WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1033 - Jamie Lee

Episode Date: July 4, 2019

Jamie Lee started her career in close proximity to comedy, but not actually doing it. She was working in PR at Comedy Central and found herself around a lot of comics in a professional capacity. It wasn’t long before she caught the bug and was doing open mics in New York City. Jamie tells Marc about the influence of her parents, who were photographers for ZZ Top and later rock concert promoters and club owners. She also talks about working with Pete Holmes on Crashing and why the stress, shame and tension surrounding weddings made her write a book about getting married. This episode is sponsored by Google Fi. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis and ACAS Creative. What the fuck buddies. What the fucking ears. What the fucking Americans.

Yay. Fourth of July. This is it. This is it. I hope you could afford to park some tanks around your house this year. That seems to be the thing to do. Not quite a parade. But you know just park a few tanks around.

Or if you've got a truck. Or a Humvee. You know just park a few tanks around or if you've got a truck or a a humvee you know just something that looks you know slightly uh militaristic or or or you know daunting intimidating spectacular in the kind of armament type of way don't don't don't be afraid to put it out in the yard this year because that's uh that seems to be the theme established by the uh the man in the house and uh yeah just park them can't you know you can't drive them around because they'll just destroy the streets but you can have them towed in and just left around kind of like a half-assed military trade show of some sort and uh yeah you could do that how are you by the way uh jamie lee the comedian is

on the show today and uh she's got a couple books out she's got a podcast called couldn't help but wonder which is available wherever you get podcasts but it's the fourth of july i don't know i i don't know what i'm gonna do i do know i'm gonna i'm gonna be away you know this is my i don't know it's my my second Fourth of July in the new place. And I kind of am a little nostalgic for the ongoing firework activity in my old neighborhood. It's always kind of jarring, exciting. Because back in Highland Park, the Fourth of July officially starts in mid-June. But kind of goes on year-round and then picks up intensity today.

And I miss the excitement. There was one year on the 4th of July. I don't know if it was 4th of July or New Year's where a bullet fell out of the sky and shattered my back windshield. It wasn't shot into the windshield. It was literally a celebratory bullet that was shot into the sky. You're just excited. You know, there were those days where you just got to shoot shit off. And it fell out of the sky into my car and broke my windshield. Could have fallen into a head. You know, anyone known where it comes from?

The bullets do come down, fellas. I'm assuming. You know, I'm sorry. I don't want to be discriminatory or gender specific. People with the guns who get excited and shoot them up into the sky because it's that day. I know you're out at the lake. I get it. But what are you going to do today, folks?

What are you going to do on the 4th of July? I hope you have a safe 4th of July. I think I have a confession to make. a safe 4th of July. I think I have a confession to make. I'll decide if I'm going to get to it because it's a little heavy hearted about it. You have options today. You can reflect on what America and America's independence and freedom means to you and what we have to do in the future to guarantee that, or just be grateful for it, or be angry about the nature of it at this point in time. I got a few emails I need to address, but I'm not going to read them entirely, just to address the one who seemed to have a tremendous amount of heavy heartedness

about the possibility of me losing hope. I'm not losing hope. I'm filled with hope, but I'm also filled with objective, sort of practical and gut insight about what's happening in the world, but I'm not losing hope. I have a tremendous love of people, despite what you think, and I believe in the good in people. And I believe in the power of the people and all that. Not losing hope. So don't worry. Some days are better than others, but I'm not losing hope. The other one was sort of along those lines. It was a Canadian fan who tended to sense that occasionally there was a heaviness on the edge of my tone that, you know, he was a depressive guy. And, you know, I know that sensitivity.

You know, I have it with my father or my brother where you write when someone says, if you have the sensitivity, if someone says, hey, how you doing? And you can hear it. You're like, hey, how you doing? You know, just a little tug to it. There's a little tug to all the sentences, even if they're talking about good things or mundane things or food or whatever. There's just a little bit of a tug. And if you feel that tug, it's an empathetic tug in a way, but it's also just the part of the heart that gets sucked in immediately to someone else's pain if you were brought up in that way. So I cannot say

that I don't have that sometimes, but it's not biological. It's fleeting. It usually might be happening for a reason that I don't feel like talking about, but I'm not living in it and I appreciate your concern. I understand you feel the tug. the tug i get it so today you all right where are you where are you in the backyard you out by the lake are you cooking a pie are you uh by yourself just uh shunning the noise outdoors are you not going to go around and drive on the roads because of crazy drunk people possibilities. Yeah, maybe just a short list of things you should, you know, look, you know, if you be careful at the grill, all right, you know,

maybe the coals are lit, all right? You don't have to spray more fluid on it, even though that's fun. Well, you know what? Go ahead and do it. It's the 4th of July. Just stand back a little bit. It is exciting and it's a powerful feeling to just watch the fire go up. But be careful with it because you don't want your meat or fish or vegetables or whatever, your tofu dogs tasting like lighter fluid. So try to have more fun with

the other things that are meant to blow up on today than the coals that you know are probably still lit. Yeah, and in grilling, you know, don't burn yourself. Don't burn the meat. If a piece falls into the coals, you know, you might want to get it out because it's not a great smell and people are going to assume that you're burning everything. But enjoy the sausages. Enjoy the burgers. Enjoy the turkey. Enjoy the grilled onion. Grilled onion is nice today. And, you know, figure out how you're going to do the fish. Make sure it's a tight fleshed fish that can hold up on the grill or else maybe put it in a little foil, wrap it up with maybe some onion or peppers in there and do it like that, the salmon. Yeah, I'm just trying to help

out. Some other pointers. If you're out at the lake, make sure that the water is deep enough. Okay. We don't want any spinal injuries or people not surfacing. So before you just go jump off, because the guy who lives by the lake did it, make sure you understand what you're getting into so you don't break your bones. Also, maybe a little heads up that fuses in general, Uh, also maybe a little heads up that, uh, fuses in general, fuses are unpredictable. Uh, this applies to both humans and to that thing you're holding in your hand that you're about to light. Don't know how quick that thing's going to go. It can surprise you.

All of a sudden you just, you touch it to the flames and all of a sudden you're, you're missing a pinky. So, you know, make, be aware of the fuse. Maybe as my dad, you say, you say, you put the firecracker down, you light it, and you step back. But who can resist lighting that firecracker in your hand and winging it? I mean, you've got to wing a few firecrackers. You know what I mean?

If you went out of your way to get a brick of black cats, you can throw quite a few of them. Or that's the thing. Be careful with the bricks. If you're going to got a lot. You can throw quite a few of them or that's the thing. Be careful with the bricks. If you're going to light a brick of black cats, you know, not only is that fuse unpredictable, but man, it's pretty exciting because it's like, you know, they're all going to go, but they're also flying around. Like sometimes one of them will pop and I'll send a couple of ones, you know, out into the ether somewhere, right? Maybe on your shoe. And that's what to me and you don't see it because it's flying, and then there you go. Then you're missing a toe.

Not with a black cat, but it'll be jarring. For those of you who went out and pursued the sort of slightly illegal, more dangerous explosives, M80s or the bigger, don't light your dynamite too close to where everyone's eating. If you're dealing with sticks of dynamite or small vials of nitroglycerin, you know, make sure you got plenty of distance from, uh, uh, you and the family or the boat or whatever. Don't blow up the boat.

