WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1380 - Chris Redd

Episode Date: November 3, 2022

Chris Redd knows what it’s like to have dreams and then watch them shift in the face of reality. It happened first with the dream of being a rapper, but then Chris realized he had a knack for this comedy thing. Now, as he departs SNL and releases his first HBO standup special, Chris and Marc talk about how your dreams further shift once you’ve had some success in life. Chris also tells Marc how he overcame his stutter, how he turned a corner in his struggle with anxiety, and how he’s adjusting to having money after growing up without any. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Alright, let's do this. How are you, what the fuckers? What the fuck buddies? What the fuck nicks? What's happening? I'm Mark Maron. This is my podcast. Welcome to it. A little bouncy. I'm in kind of a bouncy room.

I just got to Oklahoma City. Don't know what to make of it yet. I don't know. I just have no sense of Oklahoma City. I can't say that driving in made me go like, wow, I got to live here. That hasn't happened yet. But that generally does happen these days when I travel. I get to a small city and I think like, I got to live here.

I did have a little of that in Tulsa, have not had it here yet. You're going to be listening to this the day after the show. We'll assume it went well. Tonight, I'll be in Dallas, Texas at the Majestic Theater. Tomorrow, I'll be in San Antonio at the Tobin Center. And on Saturday, I'll be in Houston, Texas at the Majestic Theater. Tomorrow, I'll be in San Antonio at the Tobin Center. And on Saturday, I'll be in Houston at the Cullen Theater. I just want to get that out of the way. There's a little run we're doing.

Me and Bytes are knocking out Texas and Oklahoma City. That's what's happening. That's where we're at. Today on the show, I talked to Chris Redd. Now, this is before we talked talked before he got punched in the face with the brass knuckles in front of the comedy cellar he's he's recovering from that it seems um and and that and this is a an interview before that so there'll be no talk of that and i did ask him why uh he left sn, which was he was a cast member for many years.

And he's got an HBO special called Why Am I Like This? And that's out now. So that's why I talked to him. And I've known him for a few years, seen him around, just never happened. Today is the day. So look, I've gotten into a situation. It's not important. I'll gotten into a situation. It's not, it's not a, look, it's not important. I'll walk you through it.

So the other night I had a spot at Largo. I was doing Judd Apatow show. It's a benefit for charity. It was me and Melissa Villasenor and Dana Carvey. I also had to do the comedy store at 830. And these are spots that I accepted that I wanted to do. Not really thinking ahead because I don't know how to do that. It seems that I had to get a like a 5 a.m. car in the morning to go to the airport to fly to Oklahoma City.

But that's not really the problem. The issue was there's a place. It's called Craig's Restaurant. I know the guy, Craig. I've met met him before i don't eat there a lot but it's kind of like it's it's kind of like the neighborhood restaurant for the the neighborhood of hollywood in in the celebrity sense in a way it's just it's kind of a watering hole it's like the old dantanas it's like it's it's just the kind of go-to restaurant over there in near Beverly Hills now I've been there a couple times I've been there uh to eat with Jeff Ross a couple times I've been

there to eat with Judd uh a couple of times like I said I've met uh uh the maitre d over there and I've met uh you know Craig himself had many conversations with him i went to mike binder's birthday party at craig's but i still don't know whether or not i can get a table at craig's now the the thing is is like look this is not it's not a real problem but it just was i wanted to eat there i wanted to take kit to craig's she had never been there she had heard about it she's doing a job now which it's good for her to know about new restaurants. So I wanted to eat at Craig's, but I decided to do that at like 4.30 on the night that I wanted to eat there. And it was also the night that I had to do the two spots and I had to go do Judd show. So I wanted to eat at Craig's, but here's what usually happens when I want to eat at Craig's

because I don't make a reservation. I generally text jeff ross so i'll text jeff ross and i'll say here i've got the text chains on this all right i said how's it going man i want to go to craigs at seven who should i call just me and the chick i i put my name in so so what happens is i say how's it going man i want to go to craigs at seven who should i call just me and the chick. Now, I don't hear back from him, right? So I'm starting to squirm. And I'm like, well, fuck.

I guess I'm just going to have to go the regular way, right? I'm just going to have to call and see if my name lands at all. See, I'm really not a celebrity. I don't have a big name. And I don't go out to eat much. Most of it, I think, is really just about being a regular to place, but I cook my own food all the time. So I don't go out to eat much, but I wanted to go.

And it was my assumption that these people, the couple of people that I know, uh, you know, have pole, have sway, have juice. So what I do is I basically make Jeff Ross, my assistant in this situation. And he, he doesn't get back to me. So I call Craig's, and I put my name in. But here's how that goes. So I call, and a woman answers, and I go, do you have any tables?

Oh, no, it didn't go like that. I said, hi, it's Mark Maron calling. Do you have any tables at 7 o'clock tonight for two? Mark Maron? So I dropped the mark marin and uh nothing i get zero nothing no no look this isn't even it's not necessarily even a high-end restaurant it's just a place to eat but it's the place to eat for certain people and i don't i guess i'm not one of those people that's what i'm assuming so she goes well i can put you on a waiting list

and uh i'm like okay how do you spell the last name? And it's just sort of like, all right, why don't you just say that I don't matter, right? Again, this is a luxury problem. But now, because Jeff's not really getting back to me, I got to pull Apatow into this. So I go, hey, man, can you help me get into Craig's at seven I wanted to go there before the show with the girl I just don't have a contact the guy knows me I gave them my name fuck it we'll see so that happened like neither Jeff nor him get back to me so I tell him that I gave them my name fuck it we'll see so now on the other front Jeff Ross sends me a phone number. He sends me a guy named Nick, who's the maitre d'.

So now I'm going to text Nick. This is how this is going. So I've got Apatow engaged. I've got Jeff Ross engaged. I've called Craig's. And now I'm going to text Nick, who I'm pretty sure I've met a couple of times. So I said, hey, Nick, it's Mark Maron. I've met you before with Jeff Ross and Judd.

Jeff gave me your number, was trying to get in to eat at seven before I do Judd's show at Largo. Is that possible? Just me and my girl, thanks. Sorry to bother. I go back to Judd because Judd hasn't gotten back to me at all.

So I said, Ross gave me Nick's number. I'm good, we'll see. And then I wrote, good talk. And he hadn't talked to me at all. And then like a little while later, he texts me, sorry, I missed your request. I'm sure I would have gotten you a better seat than Ross. And I said, no one has gotten me anything. Just texted Nick. But yeah, probably.

I'm not cool enough to get into that place. And I said, have to do the store at 830. Then I'll come to Argo. And then he says, sounds good. Do you want me to contact Craig's? And I said, I just texted Nick, dropped your name and Ross. I don't know what else I can do. I just want a table for two at seven.

And I assume they are hiding one that only special people can have. They are right. I mean, Craig knows me. I just don't go there much and then judd texts back i assume they will come through but maybe you should call the restaurant and let them know you are texting with nick and i said i already put my name on a waiting list i should call back and tell them and then like that judd just he he heails. He says, my assistant is calling you to help. And I said, I feel like a real jamoke. Calling me?

Oh boy. Okay. Thanks. I can just wait to see if Nick gets back too. So ridiculous. Thanks. And then I said, I have a lot of good people working on this now. And he said, it takes a village.

So now Judd's assistant's involved. Hi, Mark. This is Cassidy, Judd's assistant's involved. Hi, Mark. This is Cassidy, Judd's assistant. Let me know if you need any help getting Craig's reservation tonight. The assistant network is strong at getting reservations. And I said, cool, thanks. Sure, I put my name on some kind of waiting list there. I also texted Nick because Jeff Ross gave me his number.

I think he's the maitre d'. I'm just trying to get a table for two at seven. Feels like if you call too i will have put all the power of the comedy industry in hollywood behind this request i imagine i can just wait to hear back from nick or maybe you can just seal the deal with your magic and she said just called you're allegedly now at the top of the waiting list i'll keep working on it if you don't get a call soon i said haha sweet thanks so nick gets back to me at some point he said i'll see what i can do sir i said thanks pal i have a lot of great people working

on this hope we can make it happen sorry to be a nuisance and he said come on in at 6 45 to 7 we got you sir i'm in i mean that's what it takes like Like, I just, I'm embarrassed. I'm embarrassed by the whole situation. But, you know, now I have Nick's number and, you know, and again, I get there and like I've met Craig many times and he sat at the table. We talked a bit. It was so interesting because I'm sitting there, we're eating at Cipino. She had some pasta, I had some meatballs. It was beautiful. The meal was beautiful. You know, I saw, you know, there were some people there of celebrity status. That's not why I wanted to go. I wanted to go because I wanted to feel part of my community.

So I guess it is why I wanted to go. I guess it is. But it was weird because every time I go there, for some reason, I think of Saget. Because I eat there with, you know, Judd, and I eat there with Jeff Ross, and I eat there with Saget once. And I was like, I miss Bob Saget out of nowhere. And then like after we ate, Craig said that Kelly, Kelly Saget was there, his wife. And I was like, oh, and we walked out back and I said hi to her.

