Woman Evolve with Sarah Jakes Roberts - The Sound of Freedom w/ Martha Munizzi

Episode Date: September 24, 2025

We were wondering where the real worshipers were at? So, the legendary, award-winning singer, songwriter, and Pastor Martha Munizzi popped out with SJR to remind us! Before setting the record straight on that whole Gospel vs. CCM debate, she tells the story of how her sound was rooted in gospel traditions and, chile…one thing's for sure: Martha Munizzi gon' always be invited to the cookout! Wait until you hear these two discuss what it's like for women operating in male-dominated spaces, balancing family and ministry, plus the freedom we're all called to walk in, sis. To stay connected with the amazing ministry work she's doing, swing by marthamunizzi.com.

Perhaps God doesn't have any question about whether or not you can do it, but it's whether or not you can be the kind of person who can do it for the long call. The kind of person that can do it in a different climate and with a different generation in an industry that is constantly changing. We're more alike than we are different. There's more love, commitment, and community than the culture would have us think. But if we let the voices of the world separate us, that's on us. But the answer is still love. This is Sarah Jake's Roberts and you are listening to the Woman Evol podcast. If you knew what I had just gone through to set this up, you'd be shocked and amazed.

But let me tell you something. I'm trying something different. I'm trying something new. And as a result, there's been lots of trial and error. I tried to change the way that I record because you're listening. Some of you are listening so you don't even know what's happening here. But if you catch this video, I am trying to change from just sitting at my desk when I'm recording the intro and outro to sitting in front of the camera and the background just wasn't giving. So I have been in this office

trying to find the right background for this podcast. And this is what you get. And if you can't see it, that's sad because I just went through a lot for you to not be able to see it. But whatever, we're back. Welcome to the Woman Evolved podcast. I am your host, there, Jake Roberts. And if you can see me, I'm really saying this in the most unimpressed, unamused energy because I just struggled for my life. And it is 4.17 p.m. And I need to leave for Wednesday night Bible study and talk to my a daughter who had a hard day at school. So we're getting what we get and we don't get upset today. How are you? What's going on in your world? Can I tell you all? Oh, my goodness. I just had an amazing meeting. And just to give you some, maybe some background and some color, I have felt for a long

time that I am on the brink of fully maximizing the potential of one of our organizations. but because I don't have this skill set and experience, I felt limited and my ability to expand and scale commiserate to what I believe God's called it to be. And I've been feeling frustrated because I feel like there is this opportunity for growth. But I'll be the first one to tell you, I don't know what I'm doing. And so I tried to hire my way out of doing what God told me to do. I tried to hire my way out of stepping into something that I don't know. I tried to hire myself out of the possibility for disappointment and failure. And all of those things failed tremendously and significantly.

And so right after conference, to be exact, I started thinking to myself, okay, I've had to learn to do things that I didn't know how to do all the time. The stakes seem a little bit higher, but I'm going to try. and I just had a meeting today that reminded me that God knows what he got when he got me and he knows he didn't get much, but that he got someone who would try. And I think that we want to deliver on the, if you're like me, you can want to deliver on the level of who God is. And that level can be so great, so beyond where you think you are, that you disqualify yourself. because you know you can't deliver on that level of greatness.

And yet the reality is that God is not asking us to deliver on his level of greatness. He's asking us to deliver on our level of greatness. And through our partnership, you bring what you got. God brings what he has. Then we see miracle, signs, wonders, manifestations of the faith required for us to do the thing that God called us to do. And so I brought my greatness, which in comparison doesn't seem like much. And I just saw God breathe on it. I don't know what's going to happen. I don't know what will come from the meeting. But what I know for sure is that God granted me an opportunity to stand up and to trust and to stumble and to stumble and maybe mispronounce some words in terms, but to still share my heart and passion and the possibility. that I believe exists. So that's been a good day. What else do? Oh, I'm preaching this week in Dallas.

Well, by the time you heard it, I would have already preached. So let me try and give you a little bit of a preview. I feel like God is dealing with my heart. I heard the word revival. So I've been studying for revival. And I don't know if you all know this. Like revival, the term is nowhere in the Bible. but revival experiences are in the Bible. And revival is a spiritual awakening. So sometimes people can be believers and they can be in the routine of their faith journey. And then something happens. Maybe it's devastation.

Maybe there's a prophet that comes and tells you, oh, my goodness, no. You got to get out of your way of thinking so that you can experience an awakening to what God is doing now. a hunger and a thirst for who God is that perhaps your family hasn't seen, your community hasn't seen, your nation hasn't seen. And so I've been studying revival and you can't have revival without repentance. And so I've been studying what it means to be repentant. And I think we all, I mean, if you don't know, repentance literally means it is a changing of your mind. I wrote down the Greek, and y'all don't care because I'm about to preach this or I would have already preached it. but I'm going to just share with you all what I wrote down about repentance,

even though I don't see it in my notes. Where's the notes? Let me go to my Bible. I'm going to go to Matthew chapter 2. And in Matthew chapter 2, now let me go to Matthew chapter 3. And chapter 3 verse 2 talks about John the Baptist saying to everyone repent. the Baptist is Jesus' cousin, Jesus' older cousin, who came before he did. And that word repent, this is what I wanted you to get. It is to think differently or afterwards or to reconsider.

To repent is to reconsider to think differently. And I feel like if we are going to experience revival in our nation, revival in our hearts, revival in our home, that there are going to have to be some things that we are willing to think differently about. And, not just to think differently, but to be remorseful that we thought the way we did in the first place. I think that part of this growth mindset mentality allows us to embrace the fact that we need to think differently, but it doesn't always position us to be remorseful for the way that we thought. And there is a connection between repentance and remorse where I can't believe I think, thought that, that I've been taking you for granted, that I became desensitized to conviction,

that I wanted my will over your will. There's a remorse and a repentance that leads to revival. A remorse, a repentance, and a reviving that is a part of revival, a reawakening, a hunger. So anyways, that's what I'm praying about. We'll see right now it's Wednesday. I could wake up Thursday and the Lord just tell me, you know what, that was for you and you alone. I've got something different for the people, so we'll see. I also have two exams in college this week. And the praise that I had when I found out that it was open book and open notes in one of them. The other one is not open books or open notes. And blessed be the rock and blessed be the lamb. And I'll just leave it at that. And I'll report back when I have answers about how that test went.

So that's what's going on in my world. I don't know if you know this or not. I'm on TikTok and on Instagram, and I've been trying to step up my content, I guess, because usually I post my messages. I post curated things that, like, maybe have to do a recap from conference or something from church, but nothing as personal. I usually just take pictures. I cannot believe that that. Can y'all hear that?

