WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1001 - Aidy Bryant

Episode Date: March 14, 2019

Aidy Bryant only recently felt like she could tap into her inner rage. She remains a wonderfully nice person and hilarious performer, but with things like her new show Shrill and other mental adjustments, Aidy feels like she’s taking ownership of some righteous anger. She has that in common with Marc, as well as the fact that they both cry while watching TV all the time. They talk about those shared traits as well as Aidy’s early love of improv, her path to Saturday Night Live, and breaking away from letting things like weight and body image dominate her life. This episode is sponsored by Stay Free: The Story of The Clash on Spotify. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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It's winter, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs, mozzarella balls, and arancini balls? Yes, we deliver those. Moose? No. But moose head? Yes. Because that's alcohol, yes we deliver those moose no but moosehead yes because that's alcohol and we deliver that too along with your favorite restaurant food groceries and other everyday

essentials order uber eats now for alcohol you must be legal drinking age please enjoy responsibly product availability varies by region see app for details all right let's do this how are you what the fuckers what the fuck buddies what the fucking ears what the fucking delics what's happening i'm mark maron this is my podcast wtf welcome to it how's it? Thank you for all the feedback on the 1000th episode of WTF. There's been tremendous amount of feedback, emails, tweets, all kinds, you know, I don't have Facebook anymore, but maybe there's Facebook posts, but just tremendous feedback and we're so glad you liked it. Once we posted it, I was a little uncomfortable with the raw emotion that i

experienced but uh you know i've done that here before so i i was okay with it and uh none of you made fun of me but i'm glad you enjoyed it and if you're just coming on board for wtf i will tell you this uh you can listen to all the archives of the show ad free with a stitcher premium subscription just go to wtfpod.com and click on the premium link so you know if you if you are new to the show and the thousandth episode moved you and you're like what about these other 950 that's how you can listen to them no ads not a bad deal did i mention today on the show ad bry Bryant is here and it was great. I love her. I think she's funny. I think she's got a very unique sensibility. I think it's very, there's something very honest about the way she is funny. I love her. I love her. And she's got

this great new show on, which it's called Shrill. And I watched all of them and I was excited to watch all of them and talk to her about it. But yeah, I'll be talking to her in a few minutes. What else do I need to get you up to speed on? I feel like I need to get you up to speed on some stuff. It's been a while. If it sounds slightly different in here, it's because I'm re-emptying my garage space because I need to tear it apart. I need to tear it apart. It's a sad thing, but I need to do, I need to get this work up to code in here. So I will probably be moving the podcast into the house proper in the upcoming weeks.

It'll be interesting. Now it's a, I mean, I'm going to set up shop in a room. It's not going to be like, yeah, this is my house. Yeah, we're just going to go hang out, you know, on the couch. And yeah, I've done podcasts like that before, actually, but it's not going to be quite that. But I don't know if you're even going to be perceptive enough to hear the difference.

But, you know, it has been sort of a chore to get everything re-emptied so i did we did the a thousandth uh one thousandth episode and i didn't uh really tell you what was going on i went to um south by southwest last weekend for the premiere the movie that uh i'm in and that uh lynn shelton directed i'm in it with michaela watkins jillian bell john bass toby huss dan baxdall uh some other people uh it it premiered it premiered at south by southwest and i i was the lead guy i don't know why i don't i didn't really realize that when uh when i shot the movie maybe i did i don't know why I didn't really realize that when I shot the movie. Maybe I did. Maybe it sort of trimmed down in the way it came edited.

I don't know, but I'm the main guy in the movie. So I was the lead in a comedy, an improvised comedy film. It was an ensemble cast, but I think, maybe I'm just saying that, but I think it was kind of about me. No, it's a very funny movie. Here's the thing about this. You know, we shot that thing, I think you remember, when I was in Birmingham, Alabama.

And we shot it inside like a couple weeks. And it was hot and it was intense because you're improvising everything. I play a pawn shop owner. And it was intense because you're improvising everything. I play a pawn shop owner. And it's kind of a comedy caper that revolves around an artifact that is brought into my pawn shop by a lesbian couple. That if it is what it is, could change everyone's entire perception of history. It's sort of a, I think it's a relevant movie about truth and not truth about conspiracies and about, uh, about, uh, you know, the, the things that divide us

currently, but it's not heavy handed anyway. That's really the, the story is a little wacky. So, you know, don't, don't get alienated, but you won't because you can't see it anywhere yet. But, uh, I think the point of, of, of what I'm trying to say here is I've never been to a movie premiere, really, of a movie that I'm in because I've really not been in many movies. And I had watched the film on my computer. So there we are in Austin at a big theater. It's a premiere. It's a packed theater. And the movie starts and it's getting laughs from the get-go. I mean, real laughs. I even laughed because I'd never seen it before. I didn't know what I knew what I did. And I couldn't, you know, you don't laugh at home when you're watching something by yourself too often. And I was too

self-conscious to do that anyways, because I was so preoccupied with my own performance when I was watching it at home on my computer. But we're sitting in a theater, me and the cast and Lynn, and the thing's fucking getting big laughs. And I've never really felt that before. I've never, it was pretty, pretty great, folks. It's a pretty, it's a pretty sweet movie. And it's very engaging.

And it was exciting because, I mean, I do kind of a heavy monologue in the middle, and I got choked up at me doing a monologue that was making me choke up. Yeah, that's weird, right? It's got to be some new narcissism. I made myself cry by watching me on the screen. And the whole experience was good. The reviews have been pretty great. And we all had fun in Austin.

I went out to Opie's. And I surprisingly did not overdo it. But even what I did do hobbled me. I was meat hobbled. Like I ate a couple nice slabs of brisket, about three or four pork ribs, the cream corn business they got going over there. I had some green beans and some butter beans, and they got the sides of the white onion, pickles, jalapenos. I did that. I felt like that was manageable.

It wasn't. And then over at Opie's in Spicewood, Texas, she's got the, they added a pecan cobbler. Are you fucking out of your mind? Are you kidding me? Pecan cobbler. It's like pie, but better. In a little single serving pecan deep dish.

Pecan cobbler. With a scoop of Blue Bell vanilla ice cream on it. And the cobbler is hot. So you get it after you've eaten all the meat. And you're just watching that vanilla ice cream melt a little into the little bumpy grooves on the top of the cobbler and you just put that first bite in your mouth and you almost cry because it's so good god damn it so yeah i did that one day and then we did a lot of press we We did Leonard Maltin's show.

Lynn Shelton and myself did the Leonard Maltin podcast. And it's kind of interesting to impress with a bunch of wacky people. But we had a good time. And I'm very proud of the movie. And I hope that everybody gets to see it soon. Someday, folks. Someday you will see Sword of Trust. I promise you. See it soon? Someday, folks. Someday you will see Sword of Trust.

I promise you. And when we do get it planted somewhere, I will play the piece of music that Tal Wilkenfeld and myself composed for the movie. I want to play that soon. Why don't I have that now? Why can't I just play that now? All the music in the film is is by uh me it just worked out that way because as you know if you listen to this show i've got a few hundred uh guitar noodles guitar riffs little things i do at the end and some of them just fit perfectly because it's down

south it's kind of hot and it's you know a lot of the things that I play kind of got a swampy blues feel, you know, that thing. So Lynn was able to kind of layer in a lot of the music that I composed here in the moment for you people. That may have sounded just like me sitting in my garage playing by myself, which it was. That was exciting. It was an exciting, good experience. Did I mention I ate pecan cobbler hot with vanilla blue bell ice cream melting on its top?

Oh, man. So, Aidy Bryant. Aidy Bryant. What a gem. She's a gem. I really always love her on Saturday Night Live, and she's still on Saturday Night Live. It's her seventh season.

