WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1261 - Tim Reid

Episode Date: September 13, 2021

Tim Reid's life changed on a New Year's Eve in the 1960s when he lucked his way into a club to see a hot young comedian. That club was Mister Kelly's, that comedian was Richard Pryor and nothing has been the same for Tim since. Tim tells Marc about his segregated upbringing, how he and Tom Dressen created the first interracial comedy team, how he got out of comedy and into acting with roles like Venus Fly Trap on WKRP in Cincinnati, and why he's currently spending a lot of his time on historical preservation. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Be honest. When was the last time you thought about your current business insurance policy? If your existing business insurance policy is renewing on autopilot each year without checking out Zensurance, you're probably spending more than you need. That's why you need to switch to low-cost coverage from Zensurance before your policy renews this year.

Zensurance does all the heavy lifting to find a policy, covering only what you need. And policies start at only $19 per month. So if your policy is renewing soon, go to Zensurance and fill out a quote. Zensurance. Mind your business. Lock the gates! soon, go to Zensurance and fill out a quote. Zensurance, mind your business. All right, let's do this. How are you? What the fuckers? What the fuck buddies? What the fuck nicks? What's happening? I'm Mark Mar maron this is my podcast wtf welcome to it how's everybody doing tim reed is my guest today tim reed uh i imagine most of you know him as venus flytrap from wkrp in cincinnati i don't know that my younger listeners would know that

he also had a show uh a fairly uh revolutionary, just in the sense it was a black lead. But that was Frank's place. And I mean, he's been on dozens of TV shows and he's a director as well. But he's been working for at least 50 years. And he started as a comic. This is the intent. This is what brought me to him. Tom Dreesen, who was on this show, also a comic, lifer, was in a comedy team with Tim Reed in the 70s. And they performed at the comedy store.

And Dreesen went on to live a life in stand-up. And Tim went on to act. And the reason he's on is he's part of this new documentary called Live at Mr. Kelly's, and it's about the iconic Chicago nightclub, Mr. Kelly's, which has been mentioned on this show by several old-timers. Shelly Berman comes to mind. But it was this very popular but progressive

and interesting nightclub in Chicago. I think it was started maybe in the 50s or 60s i don't know watch the documentary when it comes out but you know getting back into that old comedy talk old comedy store talk i just love it and i'm so weirdly not weirdly but i am definitely born again comedy store, but I never left. I mean, you know, the pandemic, you know, I wasn't there, but I am there every night. I mean, if you get excited, if you work at a place every night and all of a sudden you're like excited to get the new T-shirts, you are part of that place. I've been an appendage of that place since I was 21 years old, 22 years old. appendage of that place since i was 21 years old 22 years old i just wasn't around for a few years but you know you know the story about me in that place i'm just fucking happy about the new t-shirts

come on the world is ending buy yourself some pants went out bought some pants i slightly fat pants not totally fat pants slightly fat pants we'll see what happens and i went and got i went to this place because i wanted to get these weird ass pants and i it doesn't matter doesn't matter i'm just saying treat yourself throw away those underpants they're they're nasty um but what i was saying is i've had a couple weeks downtime between you know my last gig when was that salt lake City and St. Louis, which is this week. Come on down.

There are some tickets left, certainly for the late shows, which would be nice if you come. And I promise I won't dump on the state too much when I'm there. I'll do the other stuff. I'll do a broader dumpage, funny dumpage. I spoke to my father. He's losing his mind a little bit starting to happen and it's uh it's sad and scary but it does make him a little

more vulnerable uh which is kind of nice in an emotional way i mean i'm just looking for a silver lining you know what i? Don't miss that sweet spot at the beginning of whatever breakdown is happening mentally to your loved ones. But I've forgotten that he and his wife, Rosie, sometimes spend

the day at the movies, either watching the same movie again and again or going from theater to theater in a multiplex. And my dad and his wife went to see The Card Counter, the new Paul Schrader film, which looks pretty good. But, you know, Paul Schrader is not an easy filmmaker to process and digest. There's been some Paul Schrader movies that defy narrative standards.

There's been some great ones. Schrader's heavy, man. So I guess I get on the phone with my dad, and he and his wife had gone to see the card counter. My father's like, I don't know. I couldn't follow it. I didn't understand it. And even when Rosie explained it to me, I still couldn't get it.

I didn't understand it. And I'm like, well, I mean, you know, maybe it's just the way it's going to be from now on, Dad. Some of these things are going to get by you. He's like, no, we saw it again. I still didn't understand. So they sat there and watched it twice, and my father couldn't wrap his brain around it. It just seemed too complicated. And then when I realized it was a Paul Schrader movie,

I realized, like, you know what? It might not be my father's mental state right now. It might actually be the film. So I'm going to give my dad the benefit of the doubt until I see the movie. And I will see the movie. It's playing down the street. I always like his movie.

Auto Focus, really, Auto Focus is a masterpiece. And obviously, some of the movies he's written were quite good. People enjoy The Taxi Driver. Blue Collar, that was an amazing movie. He wrote and directed that with Richard Pryor, Harvey Keitel. Hardcore, that weird George C C Scott movie where he goes to like rescue his daughter from the world of porn that was a written and directed by Schrader great he wrote Raging Bull amazing geez man wrote The Last Temptation of Christ

heavy hitter man but the review from my father was, the card counter is complicated. I couldn't follow it. Barry Marin. All right, folks, let's talk to Tim Reed. The documentary Live at Mr. Kelly's will be released next month on VOD and DVD. But, you know, Tim has had a life

in show business and a life in comedy early on in his career, and I was curious about that. And it was nice talking to this guy. It's hockey season, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats.

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Because those are groceries, and we deliver those too. Along with your favorite restaurant food, alcohol, and other everyday essentials. Order Uber Eats now. For alcohol, you must be legal drinking age. Please enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by region. See app for details. Be honest.

When was the last time you thought about your current business insurance policy? If your existing business insurance policy is renewing on autopilot each year without checking out Zensurance, you're probably spending more than you need. That's why you need to switch to low-cost coverage from Zensurance before your policy renews this year. Zensurance does all the heavy lifting to find a policy, covering only what you need, and policies start at only $19 per month.

So if your policy is renewing soon, go to Zensurance and fill out a quote. Zensurance, mind your business. Hi. So where are you, down there in Virginia? Yeah, Richmond. My office is at Richmond. Oh, that's nice.

I've been there. I did comedy there a million years ago. What place then? I don't know what was happening then. There was a small club there. God, I wish I could remember the name of it. I did it a couple of times because I knew I had a friend down there. You come from there? Point of Ray is in Norfolk, further down, about

an hour south of here. I have no sense of Virginia. On the ocean, where all the ships are built. Oh, that's nice. But as a state, would you say it's a good state? Oh, gosh, yes. It's, right now, economically, it's the most economically sound state in the Union. Really? Yeah. What's the business? Oh, you name it. I mean, we have several military operations here, the Pentagon, Langley.

