WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1553 - Julianne Nicholson

Episode Date: July 4, 2024

Julianne Nicholson came over to the garage at the right time. With Marc deep in the middle of an acting job, it was helpful for both his curiosity and his confidence to talk to an expert actor like Julianne who is so versatile in all her performances, from movies like Black Mass to her Emmy-winning performance in Mare of Easttown. Julianne and Marc talk about their shared Boston connections, taking on heavy roles, and Julianne’s tender new film Janet Planet. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Noom Kitchen for 100 healthy and delicious recipes to promote better living, available to buy now wherever books are sold. Yes. Okay. Let's do it. All right, let's do this. How are you? What the fuckers?

What the fuck buddies? What the fuck, Nick? What's happening? I'm Marc Maron. This is my podcast, WTF. Welcome to it. We've been doing it a while. How's everybody doing on this holiday?

A time for severe reflection and maybe appreciation of the true nature of the thing. Of it being maybe the last relatively independent fourth that we might have in years. The panic has already set in. It has been for years now. And I hope the fireworks can take you out of it for a minute. Unfortunately, I'll not be going to any party this year, because the one party I go to isn't happening. But I'm sure I'll hear the fireworks.

And I'm sure I'll see my cats freak out. And I'm sure I'll hear the fireworks and I'm sure I'll see my cats freak out and I'm sure I'll sit there and reflect but uh Almost every day is like that A little uh a little shout out here. I guess it's not really a shout out, but I I'd like everyone to Take into consideration Um that you may want to foster a dog A shelter dog because I've been told by a good source, Kit, that the shelters fill up with so many pet dogs

that run away from home during the fireworks that you're needed. And in general, the shelters are filled up with doggies. And, you know, it's hard to figure out whether or not you're capable of some kind of unconditional love or whether that kind of love is real. But I'll tell you one thing, loving an animal is a very rewarding thing. And most of you know that. And there's animals in need right now. The summer is a bad time. So if you're looking to get an animal and to feel like,

you know, that feeling of love that asks for nothing other than to be fed and you get it all back, this is the time. Time to foster an animal, time to adopt an animal. There's a lot out there and it is rewarding. It might be all you have eventually. It's just your little doggie, your little cat, your little gecko, your big cat, whatever, whatever thing, whatever living thing makes you feel that love. A birdie, maybe a little parakeet or big macaw that will outlive you. Whatever it is, it's a very weird thing though to have a bunch of cats that are at the AJR now

that I have and realize like, holy shit, these things might outlive me. But they'll be okay. Somebody will take my cats. Won't you take my cats? So today I talked to Julianne Nicholson, who's an amazing actress. Amazing, always amazing.

And I don't know if you'd know her by name, but you will now. She's been in a lot of stuff, a lot of TV. You've seen her in Dream Scenario, I, Tanya, Black Mass, August, Osage County. I love her. And I met her once apparently she told me. And I met her once, apparently, she told me. And I feel like I was very intimidated.

She won an Emmy for her performance in the series Mayor of Easttown. She's in a new movie called Janet Planet, which is written and directed by Annie Baker, the playwright who I've had on. And it's a fairly stunning, very poetic movie. And I do get concerned about these poetic movies. You know, I hope they don't exist in a vacuum because despite what anyone says about the

movie business, I do worry about independent films and I worry about the type of films that this movie is, this Janet Planet movie, because they go to a different place. You know, things don't always end with a bow or well. There are certain risks being taken around the writing and the directing, and there's a lot of space left for you to place yourself into the story in terms of how it makes you feel.

And I know there's always an audience for these movies, but it's one of those things where it feels like there should always be a bigger audience. It's like there's a choir for this stuff. And one of the reasons that, you know, I feel there's so much division outside of a orchestrated effort on behalf of the wrong minded churning id and exploitation thereof of the fucky fucks, there is, you know, these movies are important because they engage our humanity. I just saw that movie Daddy-O the other night with Dakota Johnson and Sean Penn, which is a very ballsy movie to just have an entire movie be a conversation between a guy driving

a cab and his passenger. But it was beautifully written and not easy to pull off. And Dakota Johnson was brilliant, an amazing performance. Sean Penn is great. You know, he did this character, and I know why he liked it, because it is a humbled male character who is not necessarily struggling,

but sort of reflective on his own toxic behavior, you know, as one who gets older eventually reckons with, depending on what kind of person you are. But it's kind of a stunning little amazing movie. And there's all these little amazing movies that I don't even have time to take them all in but this one that that Julianne is in is kind of amazing. It's called Janet Planet and I recommend Daddio as well. Those are my movie reviews for today. I was gonna go watch the New York Ghost movie but it's

like nine hours long so I have to put aside an afternoon to feel awkward for that amount of time. But it's important, you know, humanity, you know, figuring out where to put your love at this point in time. It is the 4th of July. This is America or what we know it as now. And as we head into whatever's going to happen, it's a very difficult time for this country. And I'm not saying anything anything anyone doesn't know.

