WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1141 - Marc and Tom's Normal Things

Episode Date: July 20, 2020

Tom Scharpling and Marc spend some time talking about the kind of things we all cared about when life was normal: music, coffee, comedy, live performances, and other things that make us feel alive. Leave your worries at the garage door and listen to these two friends wax nostalgic about Dunkin' Donuts coffee, the music that first hooked them as kids, their favorite comedy albums, and their renewed love of Rodney Dangerfield and Don Rickles. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Lock the gates! all right let's do this how are you what the fuckers what the fuck buddies what the fuck terrians how's it going uh i'm mark maron this is my podcast wt. You're listening to WTF with Mark Maron. That's a old school reset. Hi, welcome back. I'm Mark Maron. You're listening to WTF Today. What the fuck is happening, man? Newly formed federal Gestapo. That's exciting.

I'm not going to go through the news. I'm just trying to temper temper the fear temper the temper temper the darkness the bleak hopeless landscape of current global culture fuck man how's it going i'm sorry i'm. Are you okay? Are you moving any of those things from home? You would think that people would need them now. You would think that people are at home just wondering, hey, those people that have, you know, either a debting problem or credit card issues. I would imagine are amassing things. People with money are probably buying things.

People with no money are probably selling stuff. How's your business doing? How are the kids? Are you finding time for yourself? Are you taking walks? Are you going outside? Are you talking to friends? Are you saying hello to your neighbors in that awkward way with a mask? Are you cleaning up? Are you organizing? Have you got everything together? Or are you in bed? Get up. Get out.

Make your bed. Shower up. Feed the fucking animals. And by animals, I'm talking about your family. And then feed your pleasant pets. Maybe the family can feed itself. I don't know your situation i just know this togetherness is starting to crack some people

so look apparently we're not going to be shooting the um fourth season of glow till sometime in 2021 i do not know when stand-up comedy is going to resurface i am not of the um type of comic that needs to go do shows at drive-ins or at half-filled houses spread out as much as i enjoy taking the stage uh i don't i don't need to do that i saved some money i'm okay for now. You can catch me on Instagram live occasionally. You can catch me here where I'm not being particularly funny. But look, today I'm going to talk to my friend Tom Sharpling. Many of you know Mr. Sharpling. He's one of the great broadcasters, one of the great broadcasters.

If you do know him, you probably know him from his show, The Best Show. And that's been on a little bit of a hiatus. He's finishing up a memoir. But you can always go listen to The Best Show stuff at bestshow.net. Here's some of the comedy. Here's some of the amazing pauses of Tom Sharpling, one of the great broadcasting stylists of the late 20th century, and a dear friend of mine, which happened later in life.

A couple of the people that are my closest friends are actually people that I have not known all my life, but it's turning out that as life goes on, I know them longer than you might think. I got a call from my first serious girlfriend out of nowhere. It's not that we've been totally out of touch but we certainly don't talk much but uh she you know heard the news about lynn and checked in and uh it's it's really interesting i mean that's going back to 1982 83 you know that that's the one that set my on a course an arc of uh heart-hardened anger over my own selfish fucking emotional liabilities that persisted for decades that first heartbreak even though i did not know how to love or be loved or even behave properly other than angry and jealous, possessive and insane, insecure and emotionally needy and aggravated.

That's a horrendous triangle. Needy, insecure and aggravated. Do not step into that tornado but nonetheless uh through a lot of things we've stayed in touch and you know she's had tragedy in her life i have this tragedy in my life now and we had a nice conversation but what's interesting is when you talk to somebody that was in your life no matter how long ago it was if it was real and it was serious and it was emotionally connected they are woven into the fabric of your being and when i heard her voice on the phone it all it's not that it all came back it wasn't it didn't all come back but the familiarity was

there it was just like the the symbiosis the connection, the sort of emotional frequencies just kind of sync up. The laugh. You hear the laugh of the person that you loved decades ago. And it's not that it brings you back, but it reconnects you in the moment to something deeply ingrained and familiar in you. And it's a beautiful thing. I was happy to talk to her. For some reason, the last few days have not been too great. As many of you said about grief, you don't know when it's going to happen.

You don't know when you're going to be overwhelmed with it. But I think what is happening for me now is that the shock and trauma and sort of PTSD and the haze and fog of reality-shattering tragedy is starting to recede a bit. And what's left is this sort of like just the pure loss. You don't lose a history with somebody but it stops you lose a potential future it's just you know it's just sitting with it that this is my life and this was not

what i signed up for but what do we sign up for i mean that's the weird thing. I did not sign up to be the guy crying alone in his bed with his 16-year-old cat. I didn't sign up for that, and I have to let it happen. And there's something about it that I find to be pathetic and embarrassing where it's not. What it is, it's tragic and it's painfully human, but in my mind pathetic and embarrassing to who you wouldn't have known it until i told you that i was laying in my bed looking at old monkey listening to him asthmatically wheeze and just crying and saying look man it's okay. We did it. You did good. Thank you.

But then like, I just kept crying because I was alone and, you know, and I was processing the loss. This is it. This is the life. I'm not saying it's not going to go away or that it's not going to ease up or it's going to be the right. I'm not going to wallow. I'm not feeling sorry for myself.

I'm just having the feelings. And in that moment, I believe that monkey was like, I'm just having the feelings and in that moment I believe that monkey was like I get it man all right and then he started licking my hand and grooming me and I'm like I'm like dude thank you but you gotta be tired of this shit and he's like I'm all right I'm all right for now but yeah you know I've been fucking eating dude dude I've been eating Patton Oswalt sent me a a box out of nowhere I get this box of Jenny's ice cream again

now I've gotten it twice now from different people I think even Jenny sent it to me but it was from Patton now you know I thanked him Jenny sent it to me. But it was from Patton. Now, you know, I thanked him. I said, thanks for the ice cream, pal. Now I can be sad and fat.

Really, though, thanks. Makes me feel better. And then like an hour later, a huge basket of food, cookies, brownies, olives, you know, the basket. And then I made a joke i said oh shit a basket too thanks man this is almost as good as my girlfriend being alive again then i wrote too dark but you know we're comics it was dark it was you know obviously horrendous joke and he went ha ha ha oh man and then, if memory serves, you are at the ice cream and baked goods phase of mourning. So I wanted you to have the primo stuff. And I said, ha ha, beautiful. Thanks. Hope you're well. And he said, hope you're doing well and that you're getting

better. And I said, overall better. Some days are sad, and he said, the sad days will never truly go away, but the days where you get to experience joy and every other emotion in the spectrum are coming back, I promise, and I said, thanks, man. It's good to hear that. Patton Oswalt stepping up. Nice man.

That's the thing about friends, showing gratitude to them do that talk to your friends and that's what this episode's really about tom and i have done shows before we did a series called the mark and tom show we've done few of those i was on his show years ago in new jersey but tom's a guy that you know we became friends you know later not that long ago really and i just love the guy and uh he's been really present for me during this time like he between you you and me he'll come over and we'll eat dinner like once a week.

We'll be out back outside just talking maskless with some distance between us. Just having a nice dinner and talking for a few hours about stuff. Talking about people, having some laughs, talking about movies. He just came over last night, actually, or the night before last. Had some dinner, talked about the Safdie brothers, Sandler movies, Paul Thomas Anderson.