But in her show, her new show, this new show, which is Shrill, that premieres tomorrow, March 15th on Hulu, all the episodes will be up to stream. And I did that already because I got special access to him so I could talk to her about it. But she's really stretching out a little bit. You know, she's really acting. The character is tremendous.

She's bringing everything that she has to it, her humor. And there's a depth to it too. There's a real range in this thing. And I was proud of her because I love her. I think she's great. And the show is funny. It's touching. It's relevant.

It's real shit, you know. It really was good. It's a good show. And I was happy to talk to her. So this is me talking to A.D. Bryant. You can get anything you need with Uber Eats. Well, almost almost anything. tour. So this is me talking a special 5 p.m. start time on Saturday, March 9th at First Ontario Centre in Hamilton. The first 5,000 fans in attendance will get a Dan Dawson bobblehead

courtesy of Backley Construction. Punch your ticket to Kids Night on Saturday, March 9th at 5 p.m. in Rock City at torontorock.com. So, nice glasses. Oh, thank you. Thank you so much. You don't come out here too often, eh? I mean, you know, here and there.

Yeah? I do. Yeah, but I don't know. Do you like it? I do. Yeah. I love it. Like, I know, here and there. Yeah? I do. Yeah, but I don't know. Do you like it? I do. Yeah. I love it. Like, I like to drive and...

You didn't drive here. I saw that you were driven here. Well, that's because I didn't get a car this time around, but yeah. You usually rent a car? Yeah, I do. Yeah. It's fun, right? I like it.

That's like, I grew up like driving around. Me too. Yeah, it's part of it. How long have you been in New York? Only like when I got SNL is when I moved so seven years. It's weird when you grow up driving and I think you grew up somewhere near me. Where'd you grow up? Arizona. Yeah I grew up in New Mexico. I know we're desert people. Yeah full-on desert people. My brother's in Phoenix. Really? Yeah that's where I'm from. My ex-wife's from Phoenix. Whoa. Yeah. I spent a lot of time in Phoenix.

You buried some bones in Phoenix. I did. Well, yeah. I broke some hearts and pissed off some parents. You and me both. Were you born there? Yeah. Really?

Mm-hmm. Did you go to Arcadia? No. Oh. No. I went to an all-girls Catholic high school that's near there, kind of. definitely a whole different type of person to like when you grow up with that in the desert. It's nice, right? I love it.

Yeah. And I love to go back. Do you go back to New Mexico? I do. I go back to New Mexico and I go to Phoenix occasionally to see my bro. And I work and I do shows sometimes in Phoenix. Yeah. Yeah.

But like, so how big of a family? I mean, just my brother and my parents. That's it? Yeah. So it's just the four of you? Yeah. Yeah, but like, so how big of a family? I mean, just my brother and my parents. That's it? Yeah. So it's just the four of you? Yeah. Yeah?

It was so nice. Are you really Irish? Kind of, yeah. Yeah? I think my dad's side of the family is way more Irish and I just like took on

all their traits. Well, just going by the name, I wasn't judging the traits. Oh, well, the traits are there too. What are the traits? I'm 50% potato. I'm like bright red all the time.

If I start drinking, I can't stop. Like all those gorgeous. I'm aggressively hard worker like until I die. Yeah. You got that too? Yeah, where I'm like I'll stay I'll stay keep plugging away you guys head home or that kind of thing oh so the the uh the that's the sort of fine line between hard worker and martyr yes you're like I'm good I'll do all of your work too

my pleasure absolutely but what so but you're telling me your brother what he's what is he what doesn't he got the same thing i feel like he swung the opposite way and now he just is like i'm going to madrid for three months and i'm gonna like run my bank account to zero and then the searching man yeah like i i wish i had more of that because i was like i'm gonna just i don't know work grind until i sleep yeah what what's but what is he, is he older or younger? Younger. Oh, yeah. So like in his 20s still or no?

Yeah, he's 25. Oh, so he's got, yeah. I mean, he's just going to go waste a few years. Yeah, he's cool. He's an off the grid guy? Yeah, in a very cool way that I am like truly the opposite of. And I wish, I think we probably are like there's a middle ground between us that's a lot healthier but you guys are close yeah super close that's

nice yeah and your folks are still around and out there yeah they're in Phoenix yeah what do they do um my mom has a store yeah that's like kind of a clothing gift store, but it's very popular in Phoenix. Very cool. It's been voted best boutique something like 15 years in a row. What's it called? Let's give it a plug. Oh, Francis Baby.

Everybody in Phoenix knows it, and they've got to go. It's called Francis Baby? No, just Francis. I was trying to be like, I don't know, give it a nasty plug. No, I liked it. It was good a nasty plug. No, I liked it. It was good. Thank you. Francis, a boutique.

How long she had that place? I think like almost 12 years, 13 years. My mom had a dress store. Really? For a while. Yeah. It's a lot of work. What do they sell there?

Like candles and cool jewelry and like artist stuff. Oh, crafts. You know. Sure, I do. So she's got a, she goes to market. Oh, yeah. And does the thing like out here. She does the whole thing, yeah.

Yeah, and finds stuff for the boutique. She's shopping, baby. That's nice. It's really nice. And like people really love it there. And it's, it is like, it was the first kind of like cool store in Phoenix, I feel like. And then like when she opened it, it was next to like one record store. There was like nothing else around.

And now there's tons of stuff all around there. And like she organizes all these cool like community events. And like, yeah, it's very cool. She's cool. She sounds like a pretty hip mom. Yeah, totally hip mom. Very cool mom. And then, yeah, my dad was a real estate agent.

And he did like historic homes like downtown Phoenix. Like Frank Lloyd Wright homes? Yeah, kind of that stuff, but also these cool, almost 1940s bungalows that are in downtown Phoenix, weirdly. Yeah, downtown Phoenix, is that starting to happen? I think it's kind of starting to happen. When I lived there, it was not happening. Yeah. I go down there.

I stay down there because there's a new club down there a club, new club down there, Stand Up Live. Oh, yeah, yeah. And, like, I never get the feeling that it's happening. I think it's trying to happen, and it's probably maybe happening in certain patches. Right. But, yeah. The patches. Yeah.

The three stores and that block. Totally. Yeah, those are the pioneers. Yeah, they've come, and they're going to turn it all around. I mean, it happens so what what is the uh the funny situation like you're but your parents are like so they're not like crazy catholics or anything no no they're just sort of like nice nice desert people desert folk yeah but they didn't come from there too did they they? Well, my mom is from New Mexico, like you.

Really? Yeah, Tucumcari. Tucumcari. I know. She must be one of the few people from there. It is like my entire family is from Tucumcari. You go to Tucumcari to visit? I have been to Tucumcari multiple times.

I don't think I've been to Tucumcari. And that's fair. But it's in some songs. Yes. And I think I've driven through it, but I have no picture of it. I think in the 70s, when most of my family was living there, it was a lot different, and now it's kind of a truck stop. Yeah.

How was it different? Was it a hippie truck stop, or was it a bigger town? I don't know. I think it was just some Americana-like kind of stuff. So your grandparents are there? No, they're in Arizona now. Everybody. Everybody. Yeah.

Everybody came down to the big city. Yeah. So no one's in Tucumcari. No, no. And where's your old man from? Chicago? He's from Columbus, Ohio. Yeah, it's America, man.

You got it. I'm from the thick of it. And so you have grandparents and family in Columbus? Yeah, a little bit. Yeah? Yeah. So you go to Ohio occasionally? You know, I drop in for a funeral and that kind of thing.

Yeah. Good to see everybody at either the happy thing or the wedding. Yes, totally. Or the sad thing, the funeral. Those are my Ohio memories completely. Those are it. Yeah. That's it, yeah.

