WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1196 - Rick Glassman

Episode Date: January 28, 2021

Not unlike a lot of comedians, Marc's relationship with Rick Glassman started out with an apology. But that apology led to both of them liking each other more than they expected. Rick explains how a recent diagnosis has given him more self-awareness and prompted him to reassess the boundaries in his life. And Marc is able to relate to Rick's desire to start doing comedy as a way to control the laughter coming at you. They also talk about Rick's time on the show Undateable and his own podcast, Take Your Shoes Off, which is more than a name, it's a way of life. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Death is in our air. This year's most anticipated series, FX's Shogun, only on Disney+. We live and we die. We control nothing beyond that. An epic saga based on the global best-selling novel by James Clavel. To show your true heart is to risk your life.

When I die here, you'll never leave Japan alive. FX's Shogun, a new original series streaming February 27th, exclusively on Disney Plus. 18 plus subscription required. T's and C's apply. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing with cannabis legalization. It's a brand new challenging marketing category.

legalization. It's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. Lock the gates! and ACAS Creative. What the fuck, buddies? What the fuck, Knicks? What the fucksters? What is happening? How are you doing?

How are the kids? How's your mom doing? Everything all right over there? How's your finger? Did it heal right? Did you have to splint it? Did you have to splint your finger? Don't stick it in that thing next time.

Seriously. How's that burn? Is that burn okay? What happened to your hair? Well, maybe you wait. You don't cut it yourself next time i know it was just the bangs but it's i'm just being honest with you but what they what fucking difference is it makes not like you're going out anyways right do whatever you want with it you know what why don't you go into the bathroom and cut your hair in a way that'll just make you laugh and laugh and laugh and then just leave it that way for a while and then the next time you do a zoom with somebody a family friend they'll be like is

she okay is he okay what's with the haircut and you can just be like what haircut and it'll be so funny you got to entertain yourself during these times because the creeping darkness is still among us good morning good afternoon how's it going? You okay? You staying in shape? Enough with the comfort food, right? Enough. Enough with it. Enough with it. Okay?

I'm tired of feeling slightly bloated, slightly filled up. I'm tired. The creeping darkness is still with us. Look, first of all, some of you were expecting William Zabka today, and Zabka had to cancel. Zabka is shooting another season of Cobra Kai, and as we know, or as I know, you think he can do something, you think you got an hour, and then the schedule changes and you don't. So we're looking to reschedule that okay it's gonna happen today in his place for those of you who are expecting

william zapka well don't be disappointed because we've got rick glassman that's right rick glassman yeah rick glassman are you like holy shit, Rick Glassman? Yup. Rick Glassman. He's a comedian who I had sort of a rocky start with. And he's got a podcast. It's called the Take Your Shoes Off podcast. And we met at the comedy store in a, you know, it was not a great first meeting, but I grew to like the kid. The kid annoyed himself right into my heart and i did his podcast and i was uh surprisingly goofy surprised everyone

myself included and uh and now he's on my show he came through in a pinch we're running tight these days week to week man we got a few in the cam, but some people got to be dropped on certain days. When someone needs to be dropped on a certain day, you drop them on that day. So Rick is here, and we had a nice conversation. Nice Jewish guy, dirty, filthy Jewish kid with the autism. We get into it. Funny guy. You might know him from Undateable. He's on that show. He's going to be on another thing, And then he does other things here and there. Okay? What are we going to do with the creeping darkness?

I can't take it. Is it just because I'm 57? Huh? Is it? Is it just the nature of the age I'm at that I see the creeping darkness? I'm meditating. Does this sound like a voice of someone who's meditating? I am. I'm yoga-ing. I'm doing the yogas. I do the yogas in the morning. I do four to five yogas,

yoga flows, right? That's been helping. I'm working out, but it's just the walking around the house, the up and down. How am I so busy? How does the day get filled well i'll tell you how i'm running a fucking restaurant that serves me cooking my ass off my cat buster he's the only cat left the other two are ashes and boxes on a shelf and buster's very talkative we're bonding a lot of people are pressuring me to get another kitten but i don't need any more anxiety. I can barely handle the dread of that's, that's the other weird thing is like so much of the dread of the ogre is gone, but then I'm back to regular dread. And this has been such a weird relief to only have very basic existential dread. Like, am I going to get sick and die? Am I going to get sick and get sick? Am I not going to get sick? Can I ever leave

the house again? What is life? What do I want to do with the rest of it? Will I be able to go outside for the rest of my life? Will we be able to travel? Will we be able to run if necessary? Do I need a gun? And that's just the happy thoughts. So I focus on the cat and I hyper focus on the cat. The cat's a little sneezy, a little sniffly. He does this. And then he stops. Now, there's no other symptoms, but my brain, it's sort of like, does he have a tumor in his nose? Is there a tumor pressing on his sinus passages? Are his lungs collapsing? Could be allergies, I guess. And I Google cat allergies and I Google cat cold and I Google, then I'm into some other thing. Cat sinus infection. Does he have discharge? Does he have fluids coming out of his eyes? Is there black gunk in his nose? Is he lethargic? Is he eating? Is he nodding? No, he's like, and then it goes every once in a while. Not all the time. Then he talks. But when I have all this time, all i do is focus on the cat so needless to say we've bonded very deeply and the thing about my cat it's like buster's a real character like he

has no balls he's got courage i'm not saying metaphorically he literally has no balls but this cat you know god bless him he's still got a lot of a lot of oomph got a lot of uh uh a lot of heck you know what i mean and that's not even a word that's just the yiddish sound my cat's full of the the yikha the gukhem he's uh he's got he's full of the the yeah not even words the chutz yeah my cat is still fucking pillows my cat will fuck the the shit out of a pillow got no balls but he's still got the gumption there's this new a nice new uh blanket cashmere blanket that i got in a box of schwag and uh buster's taken to it he'll just he'll fuck he'll fuck that blanket and he'll look right in my face while he's doing it.

I'll look at him, and I'm like, what's up? And he's like, what do you mean, what's up? Don't look at me. I'm fucking a blanket. I'm like, well, I'm going to look at you. He's like, don't you fucking look at me. He's like a little Dennis Hopper in Blue Velvet. He's got a small oxygen mask that he handles with his paw.

Don't fucking look at me. That's how he says it that's translating he's full of that cat but yeah so uh that's where buster's at he's got some sort of sneezy business and he's busy fucking pillows and blankets and talking to me and he wakes me up two or three times a night to uh just to wake me up, apparently. So he's doing okay. Okay? Who wouldn't be doing okay?

Fucking blankets. Hey, Rick Glassman is here. And as I said earlier, I've taken a liking to him. He's difficult, but he's charming. He's a comedian. He's got the podcast, Take Your Shoes Off. And you can hear that every Monday if you want.

Take Your Shoes Off. It's every Monday where you get podcasts. We're going to talk about it. We're going to talk about the goblins. There's going to be talk about Goblin Cock. Not Goblin Cock, but Goblin Cock. Hey, look, I'm sorry if it's filthy. All right. I'm just sitting here fucking a pillow. This is me talking to Rick Glass. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode

on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store

and ACAS Creative. Death is in our air. This year's most anticipated series, FX's Shogun, only on Disney+. We live and we die. We control nothing beyond that. An epic saga based on the global best-selling novel by James Clavel.

To show your true heart is to risk your life. When I die here, you'll never leave Japan alive. FX's Shogun. A new original series streaming February 27th exclusively on Disney+. 18 plus subscription required. T's and C sees apply. I got a little cocky by taking my jacket off. I left the windows open out of respect for your fear. And I guess my own.

Yeah, it's a mutual fear, no? Yeah, it is. But I mean, I don't know.'t who the fuck knows you haven't had somebody in here in a while so what do you when you're looking what are you looking at your computer monitor i bring in the laptop because this does nothing i can't seem to run the garage band and the image without it it just takes too much something i don't fucking know you seem to know more about it than me yeah it's always yeah yeah. But I mean, it seems like on your show you do a lot of video work, a lot of editing, a lot of cartoons. Yeah.

Poops, farts, elves. Goblins. Yeah, goblins. But you know, you've got to know something to do that, right? Yeah. I added live action animation and a lot of edits because, you know, you need to have something. But do you do that? Do you do the animation yourself? i you hire that out yeah well i always wanted to do animation

because i just had fun ideas for bits yeah uh i did a fake animation in an episode and a guy in england named tom yeah he made the animation for me oh so you've got fan i don't know if he's a fan or a partner at this point because literally every episode i do you pay him i do pay him well then well he's working for you on some level yeah but he did it out of the goodness of his heart because he enjoyed your comedy so much he's still the rate he's giving me he must still enjoy it right because i wouldn't be able to afford what he's doing otherwise people want to be part of it so you just what you send the file to him and he just does it yeah so i uh most of the bits are planned out while we're doing the thing you know like when you say poops and pisses and shits i would i would then send him and say

have the have the goblin be pooping on mark and pissing on his lap or something right in a smart way though yeah uh always smart and always highbrow pooping and pissing hbps yeah sure so i tell him how i want it and depending on where it is in the episode, how gratuitous it could be. Yeah. And then sometimes I find bits after the fact. Yeah. And I send it to him.