And I only know what I know, and I only know how I engage with all of it. And sometimes I just, it's not that I keep it to myself, but I try, I'm trying to put it into perspective for myself, and that might help other people. But we all know what we're up against. We all know the feeling of, you know, what does it mean to feel like you're,

you're losing the good fight? What did the good fight ever mean in the first place? How much did you put into the good fight? Is there a good fight? Are you too specific? Have you just sort of, uh, uh, kind of cornered yourself and do a, a, a few different things that make you feel better about yourself? The weird thing about the good fight

and people that live humane and decent lives and try to do the right thing is that, it's very easy to do it in your life and feel like, well, my life is just going on. But unfortunately, the bulldozer of the wrong-minded have been chipping away for about 50 years now to undo this whole goddamn thing. And if I can recommend something to those of you who aren't fully kind of informed about

the possibilities, which is many people and it's not an accusation. I mean a lot of times how far do you need to dig? You have your feelings, you know what you're against, you know what you're sort of for, you know what you're afraid of, but there's a lot of nuance and there's a lot of pretty cold facts about the possibilities of what we're heading into. And I think if you would like a kind of a primer on what it could look like, there's an episode of John Oliver's show specifically about Trump's second term that'll just give you a little information. Look man, all I know is we're at this juncture where we're all just waiting for the right old guy to die.

And that is oddly a bipartisan joke. And outside of indictments and the Supreme Court and everything else, we have a candidate, Trump, who's using a bit of Hitler in his speeches, just shamelessly using thinly veiled Hitler. And look, I'm not, you know, I already knew he was a racist and a monster, and it's not the racism that bothers me. It's the plagiarism, to be quite honest with you. How hard is it to cite your sources? You know what I mean? How hard is it to say, you know, as Hitler said or to quote my hero Hitler, how hard is that? Man up. Don't be a pussy. Enough with the dog whistles. We all know what's going on. And as a Jew, I'm a little hypersensitive to it. I will admit, you know, it's not a great time to be a Jew.

But you know, has it ever been really, I mean, has it ever been, was there ever a time in history where a Jew said, wow, what an amazing time it is to be a Jew. Maybe the fourth season of Seinfeld, but that was the extent of it. And look, you know, I don't know how to get my message out to people that don't,

you know, that aren't like-minded. It trickles out there. And I, you know, I appreciate you guys. I appreciate the audience. But what am I going to do? What am I going to go out and play at casino? I don't do casinos. I don't do a lot of the gigs that other comics do because I don't know. of the gigs that other comics do because I don't know if I'm you know I am the type of comic I am I am who I am you know I don't even know if what I'm doing can be categorized in a certain way I try to I try to frame myself properly I kind of see myself maybe as an artisanal comic you know how that I think that would work you know kind of I am the farm, you are the table kind of thing. But I can't do casinos because I have no attraction to them anyways, and it's not about money for me.

It's never been about money. And a lot of times people don't think I comment on what I need to comment on, or what you want me to comment on, or what you feel that I should be saying sometimes. But look, I am processing all this along with you and some of my process I'm public about some of it, I'm not, but there's a certain amount of, of terror in my heart, there's a certain amount of panic, but there's also the

part of me that's sort of like, all right, so if the worst happens and I don't know if you've found yourself in this area and you ask yourself like, well right, so if the worst happens, and I don't know if you've found yourself in this area, and you ask yourself like, well, because ultimately, people just wanna be okay. They just wanna be okay in their lives and feel okay in their lives and what they do in their life. They just want to be okay.

Okay is great. It's great. There's nothing wrong with being okay, but sometimes it's a little, there's a paralysis to it. There's a lack of action to being okay, and then you just have to bend your definition of okay. I don't know how many of you are thinking like, well if the worst thing happens, like think about other authoritarian countries, which happens to be most of them, and you ask yourself, oh yeah, is there someone who has my job in

Hungary? I wonder if they're doing okay. How do dentists in Hungary do? How does a massage therapist in Hungary, are they okay? Are they getting what their needs are for their little lives? Are they okay? Is it going to be okay? No, it's not. And it's weird when you're a Jew because, you know, over the last, you know, many months, you know, you're kind of a Jew as a cultural identity. It's a religion, but it's a broad cultural identity that involves a lot of people. And if you're a Jew, you know, people will say to you, oh, you're a Jew. Well, what do you think about what's going on in Israel?

Not good. Not good. Yeah, but what do you think about it? Bad. It's bad. But where do you stand? And that's a tricky question, right, for a public person, because whatever I say will be taken out of context and used by whatever side wants to use it as propaganda, even at

my low level of public profile. So it's tricky, because there's only three answers to that question. Where do you stand? Well, you can say, well, I think Israel has a right to defend itself however it sees necessary as a country. Then people say, you fascist. Or you could say, well, I think that the Israelis are committing genocide on the Palestinian people.

Well, then you're anti-Semitic. But if you say something like, well, you know, I think there should be a ceasefire and some dialogue and some movement towards some kind of peaceful resolution. Then people say, shut the fuck up. What are, what kind of coward are you? Pick a side, you worm. What kind of Jew are you? Pick a side. And it's not my job to be, to pretend like I understand. But I will tell you this this and this is just you know as if as a thought That if Israel wants to follow America's lead Historically what will eventually happen is this will all come to pass and at some point in the future

Israelis will be able to go into Gaza and spend the weekend at Palestinian casinos. And that's a casino gig I'd have to take, you know, just to be part of the solution. That, you know, I mean, it's still tricky, but I would have to take that gig. I'll be in Tucson, Arizona at the Rialto Theater on Friday, September 30th. I'm in Phoenix at the Orpheum Theater on Saturday, September 21st. You can go to WTFpod.com for tickets.

And look, I hope for the best. I'm not being cynical. I don't have a lot of hope, but I do want something to happen. I don't think that anything that's gonna happen from this point forward is gonna be good, really. But I imagine most people will adapt. Some will run.