Had a few laughs at the expense of people not present, which is nice. Talked about language. Talked about his new book. He's got to read his manuscript. But it's important to do that. However you're going to do it. Obviously, some of you are like, you guys just talked without masks on.

We did. Outside. Not too close. But yeah, man. I mean, you got to nourish that part of you. You got to stay engaged. You got to get some laughs. But I think also it's important to be grateful to the people that are there for you.

And that's for some reason that's very hard for me to do. I don't know why. It's not that I don't feel gratitude, but to connect with the words, not to be like, Hey buddy, thanks man. I, you know, thanks for hanging. But just sort of like, you know, really, cause that's the tone, like that's nice and it's polite, but that's, you know, the up, that's like pushing it out there. Like, know great to see you you know it's different than like hey i you know there's been very difficult time and i really appreciate you showing up for me and i said that to my friend sam my friend sam lipsites the other dude he um that guy calls me every night and we talk for like a half hour to an hour about stuff i'll tell him how i'm doing you know it started off like are you okay and he's walked

me through sort of suicidal ideation crying heartache you know all of it but now you know we talk and he calls me every night we just you know have a few laughs talk about stuff books thoughts news, the future. And I just, I don't know, I just got overwhelmed the other night and I thanked him, you know, with, you know, in a deep, deeply grateful way, you know, where I got choked up and because you can't take your friends for granted. You know, we have these people in our lives that some people we've had in our lives forever and you know you just sort of like yeah man best best pals you're there for me but you know as you get older and when things start to break down when things people start to get sick when you know it's just when people lose people i mean that's where

the fucking tire hits the road is that what they say the tire hits the pavement the wheel hits the road. Is that what they say? The tire hits the pavement, the wheel hits the, where the tire blows out and the rims get all fucked up. That's when you need a friend. When you're fucking, you run over a fucking bunch of nails put there in the road

by Wile E. Coyote,ote the trickster and all your tires blow out and you're driving on those fucking rims because what are you just gonna give up in the desert eventually you have to start walking and that's where your friends come in so that's what's going on and this is what this is now this was recorded um before lynn passed away not long before and you know as i've said you know Tom and I have done many episodes where we just talked about things going on, things in the culture, things we liked,

and this recording is actually an attempt to do something like that, and it was just as the pandemic was starting, right? And it was really an attempt to feel somewhat normal, to talk about normal things. And I guess my point here is that it's important to still do that. Very important. Or else you're just going to be consumed by, I don't know what your faith is or how you're holding up,

but it's bleak, man. how you're holding up, but it's bleak, man. And you got to treasure and really rely on that kind of human connection. I think that's why a lot of people listen to this show. It's important to do that. Also wanted to mention there's a new batch of ceramic WTF cap mugs available from brian jones these are the handmade mugs i gave to my guests in the normal times back in the day so right now getting these mugs from brian jones is the only way you can get them i it's almost like i'm talking to my guests no i i mean i can send you one if you've been on the show. But I guess also that saying, like, you can't just break into Josh Brolin's house and get that mug.

Okay? You got to buy it from Brian. And he's donating a portion of the sales of these mugs to the Connecticut Food Bank. You can go to BrianRJones.com slash shop starting at noon Eastern today. Tom slash shop starting at noon Eastern today. As I said earlier, Tom's taking a bit of a break from the best show as he finishes up his book. And you can always check out the best show material at the best show dot net. And right now, Tom is doing a new podcast with Julie Klausner called Double Threat. You can get that wherever you listen to podcasts.

You can get that wherever you listen to podcasts. This is me and Tom celebrating things from the normal times coming right up. You can get anything you need with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So no, you can't get an ice rink on Uber Eats. But iced tea and ice cream? Yes, we can deliver that. Uber Eats. Get almost, almost anything.

Order now. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a

producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations. How a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category. And what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. I'm all right. Are you all right? Yeah. I mean, I guess I'm fine. I go a little crazy occasionally thinking I have alright. Are you alright? Yeah. I mean, I guess I'm fine.

I go a little crazy occasionally thinking I have something. Oh, no, there'll be times when I'm just suddenly like, yeah, this is it. And I just realize it's like, oh, no, I have these things that have happened my whole life where I'd have to be congested for half a day and then it passes. But now suddenly it's like, well, there's got to be this. This is it. And I'm not got to be this is it and i'm not i'm not gonna make it through it i used to smoke i'm gonna end up in the hospital so i will tell you that that coffee i went out of the way and i got some dunkin donuts beans okay just because

sure i got a thing for dunkin donuts occasionally yeah and i was in ralph's and i get a bunch of good coffee i get high-end shit yeah and I just saw the bag of Dunkin Beans I'm like fuck it now let's go I'm living you're right back to New England I'm going there right you're back to your Boston days jacked up yeah jacked up didn't they have in Jersey oh yeah Dunkin Donuts is everywhere chock full of nuts too yeah less less that but that was more of a Manhattan thing like I would see those when i went into the city from new jersey i'd see like chock full of nuts i bought the can chock full of nuts for a while like chock full of nuts you'd see the oversized cans in like like my grandmother like they would

grandparents would have just like giant thing as chock full of nuts and then they would have like a jar of sanka yeah i guess they didn't want to. Sanka, yeah. Go through the production of making coffee. Yeah. But then, but Dunkin' Donuts, that's what got me drinking coffee. Like when I was, like nobody in my family drank coffee,

so I didn't grow up with coffee drinkers, but then just at some point when you're like, like 18, 19, you're just like, I gotta check and see what the big deal is about this. It's time. And then it was like, oh my God, this stuff is, this, I was like, I would like. I'm on a lifelong journey.

Oh, my head would spin from that. Like that stuff would make you vibrate. Oh yeah, that's what I go for. Yeah. It still does it. Yeah. I'm going up now. I'm going up.

Where you're just like, oh, wow. Yeah. And I don't do anything else. I'm clean as fuck. And I ran today, so I sweat everything out. So this is going right in. Oh, no. You're just, you, this is empty.

It's like if you just poured coffee in your car. Like if that's what you're doing right now. Exactly. You drove up to the, you just started pouring. Engine's empty. I'm empty. 10 gallons of coffee. Yeah.

Well, that's what I used to do when i did radio on air america i used to have the driver stop at fucking 3 30 in the morning and i'd buy one of the you know the kind that you people bring to the office yeah and they handled cartons oh no those yeah the i get one of those of dunkin donuts the box of dunkin yeah and i have a bag m&ms and that's what i by the time i got on the air i was like crazy i remember one time i was doing a live thing with with john worcester and we're backstage and somebody and i was just like so i needed i was just like just like dying for just energy. And I took like a giant coffee, and then I had a thing of peanut M&Ms. And I'm eating peanut M&Ms.

And somebody like saw me, and they're just like, what the fuck is wrong with you? Are you okay? And I'm just like. Yeah, you're going to. And I'm almost like ready to like put the M&Ms in the coffee. You don't realize what you look like. You look like a squirrel. Yeah.

You're drinking the coffee and you're completely, you're so focused. Yeah. Oh, yeah. And I'm just like, if I put the M&M's in my mouth, then I get a mouthful of coffee. It melts. Yeah. And then I just get the one, two punch of the chocolate and the shell melts away. And then I got the coffee and it's just like. It's just the greatest thing.