And it's removing the fact that it's a lot of fake penises and boobs and immature comedy intentionally. Right. It's a serious conversation that I have with him, and it's- It's a serious conversation about- How many veins? Farts. How many poops? Should it be poop or should it, farts. How many veins, how many poops.

Should it be poop or should it be snot? How many veins on the cock? Yeah. I didn't realize you were dealing with cocks. There's cocks? There's cocks. Really? There's cocks.

Is it your cock generally? No. And it's just a cock? I do cocks. You have cocks with the goblins? Goblin cocks? Sometimes goblin cocks. There is a monster goblin cock.

That acts on its own without being connected to a goblin? Correct.lin cocks there is a monster goblin cock um that acts on its own without being connected to a goblin correct it walks on its balls it's a free it's a free free free range cock yes it doesn't need to be part of anybody else you know my introduction to this with you at the beginning is is cocks and poops and and and pussies and balls and though that is we didn't talk pussy we didn't talk we mentioned last episode uh i my uh my guest sona yeah soothsayan um said get out of here right uh as an expression so i snapped and i disappeared and i got a production out of it yeah she snapped me back and we showed where i was and i was inside of a big vagina so you had the guy guy in England do the big vagina illustration?

Yeah. And then we give notes, you know, could we make the walls move? Could we have some like some goblin sperm going through? From the big cock? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Well, I mean, I did your show because you were, did you annoy me into it?

I can't remember. How many times did you, was it a pestering situation? No, no, I did it. I, it was a slow play. It was, I asked you once. Oh, you asked me once. Yeah, I asked you once. Right, and then you said, what about it?

Well, you shit on me, and then I gave it a year, and I said, hey, will you come do my podcast? Wait, wait, wait. You asked me to do the podcast, I shit on you, and then you wait a year? No, no, no. You shit on me first. No, I know. We can do the back story, because I don't think people know how we know each other. How do you explain it?

Because this is my show, and I'm'm interviewing you so i'd like to hear your your angle i mean we might have done this on your podcast but i i think i we don't share a lot of listeners so what do you how did you experience our first uh interaction could i and then what could i ask you a question first go to the bathroom uh no okay um this is both me uh wanting to me on your podcast speaking to an audience But also you an interviewer Right I'm feeling like

Not defensive but I'm feeling like I have sold A very niche ironic Brand of comedy As my introduction as this Immature which is fine because it is Definitely part of me it's all going to work out. Don't worry.

We got time. We're going to ease into it, buddy. Until you said that, I didn't even realize I was worried. Yeah, that's what's happening. There's a worry. I think I'm trying to understand something. I'm just worried. We all know that you're a highly sophisticated, very deep, multidimensional Jewish man.

Here's where I would animate just big goblin dicks walking between us. So why is that then? Why do you temper it like that? Dynamics. Is it dynamics? Yeah, it really is. Are you afraid to be sincere? No.

No, I see- Are you afraid that people are not going to watch it if you if you don't counter the sincerity with goblin dicks and being in a vagina if there was a fear and i don't know fear is the right word but let's say it is it's less about people won't watch it and more about if they do will they i'm insecure about making stuff that isn't special uh-huh and because you're special i want to i want to think so yeah i i want to think so i think i think you're yeah i think i think i think you do want to think you are special uh-huh i'm not that's not a burn at all it's it's you're just validating the truth which is you know we all can be at times and you just try to find your niche so

you are more often than not would you call it a a uh you're is it a branding quest that you're looking for or authenticity are you do you think that if you were true to yourself in in in the most honest way that you would be special or is that not even enough yeah i think that if i'm true to myself i am special and i and the penises yeah uh are true to me. Goblin penises. What they stand for. Sure. Just being able to cut serious moments with comedy and be able to have sincerity and honest moments. It goes both ways.

Sure. And by just having that as a device, it ended up becoming that, a device, where I now seek times to use it. But it is- But you get excited. Like sometimes you're like, I probably shouldn't use it, but I need some some dicks here i've never thought i shouldn't use it and didn't use it unless it was a budget issue uh-huh but i mean do you think i'm at i'm asking to you are there any gratuitous goblin cocks in any of the work um yes

but but but there's but but you know i'm not saying it's the richest of context but there's always a reason for it sure that you know well like right now if we had already set this up and this is my podcast i'm having a goblin cock come in but he's now wearing a tuxedo and it's not gratuitous right and it's you get to then and then you get to build this world like a quahog or a south park right Right. Around the interview. Much to the person you're talking to has no idea that they may be fucked in the ear by a goblin. That's where sometimes it gets tricky. Really?

Have you had pushback? Yeah. Yeah. It's less about what the animation is and more about the fact that I'm live editing and I'm asking people to to do stuff so you're taking them out of context in a way i'm taking them out of context i'm willing to explain it to them but i prefer if they just trust where it's going to go and i thought ours went really smooth like i played along and it was almost like we're a comedy team are you being serious because i do feel that way no i feel that way yeah there's something really pretty about having somebody come over.

Because you and I didn't know each other well at all. No. As a matter of fact, I was skeptical of everything about you. Yeah, and I feared your skepticism. Yeah. I wanted you there and also questioned why you came. Well, I mean, because you were, well, what do you mean you asked me and you seem to want me to come i don't know why i came because you're trying casual gratuitous right you're charming casual

gratuitous uh oh you would put one in there yeah it was a let's we got to move past that was just a casual come joke oh oh i see right got it got with but that would have been animated no at this point you have coming goblin cocks there has been there has yeah i don't show the come oh is that where you draw the line uh it's where tom doesn't draw the line please let's move past this because i it's no i think people need to know no i think that this will people be like what is this show we haven't even said the name of it we this is a great build uh-huh what called? It's called Take Your Shoes Off. And that's a real thing because you're like a fucking weirdo

and you won't let people in your house without, I guess that's not that weird. Yeah, I would say that though. Most people. I subscribe to being weird. I don't think that taking your shoes off is that. I think it's weird to track shit, piss, and cum through your carpet, cigarette butts.

My cat walks around on my food counter. Where do you stand with that uh that's what i grew up with cats so you don't have a problem with it uh i've accepted that that's how people live their life when i go home that's how it is they're cats on the food counter yeah i just don't use the food counter the same way i do at my house which is what you lick it off the counter right off the counter no i i like to make big portions portions and I'll leave stuff out on the counter and I'll go back to it during the day. Like you have a buffet going at your house

most of the day? Yeah. I like to make things that have different sauces and different toppings. Yeah, I never thought of it that way, but it's a buffet, an eaten buffet. And a cat is just like having a roommate. I just don't want to leave stuff out. I don't have a roommate. My cat wouldn't eat don't he wouldn't need anything i left out on the counter

he'll lick a he'll lick a piece of fish occasionally but he doesn't what's the difference between eating and licking well i guess that's true i'm more concerned about the cat than i am with me i mean you're gonna cook it what's what's what well that's not true actually yeah there's some bad shit in cat mouths yeah i my cat bit me and i had uh i had a catch in it an infection before it possibly killed me are you okay yeah but i had to take antibiotics he bit me because i he got stuck in um the blind cord and instead of just cutting it i tried to untangle him and he was panicking so he bit me for real and uh and i washed it and everything but cat bites i don't know if you know they can they have some serious fucking germs in them and you can get this infection that

goes through all of your skin i didn't know and it started to happen like i was i was on ig live and people were like you should get that looked at it was red and i went to my doctor and she was like you got this in time this could have been bad like my cat could have fucking killed me compromised my life oh that's less a counter problem and more a blinds problem i guess that is a blinds problem but next time i'll just cut the cord yeah i was just going to ask do you feel that that's kind of a microcosm of your personality where instead of just taking the easy route you want to untangle everything and get your hands dirty no i don't think that that i think that's an interesting uh metaphor that you tried to makeangle everything and get your hands dirty no i don't think that that i think

that's an interesting uh metaphor that you tried to make thank you we'll be right back after a word wait this is mine this is my show no we're doing can we edit it in here edit what in my dad's rug story no and we're back that's marshall rug gallery in cleveland ohio Did you slip? Did you think you were on your show? No, I just felt good with you, and I figured- All right, maybe. Maybe we'll- Plug my dad's rug store. Maybe we'll throw it in there. We'll play by-

Have you brought him customers? He sold a few rugs. I know at least a few rugs, but not enough to- I do commercials for him in every episode. You're a Cleveland Jew? Yeah. So, wait, where were we? Oh, no, that is not a microcosm.

