WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1483 - Dan Soder

Episode Date: October 30, 2023

Nearly fifteen years ago, Dan Soder and Marc were talking at a comedy club right after they were both fired from their respective radio gigs. Marc responded to that moment by launching this podcast while Dan committed himself to standup, which led back to radio with his show The Bonfire and to acting gigs on shows like Billions. Dan also tells Marc how his early life hardened him to adversity, losing his father and sister to tragic circumstances, and how he learned how to explain most of life thanks to pro wrestling. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Every veteran has a story. Whatever your next chapter, get support with health, education, finance, and more. At veterans.gc.ca slash services. A message from the Government of Canada. Are you self-employed? Don't think you need business insurance? Think again. Business insurance from Zensurance is a no-brainer for every business owner because it provides peace of mind a lot can go wrong a fire cyber attack stolen equipment or an unhappy customer suing you that's why you need

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knows. And I don't think we'd ever really, we never really met. Maybe we had briefly, but this is the first time we've talked. He has an HBO special called Dan Soder, Son of Gary. It was from 2019. It's sort of what got me locked into what he does. And he's funny. And he's going to be on the show today. So, look, let's get a few things out of the way. Because I mentioned a restaurant I go to here in Glendale quite often because I think it's great.

It's basically Middle Eastern food, but I said it was Persian and it's not. It's Lebanese. That place is Scaffs. It's over on Verdugo. And the last time I was in there, they had heard I mentioned it. And now, of course, I feel bad because I said it was Persian. I'm not even sure what Persian food is, to be honest with you. It's probably somewhat similar, but it's Lebanese, and it's the stuff.

You know, they've got the falafel. They've got the baba, the hummus, tahini. They make a great fool, the cabbage salad, and the meats. That's not my bag anymore. I just want to straighten that out. Not Persian, Lebanese, scaffs. There you go. Tickets go on sale for my 2024 tour this week. Here's where I'll be coming from January through June. San Diego, San Francisco, Portland, Maine, Boston, Providence, Rhode Island, Tarrytown,

New York, Atlanta, Madison, Wisconsin, Milwaukee, Chicago, Minneapolis, Montclair, New Jersey, Philly, Washington, D.C., Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Detroit, Charleston, South Carolina, Charlotte, North Carolina, Durham, North Carolina, Vancouver, and Seattle. There's a presale that starts this Wednesday, November 1st at 10 a.m. local time for each venue. The password is ALLIN. One word. ALLIN. It is all in one word, all in the general on sale date is Friday, November 3rd at 10 AM local time. Go to WTF pod.com slash tour starting Wednesday for links to all the dates and venues.

A couple of ongoing stories on Saturday night, I was honored at a grief support organization. I was honored by Our House Grief Support Center, which is an amazing organization that provides grief support for families and for individuals at all levels of grief, throughout grief. grief. And I was honored this year at their gala, and I was given the Good Grief Award for my work in publicly talking about grief on both the podcast and obviously my last special. And it was interesting for me, because I didn't know about this organization when Lynn died. I had no idea. And I kind of hammered away at it myself in the way that I thought one does, and it was during COVID, as some of you know. And unfortunately, after she passed,

it was hard to be with people. There was no memorials. There was no, you know, there was some Zoom Shiva type of things, and, you know, a lot of people reached out. I felt supported, certainly, but it was difficult. And had I known about this organization, maybe I would have sought it out because it is something that happens to everybody. And it's something that if you don't process thoroughly or process at all, it could bring you down from the inside. or processed at all, it could bring you down from the inside. But I thought it was kind of interesting that I was being honored for being hilariously sad at a grief support organization. And I think I could probably look at this as a lifetime achievement award, because if you look at it properly, and I think it's not that big a stretch, I think I've been hilariously sad my entire career.

So I'm going to look at it as a Lifetime Achievement Award, the Good Grief Award from Our House. If you want to donate to them, you can check it out. It's ourhouse-grief.org. If you could use their services or would like to support their mission, which is really to support people, individuals and families in all stages of grief. And it was amazing. Now, I want to make sure I frame this properly because it was a first in my comedy career because I knew I had to go up, accept the award, say some nice things. But also, I'm a comedian, so I believed I was expected to do a little bit of jokes. things where people were eating, big round tables, not an easy gig, but I knew I needed to drop a couple of jokes. And I'm being totally honest with you. This is a first that before I went on,

you know, there was many sort of speakers and some honors throughout the night. And then there was dinner. And then they brought up a mom and her three children who had lost a husband and a father to talk about the center and then me. So it was probably the heaviest transition I've had to deal with in my career, but a powerful evening nonetheless. So moving on right into it, the refrigerator problem. As many of you know, it's been a while that I've been struggling with the ice maker in an old fridge. I had Alex, the Ukrainian fridge repair guy, over here on and off for what seems like a year. There was passionate displays of anger and frustration. He came over with his son.

He yelled that he hated my fridge. His son said, fucking Murphy's Law. But, you know, Alex had me pretty convinced that it was his destiny and his quest in life to fix my freezer. But then, you know, it was just, it was hard to get him over. It was hard to get in touch with him. And, you know, it started to feel like a relationship I didn't necessarily want to be in. So I ordered a fridge about a month ago. It's basically the same fridge, just new.

And it makes beautiful ice, beautiful little cubes of ice with a big, beautiful tray. I mean, I was willing to fight this fight with Alex, but then I just, I lost my will. I ordered the new fridge. They took the other one out. Did not mind. I was happy to see that fucking thing go. And I'd like to believe Alex might've been too on some level. I didn't know what to say to Alex.

So I just sent him a video of me opening the fridge and the freezer, showing him the ice. And I just texted it's over. We tried. I've not heard back from him. I'm, showing him the ice. And I just texted, it's over. We tried. I've not heard back from him. I'm sure he got the message. That's where I'm at with this thing. Other things that are happening. Halloween is happening. I've bought so much candy because last year I was inundated with kids of all ages, probably some in college, not even wearing costumes, but that happens. happens you know why not if you can get away with it so i got a lot of candy i think we'll we'll carve some pumpkins tomorrow and uh on tuesday just be there i just got to be careful not to because i feel bad you know i i'm innately codependent and you know i just start to throw too much candy in and they just stand there

with their outfits and their parents and if you give one two you got to give the other two if you give one three you got to be able to shit and then all of a sudden i'm throwing all the candy into uh two bags and then i'm out of candy for when the uh the i think the slightly buzzed grown-up kids come to pillage which is fine if i don't have candy for them. But we're all set for that. I guess I should tell you, I just got out of Killers of the Flower Moon. We found the day to do it. We went. We locked in.

IMAX, baby. Fuck, that's the only way to see a movie. And it really is great to go to the movies. And I think in this time of decline that the communal feeling of being in a movie theater even if you don't like the other people you know it's just you know people were wondering and obviously there's been a lot of press on this you know between oppenheimer and barbie and just the return to the theaters the taylor swift movie but there is something great about it of having to witness with a bunch of strangers. The difference between what you do at home while you watch a movie or the impact it

has on you to walk out, even just side glancing people after a movie that was powerful like that movie was, it makes a big difference. It's a shared humanity. It's a shared bit of receiving profound storytelling. And it does mean something. It is different. It is vital. It really is. Going to the movies. And I've been doing a lot of it lately. I know my producer, Brendan, goes frequently, and it's something humans have been doing when the world seems like it has been ending forever, not just for entertainment, but again, for respite and for a little distraction. It's got things to say and the feels that it makes you have are important human feels to have in the context of what we're going through in our world today. Even deeper, even better, more than just a distraction. Art, baby.

Art. But that IMAX thing, it's just the size the screen should be like back in the old days. That's a fucking movie screen. It's supposed to be that big. I don't know if I need the chairs rumbling, but, but it's a real movie experience. And this one, the one we went to has the reclining seats. So it was nice. It was nice. I didn't even want popcorn. I ate a lot of popcorn. It doesn't matter, but the movie is spectacular. How, how is it not going to be? You know, obviously DiCaprio is amazing. De Niro is great. Uh, but Lily Gladstone fucking carries that movie, man. And I knew when I saw her in certain women, that Kelly Reichardt movie. Wow. I knew I was like, who the fuck is that? And now she is in the, you know, the biggest movie of the year, probably.

I think in terms of weight and she was amazing. And also several WTF guests, obviously it seems that's the way with any movie now, but, but I was surprised that the musicians in the movie did so fucking well. Jason Isbell is in the movie. He's got a pretty big part. And he fucking, he holds his own, man. He's there with fucking DiCaprio.

And he does the thing. Sturgill Simpson is in it. Great. Holds his own with De Niro. Great. Jack White held the screen well. Very impressive. Pat Healy, who always does these smaller parts in these movies that are either, you know, old timey set in the West or relatively new timey set in the West. And he's always good. I'm going to text him. Bargetzi hosted SNL the other night and did very well. I'm saying this with pride and excitement for people I know kind of well and people I know not so well that I've talked to, and also just to

counter my own sort of lingering sense that I am not as popular as them. That's all right, but that's not taking over. Right now, it's the other thing that's taking over. That's all right. But yeah, that's not taking over right now. It's the other thing that's taking over. It's the happy for, for the people I know thing. Listen to me live in it. It's not always there. All right. So look, here's where we're at now. We're at Dan Soder time. Uh, again, this is the first time we ever really talked. He's out on tour right now through the end of the year. You can go to DanSoder.com to find dates and get tickets and watch that 2019 HBO special, Son of Gary. I think was a big deal for him. And I think I had just seen it when I had this conversation with him. Every veteran has a story.

Whatever your next chapter, get support with health, education, finance, and more. At veterans.gc.ca slash services. A message from the Government of Canada. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer.

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about myself to know I'm not, I just, I'm too panicky, too worried, and I'm just too selfish. You know what mine is? What? I want to be liked too bad.

So I'd be like, I would do stupid things to get my kid to like me. You know, it's like I push back on the people liking me too much. You're like, you know what, watch this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're like, you think you like me? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's just keep a healthy distance. I think my entire comedy career was sort of navigating that, sort of wanting to be liked with like, I don't trust you at all.

Oh, man, it's so crazy because as a people pleaser, one of the main things you realize is, I don't want half these motherfuckers to like me. Yeah, yeah. I don't know. Why do I want you? Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. Why do I want you?

Well, people pleasing, that's like, I don't know. Maybe I fought that too, but I think I have more of it than I think. I'm a little older than you. Yeah. I come from a certain amount of chaos. Yeah. Not the same kind of chaos. Sure.