Oh my God. It's like flying high. Some asshole comes and interrupts you. You all right? Yeah. Somebody look at me. It's like, boy, yeah, exactly. Fuck you.

You all right? It's just like, man, I'm doing great. You kidding me? Look at me. This is the best I've ever been in my entire life. I got a mouthful of M&Ms and coffee. Like, how could I be doing any better it was like the highlight of my existence how are you even asking me that yeah exactly how do you think i'm

doing once you worry about worry about yourself look at me yeah oh my god so so you're burning through a lot of a lot of entertainment during this what do you what it seems to me like i'm like i liked what you said about Little Richard and Florian, what's his name? Florian Schneider, right? Yeah, I think that made sense that without Little Richard and Florian Schneider that we would have infinitely less good music.

Well, I mean, it's crazy when you think about- They're pieces. You think about influence. Yeah. And it's just like, you think about like influence. Yeah. And it's just like, I mean, like Little Richard changed everything. All of it. Like over and over and just like really set the pace for just like that kind of performance. I mean, there'd be no James Brown.

Ramones. There'd be no Prince and there'd be no Ramones. All of that stuff came, I mean, let alone Elvis, but it's just like you see that drive. Yeah, there was the fashion of it, there was the showmanship of it, but his particular groove was even more than, in a way, it was more than Chuck Berry. There was the drive of his rock and roll. If you listen to the MC5's Tutotie Fruity,

you realize like, that's it. I mean, and then that goes right to the Ramones, right? Oh yeah, it's a straight line. And it's just, and it's also funny when you listen to like these other things and they're so thin sounding and compared to the original thing. Like sometimes, like growing up,

I was not like a blues person. And then you hear these blues records and then you hear the rolling stones version just like i prefer the rolling stones version because it's just it's within my frame of reference it's a rock group player yeah but then you hear like these like you compare like little richards tootie fruity with like the mc5s version just like mc5's version since it's thin and sure of course kind of like assembled like it sounds like you hear them like building it in the studio right rather than them just playing it live in one room and just right with just mics hanging over them just like yeah we're done we got in that piano man i listened to the whole box set yesterday i

have that uh the mono box set of all the first five. Sure, sure. It's just there. It was just a drive in his voice. And, you know, to me, I listened to that music when I was a kid. I don't know why. That's all I wanted to know how to do on guitar was... You know, that's all I wanted to do. Those three chord things.

And, you know, I guess I got to Little Richard through the Beatles. Right? And my dad played all that shit when I was a kid i that was what wired my brain i talked about in the podcast just about how like my father's excitement about buddy holly richie valence you know in that american graffiti soundtrack oh my god that was my father's right i grew up with the thing that was just like the. The template. Absolutely. The Rosetta Stone. Oh, please.

And it kind of is. Oh, you listen to that and it's just amazing the basis that that, just the range of everything that those records covered. Yeah. And they were just, it's coming out of like a disposable industry. And it's weird how the timelessness came out of something that was just people thinking this isn't going to last two years from now just yeah turn out the hits yeah and they turn into garbage and just don't worry about what tomorrow is because

we're just trying to make money today on seven inch records right yeah and yeah i had the dick clark 20 years of rock and roll collection and the American Graffiti my dad had in the car. We had a Buddy Holly collection. He loved it. Yeah. And I think I got through, like, I knew Buddy Holly's Slippin' and Slidin' before I knew Little Richard's. Okay. Yeah.

But those records, all of them, like, I always wanted to do, if I was going to ever do a music show, I kept thinking about playing the songs that my daddy so like in the car sure sure oh my god that that's something i wouldn't be great oh yeah that was like the most formative like that's the stuff it's amazing how simple humans are when it's just like yeah you're gonna hear this when you're eight and you're never gonna forget it yeah ever ever it's good this is this is this will stay with you for the rest of your life and will kind of always be your favorite thing even if you don't revisit it often right or you don't think it's your favorite thing it's kind of your favorite thing i got some a couple of the songs i i listened to like i downloaded them recently like um for like oh but the thought i had was that this is stuff that my father and I bonded around, that my father shared with me. But then I realized that it was really one of the rare times where he wasn't upset or yelling or freaked out or, you know, like he was occupied and seemingly excited.

Yeah. So it wasn't that he was like, don't you love this? It was like, hey, this is making dad feel better. Exactly. Daddy's happy. Let's keep playing the, let's keep playing the coasters. Yeah. Yeah.

I listened to, no, but that was the one, he loved the stroll for some reason, which I think was the Diamonds. And it's got a really weird kind of greasy sax riff. You know that song? Come and let's stroll. Yeah. Yeah. He liked that.

He loved That'll Be the Day and all those things. But I listened to Peppermint Twist and The St the stroll and little darling which was also the diamonds little darling is one of my all-time favorite songs like that is like the most rocking it's great because it's just like it's oh it's overwhelming how much is going on where it's just like yeah it's like it's just like it's just like, it's just, it's happening. You're just like, this is the most overstuffed thing I ever heard in my life. And then it's like, my darling, I need you. You're just like, this is like one minute long. Everything has happened in this.

It's really, it's just like, like, that's that's that thing that makes a mark on you. And then it's amazing that it's just like, I mean, I was not, obviously not a kid when that stuff was coming out. No, no, it was all because of our dads. Yeah, but there's something so pure about it that it just isn't like timestamped at all. It's just like, I mean, you can obviously know when it was recorded, but just like the spirit of it is just. Yeah, the proximity to the source point of rock and roll is close. Yeah.

So, you know, and you've got to figure the newness of pushing out that way had to fuel that. So the purity of it is real, right? So if rock starts in 57 or 56 really by a couple of songs that they didn't even know that's what they were doing right delta 88 or rock around the clock oh yeah like turner and they just they just don't even know what they're um yeah it was because because the critics decided that right but something happened No, somebody decided. It's funny that somebody told the story that it went through someone's lens what this was. Yeah, right. And clearly there were people watching this story get told and being like, that's not the story.

Right. I was there. Like, who's this guy? Like, he wasn't there. He's backloading some fiction he's the one telling everybody how this went and it's just it's like even like as a kid for like the reference thing i can relate to it's like rolling stone like i would read like the rolling stone like album guide and i would just like stare at the the ratings and the reviews of the stuff i was just

like yeah and then you don't think like it just seemed like there was this like like this is just the truth and i'm just like well no this that album sucks yeah because it got two stars from this one then you meet people and you just realize there's not some giant all-knowing uh force called rolling stone it's just like magazine writers yeah it's just some 24 year old dick who's like no hang it yeah i listen i listened to two songs and yeah they had to review eight records that day you work on your record for your whole life and then somebody's just like yeah i gotta write three record reviews today and they're blasting through your thing they're in a bad mood.

Yours is the last on the pile. Yeah, exactly. Apparently you didn't do a very good job. Didn't grab me. Yeah, but I just always remember it would be just like, yeah, like seeing the story. The people telling the story would be like, like it clearly had their biases where they were just like Rolling Stone was just so anti-Zeppelin during the 70s i don't like i'd never you had to find black sabbath right all that stuff they hated it i don't know where the hell it came to me like i never trusted or never knew to read or like if you're gonna pick critics who the hell are they i'd look at rolling stone but like i never

like i don't know i i don't know how i came about. Like, I'm relatively new to amassing records. Right? But I know what you're saying, that Rolling Stone, everyone, they're all curators of some kind. Like, so the magazine is not a curator, but they have a context. This is what Rolling Stone believes in. And this is what we like and this is what we don't like. Right? You can see that and feel that.

