WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1058 - Marilu Henner

Episode Date: September 30, 2019

Marilu Henner will not forget what was said in this conversation. That’s mostly because she has a rare condition that allows her to remember virtually everything that ever happened to her. But it’s also because she and Marc go deep into her life and multifaceted career. They discuss the eccentric environment she was raised in, the tragedy that befell her family, the acting break that got her started in show business, the health challenges in her life that led to a career as an author, and her varied relationships with costars like John Travolta, Andy Kaufman, Burt Reynolds and Donald Trump. This episode is sponsored by SweeTango, Zoro.com, and Stamps.com. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

It's winter, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost almost anything. So no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs, mozzarella balls, and arancini balls? Yes, we deliver those. Moose? No. But moose head? Yes. Because that's alcohol, and we deliver that too.

Along with your favorite restaurant food, groceries, and other everyday essentials. Order Uber Eats now. For alcohol, you must be legal drinking age. Please enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by region. See app for details. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing.

With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. What the fuck, Knicks? What the fucksters? What's happening? It's Mark Maron. This is my podcast. How are you? It's called WTF. Welcome to it.

If you've never been here before, how's it going? Mary Lou Henner is on the show today. And hopefully, if everything works out correctly, Danny DeVito will be on Thursday. Kind of a taxi-themed week. Just works out like that sometimes. We'll see. I have not recorded the danny devito uh talk yet anything could happen between now and when i have to record that but that's the plan can you dig it okay also had some date confusion day and date confusion last uh what was it what day is it on thursday when i announce my dates i'm going to do it again correctly. If you want to, come see me.

I'll be at the Merriam Theater in Philadelphia on Thursday, October 10th, the Kennedy Center in Washington, D.C. on Friday, October 11th, and the Schubert Theater in Boston on Saturday, October 12th. Then I'm heading to Nashville at the James K. Polk Theater on Friday, October 18th. The Tabernacle in Atlanta on Saturday, October 19th. And the Masonic in San Francisco on Saturday, October 26th.

You can go to wtfpod.com slash tour for tickets. But I am going to be taping my special on, yep, this is going to be on October 30th at the Red Cat Theater here in LA. It's a nice black box theater. We're working on how it's going to all work there,

how you can get tickets or whatever. It's not huge. It's going to be an intimate affair. It's going to be unique and I'm going to talk to you. That's how it's going to go down. If you want to free that date up to come, please do. Tickets aren't quite available yet, but they're going to talk to you. That's how it's going to go down. So if you want to free that date up to come, please do. Tickets aren't quite available yet, but they're going to happen.

I'll let you know as soon as that happens. All right. Holy shit. Isn't this exciting that President Scumbag is being taken to task in a seemingly legitimate way? No, I'm going to pull seemingly right out of that sentence and say legit. This is some legit sort of unconstitutional fucked up behavior for a president. Yeah. Not that that's a surprise, but it looks like it's got teeth and it's very exciting. I can't say satisfying because with the power of the propaganda machine, these worms a worm out of anything.

But it looks like the screws are being put to him pretty good. And that's very satisfying. And I'm sorry if this upsets any of you, even you people that somehow rationalize or justify this guy just because, you know, you're doing OK or because you're a Republican. you're doing okay or because you're a Republican. If you really, really, what it comes down to, if you support this guy unconditionally or even conditionally, you're sort of anti-American. You don't believe in our system. And that seems to be the truth of the whole matter. The more these people defend this guy, no matter what, the more clear it is that they fundamentally don't believe in the American system of government. And that makes them un-American. They can scream socialist and this and that all they want, but they are fundamentally un-American if they don't take this guy to task in a real way. So that's how I see it. That's how I'm going to frame it. So look, folks, it's been a pretty good few days for me if I look at it correctly.

I've worked a long time. I've worked hard on a few things outside of my comedy, outside of this podcast, things like playing guitar, things like acting. And there's been some kind of I can acknowledge and see that I did all right. And that's a good feeling. If you do something and you succeeded at it, or you look at it and you're like, did a pretty good job there. Take a minute and appreciate it. Will you? Because what else? I mean, there's more to life, but Jesus Christ, you work hard on something and it works out. You should go like, oh, look at that.

I did that. I did that. And it happened last week. Patrick Stickles, Titus Andronicus, a guy who I like a lot, who's been on this show a couple of times. I like his music. He plays hard. He's an earnest motherfucker.

He's smart. He's funny. He's tormented. And I just, just i like him he's from new jersey we've always gotten along pretty good and that's always nice to hear from him he was playing here in la at the bootleg theater and i was doing comedy that night but he said come down and play neil young's keep on rocking in the Free World with me. And I'm like, all right, I think I can do that. And then I learn the chords. I know the songs. And he tells me to throw my gold top in the car,

my Deluxe, my Gibson, Les Paul. And I did. And then I get there and I just got all chicken shit. I got to the gig. It's packed out. They're about to play. And I didn't bring my guitar in. I didn't I got to the gig that it's packed out. They're about to play. And I, I didn't bring my guitar in. I didn't want to be the guy that walked in with his guitar to play one song. So I asked him earlier, it's like, if I don't bring it, we get,

do you got one around? He said, yeah, we'll set you up. But I got there and, uh, they had a jazz master out for me, a Squire jazz master. It might've been the Jay Maskis model. I didn't check. I was more focused on just the nerves of playing the song. And they rock pretty hard. They're a punk rock outfit, but it's pretty solid rock and roll stuff. It's good. He's having a great show. It was a great night. And they were about to close up. And I knew, I guess I should have figured it was going to be the last song that I was going to with them, and their last song for the night, and I realized right before that, the song before the last song, that I don't, I wasn't quite clear on some of the changes, so in a panic, I ran out of

the room where the show was, and I pulled it up on Apple Music, the song, and I listened to it, just so I kind of had it in my head, and then he called me up on stage, and we fucking did it, just so I kind of had it in my head. And then he called me up on stage and we fucking did it. And to be honest with you folks, and I don't like being this honest, but I think I've watched it like 15 to 20 times a day, every day since I played it,

just me playing that lead with a real rock band. And I get a kick out of it every time because I fucking nailed it. And I feel pretty good about that. I feel pretty good about that I feel pretty good about my ability to land a fairly solid solo on someone else's guitar with someone else's equipment on a in a great song but that that guitar sounded good so my point is all my practice has paid off. I can fucking at least three out of five times land a fucking pretty searing solo. That's all I'm saying. Proud of myself.

Is that okay? Yes. I call them president scumbag. So what else happened last night? Last night I went to the Joker premiere here in Los Angeles. It was exciting. It was kind of fun. I got dressed up.

I went with Lynn Shelton. She got dressed up. You know, we drove up. It was high security. They closed off all of Hollywood Boulevard. There were plenty of fans on the street. But, you know, there was this whole chunk of the street just empty. And it was massive security. Got out of the limo. Did the, you know there was this whole chunk of the street just empty and they it was massive security got out of the limo uh did the you know picture line there was no

reporters there was all photos just walked the line kind of hung around i finally got to sort of connect with joaquin a bit because we didn't really do it on set he gave me a hug and uh had a couple laughs and then we went into and then todd phillips of course the director so the movie itself had not seen it was very excited to see it nice there's a nice build to it uh and uh it looks great joaquin is great then and boy the end man the end, man, the end definitely delivers. I'm very limited in what I can say. But I will say this. My scene is not as long as it was shot. And, you know, these things happen.

But it made sense. Before that last week, I texted Todd Phillips, the director. I said, am I still in the movie? And he said, the walk and talk is out. is out but yeah the dressing room scene is there and you're on the and you're there you know you're you're in parts of the end of the movie i'm like okay so the walk and talk is out why is that and he said because there's not a there's not a shot in this entire film that doesn't involve uh joker doesn't involve joaquin whether it's his point of view or whether he's in it or whether it's something in his head that the one, but he said the one scene where he wasn't in, it was

when me and De Niro walking down the hallway towards the dressing room, seeing it on the big screen, knowing that you're doing the work in the present, you can only feel what you feel, but seeing it like I, you know, I, I did it, man. I held my own in that moment, in that little scene. I acted right. I took Todd Phillips' note when he gave me direction, which is basically, you know, De Niro's your boss. And I was very happy with the performance. It was very tight.

I showed up. I'm definitely in it. So that was exciting. Go see the the movie i think you'll enjoy it but it's not it doesn't open till next friday i think but it's something he's something that joaquin phoenix talk like my father that guy that joaquin guy something so look let's talk about our guest that we're we're going to enjoy right now Mary Lou Henner um wanted to do the show I ran into her in a theater uh I can't remember what show we were seeing maybe death uh to kill a mockingbird or maybe it was uh Hamilton I don't remember but I saw her and she saw me and she was very excited and she wanted to come on the show.

So today's her day. So Taxi, the show that kind of made her, first premiered 41 years ago this month. And the plan here is to talk with Danny DeVito tomorrow and have that episode for you on Thursday. So this is me talking to Mary Lou about Mary Lou and the arc of Mary Lou. And she's pretty lively. So enjoy this. And also, by the way, well, I'll tell you at the end. Enjoy this. It's Mary Lou Henner. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing.

With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly.

This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. Death is in our air. This year's most anticipated series, FX's Shogun, only on Disney+. We live and we die. We control nothing beyond that. An epic saga based on the global bestselling novel by James Clavel. To show your true heart is to risk your life. When I die here, you'll never leave Japan alive. FX's Shogun.

A new original series streaming February 27th exclusively on Disney Plus. 18 plus subscription required. T's and C's apply. Do you want to wear cans? Yeah. Ex-radio person. I know. How long did you do morning radio?

Three years. It's like, it turns you upside down, right? You know, and then I- Like six o'clock you got to be on the air? At first I was doing five till eight. Yeah. And then I was doing eight till 11. That's easier.