Well, we're here to bury so-and-so. We're here because your cousin is getting married. 100%. Yeah. So tell me about this Catholicolic school situation outfits oh yeah the outfits were happening well i went to public school my whole life and then the high school that i was supposed to go to was like i think literally like arizona schools were rated like 50th in the nation and it was that bad yeah and so we kind of like scraped it together and i went

to this very fancy high school where like john mccain's kids went to oh like that kind of fancy yeah yeah yeah and like not not where i had been so you ever so you were you were fighting it out in the public schools of phoenix yeah well i mean not that it was like crazy but it was it was just like a crazy shift where like my high school had like a right to life club and stuff like that and they would like bus girls to abortion clinics yeah to protest on Fridays and stuff and like you know that was not not my scene so so junior high was normal yeah totally normal were you doing any um theater uh I mean can you even call it theater I I don't know. But yeah, like little pageants or something.

Really? Well, more like skits. You did skits in junior high? I did like theater camps and stuff like that. You did? Yeah. So that was always your thing, your interest? Kind of, yeah.

But I was always like, this doesn't feel that great. I don't know. But no one was making you do it. I guess, again, it's like that Irish worker. I was like, well, I can't be just swimming in the summer. I got to do my programs or whatever. Yeah. But that was the thing you gravitated towards.

Yeah. I always liked it. And I could get people to laugh at me and get attention, which, how nice. So you've been doing that your whole life? I think, I mean mean a little bit yeah no sports no other i mean i dipped my toe in the pool but it wasn't i was always just like the weird like i actually i was just talking about this with my friend how briefly in seventh grade i was on like a very hot softball team that they were like winning the championship and i was just

also there yeah and how like what a hell that was because everyone was hitting home championship and I was just also there yeah and how out like what a hell that was because everyone was hitting home runs and I was just like bouncing around and being like when's the cake coming like I just really shouldn't have been there oh really but you were there for what a whole season yeah like here and there I feel like my parents would be like you should try this or try one of those did you you didn't hit anything? No. No. No. Did you get up to bat? Yeah.

I mean, I had to stand there and watch them throw the balls. Like, it was not for me. So were the other girls mad? I'm sure. I'm sure I was not well-liked for that. Dead weight on the big team? 1,000%. But, like, still got all the trophies and the medals that these young women had earned. Did you hang them in your room?

I mean, I think I had them in a box or something. Did you feel shame about your part in it? I just knew I didn't belong there. Yeah. More than shame. I was like, I shouldn't have been involved in this at all. Yeah. So you didn't show them off proudly saying, yeah, I am a sports person. No. All right.

So you go to theater camp and that's where the oddballs are. Yeah. A little bit. You know, that's, I was like, this feels better than the sports. Yeah. What is it about it? I don't know if, I think I've talked to a few people that went to theater camp, but it seems like people who, I don't know, there's just people around singing. Yeah. Right? Yeah. And just like being dumb. Like, you know, you're just like singing and doing weird like vocal warmups, even though you're 14.

Right. You know, it's just. But the bully factor is less. I don't think. God. Yeah. Yeah. It seems like a refuge.

Yeah. I think it's like everybody's trying something. Right. There. But it's like the kids who at regular high school have to walk with their head down in the halls, go to theater camp, and they open up. Yeah. But you were funny, so you probably didn't take that much shit, did you? I wasn't, no.

I like made it through school okay. Like I had friends and I participated in stuff. You weren't like a weirdo. No. I mean, I was voted most unique in high school, but it was like me and two goth girls that were also there. And I was like, oh, this is like kind of a burn. It's not like cool unique.

It's like you're a freak. That was at the Catholic high school? Well, good. Yeah, thank God. Yeah, you don't want to blend in there. Totally. So wait. Okay, so by the time you get to high school, how Catholic was it?

You had to wear the skirts. Yellow skirts and stuff. And it was all girls. Sweaters, yeah. And nuns? Nuns were there. But were you brought up with any religion? No, not really.

They just wanted you to go because it was a good school. Yeah, it was just a really good school. So you had to suck it up and take a bunch of Jesus? Yeah, 100%. Yeah, and I would go to mass and be like, whoa, what is this? Everyone's going up and down and all the little sayings. The outfits. The whole thing, top to bottom.

The pageantry. I was like, this is is wild they had something at my high school called liturgical dance i don't know if you know what that is but it's like it's truly like basically i mean in my case it was like 14 year old girls with braces dressed in sort of like ghostly robes like doing physicalizations of biblical stories but like danceified and then watching it i like, this is psychotic. Like, I can't even fathom that this is for worship. Like, it was...

It's a thing? Yes. Liturgical dance is a thing. Like a tradition, an age old... I don't know if that or if it was just like, here's a thing for high school girls to do to pray or something. Where's that SNL skit? I know.

The liturgical. How is that not? There you go. Was it going to happen now? Did I just pitch? And maybe it'll. I need. You need pitches?

I need bits. I've been there so long. I'll take any bits you can give me. So was there theater there? Yeah, there was theater there. But the thing that I was doing more than theater there was like I started doing like a teen improv group. So how did you know about improv? Oh, from theater camp.

Yeah, theater camp. You learned improv. That's the first thing I saw that I was like, that's my shit. What were they doing at seventh grade theater camp? Ooh. Long form? Absolutely not. Little like short form riddle games, you know know and that kind of thing but you you you

knew like that's the answer well yeah and then also like when i was in high school i was doing improv in like a teen group where like the ages were like 12 to 17 and so of course when i was like 17 years old i was like i'm fucking good yeah like i was like these are 12 year olds and i'm like i have an high school education of course i was like, these are 12 year olds. And I'm like, I have a high school education. Of course, I was like the star of every show we had. And I think it gave me like an inflated sense of my talent or something. Yeah. Well, that's good, though. No, it was good. It really like it made me like, oh, this is my thing. I got to go do this. Yeah. An inflated sense of your talent is necessary in order to nurture that talent into, you have to be delusional in order to

kind of have the ambition to pursue this. Yes. And like as a teen girl, I was like, I don't have any of the stuff for a teen girl like on lock. But I was like, but this, I am good. And it's a rarefied thing. Yeah. There's not like national teen girl improv competition.

Yeah, totally. And also, like, theater, I don't know, theater always felt, like, a little self-serious to me. And, like, kind of, like, the people participating in it were, like, actual dorks. Yeah. Where, like, improv dorks, I was like, at least they're funny. Yeah. You know? Like, I don't know. You don't want to be around the actual dorks. I was like, at least they're funny. Yeah. You know, like, I don't know.

You don't want to be around the actual dorks. No, I want to be around like the wacky dorks. Yeah. That makes sense to me. Still friends with any of your high school people? Yes, two. From the group? Yeah, that just like we held each other to make it through.

And yeah, we're still friends. And are they in show business? Oh, no, no, not at all. They're just people doing their life? Yes, of course. In Phoenix? Yeah, one works for like the State Department and the other is like a painter. Oh, that's nice.

Yeah. Painter, she stayed with it. Yes, totally. The creative saddle. Absolutely. State Department in DC? Mm-hmm. Ah, that must be. Yes, totally. The creative saddle. Absolutely. State Department in D.C.? Mm-hmm. Ah, that must be.

Yeah, yeah. Well, he did work for the State Department, but now he's no longer. Yeah, he was out. They pushed him out? I think that was part of it. Yeah. Also, did he want to stay? No.

No, no. No, they're just trying to gut the State Department altogether, but we don't need to do that. No, this is not for us to take on right now. No, I can't take it on at all. No. So, okay. So then you graduate high school and you're an improv wizard. And you have an inflated sense of your talent.

Absolutely. You're a genius probably. In my mind, yeah. An improv genius. An unknown improv genius. Yes. Where do you take that? known improv genius where do you take that well so like one of my high school like improv coach people that i had was like there's this place in chicago called io where you can go and like

take real classes and like do this as more of a thing and so i was kind of like that's where i gotta go chicago yeah so you just bypassed college? No, I went to college. Where? In Chicago. Ah, but that was the plan. That was part of the plan. But Northwestern?

