Woman's Hour - Isabel Allende, Erna Solberg, music with Madeleine Mitchell & Errollyn Wallen & post lockdown workwear with Emma Jacobs.

Episode Date: March 5, 2021

Anita Rani talks to the Chilean author Isabel Allende, also to the Norwegian Prime Minister Erna Solberg. To mark International Women's Day we have music with Madeleine Mitchell & Errollyn Wallen and we look at the future of workwear post lockdown. Will power suits and formal wear be a thing of the past after a year of lounging in comfies? Emma Jacobs from the Financial Times considers our appetite for zoom casual clothing and what we can expect when we all return to the office in the coming months. Presenter: Anita Rani Producer: Lisa Jenkinson Studio Engineer: John Boland

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. I'm Natalia Melman-Petrozzella, and from the BBC, this is Extreme Peak Danger. The most beautiful mountain in the world. If you die on the mountain, you stay on the mountain. This is the story of what happened when 11 climbers died on one of the world's deadliest mountains, K2, and of the risks we'll take to feel truly alive. If I tell all the details, you won't believe it anymore. Extreme, peak danger. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.

BBC Sounds. Music, radio, podcasts. Hello, I'm Anita Rani and welcome to Woman's Hour from BBC Radio 4. Good morning, it's Friday and it's Woman's Hour. A very important question for you all today. What are you wearing right now? Just how comfy are you? How comfy have you got? And when you do have to go back out there to work, back into an actual physical meeting,

what on earth will you wear? How do you feel about squeezing back into those stilettos after a year in slippers, fastening up a waistband after slouching around in joggers? Or maybe you've been dressing up every morning. Will the new office attire take a more casual look or are we all ready for some serious power dressing? I want to know what you're planning for your office wardrobe this morning.

You can text on 84844 or get in touch via social media at BBC Woman's Hour or email us through our website. Dina Lee-Kung says, I wore a Chanel jacket to the dentist and when he told me the sad news I needed extensive repair over four more appointments I thought oh goody what shall I wear and Jason says I'm not going to fit in any of my proper clothes now it's either going to have to be buy new trousers or it's joggers for work so whatever your thoughts get in touch. Now as well as planning our wardrobes we are joined by quite a lineup of incredible women today. When you think about countries who seem to be ahead of the curve of many things particularly providing opportunities for women people often think about Scandinavian countries. Well, we're talking to the Prime Minister of Norway to find out why they do things the way

they do. The absolute legend that is Isabel Allende gives us all advice about power, feminism and a new fella in her 70s. And music, sweet music. We're heading to a lighthouse in the Highlands to find out about a new composition for International Women's Day and a very special column. But first, Erna Solberg is Norway's second female prime minister, the longest-serving head of government in their history, having led a coalition government since 2013. Now seen by many as a champion of women,

Prime Minister Solberg, or Erna, as she very happily allowed me to call her, joined me earlier this week to reflect on why Norway and more broadly Scandinavia is seen as so progressive when it comes to social policy for women. I started asking about the North Alliance She Conference she's taking part in today. The opening session has a very impressive line-up.

In discussion with her are Hillary and Chelsea Clinton, the Icelandic Prime Minister Katrin Jakobsdóttir and Sadiq Khan, the London Mayor. So what will be on the agenda? Well, we'll talk about women leadership, of course, through the COVID-19, but also challenges to gender equality. Gender equality is under attack during COVID-19 based on the fact that violence at home becomes even, of course, stronger and more cases when people are staying at home. We see girls who are not attending school, so we are not sure about will they attend school in developing countries after this epidemic. And in general, of course, there's still a way to go before we are on a gender equality balance in the world.

You're thought of by many in Norway as a champion of women's rights. Where does that focus come from? I think it comes from a lot of women in politics. And politics is about people's everyday life. And what happened in the late 70s, early 80s was that there became more women active in political life. Part of the women movement moved into the more organized political life. And then, of course, we had a first government with 40% in the 80s. And we have stayed around that. And I think the focus is, of course, that everyday life's problems becomes politics. And then, of course, women's lives becomes politics in a way.