Just in case you can't hear it, the lawnmower is going. But just in case you can hear it, the lawnmower is going. can hear it, the lawnmower's going. And I've already fought for my life to get this going. So hopefully they can isolate the sound and we can keep a pushing because going out there and hollering, that don't seem like what God has for me today. But the exams, the test, pray for me, love you. Let me mind your business. Hello, Sarah. Thank you for minding my business. So I wanted to ask, what happens when you're kind of like, you know, you're far from your old self, right?

And you're getting into your new stuff, but you're not quite there yet. And you're also going through, you know, your purpose, but you're not quite there yet. You're literally right in the middle. What happens when you lose your willpower to keep going? Like, what happens when, like, you want to reach to where you're going? I know it's a journey. It's not necessarily a destination. But what happens when you lose your why or your wife?

I keep moving, so you're no longer motivated. And then you start to slowly go back into your own habits and then, like, you try to repent. And it's kind of like your old you is still winning. Like, what do you do in that moment or in that season? How do you, you know, get back on track really close to God? Because I feel like I've done it before. And I've done it before and I've done it before. And it's like, no, I want to stay on track, but I can feel myself flipping.

So I hope you can help me with that. Thank you for minding my business. The fact that she asked about repentant, like where she mentioned the word repentance, I'm maybe on something with this message on Sunday. The girl, first of all, thank you. Thank you so much for sending me your question. You want to know how can you get to a space when you haven't quite arrived to where you know you're supposed to be. But you've also moved beyond who you once were.

And you're trying to figure out, how do I get to a space where I'm not going backwards, where I'm not constantly vacillating? And I can just stay anchored. And I, the only, the most recent, am I going to be this? The most recent time that I have where I could relate to this is probably in the succession transition with my dad and the church. And there being moments where it felt so clear. You know, we've been going through this process for over three years.

And there were moments where things felt so clear. I was like ready and I could take it on. And then there were moments where things were slowing down or we would need to communicate more about different things. And I was just, I don't, it's all right. We don't have to do this. And I kept going back to the drawing board with God because I'm like, God, you know, what is it that you want me to do? And God hadn't given me any other thing to do beyond come to Dallas. And I always told my husband when we first moved, I'm like, we're either going to Dallas to determine that this is something that God has for us or to ensure that it's something that it's not. And I never got any other direction, even in the midst of the tension,

or I was like, God, what do you want me to do? And so what I know now that I didn't know then is that I was ready, how can I say this? I was ready to do the work of my purpose, but I wasn't the person who could do the work yet. I was ready to do the work that I thought was associated with my purpose, but there was a becoming that I needed to tap into that only time could reveal. And it was going to take time for me to fully step into, not time, but introspection, growth, development, healing in order for me to be the person who could step into the purpose and not just the person who could do the work of the purpose. And sometimes when we have proven that we can do hard things, that we're ready to do the work.

work of whatever our purpose requires. It's like, God, if you open the door, God, if you make it happen, I am ready to do the work, but the work isn't there. The passion is there, but the work isn't there. But that's because the becoming needs to happen before the doing. Perhaps God doesn't have any question about whether or not you can do it, but it's whether or not you can be the kind of person who can do it for the long call, the kind of person that can do it in a different climate and with a different generation in an industry that is constantly changing. And so I learned to be patient with God's timing, and I learn to stop looking for something to do and ask God more intentionally, because I don't have the work to do as far as with my hands or with my mind or with

my creativity, search my heart, Lord, help me to understand what's in my heart that you want to cultivate and that you want to develop. Help me to maximize that the work that you have for me today. Give me this day my daily bread. How do you want me to show up in this season right now? And from that place of not being so anxious for next that I miss out on the opportunity for now, I was able to settle into myself. And there is a settling into myself the practice of it that is required now. So now we've stepped into it. And it's not the work is different than I anticipated.

And I have to become a different person in order to do it. And I think understanding your patterns and your rhythms, what throws me off track, what makes me lose my motivation, what makes me lose my motivation, what makes me lose my inspiration and how do I rebound from those moments? We talked about repenting, but how do I rebound from those moments? What triggers them and what does rebounding look like for me? And the passion for me is not necessarily, and sometimes you have to reclaim your passion, right? Because your passion gets hijacked by metrics, by success, by failure, by disappointment, by criticism. You have to reclaim your passion, but passion for me is knowing that I'm doing what God's told me to do, that my passion is

in my obedience. And reclaiming that passion and not making it about performance has been very helpful for me. And so I'm trying to think about, oh, do we see Jesus in the garden, right? And his passion is certainly losing, it's certainly waning as it relates to him going to the cross. He's like, Lord, if it's your will, if you could get someone else to take this cup, if you could pass this cup from me. And he says, nevertheless, not my will, but your will be done. In other words, what's ahead of me is not necessarily something that I feel capable of doing. If there were someone else who could take this cup of sin that I'm about to drink and do it,

I would certainly take the pass. And yet, at the end of the day, I'm willing to surrender what I want for who you need me to be in this moment. And I don't believe that Pastor Phil Monty says this all the time. Your purpose isn't going anywhere without you. I don't believe that it is possible for me to miss what God has for me, but it is possible for me to miss who I need to become to lay hold of it. And asking God constantly, where do you need my heart posture? What thoughts do I need to take into captivity?

What area of forgiveness do I need to operate in so that you can have a blank canvas? I want God to have a blank canvas for the next stage of my life. I want him to be able to write whatever story he deems necessary. And so I hope this is helpful for you as it relates to that in-between stage and the awkward tension of it all. It's real. I feel it. I have felt it.

I'm sure I will feel it again. And you want to stay locked in. And I think staying locked in is creating this range that you live in. if I'm thinking about a number line and you know how like the middle can say zero and then the other side can have positives and the other side can have negatives and those moments where you feel yourself going back into those negative zones to know like oh this is what happens when X, Y and Z occurs and in order for me to move into the next to move into the positive to move into a space of being anchored, this is the tool that I need. I think that that may be the most. steadied version of yourself that you're able to tap into is the version of yourself that understands that I vacillate that in my insecurity and my pride and my frustration and my confidence and my impatience that I can start to get frustrated and resistant and from that place I do and say certain things or behaviors that I wouldn't normally engage in are easier

for me to tap into. That's a sign for me that I need to dig deeper, that I'm upset, that I'm this, that I'm that. And I will just say a practice of gratitude is also helpful, but just serving where you are now can help you to deal with the frustration of not being where you want to be. I hope that helps. I don't know who needs to hear this, but self-care is not selfish. Say it with me. Self-care is not selfish. Let that resonate in your spirit real deep. September is National Self-Care Month, and I believe that it is so important to our overall well-being that we remind ourselves to take up space in this beautiful life that we're building and trying to create for ourselves, our friends, our family, our community, that we leave space

