WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1020 - Lisa Kudrow

Episode Date: May 20, 2019

Of course Lisa Kudrow talks with Marc about Friends. But first they discuss several other topics Lisa knows well, including genealogy, global migration patterns, evolutionary biology, and headaches. Lisa also explains how Jon Lovitz was responsible for pushing her toward improv, how Conan O’Brien helped her put it all together, and how the cast of Friends stuck together to get what they deserved. Plus, some talk about The Comeback, Web Therapy, and her new movie, Booksmart. This episode is sponsored by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, Squarespace, and Starbucks Tripleshot Energy. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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T's and C's apply. Lock the gate! Alright, let's do this. How are you, what the fuckers? What the fuck buddies? What the fucking ears? What's happening? I'm Mark Maron.

This is my podcast wtf welcome to it if you're new to it if you're not you're right how's it going you want to know who's on the show today i can do that lisa kudrow is here she's in a film she's she's got a nice part as a mom in the new film book smart which is a very exciting uh fun movie about young people and that's in theaters this friday may 24th some funny shit in that movie and she's going to be here momentarily she was here already but you're going to hear momentarily unless you're already past this part but i also want to bring up the fact that i was at the comedy store last night, and Sammy Shore, that's Pauly's dad, Peter's dad, Mitzi's ex-husband, passed away. He was like 92.

I did one of the last interviews with Sammy. He was actually the guy that first opened the comedy store, but after a couple years of it being just sort of a clubhouse for stand-ups, couple years of it being just sort of a clubhouse for stand-ups uh he he admits he were divorced and she took it and made it the empire that it is and was uh but we did uh we did do uh an episode with sammy and uh we republished it uh it's from 2016 i went out to vegas to interview uh sammy it's episode 771 771 and it's available in the free episode feed of whatever podcast app you're using. It's also available at WTFpod.com. This is something we do. We don't like having to do it, but life is life, and Sammy Shore has passed away and he was a he was an important comic and he was part of a generation of comics that many people have forgotten he was once shecky green's comedy partner and that might mean nothing to a lot of people who are listening to this right now but he he was he was one of the guys he was one of the he's one of the real old school comics and he's no longer with us so rest in peace

sammy and if you want to listen to that episode, it's there in the feed for you now. I was just in Seattle. What day is today? Today's Sunday. Yeah, I don't think I've talked to you since I went to Seattle. I left Wednesday and then Thursday

I did a bunch of press for the film Sword of Trust. I was up there with Lynn Shelton, the director of the movie. And then we had the big screening. We were the opening night gala or gala or depends where you're from and whether where you're from, they pronounce it incorrectly. They had a screening of the film in front of like 3000 people in this big, beautiful auditorium theater thing. And it was it was something, man i because you're sitting there you know we introduced a movie and then you kind of wait it out people are watching it most of the people

there don't know what to expect they don't know what the movie is they don't know if it's going to be funny they know it's called a comedy and it was weird because when it premiered at south by southwest you know that was a kind of lit up young hipster ish crowd. And they were just laughing right at the beginning. But this one took a little longer, maybe seven or eight minutes before they got the groove. But man, once they dropped into that groove, laughs all the way through, all the way fucking through. How often does that happen? This is a room full of people that didn't know what to expect getting laughs.

I was laughing. I cried. I laughed again getting laughs. I was laughing. I cried. I laughed again at a movie I was in. I don't know if that's a type of narcissism or what, but it was really something. And the more I see it, the more it makes sense to me and how, because the first time you see something, you're looking at it that you're involved in. You look at it with a different type of critical eye or you maybe you're too critical, but it works together. It's so it's so good. It was so sort of exciting.

And then we did a Q&A after, which I sort of hijacked because I'm all worked up. I finished that book, Fantasyland. So I'm really on the tip of pushing back on the magical thinking epidemic that we're experiencing on all levels. But that was a great experience. It was a great experience. I think everybody had a good time. And I was in Seattle for three days or like one

day really. But I did, I was able to get down to my place. I was able to, yeah, I've been going to Seattle for a long time. And I love that city. I love the country up there. I love the climate. I love everything about the Pacific Northwest. And I love the seafood. And I love going to fish markets. And I love this place called Jack's Fish Stop. And I think I've talked about it before. And for some reason, even though I'm eating pretty fucking clean, pretty healthy, except for New York, leave me alone. I'm entitled to have a nice steak for dinner occasionally. But I've been eating pretty good. And then it's just because I get to Seattle and then the struggle begins. Are we going to have fried scallops? Are we going to Jack's fish stop? Can I fit that into my schedule? Should I even

eat a basket of fried scallops and beautiful French fries? Should I even do that? It's probably not good. And then here's the other thing that happens. The other struggle is like, hey man, just because you're on the road doesn't mean that you're on a different planet or it doesn't count. OK, just because you're on the road doesn't mean you can't continue eating, you know, in a healthy way. And then I'm like, yeah, but I'm going to die soon. And like, isn't isn't eating good food part of joy? Isn't that what joy is? Isn't joy putting fun things into your mouth? And then the other

part is me like, yeah, but is it worth it? That's the other. Who the hell is that guy talking to you? Is it really worth it? Is it worth what? I'm taking statins. I mean, come on. Doesn't that give me a little bit of a pass? No, but like, what about the calories? What about the fried? What about the, yeah, I mean, is it worth it? All right, all right man all right but it's like i'm just saying that if i get if i get to the end of my rope if i get to the last dying breath and i'm like you know a few fried scallops short of having a meaningful life i'm gonna blame you i said to myself and right up till i got there i mean my level of, you know, sort of committing to indecisiveness is profound. If I have one skill, you know, emotionally, it's like I can commit to indecisiveness for years. But I got to Jack's fish stop. I saw the dead fish. How great is it? Why do I love

looking at dead fish? It's like the saddest aquarium. I like watching fishies swim in a tank, seeing the sharkies in the big tank, seeing them swim around in circles, seeing them through the glass. Look at that fishy. But what does the top of that fish look like? What does the underside of that fish look like? What does that fish look like inside its mouth? What does that fish look like when it's just sitting still?

Those are unanswerable questions unless you're at a fish market. That's, I mean, that's really, if you want to learn, that's where you learn at the SAD, the SAD Aquarium, which is the fish market. You can like get right up close. You can stick your finger in their mouth. You can look at their eyes. You can turn them over, can hold them in your hand. You can, you know, you can throw them. They're throwing them down there. They're throwing the dead fish. So I get to the counter and I see that at Jack's fish stop, they're now serving the grilled salmon, you know, and that's healthier. Nice piece of grilled salmon. That would have been healthy, fresh. It's right there. You see, you see the guy before they cut it, you saw the whole guy. And then they're going to take a piece of that guy and just, but right up to when it was coming out of my mouth, the guys,

I can help you. And I'm like, yes, I want the scallops, scallops. And I said it, I said it like I just won something inside me that I had the commitment, like there were two people involved in that decision and they both had a different thing to say. But the louder, more committed one won. Just scallops as if then I turned and smiled at the invisible other me that was there beside me. And I got to be honest with you, man. Look, I don't know what you like or who you are or what makes your life worth living or whether you think it is. But for me, these scallops were nice big ones.

They were fried just right. They had nice tang to them, like sometimes scallopies that taste really scallopy. Fucking great. They were fucking fried perfectly on a bed of French fries with some cocktail sauce. I was so happy with them. I was so happy that I ate them for about an hour after I was happy. And then I stayed pretty happy. And even right now, even right now reflecting back on the scallops,

I don't know what was better, really, if I'm in the feelings that I'm having right now. Was the screening of a film I starred in, which got lots of laughs, equal or better than the five or six fried scallops I had that afternoon? I'm just going to put them in different columns and say they were both amazing. Look, people, how about some email reading? I've got some listener engagement I want to share with you. Let's see. This one, why don't we all spend a little time blowing some smoke up Mark's ass? How would that be?

Studs Terkel, subject line, dot, dot, dot, filled the early morning silences of my Southside Chicago home growing up, giving us all a shared experience. another tie that bound my Irish Catholic family and kept us together through the aridity and loneliness of middle-class life. He was the only man I never knew whose death I genuinely mourned. As I start a Southside Chicago family of my own, now at 34, I find your show filling a similar space. I find that comforting and important. I hope you continue your work. It's more important than you know. It's more than coincidence that you began when you did. I like to think you're picking up where Studs left off.

That is so fucking nice and humbling, and thank you for that compliment. I had the pleasure of meeting Studs towards the end of his life. It was just great. It was like, it was a great moment. I guess it was like the second version of air America. Maybe the first, I can't remember. Maybe it was towards the end of that first run on air America that he came in and, uh, yeah, he had a, he had a hearing aid in both ears and, uh, and he took them both off and he said something about like a princess removing her earrings or something and then he put the headphones on and uh the board

up calo was like uh good and he kept going he kept putting his thumb up like higher higher and it was so loud that it was bleeding into the studio. And you could hear Kalo asking if that was good coming out of his headphones. And he was like, yes, that's good, because he had taken off his hearing aids. It was very endearing and beautiful. Beautiful moment. Here's another email. Subject line, Rudolph wasn't written by Gene Autry. Dennis.

