Woman's Hour - Parenting: What's behind a kid feigning illness and not wanting to go to school?

Episode Date: November 13, 2019

What do you do when your child says they're too ill to go to school – but you suspect that they’re perfectly fine? Jane discusses with Dr Angharad Rudkin, clinical child psychologist at the University of Southampton, and Rebecca Schiller, parenting journalist and mother-of-two.

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BBC Sounds. Music, radio, podcasts. Hi, this is Jane Garvey and this is the Woman's Hour Parenting Podcast. And this week we discuss sickies. What do you do? It's that old, age-old scenario. It's first thing on a, could be a cold Monday morning, pouring with rain. And they're too ill to go to school, or they say they are. But you suspect that might not actually be the truth or the whole story. pouring with rain, and they're too ill to go to school, or they say they are. But you suspect that might not actually be the truth or the whole story.

I spoke to clinical child psychologist Dr Anne Harrod-Rudkin from the University of Southampton and to parenting journalist and mother of two, Rebecca Schiller. I asked Rebecca whether her children had tried to get a day off school when they didn't strictly need one. Yes, I mean, we're lucky they both really enjoy going to school, but we've definitely had quite a few examples of their definition of illness not quite being the same as mine. And what happens? What do you do? So my instinct is not to just dismiss them straight off and to give them a bit of a test.

So I tend to take their temperature and then I offer them their favourite breakfast, lull them into a bit of a false sense of security while they're eating it and have a chat with them. And if they haven't got a temperature, can manage to eat a breakfast and can string enough sentences together, then unless it seems like there's something else going on, they're going to school. And Anne-Harrad, that's the difficult thing. There might be something else going on. How do you find out? It is really difficult, like Rebecca said.

So I think the best thing is get to know your child, obviously, but also think about what else is happening for them in their lives. Are they not sleeping well? Are they not eating well in general? Is there something that's creating anxiety that might make you think, hmm, I'm not sure if life is going particularly well for them at the moment. We know that Rebecca's tactic is to stay absolutely calm and just carry on. I have to say, that would indicate to me, Rebecca, you've got time on your side.

These things always happen to me when I was 10 minutes from trying to fly out the house. But you actually do have a bit of time to play with, do you, first thing in the morning? I'm pretty lucky that both my husband and I tend to work from home I think my approach to it if we were both in a rush to go to a meeting might be slightly more hysterical yeah. Okay well don't look at me when you say hysterical though you might be on to something. So what about that what do you do you prepare a breakfast offer them food see if they'll have it or not? I think that's a really good idea because what we do know is that having very clear boundaries is the best way forward. So as a parent, if your child says, I've got a tummy ache, I don't want to go to school. If you just say, oh, well, okay, you don't have to

go to school, that's not useful for your child because they'll never learn to deal with difficulties as they arise. But what you don't also want to be is the other end of the spectrum where you're saying, don't be ridiculous, you're going into school, whatever. So somewhere in the middle where you're able to talk to your child and find out what's going on for them give them a nice breakfast if you can but if in doubt and the temperature is okay and they're not vomiting on your shoes then get them into school and talk to them along the way what's happening is there something that's bothering you and if so what can we do so you can go in with a plan in in place that they can get through the day let me just read you some thoughts from the listeners anne says i'm from a long line of northern matriarchs

and there's no illness my child can have that would warrant a day off school. Phil, I used to have to have a visible injury that plasters couldn't fix or be projectile vomiting to get a day off school. My mum was tough. Another listener, if your child knows that the answer is too ill to go to school means you

stay in bed all day with just a book, they won't bother if they're not really ill. Okay, you're both nodding. And Harrod, that's right. Yes, I think it is. Yes, we could talk about push and pull factors. What's pushing them away from school? And that's usually things like bullying or friendship difficulties or worries about schoolwork. But also what are the pull factors? What's keeping them at home? For very few few children it could be about concerns about the parents wanting to keep an eye on them but for most of them it'll be uh you know eight hours of fortnight and eating snacks all day and they're not ill are they if they're up to that no they're not ill and i think as a parent if you've got your tick box in your mind push pull factors what is going on for my child here it might help

you figure out what decision to make but those those friendship issues rebecca i don't know if they've cropped up with your kids but they actually're actually the hardest issues of all to fix, aren't they, as a parent? Absolutely. And I can remember the first time that my daughter, who's now nine, said that she didn't want to go to school, having loved school, because she was having some difficulties in her friendship group. And I absolutely panicked. I sent an email to the head teacher and it all blew over in in 24 hours but we have had a few examples when she's had a mysterious tummy ache that turns out to be her way of telling me something's not right with her friends at school and I feel that on one of

those occasions I have let her have a morning off and it was convenient for me. She was pretty tired. It was the end of term and she was obviously quite upset. And I know that there are times when I have been upset and I have had to clear my day in order to get my head around something. And I feel like I'm really lucky to have been able to do that for her. But actually giving her that time to talk about what's going on and to know that it will probably pass and that there are some options. We can talk to her teachers. We can, you know, look at getting her a book to help with this kind of thing. It has given her a bit more confidence to go back to school and deal with that.