And that's where maternity leave, child care comes, I think, on the political agenda. So I think representation is important for this. I don't think that in a more male-dominant society where women had less participation in the labour force, you would have the same focus on the policy issues that is difficult for women, because they wouldn't have been that difficult for women because they would be staying at home and taking care of the family. Often when people think about gender equality and certainly female opportunities, they look to Scandinavian countries and Norway as being ahead of the curve. Why is that? Let's talk about first of all maternity leave in your country, which is the first thing that people think about. 59 weeks at 80% pay. A lot of women in Britain

might be hearing that and thinking, when can I move to Norway? But what impact has that had on Norwegian women's lives? For a long, long time, we said that we have managed this dilemma of having a career and having a family at the same time. And if you had asked any Norwegian politician 10 years ago, they would have answered, the answer to that is long maternity leave. It's childcare for everybody, even though you pay for it, it's that we make sure that you can have that balance. When I say 10 years ago, it's because the fertility rate in Norway is lower now than it was 10 years ago. And we seem

to be not that good at the balance between career and having a family anymore. And I have asked the question, why do you get fewer children in our society these days compared to earlier on? Because that was one of the success stories of Norway. I'm still working on that issue because we probably have solved most of the economic and challenges families have, but maybe there's still some on the private agenda of people. So it's a success story, but not as big a success as we thought. Why is it a problem if women are having fewer children in Norway?

Well, I think it's a problem for all of our countries that when our population becomes older, you have to have younger people paying for the pension system you have. You have to have more people into health care. It's difficult when the balance between generations becomes distorted. Isn't it inevitable as we progress as societies where women just have more choice and freedom to choose what they want to do? And maybe one of those choices is not to become mothers absolutely but but that's not what women do in our way it's about the same number of women who get children in our country but they get one instead of two or two instead of three and that adds up so we would like to see how can you get more families not just women husbands and wives wives, or wives and wives, and all the new types of family life you have, to want three, not just two. That would add up a little bit more

to our balance in the future. You were only 25 when you decided to enter politics, and then within 27 years, you became Prime Minister. Was that always part of the plan? No, it was never part of the plan. I always have had as a motto that you have to do the job you have very thoroughly and concentrate on that. And then opportunities will open. But I never thought I would be the type of person who would become neither party leader nor prime minister. When I started off in politics, I thought I'd become a good advisor to a politician. Then I became a politician and it sort of increased while I was working.

And why did you think that it wasn't for you? Because I'm not big on rhetoric. Some of the ideals about politicians, I don't really fulfill that much. And maybe as all other women, you tend to, not qualities you have, you always look at what you are lacking. I think I've learned through my years as a politician that I have to see beyond, you know, what you think you cannot do to focus on what you are able to do and say more yes than no and be a little bit more daring. Oh, Erna, I think there'll be lots of women listening with amazement and reassurance to hear that, you know, the longest serving Conservative Prime Minister of Norway

also has doubts about herself in such a role. So how do we overcome them? Well, I think I learned that working hard with policy issues, being quite sure was an important part of, you know, creating your character and the respect around women always being overqualified for work and jobs. And I just had to say to myself that, OK, you are doing the same to you. So when I was asked to become vice chair of the Conservative Party, the election commissioning leader asked me, said to me, well, you have to be prepared to become leader afterwards because unless you can't say yes to this. And then he said, and then, of course, you will be our prime minister candidate. And then I just had to say, well, okay, I'm prepared for that. Even though I would have said that maybe I didn't feel very prepared for it. Then I looked around. This is the joke I

usually say in all feminist meetings. So I'd say, I looked around and who had been and I said, okay, I can do it. They can do it. I can do it. And you have to start to mobilise your own courage. And you are leading a coalition government. It was four parties and now it's three parties. I imagine that comes with its own demands and challenges. You need a lot of tolerance and you need the ability to understand the other parties and try to find what combines you and try to focus on what's the most important issues. Everybody else will focus outside the coalition on what's the most important issues. Everybody else will focus

outside the coalition on what you are disagreeing on. Then you have to sort of push forward those issues that we were agreeing on, better business environment for small and mediums, to better the economic situation for families. You have to find those focus areas. Countries that are run by women have done better during this pandemic there's Norway New Zealand Taiwan Germany do you think there's a gender difference when it comes to leadership and approach to leadership I'm not sure of that yes there is a gender difference but I don't think think that's the reason. I think maybe you should look at what's common for those countries who have female leadership. Maybe you will find the fabric