And what fighting looks like is, you know, that's on you. And I have to feel like sometimes I say things that help people, but it's usually more with Psychological things with addiction things, you know a lot of the feedback I get is around things I talk about that I go through mentally emotionally psychologically Being a sober person and that seems to help and I do believe I didn't expect that to happen But it does you feel good to be of service in that way.

And I also beat myself up about whether or not I do enough. But I guess that's a lot of us and I'm not sure that that matters. So look, you guys, this conversation with Julianne was, it's an actor's conversation, because I'm in it. I'm now involved with the acting, and it's my day-to-day to some degree. Oddly, because I'm on a golf show,

I just got a full set of clubs from TaylorMade. Good clubs, so pressure's on. The pressure is on. I've never played golf in my life. I've been to a driving range twice when I was a kid, but now I'm going to be the the most well equipped beginner on the goddamn course if I go out there and take lessons. I think I got all the clubs. I mean I think I don't know how many there are, but it seems like I've got most of them from Taylor

Made Golf and they're not even looking for a plug. They just came. I got a fan over there and now I got, and now I'm feeling a lot of pressure from the clubs that I've leaned in the corner in my dining room. Okay, so as I said, Julianne Nicholson is a brilliant actress and I've been a fan a long time, and it was a pleasure to talk to her. Did I call her Julianne more before? I'd like to talk to her too. But Julianne Nicholson is currently in Janet Planet,

which is now playing in theaters and it's a lovely, provocative movie, and this is me talking to Julieanne. sublime works by some of Quebec's most beloved artists. Join us for a journey down the St. Lawrence and see how Impressionism flourished in this country a century ago. Buy your tickets today at mcmichael.com, home to the art of Canada. Hey folks, let your imagination soar by visiting audible.ca.

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Audible makes it easy to be inspired and entertained as part of your everyday routine without needing to set aside extra time. You might want to check out some audiobooks by our recent guests like I Curse You With Joy by Tiffany Hannes or Sonic Life by Thurston Moore. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free 30-day Audible trial and your first audiobook is free. Visit audible.ca. You know, you're one of those people for some reason. Like, I feel like I met you, but I also feel like I know you anyways.

And I feel the same about you. But it's not just because of movies. I don't know what it is. I don't know if it's Boston. I don't know what it is. The Boston Connect is real. It's heavy, man. It's real, yeah. So, okay, before I wasn't being very chatty out there, I just got, I was in Vancouver.

Save it, save it, save it for the recording. We're doing it. I was in, I was in Vancouver. I did a night shoot last night. I shot till like three in the morning and then- Are you bragging? No, I'm just telling you what I've been through. No, who would brag about a night shoot?

I know that's a nightmare. It is a nightmare. I'm out at nine p.m., like I'm done. But you have that choice? No. Yeah. But here's my question, because you're professional, and I act, but this job, all I'm trying to do

is not be a dick in terms of like, what could be going on? How long is this gonna take? I know. And like in the guy, the director's a great guy, and he knew that I was being, he knew I was, like, I just, because I'll say it, I'm like, I really, I gotta get on a plane tomorrow, so. Can we wrap this up?

I got places to be. It's like, this is a two-minute scene, we're in hour five. Yeah, I don't think we need a close-up on this one. I'm constantly trying to not do close-ups. Yeah, yeah, you don't even have to cover me, I'll go. Totally. To have my standing looks good from the back.

I don't think I need to say these words, in fact. There's definitely, I can just do it a different way. Send the check to my house, I'll be all set. Can we just, that's the problem is eventually it'll get to a point where they're like, yeah, we don't need you, we have the AI, we'll just wedge you in. I know.

Scary, right? It's very scary, I've been having that conversation a lot lately and I'm trying not to go too far too quickly down the spiral. We're like what's it? Just the changing of the business and like not getting paid. And bad. And people just not being able to provide for themselves.

Yes. And it's a- No one's working. It's scary. It's a different- But you're here how long have you been here? You're working? I am. I feel very lucky and happy. What the a different concept. But you're here, how long have you been here? You're working. I am. I feel very lucky and happy.

What the hell shoots in LA that you're here for for? A new Dan Fogelman show. He did This Is Us. Oh. So it's a new show for Hulu. They're shooting. Is it called This Is Them? This Was Us.

Actually, they have a podcast called This Was Us. Of course they do. All the cast? Yeah, I think so. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's called Paradise, right now. Oh yeah? Yeah, and it shoots at Paramount, which is. All the cast. Yeah, I think so. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's called Paradise right now. Oh yeah? Yeah, and it shoots at Paramount, which is-

On the lot? Yeah, it's so nice. That's so nice. Studios are so nice. Everything's controlled. I know. And that one feels really special. It feels like old Hollywood. Every time-

Yeah, it's the best. And I rented a place around the corner, so I walk in and I just feel so grateful. Oh, so you don't drive through the gate every day. Sometimes I do if I'm lazy or if I have to go somewhere after, but normally I walk. How's that neighborhood, all right? Like, what is it, on Beverly? Beverly. Oh, so you don't drive through the gate? Sometimes I do if I'm lazy or if I have to go somewhere after, but normally I walk. How's that neighborhood, all right?

Like, what is it, on Beverly? Beverly, yeah. Melrose. It's on Melrose. It's a little sketch. It is, right? Yeah, I just like walk quickly and carry a heavy bag. How's the roll?