Hi, Mark. Dennis Quaid doesn't know his own family's history. Gene Autry didn't write Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer. It was written by a Jewish American songwriter named Johnny Marks. Nor did he write Frosty. He recorded them. It only stuck with me because I remember listening to a segment on the CBC about how so many wartime Christmas songs were written by Jews and that the Rudolph song was particularly poignant in dealing with the feeling of other that Jewish people felt. His nose. Gene Autry has a good old boy Christian nose. Dennis, cool it. Take care. Charlotte. Yep, the Jews have been entertaining

the Gentiles for a long time to the point where we are fundamentally necessary in that entertainment, primarily so they don't kill us. Mark, you have an outstanding podcast and I enjoy your work as a comedian. You have spoken about Ireland. Today's remarks with Angelica Houston made me think of a quote from John Patrick Moynihan after the JFK assassination, quote, there is no point in being Irish unless you realize that eventually the world will break your heart, unquote. Steve. Man, that's good. I like that one. Oh, Lisa Kudrow is here. I was so excited to talk to her because I love her so much. She's one of those people that I'm like, I don't even know if I could handle talking to her

because she's so exactly who she is. She's so Lisa Kudrow. But I always thought she was uniquely funny and charming and smart and all the things that people are when you like them. Right? And then it happened. She like, I was a little intimidated to be honest with you. Cause I thought she could be intense, but I had a nice time with her. She's in this new film, which I saw book smart, uh, which is funny. And it's a, it's a, an exciting teen comedy. That's good for adults, I thought.

It's in theaters this Friday, May 24th. And obviously, you know her from Friends and from other things she's done. But now you're going to know her from talking to me. This is me and Lisa Kudrow. It's winter, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So, no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs, mozzarella balls, and arancini balls?

Yes, we deliver those. Moose? No. But moose head? Yes. Because that's alcohol, and we deliver that too. Along with your favorite restaurant food, groceries, and other everyday essentials. Order Uber Eats now. For alcohol, you must be legal drinking age. Please enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by now. For alcohol, you must be legal drinking age. Please

enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by region. See app for details. It's a night for the whole family. Be a part of Kids Night when the Toronto Rock take on the Colorado Mammoth at a special 5 p.m. start time on Saturday, March 9th at First Ontario Centre in Hamilton. The first 5,000 fans in attendance will get a Dan Dawson bobblehead courtesy of Backley Construction. Punch your ticket to Kids Night on Saturday, March 9th at 5 p.m. in Rock City at torontorock.com. Bro. I can't believe I've never met you before.

I know, me too. Did you think that? Yeah, yeah. Well, I always wonder, maybe we've met. Yeah. You know. No, I don't think we ever have. Like, I know people you know, but I never met you.

Yeah, that's weird. You're from here. Yeah. Your whole life in Los Angeles. Yeah, Tarzana, the valley. Yeah? Yeah. So, like, you've never left, really?

I went to college in New York, so four years. But your family wasn't in show business? No. What were they doing? Well, my father is retired. He's a doctor. What kind of doctor? Well, he was a headache specialist.

What does that mean? That means... I mean, He was a headache specialist. What does that mean? That means... I mean, he was an internist. And then in 1971, he decided he was just going to treat and research headaches exclusively. And he was pretty notable. Really? I guess it's like one of those things where you're like, everyone gets headaches. Seems like a good business.

Well, he was, he's not usually, he's not business driven, but. I grew up with a doctor too. My dad's a doctor. Oh, what kind? Orthopedic. Oh, wow. Yeah, saws and hammers.

Sh, woof, that's rough. You can say shit. That's so rough. Yeah, surgeon, knees, backs. That's so brutal. Hips. Yeah, my dad, by the way, that's rough. You can say shit. That's so rough. Yeah, surgeon, knees, backs. That's so brutal. Hips. Yeah, my dad, by the way, he was- Is that your nicotine gum?

Oh, yeah. Oh, that's so great. What do you have? I got the nicotine lozenge. Yeah, no, I prefer the gum. Have you tried these? Yeah. You don't like them?

I don't. But don't you find yourself chewing the fucking gum like all day? Yeah. But I mean, the same piece. Oh, no. Oh. I mean, that would be great if I did. That would be great.

Like, I like these because I can completely control the discharge. What, did you take it out? No, I don't take it out. But, you know, sometimes you suck on them harder and then you get more. And like, you know, I guess I've gotten used to them. But the same as the gum, like with each death. But then I'd end up chewing a lot of gum and I think it's hard on my jaws and my teeth.

Oh, yeah. Don't you love nicotine though? Oh my God, I do. It's really toxic though. What did you learn about it? Well. We'll get back to doctors. Yeah, well, but it comes from my dad also studying it.

But I think it's like a wonder drug, though. No, but what's toxic about it? Oh, if I chew too much. Right. Or also, you know, now I had dental issues. Well, that's the reason I can't do the gum. I think it wears your jaw and your teeth down. Yeah.

Doesn't it? Well, I had work done, so I had like temporary, you know, things in crowns. Right. And so it would just yank them out. I couldn't, I couldn't chew them. So, but so my husband had these jewels. So I started doing that. Jewels, what are those? You know, the, the like vape. Oh, vape. Oh yeah. Yeah. But then you're back on the tan thing. Oh my God. And it's so much worse. I think it's, I think it's probably as bad as cigarettes, I think. We don't know what's in that shit. Well, I know they're burning something sticky that you're breathing into your lungs.

Right. So that can't be good. But I'm looking for information you might have. Yeah, but so I'd get sick. I just feel sick if I chew too much. Of course. Just ill. Yeah.

I feel it all day long. Kind of nauseous and just exhausted. Yeah. And like, oh, my God, I chew too much. Of course. Just ill. Yeah. I feel it all day long. Kind of nauseous and just exhausted. Yeah. And like, oh, my God, I'm not well. I'm not going to live long. Right. You know, like that for sure. You don't track it to the gum.

It's just like you're on a nicotine overdose. Sometimes I'll go to sleep with the things in my mouth. You too? No. Oh, no. I'd be too afraid of choking to death. I've swallowed one of them once, and I thought, oh, my God, that's the most dangerous thing that's ever happened to me.

You swallowed a nicotine gum? I swallowed it. It's like, I felt like, you know, I can- It's so funny you say it. My fair lady. Yeah. She swallowed a Marlboro. I swallowed one.

And that's all I could think was, I swallowed one. But did, I find that when I accidentally swallow them, they don't, they don't, it doesn't make me, like, I don't think it works the same way. Yeah. I think it goes, but I'm happy about the nauseousness because I do that to myself all day long. That's bad. Like, I'll just, like, I'll keep eating them until I'm like, I can't even go up the stairs. Right. It's not just nausea though. It's just, it saps the life out of you.

It does and you have to nap. Of course it is. And guess what the best delivery system for nicotine is? Chew. Tobacco. Yeah. I don't think it's chew. I think it's smoking it. Yeah.

It's the best dose. But yeah, that's why I think I get a bigger get a better dose than the gum with the lozenge. That's all. But I think it's a good thing. And my father was researching it. And he sends me stuff. Oh, really? Oh, they've done studies.

And with Parkinson's, you see a decrease. Oh, that nicotine. Oh, really? It's good for that. And Alzheimer's, you know. Oh, really? Potentially, yeah. Well, I think as long as you're not inhaling the smoke.

I think that's the burning smoke is bad. For your lungs? Yes. No, I mean, you're going to have some kind of chronic pulmonary issue if you smoke. If you smoke. Yeah. I'll tell you what I get obsessed about. What's it doing to my kidneys or my pancreas?

The nicotine? Yeah, just this. Anything? Do you know? I don't know? Got any info? I don't think so. Are you hypochondriac? Well, I say no.

Okay. But I think I'm aware and alert. And it's a fine line. I just found growing up- Pathology and caution. Yeah, true. But I found growing up with a doctor, you know, but it sounds like your dad growing up with a doctor, you know,

but it sounds like your dad, internist, researcher, headache guy, probably had reasonable hours. Oh yeah. Yeah. So he was around. Yeah. Oh, that's nice. Well, he was around. Yeah. Not a lot. Oh, so my question is when you were a kid, when you grew up with a doctor doctor if you need to see a doctor you just call your dad calls his buddy right yeah right so like i found that there were periods in my life where i always thought i had a lot of illnesses so i needed some attention from my dad can you check this out can you check this out can you send me over to bob wait how was you didn't have that you think that was in order to get attention i think in retrospect i think it was a way to get very focused attention. Or this will interest him.

I can be interesting. Yeah, look, I'm dying. Yeah. Yeah, tell me I'm not. Tell me why. I didn't feel like I needed to be interesting to my dad. No, but he was good, though. I mean, he did find us interesting.

Well, that's nice. Anyway. He liked you. Yeah. Oh, that's good. Oh, he was good, though. I mean, he did find us interesting. Well, that's nice. Anyway. He liked you. Yeah. Oh, that's good. Oh, he liked us. You guys are Jewish? Yeah.