of those countries more prepared for both women as leaders, but also for fighting in a pandemic like COVID-19, because there's a little bit less testosterone in the politics. You maybe also get women leaders, but you also get more the community approach to fighting a pandemic, which is what really gives the results. And also your parliament, it's nearly half of parliament in Norway

is made up of women. Yes. You did something really quite wonderful in the last year, which is you decided that you would address the concerns of children in Norway directly around the pandemic. Why did you decide to do this? Because children are so affected by the pandemic and they are having all the same questions as adults have in their own context of going to school, maybe not being allowed to go to school, having digital education. We closed down all the schools in Norway. They had

to put up their computers and have a digital school for nine weeks. And we were a bit inspired by Denmark, where the prime minister of Denmark was giving a speech to children. But we thought that we would answer the questions instead. And we lined up with a children's channel on the Norwegian Broadcasting Company and the magazine of the biggest newspaper in Norway, who has a children's magazine. And they asked all their readers and viewers to send in their questions and we answered them. And together with the Minister of Family and Child Affairs and Education, we have had three of those and then they have had one or two others after that. And I think it's important to take children seriously and their questions seriously.

And I think one of the interesting parts was the first press conference we had was when we still had the closed schools. And this was broadcasted, in fact, on television directly and just like the adult press conference were. And all schools had turned this into an agenda item on their school day. So I think it was one of the press conference we had the largest numbers of viewers on. And a very good way of engaging young people in politics as well. Well, good way of engaging, listening to them. And also quite a lot of parents said that

they asked better questions than the journalists did. I'm sure they did. I'm trying to imagine if Boris Johnson decided to do something similar. I'm not sure how it would go down, but it definitely have huge viewing figures. Finally, Anna, we're in lockdown, we're in a global pandemic, people are having to work in all new ways from home, and also making sure that they have time for themselves so that they can relax. So how does the Prime Minister of Norway relax during a pandemic whilst having to run a country? Are you watching Netflix, like the rest of us? am watching netflix i am doing computer games i'm

reading books hearing which computer games well i do these puzzle computer games where you're solving puzzles so that you can do it even you're traveling and i'm not raging wars against others on on my computer i'm trying to solve different types of puzzles. But it's activity that you do to relax. And then, of course, in Norway, even though we have a certain type of lockdown in Oslo these days, when it comes to people being asked to work from home, not to travel too much. And today, the municipality has closed down shops again, because of an increase in the numbers who are sick. But we have always said you have to go walk. You have to be getting fresh air.

And the prime minister also tries to do that. And what's your Netflix recommendation? What are you watching? We were late watching The Crown. So we've just finished that, me and my husband and I. It's nice to do something together because we have separate tastes. He likes the historic drama, the big wars. I am a fantasy person.

I think it's easy to look at something that is a little bit brain dead, but whether it's vampires or it's a fantasy story. Erna Solberg, the Prime Minister of Norway, talking to me there. And if you like the cut of her jib and you do want another Netflix recommendation, Borgen, Hatcombe's highly recommended.

Now, comfy loungewear has been the outfit of choice for many working from home during the pandemic. How will Zoom casual change our clothing choices when we return to the office? Is this the end of smart office wear? Well, Emma Jacobs is a work and careers columnist for the Financial Times and joins me now in a really nice sparkly blue jumper emma oh thanks yeah you look great um are

we going to see a fashion revolution off the back end of this pandemic are you know it was mini skirts in the 60s stilettos in the 80s and joggers in 2021 uh i'd like to predict the next five years and then i could go into consultancy with the fashion industry who are desperate for money. But it's very hard to tell. I'm sorry to be the boring nuance. But I mean, definitely people have enjoyed the casual side of the last few months, but I think they're also desperate to dress up and so who knows I think that people might go into the office and maximise their dressing up time certainly dig out dresses if they can fit into them after the last year sourdough and baking bread and so on. I suppose it also depends on on your workplace as well in the last few years some workplaces were already relaxing their dress codes weren't they

how has the pandemic has the pandemic accelerated this, do you think? Places like Goldman Sachs. Yeah, Goldman Sachs did ditch its formal dress code. The House of Commons told men that they didn't have to wear a tie anymore a few years ago. But we don't, I mean, the general trend is generally more casual. There's been the influence of kind of informal workplaces, IT jobs, where the uniform is hoodies and smart trousers. But I think that the overall trend is generally casual. And I would have thought that the last year has accelerated that.