It's good. Yeah? Yeah, it's really good. It's different from anything. Is it heavy? Always. Fuck. I'm waiting for a big comedy.

At least you said it. I know, I know. I'm like, oh, there she is again. I know, God, don't give her another dead baby, please. No, I'm trying to be conscious about looking for things that aren't just that. Can you do comedy? I don't know.

I've done it, yeah. I've done it and I love it. Like when you were younger in the movies? Yeah, Ally McBeal was a comedy. I did a great movie called Seeing Other People with Wally Walidarsky and Maya Forbes, writing and directing with Jay Moore, which was hilarious. Jay.

Jay, do you know Jay? Yeah, I've known him since he was a kid, I think. He was, I haven't seen him in probably 20 years, but I loved working with him. He's really talented, he's really good. Yeah, he's a very energetic, focused guy. Very funny. I went to see him in a, like he took me to like,

I don't know, one of the comedy clubs and he just did a set, like off the cuff, and I was crying. In New York? No, here. Oh yeah, he, yeah, I remember when he started, cause I was in New York and I was already doing comedy, and he just showed up from New Jersey, and he was 16 or 17.

Oh my God. He was just like this cute kid, and he's very quick. He's still pretty quick. He's so funny. I remember one of the things I first fell in love with him about was, he had to take his shirt off in it, so he was like, no pizza, no carbs. He was trying to pay. They bring in,

literally we have the read-through or or rehearsal and they bring in pizza. Without skipping a beat, he just puts one slice on top of the other and picks it up and eats two pieces at once. And I was like, yeah, we're gonna keep it real in this movie. Oh, that's the other thing about sets where you're like, okay, I'm just gonna, you know, I'm up there, I have to,

I'm gonna be shooting this thing for like three months and I come back every couple of weeks to do these., I have to, I'm gonna be shooting this thing for like three months and I come back every couple weeks to do these. And I set up so I could cook and everything. But you're on set and you're like, well, fruit's good. Fruit was okay at Crafty. And then eventually you're like, oh, look, I'll just have one of those chocolates or that cake.

Yeah, those Sour Patch Kids look good. That's where I go. Last night, you know, cause it was Friday, they brought in a food truck that only served smothered fries at 2.30 in the morning. I know. I'm pretty good at keeping away from that now. It seems like the people that really do the acting for a life, they all have their food brought in. I make my own food and bring it.

Yeah? Yeah, I just feel better. But what is it about catering? I think, first of all, I don't taste love in that food. That's true. And I taste a lot of butter and salt. Also, it's not good quality ingredients. They're trying to save money.

They're feeding all these people. And so it's definitely not organic meat. And like, processed everything. So a good caterer is someone who can fool us into thinking we're getting good food. Yeah, but I'm not even giving them a chance anymore. I just never understand it, because I'm only eating vegetables. I'm processed everything. So a good caterer is someone who can fool us into thinking we're getting good food. Yeah, but I'm not even giving them a chance anymore. I just never understand it because I'm like, I'm only eating vegetables, I'm vegan now, like how do I still feel pudge?

You know, and they're just, they must just soak it in oil. I think, I think. It doesn't matter, it's not a big topic. It's not a huge deal, but it is, it is time consuming when you have to make your own food. Yes, but I like doing it. Like I, it grounds me somehow. I agree. You too?

Yes, and then you feel like it's then it's fuel. It's doing its job and you feel good. And you made it, you know what's in it. And like I got home one night late at night and I'm like, I'm just gonna chop some garlic and get to work. Just so I can focus, feel like myself. Feet on the ground.

Yeah, and also I think I've been slight eating compulsion. So like it's nice to be engaged with food as often as possible. Yeah, definitely. As much as you can. So okay, Critics' Choice Awards. Yeah, so we, I was there for I, Tanya, and you were there for Glow.

Okay, oh yeah. And I was. That was an exciting night. That was an exciting night. And I'm friends with Betty Gilpin. And so I went over to say hi to her at your table. And. Oh, was that, it wasn't the SAG Awards, it was Critics' Choice? I'm friends with Betty Gilpin. And so I went over to say hi to her at your table and. Oh, was it, was that, was that the,

it wasn't the SAG awards, it was Critics' Choice? It was Critics' Choice. Really? Yes. There was one, I can't remember if it was SAG or Critics' Choice where it was very exciting. And I had met, I think I met Tracy Letts in the bathroom. Or I did.

Okay. And I love that guy. He's great. And it was a very odd thing. Then he came on my podcast, but I felt we really built our relationship in the men's room. Okay. I was just excited to see him.

Cause like, I don't know what to do with it. And Francis McDormand was nice to me. I knew who I was. She wasn't in there. No, she wasn't. Everyone was there. Where were you? It was a big night in the men's room.

Yeah, gosh. Did you go to the Sagors? No, I wasn't. Everyone was there. Where were you? It was a big night in the men's room. Yeah, gosh. Did you go to the Sagors? No, I wasn't invited. Oh really? Yeah. Gilpin's great. She's great. Did you talk to her yesterday?

We did Marco Polos. I just recently Marco Polo'd her, because we haven't seen each other in a long time. So like, actually by chance, like a week ago, and then I might've Marco Polo'd her yesterday and said I was gonna come do this. You're doing the podcast? Yeah.

