WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1239 - Quentin Tarantino

Episode Date: June 28, 2021

The pandemic forced a lot of changes on all of us, but for Quentin Tarantino, he was already undergoing a huge change right as the pandemic started: He became a first-time father. Now with the release of his first novel, the famed director talks with Marc about the shifting perspectives and priorities that come with getting older. They also talk about the death of Old Hollywood, the Manson family, and why he wouldn't use the name Tarantino if he had to start all over again. Plus, Tom Scharpling finally gives Marc what he wants in Get to Know Tom. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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This year's most anticipated series, FX's Shogun, only on Disney+. We live and we die. We control nothing beyond that. An epic saga based on the global best-selling novel by James Clavel. To show your true heart is to risk your life. When I die here, you'll never leave Japan alive. FX's Shogun, a new original series, streaming February 27th, exclusively on Disney+. 18 plus subscription required.

T's and C's apply. Lock the gates! All right, let's do this. How are you, what the fuckers? What the fuck buddies? What the fuck nicks? What's happening? How's it going?

Did you get that thing fixed? How much did it cost? more than you thought did they rip you off did you lose the uh the receipt what's going on are you okay i mean it's okay to throw a dish away you know if it's chipped or it doesn't matter just throw it away i know you're attached to it but you can just throw it away it doesn't matter. Seriously, nothing fucking matters. Do you understand? Is your kid all right? Did he get through that thing? Surgery go good?

How's your toe? How's your finger? How's that thing on your neck? Is your back all right? Where are you at? Hey, hey, don't freak out. Don't freak out. Relax.

Most of it is in your head. Probably almost all of it is in your head. Probably almost all of it is in your head. I'm in your head right now, and I'm saying relax. How's everybody? Big day today, I think, for a lot of people. For me, it was a pretty big day when this happened. I interviewed Quentin Tarantino last week, and it was a big day. It was a big day in the sense that he's a big personality,

a big presence in the culture, a big talent, a guy who's said everything you would think he'd had to say. Not many stones left unturned, I guess. You know, I'm not an obsessive person about people generally. I enjoy Quentin's work. I've always liked his work. I believe I've seen all the movies at least once, except for one. But it was a little nerve wracking, only because it's one of those things where it's like, I don't know where to start with that guy. Is that guy going to let me talk? Is he going to steamroll me? Is it going to be a conversation? Do we have to go movie to movie? That seems to have been done for to death.

He seems to have said his piece about everything about him that there is to be said. So what do we do? Where do we go? And he was out pushing this book once upon a time in Hollywood, a novel. So I get this book in the mail. The book is in a like old school kind of trade paperback, the kind you used to see in the 70s that your mom would read if you're my age. Big book, but the little paperback type with the pictures on front. It's all done to look like one

of those books that I saw my mom reading in the 70s. Yeah, she probably still reads. I'm sure they still have these type of books available, but it looks like a book from that time with the lettering and everything. So I'm thinking it's based on the movie, which it is, but then it becomes unclear from some of the information I got. Did he write some of it before the movie? Did some of it get filled after? Whatever the case, you know, whether it was a non-disclosure agreement, don't even say

that the book exists. So I thought I should poke around in the book, you know see what the deal is you know what maybe watch the movie again so i started reading the book and i was like holy shit i can't i can't stop reading this book and i'm not i'm not here to push the book he's here to push the book i don't read a lot of books especially not books of people that that are my guests unless they're friends like tom's going to be on here in a second i read his book before it came out but like quentin i'm like you know we'll just talk about the whatever and the movie and this and that but the book is totally different than the movie and it's totally entertaining quentin tarantino is an entertaining

motherfucker there's no way around that everything he does is entertaining he's entertaining the movies are entertaining now the book's entertaining now whatever you say about his uh his approach his sort of like homage driven frenetic collage approach to some of his films despite his genius which could have gone a different way, always entertaining. And the book is entertaining. A lot more backstory on Cliff and Rick. And in the middle, it kind of breaks off into a Western novel. It's just good.

And I didn't expect that. I didn't expect to read the whole book. And then I watched the movie again. And neither one of them distracted from the other. And that fucking movie is a masterpiece. Maybe I've thrown that word around. I haven't. I don't throw that word around too much.

I can name the masterpieces I've named over the years. Some people disagree with me. Hail Caesar, I thought was a masterpiece. I got a lot of pushback from that, from Coen Brothers nerds. But fuck them. We think what we think. But Once Upon a Time in Hollywood is truly a masterpiece. I don't think I have kind of laugh cried that much during a movie in a long time.

Fucking DiCaprio's performance is insane in the pace of the thing. Whatever. You guys know. It's Tarantino. But heading into this, I'm not nervous to meet people. It's not that I'm in awe or that I'm intimidated. Really, I just get anxious because I don't know if we're going to be able to engage. I never know that. I never know that. I never know that.

I never know if it's going to be a conversation. I don't. And sometimes it doesn't work out. They're usually all okay. Some of them are great. You know, some of them, you know, suck for some people, but very few of them suck for me. But I know when I can't get over the hump.

I know when, you know get over the hump i know when you know the thing didn't engage i know uh when i was hoping they would fill in more of their life than they do and i try to leave that open but ultimately i just want to engage and i just didn't know you know he's a bigger than life presence culturally he drove up in the uh in a yellow ford mustang gt500 the same car that was in death proof and uh we got at it we got into it i got that book in the mail and i'm looking at it i just fucking i read it loved it got me all re-excited re-engaged with the quentin and uh and you'll hear man you guys be the judge it was pretty uh we had a good time we had a good time for a lot of reasons you'll hear them you'll hear them

also i i want to throw some love to uh kim Gatewood, one of my co-stars on Glow, because we wanted to book her, but it hasn't happened yet. But she has this film out that she directed. It's her first movie. It's called Good on Paper. And it was written and stars another guest, someone I see a lot at the comedy store, Eliza Schlesinger. But it's her movie, and it's on Netflix now. Okay, here's another thing.

My friend Tom, who I've talked to, this will be the third time, you do understand, right, that we're doing a thing. I mean, I know that I've built up some credibility with this show, but please, please, people, please know or try to know when a bit is a bit you should probably know about a third of the way into the bit happening but this is the third segment and just i just want you to know that tom and i talk a lot and uh you should know when a bit is a bit you know what i'm saying okay this is a this is sharp wing has a book

coming out and it's a good book and there's interesting stuff about sharp wing i know some of you don't know sharp wing but i think you could take our word for it or my word for it he's a very funny man he's done great work go check out the best show all right get that box set Sharpling and Worcester the best of the best show that is some of the funniest radio shit that has ever happened on radio go check that out if you don't want to go listen to the best show uh which is at the um the best show dot net then go get that Sharpling and Worcester box set the best of the best show it is fucking timeless hilarious radio comedy because Tom is a radio personality of the funny ilk and this is me talking to Tom about the book that he's got coming out

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See app for details. Death is in our air. This year's most anticipated series, FX's Shogun, only on Disney+. An epic saga based on the global best-selling novel by James Clavel. To show your true heart is to risk your life. When I die here, you'll never leave Japan alive. FX's Shogun, a new original series, streaming February 27 27th exclusively on Disney+.

18 plus subscription required. T's and C's apply. Folks, that's the music. How often do I get to say that on this show? How often? When was the last time we had a recurring segment on this show? It's been since the beginning. And they failed. All of them failed. At the beginning, when we were like, we've got to make a structure for the show.

But this segment is, maybe you've gotten used to it, I don't know, maybe it'll never go away. But this is the last one for now. Get to know Tom, where we all learn a little bit more about Tom Sharpling, our friend and author of the new book, It Never Ends, available for pre-order at tomwroteabook.com. So, all right,

so let's get on it. You know, I know like the last couple times maybe I pressed too hard to get stuff that's in the book because I want to, we all want to get

an exclusive. No, I understand. I understand. Look, it's a book. It's my, I wrote the, basically the story of my life

and it has a lot of funny stuff in it and it's got a lot of not funny stuff in it and a lot of not funny stuff that is funny. Look, the last time I feel like I aggravated you because I was just pressing. But I respect where you're coming from because you want people to get the book. Yeah.

I mean, I worked on it for a long time. And it took years for me to be ready to do it. And I want the book to kind of tell the story yeah i mean i kind of feel like i feel like i was pushy and i don't usually do that you know and i don't it's not really who i am you know what i mean it's like i let people kind of do their thing and uh so how long did it take you to write this thing um a couple years over overall i took breaks but then kind of really, really powered through last year. Closed it out during the beginning of the pandemic, which was kind of nice.

I was like, oh, here's a great writing opportunity. Yeah. Everybody else is like. Oh, that's right. Because you were kind of pounding away. Yeah. Freaking out. You had deadlines.

I remember because we were having dinners and you nailed it. Yeah. I was going around the clock. I would ride this dry erase board that I would just write 2,000 words on and just leave the date. And then it was the greatest moment was when I could wipe the date off because then it meant I did it. And you tell some good stories that some people who know you would know. The Patti Smith stories in there, right? Yeah. Like the classics.

Yeah, the Patti Smith story, me being, seeing her over and over in San Francisco. Yeah, that's funny. That's funny. And then just finally confronting her in an elevator. Yeah, that's just enough for a tease for people that don't know the story that, you know, everyone else. What did I say to her? What's the... Yeah.

What thing did I... How did Tom make a fool out of himself in that particular situation? But like, you know, some people, but yeah, come on, just be, let's, I mean, this is the third one of these. Yeah. And I think I've been a good sport.

