Woman's Hour - The ladies of the Posh Club Dance Club. A Musical Family Christmas. Volunteering.

Episode Date: December 24, 2021

The ladies of the Posh Club Dance Club on what it means to them to be able to perform the dance of the flamingos, shimmy to dancehall music and feel like stars. Volunteering reached a record high during the pandemic. According to a government survey, 62% of respondents volunteered last year. Thousands volunteer for Crisis, a national charity for homeless people whose Crisis at Christmas campaign provides accommodation and support for people at Christmas. We hear from Jemma Kelehe, a shift leader at the women’s accommodation in London, who has volunteered for Crisis at Christmas for 20 years.Civil Chartered Engineer, Era Shah, talks about the lack of diversity in STEM.Vox Duo soprano Karla Grant and mezzo soprano Julia Solomon tell us about their debut single a new version of “O’ Holy Night”, in collaboration with classical group the Earthtones Trio. Plus ahead of new BBC2 programme A Musical Family Christmas, we're joined by author and lecturer Kadiatu Kanneh-Mason to discuss her favourite Christmas songs and raising seven talented musicians. And the woman who's re-created the film The Holiday to see if she could find love. Presenter Chloe Tilley Producer Beverley Purcell

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. I'm Natalia Melman-Petrozzella, and from the BBC, this is Extreme Peak Danger. The most beautiful mountain in the world. If you die on the mountain, you stay on the mountain. This is the story of what happened when 11 climbers died on one of the world's deadliest mountains, K2, and of the risks we'll take to feel truly alive. If I tell all the details, you won't believe it anymore. Extreme, peak danger. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.

BBC Sounds. Music, radio, podcasts. Good morning and welcome. Now, there is a festive theme running throughout today's programme, as you may well expect on Christmas Eve. 2021 has been the year of volunteering, with record numbers helping people, from marshalling at vaccination centres to helping at food banks. We're going to speak to one woman who has helped homeless women

on Christmas Day for the last 20 years. And I want to hear from you this morning. What have you given back this year? Have you found the time to volunteer as so many others have? If you've been predominantly working from home, has that freed up time to help others? Tell me what you've done this morning. And of course, what you have gained from the experience.

You can text us now on 84844. Text will be charged at your standard message rate. On social media, it's at BBC Women's Hour. Or, of course, you can email us through our website. We're also going to be at Posh Club. It's a South London club where anything goes for women over 60. And recreating the noughties Christmas film The Holiday, the UK and US women who swapped homes, lives and friends for a week to see if they could find love.

And we're going to throw some festive music in as well from a family of no less than seven classical musicians, including one who performed at the wedding of the Duke and Duchess of Sussex, plus a soprano duo with a version of O Holy Night. But let's begin talking about volunteering because it's reached a record high during the pandemic. According to a government survey, 62% of respondents volunteered in the past year. Thousands volunteer for Crisis, a national charity for homeless people

whose Crisis at Christmas campaign provides accommodation and support for people during the festive period. And this campaign is marking its 50th year. Well, Gemma Callagher is a volunteer. She's volunteered with Crisis at Christmas Women's Accommodation for the past 20 years. And she's with us now. Morning, Gemma. Good morning. So, very well, thank you. And thank you for joining us on Christmas Eve.

Tell us what first prompted you to get involved to what many people would see as giving up your Christmas day to help others. I didn't see it as giving up, I guess. I had a relationship breakdown and didn't want to spend Christmas on my own. I'd been donating to Crisis for a number of years, so it felt natural to me as a cause close to my heart to have a look and see what I could give back and looked into the project at Christmas and that's kind of where it went. And so what does your work involve? Talk us through what Christmas Day entails.

So we would normally get the ladies up fairly early. They have breakfast. We suggest they have a shower, but they don't always have to. The table usually gets laid. Obviously, it's very different this year because we're in a hotel. But normally in our centres, we would lay the table the night before. So it's a beautifully decorated festive table. The ladies would have their dinner. So my shift finishes with their lunch, but they actually have a Christmas dinner on the afternoon shift.

And so just explain then, you said you wake them up on Christmas morning. So these women come to you when, on Christmas Eve before that? On the 22nd we open. So the women are with us fairly early. We normally try and get some little presents wrapped for them. So in the morning they wake up to a present at the end of their bed. It's normally toiletries, something like that for them. And how do women get in touch with you to be able to come in? Are you able to take in any woman who needs support at Christmas? We do take in anyone, yes, but they are referred to us.

So they go to the day centres or they can go to their local church and they get referred to us that way. And you say that it's obviously different this year. So in it used to be predominantly colleges and schools. But last year and this year, because of the pandemic, we've had our guests in hotels. So they are in individual rooms rather than a community area. So where we were in schools, we would convert the classrooms into bedrooms. So we would move all the tables and chairs out and put camper beds in for them. Normally, six to eight women would be in one of those rooms.

But obviously, because of the pandemic, we now have them in individual hotel rooms. So presumably, you have to think about social distancing and things. Does it take something away from the experience these women are having for a few days? Yes, it does. Unfortunately, although they probably love it because they have their own room, they have obviously their own en suite and their own little kitchen area, it takes away that community kind of sociability.