Don't blow up your family. If you're, if you're playing with dynamite, I think that's probably not many of my listeners, but there's gotta be a couple out there. And you know what? Don't, uh, you know, don't blow up the animals. How about just no, uh, no hate based fun, uh, this 4th of July. And if you're shooting guns into the air, make sure that the, you know, the, the bullets, there's an arc to where they're going to go and it's not on my car. Okay. How's that? That leads me to my confession. You know you know there there was always bad kids that you

know or mythological kids you heard who blew up frogs or blew up cats or with m80s just horrible horrible stories and um well i i you know in a more demonic moment just because you know i i felt you know you know pulled in by the devil. I tried to blow up a frog when I was a kid with a firecracker. And it wasn't close enough to the frog. I think I did. I think I blew off a couple of his little fingers, his little web fingers. But I'm happy to report that that frog continued to live in my backyard for a few years. And we called him Stubby. And I apologized to him personally. And now I'm apologizing to you.

And I just want to tell kids that if you are compelled to blow up animals or bugs or lizards, make sure you're a psychopath and not somebody with a conscience who's just doing it out of internal peer pressure. Because you you got to live with that. You're going to have to live with it for the rest of your life. Stubby, he ended up okay. He was okay, but I knew I'd done something horrible. And it is horrible. Don't blow up the animals. But enjoy. Enjoy. God bless America. And be careful out out there i'm going to keep it easy i'm going to keep it light um and i you know it is a holiday show i just want you know just be safe be reflective uh understand that there's hope that america is a great country and it could be better you know

who i'm talking to don't you yeah you do don't blow up any people this weekend or today. Be careful at the grill. Don't dive in too shallow waters. I'm sorry. Am I being parental? Please don't blow up any animals. Keep your fingers. Be careful with the guns.

Don't drink and drive. All right? God bless America. don't drink and drive all right god bless america so my guest today is jamie lee she has a podcast called uh couldn't help but wonder it's available wherever you get podcasts she's uh also a stand-up and has written a couple books wedding related i believe and we talked a little while ago and now you're going to hear us do that. Okay. All right. This is me and Jamie Lee. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category.

And I want to let you know, we've produced a special bonus podcast episode With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative.

Ontario Cannabis Store, and ACAS Creative. Death is in our air. This year's most anticipated series, FX's Shogun, only on Disney+. We live and we die. We control nothing beyond that. An epic saga based on the global best-selling novel by James Clavel. To show your true heart is to risk your life. When I die here, you'll never leave Japan alive. So, wait, you didn't hydrate?

How far did you run? I never pay attention to distance. I just pay attention to time. Yeah, and I've gotten really into, quote-unquote, making the treadmill fun by focusing on 30 second increments so every 30 seconds i do something different 30 seconds how does that even work 30 what do you mean it's just to sort of gamify running because running on a treadmill is so it's so inherently boring yeah that to gamify is that a word uh i i think so it definitely applies here in that like if you just go okay i'm gonna be on the treadmill for 30 minutes you'll hate it and think about that you'll just think about the time the whole time right but if you're like every 30 seconds i have

to be focusing on a change that's about to happen whether it's like raising the ramp on the treadmill or like increasing the speed or decreasing the speed, whatever it is, just mixing it up for that entire 30 minutes. You don't really think about how long you've been on. I get it. Yeah. So it's helped me do cardio because otherwise I hate doing cardio. Really? Yeah.

I hike up a mountain right down the street. You should go hike up the mountain at Brand Park. 40 minutes up. Are you like right by that mountain though to where you like getting to the map see for me my six minutes my mountain is like a 45 minute walk for my house oh which mountain um griffith oh right yeah but if i mean i could drive there quickly but if i wanted to take you to drive here uh it took me i don't know 15 minutes so you could go here yeah maybe i should drive up there

don't tell people where i live maybe i should start hiking in a remote location i'm i'm disclosed location i've not told any i'm not telling people okay they have to figure it out but i haven't we're actually live from wisconsin now. There you go, Wisconsin. Jamie Lee, what's your real name? Jamie Lee, Jamie Amanda Lee. Are you Jew? Yeah, on my mom's side. Just one?

Yeah. Just one Jew? Just one Jew. But my mom grew up in Teaneck, New Jersey. Yeah, I know where Teaneck, New Jersey is. Teaneck's interesting because- Where'd you grow up though? I grew up in Dallas, Texas because my dad's from Texas. Like he has lived there his entire life.

Really? How did your cowboy dad meet the Jew? They went to film school together in London. So my mom went to, she like dropped out of college. She went to like a small women's college. Which one? I think it was- Like Sarah Lawrence before they let men in? to like a small woman women's college which one um i think it was like sarah warrens before before

they let men in like it starts with an e like i don't remember somewhere in new jersey it's endicott oh wow endicott college yeah so she dropped out of endicott and very dramatically she like took a bus in the middle of the night and was like i'm out um yeah and then decided she wanted to up and move to london and back in the 60s like yeah yeah so she moved to london and then my dad also moved to london they went to the same film school and then they actually became like photography partners and they were photographers for zz top um when they got together yeah they like traveled around with zz top and then this is what your parents did that's what they did initially and then when i was born like what what era of zz top early on before the beards yeah yeah pre-beards yeah like so when they were uh a great rock band

yeah but wait so they okay so they meet in London. They're going to film school. Yeah. And then what, they come back to Texas? They went to Texas. My mom moved to Texas with my dad. So your mom fell in love with your dad in London. But is this film school like photography film or motion picture film?

I think it was all of it. Not clear. The school was called the London Film School, and I don't know that it still exists. And they're both photographers? Not anymore. So they did photography for a while together, and they were partners. With ZZ Top. With ZZ Top.

And they had a studio of their own? Did they do other things other than ZZ Top? Not at the time. At the time, they were just traveling around taking pictures. Of ZZ Top. Of ZZ Top. For how long? I actually don't know.

I just know that when my mom got pregnant with me or maybe right before. It might have been after a ZZ Top show. Yeah, I know. I'm like, is my dad one of the beards? Who knows? I don't really look like my dad, so maybe. But yeah, so then they moved back to Dallas and decided to be more sort of stationary. And they opened a rock club together called The Hot Club with a K.

Club with a K. This is when you were a baby. This is when I was really little. You're the first kid or the only kid? I'm the only kid. Wow. Yeah. So then from there, they sort of stayed in Dallas and then they became club owners and concert promoters.

Really? Yeah. They owned, you actually, I don't know. I feel like you're, who knows? and then they became club owners and concert promoters. Really? Yeah. They owned, you actually, I don't know. I feel like you're, who knows? Maybe you went to one of their venues at some point if you ever visited Dallas. I didn't. Dallas is not a big stop for me. Houston a couple times.

Austin. I'm going to Dallas now. But so they were part of the rock scene in the 80s? Yes, 80s and 90s. Really, their business really took off early 90s. Club owners. Club owners. So they owned these two venues.

