Woman's Hour - Care workers and COVID-19; Silent Solutions; Anne Scott-James; Corona diary – Pauline

Episode Date: April 3, 2020

The Government has issued new guidelines on the personal protective equipment that should be used by those on the NHS frontline. It has also said that it is important for social care staff to feel safe, and that the new guidance will give them information and reassurance. But how do the army of women working to provide care in care homes and care to vulnerable adults in their own homes feel? You may have heard us on Tuesday talk about the sad expectation that violence within the home is likely to increase because of our current lock-down. One way of alerting emergency services that you're in trouble is by using the code 55 on the phone. Lucy Hadley from Women's Aid explains how it works.In 1953 pioneering journalist Anne Scott-James started to write a weekly column for the Sunday Express newspaper. 'The Anne Scott-James Page' set the bar for a new way of writing. She perfected the art of the short, sharp column - filled with her views on men, children, fashion, beauty and anything else that took her fancy. Anne’s daughter, the writer Clare Hastings, provides an insight into the first female star of London's Fleet Street. In today’s Woman's Hour Corona Diaries, we hear from Pauline in Morecambe. She tells Jane how if you live alone but aren’t classified as vulnerable, it’s easy to slip through the net when you need a helping hand.Is isolation the perfect time to experiment with your hair? Or a reason to leave well alone until it’s in the hands of a professional? We discuss DIY hair care - the Dos and the definitely DON'Ts. Tanya Harrison is the founder of Harrison Hair Studio in Liverpool. She’s set up a virtual hair clinic for her clients and tells us what kind of questions they’ve had and shares some tips if you’re eager to have a go yourself.Presenter – Jane Garvey Producer – Sarah Crawley Guest – Margaret Hodge MP Guest – Christina McAnea Guest - Lucy Hadley Guest – Pauline Vaughan Guest – Tanya Harrison Guest – Clare Hastings

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. I'm Natalia Melman-Petrozzella, and from the BBC, this is Extreme Peak Danger. The most beautiful mountain in the world. If you die on the mountain, you stay on the mountain. This is the story of what happened when 11 climbers died on one of the world's deadliest mountains, K2, and of the risks we'll take to feel truly alive. If I tell all the details, you won't believe it anymore. Extreme, peak danger. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.

This is the BBC. Hi, this is Jane Garvey and welcome to the Woman's Hour podcast. It is Friday, the 3rd of April, 2020. Welcome to your Friday. None of us have got any plans for the weekend. I was thinking I might change my sheets, but on the other hand, that's something I could realistically leave, well, until next week or indeed any time the week after that.

So we're all in the same rocky old boat, but you're very welcome to the programme. Keep in touch with us at BBC Women's Hour on Twitter or Instagram. You can email us through the website, particularly if you are a care worker, because that's our first topic of conversation this morning. Who's caring for the care workers? We're also going to later on in the, celebrate the life of Anne Scott-James, who was the first female star of Fleet Street. She was actually a very significant journalistic figure.

Anne Scott-James. We'll talk about her in the company of her daughter on Woman's Hour today. First of all, then, personal protection equipment. It's very much been a feature of the news over the last couple of weeks. And new government guidelines were issued yesterday. The government has said it is important for social care staff, both in care homes and out in the community, to be properly protected as well. But are they? We'll talk in a moment to Margaret Hodge, the MP for Barking and Dagenham, Labour MP, of course. First, Christina McAnee, who's Assistant General Secretary of Unison,

which represents about 200,000 care workers. Christina, have things improved as far as you know? Good morning, Jane. Well, I think there's a perception that things have slightly improved, although I have to say that's not really been borne out by the kind of comments and calls and emails that we're receiving in unison. So yesterday, the government published, Public Health England published some new guidance for care home settings and for community settings,

which is very helpful because it sort of spells out what you need for different kinds of circumstances, what kind of protection you need for different kinds of circumstances. But the problem is getting that message through to the people who are actually delivering the care. And certainly on the ground, we haven't seen any slowing down of the kinds of really quite distressing calls and emails that we've been getting across the union from people who work in care homes and deliver care to people in their own homes. Now, this is a fragmented industry, isn't it? Because you have care homes and deliver care to people in their own homes. Now, this is a fragmented industry, isn't it? Because you have care homes, they're run by all sorts of different organisations,

and there are many agencies providing community care workers too. What sort of things are your members worried about? What are they telling you? So you're right. Can I just comment, first of all, on the fragmentation? That's probably one of the main reasons why it's so difficult because the NHS runs on a control and command system where, by and large, if the government thinks something should happen

and pull a lever, hospital trusts will, by and large, do it. When you've got something where you've got 40,000-plus individual organisations providing care, that's just impossible and that's something that we hope will be addressed after this crisis is over. But the kinds of comments we're getting, so we've set up two things, we've got Unison set up a care, a home care and social care hotline, so an email address that our members can contact us and tell us what's happening and we will get back to them and try and deal with it. So we have got regional organisers, people on the ground who will try and deal with

and resolve those particular issues for them. The other thing we've set up is what we're calling our PPE alert, so Personal Protective Equipment Alert. And again, if you go onto the website, people can then log what the issues are. And looking at that, what we can see's it is still the same things they're not getting so we're getting calls from people who are being told you don't need anything now the basic equipment in most places would be gloves and an apron but we've got members who are now having to deal care workers who are having to deal with people who don't necessarily understand

social distancing so vulnerable adults who have got dementia, people with learning disabilities who don't really, won't necessarily understand what social distancing means. And for our members, they're very worried because nobody's telling them what they actually need to keep themselves and their families safe and to keep the patients and the people they care for safe. And that's the big problem. It's the lack of communication out to the people actually delivering the care. Some good care homes, though, will surely be doing that. And on a practical level, I confess, I don't actually know. But in a good care home, presumably whoever's in charge on a given day will hand out the