But I do think we don't know what the next bit will be like, where people work part-time from home and part-time in the office. I mean, there's a big worry, for example, about women being ignored when they're at home and that people will forget to Zoom them. And so perhaps you could see a kind of levelling up again of dress codes so that people could try and get noticed. And I suppose if some people are at home on Zoom calls, it's still in that kind of relaxed mode and other people are dressing up

to go into the office, then that's going to be quite strange as well when people are wearing different outfits. People don't know what the hybrid is going to look like. There's no best practice. We've never done it before and in any any meaningful way so i think it's going to be very hard to predict i mean it could be that everybody dresses up uh for both home and the office which i somehow doubt but it might be that we kind of go into a kind of middle where people uh dress up at the office and then sometimes for their Zoom at home kind of put on loads of makeup. Well, lots of people are getting in touch

with the programme this morning. We've got one message here that says, Boroda, hello everyone in Wales. She says, I'm wearing nothing as I'm just about to get into the shower. Thanks for that. And she says, after a week in lockdown, she's washing her hair.

She says, I've recycled most of my clothes using them to feed my craft habit of Amish knit drug knit rugs uh when I do go back out there it will be um it will be very pared down capsule wards are two sizes bigger and flat shoes flip-flops if I can get away with it and no bra I feel freed actually lots of people like the no bra aspect and the unstructured bra of, I mean, if they are wearing one. So, I mean, I think bra trends is something to look out for for the future. Jackie Weaver, the Jackie Weaver, was on our programme a few weeks ago and told us not to wear PJs in Zoom meetings.

Do you think the age old saying of dress smart, think smart is true? I think it's really interesting. I think that it's really variable a friend of mine said that she has been putting on not only high heels for her zoom interviews but also perfume so I think that people do whatever works I know that my mum who worked from home uh you know my entire life always put a face of makeup on and technology but I think people people have enjoyed having some relaxation but you know you also hear stories of people putting full face of makeup to go to Tesco and you know maximizing the opportunities to look smart I I've certainly been browsing

sequined dresses, which is something I've never thought about before. Just, you know, because you've got pent up need to show off. Lorraine, Lorraine, the artist has got in touch says, I need more colour. I've taken to making flowery clothes from old curtains before my wardrobe was nearly all black and navy. Are we going to see lots of people in sort of handmade crafted knitted things in the office because what else have people been up to in the last year i don't know how representative these two callers are they sound fantastic uh but um i don't know how many handcrafted outfits there are going to be in the city uh not that many, I'd guess. I think they'll have some sort of decor.

I mean, there are certain careers like PR, tech, media, where, I mean, everything's quite casual anyway. In fact, if you turned up in a suit for one of those jobs, people might think you had a court appearance. So generally things in certain, certain industries were quite casual anyway, weren't they? Yeah, I mean, journalism is a pretty shabby industry and I've been surprised by how

much i've really enjoyed not putting any makeup on having worn it all the time uh but i think that there there might be a kind of uh people might want to express their individuality a bit more but somebody was saying to me the other day that what they've noticed among city workers men is that the shirt used to be, I know that everyone keeps talking about the Zoom shirt as an expression of kind of difference, but he said actually it's become much more of a uniform. So every man is wearing a white shirt or a blue shirt and that's it. So who knows?

Who knows? We will be watching and paying attention. Emma, thank you so much for joining us this morning. Keep your entertaining tweets coming in. Now, the critically acclaimed and award-winning author Isabel Allende has written 24 books and sold 75 million copies worldwide. They include The House of the Spirits, based on her childhood, written at the bedside of her daughter as she lay in a coma, a coma that she never recovered from.

She was 29. And her latest book, The Soul of a Woman, is her memoir on feminism, power and what it means to be a woman. I asked, when did she first realise the fight for women's rights was so important to her? I started with the idea of how unfair the world was for women. When I was five or six years old, I was really, really young. And it has been something that I have carried with me all my life. So what did you see around you when you were five or six years old that made you become a feminist? My father abandoned the family when I wasn't even three years old.