And then that was a lot easier. At what stage do you decide to do radio? You know, I've always loved interviewing people. I used to sit in my backyard. I had a very crazy upbringing, but I used to sit in my backyard and interview people with my hairbrush. Really? And my Barbies and stuff.

Fictional people or real people? Like neighbors and kids that I knew. Because you saw it on TV? Because I saw, oh, I was obsessed with The Tonight Show. Oh, really? And so I just, I mean, I loved- Like Carson's Tonight Show? Carson's Tonight Show.

And I got to do it with him a few times too, which was so great. But like, so- I was just always into I'm so naturally curious about other people I'm always trying to like really get to know people right everything I'm just very pro extrovert yeah I don't know I'll talk to the person next to me on the airplane oh yeah you're that person like Conan has a whole routine he does I find that I don't do it hardly at all anymore. But I find that when it does happen is literally like 14 minutes before landing. Oh, that's safe.

I guess that's what it is. I don't know. But I could not talk to somebody for five hours. Right. And then out of nowhere, it's just the conversation starts to happen. But maybe you don't go to the bathroom a lot. I like a window seat. No.

And you go to the bathroom a lot? And you like the window? Well, enough. Yeah, I like the window. I like the aisle because I like to go to the bathroom. And you go to the bathroom a lot? Yeah, I like the window. I like the aisle because I like to go to the bathroom. So see, now I'd have to talk to you to be able to crawl over. That's right. My son, I have two sons, 23 and

25. The 25-year-old, Nick, he loves the middle seat. He feels it's the best of both worlds. Really? He can be on a plane. People would be so happy for him to travel. I know. I know. He wants to do, he's a filmmaker and he directs videos and stuff. How old is he?

He's a director, 25. And he's a middle seat guy? Middle seat guy since he was little. I've never met a middle seat person. He wants to do a whole documentary on the middle seat. It's a great title. The Benefits of the Middle Seat. Just call it the middle seat.

The middle seat. And he wants, he feels like even if there's nothing, well, he likes to talk to people, that kind of thing. You made another one. I made two of them. Yeah. Talkers? Both of my kids. The one is a little less of a talker. In fact, my son, Joey, who's 23, comedy, wants to be a comedy writer, writer's room, improv, graduated from Northwestern, unbelievably funny. Well, you're from Chicago, right? Chicago. That's where Northwestern is.

Yes, I went to University of Chicago, but Joey went to Northwestern. So what does it look like when you're growing up? You just told me that you had skunks as pets? No, this is what happened. I'll give you my little speech about my upbringing, and then you can take it from there. Does it have to be in the form of a speech no no but it's

sort of like how many times you've done this people yeah uh-huh it just it just says it all in like a few sentences well we have more time okay I like your pot give me give me the give me the the encapsulated few sentence speech like okay we can unpack it make it sound fresh. Yeah. But it was the heart of the city. Do you know Chicago? Sure, a little bit.

Okay, Logan Square. Do you know Logan? It's so hipster groovy now. Is it now? Yes, I do. I actually do know Logan Square. Heart of the city. You know, the Kennedy Expressway just missed demolishing my house when I was a little girl because they were building it and everything else.

Was there a pushback and protest? Like, don't push. I don't know. I was four, five. But it building it and everything else. Was there a pushback and protest? I don't know. I was four or five. You should know, though. You have that memory thing. I know. I remember. I remember when it opened.

So we lived on the boulevard, and you aren't allowed to have a commercial property, or you couldn't back then anyway. Yeah. But it didn't matter because my mother was very close friends with the aldermen. Uh-huh. And we were even like the house where, you know, people went to vote. Right.

Oh, yeah. So, yeah. It's always weird when you got to go to a house to vote. To vote. Yeah. So, but we,

my father built this garage, a fake garage, which is, you know, that's why I laud you for doing this in your garage because I grew up as a garage kid. My mother ran a dancing school in our garage, and it was 200 students from the neighborhood

between the ages of two. The hell of a big garage. It was. It was like two and a half cars. So she ran a few classes. Yeah, classes. There was never 200. Oh, no, no, no.

No, no. Baby classes, old classes. She was a dancer. A dancer. And we all danced. We all, as soon as you were 14, put to work, you had to have a class. So there were- You had to teach.

You had to teach. Oh, I danced since I was two. So yeah. What kind of dance? Ballet? Tap, ballet, jazz. My mother taught modern dancing, like jazz. You can tap?

I can tap. Have you tapped with Christopher Walken? No. Oh. Maybe that's something you should do before. I know. I aspire to tap with Christopher Walken. Do you have any memories of Christopher Walken? No. Oh, you should, maybe that's something you should do before. I know. I aspire to tap with Christopher Walken. Do you have any memories of Christopher Walken? I do. In an elevator in, we were all staying at the Viva Hotel. Yeah. The Viva, like apartments. Yeah.

In Vancouver in 1996. When you were shooting? I was shooting the Titanic. I don't know what he was shooting. He had red hair, crazy hair. And so we'd run into each other in the elevator. The Titanic? Not Titanic. No, not Titanic. The Titanic. The Titanic miniseries that starred, that my husband at the time was directing, Robert Lieberman. I played Molly Brown. You can think of a Molly Brown. I had two little kids. One was six. Joey was six and Nikki had just turned two right and uh yeah and but it was like

peter gallagher and katherine zeta jones it's what introduced her to the world in public and he had a elevator moment with walking a couple of them yeah laundry room how was that great so yeah yeah well i was married to frederick forrest he was my first husband. From Apocalypse Now. And The Rose. Yeah. So a lot of those guys that were that group knew me from that. How old were you when you were married to Frederick Forrest? 28. Yeah.

He was much older. He was much older? Well, 43. And you were 28 and he was 43? 44, yeah. 44? Yeah. And you met on that movie? No, we met on the movie Hammett at the screen test. Yeah. 44? Yeah. And you met on that movie? No, we met on the movie Hammett at the screen test.

That's what I mean, yeah. January the 5th, 1980. I won't do dates all the time. But you had no kids with him? No, I had no children. I was only with him two years. Oh, that bad, huh? Bad enough.

You either want a marriage that's bad enough that you're out in two years yeah or good enough that you're in for a while it's glad it wasn't one of those slow percolating fads no

yeah no he had he talks about it in a bad way no he definitely he definitely you know he was an alcoholic

and I'd never you know I'm so like sunny yeah like oh well that's okay was that your first alcoholic? Yes. Kind of.

Boyfriend? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. It's a shock. Yeah. But do you find that you, are you attracted to people with the compulsive sort of addictive issues?

I'm attracted to people. I'm attracted. Well, I understand. No, I don't think. No. I don't. You mean like the fix it type? I don't know. no. You mean like the fix-it type? I don't know.

I've had my relationships over the years with people who were dark and complicated. And they're attracted to me, so I'm attracted to them, that kind of thing. Yeah, you were the dark and complicated. The dark whisperer. There's a lot of them. It's a full of them yeah it's a full time job yeah no my

one of my brothers has been in and out of rehab a few times in fact I'm one of six siblings and five of us went to Betty Ford and spent the week there

and went to and they said they've never seen that happen with a family you were at Betty Ford my brother was five of you though what's five of you

five of us went there for family week. Oh, I thought you were patients. No, no, no. We got a discount. No, no, no. He wants to do a Zagat guide on rehab. Oh, he does?

For rehab? He's a real character. Oh, your brother? How many? You got five? There's two boys and four girls. Everyone's still around? Yeah.

That's nice. Our parents died very young, tragically, both of them. But yeah, the siblings are all still together. So there's a dance studio in the garage. Dance studio in the garage. You're teaching at 14. 200 students. There's tapping and there's ballet.

Nuns. Oh, I thought you said ballet. Is there a thing? This is a lower middle class neighbor in Chicago. No ballet? No ballet. You can park on the bou neighbor in Chicago. No ballet? No ballet. You can park on the boulevard. Ballet?

There's ballet? Ballet, tap, jazz, social dancing. I can see you doing jazz. Oh, yeah. Well, I did Fosse for a year on Broadway. You did? I did Chicago. I remember that.

408 performances. Of Chicago. I did it on Broadway. Yeah. And I replaced Annie Reinking, so I was the first replacement. So I went in. I did the show with Bebe Neuwirth and Joel Grey and Jimmy Naughton, and then they asked me to go to Vegas, and I thought, oh, Vegas, I don't want to go.

And then they made me an offer I couldn't refuse, so I was so excited. I went, okay, yeah, that sounds like a deal. So I went there. I took my two little boys. They were three and a half and five at the time. And we had the best time. They got us a house. The boys learned to swim.

They got their yellow belts in karate. It was fantastic. In Vegas. In Vegas. And I got so complimented because I was at the Mandalay Bay and the people were saying, oh, you're great. Whoa, we love you here. And I was like, oh, you like the show? And he was like,

no, we sell a lot more Belvedere with your crowd. It's all about the booze. It's all about the booze. Getting them back out to the casino. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's weird.

Was that the first time you worked in Vegas? Yeah, the only time. Oh, really? Yeah, it was in 99 and it was really fun. I had a great time. I mean, they had to drag me kicking and screaming to go,

and then they had to drag me kicking and screaming out of there, but the boys had to start school, so I had to do it. Yeah. But I had a blast. They gave us a bungalow. Yeah, when you get first-class treatment in Vegas, I imagine it's really first-class. The misters.

You take your kids to the wave pool and the lazy river and all that stuff. No, we had a great time. And the audiences were great. They loved the show. And we did the same show we did on Broadway. But it is kind of funny when you're doing a second show on Tuesday and you're about to start the second act and it's midnight. And you're doing me and my baby if you want want to show. Right, right. It's like crazy. There's no time in Vegas. No, there's no time. Yeah. No time.

So, okay, so you start dancing. I start dancing. Are you the youngest? Were you in the middle? No, I'm the third. Okay. My parents were married five years, then they had a girl. Yeah. Another five years, they had a second girl.