They were right next door to each other. One was called Deep Elm Live, and the other one was called The Bomb Factory. And Deep Elm Live was slightly smaller. So it was interesting who would play it. Because the venues weren't that different, but one was slightly smaller so it was interesting who would play it because the venues weren't that different but one was slightly smaller so like it's interesting because it's like green day would play deep elm live like when dookie first came out right but then like but sublime or silver chair played the bomb factory and it's like so interesting because you're like oh green day became like this massive success and you know sublime is as well but then you're like oh silver chair was kind of

like a one-hit wonder over here yeah what was that hit i don't even remember i remember the song i had the record with the frog on the frog yeah yeah i had the one song on it yeah oh i don't remember what it was i don't either doesn't matter good song yeah it was yeah i mean i listened to it a few times yeah i wish i could remember what it was it sounded like other songs of the period yeah i never got into silver i never got into that album actually i think i had the album because i got promotional copies of a lot of cds so i listened to everything at least once so you're growing up there like so by the time you're a teenager your your parents have these rock clubs yeah and they're concert promoters so they're also doing concerts at other venues around dallas you're like you probably got a lot of friends who are you're like i can get us

into that show yeah a lot of users um i had like my best friend bonnie who's still one of my best friends yeah you know she was just kind of with me all the time especially because when you're an only child you and she was an only child as well you kind of latch on to each other in that sisterhood kind of way really yeah because like i've talked to only child only children before and i i seem to every time that i talk to one i insist that it must have been a lot of pressure not to disappoint your parents or that they were afraid that uh you know that they would lose you because not obviously any parent would be afraid of losing a child but for some reason if there's only one it seems like the fear would be more intense but no one has agreed with me it's complete speculation and every only

child has said no i didn't feel that at all i feel that now now yeah like when i'm with my parents my mom gets so sad when i leave like if i go home uh-huh well now you're married aren't they aren't is there pressure they were like where are the babies yeah yes but they they know they know that i feel the pressure so i think they've kind of eased up like they don't they don't vocalize it a lot but yeah being an only child yeah you definitely bond with your friends really hard and they're over at your house all the time oh yeah because i think that you i think the big thing for me being an only child the biggest characteristic is like like i really like my space but i'm also really lonely yeah so it's like this constant push pull so it's like uh like everybody out but also like i miss you like it's just i don't know where that stems from you still have that yeah really so you're like

i'm like hyper independent but also i'm but also- Erratic, needy person? I'm hyper-independent, and I love not having plans. Yeah. But then I'm like, oh, I don't have plans. Like, I have like constant FOMO, but then once I'm out, I'm like, I want to be home. Oh, really? Like, it's just up, down, up, down, yeah. And you think that's only child-ness?

I just attribute it to that. Really? Because you're so used to having your own space as a kid. Do you have other problems like that? How does that manifest itself in other parts of your life? It sounds a little kooky. Yeah, I mean, it sounds really erratic, but it's all internal. I'm not acting on all of it.

I deal with it. It's going on inside of you. Oh, yeah, it's happening within. But I'm not tending not yeah i'm not uh i'm not like tending to all of my whims i just sense them and then try to quiet them so now it's like like uh your your parents the rock club owners like were they partiers was there a party thing in the 80s like the things that was their trouble yeah so it's interesting because um i always like kind of wanted to write about this

or do something with this but basically my parents were to me the most they were just like the the best most flawless people in so many ways in that like they really didn't drink ever like even when we were on vacation it was like a little bit of wine not in a self-righteous way right or like a preachy way they just were like not substance people right and they also were very like anti-tattoo and like all these things that you would assume like rock club parents would be like yeah everyone gets tattoos go get one were they kind of hippie people or they were they were kind of my age how you know they're older um they uh they they were very they were very trusting of me like they um but they also were like really strict with curfew and stuff like that so they were kind of these like model parents and then there was the underbelly that i kind of learned about later

in my life which was when i was 14 i found out that my dad had been doing some things some up the nose powder things uh dad was doing the blow yeah for like years but he was so functional and he took me to school every day and like you're up right but the reason i mean that's true but also you know what i mean like in the 90s yeah like especially as a kid like this is when like pulp fiction came out like you associate cocaine with death like there's no now it's like okay there are people who like dabble in it or like you know they've tried it personally i mean i don't either i associate it with a kind of good time for a couple hours but when you're a kid and you hear drugs especially when you're pushed these like anti-drug campaigns at school and you find out your dad's doing it even if he has a grasp on it yeah you just are like oh my god that's the most trouble yeah devastating

secret my family could ever have um one morning i woke up it was a saturday morning and i was up no no uh yes he was up but i i wanted to have a garage sale yeah and i wanted to go put signs up around the neighborhood so i went into his bedroom at like 7am and I was like, wake up, we got to go do this. And he was like twitching his neck, like jerking, like he had like a spasm, like literally just like couldn't hold his neck straight. Yeah. So his head kept jerking back and forth. And I was like, mom, what's wrong with dad? And she got very dramatic because clearly this was like their deal breaker that they had they were like i now know like he awake when this was happening yes and he was walking down the hall like putting his shoes on twitching getting his keys twitching and i told my mom i was like well

he can't drive twitching what's wrong with him she's like you want to know what's wrong your father does drugs and it was such an intense i wish she had said all right the reason it's happening is because this this and this let's talk to you let's like try to explain it to you in a calm way but it was so the way she said it was like our family is ending you know it just had this intensity that yeah that i think that if she had said it more calmly i probably wouldn't have had the reaction i did but i was like oh my god this is like this horrible thing that i'm learning and you know i was duped for so long i had no idea that you guys would ever do such a thing like it was just so dramatic 14 and did it end the family kind of i mean they they're still married

but my dad was kicked out of the house and then then when he was let back in, he was sort of relegated to a smaller bedroom down the hall and he sleeps in a twin bed. No shit. Still? Yeah, it's really depressing. Yeah. And my mom uses his side of the garage as storage now. So he parks in the driveway while she gets the garage. Wait, so this is 20 years later? Yes. And it's still going on? Yeah, uh-huh.

And when I bring it up, my mom will be like, she's like, well, you know, it's just, we always were arguing and stuff because of the business. Because, like, they did have this business together, and I do think working together has its own set of issues regardless. Do they still have the business? No. The business ended maybe 10, 12 years ago now. And you went to a lot of concerts though a lot of concerts really yeah i went to a lot and uh my dad good seats too right

yeah although most of them were like rock club standing room oh i thought they promoted bigger shows they did i went to those also but i the ones that i really like cherished were kind of smaller and grittier so uh like well who'd you see that made the big impact? The best show I ever saw. Best show you ever saw. Rancid at this place called Trees, which is a small club that actually has a tree growing up the middle. I think I've heard of this. Where is it?

In Dallas? In DeBellum, yeah, in Dallas. I've been there. It's a cool club. And they closed down for a while and then they reopened. Because I remember that element of it. Yeah. Could I have done a comedy show there?

Possibly. It'd be great for comedy. I think I might have done a comedy show there. Yeah, it's like small, but then they have a balcony. You'd think I remember if there's a fucking tree in there. It's actually a subtle tree. It's like not a thick tree. It's kind of like, it's a little a thick tree it's kind of like it's a little because i did some shows where i toured

with some guys like uh me and lucas melandez and another guy oh i love lucas melandez yeah yeah i haven't seen him in a long time me neither kind of falling out with him oh but it's all right okay not that bad he just got drunk and was stupid. And I was like, go fuck yourself. Oh, no. But it doesn't diminish his talent. Quality, yeah. Yeah. I haven't seen him in a long time.

I think he's all right. But yeah, I feel like I might have done a show there. Like I did a few clubs. It was a while back. I somehow avoid Dallas. But I'm going this year. I'm going in a couple months. That's cool. Where are you going to go?

Addison. Maybe. What is that? Majestic Theater. Oh, maybe. That sounds fancy. I'm sure there's some new cool venues too. Majestic.

Oh, good. That's where I saw my first stand-up show ever. Who was that? Margaret Cho. Ah. It was so good. When was that? How old were you? 13. Really? Someone took you to see Margaret Cho? My. It was so good. When was that? How old were you?

13. Really? Someone took you to see Margaret Cho? My mom did, yeah. At 13? Yeah. That must have been a filthy head full. It was, but there was something about, it's like me and my mom, it's like two women watching

a woman that it, I don't know, it's kind of like taking your kid to like a spa or something. Right. Steam room. It's like, this is what bodies look like. Like you kind of just deal. Well, it sounds like your parents were pretty cool. They were. They are.

So you're in Dallas, you're just going to school with your only childness. Yeah, I went to the weirdest school. The other only child. Yes, we all went to this school that, it was this really small school near my house. It was actually like a less than five minute drive from my house. And now looking like a less than five minute drive from my house.