But we also have the shipbuilding part for the armed forces. All the carriers and ships are built down in Norfolk Hampton Roads area. Was that what business your family was in? No, no, no, no, no. I was born and raised in what we would call nowadays Colortown. So we weren't allowed to work in those industries at that time. Oh, no kidding. So what'd your folks do?

Laborers. My mother and my grandmother started out working in white folks' homes. And then my grandmother was a businesswoman, owned a boarding house, sold whiskey illegal, and ran the numbers. So she did very well. Did you remember her? Very much. I was raised by her. Oh, really?

So she did what was necessary. Yeah, and in a very interesting way, to say the least. She was a very tough woman. I mean, had great character, but not to be fooled with by anyone. Really? Tough. If you didn't pay the rent, you might get knocked out. Really?

Yeah. That song, one of my favorite songs was Betty Davis' Eyes, because my grandmother had Betty Davis' Eyes, sort of like an attitude like Humphrey Bogart, but she was a tough woman. Wow. So how come you were raised by her? Well, my mother couldn't handle me at that point. She was going through some very difficult times. And she was living in Baltimore.

I was in Baltimore with her at that time. And around the age nine, I didn't know who my father was at that time, but around the age nine, she said, maybe it's best that you go live with your grandmother and she can take better care of you. And so I did. And I stayed with my grandmother until my teen years. Wonderful, exciting life, to say the least. It's one of the reasons I'm in the business I'm in today, because my grandmother designated me as the family storyteller. So she would force me to reiterate what was happening in the family. Or if I went to church, you know, I had to go to church on Sundays to get my

allowance. If I didn't go, I didn't get my 25 cents. So, but I would also have to tell the stories of what happened in the choir on Thursday rehearsals and what was going on in the neighborhood. on Thursday rehearsals and what was going on in the neighborhood. As I said, we lived in a segregated, very busy and interesting community at that time prior to civil rights. And most of the people in my area were workers, post office, educators. And very interesting. I never spoke socially to a white person. I worked for one until I was a freshman in college.

Really? Completely segregated. So was that out of fear or just the way it was? No, out of choice. It was our neighborhood. White folks didn't come down to where we were. They did. They were wearing a badge or trying to collect insurance money for some bogus policy. insurance money for some bogus policy.

Right. But a few, you know, we had some, a few merchants, Jewish merchants who ran small shops or, but by and large, all the businesses from my growing up were owned or operated by Blacks. We had about seven movie theaters in walking distance of my house and they were all managed or owned by Black drugstores. It was an interesting community to be in. It was all sort of changed and lost. Much of it lost in terms of its self-sufficiency.

Our dollar didn't leave our neighborhood until about maybe seven or eight times turning over before it left our neighborhood. Would you return back to that neighborhood? Did it just sort of dissipate or what happened to it? Well, you know, when the dominant culture realizes you got a good thing, of course, they want to take a part of it and soon take it over. It's all gone. I have a photo that was taken at this time. I lived in my grandmother's house. This is my grandmother's third house. And because they took the first two in eminent domain when they wanted to bring, as they did in all the segregated communities in the South, they ran the freeway system through it or built new thoroughfares for other folks to move through it quickly. And of course, they tore down and took over the housing.

took over the housing so in this picture you might see i would say maybe three to four thousand homes from this aerial photograph in 1953 54 and today you might only see 30 or 40 it's so amazing you bring that up because you know i was watching the mr kelly's documentary yesterday, Dick Gregory does a joke about it, about the freeway. Yeah. And then I read an article today that it's happening again in South Carolina. Of course. You either bring the railroad system or the freeway system through. And of course, you destroy, divide the community. It happened in New Orleans, Memphis, and Chicago, the Dan Ryan, all of that.

happened in new orleans and memphis and chicago the dan ryan all of that um as was designated because first of all they wanted to keep the value of their communities high and and putting a freeway system right through the predominantly black owned homes and and places where they live but they they they i guess they call themselves doing us a favor they built the project of course you can't own them. But it was an interesting life. And I think that not something I say was, it's not a point of better than or it was in context of how we live. And out of that, many people, such as myself, carried on a successful life thereafter from a lot of the survival training we received in those communities. Did you have a sense of, not, I mean, storytelling is one thing, but were you a comedy fan?

No, well, yeah. I mean, in terms of the people who in our neighborhood were successful comedians, uh were successful comedians um i think the first coming of age comic that i saw that i followed throughout my career until his end was richard pryor but when i saw him he was doing like the ed sullivan show yeah stuff like there's a different comic back then right and and which leads me to mr kelly's because it was seeing him at Mr. Kelly's that changed my life and got me in entertainment. But back in those days, there was Moms Mabley, there was Mantan Moreland, there was these wonderful comics who would come through our communities because they had to stay in our communities. So the Black-owned hotels, there was a woman there, a very successful Black woman

called Bonnie McGeechey, and she owned the hotel in Norfolk and a few bars and all the celebrities from Count Basie, Cab Calloway, they all had to stay. They couldn't stay in the white neighborhood. So they stayed in these black communities. And they performed there? Oh, yeah. They performed at one of the two of the theaters. They would have a thing called Midnight Ramblin'. And the Midnight Ramblin' would go on after whatever movie that was showing. After it would start, the movie would be over around 9.30, and they would empty the theaters of all the kids.

And then the adults would come in for the Midnight Ramblin'. You would see live shows. Moms made the whole bit. So you remember seeing that did you see them yeah we used to sneak in we'd hide sneak in and get caught get thrown out but uh and then you know again they they would stay in the neighborhood if they were there for a day or two they would just be passing through not only uh black performers but even some of the white performers uh especially in doing the the craze of cowboy movies back in the late fifties. Yeah.

So, you know, whip, what is it? Whip Wilson, all these guys used to come through. Gabby Hayes almost killed me. He came through and we would have these matinees,

afternoon matinees. It cost you 10 cents. Yeah. And you'd sit in there with hundreds of screaming children. Yeah. And they would show the movie whatever it was outlaws or whatever the movie was and then they would break in between because we would double features in those days sure and they would break and then out would come

this celebrity in this case it was gabby hayes gabby and he got up and you know he was hello kids or whatever he would say and he'd be up there for about, at most, 10 to 15 minutes. And then he was taken off to some other thing. They made that extra money. He asked once, I bring two kids up here. And I happened to be one of the kids he brought up. And for some reason, in his act, he said, I bet you I can lift you with two fingers. And I went, huh?