Yeah. Another five years, they had me. Yeah. And then the next year, a boy. Next year, a girl. Three years later, a boy. Was it... So, that seems like an interesting pacing.

It was. So, there's a lot of space. They had... My mother gave birth to babysitters. You know, she gave birth to me. a girl, three years later, a boy. So that seems like an interesting pacing. It was. So there's a lot of space. My mother gave birth to babysitters. She gave birth to me. That was the plan. And then 13 months later, she gave birth to the first boy, the little Buddha. So my older sister kind of raised me.

But we grew up, I mean, it was such a great way to grow up because it was not only a dancing school, but my mom ran a beauty shop out of our kitchen. The whole house was a business. The whole house was a business. The whole house was a business. 25 women from the neighborhood would come over and get their hair done in the kitchen. But were there signs or was there just a known thing? Just a known thing. Everybody came over. Everybody hung out at my house.

My parents were incredible. All under the table. Totally. Yeah. But not for a dollar a student in my moment of charge, $3 for my haircuts. Who kept her busy, though, right? I grew up with such a great role model about wanting to do a lot of different things and being an entrepreneur. What about food?

Who's feeding everybody? She was, but as my uncle used to say, as a cook, she was a very good dancer. But I liked my mother's cooking because it was very simple. She was Greek. My father was Polish. Greek's the best. I just went there for the first time. I've never been there, but Greek food, I love it.

So clean. So clean. I like fish. I like horta, which is the greens. I like horta, the greens. They're just like dandelion greens or something. Yeah, and I love the white beans. Have you had that dessert, garlic to borico?

I don't eat dairy. I haven't had dairy since, oh, today is my 40th anniversary of not having dairy. August 15th, 1979. I hardly eat it because it just seems like pure fat to me. But now that it just weighs you down. It's the hardest thing for your stomach. But for 40 years and to celebrate that, like you really have something against dairy. I do.

Oh, I, you know, I. What started that? Well, my parents both died very young. My father died of a heart attack at 52 i was 17 at the time that's terrible my mother died at 58 of arthritis of arthritis the complications rheumatoid arthritis the upper vertebrae of her spine disintegrated shifted out of position made her paralyzed from the neck down oh my god that's horrible right before i got taxi so it was really sad. Oh, sorry.

Yeah. And what's that have to do with dairy? Well, the more I started studying the human body and I went to, I took, you know, went to the Bodhi Tree, if you remember that. Yeah, I do. The Bodhi Tree bookstore? On Melrose. Yeah, it's where- I went there.

Yeah. Nutrition. The Earth Cafe is there now, I think, right? Yeah. Yeah. Or is it across the street? I think it's across the street. It's close.

But it's the same neighborhood. Yeah. Same street. Same block. So you went to the holistic bookstore. I went there. Started researching. Nutritionists.

Yeah. Doctors. I took human anatomy classes at UCLA. Out of fear for your life. I just felt like if my parents can both die in their 50s, and this is the genetic hand we've been dealt on, I've got all these brothers and sisters. I don't want to, you know. Well, how are they doing? Good.

Really good. Are they all on the same diet as you? No. The smart ones. No. The ones who are the most healthy. No. Everybody dabbles in it.

Yeah. Some of them are totally committed. Polish. How Polish was your dad? Half. Yeah? I mean, no, he was Polish. Yeah. Some of them are totally committed. Polish. How Polish was your dad? Half. Yeah? I mean, no, he was Polish. A hundred percent.

My mother, a hundred percent Greek. It's a great combination. It is an interesting conversation. I'm very lucky. I don't know if I've ever heard that one before. Yeah, it's rare. It's rare. I look probably more Polish.

Well, people always think I'm Irish and Italian, but similar. It feels pretty Chicago to me. Chicago. Polish and Greek for some reason. Certainly Polish. It's a real to me, Polish and Greek for some reason. Certainly Polish. It's a real neighborhood. Very neighborhood. My whole neighborhood was very Polish and German.

Not too many Greeks. Are you Ukrainian? A little bit Ukrainian, but mostly. Where are the pierogies from? Oh. Are they Polish? Polish. Yeah.

Yeah, pierogies were, you know. But we were very American. My parents were first generation,. But we were very American. You know, my parents were first generation, but they weren't very Greek and they weren't very Polish. Religion? Catholic. My mother discovered Catholicism and that's when she started having all the kids. And so we lived right next door to a Catholic church.

She discovered it? Was she Greek Orthodox? She was born Greek Orthodox and my oldest sister was baptized Greek Orthodox. Then she got into the Catholic Church because it was right next door. And so the nuns came over for stretch classes. In their habits? In their habits. No.

In their habits. I don't know what happened behind closed doors, but my mother, because my mom gave them exercises. The nuns class was private. The kids weren't allowed in. But she also cut their hair uh-huh and because she had this beauty shop but she'd go to the convent to cut their hair but it's a beauty shop what do you mean had a couple of those dryers in the house we had one dryer where the refrigerator was supposed to be the refrigerator was down in the basement uh-huh and so the blue hair drying chair in the kitchen, and the whole kitchen was kind of set up like a salon. You know how when you go to a salon and there's the little tray with the neck?

Yeah. That was set up in our kitchen. The kitchen was set up like a hair salon. Now, was this the primary business of the family? The dancing school was. And what did your dad do? Oh, no, my father sold. He was a troubleshooter for Ford Motor Company and Chevrolet. He was a car, you know, like manager of dealerships.

Oh, yeah. I think one of the reasons I have a good memory is I had to memorize so many phone numbers because he never stayed at a place for very long. He'd go in there for three months, build it up, move to the next, maybe six months, build it up, go to the next he was my parents were very dynamic and very you know full of energy and just he my image of my parents growing up is that there was always people laughing at you know women men lined up to dance with my mother on the dance floor and women in the corner with my father with their heads thrown back in laughter oh they looked like lana turner and clark gable in our mind yeah and then at some point because we had these big parties at, you know, somebody would put on a rumba and my father would go on the floor and everybody would clear the space and my parents would dance. Yeah. It was so sweet.

Dancing is, that kind of dancing, to know how to dance, it's very kind of exciting. It is. It's really fun. I think I learned how to do it for my first marriage, my first wedding. Oh took some ballroom classes, but I didn't stick with it. Yeah. I mean, there's certain things I think I should stick with because they probably make me feel good, but I'm not, I'm not, I wouldn't say I'm a dancer. Yeah. But I bet you have, you seem like you have natural grace. Yeah. I would hope so. I mean, I think, I think I can do it. I'm athletic and I have pretty good rhythm. What was your sport? No, I don't have

a sport, but I mean physique-wise. I work out, I run. Competitive sports were not my bag. And you have to sit here for so long. That's why it's like I don't have back issues. I have knee issues. I have ankle issues. You must walk well. I do alright. I'm a little hunched.

I have a natural hunch because I'm holding my stomach in a lot. Right. Because I grew up with that. Well, yeah, my mom was a little bit body dysmorphic. It's a hereditary trait. I think it was. I heard you talk about it in one of your podcasts. You did?

One of the many? No, but I think that that's the generation too. Yeah? Yeah, I think I think that that's the generation too yeah yeah I think definitely I mean I think you know my well one of my three mother-in-laws

because I mother-in-law because I've had three I'm on my third and final husband but he but they

every one of my mother-in-law talked about weight and talked about going on diet pills when they were pregnant or going on

you know my mother was naturally thin so she one of those people the enemy we call no going on diet pills when they were pregnant or going on, you know, my mother was naturally thin. So she. One of those people. Yeah. The enemy we call them. No, I listen. I've got the, you know, I think it's food.

I really think it's food. It's so not popular to say that now. You think what's food? I used to weigh 56 pounds more than I do right now. Stop it. I did. I did at one time. Yeah. Until I changed my, in college. Oh. I would go now. Stop it. I did. I did at one time. Yeah.

Until I changed my, in college. Oh. I would go up and down, up and down. I was a horrible yo-yo dieter. I'd go on every stupid diet. I talk about this in all of my books

because I found a different way of eating that worked for me and it just, it's like learn to love the food that loves you. That's what I call it because I knew dairy didn't love me. I knew sugar didn't love me. I knew a couple things didn't love me.

I don't eat a lot of sugar, but I eat fruit. Yeah. Well, that's a natural sugar, but it's not like refined sugar. You're not kitty cocaine sugar. No, I don't do much of that. I like stevia, like almond milk. I make my own almond milk. Oh, you do?

Yeah, it's great. My son's very allergic to nuts and cats too, so unfortunately we can't have a cat because I always liked cats. No nuts, no cats. Yeah, no nuts, no cats. Those nut allergies are scary. And I knew at seven months old because he had something from a hotel room. We were staying at the Mirage.

Oh, really? And he had taken to the hospital? No, but I could tell his whole, but you know what works for, what's the cure-all? Breast milk. Breast milk's unbelievable. Really? It is. Not considered dairy, though.

It's like, no, no, no. It's not from a cow. Totally different. Totally different chemical makeup and everything. That's good dairy, breast milk. That's good dairy. Breast milk, yes. So you're dancing.

My uncle lived upstairs with the 10 cats, 2 dogs, two birds, a skunk, 150 fish, and his boyfriend, Charles. And he taught art at the Catholic grammar school next door. He had art classes going on upstairs while the dancing school was going on, while the beauty shop was in the kitchen. It sounds like the city should have been paying for all this. They should have. And he was also the neighborhood astrologist, and he ran a cat hospital on our roof. So we had all this going on. Are you shitting me?

This is totally true. Where's this movie? This is how I grew up. Why don't you write this script? I should write this movie. It's so crazy the way I grew up, and people go, are you kidding me? It sounds like a play. It's a lot of people.