Because I got a random I love you out of nowhere. Just like, I love you, and I'm like, boy, how is that, like she does that sometimes, but it must have been. I know, she's nice. She's nice like that. Did you know her in New York? Yeah, we did a play together.

Which one? Sam Shepard play called Heartless. I don't even know that play, how do I not know this Sam Shepard play? It was a last, it was one of his last plays and did it involve a distant abusive father and I'm sure that was like the ghost of that was looming. Yeah. No just Was he around? Yeah, it was a new place. So he was in the rehearsal room every day. Oh, yeah, it was really incredible How was that? Did he? Um,, was he reworking it while you guys were doing it?

Not, not really. Not so much. Yeah, he felt like, I mean, honestly, I can't remember. I can't remember anything anymore. It was incredible for him to be in there. I don't really remember. I do remember one time we were both at the sinks at the co-ed bathrooms and like the water wasn't going.

It's the kind you put your hand in. And I just thought, I'm always gonna think of Sam Shepard now when I can't get water to run in a bathroom. I can't get those automatic ones to ever work. That's what it was. Oh, no. And he was getting really, sort of frustrated.

Yeah, it makes a fool out of everybody. I know. It's like the coolest person. Yeah, if it can make Sam Shepard feel foolish, I mean, it's doing its job. Yeah, that's the humbler. It's called the humbler. The great humbler.

That's right. So, okay, so I met you. I must have been pretty excited. Well, you were playing it cool. I was? Yeah, but that's all right. Those things are weird. I don't know. I watch you and things, and I'm like, what the fuck is she doing? So good. That's so nice. I watch Black Mask whenever it's on.

I watch Black Mask constantly. That's a good movie. It's a great movie. I feel like that was sort of a little bit of an underrated movie. I thought Johnny Mask constantly. That's a good movie. It's a great movie. I feel like that was sort of a little bit of an underrated movie. I thought Johnny Depp was amazing in that movie. He was amazing, but... And also the cast, like... Great.

Jesse Plemons. Plemons and Rory... Rory is... Oh my God. He's amazing. That guy... Bill Camp. Bill Camp's always good.

Yeah, always. And he's also in everything. He's contractually obligated to be in every... I know. We need a role for him. I'm not mad at that. No. I want to see him every time he pops up. I see him everywhere, and I guess for decades I never saw him once. That's right.

It's wild. It's his time. He's the character actor guy. He sure is. But that guy Rory, I can't remember his last name. He's amazing. I can't remember his last name. When I interviewed him, it was not easy because he's kind of an intense, dark dude.

Was he smoking? Yeah, maybe. I let people smoke if was not easy. Because he's kind of an intense, dark dude. Was he smoking? Yeah, maybe, I let people smoke if they have to. But I'd never seen somebody play a killer with such authenticity. In such a believable way, I know, I know. Like just that dead eye thing. I know, I know. Because I've met a couple in New York,

a couple of mob guys, and they have this thing where you're like, all right. I believe you. It was in passing, like at a comedy club. A guy named, one tiny guy who was involved with the club goes, this is my uncle. And I'm like, OK, he's one of them. But I think the reason the aversion was that I really,

the first time I saw it, I thought like, well, Johnny Depp is great, but he kind of looks like Nosferatu. True. Heavy makeup, you know? But then as I let that, and I know, I've met the director a few times, great guy. It's got, yeah. Yeah, and he's got a tone that he's really,

he's locked in, the guy's for real. I think so too. You know what I mean? He's like an auteur, you know, he knows. He's got his vision. Yeah. Totally. And you're so fucking good, it's like a new suit, huh? Thank you.

Oh yeah. It's so fun. My family loves that movie. Cause whenever I can trot out the Boston accent, they're delighted. Yes. And David Harbour's in there. Yeah.

That crazy scene about the steak. Yeah. I know. Some good scenes in there. Oh my God. Yeah. I loved doing that one. I loved going home and being able to do that. It was so fun.

But so what is the, like, because you, I think, I spent years in Boston. Yeah. Terrified of the Boston Irish. Yes. Smart man. This makes sense. And, you know, and I was just like this aggravated, you know, sensitive Jewish kid, you know, doing comedy for all, you know, like, I had to do One-Nighters and I had

to go to- Did you move there for BU? Yeah. Okay. And then you stayed? How did you know that? I don't know. You know things. You know things. I went to BU- And then you stayed for a while?

I went to, I actually went to Curry in Milton first, which was this weird little college because I screwed up in high school. Then I went to BU, and I was there undergrad for like, I did undergrad for like five years. Moved out back home, then went to LA for a year, and became a doorman at the comedy store. Got fucked up on drugs, left, went back to Boston to start doing comedy. So my experience of, I came in second

in the Boston comedy riot. Nice. 1988. Amazing. And you know who won? Sue McGinnis. You don't know her, but you know her. So, you know. Is the point of the story that I don't know her

and you came in second? I came in second to a person with a very Irish name. Got it, yeah, I see. Sue McGinnis, she's nice. But then I started working, so I had to do one-nighters all over, LeMonstor, Saugus, Taunton, down the Cape, Johnny Yee's, the Chinese restaurant. So I was playing, and they weren't even real clubs.

So I had to really engage. Wow. Did you ever see that Casey Affleck thing from Saturday Night Live? The Dunkin's? The Dunkin's? Of course. Yeah, it's so good. It's perfect. really engage with the, did you ever see that Casey Affleck thing from Saturday Night Live? The Dunkin's, of course. Yeah, it's so good. It's perfect.