And when I said that, that hit me right under my throat and literally lift me right off the stage because I was in shock. But he pushed back in my throat. I couldn't breathe. I couldn't get another air. And he noticed that and had one of his guys saw that it was a problem. This kid was probably going to choke to death. So they grabbed me and took me to the side of the wall and threw me out into the street. Really? grabbed me and took me to the side of the wall and threw me out into the street really the door

opened and i went out and the sun was so bright because i'd come out that it awakened me i mean it caused me to get a gas of air yeah and i was able to breathe and i went back in to try it again they wouldn't let me in and i didn't have 10 cents that's crazy on stage that was your big break my big break and it was over in about a matter of a minute. Was being physically abused by a white cowboy actor. Yeah. That's crazy, man. But it's, you know, it's the lesson that you learn in those days stuck with you and you would survive. And one of the reasons I'm so happy to be a part of the discussion of Mr. Kelly's is because when I left that community, I'm telling you about after graduating from college, my first job after the civil rights era was being hired by EI DuPont.

And I was the first black hired in their management training program. They had Blacks working in factories and stuff, but not in management training. Now, that's what brought you to Chicago? That's what brought me to Chicago. I arrived in Chicago in 68, a few days after the assassination of Dr. King. And of course, the streets were filled with military vehicles and the city was burning. And I got my first home. I was literally living in the projects in that February of that year. And then April of that year, I moved into the first house I ever owned. And about a few months later on New Year's Eve, I will never forget as long as I live. This was 68, New Year's Eve.

I happened to pick up the paper and I saw an ad for Mr. Kelly's. Yeah. It said, tonight, Richard Pryor. Yeah. Bring in the new you. And I'm going, Richard Pryor. I want to see him. I'd seen him on the Ed Sullivan show.

So I looked at my wife. Remember, I'm a country boy coming from a little closed community. I don't understand the big time. Never been in a nightclub in my life. Really? Oh no, no. I said, let's go down to see Mr. Kelly's. And my wife said, okay. So we dressed up. This is New Year's Eve around four o'clock. We dress up and drive down to see Mr. Kelly's. I get down to rush street. It's nine degrees below zero. It is so cold. I, oh God, it was cold. And I don't want to get out and stand in line. I see this line. I'm going, that's the way I'm not standing in line. And luckily, uh, I was trying to find a place to park. We must've circled about eight times. So finally someone took a sign and flipped it from

full to womb. There was one spot somebody left early. And we pulled in. I walked around to the front door banging on the door because I didn't want to stand in line. I didn't have a ticket. Trying to figure out how do I get in? And Major D comes door and says, what? What do you want? I said, we'd like to see Mr. Kellett. He said, what? I said, we'd like to get a ticket to see richard fry he said young man do you understand you see all those people i said yes he said they've been some of them had reservations a year ago you think you can just now he's a little angry with you right yeah where are you from and i said i'm from virginia so now he said all right let me give this guy a lesson in show business so he said

and about that time they let out the first show so he had let me in to because he didn't want to stand in the cold so he let me in chastise me but we were blocking the exit for other people so he said stand over there out of the way just stand over there so we get over there they emptied the whole room yeah and by the time they entered the room he turned to say something to me and he said just just stay there. And he let everybody else in. Yeah. And now they let everybody off the street in. And now he can tell me how stupid I am. About that time, a fight broke out right at the bar. I don't know if you've ever been, Mr. Kelly, but you come in the door and the bar was elevated up.

Soon as you come in, the bar was to your left elevated a woman and i guess her husband got into a big brawl at the bar and they struggled and she threw a drink and and threw it on him and broke the glass and everybody paid attention of course to hd yeah and they just left the club yelling and he said are you coming back the guy said no and they left they looked at me and said take those two seats at the bar. We sit at the bar and, and, uh, the first singer or whatever. And then out came Richard Pryor. Yeah. What a performance. I'd never seen anything live like that. And he just, he had the room in hysterics. He did an incredible show. And when he finished, I looked at my first wife. I said, Rita, I said, you know what? I want to do that.

I want to do it on that stage and I want to do it on New Year's Eve. Well, as you know, Mr. Kelly's shut down in 75, I think, or 76. But I was the last comic to work

Mr. Kelly's on New Year's Eve before it closed. You did it closed you did it i did it i worked as well we worked i would tom and i worked as a team very successfully for for several years yeah how did because i've talked to uh i talked to tom not too long ago i don't he said i knew he was from Chicago, but how did you guys come together? Well, ironically, as I said, New Year's Eve, I was watching it at Kelly's. Yeah. And then in 69, I happened to meet Tom for the first time in a JC meeting. I wanted to, the company really wanted the employees to get involved with their community. And I just bought a house in Markham, Illinois,

which is right next to Harvey where Tom's from. Yeah. And I went to the JC meeting. I said, I want to join the JC. What is the JC chamber of commerce? Junior chamber of commerce. I never understood what that is about. What is that? What do they do? It was a community organization that worked in community, tried to raise awareness of of the business opportunities economically but also help with the community they did things like

fun uh fundraiser drives to help kids buy things for pencils and stuff and all kinds of programs um and so that night uh that i joined they mentioned that there were some issues in the community that they needed to pay some attention to. It was drug abuse that was happening in these young and these with these young students at elementary schools. And they wanted some of us to go and just talk to these kids. And Tom being from the streets, me being from the streets,

I volunteered, but he said, I don't, I'm sorry, but I got everybody. He said, but give me your name. If anybody drops out, I'll call you.

Literally three days later, someone dropped out. He and I started this program with a police officer. Right. And we remember this. Yeah. And the program became so successful that it was adopted by J.C. Chapters throughout America and 16 foreign countries. The one that you and Tom did. Yeah. Yeah. It was a very successful program. JC chapters throughout America and 16 foreign countries. The one that you and Tom did. Yeah.

Yeah. It was a very successful program and we used humor and we try, because again, we're street kids and, and, and we knew a little bit about that. My, my stepfather at that time was a heroin addict, not at that time.

Prior to me growing up with a heroin addict. And so I knew, I knew a lot about the dark side of drug abuse. Did you find out where your real dad was? Yes, I found out my real dad was. He was my uncle. That's who I thought he was all those years. Later found out he was my father.

And we became dear friends. So he was around? Yeah, he was around, but he was my uncle, I thought. No one told you, huh? Never told me until I was 10 years old and was living with my grandmother, his mother. Yeah. And they got me together, and they sat down and told me, and I was happy for it. He was a cool dude.

I liked him. But the man your mom was with when you were really young was a junkie? Yeah, that's the one that i had to leave um i couldn't stay with mother because he was he was a very difficult man yeah at least to live with and they were always economic problems yeah poor and he would be there and you know a very difficult life so my grandmother came up to get me with my uncle uh trying to save me from what they thought was going to be a pretty bad life. What happened to your mother?

She went on. I mean, she finally was smart enough to leave that man. She ended up having a very difficult life till I started making money in show business. And I brought her and took care of her for the rest of her life. You did? Yeah. Yeah. That must have felt good.