No, I appreciate you doing that. Can't you just give me, like, you don't want to talk about the thing at the place with the guy, right? You don't want to talk about, you know, what happened there and, you don't want to talk about the thing at the place with the guy. Mm-hmm. Right? You don't want to talk about, you know, what happened there, and, you know, and you don't want to talk about... Yeah, but can we just... Give me one juicy one.

Give me, like, one that no one knows. Okay. All right. Well, you're in the book. That is great. Yeah. It's great. You want to tell...

Absolutely, please. Yeah, tell the story. This is great at this point in my life i'm living in new jersey i'm working at a sheet music store yeah kind of want to start doing other things but i don't it's that point where you don't even know where to start like who do i talk to what do i do you've hit a wall yeah just like i don't know what to do stuck in your life yeah but i want to try something but i don't even know what to do with this. Stuck in your life. Yeah, but I want to try something, but I don't even know where to start. Right. My friend Joe Ventura, he's working- MTV. At MTV.

He's writing and directing commercials, and it's just, he's on his way now. And then we would go every Monday night down to the Lower East Side. Yeah. The Lower East Side? Yeah. And we would go to Eating It,

which was a Monday night show. Right, Luna Lounge. Luna Loungeay night show right you were you were yeah and you were you were in a mainstay of that yeah that was like the the real the first big new york city alternative comedy show yes and everybody would go up there and do their thing yeah and i was always fucking worked up and trying to be in the moment and angry yeah and sometimes you'd go and you'd be like so i just signed a development deal for a thing. And then a couple weeks later, you're like, so that development deal's all fucked up. It's like it was the early narrative.

Yeah. I was preparing for this show. But we were getting a week-by-week update. It was beautiful. Yeah, and all the horrible things. And I was doing blow. In that awesome Lunauna lounge bathroom oh i'm trying to remember that was terrible bathroom it was up front in the club in between yeah like it was like just outside of the showroom but originally it was all one club and then i think they built a wall eventually at some point so you could have a

separation sure yeah what what a shit show that was yeah and then i remember we were there one week yeah and i i was so frustrated with my life at that point and you were on stage and and i didn't know you no did not know me and joe were there and um you were on you were saying something to the effect you were making some sort of comparison between two people and i'm working at a music store joe's working at mtv and he said yeah it's kind of like the difference between somebody who is working at mtv and somebody who works at a record store or a music store yeah and i was just like oh my god this guy if he had designed if he if somebody had hired mark to hurt my feelings, he would have come up short than what he just did now. And it's worse that he doesn't even know I exist.

And he nailed me so hard. And I was like, wow, what do I do with that? That hurt. Like it rattled me. Yeah. Yeah. But then it kind of made me be like, I got to figure something out. Yeah.

I can't feel that again. Pivotal moment. It was foundational. You shook me to my core. Oh, that's great. So I tell you, and not to be weird, but I always laugh at, like I've never heard that story before.

And I've heard it many times. I'm just so happy it made the book like that. Yeah. Oh, no, that's. It's nice that like i yeah i gotta be honest you know as as you know people i know people who write things and people that do things and i i find generally speaking i'm not you know uh you know given enough credit for their life so i really appreciate No, I'm giving you full credit for being a motivational force through, like, that was the, sometimes people talk about just like the carrot or the stick. Right. You gave me the stick.

And that forced me into action. I didn't need any more carrot. I was getting carrots at Katz's. Yeah. That was the cat. Yeah, right. And eat. Yeah, eat and go right around the corner. And then just go get driven. i didn't need any more carrot i was getting carrots at cats's yeah that was the cat yeah right yeah eat yeah eat and go right around the corner and then just go get well that's like this is like the a great book and i appreciate you you including me made me feel good no of course that

was enough that's just the right amount of me because you have a big life you know yeah you'd be weirded out if i put more you'd be just like just one chapter called mark mrc it's like what's the goal with this yeah why is because this doesn't sound good yeah like this part is a nice story but this i don't know this part it doesn't sound good yeah yeah no but uh but i do appreciate it and and people you know now that you know that i'm in it that's's going to move some product. Yeah. We're going to move some copies. The book is It Never Ends. It's a memoir by Tom, who we've been talking

to over these last three segments. We've got to do another Mark and Tom show. Yeah, let's do it. But you can pre-order it at tomwroteabook.com or I don't even know. By that point, are we done? You can get it. You can still get it there. You can always.

Then you're just ordering it. You always get it. And I'm in it. I'm in the book. And also, all the stuff about that time in high school. Yeah, well, let's hope they can get it. All right. Good to see you.

Thanks, Mark. There you go. Me and Sharpling. Again, you can buy the book at TomWroteABook.com. Thanks, Mark. was going to take to his grave before writing this book, how his life almost ended on election night in 2016, why he auditioned for the new monkeys. Yes, for real. He auditioned for the new monkeys. But you'll also get to enjoy Tom's writing and his humor and his very real and very true underdog story. It's about living a life in comedy while managing trauma and mental illness.

And the big thing is rising above whatever bad hand life has dealt you it's a very tom book so if you don't know tom you know him a little better now and now that you know that it's a bit maybe you appreciate his humor better now but this book is very tom and uh enjoy it okay okay so now moving on to Quentin Tarantino. You know, what all you gossipy freaks and all you obsessed, shallow people really want to know about anybody. You have to understand, like, but this is for fans, too, that the best that can happen here on my show is people are who they are. But the best that can happen here on my show is people are who they are. And I felt we had a couple of, we had some prolonged moments, me and Mr. Tarantino.

And I hope you enjoy this conversation. This is me talking to Quentin. The book, Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, a novel, comes out tomorrow, June 29th. This is me and Quentin. Holy mackerel. Hey, did you get a chance to read the book or scum through it or something? I read the whole book. Oh, you did?

Oh my goodness. Yeah, I read the whole book. Wow. Okay, well, you officially make the 10th person I've met so far. Oh, really? I just the whole book. Oh, you did? Oh my goodness. Yeah, I read the whole book. Wow. Okay, well you officially make the 10th person I've met so far who has read the book. Oh really? But out of how many though? It's not out. No, you're literally the 10th person I've

met who has read it. Right. And 8 of them work for me. So they had to. They had to. So you're the first person to read it that doesn't have skin in the game, you know? Well, I'll tell you. Oh, hold on a minute.

Comedy store veils. Hold on. Didn't I just meet you at the store? I'm sure you did. Yeah. Like you were in the back? Yeah. Yeah.

Uh-huh. Yeah. All in, all week. I've been back at it. Oh, great. You can move that thing in. Okay, cool. Yeah.

Hey, I have to also let you know. Yeah. Your whole it's been years since I've done like at parties or at a dinner. Yeah. Done a comedian's entire routine. Uh-huh. Alright. And I've been known to do that for all my life, but it's been years since I've done it.

Yeah. The whole hat routine. Oh, the hat. I can do that. I can do the whole fucking thing. I can do the whole fucking thing. I can do the whole fucking thing. I do it good. All right? And I did it at a fucking dinner of Israelis, and they were fucking laughing their asses off. You killed with my hat bit? I killed with your hat bit.

Oh, that's... It might as well have been my hat bit as far as they were concerned. Well, I think that's great. I love that bit. I love doing that bit. It's great. Yeah. The children's story. Someone made a children's concerned. Well, I think that's great. I love that bit. I love doing that bit. It's great. Yeah. The children's story. Someone made a children's book. They asked me, like, do you want me to write the book? I'm like, sure, go ahead, write the book. Well, here's the thing is, you know how you know you have such a good routine?

How? When somebody memorizes it from hearing it once. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's actually how good it is that you can actually say it after only hearing it once yeah i only needed to hear a carlin bit once yeah do it but don't you have like a miraculous memory i've got a good memory but i mean but nevertheless yeah i mean because i tried it there's some bits that i remember i remember a few old jokes but and there but for me it's not the whole bit usually if someone has a good turn of phrase or a good punch line that because to me that's what kind of it kind of blows your mind yeah you know you But for me, it's not the whole bit usually. If someone has a good turn of phrase or a good punchline, because to me, it kind of blows your mind.

You know that thing. It's like a turn of phrase. You do it in films. All of a sudden, you're like, what? How did that happen? How did we get here? Yeah, yeah. Well, yeah.

I can't do Carlin's entire euphemism bit. Sure, sure. But I can do like sections. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But like his AM, FM and- Oh, yeah, sure. And Klaus Klan. Oh, no, I can do bits. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That bit like- No like his AMFM and- Oh, yeah, sure. And Clash of Clans. Oh, no, I can do bits.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That bit like- No, I've heard them a zillion fucking times. I thought he was the smartest man I'd ever heard in my life when I was a kid. Yeah, was he your comic guy? Absolutely. Really? Absolutely.

Him and Richard Pryor, but I would put him above. But were you always a comic fan? Because I know that there were people- Like, I remember Kathy Griffin showed up in Pulp Fiction. Oh, yeah, yeah. But you don't use a ton of comics. But they're kind of around. No, but especially then, though, I did.

I mean, that was one of the weird things, one of the funny things about Pulp Fiction is you're watching and there's John Travolta and there's Bruce Willis and then this random Groundlings guy. Yeah. And there's this random Groundlings girl. Were you going to the Groundlings a lot? Yeah, I actually had, I was friends with Julia Sweeney at the time. Right. And Kathy Griffin. Yeah.

And they were all involved with the Groundlings. So I actually did the little Groundlings show. Oh, you did? Their Sunday show, yeah. Yeah, you got on stage and did it? Yeah, yeah, uh-huh. I was a guest. Did you do well?