And it was, you know, kind of sweet. It just look, it's a neighborhood place and the neighborhood is show business. And it was nice to go out to eat but it it did it took me a lot of support and a lot of help to feel like i was able to just go eat there and but i feel like maybe i can eat there a little easier this time i might not have to drag judd apatow or jeff ross into the situation and asked them to do my bidding to give me a table at a restaurant fucking ridiculous ridiculous but that's uh that all happened so I did that I had I had a great show at Largo it was a it was just a complete riff fest kind of weird kind of dark

impulsive car came at 5 30 which i was pushing it 7 10 flight and for some reason i i missed you know like i got someone watching the house but you know i missed the cats it's weird but i do you know because you know charlie's only going to be young once right he's so fucking crazy that cat charlie beans roscoe the new kitten it's fucking nuts like a real monster it's weird about kittens like that's that's prime time cat experience that's what you want man you want a kitten it's fun it's insane but you know it's double-edged double-edged because when you got a kitten no matter how cute you know you're gonna be saying this a lot. Ow, fuck. God damn it. And then like two minutes later, you'd be like, God damn it. Ow. Fuck, Charlie. But that's fun. That's the fun part.

That's the fun part about kittening. You never know how they're going to turn out. Enjoy that kitten. I guess it's the same with humans, but you know, it's just, uh, yeah, Charlie's good. Sammy's good. They're're all good but charlie this is a crazy kitten and the other two don't even know what the fuck to do with them ow anyway it's ending folks it's all fucking over it's coming down hard you know what I'm talking about. Get ready for it. Get ready for all of it. None of it good. Did I do all the ads? Is it time to talk to Chris Redd?

Is it time? So again, his special HBO, Chris Redd, Why Am I Like This, now streaming on HBO Max. And again, this was recorded prior to the incident last week where he got assaulted outside the Comedy Cellar in New York. So there will be no chatting about thatting. Dig it? All right, this is me and Chris Redd. You can get anything you need with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs and mozzarella balls, yes, we can deliver that. Uber Eats, get almost, almost anything.

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Zensurance does all the heavy lifting to find a policy, covering only what you need, and policies start at only $19 per month. So if your policy is renewing soon, go to Zensurance and fill out a quote. Zensurance. mind your business. I got a guy over there. That's how I'm hooked up, man. I got a guy. My boy got a meat guy. I got a meat guy. I do have a meat guy. You got to have a guy for things. Yeah. You got to have a guy for a little bit of everything, man. Yeah.

And as you get older, you got to collect those guys. I tend to do a lot of things myself, but you get a little money and then you start like, why are you doing that? Yeah. That transition from making enough money to delegate. To having a guy? Yeah. To having a guy.

Yeah. Because I was like, when do you start having a guy clean your house? When you start having cleaners. It's weird, right? Yeah, and it was just like, I was on the road so much and working so much. I was just never home. I was only home in filth. And I'm like, yo, I think now's the time I get the guy.

You're like, hey, this place looks the same as I left it. And that food's still out yeah i bought all these groceries and they're all terrible yeah no i i don't i it's a weird adjustment to make when you go through a life where you manage your own shit and then uh and then one day you realize like what what do other people do yeah and also what am i saving my money for because i don't spend money do you oh i spend money man i spend money man uh i'm i'm now in the place of my life where i'm starting to be responsible yeah uh but i was just broke for so long uh when i started making money i had to like relive all the young money dreams i

had oh really yeah i was standing on couches yeah and clubs all the shit but like i was too i was older though so i was like 33 yeah so it's like yeah it was cool but it doesn't feel the same i'm not in my 20s and i don't know half these people and i and i got too many bottles right i can't drink all this damn liquor the fuck am i doing it's kind of a sad moment it yeah it's a very sad realization i'm sitting on the couch like yeah and i'm like oh man whose couch is this you see i'm an adult i'm thinking about adult shit this couch might cost money i just took dog shit before i came in here you know i've had those moments where it's sort of like i'm gonna go do it i'm gonna spend the big money and it's and you're

just sitting there disappointed yeah you're just disappointed as hell like hey man how come this doesn't feel better my homie said my homie uh sam jay she said she said you know what it got to a point where you just have to come to terms with some dreams you just missed out on my nigga right you just missed it or maybe maybe they're just not like you know they don't feel as good as you think they are yeah you know what i mean like you think that's the answer you think that's the way to live and then you get there and you're like, nah, it's just not, it's not me. Bro, nothing taught me how superficial I was as a kid as trying to do those things as an adult and being like, what the fuck were you fighting for? I know. When you talk about that in your special, it's kind of interesting.

Like, there's a couple of interesting sort of, the idea of dreams. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, having dreams. And, you know, having kid dreams are one thing. You know what I mean? But, like, you know, in and you know having kid dreams are one thing you know what i mean but like you know in the in the special you talk about basketball but then as you get older your dreams shift but but neither one of them are that practical or that they're all like hard to reach where'd you grow up i was i i was born in st louis and uh and we kind of spent like

our half our time in st louis half our time in mississippi and then i moved to chicago when i was seven and then we moved to the suburbs of chicago uh naperville and aurora so you have family in st louis and mississippi st louis uh chicago mississippi la we have over like 300 people in my family really yeah yeah so because we'd like to fuck. A lot of people. Who's got all the brothers and sisters in your family? Your parents.

My brother. Your parents. My mom has 14 siblings. What? Yeah, yeah, yeah. My grandma had 15 kids, bro. And she was having one more kid. And she had my aunties. They're triplets.

Oh, my God. Yeah, crazy. Could you imagine going in a store for one thing and getting three of the motherfuckers? Oh, my God. So that's a lot of cousins. Yeah, a lot of cousins, a lot of people just around, and I love it. So I'm used to growing up with chaos. But most of the childhood was in Chicago?

Yeah, most of the childhood was in Chicago, and we kept our roots in Mississippi, so we would go there all of the time. But I'm trying to figure out when I first started seeing you around. Because it wasn't stand-up, was it, initially? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember you were stand-up, but did you start in stand-up?

Yeah, I started in stand-up and improv. And in Chicago, around the time where that was a sin to do both. So my attitude is a little triggering. I saw the face. I saw the face. Are you a real stand-up comedian? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Because I heard you like to do organic openings with your chest. Like, I didn't really see you around the stand-up clubs. I remember seeing you whoosh as a tree. Yeah. clubs i remember seeing you whoosh as a tree yeah but i think i think i first oh we first saw each other um laugh factory yeah when kevin neal and used to do that show where he would like have people come up oh yeah and talk shit yeah or do a set and then like sit there and talk shit for a little while right i kind of remember that yeah everybody had these big ideas about show and we were both on it. Yeah, I think I did one show with you.

I mean, I did a couple shows with you, but I think we really crossed paths. It was either at that show or it was at Comedy Store. Right. Well, yeah, it was one of those things where it's like, you know, all of a sudden Chris Redd's everywhere. The talk, the talk about Chris Redd. That's what I like to do. Not that I have it, but I like to look at my hustle like herpes. I like to

go to a city and spread facts. Was there another guy that had Redd in his name? Nah, nigga. He gone, Mark. Not anymore. Not anymore, man. Took care of that guy. I thought there was another Redd. Something Redd. Oh, Jasper Redd. Jasper Redd.

What happened to that guy? Jasper's funny. Oh, he is funny. He's a funny dude. I haven't seen him in a while. I'm sorry, Jasper Red. Jasper Red. What happened to that guy? Jasper's funny. Oh, he is funny. He's a funny dude. I haven't seen him in a while. I haven't seen him in a while. I'm sorry, Jasper. No, man. I've been waiting to run into Jasper, though, man.

All I know is Jasper Red and Michael Red. He used to play for the Bucs. Oh, no. I don't know that guy. So how many siblings do you have? I have my younger brother and my older sister. Three of you. But then I was kicked out

when i was younger so i used to live with my friends and so i just kind of considered them brothers too so you're in the suburbs of chicago i you know in the special you talk about that world the hood in the suburbs it's funny but i mean because i watched the whole thing i'm only bringing it up because i watched it man if i didn't if i didn't watch it i wouldn't bring it i would just be like so tell me about this this special. So what's this special about? Yeah, yeah, yeah. What is it like? What's that coming out? I hear it's good.

But why'd you get kicked out of your house? Well, because I went to a really racist school. It was a kind of racist area. Yeah, it's called Racist School. It was very upfront. So it was really my fault i was there you know it was like a what you wearing situation but this is in the suburbs of chicago yeah and like at the time um i wasn't we i wasn't communicating that well with my parents because

they were very much like uh we not friends i'm your parent we don't talk and then how old you at this time i'm like uh i mean it's like 13 yeah 13 13 on and so i was kind of like a quiet kid until i got to middle school and high school yeah and then it and then it i started to just kind of have beef with kids and like they would be calling me out my name and i had like white kids yeah yeah and and i had like um i had adhd and my anxiety i had a lot of anger issues i didn't understand any of that stuff so i'm just i was a very hyperactive hyper reactive kid so i went to my parents like yo i'm having trouble with this racist racist shit in the school and i thought they would feel me because they were you know from mississippi your parents yeah and my parents

and they knew the history of your people yeah they were there yeah but like it and my parents. They knew the history of your people. Yeah, they were there. But to my parents, they were like, yo, we've been through so much shit in Mississippi. Your racism doesn't even sound like a real issue to them. They didn't mean it that way, but that's definitely how it came off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was so hurt by that that I just kind of closed off and said, well, fuck it. If y'all going to treat me like I'm a bad kid, I'm'm gonna just be a bad kid then and so then i started like fighting back yeah i made a decision like fighting back i was like i'm gonna go i'm gonna go uh i'm gonna skip school go hang out in the hood with kids i really want to be around kids that look like me yeah so that began

my career of trying to just like living these dual lives it's just being in being in the burbs and then going out trying to be in the hood at the same time but do you remember like before before you turned like were you like uh like it's just a good kid like you just didn't say much or what was it like a dramatic sort of change i really had to force myself out of kicked like i was uh extremely introverted i had a stutter you had a stutter yeah man so i had to like like when I was like a bad one oh man it was bad and how I got over it was uh rapping in front of people like and it was do you think the stutter was was uh like a psychological thing or like a fear thing or what yeah it was it was a it was a fear because I had a fear of speaking in in uh in front of people um and because I took

