Woman's Hour - Runner Georgia Hunter Bell, Liquid breast augmentation, Jordyn with a Why

Episode Date: September 18, 2026

Georgia Hunter Bell rediscovered her teenage love of running during lockdown, and two years later won Team GB a Bronze medal in the 1,500m at the Paris Olympics, at the age of 30. This year she's won gold medals at the World Indoor Championships, the Commonwealth Games and the European Championships - and tonight she's competing in Athlos, a brand new all-female track and field event taking place in London for the first time. Designed by Reddit co-founder Alexis Ohanion, it's aiming to reshape women’s athletics by giving them a financial stake in their own sport. Georgia tells presenter Anita Rani about her unusual path, and whether she thinks an event of this kind can change the public perception of women’s track and field events, or even the future of the sport.More than 1,000 children have died in a measles outbreak in Bangladesh. Government figures show there have been at least 194,000 cases since March, and around 1,000 new cases are being reported everyday. The World Health Organisation says this makes Bangladesh the country with the highest number of cases in the world right now. The government is responding with an emergency vaccination campaign. Presenter Anita Rani talks to Dr Zakiul Hassan, a medical doctor who works at an international research institute in Bangladesh and is currently completing a PhD at the University of Oxford's Pandemic Sciences Institute. Seven months after MPs called for tougher safeguards around cosmetic procedures, from liquid Brazilian Butt Lifts or BBLs to breast augmentations, the Women and Equalities Committee says key recommendations remain unanswered. Christine Jardine, Interim Chair of the Committee, and Nora Nugent, President of BAAPS join Anita to discuss how patient safety is being put at risk.Candy Sangare has just become both the first woman and the first black person to win the French Wine Tasting Championship, held annually by a wine magazine, La Revue du Vin de France. Candy isn't a sommelier, but a former air steward turned entrepreneur and now has her eyes set on the world title.Jordyn with a Why, the R&B neo-soul singer songwriter of Māori heritage, has found a whole new global audience after going viral with her cover of Olivia Dean's Man I Need, hitting two million views on Instagram. Known for her ethereal sound and strong connection to her culture, she has a particular passion for Te Reo Māori and is currently in London to record a project at Abbey Road Studios. She joins us to perform live and dicuss what it means to represent te reo Māori on an international stage.Presented by: Anita Rani Produced by: Sarah Jane Griffiths

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Get more with BBC podcasts, wherever you listen. Be the first to listen to your favourite shows, like evil genius, good, bad billionaire, and You're Dead to Me, with a subscription to BBC Podcasts Premium on Apple Podcasts. You can also enjoy a range of our podcasts ad-free with an Amazon music subscription. Hello, I'm Anita Rani, and welcome to Woman's Hour from BBC Radio 4. Good morning and welcome to the program. More than a thousand children have died in a measles outbreak in Bangladesh.

We will be finding out the details. I'll be speaking to a woman who's just won a French wine tasting championship. And sports fans listen up. Althos, an all-female track and field event will be taking place in London for the very first time tonight. The remarkable Georgia Hunter Bell tells us her story from working in cyber security to realizing she could be. an elite athlete after nailing a park run. And Jordan with a Y is an R&B soul singer from New Zealand. Her Teirao Maori version of Olivia Dean went viral

and she's going to be singing for us live. Beautiful. Jordan is of Maori descent but only learnt the language later in life when she'd had her own children. So this morning I'd like to ask all of you about connecting or reconnecting to your roots. Did you discover something about your heritage later in life and what did this do

to your sense of self? Have you picked up the language? If you're bilingual, have you passed it on to your children? Are your children or grandchildren more interested in your identity than you? Are you fluent in Gaelic? Is Welsh your mother tongue? What does it mean to you to have access to another culture? The food, the

festivities, the connection to the land, the politics, whatever it is. Get in touch in the usual way. You can contact us on most smart speakers. You can say Alexa, ask BBC sounds to send a comment. You can text the program. It's 84844. You can email us by going to our website. You can contact us on WhatsApp. It's 0300-100-444. And follow us on social media. We're at BBC Women's Hour. But that text number once again, 848444. But first, more than a thousand children have died in a measles outbreak in Bangladesh. Government figures show there have been at least 194,000 cases since March. And around 1,000 new cases are being reported every day. The World Health Organization says this makes Bangladesh the country

with the highest number of cases in the world right now. The government is responding with an emergency vaccination campaign. Joining me is Dr. Zakiul Hassan, a medical doctor from Bangladesh, who's currently completing a PhD at the University of Oxford's Pandemic Sciences Institute and also works at an International Research Institute based in Bangladesh. Zakil, welcome to the program. So you've been involved in the epidemic response in Bangladesh. Can you give us a sense of scale of what's happening over there? Thank you. Good morning. So as you have just told, we are currently observing one of the largest outbreak,

not only in Bangladesh of the last few decades, but also globally in terms of both the size of the outbreak, which, as you said, we have seen over 190,000. cases, but also a large number of deaths. We are seeing nearly 100,000. So far we have seen around 150,000 admissions in hospitals and nearly 1,000 admissions every day. So in terms of the scale and the outbreak is unprecedented, we haven't seen this, as I say, last few decades. Why is this happening now? So for measles, as many of our audience would know,

this is one of the most highly infectious disease. On an average, one infected case can infect 12 to 16 other cases. And to interrupt measles transmissions, we need to have at least 95% vaccine coverage, both for dose 1 and dose 2. which means two dose of vaccinations, 95% coverage would interrupt the transmissions. Now, over the last few years, what happened is there is this development of immunity gap, which means there are pockets of areas where children may have not received both doses of vaccine.