Yes, it does. Tell us a little bit about some of the women that that you've met over the years because presumably you're you're sitting down and you're having conversations with them about their their circumstances just share some of those with us if you would uh one of the saddest ones basically was a couple of years ago um a lady came into the school that we were at and um we always them. We always talk to them about why they're there and what needs we can help them with. And she said, oh, it's really, really strange being back here. My child used to go to school here and I used to be in reception

coming to see the teachers in the head. And now I find myself back in the school homeless and looking for accommodation so that was really quite a sad circumstance but generally ladies come to us normally unfortunately for domestic violence or relationship breaks you know breaking up and we had one year some ladies who were sex trafficked into the UK and their passports taken away. So we were able to get them to the embassy, get them some passports and get them home. And so what difference do you see in these women who come in because they're with you for a few days? What's the difference you see just in that that period of time that you're with them? So it's normally uh confidence building so they some of them are extremely shy um

and over time become a lot more relaxed and comfortable with us uh spend more time talking to us you know a laughing and joking and much more comfortable with with being with us um some ladies who come uh one lady in particular that I spent a lot of time with um she came to us with um alcohol and drug dependency but over time uh we talked her into going into a detox program so um you know that that basically was just us gaining her confidence and telling her we are there to help and support her. Do you sadly see the same women year after year? Not always. And what is lovely for them is the women we do see, obviously, we know by name. So when they come through the door on the first day, we introduce them ourselves and say, oh, hi, and then welcome them by name.

And they get really, really pleased that we recognise them. But actually, for us, it's quite sad that we recognise them because obviously they're regulars to us. But yeah, there's probably a handful of ladies that are regular and we know by name, yeah. And so when they come in, this is about trying to give these women the opportunity to turn around their lives and you're giving, I mean, it's not just haircuts and the opportunity to have a bit of space and a comfortable bed and feel safe. It's about helping them to move forward. Do you keep in contact with these?

Presumably it's not just they're here for a few days and then they're just back out in the streets. No, some of them we do through Skylight and through the normal crisis. You know, it's operating all year round. So sometimes they'll come to Skylight. But we don't tend to stay in touch with them. Although obviously, if you're out and about in London and they happen to be sort of on the streets or whatever and they recognise you or you recognise them, we always try and make an effort to, you know, at least acknowledge them because that's a big point for them. They don't get ignored. But no, it's generally crisis will stay in touch with them rather than us personally. Yeah, we try not to encourage our volunteers to give out any personal information to any of the guests in case, you know, at some point in the year that guest turns up at this volunteer's house. Crisis aren't there to support that and help with that.

So we try and discourage that. And what do you personally get out of it? A sense of having a family, I guess, at Christmas. All of my team have been with me a very long time and we all do crisis together for various different reasons, but it's just a beautiful atmosphere. The ladies that come to us as guests, just seeing the difference that we can make even for just that one week um is is really humbling and will you keep doing this i mean we said you've been doing

it for 20 years is this something you you plan to do for for every christmas yes i i plan to continue to do it um obviously life has changed an awful lot for me in 20 years, but my children used to not see me at Christmas. If tomorrow. That's Gemma Kelliher, who has volunteered with Crisis at Christmas, women's accommodation for 20 years and will continue to do so. Do get in touch with us on any of the stories we're talking about today. It's 84844 on the text. It's at BBC Woman's Hour. Now, my next guest is the matriarch of a family taking the classical music world by storm. Kadiatu Kane Mason is an author,

she's a lecturer and mother to seven gifted classical musicians aged between 12 and 25. Now, one of her sons is the cellist Sheku Kane Mason. Now, he won the BBC Young Musician Competition in 2016 and you may well remember him after he wowed global audiences with his performance at the wedding of the Duke and Duchess of Sussex.

Now, they may well be forgiven for taking a break from music at Christmas, but the family are inviting us into their home for the big day in a new BBC Two programme. It is called A Musical Family Christmas with the Canet Masons, where the siblings reunite to play their most loved Christmas songs. And we can hear now from Sheku as he introduces his favourite. In the bleak midwinter has always been my favourite. I've sung it a lot, like at school and in choirs.

The first time I performed it, I performed it just for solo cello as an encore after a concerto, which was around December, quite a few years ago. Just sort of like playing around with the tune and coming up with some ideas. And so a lot of those ideas have come into the version that we've written for cello and Sister Sarta on the piano. We can speak now to their proud mum.

Well, I'm guessing she's proud. She must be. Kadiatu Kanemason about the experience. Good morning to you. Good morning. I mean, this is incredible. I was watching the programme yesterday and many people don't have one gifted child, but you've got seven. I mean, just remind us who they are, how old they are, what they play

and how magnificent they are. So they all play piano. I've got five girls and two boys. The oldest is Isata, whose main instrument is piano. She also plays violin and viola. I won't say all their second instruments, I'll say their first instrument. The second one is Breimer. Eister's 25, Breimer's 24. He plays the violin. Sheik, who's 22, he plays the cello. Konya is 21, plays the piano. Jennifer is 19, plays the piano. Then there's Aminata, 16 on violin, and Mariatu, who's 12 on cello. An incredible list. And I know from watching the programme that you talk very much about how you saw music and still see music as an education, a really important part of their childhood, to shape them as human beings, not just to be on a road to musical magnificence, if you like. out to have seven classical musicians. We wanted children who were introduced to music, who learned how to enjoy it, make it part of their lives. And I think I have a huge love of music education for all children. My children went to state school, they were lucky enough to have music in their