I took like how I was raised like you don't speak out of turn we i took that so literally that like so you're i would just be a i was just a super quiet kid for a while and then it got to the point where it was like man if i keep doing this i'm gonna get my ass whooped every day and you know with the stuttering yeah so i so i so i fixed that you know what i mean as much as i could so how how was the plan was it your idea to just start rapping over the stutter yeah oh yeah yeah i was like i'm gonna rap rapping is what i wanted to do how old are you then like 12 10 was when i started like i got i was like i bought my first rock rock kim cd yeah and because i heard i didn't know anything about rock kim at the time i just uh

my big cousin was like rock kim's the best rapper alive i'm like well that's what i want to be sure and so that's when i bought my first uh uh rap record listen to it and i was writing my own little raps and we would go to school and battle but like i had a stutter so i had to read i had to read the rap yeah wow they were the worst battles of all fucking time like your nose nose looks like uh like. It was that bad? It took forever, bro. Oh, it took so long. Were the other kids laughing at you?

Yeah, kind of. I think then I thought so because I was definitely doing it every day, so I was getting validation from you. Yeah, it's weird when you're around somebody with a stutter because we're all relatively aware of people when they have a problem. You've got to be a pretty young kid to bust on a guy with a stutter by 10 or 11 you would

think they'd be a little nicer but like even just the other day i was in a studio with a guy i can't what what context was that where i was you know i was asking what i should do and then he he started and he had that that stutter where it was stopping and there's just a moment where the entire time zone changes and you're like okay we'll just wait it out don't be rude and that's what it was and it was such a looking back it was such a rude thing to make people watch that battle

because it took all lunch period and then on top of that like sometimes it didn't end we would just be like trying to read a line and you hear the bell and all the kids like oh fuck it took too long yeah one of my cousins started going to school with me and he got mad one day because he's like i didn't even eat my pizza like why you ain't gonna get the pizza and come back like but like once it but it i gained a lot of confidence though because like because i started started reading up more about just stuttering in general.

It's like by slowing your mind down, let your thoughts catch up. So I was like, well, if I talk faster and I rap faster, maybe I can catch up with how fast my thoughts are going. And so that's how I really learned to freestyle. I just started, like, relaxing and trusting myself. So you read that when you were a kid because you were curious? Researching is, I've been doing that forever dude i would i've been like i used to be online and i because i've been insomniac since out forever so really yeah man oh i'll do high strung kid i was you thought i had a mortgage you were the middle kid uh yeah yeah but my sister is like uh 13 years older so i have like middle kid syndrome and oh and oldest yeah you

know what i'm saying yeah so because i was my mom's first but i wasn't my dad's first was my dad's second oh okay you know yeah yeah yeah but but so so you applied this idea you came up with this concept around curing your stuttering like if you rap faster then you would keep up with this concept around curing your stuttering. Like if you rap faster, then you would keep up with your mind? Yeah. We were in science class, and I asked my teacher, like, how do I work on my stutter? And she's like, well, the basis of your stutter is because your mouth is not moving as fast as your thoughts are. One of those two. Yeah.

And so I was like, oh. And so that's what I just assumed a if i go faster if i go faster i think i'll be your parents weren't helping no not at all they didn't send you a doctor no no we didn't have like full conversations then so and also i was really people i'm comfortable with it didn't it didn't like come out like that oh really no not not like well it did but it's like wasn't as drastic it was it was very much it was very much like um nerves and like anxiety it was like if i was nervous and any which was like anywhere that i wasn't comfortable which was a lot of places for a long time yeah uh i was yeah started hit me bro like speaking in front of people was the

worst fear but i was also like cracking jokes on the low so so there was like i've always been there's been like a little competing like yeah yeah well that's it's a weird thing about being like a funny person is it all comes out of discomfort yeah right so eventually you got to make fun of yourself or make fun of somebody else yeah there's a fine line between uh line between self-deprecation and fuck that guy. The line of bullying is always right there. Right there. I'm not going to take the hit.

You're going to take the hit. Yeah. I mean, I got so good at roasting kids in school. That's good when you have that, like dozens of rap battles or whatever, when there's a context that's okay to do it 100 yeah because then because it's like oh now it's like being a basketball player right now i'm just showing my skill set yeah right but i but i remember running into a kid like uh

later on like years later after we got out of high school and found out i was his bully and we hung out a lot yeah and i would just make fun of him all the time. But like, we were all making fun of each other. Right. I thought we were all doing it. Oh, and you fucked him up. Yeah. So he had this,

bro, he had this whole like rom-com get back at the bully moment. Like we were, I was, I was high as hell. When was this? How many years? Oh man,

this was at least, this was, um, at least 10, at least eight years from high school. So the kid's doing well. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Uh, I'm, I'm like, I'm like, haven't, I haven't gotten any big gig yet. I mean, at least eight years from high school. So the kid's doing well. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm like, I haven't gotten any big gig yet. I'm doing well in the comedy community, but no one in the real life knows anything about that shit. So to him, I look like a bum. I'm walking in here with my friends, just trying to have a night.

I'm high. I see him like, oh, what's good, man? He's like, yeah, man, Chris Redd. Oh, no. Watch this shit. Bet you can't do this and then he just kisses he mouth kisses like three chicks just randomly i'm like what is happening yeah and i i can't think of one roast i can't think of one comeback yeah he's just like it's like somebody somebody in the universe is just like this this is his moment. You're going to pay. And he's like, what now?

I bet you broke. He said, I make $100,000 every four months. What do you do? I bet you don't have any money in your pocket. Then he just mouth kissed another chick. I'm like, does he know these women? They don't seem to be resisting. No, it seems choreographed.

It was all planned here he comes yeah i just saw i saw one girl by the by the bar just waiting to walk and get mouth kiss but it was like the coldest like uh redemption moment for him that i didn't even know he needed i was like man i guess i'm just that was my karma bro i just had to eat that yeah yeah it's like you had it coming i had it coming. I had it coming, man. I was like, I guess I, I was like, what did I do to this kid to make him do this? Isn't that weird? Because, like, I mean, that's the interesting point is that you think everyone's, you know,

on the same page. Yeah. And then if you really think about it, you're like, nah, that guy never said anything. That's what it was. It ended up being like, oh, everybody was talking shit except him. Yeah, he was was so he just felt like the punching bag now you get you friends with that guy still we we haven't talked yeah since then but mike i hope you're doing well yeah but you got closure he got close you got closure you're doing well hope you didn't get nothing from all them random mouths yeah so once you start the rapping thing and you get confidence now is that was that the

thing you wanted to do yeah yeah that was the thing i wanted to do the most we making uh cds and i was making i was man i was using every extra dollar i had so many fucking names bro my last name was chief that was a good name chief yeah that's simple yeah yeah it's to the point you know double meanings yeah great uh but before that i was like i wanted to have a mysterious vibe yeah i went with john doe uh-huh but john doe like john money you know what i'm saying oh okay but also john doe like you don't know how to have double double meaning yeah yeah i was a real big double meaning kid but there's a there is a john doe rock guy yeah there's a john doe rock guy but he was doing rock i was i mean he's old i'm rapping yeah no one knows that

guy in your world yeah yeah and no one knew me as john doe so i had to change it because i was like if i keep being john doe no one's gonna know it's too deep for everybody it's too they was way above the head so i went with uh so i changed it to johnny dollar which which was not great no it's kind of jokey it It's very jokey. And then I got into Greek mythology. Oh, boy. There's a lot of cool names in that. Oh, yeah, sure.

So I picked... Zeus? No, I picked Callisto, which sounded cool. Wow. But it is a goddess. So I was like, that doesn't match up that much. Yeah. You're just hoping no one looks it up. Yeah, you're right.

Callisto, don't look it up and you you recorded under all these names i recorded under most of them yeah and what we selling your cds yeah man i was selling outside of clubs no i was selling them um on the streets i was selling them at school i was uh i made some decent little cash i just i never i remember when i realized that that was a thing you know what you were guys would just come up to you. And some of it's good, right? Because they're not going to get it, or they're trying to get a release, but they don't have a release, but they're still doing the work. I was used to buy those CDs. Really?

Man, well, I don't think I ever bought one on purpose because I was always kind of tricked into it. Well, right. It was that fine line between it's sort of like, all right, just how much? Right. All right, man. Whatever you need, buddy. I'll take it buddy i'll take it he's like hey yo yo let me sign this for you player let me sign this for you i'm like that's i don't own that you so so you were doing that yeah swinging cds like slinging cds i didn't want to go to uh i didn't want to go to college i wanted to kind of rap if i was all through. So this is all through high school? This is all through high school. The rap thing? Yep.