WHO estimate showed that vaccine coverage for the measles, the second dose of the vaccine in 2019 was around 90%, which dropped to around 80% in 2025. Why? Why the immunity gap? What's happened? So there are a few reasons for that that happened, particularly now. The first is there are populations that usually miss vaccine due. routine vaccination. For example, you have Arabian slams, you know, migrant populations. There are other vulnerable populations that usually meets the routine vaccinations.

And so government usually, every three, four years, they do the supplementary campaign. The last time it was done in 2020. So it's been over five years, there was no supplemental vaccine campaign. We just plan in 2024, but because of the political disruption. That didn't happen. And also the government, because of the political unrest in 24, as you know, in Bangladesh, there was a change in government. And that disrupted both the

routine vaccinations, but also resulted in delayed campaign. We just started earlier this year after the widespread transmission. So there are few reasons why we are seeing this large outbreak right now. And you've been on the ground in Bangladesh and you're in contact with your colleagues in the country. So what's happening in the health facilities? How are they coping? Thank you.

As you know, because of the size of the outbreak, we are seeing a large number of patients coming to hospitals. So the hospitals is overcrowded. As a response, measles doesn't have a specific treatment. So the treatment is basically supportive. So you isolate the patients, you provide fluids, you give them nutrition and also if they require respiratory support. Many of the patients develop pneumonia, which means they develop hypoxia, lack of oxygen in your lungs. So you need oxygen, but you also might need ventilator as many of the children are very young kids.

So when there is large number of agnitions, the hospitals for the hospital, they can very, very difficult to manage cases. and patients and and because of the lack of sometimes the oxygen and ventilators we have seen a large number of deaths as well for measles you know many of them are developing severe disease and deaths the government has you know created facilities specifically for measles so to to sort of cope up with the increase admissions and requirement of additional resources but still we are we are are seeing a large number of admissions every day. So what steps need to be taken to stem the number? Yeah.

So the first thing we need to vaccinate as many as, you know, number of children possible, identifying the pockets where, you know, there is this immunity gaps and then do CATA vaccination. So government earlier this year started a CATA vaccinations and vaccinated at least 18 million children. Identifying some of this high-risk zone where transmission is still happening.

But that didn't cover everything because you still have some areas, as we have seen, the outbreak has spread almost 64 districts, almost all part of Bangladesh. And they have started, again, another catch-up campaign which has been planned later this month. And then for management, you know,

in hospitals, government is providing as much as resources possible. There is also, you know, sort of new innovations like bubble CPAP, a low cost technology that can, you know, sort of provide oxygen for those children who develop hypoxia to improve survival. There is also plan for vitamin A supplementations because that's health, your immunity. Yeah. And that's been also scale up. and all the healthcare facilities has been prioritising measles cases

and should of managing them properly so that the survival improves and kids don't die unnecessarily. Yeah, what's your concern, the biggest concern? So now one of the major concern is how quickly we can cover the immunity gap. So previously, because of the vaccine lack of vaccine stockpile, which has been solved now, the government is now trying to, you know, like do this vaccination campaign and cover all the, you know, areas where there are still, you know, areas where we don't have, you know, this 95% coverage of the two doses of the vaccine. So if we can do that quickly, and if we can make sure that we have strong surveillance in place, we identify those high-risk zones and quickly cover them with this scatter vaccinations, then that can stop transmission.

And if not? So if not, we will see continue the transmissions and we will see more cases coming up. And what's the wider scientific community doing to? to help manage the situation? So, as you know, WHO UNICEF is also supporting the government in Bangladesh, both in terms of quickly covering the vaccines, providing support also for case management at the hospital level. And I think measles, as you know, is a vaccine preventable disease.

We are not seeing it in Bangladesh. It's also globally, we have seen cases in UK as well. There are at least 500 cases this year in London only. And many other countries also have reported measles cases. So the global community is more trying to, you know, working together to reduce vaccine hesitancy and, you know, encouraging mothers, encouraging parents so that, you know, everyone can take vaccines and, you know, sort of fighting this misinformation and disinformation regarding vaccinations. and I think

but the BBC is also in other media outlets is also trying to spreading these masses that everyone should take the vaccines to save their children. Yes, thank you so much Dr. Zakiel Hassan. Thank you for joining us

this morning. 8444. Now, did you know, Woman's Hour is nearly 80 years old and we're busy preparing the celebrations for our big party which is next month and you can get involved. We'd love to hear about how the program has helped you in your life. Did you get information that helped you make a difficult decision? Were you inspired to make a big change?

