Woman's Hour - Women pig farmers and mental health. Modern slavery. The cave woman rebuilding her business after Covid.

Episode Date: October 18, 2021

According to a new survey on mental wellbeing in agriculture, 58% of women in farming experience anxiety compared to 44% of men. What's the reason behind it? How much impact has Brexit and the pandemic had on the problem? We discuss with Alicia Chivers, Chief Executive of the Royal Agricultural Benevolent Institution, and East Yorkshire pig farmer Kate Moore.Conservative MP Sir David Ames, who was killed on Friday had been in Parliament since 1983 . Issues raised by the people he represented were top of his agenda. When a woman called Carla came and told him about how her life was blighted by endometriosis, he took up the cause. We hear from the former Labour MP for Dewsbury, who he worked with on this issue while she was in the House, despite them being politically poles apart. We've been following the work of the Salvation Army who have the Home Office contract to support all victims of modern slavery in England and Wales and have been given exclusive access to their annual report which shows that demand for their services is soaring. Young Albanian women make up the largest group of survivors who escape from their traffickers after being sexually exploited. Many of these women are waiting to hear if the Home Secretary will appeal against what's described as a landmark High Court ruling last week. It was brought by a Vietnamese woman who was trafficked to the UK and if upheld will affect hundreds of others like her. We hear from Ahmed Aydeed from law firm Duncan Lewis the woman's solicitor. Plus reporter Carolyn Atkinson talks to a survivor and to Kathy Betteridge, Major Director of Anti Trafficking and Modern Slavery at the Salvation Army.Plus Emma the Yorkshire woman who spent over a hundred hours in a cave. Lisa Bowerman owns Stump Cross Caverns, She runs the caves as a family business and they'll usually a big attraction for tourists. She explains why she hopes the stunt will give the business a lift post-covid.. Presenter Emma Barnett Producer Beverley Purcell

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. I'm Natalia Melman-Petrozzella, and from the BBC, this is Extreme Peak Danger. The most beautiful mountain in the world. If you die on the mountain, you stay on the mountain. This is the story of what happened when 11 climbers died on one of the world's deadliest mountains, K2, and of the risks we'll take to feel truly alive. If I tell all the details, you won't believe it anymore. Extreme, peak danger. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.

BBC Sounds. Music, radio, podcasts. Hello, I'm Emma Barnett and welcome to Woman's Hour from BBC Radio 4. Good morning and welcome to today's programme. Ever dreamt of a cave of one's own? I'll be talking to a woman who owns one and has just spent over 100 hours living in it. We also have for you today an exclusive report into the state of modern slavery in Britain. And also on today's programme, on the front line of farming,

the pig farmer whose impassioned plea to Boris Johnson went viral on BBC News. What does Kate Moore want to say to the Prime Minister now in light of the latest policy changes? I'm sure she won't hold back and I'm hoping you won't either. Anything you want to get in touch with me about today, you know I'm all ears. You can text me here at womanshour84844, text will be charged at your standard rate,

or on social media, it's at BBC Women's Hour, or email me through our website. But first, we want to start the programme today with the words of the family of the Conservative MP, Sir David Amess, who was killed on Friday in Essex while seeing his constituents, and they have said that their hearts are shattered as they called on people to set aside hatred and work towards togetherness. One of the longest serving MPs, Sir David had been in Parliament since 1983, and issues raised to him by the people

he represented were top of the intray, not least when a woman called Carla came and told him about how her life was blighted by endometriosis. His focus on this area of women's health was noted by the Prime Minister when he paid tribute to Sir David on Friday. And it was this focus that led to him working increasingly with the former Labour MP for Dewsbury while she was in the House, Paula Sheriff, despite them being politically poles apart? I spoke to Paula just before coming on air this morning and asked how she first met Sir David Amess. David and I actually went on a foreign trip to the Middle East. And prior to that, I hadn't had a great deal to do with him, if I'm honest. And I remember meeting him at the airport. And that trip was just wonderful. We never stopped laughing for the entire duration of that trip. We worked hard, of course, but he was the best company imaginable.

And you couldn't be, I suppose you should just say this, you were a Labour MP, him a Conservative MP, not just on your political party's front, but on lots of issues. You couldn't have been further apart on certain issues as well. Yeah, it's kind of quite ironic. We were poles apart politically. So David was a big Brexiteer. I'm a Remainer. We disagreed on many issues, including things like I'm very much pro-choice around things like abortion. David is pro-life. But we never really, this might seem odd because we were politicians, but we never really discussed the partisan politics. He was just the most kindest, gentle, charismatic, charming, and above all, funny man. And I think the thing to say at this point is, he was, as we have been hearing over the weekend, loved by many of his constituents for the work that he took on on their behalf.

And what they brought to him was what he often found himself either prioritising with the work of others or getting into or learning about new things and trying to show them in a different light for the first time. And one of those is an issue very much at the heart of women's health, which you're very familiar with, endometriosis. Yeah, absolutely. So as I understand it, David was approached by a constituent called Carla, who is the most wonderful lady. And he was really, really moved by what he heard. And he decided as a result of that, that he was going to set up an all party group to look at endometriosis and typically for David it wasn't about lip service he didn't do it just because you know perhaps it would have looked good or it might have gained him extra votes from women but he threw his heart and soul into it and I obviously supported him I did a lot of work on women's health in Parliament. And I remember going along to that first meeting with him.