And now looking back, it was kind of like, it kind of had a homeschool vibe. It wasn't. It was like a real college preparatory school. Like a homeschool vibe? Like you went to someone else's house to go to school? Yes. It was a building and there were real classrooms and everything. But there were only 16 kids in my grade.

How'd they find this school? I don't know. I guess because it was just in the neighborhood. And they wanted to put me in private school. Yeah. And so they did. And it was this teeny little school. And it was very homegrown.

And all my friends who went there, we all looked back and were like, what was that? It's so strange. Yeah? Because it was just so small and weird? Yeah. And like, yeah. It was just, it was just small and weird yeah and like yeah it was just it was so i think yeah it was just weird that like there were just so few kids yeah and so you're all like really really close which is great but then in high school i went to um

an arts magnet high school called booker t was Washington and so I went to like a proper school what's an arts magnet school um it's where it's so the four sort of they call them clusters were visual art theater music or dance and you have to like be accepted in your choice category and then you can go but you don't have to pay tuition. Oh, so what were you accepted into? Visual. I went for like painting and drawing. You were a painter? Yeah, not so much painting.

Honestly, sculpting was my main thing. Sculptor? Yeah, sculpting was my jam. In high school? Yeah, I loved it. Really? I don't do it at all anymore. Yeah, I was really into it. And I like drawing.

Sculptor. And I liked printmaking, which I didn't learn until I was there. What kind of sculptures? Sculpting, sculpture is hard. Yeah. I mean, just clay. Hard to appreciate. I tried to get into like welding a little bit.

They teach you that, but I- You were welding? I tried. I don't like fire in that way. I like kiln fire, not like sparks flying fire. So clay like figurative or just weird extract shit? No, like I did like figures and i did like a bust of a friend's head um and then but when i was like 10 years old i got very into

do you remember like femo clay like femo sculpey it's that like yeah colored clay that you can buy whatever yeah adult play-doh and you can bake it. So I was really into like making teeny little figurines in my house and like super, super detailed. Like I look back at some of the things I made and I'm like, how did I even like shape an eyeball that small? You were focused. You were alone with no friends. My friends got into the clay with me, which is now looking back, I'm like, oh, they probably didn't want to do that. But you wanted to be a sculptor? No, that's actually what I learned when I was there. clay with me which is now looking back i'm like oh they probably didn't want to do that but you wanted to be a sculptor no that's actually what i learned when i was there i was like i'm i am good

at this and like i was i felt proud to get into that school right because there were some really really talented people there but um about i guess around my junior year i was just like what am i gonna do with this because they started bringing in recruiters from like you know SVA and RISD and all these places and I was like oh a big art school yeah they all came to our school they like wanted to scoop us all right and um I remember just being like I don't think I want a career in like being commissioned to not that that's the only way to make money but I was kind of like it's hard it's the end game here like i just couldn't see it sure so then i was like i think i want to get into acting so then like at the end of high school i started doing more like theater and stuff yeah you're in plays yeah and did you switch over so this is psychotic i my, so junior year of my time at Arts Magnet, I kind of went through this

weird phase where I was like, I'm getting a great arts education, but I feel like I'm slipping behind in academics. And so I ended up going back to the small school that I went to as a kid for just one year, my senior year. What? They had a high school? Yes. That small place? Kindergarten through 12th. Yeah. Oh, one of those.

Yeah. Private, weird, hippie school. Exactly. So you bailed on the art school because you decided, I should probably learn something practical. Yeah. I think I was feeling, which is so crazy because the education was fine at the Arts Magnet. It's just like, there were some moments

where I was like, Oh, too much pressure for the, you know, to keep up with the acting or it was, no, it was actually more like I was reading books that I had read in like seventh grade at my other school as a junior. And I was just kind of like, I don't feel like school. Yeah. Yeah. So we were reading like, I mean, I don't remember specifically which books, but I just remember there were a couple where I'm like, oh, I read this when I was in middle school. Like, why am I reading this now as a junior in high school? Right. So.

You went back. I got really obsessive about that and I went back for one year. And then you graduated? It was so dumb. Why was it dumb? What do you mean? I don't know. It just feels like a quitter move.

It's like, just stick it out. It's one year. And like, this is a great place with great people. If that's one of your big regrets at this point, you're doing all right. Thanks. Like, if that's one of the ones where like, oh, fuck. It is. Whatever. It's one year. And like, this is a great place with great people. If that's one of your big regrets at this point, you're doing all right. Thanks. Like if that's one of the ones where like, oh fuck.

It is. It is. It makes me feel really good that you're saying that. It really is. I still think about it. I'm like, why did I do that? It's over.

It's over. It's behind you. All right. Thanks. Thanks for the support. So like, where does comedy start? Where does that start to happen?

I mean, but wait, so you finished the high school and then you, what? Yeah. Go to college? Yeah. I mean, but wait, so you finished high school and then you, what? Yeah. You go to college? Yeah, I went to college. I went to University of Texas in Austin. Oh.

Yeah. So, did you do anything? I was a theater major and then I switched to TV and film and writing. So, you were a theater major for a minute and then you had the same meltdown? My grandmother shamed me. Yeah, I had a really judgmental grandma and she said to me- Which one? The Jewish one or the other one? Jewish one, yeah.

Where was she? In New Jersey? Yeah. She was visiting and she said to me, you're really going to put all of your eggs in the acting basket? And I was like, all right. So then I think like two weeks later- That's not quite shaming. That's just fear and probably good advice. I know. But at the time i was like yeah i mean i listened i was like oh she's right yeah but then it all swung back the other way and now i want to act and i do act so but yeah but it's not like what are you going to get what so you

went to tv production i i was studying i was studying i was just kind of circling around the shit that i do now but never landing on it like i feel like that was what college I was just kind of circling around the shit that I do now, but never landing on it. Like, I feel like that was what college was. It was kind of like, you're sort of, it's like a puzzle and then you're kind of starting to assemble the pieces, but they don't actually make a puzzle with a clear image until later. Yeah. So like, I would like study, I studied animation a little bit and I studied screenwriting a little bit but i was still performing on like my campus television they had a show that was kind of like an entertainment news show that had a comedy slant so i i was like writing school yeah for just the school so i was like writing like and it was a live show so i was like writing monologues and stuff for that and like

i had my own little i had something i don't know honestly might have been called jamie's corner which is like the most only child name. But I had a segment where I just like talked about entertainment news in a funny way. And I had like, you know, my own two minutes on screen. Right. So you were kind of learning about the business in a way. Yeah. Writing, performing, producing television at a school.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And then doing animation randomly just because animation with the female clay no i would have loved it because i love claymation i love claymation what kind of animation you were drawing yeah i was doing it like the um the hard way like in flash where it's like you truly draw every single frame um but this is just things you could do in college. Yeah. Yeah. It was just kind of like fucking around,

but trying to focus on, trying to land on something that meant something to me. Yeah. And then when I graduated college, my first job out of college was working at Comedy Central. I was working in their press department. In New York? Mm-hmm.

So wait, so you moved to New York from Texas? Yeah. Because you got the job? Yes. I had interned in the city the summer before when I was still in school. Not at Comedy Central. I interned for a magazine. What magazine?