Yeah, I come from Jews. Yeah, full. Full Jew. Full. I just did Finding Your Roots. You did? I did it with Professor Gates. Has it aired?

I watch every one. No, I just did it like the day before yesterday. What did you find out? Crazy. Well, I mean, not totally crazy, but any. What did you find out? Crazy. Well, I mean, not totally crazy, but any of it's crazy when they go back. Any information at all. They send people to Poland to do the home. Do you know I produce Who Do You Think You Are?

Okay, yeah. But how is that different? Well, because we would send you to Poland. Oh, I should have done your show. Can I do your show? Well, depending on what he found out. And we usually find like a story. One story.

Yeah. Yeah. Within your ancestral line. You've done like a ton of them, right? Yeah. We've been on since 2009, 10. And do you deal with the celebrity pool? Is that who you usually do?

Not just regular people? Not a lottery? Yeah, it's not. I mean, that was our hope when we first started, you know, because to us, it's all interesting. But I think what the network's discovered is that to an audience. Not so much. Who's this guy? To an audience.

Yeah. They'd rather see Steve Buscemi. What'd you find out about him? That was a while ago. He had an ancestor. It was around Civil War time. Yeah. He was a dentist.

Oh. And who kind of disappeared. Yeah. And he tried to kill himself. There was a, there was, he had a suicide note that he put in a bottle and threw in the river before he jumped in. Yeah. put in a bottle and threw in the river before he jumped in yeah and it was found and published in a newspaper as if preserved for steve buscemi to find you know generations later yeah yeah it was

good yeah what i found out is um the jews were always running yeah that it was you know usually if they leave anywhere it was for because of anti-Semitism. It was very tricky. To live as a Jew? Well, yeah, because they didn't want to convert to Russian orthodoxy, right? And so then they're the Christ killers. Right. But then also, if you go back further, you had serfs in the Russian Empire. But Jews, because they weren't full citizens, they weren't serfs.

So they had it a little better. So there was a lot of tension and animosity. Yeah. I was just, because of the climate we're living in now and the mainstreaming of antisemitism, to realize that most of the migration of all, at any point in history, of the migration of all at any point in history if it has to do with jews was was trying to get away from jew haters of all you know the spectrum from uh you know you can't do things legally to killing them and that that that affected me no official policy right of anti-semitism because i think jews can adapt to yeah all, yeah. Used to not being liked. Yeah. I get that.

Did you marry a Jew? No. But his last name is Jewish. It is. Really? Stern. Go either way, that one. Stern.

Yeah. It's basically Jewish. It is Jewish. Yeah. But they're not Jews. Is it German? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Like Alsace. Yeah. There's a lot of those German names that are like, Jew? No. Nazi. No. Yeah. Not, not. Like Alsace. Yeah. There's a lot of those German names that are like, Jew? No. Nazi. No. Yeah.

Not, not. Too many Nazis named Stern, I don't think. No, no. But. So you can, so everyone thinks he's Jewish. Yeah. Is he from Germany? No, no.

He's French. French. Yeah. Do you speak French? Does he? Yeah. Do you? Oh, not great.

Do you teach your kids French? Your kid? How many kids do you have? Yeah, we have one Does he? Yeah. Do you? Oh, not great. You teaching your kids French? Your kid? How many kids do you got? Yeah, we have one. Yeah? Yeah. And we weren't allowed to speak French to him because he was a little speech delayed. Oh, he is?

Did I say speech French to him? I don't know. No, speak French. Yeah. But now, where's he at now? Oh, he'd like to learn French, but you know. Too late. There's other things to do.

And my husband feels like, you don't need to know French. No one needs to know French. Doesn't serve any purpose. So, all right, so going back to the doctor, the headache doctor. Yeah. So this is the world you grew up in, headaches. Yeah.

That was the family racket. You're in headaches. And after college, I worked for my dad, so I knew a lot about headaches. But okay. But do you get them? I don't get headaches, really. I get, you know, when I was a kid, I'd get a Disneyland headache. What does that mean? That means that it's so much stimulus and excitement that after you come down,

you get a headache. Yeah. I think I get headaches from the nicotine sometimes. Oh, really? Yeah. After a certain point. Yikes. What kind of, tell me about some other headaches you learned about. Well, my dad got every kind of headache. Oh, so this was his personal mission. Yeah. He got a kind of headache called cluster headache. I was just going to bring those up. Oh, you know about cluster headache?

I was just going to ask about them because that's the first thing that came to my mind. I don't know a lot about them. Oh. Well, it's one of the worst pains there is. Really? And people who get it, including my father, say it's like a red-hot poker being forced through your eye. And when people have them. Oh, in the back of the eye? When people have them, their head is actually like they're leaning forward from the pressure from behind or leaning back from the pressure in the front. And that whole side of the face.

Oh, my God. The eyes tearing, the nose is running, the mouth is drooping. It affects the whole. And it lasts about an hour. Really? Hour and a half. And here's the great thing. What he learned is that you can just,

if you inhale oxygen, it aborts the cluster headache. It was a breathing thing. Well, oxygen. Yeah. That he, his research, he did a lot of research. With a tank, you mean?

Yeah, yeah. Oh. And it's a lot. It's like 10 liters per minute, so you can't do it more than 10 minutes. It dries out your lungs. So he discovered this? Yeah, I think someone else sort of identified it and then he brought it up as a treatment and people started using it.

And so people with cluster headache would carry an oxygen tank in their car. And this is like the Kudrow method? Well, I don't know that it's called that at all. And there are some medications too, but his research, he was wondering what causes it. And he decided that his theory was that there's some injury to the hypothalamus. So it's not registering oxygen levels. Right. So he's a real scientist, your dad. Yeah, yeah. Oh, no, he is. Yeah. And so as a teenager, you were like, I'm going to get into headaches? Yes.

Not headaches, but I was going to go to medical school for sure. Where'd you go to college? I went to Vassar College. That's fancy. It's fancy, yeah. So is that an Ivy League school? No, it's one of the Seven Sisters to the Ivy League. It was a girl's school?

Yeah. Was it a girl's school when you went? No, no, because it switched over. It became co-ed in 1969. So you went pre-med? I went in to be pre-med, and then I decided I didn't want to be a doctor around junior year. How'd you do with the biology classes? Fine.

Yeah. But the organic chemistry was tricky. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, math, when you start getting into the calculus, like organic chemistry was tricky. Yeah. Yeah. Math, when you start getting into the calculus, I can't, I don't even know.

It's too abstract for me. I don't even know what X is. X is what you solve for. I know, but I, I couldn't do an algebra problem. I could not. That's how I knew I was going to be an entertainer because you can't charm your way through math.

No, you can't. You can't. You can't bullshit your way. Nope. No, you can't. You can't. You can't bullshit your way out of math or science. Nope. And that's why I was at a complete loss with the other like humanities. Yeah. And writing a paper. You couldn't do that either? That was my nightmare. Really? Because bullshit wasn't, I couldn't. You're not a good bullshitter? I don't think so. Oh.

I was overwhelmed all the time. So I could write eight pages of opening paragraphs. I could do that. The ideas just kept coming. I was in awe of those people and wondering, so what's the value in anything? You're not learning anything if you're just, I't understand what's the value of the humanities what's the i don't understand the value in it there's no equation there's no like how do you prove anything there's nothing concrete so yes i was i'm very linear but so you come back from college and that's when you take the gig in your dad's office

yes because so i was interested in you know a field in evolutionary biology and i thought i'm not a doctor you want to track the origins of every of you of things living yeah things yeah yeah and and my father was doing research in sort of like a now it'd be be within the neuroscience area. And so I got to participate, work with him on a study. Yeah. And the idea was, great, so I'll get published, and then that'll help me get into a good graduate program. For evolutionary biology.

Yeah. Huh. But that summer, after I graduated, our good friend, my brother's best friend is John Levitz. Yeah. And he got on Saturday Night Live. Was he always like that? Yes. Always.

Yeah. Hmm. Yeah. Hmm. Odd Jewish kid. Yeah. He's so nice. And really just funny. Yeah. He's just. He is funny. He's just funny. an odd Jewish kid he's yeah he's so nice and really

just funny yeah he's just he is funny he's just funny you know hi Mark yeah

oh see what you're he'd call the house you know and I'm younger I'm like six years younger than he and my brother and hello

oh hello Lisa like oh hold on David like I just didn't feel I didn't feel like 10 minutes of bits. Right? And so I'm like eight. And I don't feel like it. So he ends up on SNL. Right. And when I was in grade school and junior high school, I did do plays and write sketches and do stuff like that.

You wrote sketches even? Wrote sketches in junior high. Okay. So you were a funny person. Yeah, I thought so. But that's what you were doing. You were like, how can we be funny on purpose? Yeah.

Singing, no singing, no musicals? No. Just serious plays? No, not serious plays. No. Comedy stuff. Okay. All comedy. That's what I purpose. Yeah. Singing, no singing, no musicals. No. Just serious plays. So you kind of wanted to be an actor. No, not serious plays. No. No. Comedy stuff.