And he was so grateful to me for actually going to support him. And yeah, like I say, he really cared. And I think, you know, he did some fundraising for endometriosis. And he certainly was still campaigning and championing the cause, you know, right, right, right up until and right up until the end. I should say, you know, as not just as someone who suffers with endometriosis, I remember him putting this on the news agenda with that political group and party group, all party group and interviewing him about it. And I think it was the first time I'd actually spoken to a man on air, beyond a doctor, about endometriosis, a condition, if people do not know, they can look up in more detail, extremely painful condition linked to periods. And many sort of symptoms of that come up, but the hallmark of it is pain. And the way in which he spoke about it was pure shock,

you know, that this was something he didn't know about until very recently. Absolutely. I think he was genuinely quite horrified when he learned what a significant impact endometriosis can have on a woman in terms of their health, their fertility, their ability to carry on working, all those things. And he really, really cared. I remember taking part in a debate on endometriosis with David. And at the end of the debate, the first thing he did was he went over to the people in the visitors gallery to ask them if they were OK. And that was just so, so typical of him. He was so unbelievably kind. And Carla, who brought it to his attention. I know you've been speaking to her because, of course, this news, you know, it's come to a blow to so many.

But I'm sure to those who had that relationship with him, it's even harder. Gosh, yeah. Carla and I were messaging last night and we were sharing some anecdotes. And she told me how she'd seen him recently and he'd been talking about me. And she's, as you would imagine, she's absolutely devastated. She's lost somebody that was very, very dear to her too, but she's also lost their champion in Southend. And I cannot imagine the pain and the sorrow that his family are experiencing. I don't think anybody can at this time. What a loss.

I was just going to say around, I know you're not an MP at the moment. You lost your seat in 2019. But I know that you have been concerned for a while around the language, the way that we debate and that side of things and taking the temperature down. Absolutely. And I think, I mean, I raised this in the House on a number of occasions, perhaps most famously when I challenged Boris Johnson in September 2019, and he responded by saying humbug. Now, I think things have got to change.

The discourse has been deteriorating, frankly, for quite some time. And I think we all, and when I say we all, I include politicians in this. We all need to reflect on our language, our tone and our behaviour. And again, I include myself in that too. It's absolutely horrific. There's no panacea, Emma. I don't think there's a lever that we can pull and suddenly everybody's going to start loving their MPs again.

But we need to return to some sort of civility in society, you know, because I thought after Joe, I mean, that was just such a horrific, tragic event. Talking about Joe Cox there, of course. Yeah. such a you know a horrific tragic event talking about joe cox there of course yeah and now you know to have lost another mp just five years on it's it's it's frightening isn't it i mean you know irrespective of what party mps represent the vast majority are there because they want to make people's lives better and they're working incredibly incredibly hard. The hours that MPs put in, so much of it is unseen. People think we live in castles and we have moats and duck houses.

And the reality is actually very, very different. So many MPs are actually really embedded in their local communities, just like David was. How are you going to remember David? I remember his kindness, particularly when I was diagnosed with cancer last year he he rang me and he told me that he'd met my successor in the corridors in Parliament and he'd gone up to him and said I'm David Amos I was a great friend of Paula's and you've a very hard act to follow. And he sent me flowers and he kept in touch.

But I think most of all, I remember the camaraderie and the laughter that we shared and how he lit up a room with his smile. Paula Sheriff, the former Labour MP, remembering her friend Sir David Amess. And perhaps that struck a chord with you in a slightly different way, but connected around those that you hold dear in your life and those you are close to, who perhaps you couldn't be further opposed to in many ways, politically, socially, in any sort of way. Maybe that is what people are thinking about a bit more in the last few days, since he was killed, doing what he loved, working with his constituents. And perhaps a focus on that is a good friendship with a bond who perhaps you don't see eye to eye on all issues or perhaps any issues at all let me know who they are and how you met and how you have them in your life and how you talk with one another 848 84844 is the number you need to text me on or on social media

we're at bbc women's and of course you can always email too via our website. Now, I asked you right at the beginning of the programme about having your own cave. Well, a cave of one's own. Feel like it all gets a bit much at times, fancy crawling into one. A woman in the Yorkshire Dales has spent over 100 hours in a cave, a cave that she owns, to be precise.

Lisa Bowerman owns Stumpcross Caverns and on Friday night completed, I'm told, 105-hour stint underground. She runs these caves as a family business. It is a tourist attraction, which I'm also told normally gets 60,000 visitors a year. But because of COVID, like so many, the business has taken a real hit.

Lisa, I believe you're talking to me now from the cave. I am, absolutely, yes. I'm here in my cave. With the brilliant echo that a cave provides. Absolutely. I wouldn't normally ask this, especially of my female guests, because it's very, very rarely relevant. But what are you wearing? I've got my cavewoman outfit on.

Describe that to us before you explain why what does that mean yep so i've got um leopard print trousers on i have some gorgeous boots with mammoth tusks and i've got lots of furs teeth sharp teeth around my neck and a horn on my head. Like you do. And of course, a big mammoth tooth that I carry around the caves as well to guide me. Which does look plastic, I should say. Yeah, it's real for the children, of course, but it is made out of fiberglass. Yeah, I just thought I'd stress that point at this point. Tell me, what are you doing within the cave? How you've kept going during this time? What would that that was like?

Yeah. So it's been really hard, obviously, because we were closed for 10 months. So that was really hard. But, you know, I think like everybody in the pandemic, it makes you refocus. And, you know, the caves are all about education it's all about future generations and we really really want to keep these caves open for everybody to come and enjoy it's an amazing um attraction and as well when people come into the caves a lot of people say that they've never been in a cave before so to have that experience is really important um and of course um being cave woman you know and i can actually look the children in the eye and say i am a true life cave woman 105 hours yeah that that will qualify you absolutely so it's just nice to teach them about this subterranean world about all the wonderful sleeping cats the organs the wedding cake everything that's carved out by

nature that's a natural wonder and you know it's a national treasure so it's wonderful to have schools and children come in and I play lots of games with the kids and teach them about you know this limestone that's older than the dinosaurs and give them fossils and things to take away with them which they get really giddy about they're really excited was it actually like sleeping in there? Because I'm just also aware, I can see peering into our video call here, that I could see quite a bit of dripping going on. Yeah, it was really noisy and really surreal.