PPE appropriately. And presumably it's then changed with every change of resident or you tell me what happens what should happen? So yeah so yes it's people should have enough aprons and masks to be able to change those between clients or patients whoever they're looking after. The kind of stories we're getting are people who go out and deliver care to people in their own home so they may be seeing between 20 and 30 clients a day and they've been given a box of gloves that maybe has 10 or 12 sets of gloves in it they may not be given any aprons at all when they're doing that kind of job and they're told to just go on with it they're worried because a lot of the people

that they deal with they don't know if they've got COVID-19. And even we're getting stories through from care homes where patients are being discharged from hospitals or have been diagnosed with COVID-19 but aren't ill enough to get into hospital or don't meet the criteria. They're still at home. They're still in the care home. And all the staff have got to deal with it

is aprons and an apron, a thin plastic apron and a pair of gloves. Masks seems to be a problem. They don't seem to be getting access to masks. And it's not, it's not, it's just the sort of fitted mask that they need, the surgical mask, not the full breathing mask that they need. Yeah. I mean, there must also be a chance, of course, that your members are, I mean, I'm sure they won't want to,

but they might be in danger of spreading COVID-19, particularly if they're visiting people who are indeed at home and unlikely to be getting out and not seeing anybody else. Yeah, exactly. So we've had people on the phone crying. What they're worried about is they may have a relative at home that they're trying to look after but they have to go to work because this is a predominantly female predominantly low-paid workforce and um so they are incredibly worried they want to go and do the best for the people they can they care for but they're worried that they're perhaps taking infection in or taking infection away when they leave sure and you know it's it's like a perfect storm to be quite. And it's all the things that people have been saying would happen if we have a crisis in social care has exactly happened. And the impact it has on things like the NHS is massive

because they're stuck not being able to discharge people to community care homes. Or they're having to take people in where a care home's struggling because a third to a half of the staff have gone off sick. And can I just pay tribute to the care home managers who are doing a great job? Because I'm giving you the worst examples, but you're quite right, there are many care home managers

who are doing the best they can in the circumstances. Oh, the dedication of many of them is absolutely incredible. I'm not knocking every care home owner or every care home manager. Stay there, Christina. Let's bring in Margaret Hodge, Labour MP, for Barking. You've been talking to some of the care homes in your constituency. I have indeed, and I concur with so everything I think that Christina said. On the back of Peter Kyle started doing work in this in his constituency, and on the back of that, I rang all 10 care homes in my constituency that with

about 200 residents and I thought actually I was a bit nervous about it I thought they wouldn't want to have a phone call from the local MP but actually they were so grateful that somebody would be this would listen to them hear their concerns and they are feeling very isolated I think that's the first thing the second thing to say is three issues emerged from that and they are feeling very isolated. I think that's the first thing. The second thing to say is three issues emerged from that, and they were really worrying. The first is the issue about PPE, the protective equipment. So what the politicians are saying at the daily conference is simply not what's reflected of what's happening on the ground.

I mean, that's so clear to me now. I had one care home telling me that they were going from pharmacist to pharmacist to try and buy eye equipment, which, of course, wasn't there because they weren't getting delivery. Another told me that they were going to the secondary schools to pick up protective eye equipment from the chemistry labs. Terrible stories. that's the first issue the second issue is around food so there is no early morning shopping slot for the workers in care homes and the online delivery system simply doesn't work for them some of them they're just knocked off and others you can't bulk buy on that right and the third point margaret i don't want to rush you and the third one is the testing they can't maintain reliable and safe levels of staffing without testing. And the very people who live in these care homes, they're the most vulnerable group.

They're the most likely to be victims of the coronavirus, and they will find it hardest to fight that virus. So it's really important that we get away from promises on testing and action on the ground on testing. Just got an email here from a listener that's come in as we're talking. My 89-year-old mother has been released from hospital. The consultant telephoned on Wednesday to say she has tested positive for COVID-19. Why have they released her? How are her daily carers supposed to keep themselves safe? Well, that's a good illustration, Christina, of what you're up against and your members are up against. It is exactly that. And I think part of the problem is that nobody's telling them or giving them easy to follow guidance on what they should be doing in those circumstances. and we've actually raised this with Public Health England and with the department to say, why can't you produce some little easy-to-understand short video clips