Yeah, I did really good. You liked to improvise? Yeah, well, especially since the thing about, actually, I got one of the best compliments I ever got. Yeah. All right, which was, I wanted to join the Groundlings back when I first moved to Los Angeles. Yeah. Trying to be an actor to some degree.

Yeah. But I wasn't a millionaire, so I wasn't able to join those ridiculously expensive classes. I mean, you have to be a fucking millionaire to afford those classes. Right, right, right. And so I couldn't do it. And then they also were discouraging. They were like, because I was thinking, oh, hey, right. And so I couldn't do it. And then they also were discouraging. They were like, because I was thinking,

oh, hey, maybe if you do good, then you get to be in the group. Oh, right, so they got to jump through all these. And they're like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, well, fuck you. Fuck you. So I never went. And then I'm going to do the guest bit on their Sunday show. Right. And they, you know, literally it was the time of Pulp Fiction. Right. So it was like a big deal. Yeah.

And so Kathy Griffin was teaching an improv class. Right. And so the whole class came down to watch the show. Right. And then after it was over, she goes, well, Quentin, you did so good. I had to lie to them and tell them you had improv experience that was like yes what a compliment i so yeah so the the thing about like i read the whole book and i re-watched the movie uh-huh sort of like alongside of it yeah

yeah a bit but like the book is so fucking good. Oh, thank you. I mean, it's really entertaining. Even after it, because when I got it, I'd seen the movie, and I'm like, well, what is it going to be? But it's its own thing. It's totally its own thing. And the backstory on Booth, on Cliff, is so, like, I watched Brad Pitt's performance,

but there's no way to know just the depth of that guy. Did you know that before you wrote the script? Oh, some yes, some no. I knew about his war record. I knew about the war thing. I hadn't asked myself the questions about how did he get Brandy. All right, that was a book thing. That's like a whole chapter, the dog.

Well, that's one of the best chapters in the book. It's great. It's great. And also it leads to the, I don't want to spoil too much, but it is established that not only did he kill in the war, not only did he kill his wife, but there might be a couple other ones. He's actually a murderer. A murderer, yeah. And one of it sort of revolves around the dog. Right?

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Well, part of my idea, since he's such an enigma in the movie, was to flesh out his character in the book where you go to these little chapters that go back in time. And each of those chapters is like a little pulp novel unto itself starring Cliff. Yes. Right. But then you almost do the entire Lancer story from the show. Yeah. Lancer story from the show. So you get this whole backstory that's pretty rich.

You go into those characters, but not as if it were the show. No, but like it's a real... All of a sudden you're reading a Louis L'Amour Western novel. Exactly. You go through the whole thing of that. But there are some bits... I thought it was an interesting thing to break it up

and also thought it would be fun to try to write a western novel just and cram it in the novel cram it in into this one right and it doesn't end like the movie like this it's a sweet ending yeah yeah uh yes and it's sort of uh you know i mean okay here's a couple a couple of things that i just need to know if because you've been talking a lot about you you know, this is it. I mean, I spent the entire quarantine just being like, I don't really need comedy. Maybe I'm all better. Maybe life is... Maybe I fixed it and I don't have to do it. I'm healed.

Yeah, exactly. Like, wow, if no one's doing nothing, then that's off the table, right? Like, usually, I don't know about you, but I'm driven by a certain amount of spite. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's like, I'm not doing anything. Then you have that moment during the pandemic, like, no one is. Wow. Right, yeah.

I can really take some time to myself. Right. What did you find out about yourself? Oh, gosh. Well, it was weird for me because I wasn't, I couldn't be ridiculous, not reflective in that way because my pandemic literally coincided with the first year my child was born. Well, that's,

but that's different for you. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, so you have no control over this. Yes, exactly.

So I, so I was like looking on the inside, but not just because I was stuck in the house. I was like now reliving my childhood through this baby. Were you? Is that what happened yeah exactly what do you like i it's interesting like 15 months right now because for how like i because that was one of my questions is like maybe one of the reasons he keeps talking about

retirement is he might want to spend time in real life yeah no that's no that that is part of it yeah that is part of it you know the first part of the first half of the year that i was there was me finishing the book up so right great i'm in my room i'm i'm typing away what you do doing my thing and then when i i stop and oh hey look at what he's doing over here all right come in here quick quick quick he's doing this he's pointing and he means it so you're running there he's pointing and he means it it's not just gas. Yeah, right. That's exciting. That was really exciting.

So what is your experience as a grown man now? I don't know who you are emotionally, but it seems like you obviously, it's no leap of logic to think that you live in a fantasy world on some level. But what is it? Because I don't have kids. And you're my age. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you on some level, but what is it? Because I don't have kids, and you're my age, and you did it. So is it great? Yeah, well, I mean, the thing about it is from hearing you talk both on this show

and then in your routines, before I got married, we were probably ridiculously similar. Oh, yeah. All right, just like it's been me and me alone. And I'm okay, though. And I'm okay. I was okay. I was very happy. I mean, people came, it's been me and me alone. And I'm okay, though. And I'm okay. I was okay.

I was very happy. I mean, people came and went. Yeah, yeah, exactly. No, people came and went. That's exactly what I mean. People came and went. Yeah. All right.

The people I paid stayed. The ones who read the book. Yeah, exactly. The ones who have read the book before you. And so I was, yeah, and I was very happy with that. And I spent my time watching the movies, going down whatever little cinematic rabbit hole I wanted to do because that was all I had to do until I made a movie. Right. Then I was off doing something.

Right. Yeah. And then in between those times, I was like living the life that I would have lived in my 20s if I had the money to. that I would have lived in my 20s if I had the money to. Like, I have a hard time imagining what that is sometimes, because, like, I read, did you read that book, what's that guy's name, by Stratton, the Wild Bunch book? Oh, no, I don't know.

It's a book about the making of the Wild Bunch. Oh, no, I don't think I have. But it's sort of amazing, like, because, like, I assume, you mentioned Peckinpah here and there. Yeah, yeah. You mentioned certainly the guys who were in Peckinpah movies. Yeah. And certainly in... Definitely Peckinpah, I love Peckinpah. So and certainly in definitely peckinpah i love peckinpah it's so good yeah but like in once upon a time in hollywood

like you you're you're your passion and love for just not only the community of of show business you know and change you know at that time and up through the 70s but the lives of these guys yeah like you know directors not not you but like you know peckinpah was like how did he even wake up to do the fucking movie and like what what does he do like he's out there not you, but like, you know, Peckinpah was like, how did he even wake up to do the fucking movie? And like, what, what does he do? Like, he's out there like, you know, beating people up, drinking. They're up on. And then like he rents a Mexican town.

Yeah. And you don't even know if it. But you don't, you don't live that life. No, no, no. Well, I'm not. Yeah. Well, in the book. Yeah.

There's a talk about that to some degree or another. With Aldo Ray? About how alcoholism was kind of accepted back then. Sure, sure, yeah. Because these were men that had hard lives. That's right. You made the connection that it was accepted because when they came back from the war, because of PTSD, that, you know, they had to do something. They had to do something.

And then it's like, you know, and if it wasn't from the war, then like they grew up in a fucking coal mining town or they did this or that. Or just it was their dad. Yeah. And, you know, I'm not talking about Cary Grant, but I'm talking about rough men. Yes. That were actually acted in movies and starred in TV shows that were badass motherfuckers. We don't have anybody like that now. No, because it's not allowed.

How are you going to get away with it? There's no, there's no, there's no. No, I don't even mean, I don't have anybody like that now. No, because it's not allowed. How are you going to get away with it? There's no No, I don't even mean the alcoholism. I mean just that breed of man. There's people that want to think they are. There's no Lee Marvin walking around. There's no Charles Bronson walking around. I mean, not even close. No, no.

Charlize Theron is closer to Charles Bronson than any man out there. Isn't that weird? Because there's so many of these men that aspire to some strange sense of alpha or some strange sense of masculinity, but none of it has the grit that those guys did because we're too far away from it.

Yeah, I mean, look, it's kind of ridiculous about the idea that, like, Robert Aldrich goes to cast the Dirty Dozen. Oh, yeah. He throws a rock in a tree. And Charles Bronson and Telly Savalas cast the dirty dozen. Oh, yeah. He throws a rock in a tree. Yeah. And Charles Bronson and Telly Savalas and John Cassavetes fall out.

He throws another rock. Jim fucking Brown falls out of the tree. Yeah. He throws another rock. Yeah. And it's boom, boom, boom. Okay, you couldn't cast one of those guys now. Now you get, you know,

a grown-up guy who used to be on the OC. Right. Who you used, you know, a grown-up guy who used to be on the OC. Who you used. You used Luke Perry. Beverly Hills 90210, right? That was him. Yeah, yeah. Uh-huh. I had to go back twice to realize, like, oh, that's Luke Perry. That's who that is. And then you use those old guys.

Like, there's certain things that keep coming back to me from the movie. And I know there's sort of like, you know, like, where's Waldo for film nerds, like the maltese falcon was sitting there on the counter yes and that's an easy one right yeah yeah yeah so what was you were just sort of like i'm just gonna stick this here well no it's a bookstore okay it's a famous book okay okay that's actually something the so it's not not necessarily the real maltese falcon if there ever was they're saying that it's the real maltese falcon. All right, it's not. However, we could have used the real Maltese Falcon because Leo owns the real Maltese Falcon. It didn't occur to me.

It wasn't necessary. After we shot it, I said, hey, could we have used your real? Of course you could have. I go, that would have been fucking awesome. But instead, we just bought a replica. Well, that would have been more authentic to the store than they would have the real Maltese Falcon. Arthur's bookstore would have not had the real Maltese Falcon. Arthur's Bookstore would have not had the real Maltese Falcon. Does the real one have the marks from Sidney Greenstreet going...