It was called Jane Magazine. I remember that one. It was a great magazine. No, it folded. But it was really good. It was sort of a cool woman magazine. Kind of had a nylon vibe before nylon. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I was in the fashion department. I didn't know what the fuck department like i didn't know what the fuck i was i did know what the fuck i was doing but i just didn't have the language yeah or the confidence or i know i just hadn't figured out exactly what i needed to be doing but then so it's kind of like whatever i was like interning in new york and then like you know kind of doing some writing at school but also doing animation which i don't do anything with now like i was just kind of figuring it out and then when i had the job that's what it's for yeah it is i mean i did that in college you try everything you want to do and you did it like

once or twice or you get a sense of it and it's that's a good way to use the time if you're not career driven right you know if you're a creative person do as much creative shit as you can so you you know at least you know but i like was career driven i just didn't know what that career was you were you were generally ambitious but i was also like kind of a dork in that like i missed texas like football games to work on my animation project and like i always joke that i like never did college right i know like never blacked out i had a boyfriend all four years. You missed football. Yeah.

I mean, no, I wasn't. But like, that was the spirit of the school was like, go to these things. And like, I just kind of was like, I'm just kind of like working on my own stuff. But Austin was kind of a weirdo place then, wasn't it? Yeah. It's like this juxtaposition. He had one boyfriend for four years and then when he moved to new york he dumped him it wasn't a it wasn't a blatant dumping it was

a fizzle it was like he's in austin i'm in new york we saw each other a couple times and then he got a girlfriend and i was like devastated because he was kind of like my rock oh really yeah but where'd that guy end up he He lives in New York with his new girlfriend. The third one or fourth one or whatever? Yeah, maybe third. Oh. Yeah. So, wait, what were we talking about?

So you go to New York. Oh, yeah. Because you interned at the magazine, which was, you know, you're still in the zone of like kind of entertainment and coolness yeah and then you end up comedy central who are you working for comedy central um well i was working in the press department with amy miller and aileen boudot um who i believe is still there i'm not sure um and then yeah it was it was a really not doing comedy though not doing comedy but again like big comedy fan watched a lot of comedy in college like it was was like, oh, I work at Comedy Central.

I didn't even know what publicity was. What fucking year is this? This was in 2006. What? Yeah. So you've been doing comedy like 10 minutes? It doesn't feel like 10 minutes, but I appreciate that you think it's only been 10 minutes. I'm like, it's 2019.

What are you doing here? No, but I didn't start stand-up right away. So actually, it's kind of funny. I was the publicist. That feels like a very loaded term for what I actually did. But I was the department assistant. And then I was also sort of given the task of handling publicity for all stand up in the network because the main focus at the time when I started was like getting the Dave Chappelle show back on track and like Daily Show and South Park. Like there were these big, big things that most publicity energy was sort of given to.

So what did you have to do exactly? So I actually was at I think I was at your Comedy Central Presents. I went to all the Presents tapings just to like make sure everything was okay. Which one? Like the 2006 one? Yeah. With the sheep and the politics? Yeah.

Yeah. The sheep and the politics. Yep. And then, yeah, I went to like Live at Gotham tapings, Premium Blend. So you were like the Comedy Central girl. I was the girl. Yeah. I was just like hanging out.

So I probably met you. Probably. I'm Jamie from Comedy Central girl. I was the girl. Yeah. I was just like hanging out. So I probably met you. Probably. I'm Jamie from Comedy Central. Yeah. I try to like not bother people. Bullshit. Because I also felt, I just, I know at that time I was just like, you guys were so busy. I was just like, oh, I'll just like sling back.

Like I don't, what do I, what do I do? You were helping out. Yeah. But what did you do? Well, on a daily basis, I did a lot of press mailings. So if a new show came out, I made sure to get the advanced copies to everybody in the press. And I went to TCAs. Out here?

I think I handled the website. With TCAs out in Pasadena? Yes. Uh-huh. Yeah, I handled the... They redid their website while I was there. So I was like in charge of that. So you were almost like going to be a publicist.

It's weird to hear that. I mean, I knew pretty quickly this was not for me. Yeah. And I knew that because I felt like I was terrible at my job. Talk about regrets. That's a big regret of mine. Another regret? I was a shitty assistant.

A shitty publicist assistant who gives a fuck i know but i feel bad get over it okay you're gonna let this stuff go okay you know don't worry about going back to the other school okay and uh you know you're a shitty publicist assistant well you know that's why you're not the publicist i was so selfish what do you what do you mean like i would just like i would just sit there and like think about my own stuff of like what what am i gonna what do you think everyone does it jobs i don't like especially when right out of college i need to be i need to be easier on myself right what are you so hard on yourself i don't know because it's just like you're

responsible for so many people and like i was always getting in trouble and i was like i'm just bad at this i just felt like i was like I don't know I would like fuck up mailings or like I would like I remember I always had to like write press releases and you're supposed to turn them in on Fridays and I'd get in Monday and I like hadn't written it and I'd just like throw something together

last minute. So you didn't want to do that. I know. So what happened? So how do you like all of a sudden decide you know comedy thing because I knew another you know Jesse Klein used to be an executive of some kind. That always gave me a lot of comfort. I was like, okay, I'm not the only person who's like. That jumped to the other side.

Yeah, exactly. It's suspect. I've always found it suspect. But, you know, Jesse's great. She's done a lot of great stuff. And I don't know why. But, you know, when you're coming up and you see somebody who's like, yeah, I'm in publicity on the Comedy Central. And then they're doing stand-up.

I'm like, it seems like you're cheating. I mean, I think, oh, man. I'm like, I wish I hadn't worked at Comedy Central. I wish I had worked somewhere else. Why? Did you get flack for it? No. It's just like it started to get to a point where.

So I had a roommate at the time who was taking improv classes at ucb and somehow she found a flyer or something for stand-up classes at caroline's oh yeah who's teaching that linda smith oh she's great she's hysterical she's great i started with her in boston a million years ago we did comedy in boston i think she was doing it when i was in college. So when I did stand-up, the first time I was really doing stand-up, I was still in college. It was like the mid-80s. I think that's where I met her.

Cool. She's funny, yeah. Well, she's best friends with Louis. Yes, yes. All right, so okay. She's so funny and warm. You get the flyer. Got the flyer, did the class, yeah.

Although it was funny because early on, they told us, don't go to any open mics. Like, it'll crush your soul. You'll wait a long time. Don't do it. Only do bringer shows at Caroline's. Wow. And I was like, oh, okay. And then my aunt.

That was alternative motive there. Oh, totally. But I didn't know that at the time i didn't know until way later i was like oh that's why they told us not to do open mics it had nothing to do with like our well-being no they want to sell some drinks exactly so your aunt so then my aunt um my aunt debbie by marriage uh she has a cousin who was doing stand-up at the time in the city and he invited me to an open mic probably like two classes into my carol um his name's matt is he still doing it a little bit not really um but he

so anyways he was like come do this uh i think it was at the village lantern maybe some club in the west village or yeah whatever bar whatever. Village Gate? Bar with a back room. Oh, yeah. I don't know. Oh, I know. Yeah, yeah. Maybe the Lantern. No, it's like on Bleeker Street. Yeah.

Yeah. Downstairs? Yeah. So he's like, come with me. And I didn't go on until probably 1.30 in the morning and I had work the next day. And I remember it not- Welcome to the life. I know.

And it didn't, I mean, looking back, back i would cringe to watch those two minutes but i was like oh that wasn't horrible i mean i didn't love it but i definitely liked it enough to want to do it again yeah and then i got kind of like yeah i don't know and then i just i also was djing at the time um i was djing with um these two friends mine. We had a group called Fleet Week. What is that? We just DJed at bars. And we actually were making really good money and getting really consistent gigs at like the Delancey and this place called Lit, which I don't think is there anymore. So you're dealing with all areas of entertainment. Right.