for ourselves to ask yourself every now and then, even if you cannot, this is a practice, even if you cannot do it, I want you to ask yourself, what would I want to do for myself today. Sometimes we'll learn that they aren't as grand and big and lofty as we think they are. Sometimes it's just, I want 10 minutes in the car and we find a way to carve out those 10 minutes in the car. Sometimes we want to escape. Sometimes we want to escape. We want to get up out of here, get up at a dodge. But when you cannot get up out of dodge, you can create a little die, a little die in the car. We'll get you a little dodge. Self-care is a practice that we should engage in every single day. For me, self-care comes down to my prayer, my worship, being

edified and reminded of who I am to be in God and then creating space for me to release and exhale who I have become in pursuit of taking care of other people and trying to build my life, my career, our businesses, our ministries, and organization reminding myself who I am supposed to be at my core, the love that is available to me, the peace that is available to me, and then allowing myself to love on me. So here's your reminder to love on yourself. It comes as no surprise to me that National Self-Care Month and National Suicide Prevention Month are going hand in hand. Sometimes life can get so hard, so challenging, so difficult, and sometimes it feels like the only way that we can survive or the only way to even make sense of things is to not be here anymore.

I have felt those feelings myself sometimes, but I just want you to know that if you're getting this message that you are so necessary, God did not make a mistake when he created you. God's got plans to prosper you and not to harm you. And even when you can't feel God's presence, it doesn't mean that God's not there. My prayer for you is that the Holy Spirit would send comfort, would send tools, would send guidance, that would allow you to find the language and the power you need to ask for the help and connection to lead you from this dark season. May the Lord remind you that trouble doesn't last always and that there can be peace even in the midst of storms. May the Holy Spirit allow you to experience the help and the comfort that comes from God and flows through people.

National Suicide Prevention Month is something that we cannot ignore. It's something that we have to talk about more in our communities, the reality of darkness, depression, anxiety, but also the reality that with tools, medications, support, prayer, and connection, that we can make it to the other side. So I am praying for those of you who have experienced suicidal thoughts and ideations and are looking to share your story to help other people overcome. There's no time like they're present to help someone feel less alone. And right now, if that is your current battle and struggle and you're hearing this, please let this be a reminder that someone's thinking about you. That someone is me, that someone is God. There are so many of us who are thinking about those who are going through dark seasons. we are praying that light would find you, not just come towards you, but the light inside of you

through Jesus would come alive and to help lead you and guide you through this season. You know, one of the things that has been so helpful for me in the midst of all of the things that I have gone through is worship. I thought worship was one of those things that was reserved for when you have the best perspective of who God is and that it was one of those things that you do the best. best when your life is on the mountaintops. I have learned that the real beauty of worship is when you're allowed to experience it in dark and hard seasons. God is not just the God of our victories. God is the God who will sit with us in our valleys. Yay, though I walk through the valley of the shadow

of death, you're with me. Though I make my bed in hell, you'll be there with me. Though he slay me, yet shall I trust in him? These are all verses and scriptures that have become. synonymous with the reality that life gets hard, but our worship can still exist even in those hard seasons. How do we worship in hard seasons? Because God is still God in the midst of it all. And because God is who he is, his presence can help us carry and lift the load of whatever struggle we are experiencing. And worship and hard seasons go hand in hand. And there are some voices, some songs that have carried generations and generations through different moments of history. And I would consider Martha Munezzi one of those voices.

For those of you who don't know Martha, Martha Munezzi was invited to the cookout before the hamburgers were on the grill. You know what I mean? Before we decided who was hosting the cookout, Martha Munezzi was on the guest list. And she has recently sat down with me at 4th. the Woman Evolved podcast and she's done so to help us understand her incredible historic career. If you know anything about gospel music, worship, and legacy, then you already know she's been paving the way for years. We went deep. Okay, we talked about family, ministry, womanhood,

and what it really means to walk in freedom. I think one of the highlights of our conversation was her talking about the dynamic that she has with her husband as they are leading together and what it looks like to be leading with your husband when she is the more prominent teaching pastor in their church. And yet she also has a, I want to say it properly. I don't know why for some reason the word explosive comes to mind, but she has such an energetic personality and a strong personality that she's navigating that in the context of her decades-long marriage. And so she shares some insights that she's learned from that. I want you to lean in, take notes, and soak up the wisdom and laughter and truth that only Martha can bring. Let's get into it.

I do feel like when women are in ministry, there is so much, there's so much belief that, like, they're just speaking primarily to women. Yes. That we don't really talk about the reality of, like, women being in ministry is really women being in a male-dominated field. Yes. And the pressures that come with that, the responsibilities that come with that aren't something that we speak about often. And I've seen so many women in ministry have to feel like, just like women in corporate spaces, that in order to really be respected in this field, that I may need to minimize my femininity. I can't be emotional. I have to make sure that I'm thinking like one of the guys. And yet, I also believe that there is something happening culturally within faith spaces. corporate spaces where we're recognizing that a woman being authentically herself, whether that is empathetic and nurturing or more straightforward and direct, is really the only way that we can maximize our ability to reach as many people as possible. But I'm curious for you as a woman

in ministry, how have you navigated the complexities of being in that male-dominated space? Well, I'm grateful for a husband that supports me and pushes me and has for 30, 38 years and says, you know, the gifts is on you. I don't have that gift. Hold on. I'm sorry, 38 years? 38 years. Yes. Ma'am, you're giving 38 years old. Wait a minute. Well, thank you. I work on that. Believe me, I work on that. Yeah. Well, I was 19 when we got married, so we were very young and grew up together in ministry.

And music ministry was our foundation. That's what we did. My husband was a musician. and so we just were very comfortable in that, and I was out singing and being, you know, myself on the platform and then through the seasons of life that grew from that and then traveling and writing songs. You know, he was always like behind me pushing, pushing. This is great. This go for it.

And then when God called us to pastor, several years ago we've been pastoring almost 10 years. We actually celebrate in September 10 years of our church, Epic Life, here in Orlando. Man, it was the same thing. And my mother, I said to her one day years ago, I said, I just don't know if women should pastor. I just don't know. And she said, I beg your pardon.