No, I think they threw that one away. But the real one's not totally black. Because it was made for black and white film. The real one has a reddish tone to it. Yeah. Now, I had Mark Harris on the show. My favorite film writer. The best.

My favorite film writer. Like, I read that book, Pictures at the Revolution. I know. Magnificent. The best film book I've read in years. All the levels. Yeah. Like, somehow he's able to capture just, you know, not the filmmaking, but the politics

and the production politics. Like, all of it. And then the idea that of all those five films yeah it was dr doolittle that had the most wackadoo shoot dude when you read that aren't you like didn't you think like who should someone should make this movie yeah right the movie about like the making of dr doolittle rex harrison i mean that actually you could put in love with the making of easy writer it seems like crazy with the bugs yeah just the whole thing the animals that vicious fighting with his wife constantly through the production oh yeah rex

harris yeah and then that weird sea monster that they had to drag out there yeah that was the the giant snail yeah oh geez man i fucking loved it but was that because there's been a couple of books written about you know this period that you capture in the book and in the movie you know i guess easy riders raging bulls and whatever and then and but then the five the pictures of the a couple of books written about this period that you capture in the book and in the movie. I guess Easy Riders, Raging Bulls and whatever. But then the pictures of the revolution really kind of it really illustrates the transition. That's the year it starts. I mean, New Hollywood

basically starts with 1967 with the Bonnie and Clyde graduate. And to some degree, something like Dirty Dozenzen which was looked at as an answer to even though I don't think

Aldrich meant it as an answer to Vietnam. That's interesting about your movies I noticed too about this one. You don't mention Nixon ever. You don't really do politics

do you? How do you see it? Oh no well it's just it just never kind of came up with those characters. I guess. Those characters are pretty I hear you talking about

Bobby Kennedy on the radio in one scene. Oh, no, in the thing. Yeah. Yeah. Well, the Manson girl mentions like, you know, who wants to watch stupid movies where people are being murdered every day in Vietnam? The Manson rabbit hole.

Actually, I do mention one thing in there. What? When it is revealed about what happened with Cliff and the hippies at the house, how Rick becomes a bit of a hero to Nixon's silent majority. Oh, right. Oh, that's right. That's right. Even though he's a Democrat. Right.

Yeah. That's right. Yeah. And he's like down with it. Okay. As long as I'm a hero somewhere, I'm good. You know what I was very grateful for is that you do explain the weird chunk of billboard. Yeah. Like in the movie, you grateful for is that you do explain the weird chunk of billboard. Yeah.

Like in the movie, you don't, do you? No. In this, it's like the whole backstory of that. What the fuck is this? What the fuck is that? You never know. But there's a full explanation and backstory to the piece. I didn't even know it was his face.

Yeah. Did you think about that when you're putting the movie together? Like, I'm not explaining this. Well, you can explain everything and you don't need to but it takes up so much of the frame yes I know but it's like do you have to explain everything that's in your house alright I come by

you got some weird thing I could but I don't need you to what's the deal with that painting what's going on where did that fucking weird statue of the nymph come from I'll tell you where that came from the lady who lived here before left it and i i mean i'm not quite embarrassed about it but i got to do something with it so i had a lot of story to tell so yeah you know i didn't need to spend 10 minutes on the billboard

but you know but you asked yourself the question no but to ask yourself to answer that even more though is i actually think it seems real and full of vermicitude that you don't explain stuff, that it's just there because he has a life. Right. And there is an explanation,

but I'm not telling it to the audience. Sure. But he knows. Yeah. No, I agree with that. It was just sort of wild to me because from right at the beginning of the movie,

this thing is taking up a lot. It's like its own part. Yeah. And you're sort of like, what the fuck is that? And every time you see you're sort of like, what the fuck is that? And every time you see it, you're like, what the fuck is that?

Which is fine. You know, but I'm sure if I drove around your neighborhood, I would find at least four houses and you would say,

what the fuck is that? Oh, sure. Or how about when you drive around and you're like, was that always there? Yeah. The laser tag place? Who's at the laser tag place?

Does anyone go there? So I, Ned Beatty just died. You didn't work with him. No, I never did. You? Does anyone go there? So, Ned Beatty just died. You didn't work with him. No, I never did. You loved him though, right? I loved Ned Beatty. He was so great.

Yeah. And you remember, you know, that place on, what's it, Beachwood or whatever? Yeah. He lived right across the street

from that cafe. Oh yeah, way up there. On Beachwood. Yeah, yeah. And every once in a while you'd see him and his kids out on the front lawn while you're eating your breakfast.

It's like a craftsman, right? Yeah, uh-huh. Yeah, I mean, because like, I think we have a similar experience. When I in a while, you'd see him and his kids out on the front lawn while you're eating your breakfast. It's like a craftsman, right? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, because I think we have a similar experience. When I was a kid, my grandparents were in town. And for some reason, they took me and my little brother to see Deliverance when it was first showing. Yeah. And all I remember is their looks of concern, me leaving the theater.

Yeah. And then my... But do you... That's all when I i was eight yeah and did what did it do to you well here's the thing okay okay not only did i see deliverance that night my mom was on a date and she took me we saw deliverance on a double feature with the wild bunch oh that's so good mean, it's one of the greatest nights in movies in my life. Right, it defined who you are. Yeah. That was where it was all laid out. Yeah, I mean, as far as I was concerned,

when I was watching the Wild Bunch, as far as I was concerned, they slashed Angel's throat. I mean, how else could you do that? Right. They just slashed his throat. So you thought that. Yeah, and the blood hit the fucking lens.

Yeah, yeah, right, yeah, yeah. When I saw, okay, Deliverance scared the fuck out of me yeah when i saw it hillbilly monsters oh yeah it was sort of like creepy hill people after i saw it for a while i didn't want to go camping because i thought that that could happen oh yeah of course the way people were scared of the beach after jaws was how i was scared of camping yeah now living with a single mom, I didn't really have to worry about that. She's not going to buy a bunch of Coleman stoves and go camping

with me, so I need not worry. But that was the thing. But here was the thing about it, though, also, watching Deliverance. I didn't know he was being fucked up the ass. Me too! I watched it again recently. Well, I've known since then.

Yes. But when I was a little boy, I didn't know he was sticking his dick up his ass. Right, right. All right? I didn't even know what sodomy was at that time. Right. But I knew he was being humiliated.

Yeah, because, yeah. Yeah, and he was being humiliated. All right? He was being dominated. Yes, he was. I knew that. Well, any kid can understand that because you've had some situation with somebody humiliating you and trying to dominate you. He felt bad for the fat man in his underpants.

Yes, exactly. Because I was sort of surprised by what we can register and what we can't register because I watched it again recently. And it's like not only is he fucking him in the ass, but he's really fucking him. I mean, it's clear that's what's happening. Oh, yeah. But my childhood memory is just sort of like, why are they hurting the fat guy in his underwear? Yeah, no, it's like, I mean. And also, those guys are shitty.

Yeah. Oh, well, they're scary as fuck. Yeah. All right. But the thing is, though, the sodomy went right over my head. Of course. But the meaning of the rape was right there. Right.

Domination. Right. Humiliation. Right. That is what it's about. was right there. Right. Domination. Right. Humiliation. Right. That is what it's about. Right. Yes. Right.

The rape is a byproduct of that. So you knew that. So I knew what was going on without knowing the particulars. Right. And it's haunting. Yeah. But what was more haunting was that guy's teeth. Yeah.

But that whole scene, I didn't remember any of it. I watched it maybe even during the pandemic. I wanted to watch it again. I watched it during the pandemic with a couple of guys from Israel who had never seen it before and they had no idea what was going to happen. Right. So it was great watching it with two

grown men who don't know where this is going to go. And the movie does not... The movie lets you know something is going to happen. But it doesn't hint you know something is going to happen. Right. But it doesn't hint at all what's going to happen. Yeah.

I mean, you think it's probably going to be a mishap. Right, right. You know, and the river acting. And then, like, there was that piece of meat hanging out of Bert's leg. Yeah, oh, I know, yeah. This is, like, giant flank of meat hanging out of his wetsuit. He's our guy. How can he be sidelined?

He's down. And then when they find, what's his name, like all bent up. Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. So that was sort of defining. And I noticed towards the end of the book, you put that man in there. You put Curtis in. Yeah.

Was he your stepdad? He was my stepdad, yeah. And he was the guy that brought you to that movie. Yeah. No, he was gone by that time now my mom was now my mom was divorced by this time and she was uh uh dating uh and she took me on a date so what was curtis like because in the book is that bar real yeah it's a real bar what's it called uh the drinkers hall of fame yeah is it still there no i i i'm imagining it's not there right uh it was in san gabriel uh i remember it i remember i thought it

was like so cool all the the cool memorabilia. Oh, you went with him? Yeah, he took me there a couple times. So Curtis, what's his last name? Curtis Zastapil. Zastapil. So he played piano and guitar. Yeah.

And he worked at that bar. Yeah, he worked at that bar. He worked at a few bars. Two that I remember that had great names was the Drinker's Hall of Fame and one called My Old Kentucky Home. Oh, yeah? And was he a good musician? Yeah, he was good.