But once you realize that you don't have the emotional autonomy that you think you do because you either have been trained by a parent to accommodate them. My God. Right? My God. I was raised by a single mom, so mine was be a soldier. Oh, really? Yeah, it was just be a good soldier.

Oh, really? And then I never was- She didn't lean on you? Yeah, but in weird ways of keeping the house clean, of being a good soldier. Okay, yeah. I i mean that's the best way i can describe my childhood and you grew up in where is it aurora so we i mean i grew up in new mexico so we're sort of like yeah there's a there's a thing about uh southwestern and but it is the rocky mountain high plains the rocky mountain uh townie yeah it is it's it's weird

being from one of the funniest conversations. I was on the phone with Bobby Kelly, and he was with Colin Quinn. Colin. And Bobby. It was right when I started opening for Bobby, and Bobby goes, yeah, I'm on the phone with this kid, Dance Soda. Where you from, Soda? I go, I'm from Aurora, Colorado, and Colin's just a genius.

And Colin immediately goes, oh, yeah, suburbs, nice suburbs in the 70s, dilapidated from the 80s and 90s. I'm like, that's exactly what it is. It's just like moved on suburbs. Like Quinn has been making notes across America. He does. You can give him anything. I feel like I remember Aurora.

I don't know why I would have gone there, but I feel like I know it. The mall shooting, That was big. That was Batman. Colorado, we all have our own. We have our own shooting. Columbine, too? Columbine's more towards Littleton. That's west of Denver. But yeah, we were the Joker

movie theater. Oh, that guy. Yeah, Aurora Mall. And then I thought about Arvada. Arvada, because there's a record store I go to when I go to Denver in Arvada. Okay. So I drive up there. Yeah. It's called Red and Black something. It's books and records. Denver's an interesting town because... It's alright.

It's a little drunky. There's always the possibility someone's going to fucking pass out. Like, they're one of the first places to legalize the weed, so you do these shows. Yeah. You do these shows where you... Downtown Denver, it's like, what the fuck is happening? It's like Glasgow. There's just people running into walls. People get fucked up

since 2014. But you know what? People don't realize this. People were getting that fucked up before 2014. But the altitude, too. It's a training ground. I'll tell you, as an alcoholic from Colorado, I was built. I was built. Because I moved down to sea level when I was 18.

And I was laying motherfuckers out. It was just a different world. So wait, now you got engaged? Yeah, I got engaged about a year ago. It's weird. Like my experience is I think we've met a couple times. Not much. So I think we, you know what's funny?

Do we have a problem? No, not at all. You might not, but we'll work it out. So we've met at festivals a couple times through friends. Nate Bargetzi introduced me to you a couple times. Nate. Just one of the best. He is one of the best.

And what you don't remember was in 2008, 2009, we would talk all the time at the bar at Eastville Comedy Club on 4th Street. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And right after you got let go of Air America was right when I got fired at K-Rock. Oh, wow. And we used to sit at the bar and talk shit about radio, just almost like less than a handful of times. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But we sat there, and I was like a, I mean, I was a brand new, I was like new to the city, still doing mics.

Oh, so what was that, old bitter guy? No, but I just had the radio thing. Yeah. I had the radio way to talk to you. Right. That was the way in. Right, so we could talk radio. Yeah, and you gotta let go of Air America.

Yeah. I had just, K-Rock had just flipped from rock to pop. So they let everybody go. So you were a real jock? I was, yeah, I did overnights and weekends. Really? Yeah. And I had been doing that since I was 19 in Tucson.

In Tucson? Yeah, I went to Tucson. I went to the U of A. All right, let's back up. Let me just like, before we go into the U of A, my brother went to the U of A. Okay. I know Tucson. Before we go into the U of A, my brother went to the U of A.

Okay. I know Tucson. But the last time I saw you, I was like, I had a, like, it's memorable to me because I'd come to New York. I don't, I don't do as many sets at clubs as I used to because. Because you just get to this point where you really are. Yeah. You're like, you're old enough that you're like, I don't do this anymore. Well, I mean, I don't, I like the place I used to, but it's not the same place I came up in.

A lot of the guys are gone. Some are dead. So I hadn't been doing spots in New York much. And I came in from LA, and I went over there. And I mean, Esty said, go over to the underground and do a spot. And you went on before me and just leveled the place. And I didn't have my New York chops in order.

So I just remember you killing them, me standing in the back of the room going, ah, fuck. And then I go up there, and it was one of those sets, and it doesn't happen often when you've been doing it as long as I have, where you just feel that sweat

on the back of your neck. It's the worst, because your body is not reading that like, I'm going down. Yeah. But that sweat on the back of your neck. The flop sweat of just knowing. Yeah, that's not,

I'm not going to pull it off. Or it'll be in the back of your jaw, where you'll start feeling it yeah like the little clenching but you trained yourself not to show it unless you're gonna snap or you're gonna acknowledge it but you know that i just couldn't yeah it's a good feeling what i remember i didn't blame you for too long from that what i remember from that interaction is you do remember that well i remember not i don't remember me doing well i don't remember any of me doing positive right right what I remember from that interaction is. You do remember that? Well, I remember not, I don't remember me doing well. I don't remember any of me doing positive. Right,

right. What I remember is you coming downstairs. Yeah. And I was sitting talking to Liz, the manager. Yeah. And I had my hands kind of under my chin on the stairs. And I turned around and you went,

and I went like, oh, hey, like, cause I just had my hands. And I went, oh, and I thought I did such an LA thing at you where the prayer hands,

when really I just had my hands together. I was like, oh, hey, hey, Mark oh hey hey Mark like the you're walking by and I was like Mark Maron thinks I'm a dildo because I just did like the hey how are you no no I just thought you were a dildo for killing so hard I'll take that I'll take that being a dildo and uh and and making it hard for me because I personalize everything yeah but it what it, but back in 08, I remember, first off, I remember this story. You had an apartment in Astoria. Yeah. And I lived in Astoria for 17 years.

Yeah. Where? Right on 31st Street and 28th Avenue. I lived at 37th and 30th Avenue. Well, I know that because Louis Katz, one of my my closest friends he just emailed me yeah i love him he was we're just in san diego together he this is oh 708 okay yeah and he texts me hey marin's i'm thinking about moving into marin's apartment marin's moving to la yeah he's moving back to la i might take marin's apartment why don't we meet up and get lunch?

Yeah. I was like, absolutely, dude. I live in between the 30th Avenue stop and the Astoria Boulevard stop. Right, right, yeah. I'll walk over. Yeah. He gets off the train at 30th Avenue. And I remember this specifically.

He goes, so where do you want to eat lunch? I go, there's a Subway down over there. And he goes, you fucking white trash, dude. You live in one of the greatest neighborhoods for food. And it took me a while to discover all this stuff. Yeah. But now now looking back, I'm like, I'm so embarrassed that I was like, Subway? I recommended Subway when there's Taverna, there's like BZ Grill, there's like incredible food. Yeah. Well, you grew up in Colorado. What are you going to do? Yeah. I was like, well, there's a Burger King. Yeah. Yeah. Let's do that. Hiking distance. It's always Colorado terms. Hike up to the burgers here.

Sure. So I'm watching. Well, how far up did you guys have like those regional chains like Blake's, Lottaburger, or is that New Mexico? I don't think you have. Well, you got, Whataburger was New Mexico. Whataburger was a little, there was a round, but Blake's Lottaburger was definitely New Mexico.

Okay. But I don't know what's up in Colorado. I don't know what's spread out that far. Piggly Wigglies? No, we didn't get the Piggly Wigglies. Oh. I think those stopped at New Mexico. Circle K's.

Circle K's we had. Yeah, they're around everywhere, I guess. Yeah, I used to hang outside a Circle K. Sure. When I was 13. Yeah. And ask guys to buy me cigarettes. Yeah, buy cigarettes, of course.

With $3? Yeah. That's how much cigarettes were? Three bucks. When I was in high school, I remember them being at the Husky station. I swear to God, they were 55 cents a pack. Is that possible? My mom said she-

In 1980? Yeah, my mom said she quit smoking cigarettes when they got to $1.50. Right. And that was 1988. Right, so I was probably right. It was crazy. What did you smoke? I smoked Camel Lights.

And that's how you started? I started with Marlboro Reds. Of course. That's what my dad smoked. Marl that's how you started? I started with Marlboro Reds because that's what my dad smoked. Marlboro Reds. And then I moved to Marlboro Lights because I didn't want to tell my friends, but it was hurting. Sure. It always hurts. We were 13. You quit though?

I quit when I was 29. So I started smoking when I was 14. So you were 13. Yeah. Yeah. Or 12. I was 12 when I started. 12.

I was in seventh grade. Right. I was watching your special. Yeah. And it's funny to me that you're now engaged because, what was that? When did you record that? 2018? 2019. Yeah.

2019. When did you get engaged? 2022. See, like, I don't know, like, because I, here's what I couldn't get out of my head is like, because I've watched a lot of specials, and I watch a lot of the times the guys come on, but you're pretty straightforward. You're honest and uncomfortably honest in some places. And I'm familiar with that.

I do that myself. But I thought if you were to just edit that special, it would be an interesting dating profile because it would just be like, I'm Dan from Aurora, Colorado. I had a single mom. My hobbies are getting high and showering, getting high and eating, getting high and listening to music, getting high and talking to myself and laughing, getting high and talking to myself and laughing in showering. Yeah. Getting high in eating. Yeah. Getting high in listening to music. Yeah. Getting high in talking to myself and laughing. Yeah.

Getting high in talking to myself and laughing in the shower. Yeah. I aggressively and passionately will eat ass and pussy. Yeah. And I'm a really good fuck. And I want no emotional commitments. Dude, it's almost crazy because you said if you were to do that like a time capsule. Yes.

So much stuff has changed. I know, that's what I'm thinking. With the craziest one, the biggest reveal. You stopped eating ass. Well, I haven't ate ass in quite some time because I've been in a loving relationship. Oh, that was just something you do to avoid intimacy? That's just something where you're like,

look at me eating your shit. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Look at me eating your shit. But I can't smell. And I never- Anymore? In the joke, I've always had a very low like a very weak sense of smell yeah and because of cigarettes yeah it's gone and so

when really so when covid dropped and everyone was like oh one of the symptoms where you can't smell i was like i don't think i've been able to smell for a while huh and sometimes it goes in and out you really think he killed your nose? I mean, what's weird is that my fiance, Katie, had a nail polish remover. Yeah. And she was like, look at this. This was like three weeks ago.

Yeah. And I went, nothing. Really? And I went like that. And then I lifted my nose up like this. Yeah. And I got a whiff. Yeah.