Okay. All comedy. Is what I like. Yeah. And so I thought, oh, wow, this is, I didn't realize this was an option for people. I thought it was just like some magical, mysterious luck. I hear that a lot. Yeah.

Right. You know, that happens to like David Hasselhoff. Right. You know? There's no career trajectory. It's just someone's chosen by the forces of show business. Yeah. Yeah. No, I know. It's hard to know. How do you, how does people decide to do that? Right. And so, and then I thought, oh, maybe, God, I mean, I have no responsibilities. I'm 22. I don't have a mortgage to pay. I don't have kids.

This is the time you do something that selfish. And I don't want to regret it later. So you gave up on decoding the living. Well, I thought, and if it doesn't work out, I can go to graduate school. I mean, that's always an option. Just learning things. Yeah. You did well, right? Undergrad, well enough? Well enough. Yeah.

You know, not great because it was hard. I wasn't a great student, you know. So you're out there in the valley, in Tarzana? That's where I was, yeah. But like now, what is it like when you were younger, were you like coming into Hollywood to party and stuff? Westwood. We went to Westwood to go to frat parties and, you know, go to a moustache cafe and have chocolate souffles and chicken crepes.

Does that ring a bell? No. Oh. No, no. I mean, I just wonder what. Because, like, I grew up in New Mexico. What do I know? We just get in the car.

We had driver's license at 15. And go where? Drive around. Well, we did that too, by the way. Sure, you just drive around, get some grown person to buy you beer. Well, no, I didn't do that. Never? No. Huh. No, I wasn't interested. Oh. Well, good for you. I was serious. I mean, I was like 30 for a long time when you were 15 yeah yeah definitely well yeah i mean i i could feel i could see that i was like oh boy no because my dad had told me the most dangerous kind of human beings on this planet are 17 year old boys that's why they make good soldiers they don't know they can die and you know they know, they have poor judgment and don't get in a car with a 17-year-old boy.

And you didn't? I didn't. I tried not to. So we'd go to football games and there'd be a party and, oh, let's go. This guy's going to drive us. I'm like, he had a beer. I'm not getting into a car with him. And then what?

Who's going to feel sorry for me when I'm lying in a hospital bed? That's how I thought. And I loved myself for it. I did. You're so righteous. And it paid off. I was. It's like smoking. Are you an idiot? And then I, college college i started smoking a pack a day all right so you're you're drawing a line no 17 year old boys yeah in cars with beers oh but so you get done with college and love it's all right it's on snl and like the satan character drags you into show business well no i called him up and said so i think i should do this and he said absolutely do this yeah but he said go to the groundlings. That's where I learned the most. The Groundlings.

The Groundlings. Because he had studied theater in college and he took acting classes. And he said, the most I ever learned was the Groundlings, improvisation and sketch writing. And you just went over there? I've talked to a lot of Groundlings. It seemed like a fun thing. Yeah, it was fun. But they wouldn't take me because I called up and they said, okay, when's

the last time you performed? And I said, junior high school. And they said, great, we're going to send you to Cynthia Seghetti. Who's that? Improv teacher. She was phenomenal. She's passed away. A former groundling? A former groundling. So that was, she was like, she'll get into shape and then you come. And then come,

she'll prepare you and then come and audition for the classes. Yeah. So you did that. Mm-hmm. And what are you doing now? I'm spitting out my gum because it was making noise. But you couldn't you do. I thought you'd chew it and then tuck it. What happened to the process?

I don't want to tuck it. No tucking? Oh, you go straight. You just chew through? I chew through. Is it a four or two? Two. Oh.

No, no. I'm reasonable. Yeah. I break fours in half. Sometimes in the morning, I'll do a whole four. Just to kickstart. Just get it going. Just kickstart.

And then you start, then the nauseousness starts. Oh, it does? Avoiding nauseousness all day. Yeah. But then you get used to the nauseousness and you realize this is how harder drugs kill people. Yeah. Well, for me, because it's sweet, it's in lieu of dessert. And then I just like, oh, I'm still not done with the sweet,

and I'll pop another one. So you have eating problems too, huh? Well, do I? I don't know. Do you? I must. I'm nuts. I'm not saying it as a judgmental way.

You know, I have a problem. Yeah. Yeah, I do. With eating? Sure. What do you mean? I was brought up by a functioning anorexic, a proud anorexic woman. Oh.

And I was very aware of calories and chubbiness for my whole life. Oh, fun. Yes. Wow. And it's really deep and it sticks. It's stuck. It sticks. So what do you do?

I'm curious because now there's a whole body image thing. Yeah. Where all body types are represented everywhere. I just know that if I'm fatter than I'm comfortable with, I feel I don't deserve to be alive. So count me out of the proud fat people. It's not going to happen for me in this lifetime. That's funny. I feel the same way.

I feel the same way. Oh, there's a role on my, like I said, there's a little bit of a role. And I do the whole battle. Like, so what? Yeah, me too. So what, are you going to kill yourself? Yeah. Really? It's that bad are you going to kill yourself? Yeah.

Really? It's that bad that you don't deserve to live? And it's like, well, I don't deserve to be seen by anybody. Exactly. I mean, I don't deserve. And then when you go outside with your roll, you're like, ugh. Cover it up. You just feel like, and then like, do you ever feel like if you have a little roll somewhere

else, you're like, my neck is like, I have three chins now. But I do. What? I have. I have three chins now. But I do. What? I have. And it's not fat. It's like loose muscle. Oh. So, yeah.

No. And then I just go, all right. Yeah. So what? I have a whole battle. Right. All the time. Why can't I just accept myself?

Yes. And I end up with, oh, so what? I mean, so, all right. You're older. That's a good thing. Why is that a bad thing? No, I know. I do that too.

I do it. Yeah. You know? And I don't, and I, you know, I'm okay, but I'm not comfortable. But if, like, for me to be really comfortable, how, like, would you have to be emaciated? Have you ever gotten really skinny and people are like, are you okay? And you're like, I'm no i i well unfortunately for a woman yeah if you're underweight yeah you look good yeah yeah and that's all i ever got and when i

was too thin yeah i was sick all the time. Like with colds? A cold, sinus infection. Oh, really? Some kind of flu. Yeah, I was always sick. And you managed it though? You were like, you know, like you kept, you were skinny on purpose? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, for sure. Because you see yourself on TV. Yeah. And it's that, oh my God, I'm just a mountain of a girl. And I'm already bigger than Courtney and Jennifer right right so taller bigger yeah like my bones feel bigger I just felt like this mountain of a woman yeah next to them so tell me about this improv teacher oh she was phenomenal she was um what'd you learn that was like that was that like the only thing you learned?

No, the first thing I learned was commitment. Because that first class she kept saying, commit, commit. I was like, I don't even know what's happening. I just know everybody up there, I'm embarrassed for them. They're like lifting a disc and turning it into a three-act play.

I'm like, oh no, I can't. I don't think this is for me. Seems like a waste. I can't. I don't think this is for me. Yeah. Seems like a waste of time. Seems silly. Don't think this is for me. Mm-hmm. And so then next week,

I was debating whether to give the whole thing up or, oh, just go, just go. Paid for the classes. And so I was late. Nice try. I tried it. And I went, and I was late, and people were already asking, do you want to go?

I was like, no, no, I don't want to be rude and interfere with what's happening. And again, they were like throwing a space ball or something. And I was like, oh, good God. And then there was one guy who was actually just throwing a ball. Yeah. And he wasn't making a meal out of it. Right. It just looked like, oh, it just looks like he's throwing a ball.

It's not a performance. Yeah. He was comfortable. Oh, God, that's commitment. That's what she's talking about. And that's not embarrassing. Oh, commitment is what keeps it from being embarrassing. Right.

Because you're just committed to it and you're just doing it. Right. You're not self-conscious. Oh, the penny dropped. Yeah. And I thought, oh, and that guy's, I like him. And I went and talked to him. Who was that?

We had Conan O'Brien. And that was Conan O'Brien. And it was. It was Conan O'Brien. It really was Conan. And he was just kind of just throwing the ball? He was just good. Yeah.

He wasn't making a whole thing out of it. Yeah. And so I just like kept my eye on him. Like he was sort of my touchstone. He's evolved to make a whole thing out of most things now. Like I don't know what happened between then and sitting next to him on his show, but he'll make a whole thing pretty quickly and very big. Yeah. Yeah.

I guess it's just a different skill set. But then he's making fun of the fact that he's making a thing out of it. Yeah. Whereas others in the group, that was the goal. And that's when you met him, he was in the class too,

so he wasn't in the groundlings? Yeah, they wouldn't take him either. He'd been too busy on the Harvard Lampoon. Yeah. And, you know. No performing chops. And no performing chops, yeah. But he was funny then.

He was really funny. He's a very smart fellow. Yeah, super smart. Not easy on himself, that guy. No, I mean, all of his humor was, you know, the self-deprecating stuff.

Which was what was so appealing because, oh, he's not being mean. He's not taking anybody down but himself. Right. So that's nice. And that's, did you, you guys dated, right? Very briefly.