It was impulsive for me to untangle him. I didn't think to cut it. Like, he was panicking, and in that moment, my brain was like, it's because he's tangled, untangle. It didn't go the next step to, like, he's going to bite you and possibly infect your hand. Perhaps let him fucking squirm for a minute more and go find a scissor to cut the cord well that's what i'm saying yeah

but that i don't think that that means that it's a general disposition of mine to untangle i'd rather not untangle why are we doing this right now then why are we untangling you this what do you mean i feel like we're untangling. I'm an untangler. You're an untangler. I like an untangle. I lose patience with it. Everything gets tangled. And if I were an untangler, it's almost like a hobby.

It's like, I used to do a bit about it, I think, about how there are so many cords in our lives, cords, literal chords that are constantly getting tangled up and fucked up so is like constantly untangling chords the same as doing like sudoku like am i getting equal amount of like mental dexterity from the act of untangling the chords in my life as i would if i were playing a game with boxes that i don't understand well i think the difference is sudoku always comes to you intentionally tangled. So the spontaneity of it diminishes the mental agility exercise of untangling?

Well, there's a mental agility of it, which I'm disregarding. I'm just talking about having a clean life. Right. When you untangle something, it's now untangled. And also when you untangle something, you get better at untangling. Kind of.

So it's not like every day you wake up and you have to clean the same mess over and over again no but there's always knots and that brings us to my next point yeah you want to do another rug so i'd rather not so uh take your shoes off yeah is with rick glassman uh-huh i've seen bits and pieces that you put up on uh instagram of your family and it seems that you grew up with some fairly, not run-of-the-mill, but not unusual to me, middle-class Jewish maniacs. Oh, is that right?

Yeah, I mean, they weren't not unusual to me either. No, but I mean, as a Jew who's dealt with Jews of a certain ilk, your family seems to fit some of that. You know, they actually, they strike me as more kind of like pre-retirement Florida Jews, which is interesting. PRFJs? Yeah.

I don't have Florida retirement Jews in my family, so I don't really, I know the cliche. I don't know what those are. Well, I just mean it seems like they have a good time. They enjoy sports. There's a lot of them around. Yeah. It feels like there's a lot of them around yeah uh it feels like there's a lot of them uh right now in cleveland there's four of them four four mom

dad grandma and uncle the rest are out in la you got you got glassman jews out here yeah who i got my aunt i got my brother i have three cousins your aunt's out here my dad's sister moved out here before i did to do what uh get out of there i guess she and my uncle paul who passed away a couple years ago uh they're in the business and they were in show business my uncle is a writer um he just wrote uh no he passed away uh about about two years ago coming up sorry buddy thank you um his last how young young uh late 60s oh it's terrible his um he and his writing partner uh danny bilson just did the uh the five bloods was likely bilson uh no he's de mayo de mayo paul de mayo de mayo and bilson de mayo and

five to five bloods and a lot of stuff the rocketeer a lot of cool stuff but the rocketeer i kind of remember that yeah there was a kid's movie, right? Was Dennis Quaid in that? Was it about a... It was like the... The Rocketeer is like a... It was like a 50s pull. It's 30s Iron Man.

Oh, right. Oh, so it was actually a superhero movie? It wasn't based on a kid's dream or something? I don't know the origins. It was an old comic book. No, I know that, but I thought that the movie was about a kid who liked The Rocketeer or something. No, it's about a guy who becomes The Rocketeer. Oh. Yeah. Who was it? I don't remember the actor's name. Was it Dennis Clayton? No, it wasn't. It wasn't? No. Okay. But he became

The Rocketeer and boy, his arms are tired. His arms are tired. Yeah. I'm sorry I stepped on that because it probably would have got a huge laugh. Cut to the people listening just. usual act cut to the people listening just so wait so how many you got one brother yeah that's it one brother older older he's out here you're a younger brother i'm a younger brother yeah does that explain a lot about who you are yeah probably that's one thing i haven't really untangled you haven't feels too some things feel too cliche to look into really like what being a jew having i don't know the way you just said that felt anti-semitic being a jew you had your coffee ready for a sip take after joe what were you listening to when you drove it wasn't barry manilow was it yeah good ear why why would you do that um i have a mix on my phone that is just,

when I get, I work out or I try to, whenever I'm trying to- None of this, none of what you're saying right now is explaining Barry Manuel yet. I misunderstood the question. I thought you asked if I work out. Anything I do that I listen to music to get prepared for, I listen to soft music.

I work out to soft music. I go to sleep to soft music. I come over here to soft music. work out to soft music I go to sleep to soft music I come over here to soft music uh-huh and boy are my arms tired there so you got it you got it out that time the guy who was coughing before goes that's actually pretty yeah it's pretty good doesn't make sense this time yeah yeah so Barry Manilow something you grew up with no just soft music man stop it man how do you know about Barry Manilow what are you 12 how old are you uh thank you um i'm 34 36 really yeah it's getting getting up there yeah uh whenever i hear something that is soft when i hear something that's soft i shazam it yeah yeah really so what else is in your mix uh just we animate now just this flaccid dick that i'm shazamming and i know in the moment

yeah it's not going to be worth it. It's going to cost me a little extra money. They make the dick? Yeah. Yeah. We're not even doing video, which is interesting that you're still thinking dicks. How do you blend when you're talking to somebody the difference between an interview and a conversation? I mean, I know the differences when you're – I just listened to, by the way, and if we we don't talk about it here I want to talk to you about it either off a podcast or on my

prepper I don't know if it was prep I just happened to listen to your Larry King interview and uh man does that I mean I I didn't know you very well maybe we should talk about how we met but I didn't know you very well I I knew you as a personality before you came to my house. And then after you came over, and I'm feeling my eyes getting water even talking about it, I liked you in that hour and a half that we spent. Expectations weren't met, and I didn't realize the expectations I had of you, which was just a grouchy guy, which exists. I guess it's part of the Jewish cliche.

Yeah. But the amount that you played with me and did the snaps and the edits, and we never talked about it before, really. No. And then I just liked you so much. And I listened to your podcast since differently, which is, I mean, I guess it makes sense, but just like as a person, as a human,

as opposed to just like this two-dimensional thing that I don't quite know yet. Right. And listening to, and you know it was older, it was 2013, right? Yeah. But listening to you going to his door and just, it's a game over at this point. Right. And then you went through it and then you get, whether it's true or not, you were able to continue the conversation. Then he seemed to forget about it for a minute. For a minute. Yeah. Is really inspiring because it doesn't, I don't, I don't leave that discomfort that quickly. And what made you record at the door before? Well, I used to do, when I did those ones externally, when I would be traveling, there was sort of a precedent set.

Like, I would sometimes do the intros in the car driving, like to the Robin Williams episode. There were actually a couple of early episodes that we did in the car. Like, I interviewed Maria Bamford driving. So it wasn't that unusual at that time for me to make the intro happen in real time. I never knew if we'd use it or not, but it turned out to be kind of interesting. But I know what you're saying. And I think that what you're, it's, I still want to connect. I mean, there've only been a couple of times where I've remained defensive. Like what, what could have happened is he said, you know, he was being a dick and then I would have just sort of surrendered to that.

So once I think once like anything else, when that happens is once, if the conversation starts to unfold, then it goes away. You know, but if he was going to be like, what? No. Yes. I don't know.

Yeah. Good. Then it would have been a problem. But somehow I charmed him enough. I relaxed him enough. And he did the thing. I think people seem to like that. It was a great interview.

So Cleveland, how Jew-y were you in Cleveland? I didn't know how Jew-y I was until I went to college. But you grew up, you're 36. How old is your brother? About to be 39 so you have the exact same distance between you two as me and my brother maybe that has something to do with your older get along yeah my brother's two and a half years younger than me interesting because my brother and i i guess we get along fine now but we didn't get along really no why is he

what's the primary difference is it tastes i i'm feeling myself do something that i'm not i don't want to be but uh i'm i don't know don't be mean no no no i don't know how much i feel comfortable talking about that oh not because it's secretive but because it's it it's a longer conversation and i don't want to paint anybody in a picture that's negative because i remember things the way i remember them but i also looking looking back, understand my perspective as a kid isn't necessarily taking into consideration of his perspective. But I could just, in a simple way, I could just tell you from my feelings as a kid, I was, you know, I'm definitely being defensive here.