It's a unique experience, definitely. But it felt cold, damp. It's a constant seven degrees, lots of dripping water. And the dripping water falls on different things. So you get the dripping water falling on the rock and it falls in the puddles. And it seems to amplify it all with the acoustics of the caves. You get different sounds, but they seem to travel for a long way. But everything was unpleasantly damp.

But there was a lot of serenity and calmness about it as well it was really weird but the thing that was the hardest thing was not seeing daylight yes well you know not having a window to the outside world can sometimes leave you feeling a little bit disconnected what what when you're not uh trying to of course raise the profile of the caves uh and being down there the entire time when you're normally in your own abode and in your home with windows. But what is it about the cave that you love and being in that environment? Because, you know, you brought this with your husband, I believe. Did you used to work as a nurse?

Yes. So I did 25 years of children's nursing, which is, you know, I absolutely love children. And I think it is all about the future generations and education. And it's fun learning, isn't it? It's lovely. But the thing that I love about it is the fact that, you know, it's unique. It's people come because it's curiosity, isn't it? And it's a real important tool for educating. When we had the first school back after lockdown, when we didn't even know whether we'd be able to reopen the caves,

I actually cried when the first school came down the steps because I thought this is what they need to see. Everybody needs the opportunity to see it. You know, imagine living here and not being able to share it. You know, that is why I became the crazy cave lady and, you know, and was so passionate about keeping this place open because it's something that needs to be shared. It's not it's not to be, you know, kept away from people and locked away. And I know that you've been doing this with your husband as well. Did he did he bed down for the same amount of time? He did. He did, absolutely.

And the thing is, Nick does not like cold. He doesn't like damp. He doesn't like wet. He sounds like me. I would hate this. Yeah, no, he absolutely did hate it. And he really struggled with it. And he spent two days warming up. But he did it because he said, I can't let you go down there on your own.

And I was so grateful that he did it because he said i can't let you go down there on your own and i was so grateful that he did do it because the reason that we did 105 hours was because jeff workman came down for 105 days in 1963 he was a rocket scientist and he wanted to know how his mind and body clock would work in complete isolation and he died last year at 91 and we absolutely adored Jeff so it was a testament to him as well um and all the kids love to hear about Jeff you know in his adventures in the cave but he went on his own in a level below us in the clay levels below the show cave and he stayed completely on his own with no calendar no watch no clock nothing and it is it's really weird because you do lose time down here you know you can come down for a day and it

feels like half a day seeing anything strange do we need to know about anything you wouldn't know that you see after hours as it were in a cave well to be honest we had the first night we were in bed really settled down and it was really weird and the first night was the hardest because it was all unique and you know i haven't got used to my environment and um the skeleton fell over which was about 50 yards away rolled across the pathway and the head came off and that was it i was all i was all i was thinking you know it was it was quite scary this is a skeleton sorry that you've got for show as part of the display halloween so halloween halloween coming up you've got it you've got to slightly clarify certain things here you know i know you i know you're talking to me and you're

very used to all of this um but yeah you were talking to me with some kind of plastic tusk on your head here. But when you're saying a skeleton just rolls across the cave and the head comes up. Context is all, my friend. Sorry. Sorry. So, yes, we do have half term coming up. So we're having a Halloween trail. And of course, I think the staff in particular found great fun in putting a few skeletons down here early just to scare us so I think they you know really enjoyed that so we're having Halloween trails and we're hoping to be really busy next week with lots of Halloween fun so the only thing that the only

thing that managed to spook you was something that you'd put in yourself not anything natural and then the other thing that was really beautiful was when we were actually able to leave the caves we had around the chamber of pillars so you've got your stalactites coming down your stalagmites coming up when they're joined together it's a pillar or a column we have some beautiful columns and just as we went past them there was this bat hovering and the bat guided us out of the cave which was really beautiful I mean it is so calming and peaceful down here um and that was just surreal it was really lovely that that'll hopefully counter out that memory of the skeleton and the skull going across the bottom of the cave the the beautiful bat guiding you out. A message here from Sarah Kate who says,

it sounds freezing, I don't think I could cope. But I'm also minded of the fact that it's World Menopause Day, so some people may really, some women may really enjoy the idea of a cold cave to themselves. Absolutely, definitely. I mean, I must admit, I have so many layers on being cavewoman that I do like to get down in the cave with it. Otherwise, I'm boiling upstairs in the shop.

