WSJ Your Money Briefing - Why More CEOs Are Leaving Their Jobs

Episode Date: May 2, 2025

CEOs are leaving in record numbers— but some lower-level managers s ay they don’t want the headache that comes with the job. Wall Street Journal reporter Callum Borchers joins host Julia Carpenter to talk about what happens when companies can’t fill the C-suite. Sign up for the WSJ's free Markets A.M. newsletter. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Here's your money briefing for Friday, May 2nd. I'm Julia Carpenter for the Wall Street Journal. CEOs are leaving in record numbers. And once upon a time, there would have been tons of execs in training vying for the top job. But these days, some managers say they don't want the headaches, pressure, and work that come with it.

A lot of executives tell me they feel like they can't please anyone. They're always doing too much or too little, depending on whom you ask. And our culture has become a little less work-obsessed in recent years. That bleeds into the C-suite as well. So what are companies doing

to fix this broken talent pipeline? We'll talk with Wall Street Journal reporter Callum Borschers about the trickle-down effects of this CEO exodus. That's After the Break. Last year, 373 public company chief executives left their positions, according to challenger Gray and Christmas, a firm that tracks executive departures. But what does that mean for the rest of us? Wall Street Journal reporter Callum Borschers joins me. So Callum, I first want to ask, when we say these former CEOs left, do we mean they stepped down of their own accord or were they forced out?

We don't always know the real reason, Julia. You know, Andy Challenger, who's a senior vice president at the tracking firm that you just mentioned, tells me that his team tries to record the reasons for these CEO departures, but it's hard because as he notes, companies and executives often try to help each other save face in a breakup. So it can be hard to know who dumped whom, but whatever the reason, you know, the overall numbers are really striking. That tally of 373 public company CEOs leaving last year was a 24% jump over 2023.

And so the executives, recruiters, and coaches that I talked to say, this is not a pandemic phenomenon anymore. Something else is going on here. And in your story, you wrote that the last few years have brought challenge after challenge after challenge to corporate leadership. We have questions about artificial intelligence, threat of tariffs, fears of a possible recession.

So all of that chaos is happening. And then these execs are stepping down in the midst of it. Yeah, I mean, you mentioned some of the big reasons why they would want to head for the exits, Julia. I'll add a few more. I mean, layoffs take a toll on leaders too. It's not just the people who are getting the pink slips. I mean, nobody likes to be the villain.

DEI is another one. A lot of executives tell me they feel like they can't please anyone. They're always doing too much or too little, depending on whom you ask. And our culture has become a little less work-obsessed in recent years. That bleeds into the C-suite as well. I called up Blake Irving.

He's the former GoDaddy chief executive and asked if he's ever interested in getting back in the game, leading another company. And he was basically like, are you kidding me? I'm talking to you on my balcony in Mexico right now. He had just gotten off a board call. He says he spends about three quarters of his time there. He sits on a bunch of public company boards. He zooms into the meetings and he said, this is enough for me. I've got other interests. And he says more executives are making the same calculation now. So it's a sweet gig for them, but it complicates the leadership pipeline.

And then that means that them stepping down has repercussions for the other employees. You found in your story that some of the middle managers who would have once been ushered up that means that them stepping down has repercussions for the other employees. You found in your story that some of the middle managers who would have once been ushered up the career ladder are instead stalling out or calling it quits themselves. So what's happening there? It's one thing for the CEO who's already done it to go retreat to the beach, right? But it's another thing for the potential successors to go and do it early, but some are.

I met a financial manager in his 40s named Ryan Beyer, for example. He's moved his family to Puerto Rico. He was a principal at a wealth management firm in the DC area. He's the type of rising star who could be in the leadership pipeline, but he took a buyout, left early.

He's not retired. He's advising high net worth family offices. He says, look, I earned less than I used to, but I'm fine with that because I'm available for my kids' school pickups and drop-offs. I never miss a baseball game. And we're seeing more of these millennial and younger gen Xers dialing back their professional ambitions a little bit

in the name of work-life balance. You interviewed consultants and human resources professionals who said companies need to make these high ranking jobs more appealing. That way too many managers report high stress as it is, even when they're not in the C-suite. What could companies do to fix that talent problem? Now, Liska Fernandez at McLean & Company told me these are relatively new conversations with their corporate clients. How do we make these jobs appealing? Because in the past, it was a given that plenty of candidates would be clamoring for those top jobs. They haven't solved the problem yet, but she said a big strategy is trying to keep managers workloads reasonable and or making sure

that the pay matches the responsibility. Companies run into problems when they offer, let's say, a 10% pay increase for a promotion that comes with 30% more work. More people now are liable to say, no, thanks, that math doesn't add up for me. And if these companies don't fix the CEO talent problem, how could that affect employees at all other levels? I guess we're more stuck with bad bosses. I mean, that sounds sort of cheeky, but there's always somebody who's willing to be in charge.

And I think the question is whether it's somebody you'd actually want to work for. So when the people who have great leadership potential opt out, the employees who are left to be in charge. And I think the question is whether it's somebody you'd actually want to work for. So when the people who have great leadership potential opt out, the employees who are left to be managed by the alternative could lose out. So we don't have the stats on CEO exits in 2025 yet, but learning what you did working on this story, what do you expect to see? Well, the early trend line for this year is even higher than it was last year. So I just don't see any evidence that the CEO departures are slowing down. The level of economic uncertainty today is similar to what it was five years ago, early in the pandemic. But the difference

seems to be that back then, companies and executives were reluctant to make a leadership change. They wanted that steady hand at the wheel, some kind of consistency in the middle of that storm. And that doesn't seem to be the case so much today. So if a corporate board doesn't think the CEO is up for this moment, or if the boss wants out, there's probably going to be a change at the top. That's WSJ reporter Callum Borschers. And that's it for your money briefing. Tomorrow, we'll have our weekly markets wrap up, what's news in markets. And then we'll be back on Monday. weekly markets wrap up what's news in markets and then we'll be back on Monday. This episode was produced by Zoe Culkin and Anthony Bansi. I'm your host Julia Carpenter, Jessica Fenton and Michael Laval wrote our theme music.

Our supervising producer is Melanie Roy. Aisha El-Muzlim is our development producer. Scott Salloway and Chris Dinsley are our deputy editors. And Philana Patterson is the Wall Street Journal's head of news audio. Thanks for listening.