Half of middle school. I wasn't confident enough to do a bunch of rapping in middle school, but I was finding myself dance. I love to dance. So that was my thing I found in middle school. Yeah. You're a dancer. I love dancing.

At one point, I thought I wanted to be a dancer. It's so funny you're really riding this line between the whole sort of dichotomy of what you saw yourself as and what you wanted to be, like gangster with your cousin. You just really wanted to dance, didn't you? I just really wanted to dance. Shout out to my dog, Duke Deuce. He's a dancing gangster rapper right now, and I love him. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He kills it.

Yeah. He kills it. I'll send you some videos. Yeah. He kills it uh but yeah man i definitely i definitely wanted to dance i thought that was i thought it was like i thought gangsters could do all of that you know i want to be a versatile gangster i want it depends you know i i think there's a ceiling to the type of dance 100 i don't know if you could be a gangster and strip. I don't know if that's the... Or do musicals. But maybe. No, there's some musicals. A gangster musical?

They have, sure. So during this time, these two worlds, this cousin you're talking about, he's a real guy. Yes, he's a real guy. He's a representative of two people in my life. Okay.

There's a story of my... Some of it is my cousin Keith, and a some of it is my cousin keith yeah and and and a lot of it is my friend jeremy that i grew up with okay and and they're collectively this guy and they're collectively trey okay yeah yeah trey represents like a few like he represents them and there's this our stories are pretty much those two dudes more more generally than anybody but like uh because you like you're like this nice kid who like you know is nervous and now in looking back you're finding that you have issues that you're dealing with but but but you you get the rap thing to solve your your your stuttering and

awkwardness problem and now you want to go full in full in to and i cured my fear i'm not really afraid of much up now it was like because i was but i was terrified then trying that like i wasn't because i was all the characteristics about being an introvert weren't helping me with what i needed yeah you know what i'm saying so i was like i gotta i gotta be different i gotta change this i gotta figure this shit out so what what what what really happened you know in terms of like you going into the into the hood the first couple times I got clowned

crazy like what do you mean like so the first time I went to the first time I went to the by myself like

well I was with my homie Marcus yeah and coming in from the suburbs and our homegirl Ashley yeah so we all went to school

in the burrows and we all went to the city to keep it with our cousins. What was the plan? Oh, okay. And yeah, just to hang around with the homies, the gangs that are around that we were affiliated with. Right, yeah. And so I had acted like I had been out to the west side a bajillion times. I had not.

This is my first time. So I'm thinking- How old are you? Oh, I'm 15. 14 or 15 this time, right? 14. Yeah. So I'm acting, but i got my act on bro yeah and this is my first major role not sag uh and so we all kicking it people can see i'm nervous i don't know i didn't know at the time though you know i'm just feeling like i'm natural and shit yeah so then this girl ashley uh she's from out there so she's like hey um why don't you go grab some cigarillos chris from the

from the gas station and i'm like yeah why not but it to me it was the biggest moment of my fucking life because i'm like i ain't never been here before so i'm like trying to act natural right but i don't look natural so i'm just like i walk sway move the hands a little bit yeah too much too much you know and then and then this and then she uh she she said hi to her cousin right who's sitting in his car right by the gas station so before i walk in the door dude's like hey he's like hey hey man come here you want some weed i'm like oh yeah i my goofy ass is like oh that's her cousin they're cool people he's like get in so i get in the car like a clown and i close the door and there's a dude in the back seat

dude's in front seat he's like he's like uh he's like oh yeah you want some weed huh and then dude came around and like put his arm around my neck right and i was like what the fuck i threw his arm off i'm like what the fuck is that shit man he's like don't be getting in no car with no random motherfucker what's wrong with you nigga it's the hood and i'm like that's your cousin and she's like who gives i know him nigga you don't yeah and it was my first introduction to the hood for real and they gave me shit we went to this place a spot called the circle yeah this was where everybody kicked it yeah and um so we went to the circle and i just got clowned yeah that whole day but it was kind of like after that i was it was good like yeah like i was you know i had family there like so it wasn't it wasn't like i was i felt like i wasn't

at home sure but i it was definitely my hazing but but was there was there a point where you wanted to sell drugs and a point where you wanted to sell drugs and stuff yeah yeah i wanted to do all of that shit so i was like i was selling weed for a lot of for a lot of years i just wasn't very good at it like when but in the burbs all over yeah yeah all over but yeah in the burbs in the burbs i was doing some other uh some other stuff yeah uh because my my cousins and them them used to like to, you know, run up in places, right? Yeah.

Oh, yeah. And so I'm not going to say your names. Yeah, yeah. We don't need to get anyone in trouble. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the best places to do that were the Burbs. So that was my contribution to the gang was like, yo, I'll find spots that we know, you can hit.

You're the location scout. I'm the location scout for the gang. And I'm like, yo, yo, I got houses. I set up the lick. I watch the schedule. I know when they go in and run out. And I was just set up. I was set up shit all the time.

Oh, wow. And so the Burbs is where we would go to make money. Yeah. I used to, we used to, before they had like uh damn this is aging myself but before they had like those those uh alarms in stores sure you could just walk out with whatever the fuck you want before the the things they click on there yeah the snap on things yeah so i would go i would go buy liquor i was in high school at the time yeah go buy liquor and then go to the school go to part high school parties sell that shit for like

300 i would sell bottles of hypnotic for 300 like really so that was the kind of shit we would do yeah yeah you know because we knew they had money you know what i'm saying so we're like hey we're gonna take it what was there ever a point where where uh you know what makes you turn around at a certain point because i have to assume that you get to like anybody who survives you know taking chances like that yeah like you get to a point where you're like yes i'm done yeah man uh it was when my it's when my home when my homie worm died um his name was worm that's a good name yeah yeah yeah he was his real name no but that's what he called he didn't kind of like like a worm. He was a good kid, man. What happened? Just liked to smoke and play video games.

And my homie, Jeremy, had robbed some guys that were on his block. He didn't know that they were gangsters from the city who just kind of moved out to the Burbs to get a little money. So that next day they found out he did it and they came and shot his house up and worm was the only one that died huh and um he had nothing to do with it nothing to do with it and we had we know i you know we had been locked up a little bit here and there and stuff like that but like nothing like nothing nothing crazy i kind of had gotten away with it so at this point my ego was kind of there but yeah but i was seeing people like go down and there was a there was a next level of this shit i had i was like if i'm gonna do this i have to take it up a notch and that's where all the

real fucking danger is i was kind of like dipping my toe in and out right yeah it's a weird thing to know that because i i knew that with drugs you know know, by doing drugs. You're aware of it? Yeah, because there's a place where you need, you're going to cross over and you're not going to have a conscience anymore. Right. That's it. And that you're playing by a different set of rules and it's a dangerous set of rules. And exponentially, the possibilities of you dying is increasing. Right.

Yeah. Truly truly that's exactly what it is it becomes like the risk isn't isn't worth the reward of it all and yeah on top of that's like i always always had these check-ins with myself like dog are you really good at this and i've done that with not just that but like anything i've ever i'm good i'm good at rapping okay what happened is i wasn't being i didn't know who i was fully well that's right yeah on that so i wasn't being as authentic as i could right i also was trying to help so many different people that i was never focusing on finishing a thing fully so i would always have like these drafts of songs that were good yeah they needed to work right

and the technique and i just wasn't like drilling it the way i did i corrected that behavior with comedy right not only i was supposed to be doing this for sure but like also that that method made me so much better and i applied it back to the music and the comedy music yeah took off and i was like oh oh i had to work harder but but there was that that point where like you know that next level after worm died yeah you just you you got scared well me and me and my cousin were like dude do we want to end up like this yeah this kid didn't even get to c18 and he didn't do nothing and he didn't do a thing you know i'm saying it was just like me me and me my boy was like yo we're gonna keep you know we kept selling weed and shit.

Yeah, yeah. We kept rapping. But, like, as far as all the other shit, bro, we got to get, you know, we got to start figuring out how to, like, get out of this shit. Right. Was it hard? No. I mean, not, I mean, no. Well, you lived far away.

I did. And then someone had, I had did something and then somebody had snitched on me. And so I had moved, I had moved away to Milwaukee to live with my sister for like a year and really yeah and then by the time i came back i was just out of sync with everybody you know good thank god so i used that to like what you do in milwaukee so some drugs off my porch so we we we just weed yeah uh so we'd off my porch and and kicked with my sister got to know her a little bit better and yeah and just kind of lay low yeah and like how old were you figure out what i was gonna do i i was like 20 oh wow maybe 19 maybe 19 i was like out of high school right

just out of high school so so you're doing uh you know you're doing time in the self-imposed protection program yeah yeah and and you're thinking about your life I'm thinking about like where am I gonna take this like we're actually gonna do and and I was still in the rap phase of my life then yeah I was like man we're just gonna like me I'm a rap maybe start a label you know I'm saying it just like put everything I got into this yeah and I was doing that already but like without the without all the bullshit yeah yeah and uh and we you know we had we had some gigs at some colleges and we and there were some like little things throughout you know how you know how it is when you're like building up and just like like a little piece yeah yeah a little bit of interest some guy comes

up to you and goes you guys are good yeah exactly like everybody ain't going wow but there's like four people that are like you're the best thing i've heard exactly and i'm like yeah one day everyone will say what you said no just that guy actually and he'll go to every show oh man he'll be swaying whether the beats on or not that guy that guy yeah yeah but it wasn't until like it was like 22 or 23 where i had literally from from the point i could work yeah i had spent every dollar trying to make rap work and it was it just got to the point where i'm like man am i gonna just keep being broke what did you find did you have a moment with that too because like i don't know man it's it's weird when you you realize at some point you're a talented person

and you know that because you're doing shit right but there there is that moment where you're like i don't think i'm good enough at this yeah it's like what's it was like i don't think the way i i feel like i'm gonna get on or become who i'm supposed to be yeah yeah i don't think the vision i had here is the vision that's playing out and i was like if i keep going to the studio laying these tracks yeah same thing the same way i think at 30 i'll still be here doing this in this way and i just couldn't risk that it's a weird moment where you realize like you know this could never go anywhere and i might not know it right exactly until it's too fucking late. Right. Right. There's no, you can't do nothing. It's like, what more proof do you need than 22 years of it not working?