Lisa, good luck to you. Thank you very much. Lisa, within Stump Cross Caverns, who's been spending 105 hours, you've just heard the reasons why, within a cave with her husband within the Yorkshire Dales. It's good to be able to talk to people wherever they're listening this morning and whatever they're doing. So do get in touch with us. And as I say, Sarah Kate does not like the sound of that. I've got a message here from Nikki talking about my conversation

with the former Labour MP, Paula Sheriff, talking about those who you may not agree with. A wonderful interview about friendship and genuine love and affection across the political divide. So those messages coming in about perhaps those friendships and bonds that you have with those that you don't necessarily see eye to eye on. And another message just from Ruth listening into my conversation there with

cavewoman Lisa Bowerman, who says, I think on a Monday morning, we all need a huge dose of whatever Lisa is on. Thanks, Emma, for a mind-boggling morning. Hashtag cavewoman. Hashtag who knew? I told you, all life is here. So keep those messages coming in on your experiences with those friendships, but also, of course, anything about, I don't know, you could tell me where you've slept that perhaps was quite unusual

or your experiences of caves. That's a question I've never asked on the radio before. 84844 on social media at BBC Women's Hour or email me through the Women's Hour website. Now I mentioned this report with regards to modern slavery and I just wanted to read a message that came in straight away off the back of that before I tell you what we found and what our reporters found. Liz in London says, I hear you're talking today about, quote, modern slavery. Nothing modern about it. How about renaming it? Current slavery comes to mind. Well, Woman's Hour has discovered that more than 10 extra safe houses for victims of modern slavery have been opened in England and Wales in the first six months of this year to cope with the rising numbers of those being trafficked. Modern slavery is when people are bought, sold, trafficked and exploited and

forced to work in all sorts of places, from beauty parlours to brothels, car washes to cannabis farms and in some cases within family homes as servants. Young Albanian women make up the largest group of survivors who escape after being exploited. More on that shortly. And many of these women are waiting to hear if Priti Patel, the Home Secretary, will appeal against what's being described as a landmark ruling made at the High Court last week. It was brought by a Vietnamese woman who was trafficked to the UK. And if upheld, it will affect hundreds of others like her. I can now talk to Ahmed Aidid from the law firm Duncan Lewis, who's that woman's solicitor and joins me now in the studio. Good morning. Good morning, Emma. Could you first of all tell us a bit about this woman and what she's gone through? Well, our client, due to an anonymity order, can't be here

today. So she's asked me to appear on her behalf. And what happened in relation to our client is she was trafficked from Vietnam to Russia. So I'll take you, give you a short summary of what happened. She was trafficked from Vietnam to Russia, where she was forced into sex work. And then she was subsequently trafficked from Russia to France, where she was again forced into sex work. And she was then packed into a tiny space on a lorry and then trafficked over to the UK where she was where they were found actually by the police and a few short few days later she was re-trafficked from local authority she was then subsequently you know held in captivity for over a year where she was treated horribly I mean I don't want to go into the details today but the the court case is there and you can see the details.

And, you know, she had actually escaped and was subsequently again found. You're in this cycle where you're constantly trying to escape and you're constantly being re-trafficked. She was, in fact, trafficked around the country where she was forced into sex work and then forced to work in a cannabis house where she was forced to have sex with the workers and also forced into labor at these cannabis houses. Actually, she'd been trafficked all around the country and found on numerous occasions by the police and yet again still re-trafficked. And what actually happened is, on one of these instances, the police, she was actually identified as a potential victim of trafficking. And there was a what's called a reasonable grounds decision made by the Home Secretary. And subsequent to that, she was again

re-trafficked. And the next time she was found by the police, she was actually charged and convicted of cannabis cultivation. Now, no one noticed the fact that she actually had a reasonable grounds decision that she may have actually been a victim of trafficking. And in court, when she was being convicted and sentenced, the judge had no idea of that either. And she was then subsequently sentenced and convicted and imprisoned in the UK. And then we started to act for her shortly before her sentence was about to conclude. And that is when we made an application to the Home Secretary and informed her but irrespective of that she was then subsequently still detained by the Home Secretary in immigration

detention unlawfully which has now been accepted by the Home Secretary that she should never have detained this person in our client in the first place and falsely imprisoned for that period and now she's you know in recovering and she was then subsequently taken into a safe house and now living in shared accommodation in asylum support accommodation. So that's where she is at the moment. But this particular ruling could be major, could be landmark. Why? What does it mean? So what happens is when you're in the UK, it takes such a long period for you to just be identified as a survivor of trafficking. This is a process conducted by the Home Secretary to make decisions. And this takes two years. So in our client's case, it took from 2018 to over three years to just simply identify her as a survivor of trafficking. So you're then left to live in limbo where you're not allowed to work. You don't have

lawful status. You're actually unlawfully residing in the UK so what what a client had asked for is to be granted leave to remain for the period while she awaits final determination of her asylum claim in the UK this was subsequently refused by the Home Secretary because as the court has found has actually misunderstood her own policy that she should be granting leave to remain to survivors of trafficking if they must remain in the UK and to not force them to live in this limbo where you're unable to work or live any form of life in the UK. So that's what the consideration is at the moment. I should say in a Home Office statement, we have this, the judgment does not state that leave must be granted to all victims of modern slavery, but it may be necessary when a victim

is pursuing a claim for asylum based on the fear of being re-trafficked. We are carefully considering the implications of this judgment and a decision on whether to appeal or not will be made in due course. Yes, I mean we accept that this doesn't apply to every single survivor of trafficking. We're talking about a group of survivors of trafficking who've been confirmed by the Home Secretary herself that they're survivors of trafficking but are yet still living in limbo. Now this judgment applies to all of those. And research shows that are over 956 people in that category identified in 2019 alone. So it's a large number of people who are living in the UK in limbo, and hopefully will now be granted leave to remain. But also, being granted

leave to remain means that they will be able to no longer have to live off of state benefits and can actually work. And Rights Lab, who's part of the Nottingham University, have actually conducted a cost benefit analysis on this. And it's actually shown that if survivors in this category were to be granted leave to remain, they would in fact assist the economy in terms of it would be a saving, but actually not only a saving, but a financial benefit in terms of the public purse. And in terms of your client, how long do you expect to know the upshot of this or how it could change her reality? Well, it has already because the fact that she has won this case now means that she will now hopefully be granted leave to remain, meaning there's no longer this thing being held overhead that she could be detained at any time. Because if you don't have lawful residence in the UK, you could be detained at any time by the Home Secretary. And that's already happened with our client. So if you have

that looming over your head while you're trying to recover, it's not going to assist. But we've already seen, and I spoke to her last week, and it's obviously providing you with some hope to assist in your recovery. And in terms of the decision on whether to appeal or not from the Home Secretary, of course, that's still pending. What will happen to somebody like your client if there is a decision to appeal? It'll mean that we'll have to await final determination on this issue. It'll depend because obviously, first, they have to be granted permission to appeal by the Court of Appeal because the High Court has granted it. So we'll find out this week if the Home