How dare you? She was like, she rebuked me. She said, I grew up with a female pastor. And no one never ever thought anything about it back in the 50s and the 60s. And it's become more kind of almost a current trend of an idea that women can't do that or shouldn't do that or the debates online about that. But my mother was like, you're doing it. God's called you, and my husband said, I don't know what your hangups are, but it was my own hangups. It was feeling like, do I have what it takes? And then comparing myself to other men

in ministry. Well, you can't compare yourself to other men. You can't compare yourself to anybody and stepping into it. It is not easy. I do feel like I'm a front runner, four runner, kind of plowing through some walls for people coming up behind me. Even in worship, in the worship space too. There wasn't a lot of women leading and I kind of came up right in a perfect space where it was needed and here were so many young women 20, 30 years younger than me saying, I watched you. I've watched you for all these years and you gave me permission and that's such a beautiful thing, but I would be lying if I didn't say that it did not come with struggles and inwardly, more than anything, just that, you know, what's my role? And can I be bold? Can I be strong? Can I

say it like a man would say it. Can I, can I be frank? Can I get up and say, but again, I think in any, like in any other area of your life, once you gain the respect and the honor and the love of people and they trust you, you can say anything. And I will say, Sarah, I do believe we are in the age of women, not just because of the culture, but because of the anointing. I do believe there's a mothering anointing that's needed. There are men that don't trust other men. Yeah. We see that in our church, they don't trust men.

They don't, and that's unfortunate, so my husband kind of feels a different type of role, so until that's healed. But they'd rather hear a woman say it. They've been raised by a single mom. It doesn't bother them for the mother of the house to get up and bring correction or bring love or bring, you know, teaching. And so it's not easy.

It certainly isn't easy, but the anointing and the presence of God helps me every week when I feel like I don't have, this, somebody else should be saying this. You know, that's probably the biggest hurdle that I have to overcome is myself. It's feeling, giving myself permission. Me too. That's, I felt understood, underscored, capitalized, bold, all of those things. Yes. I feel the exact same way. I think what you said about men being more willing to listen to women than perhaps ever before is really, it's really on point.

Because to your point, they have been raised in the households with strong mothers who often did all of the leading and organizing in the homes. And then they sought relationship and connections with women. When we even look at like the research about relationships, often romantic relationships are the only space where men have the ability to be vulnerable and to experience. intimacy because it doesn't happen in their relationships with men. And I think that we are beginning to see men hunger for this desire to not have so much toxic masculinity, to not have to hold it all together. And I do think that we do need spaces that allow for them to tear their walls down. And if they've only experienced that with women, then maybe women being in ministry is a place where they can have deeper revelation and encounters with God. Yes. And I think that's 100, you just said it so

beautifully. It's bringing people back. You know, we always want them to be where they're supposed to be, but just like you, just like me, we're on a journey. We're not all in the same place in our relationship with God. So God may send me people that are bringing me from, I'm helping them get from stage one to stage 10. And then maybe there's another phase for them. But don't neglect the first few phases that the right voice, that we're bringing them, like we're just learning to just bring them back into a place of relationship with God and being sensitive to those things and not be so dogmatic about who should be the one doing that and who's speaking to them. I think about women that, you know, mother, sons, I have a son, you know, and my husband's voice

is very important, but he'll say, you know how to talk to him. Like, you know how to say the things because he thinks more like me, like, please don't make me have a conversation with him without you in the room, you know, because you just have a way. And, but then the vice versa is true. But mothers that are mothering sons, you know, they have to learn how to be both mother and father and then make sure that they allow other men in their lives to help them because I do believe you can't replace men. I don't believe women replace men and I don't believe men replace women. We all have our place. And one of the things I've had to learn is through all these years of pastoring and it goes through different phases, especially me being the front, the one everybody

sees and hears and just assumes that I'm in complete control when we work together. Yesterday I was on a call with somebody that we work with, and they were asking about a trip, can we go on this event? And I need to book you here. And I said, yes, we can do it. And I answered before my husband could. And they said, well, wait a minute, Martha, we need to hear from the king. We need to make sure he's on board.

I said, you just heard from the queen. And we laughed, you know, but it was like, what? What? I'm 57. Like, he knows if I'm going to go. you know, unless there's a reason not to, we're in agreement, we're going. You know, we've had to learn how to have different seasons where he would lead and then I would lead. And that's probably been a struggle.

And for a lot of women it is because we're so strong. You know, I heard a pastor say so many years ago that women are asked by God to submit, not because we're weaker, but because we're so strong. He's asking us to take a little bit of, but we don't have to feel as if we're not submitting to one another. But in pastoring and in leadership, I have to be careful that my husband, you know, that I don't run over him because I am strong and that I'm preaching and I'm learning and I'm studying and I'm full of the word and I'm prophetic and then and men are more single focused, you know, and I've had to learn. I still have to stay in my femininity. I still have to

make sure that I'm a woman first and I'm his wife and because it can get cloudy. Those lines can get cloudy really easily. We don't mean to, you know, because I never want to feel like he's kind of taking a back seat because she's got it. She's so strong. She's got it. I always want to make sure I'm leaving space and people know who my covering is. And that's what makes a difference. Then I can run like it's a playground. I can do whatever God's called me to do. It's no problem at all. But as long as he and I are strong and there's an understanding there, then the doors are always open. That's so good. There's a lot of conversation as we're seeing women become more progressive and successful in their careers and in academia about how that fits in the context of them being in relationships and what power dynamics looks like. And I feel like one of the things that has helped me in my marriage is I really have an order in what is most important to me. And the moment that God brought my husband into my life, what was most important to me was, being his wife. And I wanted to be his wife, right? Like, not just a wife, because sometimes we

just want to be, just make me the Proverbs 31 woman. But there may be some things about the Proverbs 31 woman that doesn't fit for your husband. And so to know my husband well enough, to know what it means to be a good wife to him. And for me to be able to determine whether or not I could be that type of wife for him was the foundation for our relationship. And anything that keeps me away from prioritizing my number one goal of being his incredible wife, I begin to question and balance. Yes, I'm a powerful woman. Yes, I have an opportunity to make incredible impact on the world in different spaces and fields, but it can't come at the expense of me being his incredible wife. And what I love is that I married a man who wants me to make that impact.

So he wants me to be his wife, but he also wants me to be in the fullness of who I am as a woman. And I think that we have to marry people not just because we want them and need them to be something to us, but because we want to support who they are in the world and who they can be in our families. And I think that we have to be less self-centered in relationships so that we can truly see it as a partnership that is meant to affect change in the world. And it sounds like you guys are doing that. We are. And we have our moments where we lose sight of it sometimes. But we just realize, okay, especially as you get older,

because so many things change and your mindset's change and you can get comfortable. And then, you know, it just, it does adjust and you have to continue to go back. It's a great way to look at it that at the beginning of all this, it was just you and me. And we don't need to be so driven for ministry that we lose the joy of our relationship. That doesn't matter. That's, you know, God will open doors anywhere. but I think the greatest legacy we can leave is a good marriage, a strong marriage. Not that we haven't taught our children, you know, how to resolve conflict.

You know, I think when they say, don't fight in front of your kids, well, sometimes you just can't help it. But we also learn how to apologize in front of them. We also learn how to sit down and say, hey, that's not, that's not the way that should have gone. You know, especially because we also pastor with our whole family, our girls, Danielle and Nicole, lead our worship. They run our kids ministry. They do so much here. And our son is a big part of our tech team. And so working together as a family, you know this.