That's all right. You know, it's a big brother, little brother thing, but I was scared a lot and bullied. By him? here there's that's right you know it's a big brother little brother thing but i i i was i was scared a lot and bullied and by him you know the fear comes from part of that but um i had still do but i had some very serious ocd as a kid yeah um not just in my rituals but also in the in the things that felt still today logical of just keeping things a certain way. Sure. And, you know, basically he was a cat on my countertops.

Oh, right. And my whole life was a countertop. He was chaos? He was chaos. And you were clean up. Yeah. I took on that role, I guess. He's a brilliant, he truly is, you know,

I know people say that about their family, but maybe I have a bias. I think he's the smartest person I've ever met. Oh yeah? Is he in the business? No. He has restaurants. In Cleveland? Not right now.

No, here. And he is a, I don't know, have you ever been to the Greyhound? Oh yeah, over in Highland Park? There's Highland Park and Glendale and Bar ETA. Yeah, I remember when they opened that. That's your guy? That's your brother? Yeah.

Pizza. Yeah, they do pizza, burgers. Right, burgers. Cornbread. It's pizza burgers uh right cornbread it's just i remember cornbread my father was in the restaurant business growing up and his no kidding i like cornbread this is the best cornbread it's my yeah i want to get brag my dad uh my dad used to do rib cook-offs and cornbread and and uh michael jordan and isaiah thomas and lamb beer they all came and your dad a well-known pit master?

What's a pit master? Oh, no. A pit master is like a barbecue pit, right? Were there pit masters back in the- I mean, I think that's just a name for a guy that uses a barbecue like I have. Like a smoker. Did he have a smoker? Yeah.

It was a sports bar and grill. It was a big barbecue joint. He had a smoker? Oh, so he had a real barbecue joint. Ribs and cornbread. Ribs and cornbread. Ribs and cornbread. So I think, theoretically, you could be a pit master if you're legit doing ribs. Yeah, I'll tell you, right now, he's more than a pit master.

We'll be right back with a word from our sponsor. We'll put a Marshall Rug commercial here. Maybe. Yeah. Marshall Rugs in Cleveland? Yeah. If you're looking for just the right flooring, you need choices. At Marshall Carpet One, you'll find thousands of choices, including carpet, hardwood, rugs,

and luxury vinyl. So make the right choice and visit Marshall Carpet One and Rug Gallery. And we promise, with more than 50 years as a family-owned business, we've got you covered. My brother's younger, but he was a jock and I wasn't. And his whole life was about tennis. Like literally, his entire childhood was about tennis. And him and I were so different in behavior. But now, we're like, so like it's painful.

Why would, painful, that's just as a figure of speech, you said, right? Well, you just like, well, no, I mean, it's like if you can feel each other that deeply, you know, like I know when he's going through something, like I can hear it. Like that's the weird thing about growing up in a family without boundaries

is that you kind of get a sense pretty quickly. That's a great way of explaining growing up in a middle-ish, I think I'm more upper middle, I don't want to lie to you, class Jewish family. It's a lack of boundaries. Sorry to cut you off, by the way. I think it's great.

It's your show. You think the lack of boundaries is great? I think growing up in a place, I think it's a fine line. I would equate it to getting antibodies. Interesting. Okay, I'll talk you through that but it seemed like though the your parents are loud my mom is loud but my mom is loud in a way where it works because she's so kind to where it's loud kind i've gotten better

over the years yeah i came into some some pretty big self-awareness almost four years ago now, but my loudness was very attention-seeking and aggressive without knowing it. And my mom's loud is just wanting to help people and maybe they need to hear me. So the boundary issue was my mom was loud, but everyone loved her, including everyone in the family. Your dad? everyone loved her including my everyone in the family and my your dad my dad is uh you know he sold cornbread in his in his uh jokes under under his breath all right but what's his what's his boundarylessness look like um the boundary list is more i guess i guess it's my mom um so she you know everybody everyone had to react to her. You know, I'm figuring this out with you, so could I change and add to my answer?

Let me collect myself. We'll be right back. That's against the rules. Yeah, I'll bend the rules this time. Thank you. You can change and add to your answer now. Because, yeah, you know to i'm trying to define something when i really only could know it through my eyes from then so just trying to think of that is my brother would be uh my brother would you know i am the way i am and things need to be a certain

way and clean and yeah my brother would be uh he played sports and he's outside in the mud ironically enough getting some antibodies and he would find a mike and ike in the dirt and eat it to get a laugh right and he would come in and he'd have some dirt under the fingernails he's a boy he plays you get dirty yeah sure eat mike and ike's out of the dirt sure or maybe a razzle or a skittle but it was a mike and i was a mike and i was one of the two at least sure and uh we would have m&ms on the counter as like decorative but people you know you eat m&ms And my brother liked the way. Yes. Yeah. My brother would like the way M&M's feel

going between his fingers. Sure. Because if, you know, listen. Feels good. Yeah, it's like a waterfall. Sure, something. But they're not his waterfalls. Well.

So my brother's got dirt in his fingers. He's touching all the M&M's. He's eating out of the cereal. He's eating on the chips. And the cereal too? Yeah, cereal boxes. And digging for the prize of it. Yeah, I guess.

Okay. I wasn't one who needed the prize. Yeah, I know. And I'm sorry if that was a joke you were making. No one needs the prize. But uh he yeah i guess i wasn't one who needed the prize yeah i'm sorry if that was a joke you were making no one needs the prize but you want to get it out i want to have cereal that doesn't have dirt in it so i'm now i'm now sitting on the couch feeling like i'm forced to keep inventory and watch and i started to only eat the cereals that my brother didn't like right and i felt like out of i didn't have control over the things i wanted because i was limited while i was building this resentment of watching my brother and i i don't want to say bad stuff he's a kid he's a little boy but his brother stuff it's fine we share a bathroom yeah pisses on the on the towels he pissed on the towels the cat pissed

on the towels if he left the towel down oh the cat pissed on the towels but your brother probably just pissed on the rim of the toilet, mostly. If he even hit the toilet. But I got to tell you something, he's changed. You got to check out the Greyhound. It really is delicious and clean. Yeah, I don't know why I'm uncomfortable about this.

It feels like I'm talking, I am. I'm literally talking about someone. But I like the idea that you brought up about growing up in a boundaryless home gives you antibodies to what? i'll tell you what um i mean i like the idea and i'm just wondering if we can flesh it out yeah so much like germs you could get too much and get sick of it you don't want to have no boundaries because then you don't you need to learn them and i think that the only reason, any success I have in my life is because of the combination

of, of knowing that I have to stop somewhere, but, but being liquid with other people's boundaries. Huh? Um, right. You know, when you come over in a similar way, you said if, if, if Larry King acted a certain way, you would then have to mirror that. But at the same time, it is your interview and you're in control. And if you were to come over and I snap for you putting on a fake mustache and you're

not into it and I don't recognize your boundary, it's game over. But if I assume your boundary based on how I've been conditioned people's boundaries are, I wouldn't be able to push it that far. So by being comfortable in testing boundaries and playing with boundaries and experimenting with them, you run the risk of stepping over them at times sure but you also learn how to not stay so tight into what you think comfortable is right and uh part of this awareness that i've come into that i'm super grateful for is making people uncomfortable making myself uncomfortable it's an operational cost of doing what we do um but it's not about making people uncomfortable that making myself uncomfortable it's an operational cost of doing what we do

um but it's not about making people uncomfortable that is the problem in my opinion it's about recognizing it fast enough and deciding why you're doing it yeah i mean well right so you're talking about stand-up in terms of what we do but i think no i mean that very interpersonally okay but also stand-up yeah like i'm tracking what you're saying specifically to stand up because stand up is something because i often try to figure out why exactly i chose that my childhood really what i was trying to overcome and what terrified me more than anything was being embarrassed i didn't want to be embarrassed. And my mother used to embarrass me. I found my parents embarrassing.

And I always felt embarrassed. And I was terrified of being embarrassed. So somehow, and neither one of them had boundaries. But it was different. It wasn't so much yelling as much as it was emotional indecisiveness. So it was kind of floaty. You know what I mean? No discipline.