It's amazing. Yeah. It's like the best thing he's ever done. I can't, I shouldn't say that. I know, it's so good. But you grew up in that? So I lived there, I was born there, yes, and then I went out, lived in Western Mass with my mom

from seven to 11, and then I moved back to Boston for sixth grade, and then I was there from sixth grade seven to 11, and then I moved back to Boston for sixth grade, and then I was there from sixth grade through high school. And I'd go back to my mom's in Western Mass for vacations. But so is your mom from Boston? Yeah, she grew up in Beverly. Right. My dad's family's from Medford.

Oh, so it's real. Oh yeah. Everyone sounds like you. A lot, it's so interesting. It's been a really interesting thing about doing accents actually, because even in the same family, accents are not the same,

because it depends on your job, a million things. But there are a lot of strong accents. Yeah. And I don't even know what that accent comes from. I think it's- There's nothing like it. I know, I know. And you can't, like anyone who tries to do it. There's nothing like it. I know, I know. And you can't, like, anyone who tries to do it... It's really hard.

Unless you have it. Yes. There's nothing, like, I don't want to throw anybody out. You don't want to out anybody. No. It pains me. That's why I was such a relief when I got black masked, because it actually pains me to listen to bad Boston accents. So how long did you last watching Mystic River?

You know, I never watched that. Maybe I was sparing myself. They were all doing it. All over the place. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And like, I get it, but it's a very weird, delicate thing, that accent. Totally. That's the other thing in black mask. I thought everybody got it, like Jesse Plemons got that accent.

He's another guy. Him and Rory, like they're very, you know, they're not easy to talk to, not because they're hard to talk to. They don't talk much. Right. But they have some inner working. I don't know. Totally. I don't know what it is, but they're just gifted guys. I agree. You too?

I agree. Hey, thanks. But like that character in Black Mask, I mean, that's a real person, right? Yeah, based on two people, based on both of his wives, John Connolly's wives. It was like an amalgamation of those two people. And imagination and just knowing people from that area. Well, yeah, I mean, you had to know all of them. Yeah. He did pretty good with it.

Yeah, he really did. Joel Edgerton. of them. He did pretty good with it. Yeah, he really did. Joel Edgerton, I thought he did a great job with it. But sometimes I hear people from, there's like an Australia, Boston thing that's not that far off. I've heard that before. But it's weird when you go down the Eastern Seaboard and it all shifts because Philly's got a thing,

New York's got a thing, Providence has a thing, but it's closer to Boston. I don't even know where that came from. It must have been Irish somehow. Yeah. I guess so. It was the weirdest thing because having been in Boston for all that time and performing for those people and just being terrified of just rooms full of sweaty... Drunk Irish, flat faces. Mack! Mack!

I know, but they're funny people. They're hilarious people. And can be very charming and very friendly. Yeah, yeah. Mack! Mack! I know, but they're funny people. They're hilarious people. And can be very charming. Yeah. And very friendly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I was very intimidated by them. Right. And I remember the first time I went to Ireland, I'm like, oh my god, they're all here. This is where they come from. But the Irish are so nice. They're so humble. No, it's different. It's totally different, but they look the same. It's the same, because when I grew up, it was all Irish, Catholic, and Italian Catholic. So it was sort of, it's different. It's totally different, but they look the same. It's the same, because when I grew up, it was all Irish Catholic and Italian Catholic. So it was sort of, it was, you were either O'Brien or like, you know.

Right, right, right. One of them. Bonsignori. Yeah, yeah, yeah, sure. So it was always those. So your school was all Irish and Italian? Yes. So what happened?

So do you have sisters, like brothers? I have a full sister who's two years younger than I am, and I have a half sister and half brother. Oh, so there's not like nine of you? No, no, no. That's good. No, my mom's the oldest of 10, my dad's the oldest of seven. So I'm the oldest of like 40 grand,

literally 40 grandkids on my mother's side, because there's 10 of them and most of them had four kids. Really? Mm-hmm. Do you know them, and most of them had four kids. Really? Do you know them all? Of course. I miss them. They've scattered some now, as people do.

But growing up, like in the 70s and 80s, and the family parties were my favorite thing, because my aunts and uncles were all hilarious, and young, and funny. They're characters, man. Really? But they're overwhelming sometimes. Because when I was starting out, I don't know if you know who Lenny Clack is.

I don't know. There was Lenny Clack and Mike Clack and Mack Clack. Were they all comedians? Lenny was a comic. OK. Mike was a manager and booker. Oh my god. And Mack worked at the bar.

Mack is the best name to say with the Boston accent. Yeah. Yeah. Another good name is when my girlfriend to say with the Boston accent. Yeah, yeah. Another good name is like when my girlfriend up there was living in Somerville, there was always drama at the building across the street. There was always a girl on the street going, Jennifer!

It was the best. Like in the middle of the night, just screaming Jennifer with that accent. So what part of Boston did you grow up in? Medford. Oh, it was Medford. I was just out there at that theater. There's a theater out there.

There's a big theater. Where? Yeah, I know. I didn't know about it either, but I played it. In Medford? Yeah. Like either, like the Schubert's in Boston, then there's the Wilbur, but there's one now

that they're booking in Medford. It seats about 1300. Wow, big. It's kind of old school. And Medford's right beyond Cambridge, right? Yeah. Yeah. I know a guy opened a bagel shop there, but the theater was great. And I couldn't believe it. It was packed. It was beautiful. I'll ask my dad about it. How am I going to know? Yeah, I don't think he can.

