first start with doing a script as if you were Wes Anderson and you were describing the woman that you are and the woman you know yourself to be and the woman you want to be, literally all three. So for context, Wes Anderson is one of my favorites is so quirky and I like the way that he summarizes his main characters at the beginning of every film.

because it's not just, let's use me, for example, it wouldn't be Janice's serial entrepreneur who has had some trauma and channeled it into growth and helping others find pathways through of healing, through using that to amplify others. Right?

I think that's kind of like the headline or like my LinkedIn. It would be like, Janice woke up at 5 a.m. with her best friend, morning anxiety, and she had to take a 15-minute walk around her apartment

and to get some fresh air. And just sort of those inner details of like, who is that person? What do they actually believe? What is their morning like? What is she having for breakfast? Does she even eat breakfast? What does she actually believe? And then once you have that,

put yourself in the scenario that you're assessing. If you're going into a difficult conversation or you're going into a space where DEI has been removed, just circling back to that, think about who that woman, you will be proud of would enter the room and just start writing the script. Don't put the pressure on yourself to be that. Just ideal situation, write it out, read it, figure out what resonates for you,

and then start putting some pieces in place to begin getting comfortable with becoming that woman. Write down, what about that makes you so uncomfortable? What about advocating for yourself makes you so uncomfortable? Does that come from limiting beliefs that? were put upon you? Or are they beliefs that you learned from certain situations from your past? How old were you when that happened?

Who was that little girl that was hurt that taught you to self-abandon yourself? Right? Sit with her. Talk to her. Walk her through what's happening in this scenario now. Walk her through what will happen when it goes well and believe that it will go well and believe that if it doesn't, you'll be okay. And walk her through those scenarios.

walk her through other examples of how you have survived 100% of the things that you've been through and actually show her that it is okay for her to trust present you now and that you have the wisdom to make the best possible decisions and the strength and hopefully the community around you so that if it's not the desired outcome, you know that it's just a pathway to the outcome that is really meant for you.

That would be my advice on that. And I know it's easier said than done, right? Like I've been in therapy for five years every other Tuesday. And quite honestly, even last week, I was like, you know what? No, I'm going to push the fight button right now in this conversation. So I know that it's easier said than done. But when you can actually take some time and write those life scripts, begin becoming her, forgiving little you and holding that time to care for her.

and see that the growth that you've taken and the steps that you've taken have all worked out in your favor. I have seen that just completely changed the way that I've interacted in my day to day and just the way that I view life in general. Actually, I don't know if I agree with you about it being easier said than done because I do think what makes it so hard is the idea that I'm supposed to wake up and step into this person. I feel like being able to write that vision and make it plain allows you to start flirting. with the person you want to become. And if you can't visualize it, if you can't figure out what's important to that person, what they believe, then it is more difficult to step into it. It feels impossible.

But I feel like you're not risking anything by writing it down. And by writing it down, you begin to remove those limits. So, I mean, it is quite literally easier said than done, but it is, I think, the most easy first step that any person can take when beginning to really change the way they're showing up in the world. Take that first step. For me, I think it's the idea that you write it, you go to sleep, you wake up, and all of your limiting beliefs have just gone away. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

The routines that you've built that maybe aren't serving your path to becoming that woman have just magically gone away. Right. And suddenly, you know, you're waking up and you're, you know, getting your 10,000 steps in or whatever routines you feel. feel it will be better for you, removing your vices and habits and just immediately becoming that person. For me, personally, I know that it took me quite some time to really understand those and release my dependency on them as I was becoming the woman that I would be so proud of being today. I hate that we are running out of time. I have to ask you, I'm going to end up running a little late for our next interview, but I have to ask you because I feel like it just fits so perfectly.

let's say we write the vision, we step into the vision, we're reading the script, we're owning it, but when it's time for us to close that door and put that bonnet on, we were like, I do not know who that person was, I don't trust her, I have imposter syndrome. Can you help me understand, especially for women in leadership? Have you dealt with it? How do you push past it, give it a moment to speak, breathe, and then deny it? Like, what is the process for imposter syndrome? Of course, short answers, yes. Of course, I have felt that. And there's just a difference. For me, I remind myself that being a complete person means that you are a compilation of parts. And some parts will need to take up more emotional labor and do a little bit more work

in moments than others. So if you're getting ready for a big presentation or you're going to work and there's something important happening, sit back and really talk to yourself and say, okay, the part of me that can advocate for myself, the part of me that can public speak, the part of whatever it is, the part of me that will support the future that I am advocating for, I need you to just give me 10% more.

I need you to be the star of this movie right now. Spotlights on you. It is your time to shine. while these other parts of me, like the nervousness or the imposter syndrome, I hear you, I love you, but I need you to just kind of sit on the couch with me while this piece goes forward and let's watch how great she shines, right? Like let's hype her up. Let's tell her that she's doing a good job, but I'm going to need you to sit with me here while we do that and actually giving your body the time to say yes

and give her the permission to say yes. And then remembering and telling the part of you that needs to kind of step it up, that it's temporary and holding space for her and say, I love you, you are strong, I am grateful for you, and just know that this is temporary. So give it 110% in the arena right now, girl, because once you're done, we will have these treats for you. Think about your self-care process for after you've done that. I think psychologically reminding yourself with rewards that you did a good job, it could be something as small as being able to sit on your patio for an extra 10 minutes that evening or calling a friend, but have some sort of reward waiting for you.

Studies have shown that when you have something that you're looking forward to, you actually end up overperforming in most cases. So telling that part of you that maybe isn't as comfortable being that forward, that there is something outside of just productivity and capitalism in it for them, and then allowing it to come back and allowing it to come back and allowing, those parts of you that maybe we're sitting back and kind of zipping up for the moment to then take the spotlight. And then finally giving yourself that self-care would be the process. Janice, I hate that we did not have it. You have to do a part too with me because I feel like

I've only scratched the surface, especially for my women in leadership and entrepreneurship. So please promise me that I can bother you again soon. It is never a bother and I would be honored. Thank you so much for having me. My pleasure. Thank you. I really feel like the gems that were dropped here were plenty, and I hope y'all caught every last single one. Since the impossible is closer than you think.

Today's episode is a powerful reminder that no dream is too big for God and that mentorship is out here changing the game. Janus, thank you so much for your wisdom. It has truly been a gift, and I'm so appreciative of it. You've shifted our mindsets and shown us a way. way forward both personally and professionally. God, I'm praying for the dream of every woman who's listening to this podcast and some of the fellas who are chimed in as well. God, as they seek to understand what their unique gifts, talents, and offerings are, I pray that you would make the

path clear, that you would allow them to experience the gift of mentorship in its perfect timing. If they're in a season right now of isolation, maybe you're cultivating, independence, resilience, creativity inside of them. God, I pray that you would give them the peace of knowing that you see them and you know exactly what they need, when they need it, and what they don't need. Continue to order our steps and give us the strength to take them. In Jesus' name, I pray. Amen. Evolve.