Secretary appeals and then subsequently they will then still need to be granted permission to appeal by first the High Court and then the Court of Appeal. If that's refused, the judgment stands. If it is granted permission, then we'll have to await final determination on this issue. Ahmed, I do thank you very much from the law firm Duncan Lewis. The Home Secretary has until tomorrow night to accept the ruling or appeal, as you say, so that decision pending. For the past few months, Woman's Hour has been following the work of the Salvation Army, which has the Home Office contract to support or confirm survivors of modern slavery in England and Wales. We've been given exclusive access to its services and its annual report

which shows that demand for its services is soaring. Our reporter Carolyn Atkinson is at a location in London where human trafficking survivors are being supported. Carolyn tell us more. Well in the UK right now this morning as we go about our mornings there are tens of thousands of people who are victims of modern slavery and many of them will have been trafficked now they're exploited and they're forced to work in all sorts of places and often the shocking thing is it's in plain sight it's in all the places many of us go to like cafes and restaurants and car washes and beauty salons but it can also be things like fruit and veg picking or working on building sites or cannabis farms as we just heard there

about that that woman and some are also very hidden away in family homes. They're working around the clock and they're being used as housekeepers and cooks and nannies and carers. So a whole range of different situations. Now, I'm in the back garden of this Salvation Army building where they support people who have escaped these traumatic and very horrific ideals. And these are not people, I should say, who've paid someone to come here. They have been conned and they've been coerced. Now, with me is Cathy Betteridge, the Director of Anti-Trafficking and Modern Slavery at the Salvation Army. And Cathy, today is actually Anti-Slavery Day. Now, your annual report warns of a rising number of victims, doesn't it, coming through your doors.

Now, in one way, that's quite positive because these are people who have escaped or they've been rescued, but it also shows that there's a huge rising number of victims who have a demand for your services. So in your report this year, what have you painted the picture of? Sure. I think what it highlights is the fact that although William Wilberforce many years ago obviously helped to abolish slavery, like your listeners just said, it's no longer just modern, it's current. So there are people who are still caught up in slavery.

And our report for the 10th year this year highlights the fact that our numbers are growing. So from our first year back in 2011, when we had 378 clients in our service, this year we've reported we have 2,662. So it's a 595% growth in the numbers of individuals coming into our specialist service. And we know also that you've had to put in, as it were, an extra 90 beds. That's at least 10 more safe houses. I mean, that really is quite a shocking rise in just six months of this year. Was that to do with

the pandemic or was it just happening anyway? Well, it was happening anyway, but obviously with the pandemic, we had to put in precautionary measures to make sure that if anybody was diagnosed with COVID, that they were protected. Thankfully, we didn't. We had people who were diagnosed, we had no fatalities, but we could then move them into somewhere that was safe. But it's also because the numbers are rising. And young Albanian women are the most exploited, aren't they? What are you seeing happening there? So for this year, again, that's the highest country of individuals coming into our service. So this year we've had 523 women.

What we're finding is that they are groomed into a relationship. They're tricked into believing that either they're going to marry somebody or they're going to live happily ever after, basically. Women don't have the high status in Albania, so they want to leave the country in many ways. And the organized criminals recognize that, so they target them. And they're all incredibly young, they're trafficked into the UK, and it's called the boyfriend route, isn't it, or the boyfriend method. Now listen what happened to this university student who we are calling Sara.

She was in her 20s. She was studying modern languages when she was trafficked from Albania by her supposed boyfriend. And she ended up here in a brothel. Now, despite the trauma, she said she wanted to talk to me because she is desperate to tell people what's happening. And I must warn you may find her story very upsetting. I've always loved studying. I've loved books. I've loved to learn about different cultures. Languages were a way for me to be closer to different cultures and to be able to express myself the way I wanted to. So books were something that I always enjoyed.

They made me feel better. They were like my best friend because I didn't have anyone, just myself at that time. After that, things went in a bad way. I tried to love someone. I trusted someone. And it came to a point that I decided to follow him to build our life together. But then things went completely wrong. I trusted the wrong person. I believed in the wrong person. And that person exploited me. he gave me the love and the words that I needed to hear

at that time and of course I believed because I didn't know anything better than that but he was he was tricking you yeah he lived in another country we went to that country first for like three days but he never sent me to his home but after he said do you want us to go to another country just so we can pass a few days together there it was like a tourist city and have a lovely time and after we can come back and just start our life from the beginning. And we went there to the second country. After we arrived there, two of his friends were waiting for me and for him there because we didn't have too much clothes with us, just my documents, his documents, which he had in hand, the documents, because I didn't know how to book. I never flied before or something.