that explain how the virus is spread and explain to them what you need in different circumstances because people are incredibly afraid. They think they're going to catch the virus. I don't mean everyone thinks this, but many people are just concerned, they're afraid about how they would catch it and how they would spread it. And I think if we could explain what is the actual protective equipment that they need in different circumstances, that would be incredibly helpful. We're just not getting that. Right. And something else I think it's important

to acknowledge is that some members, some of your members working in care homes are going to be asked to do a rather different sort of care because we know that COVID-19 is spreading in care homes naturally because of the environment and those patients will not be admitted to hospital. So there is going to be a, well there's going to be a change of circumstances to put it mildly in some of these, in some of these establishments Christina? There is and what's happening is there's been some discussions taking place within both the local government association and with NHS employers about actually being able to move staff so I think the big worry will be when staff in the care homes start to get ill and we start to see levels of staffing that aren't safe. What it means is they're probably going to have to move people from the NHS to go out and work in care homes

to care for people, particularly those who've been diagnosed with COVID-19. And as you say, quite rightly, Jane, need a different type of care when they've actually been diagnosed with it than perhaps the ongoing care they normally would have. Now that itself will have an impact on the NHS because they'll be looking after the most acute patients. But if they're having to then transfer people to work in care homes, that's a huge worry. Are you concerned about that, Margaret Hodge? Yeah, of course I am.

I think actually what will happen, and I began to see it in the survey we did, is that people will end up in hospital. I think the big nightingale hospitals will start having these people. And can I just add another issue that has been raised with me? So a lot of the workers working in care homes in my constituency are agency workers. Some of them come from other countries. They're on visas, and the work permits that they're on have no recourse to public funds. So they are now raising with me the issue that what happens if they get ill, they will have no protection from the state for them and their families because

of the nature of the work permit on which they're working. So there are lots of sort of unintended consequences here that people just haven't started thinking through. And Christina alluded earlier to the fact that as a nation, successive governments, we as individuals have all avoided having the big conversation about social care. Do you think, Margaret, that after this is over, we will finally confront that? I hope so. I've for a long time argued this has to be a cross-party discussion. It cannot be. You can't play politics with people's lives, particularly when they're at the most vulnerable stage of their lives. We have to build a cross-party consensus. There are very tough decisions that have been taken. We've got to stop doing reports and surveys on ways forward and we just have to start working together and deciding in the interests of the most vulnerable people

in our community and the staff who look after them so valiantly. Thank you very much. That's Margaret Hodge, Labour MP for Barking. You also heard from the Assistant General Secretary of Unison, Christina McAnee. And again, if you have any personal experience, whether you are a care worker, whether you're perhaps married to one or whether you're concerned about a relative

who is in a care home or is reliant on carers, we would love to hear from you. Email the programme via the website bbc.co.uk slash womanshour. Now we did describe, I think earlier in the week and indeed last week as well, the acceptance, perhaps we shouldn't be so accepting, of the fact that domestic violence is going to increase during the lockdown. And we discussed too the fact that it hadn't been raised at the daily coronavirus briefing that happens at around five o'clock. Now credit goes to Paul Waugh of the Huffington Post, who did actually raise it at the briefing last night. We know as well, it can be hard to ask

for help when you are locked at home with your abuser. And that's why domestic violence organisations are hoping that people will access their services online, there is another way that you can do it. And Lucy Hadley is Campaigns and Policy Manager at Women's Aid. Lucy Hadley, good morning to you. Good morning. Just explain how you can make contact on the phone but without speaking. That's if you need to, obviously. That's right. So we're providing online support through our live chat service at Women's Aid, which you can access every day between 10 and 12. And we're seeking more funding for that vital service because it's really important that women can access support online and not necessarily have to speak over the phone. But the other really important means of getting help is, of course, calling the police if you're in danger or in immediate harm.

We know for many survivors of domestic abuse calling the police can be extremely dangerous and abusers will threaten to hurt them or even kill them if they try and speak out about that abuse and obviously we know in the current time that that fear is likely to be even more severe for those women who are experiencing domestic abuse during the lockdown when the perpetrator is constantly there. So there's a silent solution system which enables you to make silent 999 calls without putting yourself in further danger. It's really important that everyone experiencing domestic abuse knows how this works and we're encouraging survivors to familiarise themselves with this system. So what do you do? Well, a silent 999 call on its own won't bring police assistance

as the police receive so many of those calls, including hoax calls every day. So what happens if you can't speak when you're asked what emergency service you need, you're diverted to an automated silent solution system and you can access support by either coughing, tapping the keys or pressing five five. And you'll be automatically diverted to to the help you need.

So it's really important. Everyone knows how that works. And you do have to take those steps, either pressing five five, coughing or tapping the keys to make sure that you're diverted to the to to emergency help. Does that mean that help will physically come or are you just put through to another organisation? Just explain exactly what happens. So you'll be diverted to the police who will be trying to respond to you by asking very simple yes or no questions

so you won't have to speak in as much detail as you normally would. There is also, you know, for landlines, the police can then, of course, track the call and know where you are too. Great. Thank you very much for making that clear. Lucy Hadley, who works for Women's Aid. Don't forget, of course,

the Women's Hour podcast is available every single day. There's additional content in the podcast. We usually just use the opportunity to run through some of the really interesting emails that come in during the course of the programme. It's well worth getting. And it might be something that you can recommend perhaps to a friend of yours who, for reasons lost in the confusion and mists of time, isn't a regular listener to the programme. Introduce them to the Woman's Hour podcast. Now everyone has perhaps a little bit more availability during the course of the day. It might be something that people can build into their routine.