Oh, really not long? Yeah, really briefly. We were meant to be friends. Yeah, and you're still friends? Yeah. He's always been nice to me and I like him. I did his podcast. He's done mine.

I've done his show a million times. Yeah. And at some point I realized, like, it's not easy for this guy getting through the day. But he's, I mean, but he works on it. Well, that's what he's, like, he overworks. I mean, like, he's like. Oh, I don't mean professionally. Oh, you mean the.

He works on. On himself. I need to be there. Yeah. You know, as a husband, as a father. That's good. I mean, he, from as long as I've, not as long as I've known him. Right.

But when he realized, ooh, I'm going to need relationships and, you know. Yeah. He made it a priority to work on. And he's okay. Which I think is admirable. He's doing all right. Oh, yeah. He's a very tall fellow. No, yeah. He's a very tall fellow.

No, yeah. He's not small. No, big boy. So, all right. Super tall. So the penny dropped and you start committing. I started committing, yeah. And so, yeah, that was it.

She was great. Well, I find with improv, like I didn't do it. Like I come from standup, but like it seems that with improv, because of exactly what you're talking about, you do sort of find innately what is exactly funny about you, right? And how to kind of apply it to whatever. You can, yeah. I think anyone can be funny. Yeah.

I do. And with improv, your instincts kind of get honed with other people, which is nice. Yeah. Because there's other people involved. With stand-up, you're just sort of like, I'm going to go say these things and make all these fuckers laugh. No, but you're still listening and paying attention.

Sure. You're getting constant feedback, whether you're aware of it or not. Oh, I'm very aware of it. You are aware of it. Yeah. You are still in a dance with the audience. I can tell. You make adjustments and alterations, right?

When you do stand-up? Yeah. Of course. Well, I don't know how many... dance with the audience and you make adjustments and alterations when you stand up yeah of course well i don't know how many like you do make adjustments but i've gotten to the point where like i can identify a laugh in an audience when i hear it the first time like i'll have to do like 20 minutes of an hour show and i'll hear a laugh that i hadn't heard before i'll be like really 20 minutes in that's the first one you got i mean i would have noticed that before it took me 20 that was the joke yeah like so i'm very attuned yeah well it's also just like flying straight into the

truth yeah right it's always okay and then you know what's funny i I never was interested in doing stand-up, really, because it's too much work. But I took a class, and the first five minutes, each of us would have to go up and do five minutes of stand-up. Because his point was, the audience is uncomfortable if you're uncomfortable. If you're okay with everything, then the audience is more inclined to laugh. I wish I'd known that the first 15 years of my career. Even if what you're saying

isn't hilarious. If what you're saying is hilarious, then it's great. And so I felt like that was true. If you can just pretend to be okay with everything. Right. Not happy, but just, I'm okay.

Pretend to be comfortable. You're pissing me off. Right. Like you're just comfortable. Right. Yeah, I didn't do it that way. But you do that now. I'm very comfortable.

Yeah. Yeah, but it's real. Yeah. But I pretended to not be afraid for a long time, but that just looked like anger. Not hilarious. But that works too. Oh, no. Well, I've noticed this about improvisers too and certain types of people.

There's a type of anger that's funny, but it can't be literally like lashing out at the audience. Right. Like if you're like, oh, this world, I can't take it. Yeah, that's that cranky business. Me against the world. That's funny. Like, how come everything keeps shitting on me? Right.

That's funny. But like, you guys suck. Yeah, no. Not as funny. Yeah, you can't be angry at the people that came to see you. You're my parents. I don't like either of you. Although that's kind of funny.

Yeah. Well, that's it. Yeah. I used to say that. It took me years to realize that Hollywood wasn't my parents. I'm here. Just as stingy with the money. For sure.

Now, you did okay. You got out under the wire. I know. You got in under the wire. We caused the wire. You did. You broke it. I think. You guys broke it. You took all the money. I know. You got in under the wire. We caused the wire. You did. You broke it. I think. You guys broke it. I think. You took all the money. Well, no.

Otherwise, they wouldn't have paid us what we asked for. Yeah. But, yeah, no,

we were, I thought the smartest thing in the world was the six of us saying, yeah, you can fire any one of us and still do the show

because, yes, everyone's replaceable. Sure. But all of us are not replaceable. That was quite the... Revelation. You took on show business. And I got a figure at that point in that show, you're kind of like, what the fuck do we have to lose?

I mean, it was like, what, nine years in? I mean, there had to be... No, eight. Eight years in? I don't know. Yeah, I mean, was like what nine years in I mean there had to be eight years in I don't know yeah I mean was there something we got flack from our first renegotiation when we wanted a hundred thousand an episode right a lot of flack like well that's a lot of money what a nerve yeah yeah and then it just became the biggest thing ever like fine all right we want a million you still make money off gonna hate us anyway yeah don in episode. You still make money off it now. You're going to hate us anyway.

Yeah, don't you? What? You still make money off it. Yeah. It's on Netflix, right? It's on Netflix, and it still is in syndication. It's crazy. They thought Netflix would kill syndication.

Hasn't. It boosted syndication. Did it? Well, not everyone has Netflix, but everyone wants to be able to. Kids discovered it on Netflix. Want to watch it, yeah. But if you don't has Netflix, but everyone wants to be able to, like kids. Yeah. Discovered it on Netflix. Want to watch, yeah.

But if you don't have Netflix, you have to watch it somewhere. And it's always on somewhere and you can just sort of sit there and like, oh, there it is. And all over the world,

it's on in syndication. It's crazy. It's great. It is great, but like you are that person to so many people. Yes. That's fine.

It's fine with you. Yeah. Yeah. But wait, so the Groundlings, who was in it with you? How'd you get, you finally got in? Yeah, I got, yeah. Take the classes. You know.

And is your dad happy with this? Very. What's your mom do? My mom is retired. She was a travel agent. That's what they do. Yeah. Doctor's wife sometimes become travel agents. Yeah. Or real agent. That's what they do. Yeah. Doctor's wife sometimes become travel agents or real estate brokers.

She did different things. Yeah. My mom splattered painted sweatsuits for a while and then opened a boutique. Really? Yes. And how'd it go? It's okay. It's all right.

She's still doing it. No. I think she tried to be a travel agent, but that didn't pan out. But she had the kit. And then later she got into real estate. She wasn't that great at it. She's okay now. She's just retired.

She's good. But your folks are happy with your comedic decisions. Yeah. My mom was nervous for a while. It's scary. Because it took like eight, nine years before I could support myself. What did your brother end up doing? Neurologist.

Oh, so they were like, we got one. I don't think they, they were never worried about us. And my sister was married to a great guy and, you know, she has two. Now they're grown. Yeah. They were never worried about us. But I mean, my sisters told me my mom was actually worried about me. Well, they are because they're worried about security.

It's just like, what are you going to do if things don't go well? Yeah. For my mom, I think mostly it was always, how are you going to find a husband? Oh, yeah. You know, and with biology, it was, you got to lighten up. So, yes, maybe with the acting thing, she'll lighten up and then meet someone. Maybe she'll start flirting. Like that's got to be part of the behavioral repertoire.

It's just not, you know. It wasn't your focus? No. This is your first husband? Uh-huh. Not that long, right? That we've been married? Yeah.

I mean, 24 years. That's a long time. Yeah. Oh, so you found a guy and you stayed with him for a long time. Yeah. Oh, it worked out. Yeah. I thought for some reason it was new. I's a long time. Yeah. Oh, so you found a guy and you stayed with him for a long time. Yeah. Oh, it worked out. Yeah. I thought for some reason it was new.

I learned how to commit. Yeah. From Cynthia Seghetti. Who was in your Groundlings crew? So Julia Sweeney. Oh, yeah. We were in the company together. I've talked to her.

And when she got on Saturday Night Live. Yeah, she's so good. She's so talented oh my god and kathy griffin ah yes kathy griffin who you know she's a really good person no i agree with you yeah yeah i think that's not fully understood definitely knows how to commit she knows how to commit well she was great at in-between sketches. You just send her out to talk to the audience. Oh, right.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And she was hilarious and great. And she would do song improvs, which I think are really hard. Yeah, they are hard. So good. Make up a song. You really can't be embarrassed with that stuff. No.

I remember voting in Will Ferrell. He's very funny. Oh, my God. He could do it so quickly. But he's very serious when you talk to him. And even if he just does it a little bit, you're like, oh, you did it. It's so wild to have that kind of weird magical power. Because he just turns one little switch and it's just like fucking funny.

Yeah. No, beyond. Yeah. I watched that whole Sherlock Holmes movie. Not a funny movie, but's just like fucking funny. Yeah. No, beyond. Yeah. I watched that whole Sherlock Holmes movie. Not a funny movie, but you just wait for a couple moments. Well, but what about the other guys? That movie still makes me laugh out loud every single scene. And I don't understand why there wasn't a second one.

I don't understand. Was that McKay? I think it was an early McKay movie, wasn't it? Those movies, I don't understand those movies. Because they don't play anything real. The movie you just did that I watched, Booksmart. Oh, yeah. That's good, isn't it?