schools. And I think if they hadn't have had that, they couldn't have become classical musicians, and couldn't have become the people that they are as well. And it's interesting you talk about that because many people will know that there isn't a fantastic music provision in state schools across the country. Obviously, it differs school by school. And I know that you've also talked about how you told your children they will have to work twice as hard as well because they don't fit that classic white mould that many people would put with classical music. Have they found that those challenges you worried about were put in front of them? Oh yes definitely. I think if you go to a state school and if you don't come from the normal demographic of the classical musician then it's going to be more difficult for you and I think

the barriers are financial because of course learning a musical instrument is expensive. The instruments are expensive. The lessons are expensive. But also it's cultural. And I think there are cultural barriers in front of children who think that when they go to a concert, people on stage don't look like them. The audience doesn't look like them. And I do think the only way to change that is to offer music to everyone in the state system. Otherwise, it will never change. And my worry is that in fact, it's getting worse. So did your children as they went on their journey to becoming classical musicians, did they find it difficult to think that they fit? Or was your encouragement enough to enable them to think, no, I do belong here? Yes, I think we were very determined that they would always feel that they

could do anything that they wanted to do. And we didn't talk negatively to them about how difficult it was. We just were very positive all the time. And of course, we come from both of us, my husband and I, Stuart and I, come from an extended family who also believe in music, believe that children can break down any barriers. And although we didn't have many, I suppose, role models in classical music itself, there are so many role models elsewhere. So we talked to them about Bob Marley, for instance, or Muhammad Ali, or role models in politics or sport, because they also broke down barriers. Well, you mentioned Bob Marley because your children don't just look at the sort of classical arrangements.

There is a real eclectic mix and, you know, Bob Marley is in there as an influence. Yes, exactly. And I think these barriers between different genres of music are false. And I don't think classical music needs to be so rigid so they do play pure classical music but also they play around with different styles and they have classical arrangements of for example Bob Marley or Leonard Cohen's Alleluia that's also in the program tomorrow and they play for example Who the Cat Fit by Bob Marley they'll be playing tomorrow and I think that's really and reggae versions of classical songs or the other way around. And I think that's really important because music should be something that's alive. Now you've mentioned the expense. I

mean, the expense of having seven children, I wouldn't even like to think about anyway. But when you're talking about the music lessons, the instruments, that is, it must have been unbelievable. You must have had to sacrifice a lot to be able to get, because I'm guessing you can't also pass down musical instruments always. Not always. I mean, that's why I think we stuck with piano and string. So they played piano, violin and cello. I think if we'd gone any wider, it would have been impossible. So the thing with the violin you get and the cello, you start with a quarter size and a half size and a three quarter size and you can pass all of those down. You can also pass down sheet music and expertise.

So the older ones teach the younger ones a lot. But yes, I think if we had thought that we were going to have seven children in the first place and then going to give them all classical music. You can't think about anything in advance. It just happens. And I know that you have got up for years ridiculously early on a Saturday morning. Tell us about your Saturday mornings.

Yes, so all of them auditioned for the primary and junior Royal Academy of Music in London. And of course, we're from Nottingham. So that meant getting up really early, catching the six o'clock train to get there for the nine o'clock lesson. And as it went on, Isator started. And then at one point, there were five of them all going at the same time. So getting teenagers out of bed in time for the train was a real ordeal.

I know you mentioned in the programme that some people have called you a pushy mum and they may be listening to this going those kids can't have wanted to do it all by themselves she must have been forcing them what do you say to that? I think you have to believe in your children and I think that's all we did actually and we were also very honest with them and said that you can't achieve anything without working for it. But of course, you can't force your children to do anything. And I think there's also a very popular idea that classical music is something that's very painful and it's not fun. And actually, it really is fun. And they did enjoy it. And they do enjoy it. Do you still have to get up at that time? Because having a 12-year-old, I'm guessing

you're still doing that. I'm still doing that, yes. And I know that also you're quite a competitive family, which I guess drives the motivation for the music as well. There's lots of really nice sort of outtakes and family video footage, which is included in this programme, where you all sit down and watch it. But there does seem to be quite a competitive stream running through it. Oh, yes, definitely.

They're not competitive when it comes to music, because they see that as a sharing and a collective thing. But when it comes to family board games, then that's very different. So does that mean you try and avoid the family board games at Christmas so that it doesn't all go wrong? Oh, no, no. That's the best fun that we all have. So the board games at Christmas so that it doesn't all go wrong? Oh no no that's best fun that we all have so the board games are taken very seriously and they're very loud and

very noisy but they're the best fun we have. Now we must talk as well about Sheku because many people will remember his incredible performance at the royal wedding at the Duke and Duchess of Sussex's wedding. How did did that come about? That literally came about with a phone call. First of all, I had an email saying that they would like, from Kensington Palace, saying that they would like to talk to Sheku. And I gave them his phone number and they phoned him and the woman said, oh, this is Kensington Palace and there's someone on the line who would like to talk to you, Sheku an American voice came on and said hello Sheku this is Meghan Markle would you like to play at my wedding and that's how it happened. Wow and how did he respond I mean could

he even speak when that happened? He just said thank you very much I'd love to play at your wedding and that was it he's very cool and calm Sheku. But it was lovely because it was all very personal. And that was what was a very intimate occasion. I know it was watched by over two billion people, but the actual experience, I think, for Sheku was this is a lovely personal wedding. Well, that's interesting. So I wanted to ask you if you felt the pressure performing then.