So just refer them to BBC Sounds and they can get hold of the Woman's Hour podcast there. Next week, I'm delighted to say that on Tuesday, we're going to get some Lockdown the Mary Berry Way tips. Mary will be joining us from her home and we'll talk about how to get the best out of those store-covered ingredients. Perhaps my second jar of capers will finally get

an airing and be put to good use next week. And she'll also just tell us how she is coping during all this because it doesn't matter who you are or where you are, it's a challenge. Which is a good time to bring in our coronavirus diary on Women's Hour today. It's from Pauline in Morecambe. Pauline, good time to bring in our coronavirus diary on Women's Hour today.

It's from Pauline in Morecambe. Pauline, good morning to you. How are you today? Good morning. I'm a lot better than I have been over the last 16 days. I do think I've turned the corner and moving forward. We need to make clear that you emailed the programme and you actually say you've definitely had it. Well, of course, you can't be certain, can you? So when did you first get symptoms that you now believe might have been the start of the coronavirus?

Right, on about the 16th of March, I started with a very irritating little cough in the back of my throat. And I thought nothing about it because I do have seasonal allergies I thought oh it's just tree pollen season and then a couple of days later I started feeling extremely tired I don't just mean tired I've been sleepy I mean just I needed to sleep and the following day it was just obvious that I was not going to go to work that day. And that really has been my main symptom of being the tiredness. Besides that, I've had the aching muscles, the headache, everything that goes with it, except for the temperature.

So, of course, you're right. I can't say that I've definitely had it. I wish there was a test available to tell me if I've had it or not. Tell us a little bit more about yourself. I think you're 59, aren't you? And you've got two sons, but they're abroad. Yeah, my family, both of the sons live abroad in the Middle East. So it wasn't a case of they could be any help

to me they were brilliant on the phone and on whatsapp and what have you but there was nothing they could do and i did have rather a big problem about five days into the illness when i was feeling absolutely dreadful i hadn't known i was going to be ill so I hadn't stocked up for it and I was more or less completely out of fresh veg and bread and I've only lived here for six, seven months. I knew absolutely nobody that I could ask. My nearest friend with transport was 25 miles away i didn't want to trail her up here um so i ended up emailing the local mp who got back to me about a day later i think it was later in the day actually and also i emailed um age uk who rang me and offered some sort of help they weren't sure what they were going to do because at that stage

they were still setting everything up yeah but by the time they'd rung me back um my landlord had been in touch about something completely different and i just told him and he immediately said he would go and do some shopping for me he lives 40 miles away i didn't want to trail him all this way but he insisted and he was absolutely brilliant i know we talk about landlords a lot but he brought me love shopping absolutely wouldn't take any petrol money or anything obviously i paid him for the shopping yeah but other than that i would have been absolutely stranded because I'd had nothing through the door, none of these notes that would have been advised to put through from neighbours, nothing from, like, the counsellor anywhere.

I'd looked on Facebook and at that stage there was nothing there. I couldn't see anything at all on social media. I'd really struggled to get food deliveries. I mean, that is sort of seen as the solution to all our problems. Yeah, but of course, if you can't get through, it's no solution, is it? I think, you know, what you say will definitely ring bells with so many people listening, Pauline, because through no fault of your own, you're relatively new in that part of the world, in Morecambe. Your kids live on the other side of the world

and they want to help, but there's a limit to what you can do. And none of us were expecting this, were we? That's right. You just sit there and think, what am I supposed to do? Obviously, I couldn't go out, even if I'd have wanted to, because of the seven days isolation. But also, I felt so so ill I couldn't have gone um and like I say but the landlord's stepping in I don't know where are they can I just ask how

you're getting through the days because all of us now are looking at a weekend where I mean frankly I literally I don't know what I'm going to do along with everybody else. How have you been coping? Well, remember, when you're really ill, you don't want to do anything anyway. My solution to that was radio. Of course. All the time that I was awake, I had the radio on. In fact, to be honest, I had the radio on while I was asleep. Yeah.

But other than that, I suppose I'm lucky in that I've got books I want to read. I've got, only having been here seven months, there's plenty in the flat I want to do. No, I've not struggled in that respect. And I've not felt the loneliness the same because of all the social media. I've felt more isolated than lonely, if that makes sense. No, that's a very interesting distinction. You say reading's been a help. Can you recommend something, if anybody's looking for anything, for this weekend?

I'm reading Tony Benn's diaries at the moment. Oh, are you? Right, OK. Well, that's fair enough. Are they any good? Yes, it's very interesting. You've got to be able to put yourself back in that time era, of course. But because it's a diary, it's broken up, so you don't need to concentrate through a full paragraph.