Well, it's like you can't take it with you. Exactly. Because there's so much going on. But it gave us such an outlook. Exactly. But it gave us such an outlook. And my mother and my uncle were so obsessed with old movies and culture and theater and opera and everything else that we would be exposed to all of that. And gayness.

And gayness. Oh, I knew that they were a couple. He had his arm around him at dinners. Their beds were pushed together. So you grew up with tolerance and embracing people. Do you want to know something? I was 21 years old and in the First National Company of greece and i was in boston i not boston i was in another city in in toronto and i got a birthday card that said love uncle dan and charles and my girl my one of the girls in the show she said love uncle dan and charles is your uncle gay and I said yeah it's like

there was no label there was no label to us right you know they had the most successful relationship of any of the relationships

in our whole family they were together the longest and they're buried next to each other how do you have a pet skunk though is a big question

he got it he deodorized it you know you take the little sack off you do and it was a nice animal so cute jet what was all the fucking animals so how did they live up there did it smell like shit all the time deodorized it. You take the little sack off. You do. And it was a nice animal? So cute. Jet.

What was all the fucking animals? So how did they live up there? Did it smell like shit all the time? It sounds like a fucking zoo. No. No, he kind of cleaned it up. And we were the godparents. Each one of us got a cat.

Mine was Chiffon, a little calico cat. It was so cute. And this was going on upstairs. The dancing school. All of this went on all the time. And it's just the way it was and there were five of you, six of you six of us, and this was all going on

this was all going on, so I grew up with a very kind of theatrical upbringing, and people would call, you know, colleges high schools community theaters would call the house and want kids for a show

and so we, you you know i was always like the first one with her hand up so i would i got to do a lot of connections i had connections so i started doing a lot of community theater and then when i was 15 i did like a very famous production of the boyfriend in chicago i was the youngest kid by person by far it was like a big theater production um yeah it was community theater but it was like a very well respected one right and then one of the guys that i met who was in the advertising agency quite a bit older Like a big theater production? Yeah, it was community theater, but it was like a very well-respected one. And then one of the guys that I met who was in the advertising agency, quite a bit older, he called me and he said,

Hannah, I've written the show. It may never get off the ground. We're going to perform it in a converted trolley barn. I wrote it about the kids I went to high school. It's called Grease. So I did the original company of Grease in Chicago. Before it got to New York? Before anything.

Oh, wow. So I did that. He of Grease in Chicago. Before it got to New York? Before anything. Oh, wow. So I did that. He wrote all the music and everything? He and his partner, yeah, Warren Casey. It was Jim Jacobs and then Warren Casey. And so the first day of rehearsal, we both, we walked in and it was like two stacks about nine inches tall. One of them was songs and the other one was scenes. And he'd pass out the scenes.

Who were you? Well, do you know the play or the movie? I feel like I saw the play when I was a kid in New York. I don't know. I remember that. When were you? September 27th, 1963. Oh, you were going on a Friday.

Okay. Are you sure? I thought it was a Thursday night. It was a Friday? Okay. It might have been after midnight. Yeah. Yeah.

Really? September 27th, 1963 was a Friday? Okay. It might have been after midnight. Yeah. Yeah. Really? September 27th, 1963 is a Friday? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Okay. I believe you. Pretty sure.

That's just off the top of my head. So he wrote it about these kids from school. I think I remember the sexy tough one. Rizzo. Rizzo. Rizzo was funny. Yeah. And then like, I can't remember the sexy tough one. Rizzo? Rizzo was funny. I can't remember who played who. It opened in New York, February 14th of 72.

And so you might have seen it if you saw the original company. And then it moved to Broadway. So it was at the Eden Theater. I was in college. Who played Rizzo on Broadway? Adrienne Barbeau. And who played the good girl? Carol Demas.

Huh. I wonder who I saw. But you might have seen Barry Bostwick, maybe? I can't. I really can't remember. So who'd you play? I played Marty. He was in it, who sang Freddie, My Love.

Oh, yeah. And his boyfriend went off and was very anxious. The one who I saw do it had a really nasally voice. No, that might have been Frenchie. Oh, Frenchie. That's Frenchie. Frenchie with the red hair and stuff. I wore a blonde wig.

Oh, okay. She was like the one who was very flirty with everybody. Sort of a Marilyn Monroe wannabe. Oh, okay. And flirted with the disc jockey who came to do the, what do you call it? So anyway, so here I am. I'm doing the show in Chicago. The show goes to Broadway. My father had just passed away, so I didn't want to do anything.

I didn't want to go to New York and audition. And then I get a call. I went to University of Chicago on four scholarships because I was like- Four scholarships for dance, hair, animals. Yes. And just social, just personality. What were the scholarships? National Merit, National Honor Society.

I was named Outstanding Teenager of Illinois, which is kind of cool. Yeah, well, you know, I knew how to fill in a good resume. I was an overachiever as a little kid. And what did you do in college? I did a lot of plays, but they didn't have, you couldn't get a theater degree, so I was going for a political science. But I placed out of a lot of classes, so I would have graduated in three years. But then, at the beginning of my third year, I get a call from Jim Jacobs who says, we're casting the National Company.

It starts rehearsal tomorrow. I've saved the part for you. Please come to New York today. You have to come to get the job. I said, oh, I'm on my way to the library. I have two papers due. I'm in a relationship. Thank you for thinking of me.

Hang up the phone. And I walked to the library and my car was parked in front of the library. And I thought, is this a sign? Because it was never parked there. And I thought, I'm going. So I went to to the airport flew student standby remember maybe you were kind of yeah and uh got the job and so showed up at the first rehearsal and in that room was um uh Jeff Conaway was playing Danny Zuko sure and do you know who

Judy Kaye is she won the Tony Award I think I think I saw him as him. Is that possible? Oh, as Danny? Yeah, that's very possible. And Jerry Zaks just directed My Fair Lady, directs like everything on Broadway. He was playing Kinnicky. Michael Leveque, who did the original Everybody Loves Raymond, he was playing Sonny. And John Travolta was playing Doody. And Richard Gere was rehearsing with us to play Danny in London.

What year is this? This is November the 28th of 1972. So none of these guys were known guys? Oh, nobody. No, and they were all like four or five years older than Danny and I. All right, so let's talk about Travolta for a minute, since you don't seem to care about talking about people. In the good ways. Yeah.

Well, all right. All of a sudden you got so serious. Oh, my God. It's like, should I? Relative with this light in my eyes. I'm just curious, like relative to, you know, what he's become, which is he's still John Travolta, but there's a lot of mystery and weirdness about him. What was he like as a kid? He was.

Well, he's he and I immediately got along because we're both from families of six kids. Yeah. We both have two brothers and three sisters because he's from a family of three and three and I'm two and four. So we both have two sisters and three brothers. His mother taught drama. My mother taught dance. His father sold tires. My father sold cars.

We both grew up in these lower middle class neighborhoods but thought we were the cultural center of our neighborhood. And just grew up singing and dancing and performing and everything else. He was, during that time, like my best, best friend because we were very familial and very comfortable with each other and just took to each other right away. Are you still friends? Yeah, not as much, you know, unfortunately. Things get weird. I think Scientology has something to do.

Took him away? I think so so i don't know yeah i mean that's been a long time already but this is yeah i know when he and it no it happened over time yeah but you guys were you never dated you weren't oh yeah on and off for 13 years for 13 years yeah on and off but yeah we lived together for a while he He's just, he's a great guy. I mean, our family's very close. You know his family? We travel with them very well. Oh, wow. Yeah, we travel back and forth, you know,

spent a lot of holidays together, our families and stuff. So these were your young, like, formative love years. Yeah, really good. With John Travolta. Yes, but we were, I would say we were always more friends and siblings than lovers. I mean, we were lovers, but we were definitely. Was that always the weird rub of it?

Like you were too good of friends? No, because we could stay up all night talking. He reminded me of my brothers. I reminded him of his sisters. And he's a great guy. He's a great, great guy. Oh, that's sweet. Like I never ask people about this stuff, but it just, I'm curious about what these,

since your memory is so good, what these people were like when they were younger. Yeah. Like what's your gear? I don't know. these, since your memory is so good, what these people were like when they were younger. Yeah. Like Richard Gere, I don't know. Oh, Richard was fantastic. We did, we did, well, Richard I knew from the Grease Days, but then my first movie that, I came out here in 77 to do a screen test. Well, no, I came out in April to do a screen test for a movie called Blood Brothers. Right. Which was, and he ended up getting the part opposite me.

And he was fantastic. So we got to be friendly then. And whenever we see each other at some function or something, it's like we're right back there. Oh, that's sweet. Yeah. Okay, so you do the national touring thing. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

With Grease. It was so much fun. And it was like I'm back in my hometown. And, you know, we had a theater that I'd gone to as a little girl and wanted to be there. And I went to New York one weekend to visit a friend of mine who was doing Grease on Broadway. And she had me meet her at the theater because she had a singing lesson. And I walk in and they're auditioning for a new Broadway show called Over Here, which I had heard about. But I didn't think there was a part for me.

And I get on stage. I audition. And a week later, they flew didn't think there was a part for me. And I get on stage. I audition. And a week later, they flew me back and I got the part. Musical. Musical. You like the musicals. I love to sing and dance. Well, I love all of it.

Yeah. I love all of it. So you do that for how long? I did that a year. And so now you're like a- In New York. A known thing. Well, I started getting an agent and stuff like that. So people, they send you. year and then and then and so now you're like a new york a known thing well you know i started

getting an agent and stuff like that so people you know they send you i did i auditioned for 40 commercials before i got one because i finally figured out how to land a commercial how's that but then i did 72 of them how do you land a commercial you have to go in and be yourself that's it don't act don't act. Don't act. That's the hardest thing for people to learn. Yeah. You were talking about that in one. I feel like I'm a student of yours now because I've been listening to your podcasts.