Take up a cause and become a campaigner or something you heard, give you the confidence to try something new, be it a job, a hobby, or even a new relationship, whether it's something you did after hearing one item or perhaps you are a lifelong listener and that has made an impact. We would love to hear from you can text us. It's 84844 and you can email the program by going to our website. Now let's turn to the subject of cosmetic surgery and interventions, or more precisely the regulation of these procedures. MPs on the Women and Equality's Committee

have just released their second report this year, demanding new laws in this area for England and Wales. Their first report came out in February, but there's been no response from the government. Ten professional health bodies have also written to the health minister saying patients have been waiting long enough. concerns range range from surgeons carrying out procedures they're not trained to do and new liquid breast augmentation or lunchtime boob jobs as some people call them while joining me now is the

women and inequalities committee interim chair christine jardin who's the libdem MP for edinburgh west along with nora nugent the president of the british association of aesthetic plastic surgeons christine and norah welcome Christine, your latest report is a follow-up on the one the committee released in February calling for reform in this sector. Can you tell us what the committee want and why? We're disappointed that we're now midway through September and there's been no action. And we feel that this delay in acting is prolonging a significant risk to patient safety. What we had called for was an immediate end to, you know, high-risk procedures being carried.

out in the high streets by unqualified people, didn't have any training. And we recommended that the government should put these restrictions on immediately and things like Brazilian buttlifts should be banned from the high street. And here we are in September. Nothing has happened. And the government's excuse so far has been that it's difficult to balance the needs of the high street with health.

And I would argue that you shouldn't balance the needs of the high street with health. You should think about health. Why do you think there's been no action? I mean, they have said that it's very complicated and that they have to look at the regulations and that there will be a policy comes out and I suppose you have to take into account the fact that there's a new Prime Minister

but it's the same health minister who's there who was dealing with it. So I really think that we're impatient because we don't think it's enough that they've said that, you know, they're going to put out a formal government response once their consultation on a proposed approach is published, and that we have to wait for that. And that, you know, they've said it's complex,

and they have to strike a balance between increased patient safety and putting new requirements on businesses. But as I said, I can't actually see that as acceptable. I don't think that we could compromise on people's safety. People are being led to believe that either by omission, that what they're going for, the treatments they're going for will be safe and regulated. And that is not the situation in many cases. We've heard horror stories of people being treated in unhygienic circumstances by unqualified people.

And that's not good enough. Nora, I'm going to bring you in because you've given evidence to the committee about the issues. And as I mentioned, one of the things highlighted is what I've, become known by some as liquid boob jobs. Can you tell us what they are and what the risks are? Yes, thank you. So a liquid boob job is essentially the breast equivalent of the liquid Brazilian buttlift and equally, if not a worse idea. It's injecting derma filler for breast enhancement. And from our perspective, that brings along huge concerns. It's not just that number one, it's not very effective. It's not the most effective way to treat any breast condition.

But number two, breast tissue is glandular tissue, and there is a relatively high risk of breast cancer is one of the most common cancers that women get. And injecting dermal filler can cause problems such as infections, inflammatory nodules, tissue loss, and it can affect screening for breast cancer if it's causing scarring and opacities that show up on mammograms. And we We have seen examples of mammograms totally distorted by the appearance of dermal filler in breast tissue. If you look at who's doing it, there are no breast surgeons of any description that are reputable offering this. And that tells you a lot about the procedure itself. It's not effective for any cosmetic reason and it is potentially a very harmful procedure for women going forward into the future and difficult to reverse.

Well, Christine mentioned the Brazilian buttlift as well. and we've heard about the death of Alice Webb, who died in 2024 after becoming and well-following cosmetic procedure, and that is believed that she had a non-surgical Brazilian buttlift. In your view, should these procedures be restricted immediately? Of course. They should never have been allowed to get into the hands of lay people in the first place. This is why we're in the mess we're in.

It is going to be much harder now to roll back than it would have been to keep up with progress or industry and stop it from happening in the first place. Nobody who is not a healthcare professional should have a syringe of derma filler in their hands for anywhere in the body. And Brazilian buttlift is a particularly high-risk procedure because of the particular anatomy

and the volumes of filler being used. And the report says, Nora, that women are paying the price for a lack of regulation. So what does that look like? Well, I feel very strongly about this. Most, I'm going to say patients, because these are medical procedures, so I'm not going to use the word clients,

as you see reported. Most patients undergoing these procedures are women. Whenever we look at surveys of cosmetic procedures of any description, surgical or non-surgical, the overwhelming majority of patients are women. And therefore, the overwhelming majority of people suffering complications from these procedures and being misled into thinking

they're undergoing a beauty treatment or undergoing a safe treatment by someone who's qualified to do it. The overwhelming majority of people being misled and suffering complications are women over 90%. And the committee was told that procedures are taking place in living rooms, hotels and beauty salons. How widespread is the problem? It's very widespread and unfortunately we can't quantify it exactly

because there's no central register of who's doing it. This is not a regulated area. So there's no regulatory list of who's doing it or where they're doing it. This is the whole problem. But if you look anywhere online, on the high street, you will see advertisements. And, you know, it's being blurred into a beauty treatment,

and it is not. It is a medical treatment. And surgeons themselves have come in for criticism, haven't they? And people may be surprised to hear that you don't have to have specific training to call yourself a cosmetic surgeon. Is that right?