And it's the same with like guys that i buy records from or when i was a kid who turned me on to records outside of my father who set the the groundwork which was good groundwork i mean i think having been you know built on the oldies for rock and roll in general it's good sure it's all kind of in there but like then as as i got older you know i had records everyone had then i inherited some records and then like i had records everyone had then i inherited some records and then like i had a few hundred records in high school and things were happening in high school and there was a guy in high school that turned me on to the shit but now like i mean i don't even know what you're sitting on you're like there's some i there's this mysterious thing about

you in that you know like how many records do you have and then it's like oh my, you know, like, how many records do you have? And then it's like, oh my God. You know, like, you can't even say it. And then I picture there's probably houses filled with records back in Jersey. Yeah, there's a lot of records. It's a fair amount. But, like, what are we talking? Thousands, I guess. Yeah, I know.

I mean, it's just, it's all I ever did, you know? From when? From when I was 10. I just started buying records. Why are you being secretive about it? Are you ashamed of the size? No, it's sometimes, it's just, I always picture the idea that you spend your life collecting a thing and you're just like, don't touch that one, that one's a thing.

And then you die. Yeah. And then somebody's just, that does it,'s just throwing all of it in a dumpster with no, just like, I don't know what this stuff is. They didn't buy it at the estate sale. It's cheaper to throw it. They'll just rent one of these dumpsters. They drop in your driveway.

My brother just going through like, I don't know. Do we keep this? Yeah. And that's like, I picture that being, i also don't want to get caught up in the the um i don't know there's like a collecting side of things that's always been such a bummer to me where it's like it where it's and it's this sounds like a like a trite thing but where people are just like they lose sight of the music being what this is about yeah and i can't do that and i don't have the room for it so that was sort of the i think i have is yeah and i can't do that and i don't have the room for

it so that was sort of the i think i have a fear of i've had a fear of the records owning me for a while and uh it's a scary thing because the records can own you no i know and like i bought i've bought things sealed like so i had i unsealed something yesterday i'm trying to remember what the hell it is that i opened because i got a sealed copy of it. And I'm like, who am I waiting for to listen to this? You know, I bought this at some point. Yeah. And it was still sealed.

But, like, when I go through, like, I've been listening to all the records. Mm-hmm. I've been primarily to a lot of the records, the older records. Because, like, I get hung up, like, I want to time travel. I want old records. I get sent a lot of new records. Yeah records and i'll listen to them a couple times but rarely i don't feel like compelled to keep new records i don't know why uh-huh do you unless they speak to you yeah unless they're amazing sure now i'm compelled to hold on to all of it this is why i'm oh trying to

it's a battle you're that guy so so you've just got maybe i'll like it five years from now i know maybe i've got an amazing thing if i got rid of it then i'm the i'm a real sucker but you're unloading this thing now if i'm gonna want it five years from now it's just like just say goodbye to it and go get it again but well you're right but so what have you found that that happened so you got all these records that you thought five years from now you would like him and now it's 10 years later and you still have the record still sitting there like there's a there's a certain philosophy that i i've have where it's just like isn't it enough that i knew the right things if doesn't mean i read the book or i right listen to the record it's like i knew what the good ones were isn't that half of isn't that most of this like

i think so i can curate the but it's like's, but that's, but it shouldn't be though. It should just be like, should be able to be happy with just like this little stash of the best stuff and let that be what that is. Well, see, but see, I can't, my thing has been like, I'm amazed at how much I don't know. So like, you know, when I deal with, you know, I imagine if we spent time together with your records, I would be like, I don't know anything about this. And I like that feeling.

So like then, like, how am I going to learn about this? It's funny. I started this in the pandemic. This has been a chance for me to start five new podcasts, which is great. I, you know, Julie Klaus and I started one we're doing. And then what do you do it over the i do it on a zoom on my end and she's oh she records good too and then we just sync it yeah that's good yeah our producer puts it together that's we're doing that and that's

called double threat but i also started this other one for like a bonus thing for best show yeah people and it's me and the the producers on the best show we're going year by year through crosby stills nash and young through all of the through every solo album really yeah and it's like we just recorded this morning for all two and a half hours and i'm just like we're doing two two each because it's so you're going backwards too we're no we're going in we're going chronologically foe we started with the first episode was everything birds in the hollies the first episode was like episode zero would be like everything before csn so buffalo springfield buffalo springfield Hollies. Yeah. And then we're taking two-year chunks at a time going forward. We just did 75, 76, and it was just like,

it's like one of the worst experiences of my life. Steven Stills made like four albums a year at one point where he was just like, first of all, he recorded every one of his albums in Miami. So he jacked on blows. You just know, exactly. Running around with guns. Yeah, he's just like dressed in like either a football jersey

or like dressed as like some paramilitary guy. Yeah. And you're just like, and it's just like, but it's like. How's the music? Oh, I mean, some of the stuff is like, there's these Crosbyash albums right where they would do they did one like every eight months yeah and you're just like you guys are just like it you guys are like you look like you're dying like you look at the cover and they look so unhealthy

on it and these records are just and then but just concurrently like neil young is like transcending time exactly he's just like reinventing the whole thing. Yeah. Every album. Yeah. Like Crosby. Crosby's too much, man. Crosby is too much.

Did you listen to the thing I did with him? Of the podcast? A few years ago? Yeah. Yeah. It was the greatest. He's just like, I'm kind of an asshole. Dude, he would have stayed at my house all day.

Yeah. But the thing that was amazing about him is like i never i didn't know him and look i've got i've got plenty of love for crosby stills nash and young and crosby stills and nash really you know i don't that's the thing i i like sweet judy blue eyes and uh and the live record and uh uh you know deja vu some of it but i listened to it when i was a kid it was formative sure um but but he like i didn't know him and i think i tracked him down on twitter i don't know if i told you this and i get this phone call from him did i tell you about that no no oh it's a time and i'm and i'm i don't want to get into it now really because i don't want to betray anybody but

something there was something going on between between him and Graham that involved a woman. And these guys are like 80. Right. I mean, they've made some of this more public now. Some of the like the. Yeah. But here's the thing. Like, yeah, he's telling me, you know, get signs like, look, man, I just don't want to get into that.

And so if you're planning on getting, I'm like, number one, I don't know what he's talking about. But deeper than that, who could possibly give a fuck? I mean, they're like 90. And he's like, let's not get into the chick thing. It's like, is there somebody? Who is actively waiting for this information? Yeah. Just they're fighting over girlfriends.

And they're just like still. It is insane that these guys first of all it's insane all four of them are alive it's unbelievable like you know god bless all of them they're still yeah all four of the ramones are dead yeah and all four of crosby stills nash and young are alive i don't think stills can hear no i think stills is not doing particularly great crosby's just meeting kids he had yeah yeah and he forms a band with him yeah yep he um and they self-publishes self uh releases his record we got him to call the best show one night we're just doing the show and then one of the producers jason

it just starts just like poking him on twitter being like hey call up and he just calls up it's the weirdest thing that's ever happened. So he's like, hey, man, I just want to say. And it's just like, and I had no preparation for it. No nukes, man. No nukes. They're like, David Crosby's on line four. I'm just like, okay.