It's like, you're okay. Yeah. You're good. Yeah. But I mean, truly, I was like, I could rap my ass off. Yeah. I still can't. Yeah.

But like, it just wasn't clicking. Yeah. So I was like, man, I need to switch. How's the dancing going at that time? So when I stopped rapping. Yeah. Rapping was, I was tunnel vision with clicking. Yeah. So I was like, man, I need to switch. How's the dancing going at that time? So when I stopped rapping, I was tunnel vision with rap. Yeah. These other skill sets were just I wanted to be the rapper that could do everything. Yeah, yeah.

So after I stopped rapping, I looked inward. I was like, okay, what other things am I good at that could be my next dream I chase? Fuck going to school. Right. I chase dreams. Yeah. That's what I do. Yeah. I'm a dreamer.'m an active dreamer yeah and so i was like i want to dance yeah so so i went to an

audition yeah uh for um one of r kelly's videos uh-huh and i i i got the audition yeah did well yeah got the gig yeah and then i was going got the callback right i was going to the callback yeah before it even started these motherfuckers were like they were just catty and like talking shit to each other and dancer you know not in i was just leaving gangsters and rappers and shit and now i'm over here with these catty ass motherfuckers and they're like bitch you can't eat perrier i'm like huh yeah nah i'm good and i didn't even do the callback i walked dead out that place and i was like i'm not no yeah i don't love it this much yeah because i'm like none of that shit would have turned me off if i really wanted to do it right you know but after i left the dream of my life yeah and i'm like i know this

don't feel right. It's a moment. Like I had, there's a moment where, so I can't remember. Someone shared it. Like I went on an audition. Like I barely had an agent,

but they sent me on an audition for like a Doritos commercial. So I can't remember. But all I know is that I've been told that I walk into a room and there's a bunch of comics in that room waiting to do this. And I'm just like,

fuck this. I'm not doing this. I'm not doing this. I'm not doing this. Not for fucking potato chips. You know, like this. You gotta know yourself, man. Well, yeah,

because like, what are you willing to, you know, you don't want to sell out for nothing. For nothing? Yeah. And I was worried

about the time of like, beating one of these motherfuckers asses and then getting in trouble for that shit. Like, I'm like, I don't want to. Well,uckers asses and then getting in trouble for that shit. Like, I'm like, I don't want to. It turns out R. Kelly got in trouble for everybody.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. He was good with trouble. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I actually lucked out. Yeah. So then, okay, so dancing's over. Dancing is over. Okay.

And so right before comedy, I was completely lost, spiraled. How old are you then? 24? I'm 20. I'm still 22. Okay, you're 22. So you're on schedule you're you're not gonna be a criminal now i'm not gonna be a rapper i'm not gonna be dancing's out so now you're lost this is the most random thing yeah i became a my a model manager bro uh-huh so you just want to you just look for a hustle hustle

yeah when you talk about we talk about those people with like 15 slashes on a business card, that was me. Oh yeah. Do you have one of those cards? Oh, what? Oh man. I wish I could, I'm going to try to look for one. I'm going back home Mississippi.

Like after this, I'm going to, I will send you some. If I could, I hope I can find some. Do you just have your picture on it? Yeah. Oh my God. Yeah, dude. What? With the silly writing, the cursive.

Yeah, with the, I think the name of the company. Bravura. Oh, yeah. It was like. A model manager. So you're an on the level pimp. No, man. Yeah.

It's what it felt like. But not at first, though. At first, it was just, i was at this club that i've been trying to get into a long time with a couple of friends and they just happened to be pretty as hell and uh second r kelly visit uh his people were there and they were scouting for one of his artists videos yeah and so they wanted to meet with my friend cap and uh what's up cap and cap was like hey could you could you come and be and pretend you're my manager because i i don't feel safe with these guys and and i just want to make sure everything's

on the up and up so i was like i don't know how to be a manager so i googled some shit real quick 10 and then i went over there and i just played the position yeah and she got she got the gig i drove her to the gig uh just to make sure everything's cool sure we got the check yeah i got my 10 that next week i had four more girls that were like i'm like submitting for shit and driving places and i'm now i'm just like now i'm just managing these mobs where are you at i'm i had just moved i had just moved back to uh chicago aurora yeah okay yeah chic yeah it's a roar cuz I was rekindling things with my parents right right also I was broke as fuck he needed help but I'll do some places sleep in the house hey I guess we could work

through it she had just lost her job so like we were both in the you know in the right place for change oh really yeah it was it was cool like you know my mom's always been a good one this one is 22 yeah but it was something that made her vulnerable in a way that i needed to see her and then like i was the same way and so we were able to really like get over so that was that moment yeah like you didn't know what you were doing or who you were and she would had time on her hands and was a little beat up herself. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so in that way, we got super close in that time.

That's good. It took some work. And I was managing these models. I was actually making some money, some decent money. Really? Yeah, it was like decent money to me. What did they do? It was for videos or for showing up at parties and that kind of stuff? Yeah, we did a few of those. It would for videos or for showing up at parties and that kind of stuff? Yeah.

We did a few of those. It would be videos. There was a thing called Remix the Runway. It was this event, this fashion music concert event. Right. So I would book for that. I booked for that for three years. And then there would just be different events that we would book them for.

On the level shit. On the level, dog. And it felt safe with you. That's good. Yeah. yeah yeah i'm looking for all on the level shit on the level dog i felt safe with you that's good yeah i was very i was very like i didn't want to be the dude that was just like being a sleazeball creepy yeah yeah i was like if i'm gonna do this i'm gonna take a series and plus a lot of girls were my friends yeah and i had become friends i was spending so much time with them so you know and so then uh but then it got to a point where i was like, am I really going to just manage motherfuckers?

Because it got to that ceiling like we're talking about where I had to go to the next level with it. I'm like, do I want to manage? Build out the business. Yeah. Get more girls. Right. Yeah. Because there were starting to be these rumors of like pimping and all this other stuff.

So I have to take it up a notch to either kill those rumors and just really, really go hard at this. Or take one more shot at my own dreams real quick at that time which was i had no idea i just knew that i i just knew i should try something right else because then because like if you stay in in those games you're just going to be the guy with different business cards every couple years exactly i'm selling hats one year like i don't cowboy 59 50s we got hats yeah exactly you know it's one of them things yeah so like it was really me playing video games high as hell with my with my homie marcus i was rapping with that we we were not rapping at this point we were just playing video games smoking weed and then uh i saw a

commercial for second city and i was like huh really just on tv it's on tv which i've never seen again huh uh but it was just dead ass and i went i hadn't really heard of second city at all yeah at this point and so i went up to my pops like yo you had a second city and he's like yeah he's like yeah i know second city and he started naming people and i was like oh shit maybe maybe maybe i'm funny yeah right yeah and i was like i mean oh let me try what's your dad do what does he do oh my dad uh he did a lot of things but he was a loan officer for churches in the inner city okay so he would he would help like black churches get funds to uh to keep their churches or to build

out and expand and stuff like that okay uh but he had he had a few other jobs before that yeah yeah one one was a repo man in detroit so my boy been shot at yeah yeah actually that was like his last day at work he said he got shot he's like shit ain't worth this i'm gonna find an easier uh environment yeah yeah he's a good guy though oh yeah my dad's cool as shit always supportive yeah he was he was the you know why he didn't agree all the time with things and um he definitely it's just he definitely like wanted to see me do well yeah and he out of the two at uh growing up he was the more lenient one with dreams uh-huh because he was he was a baseball player yeah and he had one and yes so he chased dreams my mom's did it by the book you know yeah she did it very very well so yeah she's like don't tell me how to make it i right i did yeah you know

yeah and he hurt his knee but so he had a little more patience with my dreams right you know even if he didn't know how to support me vocally every time yeah he was still like yeah he was sliding me a little 20 because i had no money like slide me a little 20 like all right man go ahead you know yeah so he would look out and i remember he oh he paid for my first few classes at second city so i could just see what it was and what was it like going over there oh man i was. I was coming straight, again, straight out of this world of just a very different world to this what seemed like a corny-ass world to me of just like a bunch of people, a bunch of grown people walking around a room, filling the space. Mostly white, right? Yeah, mostly.

Yes, all white. Yeah. And they were just, but it was something about it that I really loved. It was like, it was just, I couldn't, the class itself didn't sell me right away. Yeah. I went and saw an IO show and I saw like Tim Robinson and a few, Sam Richardson and a few other folks that are like fire at this. Sam and Tim.