And he might not have, but he will next time. Yeah? Yes. Yes, he's very up for it. So but your parents didn't stay together? No. Yeah. Yes. Yes, he's very up for it. So, but your parents didn't stay together? No. No. What's your dad do? Is he in a Boston type of business?

He's retired now. He was a teacher. Oh. Yeah. Well, that's nice. I sold insurance when I was in school and then later career was teaching. Yeah. Yeah.

Nice guy. Very nice guy. Oh, that's good. Big, nice, gentle giant. Oh yeah? Yeah, he's like six foot five. Very Irish. The noble brow. Oh yeah?

Yeah. Is that what you call it? That's what my husband calls it, my family's forehead. The noble brow. Where's your husband from? The five heads. England.

Oh, so he's got a... He has one too, so it takes one to no one. Oh really, he's Irish as well? We all have big old heads. England. Oh, so he's got a, He has one too, so it's like takes one to know one. Oh really, he's Irish as well? Big old heads. No, he's English, but just big headed people. Have you gone to Ireland? I've never been. What are you talking about?

I know, to my great shame. My uncle moved there like 40 years ago to Northern Ireland, to Belfast. My mother just came back from there. That's the most beautiful place in the world. I know. When there was a big wedding there, I chose to be a camp counselor instead.

So I missed that big trip and I have to go now. It's easier in England. I know. Right? Yeah. It's like an hour. I know. I know.

I know. You can just go for the day. I know. Go to Dublin at least. It's gonna happen. Are you nervous? What do you? No, I don't know.

I haven't made it a priority, but I am going to now. You will just blend in. I know that. I've heard that. You just look like everybody else there. It's like your people. It's like coming home. So wait, so, okay, so you live out in Western Mass too? I moved, yeah, from 16. Why did that happen? Because my mom and dad split up,

and then my mom, the man who has now been my stepfather, he was living in Maine, and so they chose this Western Mass to sort of meet in this little cabin in the woods with no electricity or running water. Whose idea was that? Montague, Massachusetts, my mom and my stepfather's. That had to be a Maine idea.

Massachusetts, my mom and my stepfathers. That had to be a main idea. I expect he suggested it and she approved. Who knows, it was like 1978. But actually it was, you know, in hindsight amazing. An adjustment but pretty special. I, yeah, mentioning all these states like triggers my, like, I know. The idea of driving as a 22-year-old, you know, to do comedy in these places.

Yeah, would you take, like, the two, out from Boston to Western Mass? Boston's the most confusing fucking city because West doesn't mean West, because it's not a grid, and it's just like this crescent. So you can't go direct, you gotta know your fucking highways. That's true. But no, yeah, a Gunkwit,

I did one of my first gigs in a Gunkwit, I did one of my first gigs in a Gunkwit, York. Where is that, is that like south? It's a beach town. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, a Gunkwit, York main, there was a gig. I drove to the furthest point east in the United States, Machias main, to open for a hypnotist.

That's a lot. It was like nine hours way up into main. Oh my God. All right, so you're in a cabin. Yes. And you're seven? Yes. So that's exciting.

Yes, I mean, I don't know if it was exciting, but that's what we did. That was it. When you're little, you just kind of get on with it, right? Like this is your situation, so like deal with it. What seems like a fun thing? Yeah, it's a lot of work. Like a pump for water and-

Bathrooms, no bathrooms? There's a bathroom, but you had to, there's a lot of work, like a pump for water and- Bathrooms, no bathrooms? There's a bathroom, but you had to, there's a outhouse and a bathroom, but you had to like, to flush, you had to like pump this bucket and then pour it down and then flush. Yeah, that sounds like some sort of like, I guess at that point it wouldn't, it was kind of hippy-ish, huh?

Yeah, I guess so, I mean- Or whatever they call that. Exactly, I mean, I feel like- Living off the land, did you garden? Oh my gosh, yeah, my mom's an herbalist, we had a big garden. She's an herbalist. Yes. I mean, I feel like I know I've- Living off the land, did you garden? Oh my gosh, yeah. My mom's an herbalist. We had a big garden. She's an herbalist.

Yes, since then. She started- She's still an herbalist. Yes, she's a thriving company, actually. Really? Yeah, after years of like just doing it for the love as a business and yeah. Now, what is an herbalist?

Is that medicine? Is she medicine? Some, some, yeah. I don't know if you call it medicine, but like, yes, for healing and well-being. Yeah. Healing herbs. Yeah.

Yeah. And now like, so it all took off now? Yeah. Yeah. And she grows it all still? Most of it she grows herself. She has like 12 people working for her now. And my stepfather is in the business as well.

Is there a brand? It's called Woodland Essence. Really? Yeah, and she's in doctor's offices also. She's not anti-Western medicine, it's more in like support of. But does she make oils as well? Yeah, oils, tinctures, salves, creams. And do you believe it?

I believe it, well the thing is you can't just do one thing. It's like a lifestyle, but yeah, I believe it. I believe it, well the thing is, you can't just do one thing, it's like a lifestyle. But yeah, I believe it. It's a lifestyle? Yes, I mean you can't be like eating, you can't be eating like Big Macs and smoking cigarettes and then doing like, why isn't this echinacea like fixing my cold, you know what I mean? I see.