But so the DJ thing, I think it came from the same place the i think i knew i wanted to be doing stand-up but i um was just like oh this is another like activity that like gives you attention and like it's at night but then when i realized i wanted to be doing stand-up i completely stopped djing because they're both nighttime jobs so did you start hitting the stand-up pretty hard or what behind my behind linda smith's back i was doing a lot of open mics right so like a lot and you're still working at comedy central yes and it was starting to i think it was just it started to feel like a conflict of interest kind of quickly for me and like where like so where does it end up so you're doing like this you're the scene that you came up in is different than the one i came up and so like um

you're doing a lot of these open mics you're writing material you're what doing like this, the scene that you came up in is different than the one I came up in. So like you're doing a lot of these open mics, you're writing material, you're doing like the alternative rooms, Brooklyn and that kind of shit. Yeah, not so much Brooklyn, a lot of East Village. Oh really? So who are your contemporaries that I would know? Mike Lawrence. Oh yeah, I love Mike. Dan St. Germain. Oh yeah.

Mark Norman. Okay. Those were my main ones that I saw pretty much every day at open mics, multiple open mics. Yeah, Dan must have been exciting. I love Dan. He's doing all right. Yeah. But I, yeah, we, and then I'm trying to think who else.

A lot of people who don't. I love Mike. Mike's open for me. He used to open for me occasionally. He's very funny. He's excellent. Yeah. Yeah.

And. So they were all starting out when you were coming up yeah so we really like grinded it out together in that i would leave work this is also how i was a bad assistant i would like leave work kind of early just to like do the sign up yeah sometimes you could get a friend to sign you up but a lot of times you're like they would start to resent you for that so you're like i gotta actually like be there. Yeah. So yeah, I would just like do like three open mics in a night and then slowly start booking booked shows. Like what?

Cabin was a big one for us. Oh, out in a long Island city. No, no, wait, the East village, Sean Patton,

Sean Patton. Yeah. Yeah. He was like, just such a like lovely friend to me when I was starting out. How's he doing? He's doing well. I haven't seen him in a while.

I haven't either. Because I think he lives in New York. Uh-huh. But I saw him when I was there and he's at the cellar. And yeah, I think he's doing well. So you're doing cabin. You're doing like, did you break in? That was a big one to get on.

I remember being like, oh, I booked cabin. Like this is it. Yeah. Yeah. And how much time did you have at that time? Probably 10 minutes. How much time you got now? Like 10 minutes. Yeah. Yeah. And how much time did you have at that time? Probably 10 minutes. How much time you got now? Like 10 minutes.

But it's really polished. It's so different. It's such a tight 10. No, but now, yeah, now we headlining, baby. We're doing it. Yeah? Yeah. You go out there? Yeah. Well, I had to cancel some dates recently, which I was really

bummed about. Yeah. I cleared my sketch. go out there yeah well i had to cancel some dates recently which is really the podcast yeah i cleared my sketch so you're coming up in new york so you work at the cellar now yes you kind of you broke the scene yeah it's kind of crazy because i actually i i didn't so when i was living in new york the people that i started with like mike and everybody like we we uh we weren't in at the cellar it was at least I don't know if Mike would feel this way but I was like oh that's like a distant that's like a pipe dream like I don't know it's like a mainstream club like you know there's definitely there's definitely a line drawn between whatever the alt scene was and whoever comes out of it and then eventually breaking into the cellar which is still

fundamentally a mainstream comedy club it doesn't indulge much bullshit yeah and like my like i moved out here to la right when my class started getting passed there so i kind of missed this window i don't know it's just a timing thing i just kind of happened oh why did i move out here i moved out here for a writing job um like in 2014 but that was kind of around the time that on what um on the pete holmes show oh you moved out here to do that yes now okay so let's wait but didn't you do some other thing some mtv thing yeah oh i was on girl code yeah but that was younger right right? No. Girl Code was actually happening concurrently. To you coming up as a stand-up?

Or what? It was like, I was basically like stand-up. Then I did Last Comic Standing. That was kind of like my first TV thing. I did two episodes of that. I made it to the semifinals. Oh, that's pretty good. And that was exciting.

And then I started kind of doing colleges. So you hammer away. You do the open mics, you go on a cabin, and then you audition for a last comic? Correct. And you and Pete, you were dating, right? We had broken up at that point. When did you, but he's a little older than you? Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Definitely. We dated for like less than a year. Yeah, because I can't remember what's public information, what's private information. That's fine. Or what I heard about, like, because I remember you dated for less than a year. We dated for less than a year when I was maybe like two years. That sounds like a lot to me.

Yeah. It's kind of, it's weird because it's like. I don't want to be mean to pete but like he's a what you know well also when i i don't even know how to respond you don't have to but i i don't talk smack on this show too often i'm gonna let you do it okay um no but it was you know i think it was difficult for me because i was new to stand up and i was so excited to just find people i connected with and like have that sort of feeling like oh we're all family and we all get each other we don't have to explain each other to each other and uh so yeah so i met pete he was definitely more

um seasoned than i was at the time but still kind of in this like we were on shows together he's not that much older than you is he like five years yeah right right so yeah i yeah so we were whatever so we were just like we started dating and then it kind of just became clear like i need to be doing my thing and um he needs to be doing his but the cool thing is that because we broke up and then he moved to Los Angeles. I was still in New York. Right. And then we had this project that we had worked on

when we were dating. It was a parody of 19 Kids and Counting, that show on TLC, called Kid Farm. Yeah. And it ended up getting picked up to be a web series on Comedy Central. Yeah.

And so we came back together to work on that together. Right. And then it kind of just seamlessly became like, oh, we're like work partners. We can do that. Yeah. Like the relationship was good, but it wasn't the relationship for either of us. Yeah. And now we're able to just kind of function in a career capacity, which has been great.

That's nice. I can't imagine doing that with any of the women I've dated in my life. It is pretty. I don't have it with anybody else that I've dated where I'm like working with them or even, yeah, even buds really. I mean, it's not like, it's not tense. It's just like, no, neither of us are putting in an effort. And when did last comic standing happen? That happened around 2000.

That was like right after Pete and I broke up, like 2009 or so. So that's a big break, though. That's when you start doing the work, right? It felt like a really big break. Yeah. Yeah, my mom was visiting. And I was like, you know, she's like, okay, I'm going to go like walk around Soho while you like do your little audition. She wasn't that patronizing, but it was that vibe of like, yeah, I'm just going to like go try to be on this show.

And I did two minutes in front of Natasha Leggero and Greg Giraldo and Andy Kindler. They were the judges. Oh, Greg. And it was really fun. It was at Gotham. The auditions were at Gotham, which is like kind of, I love that club. I don't know. It's just the old Gotham or the new Gotham.

Yeah. The one. So you didn't know. It's just a- The old Gotham or the new Gotham? Yeah, the one. Same one? Yeah. So you didn't know the original one? No. Yeah. Where was that? Where was it?

Maybe 22nd or something. It was a smaller room. I've only done the new one a couple of times. It seems very wide and weird. It is wide, but when it's good, it's really good. And like they were such- The hot room? Yeah.

And they were just such nice judges. Like that, I mean, I think there were some other seasons that were a little more cutthroat good and like they were such a hot room yeah and they were just such nice judges like they that i mean i think there were some other seasons that were a little more cutthroat and the energy was kind of like like you know you're gonna win or lose like it kind of had that game show energy but that was not the season i was on it was very supportive and so after that you had you put together your hour and you started doing the clubs and colleges. Started doing colleges, yeah. And then like two years later was Girl Code. I auditioned for that and got that. What is that?

I've never seen it. Yeah, so it was a show that was on MTV. It was a talking heads show with an all-female cast. And we all basically were just doing stand-up on TV. But you did a lot of those, right? Yeah, yeah. It was five seasons. Jesus.