No. And that is shocking too. And I would argue that most people who put themselves forward as a cosmetic surgeon are not plastic surgeons because plastic surgeons who have done the training tend to call themselves plastic surgeons. Most people, it's generalising a little bit,

but most people who put themselves forward as a cosmetic surgeon are probably not a plastic surgeon. And that is another big blind gap in our regulation. Christine, how shocked were you about some of the evidence you heard about procedures being qualified, being carried out by unqualified people in unsafe settings? Well, I was absolutely horrified because you do assume that if someone is carrying out what is a medical procedure that they've got training, they've got qualifications.

And what we heard was, as Nora says, you know, mostly women are going into these high street places and they think the people are qualified and they're being treated in huge quotation marks by people who have no formal training and there's no regulation at all. And very often, some of the evidence we heard was that women, when they realise that that's the case, are too far down the line, really, to, you know, it's embarrassing. They're under pressure. They feel they have to go through with it. And that, again, is something that is hugely unfair. And we really need, you know, any invasive surgical cosmetic procedure must surely have specialist training. And there should be appropriate board certification. And this is what the committee, has called for. We want the government to look at a timetable for wider reform. Because there's also a cost to the NHS in this as well. Because women who are, and we had some horrific tales of women getting sepsis because they were treated in someone's home and things like that. So, you know, they then have to have treatment from the NHS and that costs money. It's hugely damaging for them. They have, in some cases, one woman we had to sort of, it was going to have a lifelong impact on her.

And that's, you know, people are not made aware. They think they've been treated by qualified people. Then they have these, you know, horrific injuries, long-term life implications. You know, we do need to know more about the health implications as well. And then they have to be treated on the NHS, and that is another difficulty. Nora, what questions should anyone can be considering

if they are thinking about some kind of cosmetic? procedure? What should they be doing before they book? The number one is looking at why they wanted in the first place, what they are hoping to achieve from it. But because some procedures can solve problems, but they do not solve all problems. And you need to work out what you want and why you want first. Secondly, ensure that if you were having anything invasive, regardless of why you're having it, that you were seeing a healthcare professional in a healthcare set. We have the framework. It's just not in regulation.

You know, make sure that you're seeing a healthcare professional in a CQC registered premises. Make sure that you're not booked immediately for treatment before you've had any chance to discuss anything and before you've handed over money. You know, we have a consultation first. I no longer treat on the same day for pretty much everything. Definitely not for surgery, but even non-surgical, more minor procedures.

I have a consultation first, then send out the information, the information and then book for treatment. So at no time should you be forced to have an invasive procedure before you've ever met the person who's doing it or before you know anything about it. Christine Jardine and Nora Nugent, thank you so much for speaking to us this morning. And if you've got a medical concern, then do go to your GP. We have a statement from a Department of Health and Social Care spokesperson who says, we've worked with experts to ensure only qualified healthcare professionals can perform these high-risk cosmetic procedures. procedures will soon be consulting on this new legislation, including restricting all cosmetic

surgery to doctors who are regulated to strict standards set by the General Medical Council and who work from Care Quality Commission regulated settings. For anyone considering a cosmetic procedure, please check the provider's qualifications and insurance and avoid treatments that appear suspiciously cheap. 84844. Get more with BBC Podcasts. wherever you listen. Be the first to listen to your favorite shows,

like evil genius, good, bad billionaire, and You're Dead to Me, with a subscription to BBC Podcasts Premium on Apple Podcasts. You can also enjoy a range of our podcasts, ad-free, with an Amazon music subscription. Now, you might have already heard about the middle-distance runner,

Georgia Hunter Bell's incredible start to her athletics career. As she turned 30, she left a full-time career in cyber security and less than two years after doing a park run for fun, she won a bronze medal in the 1,500 metres at the Paris Olympics. Tonight she'll be taking part in Athlos, an all-female track and field event happening in London for the very first time.

Its creators call it a global women's sport initiative that's aiming to give female athletes a financial stake in their sports. Well, we spoke to the man behind Athlos, Reddick co-founder Alexis O'hanion, and husband of Serena Williams on Woman's Hour back in May, and I caught up with Georgia Hunter Bell and asked her about her earliest memories of running and when she realised she might have something special.

I remember just being at Sports Day as a kid at school and I'm beating some of the boys in some of the races and I remember a few parents would kind of speak to each other and be like, oh, she's quite good. And going down to the local running club. And it just kind of started, yeah, from a really young age, getting into the UK club system. developed as I got older, went over to the US on a track scholarship running,

but then quit and didn't think I was ever going to make it as a professional and only really got back into it throughout COVID. And then now my life is, yeah, very different. I'm a professional track and field athlete and have many kind of world medals to my name, but only really turned professional at 30 years old. So not a very traditional route. Not a traditional route, a really inspiring story though. Going back to when you were little, did you just feel very comfortable, you just had a natural proficiency, you had just had a talent for it that your parents spotted?

Yeah, I think so. I think so. You know, just felt very natural doing it. It came to me quite easy as a kid, which I think on the one hand is great, but then also as you get older and it gets harder, you have to realize that, okay, got to work on things. And that was a bit of a mental adjustment as well. But yeah, I think just very naturally as a kid knew that this was something that I was good at. This is something that I wanted to do. And then as you mentioned, in your early 20s, you were on a track and field scholarship in Berkeley and California. Congratulations. Thank you.