Right. I'm sure he'd have been very glad to know that he was bringing you pleasure. What is, to put it mildly, a challenging time. OK, well, I hope you get through the weekend and I think you're hoping to go back to work towards the end of next week, is that right? I am. I mean, this is another thing. Because of the way we work nowadays, I don't go into an office or anything like that

on a normal day-to-day basis. I work for a field sales agency. So I'm in and out of large, multiple stores, the supermarkets each and every day. You're delivering food, are you? No, I'm not delivering food.

I'm actually a bland ambassador. Basically, most of my time is spent in the large supermarkets. Usually 90% of it is communication 10% is about getting stock onto the shelves but my company logo brand has now reversed that so I'm probably when I go back I'm going to be spending 10% of my time communicating with managers and about 90% of time putting goods on shelves and I'm really hoping that I'm going to be up to that

because it is quite physical work. Yeah, that sounds like it could be pretty gruelling for someone who's getting over a nasty virus, whatever it was. It is, yes. At the moment, I would feel so much better. Remember, I'm going to be exposed to all the germs and things that are in those stores and the people around me. It just would make such a terrific difference to my confidence level

to know that I've actually had it and that I've got some antibodies that will fight it off. And this brings us back to testing, which is obviously a subject that's not too far from anybody's mind at the moment. Well, Pauline, I really do wish you all the very best. And I'm really glad that radio has played, well, perhaps a small but not insignificant part in just keeping you going. It's keeping us all

going, isn't it, actually? It'll certainly be true for me over the weekend. It's kept me sane. And if anyone relies on Woman's Hour to keep them sane, that's a measure of the times we're in, Pauline, is what I'll say. No, seriously, take care of yourself and we value you and all the other listeners

and their contributions very, very highly. Pauline, take care. Thank you. Thank you. Bye. Bye-bye. That is Pauline in Morecambe, who hopes to be back in that job towards the end of next week and she is braced for the weekend, as we all are. Now, later on

today, I should be having my colour done but I can't of course so high time we talk to an award-winning indeed a multi-award-winning hairdresser Tanya Harrison who's from Harrison Hair Studio in Liverpool. Tanya am I right you've set up a virtual hair clinic is that right? Yes that's right and it's just to help some of our clients going through these difficult times with the hair. Yeah. How does it work virtually? Just explain. So what we've been doing is me and a couple of the stylists that work for me have just been going through and just tackling our own issues. Mine being the grey, you know.

Yeah. Getting rid of it, making it so that you can't see a grey as prominent um sarah she's been she's got curly hair so she's been going through and showing people how to do the hair curly megan's being blue drying and alex is being shown showing you how to do braids what is is it like for your clients? Are they, I mean, they must be missing you because I'm missing, I go to the hairdressers once every six weeks or so.

It is something I look forward to and it must be true for your clients as well. Oh, yeah, it is. And they've all been, you know, contacting me, what can they do and stuff like that. So, but everyone's just being you know you've just got to get on with it haven't you and you've got to take this time and you'll be able to practice doing your own hair get all them tongs and stuff out of the cupboard that you've bought years ago

yeah exactly but you know tongs in the hands of a rank amateur and i'd include myself there i mean they can be they can be dangerous things are you do you seriously think those of us who want to do our hair should attempt to do it ourselves, honestly? Honestly, no. But if you want to, then we'll be there to fix it when you come back to work. Yeah, that's true, that's true. Okay, can I just read out, there's a few emails here

which are worth reading out if you don't mind. This is from Julia, who says my husband and I have isolated ourselves as one household with my parents who are 93 in order to help them through the crisis. It's very trying for a number of reasons. But one of the worst issues is that my mother, who has dementia simply cannot either remember nor understand why she can't have her regular weekly hairdressing trip for a shampoo and set is there any way that i could tackle it myself do you have any advice for that listener oh yeah well all that you've got to do is just take each section um for the way she wears her hair so if it all goes back take your first section for the way she wears her hair. So if it all goes back, take your first section at the front and just the width of the roller size, that's your section size, and then just winding it back on itself,

using a setting lotion if you've got one or hairspray. Setting lotion, you can get that online, can't you? Oh, yeah. The one that we use in the salon is L'Oreal. It's called Play and it's brilliant. You can use it for anything. You can use it for blow-drying. It's got a heat protector in it, you know.

Okay, I'm sure there are other setting lotions available. Oh, yeah, yeah. But that is one of the ones that you recommend. And there are instructions on all these setting lotions, are there? Oh, yeah. Yeah, so, I mean, I do understand where that lady's coming from because a lot of older ladies love their trip for the shampoo and set yeah and if they can't have it it's really depressing um here's another one from hannah um it's not just about making your hair look pretty but you develop a relationship

with your hairdresser i've been going to my hairdresser for nine years and I would find it really hard to find another one that I know on a personal level. And that's true as well, isn't it, Tanya? You don't just want anyone doing your hair. You want the person who's always done it, if you're lucky. Yeah, definitely. And I've got some clients who have done for over 20 years

and I regard them as friends. I see them more than my own family most of the time. So yeah, it is. It's quite sad, and especially those ones who come to the salon and that's their, you know, their get-out every week and we can all have a good chat and stuff. What about doing fringes? If you have maybe a teenager whose fringe is getting ridiculous,

what are your tips for cutting a fringe? Well, what I'd recommend you to do is just take small sections. So just take your first section, a teeny bit, and rest your fingers on the bridge of your nose and then just cut on little bits. None of these dramatic, you know, getting a bobble in and chopping it off. Yes. That's just scary.