Because I'm talking to David Crosby now. And he was, I was just like, I just want to say thank you for calling in. And, you know, this one bird song, Everybody's Been Burned, is one of my all-time favorite songs. And he's like, oh, you like the old stuff. Okay, okay. And then I like quick typed like davidcrosby.com. I was like, no, no, I like your new album. I saw like the name of the new album.

I didn't know what the name of the album. I knew he was going to call in. I would have listened to it if I had the problem. I was like, I like Star Sailor. How are you going to know? Who the hell is listening to his new stuff? He's like, okay, okay. You like the new stuff.

And then he just. Then he just started talking about nukes, right? Yeah, he started talking about nukes. But he was so like, you just picture him just sitting there. But he was one of the fucking first. He was like top notch ego monster. Just fucking and drugs and just like almost satanic. Yeah.

Dionassian fucking cluster fuck up there in the hills, you know? And then he was like the Lord over it all. Yeah. He was like, those guys were the first people that like the hippies were just like, these guys are just out for the money man oh yeah like like the money and the sex like they got singled out just like they're charging twice as much for concert tickets and they're just like they think they're they're rock stars and we're supposed to like they were the first ones to kind of get to kind of get dragged by the oh really by the counterculture

like csny really like represented this um this thing they're just like you guys are fakes and you're just you're not a part of the call like right right right because back then it was always well that's interesting because that kind of makes sense because i think the either the a and r guy i mean it they were a geffen project i mean deja vu was david geffen's like one of his first and you know I think in that in his push yeah like and he's clearly a guy who's gonna sell out the fucking hippie oh he doesn't care yeah he doesn't care but I think that I think he was they were with him I think Deja Vu is now and I'm just I look what do I know I mean they were all kind of hanging out but

obviously guys like Geffen saw a tremendous amount of money in the music. Oh, yeah. You know, fuck the cause. I mean, you can maintain the illusion, fellas. Oh, absolutely. No, they were like, because I think Geffen did that big, they did like this big 74 like mega tour where they were playing like football stadium.

Right. And I think that was a Geffen thing. Do you like any of it? I mean, really? I like some of it. I like. Because Dan's a big Crosby solo fan like that. I can't remember. I love that album. That album's great. What's it called? effing thing but do you do you like any of it i mean really i like some of it i like because dan's big crosby solo fan like that i can't remember i love that album what's it called i can't remember

if only if i could only remember my name but you like that record yeah i think it's great that's some serious hippie shit that right yeah but that's a sad record too because his his girlfriend had just died oh right like you can just it's a yeah you feel it yeah you can kind of feel this is a guy trying to get healed through music. And I think that's in it. But then he goes off the rails kind of. He goes on the rails and off the rails at the same time. Oh, on that record.

But I mean, just like over the next 10 years, he's like, you can, if you just look at the pictures of him year by year, you're just like, he's aging like a dog. It's like every year is seven years ends with him in jail i mean it's like it ends with a mug shot when he's got his short hair and his liver's going yeah but here's my thing like he like i'm going through the records i've gone through them all i got i got new uh record dividers that are very nice okay i moved

the jazz upstairs. Okay. So I had more room downstairs. Sure. Jazz and comedy upstairs because comedy is just sort of a guilty pleasure. I don't listen to that. Well, comedy is like jazz. Kind of. Okay.

It's just like, you know what people are always like, my comedy is kind of like jazz. Yeah, I can't. But jazz you can listen to again. I can't. Yes, exactly. You're not exactly throwing on a Shelly Berman album again. Not too often. For the 200th time?

There's no nuance there. It's like, I didn't hear that. Did you hear the beat on that? It took an extra second before he says, there's a woman hanging outside of the window. What is the upper limit of how many times you could listen to a comedy record? Exactly.

Three? Well, some of them are kind of, like there's one record that i will play for people and it's a rodney dangerfield record before he got the hook like uh it's called the loser or something uh-huh it's actually signed i don't know where i got it but it's where he kind of long form bits so it's like it's it's rodney doing this thing that you just don't know him for before he got the respect thing and yeah so it's kind of a nice thing. Like it's kind of nice to listen to people before they,

you know, fully formed. Oh yeah. Yeah. But I, I think the, the most interesting thing about comedy records is just the bad decisions people make about the cover art,

which I've done myself. You know, like, you know, when you look at comedy records, like how did they think that was a good idea? Even peers of mine, people we know have record covers where it's sort of like really you're holding up a thing with

a thing and you're making that face what are you doing those the covers of comedy records and the the way a stage is dressed on a comedy special to me are so telling where you come out it's the giant pencils i've made bad mistakes like people are just like bad mistakes i got props it's like a just like it's like i'm in the playground but they give you these options that's the fucked up thing is that like that's the worst thing you can do yeah because it's like with those comedy central half hours they're like yeah let us know what you want to do at the stage so my first one i did two of those and the first one i'm like for some reason i'm like i want a sideshow banner okay because i

thought i don't know what i thought i thought it'd be interesting yeah but it just looks weird it's just a fat lady and some you know and i'm like what was i doing and what does it mean people are like what's that why does he have that up there and then the next one was worse. Mm-hmm. Where it was worse. I'm ashamed of it. What was it? It's like 2006, I think. Uh-huh. And I'm like, I want to- Which is not one of your banner years, 2006. No, it wasn't bad.

I was at Air America. It was pretty political. Yeah. You know, the set was tight, but it was pretty political. So I had this idea- I just mean in terms of like you were- Oh, yeah, like you were, because people who maybe don't know your whole thing, it's like you were not. Oh yeah, it was right after.

I think I just, was I separated yet? I might, it might've been right before we got divorced. Because you had the, because I was looking at. The Air America thing I always look at is like after 2004 yeah it was like because i went to that i went to that election party that air america 2004 election party yeah which was one of the most i mean that to me is the launch you mean the launch party for air america no no like literally the night of the 2004 presidential election when it was just like oh yeah like when it's like when bush won yeah when bush won and it was just

like sam i would talk to sam cedar in the morning and he would just be like he's like carrie's got this in the bag i just talked to somebody yeah that laurence or donald did that to me with hillary too at the bowery i'm like dude is she gonna win he's like oh yeah and i just remember being at that party and watching like people like being there. I can't remember. It was just, but it was such, I just remember seeing like, uh, Rachel Maddow and, um, Liz Winstead. Yeah.

Liz Winstead. And they were, people were just like, well, there's counties in Ohio that haven't come in yet. And those are more Democrat faith. And it was just like, this is over. We lost. Yeah. But people were just trying to like pull hope

from nowhere and i was just like i felt like the air america thing was just like this place existed to beat this guy and it's like what's this gonna be now is that what fight it you just keep pushing against it so yeah for me it was fine but the but the set was the problem where I thought, like, I'm going to have a big picture of a herd of sheep going the other way. Uh-huh. And I'm going to be. You're the sheep going the other way. The one sheep. Sure.

I'm not going with the herd. Yeah. So there's a picture of literally a photograph of the asses of a herd of sheep. All right? And then somehow I signed off on the idea to have one stuffed sheep on the stage. Okay. And I did that. That exists in the world.