And it was really, it felt really special. Union gig? No, no. Um, but it was like paying my rent and. In New York. Yeah. I didn't feel poor anymore. So you're doing colleges and you do. I mean, now I would feel poor if that were my salary, but at the time I was like killing it. Right. So you're doing that, you're doing standup and then Pete says, come right on this show.

Yeah. right so you're doing that you're doing stand-up and then pizza's coming right on this show yeah now wasn't there a thing though where you you were his girlfriend and but you wanted to play his girlfriend but you didn't get to no or something no wait what i don't know i don't oh wait you mean crashing yeah oh so crashing crashing uh the way that happened so i was writing on crashing i was writing it on writing on it on the first season and then second season they were like okay well there's there's probably gonna be like a girl comedian that pete hangs out with right and i was like oh that sounds like me to me um and then yeah i kind of was like pitching myself for it. And they're like, we don't think you're right for it.

It's not the right energy. We're looking for it. And so I was like, okay. And then I kind of just like, whatever, hung back. And I was like, it's just not my role. It's fine. Did you talk to Pete? Not really.

Hmm. Yeah. I don't like that character was not, that relationship was not built on our relationship and i i make that clear only because it's like the process to get that role was such a process like i they truly were auditioning every person in comedy actress huge names like they were doing a full wide search and so i wasn't even allowed not i don't want to say allowed but I wasn't being considered to audition for it and then last minute Pete was like oh yeah you know we're gonna bring you in and I was like oh okay cool and by that time I was content writing on the show and kind of had

made peace with the fact that like this is just not my part right so when I went in I think that because I was in that headspace I had a really great audition yeah and had a lot of fun and uh then I didn't hear anything for two weeks yeah and I uh showed up at work because we're still in the writing offices in New York and everyone was being really weird to me like I don't know I just like felt it I was like what and I was like oh my god it's because I didn't get it yeah don't they feel bad for me oh and then um who got it i texted my manager yeah yeah i texted my manager and i was just like i was like what's going on i don't like have you heard anything and then it turns out the reason they were being weird is because i got the part you got the part yeah i got the part in this but like how come i've watched some of them like i know i watched

the last season i think when you guys are kind of like make or, you know, it's weird, but you guys make up. Yeah. We're like friends in the last season. So this was the second season mostly? The second season. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you got the part.

Yeah, I got the part. It was crazy. You got to be Pete's girlfriend again. Oh my God. Please don't put it like that. Are you married at that point yet? Yeah. You are? Yeah. When did you get married? I got married almost three years ago. And then you like, and then you,

so, all right, so you're writing a peach show. You write your wedding book. Yeah. I wrote a book called Ridiculous, an unfiltered guide to being a bride. Just being a snarky, you know, take it down and notch the hole. I mean, yeah't know snark sure but like it was more just that when i was getting married i felt like all the materials that were available yeah to brides uh they were all so i don't know they all felt really fake to me and they all felt really fear-based it was like oh if you don't do x y and z and Z, your wedding's going to be a failure? Well, it's just like this habit. There's a whole industry that has a lot of sway on how it's supposed to go. I mean, I had a big wedding, and I've had a small wedding. Neither of the fucking marriages worked out.

But I know what both of those are like. I know what a big wedding is like and what the pressure is. So you just needed to kind of make it more accessible and like try to show what's really necessary and what isn't to have a good time yeah and also like um yeah also just making sure that like people didn't feel alone because i thought that when i was getting married it was it was particularly like isolating and alienating that every person was saying to me like oh my god this is the most special time of your life. This is the most exciting time of your life.

And I was like, like, why am I fighting with my fiance so much? And like, why do I feel like weird towards like my parents and his parents? And like, I don't know. I was like,

things just feel so sad and, and angry. And, um, and then the more people I talked to were like, yeah, we also felt that that but no one's really talking about that you're like almost not allowed to so i wanted the best day of your life

it's a fucking night i know i call it your medium day yeah yeah it's not the best day of your life it's it's a nice day but it's very it's like a production is your is he in show business he's a comic right you guys used to do that's right they you did the show together yeah yeah yeah monthly show yeah at UCB called date night and he's a stand-up yes what's his name again he started doing stand-up more recently yeah Dan Black uh-huh yeah where'd you meet that guy on a podcast oh yeah yeah we uh we were both on a podcast he was uh he came on in character uh character, and I was just like, whatever, myself. And his character was very, very funny, and I just kind of had a moment where I was like, how have I never met this person?

They're like truly the funniest person. So now you're a show business couple. Oh, yes. How's that going? Power couple. It's good. I mean, like my, you know. What's he doing?

He also has a podcast, and he like books a lot of commercials and stuff. So he's like more, he's like sort of in that UCB acting realm. Is it good? Is what good? Being with a performer? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's good.

It's mostly good, I would say. But I think my big issue with marriage in general is like i like i've said like my parents have a bizarre they have a bizarre marriage your dad sleeps in a closet yeah and i just in general don't i don't really know it's weird i have like two extremes in my life i have like my parents dad sleeps in a closet and then i have like my grandparents who had like the most beautiful love until my grandmother died three years ago. And then my aunt and uncle have been together since high school and they're super into each other still. So I kind of don't know what like the gray area looks like.

I have two extremes. So I'm always kind of trying to navigate that. Yeah. It's good. But I just sometimes I'm like, am I built for this? I don't know. I don't know what's real. Who does? Who knows what's real? Trying to figure it out don't know what's real. Who does?

Who knows what's real? Trying to figure it out. Yeah. It's interesting. So when, but you guys don't, you're not competitive or sort of like? No, he's super supportive. That's good. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not competitive. There have been times like when we were getting. Obviously you're not going up for the same things. No. But I just mean in terms of like sometimes when someone's working and someone isn't it gets a little gnarly yeah like when he started doing stand-up i mean he would he would admit this too like i think you know when we first started dating he wasn't doing stand-up and that was kind of like he was like the

improv guy and i was a stand-up person so we had like commonalities and that we're both doing comedy but we're not doing the same thing yeah and associating with the same people right so when he started doing stand-up i definitely was like oh that's like my world yeah so it's like an adjustment where it's like i still like i have to be supportive and not like weird about it like sometimes i get weird because i'm like i there's it's almost like i'm i'm a baby and i have to take care of the baby and now it's like oh we have a second stand-up baby now that we have to nurture, and it's a lot. Oh, no, your face. No, it's all right.

Yeah, I mean, no, my second wife was a stand-up, but she's not a stand-up anymore. She's gone. So, all right, so you write on Crashing for three seasons. You act on two of them. The writing experience was good, and everything, the relationships all stayed pretty good. Now, I guess they're not picking it up. They're not.

Was that, did you guys know that was coming? I didn't. Pete had said something about how he was like, I don't know if we're getting a fourth season. But we actually did a brainstorm room to kind of map out what a fourth season might look like. And it was really fun. So I was kind of bummed to not be season might look like yeah and it was really fun so i was kind of bummed to not be able to carry out that so it was a surprise yeah it was um but now i'm like oh well it was really expensive to make and you don't know how many people were watching it yeah i don't have that information do you do you find that when you go on the road now people know you yes which i love and people really loved that character in a way that makes me it's just nice

because it's like you know it's it's kind of like like i think about like with your role on glow i'm like not only is that i mean glow is like such a phenomenal show just in general but then it's also like that's such a cool character you get to play like he has depth and like i don't know he like he resonates i i feel like i was happy that i feel like that was that character yeah yeah i really do i'm really like proud to have played her yeah so now what are you doing club dates why'd you have to cancel some dates oh just uh just to like uh potential there was like a thing that might, I don't know. A thing popped up, and it was like, oh, you might, like, book this thing so you can't leave. So that was what happened.