My mother was pregnant of my little brother. And my mother was a señorita in a South American society, Catholic, conservative, raised to be a mother and somebody's wife. And she found herself abandoned, alone, with no skills to work, and three babies. So she went back to live in her father's house. My grandmother died. And so it was the house of a widower. And my bachelor uncles lived in the house as well. My mother was in a very vulnerable position. She had no money. She was a charity case, really. So my grandfather paid for our schooling and all that. But my mother had no pocket money, no freedom. She had to take care of her reputation.

And I could see very young, I could see how unfair the situation of my mother was compared to my uncles and my grandfather. So I think that it started then. And the difference between what was happening with the men and the women around you really angered you, didn't it? Particularly the machismo you saw around you. Yes. I was a rebellious child, I suppose, anyhow. But it was sort of targeted against male authority. And that became so prevalent in my life that I even left the church when I was 15 and I never went back because the idea that some guys with robes would be telling me what to do was just inconceivable. In the 60s, you started writing for a feminist magazine called Paula and you poked fun at Makismo in that and you started a column called Civilize Your Troglodyte.

Good title. How did that go down? It went very well, actually, because, you know, feminism, we got a lot of aggression because feminism was so new. And it was presented as a war against men, against the church, against establishment, against everything. And the fact that I could do it with humour made it more tolerable. Sometimes I would get letters or men would tell me, I have a friend just like your troglodyte. It was always a friend. It was never them. In honour of your daughter, Paula, who died at the age of 29, you set up a foundation. And it was your trip to India that inspired that. I'd love to hear more about that. This was in 1993 or 94, I think. After my daughter died,

I wrote a book called Paula. And when the book was out of my hands, I just felt a horrible void. I didn't know what to do with my life. And so my husband and a friend took me to India with the idea of getting me out of my comfort zone. And maybe that would sort of shake me up. And we ended up renting a car with a driver. And we were in Rajasthan in some very rural area. And we stopped. And there was a group of, let's say, six women, very poor, around a tree. So my friend and I walked to them. We didn't share a language, but we gave them some bracelets that we had bought in the market. And there was that exchange that women sometimes have just by touching, you know, touching each other's hair and smiling. And then when we were going back to the car because the driver was

honking, one of the women gave me this little pack of rags, really. And I thought she was trying to give me something back because of the bracelets. And I said, no, no, no, it's not necessary. I tried to give it back and she wouldn't take it. So I opened it, and to my horror, I saw that it was a newborn baby. I don't think the baby was more than a day old. The umbilical cord was still there. And the baby was naked, and it smelled of, I don't know, of ashes. It was just such an incredible thing. So I kissed the baby, blessed the baby, and tried to give it back again. And then

she backed off. She didn't want the baby. And the driver came, took the baby from my hands, gave it to the first woman that was standing there and pushed me into the car. And in the car, like a minute later, I reacted and I said, what happened? Why that woman try to give me a baby? And the driver said, was a girl. Who wants a girl? And you know, that was the moment when I realized what I was going to do with the income that came from the book I had written about my daughter. And I decided to create a foundation to help women like that woman who was so desperate and poor that she was willing to give away her child and that little girl whose destiny must have been pretty bad. With the profits from that book. Well since then the foundation has

grown and a lot of my income goes directly to the foundation. You now live in California, but during the pandemic, cases of domestic violence have increased all over the world. But in Chile, they're some of the highest rates in the world. How concerned are you about this? It is true that the numbers are appalling and domestic violence has been a problem in Chile always, as it has been in Mexico and in many other countries, not only Chile. But in Chile, because we keep records, they look terrible, more terrible than in other places where no records are kept. The women's movements, and there are several in Chile,

the women's groups have been creating awareness of this and trying to change the laws. And a lot has been done. When Michelle Bachelet was elected the first woman president in our country, her first mission was to confront domestic violence. And so there were new laws and shelters and information, education, and also punishment for the aggressors. So that changed a little. The pandemic has exacerbated all the problems that women have. Women were the first to lose their jobs. They will be the last to get them back.