There was a point where somebody said to you, you like this sheep? And you're just like, yeah, I'm good. Yeah, put the one out there because that sort of solidifies the message. And all you just see me standing up there with sheep asses behind me It's like, yeah, I'm good. Yeah, put the one out there because that sort of solidifies the message. Yeah. And all you just see me standing up there with sheep asses behind me and a big stupid stuffed sheep on stage. Yeah. And in my mind, I'm like, I'm nailing this. I'm nailing it. Isn't that so funny that you get to the point where you're just like, of course I don't need any of that.

Like you needed literally none of it. Well, they gave you the option. That's what I'm telling you. That was their way of personalizing it because they churned those things out. The half hours were all shot in one week, sometimes two in a day. Yeah. So, you know, you kind of, they're like, what do you want? We're going to make it your own and whatever.

So what's backstage look like at that thing? There's a giant crib and then there's like. I don't remember, but like it was. Just like every comedian has like their thing. Yeah. Well, they're good. That's what they put their money into is, I guess, getting these set changes. and then there's like I don't remember but like it was just like every comedian has like their thing yeah well they yeah they're good that's what they put

their money into is I guess getting these set changes but that what did it take for mine nothing they put a slide up yeah

and they brought a stuffed sheep in we got the slide and the sheep he's good we got the sheep well good way it's easy

this guy's easy yeah and the other time it was just a sideshow banner that was a bad that was bad because like I was you know i i was not

sober yet and and i came out to la it was a sad experience i think i was still married to kim i don't remember what year that was where'd you tape that at uh like over here in hollywood on vine uh i don't remember what theater it was it was one of those theaters over there okay the ivar maybe or something where they i don't remember but uh but it was it was one of those theaters over there okay the ivar maybe or something where they i don't remember but uh but it was like that was the year that hedberg taped his that changed his life that thing he did i was there and it was like he didn't do that well but the kids loved it yeah and i remember they bust in a lot of samoans i don't know why they were busting in audience members and all i know is that like i'd come out here

i knew my material and i watched some of it the other day and it's bad. And I wore a black suit with a red shirt. I was well groomed. And I really was like, I'm going to stay clean. I'm going to come out here and just be cool. So like the night before the special, I just went over to the guy I did drugs with at that time who was out here. And, you know, and Bob, I i was like i'll just do a couple lines and then i ended up like up all night not with him but just in my fucking hotel room going like

why the fuck i do that and i do the i do the set and it's bad it's okay nothing lands like someone had done a thing on youtube or written an article a deep dive into the rabbit hole of me and just all the way up through the current special and i had long clip of that one I'm telling you about. And I'm like, oh my God. And there are things I remember loving, loving about that set. And so here's how, this was the worst moment about it though.

It's like, I do this, it's my first half hour for Comedy Central and I walk into the dressing room and I got no friends there. Nobody's there except my Coke guy, except for bob and and he's in the green room going they got roast beef that's that's what i walk up stage to is bob yeah standing there with a plate of roast beef yeah didn't even say good set and i was sort of like oh yeah what the fuck have i become no this is bad yeah i played i was at maxwell's for a yolo tango thing that's one of the first

that's one of the first times we had an extended conversation with me and you right oh that's right one of their hanukkah shows that's right and i never felt like i did well with those things that was the night you and i had a long conversation right in the hallway and we decided like we should be friends exactly it's like back then it's just like this thing where like you're like it is such a weird thing where you're just not sure. Like, especially when you carry so much just like shittiness. Yeah. For, and which I know I do where I'm just like, I should mix it up with this guy.

What's it do? Or should I be, should I like this guy or should I go after like for no reason? Yeah. It's like, it's so pathetic. Yeah. I can't. Oh no. He's a great guy.

I like him. It was sweaty too. Wasn't sweaty. Oh, it's always hot. The Maxwell's so pathetic. Yeah. I can't. Oh, no, he's a great guy. I like him. It was sweaty, too. Wasn't it sweaty? Oh, it's always hot. The Maxwell's. Maxwell's. Those Yola Tango Hanukkah shows were so crowded. And I just remember early on, like, I tweeted something that was like a weird blind item

subtweet thing that like. About what? Taking a shot at some at another podcast not at not at you right and i just remember brendan like writing me before i even knew brendan he's just like it's like hey man are you talking about us i'm like no he's like oh cool because i i like your show and i was kind of like oh i like your show too and then suddenly it's like that's all it took to be just like friends. Friends with Brendan? Exactly. Friends with everybody was just like,

no, I was ripping on somebody else. Oh, good. I don't like them either. Yeah. We're friends now. Well, that's exactly it. It's just like, yeah, they're terrible. Oh, good.

We're friends. Good. What a sad state of affairs. The Rodney thing you were saying, I've been watching so much. Like he has this YouTube channel up now I guess they're putting a lot of you know all the Tonight Show it's like I said about him I say about him it's like you know it's it's odd that in in in the big picture in the history of comedy

he doesn't get the respect he deserves he still doesn't know it's and he's great. It's unbelievable the level of, it's like him and Rickles covered everything I'm interested in. Like those two represent all of the comedy I could ever want from a thing. And it's like, his thing is just so, like, if you watch a bunch of the Tonight Show things, you realize like the game within the game that when he would sit down on the couch with johnny yeah and then just be just kind of like they're just going through just like health yeah yeah yeah my dumb kid yeah yeah like and it's just this ramp up to like he just like he just like and he gets to the and it's just like you could see the amount of fun that they're having knowing that this is a game that like all he's looking to

do is land one with johnny and it's like you like he doesn't always land one because like because rodney like right out of the gate he's like everything's twitching everything everything is moving on that guy his head his arms his legs he's sweating he's touching himself yeah it's like it's everything's going and it's all funny it's it's the funny the the funniest conceit is that he sits down and then johnny goes harry news like i'm doing good uh last week i was in rough shape though last week rough shape just the idea that like i gotta tell you rough shape last week last week i was in rough shape is the funniest thing i've ever heard and then when like one doesn't land he'll just go like, well, you know, not all funny.

There's someone just meant to be cute. And that just kills Johnny, the idea that just like... He knows when he bombs. Oh my God. He's only trying to land jokes, man. And it's like he's such a package, that guy. And then to find out in retrospect, he's been paralyzed

with depression. Oh, he's profoundly sad. He's unfixable. Yeah lewis used to say he referred to it as the heaviness i got the heaviness heartbreaking yeah you can just feel just like i mean i just think you you feel this guy and there's it seems like there's a part of him that's just like where were you bums when i was trying to make it took me 30 years to get here. I hate all of you. I had to sell pot out of my trunk and fucking go get into the woman inciting business with Joe Ansis because I had fucking kids. Yeah.

You assholes. Exactly. Where were you guys? You made me grind it out until I'm in my 50s before you started paying attention. Yeah. Everything. All he's doing is trying not to get sucked into the vacuum of self. Oh, my God. Just the darkness. He's like, I'm in my 50s before you start paying attention. Yeah, and everything, like, all he's doing is trying not to get sucked into the vacuum of self. You know, just the darkness.

He's like, I'm fighting. I'm trying not to drown here, Johnny. Look at me. And he just won't. I'm swimming. He just knows to not show the person. Like, he just knows. He's just like, I'll never show you.