I think Sheku very much performs to the people who are in front of him and he loves performing and he sees it as a communication so for him I think it was just a lovely happy occasion. I don't think he thinks about all the people behind the camera, I mean you can't. No, no that's probably very wise advice. Thank you so much for speaking to us, it's been a delight to speak to you this morning. That is Kadiatu Kane Mason. You can catch up with that programme. It's called A Musical Family Christmas.

It's on BBC Two tomorrow night just after half past eight. Lots of you getting in touch with us this morning about your stories about volunteering. Particularly volunteering

has reached record levels over the last year. And many people sharing your experiences this morning. Matt has got in touch saying i volunteer as a community first responder contributing to frontline work for the ambulance service i've done this for 11 years but it's been very rewarding to do this during the

pandemic it's also helped keep a sense of normality as the essential patient facing work is unaffected by the zoom phenomenon another one here karen in hampshire says i've been volunteering my local vaccination center since the summer from parking cars to welcoming people at the door giving out phenomenon. Another one here, Karen in Hampshire says, I've been volunteering at my local vaccination centre since the summer, from parking cars to welcoming people at the door, giving out information to the unvaccinated, to seating people for their jabs. I have thoroughly enjoyed giving something back. It's been a ray of positivity in an otherwise uncertain time. Karen, thank you for getting in touch. And just one more for now. Re-volunteering, I have a unique experience. I have been volunteering at the dinosaur exhibition at Norwich Cathedral.

Dippy is a cast of the dinosaur skeleton in the Natural History Museum and has been on a tour around the country. The dinosaur fitted in very well at the cathedral, the only building in the city big enough and there were over 100,000 visitors. It has been a joy to be part of this unique project. Do share your experiences of volunteering throughout the last year. It's 8 a joy to be part of this unique project. Do share your experiences of

volunteering throughout the last year. It's 84844 on the text or you can tweet us at BBC Woman's Hour. Now, do you feel like you have become your parents' relationship therapist? Many of us, of course, are returning to the family home this Christmas. And whilst we may love our parents, it doesn't mean they're easy to live with, even if it's just for a few days. Are you having to play counsellor to mum and dad, getting them to sit down, talk to them like a couple of squabbling siblings? Does it fall on you to try and fix your parents' marriage? We know that lawyers call the first Monday back after Christmas, Divorce Day. Do you fear that's where they're heading? Well, if so, we would really like to hear from you. You can also tell us how it's impacting you, of course. Get in touch on Twitter, on Instagram,

or through the Woman's Hour website. Right, let's head to Posh Club. It's a weekly event at four different locations around the South East, providing entertainment for older people, including dancing, burlesque, strippers. The only rule is you have to dress up. Sue Elliot Nicholls went to the Hackney branch in East London to meet the ladies of the Posh Club Dance Club, known as PCDC. Most of the dance company are in their 70s and they are having a whale of a time. There's nothing so exhilarating as a social occasion. Welcome to the Posh Club. Come on in, get in the room.

Time they ask me out for a dinner or a wrap. As soon as I hear that music, I forget about the aches and the pain. Even my husband says to me, how come you were just complaining your knee's paining and the music just started?

It seemed to sort of make me forget that I've got pains, you know. My name's Niall Weir. I'm the rector of St Paul's Church, West Hackney, home to many great organisations, of which the Posh Club is certainly up there at the top of the league. I like dressing up for an evening ball or a social brawl. I literally walked in the door and was met by glitter balls, flashing lights,

the suited and the booted, older people of every single nationality, strippers, vaudeville. It's like walking into a treasure trove of joy and fun and colour and noise. Lots of things that you can see, but lots of things that you don't see, that you can't touch, that you can't bottle, which is people really moving up alongside people they wouldn't meet anywhere else, people having a laugh, people looking out for each other if somebody's not there one week. They wonder where they week, they wonder where

they are, they phone them up, all those sort of lovely stuff and as a church we've learned so much about how to be welcoming and how to be good shepherds and all of that and I think Ducky are fantastic shepherds. Ducky Productions, based at London's famous gay venue the Vauxhall Tavern, specialises in putting on LGBTQ plus events. Nine years ago, Ducky's Simon Casson and his sister Annie wanted to cheer at their mum. She just moved to a different area and she was feeling lonely. So they set up a tea party for her in the front room, using all the best china and the glitziest dress code. And so the Posh Club was born. My name is Angela. I'm 74 years old. Even before with the PCDC, we all loved dancing anyway, you know.

I mean, my husband's always saying to me, as soon as anybody can just knock two things together, you're off, you know. Then we stretch it out across the body. My name is H. Pluess and I am the artistic director of PCDC. And then we're folding in. I was originally like the landlady of the Push Club. In that role, I was just able to see all of this untapped talent and desire to get up on stage.