Oh, yeah? For a few days. I was so excited to be on this. You have no idea. Why not? Because I know so many of the people that you talk about in an interview. And yeah, so is there any corrections that need to be made? Just a couple.

No, I'm kidding. Like who? Who did you listen to that you know? Well, I love David Letterman. That was great. I remember the first time I met him.

Yeah. That was November 22nd, 1979. He was hosting The Tonight Show and I came on and we just, I did his show like 14 times.

Yeah. I love him. Yeah. And Jay, of course. And you know, Jay, but you said that you met Jay and he took you to the comedy store. What was that?

Okay. And you were talking about, and Letterman was talking about the fact that he was so good. And I remember some of his things, like one of the things he did was about being a college student and you couldn't have a microwave. You couldn't cook in your room. And it was like the cops, come on now, we know you got soup in there. Yeah, right. I'm sure he did that for years. But it was interesting because we hung out all day, went to the comedy store.

Wait, now what did you say you put together for what reason that you were auditioning for something? Oh, American Hot Wax, which I was totally wrong for. I kept saying, you need a nice- Were you in that? No, no, no. Fran Drescher got the part and she was perfect. I always- That was the Alan Freed movie?

Yeah. Oh, yeah. I've always had like a Freed movie? Yeah Oh yeah I've always had like a very producer head Yeah And so when I think I'm wrong for something I'm the first person to say

don't get me Yeah Get this other person Yeah I probably talked myself out of many jobs that way Did you do movies before you did TV?

I did I did some work in New York Yeah But then I got cast in the film with Richard Gere came out here to do this. A casting director really liked me and kept bringing me in for everything.

And they brought me in for Taxi. Yeah. And I was totally wrong for the part because at the time I was 25. They wanted a 35-year-old Italian New Yorker who could have a 16-year-old daughter. Right. But they liked me and they thought I could hold my own with the guys and they wanted, and in the meantime,

Yeah. I had done the pilot for Paper Chase and did it as a guest star and then I tested so high, they thought, what, we only have her as a guest star? So then it was great because Taxi was like,

well, we still want this 35-year-old girl and blah, blah, blah. Yeah. And they said, well, okay, you're going to lose her to Paper Chase then. So they went, okay, she's Elaine. Oh, thank God for Paper Chase. Which she didn't. I know.

I know. It's like those happy things. Which didn't even last as a show, did it? Three years. Oh, it did? Three years. We were five. Taxi was five.

Only five. It was three. Seems like Taxi was on forever. I know. We did so many. It was such a powerful presence culturally. We had so much fun judd hirsch played the dad on my show he played my dad oh he did yeah he's intense huh he is intense and

i was worried about it oh really yeah because like we it was it was my concern was when we were able to get him yeah i mean this is only a few years ago. Yeah. Was that he'd be too Jew-y and too soft because my dad's a little aggravated and a little bipolar. Oh my God. That's where he lives. I know. Aggravated and oh my God, he must have been amazing.

Well, once we made the adjustment, because like he does sort of settle into like, you know, a Judd Hirsch thing that sort of, you know, like it wasn't as aggressive, but like right when, I just remember there was this moment where I'm like, he's doing it.

He's being too cute. And he's kind of, you know, he's just doing this Jew thing. Really? And we were like, someone's got to tell him. My dad's a little nuts. Oh, my, Judd is one of the most intense people I've ever met in my entire life. I mean, we, you know, when we all. Yeah.

Once we made the adjustment, it was right there. Yeah. He's fabulous. He's a fabulous actor. I learned, watching him and Danny DeVito just take a script that was, you know, I mean, there were no bad taxis, but there were some that were much better than others and some that in the beginning of the week, you'd think like, oh, and they were just masters. And Christopher Lloyd, too.

He came in as a guest star and they just loved him so much. They just made him a regular the following year. And Christopher Lloyd, too. Is it like a trip? He came in as a guest star, and they just loved him so much. They just made him a regular the following year. And what about Andy? Andy. I loved Andy. I was so disappointed in Man on the Moon. So, so, so disappointed. Oh, me too.

Yeah. I thought, well, now that I've seen the documentary with Jim and Andy, it was like, well, Jim had his own thing going. How are you going to, like, any biopic? I mean, the problem is, is if the guy is, you know him, if the world knows him, it's already, you know,

you're already working at a disadvantage. Yeah. How are you going to do that guy? Yeah, but I also think that they made the choice to make him so crazy all the time and not sweet. And Andy's genius was that he knew what he was doing all the time and not sweet and Andy's genius was that he knew what he was doing all the time and he was like this sweet boy from Long Island who could have like serious conversations with you and be so adorable and then do something crazy.

You know and that was like the yin yang of that was so appealing. But you were part of the, you were in Man on the Moon. Yeah, Man on the Moon. Yeah, I wore the same clothes. I still had them. And what, now, but like why, I mean, there's all this mythology that I think was, you know, mostly, what's his name? Who was his partner?

I interviewed him for two and a half hours. Oh, Bob Zmuda? Like Zmuda really kind of like built this myth around him. Yeah. But I mean, he was a prankster, but was he really, he wasn't, he was, like, he knew what he was up to. He knew what he was up to. I mean, first of all, I know Zmuda since I'm in grade school. What?

Because we did, Zmuda is like, my life is like a Dickens novel anyway. People kind of wander in and out. But Zmuda and I, I was in eighth grade going into freshman year. He was a junior going into senior year. And we ended up at the same Loyola University high school thing. And we did The Boyfriend together. And then all of a sudden I go to school and he ends up in my show in high school. I was a freshman and he was a senior.

He ended up playing a part in the Unsinkable Molly Brown. Yeah. Then I run into him in New York when I'm doing Grease. And he's good friends with somebody in the show. Yeah. And then I come out to Hollywood and there he is. And he's a right-hand guy. So I've known Zmuda a very long time.

That's crazy. I know. Crazy, crazy. Yeah. But I think you're right. He had this mythology. But Zmuda has that Chicago sort of, let's see what we can get away with thing. The hustler. The hustler. Yeah. But I think you're right. He had this mythology. But Zmuda has that Chicago sort of, let's see what we can get away with thing. The hustler.

The hustler. Yeah. And in the best way. And Andy was just, he'd come up with the craziest things. I mean, that whole Tony Clifton thing was insane. And did happen the way it was, only it was even crazier than you saw in the movie if you saw it. Really? It was crazier?

It was crazy. I mean, imagine that you're working with someone. You really like them. You're working together three months. And then all of a sudden your producers say to you, okay, the guest star next week is going to be Andy. Well, it's not Andy, but just play along. It's like, oh, okay. Yeah.

And then he shows up with this fake chest, you know, like padded out with the ruffled tuxedo shirt and the, you know, ice blue tuxedo jacket with a mustache, orange fake nose, wig and chain smoking. You know, and it's like, hey, pretty lady. Hey, let's get to work here. And he was such a bad actor. Tony Clifton was so bad playing a part. He was going to be playing Louis de Palma's brother. He was, and the episode. And was it, and it was Andy or was it Bob? It was Andy.

Yeah. Oh, it was totally Andy. Yeah. No, it was always, it was Andy. Well, Bob is done, Tony. I know, but that's. Later. Yeah.

Yeah. Later. To sort of carry on this myth that maybe Andy's not dead. Yeah. But so, but so you all had to play along. It was, it came down from the top. We played along until Tuesday and then went to the to play along it was it came down from the top tuesday and then went to the run-through and it was so horrible yeah you know i remember some of the lines because

um it was about uh louis de palma negotiating with his brother who was going to get stuck with their mother for the holidays and the way he said the lines was like this, you know, ma, sometimes she's glad, sometimes she's sad. As Jim Brooks said, you can't have a man playing a man, playing a man, playing a man. It's like, I believe in artist painting, but they can't paint on other artists. They can't paint on the other actors. And so they fired him, but he said he would only get fired. They called Andy at night and said, Tuesday night and said said, it's just not working out with your friend Tony. We're going to have to fire him.

And he said, can you do it in person? So the next day we came in. Jim Burrow said, who's directing, he said, you, you know, just play along. We don't know what's going to happen, but here he is. He's going to, you know, this he's going to you know this is the new guy yeah so he starts and we're like okay finally we can have a show this week yeah and then after lunch out of nowhere here comes andy with the two here comes tony with the two hookers that he was hanging out with right weekend in his trailer all week in his trailer it's like okay

where's the director let's go let's get to work and all this yeah you know and then judd turns to me he says uh the man wants a psychodrama. He wants a psychodrama. The man being Andy. Andy. And they started punching each other until the Paramount guards pulled them apart. But my question is, why did everyone feel like they had to play along with this? Why would, if Jim called Andy.

That's a good question to ask our country right now. It's like, people are fascinated by bad behavior. And I think that. No, I get it. But like, if everyone knew it was Andy and, you know, and they, why did they indulge Andy Kaufman to that degree? I think they loved what he was doing as Latke so much, even though he only had to come in Tuesday afternoon for the run through. They wrote this in the script. It said what he was saying, but didn so much even though he only had to come in tuesday afternoon for the run through they wrote this in the script it said what he was saying but didn't have the language right and andy i always use this line i said andy made up a country i wanted to visit right because it was such so rich in culture what he brought in terms of the language and the history of of you

know latke land whatever it was called and so he he they loved what he was doing so much they didn't want to lose him and when he signed his contract no when he signed his contract he said my friend tony clifton has to play has to be a guest star and he wanted three yeah and he they said we'll sign him for one right so it was like oh let's see you know we'll play along but they were you know he had enough leverage to kind of do that. It was really good. And they were fascinated. I think our guys were fascinated. I think that they thought like, well, this is kind of funny. This is kind of cool.