God, no. I went to like an artsy school for dummies kind of. I mean, I love it, but it's called Columbia College. I've heard of Columbia College. It's a cool school because they truly let you take classes like in all different arts and disciplines and they really encourage you to like do productions in the city or like do, you know,

yeah, whereas like almost all the other Chicago theater-y stuff, it's like very, like you only work at our school and like just conservatory kind of stuff. But like, did you go there because you didn't get good grades no i got good grades at a fancy school but i had been like just doing this insanely academic stuff in my high school

yeah that was like at a certain point i was just like this sucks you know and i want to like yeah like i don't want to say an artist but i was like i want to i want to like be like, I don't want to say an artist, but I was like, I want to, I want to be a creative person around creative people. And so I went to a school that was really, and I'm still friends with a lot of people who are designers and whatever that I met in college and they've worked on things I've worked on and it's been the best. That's great. Yeah. It was amazing.

It's nice to know that. So like you didn't go in going like, let me get a communications degree. No. You knew like, I'm going to be this. Yeah, I wanted to. I didn't know if it would happen. I just knew. I just was like, I want to be smart.

I don't want to take any business classes, but I'd like to be a smart person. Yes. Of course. Yeah. So I'll get a full liberal arts and just charm my way through it. Yeah. And not remember much of anything except a few poems. But that, what a nice thing to know.

Yeah. And appreciate some movies. Great. But what a nice thing to know. Yeah, and appreciate some movies. Great. But I don't pretend to know more than I know. I feel like you know a lot, though. Yeah, yeah, but there's a limit to it. Yeah, but I guess that's normal. I wish I had the guts to be more. Like, I did plays and stuff, but I don't know.

Like, I was always pretty terrified to be on stage in too vulnerable a way. That took, like, years, decades decades i'm so surprised just as a fan of your work i see you as like a vulnerable but for years performer yeah but for years it was just angry yeah yeah but that there's something like i am very uncomfortable showing anger because i'm like that's not in my deal you know like why is that i don't i think it's like probably socialized for women in a lot of ways that it's like not pretty or cool or acceptable to be mad you know do you ever rage out i'm starting to occasionally rage and it feels so good because i think it's been like pushed down for a long time. But it seems like, because I watch your show.

Uh-oh. No, I watch all of it. Oh. I liked it. I like you. Oh, thank you. I think you're funny. I like you.

And I get moved. Oh, that's nice. I'm moved by your being. Thank you. God. But the thing is, I just wonder, just because of the nature, I know that the character on the show is not fundamentally you. No, but I helped write it, and it's definitely, there's threads in there that I'm like, yeah, that's me. Yeah. Well, I always wonder, though, because you seem like sort of the people pleaser thing, the martyry kind of like, I'll do it, like that whole thing.

That to me, like, I always wonder just how like i'll do it like that whole thing that to me like i always wonder just how much rage comes from living like that yeah so much so so much but i can smile my way through a lot of anger which is that's fucked up yeah but like what is that why why what was like how do like what was it what that you were growing up with that like what is that why why what was like how do you like what was it what that you were growing up with that like what do you think it comes from i don't know because i i also feel like my parents are both very even-keeled like never raised their voice at me never liars i mean it was like if i got in trouble it was like we sat down we talked about it it was like you know we're disappointed or those and like that kind of thing hit me deeply you know of course the

disappointed thing is the worst yes it's like in your bones just yell at me just yell at me but there is something like sort of that's like slow down think about it talk about it but it doesn't always maybe allow for you to like have that visceral anger which i feel like only maybe in the last like five years have I been like oh what is that in the back of my bones that feels like a fire you know and wants to say fuck you yes yeah oh good well I'm glad that's happening thank you it feels so good yeah but I like I would think that like when you're doing improv though like like you didn't find one that could yell and scream uh i mean yeah i'm sure i did i i definitely have and i feel like part of what improv did was

like it gave me it put me in the driver's seat a little bit where i was much used to like just kind of being like yes sir thank you i will do. And what a joy for me. And wow. And woo. And like, and like for improv, it was like, no, I write what I say in the moment. And like the audience kind of has to eat it. And like, I liked that feeling or like, you know, being in control. Like. It's the best.

It's also the best to generate like that. Because I mean, that's how I generate my stand up where all of a sudden you surprise yourself. You're like, that came out of my face. Totally. I just said that. Where did generate my stand-up, where all of a sudden you surprise yourself. You're like, that came out of my face. Totally. I just said that. Where did that come from? Yeah. It is like it's very, there's such an ease to it when it's easy.

And what a nice ride that is, you know? So you're at Columbia College and you're majoring in improv? In acting. Yeah, because they didn't have like a comedy improv sketch major now i think they do which is insane to me but yeah well i think your generation kind of turned the entire uh structure of the comedy entertainment business to around yeah like you know it's sort of interesting the chicago thing yeah like how like for a while there, it was all about standups. And then all of a sudden it was like,

no, these people that, that work with other people, they're more well adjusted and funnier and they have a little more control over their talent. Oh my, I don't know. I feel like there's a good in both,

you know? I mean, and like, I, I definitely, the thing that I think I got out of going to Chicago first, rather than maybe going to like New York or LA is I. is I really did just go there because I loved improv. And I wasn't like angling like, OK, and then I'll get on SNL and whatever.

I really that was like especially coming from Arizona. It was just like, that's not part of the dream. Like, I just want to do this stuff, you know. And and I feel like having like, you know i was in chicago seven years where i just did shows every night of the week but you were there like that's including college yeah because during college i would like go school go to school during the day and then like at night i would go do improv or sketch or whatever so when you studied acting though like what did what how did that help i mean did you do like were you into it? No.

Like, I didn't like it really, you know? I mean, I never, like, auditioned for a play in college. I never, like, did any. How do you major in acting and not? Because I was doing shows, like, out for real audiences in Chicago. I know, but isn't that part of you getting a grade to be in a play? Yeah, you would think, but I don't know. I made it through.

Yeah. Were you able to use your nightlife as a credit? A little bit. I mean, like, it was really nice that by the time, like, I finished school, I was occasionally getting paid to perform comedy, like, you know, around Chicago or doing touring shows and that kind of thing. So I did get like, I think like some internship credit or something for like the touring stuff. Well, that's good. Yeah. All right.

So you go and you're like, when do you, how do you first venture out? Like what, like how does that happen? Like in Chicago? Yeah. Yeah. From college, you know? Well, I was like, you know, in school with a bunch of theatery people and so i was like i'm gonna go take classes at this place at io and a couple friends joined me and then that's improv

olympic yeah and then so that's kind of where i started and i like got on a improv team there when i finished but not second city no i never not no i never really like took the classes there or did their, like the way you go up their ladder. Did you see shows there? No. Really? Weirdly, no, I didn't. I mean, I, the. You're an IO person.

I was like an improv person. I wasn't really doing sketch in that same way. Towards, you know, like the end of my college time, I started doing shows at the Annoyance Theater, which is like a little more sketchy and it's a little more writing stuff. With Sedaris? Uh-huh. Yeah. So like. They started it, right? Who started it?

Well, Mick Napier started it. Mick Napier. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he like directed Amy Sedaris' one-woman show. And he like, you know, he taught many, and me included included, was a huge teacher of mine and helped me so much. I remember him. I just talked to Amy. Oh, really?

Yeah. I just saw her at the airport. Just now? Well, a couple days ago. Yeah, I interviewed her. She's wonderful. Yeah, she is. Truly like no one else like her and a true artist's mind.

But yeah, she brought up annoyance. Yeah, because I knew like that crew that did the Exit 57 sketch show, I think were a lot of annoyance people. Yeah. Like I think they were all from there. I mean, the cool thing for me that was cool about the annoyance was like it was very like punk rock. Like when I was starting there, it was like, whoa, this is not like second city. It's not this like polished sketch. It's like almost veering in the world of performance art.