And I wanted to invert, I suppose, the relationship between the audience and the talent and make the club members the talent on stage, if you see what I mean. It's wonderful for me to talk about, oh, I must dash off, I've got rehearsals. It's fantastic. Oh, who'd have thought it? I've never, ever performed my whole life

until I was in my 70s. So we're working on our Christmas show. We always have the Christmas spot at Posh Club and we are bringing our Dance of Flamingos Christmas show to the brilliant members of the Posh Club. Insnate the flamingos in all their glory. Eight women and Donald, one honorary woman, dressed in pink leotards with pink and yellow fishnets,

feather boas, blow-up flamingo rubber rings around their waists and flamingo puppet gloves opening and closing their beaks to the beat. The audience loved it, whooping with delight and banging on the tables. They care about the standards of work and we all want to make something extraordinary. That's always what we're aiming for, to feel extraordinary, to look extraordinary, to be extraordinary and we tour all over. We did a tour and we had a bus. We had a tour bus just like stars. The thing is, every piece we do,

every performance, it's professional. So I feel like a star. Especially when we were able to dance at Sadler's Wells, it was absolutely fantastic going and telling my friends, I've been dancing at Sadler's Wells, so next week I'll be on the red carpet. We're looking at a tour of stately homes in the future. There's even talk, can you believe it,

one of our members, a couple of them actually, are from Barbados. And we're actually thinking of going. That's beyond my wildest dreams. We have to move our hips, move to the left, move to the right. We've got to move our body all over. There are times you feel pain, but you put your mind on what you're doing.

Being not exercising for so long, you find it, you know, a bit tiresome at times when we first started. Because you really had to get into it. Being involved and if you're going on stage for people to see you, you want to show them and give them your best. I see the beauty in all of our limitations and working with those limitations brings this incredible richness and a history of their bodies and what they can and can't do and what they can't do is as interesting and beautiful as what they can do. I cannot believe some of the moves that I can actually perform now. You know, the hip movement and the boob shaking, the shimmying. Hiney, hiney, hiney, ho! Hiney, hiney, ho! I need to mix with people because I get bored indoors and PCDC is a very good way to get us out and get our bodies going.

You can imagine lockdown. I felt so alone. I felt useless. I thought, oh my God, what's going to happen? I got so very, very low during lockdown, especially when Christmas was cancelled last year, that was devastating to me. And had it not been for our leader, H, coming to film us, I don't know if I'd still be here. My family live in different parts of the country now. My grandchildren are grown up. My husband passed away six years ago. So I was lonely. And so the group have become my family. I asked them quite a long time ago, will you be my family? And they all said yes, of course. Thank goodness for charity shops and getting loud jewellery and different sparkly tops.

Have you found yourself at Posh Club mixing with people that you didn't normally imagine yourself mixing with? Yes. You know, we're there to have a nice time, enjoy ourselves, and we're not bothered with, you know, what your sexuality is or what, you know. We're just there to have a nice time. Some of the highlights for me was when we appeared at Gay Shame at the Vauxhall Tavern. It was so amazing to mix with people that obviously women my age don't normally mix with. Gay shame.

Gay shame. Oh, you should have been there. You should have the time of your life. And it was not only us, it was inter-age group. It was us as elders and some youngers was in the team. So it was a fantastic mixture and a marvellous night. And don't forget the men as well. There was all men.

A lot of guys was in the group that was performing with us. Oh, it was hilarious. It's wonderful. You're doing dance hall. So are you doing proper dance hall? Yes. Quite sexy. It is. Can you describe it? I mean,

it is quite raunchy, isn't it? It is raunchy and you've got to move your body to the music. Basically, it's exciting and if you're dancing with a partner, that's more exciting. You've got to shake, you've got to, your hips, you've got to go round and round and up and down. And you've got to feel the movement. You've got to feel the music. You're making me go a bit hot under the collar here. And the sensuality comes out in that music

because it touches us in the inside. And we've got to express this. That is our art form. My daughter, she said, Mum, you're at it again. I said, yes, Beverly, it's keeping me fit. I'm enjoying it. And as long as I've got the breath in my body, I will keep going. Well, they certainly know how to enjoy themselves, don't they? Sue Elliott Nichols there going to the Hackney branch of Posh Club. And I have to say, we've got to thank Maybelline Dick,

Dahlia Douglas, Jeannie McCaffrey-Inbush, Angela Roach, Barbara Lane, all of the lovely ladies at the Posh Club Dance Club. Great insight into what you get up to in your spare time. Now earlier in the programme we were talking to Kadiatu Kane-Mason. She is the mother of seven classical musicians. It's a programme

going out on BBC Two. In fact, tomorrow night, a musical Family Christmas. And she was saying she had real concerns about the availability of music education in schools. Her children all went to state schools and they were lucky to have that provision she was worried that that's not available to everybody but steve has got in touch saying music is thriving in state schools right now last summer we had two 13 year olds archie and derry get accepted into the royal college of music

through their own desire and hard work plus our support in school well steve that's fantastic to hear i hope that that availability is there for all children across the country. We've also been talking about volunteering. It's been a record year for people volunteering this year. And I wanted to know your experiences of what you've given your time to this year, particularly if it's something that you haven't done before. Anne in Saffron Walden says, I've been a telephone volunteer

throughout the pandemic. This involves phoning people all over the country who are alone or have requested someone to check that they're OK. It's been very rewarding. And I've spoken with people from all over the country,