It's good. I thought that movie was great. And I hadn't seen a lot of those kids. No, I know. Isn't that fun? Yeah. They're so good. Yeah.

I loved that movie. Why do you end up doing movies now? Like, what was the process of that one? Because you can do whatever you want. Did you like Olivia or were you friends with her? Didn't she direct it? She directed it, yeah. No, no, it's not that we were good friends or anything.

I just thought, I like it. It's a day. I mean, it was one day. That was how I chose right right to do they asked you and I didn't have to leave town right yeah right yeah yeah I don't have to leave town now I'm more I think I'm okay to leave town and and what and work more oh really ready even if it's inconvenient. I went to Manchester, England

to shoot four episodes. You were in Manchester? I didn't get a sense of it. I was only there for a minute. Yeah. To shoot four episodes of the genealogy show? No.

Do you know Mae Martin? No. She's a comedian. Yeah. And she has her own show for Netflix and E4. Okay. And I'm playing her mother.

I don't know what E4 is. It's a UK network. Oh, and you play her mother? Mm-hmm. And you had a good time? Yeah. And you were there for what? How long?

I did. Nine days. That's all right. That's good. But you're probably ready to come home, right? Sure. You're good for nine days. I think I, yeah, I did that, yeah.

About nine days, though. I don't know. Let's see what I can do. Okay. I think I, yeah, I did that, yeah. About nine days, so. I don't know, let's see what I can do. I'm willing to test it again, but I didn't want to for a long time. Yeah, so when you're in the groundlings with all these people, did SNL, you never tried out for it? Yeah, they came once, and I was told they were looking at me

and Julia Sweeney. Kathy Griffin was told they were looking at her. Heather Morgan was told they were looking at me and Julia Sweeney. Right. Kathy Griffin was told they were looking at her. Heather Morgan was told they were looking at her. Heather Morgan. What happened to Heather Morgan? She was so trippy, man. She's amazing. She was great.

Yeah. Great talent. Yeah. I've not seen her in so long. Yeah. I knew her in New York. Uh-huh. Like I remember seeing, I think a one person show.

Yeah. And it was like, what the fuck? Dad cancer, fear in boys or something. Yeah. What the fuck? Dad Cancer, Fear and Boys or something. Yeah. No, she's unbelievable. What's she doing? Just writing. Huh.

Yeah. I haven't seen her in so long. I haven't heard that name in so long. I remember being so like, this person's from another world kind of person. No, she's the real deal. Yeah. Like a real artist. Right. Like Maria, like Bamford. You're like, where does this come from? Yeah's the real deal. Yeah. Like a real artist. Right, like Maria,

like Bamford. You're like, where does this come from? Yeah, yeah. Huh. Yeah. So you're all auditioning. So we all thought that,

but I think they were there to see Julia for sure. Right. Yeah. And she got it. Yeah. And you never tried again? No.

Hmm. No. I mean, the Groundlings was pretty competitive and I had heard SNL was a pretty competitive play. So I never felt like, shoot, that's what I need to be doing. Yeah, I mean, I don't think it's for everybody. You assume once you learn that this is how you get into show business,

that you assume, like, who doesn't want to be on Saturday Night Live? I don't know. Some people don't. Yeah. And you just started acting is that what happened yeah i was in a play that robin schiff wrote and she had been a grounding yeah yeah she had been a grounding and she had a play called ladies room that was my first audition for a backers audition for ladies room a backers audition backers i mean like yeah you're you're if there's a fallout, if someone doesn't show up? No, like in order to mount the play, they needed backers to finance the production.

So there was an audition for like Aaron Spelling and Doug Kramer. Okay. And I auditioned to play one of two idiot girls. Yeah. It was called Ladies Room. Okay. And I got it. That was my first audition and I got it for the backers audition. Yeah. It was called Ladies Room. Okay. And I got it. That was my first audition and I got it for

the backers audition. Okay. And so then I was in the play. Yeah. And our two characters, Romy and Michelle were who those two characters were. Oh, and that became a movie. And then later, later, later, later it became a movie. Written by the same person. Robin Schiff. She decided to make it a movie.

Well, she had tried before. Yeah. And also there was a movie. Written by the same person. Robin Schiff. She decided to make it a movie. Well, she had tried before. Yeah. And also, there was a pilot. Yeah, for a TV show. For Romeo and Michelle, for us. This was her wife's work. It was. Well, not really.

She did a lot of other things. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, yeah, and then that was my first audition. And then it just took off from there? It came way later. Yeah, I got some auditions. From that? From the play.

That was great. And my first guest star on Cheers. That was exciting? That was good. Yeah, that was exciting. And it was good to see that all that stuff like, oh my God, how could it ever end? And then nothing. Really?

Yeah. After Cheers? For a few years for really yeah for a few years yeah for a few years oh my god so that was all good stuff to see oh it goes up and down just stay with it it goes up and down right okay good were you just doing like tv at the beginning you know like guest star stuff yeah and you know movie role here and there. Little ones? Yeah. Like it says, like you worked with Newhart? Yeah.

He's the best. Two times. Two different shows. Romy and Michelle, Christy Meller and I were in the finale, the series finale of the Newhart show, that phenomenal thing

where he wakes up with Suzanne Plachette. We were in that. So that was so exciting to be there and there's Suzanne Plachette like We were in that. So that was so exciting to be there. And there's Suzanne Plachette like, well, I don't know. I don't say anything about what this is. Yeah. It was so exciting. We were the wives of Larry, Daryl, and Daryl. That was like, I interviewed him. It was such an honor somehow. Bob Newhart? Yeah.

Yeah. Well, then he had a show, Bob, and I played Tom Poston's daughter, Kathy. I had a recurring role. And Bob Newhart remembered me. From Bob? Years later. From that. From Bob. Wow. That's thrilling. Yeah, it is. Yeah. Because it's really exciting to meet these old comedy heroes.

I know. And he's nice. He's a really decent, good person. He's also just hilarious. So funny. The timing, right? So funny. Tim Conway just passed away. He did?

Today. Today? Yeah. Oh, no. Sorry, I didn't mean to be the one to tell you. Oh, I went to school with Tim Conway Jr. Did you go to school with Paul Thomas Anderson too? I don't think so.

No, no. Because Paul Thomas Anderson's dad and Tim Conway were like best friends. Yeah, I think he's a little older. He went to Taft High School, I think, or Birmingham. Paul Thomas Anderson? Yeah. I don't know, where'd you go?

Taft. But you think he was a little older? I think so, that's what I'm trying to remember. Well, maybe he's not, I don't know. Where'd you go? Taft. But you think he was a little older? I think so. That's what I'm trying to remember. Well, maybe he's not. I don't know. Yeah, but you didn't know him. I don't know.

Oh, yeah. So you knew Tim's son? Tim. Yeah. He's Tim Conway Jr. I guess. I think he was ill for a little while with the Alzheimer's or something. But he passed away today.

He's very funny, too. That generation's going. Yeah guess, and it happens. Yeah. Do you think about death? Yeah, I mean, I try not to. Yeah, but it's right there all the time. Because I don't like that we don't get to know what that is. You're kind of a little control freak, a little bit?

I think so, yeah. I try not to be. I try to control it. So what is the process to, like I know you've got quite a resume, but Friends, like 236 episodes? Okay, yeah. Wow.

That's a lot. I know I don't remember any of them. But they have it separated on this. What? Did you play your sister too? Oh yeah, Ursula. Right, so it says main role, 236 episodes, recurring role, eight episodes.

That's funny, is that IMDb? No, it's on Wiki. Oh, recurring role, yeah. Well, because also Ursula was from Mad About You. Right, right, that's where the character originated? Ursula. Yeah. Yeah, Ursula was from Mad About You. Right. Right. That's where the character originated? Ursula. Yeah. Yeah.

Ursula did. She showed up. So when did that? I don't know the whole history of Friends. But Friends, Phoebe wasn't really like Ursula. Right. Not really. Right.

Yeah. I had a recurring role on Mad About You. And because of that, David Crane, who created Friends, his boyfriend, Jeffrey Cleric, was a writer on Mad About You. And he's like, oh, you should see her for Phoebe. And the rest is history. And I got to. And then we were on right after Mad About You. So it was, well, you're going to see the same blonde head and voice.

Was it a problem? After a half hour later. So, yeah. Oh, you did a lot. You were Ursula on there a lot. Yeah. But the character's different a little. Yeah.

I thought, I mean, to me it was. You know, what you see on the outside, I don't know if it feels that different. But, you know, I mean, she was really dense. You were coming from a totally different place she was dense how much do you how did those relationships

sustain like you know after working with those people for 10 years do you talk to the other ones yeah I mean the girls more than the guys right but yeah we all still get along we had dinner Really? Yeah. Which ones? I mean, the girls more than the guys. Right.

But yeah, we all still get along. We had dinner a couple years ago. Everybody? Everybody for the first time since we were finished. Where'd you eat? At Jennifer's house. Oh. Yeah.