Yeah. And I see them improvising. And I see Tim improvises 12 different dudes. Yeah. And I'm like angry. Like, this is not fucking off the top bro you know man right i'm walking away he was faking it yeah and then and then as i see another show i'm like oh these niggas are this good oh this is fire yeah it's like freestyling but funny you know

and so that's why i was like super in love with improv because it it fed my freestyle and those guys tim yeah and and sam are so they're they're out there dude yeah do it this was before they were this was before the world knew that they were that good yeah i mean and but they were like they were they were at the top in chicago yeah right yeah yeah yeah do it yeah and so but then i but then like people were saying that you know you had to pick improv or stand-up i was coming from rap. I didn't give a fuck about the separation. I'm doing it all. I'm doing comedy.

So I did all of it. I did sketch writing. But you get into the classes, and you go through how many years of that? For the improv, I did every class you could take. I put all my cash into that. Yeah. But is there a tier? Don't you become part of the

crew and then how does that work yeah so it's like it's like the introductory classes yeah then you have the uh uh conservatory which is like the elevated you have to be you have to audition for right and then they have these different companies um these bizcos and different companies that you can like work and get a little money from and then they have the doing shows yeah doing show how far did you get what'd you do i did it all bro i got i got i did i toured i did um you toured with second city we were the first crew to go international so we went to london to perform and that had been my first time out the country yeah and and then i was doing i was doing stand-up on like along with it so you're doing both So you're doing like Zany's and shit in Chicago?

No, Bert was an asshole, and I hated Bert. From Zany's? Zany's downtown. So I never did Zany's. He never let me do Zany's. But I did jokes and notes. I did everything else. The laugh track, did you ever do it when it was the theater,

like the Lakeview? Wasn't there a movie theater you used to book? That guy Ritter used to book comedy there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember I did it. So who are you coming up with then in stand-up over there what's that crew of the chicago guys you had drew michael oh yeah um like rail had just rail had just kind of went to la yeah hannibal had just left the scene yeah tj had just left the scene okay yeah and mike holmes and mike mail Mike Homes. Yeah. Pete Holmes, Mike and Kumail.

Weren't they Chicago guys? Yeah. Yeah. But they were, they were a little bit ahead. Kyle before you. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, D-Ray was still kind of, D-Ray Davis was still kind of around, but he was in LA

doing his shows and stuff. And then you had like, they were all kind of OGs. I'm trying to remember my squad. Like of who's, I'm sure there's a lot of people. So you're really doing both. Yeah. I'm, I'm, I'm in the scenes though. Yeah. And I've got a lot of, a Yeah, so you're really doing both. Yeah, I'm in the scenes though. And I've got a lot of

ridicule for that shit. From the comics. Yeah, all the comics was shit. Improv people aren't going to bust your balls for doing stand-up. Yes, they bust your balls passive-aggressively. They're like, I know you're a stand-up, but it's not about you just getting the joke, it's about

everyone getting the joke. Oh, so you had to deal with that. Yeah. This is not your show. It's our show. And I'm like, all right, man. I'm learning. Yeah, but you learned how to, like, I find that the people that did improv, because I never did, and it was sort of not the thing to do.

There was definitely two different worlds, and I never even thought about it. But you learned how to write. You learned how to work with other people. You learned how to direct a little bit and all that shit, right? 100%. And you know how to, like, kind you know how to direct a little bit and all that shit right 100 and you know how to like kind of like think on your feet which you can get yeah by being on stage sure enough but like there's a special kind of like i i love an elevated like improv experience with a with an audience member i don't like the easy like one two punching you

know oh no no yeah if you really get into it set up you know yeah just to pay off a thing you know what I mean? Oh, no, no, yeah. If you really get into it. Or like the fake setup. You know, yeah. Just to pay off a thing. You know, it's like, no, no, like really just go off and see where this goes real quick. Yeah, yeah, make it real. Yeah. Yeah. So when does it start to work out? Is your old man on board now

that you're doing shows and shit? Oh, man, they're... Both of them? They're my biggest fans. Oh, great. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it started to click. They both started to click um right around my

sixth year was when was when like i was starting to feel like strong like they were like from year one to three i was trash yeah i was just bad because i was you know i was good enough but i was bad i wasn't i look back and i'd be like that's yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah with some promise right i just was spread too thin trying to learn too many things right but then uh they started like after like yeah year four it was like oh i'm starting to feel it although it was still like i feel stronger than improv than doing my writing yeah writing feel stronger than my improv right now sure and but it didn't like around like year five like six it was like oh i know how to use my superpower a little bit. You know what I'm saying?

I know how to separate it. Yeah, yeah. And you're conscious of it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a weird time when you feel that. Or some of that fear goes away. Yeah. And you're not jumping.

You're not on the edge. You got to get to sort of like, it just happens. I miss the edge. Because the edge. Because now I have so much fun with doing both right that like my shows be long as hell and you know yeah yeah so i'm like so so you know i don't know when it you know i don't know in the curve the improv if it's just if i'm just having it ball well i don't know like i think it's weird though when you go back and forth like i don't know how much you cut in the special

but you know you were definitely doing some crowd work and stuff yeah and i there was one point in the special where there's a cut after you do some pretty good crowd work and you just go back to the bit and they're sort of like they're amazed that you remembered yes yes that had that had happened on my tour for two because i sometimes you can't follow your own crowd work yeah yeah true yo i'll also that these are the two things i was worried about with the special because i was like i knew i wanted to improvise in the special but i knew i wanted to have it be thematic yeah and tie in but i didn't want to plan it right and i was like but i i hope i'm not chasing my laugh in the middle of the show you know i'm saying i'm not hoping i'm chasing this fucking moment yeah and i and i hope that like i hope that i hope that the

me calling back my set yeah that moment happens on on camera you know how you could be on the road and you're like that was my special on the road i know yeah and you never get it back and you never get it back you never do it again and that thing was happening so many times but then it was like the lead up to the special like the last five hours i practiced that the moment never came and i'm like nigga what the callback yeah yeah i'm like you can't i mean it's one of those things that you like it's a skill set i know i have right i can't force it but you you kind of can you can you can yeah i mean that night i knew i knew exactly what i was doing i was like when i do this it's gonna fucking it's gonna fuck them up you know i was just feeling good yeah and i was like someone to put like i knew exactly what i was doing and. It's okay to know that. It felt great. I mean, they like the trick.

They do. You know how the technique works? Yeah. And they like it. It's like, oh, that's from before. Yeah. It's like, man, it's like he knows what he's doing. Yeah, exactly.

Man, I had a ball shooting that thing. I feel like I enjoyed myself too much i laughed so much more than i usually do it's funny what do you yeah like what do you what do you watch that when you watch yourself because like when you're younger you laugh out of a sort of insecurity right but then sometimes like as you get older you laugh because you're like fuck i just did that yeah it's kind of it's kind of like yeah damn i'm good i'm really good at this i'm having a fucking ball exactly you know and and so i like a in that way i do like it because i feel like we're all my the show really feels like it's like a kind of like a storytelling party a little bit yeah yeah

which is in the crowd work was you lucked out man right i'm like what if we get done yeah exactly man because they were like well i had like one of the best like you know the like the crowd seeder she's amazing i mean her name escapes me i'm so sorry i love you so much um i'm just i'm just really tired but she was like asking me like yo who you want in the front and it was really skewing to my like i don't want to plan too much yeah just make sure there's some couples you know yeah right but you didn't know anybody's occupation nah like varying ages of couples yeah yeah some single folks yeah yeah yeah and then whoever you want yeah yeah it worked out so that was all planned

that was like i got to remember that because i i don't i don't recall any of my specials having a cedar who was that uh well they knew, they knew I was going to improvise. Oh, so they wanted to make sure that you had some meat. Yeah. And I was like, it really was just like, yo, make sure some, no family in the front. Yeah. Oh, never. I don't even want to see them.

Yeah. No family in front. So they had like a super dope section. Yeah. Way up top. Good, good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was tight.

And then I was was like just make sure you have some couples that i can readily see on camera right and that's really what it was for it was yeah it wasn't for me planning it was more for like i need to make sure that you can see these people sure uh because i have i have this like split screen yeah yeah yeah i've never seen that before yes yes that's all i wanted i'm done that's that's all i wanted man because usually they use it to uh cut away you know you see the audience to do cuts and i i've gotten away from that i think everyone's sort of like i don't want to see him at all bro right i swear i think i i'm shout out to my uh the editor sean because i feel like i was yelling notes like i don't want to see

them yeah why are we seeing them yeah yeah yeah you know but it is it's like it it feels really needy yeah when it's not like um I mean there's obviously natural points where it just feels yeah yeah sure but like those points are so much smaller than like the specials that are out there yeah I don't want to pinpoint anybody's but like in terms of crowd work yeah in terms of like just like seeing the crowd right so many times no no no i think that's going out of favor yeah it's like tell don't tell me when to laugh yeah yeah you know just roll with it yeah yeah and and also they used to use it to cut away like and then like you see all those old specials where they're just cutting to people with bad haircuts from a different era yeah you know for no reason and then you see him twice i'm like how's that guy taking up any screen time yeah i don't get what i don't get why we have to see this man with this weird laugh they just did it because

they wanted to be able to cut yeah so like they want to take a chunk out so like show the laughing guy and now we're back we lost 20 minutes that's what yeah it was for cutting so wait so when you're how does the snl happen snl happens you're doing stand-up you're doing improv yeah and you got a little name for yourself in chicago or what yeah yeah i mean i got a name for myself in chicago i've i've started to i've started to be i'm like in la so i'm building a name for myself in la at this point oh yeah yeah i had just done the pop star never that's like where around the time i met you before snl yep yep yeah yeah and um and i had just done pop stars so that that was like my first big movie what is it oh the movie okay yeah andy sandberg and and those guys yeah yeah

and uh but i was still broke you know i had made some movie money but i was you know it was just enough people don't realize that you know it's not like you know your first movie or these tv spots you're not making you're not making bread and also you're doing day jobs i'm no i was i was very much like you guys you gotta put all your eggs while i was doing j jobs they were all like focused all creative focus i was teaching kids on the south side chicago uh improv and writing and then i was like was like, and I was writing commercials for this ad agency because they just had heard about me. Yeah, yeah.