So he took care of everything and he had everything. And we met his friends. And afterwards, we went to a nightclub because being young and, let's say, in love, after having a traumatic past from my family we drank all night and we danced after I don't even remember what happened because I was so drunk and I just want to sleep I remember when I woke up I'm sorry it's okay you know obviously you're talking freely um now yeah but we don't want to traumatize you in any any way sarah so but you were you were drugged and then i was raped by them and um i was they were all naked um and i was covered in bruises. It was very traumatic for me. I will never forget what

I've been through, but I was forced to go in a big lorry. I had guns in my head and I was forced not to speak or say anything or else he would shoot at me. He exploited me here in the UK. I was being kept in a house. I'm sorry. All by myself. And I was locked in a room where you couldn't see anything if it was day or night. I was all alone. The windows were covered by bars like in the jail it was very difficult for me I was being exploited so much in that house and after I don't know it was lucky for me that

I managed to escape from that house I was lucky because I knew how to speak English. People on the street helped me. So I ran away and I saw a bus station. I went inside the bus. The driver, I said to him, can I please come? I don't have any money with me, but I really need help. And yeah, he kindly said, please go inside relax don't worry don't don't think about it and I stayed in the bus and I was watching outside inside I was terrified I wanted to cry to scream but I didn't want to cause a scene. So I kept quiet. I was terrified at the moment,

but happy that still people were there. And if something bad happened to me, like the person will try and come and find me and kill me. At least they will see him and fight him. Well, that's Sarah. And the incredible kindness of one bus driver was the key to her being rescued and helped to get her life back on track. Now, she is still living in the safe house more than a year on. She has been recognised as a victim of trafficking now, and she's applied for asylum. But the gang that trafficked her is still thought to be at large. Now, Cathy, a key part of the operation you run is a largely unknown and unsung group of network of women

who are volunteer drivers. They're on standby, aren't they? Literally day and night, ready to pick someone up. How does that work? Yes, so we have a number of volunteers, both female and male, but in particular, they're highly trained. And so, for example, if somebody is rescued and they need to be moved from where they've been rescued to a place of safety,

I'll volunteer to hear drivers do that. And how often are they doing this? So they could be doing at least maybe one trip a day, one journey a day, but they're growing. So the last year we had 340 journeys over the whole year. And what we're finding, our clients will tell us, is that when they're picked up and they're met, it's the first time somebody's been kind to them,

it's the first time somebody's smiled, given them food, helped them just sort of sit in the back of the car and have their emotions, feeling safe, and that's been the key thing, they feel safe. Well, over the past few months, some of the volunteer drivers have actually been recording audio diaries of their journeys for Women's Hour and others recorded their thoughts when they got home. All are ready to head out and pick up anyone at any time. Okay we've had a call this morning from the Salvation Army. There's a new journey

coming. Do you think we could take a look? It also says it's a couple as well which is unusual it's saying it's central london to the north all ready to go well the client is an absolutely lovely young lady who has been sorely abused although we don't encourage sharing their stories in the car she did want to unburden herself a bit and is the victim of a forced marriage and the in-laws have been most cruel to her. So we've reaffirmed that she's done the bravest thing by being able to escape. We picked up a young lady from a hospital. They told us the lady had apparently been pushed out of the car door. She was no longer useful to them at eight months pregnant.

I was so angry when I heard that she had been abused and the traffickers had just gotten rid of her. I gave her a bag of toiletries, snacks, some water and a baby blanket so that baby could have something to snuggle up into and we wished her well. So just had a call from John, who's driving the first leg. We'll rendezvous at a service station. She speaks really good English

and her seven-year-old son is a real charmer, enjoying himself sat in the back of the car. On mum's phone, it's keeping him quiet apart from the giggles that we keep getting, which is lovely. They've just ordered their food. We're just going to get ourselves a coffee and sandwich and then hopefully we'll have them at the safe house

around about five o'clock, I guess. It seemed to go quite well, didn't it? It did. The lady was a bit anxious. I think that's the youngest one you've been with me for, isn't it? Yes, it is. Really young. I hope she eats something tonight. I was worried because she was so thin. Yeah. We picked up a terrified man. He was on methadone.

To help kick a drug habit, his traffickers had put him on to make him more compliant. He preferred to sit in the floor well of the car with his coat over his head until he had left the area. The police kept track of us for our safety and his, by phone, on our journey. Not one for the faint-hearted. We've heard that the lady is very

traumatised, so we will just endeavour to meet her with kindness and reassure her that she's going to a lovely safe house and the staff there are going to help and support her and help her to recover. Now, Cathy Betteridge, another shocking fact in your report, which might surprise quite a lot of people, is the second most trafficked group are people who are British nationals. What's happening? Yes, absolutely. Yes. So what we're finding is that younger people, so maybe between the ages of 18 and 24, are caught up in county lines. And we find that gangs involve them in criminal activity. So it's moving drugs across counties. Women in particular, because again, it's very like Sarah's situation.

They're coerced into a relationship and tricked into that, and then they have to perform criminal activities. And there are couples as well involved. Yes, yes. So we have a couple who were caught up in shoplifting. So they were given a shopping list, and they had to go into a shop and lift the various items and then take them back to their their um the gang member and so yes criminal activity in that way is is very very high now obviously the work you do is all to get good outcomes there are a lot of success stories in there i mean i know there was one example of a woman who'd been spotted in a cafe

i mean what can we do to spot this happening in front of us? Yes, so I would urge the public just to keep their eyes open. So, yes, this young woman, she was a student. She'd come into the country. She'd met up with somebody from her own country, from India, and she'd been asked to work in this cafe. And again, she'd been then monitored through CCTV. She wasn't allowed to go to the toilet. She wasn't allowed.