They have been victims of the virus massively because they take care of people. They take care of people in nursing homes, in schools, with children, everywhere, in hospitals. And they are the least protected. In the United States, many of them are undocumented. If they get sick, they don't even have treatment. So I think that the pandemic has made us very aware of how much more we have to do as women. You know, I always say one woman alone is just very vulnerable. We have no power. But when we get together, we are invincible. So let's get together. I completely agree with you when we get together we're invincible there's so much strength in the sisterhood where do men fit into it i think

that young men fit into this i'm not talking about older men without education who i mean you have to wait wait until they die off it was nothing to do with it. But younger generations that have been brought up by mothers like me and who have girlfriends who have been brought by mothers like me, who will not put up with this. So they are either aware and understanding, or sometimes they are part of the movement, which is great. Also, I see that my grandchildren, in my grandchildren's generation, the gender gap is not that important. Many, many young people define themselves as non-binary. So it's not about being male or female, it's about who you are. And that is a huge change that will accelerate whatever we have to do to replace the patriarchy. I want to talk about romance because you say you're a romantic, but you find it very difficult to write about.

You know, I love the idea of romance, of the couple that falls in love and they're happy ever after. It never happens in real life, though. And I write very realistic novels. So I find myself around half of the work and I don't like the guy. I don't like my hero. And I think, if I don't like him, why would my female protagonist like him?

And I have to kill him. But then I bring someone else in because it's always about love. female protagonist like him and I have to kill him. But then I bring someone else in because it's always about love. For me, love is really important. It doesn't have to be the romantic love of romance novels, but relationships are essential to me. And your passion is just as intense now as it always has been. So you've been married three times and you've just remarried again in your seventies. It may be, it's not my last marriage. Who knows? Maybe, who knows? Tell us

how you met Roger. Roger is adorable and I shouldn't be saying this. I know, is Roger listening? No, he's not. He's not. But I keep telling him, you don't take me for granted because you know what? I can still marry one more time or two. Well, Roger heard me on the radio, actually. He was a lawyer in New York with a very formal, stable, I would say even conservative life. And he was a widower. And I don't know what I said on the radio, but he decided to write to me. And he started writing every day, morning and evening, for five months. We never talked on the phone and we never met. And then I went to New York for a conference and I thought, well, I should meet this guy.

And so we went out for lunch and I liked him. He seemed exactly as what I had thought he was by reading his emails. So after the first course, I asked him, what are your intentions? Because I am 74 years old, I have no time to waste. The poor guy choked on the ravioli, but he didn't escape. And three days later, he asked me to marry him. And I said, look, marriage is out of the question, but we can be lovers. The problem is that I live in California and you live in New York. So eventually he decided to sell his house, give away everything and move with me to California. He knew he was onto a good thing, Isabel. It's funny because when he arrived, he brought only with him two bikes, his clothes, and for

some reason, some crystal glasses. Who knows why? But it's working really beautifully. Good. I'm really happy to hear that. It sounds great. Crystal glasses. Very nice. I have to ask, you are so vibrant, beautiful, funny, sexy, passionate. Oh, please.

Can you tell I love you a little bit? What's the secret? Well, I don't think I am any of all those things that you mentioned, but I do have a lot of energy. But I think that the most important thing at my age, aside from love and the few people that you want to have close to you and a dog, if possible, the most important thing is purpose. To have something that you're passionate about. My hero is called Olga Murray, and she appears in the book. She is a 96-year-old young woman in tennis shoes. She has saved thousands of kids from servitude, from starvation, from exploitation in Nepal. And this little woman at 96 still

travels to Nepal twice a year and has this incredible work. She looks 50 because she has purpose. And I know a couple of nuns that are, I don't know, there must be like almost a hundred still working. And those are the people that are my heroes because I want to be like them, if possible. And I want to be like you, Isabel, the ever inspiring and powerful Isabel Allende there. Now to mark International Women's Day on Monday, the classical violinist Madeline Mitchell will direct a live streamed concert at St. John Smith Square, celebrating a century of music by British women from 1921 to 2021. And with her London Chamber Ensemble, she's put together a range of chamber music,

celebrating some of the finest British female composers of the past 100 years and includes the world premiere of a new work by Errolyn Wallen CBE. And I'm delighted that both Madeleine and Errolyn join me this morning. Welcome to Woman's Hour. Madeleine, how did you go about choosing the female composers to include in the concert? Was it a hard list to compile? Well, the seeds were sort of sown two years ago on International Women's Day 2019 with the release of my album of the chamber music by Grace Williams, a Welsh composer born in