Like it purposely trying to be disgusting sometimes. And like, what was the angle? Did they have a manifesto? Was there a method? I don't know. And I would hate to paraphrase, but I,

I would say it was like, sort of like take care of yourself and like make the audience eat it a little bit. Like, just like be bold and like make the audience eat it a little bit. Like just like be bold. Push your limits. Yeah, push your limits, you know. And like. And you start, so you're at IO doing straight up improv.

Old school. Tourist crowds. Harold's like old school improv. And that's where you learned all that stuff? Uh-huh, which, yeah. And that's where I did a ton of shows. It was just like reps, which was really nice. You were part of the troop? Yeah, multiple troops, proudly tro did a ton of shows. It was just like reps, which was really nice. You were part of the troupe?

Yeah, multiple troupes, proudly trouping it, yeah. Yeah, and then how did annoyance happen? And so someone saw me in one of those improv shows and was like, hey, you should come try something here, and I did. And was it like a little theater kind of deal? Yeah. Like, where am I, what is this?

Kind of, yeah, like I got, I basically, they were like, you should come do this like little 20 minute play we're doing and we improvise to write basically so you'll improvise a bunch of scenes and then if you like when you re-improvise it and you use that to write and that's like sort of what the annoyance does is they write like narrative shows through improv and like fine tuning so that's almost sketch. Yeah, it is. It's like, it's the start of it for me. It was, yeah. And how long did you spend there? So at the Annoyance, I did like, you know,

maybe two shows, which is not that long. But from doing one of those shows, I got hired by Second City, which is like kind of rare. What does that mean? So you did do Second City. Well, yeah. So, but like typically what people do is they'll go through their training program and then they might be in one of their

like junior performing groups and then they might get on a touring company and then they'll tour for a couple years and then they'll you know whatever and i i sort of weirdly and luckily got to like bypass a lot of those steps and did a show at show at the Annoyance. And a director from Second City saw me and then cast me in one of the main, like not main stage, but there's two main stages there. One is called main stage, one's called ETC,

and I was on the ETC stage. Now, so like, but there you are, you're used to working with a certain group of people. Now you're, it's sort of like now you're in the big time kind of thing. This is the big leagues. You kind of skip some steps. So you're going over there knowing that some of them are going to

resent you yeah fully yeah truly yeah and you know i think a lot of people also like went to second city and waited for 10 years and didn't get those jobs and like you know it is like it's a it's very highly coveted job so i always felt very appreciative and loved working there. Did you get any flack? I've heard like rumblings, but nothing. I always felt like I worked really hard and I did a million shows. I deserve to be there. Right.

Yeah, that's good. Yeah. Pretty well adjusted. I'm trying so hard. Thank you. Who are some of the people there when you got there? Anyone we know? Oh, yeah.

I mean, Tim Robinson was there around that. Sam Richardson. Cecily Strong was around there. Oh, yeah. She's great. Yeah, she's great. She was there? Mm-hmm.

Yeah, I like her. She's funny. So funny. There's some funny people on this crew. So you're doing Second City. Mm-hmm. But at this point, like, you know, like, after college, I mean, you say you didn't know what the trajectory was with improv.

Mm-hmm. But by the time I imagine you get to doing improv in Chicago, SNL becomes this thing there. It's weird. Hanging over it. It did eventually for me because I was performing in a show with Vanessa Bayer

when she got hired. And that I think for me was the first time I was like, oh my God, I'm so, what? Close to it? Yeah,

like I have a, there's a way that showbiz comes to Chicago and like scoops you up and takes you away like i was i could not believe that you know what i mean i had never seen it happen there before and i didn't know anyone so i was just like oh i'm just here kind of plugging away like trying to yeah get good you never really thought about it i just didn't i guess i didn't think that that could happen.

Like, I don't know. I know it sounds stupid now because I know that that's how it works. But I was really naive when it came to that stuff. Uh-huh. And you saw her go? Yeah. And, like, she and I, like, performed together for years in Chicago. And we did a show at the Annoyance together that we, like, rode.

And, you know, some of our friends were in. Yeah. Yeah. she went i was like what you know this was insane and are you guys still friends yeah super close what's she doing she's she just moved to la she did yeah from new york um yeah she's been she's like working on a ton of stuff she's got cool irons in the fire you know yeah yeah yeah i just i realized i haven't seen her in a while yeah i am i'm actually watching the show occasionally oh yeah wow i i never thought it would happen again but it did i'm curious like why now or do you think or even well it's not even about the politics it just so happens now there like, the cast is so fucking good. Oh, that's, I think we have a really cool cast. Beck Bennett, who's in your show.

Oh, my, yes. His cameo in your show. It's not a cameo. Yes. There's a little part there. Yes. It was great. He's so great.

I love him so much. Yeah, he's like, here's the weird thing about SNL, and it's something that Lauren, like, talked to me about. Yeah. Like, Lauren demystified everything for me to my face. Yes. Because I mythologized the first few seasons of the show. And he's like, look, there's been a lot of great cast.

And I don't know that there was a period there where I think like anything else, it's no longer relevant to you. Sure. Because I grew up, I'm old. Yeah. So to come back around to it and to see it so repopularized is so amazing.

It is crazy. I mean, even when I got hired, I wasn't like watching the show regularly because I was like out doing shows. I hadn't watched the show in like five years. Exactly. But then I do think it like it kind of comes and goes depending on your age and like where you're at. But now you can watch it anytime, which is a big difference. Yeah, that is a different thing. It's like you can.

It doesn't matter. You know, you don't have to like back in the day. You're like, I'm going to be home at 1130. No, I know. And when you're 14, it's not a big difference yeah that is a different thing it's like you can it doesn't matter you know you don't have to like back in the day you're like i gotta be home at 11 30 to no i know when you're 14 it's not a big problem but when you're 19 it is well also i feel like it's drastically changed the way you write for snl because it is like i don't know some of those early sketches if you watch them they're like incredibly patient and like nine minutes long and like now you rarely will see a sketch more than four minutes. And it is like a joke every two seconds, you know,

like, or at least they're just like, you know, it's like a machine gun in a way. Like there's not a lot of air to breathe. And that's like part of what it is now. Cause it's like clips, you know,

and stuff. Right. It's changed everything. Yeah. Everything's got to deliver. Totally. Right up front and keep going. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah good that's why i'm watching okay good i like that that's great all right but how does it happen for you so you see yeah you see bear just disappear

plucked up yeah by the big time there went my friend yeah um and basically right after that i got hired by second city and so what you do there is you like write a show with five other people and you perform that show for like six months. And so I did one of those and then I did another one of those. And I think the second time around, I just like knew more, knew what I was doing more. And I sort of like wrote myself better pieces. And then we opened that show. myself better pieces yeah and then we opened that show and like two nights later lorn and all the producers came to see that show which i think was really lucky for me because they watched a full two-hour comedy show that i did with my friends you know and i didn't have to just like have it

all crammed into five minutes you know who were they there to see was it just that they just showed up i think it was sort of like this was right was right after, like, Kristen Wiig had left. Right, I was saying needed people. And it was, like, about to be, like, Bill Hader and Jason Sudeikis and Fred Armisen's last season. And so they were kind of, I think, being like, okay, we've got to get some new blood in here. So they were just scouting generally, you know, like not. Right. And they came to see our show, yeah.

And I had, like, a couple, like, big pieces in it that were like my my thing. And then they came backstage and like said hi and whatever. And I just remembered that like Lauren was like talking to me a lot backstage. And I was like, oh, does that mean like I'm special? Like, do I get the candy? I don't know. I felt like a little whatever. And then a couple of days later, I was in an antique mall with my parents. And I got a phone call that they were like, oh, they want to fly you out to audition five minutes.