If you just do it a bit at a time, then you'll be able to get the shaping in it and it won't be too short. About grey, I mean, well, I should be grey, although my mother's 86 and she's not that grey. I don't know what miracle cure she's discovered. But should you cover up your grey? I've seen the things you can buy in high street chemists the ones that you

know claim to cover up your grey with just a quick spray are they any good they're brilliant they are really good and they're they're a quick fix and they just shampoo straight out okay you can get ones that are like a powder or you can get the sprees and they are they're really really good bleach sensible if you don't know what you're doing it's not is it no never never ever do bleach on yourself at home we take a lot of precaution in the salon when we're bleaching somebody's hair we'll do strand tests and stuff so it i would never never ever recommend it in terms of the impact of all this on you and indeed on your business, what was it like when you just realised you'd just have to close and you had no idea when you were going to open again? It was really, really hard. I'm never off sick, so I've never actually cancelled clients before.

So to phone clients and say that we won't be there they all understood and they were all they knew exactly why we were doing it but it was really hard and yet at the time when we were closing we didn't know what the what the future held but I'm quite positive and I'm looking forward to just getting back in the salon now. But you've no idea when that will be, have you? No, no, literally no idea. We're just taking each week as it comes. A lot of hairdressers are self-employed, aren't they? It's going to be a really tough time for lots of people. Are you finding that in your industry that perhaps decent clients are sending the hairdressers a few quid just to tide them over,

even if they can't make the appointment? Yeah, well, some hairdressers are coming up with all ideas for to be getting a little bit of money into the salon and most clients would would do that yeah definitely you did mention earlier that one of your colleagues mentions has she has a special technique for curly hair i mean i may as well abuse my position i've got abundant rather thick hair and in a few weeks i will if i don't get a cut i will look like crystal tips um if anybody is old enough to remember crystal tips they'll know who i mean what am i supposed to do with my barnet over the next couple of weeks tanya do you wear a curly normally it just it's just there i

suppose it is yeah it's it's wavy certainlyavy certainly the best thing to do is a good moisturising shampoo and conditioner on it and some oil or a blow drying cream and just let it dry naturally I know that's most probably horrifying to you but just don't touch it it's the best tip

if I was to let it dry naturally before work I'd have to get up at about half past three if you do it the night before you'll be fine oh i suppose just just leave it before before you go to bed i need you in my life just take each every section and just twirl it around your finger and some of the curls will just be more defined all right um everybody will look forward to that quite sure my defined if grayingying hair will be available over the next couple of weeks. Really good to talk to you, Tanya. And I hope things improve for you and everybody else in your line of work, because you're very important to lots of people, as I'm sure you know.

Thank you. Thank you. That's Tanya Harrison, who works in Liverpool as a hairstylist at her salon. Now, we're going to veer off topic ever so slightly. I mean, obviously a lot of the programme is about the coronavirus and about the implications of it on women's lives and the impact of it. But it's not all that's going on. And Women's Hour always makes a virtue of celebrating the lives of women that you might not know too much about. And today we're going to talk about a woman called Anne Scott James, who was a real Fleet Street phenomenon.

She was arguably the first lady of Fleet Street. And her daughter, Claire Hastings, has written about her in a book called Hold the Front Page. Claire, good morning to you. How are you? Oh, very well, thank you. Very interesting to hear about how to cut my fringe. Yeah, well, are you going to tackle it later? I've already tackled it, unfortunately.

Oh, right, OK. Well, wait a couple of weeks and then you can... Wait a couple of weeks, go no further into that. Yeah and then use the advice you've just heard. Now Ann Scott-James was a name that I knew actually but only because I suppose I'm a bit of a journalism nerd but she will be a name that people perhaps did know and have forgotten. So tell us a bit about your mum. Well my mum was a career journalist at that glorious time when to be a journalist was something to be celebrated and she worked, it was in her DNA, her family were writers and she started, well she first went on to Fleet Street in 1951 at a very testosterone

time. She really was one of the first women of Fleet Street. Yes well and, and I gather that throughout the book, in fact, she makes much of the fact that she is not a feminist, despite basically blazing a trail for women. So what would you say about that? Well, she wasn't a feminist in the sort of tub-thumping way. She believed very much that women should be treated as equals. She wanted to be respected on her own merits, not on her sex. So she wanted to be respected as a journalist. And she certainly didn't think of herself as forging a path for women. She thought it was quite enough, I think, to forge her own then.