And you'd consider him a stepdad? Oh, he was good. And he was, you would consider him a stepdad? Oh, he actually was my stepdad. Because he was there for the longest? Yeah, absolutely. And he was there at the really formative time. But he helped form you. Yeah, exactly. Two to seven or eight. Yeah, and what was it

about him that really kind of wired your brain? Well, one of the things about it, well, it's a couple things yeah one is the fact that his presence he was there yeah he was there and one of the things was my mom was a nurse yeah so she was working during so before i started going to school yeah she was working during the day yeah he worked at night yeah because he was a piano bar musician so he was home all day long. Right. So I was with him all day. What'd you do? Play piano?

We did a zillion things together. No, he never taught me an instrument. But it was like, he did all kinds of things and he took me with him whenever.

We went to diners and we had lunch. Did he smoke? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Like a chimney. Yeah. But he had buddies

so he went and saw his buddies and just took me with him. Yeah. We went to see a ton of movies. We had a thing that we went to, we had a whole so he went and saw his buddies and just took me with him. We went to see a ton of movies. We had a whole thing that went on for as long as I was with him at a certain point, that we went to the movies every Monday night. Oh, that's nice.

Every single Monday night, no matter what. Yeah, to all those movie theaters that you had in this book. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And then if there was nothing else playing, we saw something we liked again. Wow. So what part of Hollywood or Los Angeles were you living in? That was,

it started when I was like living in Alhambra. Okay, yeah. All right. And then we moved to El Segundo. Okay, okay. But so you had to drive into the city

it was a thing. Yeah, no, no. We saw like, when we lived in Alhambra, we went to like the theaters that were in that area, in that East LA area, Montebello area. Yeah, yeah LA area, Montebello area,

Montebello and El Monte area. And then I can remember the name of all of them, frankly. And then when we moved to El Segundo, then we went to like the, and particularly there was like two cinemas right by where the LAX is. There was one cinema, they're still there.

They're just office buildings now. There was the Loyola on one end of Sepulveda and the Paradise on the other end of Sepulveda every once in a while we'd drive into Marina Del Rey and go to the

UA Marina Del Rey theater which was a multiplex yeah da da da da da da da da da da da da little projector thing yeah yeah yeah

and da da da da da da da da da da da right you know what that's actually called funky fan um and did it did did did did did right yeah you know what that's actually called funky fanfare and and it is a funky fanfare that was the coming attraction yeah the coming attraction thing yeah um did you we play that in front of every movie you do beverly yeah right that's where i saw it recently then yeah yeah right because every movie starts with that you gotta have that right and don't you gotta have it and don't you have the concession stand thing

the little oh yeah yeah we always have a little have the concession stand thing? Oh, yeah, yeah. We always have one little concession stand store, yeah. So this guy was around for a while. Now, because I was trying to figure out, because when I was a kid, you know, for some reason I had an obsession with old Hollywood. But it wasn't because I watched movies. I was literally

obsessed with the pictures of old actors. And I don't even know why, but I could name a lot of them without knowing their movies. And I found it so compelling. Just the black and whites. And I remember I got obsessed with the pictures of old actors. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I don't even know why, but I could name a lot of them without knowing their movies. Oh, yeah. Okay. And I found it so compelling, just the black and whites. And I remember I got obsessed with these tabloid magazines they used to have. Yeah, yeah.

The Fatty Arbuckle thing. The Hollywood Confidential, things like that. Those kind of things. Because they used to have them at the Skaggs Drugstore next to the True Detective stuff. But I never became a full-on old movie guy. But for some reason, I became really enthralled with just the way they looked. Yeah. Like that these guys were all dead.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, like there they are. Well, when I was like around that time in the early 70s, 71, 72, 73, I was really connected, especially when it came to movie stars and all that kind of stuff. Yeah. I was really connected to one, the Universal Monsters. Yeah. And I was really connected to the old- Monsters and I was really connected to the old time old time comedians

especially W.C. Fields I was really really really into W.C. Fields and I was really really into Abbie Costello but I also really liked Laurel and Hardy and I didn't love the Marx Brothers that much I liked them but I didn't love them I still don't, I tried again

do you ever have those things, I don't know if you suffer from that where you're like I should like this yeah well I love Groucho's running bits all right Groucho's mile a minute bits are fantastic especially when he's with the woman all right the battle axe woman yeah yeah but

W.C. Fields was your guy yeah but W.C. Fields was my guy I don't know what it was about W.C. Fields I just thought he was hysterical. I loved him in the movies. I loved a cartoon of him. I loved statues of him. I remember those statues. Any kind of a caricature of W.C. Fields, I just thought was the greatest thing ever.

Because he was snotty to kids. Yeah. I don't even know if I understood what he was saying. I just thought he, I liked him. Isn't that weird? It's because it's like

this weird, cranky vulnerability. It's a weird, it's a very strange and unique comic type to be, you know, that cranky or that angry, but you can't help

but be funny. There's so few of them. But then also the, I mean, the idea though that like something like you never give a second an even break is so ridiculously surreal.

And the idea to be a little boy and to watch that kind of surreal movie. And it doesn't take place in any kind of world that we know of where the rules and the laws that exist just don't apply. And what is going on here? But then Kurt is laughing hysterically, so I guess it's okay. So now I. Well, yeah. And like, what is going on here? But then Kurt is laughing hysterically so I guess it's okay. Yeah. So now I'm laughing too.

At the weird place. One of the other things with Kurt though was I'm positive he wasn't a movie expert but he knew stuff. He is an adult man. He knew movies.

He knew stuff. He knew actors' names. So we'd be watching movies in the afternoon on television. Yeah. And he would just like, you know, point out an actor. Oh, that's Roddy McDowell. I really like Roddy McDowell. I really like Roddy McDowell when he's playing an asshole.

All right. Roddy McDowell's a good asshole. Yeah. I dig him. Yeah. Like he's playing an asshole. Yeah. That's great.

All right. All right. Okay. Oh, that's Aldo Ray. All right. That's whoever. Sure. All right. Okay. Oh, that's Aldo Ray. All right. That's whoever. All right. Or something else that he would do is like we went to the movies and we saw the Disney version of Swiss Family Robinson.

Yeah. All right. So then we'd be watching a movie and then the actor Thomas Mitchell walks down. Oh, Thomas Mitchell. Okay. See that guy, Quentin, he played the father in Swiss Family Robinson in the original Swiss Family Robinson. All right, so he just pointed out things like that. Yeah, and then you're like, oh, they move around.

Yeah. There was one before that? Yeah. Yeah, it was like in the 30s. And that's the father. He was the father. Wow. Yeah.

Okay, so as a little boy, I thought, wow, one of the things that's so good when you become an adult is you become an expert on movies. You know every actor who's in every movie you watch. You know everything they've done, and you're an expert. Wow, I can't wait to be an adult so I can be an expert on movies. I better start paying attention now. Well, little did I know that, no, most people don't become an expert on movies when they become an adult. But I did because I was like boning up for it all. Right, but that's what stuck.

You're like, this is what I want to do. Yes. Like it was that compelling. But I just thought it was a rite of passage. Right, in your brain. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Because some kids are like sports, some are like whatever, but you're like, no, movies. Yeah.

This is like, it never ends. Yeah. It can go on forever. But at that time, did you know that your real dad had set out to be in movies? No, I didn't really quite. They had tried to explain it to me. But since Kurt was so much as far as I was concerned, my father. Their explanation didn't make any sense.

It was just mush. Right. And so I just projected it. Like there was another guy. Yeah, I didn't really get it. Yeah. I mean, I remember because I was born Tarantino. His name was Zastapil, but he actually adopted me.

Okay. So I would have his last name. Yeah. And I remember them taking me to the adoption process that I had to talk to the judge. Oh, yeah. And they go, okay, so Quentin, here's what this is about. Yeah. And so they explain it all to me and da da da da da.

And then they bring and I remember this. They bring me into the office and I meet with the judge. OK, so now, Quentin, do you know why you're here? No. What the fuck? We just spent 15 minutes explaining to you. Well, Quentin, let me tell you why you're here what the fuck was that we walked outside what the fuck was that these people kidnapped me

and i don't know what they're trying to do judge but uh uh yeah so i didn't really uh so it wasn't until a bit later yeah that when i got a little older that I realized oh okay he's my stepdad and my mom and but I never went by that I didn't even know about the name Tarantino

really at that time I was Zastapil that was my name all through I was always known by that that's what I that's how I learned

to write that's what I learned when I first learned to write I learned to write that's a good one to learn to write I mean as far as

training yourself to write things I mean actually I've always liked a good one to learn to write. Yeah. I mean, as far as training yourself to write things. I mean, actually, I've always liked, that's almost the Ellis Island spelling. Zastupil? Pronunciation, yeah. The real pronunciation is Zastupil, which I think is cooler. What kind of name is it? I think it's Tricolsovacian.

Oh, really? Yeah. So the Tarantino thing didn't happen until later. Yeah. And I never knew him at all. So when I took the name tarantino of like around 18 or 19 it was simply because it sounded cool it was italian yeah it sounded quentin tarantino sounded like a cool name it had nothing to do with him and it had nothing to do

with the family it was simply just i thought it was a cool sounding name right but it is your and it had it yeah and it is my name yeah and it had a and it but it also had the benefit of uh uh reinvention because i had never used it right right exciting new thing but you're the one of the few guys that you know creates a stage name that's actually your actual name yeah because you had zestable which would not have been as compelling as tarantino probably well if i had to do it all over again i wouldn't use the name tarantino if i had to do it all over again i would uh call yourself burt Reynolds? No, no. I wish. I would use my middle name, which is Jerome, as my last name. I would be Quentin Jerome.

Really? Yeah. Huh. I think you made the right choice. I get it. But when did you, did you at some point investigate your real father? No. All right.