And, of course, the next day everything's been fine. That's interesting. So, actually, Anne Harrod, is the basic rule of thumb to take everything quite seriously? Don't dismiss your child ever. Yes, but we're all humans and we're all busy parents. And I think sometimes we don't listen quite as well as we should do. But I think on the whole, if you can listen to your child and just keep a careful eye out on them

if there are, say, changes around behaviour or sleeping and eating. And resilience, you know, it's a very trendy concept at the moment, resilience. And we can talk to our children all we like about resilience. But at the end of the day, you build up resilience by going into difficult, tricky situations. So arming your child to go into school when they've got no one to sit with at lunchtime or they've got no one to play with in break time. That's tough when you put it like that. It is tough. It is tough. It is. But we've all been there and we all grow by getting through those situations. So we can't overprotect our children because they will grow up to be adults who can't deal with tough times. So there's

a real balance to be had. Yeah. And when a child moves to secondary school, actually, that can be trickier. The transformation, the transition. That's it. Thank you. The transition. I'm having a very menopausal day with language today, just forgive me. The transition to secondary school can be quite tough. It can be, yes. And that can make everybody feel a bit more vulnerable. So what do you do at that stage?

Because as a parent, you're actually lesser. You might not know other parents and you might be more reluctant to go into the school. That's it. As parents of children in primary school, you're far more networked, really, so you more than likely know the parents of the children in your child's class.

You get to secondary school, your child doesn't want you within a mile radius of the school. They certainly don't want you getting involved or interfering with their friendships. But at the end of the day, they're still learning how to deal with them. So they have to accept if they're not going to school or if they're saying every day

that they don't want to go to school, you are going to get involved and you're going to figure out ways with them so they have to accept if they're not going to school or if they're saying every day that they don't want to go to school you are going to get involved and you're going to figure out ways with them of helping the day get a bit better whether that involves talking to the head of year or whether it involves texting a friend's parent. Right but don't be afraid to get involved but do you though tell the child what you're doing? Absolutely. You do? Absolutely I think when it comes to any school refusal or any issues around anxiety working together as a team is always the best research don't do it on the sly without no no don't do it on the slide because you will get found out just as when your teenager does something on the slide they will get find out found out so open communication is the best and letting your child know i know this is embarrassing for you and it

probably feels a bit awkward but i am going to go and email your head of year just to figure out what's going on and see if there's anything that we can do to help make going to school a bit better for you. Right and you did say Rebecca that you have taken time out yourself when you just haven't felt right. The concept of mental health particularly with very young children it's still not something that many people are all that comfortable with but what do you think about that? How would you express it to your children? Because they are very young. They are. And I think part of that is modelling, modelling that behaviour yourself. I'm not naturally someone that's good at cutting myself some slack. It's a learned skill, something that I'm trying to be better at. So just trying to talk about, you know, I'm feeling really stressed out at the moment. I've

got a lot on, so I'm not going to be able to do this thing because I need a bit of time to do some gardening or just watch some TV to make myself feel better. But then also trying to be a bit more tuned into them so I can see that with schoolwork, there seems to be a lot of pressure, even in primary school at the moment, target-related pressure. It's quite... It doesn't feel like the school system that I was in as in primary school at the moment target related pressure and it's quite it doesn't feel like this the school system that I was in as a primary school child and so I can

see that they're actually there are pressures that my kids are having that I did not have as a primary age child. That was Rebecca Schiller and Dr Anne Harrod-Rudkin and if there's an issue you'd like us to cover on the Woman's Hour Parenting Podcast contact us via the website bbc.co.uk slash Woman's Hour. everybody. Every doula that I know. It was fake. No pregnancy. And the deeper I dig, the more questions I unearth. How long has she been doing this? What does she have to gain from this? From CBC and the BBC World Service, The Con, Caitlin's Baby. It's a long story, settle in. Available now.