And so, yes, she just wanted to write and not to be considered in any other way but as a writer. Now, the book is called Hold the Front Page, The Wit and Wisdom of Anne Scott James and she was a very witty woman. There's a dry quality to her humour. Very pithy. Yeah, very pithy. I was going to say

much of it is utterly timeless. You know, you could take some of her opinion pages and read them now. Well, I think that is what actually struck me because I only began this book because I started to get emails from various people who wanted to write about her. I think they'd read about, they'd seen her pages in Picture Post,

which is where she started serious journalism during the war. And they wanted to know more about the woman behind the page. And then I started reading her articles, particularly from the Express, which is where she first started. And they were just very funny.

And you could change a couple of names or move the sentences round, and they would be as funny now. They are just very quick. And she developed this technique. She'd never used 200 words if 50 would do. So she invented this technique of a short, sharp column. And they are very, very funny. They're very succinct.

She was always in work, wasn't she? I think she left the express and went to the Mail, which was probably quite unusual in those days. She did. She was known as crossing the street, and it was unusual. I think it has to be taken back a bit, but it has to remember that the newspapers then were the way that people got the news.

And so Anne, when she was writing for the Express, was talking to four million readers a week. I mean, it's extraordinary to think of for a publication today. They were, they were, everybody read, everybody read the Express. And so then she became a journalist that people vied for, they wanted her. So then she went on to the Mail for quite a long time. Now, go on, you call her Anne, which I always get, it's just always sort of, I don't know,

it's a strange thing when somebody calls their mum by their first name. But I mean, was she a... It is a choice for writing this book. I mean, I do call, obviously I call her mum or mummy or whatever I call her. But it helped me to write the book because otherwise it became much too personal. And I thought, there is

no point in writing this book if it just becomes about me along the way. It's my opinion of her. And the way to make the emphasis on that was to refer to her as Anne, often through the book. Yes, no, that's very interesting. What sort of a mother was she? Because I can't... Was she there a lot? Or presumably she worked from home?

No, she worked from the office. Oh, did she? She loved Fleet Street. I mean, it's when all the papers, you know, were there on the street, jostling side by side. So she loved to go to Fleet Street and did not really like being at home. In my formative years, she was very rarely there. We were brought up by Nanny and she went to work. And so really for the first formative years, I didn't see a great deal of her.

She would appear from time to time. She would waft in and waft out. Well, we should also say that she was a beautiful woman extremely striking nearly six foot tall yes she was she was 5 11 in her stocking feet as she'd often tell me and uh she was a beauty and that people would often tell me that too her friends would say she was a beautiful woman and you can see from the photographs in the book i mean she's photographed by some very iconic people and she was a beauty there's no doubt about that and remains there all her life you only had to look at her yeah there was a woman who'd been a beauty in her youth and um she loved her work which is the

other thing that actually shines through this book here was someone who found what she was good at and absolutely relished every single moment she relished she relished writing i mean she loved to write whatever whatever she was writing, that was even in, her work ethic was extraordinary. She never stopped writing. And she through that, I mean, I learnt that work was an extraordinarily fulfilling thing to do. And also it provided a

solace, I think, for her in times of stress. She wrote to my stepfather after he died for a year just talking about her feelings of bereavement and also keeping him up to date with what was happening. You know, she just, she wrote, she wrote and wrote and wrote. Yes. This is what she liked to do.

Yeah, no, her third husband, that was a real love story, wasn't it? And that's very touching that she kept on writing to him after he died. It was a love story, yes. That was Claire Hastings talking about her mother, the journalist Anne Scott James. Claire has written a book about her. It's called Hold the Front Page, The Wit and Wisdom of Anne Scott James. Now, lots and lots of emails from you today on a whole range of subjects, but obviously care homes and care workers was the thing that really got you thinking today

for very understandable reasons. So I'll read a range of your responses. This is from Mary. My husband is in an amazing care home in Carnarvon. They are taking every precaution since they locked down a couple of weeks ago, but they go the extra mile. They ring to say how well he's doing. There's FaceTime, etc. And they always make time for me whenever I ring, which is most days. I cannot thank them enough for the care they give, especially as my husband has not been there for a very long time. Mary, thank you for that positive contribution. And this is from Melanie. Jane, my husband has motor neuron disease and we have carers carers in three times a day and they're superb he is 55 and increasingly frail he's on

a ventilator and has respiratory problems we are very concerned in the household as carers have got to deal with many needy patients and who knows what may happen. They need appropriate PPE urgently. They also need to be better paid and valued. They are offering an essential service. Melanie, thank you. I'm glad to hear that you're getting such wonderful service from the carers who come in to look after your husband. But to put it mildly, it's not an easy time, is it? So our very best wishes to you both. This is from Janet, who says um i'm a company or i have a company running four care homes in the north of england and we feel under attack by the new legislation which is allowing hospital discharge into care homes without any pre-admission assessment and no option for the manager of the care home

to assess their ability to meet the needs of the new resident. This is really important and I confess I didn't really understand this but I'll read on because this is instructive for all of us I imagine. One of our homes has experienced first hand a discharge from hospital last week. The ambulance turned up at half past seven and insisted that a lady was taken into the home. But the home didn't have appropriate equipment or staffing to meet her needs. She's very unwell.