And they want you to write, you know, put it together based on the stuff you did in that show. So they want it to be really similar because they want to show kind of the same stuff to the people back at the studio, you know. So you were at an antique mall in phoenix actually they had flown to chicago to see my new show which had just opened so they were we were at an antique mall on the north side of chicago and you're like i fully like got off the phone and started going like mom mommy like just like a full child did she go what what's the matter? Oh, yeah. And I was like, they want me on.

So no, they got to go to New York now. Like just couldn't even talk and was totally freaked out. Were you able to have the, did you stay at the antique mall or did you have to leave? No, I was like, I have to go home and like have diarrhea right now. Like I just fully like crumbled in that moment. That's good. All right. So you fly out there. Yeah.

And they put you up. Yeah. And then you go to the studio. You go to the, what is it, the eighth floor? Well, so weirdly, so for this one, it was like all women. So they brought in like 15 women or something. Did they put you in a room with no windows? No, but they had us audition on Jimmy Fallon fallon's set weirdly yeah so like on the sixth

floor yeah um and so i did my five minutes and it was fine i got laughs i i had been told like expect nothing and then like i did get laughs and so i was like oh like that i was super relieved and happy yeah and then i left i flew back to chicago and then they were like can you fly back to talk to him no to meet like Seth Meyers and the writers and like yeah some of the producers and stuff and so I went for just like I think kind of like a crazy test to just see if I was nuts you know why do you think why what were the questions nothing it was just like where are you from how's it going are you a normal person who can have a normal conversation kind of like you know? Really? Why do you think, why, what were the questions? Nothing. It was just like, where are you from? How's it going? Are you a normal person who can have a normal conversation

kind of like, you know? Yeah. And then I flew back to Chicago. Yeah. But then I flew back to Chicago and I was like, well,

I guess that's it. Like I didn't get it and that's what it is. And then like a week later they were like, we want you to come back out, do another five minutes and new material.

And can you write it in like two days? And I was like, yes, I can. And I love to do that. Characters? Yeah. And what'd you come up with in those two days? Oh, my God. Basically, I don't do impressions.

It's like not my wheelhouse. So I was like. But they want you to do one, huh? Yes. So I was like just scraping the bottom of the barrel for what i could find so i did an adele which she was like kind of hot at the time you know um and i did like an ethel merman which not topical but did you sing i know we're not i should have but no i didn't um and then yeah i don't know i think that's really it. Those were all my impressions.

But I mostly just did like a million characters. How many of them do you still do? Almost zero. Really? Yeah, and I don't know that I've ever done any of them on the show. Really? In any capacity, yeah. Huh.

Yeah. Is that your choice? I think there was one piece that I submitted submitted. Yeah. That didn't go. Right. But it kind of like just doesn't translate. Like it was a piece where I said fuck kind of a lot. Yeah. And like to then like to make it SNL-y, you have to be like, you're bad.

Or like, you know, it just like doesn't work in the same way. I don't know. No, fuck is, fuck. Yeah. That's what it is. Yeah. It was like a, it was like kind of like a Dolly Parton style character that was like her all ex-husband band. And so, you know, it was like you kind of needed

a little fire under there. That's still a funny premise. Yeah, oh no, totally. That was very funny on the show on Shrill, when the text, fuck? Oh yeah. Question mark. I mean, it happens.

Does it? I think so. That straightforward? I mean, it happens. Does it? I think so. That straightforward? I'm, you know. I like that you use fuck. And then like later in the season, someone says smash is not my word. Yeah. Are we going to smash?

Yes. And I don't think I knew what that meant until maybe a month ago. Really? Like I come from the generation of fuck. Yeah, of course. Not the generation of smash or hang out. But I feel like even smash has like a little bit of a wink to it and that you know that it's like kind of dumb. I do.

Yeah, I guess so. I guess I think it's I think maybe it's dumb, but it's also like it trivializes it in a way. Like it's just a thing that we do sometimes. Yeah, we smash. Yeah, exactly. But OK, so so then you go back for the second audition. Mm hmm. Yes.

And you didn't have to sit down with Lauren in that office? No. He doesn't seem to do that like he used to. Well, so I went for my second audition. I did my thing. And this time it was, like, boys and girls, and it was some of the girls who I'd seen before. Like, Cecily was with me both times.

And so it was sort of this, like, narrowed-down pool, you know? Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. And so I did that audition, and I went back to Chicago. And then two days sort of this like narrowed down pool, you know? And, um, and so I did that audition and I went back to Chicago and then two days later they were like, can you fly back? So I was going back and forth. I went back and forth like four times. Uh, and it was super scary, you know? Cause I was like, what's happening?

Is this really going to happen? Right. Um, and, and then the fourth time that i flew back was when i like met with lauren and so you did meet with him yeah i did eventually yeah but not through that whole like month long and you had met him did you did you catch up about hanging out at the uh at second city no i mean i met him you know we had like a lovely little interaction with him backstage at second city that i was like okay i'll live off that for the rest of my life or something, you know. And then I went to his office and he kept sort of like saying stuff that I was like, did I get it or did I not?

Like, I couldn't tell. Like what? He was like, you're very young. You have a lot to learn. Yeah. And so, and I had heard of like people like auditioning and then a couple of years later coming back.

And so I was like, maybe he's kind of telling me like, go keep working and we'll see you in a couple of years. Um, and then he was like, you know, the wigs are a whole nother level. Like it takes it up and I'm like,

okay. He's got, he always asks about the wig. I know it's, I think cause he's, you know, I don't know. It's a, it is different. Like to wear wigs yeah kind of yeah but but then at the very end of the meeting

he stood up and was like but i think you'll do very well here and i still didn't really like know what he meant and i thought he meant like someday you might do very well here or something and so he gave me a hug and I was like okay and then I walked out the door and two producers gave me hugs but then I just walked right out of the building into my hotel like no one was like okay you're gonna start on here's your room no nothing and so I just sort of like walked out of the building and I was like I don't know like I don't know and then maybe 20 minutes later one of the building and I was like, I don't know. Like, I don't know. And then maybe 20 minutes later, one of the producers called me and was like, did you know, you got it. Okay. And I was like, oh, oh, thank you. And she was like, yeah, we could tell you didn't know. And I was like, okay. Yeah, I didn't. I had no idea. That's why I left the building.

Yes. I just assumed it was over. So. Did you go back to the building? No, I just sat in my uh hotel room with timmy robinson who also was hired in that moment and we both sort of just it wasn't even like excitement we were just staring at each other like what's gonna happen now like what's this oh really yeah no crying no yelling just sort of like no we go and you know, we couldn't tell anyone. Like it was a secret. So you're like. Oh, you're not allowed to?

No, because they like release it, you know? And so you're kind of like, you have this secret that you're like, want to scream, but. And what year was that? 2012. So you've been there a while. This is my seventh season. Yeah. And you're a powerhouse.

Oh my God. Come on. Thank you. That's very nice. You're on a lot i mean yeah i i weaseled my way in there yeah and what how does it work i know how it works kind of but like do you are you do you work with certain writers yeah you know i mean when i first started i would say like my first four seasons. Yeah. I wrote almost exclusively with Chris Kelly and Sarah Schneider who were head writers there and they have a show now. They left the show. And so then when they left, I started writing with like a lot more other people. And now I kind of like switch it up a lot.

Kate McKinnon, Chris Kelly, Sarah Schneider and I, we wrote a lot together. Yeah. And like really kind of the stuff that I think like kept me my job on the show. You know, like we wrote a lot of like all girl music videos and kind of some like kind of did what the Lonely Island had done. But like for the ladies. Oh, OK. Yeah, that was smart. I mean, it was like really fun.

And I feel like it was like what helped us kind of like find our thing on the show. Yeah. Yeah. And you're and you're just you're in. So you don't have any sort of like. I'm on the show. Yeah. Yeah. And you're, and you're just, you're in, so you don't have any sort of like. I'm not scared anymore. Is that what, is that what you mean?