And I was like, oh, I caught a little bit of it. Yeah. And she's like, man, we got to get you to a doctor. We got to fix it. Fix whatever the fuck's going on. Well, did you get punched in the face? Yeah, when I was little. So it might and she's like man we gotta get you to a doctor they gotta fix it fix whatever the fuck's going did you get punched in the face yeah when i was little so it might have been you know so you so that's a broken nose i also hit it on a mailbox riding a bike one time break it yeah my mom like my mom did the single mom thing where she was like i don't have time to go to the

hospital so let's just the boxing thing yeah she was like we're just gonna put it in the middle and i remember like i'm sorry i'm sorry because when you get injured yeah you know with a single mom sure i gotta leave work i gotta do something well like how much of that stuff like because i'm finding that at my age because i talked uh sort of shamelessly about some of the same things you did in terms of the type of people you have sex with sure you. You know, you know, and like, I've grown to realize that when you're that kind of person, you're just out there fucking.

Yeah. That you're, it's actually, uh, protecting you from intimacy. Yeah. It's, it took,

it took the pandemic. It took, um, living with someone. I've never lived with a woman. Yeah. It sounded like you were, you know,

you were pretty dead set on just. And she cracked me. What what's funny is i at that taping of that special was our second date wow our second date when she was at that special and which was great when you're dating because you're like you want to yeah watch me watch me talk about all these other chicks i fucked i was like so some of that stuff, but she's so great. She understood. And what was weird is living together in the pandemic and understanding that I felt like my comedy was, I liked the jokes, but I didn't think it was cracking through. And then I realized all stuff-

Cracking through yourself? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Like really getting to my core. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Even with the mantle. And I realized, you know, I've been in therapy for 12 years. Have you?

Yeah, but I realized, oh, I'm not letting anyone in. Right. And that includes not only my partners, but the audience. I'm not really. You're putting on a show. Yeah, I'm like. The Irish charm offensive. Yeah, that's exactly it.

I'm letting you in part way. Yeah. It's like my Swedish side is stubborn. My Irish side is like, that's far enough. Yeah. That's far enough. You got enough. You're in.

I showed you the sadness. So just know that there's sadness, okay? Yeah, right, exactly. That's what's behind that door. But to actually let someone in has been very rewarding. Yeah? It's been very like, oh, shit. All right.

Because I deal with this now on stage. But what do we, because you're a guy, I do what you do. I talk about myself. Sure. And I talk about things that are emotionally disturbing, all this shit. That's the world we're in. Long form, personal comedy. I like that. Obs know, that's the world we're in. Long form, personal comedy. I like that.

Observation. That's what we do, right? So that's going to evolve as you evolve, right? But then you start to wonder, and I don't know if you get this. I don't know how you write either. It's just sort of, I talked about the other night. I did an alt show for the first time in forever. It was outside at a record store.

Yeah. And, you know, I did some shit that I'm working on that's pretty serious. It's pretty heavy. But from talking about Lynn's death, you know i i know how to get in there and work that shit out but like i said something i said this this was a real alt set man because back in the day you do one of these sets and you go home and you go like why did i tell those people you go i let a lot loose man why did i don't know those fucking people a lot of people got a lot loose, man. Yeah, man. I don't know those fucking people. A lot of people got a lot of info on me right now. That's right.

I gave out a dossier. Right. Yeah. An emotional dossier. It is. Do you feel that? Yeah. You know, I've been doing this bit.

I got hair surgery during the pandemic. What does that mean? I got the back of my head chopped off and put on the top of my head. Were you bald up there? I was going bald. On the back or in the front? On the front. Oh.

And this doctor was like, oh, we cure that now. Really? This doctor was like, oh, this is literally the way he sold me. I'm such a mark, and you'll learn that about me. Really? I'm a true mark. I'm a huge professional wrestling fan. I can be bought in. You're lucky I-

You didn't strike me as a mark, but maybe I can. You're lucky I wasn't climbing the walls of the Capitol on January 6th. That's how big of a mark I can. You're lucky I wasn't climbing the walls of the Capitol on January 6th. That's how big of a mark I am. But that means because you know it, as I do too, you have to be hypervigilant about what you let in. Exactly. Before you open your mouth and say, like, this kind of makes sense. You're like, hold on. Yeah.

But I got in that moment. This doctor's like, one surgery. We could do it here and you won't ever go bald. Right. And it was like, I rushed to do it. Yeah. Because I'm also an addict. Yeah, sure.

So you know that feeling of like, oh, make it all better. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, this will make it all better? Make it all better. Tomorrow. Pour me a drink. That makes it better? That makes it all better.

Yeah, yeah. And so this guy did it. And I did it. I got the surgery. And then I regretted it. Really? I got it. It looks good, though.

It's great. How long ago was that? I've been saying on stage about a year ago. Oh so till then i don't even see where where it happened it was it was coming in but i on stage i call it my hair tits that i got hair tits done yeah but what happened was is i got it done and then i hit this moment of like what did i do right i should have just gone bald who the fuck am i should just go bald you yeah and then it's this you know that mean part of your brain that's like you pussy yeah yeah why did you suck it up yeah yeah and then i said vain girl and i exactly and i turned to katie and i'm like i think i regret this or whatever and she

goes well lucky for you you can always write bits about it right and you can go on stage to talk about it right and somehow in a way of opening up to that level of insecurity that felt like intimacy to be like hey guys i was really insecure about the size of my head and i was going bald yeah but you don't you think you know talking about my dead dad size problems oh my god i wear a size eight fitted hat i i wear an eight and three quarters you're the first person i've ever met over an eight no dude and i'm shorter than you it's ridiculous i see pictures of me i'm like battering'm like a fucking bobblehead. Yeah, that's how I felt my whole life. The only thing I ever said to myself was,

most movie stars are short with big heads. Every big head guy tells himself that. I know, but I watch myself on camera, and I'm like, I still look like a guy with a big head. It's not working. Every big head guy goes, you know, that means it's going to be a movie star. What about your dad?

But when I was on stage, you know, the first step of that movie star what about your dad but when i was on stage you know the first step of that was talking about my dad yeah dying right like you said when you're talking about lynn there's a thing that we have a certain skill set where once you know how to do that it's like a mechanic you're like i know how to i know how to fix that i know how to do that well yeah you you're kind of making it better for yourself in a way but it was interesting the way you framed that though because you sort of defended him and i i can't imagine that's the reality of it no no not at all not at all like my dad left he was a drunk and then he said he died partying yeah because it was it was an easier way of it was a funny way of being like oh he abandoned me and didn't care

right but you but in the end you did the the codependent thing and you're like you're just having a great time yeah i really on the beach i forgave my parents for every misstep and never allowed myself to feel the anger and actually process is that really forgiving or is that just sort of shutting it down shutting it down so okay so you're growing up your dad left when uh my parents broke up when I was five. My dad. And you had a relationship with the guy, though? Yeah, we were real close.

Oh, okay. When I was under the age of five, so my mom worked at Aetna. I was born in Hartford, Connecticut, and my mom. Oh, man, lucky you got out of there. I know, right? There's nothing going on there. Yeah, I know. I drive through there, and I go. What is happening?

At least my parents fucked here. Yeah, I came from here. Yeah, at least this is where they put this fucking soul in a little piece of meat. But my parents moved. My mom got transferred from Aetna to Denver. And when she got transferred, that's when they broke up because she found out he had been stealing

from their mutual account. To do what? To pay off a guy. My dad... This is a good story. to pay off a guy. My dad. This is a good story. To pay off a guy. Yeah, my dad was a bartender in Connecticut. Yeah.

And a lot of the Wall Street guys would come in. Right. This is the 80s. So he's a Mark too? He's a Mark. Oh, yeah. What happened? This guy was like, hey, just take this money,

you put it in the Wall Street, and then it comes back out. My dad had zero business fucking with Wall Street. Right. So he took a loan from a guy. Yeah, a guy. I think for like 15K. Yeah, what was the vig? Exactly.

Yeah. And he lost it. Yeah. And instead of telling my mom that he fucked up, he just took the money out of their mutual account. And this is before the internet. Uh-huh. Just signed the check. Was it one of the boys who he took the loan from?

Like, was it a mob thing? No, no, no. It was not a connected man. I think it was a guy that worked at a firm in New York that was a regular off the train, would come and get drunk. Sure. And my dad was very personable.

He was a great bartender. Right. And he... That's why you're a comic yeah i used to watch my dad so what i mean so he stole so he stole my he didn't tell my mom and then my mom moved to colorado and kind of figured it out when the bank called and was like hey you're uh you've been past drawn and we're gonna have to shut this down yeah and then my mom had to file for bankruptcy and she kept them out. Oh my God, that was it. And it was it.

And then he moved back. He's from the Bay Area. So he moved to the Bay Area. Yeah. And, but we were real close up until then. Like one to five, since my mom worked during the day. Yeah, he'd sit you up on the bar. Oh, dude, even better.

Yeah. So when he, when my parents broke up, he moved to San Francisco. And then when I was about 10, he moved with my grandmother to this place called Lake County, Northern California. He would bartend at a bowling alley. Oh, nice. And I would just sit behind the bar on a milk crate reading comic books.

At 11 or so, or 10? I was like 9 and 10. Yeah, yeah. 8, 9, and 10. And you had siblings? I had a sister whose birthday it is today. Oh. And she passed away when I was 16.

She got killed in a car accident when I was 16. She was my half-sister. In Aurora? No. And she actually died in Los Angeles on Interstate 10. She was from Fontana in Riverside. She's your half-sister? How?

My dad had her when he was 20 in the Navy. But you were closer. Yeah. My mom made sure of that. Oh. Because he abandoned that family. Then he abandoned our family. Yeah.

So my mom reached out to his ex-wife and was like, Hey, these kids should know each other since they got a common thing going on. And my sister was 12 years older and she, uh, she was great, man. She, you know, in a lot of ways, I think my, my sister saved my life by being the one person I could trust and one person that, uh, saw me for me.

And yeah. Like when did you realize that when I was about, uh, I mean, after she passed away, definitely, but when she was still alive, she would just kind of pull me aside and be like,

these people are fucking nuts, dude. Yeah. Your mom and her boyfriend are nuts. Yeah. Fuck our dad's whole family. Yeah. Fuck that whole family.

Yeah. She's like, but you're, you're a good kid and like do what whole family. Yeah. Fuck that whole family. Yeah. She's like, but you're a good kid. And like, do what you love. Yeah. She got me into music. I used to listen to music

and I would only listen to the hits. I remember that. Sure. Because you grew up in it. Yeah. I grew up in it everywhere. The hits. Whatever year you grew up in,

it's like, those are the ones that are in there. Yeah. And I remember I got into, I finally got into Jimi Hendrix. Sure. I was like. Because of her?