So that's a big deal to get that. Tell me what happens whilst you were there. Did you notice a real difference in people's attitudes to sport? Going to a scholarship on the US, it's such a privilege in so many ways. You know, it's not easy to get into these universities and the whole of it. experience, the facilities, everything they have. It's kind of crazy. There's no real comparison to it in the UK. So on the one hand, that was amazing and really grateful for the opportunity. I think for me personally, my running didn't approve. So I never ran faster than I did in the UK and

experienced quite a lot of injuries, which ultimately did lead me to stop when I graduated. So it was a a really good experience, but a bit of a roller coaster as well. You say it was the sort of overtraining that led you to take a hiatus. So can you tell us like, I mean, what happens and what that does to your psychology? Tough times, really. I mean, just running too much mileage out there led me to have stress fractures and then needing to take periods outside of running and then kind of being in a constant injury cycle of then trying to get fit again and race again.

And it's hard. During that period, I really just lost the love for it because all of the, the confidence and the natural ability I'd felt with running at the beginning had been replaced with, you know, dreading racing, dreading training, not feeling good about myself when things were going wrong. So it was a bit of a mental adjustment and I think more just that realization that I haven't made it as a runner when I graduated. So I'm going to have to go into the working world, get a job and grow up a little bit. It was a bit of a shock to the system realizing that. But obviously you had a bit of a happier ending later on.

Yeah, well, before we get to the happy ending, you did get a job, but you started working in sales in a cyber security firm. I mean, complete contrast. Complete contrast, yeah. You know, I was in the Bay Area in San Francisco and lots of people were going into tech and this was the job I went into. And to be honest, I actually really loved it. It was a really interesting industry, very fast-paced, fun job. A lot of athletes actually go into it because it's very similar in terms of kind of targets that you need to hit. and growth. So I worked in that industry for seven years and was very, very interesting. So I feel like I've seen two sides of the working world, the professional athlete side, but also the corporate side too. Yeah. And then your life pivoted in a very different direction. Tell us about your entry back into athleticism. It started with a park run. Yeah, it did. I mean, very gradual. It went

from thinking, I'm never going to run again and I'll just leave it there to going out for runs, for enjoyment during COVID you know there really wasn't a lot that you could do so that got me back into exercising when park ground opened up again that was a really great thing for me to get stuck into because it was just that kind of small challenge against yourself which started that competitive interest to come back and then it was just gradual I got back in touch with my old coach just because I wanted to follow a plan and then before we knew it we were in Olympic year I'm training really well I'm having all these breakthroughs and It went from being, could I make the Olympic team to could I actually get a medal at the Olympics, which I did.

And then that kind of slingshotted me into being a full-time professional after that. I mean, it's unbelievable. I mean, this summer you've won gold medals at the World Athletics Indoor Championships, the European Championships and the Commonwealth Games. And you're competing in Athos tonight. What's it like competing at a brand new event? Yeah, it's really fun. It's exciting that there are so many opportunities in track and field at the moment. I feel like in general, the public is getting really interested in running from health and wellness perspective on their own perspective.

But then it builds that interest in seeing British athletes on the global stage as well. So competing at Athlos here will be a very fun event. It's in London. I'm from London. So that makes it extra exciting. And it's just going to be a great opportunity. Well, we had Alexis Hanyan, who's the founder of the event on the program in May. Let's hear a clip of what he had to say about it. So this is a chance to put these incredible athletes on the grandest stage possible.

You know, we all tune in for them during the Olympics. And the thing I couldn't get out of my head was we were wrapped with attention, the biggest brands of the world, fullest stadiums, millions and millions of viewers. And then these athletes seemed to disappear for the four years in between. And one of the things that motivated me to start Athlos was then when I spoke to some of these athletes, Shakari Richards and Gabby Thomas, Tarr Davis Woodhaw, I found out how little money they made from their championships in between. Before Athlos, I think the top prize was $30,000. And so we said, okay, we'll double that.

And let's see what happens. And we've now had back-to-back meets in New York over the last two years. Millions of people have tuned in, sell-out crowds. tons of just entertainment delight, some records broken and a spectacle. And we knew if we wanted to go global and really build this league out, the place we had to go first was here in London.

Sounds like it makes it so exciting. He says he hopes the competition can become the Formula One of track and field. What do you think? I feel like I understand where he's going with that. He definitely brings the glitz and the glamour and he has lots of experience in women's sport. And I feel like I did Atlas last year

and I definitely felt that show business element to it as well as the racing. So I feel like if anyone is going to do that and make it successful, it's Alexis and Serena's together for sure. And I think he's absolutely right that everyone gets really tuned in to athletes during the Olympics. And then it's almost like four years later, that's when that interest peaks again. So this is a way to kind of showcase us, keep us connected to the public, and then of course give us great opportunities with athletes to have a great race. and be able to earn some good money as well.