Scotland to the Isle of Wight. After Christmas, I'll volunteer at a vaccination centre as I know that they need extra people. Happy Christmas, says Anne. Well, happy Christmas to you. And thank you for getting in touch with us here on Woman's Hour. Leslie has gone in touch saying, I've volunteered for various charities since I was at university in 1970. I've always felt that I was lucky in life and felt the need to share that luck with others. Citizens

Advice, Retired Greyhounds, local museums and libraries and a church Christmas tree festival have been and still are my interests. I have learned so much from all the people I've met and the pleasure I get from helping someone else is immense. I would recommend volunteering to everybody. Merry Christmas, says Leslie. And another one here from Pamela. She says, hello, I signed up when the NHS appealed for volunteers back in spring 2020 and have been a volunteer responder since then as a retired teacher i was pleased to be able to contribute and help the national effort i have thoroughly enjoyed talking to and helping many people i've also been a steward

at vaccination centers as they say we are all in this together pamela thank you for getting in touch thank you to all of you because we mustn't forget that so much of this country relies on people giving up their time to be volunteers thank you to all of you who take that time out to do that now, if you like a Christmas rom-com, the chances are you have watched the film The Holiday

it was released 15 years ago it follows the story of Iris from England, played by Kate Winslet and Amanda from the US, played by Cameron Diaz. Now, both, freshly heartbroken, find each other on Home Exchange website and agree to swap places for Christmas. Now, last month, Lizzie Frenier, acting digital publishing editor and travel writer at The Telegraph, decided she was going to recreate this. So she swapped homes with a woman that she met online, Camille Wyand, and headed to an apartment in New York. Well, Lizzie and Camille, join me now.

Good morning to both of you. Good morning. Hi. Hi, good morning. Thank you so much for speaking to us. Now, before we begin, I have to explain to people there are two American accents there, people may be scratching their heads saying, hang on a minute, I thought there was a British woman. Lizzie, you were born in California. I know that you moved to the UK as a child but you've retained your American accent yeah that's exactly it I was born in California moved when I was 15 to Wiltshire and and have lived in Nottingham in London since then but somehow I've kept this American twang well that's fantastic it's important to remember your roots um so just explain to us, if you would, Lizzie, why did you think, do you know what, I'm going to recreate the holiday? Well, I was actually, I was just scrolling Instagram at the

end of November. And I saw this post from Thursday Dating, which is a dating app that has users in London, New York. And they had decided to partner up with Home Exchange to create a special section of the website that was exclusively for singles in New York and London in order to recreate the holiday. And as soon as they saw that post, I thought, oh my God, that would be such a brilliant thing to do, not only for my personal life, but as a story for The Telegraph as well. Because in the holiday, Kate Winslet is actually a journalist at the telegraph so it was sort of the perfect little serendipitous moment so I pitched it to my editor and she thought it was a great idea the next day I went on the home exchange website the Thursday dating section and looked at different

single women living in New York I messaged a few different girls and the Camille's profile was the one that really stood out to me because I could just tell from the pictures that she had and the things that she said about herself that if we lived in the same city we would be friends and I knew if I wanted to do this it needed to be with someone that I could be friends with and that would lean into the whole experience so I sent her a message and within a few hours she replied saying yeah how about doing it in January and I said no you know if we want to make this like the holiday we need to do it next week and we need to do it before Christmas um and she replied saying okay let's do it so it was sort of a whirlwind that it happened all so quickly but

um that was part of the magic of it of just oh no Lizzie's line has frozen I can tell we'll try and reconnect with lizzy but in the meantime camille how how were you how did you respond to the idea that lizzy just messaged you out of the blue suggesting that hey let's do this and let's do this straight away yeah so i when i had originally signed up for home exchange i was really planning on doing it more in the spring. And when I had made my made my account, Lizzie had reached out to me within a few hours. And so I woke up and I was like, Oh, no, that's a bit too soon. But as Lizzie said, we had to do it in December, which I really love the spontaneity of it. And very quickly was like, nevermind, I'm in like, let's do it in December. So I think the whole spontaneity of it made very quickly was like never mind I'm in like let's do it in December so um I think the whole spontaneity of it made it more fun. Now what you guys did is you actually met in South London didn't you you swapped keys there so Camille first of all you didn't get to go to the lovely snowy Surrey cottage which was in the holiday which Kate Winslet did you got the flat in Tooting now I don't want to put down Lizzie's flat but but how was that for you it was wonderful I was really

lucky because Lizzie has three wonderful roommates and it was really awesome getting to meet them and of course getting to meet Lizzie first and I hit it off right away with Lizzie and just felt like we were old friends catching up that night that we got pizza and wine and and instantly too with her roommates I felt like you know they would be my friends in New York as well and so it was nice having girlfriends to chat with that whole weekend about everything going on. And Lizzie how about you you headed off to New York and went to Camille's apartment tell us about that. Yeah so I'd met Camille the night before so it was nice because I you know had a sense of who she was but it was that moment of walking into her apartment I'm used to staying into hotels where