Yeah, it was good. It was, I mean, certainly happy to take care of my family, but it was a difficult time. My grandmother, who, again, raised me, and so much of her is in me. And my father, they passed away in the same year. So I lost the two most important people people in my life and then my mother was having some very difficult times so it was um i was thrust into uh head of the family long before i was ready to to take that mantle that's why i think tom and i got along so well so well together because of his difficult past my difficult past uh well he had the weird thing too where he didn't know

who was who and then he found out yeah it was uh and i think that's one of the reasons richard prior and i got along so well after we finally i met him a few years later and we became uh i would say i wouldn't say deep friends but acquaintances. And always I had the opportunity to spend a little time with him occasionally. And his past and my past, there were some similarities. Yeah. And we came out of that era. And so did Tom. So you and Tom do this.

You put together this shtick to help the kids. Yeah, we do that. And finally, one day during our program in the morning, one of the kids said to us, you guys are funny. You ought to be a comedy team. And we'd never thought about it. And we thought, oh.

So one night at the bar, having a drink, he said, you think of what I'm thinking? I said, yeah, you want to try it? He said, why not? And that was in late 69. And we started performing in local spots and every way we could work and ended up at Mr. Kelly's, I think, in 70. Our first time was 72, I believe. So what's it what's the scene, though?

So you're like, what do you do with the pot? You just said you hold them both jobs. I was working. I stayed with the pot for about a year, year and a half, and Moonlighted as a comic. Wasn't that much work at that time. There were no comedy clubs. Right, yeah, of course, yeah. So we had to kind of, you know, you end up working everywhere.

The Chitlin Circuit, the Polish Circuit, the Italian Circuit. So really, but are you opening for musical acts, or what are you doing? One thing, you go in, you hustle, you, you know, wherever there's a restaurant with a singer, they might use a comic. We got lucky and we opened for Count Basie, Sarah Vaughn, all those people. When they would come through the community, you know, they would need somebody to be sort of an empty comic.

And they give you a few dollars, not a lot. And but it gave us an opportunity to work. And then we worked those, those clubs at that time, the Burning Spear, all those black clubs that were interested in going black and white guy, let's see what they're up to. And then we, we worked ourselves to the north side, started working things up there.

And then finally, one day we got Mr. Kelly. Well, what, what was it like for you guys? I mean, How did they receive Tom? Was there ever tension? Oh, gosh, yes. Despite tension, I got poisoned.

They chased Tom out of a place. You got poisoned? Yeah, I got poisoned. I think it was in North Dakota somewhere. But anyway, the thing about that era was that whenever we walked out on stage and we opened for someells. I mean, we opened for really interesting groups. And we were never expected. So whenever we walked out there for our career, the first few seconds, say 40 seconds to a minute,

it was complete silence. No matter whether it was a black audience, white audience, or mixed audience. They didn't know what to do with it. Well, they were afraid. They were inquisitive, like, what is going to happen now? Yeah. And so you had to get them, and you had to get them quickly. Now, if you were successful, and we weren't always successful in getting them.

We had to build sometimes. But if you got them early on, it was a heck of a show. Yeah. We challenged. we didn't write quote race jokes there was no race basically what we did was be ourselves and take the world through the world that as we saw it and as we responded to it and again places like uh the playboy clubs and mr kelly's were going through the same kind of thing. You know, it's hard to think about Kelly's

and not think about contextual lifestyle at that time. Yeah. You know, Mr. Kelly's were breaking ground, but in Chicago, it was just taken as part of the deal once you were in the club, outside the club. It's a whole different thing. Right. You didn't want to go to Cicero, and you didn't want to go to these places and they didn't want to go

down to the south side but in that club it had an atmosphere that is hard to find if at all today in a club you knew you're going to see something interesting you knew the performers whether they were singers you knew you were seeing in many cases the first time that someone ever really got quote in the beginning of the big time see kelly's you know if you were a performer you dreamed of working kelly i mean like i said the first time i went in there i wanted to be in that place who was like who was doing the circuit when you were around who were your contemporaries that you'd see out and about gosh well of course uh i wouldn't call your contemporaries that you'd see out and about? Gosh. Well, of course, I wouldn't call them contemporaries, but who would work in a club at that time was, of course, Dave Gregory. Yeah.

Stowie Mitchell. Oh, my God. Billy Wallace. All the top comics we opened for at Kelly's. We opened for some of the greats, you know, as I said, Sarah Vaughn. Yeah. We opened for Della Reese. But I saw in there Bette Midler's first foray into nightclub business when she left the bath in New York.

Yeah. One of her first club gigs was Mr. Kelly. You know, you would see anyone. You see the Smothers Brothers. You see anybody there. I mean, if you were entertainment and you were, quote, making your way and rising above the fray, that that that level of I'm going near the big time, you wanted to and had to work, Mr. Kelly. I mean, you just you weren't in show business until you really did it. Sure. And then you were doing the road. I mean, how'd you get to how'd you get to get poisoned in South Dakota? Well, you know, luckily we hooked up with a group out of Chicago that were doing colleges, putting together college bills.

And there weren't many, but we went to Mankato. We went to Fargo, North Dakota. We went to these places, these Chadron State. You know, we went to these small colleges and we follow we opened for neil diamond we opened for musical group bread we opened whoever was there we'd get a few bucks and we'd open for them but of course they didn't give you a lot and we had to get there so we didn't make a lot of money we had to drive wherever we were if in the case of the uh of north dakota you know you sometimes you spend seven to eight hours in a car oh i know i know i've done it yeah and we stopped to eat and sometimes the places

that we stopped in people didn't didn't take kindly to either my presence or his presence interesting and uh so we got i got poisoned up in that area and he got attacked in a place in missouri we had we had worked um a prison um and that in missouri i think joplin uh well anyway we worked at prison we were coming back and hungry was oh man was doing it just before thanksgiving i'll never forget we went in this bar to eat the only thing open roadside there were about four or five motorcycles parked outside but hunger will force you to do things sometimes your brain tells you not to do yeah we we were very hungry we went in there and it was funny he was giving me a lecture he said now look keep your attitude down don't let your temper get you know because we could get hurt in here oh yeah yeah yeah you know i know what i'm

doing i'll handle these crackers. He was coaching me. We go in there. At that time, he had long hair. Oh, no shit. He had a little belly. He had that long. And as soon as we sat down, a few of these tough bikers said, look at that long-haired weirdo over there. And I wasn't paying no attention.

But they didn't like Tom. And they were giving him a hard time. And we were waiting to have our food come, but we realized that it was time to leave. Oh, no, yeah. We didn't know food. So he said, he said, do me a favor.

He said, you go start the car and turn it around. Yeah. And I said, no, he said, no, no, go, go. I said, don't start. He said, I'm not the car and turn it around. And I said, no. He said, no, no, go, go. I said, don't start. He said, I'm not going to start anything.