Because, you know, well, he had 30 fucking years to find me all right and he never did but then when i became famous he crawled out of the woodwork did he yeah yeah oh what was that like fucking horrible really yeah it was a drag it was a drag what'd he do well he just you know he just uh hey buddy yeah he tried he tried to reach out to me uh i i wasn't interested and then all of a sudden uh this woman named jamie bernard wrote a a book about me the first biography about me uh is i had done two movies all right and the book was called quentin tarantino the man in his movies two movies both of them were just uh reservoir dogs and yeah pulp fiction yeah so it's like the man in his movies.

It's a little premature. Yeah, both of them. There you go. So she was kind of the expert on me at that moment in time. And all of a sudden, he got in contact with her. And then she's like, oh my God, I'm talking to the father that no one's ever talked to before. So she does this whole interview- With that guy. With him. Who knows nothing. Who I've never met. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. You can't even say that he was a bad dad and maybe that reflected on Quentin's life. No, he was not there.

Did he manufacture a story? Well, he just talked about himself and talked about himself. And the picture of him is him dressed in a black suit like a reservoir dog pointing a gun. Oh, my God. Yeahing a gun. Oh, my God. Yeah, it was pretty tasteless. So, did you have a confrontation with the guy? No, I just wanted him to go away. But you never talked to him?

Look, one time... Yeah. One time... Did he ask you to be in a movie? No, no, no. Okay, that's something else. Okay, that's something else. Oh, it is.

Okay, so... He wanted to be an actor a long time ago yeah and then sometime in the 90s yeah him

and Al Pacino's estranged father Sal Pacino no hooked up and they started doing these straight to video movies really

starring them so you could actually put on the video box Pacino and Tarantino in you know, Silver Dudes with Guns or whatever that was called. And so they started doing these straight to video movies.

Did you watch any? No, I never saw any. I didn't even want to know what the guy looks like. It's hilarious. The only movies you won't watch. Yeah, right. I mean, oddly enough, to actually the guy looks like it's hilarious the the the movie the only movies you won't watch yeah right i mean oddly enough to actually to i actually think there is something look i'm not into this dude right but i actually think there is something kind of sweet yeah about the idea that the son that he never saw ever allowed him to have somewhat of a semblance of the career that he never saw ever allowed him to have somewhat

of a semblance of the career that he was never able to get on his own. I actually think there's something sweet about that. It's done as exploitively as possible, but nevertheless, he was able to end up living his dream doing these straight-to-video movies, acting and playing roles,

and my fame gave him that. I mean, i'm compassionate enough to appreciate that yeah i think that's actually kind of a good thing yeah if he had been cool yeah and hadn't tried to horn in yeah and he had just had some class yeah i would actually be all down i might have even looked him up right if he had if he had had class right so So then one day I was in a cafe. Yeah. And I'm in a cafe. I'm ordering something. And all of a sudden he's just there.

Yeah. And he's like, hi, it's me. And I look up and I knew exactly who it was. Yeah. Does he look like you? No. No, he doesn't look like me. Not that I think. Okay. i go oh yeah this is it i knew yeah i knew this day was going yeah yeah yeah and he goes yep

that day is today and he goes may i sit and i just just looked at the table and I waved him away with my hand. I just looked down. I didn't want to look. I looked at him when I said, uh. Yeah, yeah. And then I just looked down at my plate and I just waved him away. Yeah. I just, just go.

Right. Just go. Just go. Yeah. And he went. And that was it. That was it. Huh.

You don't know if he's alive or dead? I'm sure he's alive. No. He's done enough that when he dies they'll they'll write about oh right right right he'll get a variety piece oh i'm sure i'm sure i'm not saying it's gonna be front page all right so what was the relationship like you know not unlike deliverance you know when did because manson plays pretty heavy in everything in your your brain. Yeah, yeah. And mine too. But I don't know that I have specific recollections

of it when I was a kid. It might be there, but I don't. I remember body counts in war footage and I remember deliverance, but I don't really remember the Manson events. Well, okay. I don't remember. I remember Manson, the name.

Yeah. But I don't remember the events, Manson, the name. Yeah. But I don't remember the events. But I actually remember it very clearly because I'm looking at this hammer because it's making me think of what I'm talking about. Yeah. Because there was a thing between, I guess, 69 and 70 where I was sort of watching the news with my parents. Yeah. But the only things that grabbed me were violent murders. Sure, of course.

Because you can understand that. Shanghai Shack and Phnom Penh. I don't know what that means. Yeah, but like, this guy killed these people. Yeah, but then there was a guy who was running around Southern California killing people with a hammer. I've never heard about him ever since, but it was a big deal then. And I think it only lasted a few months,

but in a weird way, I was into this hammer guy as if it was a movie or a TV show. What happened with the hammer guy? Yeah. It was another thing with the hammer guy. And then after they caught the hammer guy, then there was somebody else doing something that was intriguing enough that I was like, kind of like glued to the TV.

And then all of a sudden those guys went away and then it was about Manson. Yeah. And it was just a name. I didn't understand anything that went on or anything. It was just a name. Manson, Manson, Manson, Manson. And it was, I heard the name enough. And I don't know, I don't know if I even had visual imagery going with, but I heard the name Manson enough that at one point I asked Kurt, I go, um, who's this Manson guy? And he was like, no, you don't need to know that. You don't need to know that. Yeah. Well, did you like, in order to get this, cause I just became obsessed with the idea. Uh, like I was like, I, Quentin, you don't need to know that. Wow. You don't need to know that. Yeah. Well, did you, like, in order to get this, because I just became obsessed with the idea.

Like, I got this weird when I was, you know, years ago when I'd cocained myself into psychosis. You know, things got pretty mystical. So I needed some answers. Right, yeah, yeah. I needed to know about the credibility of witchcraft, the history of it. So, you know, you start reading about this. of witchcraft, the history of it. So, you know, you start reading about this, but the thing about the movie and the book Once Upon a Time in Hollywood is that effectively, you know, Manson was the catalyst for the

death of the 60s, period. Yes. And, you know, that and speed, right? Yeah, right. So, like, and he was a witch, you know, and he did have a sort of weird agenda, but like not unlike, I think the thing I love about the ending of the movie that, you know, that this was clearly, you know, not unlike Hitler in the other movie. Yeah. You were like, I just need to correct.

Yeah. Yeah. Right. Oh, yeah, absolutely. This story doesn't end. Yeah. Right. Yeah.

Oh, actually, I have to say one of the things that was a great name drop for two seconds. Yeah. All right. I I'm friendly with uh dan akroyd and his wife donna oh yeah and uh um oh my god i can't imagine you two in a room drink a lot of vodka yeah a lot of talking yeah and then he uh they went and saw uh the film when it came out and he left this cool message on the machine it's like particularly great about dan akroyd leaving a message on your answering machine. And he leaves a message on the answering machine.

Hey, Quentin, just to let you know, me and Donna saw Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. It was fantastic. We loved it. You don't have to call back. Just letting you know that we loved it. And boy, those hippies sure picked the wrong fucking house that night. Yeah. Well, and the fact that you, like, but see, you you you you got and in the book even more so

about him and about the nature of that guy i mean there's a lot of been a lot of books written about him but did you read that like that newell emmons book like manson in his own words oh yes i did yeah by the guy i i i don't think i read that one from a chapter a cover to cover yeah but i read um obviously i read helter skelter, which is basically a bunch of bullshit. Did you read Nicholas Schreck's thing, The Manson File? Any of that stuff? No, I read The Family. Oh, yeah, The Family.

I read Helter Skelter, which is mostly bullshit. Right. And I read that new book that came out, Manson, which was fantastic. Was it? It was, I mean, fantastic. The best one. That's where you got most of the information. Yeah.

Well, that was, well, no, that just gave you more. It was more of a biography about him. Yeah. And it had stuff that hadn't been in the other ones. But then the Tom O'Neill tops them all. The Tom O'Neill book tops them all. Which one's that? That's the new one, Chaos. Oh, Chaos.

I mean, that's just- That's it? That's the one. Okay. That's the one. All the other ones are preambles to that one. Well, what do you hinge your fascination on that guy with? Because there's elements

of him in a couple of female characters. Well, you know, I actually exercised my fascination with him by doing the movie and everything. But I think there is

an aspect, you can't be from Southern California. And not be fascinated. Yeah, especially our age, our generation. It's like he really had something, especially for the Gen Xers.

Yeah. There was something mythological. Well, yeah, that's a position he holds. Do you know I'm the guy that told Paul McCartney that he was dead? Oh, what? Yeah. When I interviewed Paul, I just sort of brought up this idea that's sort of like, how'd you guys handle the whole hell? Oh, yeah.

And he's like, well, we didn't have a press strategy, you know, because it didn't exist then. Right. And I'm like, you know, he died. He's like, I didn't know that. Like, I told Paul McCartney that Manson died. Oh, really? Yeah. Oh, my God. Oh, I thought you were talking about the Paul is dead thing. No, no, no. Like, the real Paul McCartney didn't know he was dead. Okay, by the way,

we're talking about when being a little kid. When I was a little kid around that time. Yeah. My dad believed the Paul is dead story to be true. Who, Curtis? Yeah, Curtis believed the Paul is dead thing. Really? Everybody believed it for a while. I mean, I didn't know everybody.

I was a little kid. But I mean, that was taken really, really seriously for about two years. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And my dad- So he listened to the I buried Paul. Yeah, well, the whole thing. He's barefoot, crossing Abbey Road. Abbey Road, right, yeah. And my dad- So he listened to the I Buried Paul. Yeah, well, the whole thing. Oh, and he's barefoot, crossing Abbey Road. Yeah, Abbey Road, right, right.