there's maybe that more anonymous feeling whereas walking into Camille's apartment by the books that she had on the floor and the candles that I could see on her cupboards and everything I got more of a sense of who she was and it was a really nice thing that we even had some of the same like we had the same anthology from Rupi Kaur and we also have the same diptych candle and things like that so that was quite funny um to see but it was definitely a nerve-wracking experience too because camille lives on her own so i sort of arrived and felt you know what have i signed myself up for but the the thing i took away from the whole experience was everyone i met was so friendly and nice and was so excited about what I was doing and wanted me to meet this friend or that friend it made the whole thing um a lot

easier well let's talk about the romance because obviously the holiday is a rom-com and we know what happens to Cameron Diaz and to Kate Winslet they they hook up with people when they have swapped lives what about you guys um Cam, what happened with you dating wise? Yeah, so I really wasn't expecting much from it. I figured I'd have like a few funny dating stories and head back to the United States with just some stories. But just went on a date with one person and his name is Patty. And so we met at a restaurant and had like a wonderful time. He was so sweet, so charming and just the conversation flowed so well. and had like a wonderful time. He was so sweet, so charming. And just the conversation flowed so well.

We had so much in common. And we went to like a little event after and then continued to see each other for the rest of the weekend. And that Sunday, actually, we went to the pub from the holiday. So while I was in the cute little cottage in Surrey, I did go out to the pub where some scenes from the movie were shot. So it was really sweet. We took a train out there and had dinner there one night. And we just really had a wonderful time together. And we're still talking now and have FaceTimed. And yeah, he was really sweet. And it was really great to do this experience with him. Did he tell you he was going to be your Jude Law?

He made some type of comment like that. He had seen the Instagram post from Thursday Dating about that we were doing this. And he messaged me like, what's this all about? Are you looking for Jude Law? And then it went from there. And Lizzie, what about you? What were your experiences? Because you said you felt a bit more, well, well alone maybe a bit more vulnerable being in New York because obviously Camille had gone to your flat where there were

other other girls living there whereas you were in a flat on your own so did you first of all did you feel safe just trying to meet up with guys in New York? I did actually you know and I set up different things in advance to make myself feel safe. Like my, you know, I sent my parents the address of where I was staying. And before I went on a date with anyone, I shared that phone number with my friends and family as well. Just to, you know, because I wasn't in a different city. But overall, you know, I felt really safe throughout the whole experience. And I go on dates in London as well. So while I was in a different city, it wasn't that different to what I would do in my day-to-day life.

So tell us your dating experience then in New York. So, yeah, so on the first night, the Thursday dating app actually set me up with someone before I went because I was a bit nervous about not knowing anyone who was another Thursday member. And it was the perfect introduction to New York City. He was so kind and he planned a whole evening where we went for old fashions at a little bar around the corner from Camille's apartment. And we went for pizza by the slice. And then we ended up at this piano dive bar

where everybody just burst into song randomly, random different Broadway show tunes. So it was really fun. Although I did come away feeling more like it was a friendship than anything else. But then I did go on another date while I was here too, which was someone that I met on the Thursday app. If you don't know how it works, basically it only works one day a week,

which fitted in perfectly with what we were doing in this trip because it makes you be more spontaneous. So the rest of the week you can't message anyone, so you just have to go on the app on Thursday message a few people and the idea is that you either meet up that night or you know probably that weekend so I messaged a few different people on the app one person got back to me saw them on Friday night and I ended up having um such a nice time both of us didn't want the evening to end, went out dancing in Greenwich Village and saw them a few more times over the weekend. So, yeah, it was, you know, there was more, it turned out to be more of a rom-com than I expected.

So is there a future in it? Because this is difficult for both of you. You've met guys that you get on well with, but you've swapped back to your own lives now. So, Lizzie, is there a future in this? I don't know. I don't want to jinx anything. We'll just have to have to see I mean it is it frustrating that you've met someone and then obviously you've you you're going back home and and getting on with your your real life if you like yeah it's definitely really sad that he's quite far away in London there are talks of him

you know getting a flight and coming to visit in New York City but I mean if it doesn't work out I know that we'll be good friends going forward but I'm sure we'll see each other sometime in the future as well. Lizzie I know this was a work thing and it was kind of you know something that you could do for work but also have the experience but what did you get out of it was it other than obviously meeting a nice guy did you feel it was beneficial? 100% if I could do it again I would if I've had various people message me saying they're thinking about doing it next year and my advice is to go for it there was so many things I learned about it learned about myself through doing it first of all it was just so nice to feel spontaneous again to do something outside of my

comfort zone and just you know enjoy something for the for the sake of it but then also it's the female friendship that I found out of it um Camille is one of the kindest people I've ever met um and she's so interesting and nice and we've both said we're so happy that we did this and we found friends in each other since it ended um earlier this week we've been speaking on the phone pretty much every day and I know that I can speak to her going forwards. And I would love to come back and visit her and plan a trip to the Hamptons or something like that. And Camille, what about you? What did you get out of it? I agree with Lizzie. And as I mentioned earlier, I felt like right when we met, we hit it off and had felt like we had known each other for years. Lizzie's so wonderful and so sweet. And it's been

so amazing getting to know her and hear about her life and and I know that I have a friend for life now and I know we're gonna we're already planning trips in the future of when we're gonna see each other again and so I'm really excited for that and to see where our friendship goes well best of luck and and how the relationships go with the men that obviously we don't want to jinx at this point but um thank you so much thank you so much for uh joining us and explaining that to us you heard that from Lizzie Frenier who is acting digital publishing editor and travel writer at the Telegraph and she swapped homes with Camille Wyand and headed to her apartment in New York. Now Vox Duo are soprano

Carla Grant and mezzo-soprano Julia Solomon. They met while studying at the Royal Conservatoire of Scotland. They released a special debut single. It is a new version of the carol O Holy Night in collaboration with the classical group the Earth Tones Trio. Well, Carla joins us now from Stirling and Julia joins us from Brazil. Good morning to both of you. Morning. Good morning.