So I go out and get the car, pull it around by the door, flip his door open. And he gets up and really gives these guys an interesting discussion about who they are and how to ball certain parts of their bodies. Wow. When they finally went after him, he rushed out the door, slammed it, and jumped in my car, and we took out about three motorcycles and got away from there. Oh, you had to take out the motorcycles. Oh, yeah, yeah. We had to back up.

Oh, jeez. They could follow. That up the uh oh geez that's crazy that night yeah just i mean we got attacked on stage throwing things at us you know and uh it was an interesting but again two guys from the street um who believed that um they had an idea that would work. We were funny at times. We worked our act strong enough to be in places like Mr. Kelly's and the Playboy Circus. We worked the Playboy Circus at that time all over

America. Playboy clubs? Yeah, all of them. We worked those. Boston, LA. Were those nice? It was very nice. It gave you a chance to work your act. You know, back in those days, unlike today, you know, kids can use language more than words. Yeah. Four-letter word is a punchline.

But back when we were doing it, you had to have an act. I mean, you had to be able. You couldn't say those things. You couldn't curse. What was the headlining show? Was it like a 35, 40 minutes? Depending on the,

on the, on the place. If we were headliners, which we were a few times, we had to do anywhere from 40 to 45, 40 to 60 minutes. Yeah. If we were,

of course, most of the time we were opening act and we would do, depending if it was a playboy club, 18 minutes and they met 18 minutes. No kidding. Under 18, you didn't get paid. You club 18 minutes and they meant 18 minutes no kidding under 18 you didn't get paid you went over 20 and they would bring the hook uh so we do playboy clubs and we were uh 18 minutes kelly's we had almost 30 minutes uh they were very strict about time very strict about language um racially we never had any issues because we, you know,

we were racial just by standing up on stage next to one another. I mean, you didn't make it a day to see a whole lot of integrated conversation. But you guys, you addressed it though, right? Well, yeah, we did, but we did it in our own way. We did, you know, it wasn't,

it was putting each other in situations where race was the was the elephant in the room, you know, but we didn't talk about the elephant. Right. And so they would they would we did things like we had a couple of routines that I went to visit his Italian family. Right. And the things that I was saying in the wrong way. And then we did one where he had we had to go somewhere in a black community he wanted me to teach him how to be black oh yeah and i would you know things like that that the audience could really relate to because many of them were thinking or thinking about maybe i'll have a black friend or a white friend i wonder how that would be and then we did things like the dating game where i played uh

three characters and he played the the young lady you know and it was always going to be a brother one of those characters yeah and so it was those kind of things that we did and we worked wherever we worked and and uh we had a predominant mr kelly was always an angry audience but if we worked the club where it was predominantly black, the first few minutes or seconds were always the same. Whether it was all black or all white, it was all, what is this? Yeah. What's going to happen here? Yeah.

As soon as you could see that you were going to have fun and the audience could see that, okay, they're going to have fun with this. This is different. You would always win them over. I mean, I think it's really difficult for me, you know, just as a, as a white guy, my age, you know, to sort of, you know, really kind of like try to put myself in the place that you came up in, in the sense that this is, you know, this is sense that this is not ancient history. This is recently. It's recently.

Definitely. You know, I tell people when I was living in the community, which I explained, we couldn't vote. They had poll tax. You know, this was not long ago. This was, like you say, it's been my lifetime. Yeah. Where I had to get on a bus and sit in the

back because the sign said colored back here uh all those things i went to all black schools tom was actually my first white friend the first white person i had any social discussion with was tom jason i had none before that and i wasn't quote for any. Just that was not in my peripheral life. So when did you guys come out here? California. Oh, California. We went out there first time to work the Playboy Club. And then we had a Delores manager, a gentleman by the name of Lee Maggot.

He decided he was going to manage us yeah and uh and put us in a few things and uh so i would say 74 then 75 as a team then we split up in the early part of 76 now what now what was the decision there was it acrimonious no no i i don't i don't think it was it was for me um there's uh if you read our book uh tim and tom a comedy in black and white you'll see dueling versions of why uh but as i think back on it many years ago what i was feeling uh you know i i could we weren't making any money and I had left DuPont and I mean, we, we were not, we were in financially, uh, difficult times. And so I'm going, if this is show business, maybe I made the wrong choice. Poverty was never anything I was ever going to be. I had lived through that as a young person and I didn't want it in my life. I was like, this thing could end up being a bad mistake. Although the company,

DuPont, had always offered me a job if I wanted to return. I looked at it, I'm going, this is not working. I'm not making any money here. I'm not, you know, I got two kids at that time. He had three and it was very difficult. Wow. I can't do this. I got to make some money. So I began to look at other options, not from comedy, but I started acting, doing commercials, any way that I could make some money in this field of entertainment. Did you guys do the, but did you, were you at the comedy store? No, at that time we hadn't the comedy store back then comedy store didn't really start as what it became until 75 but you guys were already broken up by then yeah we we split up in 76 uh we worked there with with sammy did our stuff together but

it was nobody i mean had no crowds and then uh when we split up, it became more and more successful. And I worked there as a solo. I was working at those times. Who were the solos? Of course, David Letterman, Jay Leno. All of us were struggling trying to make it. And then some new ones come in, like George Wallace. Yeah.

All these new people but shirley hempfield um paul of course paul mooney and uh johnny witherspoon yeah my good buddy i mean but we were all struggling all of us were there at that time struggling nobody was i think the first person to break out was jimmy walker yeah and then after that freddie prins came through but he never really spent a lot of time at a comic so he came from new york hit the big time got chico and the man and uh went straight to stardom who worked of course um at mr kelly's like matter of fact he did his first comedy album at mr kelly yeah i saw that in the movie i wrote uh one of his routine he liked one of my routines and uh he called me i was living in california time he called me and he said tim

and he says man i need some more material i'm running out of material can i take your your your piece that i one of the pieces i did and i said yeah man because i love freddie he was we knew freddie when he was breaking in in New York when he was like 17 years old. Good guy. He was a very good guy. He was wonderful. I mean, he just had an energy about him that you couldn't help but just, you know, love his view of life. He was a fun guy and very funny man on and off stage.

And so we went out then. and very funny man on and off stage. Um, and, um, so we went out then when we got out there to work, um, what was the bit? Oh, the bit was about, um, I used to do a bit about,

uh, as a standup about how the voice of a black man would change. Uh, when he's talking to his, his brothers arguing and a care and all. And then when a beautiful woman walked by, you know, when his brother, arguing and all, and then when a beautiful woman walked by. You know, when his brothers, he was like, you know, very high. Hey, man, I don't get this.