No real principles. not much guidance. Everybody was just sort of, it was amoebic, the family unit. So you didn't know where you were at any given moment emotionally? Self-wise. Right. talking about this immunity to figuring out, because if you have no boundaries or you grow up in a fairly boundaryless place, that means you probably get hurt often early on, right? Because of the sensitivity of that. And then all of a sudden you get reactive. So either you're going to be defensive or hostile or preemptive to be defensive, right? But conversely, it does enable you to absorb people in a different and more all immersive way. And once you get the hang of that, you can sort of dictate the the intimacy of the situation quicker than most people and also have it be relatively inappropriate quicker than most people. And then you have to navigate that yeah so being that makes sense yeah uh being inappropriate making somebody uncomfortable uh not being connected with somebody you know there's only so much we control and i i

really believe it's more than most people think and in terms of interpersonal relations yeah and it really comes down yeah you can do it until the other person gets tired of it. That could take years. Well, yeah, I guess if they get tired of it. But people's feelings are heavily based on subconscious expectations or maybe conscious, but at the least expectations. Mitigating expectations is the key to understanding somebody's boundaries because a true boundary isn't about expectation. It's about where they feel safe and comfortable. So sometimes they could be uncomfortable because an they feel safe and comfortable. Right. So sometimes they could be uncomfortable because an expectation is not being met. Right.

I got a diagnosis four years ago that I had ASD level one, which is commonly known as Asperger's syndrome. Yeah. Which is a funny word. Yeah. Asperger's. And I made a dick on an ass eating a burger no huh no interesting but if this were my podcast you just thought of that now no i've been sitting on it um and uh after that diagnosis i i i've learned a lot about

i had to go to i don't know how much time we have if it's worth getting into, but I went to a lot of special classes, special schools, kicked out. Four years ago? In grade school and high school. So before you knew you were Asperger's 1. I was diagnosed with a whole bunch of different things as a kid. The ADD, the ADHD, the OCD, learning disability, which isn't a specific diagnosis. How did that manifest itself? Because you must have been-

Which one? Any of them. Like, well, what was the symptoms of why were you seen as a problem? What weren't you doing or what were you doing? Well, hyperactive, asking a lot of questions. Asking questions to where teachers thought I was making fun. Wow.

Not understanding. So your earnestness was mistaken for sarcasm? And I developed a sarcasm in a way to try and control how people see me. If you're going to think that I'm not, let me at least try and make it funny. Let me find new ways of asking questions or trying to explain myself until things work.

I never picked up on social cues. I didn't know that I wasn't picking up on them. But Asperger's is different than autism right um asper no it's so uh clinically they've they've uh asperger's is no longer a definition anymore it's asperger it's autism level one okay uh so asd level one two and three so asperger's is level one um what's level two uh more challenges What's level two? More challenges. Are you hoping to get there?

No. Okay. No. Can I try to untangle something? Yeah. What's the intention behind the joke of wanting to get there? Oh, because it's like when you think of levels. Oh, so like two is better than- Right.

Gotcha. It wasn't like then you'll have like a bigger niche to explore? No. No, that was where you went with your insecurity. yeah mine was a number joke you went deeper that's why yeah it wasn't insecurity i i i've talked about it on my podcast maybe five of them i i do get insecure talking about it because of what people's understanding or lack of of what uh autism is and i find myself either becoming a spokesperson for something that I can't be or defending a diagnosis that has changed my life for the better because people think it is

something that it's not necessarily. Well, I think like what's interesting to me is, is that you've learned how to utilize and understand your, uh, your compulsive and also your earnest curiosity, which I think as a symptom, I imagine, of the autism would be overwhelming to some people. But you understand it enough to be charming in it and also see the humor in it. You have enough self-awareness around it that you don't feel uncomfortable with it and you can make it funny even yeah i yeah yeah it's it's uh not only do i not feel uncomfortable with it when i got the diagnosis it validated so many things of my past oh my god if i had known that i wouldn't have done that more so this is that, and it's not my fault, and or I could understand how to improve upon it. I've got to go apologize to some teachers.

And ask people who should apologize to me to come on my podcast. But I bring that up because one of the things I learned was how much, and any neurotypical person I'm sure could relate to this. We think something, so we assume the other person thinks it. You are sharing the same point. If I'm cold, you're cold. If I'm feeling this isn't going well, you are. That's not true, though. Of course it's not true.

But I'm saying that mindset of not recognizing that there's other perspectives. A common symptom of autism is challenging to adapt to certain situations and an inability or difficulty to recognize that people think differently than you. It's why people get, it's why they get frustrated so often or why they seem to lack empathy because... Autistic people. Yeah. Okay. And I, one of the things

that I've been, I guess maybe the biggest thing I've been focusing on and where this podcast has been such a blessing for me uh is being able to ask people I mean in a small way asking you what was the intention behind that joke right I would always ask questions like that but it could seem aggressive if I were to say what's your point what do you mean I'm always trying to understand uh so when I found these things out and then i was single and i was dating i was able to make jokes but they were very um inspired uh i smoke weed and i like to smoke pot uh when you're on a date especially if it's somebody who smokes right and to be able to say to somebody

preemptively right i get a little goofy you know and right Right. And sometimes I don't know when I go a little far. Yeah. So I'd like to ask of you, if you're ever feeling like this is a little bit too much and you don't know how to handle it, give me the benefit of the doubt and just like nudge me. When did you decide that comedy was somehow the answer for you?

So I was telling you earlier, I didn't know that I didn't pick up on facial cues and I didn't recognize people's hints. They would say, not today, Rick. I'm busy. To friends, I would just think, oh, he can't today. He's busy for three years. Right.

But something I always did understand was a laugh. I knew a laugh was comfortable because not only is it nice to get a laugh for the obvious reasons, it was one of the few times where I felt confident in being on the same page with somebody. It wasn't just with me making them laugh, if we were laughing together. What did Harry Scherer say to me? The reason people do comedy is you can control why people are laughing at you. I like that.

Yeah, and on a more specific level, you can control how people feel about you for a minute. Because even somebody who doesn't like you- So I'll laugh a minute. Maybe you can control it for 10, 15 seconds a minute. Because even somebody who doesn't like you. Go on and laugh a minute. Maybe you can control it for like 10, 15 seconds and then you gotta keep going. Yeah, but the dopamine lasts longer than the laugh. Sure. Put that on a shirt.

Then the door is open. Yeah. Got it. And then that's why you keep doing it and you seek it. And it's a vicious cycle. And then eventually people go like, do you always have to be funny? And then all of a sudden you're in a different conversation. Yeah.

Do you always have to be on? Is the all of a sudden you're in a different conversation, aren't you? Yeah. Do you always have to be on is the one I get. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I was shut down. I was trampled by a couple of girlfriends way back with the sort of – because, like, when you're a comic, it's your profession. So there's sort of like that weird black beltism to it. Like, you know, I'm black belted getting laughs, but I can't use it in public. I can only do it on stage professionally.

But I don't think it was funny, but I've had girlfriends early on who were like, why do you have to talk so much when we're out with boys? Why do you have to domineer the conversation? It struck me. What have you figured out since then? Why do you have to? I don't.

I stopped a long time ago. I mean, I think the reason it stuck with me, it was correct. And it really wasn't my nature. It was overcompensating. Yeah. Yeah. It's annoying when people do that. Be careful of letting other people's definition of your identity distinguish between the difference of overcompensating and just being and compensating

because she's not wrong but she might be the wrong person it's a long time ago well i'll speak for me i appreciate the advice well when you know i have to find the different when somebody thinks i'm being something that they don't like they're not wrong but it doesn't mean i don't like it and that doesn't mean that it's not me or it's not you yeah yeah it's like it could be it could be as simple as like well you must not like me right and that's okay yeah now get the fuck out of my house but how what is the what is the this that's a little aggressive i apologize no no it's okay because it's hypothetical person yeah but how it's it's finding that difference it's knowing when to untangle of this person doesn't like this part of me, but this is who I am.

And do I like this who I am? And also, is she right about what I'm doing right now or is this part of me? Right. Because sometimes when you're with somebody, you're doing something that isn't innately you because you're trying to accommodate them or charm them or impress them. I get the most uncomfortable when I find myself doing that. Yeah. That's a big challenge of podcasting sometimes that happens and at least for me yeah um i'm proud to say for better and for worse i am who i am most the time but sometimes i find myself in a situation where i'm trying either trying for the person trying for the audience trying for the the post-production animation right but when i'm not present and i'm trying something i catch it that's when i get

embarrassed let's get out of the head for a minute and get into into real life so you you we understand how you understood that you liked getting laughs so what was where'd you start doing comedy in cleveland cleveland yeah and where hilarities the first stand-up set I did was at the Cleveland Improv, and I was doing improvisation theater as well. Oh, you were part of a group. Uh-huh. I was part of theirs. They weren't,

I don't know if they would have thought that. I do remember feeling just like a lot of groups. I felt like I was forcing my way in. So wait, so they were a group, and then they were improvising, and you would just jump in? They were a team they they held uh once what's that two of them there

was i don't know like eight oh big eight people one team sure and they had like they had practices every week yeah so their performance they had a performance every week and a practice every week the team did the performances there were more people and i was one of the one in the practice yeah and i would just you know show up and do some improv comedy. And uh. But you liked that? I loved it. That was what I was doing for the first four or five years

before standup took priority. And when did you start doing standup? April, no March 4th 2007. Like when did you start wearing the t-shirt about being a paid regular? Oh, I'm Not Passed at the Comedy Store sweatshirt. I made that over Thanksgiving. Oh, recently. Yeah.