Yeah, I might just have to explain in case people don't know that Alexis is married to Serena Williams. And I think it was a conversation, if I remember from the interview with his wife, where he said that, you know, our daughter could get into sport and she said, well, not until the girls are paid equally. And it kind of like made him sort of sit up and pay attention, which I quite like the idea of them having that conversation

over a cup of coffee in the morning or whatever. Now, if you win your event, you get $65,000 in prize money and all athletes that take part will be offered equity in the league, the idea being that they'll be rewarded if it's successful. So does that make sense to you? What does that mean to you? Yeah, I think it's great. I mean, obviously, if you've got equity in something,

you're going to be a lot more invested in the success of it. So I think it's a smart move to engage us as athletes, not just on a one-off, but for the longevity of the league. And then, of course, you know, incentivising graces with big prize money. That's where you're going to get some great performances. That's where you're going to get the best athletes coming out, especially because it's the last race of the season for us. We've had a long year of racing,

but everyone still wants to be here, still wants to show up and have this great opportunity to race against each other for the win. I want to ask you about your sleep patterns because in the past you've said you need at least nine to ten hours of sleep for your recovery,

yet you got just one hour, 20 minutes of sleep after winning the European gold in the 1500 metres this summer. So how do you manage having such highs and lows with your adrenaline and sleep as an athlete? Yeah, it's really hard. Any athlete will tell you if you've got a night race, it's almost impossible to sleep afterwards. Also, the better the race goes, the less steep you get because you are really just on cloud nine and it's really hard to calm your nervous system down. So sometimes when you see that low sleep score, you think, okay, they must have had a good race. But it's just about being disciplined. You know, it's the weeks and the run up to it. It's that week and week out, making sure that you're getting that consistency. So when you have a one-off crazy sleep night, it doesn't turn into a bad week. Your training partner is Keely Hodgkinson, the team GB Olympic gold medalist for the 800 metres. What have you taught each other? Good question. We were actually talking about

this the other day. I mean, I've learned a lot from her. I think she brings out like a really fun, playful side of myself and the team, which I think is really useful in a lot of high pressure environments that we go into, you know, keeping that balance. I think it allows us to compete our best because we are so relaxed and unhappy around each other. And when I asked her what she's learned about me, because it came up in an interview the other day, I think she said, just kind of my mindset of how I believe I can do anything and go into races where I'm probably punching above my weight and are still able to come away and be successful. She's like, I want to take that on and have learned that from you. So, yeah, we're constantly learning as a team together.

I mean, honestly, I'm still, Georgia, figuring out this moment of you thought it was all over, you'd got your job, you know, you're on Sivvy Street, if you like, and then all of a sudden it flew Park Run, realized, I don't know, I can, I'm still got it years later. I can do this, yeah. Yeah, I mean, I think it just goes to back to the point of people can think that they're really stuck in their ways or they're on a certain path. And actually, my experience has really taught me that so many people's careers, are so varied. Like you really can do anything. And if you're passionate about something and you see it progressing, like don't put limits on yourself for what you can achieve because I've learned so many more stories since people have contacted me about my own about how their lives have changed. So I think, you know, that's just so important to know, like don't put any limits on yourself or

think that because everyone else has done this, you should be doing this too. Like everyone's path is completely different. Yeah, absolutely. And I know that the LA Olympics in 2028 are in your and that there is a decision whether to follow in the steps of the great Dame Kelly Holmes and double up with the 800 and the 1,500 metres. I mean, it worked out pretty well for her. She won two gold back in Athens in 2004. At the same age, you'll be, 34. So what advice has she had for you?

Yeah, she's been actually a great source of, obviously, inspiration as a kid growing up, but then also advice. We were on very similar paths, hopefully, because she won a bronze medal at the Olympics when she was 30. just like me. And when I've been deciding whether I were a double throughout these past years, she's been great, she's been on the phone, when I've been getting her advice about the schedule, the competition.

So hopefully she'll continue to fill that mentor role for me. And yeah, we've got decisions to make in the upcoming future about whether I would double in LA. We've got a wild championships next year, and depending on what that schedule looks like, we'll make a decision about whether I would give the double a go there ahead of the Olympics. but yeah lots of decisions to be made and of course she is an absolute legend so it would be

incredible to follow in her footsteps. Amazing. And actually just another thing that came up in conversation because we've been talking on the programme about the announcement from Spain's football governing body that it's going to offer egg freezing to its top female players. Is this a conversation that you hear among your athletes like when you get together? It's not something that I've heard about so far in running yet but I know that it's something that has come up in tennis as well of offering kind of maternity packages. So I think it is

becoming a lot more normalized. Like we've seen some of the greatest athletes in the world this year in track and field take time off to have a baby like Sydney McLaughlin Ravoni and Beatrice Trebair and Segui. So I think it is becoming a lot more of a normal thing to have a pay-bee and return to racing, which is obviously great and kind of sets a nice standard for us to see what's possible and how you can do it at the top level. And you can watch Georgia Hunter Bell and her training partner, Keely Hodgkinson, competing in the female-only track event, Athloss tonight, live on BBC Eye Player and and Red Button and the BBC Sport website.

Now, my next guest is the first woman and black person to win the French wine tasting championship held annually by a wine magazine La Revue de Vain de France. Now she says she has her eyes set on the world title. Candy Sangare is a sommelier, previously an air hostess. She's now running a business and a brand management agency. And she says that when she first walked into the world of wine, she felt the complete opposite to her male counterparts. And she joins us now.

Congratulations, Candy. You are living out some people's dream careers, from being an air hostess to now an award-winning wine taster. How did you make the jump from Cabellie? crew to Somelier. Hi everyone. Good morning. First of all, I'm not a Somalia at all. I'm sorry.