Yeah, where were we going to go? You know, that would be weird. See, what about that part of a celebrity life? Yeah. What about that? Well, I don't feel like it's so bad for me. Right. You know, I mean, I'm married to a regular person. Really?

Yeah. What's he do? He was in advertising. He's retired. Oh, you're married to a retired advertising guy. Uh-huh. Did he have his own company? Yeah. Oh, so he sold it. Yeah. Oh, that's married to a retired advertising guy. Uh-huh. Did he have his own company? Yeah.

Oh, so he sold it. Yeah. Oh, so that's good. Yeah. So it's not that bad for you. But during the heyday of it, it must have been kind of intense. Yeah. But you didn't mind it.

No, no, I did. Oh, you did? Yeah, because I don't like crowds. And they would gather? Sometimes. Yeah? You know, but you try to avoid that. Yeah.

You know, like I can't even go to concerts, not because of celebrity, but because I don't like crowds. Do you have that? And clubs, never. No way. Just too many people around? Yeah. I get nervous. Uh-huh.

You know, like when you see like a club and everyone's stampeding out and 10 people die or, you know, like. That one time that happened that well there was a rash of that happening but i guess so i realized it in college we were waiting in line for a concert at the chapel and we were all tightly packed in line yeah and like the person behind me was like i could feel them and i wanted to punch them right like i got i felt really violent yeah well you know the feeling where the whole crowd is moving and no one really has and I wanted to punch them. Right. Like I got, I felt really violent. Yeah. Well, you know the feeling where the whole crowd is moving

and no one really has control? That's horrifying. Oh no, right. The worst feeling where you're like, what's happening? And no one can answer the question

because it's just happening. Yeah. Yeah, that's terrible. So that for you too? I don't like that shit. Is an issue? Yeah.

Can you be at a concert? I can. Where everyone is? Well, I don't go up to the stage. But sometimes I'm like, I can't get up there. But sometimes if I do it, I'm like, I'm glad I came up here. But who am I really seeing now?

Usually the concerts I go to, it's people my age standing around. So if you're sitting up front, you're like, are we going to stand? Or no, is anyone else standing? Well, I think we can stay seated. Let's just stay in the seats. It's on the legs let's just sit down oh fuck that guy's standing i guess we're up here we go but i get like anywhere it's okay if we can leave just a few minutes before everybody else oh always yeah it's the best i did a whole bit about that it's actually better than the show.

Getting out successfully before everybody else. That feeling of like, we fucking did it. We're out. Oh my God. It's like walking within a crushing herd. No, no, no. I don't like too much of anything. Can't you get backstage?

I think you can get backstage if you had your people call. If you want to go to something. I don't know if you know this about being who you are but you could probably make a couple calls and you know get pretty good seats but but backstage probably the side stage yeah well i mean i have i i went see ya as a friend and she wanted me to go see her and i was like ah she said no no it'll be okay you'll see and i brought my son and it was it was fine yeah it was great you guys hang out yeah not lately she was doing this project and so she was really busy but so you all go to dinner jen's house and how'd that go great i mean we just laughed the whole night it was was really fun. Yeah? Yeah. And everybody's got their own lives now.

Yeah. It's wild. Yeah. And everyone's pretty happy? Yeah. Huh. Seems to be. I mean, you would assume that.

How could they, you know? I mean, you see a lot of Jen somehow in the world. Right. There's never a non-Aniston time. That's true. That's completely true. No matter what. Even if she's notiston time. That's true. That's completely true. Even if she's not doing anything, she's around. Oh, there she is.

She's on that. Oh, there's Jen. Yeah. Oh, look, she's on that thing. Yeah. Yeah. She's a really happy person. That's good to know.

Yeah. Yeah. Don't need to worry about her. So it seems like when you did the comeback, though, you can do the dramatic thing. Yeah. Do you like doing that? Yeah.

Is that what you want to do now, you think? Yeah, I wouldn't mind. There's something to me a little easier about that. About being, oh, about not being, about being. Yeah, funny, you know. Funny's hard. Which kind of funny? Which tone of funny?

Which level? How broad? How, what's, you know? Yeah, funny, you know. Funny's hard. Like, which kind of funny? Which tone of funny? Which level? How broad? How, what's, you know? Yeah, yeah. There's so many possibilities. But you're one of those people where it's sort of like you do a thing. I do?

Yeah. Okay, what is that? You just did it. Oh. Like, you know, what's that? Like, I mean. You like have at least a thing that you do. And I imagine when people hire you,

they're like, do more of your thing or less of your thing. Yeah, maybe. Serious movies though. I'm trying to remember. Cause the comeback, you were kind of intense.

I mean, that was not. Oh yeah, it was up and down. It was, it was like, to me, I laughed out loud that first season.

It made me laugh just. Sure. From start to finish. And I know it was very disturbing to other people which i didn't fully understand why because they they couldn't they they could they assumed it was you because the similarities were were too much for them to bear because like i see you now not similarities i mean you're you're a pleasant person you seem happy with your life you have your problems and you you chew too much nicotine gum and you worry about your weight and

you try to manage things that are out of your control. But aside from that. In general, I'm fine. I mean, it's like the normal range of neuroses. I mean, yeah. Exactly. But I think that people who grew to love you as Phoebe, then you do this show and they're like, oh, my God, she's miserable. But I wasn't miserable. I know that, but they don't know. And she wasn't miserable. I think, but honestly, because Michael Patrick King, we did that together and we were working on that. He said he had a moment where he just went, uh-oh.

I went, what? He said, I think we have a point of reference for this character as a man yeah there's no point of reference for this character for a woman you mean a washed up sitcom star yeah who's still trying to get on that treadmill and right you know ambitious and you know humiliate will humiliate herself for the sake of the spotlight. So there was no precedent? Is that what he was saying? That we could go like, like so-and-so.

Right. There's no frame of reference for this. And it might be too ahead of the curve for that. And I was like, I don't understand. That doesn't make sense to me. Women are just as ambitious as men. I didn't even register until then we were canceled. And two things happened.

First was artists, you know, writers and people would say that was a fantastic show and the network made a mistake. The executives, you know, mostly men. Right. Like straight men. Yeah. They, like straight men, were like, yeah, wonder why, why do you think it didn't work? Because it didn't work. I was like, well, it worked. I mean, the ratings were fine.

Yeah, oh, really, not the ratings? I said, well, I think maybe because she's a woman. Yes, that's it. I think that's it. Yes. So there are. I think that's it. Yes. So there are two things in that. One of them is, oh, it's a woman. We don't have a point of reference.

Women shouldn't humiliate themselves because we need to take care of their victims. They're not in the power position, so don't make fun of them. The other part was the business people were not questioning a business decision by HBO. The artists were saying, oh, they made a mistake. But the business people were like, no, no, it's justified somehow. Let's figure out.

We'll work backward from there. I don't know. And then they made another one. Yeah. Nine years later. What was that? Were you holding onto it for that long, or whose idea was that?

How did that happen? That was, no, the network was like, you know what, we're about to redo this and redo that. Why don't we redo that? I think the audience, our audience, would like to see that. And have that one go over. I think great.

Yeah. Great, yeah. But you didn't want to do more? No. Hmm. Hmm. No, they didn't want to do more. Oh, they didn't?

They didn't want to do more. That's so fucking crazy, isn't it? Because I don't think the ratings were that great. It's sort of like a cult thing. On HBO? Was it HBO? Yeah, HBO. I think it's more of a cult thing.

It's weird now. Now with Netflix, I'm on a show on Netflix, right? Wait, which one is that? Glow. Oh, yeah. Okay. And you don't know. They run things like if it's not huge, you know, like three, two, three seasons,

three, four seasons, right? We're done. Yeah. But on some level, isn't four seasons enough? Really? Yeah. I mean, isn't that really enough? It should be, but it wasn't before because there was syndication.

But Netflix doesn't have to worry about syndication. And also, like, I realized, too, is, like, you know what happens, like, with Friends or anything else? Is that, you know, you're employing a lot of people. Yeah. So whether or not you're sick of it, or the stories run out, or you're repeating yourself, it's like, yeah, but like. Couple hundred people have a job.

Yeah. Yeah, I know. You feel that, I bet. Yeah, that's what's too bad. But you know, the other thing is, that's the argument that's never taken to Sacramento for California, like the tax yeah rebates for shooting right in this state yeah it's not because i know their argument is we can't give a tax credit to you know steven spielberg right you know that's just so you're saying they should

shoot more there's incentive in it to shoot they They should because it's not Steven Spielberg. It's not the people who have money that you're giving a tax break to. Yeah. It's the people, the hundreds of people who work on a production. It's the businesses surrounding this industry that you are supporting when you allow people to shoot here. Right. But I guess the state's just sort of like, oh, they're making so much money. Let's take it.

Yeah. Right? And then people are like, we're going to Albuquerque. We're going to Vancouver. Louisiana. Now I hear Puerto Rico. South Africa. Really?

Yes. Productions are going all the way to South Africa? Yeah. Just to do a sitcom? Yeah. That's do a sitcom? Yeah. That's crazy. Crazy. So you worked with Jane and Lily?