Oh, okay. I'm Not Passed at the Comedy Store was a conversation that happened on one of the episodes, and then people would bring it up. Why isn't he passed or whatever? In nice ways it was they were nice things but it wasn't an identity of mine by any means um sort of a joke shirt uh yeah but but then it was like uh you know everybody isn't passed somewhere um they have their hurdles or obstacles but but here in this town the the weird sort of like being passed at

the comedy yeah it's like the cellar there's like getting passed at the cellar in New York. Yeah. Like there's like, you know. There's two types of comedians. Yeah. Passed at the cellar, not passed. Passed at the store,

not passed. Oh, you're passed? Do you want to come do my, do you want to come do my podcast? Hey, you should get Rick Glassman on it. Is he passed at the store? Is he? I don't know.

Is he funny? I don't know what his status at the store is. I think he does bringer shows. Uh-huh. Yeah, there's a stigma. There's a stigma to doing bringer shows, and then there's a stigma to not being passed.

But what about the alt scene? You weren't part of the alt scene? I don't know if I'm being hard on myself, but I don't know if I'm part of any scene. I just, you know, I got on a television show a few years ago, and it was... How did he find you? Who's he?

Bill. The improv. Bill Lawrence found you at the improv? Yeah. You were doing stand-up i was doing a will smith impression and this was like for those people who don't know who i'm talking to it's rick glassman i'm resetting like we're on radio uh welcome back rick glassman is my guest and you might have known he was on the show undateable which was on for three seasons three seasons then canceled for reasons that a lot of people don't understand cut to a clip of us just having a meltdown on set just racist meltdown uh yeah bill bill saw me on a racist meltdown yeah i feel like if uh if oh i see i see i got that's a joke that didn't really happen no like just to say why would no one knows

why i got canceled cut to just well you got canceled for the reason everything gets canceled not enough people were watching it yeah all right yeah but it was you and dalia and funches and then brent moran yeah moran yeah yeah bill saw me i was doing some weird stuff yeah and he said um i like how comfortable you are in uncomfortable moments and that's sort of your place that's your thing that's your hook uh yeah is that an anti-semitic remark no not i'll have nothing to do with your nose i there's uh we have more to do with that's what you're known for hey man i just made everything uncomfortable but i'm gonna sit in it for a while make you guys love me yeah you know uh that's the part where the podcast has helped me as i never wanted to make people uncomfortable that's just a symptom of the joke

you know is that true though yeah 100 i always want people to be in on it with me i just can't wink to them and say hey because then it doesn't work anymore yeah but but that but that goes back to this sort of idea that everybody sort of knows where you're at yeah that's why that's why it's not a flawless art form they don't know where i'm at i have to find ways of telling that of showing them without telling dude we're you know we're gonna we're gonna end up where you know you and i sort of first met that's where we're gonna end up okay with with what we're talking about right now i don't know if it's the come down or just the conversation but i don't know how i feel right now what What's the matter? I don't know. I can't tell if I'm insecure about talking too much

or not saying the right things. Did the bottom just fall out on you? It didn't fall out, but I'm realizing, oh, it's not cement. Really? Oh, no, no, no. Everything's going good. Don't, don't, don't, don't.

Ron Perlman. I almost lost Ron Perlman on here. He had a heart attack no he just he just fell into an insecure hole for a minute and and it was touch and go ah i don't know if this is an insecure i think this is just cost of doing business it's an energy thing yeah i don't know i'm not buying it can i tell you can i tell you where part of it comes from i'm i'm aware of it what you just exhaled the same way my doctor did before he told me he doesn't like when i come in by the way let me tell you this quick story how often do you go in i i ask a lot of questions okay yeah i would go to the doctor a lot yeah i would get std checks even if i hadn't had sex

since the last time i got one because i was in the doctor's office i dude i i am a recovering hypochondriac I understand your plight I was asking my doctor I had shoulder surgery and I asked my doctor a question about my shoulder He's not my shoulder doctor But he's a doctor and I'm there and I got some inflammation issues I got a question doc And he goes what you just did

He went And I said it seems like you don't really like When I come in here And he said when i come to the door and i see your name is on the clipboard i do take a breath and i said i said am i i said i spend no more than 10 minutes at a time with you he goes yeah but there's too many questions yeah um a year later i get this autism diagnosis i go back to him you'm basically, you know, like twirling my watch. Yeah.

Hello, doctor. Guess what? Guess what I found out? He apologized and he said, that makes so much sense. And since then, I don't see this doctor anymore, but I did for another year plus. And he was so nice to me. And he was talking to me about baseball. I don't watch baseball. I'm not interested in baseball.

Basketball is your thing, right? Yeah, but I also, basketball only only but not so much to where your mother's football right my grandma oh it's your grandma is football my mom is andy griffith okay but yeah he was just so nice and there is a perfect luck of course yeah okay um of example of expectation where i'm the same guy asking the same questions but now this guy thinks i'm you know whatever he thinks autism is so now he's like hey man did you see the the the i couldn't even think of a baseball the dodgers like he likes numbers the autistic guys he likes stats yeah well just take my blood and tell me what i have going on with my dick wow never had any stds did you i've had you know little things

little things here and there that you know not Nothing that a pill didn't take care of Oh good Really? Here's where we animate my dick from 2014 Coughing explaining We have to understand it was a different time Yeah sure But you're still with the girl who lives in England?

Yeah Is she in England? She's in Australia now She's a dual citizen Her family lives in Australia. And boy, her arm's tired after she traveled. Sure. Because she had to fly there.

Yeah. Back to the guy who's like, no, it's working. It's way back. It's called back. I get it, man. These guys are pros. When did you move here, though? 2008.

So you came out here to do comedy, kind of. Came out here to act. I didn't know if it was comedy, but I had- Had you done any acting training other than the yeah, I did theater theater in college You did marketing in theater marketing in theater. So it's working out for you I'm on I'm on Marc Maron's what the fuck podcast talking about acting did yeah, and you did a TV show And I got a show coming out later. You're selling yourself. Yeah with dicks and goblins Did you hear that? I got a show coming out this year. It's gonna get to it. I'm a pro So what's this show you have coming out?

Writing down, ask what the show. It's a Jason Kadam show that he did, Parenthood and Friday Night Lights. Oh. He's brilliant. Yeah. And there's an Israeli show called On the Spectrum. Yeah.

And they're remaking it for Amazon. I don't know if it's going to be called On the Spectrum. Yeah. And they're remaking it for Amazon. I don't know if it's going to be called On the Spectrum. What's that about? It's about a couple of football players who just fuck girls all day, every day. Weird name for a show about that. It's three autistic roommates who are finding ways of learning how to live life independently with jobs. Don't they have like a reality dating show for autism? Oh, man.

Yeah. It's an Australian show called, I don't remember. Something Spectrum, I think. And why'd you go, oh man? Because it's a great show and I don't remember the name of it. Oh, you like the show? I love it. Why don't you get someone to get you the rights and you can host the American version?

I don't want to host it. Okay? Yeah. Can we move past the hosting? I'm just pitching. I'm just pitching, man. Ideas, man. I'm worried about your career it. Okay? Yeah. Can we move past the hosting? I'm just pitching. I'm just pitching, man. I'm just pitching ideas, man. I'm worried about your career.

Are you? No. So what's the, what's this Spectrum show? Did you already shoot it? We filmed the pilot and we start filming the series in March. That's great. So you're going to be on an Amazon show. Yeah.

Called On the Spectrum. They might change the name, so. To what? Football and Chicks. but who's the other actors um uh joe montagna plays my dad i like that guy uh sosi bacon uh plays my caregiver and uh there's a there's a few people that um there's two the uh the the uh other two autistic actors are, all three of us are somewhere on the spectrum. Yeah. And I don't really know them from before.

I don't know what type of experiences they have. But I mean, what was the experience being with them, the three of you? I talked to Jason when we were filming during one of the scenes about, the same insecurity I told you about. What are you looking at? I just look at, I get hung up on levels.