11 or 12. And I, it was probably because of a movie all along thei Hendrix. Sure. I was like- Because of her? 11 or 12. Sure. And it was probably because of a movie all along the Watchtower. Yeah. And I got the best of Jimi Hendrix or whatever. Yeah. And she was like, I was like, no, I love Jimi.

She's like, name a song that isn't Purple Haze or all along the Watchtower. And I was like, hey, Joe. Yeah. And I was like so proud of that. Yeah. And she was like, no, dude. Like, listen to the albums.

And she was the first person that sat me down. She's like, if you like an artist like listen to the albums and she was the first person that sat me down she's like if you like an artist yeah listen to their full album sure and you'll find songs that no one else likes that you that mean more to you yeah and i that lesson changed the way that i take in stuff yeah yeah because you're like oh well there's a whole product i'm a massive queens of the Stone Age fan. Favorite band. You had Josh Homme on. I know.

I did. I listened to that interview on a bus to a gig in Boston. It was one of my favorite interviews. Oh, good. Because you asked him a question specifically that I remember. You were talking about, you said, you don't sing lead on some of your songs. I think you were specifically speaking about Mark Lanigan from the Screaming Trees, who sang my favorite Queens of the Sun Age song, In the Fade,

which is what closes out my HBO special. Yeah, it's great. But Josh Homme answered, he said, I want to make something great, I don't care how small the part of it I am. And that, to me, I was on a bus, going to a gig, listening on my phone,

and I remember being like, that's the way to create yeah the way to create is like selfless collaboration but to remove the ego right are you is what you're making is the goal to make something that you're proud of yeah that you've put yourself into no matter how large of a role you have it yeah and i loved it but my sister was the one that got me to listen to music in a way where I got into Soundgarden deeper than a lot of people. Yeah. Because I would just fall in love with certain songs.

And so that was always- Those old Soundgarden, like the sound, the old Soundgarden, like Loud Love. Oh my God. Or the, what's that one, Gun? I mean, my favorite, my favorite song is from Super Unknown, one of the most famous albums. Yeah. But Fourth of July, no one talks about. No, no yeah and it's a song that i come on i played it i played that for louis on the drive up and he was like yeah i don't really fuck with soundgarden he's

like but this song is unbelievable how can you not fuck with soundgarden i know they're unbelievable yeah i mean i i'm in like a deep vinyl hole right now i mean i've got thousands where i sat down last night and i just listened to all of the Velvet Underground loaded. Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah. That kind of shit. And when she did that to me with music, that unlocked me doing that with comedy,

which is what I've always been obsessed with, which was stand-up comedy. So I started listening to random ass albums and getting into comedy scenes where I wasn't living anywhere in New York. Like what? Like New York. Yeah. Specifically into like comedy scenes where I wasn't living anywhere. Like what? Like New York. Yeah.

Like New York. Like New York. Yeah. Specifically Colin Quinn and kind of all the branches of that tree. The branches of the tough crowd. Tough crowd. Like the. Yeah.

And I got. Geraldo, Patrice. Yes. Bill Burr. Burr. It was all those guys. Bobby Kelly. Bobby.

Keith Robinson. All these guys. How's Bobby doing? He's doing great. I love him, dude. I love him, too. He's like an older brother to me. I, you know, I just guys he's doing great i love him dude i love him he's like an older brother to me i you know i just uh he's an honest fucker dude he'll call me and he'll be like dad and you just know you're getting a real conversation with bobby but it'd be it that kind of love for stand-up i think is what got me into especially like i got into all these old

specials i was just watching shit from the 90s. Yeah. All the young comics of comedy. It's wild, right? It's interesting how that stuff, a lot of it doesn't hold up. Yeah. But you can see who the guys were when they're kids. There's one from 1994 or 5.

Young Comedians of Comedy taped at Aspen. Yeah. Oh, God. And it's Chappelle. I know, yeah. And then the guy. Louis. Yeah.

And Attell. Yeah. And then what's his name? The Canadian with the cigar who tanked. Fucking, yes. yeah oh god and it's chapelle i know yeah and then the guy louis yeah and attell yeah and then what's his name the canadian with the cigar who tanked fucking yes i think he's i think he's dead oh no he was the other guy yeah he he i was there i was there uh that year and i watched that show what the fuck was his name i don't know he went up there with such confidence because the other guys didn't louis and chapelle yeah they but they weren't no they were young and they were young and that's what's funny is you see when you watch those sets oh see it's sad i can't remember that guy's name that poor guy the glimmer of you see like oh that's gonna be a tell a tell does like a move tell by that time

was pretty a tell but he wasn't he wasn't a telling. He wasn't double hands on the mic. He wasn't broken totally. But he hit like his pace. And then there was a moment where Louis does a joke that's a very like Louis from 08 joke. So it was more absurdism than biographical. And Chappelle was doing like,

he didn't have the same delivery. He was a kid. Yeah. I mean, did he do the hat thing? Like he, yeah, it was much different. He did the same delivery. Well, he was a kid. Yeah. I mean, did he do the hat thing? Like, yeah, it was much different. I think he did the Batman joke, where he's like, Batman never comes to a Blake neighborhood.

And you're like, oh, that's fun. You, like, see kind of how he works. Everything's a little lighter. Yes. Yeah. And you saw that, and then, like, you know, I grew up in a great time where Comedy Central cared about stand-up.

Yeah. So they were putting on, come home from school, watch Premium Blend. Yeah. So they were putting on, come home from school, watch Premium Blend. Yeah. Or they'd run old A-lists from Bravo. I just talked to Richard Lewis about my A-list. Yeah, that was the one that was,

you know, one of my favorite pictures of my dad. Yeah. He's on vacation. It's just like a very nice, pleasant picture of him. Yeah. Because it got real dark. Yeah. But he is,

he's sitting there with his legs crossed and he's got an MTV half hour comedy hour shirt on. And I was like, I remember watching those. I remember doing those. I mean, that's what I mean. Well, that was a whole different time because I came up in that time and there was just this huge basic cable explosion

where they just needed people. I mean, people can do their own thing now and it seems like anybody can get on the thing sure but back then to get on TV. It meant something There was no internet There was no YouTube so you were always taping these fucking things and every one of those basic cable networks had a thing at least Once a year yeah a new comedy showcase it was kind of crazy, and I loved it You're just like I would turn it on and back okay. They're doing comedy outside at the beach in Miami Yeah, I'll watch this try to avoid like, okay, they're doing comedy outside at the beach in Miami.

Yeah. I'll watch this. Try to avoid that one. That was Jon Stewart hosted that, right? Yeah, yeah. I think it was. I think it was Jon Stewart. And it was like.

Spring break. But it was my like, I'm sure the way musicians get into music and then start getting more hyper focused on certain stuff. That was. Yeah, when I was coming up, you had to go to the specials that were available from HBO. Yeah. There wasn't, you know, or my peers, you know, I knew, I came up with that generation.

You know, me, Todd Berry, Attell. Yeah. CK, Nick DiPaolo. Patton Oswalt. No, he was later. Really? Yeah, I was with

the New York crew. Oh, yeah. So it was like, it was Jeff Ross, Silverman, Rogel. I mean, these guys... Kevin Brennan. Yes. Yeah. When he was before, it was Jeff Ross, Silverman, Rogel. I mean, these guys. Kevin Brennan. Yes.

Yeah. When he was before, before he broke. Yeah. Well, I remember even like being at the cellar one time, Sarah Silverman sat down and she was like, where do you live? Yeah. I was like, Astoria. And she immediately went, oh, I lost my virginity to Kevin Brennan in Astoria.

And you're like, it was such a Sarah Silverman moment. Sure. That I was sitting there like, this is surreal. And as a comedy fan. You should have asked her about who followed Kevin. I think there's a fairly long line of comics, not including me. I was odd man out on that one.

But Kevin and I, yeah, we started together. He was intense. He's always been intense. Very funny. Very funny. And then that was the group. your guys's group in new york yeah that solidified like oh i want to go yeah that was the first real you know crew that were sort of identifiable because of those shows you were talking yeah and they would talk shit to each other yeah whenever i would hear them on

stuff they would bust balls the way as me and my friends did so i was like i kind of liked this yeah and i liked it i liked everything about the new york comedy scene what i could see in I would hear him on stuff. It would bust balls the way as me and my friends did. So I was like, I kind of liked this. Yeah. And I liked it. I liked everything about the New York comedy scene. What I could see in Insomniac, what I could see in Tough Crowd, what I could see on the comedian documentary that Seinfeld did. Oh, man. With Orny Adams.

That documentary was like, oh, man. It was my favorite thing to watch when I would get home. If I was bored, I'd be like, I'm going to put on Comedian. I liked how they put all the different music that was in it, but specifically what I loved was Colin Quinn. Sure, Colin. He was the guy that I gravitated to in that whole documentary. Well, you guys are similar.

You're just like smart Irish guys. Yeah, but it was— Charming smart Irish guys that talk a lot. Yeah, just motor mouth. Yeah. But it was fun watchingming, smart Irish guys that talk a lot. Yeah, just motor mouth. Yeah. But it was fun watching that and then being like, like through that being like, okay,

I think I want to go east because I started in Tucson. Yeah. Well, that's right. So your dad is full on drunk? Yeah. And that's what killed him? Yeah. He got hepatitis C. Oh, fuck.

From fucking around in this lake town. Yeah. And then he drank so hard and didn't go to the doctor. Oh, they can cure that now. It's too bad. Dude. Yeah. I told Louie this story.

Louie Katz or CK? Louie Katz. Yeah. We were driving and I told him this story about my grandmother. Yeah. And he was like, how are you not doing that as a bit? And I was like, it's too dark. Which one?

So my dad got hepatitis C c which turned into cirrhosis and then he died you were in high school yeah i was 14 yeah i was a freshman in high school where did he die he died in uh he died in the va in san francisco okay but he um what was he a va of vietnam did he vietnam was he there no he was in the Navy. He cooked in the Navy. Okay. He got drunk on the roof. On the boat? While they fired missiles at the fucking. Okay. The Da Nang River. Yeah.

He didn't even. Didn't get off the boat? He's like, I fought in Vietnam, but he'd always do the hand jerk. Sure, sure. I fought in Vietnam. Yeah. Where was he from? San Francisco?