Well, I mean like, how long do you think you'll stay? Oh. As long as they'll have you or? I don't know. I don't know about that, but I,

I don't know. I mean, I've done this other show that's a lot of work. Shrill. Shrill, yeah. And,

and Lauren produced it? Yeah, Lauren produced it. So how does that work? Cause like he does that, but it's not. Shrill, yeah. And Lauren produced it? Yeah, Lauren produced it. So how does that work? Because he does that, but it's not always. There are some people from SNL that do shows. Usually he's got a piece of it, but sometimes he doesn't. But then there's others that he seems to really,

because it's a Broadway video show, right? Yeah, it is. So how does that work? How did that all come together? Is that a contractual thing, or do you go talk to him? No, it is. So how does that work? How did that all come together? Is that a contractual thing or do you go talk to him? No, it's not contractual. I guess for me, I can only speak to what happened for me because I think it is different for every person. But, you know, I would say basically what happened was the show is based on a book called Shrill, which is a memoir by this woman named Lindy West. And I loved the book.

book called shrill, which is a memoir by this woman named Lindy West. And I loved the book. And so then when I heard that it had been optioned, I really was like, what are they going to make with that? Cause that is the thing that I've ever read that I was like, this is a lot like my experience, you know? And so then, you know, Elizabeth Banks was the one who had optioned it and she was executive producing the show. And when I met with them, I was sort of like, look, I want to do this, but I don't want to leave SNL. I don't want to. And is there a way that I can do both? And I would love to have Lorne involved. And so then I kind of went to Lorne and was like, look, here's this thing. I really love this book. This story is important to me and I want to do it. And will you help me do it? And he was so wonderful and really was like, this is a perfect thing for you.

And he was sort of like, you know, i think this is how audiences should get to know you better in a lot of ways and and so i he was so wonderful and supportive and like truly has helped so much and like yeah it was really nice and so basically i got to do both like kind of at the same time thanks is still involved yeah she's an executive producer huh yeah is she at like is she in the mix yeah she's in the. Is she in the mix? Yeah, she's in the mix. She's in the mix. She watches and- She watches. She's in the mix.

I like her. I haven't seen her in a while. Yeah, she's great. Yeah, she is. She's like a true trailblazer on that front as far as like, I think a long time ago, she was like, I'm not just going to be an actress. I'm going to like mixed shit. And she really did it.

Yeah, she's made some big shit. Yeah. Yeah, I watched all of them that they gave me there's six i watched yeah there's six episodes so you saw the whole dang thing i watched the whole thing but so how you are involved in the writing yeah how many how what's the writing crew like how many are there um well there were basically seven of us in the writer's room i think and um or no yeah that's about right because we co-wrote the first couple scripts um like yeah so then everyone gets assigned one and then you kind of bring it back in

and yeah and then i usually kind of did like the last pass basically right yeah and this character annie right yeah now how much of that is you know i i don't know the book. Yeah, it's okay. How much of it is like you're like, especially, I mean, the most, the theme of being sort of a doormat-ish kind of person and struggling with self-acceptance and weight. Is that a struggle that you feel the same struggle? Yeah. I mean, I think I feel differently about it now than like maybe where the character is at right in this show um but certainly like when i read lindy's book i felt like she sort of like verbalized all these things that i had always thought you know which was like this seems like a fucking scam that's been sold to women in a lot of ways like the diet culture yeah and like i don't want to do it anymore like

fuck it you know and um and just feeling like i don't i just always felt like i don't know how long i can have the only motivating thing in my life be like the width of my thighs or like the size of my stomach it just felt like such a hollow thing to chase even from a really young age i was like i don't like this you know like i don't what's what's but you always had that issue well i just oh yeah i was always fat but i i i don't know i just always felt like yeah i'm fat but it doesn't make me a bad person like you know i still have value sure and and actually my value isn't my body it's like my brain me a bad person like you know i still have value sure and and actually my value isn't my body it's like my brain and my friendship and my you know talent comedy my

talent my relationships all these things and and i don't know i think i said book changed your life well i definitely related to hitting a breaking point being like i'm not going to participate in this system and i'm going to try and achieve things beyond like you know losing 10 pounds and the second I did that was like shortly after I got hired by Second City and then shortly after that I was hired by SNL and like I wonder if I had been obsessing so consciously all the time in the back of your head like don't eat this and do this and you know you know like that kind of mindset where you're just tortured by like what's going in what's going out and are you doing this or doing that and i look this and tugging my shirt and you know just like the constant yeah loop yeah i have that and i'm not heavy yes but i think that's the thing is like and that's how i felt about this

book am i like no you're you're You gorgeous body. I've been thinking that through this whole interview. Look at it. I've been going like doing the Coke bottle hands and everything. Thank you. But you know what I mean.

It's just like, it's a mindset that when you're in it, it's a trap, you know? It's a trap because you're never going to win. No. It's never enough.

Right. And even if you get to where you think you want to be, then it's always staying there and then it just, the whole game turns. Yes. And even if you get to where you think you want to be, then it's always staying there. And then it just, the whole game turns. Yes. And then your whole thing, it's all about, you know, this weird control and it's the worst.

It's so dark. And I think just like what you're saying, people of all shapes and sizes have this like internal record spinning with this kind of stuff in it. You'll never be good enough. Yeah. That's what it boils down to, you know? And I think particularly for girls, there's unbelievable amount of pressure. And when you've been raised with like, you know, 18 years of like, that's part of being a woman, you know, you're just like, there's, there does come a point where you're like,

am I going to do this? Right. Am I going to do this for the next 60 years? To what end? For what? For who? Yeah, and the show really shows the arc of that realization, which is great. It's really touching and it's well executed and you can sort of feel it through all the relationships with the character.

you know, feel it through all the, you know, the relationships with the character. And also just, you know, there's that one moment, which I thought was beautiful because I get choked up because I'm old and, you know, I don't experience my feelings properly. So like I get choked up when I watch things. No, are you kidding me? I sob when I watch things. And I love it because I'm alone. Yeah. Like, you know, like if I'm with someone else, my girlfriend or something, and some tears start squirting out, I'll just try not to make the noise. I have that on planes when I watch movies where I'm like, ma'am, you have to keep it under control because I want to fully like, you know, like just go there. And because I like love to watch and absorb. And then you let out like.

Yes. And then I'm like, someone is eating lasagna next to you. Like, stop. But there's that one moment where, you know, the sort of confident big woman kind of just walks down the street and you sort of start following her. Yeah. It was so beautifully conceived and shot. Yeah. And, you know, it just it all made, you know, made sense, you know, like with nothing being said, it was nice.

Well, I just think, I think now it's a little bit of a different time because there's like the internet and there's all different kinds of ways to live and you can see like images of all different kinds of people. But for me, like in Arizona where everyone's in a swimsuit year round like i just felt like there was only one way to be and like if i'm not that then what what am i gonna be and like how can i find a purpose and or yeah or like do i not deserve to go after my sting because i don't look like how you're supposed to look or all that stuff i mean it's like it's kind of basic but i think but it's torture yeah and it's incredibly like shameful and painful and embarrassing. And there's so much pain there. Well, it's great that you can draw from it now in a sort of controlled way.

Yeah. But it's very real. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. You're not at risk of sort of like crumbling, you know, like you have distance from it because you've made adjustments in your own life and mind. But you can go there to let this character be that. Yeah. And I mean, I have to say like this was, the show is definitely more like acting than I had ever like done but prior to it yeah yeah i can feel that

yeah and so i guess i i feel very lucky that i wasn't playing like a 18th century battle war nurse like this was something i was like i know this experience i know how it feels to to be that person or to have someone say something to you that cuts you to the bone or that you know like i know that feeling to take it yeah and and to take it and smile and say thank you yeah you know like well yeah i thought that was like sort of like um with these stories and with the script and in whatever you think you're capable of as as a real actor is that when it's there and you've been there yeah it comes right back totally oh totally to the point where i was yeah it like shook me a little bit i bet and i thought that the uh like it's it's just sort of

interesting that i think what's great about this show compared to other shows like it where you know a comedic person you know has you know builds a show around themselves sure is that you know these are these are complicated emotional psychological issues that you know you really kind of like the arc of the six episodes you know really transforms there there is a transformation with everybody yeah which is really the goal of a good story, right? Totally, yes. A good piece of drama or not necessarily comedy, but this sort of rides a line. But like how everybody, you have the dude who is, you know, just fucking you, turns into a person. Yes.