No, no, I get obsessed with like, I don't want it to pop to me. I'm fine. It's just a habit. Sorry, I'm with you. I get distracted when someone looks away. You talk to Jason. I talk to Jason because I'm playing a character,

but I was also chosen cast because of my life experiences. Yeah. And how much do I bring who I am to this character versus how much am I taking on the character that they've written for me? And there's a line between the two where I feel I'm making assumptions that make me feel like, am I being a spokesperson for this thing? Am I creating this character that is inauthentic? And that's what acting is. And you have to do the research for it but there's something there's something because this is still a relatively

new diagnosis for me where there is an insecurity and an identity to it where I feel like I have to really understand it before I could because there's a there's a really big responsibility this show is beautiful it it's beautiful it's it's you know it's Jason Kadams it's one of the ones that you can probably you know cry at every episode at some beautiful. It's, you know, it's Jason Kadams. It's one of the ones that you can probably, you know, cry at every episode at some point. And it's also, you know, I don't take on this responsibility, but the show has a responsibility of educating what this is and can be and some of the obstacles. Destigmatizing. Yes.

And through that show, I then become. I just did a classic Larry King. What? By packaging something? The one word. Destigmatizing. Uh-huh. Yeah.

And so I have this responsibility to be part of something, and I don't want to lie, but also I'm playing a character. Right. It gets tough. Well, maybe you should not think about it so much. Yeah. There's a line between not thinking about versus not prepping and putting in the work right i guess but if you're doing a good job does he

think you're doing a good job who's to say until he laughs i don't know how he feels but he said i am and i think and i connect with the character very strongly so i think i am well i mean how much of what you do is just weird kind of being hard on yourself you know and you know uh part of the issue i feel like your cadence forced the second part i don't know i mean what's the difference you can make choices around being hard on yourself maybe i'll get better at it but i'm pretty comfortable knowing that that that it's it's not as i am hard hard on myself sometimes, but I have accepted that this is going to sound so ridiculous and I don't mean this as a joke.

I'm excited. I have realized that I'm not perfect. Wait, what? I realize that people aren't perfect. Wait. It took me a while. Come on.

Could you connect with me for a second and try to understand what i mean by that because when you look at people you it's easier to uh accept other people's flaws because you've accepted them as opposed to your own where you're mad that you have them so when you've accepted somebody else's flaws it doesn't take away from their perfection yeah when lebron misses a shot it doesn't mean he's not perfect that's part of what it is yeah because i i don't accept anyone's flaws i'm always judging and i like a lot of times i'm just sort of like that's sad yeah and i hope that person's okay and that's why people are scared to have you over on their podcast for the first time but then you prove them wrong yeah i but but it's like it's just natural and then you just get to know the

person as they are they're not perfect but they are who they are yeah what does perfect mean um i just know i could be three pounds wider i think i i think the closest to perfect means uh acceptance of who you are and uh a fair amount of awareness to recognize where you can change and if you can right um and also knowing your limitations yeah yeah so if i'm if i'm cast in a role where like this one where i feel it's built for me to shine if you can. Right. And also knowing your limitations. Yeah. Yeah. So if I'm cast in a role where, like this one, where I feel it's built for me to shine, Yeah. my limitations are going to be a lot greater

than if I'm on Undateable where that's not necessarily my wheelhouse, that character. Because it's a caricature. It's a caricature. It's limited. It's very limited, both in attempts of jokes

the type of joke and it's just a one-line you're a joke machine yeah uh yeah and it was in a style that at the time though i'm still not built for it i i i didn't understand it yeah i felt like i was used to i'm used to driving to the hole and then i got a job where i'm supposed to take take screens and that's an important job but i i wanted to do other things yeah um and this has more range to it this is it actually embraces your nature yeah and i under i mean i've literally been spending four years researching it and understanding it and and and seeing these these i now have autistic friends and i know autistic people but i don't have autistic friends before this show. That you know of.

That I know of, yeah. That talk about their experiences through the lens of autism and their obstacles and strengths. And now I'm literally in a room with these people for hours talking about it and asking questions, and they're asking questions. I love questions. And finding patterns between our personalities and finding things that I realize, is this aick thing or is this an autism thing are those different does that matter um great is this a neurotypical thing is this a jewish thing yeah and it's just open it and you're hoping that eventually you'll you'll come out the other side of it going i i'm fully integrated what i want to come out the other side is is believing something that is whether it's real or not,

which is I'm special back to that thing again, like a lot of the, the not being included and, and the, and the, the negative experiences I had in my life, the special schools and such. Didn't that make you feel special?

No, it made me feel, it made me feel less than different, which, which you say you're in a bad way. Yes. Got it. Where your fear

and uh and um where you work to to avoid is embarrassment mine is uh not being good enough i mean it's the same thing but just a different place in our mind i have that too uh that's part of it this i'm sorry it's okay you're doing great thanks this diagnosis offered me uh a perception of all of those things were supposed to be and it's not that I'm not good enough it's that I have obstacles but you know I could do a lot of things great too and that's where that perfect thing comes from where all those shots I missed I realized oh you're you know maybe you should be playing a different sport or sure it's okay to miss or whatever it might be yeah so that's special that that feeling everybody make light of it literally yeah yeah i mean i know enough about myself at this age to

know that when i do this sort of self-hatred or expectations or perfectionist saying that it's ridiculous but there's something comforting about it because i've been doing it so fucking long because you you you uh procured aick. No, no, it's just, it's even older than that. It's really like, you know, kind of like home base. Yeah. You know what I mean?

Like joy is weird to me because I don't know how to experience it. So when I do experience it, I'm like, this is weird and terrible. And, you know, like even when I look good or I'm at a good weight or I'm healthy, I'm sort of like, I'm not good enough. You know, like, but I know it's bullshit and it doesn't matter who my judging.

I'm not even I'm not out in the world right now. I'm not even doing television and I'm fucking beating myself up over four pounds. You said something to me. I texted you last week about coming back on my podcast to talk about embarrassment and how to get past certain feelings in a moment. I did. Yeah. And you said something to me that I loved. I was asking what, I wanted to listen to some of your podcasts where you felt, coincidentally,

as the Larry King one posted, where you felt embarrassed, uncomfortable, not in the pocket and tools to avoid and acknowledge. And amongst some other texts, you said, there's been many moments, but who cares? They're real and they're human and we all have them. And i i knew that already it was articulated in a way packaged that was like yeah that's you you miss yeah that's great you miss shots sure we had like nine during this conversation did we no you brought you brought attention to all of them i brought oh fuck yeah now 10 yeah exactly i also gotta let know, I feel great again with you. It's cool to be here.

It's cool to be doing your podcast. I knew it would come around. And yeah, it did. I had complete confidence that we were going to pull you out of it, whatever the fuck happened to. But that was like, when I first met you, this was my experience. I know we've talked about it before. I didn't really know you. I knew you were on the show.

I had no idea that you were on the spectrum. But you didn't know you were on the spectrum when you did Unbeatable. Oh, no, no, no. I did when I did stand-up, but I wasn't talking about it. Right. But what I did is I walked up to the belly room. Sometimes I go up there in between my spots in the real rooms as a past person. Were you feeling insecure there or were you bullying me?

No. No, I'm just saying I went up to the belly room. Which I do sometimes. Which I do sometimes in between sets because I'm past at the comedy store and I can do sets

in the real room. You passed at the cellar too? I passed at the cellar. It took me eight years though. It took me a long time to pass at the cellar. Yeah, well I'm 12 and I used to answer phones there.

You used to cellar? At the store. You used to answer phones there and you didn't get the, I answered phones there. Yeah. store? You used to answer phones there? And you didn't get the... I answered phones there. Yeah. Once Tommy got the boot. Oh, it was harder. You were on the Tommy trajectory? I was on the Tommy trajectory.

Anyway. So I go up to the bell room. I'm just being a dick. And I see you, and I kind of know you. I hadn't seen your stand-up that I remembered. And there you were with a bag. And in my mind, I'm like, he's a bag guy bad guy he's got a bag i know there's an act in that bag and i prejudged and then you went up with your judge is a prejudge just you judged so prejudge isn't a word uh it's assumed it's it's what's the difference between prejudged and judged i feel like a prejudge is

like putting a one in front of the x it works works, but... I mean, you could make a calculated judgment after you met me to assume you know more, but it's still a judgment. Right. Okay, fine. So I judged, based on the bag, that you were going to take things out of the bag for your stand-up routine. That's more of a deduction. Fine. But no, because I don't have great feelings about bags.

Yeah. And stand-up. Take my ex-wife. Yeah. Boom boom you have an ex-wife oh he doesn't but let's carry on do you not technically no but you know it's a space holder okay fine you were never married no so it's a joke yeah it was the arms tired got it level joke i got it i figured edit this part out. Go on. Just put in a Marshall Rudd commercial during the last four minutes. But then you go up with your bag and you start doing the bag bit. You know, like here's a thing

and here's another thing. I'm putting a hat on. I remember. Then there's a puppet that you explained to me was from the Undateable show that you kept and you used in your act.