Let's see what. But then when they realized it was not going to work, they got rid of him. Was the entire experience of Taxi a good experience? Fantastic. Oh, such a golden time in all of our lives. And every one of us will say that. Jim Brooks and Danny and Tony and all of us. We loved it. I always say we had 112 shows. We had 112 parties. We were like the cool kids because it was, you know, Bosom Buddies and Happy Days, Laverne and Shirley, Working Stiffs, Mork and Mindy. Everybody came and hung out at taxis. It was like my family. Everybody came out and hung out at taxis. It was like my family. Yeah. Everybody came out and hung out at taxis. And then was it from taxi that you were able to do the movies, most of the bigger movies that you did? Yeah.

Went right into like movies. I can't believe there's a fucking wood chipper out there today. I can't tell you how it's fucking annoying me sometimes. Oh, I'm sorry. Well, I'm a good guest to have then because it's not annoying me. Oh, no. No, I don't even think it picks up on the mics that much, but it's like every fucking day in this neighborhood. There's something. Like in my old neighborhood, I was tucked even think it picks up on the mics that much, but it's like every fucking day in this neighborhood.

Like in my old neighborhood, I was tucked in the back. And it's just like with all these yards, it's like every day. Yeah. It's just like it's one thing with the blowers, but then it just becomes this thing where like earlier there was a blower. And then there was a second level, which is a wood chipper. And I'm like, what? A wood chipper? What is that?

It's Fargo? Yeah. It's like it becomes like this farce i know with the goddamn blowers and then it's like what is that noise when you are at a hotel do you have to have it quiet or do you have to have it dark i don't like there to be a nightclub downstairs or to be on the street where it's like you know going till two in the morning. I like a quiet environment, sure. And I know, like, look, I've been doing a podcast from my house one way or the other for a long time. And I don't mind texture, but like it just makes me sort of like, it fills me with a type of resentment. Right.

The gardening equipment in this particular neighborhood. But you have a beautiful neighborhood. I understand. It's just one of those days where I think I'm looking for a reason to lose my fucking mind. Oh, why? Oh, that's okay. You can do it in front of me. I'm used to people.

Because show business is irritating sometimes. It is. It's very irritating. You have to get to inner peace and have a good family life a lot sooner these days. You do? You do. to get to inner peace and have a good family life yeah a lot sooner these days you do you do but you've had this like like amazingly kind of persistent career in show business well i think because i haven't messed myself up maybe i don't know i don't know i i you know what it's like i

think because of my parents and the crazy way i grew up yeah i'm always like looking like okay what's over here what's this so I do a lot of different things. But you did all these like fun movies. Did fun movies. I don't know if they, some of them weren't huge movies. They were kind of weird movies. Oh, they were like weird, but I did some movies that we thought were going to be huge and then they weren't.

Like. Like Johnny Dangerously. Right. That was a heartbreaker. Yeah. That was, was that Piscopo and Michael Keaton? Yeah. And the funniest person I've ever worked with. The two funniestbreaker. Yeah. Was that Piscopo and Michael Keaton? And the funniest person I've ever worked with.

The two funniest people I have ever, ever worked with. Yeah. Griffin Dunn and Ian McShane. Oh, wow. They will put anybody to shame. They are the funniest two people I have ever worked with in my life. Both of them having sort of like a pretty good few years. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

For sure. As older dudes. How great is Griffin? How did he not get a nomination? For Trans Yeah, yeah, yeah. For sure. He has older dudes. How great is Griffin in, how did he not get a nomination? For Transparent? Oh, no, for This Is Us. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's so good in that show.

Yeah, yeah. I just realized I re-watched Dallas Buyers Club. Oh, yeah. And he plays a doctor in Mexico. He's so good.

He can do anything, but he is personally the funniest. He and Ian McShane, tears roll down your cheeks when you work with these guys. They're unbelievable. I did a movie in the south of France. I can't even picture Ian McShane as tears roll down your cheeks when you work with these guys. They're unbelievable. I did a movie in the south of France with Ian.

I can't even picture Ian McShane as funny. Oh, so funny. So funny. Like, killer funny. Which movies did you do with them? I did a little Showtime movie back then called Grand Larceny with Omar Sharif, Louis Jordan. Oh, wow. It was pretty cool people.

Funniest. See, that's what's interesting about you, too, is that you're at really this weird, like a lot of that generation was still around. Yeah. In Hollywood. And Burt, I worked with Burt five times and worked with him for four years on a series, but also did The Man Who Loved Women with him and got directed by Blake Edwards and just bonded

with him, like first moment, laughed, had so much fun with him. Nice guy. Oh. Burt Reynolds. The best. The best. The best. I loved him so much.

What a great guy. But I can't believe that we're coming on the one year anniversary. Such a special, special person. Just really. And it's funny

because we never had an affair. We never, you know, had a thing together. Yeah. But we just loved each other. Just loved. Maybe that's why we got to work together so many times, I always think, you know, I say that. Yeah. Wonderful, wonderful man. Yeah. Special and just so generous. It is hard to believe he's gone,

really. I know. Cause you know why it's really hard? Cause his parents lived well into their nineties, like 96 and something. And so that he died so young. How old was he? He was like 81. Yeah. It's just like, there are these people that were always so young how old was he like 81 yeah it's just like there are these people that were always so present in the culture for so long i know and just there yeah and you just you know you don't their absence it's sort of like wow that's it's happened yeah yeah and you guys stayed close until we stayed close oh we called each other on birthdays and he did my radio show and you know he talks about me in his book. I talk about him in my book.

I guess that's not so Hollywood. That's not like a stupid thing to say. But we stay in contact. Well, I'm sorry for your loss. Yeah. Oh, what a great guy. He was great. Yeah, I've been very lucky in my career to work with a lot of wonderful people.

L.A. Story you did with Steve Martin. Oh, my God. Yeah. My favorite part I've ever played. Yeah, I've been very lucky in my career to work with a lot of wonderful people. L.A. Story you did with Steve Martin. Oh, my God. Yeah. My favorite part I've ever played. Yeah. Not the most like me. In fact, very unlike me. But Steve gave me free reign.

I read the script. Yeah. And I wanted to go in as this character. Right. And they said, no, can you read the part of Trudy, the girlfriend? Yeah. And I thought, I'm so not dressed. I want to look like the part.

I said, can I do it tomorrow? Because I had therapy, actually. So I had therapy on the phone, and I wanted to go to my therapy. Are you still in therapy? I did 28 years of therapy with a brilliant psychoanalyst who passed away. And now sometimes my husband and I go to her son.

She was such a brilliant therapist. Her name is Dr. Ruth Velikovsky-Sharon. She would set up Sunday nights at 6.30 LA time, 9.30 New York time, set up six speaker boxes in her place in Princeton, New Jersey, and the six siblings for 10 years, every other Sunday, would do group therapy. Wow. So 28 years of that type of psychoanalysis. Loved it. So when you do that for 28 years and then you do it with your, like, what is, because there are some people that will do it, therapy. Like, and I've done it on and off my life and I'm very self-examining.

But when you sort of stay in that consistent relationship with a therapist, what are you working on? I always liken it to like there's always things that come up and there's always so many people but why do they need what do you need them for because it's it's great to brainstorm with somebody that you trust that you can it's like going to a computer and it's you're asking questions that ask you questions that back and forth and back and forth so there were just so many people but you but for you did you have a psychological issues that you you know that constant needed constant maintenance no new ones come up because I definitely went into it at the time I felt like I was numb my my my mother was still alive but my father had died I was

having I found myself dating a lot of men that were in other relationships so I was kind of like a professional other woman and I found myself dating a lot of men that were in other relationships. So I was kind of like a professional other woman. And I found myself not picking impossible people to have a relationship with and then complaining that I didn't, couldn't, where is that guy? You know, I'm not, how can I have a relationship? Without blaming yourself. Without blaming myself. So it was always easy to leave or say, oh, well, of course it didn't work out. He had a girlfriend or he was crazy or he did this or whatever.

And I remember, and it was just like hard for me to make commitments and things and i remember i was living um up on 83rd street at the time and i like went to the 79th street uh l took a subway to go downtown yeah and i got on and then we pulled up to 72nd and i thought should i take the express stay on the local express stay on 72nd and I thought, ooh, should I take the express? Stay on the local express, stay on the local express. And I thought, I'm going to take the express. So I ran to the express, the doors closed, ran back to the local, the doors closed. And the two trains were like whizzing by me. I'm in the middle of the platform and I thought, no wonder I'm on my way to therapy.

You know, it was like not easy for me to make decisions or to take action. And I just felt like I was so out of touch with my feelings at the time and then new things come up you want to become more successful and the problems get bigger and you lose your mom and you know yeah weight is an issue because i was dealing with with weight you know women you can't talk to any women because we were raised by mothers like your mother like my mother and then there you know there there were issues always with food and stuff until I figured out how to eat. So really it was about kind of like trying to make better decisions for yourself, accepting who you are and why you make the decisions you do. You know what it is

too? I always thought that I don't want to be a wise old person. I want to be a wise young person. I want to doctorate on myself. I don't want just an eighth grade or a high school or a college education. I want to know why I do what I do, where that comes from, why am I reactive, what is going on here. And it just felt like, and I just loved it. I loved the process so much. And the more I was getting my siblings into it, the more I could see. What were you doing? So you got six speakers set up, and you're doing group therapy from different places. Yeah. What are you trying to, was it more

about the relationships between you guys or what you happened in your childhood? Everything, everything. I mean, we, you know, we had a very tragic, very tragic situation with my father and one of my brothers that I was talking about a little bit earlier. He, we were having a Christmas party at our house. I was 17. He was 16. My sister was 15. My brother was 12. My two older sisters were like 27 and 23. Big Christmas party, all the dancing students, blah, blah, blah. My brother got into some liquor that my father had been given as a Christmas gift. He started mouthing off to one of the guests. My father made him go in the house. I see my sister. I'm at the party.

I see my sister run out, get my mother. I follow them. My brother and father are arguing. My brother is like hitting him. My father's got him down. He's hitting him. My mother separates them. My father slumps into a chair and has a heart attack and dies. And that's how he dies. So we had things to deal with in my family. You know? And so...