We're just making it up. Yeah. I am wine passionate and I'm working with one with my own company to create some experience and to create some wine tour. But I'm working with gastronomy and luxury too. And you won. Yeah. How did that feel? How did that feel? This felt very, first of all, it was like a big surprise because we are a friend of professional people.

Somelier, as you say, people were working in the world of the wine and has ex-flight attendant. I wasn't prepared for that at all. So how did that happen? How did you go from flight? attendance to experts in wine tasting? And this it's very very very funny because I am France, French. I'm living in French the gastronomy country but it was in Brazil that everything happened. I live in Brazil and the life made that I was the director of a French restaurant and I started to would like the gastronomy and the wine.

And when I came back to Paris after the COVID, when the COVID start, it was in my mind to create a company who I can make gastronomy, wine, luxury, and hospitality. And because I am a little bit perfectionist, I made like the WVSET, FAS, it's on diploma from the wine, the wine and because I want to improve myself and I and I need to know about no more about wine because wine is not only about a bottle it's about a lot of thing behind. So you studied and studied and studied because you're a perfectionist. So you as I mentioned at the beginning you're the

first woman and the first black person to win a competition like this. Congratulations. That is a thing. So tell me what it's like walking into these competitions. What does that feel like and what's the reaction you get? First, I wasn't prepared for the competition because for me it was like, okay, I'm here only to improve myself, to know about more, about wine, everything. And when you go through the door and you see only men, white men, and with a certain age, you're like, oh my God,

do I have in the right place? But because I'm always with a smile and I take everything very easy, I go to my table and I just sit down and everyone was looking at me like, what she's doing there? Maybe she's in the wrong place, I don't know. And day after day, time after time,

because there is a different state, people start to accept me the way I was, because, okay, I am a woman. Okay, I'm black, but I'm working every day for that. I'm training and I have my place, you know? Yes, and you beat them all. So we are very happy for you. I'm very proud of you.

And we know that you're going on to the World Championship now. So congratulations. Good luck with that. And if you win, come back and talk to us because I know you're going to do that with your female partner. But thank you, Kandi, Sengaro. Thank you so much for taking the time to speak to us this morning. 84844 is...

the text number. Lots of you are getting in touch, actually, about various things we've spoken about this morning. On the subject of measles, we've had a few messages saying, thank you for covering measles. People in the UK have no living memory of how dangerous it is. It can also cause encephalitis and deafness in addition to pneumonia, mentioned by your guest. So please check you're vaccinated. That's from Stephanie in Suffolk. And lots of you getting in touch about heritage. One here saying, traced our family history back to North East Scotland in the 1400s. He thinks we came over to Ireland

with Robert the Bruce. I've since been over to Scotland multiple times and discover a different part of it every single year. The reason I ask is because of my next guest. I'm joined by the R&B Neo-Soul singer-songwriter of Maori Heritage Jordan with a Y.

New Zealand-based Jordan is best known for her ethereal sound and strong connection to her culture. Growing up in South Auckland, She has a passion for Teirao Maori and has been doing covers of popular songs with her Olivia Dean's Man I Need cover going viral with 2 million views on Instagram. She's currently in London working on a project at Abbey Road Studios, no less, but has made time to come and see us. Welcome. Oh my goodness.

Thank you so much for having me. I feel so grateful. We are grateful to have you here. When did you start singing? Tell us about the beginning. Yeah, I grew up singing. I grew up. My dad was a pastor.

and so we grew up going to church and I guess when you grow up with a father as a pastor I'm sure a lot of people understand you just automatically become a part of the church band and so that was my upbringing that's how I learned how to sing. Singing and I suppose that also because a lot of people who either grow up singing in the church

or your confidence grows as well because you have to perform right? Yeah absolutely I think too singing as a part of a group knowing how to sing with community and finding your place in a larger group setting which I think is, yeah, that's sort of how I work still. So tell me more about how you began singing in Terrio Māori.

Well, I didn't grow up speaking Tereo Māori. It's an endangered language. So in the world, there's not a lot of speakers. But I, myself and my husband, we joined a full immersion learning environment, like a school, full time in 2019. And I had had my first son by then. And so we wanted him. him to grow up, really connected to his Māori heritage, his Māori culture.

And we wanted them, our children, to be bilingual to just be able to move in and out of the worlds that make up who they are. That's commitment to learning a language, like full immersion. Totally. Like when you say full immersion, like all day, every day. Yeah, 9am to 3pm, Monday to Friday, full immersion. Yeah, and it is a big commitment and very expensive. And that's not just about the language, is it?

that's about connecting to something much deeper. It is. You know, there are people who learn a language because it's a hobby and they just want to, it's interest. And then there's reclamation, language reclamation, identity reclamation. I think that's what, that is what my journey has been. Has it changed you? Completely, inside out.

Completely changed my entire world. My family is a bilingual family now. We speak. Terrell Māori at home. My siblings have learned teoreo Māori. my children go to full immersion Māori language schooling and it completely opened the door as well for this music career and being able to song write and I don't know

I think it just helped me discover who I was and leaning into that has then opened this entire world you've been doing covers of popular songs and your Olivia Dean's man I need went viral as I mentioned two million views on Instagram how surprised are you by that So surprised. I mean, we love Olivia Dean. She's an incredible songwriter. We love Olivia Dean. I'm not surprised about that part. I think I was just really surprised that around the world there was such an incredible response to Terrell Māori and that people were wanting to then write the same thing in their own language or people just were really interested in this language that they hadn't heard of before and even other indigenous cultures wanting to hear the songs in their own languages.