1906 with the London Chamber Ensemble for Naxos and none of this music had been recorded before and some of it was unpublished so it wasn't known and we were absolutely thrilled with the reception that this received. In fact the director of the BBC National Orchestra of Wales heard me on Woman's Hour and as a result asked me to record the Grace Williams Violin Concerto. But there are so many fabulous women composers and I discovered this marvellous piano trio by Rebecca Clarke, the oldest composer that we're featuring. She was born in 1886 and this piece was written in 1921, so I thought, oh that's exactly a century ago. She was one of the first professional players in a London orchestra, she had to support herself as well as composing, she was a viola player,

and a lot of her music had been neglected, although this piano trio was first performed in Wigmore Hall in 1921. And I just thought, well, it would really be the culmination to commission a new work by Errolyn Wallen. And I was so pleased that the Ralph Vaughan Williams Trust supported my commission and indeed that the Ambass Trust have supported the concert at St John's Smith Square on Monday. Let me bring Errolyn in on this. Errolyn, what a gift to be asked to be composed for this concert. Oh, yes, Anita, it's a tremendous honour. And it was about two years ago, Madeleine first sort of knew to the idea of commissioning work for me,

but I had no idea it was for such a very special concert. It's a great privilege for me. I had no idea it's for such a very special concert it's it's a great privilege for me I think we should you you've also Madeleine um got there are two Judith Weir pieces included including this one I think we should have listened to some music this is Atlantic Drift Madeleine tell me what we're listening to. We'll let it play underneath. This is called Sleep Sound in the Morning, which is from a group of pieces called Atlantic Drift. It describes the celebrating the flow of traditional music from the British Isles to North America and back again.

And Judith is the first female master of the Queen's music. We're also including another piece of hers called the Bagpiper String Trio. I recorded that track with a former student of mine from the Royal College of Music, Keris Jones, on an album called Violin Muse for Divine Arts in 2017. It really is a celebration of women in music. And also you're unearthing some history here. Errolyn, tell us about your piece that you've composed for this. It's called Sojourner Truth.

What was the idea behind it? You know, I've been so inspired by women that have gone before us. And Sojourner Truth was, she campaigned against, she was an abolitionist and a human rights act, women's rights activist and she escaped just you know she escaped slavery, she couldn't read a right yet she gave these phenomenal speeches and I wanted to write a piece remembering her and I wanted her title, her name to be in the title so that she's never forgotten that I mean the spirit and energy, Isabella Eandy never forgotten that I mean the spirit and energy

Isabella Eandy was talking about this the spirit and energy of this one was incredible I thought let that be my inspiration for this piece from Adeline. She went to court didn't she and won even though she was illiterate Sojourner truth. Yeah she went to she's the first black woman to recover her son from slavery and she represented herself in court. I mean, incredible. How did you try to capture her story in music? Well, I took a spiritual, it's called Over the Crossing, and it's a fantastic piece. And then I sort of worked with that as the theme. I think we can listen to a little bit of it. How wonderful to be able to hear that being played. And Errolyn, you're speaking to us from your lighthouse in Scotland, are you?

Is that where you've spent the whole of lockdown? Yes, I've been here for a year, practically, apart from the last night of the prom, so I had a piece played. You've been there for a year. So how was it? Was it the perfect place to spend lockdown or did you miss company? I've loved it every second. I've never been bored.

I've got so much music to write. I live on top of the sea. It's fantastic. And Madeleine. It was so great when we were first, when I first received this piece from Errolyn, I was rehearsing with the pianist who's playing with me there, Sophia Rahman. And we're able to have Errolyn on FaceTime hearing it and giving us feedback. And that's the joy of having a new piece where you can ask the composer things it is wonderful and it's so uplifting and i can tell just by looking at

your faces on zoom uh how excited you are about the concert uh the important thing is whilst you were all facetiming what were you wearing were you dressed up we will be dressed up in full evening clothes for monday and it's been such a joy to play with friends and colleagues again. And if I could just mention the other composers, because they're all fabulous. Thea Marsgrave, who's 92, has been messaging me from California. Cheryl Frances Hode, Ruth Gipps, whose centenary falls this year and she's on Radio 3 next week, Composer of the Week.

And Helen Grime as well. They've all got a mention. That's wonderful. Madeleine and Errolyn, thank you very much for joining me and we'll give you the details of where you can find that concert on our website. That's all for today's Woman's Hour. Join us again next time.

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