Oakland. Yeah. Okay. He grew up in Oakland. All right, so your grandma? So my dad gets hepatitis C. It turns to cirrhosis. My aunt, Karenaren was a registered nurse yeah so she's like i'm gonna come help my brother yeah she's taking care of him he's throwing up

blood yeah and it gets into her eyes yeah she didn't realize it some of it splashed and she got hepatitis c oh my god and it turned into liver cancer come on and she died what the fuck 10 years later after my dad died. That's an interesting, it's a family disease. It is. It's what the sodas do. But how do you get it that way? Yeah.

She died of your fucking dad's alcoholism. Yeah. Or bad behavior, whatever. She basically was in the blast radius. Yeah, I shouldn't judge the behavior, but whatever. He was fun as hell. But the joke I was telling louis that it never worked was i play cards with my grandmother every time i visit her and she's

96 now but about fucking three years ago we're playing gin rummy in the room and the tv's in the room and the volume's on 100 yeah because she's old yeah and the commercial's like hepatitis c is curable yeah go. Go get your hepatitis C cure. And I'm like, I'm going to go turn down the TV. Both of her kids got taken out by this thing. Yeah. That they're like, not even a threat anymore. Yeah, yeah.

And my grandmother's like, huh? And you're like, don't worry about it, Anna. No, hep C's still very dangerous. Yeah. Very, very dangerous. Yeah. But Louie's like, you got to talk about it on stage. I'm like, it's just so dark.

I don't know how to get to it. You just got to get a strong tag. You'll figure it out. Yeah, but her being like, you got to talk about it on stage. I'm like, it's just so dark. I don't know how to get to it. You just got to get a strong tag. You'll figure it out. Yeah, but her being like, huh? And you're like, no, they said it's still not curable. Terrible. Yeah. Is she the Irish one?

No, my mom's side's the Irish one. Oh, okay. Surprisingly, the Swedish side are the ones that all died from drinking. I think they're pretty big drinkers. Yeah, they're low-key. Yeah, yeah. No one really- Quiet drinkers. You know, Giannis Papas. Yeah, yeah. No one really- Quiet drinkers.

You know, Giannis Papas was telling me that, and I looked it up, the government controls their liquor stores. Oh, really? The government's like- It's like in New Hampshire, an entire country of New Hampshire?

Yeah, they're like, shut it down. You guys have had too much. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because when they do, they're just like- They keep going. Let's just keep going.

It's not even a tax thing or it's just a controlled thing. Yeah, they're like, you guys go until you're dead. They need people to be more alert at work in the morning. Yeah. I was fascinated by that. I was like, the Irish side's all alive.

So when you're a kid, though, like you're 14, he dies, and you're leaning on professional wrestling? Wrestling and comedy. Yeah. And football, San Francisco 49ers. Wrestling, because my producer, they do a weekly wrestling show on the bonus material. Oh love it he tried to get me into it and i had chris jericho on it and all the guys aw rules but you gotta grow up with it because i can't backload it yes and i'm a 59

year old jew who likes music and whatnot i can't i'm not going to be like i got to get to the wrestling i'm going to tell you right now the way you're built you'll never be able to take in wrestling really you will you are you know never be able to take in wrestling. Really? You will, you are, you know how they say learn a language your first five years? Right, yeah, exactly. You can't learn another language. That's right, exactly. You can't learn wrestling. But I, you know, we went and I talked to the guys because Brendan is so important to me.

And you were in GLOW. He's a bright guy. Yeah, I was around it, but thank God that character didn't give a shit about wrestling. Yeah. But like, I get it now. I won't be condescending about the about the nature of it i've learned you know 40 years old from 40 years of loving wrestling i've learned how that like i don't resent people that mock it i don't resent people that are like you know it's not real not real. Or they're like, you're like, I love my fake gay fighting.

Yeah. Let me have it. Sure. I love the thought of a dead man fighting the son of a plumber, you know, for a piece of metal, for a hunk of metal to wear around their waist. I love this shit because it turns my brain off. And I also know the, you know what it is? You know the stories.

The outcome is determined. Yeah. So I know no matter what, it's been settled. Right. It's like this Buddhist thought where you're like, it has already been written.

Yes. One hand writes the other. It is. But if you spend your whole life in it, you know the different scripts, you know the guys that turn, you know the heel turn, you know all that stuff.

Love it. But oddly though, culturally, it's very informative. You know the different scripts. You know the guys that turn. You know the heel turn. You know all that stuff. Love it. Oddly though, culturally, it's very informative. Professional wrestling, if you spend your life watching it and loving it, you can really understand politics at this point in time. The entire right wing is a fucking bunch of heels. It's the joke that I said in the HBO

special where I said Donald Trump, Rick flared his way into the White House. He's one of the greatest heels that ever lived. He was great when he participated with the WWE. Yeah. And honestly. Unfortunately, the world hangs in the balance. I know.

One of the great heel turns. But he was always a heel. There was no turn. Katie and I were talking about, for some reason, we were talking about wrestling and politics and all that mixture or whatever. And she goes, oh yeah, politics is wrestling, but it's wrestling where the fans get really hurt by what the wrestlers do. And I was like, I've never thought about it like that. I was like, that's fucking insane. And it's true. And you know, we had, and they don't, and they don't know that they are because they believe it.

Yeah. And Obama was kind of like a Hulk Hogan heel where everyone was, I mean, a baby face where everyone was like, we got a baby face. And he says all the right things. Yeah. And that's why everyone got stoked. And then you had kind of like a stone cold feel for the right when Donald Trump showed up. Where they're like, he doesn't like the regular career politicians. Yeah, yeah. He's saying what he wants.

Yeah. He's attacking. Yeah. They really like. But unfortunately, the fans don't know it's fake. I know. I know. I know. That's the difference between wrestling and politics.

That's why whenever I have a friend that's super into politics, I go, we're the same side. We're different sides of the same coin. Yeah. You believe in politics the way I believe in wrestling. Right. I'm lucky that I'm politically, I'm apolitical because I'm like, it's the left and right arm of the same monster.

It's all going to the same rich people. But you're a decent guy. I mean, really, it comes down to tolerance and thinking that everybody should be okay. Yes. That's my philosophy of like, I don't know, why don't we help out each other a little bit? Yeah, right.

Seems a little... So how do you get to Tucson? You go to school there? Yeah, so I graduated high school in Aurora. You know, shout out smoky hill high school and i uh when your dad died though did it shatter your life it made me mad it made me real mad in a way of like um fuck man i thought we were gonna repair that yeah because one to five was so good and then five to 14 but did you are you an alcoholic? Yeah. Oh yeah. I started getting fucked up.

14, 15. Are you sober? I haven't drank in 10 years. I smoke weed still. Yeah, yeah. But not, honestly, my weed intake since 38. Yeah. I'm like, what am I doing?

Like, what am I, I'm forgetting so much stuff and I'm scared. Apparently you're enjoying your day. You're forgetting stuff and you're scared. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, ugh. And how about the self-consciousness? Oh my God. Didn't you get like hyper, like a guy like you?

I mean, like when I'd smoke weed during the day, any interaction was like, oh my God, they're looking right through me. I can't. I would do, you know, I did eight years of a radio show with Big Jay and we'd get high and I'd be like, what the fuck did I, I'd go home and I'd be like, what did I say? Yeah. What the fuck did i go home and i'd be like what did i say what the fuck did i say but it it you know my dad dies at 14 and i'm kind of like um i'm angry my mom my mom the guy that's living with us my mom's boyfriend was my godfather he was a real shithead oh really it's my dad's ex-best friend and they were really yeah they were very okay with um you know, my mom's since apologized.

My mom and I have had some real heart-to-hearts that have made our relationship much, much better than it was. Yeah. But when I was 14, I kind of just fucking hated everybody. Yeah. I was like, well, if my dad, except my sister. Yeah. Were you fighting? yeah were you fighting uh i wouldn't get in fights as much as i would just kind of like uh shut down and and go be on my own go upstairs and or start getting fucked up i really liked

getting fucked up well it's weird about growing up in a in a small kind of southwestern town where you know because i don't know we got our driver's licenses at 15 in new mexico 16 we were 16 but but we would just go down to the shopping mall late at night and put shopping carts in front of the car and get them going like 40 50 miles an hour and just let them run into shit fun as hell that's what you do man yeah and then i started getting into smoking weed yeah at 14 15 no sports i played football yeah so I'd clean up, but I wasn't good. Yeah. I liked it. Yeah. But it wasn't a thing I was, I needed that fatherly, like, attaboy.

Yeah. I didn't have. See, that's the fucking thing, right? That's part of the comic thing, too, is, like, you're looking for this approval. Like, you know, my dad was just a bipolar, narcissistic fuck. Yeah. And, like, I get along fine with him now because he has dementia. He's very sweet.

Yeah. Yeah. And like, I get along fine with him now because he has dementia. He's very sweet. Yeah. Yeah. Fucking flip. But it's weird that when there's an emotional absence there, you know, the sort of need for approval is fucked up.

It's, dude, I had a- Anybody with a strong personality, you're like, I'm going to be part of you. Yeah. Yeah.

You're like, how do you say that? You say, you're like, it's like one of those movies where you're mimicking how their mouths say it. Yeah.

Like when an alien comes to Earth and learns how to talk and they go, you are saying. Yeah. That's what it was like. And I was having my mom, you know, and no disrespect to her, but she was having a social life. Yeah. While I was spinning. Yeah. I didn't know who the fuck I was and I'm having these different dudes come in. And I didn't want, I was on a podcast one time and someone was like, did you ever try to fuck with them?

Yeah. Or like scare them away? Yeah. And I was like, hell no. Yeah. I wanted a male role model so bad. Right, right. They were coming in, I was like, hello, sir.

Yeah. I look forward to you being my father one day. Yeah, yeah. And then you're wearing the same hat as them. Yeah, and I'm like, whoop, I'm chewing tobacco because they chew tobacco. But it became a thing of of when i was 14 i was like i like getting fucked up and it turns out i'm real good at it yeah i could hold my shit yeah

and i could get fucked up and i wasn't a problem yeah it was actually like silly so it made you it took away the anger took away the anger took away everything and then it became like oh i'm gonna smoke weed all the time yeah and i And I had a problem with like, oh, I don't want to drink because that's what my dad did. Yeah. But then I started drinking at 15 and I was like, oh, I can drink. Oh, yeah. Like, oh, I forgot. I just decided I want to be like my dad.