So I had to cancel a couple dates, but I'm going to reschedule those soon. But what are you doing? Are you doing, like, weekends at clubs, or are you doing just one-offs? Yeah, weekends at clubs. Oh, yeah? Mm-hmm. Yeah. You draw pretty good?

Yeah. It's been really good. Since crashing, it's been, I mean, like Girl Code was helpful, but Crashing, I feel like, has been even more helpful. People really like, yeah, the people who love that show, like, love that show. What, Crashing? Yeah, yeah. But I guess that's every show.

The people who love it just love it. What kind of people are they? How do you generalize? They're pretty, I mean, a lot of them are just comedy fans. Right. A lot of them are Pete fans. Yeah. And then a lot of them are just comedy fans right a lot of them are pete fans yeah and then a lot of them are judd fans like they kind of follow his his whole trajectory so what happens now though like you know so now you get you get cut loose from a show

yeah and what are you developing your own stuff are you looking for yeah you are yeah i have a pilot with free form that i wrote i don't even know what that is it's a network okay um it used to be abc family but now they're like edgier yeah so i free form yeah no more family no whatever man fuck the families we're free yeah but yeah so i wrote this script that i was working on for like truly two and a half years. I called The Girlfriend and I'm working on that right now. And then I have a show based on my- So you got a development deal with them? Is that it?

Yeah. Okay. So they're like, here's some money. We like this idea. Fix it. Yes. Right. Yeah.

So I had a script, did like two pretty major rewrites and now I'm waiting to hear about things. Yeah. And what else were you going to say? And then, oh yeah, I have a show that I'm developing based on my book on the what what yeah ridiculous yeah yeah everyone calls it whatalicious that font really fucked me it looks like whatalicious yeah you're everyone says that really yeah everyone says whatalicious and i'm like it's ridiculous i mean it's a fake word regardless right Right. Still, I'm like, I should have had a clearer.

So how does that jump to a book, a show? Like it's a weekly thing. You do like one chapter of the book as a sort of out in the world show? Kind of. Well, I think it's going to be with a streaming service, which I don't think I'm allowed to talk about. But I think it's going to be kind of like cool a queer eye vibe for weddings so it's going to be like funny but also helpful are you going to be on it yes and you're going to bring some other people yeah i'm going to host it we've already cast the couples so we're going to it'll be it'll

be an hour oh i see you walk through this shit with the couples exactly i like help them is there a dude involved for the dude uh do you know i mean like so you're dealing with a a groom and a oh yes mostly mostly bride focused but yeah we we handle the couple for sure yeah especially if like they're arguing or anything i want to get in there get in the weeds and oh yeah yeah make some funny what's going on, you guys? One of those shows. Well, I just think that, like, yeah, like I was saying,

I think that it can get really tense around weddings and I think people feel like a lot of shame, you know? Like, they're like, oh, if we were more solid, we wouldn't be fighting. And it's like, no,

the wedding brings that out in people. I just remember when I got married at the big wedding, you know, it was like a big thing about the food and that, like, I wanted a certain type of food or wanted

them to do it. But you don't, what you don't realize it's like, you know, whatever your special request is, it's just wedding food. Exactly. You know, it's like, yeah, they'll accommodate you, but it's not going to be amazing. No, I always say that, like, I think it's, it's great if the food is great at your wedding, that's wonderful. Um, but I think quantity is actually more important because I think when people go to weddings, they, uh, there's a, there's a sense like your guests kind of feel like they're sort of trapped on a deserted Island and they're fending for themselves cause they're kind of out of their comfort zone and they don't necessarily know anyone there and you have to stay because if you leave, you're an asshole.

So like you need to make sure your guests are just like very nourished because i think that the worst thing is if like you get a tiny piece of steak and like three little carrots and you got you got a whole another two three hours yeah i gotta dance and it's also like don't give me a lot of food because i require a lot of food give me food because i need to like emotionally eat my way through the next five hours yeah this sad event that i'm forced to go to. Exactly. I was told, someone told my brother,

I don't know where I heard it, that on your wedding day, you should hold hands with your bride or your groom always. I've heard this, yeah. Right, so you have the same experience and not like separate experiences. Yeah, I think that's hard to hold hands. The whole time? The whole time. Where are that's hard. Just hold hands. The whole time?

The whole time. Where are you? What? That sounds terrible. It's just like all of it's just sort of like, now we're going to smash the cake in the face. And like, what is it? It's like a fucking charade. The smashing the cake.

I mean, that is a hard no for me. Like I had spent four hours getting my makeup done. No, we fed. We gently fed. Did you do it? Is he Jewish? Yes. Did you do Jew wedding? Jew, we fed. We gently fed. Did you do it? Is he Jewish? Yes. Did you do Jew wedding?

Jew wedding? Yes. Why do you say it like that? Because it was, it was tricky for me. I guess you're theoretically Jewish. Yeah, but when you grow up in Texas, it doesn't look, but it doesn't look the same. At least my experience was not the same. Like I did not grow up with a lot of traditions.

My family's not religious. My dad was raised like loosely baptist yeah so to my my husband's from long island and like oh so it's real jewish stuff real yeah so i was um he's from roslyn heights yeah so kind of near nassau nassau county how long has it been in the marriage county um we've been married almost three years at the end of this month. Three? Yeah. Yep. Yep.

Yeah. The three to four, that's a rough one. If you get through the three to four, you can make it. Oh, okay. Is that a thing? It was for me. Okay, okay. Great.

I didn't make it through three. Either time. You're doing great. This house is beautiful. You're killing it. three. Either time. You're doing great. This house is beautiful. You're killing it. I'm all right. You're all right. Yeah, I mean, a lot of things.

There's some good things going on. All right, so what are we looking for now from you? What happens? We're not really promoting anything, are we? We know what you're up to and you can get the book. Yeah. And you can watch you on crashing. Yeah.

But that's sadly over. I have a podcast that's gonna be about sex in the city called Couldn't Help But Wonder and I'm doing it with my friend Rose Cernow. What is it about? What does that mean, sex in the city? We're going through like the whole series. We're starting from the first episode.

And it's like that show was on 20 years ago. So we're kind of discussing like- You're such a lady. The cultural relevance. Such a girl lady. I am. But like the new version of the lady okay is it important to you are you excited about the sex in the city i am yeah i'm really

excited because you haven't watched it in 20 years yeah well i've watched it since but it's fun to like kind of talk about like what parts are still relevant or yeah, just kind of how it applies to now. Okay. Yeah. That sounds good. And you're going to be touring and whatever. Yeah.

Do you feel good about what's happened here? I loved it. I did. I'll talk to you later. Okay. Bye. That was Jamie Lee. Go listen to her podcast, Couldn't Help But Wonder,

available wherever you get your podcasts. Also, all my tour dates are at wtfpod.com slash tour. And if you're interested, if the movie Sword of Trust is screening near you, go to swordoftrust.com to get the full rundown of where it's playing. It opens next week. I'll be in New York at the 92nd Street Y with Lynn Shelton

and my friend Sam Lipsight moderating a Q&A. And it's opening around the country. So go look for those dates, people, will you? So now, I believe, I will play some distorted nice guitar for you. අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි අපි Boomer lives! It's winter, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost almost anything. So no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs, mozzarella balls, and arancini balls? Yes, we deliver those.

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See app for details. It's a night for the whole family. Be a part of Kids Night when the Toronto Rock take on the Colorado Mammoth at a special 5 p.m. start time on Saturday, March 9th at First Ontario Centre in Hamilton. The first 5,000 fans in attendance will get a Dan Dawson bobblehead courtesy of Backley Construction. Punch your ticket to Kids Night on Saturday, March 9th at 5pm

in Rock City at torontorock.com.