Yeah. Had you worked with her before? Oh, yeah, I love Lily. Yeah, yeah, because we did a thing called Web Therapy, and she played my mother. Oh, right. She was fantastic. And what happened to that show? That show got canceled.

We were on Showtime. Does it hurt your feelings? No. For you, it's just part of the business? Yeah, I don't take it personally. But this genealogy show keeps going. We're back on NBC. We started on NBC.

They canceled us. Yeah. And then TLC picked us up. Yeah. And now we're back on NBC. They canceled us. Yeah. And then TLC picked us up. Yeah. And now we're back on NBC. Well, that's a good story. It's great. It's unprecedented. And you love doing it. I love doing it with all my heart. Now, I haven't watched it. Do you travel with them when they go to these places? I don't. Oh, you don't. I would if someone really wants me to. Oh, but you'll have a subject and then you'll take them to where their ancestral roots are?

Yes, they're walking in the footsteps of their ancestor. Yeah. It's unbelievable. The stuff that blows me away is like we did Josh Groban and he went to Germany where he had like a great, great, great, great, great, great.

It was like the 17th century. Yeah. And that guy's at this college, right? And it's right after like Lutheranism took over, you know, or maybe it was before that. Are these Jews? No, this one was not. No, no, no. And you see what he did in school.

He had to work as a musician to teach music, and his instrument was his voice. No. Josh Groban. Way, way, way, way back. See, that kind of stuff's wild. And his ancestor's instrument was his voice. That's crazy.

Just like Josh Groban. We're got to go. Someone's calling me. I'm just going to say stop. Are there like, do you have another thing to do? No. You have the watch? Yeah.

I stopped wearing it for a while and then I started wearing it again. Is it good? It seems too small. I mean. Too small for what? You can't read that? I can actually. Yeah.

That's not bad. No. But you can't read that. I can actually. Yeah. That's not bad. No, but you can't read news on there. No, no, that's not what I use it for. You just use it for what do I got to do? And Hey, well, it taps me. Like if I'm not breathing enough, I'm not kidding. Sometimes I just hold my breath. Yeah. Do you sometimes realize like, why am I holding my breath? No, I don't. That's the bad part. My husband, if we're on the phone, he'll say, well, you're not breathing. Why do we do that? I don't know.

Oh, I do know actually. Well, tell me. I do. What? It's because I feel like I can be more alert to my surroundings if that pesky breathing isn't interfering with what I'm hearing. So you're conscious of it. I just find myself doing it.

I'm like, all of a sudden, I'm like, why am I not breathing? Yeah, if I bend down to pick something up and it's taking me too long for whatever reason to do what I have to do, bending over, I get dizzy because I've stopped breathing. I've been holding my breath. Oh, that's weird, huh? what I have to do, bending over. Right. I get dizzy because I've stopped breathing. I've been holding my breath. Oh, that's weird, huh?

So I have to remind myself, you're allowed to breathe. Yeah. In and out. Oh, yeah, through this. When you are bending over. Like, you're allowed. I think when I stop breathing, it's usually a tense moment in my mind or with somebody where I'm like, maybe if I, something inside of me is like, if you're not breathing, you're

not here. Oh. Oh. Oh. Okay. What? Is that why I do it? No, I don't know. No, that's a good one.

That's a good one. God damn it. All right, so now what's happening now is the genealogy show is coming back. Yeah. You got the movie out, Booksmart, which is nice. It's a good, it's so good. And Olivia Wilde is the real deal. Yeah.

She's a director. There's a lot going on in that movie. I can't remember what it reminded me. Oh, you know what it reminded me of? What? Kind of. I might not be remembering it correctly. Remember that movie Go with everybody, with Sarah Pauly, Jay Moore, and like, you know,

Oliphant. I didn't see it. Well, there was just like a lot of young people, a lot of stuff going on from all angles. Like I remember that vibe. Like it just keeps moving. Yeah. What's the one, the real funny young woman,

Beanie, is that her name? Oh, Beanie Feldstein. Where'd she come from? She came from here She's like classic She grew up here You know who her brother is? Nope

Jonah Hill Oh that's his sister Right That makes sense Yeah They're funny people She makes sense too I mean she did

Theater in high school No I remember hearing that Because I remember him Saying his sister Beanie She's fantastic Naturally funny person She just is great Yeah Caitlin Deaver So good She's so good She's fantastic. Naturally funny person. She just is great. Yeah.

Caitlin Deaver was so good. She's so good. She's a good actress. Oh my God. Everyone in it was just so good. I agree with you. My God. Are you about to make a movie?

Is that why we were talking about it in sort of a cagey way about you, are you going out and doing it? Oh, making a movie? Yeah. No, I'm not about to make a movie. But I might about, I think I will if something doesn't happen, do a movie? No, I'm not about to make a movie. But I might about, I think I will,

if something doesn't happen, do a pilot. Yeah? Yeah. Really? It's on the table? Yeah. It's on the table. Does it look good?

It's on the table getting sorted out. Is it your show? No. Oh. Well, no. No? What are you going to do now? Are you going to go eat? Me? Yeah. Right now? Yeah, after this. No. Oh. Well, no. No? What are you going to do now? Are you going to go eat?

Me? Yeah. Right now? Yeah, after this. No. Oh. All right. Fat as I am.

No, I'm just kidding. Rolls? Do I deserve to eat? I don't know. I'm so like in my own ass with that right now. I don't go to restaurants because I can make it at home and I have control of that situation. Do you eat meat? Yeah. I like meat. It's good, right? I like it. I have control of that situation. Oh. Do you eat meat? Yeah. I like meat.

It's good, right? I like it. I have to eat less of it. Yeah? Why? Because cholesterol? No. No.

That's one thing I'm completely not worried about. But, yeah. It was good talking to you. You too. Do you feel like we've done everything we can? Yeah. Yeah. It was good talking to you. You too. Do you feel like we've done everything we can? Yeah. Yeah. At least.

And you're friends with everybody. Yeah. From the friends and everything. Oh, yeah. That's great. Yeah, why not? Well, I like that you guys sometimes hang out because I still have this weird idea about show business

even though I'm in it where if someone's in a movie, I'm like, do you guys hang out? Are you and Billy Crystal? No. Why would you? Yeah, no. I don't hang out with Billy Crystal. No, I'm like, you guys hang out? Are you and Billy Crystal? No. Why would you? Yeah, no. I don't hang out with Billy Crystal. No, I know,

but I just always assume that there's a camaraderie. He's one of those people where you just like, it's like, you know, you get the Tinder going. Like you just get like, oh, there it's going to catch.

You're just like, and then you just light up. If you just like blow a little smoke under Billy Crystal, you've got two hours on your hands. That's what's great about him because he'll tell you everything. Like there is no secret. There's no everything.

He's just an open book. And oddly sort of like still doesn't, like he's one of those guys that's driven by like, you know, I didn't really do his, like he's a little insecure for a guy who's done as much as he has. Who isn't? That's what always shocks me. When does that go away oh that's what always shocks me about every about all of us yeah what is that about because i got to go to therapy at four oh well stop bragging no but it's nice that you get to but there's some part that of of me and of performers that just don't ever think we're good enough.

Who did that? You. You did it. You did it. You don't seem insecure. Well, I have periods where I am for sure. But because that's all your decision. It is?

It's a decision. It's a state of mind. It's a- Science? Is it science? Well, there's a lot you can control. Yeah, act as if. Don't stop thinking about it. Yeah, a lot you can control. Act as if. Stop thinking about it.

Yeah, I think you're right. Create your own reality. Well, you've got to be careful with that. There is no reality. Yeah, that's right. I do believe that. Well, I mean, so do 35% of the country who believe that Hillary Clinton was involved in a pedophilia ring. Oh, well.

You have to acknowledge some of that. No, there's facts. But in the absence of facts, which is a big chunk of our existence. Day to day. There's a big chunk. Yeah. Where there are no facts. That's you decide.

You can decide. Yeah. To breathe. To breathe that people like you. Yeah. Or they don't. Sure. It doesn't matter.

Either way, you don't know one way or the other. So you might as well decide that they do. Why not? Because you know what I've learned over time? They're not even fucking thinking about you. No one's thinking about you. They're thinking about themselves. Everything a human being says to you has to do with themselves and not you.

Okay. Well, I'm glad we got that solved. Do you need therapy now? I'm wondering. Well, can we get my mother on the phone? Let me get my mother on the phone. After this talk? We just talked to my mother?

Thanks, Lisa. There you go. Wasn't she great? I like her. I love her. Just say love now. It's all about love. All about open heartedness.

Trying. I'm trying. Seriously. Oh, man. My chest chest hurts it does hey okay so okay the new movie book smart that lisa's in is in theaters this friday may 24th and you can watch the show friends anytime to the echo box on the Gibson Les Paul Deluxe through the old 1958 Fender amp. And now, you will hear that. so Thank you. Boomer lives. You can get anything you need with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs and mozzarella balls, yes, we can deliver that. Uber Eats, get almost, almost anything. Order now.

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