Oh, my God. And it's like finding out your, it was always this, it was always this thing. When you have a dad that leaves, in your mind, somewhere in your mind. Yeah. You go, one of two things he's either got another family yeah which that really hurts yeah getting cucked yeah just being like oh you're raising another boy yeah yeah not me who's that kid so you're worried about that yeah or the the positive one is you're like what if my dad's an assassin what if my dad is like gone because he

has to go do all this right sure so in your head you're like well he's gonna come back and be like you know how to you were born to a long family of assassins you're looking for a cool thing nope just an alcoholic yeah right so you start drinking not so heroic yeah then you start drinking you go oh this is what we do this is what our family does this is our superpower i'm very good at this so i just in high school became the guy that was funny got fucked up didn't really bother anybody because that's kind of just what i wanted yeah in high school i was kind of like hey come over to my house when my sister died when i was 16 did that level you that destroyed me no that destroyed me that destroyed me that made me in a weird way kind of uh shut down for a little bit but then it made me realize it made me believe in god huh which is uh weird because you think it

wouldn't yeah i think it'd do the opposite well how how did that manifest well when my dad died i stopped believing in god when my dad died i was like oh well what the fuck dude yeah like we were supposed to have the movie moment right where he realizes oh i shouldn't drink i got a good kid yeah and then he comes back and i'm like i'm mad at you but i love you and then we're okay yeah and then roll credits yeah but he died and i was like well there goes that yeah and then my sister uh she would visit she'd come and visit yeah she was a grown-up right she was 26 at this point when i was or i was when i was 14 she was 26 yeah she helped me get through the death through the funeral yeah and then she visited

to go to a lilith fair and uh we were hanging out yeah we were hanging out in the guest room. She was packing before she left. Yeah. And I was like, do you remember a couple years ago? I was like, I don't think dad's going to make it to my high school graduation. She was like, yeah, I remember you saying that. She was like, that's so crazy you said that. Then he died two years later. She's like, but I'm going to make it.

I'm going to be there at your high school graduation. And I was like, I appreciate that. And like, we were just talking and, you know, and then she gave me this long speech about people die. It's a part of life. People come into your life and they affect it.

And then they, then they're gone. She's like, I've lost friends. I've lost, I lost dad. You know, she's like,

I've lost a lot of people. She's like, but that doesn't take away from the love that you felt from them when they were here that doesn't one doesn't affect the other just because they died doesn't mean that they weren't here loving you I wasn't a real love so we had this like very long conversation huh and then I had to go to school the next day and I had football practice after and so I get home from football practice and my sister's gone my mom had taken her to the airport and there was this letter on my bed that was like

hey fuck all the bullshit about what dad did to you and like what that family does to you you're a good kid yeah and you're turning out to be a good man yeah and i'm very proud of you and you're very funny and you're very like uh you have a big heart. And she was like, don't stop doing that. And there was just this moment where I was like, man, that really meant a lot to me. And then three weeks later, she was killed in a car accident. And it just, there was this moment of like, oh, I got that. I got that like, goodbye. I got that like, that real like, hey, I love you.

You're going to be okay. I'll see you later. And it was like, I don't believe in religion because I think it's all business. But I believe in a creator that had to give me that moment. Because if I didn't have that moment, I would have, I'd be dead. I'd be fucking dead. I would have been so angry. I would have been so mad.

I would have just, I would have burned myself up. Yeah. So in a sense that the kind of talk you had and then the letter. Yeah. There was like real closure somehow. Yeah, I got closure. It was like handing a receipt before you buy something. You're like, what's this receipt?

You're like, I don't need that. And then you're like, oh, fuck. So you're actually able to kind of grieve in a real way. And have closure, which was the problem I had with my father's death. I didn't get closure. I didn't get to be like, dude, what the fuck, dude? I loved you. Where were you?

And so I was so mad about that. And then with Michelle's death, it just was like, all right. Like, fuck, it hurts. I i'm gonna walk off this pain yeah but i had something that could that i could point to and be like i got to say goodbye yeah she said goodbye to me yeah even if it wasn't really me saying about her she got to say like i love you i got you yeah this love that i gave you it's it's good and it stays yeah it stays it doesn't go anywhere and it that kind of that pain motivated me yeah because i was like well if my sister's gonna die if my dad's gonna die and then my aunt karen who i was close

to dies if all these people around me are dying why am i here well it must be for a reason yeah so i might as well make this life what i want it to be right what do i love i love music i love comedy so go fucking do all that shit yeah and i and i i moved to tucson i went to u of a i got in there because my mom asked me one thing she said listen i know you're not once michelle died my mom was like what am i gonna fucking tell you you a, you're a man. God is, you know, whatever you want to say though, the world has, has calloused you. So I was smoking cigarettes. I could smoke weed in the garage, not in the house. Could not drive if I smoked weed. But my mom had a very, like, we became roommates where she was like, Hey, I got you. You got me. Yeah. But there was a respect. It just changed. My mom's energy towards me completely changed of like.

She understood the loss you went through. Yeah. Yeah. And she was like, and she respected me for it. Right. There was this weird like, all right, you're still, I wasn't, I didn't go crazy. Yeah. I was still respectful to her and stuff, but she was like, I respect what you've been through.

And she asked me, she said she said listen just get a college degree yeah that's all i want and also she want you to get hard yeah or or fuck your whole life exactly and that's why she was like go to college yeah you'll have experiences because i kind of already knew i wanted to do stand-up and she was like go just please for me a single mom get that college degree. Because in her generation, the boomer generation, that was like, oh, you did a good job. Your kids have college degrees.

You did it. So I went to U of A. I didn't want to go in Colorado. I wanted to go to a place where I was a little uncomfortable. Sure. And I was like, Arizona, it's warm. It's a good city, though. Tucson, really knew nothing about it.

Hated it. Oh, really? nothing about it. Hated it. Oh, really? Hated it. Why, too dry, too desert? Too frat and sorority. Party school. Too rich kid. Yeah.

I moved there, and it was like, I had enough for cigarettes, and then that was it. Yeah. And shit weed. Yeah. And an 18-pack of Ice House. Right. And I would just drink whatever I could. Yeah.

I'd get whatever I could, um i didn't like it and i was like talking to my mom and i was like i think i'm gonna transfer i think i'm gonna transfer back to colorado yeah colorado state yeah maybe and my mom was like huh i just it doesn't seem like you to quit something like this and i was like huh you know and then you're like hey you want to fucking challenge me yeah yeah and i went and i was working at the college radio station kamp yeah and i had like and i kind of found like you know that first glimmer when you start doing stand-up or you start doing something where you go like oh i like this yeah i can do this and i could i could maybe do this yeah yeah and i had a show at kamp arizona student Radio. My boss was this guy, Vic Garcia.

Yeah. Who ended up becoming my brother. He's my lifelong friend. Yeah. And he would let me fuck around. Yeah. I could fuck around. I could be funny.

It was a news show. Right. But it was a comedy show. Yeah. And then I was like, well, I like this. Well, maybe I'll go work at the radio station. In between my freshman and sophomore year, I went and worked in Alaska. Yeah Alaska because my dad's sister was up there where my aunt Karen in Kenai which is in the Cook Inlet yeah and my aunt Karen had the cancer from the hepatitis C yeah and she

was up in Soldotna she worked at a hospital in Soldotna yeah and she was like why don't you move up here yeah she's like what are you gonna do in between your freshman and sophomore year of college we need to go work at applebee's and aurora yeah she's like come up here yeah and i moved up there huh just kind of like sight unseen just like yeah fuck it took two bags up there and she's like you got to get a job i applied everywhere yeah restaurants the radio station and finally i went to the docks and i was like you guys hiring and they're like we're always hiring and then i worked as a member of the dock crew at pacific star seafood that's a classic irish yeah it is like old school i'll go find myself in the work yeah yeah and my mom is irish catholic you know she was she was the irish family member so i think i really got all like a lot of the personality traits of like yeah you fucking go work yeah yeah it's not work until you hurt right and uh and i went up there and you know i spent the first two weeks with my aunt and then

i got hired and then i lived on the docks for three months huh made good money just taking shit off boats taking shit fuel in the boats doing fish nights uh a lot of times i was fish night like well the they only really fish for salmon mondays and wednesdays okay 20 years ago but mondays and wednesdays were fish nights and fish and game would come and like monitor to make sure you weren't over fishing the river yeah the kenai river is you know one of the largest salmon populations in the world and they um they would monitor it so doc crew you're working on fish nights you're working like 8 a.m to 2 a.m huh you're just going straight through you get a lunch break a dinner break and then like another snack break yeah but

it was the shit the guys i worked with you know mike and dave and like my roommate steve and and and we would all just get really stoned at lunch yeah and then fucking work yeah and i like and i was making them laugh i was like getting them yeah when we were getting high i was like making them laugh like my buddies back in aurora yeah i was like maybe i should do stand-up yeah and my aunt karen and i after you know when i i would get nights i would get nights where i could go to her house and have dinner and i remember we were smoking cigarettes watching daniel tosh do stand-up and i was like he's so funny i was like do you think i could do standup? And she didn't even blink.

She was like, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And that was like in a weird way, just like her not even blinking and being like, yeah, of course. Yeah. I was like, oh, well, I'm going to try this shit. Yeah.

So I moved back to Tucson for my sophomore year, blew through the money, blew through the money, dude. Good time? I mean, was just like, I got it. I was buying cartons of cigarettes. I was loving life. That's how we blow through money.

I bought a whole carton. Oh, dude, just in the freezer. Just pull a new pack out in the freezer. And I ran out of money after the fall semester. Spring semester, I'm like, well, fuck, I need a job. And I was like, well, maybe I'll work at the radio station. I loved working at KMP. So let me go try to work at the alternative station kfma yeah and i went there and bothered them just bothered them yeah and then i finally got the call and they're like hey

we need you to work midnight to 6 a.m on friday and saturday nights and i was like done and through kfma i met much like more lifelong friends uh greg shishman who now lives in seattle from albuquerque yeah he says what's up he said tell an albuquerque okay nice but he uh he works at the end now up in seattle and he was like um he was like my first professional big brother yeah he was the first guy that i came into the radio station he's like i'm gonna teach you how to run the board yeah i'm gonna teach you. He's like I'm gonna teach you how to run the board Yeah, I'm gonna teach you how to do edits. I'm gonna teach you how to do everything. Yeah, and I kind of was like I Found that first attaboy. Yeah on that first like oh, yeah mentor. Yeah, like I'm comfortable here. Yeah, I can learn I can fail Yeah, no one's gonna be mad at me middle of the night middle of the night Middle of the night and I you know, and worked at kfma you know the first shift

i did i hadn't i never talked on the on the real radio yeah and i was so fucking nervous yeah and everyone's like hey it's just like you're talking to your friend and i'm like yeah and i think the first break i cracked the mic i said 92.1 and 101.3 my voice snapped and i was like shit and on our air check tape on the cassette yeah i wrote scared dan and then on the other side i wrote not so scared dan because it was the next shift and i was better yeah and i took it into our pro our music director at the time matt spry and he was like scared dan and i was like oh scared he goes well that's your radio name and so for four years i was was scared Dan on KFMA. And it was like, it gave me this ability to kind of like,

it gave me momentum. And then I started doing the mics. And I did an open mic at Laughs in Tucson, and it went well. And then the next four months bombed every mic. Was Bynum there? No, this was- Post Bynum? This was Scotty Goff, who bought it from Bynum and then sold it back to him.