And that was the core of it for everybody. That was part of it. That was part of it. But everyone was there. Everyone was there. We had 100 people in our dance studio and all through our house and everything else. And it was just very.

And then your dad, your brother probably had what feelings of guilt. He was 16. Sure. You know, all kinds of things. So, you know, things got shoveled under the. I mean, we've always been a very verbal family. Very like people, you know, have incredible conversations. Our favorite thing to do is sit around and talk.

But we had issues and we had to like deal with certain things. you know, have incredible conversations. Our favorite thing to do is sit around and talk. But we had issues, and we had to, like, deal with certain things. And then things come up in our own lives that you want to bring to the group and sort of talk to them about. Right. And you were 17? I was 17. I had just turned 26. And it was tragic.

It was quick. Tragic. Horrible. Like, overnight. Like, our life turned on a dime. And what's crazy is that if I were writing a story about

this family and there were certain signs along the way you know just little conversations and things

you know my dad was not in the health I'll give you an example I was filling in one of the scholarship things and my father

filled in the financial and I filled in the personal information and I said oh let me check it and he said no no no that's okay he sent it in I got it back in the mail two days after he died and they wanted my mother's age because nobody was ever sure of my mother's age so I left it blank and he left it blank yeah just because we thought the other one filled it right but what my father had written was um said, if you expect decrease in income. And so he had a different income for the following year written down.

And he wrote, expect decreased salary because of decrease in health. Angina pains are more frequent and severe. So he knew. And do you find that after, like through all this process, like are you guys very close now? Oh yeah, super close, all of us. We get together at Christmas and we all block off five days to a week and do such incredible things together. We have, you know, there's always some kind of food crawl that it starts with. We did an Anthony Bourdain food crawl last time. We do a Christmas survey.

We do Secret Santa. I do the cooking for Christmas. We go to somebody else's house. We do some kind of sports event. No, we're super close. And now the family number's, you number's in 32 or 33 or something. Oh, yeah. Everyone's got kids, and kids have got kids probably?

Well, yeah. Kids, my oldest sister. You want to hear something crazy in my family? My oldest sister's daughter, because we're a 15-year spread, my oldest sister's daughter is 54. My brother's, who's 15 years younger than the sister, his daughter's four. So there's a 50-year age spread in that second tier.

That's so crazy. It's crazy. So now you doing Dancing with the Stars makes sense, right? And you did it. I did it. That was one of the hardest things of my life. Really? Yeah.

It was hard for a lot of different reasons. But yeah, it was really intense. But it was, I just, my mission was to stay on the show. Okay.

Because of competitive reasons? No. I think I had the wrong partner at the time. Who was your partner? Derek Hough. He was in a tough time in his life.

I'm very like, he was, I don't think we were a match. Oh. And so, unfortunately. So you had to deal with a little more emotional baggage than you prepared? like, he was, I don't think we were a match. Oh. And so, unfortunately. So you had to deal with a little more

emotional baggage than you prepared? Well, I knew, I mean, he was doing two jobs, so his, the schedule was based

around him rather than. What was he going through in his life? He was going through, no, no, no, he was going through hairspray. He was going through

hairspray, but he was also going through, I think he expected to come back and have it. I mean, yeah. Okay,

all right. But, okay, so, and then, but The I mean, yeah. Okay. All right. But okay. So, and then, but The Apprentice too. Yes. Now, when you do these things, are you doing it to stay, do you like the work or you need the work? I love, no, no. They don't pay you enough on Apprentice, believe me.

You just want to do it. You lose money. You did it when Trump was the guy. Yeah, it was fun. I was the first person they called for celebrity apprentice because i know uh chuck labelle and i knew mark burnett yeah so they called me they said would you do and donald's on the phone too and it was a blast it's the hardest thing i've ever done in my life and it was so much fun and it was so crazy and you get no sleep but you really prove what you can do to yourself i think and

you had a relationship with donald the that was show business yeah that was show business no but i mean like before he is the president yeah now what you know as somebody who knew him as this guy that had this reality show right what were your were your feelings about him at that time? Well, he was certainly fun in the show. And he was totally fascinated by my memory. So every show, you didn't see it because they, of course, cut it out. But every boardroom, he'd have me tell him what happened. I mean, he was always like, Mary Lou, if I take you to Vegas,

could you count cards and stuff? Right. Of course, that's what he'd ask. Somebody would say what happened on a task, and he'd say, Mary Lou, is that true? Because you're the one with the memory. I have a good memory, too. My memory's not—I can't do the dates thing, but I have an excellent memory. That's so funny.

But he'd say something totally inappropriate, and he'd say, Eric, cut that out. And I'd say, I don't know. That's kind of funny. He'd say, Eric, leave that in. But I'll tell you something. He was fascinating because he used no notes. Yeah. And he just, he was off the cuff.

And he was like, he was kind of like fun and wacky. If someone had told me that four years to the day after I was fired from a fake job from a fake boss on a fake show that he would be President of the United States, no way would I have believed it.

And how do you sort of assimilate that in your head with the, you know, like knowing that guy and having that kind of relationship,

you know, because most of the people I know, comedians and stuff who knew him, they're like, yeah, he was kind of a clown and, you know, funny and he made you feel of the guys, people I know, comedians and stuff who knew him, they're like, yeah, he was kind of a clown and,

you know, funny and he made you feel good. And he's very charming. He's very charming. He tripped once in front of me. It's like, Oh, she's going to remember that.

You know, he was like, very quick, very quick. Yeah. He was really fun. I never expected him to be president. I never expected him to be like the president he is.

At all. I thought he'd be much kinder and more conscious and more you know do you think he only gives a shit about himself i think he goes where the action is i think if everybody you know loved him over on the democratic side he'd go there i think he you know so yeah i i don't i don't even think it's it's i think he goes where the action is he goes where's where's the crowd. And he knows how to stir people up. That's for sure.

You know, he knows how to stir people up. But I hate all the racism. I hate all the misogyny. I mean, he was no more inappropriate in the boardroom than most guys of that generation. You know what I mean? But he was so, the, I, I, I, the idea of the children at the borders and the families,

I, I did not expect that from him at all. I didn't expect him to turn into that guy. Yeah. And he goes with the fan base

that wants that. Yeah. So that's what he does. You know, and I think that people, there's, there must be some kind of puppet master,

although he doesn't want to think that there is. There's several. Several. Yeah, because he doesn't want to concern himself with that shit he's of course he doesn't know what he's doing he just wants to be in front of the people he didn't expect to win yeah but i mean but he's the guy but he doesn't he's no thinker so he's like he's got all these monsters

you know i'm not even sure i'm not even being an apologist it's just that you know you're right he he's going for the crowd they're really horrible and then he's got people that are you know uh you know republican policy dudes and religious fanatics who are just like he's like i don't want to deal with that you get do whatever you want i'll keep these he likes the crowd yeah i'll keep these people worked up however he can keep him worked up yeah i'm i'm surprised i'm i'm saddened by ivanka because i loved her and i we she and i you know we had a nice relationship and it's hard to picture them as even regular they're not even like they're what kind of people are they i know i mean that so many things are going on right now and just just the bullying it's just it's just it's so crazy making that how do you wrap your head around it

I just think that they're so insulated that they really don't give a fuck it's just that like ultimately whatever the policies outside of environmental

which is going to affect everybody he knows that none of it's going to touch him right he doesn't have to yeah exactly

it has no effect on his life but you know it is too you know as an actor you're always trying to figure out what's your want

in the scene what does everybody want in the scene. What does everybody want in the scene? He just wants to stay in front of the crowd. He wants to stay with people cheering and yelling.

He turns every appearance into people you know cheering and yelling. Yeah. He doesn't care if they're yelling lock her up

or kick her out or whatever it is. Yeah. Yeah. But it was fun. I had a great time. I made a lot of money okay good for uh alzheimer's association yeah and the first time for a physician's committee for responsible

medicine you know and so that's great yeah so now the books now this has been your journey through getting healthy and you know learning a different way to live? Because you did position yourself as sort of a self-help person for a while. Yeah, of course. Of course. No, no, no. For sure? If therapy can be self-help, is that what you're saying? No, no.

I mean like when you write books about diet, about that kind of stuff. No, totally. I was doing Chicago on Broadway and writing a book at the same time because, you know, God forbid there's any downtime even with a three and a nine, you know, two year old and a three and a half year old. But, you know, I was like so revved up from all the Fosse afterwards that the kids were asleep. So I'd go to an office and work with somebody who was, you know, taking notes and we were brainstorming and making tapes and stuff like that. And I finished the show and the book came out and immediately went on the New York Times bestseller list. Well, it was the first health book.

I had written an autobiography. What was the first health book called? Total Health Makeover. Yeah. And it was on the list for a very long time. It was great. I was really, it just gave me another whole career. Now, these things, do you tour with them?

Do you ever go out and do the talks? Oh, all the time. You do? At least 10 times. I'm going to Spartanburg, South Carolina next week. And I was just in San Diego. I'm going to San Diego again. I was in, I mean, I go all over the country. What's the name of the talk? I do different talks because, because I wrote a memory book, but then also my husband, that's another whole story. Yeah. He and I knew each other in college. He was my roommate's boyfriend. This is your third husband.

Third and final. Yeah. He was my roommate's boyfriend. Yeah. We ran into each other in a courthouse in New Orleans when I was getting married to Freddie Forrest.