And despite many attempts by the manager to have her moved to a more appropriate setting, she's still there. Her family are distraught. She has now been tested for COVID-19 and found to be positive. This is being used as another reason not to move her. She is only 71. The NHS is failing her completely and at the same time putting 17 other vulnerable residents in this particular case at risk. Janet, that is a real insight. Thank you. Thank you very much for that. Sue says our younger daughter is a care worker in a care home in Scotland. The management have got PPE, but they

only plan to release it once there's an outbreak. The home is due to receive 10 elderly patients from hospital who are said to be medically fit. But the home is already understaffed and our daughter is concerned to go on shift without protection and with this sudden influx of residents to care for. There we go, there's another illustration of what everybody's up against. This is from Sarah. My mum is 86, disabled and with dementia,

and she lives with me. She has four care visits a day through social services. Two out of three of her carers are off sick. I have said I don't want any more carers to replace them as it's bad enough with multiple people coming in. Plus they have no protective gear apart from gloves. District nurses do come in twice a week. They are wearing the gear. We are coping because I live with her. We're both staying in 100% of the time, although I'm still very worried about the virus being brought in. I dread to think what is happening with people on their own and what the situation will be like in a few weeks.

And from Jane, my father is in a care home with dementia. Firstly, I was unaware that he wouldn't be able to access hospital treatment in the event of getting COVID-19. He is at present unwell with a different infection and it's really horrible not being able to visit him and see how he is. He misses me terribly and sadly has no understanding of why I can't visit and that is heartbreaking. The care staff are amazing and must be so frightened about how they're going to be able to cope. And we could go on, but I'll read just one more on this subject. I'm 63 and a recently retired GP. I live in Sheffield. I've put myself forward to go back to work. My mother's 89. She's in a care home in the West Midlands. I'm concerned that if she gets COVID-19, she may

suffer unnecessarily as there will be no one available to provide palliative care. The staff, to my knowledge, are not trained in this area. That was something we did mention in our discussion. Lynn goes on, my mother has Alzheimer's, she is profoundly deaf and she will not know what is happening around her with her carers wearing masks, etc. Lynn Nina I'm so sorry and I know you must feel well just absolutely helpless and plus you're a doctor so you understand exactly what will be going on what can we say about that except to say I hope it helps just to be just to be heard and the very best to you and to your mum. Let's talk about hair. Let's talk about hair.

Because as I said during the programme, I'm missing my colour appointment. And I think you'll probably notice on Monday when you listen to the programme that the quality of my hair will be lacking and there'll be a real detrimental effect on the programme. I think we can all acknowledge that. Amanda says, listening to you today, please let listeners

know it's incredibly important to do a skin patch test if you're intending to dye your hair. I had a terrible reaction a couple of years ago just having a skin patch test in my hairdressers with my usual hair dye. Manufacturers change their ingredients. I don't dye my hair anymore.

I've got curly hair and I use apple cider vinegar with warm water okay well maybe that's something that's something I could try Pip says Jane my biggest tip for cutting hair never get home from a good night out

slightly worse for wear or in these current times after a little drink or two and attempt to cut your own fringe you will regret it in the morning I have no doubt whatsoever about that, Pip, so I won't be attempting it. Sue says, not being able to get to a hairdresser,

I have solved the problem. My son shaved his head, shaved my head, sorry, for the Air Ambulance Charity on Tuesday. I've raised almost 400 quid already and I will save on hair products as well. I'm being creative with scarves. And thank you, Sue. Can you send us a picture? We should, I'd like to see what you look like. I'm sure you look fantastic, by the way. And Sarah makes a good point. Great programme today.

Sound a bit Steve Wright there, but we'll leave it in. I have offered my hairdresser payment for four advanced haircuts to help them get through, they are so important to us. Sarah, that's a really good thing to have done. And I think if it's something that you can do, we should all be doing it, shouldn't we? If we possibly can, because she's right. I actually am going to miss going to the hairdressers today. Thank you so much for engaging with Woman's Hour and everything we've done this week. We'll trundle on. We'll be back, of course, with the highlights of the week

with the weekend edition of the programme in podcast and radio form. And then we're back live on the radio two minutes past ten Monday morning. And then, of course, there'll be another podcast on Monday as well. Take care. I hope your weekend is,

well, let's be honest, as good as it can be. Hi, I'm Catherine Bell-H. Hi, I'm Catherine Bowhart. And I'm Sarah Keyworth. We're comedians separately and a couple together, and we're the host of You'll Do, the podcast that gives you a little insight into perfectly imperfect love. Yeah, forget nights in with this one and hashtag couples goals. We want to know the whys and hows of sticking with the people we love and asking a few of

the questions that are meant to help us develop intimacy. So why not give it a listen and subscribe to You'll Do on BBC Sounds. I'm Sarah Treleaven and for over a year, I've been working on one of the most complex stories I've ever covered. There was somebody out there who's faking pregnancies. I started like warning everybody. Every doula that I know. It was somebody out there who's faking pregnancies. I started like warning everybody. Every doula that I know. It was fake.

No pregnancy. And the deeper I dig, the more questions I unearth. How long has she been doing this? What does she have to gain from this? From CBC and the BBC World Service, The Con, Caitlin's Baby. It's a long story, settle in. Available now.