But to me, my problem was is like all these guys who do the bag routine, there's not a lot of them. But there have been- It's a tough act. Right. But there have been-

Any generation has got the guy who's got the bag. And any generation has the guy who sits down and he's upset and angry. About the bag. About somebody that they prejudged. Right. Yeah. About everything. Yeah.

Yeah. It's much more common to have the guy who sits down and he's angry than it is the bad guy. Which my point is, is that because bad guys think they're special. But my point in judging- And angry guys are upset that they're not. Maybe. No, I don't know if that's true. I think angry guys think they have something to say.

Okay. Yeah. But the crank is- I was never really- some guys are natural cranks and they're funny. You're not a natural crank? It took me a long time. I was actually angry, which is less entertaining. Okay. But it's just speaking to your desire to be seen as special.

And I think that bad guys, you know, going back to Kaufman or anybody, even Len schultz uh who but there's a different type of bad guy you're doing a conceptual bit you have a there's an intelligence to it you're not just a prop act uh thank you yeah um in fact i avoided props for a long time out of insecurity that you would be judged by me by but that i wouldn't be able to translate the the irony um that you weren't doing props for real well well not listen if you do props for real and you're good at it more power to you that's not what my craft is so i would be faking it right but there are so many funny things you could do with props because of the built-in expectations to props the feeling you had right and i didn't want to do it because then you got to travel with them and you become a prop guy and but then i realized what do i care

if it gets a laugh but anyway go on no but then you went up and you did it and you you know i i was i i think i went on and mocked you I'm sure your memory of this is crystal clear. My memory of it is, yeah, go on. And then, but later, like, I did find, there was something I liked about you because you were earnest. You liked about me from the set? Yeah, but didn't I apologize to you?

The next day, and I still don't, even after our podcast, I still don't know how you got my number or people make fun of me all the time. I have Asperger's. No, I'm just kidding about the making fun because of that. Nobody has texted me and apologized the next day. And it's almost as if, you know, it was Stockholm syndrome.

It's not that, but it's almost as if if you being mean and then apologizing after made you more likable than had you not done anything to begin with. There's also something to the fact that when you were mean to me, I crushed that set. I don't know if you remember. And I don't crush that often. That just... Right. If I'm doing eight minutes or less, I could do really well.

Yeah. And I had a great set so i didn't feel that your judgments or pre-judgments and your your anger yeah was it based on you bombing yeah or me is or more specifically based on me as a performer it was me being an insecure dick trying to follow a mess and make the you know to take a shot at you on the way out so i could get my first laugh the first three i'm not sure it worked uh you did about to take a shot at you on the way out so I could get my first laugh. The first three. I'm not sure it worked. You did about, you did probably five, seven minutes on me in a less than 15 minute set. And the first three minutes, not only was I flattered, it was funny.

Yeah. It was like, because I just did well. Yeah. Now he's calling to attention the oddities. So you could then set the stage for your different thing. You're basically, it's just a tool of changing expectation. I'm not going to come up here and pull my dick out and have a puppet. I'm going to sit on a chair and complain. Did you pull your dick out?

No. Did I complain? I guess I complained. Here's Mark Maron. He's well established. He's passed it. It's Comedy Store and The Cellar. He's talking about me.

This is great. Minute four, it's like, all right,'s let's all right now do your do your stuff you know and then minute seven was like all right i don't know if he's riding the wave but you were being a little yeah you were being mean i my feelings weren't hurt but i i didn't understand what you were doing yeah and i didn't i didn't go home sad i I didn't think much of it. I think it became a broader conversation about guys who do that. Yeah. Right. And I think that also unlocked something for you, which was you were making comedy associations.

And kind of like what you said here, there's always, you said, I've been doing this for however long. A million years. And you said, there's always one of that. Right. And that made me laugh because that's funny. And also, oh, there's only one of that? Exactly. Well, that's the point.

That's what got us here is the specialness. But then you texted me. You apologized. You used too many big words. And I thought that was really- You don't have that anymore in your phone? They delete after a year. But I have the screen grab somewhere.

That's okay. And it's on my podcast, if i if i'm plugging something else watch our podcast um i do get messages about it often i tag you sometimes how much people really like that one and they get to see you in a way that like seeing you silly like that yeah um right well i felt bad because like you know there there's something about not carrying that stuff with me you know i'm trying to figure out like why you know like i think i knew i went too far in a way not that you would have would have mattered to you necessarily but um i just felt like i was it was just one of those things where i was just mean i was just being like a bully or something yeah it was to your credit it was uh obviously an act like you were you were trying to be funny yeah and you were for most of it yeah um you were funny enough for all of it right um but yeah it did get to a point to where it's like the intention behind it was as you said feeling insecure about right

you know whatever it might have been for you right um but had we ran into each other a month later and had a conversation in the hallway there would have been nothing nothing that you did would have made me be like squinting my eyes at you you know it's just yeah it happens all the time but no but you would have it would have sort of uh implanted even deeper the idea that like oh yeah yeah, Mark's a cranky fuck and you know, he's going to come to my house. He's going to be cranky and it's going to be, I wouldn't have asked you to come on had you not sent me the message.

Right. I wouldn't have felt that there was any connection between us. Not that there couldn't be, but there wasn't one. That's true. So, you know, I just been reaching out because you have a successful podcast and will you

help me bring numbers in or whatever the superficial reason would be. That's the only reason i'm having you on uh trying to get that youtube audience yeah um but like i said people shit on me all the time my friend it's part of you know part of what we do it's part of what we do and you have to acknowledge the room and you didn't do anything i didn't feel like you crossed a line you just stood on it a little longer than you needed to um and that's a performance note and that's a performance note and that's yeah that's just a critique of like when in doubt just cap it at 180 seconds but that message to me was like uh because also you didn't have my number it wasn't just a fuck i got a message you had to ask somebody yeah like you and and it was the next day so you thought

about it and i just thought that that was just forget you being mean or not mean or funny or funny enough whatever it might be it was i think it was me waking up and thinking like you know i think you're too old to be threatened by a puppet well me being threatened by a puppet is the only reason i use one let me ask you a question. Now that our friendship is getting to the point to... My doctor. Listen, I'm not a shoulder doctor, Rick. I have autism, Mark. Oh, my God. Do you like sports?

Yeah. Yeah. How do we piggyback your guests to then, on their way home, come over to do mine? Oh, boy. Well, I mean, no one's coming over anymore except for yeah comics for some reason the only people that come over are comics of your generation is that because you feel comfortable with them or they feel comfortable with you no it's just they're willing to do it right uh you know i don't know like i've gotten

to the point like if you have it i probably got it if i got it you probably have it but i feel we both safe enough but i was getting tested like every fucking two weeks for a while yeah um I definitely make assumptions based on people's the the projection I have of their lifestyle yeah whether or not I'm comfortable with that thing yeah I'm I'm I'm nervous all the time anyways um that's why I do mine on the balcony I have my guests on the balcony I open the windows and we're safe. We're separated and there's the glass here, but who the fuck knows? It'll be all right. Okay. Oh, yes. So, sure.

I will let people know that you do a podcast and it's on a balcony. Why don't I just tell them to watch this show? Yeah, but I'm not talking about your audience. I'm talking about your guests. No, I know, I know. Bring it up for the next... What if you did a segment for the next,

I don't know, for the rest of the year? Yeah. That's a long time. January. Until the end of 2022, whenever you want. And you say something where it's like- Why don't you print up some cards for me and I can just hand them to the people. Sure.

Like Rick Glassman, take your shoes off. Yeah. And then make a little picture of you and a goblin cock in the balcony. Uh-huh. And say like, you know, if you want to talk to this guy, you think that will do it? No,

I think it's a horrible sell. And also I only had 45 seconds to do it before it becomes gratuitous. So I'm going to just text you after and tell you how to get me Obama. Good talking to you, buddy. Thanks. You too, man.

Rick Glassman. man rick glassman that was a a lot of self-awareness around autism it turned out to be an educational powerful talk empowering and uh eye-opening both to those of us who don't have autism and people who have autism it's sort of an inspirational story, the Rick Glassman story, which I'm writing right now. All right, you guys, look, maybe it was a weird one. Maybe it was. Maybe I'm weird today, but it's better than being sad, isn't it? Weird is better than sad. Now let's play some sad music. Let's go down to the continent, okay? God, when can we run again? And I mean away. guitar solo Boomer lives. Lafonda, monkey, flying. flying, cat angels, cat angels everywhere. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing.

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