And so I was just like, yeah, we wrote some KFC commercials and some. They hired a nigga for the chicken commercial. God damn. Motherfuckers. No one has to know. Yeah. I do want to know where that guy uh love that chicken for papa i want to know where he's at yeah because no one sings about chicken like that well you're gonna you're gonna run into him now you'll be getting a call i'm right here man i've been here

the whole time and i could use a job what do you love hot singer for you right now so so what they come out to chicago for show no they were so they were in la oh and uh and i was at that point i was like when i go to la i'm just trying to be on as many shows as possible and uh and i got a call and they were like yo they want to see you at a showcase and i'm like okay lauren or no? No, it was Linzy Shookus and I guess a few others, whoever she was with. Yeah. And they come to Chicago and do those auditions all the time.

Sure. I could never get one in Chicago. Because in the improv scene, I was too much stand up and I wasn't around them too much. I'm telling you, it was a whole thing. You didn't have any friends, huh? I had a lot of friends. But no one who would put you on the showcase? No one who would put me on the showcase.

Wow. Yeah, it was threatening. You got a beef? You got a resentment? I don't know what it was. I think I had too many shows, I guess. But I mean, are you mad at the person that held you back? Not at all.

No, no, no. Because I don't really know who. I couldn't really pinpoint. Pinpoint who said, no Chris. Not on this one. I just blamed people, the theater folks. I just blamed whoever was the head of, you know, I was like, oh, these motherfuckers don't see me, but it's all good. And then I was in that phase of my life, I was in a place where everybody wanted SNL

so much that I was like, fuck that. I don't want that shit. And then I got the audition. And I was like, oh, well, maybe. I mean, I'll just go see what it is. I'll just go be funny. It's another show. I'll just go do another show.

But you just wanted it. Oh, you mean in terms of how you were going to handle the audition, you didn't want to psych yourself out? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I definitely wanted it. But I wasn't ever going to admit that even to myself at that time i was just like i'm just gonna go right i had six shows that day along with that showcase i'm like it's a show right so i'm dude i'm three drinks in i walk in there i i fucking killed it and i can't believe i i i did because i was like didn't care yeah and then they hit me and they

were like yo this that was amazing they want you to fly in uh and i was like all right so then i went in uh had some strong like two drinks that they and i went in before you did the studio yeah yeah and i killed it there so they gave me they gave me the call back and then you got to go meet lauren yeah yeah so in between that call back you got to meet lauren right how many drinks you have before that so they hit me and they're like uh you gotta time your high for that one they're like any notes i was like any notes and they were like yeah just uh tighten up and i was like oh it's because i was tipsy as fuck uh so i was like all right no drinks this time i have one and i have a half of one on one and then i'll be good but for i wasn't nervous to meet lauren i was i was like excited because there was so much mystery.

So you did two auditions and then you had the Lorne meeting? I did the first audition. We did a callback and Lorne meeting in the same time. Oh, so you did the studio and Lorne the same time? Yeah. So how long did you wait for Lorne? A day and a half because he was flying from the Hamptons in his helicopter and then decided not

to come oh and wow so that that's pretty dramatic waiting usually he's just in the other room and you don't understand what the fuck is going on but you got helicopter treatment yo i got helicopter he decided to go back didn't didn't want to fly down that's what they said you know man and i was like man hey if you got if you got turnaround helicopter money, I don't know if there's that much I can say to you. You know what I'm saying? So then I finally met him, and he was really good. We kind of hit it off from the start. He's a good dude, man.

He is who he is. That's true. That was demystified for me when I talked to him because I didn't get the show, and I held it. I had a weird bitterness about it for decades really he agreed for an interview and he explained to me what happened it was a good enough explanation but you do realize that no matter how rich he is or whoever the hell you think he is or whatever he's done he's still a guy that just goes to work at that building yeah man runs a tv show yeah dude and he loves doing it yeah and he's like

and yeah and he just like and he's like focused on the show and making that show good. But now you, it was funny that in the special when you talk about fans of SNL being like specifically white in a way. Yeah. I never thought of that, but it's kind of true. It's just the way that we, the way that we look at, the way that most black culture looks at and live in color is the way that SNL fans look at SNL. And the color was like, what, two seasons? Yeah. Three seasons?

But there's like, and I'm not saying this to say that there's not fans of all colors of SNL. Sure, sure. But if you put a pie chart together, they would be majority white. And that's fine. if you put a pie chart together right they would be majority white and that's fine well yeah because it is like it's it's interesting because it's there it is it's a white show yeah and and the thing is is that living color was a specific cultural event for black people exactly you know it was the weigh-ins and everybody and it was all black right except for jim carrey yeah it was weird weird with a rubber face But funny as hell

But SNL they've had issues around Diversity Yeah yeah yeah Representation I always fuck that word I have to realize that the new word is Representation You gotta get that shit right I'm sorry

They're pretty good now they're representing everybody now I will say I was a part of the most diverse era of SNL there's ever been. And it's still very diverse now. And you're just leaving now? Yeah, yeah. I was always debating. This was before I knew the contract. But I was always like, if I get it, four years, I'm done.

And I was screaming four years forever and then you get in there and you know and it's it's the i i've always loved that job as much as i hated the job i think it's what makes it a beautiful place to work at right because it keeps you just feeling something yeah yeah and working for yeah and you're you're lit up man yeah it's live it's real time and there's nothing like there's nothing like and the competitiveness of the week oh wait to see what gets on what doesn't get on if you're gonna be on if anyone's gonna do your shit yeah exactly it's it's it's that whole thing and you're and you're creating in a vacuum too uh in a way because yeah because there's so many things you

can't get away with but you're trying to get away with certain shit right and so in that way i was like man i don't want to leave until i've i've learned everything i can from this place sure you know and and then you know when it came down to this year this summer i i mean this year i lost my i lost one of my best friends i'm sorry about that dude it was so terrible man he um i'm sorry about jack yeah thank you man i miss i miss him so much and uh and what we did together was so fire and what was that the show down yeah yeah that was like i man you know because i i used to see that guy at the comedy store we met him i met him a few times and

yeah he said some nice things about a very specific joke of mine which i was very flattered by because he just seemed like such a you know like he was all lit up he had that shiny kind of like charisma to him you know yeah man he could control the room did you see that coming funny no no man no i mean there was you know it was always no nah he was always talking shit we would always talk shit we were he had to be dark in that way but like it was never no one ever thought he would actually do it. But he had depression? Yeah. Uh-oh. Yeah.

I mean, yeah. I should say, we should say his name. Jack Knight. Jack Knight. On my special, I wear a JK on the back, and it's for my boy, man. Did that spark you to get serious with your shit? It's, oh, I've always been serious, Mark. No, I mean about the issues. No, it's oh i've always been serious mark no i mean about the

issues no it's well it was i was already on my way he i used to we used to talk all the time about about that like about just like the depression and like really how i'm feeling yeah we we would talk we would talk um we we had like one like three hour conversation about just kind of everything it was a it was like a couple days before oh my god um so i was glad i was like really glad i was on like a plane delay randomly yeah and just called him and we just was talking shit and i was so glad i had that convo with him but us making our show and like me coming from snl and then doing like a show that was all us and just like sam yeah yeah it's me sam jay lynx and kerman and it was just very much us and uh so funny and i was like man i i don't you know and i lost my other homie teddy

ray and so it was like bro i gotta spend time doing what i really want to do like and and because we don't know when when we gonna go you. You know what I'm saying? We've lost so many damn comics. What happened to Teddy? Teddy passed away. Yeah. How's that? I think I didn't. In the pool, man. Yeah.

That's right. That wasn't that long ago either, right? No, it wasn't, man. It was like a couple weeks after Jack. Right. Yeah, it was a tough one, man. So I was like, bro, I want to be able to get out and work with my friends. So that was one of the reasons you get out of SNL too. Yeah, and also I'm just ready to come.

How many years did you go put in? Five. All right. Yeah, I feel like five was- That's right. It's not too little, not too much. Not too much. A year later than you planned.

Yeah, yeah. But you didn't get stuck. Yeah. I could have done one more, but i won't i won't regret it but were you like everyone else is leaving no i wasn't that it was it was people were writing like that but it's not that at all for me it was like i'm gonna miss those people but that gave us more more to play with like it was so many people there that you're fighting for very little time and i'm like i don't know how much longer I can fight for two minutes.

Right. Five minutes. So it's, it was always competitive, but when there's, you know, 23 players, bro,

and it's like, I can go do shows. Yeah. I can go make us, I can go do other stuff. Yeah. Yeah. And I don't want to leave this thing bitter as shit.