I'm not sure. And, like, once in a while, you get these little glimpses of, like, the act. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And where he'll just be glimpses of like the, like the act and where he'll just be like, like, he'll just say like, like I got dates I'm playing over at this, you know, I got this movie coming out easy money and it's a good movie, but I really like doing the live stuff. It's just like, like you just know he hates, like he hates these movies.

Like he just, he just knows he's grabbing whatever they'll give him. He'll take, but it's not why he's there. The live show, like stand-up is what kept the lights on for the guy. And whenever he gets to that moment where he's just like, oh, I played a lot of rough places, it's going to be like Vito's Boom Boom Room. It's like formerly Nunzio's. I'm so glad these. I like looking at those too. i always end up on him too

i like rickles too the thing i liked about rickles is that rickles like almost always on tv appearances would say like 20 of what he said makes no sense at all oh it's it's in me it's it's it's just word salad it's like it's just look at this guy he's got the thing on his head with the two four things in the nine in the in the five uh spaghettios yeah he'll always be like yeah this guy's busy knocking on the door he's trying to tell me he's trying to sell me a pair of pants and you're just like what's that mean like the timing was always great he just knows he can like ram it through and he knows like some of these are nothing i've never like watching him do a special and like the thing that killed me i'll never forget he just he says to some guy up front

and i think it was a play i said because where'd you get that suit that come with two pairs of pants and a yo-yo he would go his there was there's this like five i think it's like a it might be like five hours long of him every every like it was like i think it was like every letterman appearance for rickles from like 83 all the way till when like his like final one and it's just like when he came out with the cane when he would be out there already, like they would come back from a commercial break. He'd be sitting there cause he couldn't walk.

So, but he would be like one of the funny, it's like one of the meanest and funniest things he did this. He would like all, he would like do variations on jokes where he'd just be like, he'd be like, you know, Dave,

I went to, uh, I was on Jerry Lewis's, uh, telethon and he comes out, he sings, you'll never walk alone, the kids get up and leave. And it's just like, that's the meanest thing. But he does like.

There are moments where you watch Rickles, and he's filled with real fury. Like, you know, like you can see it, like, it's all cute, but like, there's something behind there that's sort of like, oh my God. Yeah. Well, he also, it must be a thing to know you're the court jester. For them. For these. Did you ever see that one of him just where they set up a makeshift Vegas lounge for him to entertain people in show business? Have you seen that?

I don't know. I don't know. It was like, I don't know who did it. It was a Dean Martin roast or something something i think i might have it but they're like you know this guy we're gonna you know he's the guy who does this so if you've never seen him in vegas so they created on the set like a stage for him to do his shtick but in the in the audience is pap boone and like all these weird celebrities of all different kinds. And he just goes at him. Oh, yeah.

It's crazy. Yeah. It's crazy because he's sweating. And it's like, it's probably, how is that not the worst nightmare? You know? But it must be the worst and the best. Like he's bulletproof. He knows it's just like, I have the mic. I can say whatever I want.

And you people are going to laugh at it. When he's on the roast when he says that like his timing was so good yeah when james james stewart jimmy stewart's on the dais uh-huh and rickles like jimmy i talked to the family you're doing fine those are always the um oh my god he would like he um that album he did this album hello dummy which is like just the stand-up and it's like with the song at the end i don't know at the end of it there's this speech he always did where it's like we i was in the navy and we stood on that ship and we looked out and we were all brothers and i don't make fun of little people you're all big people like he's just like that's kind of a yeah cop out of it yeah but he

like there's a point where he's like um he's just showing he could like make fun of anybody it's like where are you where are you from and the guy's like uh i'm welsh he's like yeah let me make you feel at home cave in like so he could just do like a mining joke and everybody's like i was like this guy is just like he can say anything he could spin anything it's all rhythm it's all pace yeah and it's just like force of the words yeah like you have to kind of realize how little you need it's like it's not unlike the specials you didn't you realize you didn't need a sheep on stage no you don't need anything and then you're better off without even shooting the audience that was the best thing i started you don't need anything. You're better off without even shooting the audience. That was the best thing I started doing.

Don't ever cut to the audience. It's just a trick so you can make cuts. Why look at that weirdo? Like evening of the improvs, it's like, why am I looking at those people? I never want to see the audience in any of those things. And it just feels like, you know, I can't stand the comedy specials whenever. There's like this thing when like somebody would make a reference to just like they'd be like yeah you know they'll basically mention some either like either a gender or ethnicity and then they cut to the audience member who lines up with the joke it's like it's like the one of the that's like the worst thing i ever saw in my life the two

black people yeah they're just like there was nothing worse than um the audience cuts during i think paul rodriguez uh did a special in a prison just horrendous well that might be the only one i would want to see audience reactions to it just but they would cut to like people clearly didn't want to be seen what is the what is for you the ceiling on what is uh for for comedy crowd wise size wise like what where do you think it gets lost oh uh i would say you start to kind of buckle at 1200 okay i i think you can still kind of make something intimate with 1200 and make comedy real like you can still reach the yeah but once you get up into like 2000 or you know 1500 where what was carnegie hall 2200 yeah but that's a different kind of that room's got like perfect sound situation so that like when you did carnegie hall you you felt like you were

reaching the people i felt like i did not do well there. That was such a fun show. I never got off stage. I did like two hours. It was the greatest because I was sitting there. I was sitting one row behind your mother. And then you just went off and you did the stuff about your mother. And I'm watching your mother watch this. I'm like, this is the highlight of my life right now. I'm watching this guy reckon with this thing.

You're the person. And and 20 however many thousand people yeah they're just we're all spectators to this guy finally squaring off with his mother did i do that yeah you were just like because you're doing the whole thing about just like why don't i get to pull the plug oh right, yeah. Oh, right. About my brother? Yeah, your brother gets the- He's the number one. He gets to pull the plug on her? Yeah. Yeah. Why does he get to kill her?

It's just like, but seeing you do that- In front of her? To her, it really was just like you could just erase all the, it would just be, it was you and her sitting in Carnegie Hall. And then I had the lady bring out my phone to read the email from my father. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. Yeah, I was riffing. It's a big night for me to fucking riff for an hour but that's the cap

that to you is like no but that's a different structure yeah it was that was tricky I felt the weight of it like you could like I can open my I can feel when I'm open and when it starts to buckle like I can feel like like in my heart I can feel like oh no i gotta it's a fight now like i'm losing them back there okay do you feel like you lose i would you know this is so interesting to me do you feel like when you look at a theater yeah are you focusing on sections are you focusing on the entirety of the room are you not when you're in it when you're on stage no like some theaters like have a good role to them and you know, you feel, you know,

buoyed. Like, you know, it really depends also on the acoustics of the theater. But like when I did a symphony hall, both times I did a symphony hall. Three times.

I did one in San Francisco, I did one in England and I did a BAM. Like, they're like, that type of structure that's built for an orchestra, like I started to feel like, like at any second I could get zero laughter.

Okay. And I don't know why. Like there was the potential for the connection to break? Yes. Is that what it is? Right, right. It feels just like. Yeah, like I'm going to be up here alone and I'm going to hear myself talking and it could happen.

And I don't know why. And I think it's my own fear. Maybe it's because ultimately that's on me. Right. Like, I don't know what what makes me continue to be confident in those moments. But even when you're bombing, you've got to keep doing the act. So like you do not. And it's a liability. It can happen. And it's a horrible feeling. I don't know why, but I can't open back up. And here I am, not even on autopilot, but I'm just doing it. But I'm not connecting. And now I got to live with this for an hour.