She had to stand the whole time. And the police actually then began to recognize that she was actually in danger. And so for us in these kinds of places, look out for somebody who might be malnourished, who might be seemingly being controlled, who might be, you know, activities in a residential area of a house where maybe there's comings and goings, which may not be normal. Report it to the police. Don't tackle it yourself report it to the police the police will then pick up that investigation okay kathy betteridge director of anti-trafficking and modern

slavery at the salvation army thank you um we did try to speak to the home office minister responsible about modern slavery about what the government was doing they said no but they gave us a statement saying human trafficking has absolutely no place in our society we are committed to stamping out this abhorrent crime whilst ensuring victims are protected and offenders prosecuted the uk it says has led the world in protecting victims of modern slavery and through the modern slavery victim care contract delivered by the salvation army we provide specialist support to help people rebuild their lives. Our reporter, Carolyn Atkinson, thank you very much for that

and for those many insights and a lot of you getting in touch to talk about how powerful and educational you found that. You've also been getting in touch throughout the programme and I do want to make sure I made some time to read

some of these wonderful messages about friendships and bonds across the political divide after we heard right at the start of the programme from the former Labour MP, Paula Sheriff, paying tribute to her friend, the Conservative MP, Sir David Amess, who was killed on Friday doing what he loved best in many ways, talking to his constituents. And they were poles apart politically, as she made no secret of, but they bonded as people, but also over his campaigning work with regards to women's health and endometriosis in particular

after it was raised to him by a member of his constituency, Carla. A message here in the morning, I just wanted to tell you about my lovely friend Bridget, who now lives in Belgium. We've known each other since we were students in 1983 and we have virtually nothing in common apart from that. Different faiths, different family circumstances, different politics and now different countries. In fact, I really can't think of much that we have in common. We rarely see each other. However, I hold her in my heart and I deeply value our friendship. I know we will be friends as long as we live. No idea why we are friends. We just are and always

will be. Another one from Tessa, who's got in touch this morning, who says, I am married to a stalwart conservative voter. I've been a member of the Labour Party all my life. Partnership goes far beyond political differences and we keep each other on our toes. I bet you do. Very diplomatically put and our proof that you can love each other completely while disagreeing about politics. And I love this one, especially from Suzanne. Thank you so much for all of these messages. Suzanne writes to say, my friend doesn't vote Labour while I am a regular door knocker for the party. One Christmas, she got me hand warmers with a note saying for canvassing, that's love. It is indeed, Suzanne, thank you so much for that. And a warming tale as it is.

And actually some stories, I should say, coming in about being in a cave. You know, I ask, you always deliver. And messages talking about keeping warm within caves and haptics as well. So, you know, it all comes through here. Amanda says, when my best friend and I were 15, we ran away from home together and went and lived in a cave for a few days on the beach in Melbourne.

We lived on potato chips and beer. That's great. And we kept our beers cold by putting them in rock pools with rocks on them to stop them floating away. Amanda, thank you very much for that. But I did tell you about a conversation we were going to have around farmers and their well-being, especially in light of what we've been hearing in the news recently. A shortage of butchers at industrial slaughterhouses has led to warnings that 10,000 pigs a week could be needlessly culled. While the National Pig Association has welcomed the government's announcement, which came through on Thursday evening, to offer temporary visas for 800 butchers to work in UK plants and a private storage aid scheme alongside a one-month pork levy holiday, they're still concerned that perhaps it's

too little too late, compounding the stress on farmers and those working in farming. My next guest's impassioned plea to Boris Johnson on BBC News went viral. That's the East Yorkshire pig farmer, Kate Moore. Good morning. Good morning. Thanks for joining us today. And I'm also joined by Alicia Chivers, who's the chief executive of the Royal Agricultural Benevolent Institution, which conducted a survey with Exeter University about mental well-being in agriculture, which found that women in farming are more likely to suffer from anxiety and or depression, and that the picture across the board was not one to perhaps boast about in many ways. Alicia, I'll come to you very shortly.

But Kate, let me start with you because you've, of course, I know that particular study was actually prior to some of these issues, but there's been a lot of stress in farming for some time. Your reaction, first of all, I suppose, to the news at the end of last week, does it alleviate the pressure? I don't think it completely alleviates it it's definitely a welcome some positive news definitely but we're still waiting on hearing the actual detail of it potentially too little too late. It could be that situation and I know you're busy morning. You've had a busy morning on the farm. Yeah, farming is 24-7. So, yeah, we never stop, really. Yeah. And I think what really struck a chord with people who may have seen or may not, they'll check it out afterwards, perhaps that clip, was that direct appeal from you to the prime minister to try and communicate the reality.

Yeah, I mean, it's desperate. I'm a farmer because i love animals and i love doing what i do but i'm doing it because it's to feed the nation there's a demand for my products um for boris johnson to completely misunderstand that killing pigs on farm to be wasted was totally different to killing them to go into the food chain and it was just. And it's been a really difficult two, three weeks. Kate, I'm so sorry. We've been let down slightly by technology there because your line's just coming in and out. While we fix that, let me go over to Alicia.

Alicia, good morning. Good morning. When you were looking into the stresses and strains in agriculture, what was it that particularly women were speaking about? Well, we have obviously identified an unfortunately low level of mental well-being across the board. But it was interesting, as you say, that women presented particularly poorly and there were clear differentials between the levels of depression and anxiety with women in farming, as opposed to men. And that was particularly differentiated in the age group 25 to 44, which is clearly sort of where you're looking at the child raising sort of status. And that sort of whilst, you know, it's a generalisation, but actually,

there are still very strongly held gender roles within the farming community. And often farming women on top of taking a direct or supportive role in the farm business, they are often dealing with very stressful paperwork. They're a confidant for the partner or spouse. And they're also often the primary caregiver. And I think that the survey has really given us an indicator as to how that basket of stressors is really impacting on women in farming. So, you know, if we look at the statistics, you know, around 48% of farming women who responded to our survey at that age group were probably or possibly depressed, and nearly two thirds were experiencing

relatively severe or moderate anxiety. And we need to think about how we can deal with that. And as you said, this is before the current crisis that that kate and those in the the pig sector are experienced at the moment and please let's not underestimate the emotional impact that this is going to have on on farming people in that sector of having to cull your livestock on farm alicia i'm hoping i can um bring up and get kate back on the line hello kate hi yeah i mean we were talking there just i don't know how much you could hear, but we were talking there about the stresses across the board and of course the isolation that can also go on, but the concern about your actual business being paramount there with women and men working in farming.