So this was the Scotty Goff era of laughs. Because the first laughs was in Albuquerque. Oh, I know. That was my first road gig. Yep. It was working for, I was emceeing for a dirty magician. Oh yeah, which one? His name was, what was his name?

That's so funny. I broke in doing road work with a dirty magician. Oh my God. No, hypnotist. I was with Frank Santos. Oh, I know Frank. I broke in doing road work with a dirty magician. Oh my God. No, hypnotist. I was with Frank Santos. Oh, I know Frank. I know Frank Santos because of laughs.

Frank Santos would come around. It was, his name was something, Chad Gross, I think. Yeah. But he was like, you know, he'd do the thing

where the woman would put her hands through his thing and he'd be like, now grab my belt. And you're like, you fucking perv. Yeah.

But it was the first condo I stayed in. Sure, sure. Albuquerque. Yeah. Driving from Tucson to laughs. Yeah. I mean I stayed in, Albuquerque, driving from Tucson to Laffs, I mean from Tucson to Albuquerque. And so I started going to Laffs, but I started bombing and I couldn't,

I was like, no, but my first set went so well. Right. What the fuck's going on? Yeah. And there was a KFMA staff dinner. Yeah. In the morning show, the Frank show, there was a comedian named Dave Ashley

who has since passed away. He was a sidekick? Yeah, he was like the comedian on the show. And he did stand-up at laughs. Right. And him and his wife Beth were the nicest. Yeah. Especially young comics.

You know that when you're coming up, you're like, I just want someone to be nice to me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Everyone's being fucking mean. Someone be nice to me. And Dave, we were at this snap. Well, he sounds like a guy who found his groove. Yeah. had super funny man yeah and i remember we were at we were at this dinner because we had done well in the ratings so like the company took us out and i was the overnight guy so i was just a free meal yeah and we're at dinner and i'm telling dave ashley i'm

like dude i'm fucking bombing when i do these mics and he goes are you prepared and I was like even him saying that in the moment I went no and he goes he's riffing I go yeah I'm just up there riffing he goes no dude because I know you know stand-up I go yeah I know people get jokes but I thought they just riffed and keep her and he goes no right yeah, right. Yeah. Jokes. Yeah. He was the first person. I was, it was, it's so funny to say that now that I've been doing standup for 19 years or whatever, but it was like the first, like, oh, oh, okay. Yeah. That makes sense.

And so I started. Yeah. Cause of Dave Ashley, I started writing down like, oh, I think this is funny. Yeah. And then like learning how. Sure. And it, I mean, mean it it changed sure mike started going well more control yeah it's funny about radio comics they don't get credit but those

guys who went to radio in the 80s you know morning show comic radio is not easy no and it's like you got to be you know firing on all cylinders you got to be four in the morning quick as shit i always like have a real big place in my heart for morning cruise yeah and it was it was a thing where the frank show was so popular and like they were like the rock stars of our station yeah that it was kind of cool even to be affiliated with yeah it was kind of cool to be like when i remember when i got to go first time i went on the frank show i was just trying to be funny yeah just yeah yeah and i remember frank was like man you're green yeah yeah you are just launching take it down a notch yeah yeah it was the same as when i

fucked an older woman for the first time yeah yeah slow down i was like slow the fuck down because i was just like focus i was just like no i'm gonna give it to you yeah yeah yeah and um you know kfma be kind of kind of became my safe house in Tucson. It became the place that I could go where I wasn't at U of A. I was living in Tucson. In real life, yeah. Even though I was taking classes and stuff, I didn't, I still hung out with kids from U of A, but it was because my roommate was a weed dealer.

Sure, you got to stay in the loop. In the loop. I'd go out and drink on Thursday nights with people. That was the big night. But mostly I would be at laughs, trying to get guest sets on fridays and saturdays yeah and working at kfma the rest of the time that's great so you finish your degree i got my degree i was starting to do the road stuff my senior year like featuring i was featuring i was emceeing at laughs albuquerque it's funny because i did one of my first paid gigs when i was a doorman at

the comedy so i went to laughs i think i likes. I think I might have opened for Jeff Foxworthy before the redneck thing. Because by the way, all those headshots were still up at Laffs. Sure. But I was there in 03, 04. Yeah, I'm talking 87. So it was fun for us because 04, you're looking at the 87 headshots and you're going like, look at Foxworthy. I know.'re going like, look at Foxworthy. I know.

You're like, look at Seinfeld. Foxworthy with the mullet. Oh my God. So we would always, you know, I would stand there waiting to go up and just look at it being like, crazy, these guys work there. Oh, dude, you're going to the store tomorrow night? Yeah, I'm at the store tomorrow night. Yeah, look at that hallway.

I love it. That reminds me of laughs. Every time I've been at the store, I'm like, oh, man, this is like the Zanies in Nashville. Again. Very similar Zanies in Chicago. They have all the old ones. And you're like, look at this motherfucker. But those two have Killer B's headshots.

Killer B, save up. The reason they got that balcony. Now it's the Nate Bargetzi balcony. Yeah, yeah. Now Nate Bargetzi. That whole town's Nate Bargetzi. Yeah. His whole face is on the side.

There's fucking murals on the wall. Yeah, it's like Roadhouse. He's fucking running shit. I can't be, it's so rare that I'm happy for a guy, but I'm certainly happy for him. He used to open for me. Dude. And I remember seeing him in Grand Rapids for the first time.

And I didn't, I met him in New York, but I didn't know him in New York. But he was still kind of doughy and sweaty. And he was up in Grand Rapids. And I was like, who the fuck is this guy? It was the Laugh It Up Festival. Yeah. And you, because Nate's one of my best friends.

Oh, yeah. And I, back in the day when he was doughy and sweaty, I was opening for him. Right. That was the road gigs I was getting. Okay. When Nate was doing C-Club. Yeah. And he was just my friend.

And I was just so taken with his. And I remember specifically, he goes, dude, Mark Maron came up to me and was like, you're funny. And he was like like he watched both my shows and i remember both of us being like what i was like i i knew marion uh i i would talk to him air america but it was after the what the you know after this podcast fucking exploded and he's like i mean dude he like i might work with I was like, dude, charmed life. It was like, and now he's doing arenas. I know. And he's like the guy.

I know. And it's so deserved. Yeah. It's so loving. But, you know, KFMA and doing laughs got me ready. And then it kind of came to the point where I was like, well, you don't stay here. And I didn't like LA.

Yeah. I didn't like the energy of LA. No, you made the right call and i was and i always like i said from growing up and loving tough stuff i was like and i remember being like let me just see if i can hang i just want to see if i can fucking hang with the big dogs yeah in new york and i moved there and it was the greatest decision i ever made it was some of the leanest years of my life, you know, with zero. So you had like what, three, four years under your belt of hammering it out? I had two and a half years. And then, so I kind of knew, but then I moved there and I went to like three mics and I

was like, I got to rewrite everything. Yeah. I'm so road hacky. Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. You could just tell. I was like, I was doing things that were pandering.

Sure. To the crowd. Sure. And then I'm going to open mics and it's like Rory was doing things that were pandering to the crowd. Sure. And then I'm going to open mics and it's like Rory Scovel. Right. Kumail just moved there. Jesse Pop.

Like I'm watching these guys that are like, I'm like, holy shit. And I'm coming up with. Those are kind of lyrical guys. We weren't watching the punchies. I will. Like Etel and Geraldo. I would sneak into the cellar. Yeah. And that was.

That's where you. That was the education. That's into the cellar. Yeah. And that was the education. That's like the boxing ring. Yeah. I would go. I became friends with Big Jay. Yeah. I became friends with Big Jay Oakerson, who's still to this day one of my closest friends.

Yeah. And he got me in with one of the door guys at the cellar, Shaq, who's passed away, rest in peace. But Shaq would be like, I wasn't at the cellar, none of that. He just knew I was a comic, and he'd be like, all right, you can come in. Right. And he would sneak me into the little seats on the side. Yeah, sure.

And I would watch Geraldo, Attell. One time I was watching Attell. Yeah. And as a desert rat, this blew my mind. This was before Louis came out. Yeah. So the cellar wasn't sold out every show. No, I know, yeah.

It was like a weeknight. They would do one crowd for both shows and then you could leave. Just the one room? Yeah, just the one room and the crowd could leave and more people would come in. Right.

And it was ever-changing, but it was technically two shows. So I'm watching a tell on the late show, drinking a beer, just watching a tell, and someone sits now next to me with a full pitcher of beer, and I'm like, who's in Stanhope?

Yeah, sure. Doug Stanhope, who's one of my heroes. And I'm just like, what the fuck? And he's like hammered, Doug, being real Doug. And he's watching a tell, and he's like hitting me on my arm on a tell jokes, and I'm like, right? And I'm like, in my head, I'm like, I gotta go sleep on a futon in Hoboken.

This is so worth it. It's so worth it just to watch Stan Hope lose it to a tell. Oh, dude, I used to, I remember when I was working at the improv in like the late 80s, at the original improv, and Hicks was living in town for, he lasted a few months. And, you know, we're hanging out in the bar in front of the improv, and Brian Regan was going on. Yeah. And Hicks was like, got to go watch Regan.

Really? Yeah. I love that. I geek out so few often anymore. We're sitting in the back of the improv. There's hardly anyone there and Hicks is just loving Regan.

I love it. Because Regan's one of the greatest, the funniest of all time and Hicks, obviously legendary. Yeah, yeah. But just so different.

So different. But it's like me, I like watching Goofy. I love Nate. I know. It's like I'm. I like watching Goofy Guy. I love Nate. I know. It's like I'm not callous. People can get in. I love it, though.

Yeah, yeah. I love Hicks being like, ah, stub it out of cigarette. I gotta go watch Regan. I gotta go watch Regan. Totally. Let's fucking go. Totally.