And then like, and he, I go, what do you mean he's dead? I was ridiculously skeptical about the whole thing. But, and then he started explaining it. Because he listened to the, watched this show and listened to this radio thing or whatever. That's interesting. It's how some people explain your movies. Yeah. What that's about.

I mean, but I mean, people took the Paul is dead thing ridiculously seriously. Well, look at the world we live in now. People want to, will believe anything. Yeah. And it doesn't matter if it has any foundation in reality. It seems sometimes that the more it doesn't have a foundation in reality, if it's interesting and it gives them a sense of control and mystery, they'll fucking buy it.

Well, look, okay. I have been known in my life to tell outrageous whopper lies to get out of shit. Yeah. And I learned fairly quickly, the more outrageous the lie, the more people will believe it because like, well, what kind of fucking lunatic would come up with that shit? Right, right. And then it just becomes part of your person.

Like you're that guy. Yeah. You've And then it just becomes part of your person. Like you're that guy. Yeah. You've told the lie and like the lie becomes real. I'm going to tell, if I was going to tell a boss a fucking lie, it's going to be a big one. You literally have to call me a liar to my face. And that is how you started to craft stories. Yeah.

Well, there was another interesting moment in this book where you kind of summed up all of the, you know, like, I thought I underlined it. I underlined weird things. There was a couple of things, like, it was a small fucking town. When I talk to, like, Begley or Walter Hill or any of the old timers, Nick Nolte, I'm always fascinated with the idea that that community of that time, of the people that you're sort of paying an homage to in the book and in the movie, it was really a small community of people that all kind of knew each other. Everybody was sort of around. Yeah. Like, you know, all that stuff about the thing about Manson's access to the music business was because it was a small town.

It was a small town. And Dennis Wilson was like, you know, oh, this guy seems cool. Yeah. But I kind of love like i feel a nostalgia for that you and i didn't live it but i always like talking to those guys you know who like like you ever talked to begley uh yes i have yes like he was he'd been to spawn ranch dude oh wow what not he didn't meet manson but he went out there one night with some friend of his yeah like like Went down there and saw some girls.

Yeah. The girls. The girls. But I really appreciated that whole part of it. And the other thing I wanted to bring up was you summed up what the story structure is for most movies, most plays. I can't remember the paragraph. You know what I'm talking about?

Which one? It was just sort of like, this is what happens in almost all stories oh yeah okay is that is that me wrapping up the gun smoke episode maybe maybe yeah what was it though do you remember yeah it was about the idea that uh once the james stacy character kills this guy well now you know that at the end of the episode matt dylan's gonna shoot him right and now you're just sitting there waiting for that to happen right even though you like the guy. Right. But that is going to be how it ends. Yeah.

And now you're just waiting for that to happen. And that's like almost all stories. Yeah, exactly. Well, it's definitely all gun smokes, but you could apply that to a lot of genres. Shakespeare. Yeah. What's the other thing? Oh, I like the Pauline Kael quote.

And then I just like, the way you sort of pull apart Manson. And the bit that I was thinking of do you remember the Sam Kennison bit it's one of my favorite bits of his oh yeah oh yeah glad to see your fuckers can handle your yes exactly oh you're leaving right now right right you still have time to shove a chainsaw up my ass yeah but that line glad to see you fuckers can handle your erased all of what he represented yes absolutely and it was genius and you did it with cliff yeah where you're like you know where he goes no that ain't it where he goes i'm the devil and i'm here to do the devil no something stupid

yeah it's like the greatest fucking comic beat i love it i just i love i love all of it now what is this all this about that you you know it might be your last movie what where's that coming from okay that what what's that's coming from the way was that just a day no no no that comes from the way the press handles stuff you do it's a podcast you say something there's obviously a giggle in your voice sure all right and then 134 outlets all right pick it up because they don't want the giggle in the voice right that's not clickbait yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah right i get it so it was just taken out of context you have no intention to quit working no no no i still got another no i like i'm is there a part two of this it looks like there's a lot of outtakes in that trailer yeah yeah there is how much how much footage is that hasn't wasn't used no i think

that i think if i were to like uh put it all together in a way where I would use everything I wanted and didn't have to worry about time or something, it'd probably be about three hours and 20 minutes or something. Really? Yeah, yeah. But it's sort of interesting, some of the choices you made, because it's clear that in that trailer for the book, some of the things that you didn't put in, like Manson's goofy dance when he sees Cliff, you don the things that you didn't put in, like, you know, Manson's goofy dance when he sees Cliff.

Like, you don't need that. Like that Manson. Well, no, look, that was good. And like Brad is still, I think, annoyed that I didn't have that in there because it was like it wrapped up everything. In what way? Well, it just, well, they wrapped up the entire encounter. All right. He shows up at the house.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Then they look at each other. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's a great Manson bit, the little goofy dance. Yeah. look at each other. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's a great Manson bit, the little goofy dance he does. And everything, fuck you, Jack. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. We were saying, fuck you, Jack, all right, through the whole fucking set.

I used to do a bit about Manson about how he's become sort of the old vaudevillian of serial killers. Yeah, yes, exactly. Still doing that bit. Hey, man. Yeah, exactly. He's the Georgie Jessel. Yeah, yeah. The serial killer.

So you just didn't put that in because you wanted to keep it tight, a tight two and a half? Well, it was even more than that. It was more the, yes, I did. But the thing is, especially when you're doing like a long movie where, okay, now here's this guy's story. And now we have to go to her story. And now we have to go to this guy's story. You know, throughout the whole thing, you're pacing it. You're pacing it.

Right. And you can't wear out your welcome. Yeah. Where like, yeah, I can have that in here now. But will that wear out the welcome on this sequence coming up here? Yeah. So I thought I needed to cut it shorter because then I thought the scene between the little girl and Rick would run too long. Right.

So you just have to. So it's just the pacing thing is the audience has just got to keep up with you. Right. All right. And if you just stay run too long. Right. So you just have to, so it's just the pacing thing is the audience has just got to keep up with you. Right. All right. And if you just stay here too long, if you stay here too long, it's not going to be because you stayed too long in the scene you're watching. Yeah. It's because you stayed too long in an earlier scene. Okay.

Right, right, right. And now it's catching up with them. But you also have a sense of when the thing is drooping. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Because like all that stuff with DiCaprio, like you, yourio, he's sort of unlike anybody, isn't he? Yeah, he is.

I mean, I can't. When I was watching that, the amount of laugh, sort of almost crying I did just watching him wrangle that dude. It's crazy. But in the book, this is Cliff's book. Yeah. Don't you think? you're so like this is cliff's book yeah don't you think um i think it can appear that way because there's those isolated chapters about him but it just seems like the depth of of dalton is relative to his experience as an actor which is you know he's but that But that's him. I get it. I get it, right? But the depth of Cliff-

Oh, that's, well, yes. You know, is something that, you know, goes further back. And also there's no childhood things in here. No, there's no, no, there's no child, oh yeah, there's no childhood things. But there was an interesting section though because when I first handed the book in

to my editor and he's looking at it, he goes, you know, Quentin, for the last four chapters, we don't have any Cliff. I mean, Cliff's in the bar with them at the Drinker's Hall of Fame, but he's not talking. I'm really kind of missing him. I go, well, I don't want to just hop to him going back to Pasadena or something like that or Van Nuys. I don't want to just hop to him going back to Pasadena or something like that, or Van Nuys. I don't want to just hop to that. But then I remembered I had that Aldo Ray chapter that I had written a long time ago. Right.

And I go, well, I can stick something in here there, and that will be like a hop forward. And that's like one of those weird kind of like, I don't know all the names, so I don't know who's real and who isn't. Yeah. So I don't know who's real and who isn't. But like all the Ray thing and its foundation in actual events and history is really like a weird little kind of a true Hollywood history snippet. Oh, it absolutely is. And then it plays with the novel because it's like, well, that's what Rick could become if he lets his drinking get too bad. But it's so weird that the balance of your fascination with that era of hollywood where you had all these studio players that were still around some of them isn't the guy in the bookstore one of the old-timers oh yeah yeah so like you know you have this you know this

uh this kind of like um uh respect and and and but but all the the the subterranean story, the dark side of all this stuff is equally happening. Yeah. And it's all part of it, the yin and yang of Hollywood, the illusion and what's behind the illusion, and the sort of terrible kind of tragic existential sad stories that happen. No, no. I mean, you've always had, in Hollywood, you've had great success standing right next to great failure. Right. Constantly.

And so you look at Aldo Ray, one of his big movies that's a classic, a film noir classic. Yeah. It's the film Nightfall. Right. And then, okay, so you look at him, and in that movie, he's starring opposite Anne Bancroft. Right. Okay, so now you look at Anne Bancroft's career in 1969. And you look at Aldo Ray's career inft. Right. Okay, so now you look at Anne Bancroft's career in 1969 and you look at Aldo Ray's

career in 1969. Right. Then you look at Aldo Ray's career in 1977 when he's actually acting in a porn movie and you look at Anne Bancroft's career in 1977. But there was a time that they sat on a barstool together and they were leads. Yeah. Crazy. It's crazy because

like there's something that dark seedy part of Hollywood informs the good part and they're inseparable after a certain point. And it's part of the allure and the charm of it. And I think it's also part of what we were talking about at the beginning, that there are none of those men anymore, like Lee Marvin or Bronson, because they embodied that. They embodied it, absolutely. And now everybody is so self-aware and so careerist and that the platforms and the possibilities have been spread so thin that there's no sense of community and no sense of real heroes of film anymore. Well, just that whole changing of the zeitgeist at that time. I mentioned a thing in there and yeah where um it's just a mind fuck yeah for rick he's like okay wait a minute now people like me are passe and then it's like people like lee marvin and charles bronson and lee van cleef who were bad guys in every fucking single Western TV show out there.