It can be the best of times and the worst of times. It can be such a struggle. Why'd you say that? Why'd you do that? I thought we weren't. You know, and then your family, you have that familiarity that you don't have the lines that other people would never say to each other that your family will say. You know, so it's finding that balance of honor, respect, pastors, parents, all those things

that are, that are, you know, I feel like I have a lifetime of. of I think I could maybe give some advice to people of what to do and what not to do. But the greatest gift of my life that I could leave is the legacy of my family, not my songs, not my preaching, but it's my family that we're still together, that we still love Jesus, we still love each other.

You know, we have our moments, but at the end of the day, we know what we're called to, and we're gonna fight for our family. And that's the greatest gift I can give. Like we're so far off what we probably say, you're going to talk about. But you're just like striking so many courts for me.

The moment that I began to see that like God was granting me the opportunity to have access to so many people different, so many different people's walk in their journey and that there would be a lot of influence connected to that, it has been my prayer that God would help me to protect the purity of my heart. Because the moment you start to become influential or popular, there are. are so many people who want to hijack your gift, your anointing, who want to help you that tell you, you can capitalize it, you can maximize it. And before we know it, we've turned ministry into this pursuit of success that looks like the world, right? I might as well be

pursuing something that brings glory to my name instead of glory to God. And so what balances me is that's all I want to. I want to be known as a woman of God for real, but to my kids. and to my husband. You know what I mean? Like people may misinterpret me publicly. People may not always feel that way, but I don't want to live so that other people can speak well of me, and the people in my very household don't know the core of who I am.

And I feel like, man, keeping that in front of me, it's hard sometimes because people are like, oh, dangling this carative. You could do this and you could do that and you could be this. But I don't want my name to be greater in the world than it is in my house. I want a real legacy for my children. They're going to find another Sarah Jake's Roberts. They're going to find someone else who preaches in a way that's more relatable.

They're going to cancel me for something I meant to say or didn't mean this. I want to die and people are going to move on if Jesus doesn't come back. But what I do for my children, that's going to last. It is. It is. And I remember back, I think our middle daughter was 13. And the same thing, I got, you know, a production team approached me. we want to do like a housewives of Orlando or preachers wives of Orlando or something.

And you know, you first hear that you think, hey, that sounds fun. Let's do it. And I remember talking about it in front of her. And she was 13 and she was watching TV. She had her back to me. And I said, hey, Nicole, I just wanted to tell you this opportunity. So we're going to be doing like a reality show. It's going to be really exciting.

She didn't even turn around, Sarah. She went, we're not doing that. I said, okay, first of all, I'm the mother here. Right, like, wait a minute. You're going to do what I say. She's like, no, we're not doing that. And to know her, her mental name was joy, she's the most up for anything, happy, go lucky, says yes to everything.

So that was so out of character for her. She just said, no, we're not doing it. You need to let them know we're not doing that. And in that moment, it was like the first time I thought, I think that's the voice of God speaking through her. And it was. It was. And there were so many other things that kind of started falling apart and came to light after

that. That was just a signal that it sounds good, it looks good, and it feels. feels like that would be part, it would be the next step. You know, you've already had this, this success, let's go there. And it never actually even materialized, but at the end of the day, it was just something that my daughter, and thank God, our family, they all have anointings. They all have prophetic gifts, all of my kids. And we just go as a family or we don't go. You know, we just learn that if my kids are like, I'm not feeling that person, I better pay attention to that, because they know me better than anybody. And if I disregard that,

every time I wish I hadn't. I wish I had heard their little voices and not just relegated them to the kids. And now they're adults. And even now they care. You know, they understand the legacy that they have to leave to their children. They're like, mom, this is not just about you.

This is our legacy too. What you do impacts us. And it's really something that I keep out in front of me as much as I can that I'm not here just doing the Martha Minizzi thing. And I'm the pastor. And, you know, just everybody fall in line. And it's so easy to get into that role

because you're just trying to get things done and hear from God and everybody needs to jump in and just get in line. Okay, but that's to the detriment of the team that God's put around me of trusted people that are going to help me get to where I want to go. So it's always a test of humility and just taking a step back and saying,

God, if it's you, then my family's on board. There's a yes. Okay, so I have to ask you, when people hear the word crossover, they usually mean from like one genre into a more mainstream genre. When I think about who you are and crossing over, you got not just in your space, but like in gospel spaces.

And I want to try and say this as delicately and authentically as possible. I know what you're going to say. Martha, you got invited to the cookout before people were being invited to the cookout. Do you understand what I'm saying? I completely understand. I completely, and I'm so grateful for it. How did you, like at what, like, what were the signs? Like, did you grow up around black people? Were you, like, what, when did you realize that, like, I am in a space that has historically only had people who look like them? And yet they've created space for me, trusted my voice and my anointing. Like, did you notice that? Was it a thing? Did it make sense based off of all of the other things that had happened in your life?

I love this question. I love this question. I don't get asked very often because I think people just kind of shy away from it. And it's just like your family, we don't talk about it, you're just coming in, it just is what it is.

But yeah, I remember, I met my husband, we were both very young, but he was a huge Andre Crouch fan and he played all the gospel music back from that day. And I remember Andre Crouch soon and very soon.

And I grew up in more of a Southern gospel. My father was a songwriter. He wrote a song of the year in 1977 called Learning to Link. So I was always around music and when gospel was really starting to become something through Andre and he just crossed so many barriers. And then my husband said, and we were dating. He said, have you heard the song? Somebody told me.

And he started playing it on the piano. And I was like, no, but I love that. I love that sound. I love that music. And then I was back when I was about 19 or 20, I worked at Charisma Magazine here in Orlando, Strang. and they would, people would send, and artists would send in, and labels would send in cassettes.

This was back in the day where we had cassettes, to the magazine, and they would listen to the magazine, and they'd write a review. And so when they would get done with the songs, with the cassettes, they'd put them in a little cardboard box and put it in the break room.

So they'd say, take whatever you want. And so I would go in, and I would see, one day, I'll never forget it, I picked up a Ricky Grundy Mass Choir and then a John P. Key cassette. I went home. I'm 20 years old, 21 years old. I put it on because we would always come home and then listen to music.

And I heard a gospel choir like that for the first time. And I said, I don't know what I have to do, but this is my music. This is the music I have to make. I'm going to only buy this music. I don't remember, I mean, Amy Grant, Michael W. Smith and gospel. That was it for me. And mostly gospel. And then I just started dreaming about one day I'm going to direct my own choir.