Yeah, I think the difference for farmers is the fact that it's our livelihood as well. We live where we work. And a lot in agriculture, we don't actually know how much we're going to get paid for a product that we're producing, be it an animal or a crop, until we actually harvest it. So we've put in a lot of the time, the effort, the money, and we have no idea how much we're going to get paid for that. It's quite a scary prospect. You do this with your sisters is that right yes that's correct and and how how is it uh you know with with you and and in terms of how you share that load and how you how you distribute that concern i suppose in some ways i think that i'm very fortunate that it's a family business because we can talk to each other and we can share the load, I suppose, exactly what you said.

But, yeah, we all look after different areas of the business. And so it does fall on different people depending on what the problem is. A message came in and we're talking about, you know, kindness, but there's also tough questions, I suppose, from Enda. Straight away when I mentioned your name and what's been going on. And the question was, could you ask the pig farmer why she is now complaining about the predicted outcomes of Brexit when she gleefully welcomed Brexit? Does she now regret her support for leaving the EU? Now, of course, I've got no idea how you voted. And I'm not sure this person does either. But there's a feeling there, certainly that some people are tapping into and I wanted to give you the chance to respond. I think that this is

something that came to light on Friday that people like to troll people on social media which is really unfair. Yes I did vote for Brexit but I can assure everybody that's listening that I did not vote for this. I voted for people to be more patriotic. I voted for the government to look after ourselves, to put border controls in. There's a number of things that I voted. I went to a number of meetings, nearly one a week. I was very educated in my vote. And I respect other people's vote and they should respect my vote. And I suppose on that point, when you say this isn't what you voted for, and of course, there's been a pandemic as well in this, but there are very specific issues related to Brexit. I don't have time to go into all of those now.

And that's not why you're here necessarily. But how does that play into what you feel about what's going on right now, bearing in mind how you did vote? You know, the pandemic has definitely played its part in this. The EU workers quite rightly want to go home. And actually, it's the processors that have had the problem. They didn't get their staff sorted. They knew they had 60% of EU people working in their factories. So it's completely out of my control. And actually, the new butchers that are coming, I've been told a lot on on social media why would eu people want to come over here well actually they're not coming from the eu they're coming from uh south america and asia the eu countries have got their economical country is a lot better than it was 10 years ago and so they've got jobs in their country

which is fair enough they They can sustain themselves there. Are you feeling any better this week, Kate? Yes, I am. There's still a huge amount of worry. We are nowhere near the end. We still don't know when these butchers are going to come. We don't know when the storage is going to open. You know, there's still going to be a lot of colleagues that do have to kill pigs on farm and that's just criminal and are you are you are you going to have to i've done a lot of work on it over the weekend and i'm hoping that we can juggle enough to not but it depends a lot on the detail

but this is ultimately about a pig's life this is not about brexit coronavirus or anything it is purely about a pig's life that I bred to feed the nation. Alicia, talking there, she hopes, Kate, she's made the changes to hopefully alleviate strain. And again, as I say, we don't have time to go into

those debates per se, but it's about the emotional backdrop that you were looking at that farmers are dealing with. And men are greatly struggling too. Absolutely. Across the board board we have higher levels of poor mental and physical well-being in the farming community and it's something that as

a community we know kate and everybody in in farming and around farming need to be part of the solution to this and actually even you know outside of that picking up something kate said very quickly um one of the stresses and on average, there were six stress factors. So whether that was, as I said, outside this crisis, Brexit is a part of that. But the average farming person is feeling stressed by at least six factors, one of which about 30 percent of our respondents included not feeling valued by the public around them. And I think that's where we can all have a part. There are lots of support organisations for people like Kate for their emotional wellbeing,

but actually everybody can play a really important part here of ensuring that you make the farming people around you feel valued. They are providing, they are another primary service provider. We cannot manage without them and they are not feeling supported by the British public. Alicia, we've got to leave it there. Alicia Chivers, Kate Moore, I'll let you get back to the farm. Thank you very much for your contributions. And to all of you, I'll be back with you tomorrow at 10. That's all for today's Woman's Hour. Thank you so much for your time. Join us again for the next one.

That's the moment it hit me. I'm like, oh my gosh, I think I'm in a cult. I used to think to myself, these people are mad, but until I realised that I'm mad as well. I'm Paris Lees, and this is The Flipside. In each episode, I tell two stories from opposite sides of the coin and use science to ask questions about elements of the human experience that we sometimes take for granted.

I know that we're genetically related, but in my mind I don't have the feeling that we are necessarily kin. My dad said, you know that we love you and I am your father, but... Subscribe to The Flipside with me, Paris Lees, on BBC Sounds. warning everybody. Every doula that I know. It was fake. No pregnancy. And the deeper I dig, the more questions I unearth. How long has she been doing this? What does she have to gain from this? From CBC and the BBC World Service, The Con, Caitlin's Baby. It's a long story, settle in. Available now.