They're now the stars. Yeah. What the fuck is this world we're living in? And me and Ty Harden are on our fucking ass. What's going on? And also, right. But also that focus on the outfit that they wanted him to, as a decatur, they wanted him to look more like a hippie. Yeah, yeah.

Like he couldn't quite accept it or process it, but eventually he gets the hang of it because the kid thinks it's cool yeah yeah yeah like well i even like the idea when he's like looking at the mirror himself and he's like somewhere along the line the pompadour became him right and he just doesn't that that's it became an image yeah but when he's like wearing the long wig with the droopy mustache and he's looking at himself he sees a guy he's never seen before right yeah and all of a sudden oh wow he kind of sees what marvin shores was saying the with the droopy mustache and he's looking at himself. He sees a guy he's never seen before. Right. Yeah.

And all of a sudden, oh, wow, he kind of sees what Marvin Shores was saying the other night. Yes. Oh, okay. It dawns on him.

This guy doesn't look like an Eisenhower relic. That's right. This guy could be in a Peckinpah movie. Yet he still calls the fucking hippie in the car Dennis Hopper.

Yeah, right. He still identifies that. So do you find like because now we're at another paradigm shift right or about 10 years out from one do you do you ever feel because i feel it and you know and i was never that relevant but do you feel that you struggled to maintain relevance no not really because uh i i guess if this movie came out and people were like, quitting who? I guess I was like, oh, okay. I guess the parade has passed me by.

All right. I guess there was an expiration date. Right, right, right. But no, it seemed like it was a big deal. Yeah. And the fact that people think me retiring is still a big deal, that they're talking about it all the time. I guess it makes me think that my place is pretty good. You still got your own float in the parade. I haven't.

I'm not underdog. I'm still Bart Simpson. I have Bart Simpson's position at the Thanksgiving Day Parade. Yeah. But when you think about the kid in your new life and you seem pretty grounded yeah and more well adjusted than i think maybe you've been in the past yeah probably well you know getting married to the right woman having a good kid you know yeah all of a sudden being surrounded by people who love you as opposed to uh sycophants and weirdos smoking pot all day and night in your room

yeah yeah did that help you? I enjoyed it. Yeah. I enjoyed it. Yeah. It's amazing that you can- I enjoyed it too much because it was all like, well, what's going to be better than that? Yeah. It's an easy, yeah. It always sort of fucked with my memory a little bit. My memory's not holding up as well as I'd like it to anyways. But it felt like the reason why I kind of focused on those statements about possible retirement, because it feels like the reason why i kind of focused on those statements about like possible retirement because it feels like that they're this somehow this was kind of like an homage a love letter a farewell this was like this was like to me the most honest movie about what was your passion your entire life that you owed it to that generation of guys that's very well that's very

well said and it's also one of those weird things where, you know, and the book was able to even go even further with it. Where it's like, look, I am an expert about this stuff. Because like I said, I've been filling my brain with it. Right, right. And then to actually write this movie, like, oh my God, I finally have a narrative thing I can do where I can use this expert knowledge. Right. And I don't need to take everybody along with me when I do this. I'm just going to bombard you with all this terminology and this stuff and you get what you get.

But I mean, I always liked it in movies where like something like Bull Durham. You go see Bull Durham. When you walk out, you feel like you're a bit of an expert on the minor league baseball because they're talking above your head. Right. But they know what the fuck they're talking about. Sure, sure. But there's enough to the game that they know that, well, the people that just like baseball,

they're going to— But even people who don't know shit about minor league baseball, you walk out feeling a bit like an expert. Right. And also, I think it inspires people to sort of engage on a different level. Absolutely. Like, I think that because of you, you know, you've say you've salvaged or introduced a lot of people to all different types of movies from all different parts of the world. Yeah. And, you know, that's a very gratifying the fact that, especially as a guy who worked at a video store whose job was recommending movies to people and trying to get them

to walk on the wild side a little bit. You know, there's a, you know, there's almost now, about 30 years down the line, almost two different generations

of people who got into my movies and read my interviews and heard the things that I liked. Spaghetti Westerns, Italian horror films, Kung Fu movies, martial arts, samurai shit. And then went, oh, he likes that? Well, let me give that a shot. Oh, wow, that's really cool. I think, oh, Mario Bava, he's really neat.

Let me see another Mario Bava movie. Dario Argento, who's that? Right, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, you did that for people now do like dessert are you uh nervous about the challenges of filmmaking you know post-covid or do you think you think you'll be able to do a movie on the scale of something like uh once upon a time in hollywood again um i think it remains to be seen yeah i think it remains to be seen. I mean, I am not sure right now we could make a $95 million movie like Once Upon a Time in Hollywood and release it theatrically and have it make $300 million simply by asses in seats. I don't know that yeah in fact i i

would guess not right now that it might become that way again yeah but but i mean not simultaneously streaming not where any other money is coming from any other where other than an ass in a seat yeah and that was the case with once upon a time in hollywood right and it was a nice build too it kept going it did yeah two You had two roles, right? Yeah, I think there actually was, you know, as of now, we'll see what happens. As of now, 2019 was the last year of movies as we know it. Right. The way we've known it.

Right. I think there is an aspect that, like, I literally, me in 1917, Joker, we threw through the fucking window just before a slam shot. Right. Our tail feathers practically got caught in the wood. Yeah. I don't know if a movie can make as much as the Joker just by asses and seats the way that did. I mean, that was fucking phenomenal. Yeah.

I was in that movie. I know that i i'd like to think that i i put at least eight of those asses yeah i think i was good for 112 dollars on that out of the half a billion that it made oh i have to let you know actually uh um early on in the pre-production of once upon a Time in Hollywood, I flirted around with the idea of, I couldn't be happier with what Dakota Fanning did. She was one of the actually best performances in the movie. I think she's amazing as Squeaky Fromm. She becomes Squeaky Fromm. Oh, yeah.

But early on, I investigated the idea of Jennifer Lawrence. Yes. Playing Squeaky. Yeah. And so she came down to the house. Yeah. To read the script because I wasn't letting it out. Yeah. So she came down to the house and I just gave her the script. Yes. Playing Squeaky. Yeah. And so she came down to the house to read the script because I wasn't letting it out.

Yeah. So she came down to the house and I just gave her the script. Okay, go in my living room or go outside by the pool and read it. And so she read it and then afterwards

we talked about it a little bit and she was interested in doing but then it didn't work out. Yeah. But she's a very nice person and I respect her as an actress. But she actually, she goes,

can I just make a recommendation for somebody to cast? And I go, oh yeah, sure. You know that agent guy that talks to Rick at the beginning? Why don't you cast Marc Maron for that? I think he would be really, really good. Well, I'm actually kind of thinking that Marvin Schwartz should be like

significantly older than Marc Maron but I actually see what you mean. If he wasn't if I wasn't basing it on that older O'Fello, yeah, he could do a good job with that part. Oh, that is very nice. She was in there pitching for you, man. Well, good.

Now I have my great escape story. I wouldn't say I was close to getting the part, but I was on a list. Yeah, you were sort of on a list. I think you could legitimately say. Well, thanks, man. Metaphoric list. Well, thanks, buddy.

It was great talking to you. You too, man. Thanks for coming. Hey, thanks for reading the book. I really appreciate it. I loved the book. And I burned through it because I wanted to, not because I had to. Good deal, man.

Thanks a bunch. Good times. Good conversation. Thanks, man. There you go. There you go. There you go. He had to go. He had to drive off.

He had to drive off in his yellow GT500 Ford Mustang with the black stripe. He had to get on to another thing. But that was great. That was really, it was humbling and flattering to me but also it was great to get to know him and when he was leaving it was hilarious because Brendan told him I've only come out for two interviews from New York

President Obama and you and he was very flattered and humbled by that. But it was interesting because he really had a good time and he thought it was great. He was beside himself. He couldn't believe it was just a natural conversation. He kept saying, it was just a conversation. Yeah.

And he was very excited to get the mug. The Brian Jones hand-thrown cat mug. And again Jones hand-thrown cat mug. And again, I can't... Not that he needs bread or that I need to sell this. It's not on me to sell it, but I enjoyed the book a lot.

Once Upon a Time in Hollywood by Quentin Tarantino. If you read the book and then watch the movie again, there's a depth to the movie that can't really be seen or even imagined. I don't know. They both feed each other nicely, but the book stands on its own. As does the movie that you know can't really be seen or even imagined i don't know they both feed each other nicely but the book stands on its own as does the movie obviously and it also sounds a little like there's a director's cut you know like a second one like a real director's cut

somewhere happening uh i guess more will be revealed as as they say in the racket. Okay. Enjoy. Enjoy your lives. Enjoy your day. I'm going to play some guitar. Thank you. guitar solo Thank you. Boomer lives Monkey and Lafonda Cat angels everywhere. I'm Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing.

With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative.

It's a night for the whole family. Be a part of Kids Night when the Toronto Rock take on the Colorado Mammoth at a special 5 p.m. start time on Saturday, March 9th at First Ontario Centre in Hamilton. The first 5,000 fans in attendance will get a Dan Dawson bobblehead courtesy of Backley Construction. Punch your ticket to Kids Night on Saturday, March 9th at 5pm in Rock City at torontorock.com.