You know, as soon as the woman walked by, I was like, hey, baby, how you doing? And it was a long thing, and the punchline was that. He really liked that. And, of course, he did it and changed it into his culture. And if you look at the back of that album, you'll see my he gave me credit for it oh that's great that's a great story so you're out here with all these guys it's so sad because so many of those guys you mentioned passed away pretty recently i taught you know i talked to george wallace he's okay but mooney's gone witherspoon's gone and yeah well a lot of them george miller he's gone. Yeah. Well, a lot of them, George Miller.

He's gone, yeah. So many of them. Who, back then, comedy is a hard business. Yeah. I mean, comedy is not to be taken lightly. I'm sorry.

I may use that. You've been missing the bus. And it's not so much busy and difficult in terms of what you do. It's what it does to you on the inside. And if you're not strong enough on the inside to take the downside of it, it can really wreck your life. I mean, it can drive you into drugs or whatever it is.

You know, it is so many of them. Oh, I know. Yeah. Yeah. I don't have to tell you to have to have survived. I, Tom and I were together recently talking about it. And, uh, of course I say to him and he says to me, neither of us would be where we are today had we not come together and gone in the trenches together and fought for six years and taken the defeat and taken the victories together. The defeats are, I've had some horrible things happen to me, losing people I love, but not many of them have ever reached the depth of the pain you feel when you bomb and it doesn't go well and your life is on it. I mean, it's a deep pain or the euphoria of when you hit, I mean, when you hit, I mean, when you've got that,

you're in that zone and you know, you rule the room, you've got these people, they're all living off of your energy. Yeah. And the high from that is, is not a drug ever invented. Yeah.

That can top the high. Yeah. And so when you, when you have to live with those kinds of roller coaster rides and professions, if you're not strong enough, it can change your life in ways that you would hope it would. You never got screwed up, though? No, we were, again, you know, I keep saying Tom and I had a few things in

common. I keep saying Tom and I had a few things in common. One of them was we had seen so much of tragedy as young people, as kids, poverty, drug abuse, alcoholism. I lived at my grandma's house, my aunt had one of the biggest whore houses in Norfolk. And I stayed there for a year. That's the thing you had in common with Richard. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Richard would talk about that. Well, you know, he did the same thing I did. You know, Johns would be waiting. I'd dance with Nichols. You know, and then you see transit people, the lives of transit people, my grandmother's room and house, people would come and go.

And you would see these broken men, you know, who just hanging in there. You know, a few of them, I got to know not deeply, but I got to talk to them and you hear their stories, world war two veterans, um, whoever they are, things that had gone bad for them. So when you see that you come away and you live through segregation, you know, you get chased by the come away and you live through segregation. You get chased by the Klan or dogs turned on you. When you get to Hollywood and they start throwing heavy things that didn't quite so bad, you go, that's all you got? You've got to come a little stronger than that white guy. I'm not afraid of you. And Tom and I were able to, at the weakest part of our venture, when things weren't going well, we would look at each other.

And one thing we knew was we weren't going to let whatever that was stop us. And we'd get into arguments and everything. One of my favorite Mr. Kelly arguments, we had the first show didn't go as well as we had hoped. And of course, what two comics will do is blame the other. So we had this big argument of blaming. I'm blaming him. He's blaming me. And we were just shouting at each other.

The energy of that first show, the negative energy of that first show. And somebody knocked at the door. Now, I don't know if you ever heard of a gentleman by the name of Herb Kupfinet, but Herb Kupfinet was Mr. Entertainment. He was the male head of hopper of Chicago. He had a column in Chicago Sun Time. And if you were entertained and you didn't get in his column, you didn't get reviewed by him uh he could he could literally help a career and he took a liking to tom and i very early on we did purple heart cruise he would have every year for war veterans and uh you we got some very favorable

reviews from him well he would always come up to the me does before the show i don't know that tim and we're yelling and scrambling and and tom knew he was coming and he bam bam bam and i i don't know he comes to be quiet that that's probably uh cut and me not believing him uh said something very uh nasty while i was saying it, because I didn't think he was there. And open the door and he was standing right there looking at me in my face.

And I'm thinking, my career is over. And he just looked at me and he said, damn. His wife was with him. Calm down. Calm down.

And they came in and sat us down and talked to us and uh i will never forget that and then we went down and had a great show so when you were at the store like and you were going solo was that when he started acting more was that when richard was around yeah i i would i would like i have to say i was uh i always thought always thought I could make an audience laugh. That wasn't a problem. But I didn't love stand-up. Tom loved stand-up. And Tom is and was a better comic than I was.

He understood the mechanism of comedy. He understood how to structure it in his favor. And he also loved it. He would work all every night. He'd go somewhere. Me, I was like, nah, I'd rather be an actor. I don't really want to. People, you know, make me laugh.

So my heart wasn't in it, to say the least. And I started acting a lot. And I remember Richard saying to me one night i i had performed at the comedy store in the main room and uh done well and when i was coming down richard was sitting in the back and he often would just come in sometime and just watch yeah watch whoever's working and he said come here man he said uh he's doing well in the i forgot what show i was i think it was on krp he said you're doing well i said yeah rich i you're doing well in the, I forgot what show I was on. I think I was on KRP. He said, you're doing well.

I said, yeah, Rich, I'm doing well, man. He said, yeah. He said, but let me tell you something. He said, don't ever give up the stand-up. Don't ever give it up. Yeah. He said, don't ever give it up. And he was a little tick with me because I, whenever I saw him later in life,

he was a little tick that I didn't stick with the stand-up. Really? Yeah. Well, didn't you, were you that I didn't stick with the stand up. Really? Yeah. Well, didn't you, were you on that show he did with all those comedy store people? Oh yeah. That was before, that was in 76. We'd only, I had just finished LA about a year, year and a half when that happened. He used everybody, right?

Robin and Sarah Burr. Yeah, Robin Williams. Everybody. It was, he needed an ensemble. And Paul Mooney went to him and said, look, Richard, you work best when you're working off of other people. So let me put together a team. And so he put together the team, brought us all on. Paul Mooney did. Yeah. And those shows were probably 80 percent improv. Really? They would come out. Here's the sketch. Here's the costumes. This is a setup you

at the star wars bar go for it and it was a it was like being in boot camp for comedy it was unbelievable uh somebody should write a book about the richard pryor show about the behind the scenes of the richard pryor show it was phenomenal i mean the things that went on just and the people involved it involved, it's never been anything like it in my career. I've done about 26, 27 television series in my career over the last 50 years. And while all of them have been unique, nothing has been as unique as those four episodes we've done on the prior show. You think it was a good entry into thinking on your feet and being on camera and all that stuff?

I think it was not only just that, but it also gave all of us a sense of power. Yeah. It wasn't just that we were funny or individually could do improvisation. just that we were funny or individually could do improvisation it made all of us especially uh myself robin williams all of us it made us realize the power that we had as a comic the kind of presentation that could could could change the face of what people thought about comedy. Yeah. I mean, prior to that, Robin was funny, but he wasn't quite as dominant as he was after that. You know, he found his power. And I think I found a certain amount in mine and certainly Spoon.