You know, your parents have their struggles. And so everybody's got this nice arc. It isn't one of these sort of like episode by episode. This is the comedic persona. This is how she behaves in every situation. Yeah. And, you know, that's where the funny comes from. Right.

This isn't one of those shows. No, I think we've made a real effort to like, I mean, and this was conscious. Like, I feel like so many times when you've seen a fat character in TV, they really are like a little one dimensional or, or they're just sort of like their whole thing is like, I'm a fat person. I'm a fat person at the store. I'm a fat person at the beach. I'm a fat person

doing this. And we tried to make this just a person who has a life who occasionally is reminded that she is fat, you know, by exterior forces, which is more of how the experience is, you know? And what happens because of that is that, you know, once that character acknowledges that and you understand that that's what that person is going through, you already really see her as a person by having that self-awareness, right? So when, you know, you show up at the dumb party dumb party you know in that glittery dress yeah you know no one's sitting there going like oh look at this sad fat lady yeah you know it's just sort of like oh that that person you know what i mean you're not playing it for like i'm out of fish

out of water here totally because there's like some dignity to her exactly which i think a lot of times fat characters don't have a lot of dignity. They're played as like cartoon characters, you know? And I think that's partially because that's comfortable as an audience member to watch a fat person like jump on a man as a joke, rather than like have a meaningful like sexual experience with a man, because why would a fat woman ever be desired by a man? Like, you know, it's a little bit challenging. There are challenging ideas that we tried to sort of just like let be normal, if that makes sense. No, I think you did, you know, because I can also in the world of comedy and improv there, you know, generally it's a fat dude.

And that dude, you know, it's almost an archetype. Totally. That they're expected to behave a certain way that you know and it was for years you just saw it with you know farley belushi john candy that you know they could all act but you know their place in this sort of commedia della arte of improv was like the fat guy is going to be yeah totally and i think even to see a fat woman, what you often saw was a fat man dressed as a woman. Right, right. It's like a full joke. Yeah, right.

So I just, and I don't think we're like completely breaking new ground. In a lot of ways, it's a really traditional TV show. She's got a job, a boyfriend, her family, her friends, you know, whatever. That's what it is. But I do think it's looking at it through this POV that is a little less often explored with dignity, you know? Right. But that it's still like fun and it can be a light watch in a lot of ways and that it's funny and it's not just like this painful slog about like being a fat woman. Well, I think it's relatively new.

I mean, I think there have been fat women TV characters that had depth before, but really addressing, you know, body shame and body consciousness and the cultural pressure. I mean, that seems relatively new to me. Like, I don't think you're way past the source point. You know, This Is Us does it.

Mike and Molly sort of does it, you know, but, you know, I think it does it mike and molly sort of does it you know but but you know i think it's it's it's important well good good god thank you and i and i also like to like it and also your foil in the sort of the the shape of john cameron mitchell who is like you know so close to over the top yeah just awful like The one thing that didn't happen this season was I didn't see him buckle enough. Mm-hmm. So I imagine we'll see that later. Ooh.

I can only hope. Yeah. Are you picked up? Are you doing another one? I don't know. Oh, you don't know. I don't know. I think they will tell us shortly after it comes out.

I guess so. Yeah, good. I hope so. How long did it take you to write those? Because this waiting for a year thing is bothering me. No, I mean,

you know, I have to say in a lot of ways we were really lucky was because I was doing SNL at the same time and they knew that I wasn't going to leave.

There was, they could only do it during my summer window. So it had to be shot and done by September. And written? And written. So basically we got picked up

at the end of May. We wrote June and July. We shot August, September, and now it's out in March. I mean, it's that, it was really, really wild. But it'd be nice if people did a half a year turnaround instead of a year turnaround. Sure. Oh my God, totally. I don't know why, because they're like on glow, you know, it's like a year. Yeah. And like, we've gotten used to waiting a year, but I think it's too long. Are they going to drop it all at once or are they going to do it? No, it's all at once. Yeah. Yeah.

See, like that's the thing. No, it's like so much work that then is like it's out there. It's like cooking for a day. Yeah. For Thanksgiving. And then it's like in an hour, it's just gone. I know. I don't know if it's well, either way.

It's great. Oh, thanks. Great job. Thanks. That means so much coming from you. You're so good. That's so nice. I don't know.

But thank you. And thank you for talking to me. Oh, Mike, this is an honor. Do you feel good? Do you feel satisfied? I just, and this is my people pleaser. I hope you feel satisfied. I do.

Really? Okay, I'm glad. Yeah, I don't know what's going to happen ever. Yeah. You know what I mean? I used to be more hung up on, like there were times where, the thing about me is like,

even if it's not what I think it's going to be, I'll keep people in here. Yeah. For a long time, just so we have something to work with. Yeah. But this is great. But you mean like get hung up on,

like the thing you get hung up on being like, whether you like got to the heart of the person or more just like did you make an entertaining show or what do you mean it's not the heart of the person it's just it's engaged and you know we you know we had a conversation and sometimes you know that you don't know when that's going to really break open and happen yeah but but a lot of times there are people that just don't do that. And then it's sort of like, but even those, they turn out okay. Because most of the time, if I'm talking to somebody, I may not have thought it, but a lot of times people have never heard that person talk. So even if I'm not, you know what I mean? So even if I'm not satisfied or I didn't think it was great, the next thing you know, people are like, that was amazing.

I've never heard that guy say anything. So it works out. Oh, well, I'm glad. But you were great. Oh, thank you. This is the kind of praise I need. And I hope you get picked up and have fun at SNL. Thank you.

All right. That was me and Aidy Bryant. I love her. Don't you love her? How can you not love Aidy Bryant? The show is Shrill. It premieres tomorrow, March 15th on Hulu. All the episodes will be available to stream.

And she's also, of course, on Saturday Night Live on NBC. It's her seventh season on the show. And please go to WTFpod.com slash tour if you could. I'd like to get some people out to, well, the Aspen date, March 23rd at the Wheeler Opera House. Apparently, it's going to, I'm relying on skiers. But the UK dates, April 4th at the Lowry. The Lowry is in Salford. Royal Festival Hall is in London on April 6th.

The Rep Theater is in Birmingham April 8th. And Vicar Street in Dublin on April 11th. Come out, you guys. I know you're scared of Brexit, some of yous, but come out. Come out to the show. And I'll be in San Diego at the American Comedy Company April 18th and 19th and 20th. Good Nights Comedy Club in Raleigh, North Carolina, May 16th, May 17th and May 18th. Comedy Club on State, May 23rd.

That's in Madison, Wisconsin, May 23rd, 24th and 25th. And the Vermont Comedy Club, June 6th, June 7th and June 8th. And Helium Comedy Club in St. Louis, Missouri, June 13th and June 14th and June 8th. And Helium Comedy Club in St. Louis, Missouri, June 13th and June 14th and June 15th. A lot of dates tightening up that hour, folks. Let me see. I haven't picked up the guitar. I don't know.

Yeah, I can. Hold on. Let me see what I can... Thank you. Thank you. Boomer lives! Well, almost, almost anything. So no, you can't get an ice rink on Uber Eats. But iced tea and ice cream? Yes, we can deliver that. Uber Eats. Get almost, almost anything. Order now. Product availability may vary by region.

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