So it was really surprising in the best way. I feel we should carry on this conversation, but before that we should hear some of you singing in the language and get a sense of it. So you're going to sing something else by Olivia Dene. What are you going to sing for it? Yeah, we'll sing a couple minutes, and we've done the chorus in Tidal Māori.

Amazing. So take your place by the microphone. And I'm very excited. It's always such a privilege to have someone sing live for us. But I think this is going to be a real treat. So here is Jordan with a Y singing a couple of minutes by Olivia Dean. Jordan with a Y. Come and have a seat.

That was magnificent. Look, I'm going to, I'm on my feet. I'm on my feet. I appreciate it. Absolutely beautiful. Your voice. Does it feel different emotionally when you're singing the two different languages? Yeah, a little bit.

I think, I mean, I love Olivia's songwriting. I think the essence of her songwriting is being able to. match that in Terrell Māori and not being an expert. Part of it is just giving it a go, doing what I can with what I have and what I know. But there is something really empowering about singing in your own language. Yes, tell me more. It feels, I don't know, the journey of reclamation is different to learning as a hobby. It's reconnecting you.

Learning language, I think it connects you with your family story and everyone's got really different family stories. it connects you with land. It connects you with your landmarks, oceans. It connects you with a much bigger, broader context. And it's a different sort of identity and former. And your ancestors? It connects you to your ancestors, for real. So there is something deeply spiritual, I think, about the journey of reclamation.

Really difficult. I think wrapping your tongue around something that should be familiar, but then isn't, can really get in your mind a little bit. For all the reclaimers out there, I feel you. And just giving it a go is the best thing, no matter how hard it is. Lots of people have actually got in touch with their own sort of connection to culture and language. I'm going to read this one out here. So my great grandparents spoke Gaelic as their first language.

And our maps of Scotland are littered with Gaelic names. I used to be a keen walker and climate exploring the country. It's a whole new world when the names are translated and the places have a meaning not previously known. Sadly, my parents and their parents were beaten if they're. dare to speak in their first language when they went to school. So much of it was sadly lost to future generations. Many Gaelic speakers still live and talk in the Western Isles and the Outer Hebrides. Now we have colleges and schools, so it's alive.

I'm not fluent, but I'm very happy to keep learning the language and enjoy the whole culture of the Gaelic heritage. I mean, what's the response been to you, apart from, you know, 2 million people really hearing something in the language and your voice, but within New Zealand, what's the reaction mean? There's just such a pride in our language and such a joy attached to it. I really love that comment

because I think people back home can relate definitely to the struggle of reclamation and about the journey of Terel Māori has very similar heritage to that, not being allowed to be spoken in schools. So I think being able to have Terel Māori in music, music is so universal and whether you're confident in a language or not,

it's been such an empowering tool. to use while we're revitalising. But I think the response has been incredible. I think people back home are really excited about the place of Tereo Māori in the world, but also just at home. Yes, and that there's a generation who are really proudly connecting. Exactly, because it wasn't always like that. And so here we are just being completely joyful in being Māori.

I'm going to read another one out because there are lots coming through. I'm the granddaughter of two Eastern European refugees. We engage in cultural and religious aspects of our identity and visit Poland often. My mother and aunt are receptive bilingual, but myself, my sister and my cousins have no language at all. I often wonder if the language represented a conduit for trauma or a reminder of the terrible loss they suffered.

But I find it hard not to resent the feeling that an important part of my identity has been foreclosed to me. I have to say, I don't have the name, but Jordan could be an example because it's never too late. No, it's never too late. It's never too late. And it's also never too little. What learning one word is reclamation. learning one song is reclamation

participating in a cultural practice that you didn't use to before is reclamation and that's a way that that culture keeps living among us. I love it, I'm so inspired, I'm bilingual from birth as well and I'm so proud of that. I just think it's like it's a superpower.

You're recording now at the Abbey Road Studios. What does this mean for Maori music and for you? This is incredible. I think what it means, and this is the whole goal, I came over with a group of friends where on this campaign called Real Māori is global because we believe in the global value of indigenous language and so being able to take it to the biggest platforms is our goal.

Abbey Road Studios to us is just such an iconic venue and it means I think when we think about indigenous language we can attach that then to ambition, to dreaming big, to opportunity, to travel and hopefully for more Māori music and musicians to really pursue dreaming that big as well and not just thinking that it's something for home. It's been so wonderful to speak to you and to hear you sing

and for you to make the time to come and see us. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Jordan with Hawaii and she'll be performing at the Pacific Tavern in London this Sunday. Join me tomorrow for weekend Women's Hour. That's all for today's Woman's Hour. Join us again next time. Hello, I'm Greg Jenner.

I'm the host of You're Dead to Me, the comedy podcast that takes history seriously. And we are back for a 12th series. Everyone in that film is wearing their own pants. We're joined by comedians like Kyle Smith Bino and Desiree Birch. Can't see how this would go wrong. We'll meet many medieval saints. Motivational speaker saint.

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