I love it so much. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because Rant and E Minor is just as important to me as I walked on the moon. Of course. They're like those two albums where you're like,

I just love. That's the full spectrum. Yeah. The full spectrum. But moving to New York and then i had no money and i was waiting tables and i got hired uh rob cross who used to be the operations manager of k rock and he was like the man at kfma that won in tucson was now at serious because he went there with howard right oh five right and i reached out to him.

I was like, hey, man, former KFMA, desert rat. I'm in the city. I'm doing stand-up. Yeah. If you need to hire anybody. And he was like, I don't know, come by, Sirius. Come to Sirius and talk to me. Yeah.

And so I talked to him. And he's like, listen, we're having a hiring freeze right now. I remember him specifically going, it's an EEO hiring freeze. I was like, I don't know what that means. But he's like, but you can do production and stuff. I'll let people know. Yeah. And then I got a call from Danny at, she worked at Free FM, which was the old K-Rock.

Yeah. And she's like, we're doing rock music on the weekends. Yeah. Do you want to come in and maybe do some, like get back on air? Yeah. Abso-fucking-lutely. Yeah.

And I went in and I got a job and it was union. Yeah. So I was getting good money. Oh, great. Like 250 a shift. Yeah. And I would just work. Whenever someone would call out, I would be there.

Yeah. And I saved up and that's how I got the place in Astoria. Yeah. To rent. And I worked at K-Rock. And then I was doing standup, but also working at K-Rock on like, because it switched back from Free FM to to wxrk k rock and i would give nate shout outs on the radio they'd be driving back from like one-nighters yeah and big j would be like hey you were gonna k rock i'm like yeah

who are you with yeah he'd be like justin and all these people are like hey jay and justin are driving back right now from a gig you know they'd they'd be like, ah! The radio was still cool. Yeah, yeah. And then, you know, you were at Air America. Yeah. And then that's what leads us when you got let go. I think like a month later I was let go. Yeah. And I remember seeing you at Eastville, and I was like, all right, I have something to talk to him about.

And I remember walking up to you being like, you know, I know you got fired at Air America. I just got fired from CBS Radio. And you were like, you know, I know you got fired at Air America. I just got fired from CBS Radio and you were like, oh man. And you were just like, what the fuck? And you were really, you know,

it was before you had this. Sure. I was a pretty shattered guy. Yeah. And I remember you being like, man, fuck them. Yeah. What is this shit?

Radio's dying. And I was like, yeah, Mark Maron. And I knew you, you know, I knew about you well. I'd listened to your album so I was like, yeah maron and i knew you know i knew about you well i'd listen to your album so i was like yeah man fucking radio right and i'm drinking a beer but it was such like you know little kids when they follow adults and they're like see an adult do something that was

me doing that to you yeah where i was like right locked right into the crankiness look at us trying to be funny and they're not letting us and they they were like, man, I'm going to California. And I was like, oh, that's awesome. So I was already shattered. I'd gotten through the divorce and I came back and started this in 2009. Yeah. And you just hammered it out. Yeah.

And here we are. Full circle. It was crazy. And it was like, you know, then I got fired. When I got fired from K-Rock, I was like, well. All in. All in, man. Let's just do, and I would just wait tables during the day and just do standup at night

and then was lucky and I got Montreal and that led to a manager that got me a gig that I could leave, you know, waiting tables and it's just been like. And you're doing some acting now? Yeah, I did some acting. I was on the, I was on the show Billions, which is wrapping it, which is over. It's the final season. You like the acting? I do.

I don't like the pursuit of roles. the acting i do i don't like the pursuit of roles me neither and i don't like the waiting either either do i it's big j that was big j's biggest problem yeah because what's funny is how i got back to radio yeah podcasts were blowing up yeah and i didn't have one and big j has always been one of my closest friends and his girlfriend christine we were outside smoking cigarettes at the cellar one night she's like why don't you guys do a podcast yeah you guys are always joking around yeah and i was like yeah let's try it so i bought all the stuff yeah uh you know and what was it called well we we didn't have a name for it yeah we were recording it in queens under the train yeah so we're gonna call it the under the train podcast right but we didn't have anything and then a tell was doing a show for comedy central called um the a tell from the

underground or it was like yeah it was a tell in all his favorite new york comics and i was there watching jay tape his set and one of the guys from comedy central was like asking about what i was doing and i was like oh jay and i have eight practice episodes of a podcast and he was like don't release those don't release those he's like can I hear a couple of them yeah this guy Steve who's we called him cool dad and I was like yeah I'll give it to you and so uh Dave Kimowitz the late great Dave Kimowitz who was Jay's manager who passed away he did like a sizzle reel yeah and he gave it to him and they loved it and serious had been reaching out to me about doing something because i had been on opie and anthony a lot yeah and they were like you know we kind of want to figure something out for you they were trying to get

me in somehow and then with this tape comedy central was a little more excited yeah and we went to serious and they were like their first idea was for me to host a clip show right now where i play stand-up yeah yeah yeah and i said yeah. And I said, no, have me and Jay fuck around. Yeah. And they're like, maybe in a couple months we can have Jay come on as a guest. I was like, no, no, no. I said this in a boardroom,

which as a former radio guy you'll love. Yeah. I said, why do radio people do this all the time? I said, get the fuck out of the way. Yeah. Let us, that's exactly what I said. Yeah, yeah. And my manager, Brian Stern, was like,

all right, I don't know if I'd say it like that. But I go, get out of the way. Just get out of the way and try it. Yeah. What do you got to do? You got 900 stations. Yeah. So they gave us six test episodes.

Yeah. And Jay and I did it, and it became the bonfire. Right. And then we did the bonfire, which grew to four days a week, which we did for eight years. Yeah. And I was back in radio. Yeah. But on my terms.

Yeah, it's great. In a place at Sirius that didn't have an EEO hiring for years when I got hired. Now, did you pull an audience? It was great. Yeah. Best fans.

And they've stuck, I left in March. I stepped away from the show and Bobby Kelly took over for me. All right. Because Big J, the entire time we made the show, I was Learie of radio,

as we've just explained. Sure. I was kind of over it after I got fired from K-Rock. And everything, the whole landscape's changing. And I just didn't want to be in radio. So I didn't have a sweet tooth for it. Yeah, yeah. And Jay loves broadcasting.

He's great at it. Yeah. And he was like, I want to do the show. And I kept being like, I'm only doing this for a limited amount of time. Yeah. I made that clear from the beginning. I was like, hey hey i don't want to do this forever yeah and jay was like i do and i was like well let's build this show and then i'll i'll bail when i feel necessary right thinking two three years yeah and we went eight years but it got us through the pandemic

sure and big jay's one of the funniest human beings i've ever been it's great yeah i always loved him yeah so now you're just on the road. Now I'm just doing stand-up. And how's the draw? Good? It's great. Oh, good. Bonfire fans are still coming out. Yeah.

Billions fans. Because I noticed you're touring, yeah. Yeah, and I'm going to start a podcast in October or November. Just a 30-minute one-on-one. On your own terms. On my own terms. Yeah. Come and hang out.

Yeah. We're just going to bullshit about whatever you feel like. Well, I'll come do it. Yeah, I would love that. I would fucking blow my mind to have Marc Maron. Yeah, he's kind of, you know. But it's like cynical. Hang out. Yeah, yeah. But you're like. Well, I'll come do it. Yeah. I would love that. I would fucking blow my mind to have Mark Maron. Yeah. He's kind of, you know. But it's like cynical.

Hang out. Yeah, yeah. But you're like, oh. Yeah. Come recreate that Eastville hang at the bar. Yeah, we've gotten all the way full circle in this conversation back to Eastville and now your trajectory. Now I'll come to your podcast.

Yeah. And then the world will end. And then it's all, we're all, the simulation keeps fucking recycling. But what's the website? Because I know you got a lot of dates coming up. DanSoder.com. They're all up there. Yeah.

Great talking to you, man. Man, this was, out of all the interviews I've listened to, you know, the Robin Williams, the Josh Homme, the Obama. Yeah. You know, it's like, this was real cool, man. Yeah. I really appreciate it. I thought you were going to say, like, this was going to be the best interview.

No, no, no. I actually felt bad. I felt like the entire time entire time i'm like i got too sad at one point i should have been funnier no no no yeah that wasn't that that sadness was uh legitimate oh it was a hundred percent and you know how this show works we're not looking for laughs all the time i'll just i'll my favorite i'll turn you to sadness one of my favorite moments was louis choking up about talking about his daughter being born. Oh, my God. Yeah. Boy. I wish, well, what are you going to do? You guys got to run that back. We'll see.

I'll talk to you later. Later. There you go. Dan Soder. His tour dates and ticket links are at dansoder.com. Hang out for a minute, people. sar at dansoder.com. Hang out for a minute, people. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category.

And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. It's a night for the whole family.

Be a part of Kids Night when the toronto rock take on the colorado mammoth at a special 5 p.m start time on saturday march 9th at first ontario center in hamilton the first 5 000 fans in attendance will get a dan dawson bobblehead courtesy of backley construction punch your ticket to kids night on saturday March 9th at 5 PM in rock city at Toronto rock.com. Four years ago this week, I had a great chat here in the garage with the one and only John Goodman. You can go listen to that right now in whatever app you're using to listen to this episode. You know, it's like when you finally get that clarity and you're feeling relatively comfortable in your own skin. I mean, the worst thing about it is that, you know, that's it.

That's all there is. That's the hardest thing to accept. But I didn't know that for 30 years. Right, right, right. And it took me a long time to just, okay, this is all right. Yeah. And when I look around, it's better than all right. It's pretty good.

It's good. The gratitude element is always the missing factor when you're hard on yourself, better than all right. It's pretty good. It's good. The gratitude element is always the missing factor when you're hard on yourself, you know, because I'm just sort of like, fuck it. You know,

what the fuck? What's the fucking point? I'm an asshole. And then, you know, if you're able to manage it, which I'm not great at, you know,

it's okay. Well, yeah, I figure nobody owes me a thing. Right. Take care of yourself. Right.

Nobody owes you anything, but that doesn't mean there's not a world full of yourself. Right. Nobody owes you anything. But that doesn't mean there's not a world full of assholes out there. Oh, yeah. And mostly you have to laugh at them. Yeah.

Well, that's the best way to do it, you know, as opposed to sort of... My thing is is I get into a thing where I'm like, that guy's an asshole.

Why am I not more like him? Yeah. He's successful. Yeah, exactly. To get all WTF episodes ad-free, sign up for WTF Plus by going to the link

in the episode description or go to WTFpod.com and click on WTF Plus. All right. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Guitar time. Thank you. Stamford Stadion Nettopp Thank you. Thank you. boomer lives monkey and lafonda cat angels everywhere