One day I'm going to, that was the, the drive. and I know it was the Holy Spirit. So from that moment on, I have been a gospel music fan. And I attended a church here and was a worship leader in Orlando for eight years. It was a very heavy gospel. But I remember teaching songs from Kirk Franklin and John P. Key and Fred Hammond and even Dietrich Haddon back of the day. I would teach that choir all gospel. And the shift that happened in our church was remarkable.

And it was very, very diverse. and it was so natural and organic. I didn't think about it. I think, this is what I love, this is what we're doing. And I wasn't trying to make that happen. I didn't say, hey, I've got this great long-term plant, not at all. And I wrote because of who you are. One day, my kids are really little,

and I was just spending time with the Holy Spirit and watching them and just like, Lord, I thank you for who you are. And then the Lord said, but then who am I? And then I wrote the Jehovah Jira, you're my provider. And I would sing it at my church. And that song got out before, I mean, I was just in the trenches of singing in my church, leading my choir. Most of the choir were African Americans. And it just felt like family.

We didn't think about it. And that's kind of the organic way that it started. And then when we started to travel, our pastor said to us one day, he said, you know, your season's up here. You need to go. You need to start traveling. We were heartbroken. But at the same time, so grateful that he saw, like, this is your window. You got to run.

you got to jump. And we just said, let's run in the gospel field, because that's where our songs were being sung. Alvin Slaughter, were singing my songs, different people. And that was the direction we went into because it just felt right. And so when I won my first stellar, I didn't really even think about it until somebody made a joke about it. And I was like, oh, I guess so, honestly. But the older I get, Sarah, the more I realize, I'm in awe. I'm in awe. We just were at the Stellars. And it's just like 30 years, 25 years, oh, there's Martha and Dano, there's Martha. Like, it's family. It doesn't feel like it's not family. It feels very natural. Can I tell you, what has your acceptance, your ability to be free in this space taught you

about the overall, I guess, dynamic of race relations in our country? Listen, we're more alike than we are different. we love Jesus and we love each other, there's more love and commitment and community and unity than the culture would have us think. And if we just listen to media and to what we're hearing that people are doing for clickbait, you know, for getting their views up, we would think that we all literally hate each other. And I'm sure there are people that are. But when we come together, and it's really under the banner of worship, we love Jesus. You know, and there are people that'll type something, the keyboard warriors will put it online, but they would never say it to you.

I've felt nothing but love and acceptance, and except for maybe one or two little comments online or something that I just know people are hurt or people are just trying to be heard. But I believe, like the Bible says, there are more for us than who are against us. That's still true. And if we let the voices of the world separate us, that's on us. that's on us because we're called to be separate. We're called to be a sign to the world that we're in unity, that we love each other, that yeah, we disagreed 20 years ago.

We just didn't talk about it. We all had different political stances. It's just now so up in the media. We hear about it so much that we feel like we all need to have an answer. But the answer is still love. It's still agreement. It's still what do we? agree on. Let's build on that.

As a vet, I'm wondering, there's been some chatter online, or at least there was about, like, CCM versus gospel. And, like, what was your take on that, given your unique positioning? Well, there's no question. I don't have any problem adding to the noise. There's nothing like gospel music.

I mean, I think it's still the best music. I think that's just my opinion, and I'm supposed to have it. And I'm going to have that because I'm smart. But I'm just kidding But you know, I think again People are being drawn To the anointing and to say that gospel music is

You know, dead or whatever I mean that's just that's just silly That's just silly but I also think that it was a good conversation to have Because it kind of woke us all up to go wait a second Hold a second Not only are we not dying but now we're going to start fighting Yes Now we're going to start fighting

You just poke the bear. You know, like we're not, if anybody would even dare say that, we're going to show you that we're not dying and that we're coming back stronger than ever. I feel like we're in the greatest season of what God is about to birth in the earth through sound and through music. I do think it was a conversation that needed to be had

because I think it made people wake up and go, okay, we're going to show you. We're going to come back stronger than ever. And we're about to see and hear some of the greatest music, anointed music, than ever. That's what I feel like

we're about to embark into. You know, I, well, I'm going to evolve exists at this intersection of people who may have been raised in church,

may have left the church, may have never been to church. And so part of what we try to curate is an environment of worship that reaches any and everybody. And so we blend the sounds with great intention. And yet there is this reality

that there is something about tapping into for every mountain. There is something about these moments where it just takes things to a deeper, more resonant level. And I do believe that I think there's a space for everything to exist, but I do think we're at our best when like everything is blending together. And I think most importantly though, and I just taught a Wednesday night Bible study not too long ago where I was talking about worship. I do think that people have a worship preference. when they don't have a worship lifestyle. Right.

And I think that us needing to sonically be able to tap into our worship is just the beginning stages of what it means to truly be a worshipper. Because when we talk about worship, we're not talking about what's your favorite beat, what's your favorite artist, how do you want the music played? We're really talking about our heart posture. and a worship leader allows us to live in the overflow of their heart for God and their attention and focus for God. If someone is like just beginning their worship journey, and they do think it's about what kind of music moves me, and they're learning that that's just the beginning stages.

Like, yeah, maybe that music ushers you into the presence of the Lord, but you've got to learn to be ushered into the presence of the Lord with no music. Like, where would you tell them to start? You know, first of all, worship leaders, you've got to be a music junkie. Like you need to live it, eat it, breathe it. You don't have time for anything else. We need to be on our game because the devil is seeking whom he may devour. And we need to constantly put ourselves in an environment daily of worship.

If we're going to lead other people, we have to more than ever, more than even 20 years ago. Because of the voices that come in. And I, you know, I think it starts with even learning. an instrument, learn how to play a guitar, learn how to play, you know, three chords. You can play just about any song if you do that. Spend time in the presence of God, even prophetically singing. You don't have to do it on stage. Probably don't do it on stage until you're comfortable with it, you know, privately. But it always starts private. Anything that's powerful on the stage always starts in a private moment that is authentic and that is this real. And that's what I

found, people would say, you just lead with so much anointing. Oh my gosh, it's so different. You just, like, listen, I just read more this week. I spent more time with God. I had an encounter with God this week on my own, and it wasn't public. And because honestly, you'll find, and I'm sure you know this too, but especially when you're leading people in worship, you can lead a whole worship set and feel nothing. Yeah. You don't feel the presence of God at all. And you learn to say that's not, that doesn't indicate that he's there. or not, just because I don't feel anything. So if we're spending time with God in his presence daily, then when those moments happen and we're plowing, other people are experiencing it, but maybe we're

still at the helm plowing. We don't necessarily sense it. We've spent enough time on our own in the presence of God that that doesn't move us. We understand that, hey, I've already been filled, I've got, I've got him. He's in me. I've experienced him this week. So now that I'm leading, I'm in the forefront leading other people. And it's starting, it just starts with time in God's presence. Learn to navigate the holy place. And whatever music is that, is bringing you into the presence of God. What brings you to your knees?