All of us did. It was, we never had that kind of freedom before. And Richard was there to drive the whole thing. Richard was there and he was the leader. And as I said, it was boot camp. And we had the best drill and structure in the history of comedy. That's amazing. But yeah, you know, like all of us, we loved him for who he was. We loved him for what he did. And we loved him for how he thought about humanity.

You know, it was it was there are few people who ever been able to walk that path the way he did. What do you think it was exactly? How do you characterize that path? Oh, boy. Oh, a path of truth. Storytellers must understand the path of truth. I don't care how your medium, whether it's writing, singing, dancing, whatever, however you tell a story, however you use your body, your mind. You must have an understanding of the power of truth and use it, uh, uh, uh, to, for your purpose.

And he did that. Um, matter of fact, when, when he was, he was, um, forced out of the business for a brief period after he had started working in

Vegas, you know, like I say, when I first saw him, Ed Sullivan, that wasn't the same company who did, uh, crafts,

the album crafts. Right. You mean, you mean after, after he hit the wall in Vegas and blew it up? Yeah. Well, they took him out. I mean, they didn't want him there. He could not become who they wanted him to become.

He didn't want to lose his truth. And his truth was born in his existence at his grandmother's whorehouse. Yeah. His existence at his grandmother's whorehouse, his existence with the people he had seen, the characters that you see when you are at the depths of struggle and you survive. You can't that that makes you a little bit aware, more aware than the average person. What gives you that empathy? Yeah. Yeah. And also that that anger and that truth, that power that you want to use your power to change, to affect people, to shock people, to get, I remember the first time you had to buy it and you go to the record store and you had to buy it. They had it under the counter. They didn't even have it out. And when you sit down and listen to the routine, it was such truth that I had never heard that kind of truth before.

In a very, in a funny way, I never heard it. Never heard that kind of truth. And I think that that was after him leaving Vegas, hanging out in Oakland, going back to the source, being around the people that he had grown up with and realizing that he owed them their truth. And then when he started coming back and he did Craps and a few other albums after that,

he found his base yeah as a comic i never found my base uh tom found his base and you've got to have that base you got to know what what your platform is and i know what it is in life i know what it is when i speak to people i know what it is when i act but as. I know what it is when I act. But as a comic, I never really took the time to discover my base. And I didn't have that Vegas moment that Richard had. You know in your heart if you want to live on that stage. It's not just living. I could make some money

on the stage as a comic um but again it's back to truth a comic uh today the closest i know to that kind of truth is dave chappelle yeah and i mean he's flying close to the sun and uh i pray that uh he doesn't um crash into it. I mean, because his truth, he's being propelled by his place, his truth. And it's a very difficult platform to maintain, as you saw with Richard, you saw with Lenny Bruce. You know, you name those people and there aren't that many. You name those people who sacrifice their being for truth. And it's a noble and incredible life to choose on stage. I don't know why. I think maybe my anger.

I jokingly tell people I suffer from P., which is post-segregation stress disorder. Yeah. You know, and it is in my life. And it comes out sometimes in a funny way, a positive way, but I can't shake it. And I don't think I just couldn't shake it on stage the way Richard found a place for it. But it exercised him in another way. You know, he found a place for it on stage. He could, you know, I was with with him the night myself, Paul Mooney's spoon.

A bunch of us was at night at the sunset live on the Sunset Strip. And he the first night he bombed. Right. And I mean, it was it was very painful to watch because this is our hero. But we all knew that that was just that night. It just didn't, his groove, he just didn't get there. And he came. We were there the next night when he came back. Yeah.

And it's one of the funniest shows that I've ever seen. Yeah, yeah, yeah. the next night when he came back yeah and it's one of the funniest shows that i've ever seen you know yeah yeah uh you you could you when you go that deep you go that far and you're able to come back yeah you know uh and do it it doesn't destroy you that says a lot you know yeah it's interesting that you kind of carry that with you that what you felt like he he was disappointed in you yeah he was i had no question about it but he was always nice to. Yeah, he was. No question about it. But he was always nice to me. Richard was always, I guess the word nice is the best way to say it.

He always treated me in a very cordial or warm way without being, you know, that was just between us. And again, it had to do our background. It had to do with how we both witnessed things at an early age. And you don't, you don't share those wounds. And not anybody else who's had it can fight it in someone. I could have, I spotted in Tom, you don't, you don't forget that. You respect that. Anybody who goes through that and survive, you respect them.

And, and when you, when you were on WKRP, I mean, that was one of those shows that people loved it. And, you know, I have to assume that not unlike your comedy family, those people must have become a family with you and Hessman and those people. It was a family, and many of us still are connected today. I mean, it was back in the days when ensemble comedy was at its height of acceptance in our business. And it was a wonderful experience. It's funny. Howard Hessman played Johnny Fever. Howard Hessman used to be with a group called the Ace Trucking Company. Yeah, with Fred Willard, was it? Yeah, Fred Willard, a dear friend we lost. And they did a routine. When Tom and I decided to go in the show business,

we had no idea what our act was going to be. We just started writing stuff. And one night, I was watching the Carson show, and out came the Ace Trucking Company. And they did a routine of teaching the black gentleman, teaching one of the white gentlemen how to be black. And it was hysterical. Now, I saw it. I told Tom, I said, now, I don't know. I know we're not supposed to steal, but it's a natural. Now, I don't know. I know we're not supposed to steal, but it's a natural. We've got to find a way to work that routine, hide the stuff that we've stolen and work that routine.

And sure enough, we we trotted into it and we did it as close to what we could do. That wasn't quite like theirs. But any comic knows where the germ that the seed yeah of the routine so when i got krp and uh i'm sure word had gotten back to them at that time because we were doing becoming a quite not quite successful but more successful than people or any other black and white comedy team so when i got on the set and I saw Howard Hessman, he looked at me, I looked at him and I said, yes, we, I had to be a couple of my mother, but I confessed our sin. And I think we laughed because they had broken up at that time.

And we became, of course, dear friend. Yeah. Oh, you did it. You told the truth. I had to. I had to. You still talk to him? Oh, yeah. Yeah, we're different. That's nice, man, you know, because I talk to a lot of people.

They don't hold on to those relationships, you know, but you guys were together for years. I mean, how many years? Yeah. Actually, four years. It seems longer, but we were there four years. But it was, again, a different kind of experience. We were more involved in the making of that show because of the creator, Hugh Wilson, who passed away a couple years ago.

And it was through his guidance and his openness to allow us. That's how I got into writing. I wrote a few of the episodes, Richard wrote, some of us directed. And we, we got, we cut our teeth behind the scene and the behind the camera.