It's the worst. And I don't know. I always think at a symphony hall, it's sort of like, this isn't built for one troubled Jew. This is built to house a symphony yeah you know of people that spent you know put together a big thing yeah not me going oh god what is gonna happen with you know and do you do you feel yourself watching yourself do it i've only had that happen once or twice like it's like an observant oh when you leave your body yeah the worst and like it literally you're like i'm gonna go backstage do what you can i'll meet you back there i'm sorry buddy i just can't can't hang out for this oh my god but but me but that that's funny that this one form caps out at such a relatively low number before you start to feel like you lose the connection.

That's me. I mean, guys do arenas. But I still think a lot of that's a cash grab. I mean, who the fuck would go see comedy at a football stadium? But that's what I don't understand. It's just the idea of when you would have – when there was that stretch where all these people were playing madison square garden and they had like you know i think louis and amy schumer and everybody was like like got to do the garden right yeah like they were doing the guard and it's just like

that's what is that 15 000 people for a stand-up thing or if you're not even doing the back was it it's if it's it's over 10 so it just feels like there's just such a ceiling on any kind of connection you could have just based on acoustics. Yeah, right, but you're doing a different kind of thing. Your jokes, like I can't, like I like room, so I can fuck off, you know, and find something new. You know, but if you're tight and your jokes land,

like you got got in order to do that size of room your jokes have got to land strong yeah you can't just you know you can't be thoughtful you can't you can't be lyrical really yeah yeah yeah because like then you're going to come to the end of it and people are going to be like is it done you know so you know like you'll notice that most of those guys that do the big rooms, they're going to, you know, everything, boom, boom, boom. Oh, yeah. It's got to be. It's like the equivalent of just like, if you're going to be a band playing there, your thing has to translate to the whole room.

Well, that's why they play the hits, man. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, it's just got to land. I mean, I could do it, and I've gotten better at doing it. I did those oddball things for 20,000 people. And when I do it, I'm like, which jokes do I know close strong? And a lot of guys, that's all they think about. Like everything.

But some of my jokes are, you know, they're not. It's not they don't close strong, but they go a different direction. They're more personal. But you don't really have that option there no i know when you're in a place like that you know anything that anything that's subtle can read as not working right right which is just such a crazy thing but that's the way that is it's just the nature of the thing but with music it's amazing that there's like there's no ceiling on how big if you're big enough for the people you can play to 200 000 people that five people can be playing for 200 000 people and it works yeah because it's music's magic yeah because everybody

has a relationship different like with the song and they can listen to it over and over again yeah and you know they're just all amazed it's just it's a whole different thing yeah but it's so funny that when they first started having bands at Madison Square Garden, I remember, I think I was talking to Terry Reed, who was opening in a band, opening for Cream or somebody, I think it was Terry Reed. Okay. And when him and Clapton got into Madison Square Garden, and they were walking around looking at it, marveling at it, it was because they'd seen Sonny Liston fight there on television.

Yeah. It wasn't because bands had played there. There's no tradition of that. This is where the boxers were. You know what I mean? Yeah, that is so funny. It's just because it's an all-purpose entertainment center. Right.

Where it's just like, we'll have Elvis is going to be here, and then there's going to be the Knicks are going to play a game tomorrow. And it's just like, and we're going to have a hockey game in here. It's just like everything. Yeah. Yeah. That was the weird thing about Carnegie Hall that I had to realize, too, is as mythic as that place is, most of the time it's not filled you know like it's it's some

saturday afternoon concert series yeah yeah yeah yeah it's a you know it's a persian fiddle player you know but but i'm not saying that's bad but i'm just saying like it's not there's so much weight to it like it's carnegie hall but it's like no one ever goes there it's like they they run things every day yeah you know what you have four times a week and they're like oh we've only got 12 people in there for the Persian dance just this functional concert hall where it's just like we gotta do something here the worst part about that night was like outside of me not feeling great about it was you know we you know I have I had my management scramble to get cats's for everybody and put it in a room upstairs.

But I wasn't told that if we're there after a certain hour, they got to pay the union over time. So there was all this meat upstairs. And we all go into this room. And all these people came up. And they were literally like, you got to get out. I'm like, what's going to happen to this meat? Yeah, it was rough. And I didn't realize that the festival was like, just we don't want to pay them anymore.

Yeah. You got to get out. And then me and you walked like 90 blocks. Yeah. And Nate Bargetti gave me some dip. I remember I had a skull pack in and you and I were decompressing. No, that was exciting. That was just like.

Took the walk. Seeing that whole thing and just you kind of like doing a post-game thing after. It was very flattering that you asked me to be there. And it was a special night. We didn't feel. You said you recorded it. I did. Even though it's not like.

I can't release it. I have it somewhere. Yeah. I have a hard time. I listen to it. That'll be in your box set. It'll be in the box set. I thought to Swissle about putting them out. He's got most of my set. It'll be in the box set. I thought Stan, I've talked to Schlissel

about putting them out. He's got most of my records, you know, to put them all out. But like, is comedy really like that? There were some records I've done,

like, Final Engagement seems to resonate with some people because it's like, it's such a dark, angry record. And I recently talked

to Louis Katz, who's a comic who's going through a breakup. And he's like, I listened to that thing. It was helpful. And it was like, one of these records where I's a comic who's going through a breakup. And he's like, I listened to that thing. It was helpful. And it was like one of these records where I'm like, I'm going through that separation. I'm heartbroken.

I'm angry. I can barely keep my fucking sanity together. And I call up Schlissel, who does recording. I said, I think I got something. You should just meet me in Seattle with the shit. And he did. And I got the worst comedy club in the world to let me work there. And we taped like four shows of me just sort of like in the darkest place of my life.

And it exists in the world. Yeah. Well, and now it's... It's helpful to people that are going through heartbreak. Yeah. You made... That's the comedy equivalent of some of these records. Yes, exactly.

Well, this was fun. That was great. Are we good? Oh, yeah. I'm about to have a crash from the coffee yeah no that's that's how it works i think we got a lot done yeah well tom take care of yourself you too stay safe all right so that was me and tom sharpling uh you can hear tom if you go to the Best Show archives, as I said earlier, at thebestshow.net.

Or you can listen to his new podcast with Julie Klausner. It's called Double Threat. And you can get that wherever you get podcasts. Did I mention that I'm getting fat? And Tom and I, the other night, as I told you earlier about the gift basket from Pat and Tom and I, I just pulled out the brownies, the cookies, and the brittle and the other thing. And Tom and I became human garbage cans. No one says garbage as good as Tom Sharpton.

Now I will attempt some finger picking on a loud distorted Telecaster. Okay? Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Boomer lives. O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations. How a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category. And what the term dignified consumption actually means.

I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. It's a night for the whole family. Be a part of Kids Night when the Toronto Rock take on the Colorado Mammoth at a special 5 p.m. start time on Saturday, March 9th at First Ontario Centre in Hamilton. The first 5,000 fans in attendance will get a Dan Dawson bobblehead courtesy of Backley Construction.

Punch your ticket to Kids Night on Saturday, March 9th at 5pm in Rock City at torontorock.com.