That long ago. Right. Getting the marriage license and ran into Michael in the hallway. He was just passing through married with kids and stuff, but we always liked each other. And as he walked away from me, I thought, how come I'm not marrying a guy like

that? Didn't bode well for my first marriage. But anyway, so what happened was we reconnected 16 and a half years ago, got together. Within a week, we're saying, I love you. You're the love of my life. And- You were both divorced? Yeah. Two months later, he's diagnosed with bladder cancer and then lung cancer. And I said, failure is not an option. You're the love of my life. I know like the best people that integrative medicine and to make a very long story short, no chemo, no radiation. He didn't lose his bladder. He didn't lose his prostate. They were telling us the guy was going to take out his bladder and his prostate and make a neobladder

with his intestines and hose up his penis so that if we wanted to have sex, we can pump it up six times. And I said, oh, can we have the seven pump model? Because we're a sexy couple. And he said, I said, what about nutrition, health, detox? He said, have all the steak and highballs you want. Then we'll do chemo and radiation. And then he found out he had lung cancer as well because they did a body scan, two separate sites, two primary sites. He totally nursed himself back to health. He was very lucky with the lung cancer because it was bronchial alveolar, which is a very slow-growing cancer. And it was in a very specific spot of his lower right lobe. So right lung, and they took it out from the side. But he never did chemo or radiation. He did immunotherapy for the bladder, and he's almost 16 years in remission this November. So no chemo, but immunotherapy. There was definitely medicine

involved. Oh yeah. But just not, but total detox. He did total, total detox. Everything from getting rid of the fillings in his teeth, chelation therapy, totally vegan diet, lots of supplementation, infrared saunas, because they get it on the cellular level because a lot of the poisons are in your fat. So they kind of clean that out. Lymphatic massages, high colonics. I mean, he did everything and he continues to do a lot of these things because he's maintained it and he's been in remission. It'll be November 24th. It'll be 16 years. Well, that's congratulations. Yeah. So we wrote a book about that. So we both go sometimes around the country or I go to talk to a lot of cancer groups about Michael's protocol and our journey through all of that. But I would have to say that most of the things I do now are, you know, in terms of speaking have to do with memory, health and cancer.

What do you say about memory? Well, I talk about the fact that no matter how bad people think their memory is, it's so much better than they realize. But you just have to know how to grab onto it. Because we just have, people who have my kind of memory, we just have an extraordinary retrieval system. But all your memories are inside of you. They're all part of you and on your emotional heart. I'm going to knock this part of you and on your emotional hard drive. Everybody has a primary track, what I call a primary track. It's like in the jigsaw puzzle of your life, what are the hard edged pieces by which you can interlock the other pieces too? And so, you know, for a lot of people, it might be gigs that you've played, relationships, places you've

lived. Everything's becoming sort of a mush. Well, because you're in the same place every day. No, I've been in too many different places. And I can't place people. Like there are chunks of my life that took place in New York, Boston, San Francisco. But that should be easier for you. Kind of. Because memory happens in chunks. I guess so.

But when someone comes up to me and they're like, hey, I've met so many people. Yeah. And I used to be pretty good at remembering faces. But some of it's just lost. Is it pre the 20 years? Is it a sobriety? Sure, some of it, yeah. So it's like two different realities?

I guess. No, it's just like, I don't know what's really going on with me. It just seems like some things are getting very far away. Hmm. Yeah. You know? on with me it just seems like some things are getting very far away you know and uh you know i i think that and i'm also overwhelmed and busy all the time and i think it just becomes hard to you know like i'm so everything in the present but like i feel like i'm losing things but are

you naturally pruning or do you choose to prune? My memory? Yeah. Because a lot of times people prune away because they don't want to. I don't know. I don't think I'm doing it on purpose. It just seems like there are different lives I lived. But they should be almost easier to track. No, I can track them to a degree.

Yeah. You know what I mean? a degree. Yeah. You know what I mean? Well, the saddest thing that I learned through all of this memory stuff was that in any given year of someone's life, most people remember only 8 to 11 things that happened to them. And that to me is just crazy because I can't even imagine that. I can't imagine only hanging on to 8 to 11 things that happened within a year. So if I said to you, you know, 2003 or 1997 or, you know, 2016 or whatever, that most people would only remember 8 to 11. So that's like what does that mean? And you can remember everything from every day. Pretty much.

Yeah. Some things take a little bit longer, but some things are so... The day of the week just comes up automatically. I don't even know how. It just, it's there. Yeah. And it just comes up and then it starts to fill in all the details

and it gets deeper and deeper the more I start, you know, thinking about it. Like if I set a date, you could do that? Yeah, tell me a date. As long as I'm conscious, not before I'm born. Because people go, what about 1800? Or could you go back in a memory and like you're in the room, but you go around the door and go, I can't bend time.

I'm not going to be able to. Well, let's say like, okay, so let's say like August 9th, 1999. Okay, August 9th, 1999. August 9th was a Monday. Look it up. Okay. I believe you. Yeah.

What was going on with you that day? I was doing Chicago in, oh, I know exactly what I was doing. Oh my gosh. We went to see Siegfried and Roy that day at the Mirage. I was doing Chicago, August 9th, 1999.

We ate at Cherko the night before. And we ate, of course, at the Mirage the day of, August 9th. I was off that day. I had a green top on. Wow, and you went with your kids. I went with my kids and my husband, and we had a big fight. Seriously? That was my second husband, yeah.

About Siegfried and Roy? No. That's sort of fascinating that you can do that, huh? It's fun for me. had a big fight seriously that was my second husband yeah about zig freedom roy no that's sort of fascinating that you can do that huh it's fun for me what do you what is that and you have a certain type of uh thing what do you mean what is it called yeah it's called h sam highly superior autobiographical memory and they've taken 300 measurements of our brains and they found nine areas 10 times larger than the normal brain. And there's very few people in the world who have this. There's a group in the 99th percentile, and they've relaxed some of the criteria because they needed more money for research.

There's so few people. Do you know the others? I met a couple of them. Because of the 60 Minutes thing. I don't know if you saw that. I heard about it, yeah. It's been life-changing. Because, you know, you just grow up with this thing. You don't even know it's that weird.

You don't realize how few people have it. And then all of a sudden people are talking about it in your medical books and people are testing you. Well, that's very entertaining. And it must have something to do with your energy level as well, I guess. I don't know what exactly. Well, memory is tied to adrenaline. Yeah. That's why people remember the highs and the lows.

Right. But I'm trying to help people remember. But you just have them all at the old, you have all of it all the time. It's all happening. Are you making fun of me? No. I couldn't wait to do your show. I was more excited or almost as excited as when I went on the Tonight Show with Sting, which was maybe my most memorable.

What day was that? May the 13th of 1993. It was a Thursday. And I was on with Jay. And I found out Sting was going to be on. I totally embarrassed myself and I didn't care. I just had to. And people to this day stop me about that.

What did you do? Oh, my God. I said to him, I was so excited. I was like, you know, I love you. I couldn't wait to meet you. my God. I said to him, I was so excited. I was like, you know, I love you. I couldn't wait to meet you. Sting. I said to Sting, yeah, and I wanted to smell him. And, you know, I said, do you know how I wrote in the book?

I said, I wanted to write on the page next to you. Mercedes Ruehl was there. So I turned the thing over. I wrote, please, and I wrote on the other side. I said, please keep this book closed so that Sting is always on top of me. You know, I said things like that. Was he a nice guy to you? You shut up.

Yes. He didn't strike me as a terrific, he seems like a little. Sandoff-ish. Something. He's, yeah. He was very nice. He was very nice. Well, I'm glad.

It's nice when somebody loves you as a fan to be at least cordial. But you want to be, have you had people come up to you? Did you feel accosted by me at the theater? No, not accosted. No, I was happy to see you. You weren't very friendly backstage when you went to talk to Annette Bening. I was standing there with Annette Bening. I have a lot going on there. Okay. didn't was I nice in the theater I was you still I never thought I'd

hear from you again really yes because you weren't you weren't that friendly but that's okay now I see how friendly you are and how good you are I'm very I'm very good with uh my fans and people that know me I try to be gracious and nice. If I'm not, it's only because I'm tired or I've been through. Sometimes you're trying to have a day. Of course. Oh, I know what it's like. No, I mean, and I probably hosed you too much about what a fan I was to say, I want to be on your show.

How did it go? Do you feel this show went good? Yeah, I think so. No, no, I think it did too, but if you were so excited about it, I don't want you to leave going like, that wasn't a good experience. That was a letdown. And it's funny that, well, first of all, I'm a little disappointed

we're not in your garage because of my garage roots. Well, I'm sorry to let you down on the garage. No, I'm teasing you. But also WTF is something that we used to say at Taxi all the time. Like if there was, we used to have two phrases. One of them was if all of a sudden you thought, likeTF is something that we used to say at Taxi all the time. Like if there was, we used to have two phrases. One of them was if all of a sudden you thought like, what does that joke mean? We'd call it joke obscura.

Joke obscura. And we'd point to our script. And the other one was like if something took you out of it, it was a what the fuck. So that you had to like a WTF and we'd write it in our scripts. Because it's like the person who's watching the show has to turn to the person next to them like, what did they just say? Right, right, right. What did that mean? So we're always trying to avoid J-O's and WTF's in our scripts.

Oh, good. So that reminds me of it. Yeah, I'm glad you didn't avoid this one. No, I didn't, of course. And the other funny thing that, you know, I told you I did the original Grease in Chicago, but my mother wouldn't come to see it because I said, fuck you in it seven times, my character. And she just didn't like me swearing. She said, you can take all your clothes off, but you can't swear.

But then she saw the Broadway version that I did and the on the road version, and she saw it. And I still said a lot of fuck yous. And she was okay? She was okay. Your daughter was in show business. Are you kidding? Her dream. She acclimated to the fuck yous?

She loved it. All right. Well, it was great talking to you. Thanks for coming. Nice talking to you too. There you go. And you know what? She was right.

She was right. My birthday was on a Friday. There you go. I'm going to play some guitar now. I have been listening to a little bit too much Modu Maktar. Yeah, maybe you can hear it in... You know what? I'm going to go. Enjoy yourselves. guitar solo Thank you. ¶¶ Boomer lives! Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think

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