What are the songs? And it might be to go back. And as you're learning to glean, I'm so grateful for the years. That's one great thing about getting older. You have so many decades to just pull from of the songs. that have just totally changed our lives. I'm so grateful for the Don Moans and the Ron Connollies back in the day and, you know,

just the anointings that have come across our lives that have fed us and helped us and shifted us. And we've fed that to our children over the years. Go back and listen to the songs, the hymns, the find the river. Find the river. Find the songs that bring you to the place of repentance, of awe, of humility. Find that on your own. Don't wait to Sunday morning to find it because it's going to feel clunky. It's going to, everybody's coming in with a different mindset.

Everybody's coming in with a different struggle. And then you're just trying to lead everybody. They're not in unity yet because you've not found that place first that you need to find to pull them in. And it's hard to explain it, but it becomes instinctive the more you experience it. And that's what I tell people. Have that time alone with the Holy Spirit. That's the best place to start, your own encounter.

Do you feel like you're in your prime? I, you know, yes. I sense that as you're talking. You feel very assured and confident about what it is you carry. I absolutely do. I appreciate you saying it because I didn't feel it even in my 40s as much as I feel it now. Pastoring has really given me a lot of that,

although there's a whole other list of insecurities that come along because it's a whole other list of insecurities that come along because it's another stage. It's another skill set. I've spent a lot more time with God because I have to. You don't phone it in. I want to give my best every time I get up to speak, which I speak most Sundays.

And it's always another word, another. So I'm spending a lot of time just diving into the word and get. And for worship leaders, we can phone it in. You know, you can sing the same songs, have the same exhortation. and come on somebody, let's all lift our hands and worship God. This is the day God's made, let us rejoice. And that's the extent of your relationship with God.

And I learned that that was me, because I was a worship leader and I was singing, you know, glorious. And I had all the little sound bites. But then pastoring, you got to have a deep well. Honey, you can't just preach on worship. And then my mother always says, every time you preach it's so good. You always have an aha moment. I'm like, mother, do you know how many hours I dig? for the, just the one little ah, and then you got to keep it simple.

Then you've got to keep it relatable. Right. So it's all of those things. And biblical and the idea. Forget, yeah, that's the biggest part. But, you know, and then I'm just so grateful for these lasting years that have taught me. It's been like a master class that's brought me to this place at 57 that is probably one of the biggest struggles I have.

Like, my husband and I are trying to find our footing because it's like, I know what I know. And you're going to tell me I don't know what I know. It's like, okay, but calm down. Take a breath. It's okay. But I think I have a twin sister, Mary, and she and I talk about it, and we have literally parallel lives in so many ways. And so we really help each other, you know, with the changes of life and how, you know,

you change in your 50s, your husband changes in his 60s, and life changes, and the kids changes, all of that. But it's all good. And then I do feel like I've got something to say, I know I can help you. I know I can strengthen. you. I know I can lead you. And it's a confidence I didn't have until I hit the stage of my life for sure. So do you think that that's what freedom looks like for you in this season? 100%. 100%. It's freedom. You know what I think about my mother who's 80 and has zero filter.

And I love it. But you know exactly how she feels. I'm like, but I understand that. You start realizing I'm free to feel the way I feel. I'm free to do what I know I need to do. I'm not. I'm comparing myself anymore. I'm not going back through all the insecurities that I dealt with at an early stage. That's the benefit. I'm telling everybody, get ready, because you're going to love getting older as a woman because you do start walking in a, just a confidence that you, and then your kids now, you know, they're in their 30s, and you're like, yeah, you're going to do it this way, and then they know they have a confidence that they didn't have. So it's a beautiful thing. I feel like I spend most of my time encouraging 20s and 30-year-old women and young men too. I feel like helping them

navigate and saying perspective, it's perspective. You're looking at it wrong. Like I probably have the same conversation several times a week with different young people, but I'm so grateful that I can give them that wisdom and it can change their life. Do you think it's possible to achieve this level of freedom at earlier stage? in our life. Because almost every woman who I speak to who's in her 50, she's in her 60, she's like, child, I finally gave up on this idea of then I'll be free, then I'll be free, then I'll be free, and I'm claiming my freedom now. But I feel like, and I'm 37, I think part of what, you know, gives me trepidation about freedom and what it looks like is I think there are many ways that we're

still trying to make sure that we fit into what it means to be a mother, a wife, a leader, a friend, as opposed to just owning like, hey, this is what I can do, this is what I can't do. I said what I said. I'm sorry for what I said. Like, it feels like freedom is exhausting or it is risky. What do we do when freedom feels risky instead of liberating? Well, I think getting older, you stop caring so much. You just naturally stop more. in your 30s and 40s, you know, you're fighting for freedom.

You're always fighting to say, you're explaining. I said that because, you know, I didn't mean to hurt you, but, you know, or whatever it is. And then you feel like at some point I need to explain myself. When you get into your 40s and 50s, you just go, I don't have the time or the energy. You either know me or you don't. And people do give you a little bit more permission to, you know, because people walk in and they'll start crying and go, I just feel like you're my mom, you know. You'll let your mom say things to you that you wouldn't let other people say.

So I think you just stop fighting so much for freedom and you just start walking in it. You just start feeling like, okay, I've gotten to this place here. I'm just going to, you just stop worrying so much. You still have worries. I still have worries. I'm still a people pleaser at heart. I never want to hurt anybody's feelings. But I'll get up and now and I'll say things on Sunday and I'll say, and if you care,

I hope you still love me. it's okay. I'm just going to say it because you need to hear it, you know, and I don't go home and ring my hands and I shouldn't have said it. What if I get an email? I just go, well, if I do, it's okay. I said the truth, and it is what it is. And I don't wear it as much. I don't, what I don't worry about it as much. I really don't. And I think that comes with age. And you just don't fight for freedom. You walk in it. That's so good. Okay, so I'm wondering, I'm going to try and hit some of the questions, because I just, I went in a talk. You mentored me on this call.

Oh, praise God. I guess how do you balance the weight of leading people in worship with the responsibility of shepherding hearts? Wow. I think it all kind of culminates because worship is such a part of the pastoral experience. Because even if I wasn't a worship leader as a pastor, I still have to be an example of leading in worship and then give my team the freedom to lead us. So that is still a big part of it. We did a night of worship here at our church recently, and my daughter said, I want you to sing. I said, are you sure?