Lovely to speak to you both. Thank you for joining us on this Christmas Eve. Now, I know that you were both soloists and I'm useless at singing. I don't understand anything about it. So explain to me how difficult is it from going to singing solo to forming a duo? Carla, maybe you can explain to us first. It is quite similar in a way, except you do have to think about other things like how you blend with the other person and that you're creating, you know, the same colours with the music and that you're on the same page with everything. And it's actually a really nice thing to do to be able to sing with someone else and it's like a connection through the music. So Julia it's about not being selfish it's about working together. It is I think one of the things that helps us so much is that how well we know

each other and that we're really good friends And I think that actually really helps us communicate while we're singing without having to, you know, talk about it. Sometimes you just sort of listen to how the other person breathes and things like that. And we can understand what the other person is wanting to do, that we're on the same page. And I think when we started working together, that wasn't always we knew that we had um a really something really good going but we weren't able to to communicate so quickly and

now it's almost instantaneous and how does that work is that just practice I think it is, yeah. A lot of it's practice and communication. Sorry, go ahead. Oh, just outside of the working together as well, just outside of singing. We always talk about what we want and what we think might be special about a piece and what we love about it. And I think that really helps us have the same vision for when we're performing together. So, Carla, I mean, you haven't picked much of an iconic song there, have you? Oh, Holy Night. I mean, was that quite intimidating to give your version and to release that as your debut single? Yeah, I mean, it's such a well known and loved Christmas song. But I think

what Ewan has done with the arrangement is just really special and unique. I mean, you don't normally hear it with two voices, as well as three other instruments as well. And that's been really exciting for us to work with the different colours and textures that he's created within the arrangement. So we're really grateful to be able to share that. You mentioned Ewan, that's Ewan Stevenson there who put it together. Just talk to us a little bit, if you would, Julia, about the process of recording this single, because it was quite interesting, wasn't it? It was. we've never been in a recording booth before anything like that we're quite used to live audiences

and no microphones or anything like that so when we went into into the studio we went in individually so Carla would go first she's got the melody and then um it was easier for me to go into the booth after her and listen to her on some headphones and time how I would fit in with her um as if we were singing um together at the same time so this is an ignorant question why couldn't you sing together at the same time I think that perhaps you've got more control over the sound and um well we've never really done it before so we did talk about doing it together um but I think it's to do with the acoustics of the the room that we were in and things like that yeah and Carla how was it for you did you find it difficult I did yeah um it I it was it was just a new skill to have to um to to learn and

but it was really exciting in a way as well and having to um having to actually sing it with the headphones but without Julia I had to kind of we did practice together um in our own time before recording so we kind of had an idea of what it would sound like and how to um blend together in certain areas so that that wasn't such a shock when going into the studio um yeah i was just going to say one of the benefits i'm guessing as well you talk about how you knew each other so well julia it was actually during lockdown that you lived together as well and you performed some concerts online. That's right, yeah. Well, we just wanted to make the best of our time

and we thought it would be really special to keep sharing music with people in lockdown. So we put up a Zoom concert and performed to people on their screens. And we got dressed up in the flats and put on our ball gowns and made a big event of it. And it really felt like it was a live concert. We had butterflies before, even though we were just in our kitchen. And it really felt really special to do. And I'm sure a real lift for people listening as well. So important during lockdown.

Now, listen, let's end the programme. Let's hear a little bit of O Holy Night by Vox Duo, accompanied by the Earth Tones Trio, which was composed by Ewan Stevenson. When Christ was born And that was Vox Duo, otherwise known as Carla Grant and Julia Solomon with their debut single, a new version of the carol O Holy Night. Thank you for your company today and, of course, for all of your messages.

Weekend Woman's Hour is here on Radio 4 tomorrow at quarter past four. Emma's back on Monday with some classic Woman's Hour interviews from this year. From the makers of The Battersea Poltergeist, a new podcast series for BBC Radio 4, Uncanny. Do you believe in ghosts? No. Have you seen one? Yes.

Real-life stories that are supernatural, told by the people they happen to. Presented by me, Danny Robbins. There is a very strong sense of pure evil. Subscribe to Uncanny on BBC Sounds. been working on one of the most complex stories I've ever covered. There was somebody out there who's faking pregnancies. I started like warning everybody. Every doula that I know. It was fake. No pregnancy. And the deeper I dig, the more questions I unearth. How long has she been doing this? What does she have to gain from this? From CBC and the BBC World Service, The Con, Caitlin's Baby. It's a long story, settle in. Available now.