I produced a couple of the shows, you know, taking it all the way through delivery to the network. So I learned a lot about the business and the power of the business behind the scene that I never would have the opportunity to do. And did you, you had your own show, didn't you, for a while? I've had several. Yeah, I did. I did a couple of shows, some I created and got one that was probably one of the more interesting shows in the history of television. Frank's Place. Yeah.

Nominated for nine Emmys. I remember that. Yeah, it was quite a show. And I actually had Tom on KRP. He came on and he played a white guy working at an all-black radio station. That's funny. And it was a great, great episode. That's funny. And you did a lot of episodic TV. You worked with Ed Asner. Yeah, I worked with Ed.

Like I said, I don't think there's, and somebody would have to prove me wrong, but I don't think there's anyone who's done as many television series as I have in the history of television. Yeah, really? I would have liked for one to go on 12 years as opposed to having 12. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Over a period of 12 years. But now, where are you at now with work? What are you doing? Right now, I am behind the scenes more. I just directed a feature film, not a feature film, a TV movie that'll be out in November. I am launching a streaming service for the African diaspora, covering Africa, Europe, and North America,

about two or three channels. I had it up, tested it for about eight months. Now we're going to go broad with it. I spent a lot of time in Africa, Ethiopia, particular South Africa and Cape Verde. And the history there is so rich. What draws you to that? I've always been a lover of travel and I've always been someone who just delves into history. That goes back to my segregated community. Although we were segregated in a sense from the dominant culture, we were very much involved with the history of the African diaspora because I had teachers. We had an incredible education at that time. My high school, my elementary school, and my college, I went to all black teachers, all black, and many of them were young,

And many of them were young, World War II veterans, Vietnam was just beginning. And these young folks had gone to these historically black colleges. It's turned out so many important leaders and business people in this country. And so their love for history, love for culture that wasn't in our history books, filtered through their program. So I was exposed to a lot of stuff that I normally would not have been exposed to in an integrated community, especially nowadays when you can't even, you know, now we got Texas and saying you can't even teach that kind of stuff anymore. It's so I decided since the public school system won't be teaching it the way it should, there has to be an outlet for it so that young people get a sense of history other than just slavery.

Africa is a lot more than just slavery and minerals. There are people there, 1.3 billion people, and they have a history and a culture. And let's learn as much about it as we can. And also, what I also love about the people of diaspora, no matter whether it comes from Italy, Israel, when people leave their country and come and

settle in another country, they change the way people live there. They bring their food, they bring their culture, their dance, their music, and it's integrated in this wonderful place called America. Well, I think we need to know how those things are integrated into the community. How did life change in these countries? So when I travel to, I was in, I was in a Marshall Island Islands visiting the military.

And I'm on a flight, short flight from, I forgot what, one of these small islands somewhere else. And everybody on the plane looked like they came from Detroit. And I'm looking at them and said, where are you from? They said, no, no, we're from the Marshall Islands. I said, what do you mean you're from the Marshall Islands? You look like somebody that I know from Detroit. We were joking about it. And then I get there and I see this incredible culture. I'm intrigued. How did you get here? Would you come over with Captain Cook? I mean, where did this culture come from? And the history and the story of it is quite

unique. Like when I went to Brazil for the first time, I love Brazil and I go to Brazil, Bahia and places like that. And I'm looking at people who look more like me than they do here in Virginia. And I'm going, and then I find out that the majority of slaves coming from the continent of Africa settled in Brazil, South America. I mean, that's the majority. I guess it was Bush that went to Brazil for the first time when he was president. And he was shocked that there were so many black people. Well, I think out of a country of 150 million, 80 to 90 million of Afro-Brazilian. Let's talk about that culture.

Let's talk about condom blade. Let's talk about that stuff. It's important. It's so important now too, because it's being threatened. In threat. So I think, but also I think it's, one of the reasons it's being threatened

is because to protect it. You know, the dominant culture, whoever they may be at any country, the dominant culture wants to protect this position. And they don't want everybody to think that they want everybody to think that they did everything. Of course, that's just the nature of the egotistical nature of a human being. But when you look at the other involvement of people, I was when I was in Ethiopia, I mentioned to them something that they did not know. Here's a country that for over 3,000 years has never been ruled by anybody but an African. It's never been conquered. It was occupied for a couple of years by the Italians before they defeated them, but it's never been conquered. It has an interesting history. So I was telling them, I said, you know, Ethiopians are warriors.

They like they are like, you know, they go off and fight. They fought in Korea. The majority of people that fought in Korea were not just Americans, were Ethiopians. Many of them settled in Korea. So you see. But did you know that the first battle won in 1775 before Washington defeated anybody was won by a troop of Ethiopians. They won the first battle of our war of independence. They were mercenaries? A group of mercenaries over here fought and won the first battle. You know, and you look at stuff like that and say, why is that interesting? Well, it's just interesting to show how cultures, No kidding. history. That to me is interesting. And those people who do it, I know we came together today

to talk about the incredible club called Mr. Kelly. But when you look back, if I were to do history of entertainment, you have to do what's being done with this documentary. You have to talk about this club during the time of the early 50s all the way up through the 70s that what was going on contextually not only in race but in gangsters and chicago this club was a almost like a watering hole where all all species would come yeah you know all races would come. Yeah. You know, all races would come and perform and sit. And they allowed people into the room that most folks didn't want to go in the room. Women. I mean, Lily Tomlin up talking about sexism and stuff like that, you know, and going after it.

Where else could she do that? Yeah. You couldn't do it in Vegas. So Mr. Kelly, Kelly's why I'm pleased and not only be a part of it, but to see it come out now is because I think the country needs to see more of that kind of history, uh, as opposed to, you know, everything about the worst of us or the tragedy of us. Yeah. I think that's good. That's a hopeful message. I don't have a, I don't, I'm not always able to find hope,

but I, but I think that's true. I think that's a good way to find it. Well, again, my life changed sitting in that bar one night, watching a person perform that inspired me so that I went after that dream. And lo and behold,

I'm sitting here talking to today. And it happened in a very short amount of time. Had I not gone that night, had I not been so stupid to believe I could get in a club without reservations on New Year's Eve. Yeah. I wouldn't have jumped yet today. My life has changed. It's a beautiful thing. Beautiful thing, Tim.

It was great talking to you, buddy. My pleasure, man. I enjoyed it. Yeah. Take care of yourself. I will. You too. That was Tim Reed. The documentary is live at Mr. Kelly's. You can check out

some of the other things he mentioned. A lovely gentleman. Nice guy. Nice to get back into the history. I like the old comedy store stuff that place Mr. Kelly's must have been amazing must have been amazing nothing is ever going to get better ever again there are no more tunnels to get through this is how it's going to be ride it out

adapt fixing might be over I don't know is that negative here's my attempt at some metal Flapped. Fixing might be over. I don't know. Is that negative? Here's my attempt at some metal. Thank you. Boomer lives. Monkey in La Fonda. Cat angels everywhere, man. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence.

Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising.

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