Because I get up there and I'll take right over if I feel something, you know, and she'll say, just leave a break for me, like look at me because I might have something to say too. And so we've learned to kind of laugh about it. But when I get up, that pastoral worship prophetic thing just takes over. And I'm, you know, I go. I have to learn to leave room for my team. to be developed. And even though I know, God told me to say it,

God told me to sing it, God spoke to me. I have to come home a lot of times ago, I'm sorry. I should have waited another 30 seconds, you know, and given you it, because I have to remember, I'm still training up the next generation. And if I fill all the air up, fill all the space, then they never get to step in to their role. You mentioned your 80-year-old mother who has no filter,

which I can't, I would love to experience this. And then also your daughter, And I'm wondering, what do you see God healing progressively in your bloodline? Wow. You know, we've experienced through my family, just as a young girl, my grandfather on my father's side, molestation of myself, my cousins, all of those things. and we had my parents divorced over it, it split the families. We've had to overcome divorce.

We've had to overcome all of those things, you know, deliverance to get free from some things. All of those that I think most people would say, that's in my family too. You know, my parents divorced after 30 years of ministry and marriage, and it was very painful and very ugly. And, you know, narcissism, emotional abuse, verbal abuse, all of those things.

I've tried to shield my kids up as much as I can, but at the same time, you know, it's the enemy assigns demonic forces to your family. That's one thing I've realized. And even with our son, I've had to, you know, there has been issues in the past in our family with alcoholism and drug addiction and just shielding them and making us really aware, don't even play with it.

You know, it's in, again, we don't, we know that there's freedom in Jesus. You know, we're not under a curse, but we also know that we're weak as human beings. Our flesh can be weak, and we can have a proclivity to things and not even understand why. And the enemy is seeking whom he made of our power. He's prowling. And we can't, we have to always be aware of the assignment on our family that is the spiritual agenda and also the agenda of the enemy that would love to still kill and destroy. And so just navigating my kids through their teen years, and through their early years and then, you know, some of the things that, you know, my son making

decisions that were not what we taught him, walking him through some of those seasons of his life until, you know, and walking him through it, it's been, it's been a struggle. But at the same time, it's equipped us because how can I minister to other people as a pastor when they come up and they tell me the horror stories of their children? And I look at them and go, I don't know what you're talking about. My kids are perfect. You know, I, that's not my story. I have, I have so much compassion. I put my armor on. I'm going to go, honey, I am so, I get it.

I am so sorry. You know, and again, it becomes almost a gift. And I know that, you know, even though the enemy tried it, he was able to influence them in a small way, but he didn't take them out. And they're living for Jesus, and they love Jesus, and they're serving Jesus, and we're fighting all the way through

until they're walking in the ultimate plan he has. for them. Amen. Well, you know, I think that who you are and the body of Christ and what you have contributed to what God is doing in the earth is undeniable, literally a legend, a goat. My husband and I were talking about it this morning, but having this opportunity to understand who you are as a wife and a mother and how you're still growing in your womanhood and owning your freedom has been a gift to me. So I just want to thank you for being so open and generous with your experiences and your wisdom because it's going to help us. Thank you so much. And we, we know, I've got so much coming. We're right now working on our albums coming out this September

and Church's Revival. And it's a legacy album because I worked with my daughters on this. They're on it. They wrote with me, performed with me. People are going to be real excited when they see Danielle and Nicole, you know, more and more and more as part of what I do. And it's our, it's our family ministry. And it's kind of bleeding over into that. We're coming together. And I do I've replicated myself, Sarah, a couple times. I'm real happy with myself. And then, you know, we have a conference that's coming up in September with Naomi Rain and releasing the new music. So we're busy, but we are in the best season of our lives, for sure.

That is, I mean, first of all, I can only imagine the encounter that's going to happen at your conference. But the beauty of an intergenerational anointing is that it helps other people tap into, like, an intergenerational anointing that exists on their lives. And we see that God is in covenant with generations. And so for people who are just now understanding God's covenant for themselves, I think that being a part of the conference, listening to this music is going to help them unpack the intergenerational anointing and covenant that is available to all of us. So blessings to Danielle and Nicole.

I can't wait to experience it. Thank you. Thank you. I can't wait for the world to hear it. It's going to be incredible. It's going to be a great conference. And this is going to be an amazing year. It already has been.

and I know there's still more. Just like I said 25 years ago, the best is yet to come, I still feel that way, for sure. Amazing. Thank you. Thank you. Well, that's it.

You have heard from one of the most iconic voices in gospel music. I love how she advocated for the place of gospel music and the overall sound of what's happening in the world right now. There are some irreplaceable, beautiful deliverance,

melodies, harmonies, breakthrough, just a resonance that exists with gospel music that you don't find everywhere. And so I'm grateful that she shares and the desire to see it platformed and growing because we need it now more than ever. I feel like, like with all conversations, having a woman who is full of wisdom like Martha Munezi will always leave you better than you word before and it's such a reminder of God's faithfulness and the beauty of walking in freedom that women are called to lead. I love showing you different women's leadership journeys and the lessons that they've learned along the way. Don't forget if you want to keep up with everything happening in the woman evolved world, including the fact that conference is open for Woman

Evolve 26 and we are so looking for it. We're taking it back to Atlanta and you know the tickets are there and the tickets are amazing because anywhere in the room the glory of God is going to appear. And that is something that we don't take for granted. We just thank God for. The dates are July 30th through August 1st, 2026. And I will be honest, there are limited seats available, but there are limited seats available. You can download the WOMADEvolve TV app if you want to catch up. If you want to catch up, come on catch up, if you want to catch up on WOMMEEVV25 content, maybe you miss conference or maybe you want to relive it. Subscribe to us on YouTube and stay connected through the woman evolve app.

That way you never miss a moment, a word or a story that helps you evolve into the woman you're destined to be. Until next. Hold on. I got to pray for you. Where you thought she was going without this prayer? Nowhere. Turn to your neighbor and say nowhere. Oh, goodness.

Lord, I want to say a special prayer today for women who are leaders. Maybe they're leaders in their family, their leaders, and their leaders in their. their ministry, their leaders, and their organizations, their entrepreneurs. And God, I just pray that you would remind them of your qualifying of who they are, that you knew exactly what they did and did not carry and called them anyway, that you understood that their perspective, their gifts, their talents, their offering were necessary for what you're trying to do in the overall grand scheme of your plan. God, I pray that my sisters would feel anchored in your intentionality.

When the world is changing and the economy feels like there may not be space for all of us, God, may we stay anchored in your intentionality, that He that began a work in us that you're going to complete it. Help us to continue to be sensitive to the new ways that we can experience your provision in your presence, the new ways that we can experience your creativity. God, I pray that in the moments where it's hard, where we feel frustrated, where we feel like our life just isn't progressing in purpose the way that we thought that it would, that you would settle us into a rhythm of peace where we trust that we are not missing anything, that you hold time and opportunity in your hands. So give us a heart to lean into what you're doing and the sensitivity to say yes when it's our time and to be still without feeling like stillness is punishment. In Jesus' name I pray. Amen.

All right, y'all. I'll see you next week. Evolve.