Yeah. Right. You know, so it was, it just, it just felt like the right thing to do yeah and uh and and i'm working on some exciting shit yeah uh and i haven't focused on just kind of like stand up being a major thing like i've been juggling it and i've definitely put all my

time as much time as i possibly can but it's gonna be cool we did the special you worked that out yeah yeah that took a little time i didn't i never took breaks so on my off weeks from snl i was on the road pounding away yeah and where's the uh how's the uh the the um self-help business you know in terms of how where you at with that you feeling good about the therapist and stuff yeah i'm feeling good like we're we're two years deep now yeah and um and i i like it a lot yeah you know i'm i'm um my my anxiety was has been peaking how's that manifest for you though like because you're working all the time so what's the anxiety what is it usually about because i have anxiety problems and and i'm having

i've been having a little bit of a hard time with it because i've had it on and off all my life but for some reason like i what i do is i i worry about shit yeah i worry and i spiral so i so the thoughts are just like it's just like rapidly but you're just making up shit that's gonna make you crazy and you can't control it yeah and i'm just i'm just thinking about the worst case scenarios and it gets to a point where it's just kind of like debilitating like i just like isolate and did jack have that uh like in his yeah in his way yeah but or he was more classic depressed uh i mean honestly jack was jack was dope jack was just he wasn't like walking around depression yeah but but he because i find that the only reason i asked that we need to talk about we

can't speak for the dead and he's your friend but but like if i let my my anxiety go long enough i get depressed yeah yeah i mean i i was i was dipping, like, every four or five days until I started, like, so I got, I'm on Wellbutrin now. Oh, yeah? And that really helps a lot. Yeah, does it? Like, with the spirals, yeah. Like, I never go as low as I was going.

Okay. I was going low for years. I just thought I would have to, like, every, like, every other week, I'll just have a day or two where I'm just not gonna see people you know i'm saying yeah yeah like dealt with it that way until uh i was dating somebody and they're like hey you know why don't you try this and i was always scared of it changing like oh you mean the pills yeah yeah and but then like this is like super mild and it just yeah it's not bad yeah and and and i took it and it was like, oh, my God.

People feel like this? You don't have to feel like that. Wow. Oh, that's. Oh. You got the right one. Yeah. You know what I'm saying?

And so that changed everything. Oh, good. Well, that's great, man. And what do you got? What are you working on now? Movies? Yeah, man. So, you know, we got the special.

But then I got a couple of projects with Broadway Video. Yeah, man. We got the special, but then I got a couple projects with Broadway Video. Oh, yeah. Working on one for Audible with Will Steven. You're going to be working for Lorne the rest of your life. Rest of my life, man. I can't get away from the man. No, I love the dude. And we're doing Cyber Monday.

This is going to be a movie. We're shooting that. They're doing the deals now, so I can't say when we're shooting it. But we're shooting it soon. doing the deals now so yeah i can't say all right but soon and then um and i'm working with some with some folks i'll come back to tell you who okay um uh but we're working on a tv show oh good and and a movie i kind of want to do a horror comedy so oh yeah and called marlin wayans he loves that shit man he loves that shit don't he shout out scary movie I just did I just did

Corden with him yeah and him and I we get we have a funny relationship I just can't help but bust his balls he laughs

cause we did Respect Together so we became friends oh that's funny yeah yeah but he's in another movie that's kind of a scary movie but it's a family scary movie

he didn't write it he's just in it he's just in it get that check man he's funny family scary movies are always fun it's all like ooh yeah yeah it's light but you know i'm a i say that more than

if you ever listen to this i say that only because i'm a true horror fan so i look at family movies and i was like oh that's soft yeah yeah that's nice that's horror for the suburbs right you like the horror oh i love it man because i think i think i love it because i've been watching them forever but also it has the same kind of like uh rhythm as comedy it does actually yeah yeah and like i i can deal with it sometimes i get a little impatient with horror really yeah because like let's just get on with it kill the guy what are we doing what are we what are we doing i was just gonna take i get I get impatient if it's like no meaning to like, there's like a show out now called Slasher, which is just a guy killing people for no reason. And I'm just like, I don't like that.

No story? No story. Just like, just different scenarios where people are getting slashed up. It's just like murder porn. Yeah. I'm like, well, this is not fun for me, bro. I got to get into it more. My girlfriend likes it.

I mean, there's some of it I like, but maybe there's some old school shit that I gotta get into. Man, there's some really good shit out there. Barbarian is a great one. Yeah? Yeah, Barbarian is super dope. Doctor Sleep is one of my favorites. These are shows or movies?

These are movies. Okay. Yeah, but I love, I like horror too because there's, it's easy to fall into the pitfalls of being a hack. Yeah, sure. There's so many things into the pitfalls of being a hack. Just like the Saban's Comet. There's so many things. It's all been done.

Yeah, it's all been done. So it's really challenging to make a good one. So when you do, it's like, oh, shit. And that's the plan? That's the plan. I'm going to try. All right. I'm going to get after it.

Good to talk to you, man. Man, it's great to talk to you, bro. And finally. You know what I'm saying? About goddamn time. That's right. Are you going to stay in New York? Yeah, I'm in Harlem. Okay. I'm going to About goddamn time. Yeah, that's right. Are you going to stay in New York? Yeah, I'm in Harlem.

Okay. I'm going to stay in Harlem. All right. But I'm going to be in LA a bunch. All right, I'll see you over there. Yeah, yeah. All right, buddy. Chris Redd.

The show, the comedy show, the special. Why Am I Like This? Streaming on HBO Max. And if you could, please hang out for a second. Iced tea and ice cream? Yes. We can deliver that. Uber Eats. Get almost almost anything. Order now. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence.

Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. creative. All right, folks, today's archive episode that we are highlighting is episode 642 with Michaela Watkins. Now, Michaela Watkins is a close friend of mine. She was a close friend

of Lynn Shelton's as well. But but in the episode we talk about how she is one of the few former snl cast members who is honest and open about how she didn't have a great time at snl uh and this is a little bit of that i like lauren a lot i respect them but i didn't want to be uh i here's the thing i didn't want to i thought our relationship would happen organically so i never pushed one with him right i never kissed ass i never and every time and i was really intimidated by him but i felt like over time i'm gonna get to know him as a person and he'll get to know me as a person and and i trusted that that would happen right so i don't think i never i never kissed ass right i never uh seeked people

out and every once in a while you know one of the cast members like you should go thank lauren go say hi to lauren you know make sure you stop by or maybe not the cast but sometimes the other producers like you should go say hi to lauren and i'd walk up to his table be like hi and he's like hello and i'm like how are you doing are you having a good time? I'm like, yeah, I am. I'm really happy to be here. I like your tie. Okay. Okay. I'll talk to you later. Okay.

Goodbye. But so that, so the real reason why you didn't necessarily kiss ass is that, you know, I wasn't good at it. And also, uh, like Bill Hader said,

you know, the fact that you're going to go do this movie and he's letting you off to go do this movie or whatever. Which movie? It was Backup Plan. And he said, you should thank Lorne because, you know, I one time didn't and I could tell, I don't know, maybe he bothered. I don't know. He didn't know, you know, but he was just like, maybe you want to, you know. And I just was walking down the hall and you sometimes see him coming.

Yeah. And every part of me is like go the other way just turn turn on your heels go run move but i was like no i'm gonna i'm gonna take bill's advice i'm gonna go thank him you know and uh and and by the way bill is incredibly sweet i mean you didn't have to people don't usually give advice there it was really nice of him to so uh so i i know it was coming from a nice place but i i went over to uh lauren and it was really nice of him to so uh so i and i know it was coming from a nice place but i i went over to uh lauren and it was without any like you know warming into a conversation i was like hi lauren i just want to say thank you so much for letting me do this movie i am really excited

to go do this and you're just very nice and also i do is that you do you have a lot of shirts like that i like that one it's very nice on your body okay and he just kind of looked at me and he went okay like just okay and i was like this guy hates me and he never i like i said i never had that one-on-one where i sit down in his office and he gets to know me as me so uh it's just i could never i always misfired every time i talked to the guy yeah so yeah there you go michaela walkins episode 642 and that's available for free on all podcast apps and platforms you can get every wtf episode ad free with a wtf plus subscription click on the link in the episode description or go to wtfpod.com and click on WTF Plus.

Tonight, I'm in Dallas, Texas at the Majestic Theater. Tomorrow, Friday, I'm in San Antonio at the Tobin Center for the Performing Arts for two shows. And on Saturday, I'm in Houston at the Cullen Theater at Wortham Center. Then I'm in Long Beach, California at the Carpenter Performing Arts Center on Saturday, November 12th. Eugene, Oregon at the Holt Center for the Performing Center on Saturday, November 12th. Eugene, Oregon at the Holt Center for the Performing Arts on Friday, November 18th. And Bend, Oregon at the Tower Theater on Saturday, November 19th. In December, I'm in Asheville, North Carolina at the Orange Peel for two shows on Friday, December 2nd. And then Nashville, Tennessee, I'm at the James K.

Polk Center on Saturday, December 3rd. And my HBO special taping is at Town Hall in New York City on Thursday, December 8th. Go to WTFpod.com slash tour for all dates and ticket info. Okay, now here's some guitar that I did at some point. Thank you.