It's sort of a, but it is, but yes I believe, I believe. Yeah, I've taken a lot of herbs in my life. Yeah. And, but I think I was probably somewhere in the spectrum of not living the cleanest life. Copy that. Yeah. So I wasn't getting the effect necessary.

Some of the other things might've been canceling them out. Yeah, but now I live pretty clean. I don't think I take any herbs right now. Maybe it's somewhere in the pills. I never can feel the difference. Yeah, I don put it clean. I don't think I take any herbs right now. Maybe it's somewhere in the pills. I never can feel the difference. Yeah. I don't take it generally, but she has, like, for instance, a salve that I love, a cryptolepsis salve.

Cryptolepsis? What is that supposed to do? Yeah, cryptolepsis. It, like, makes wounds heal faster, I find, or like little skin things, hangnails. And it does it. Yes, in my experience, yes. So they built this business in a cabin in Maine. Massachusetts.

In Massachusetts. Western Massachusetts. Yes. Where like, what's it near? Amherst. Oh, yeah. It's called Montague, Massachusetts. Amherst?

Yeah. Amherst. That's where all the little schools are. There's a lot of schools there. Good schools there. Yeah. There's like, yeah. It's a five, it's a five college town, I think.

What's the hippie school there? Not Reed, but the other one that's in Oregon. What's it? Hampshire College? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Let the knowing laugh. I'm majoring in not working. It's my own major. I designed it. All right. So you're out there, you're herballing, and then you go back to Boston. So how do you get into this acting business? So I moved to New York when I was 18.

I didn't go to college right away. 18, so young. Yeah, and what years was it? So I moved to New York in 1990, in February of 1990. I was there. Were you? Down the street. Wasn't it great? It was, kind of in February of 1990. I was there. Were you? Down the street.

Wasn't it great? It was kind of. I loved it. It was crazy. It was crazy. Yeah, it was like the end of the crazy. I know, I'm so glad I got a little taste. Oh yeah, I was in Alphabet City.

Same. Where? Well I lived on, I mean we would just hang out there. Did you go to Benny's Burritos? Sure, I lived on. Save the Robots? Yeah, I was on the same street as Save the Robots. I was on second between. That was like on C Robots? Yeah, I was on the same street as Save the Robots. I was on second between-

That was like on C, right? Yeah, that was a little further down. I lived right next to, you know that thing that had all the weird sculptures outside? It was like at second and B? Yes. And I don't even know what it was, but I lived on, right there,

I lived on second between A and B. I was on second between third and fourth, but in 90 to 94, I was on Mott. By the Hells Angels? Mott between Houseton and Prince. Oh, that's nice. That was to 94, I was on Mott. By the Hells Angels? Mott between Houston and Prince. Oh, that's nice. That was fun. When it was still little Italy.

In that huge building? No, it was right across the street from the church on the other side of the church, old tenement building. Oh, okay. Sixth floor walk up. Yeah, it was pretty exciting then. So fun. A lot of heroin where I was living.

There was heroin, it was definitely around. Heroin was everywhere. I know. What did people? I worked in a restaurant. Kneeling over. I know. But, why did people? I worked in a restaurant. Kneeling over. Did you ever go to Sugar Reef? It was a Caribbean restaurant on Second Avenue,

but I remember when I, I was so naive when I first got there. Yeah. And I was working one night and there was a girl who was on the nod. Yeah. Like over her plate. And I was like, you guys.

Yeah. That girl, that poor girl has narcolepsy. Like what? No, she's high. I was like, no, she's got narcolepsy. Like, what? No, she's high. I was like, no, she's got narcolepsy. She's sleeping right over her food. They're like, oh dear. Go, go. Time to educate the rural girl.

Go pick up the jerk chicken and just be quiet. So when you're in New York, like, what are you doing? So I first went there with a modeling agency from Boston, brought me and another girl there. How was that local Boston modeling agency? Well, that's why I went to New York. But actually, it was, I mean, for Boston, it was like. Who was running that thing?

What was that character? Oh, God. I think somebody, Kathy and somebody who had like a cane with a wolf's head on it. Oh, good, yeah, sure. Bill. But anyway, yeah sure. Bill. But anyway, I went to New York with another girl,

but I did that for literally about six months, and I was like, no, no, I don't think I wanna do this. Modeling? Yeah, and so we went. Were you good? I know I wasn't good at it, I was scared. I was like, what? It was basically a way to get to New York.

Yeah. If that makes sense. So you're there and you do it for six months. So I was there, and then we got our own apartment down in Little Italy and started. It's great, it's great block. It was so good, it was so nice. The guys were still like sitting out, freckles.

Yeah. The whole time, they would look after us. In front of the clubhouse? Yeah. Yeah, the social clubs? Yes. Yeah. They're like, what are you doing tonight? Actually, one time I told them I worked at,

my friend opened a club on Houston and I happened to, this again, naive, that all changed. But I told them I was working at this club on Houston and later that night I was cocktail-wage thing. I saw him and another couple guys, I hid. And I didn't tell my friend like, hey, those are my neighbors over on Monk. Those are the, who are those scary men?

I have no idea. Are they gone? Oh God, get them out of here. So what happens? You moved down there. I was waitressing, and then I started going to school at Hunter College. And then I always wanted to act.

And so I would sort of every once in a while try and act in class. And, but none really, I didn't like them. They didn't make sense to me. And then when I was 24, I happened to, in the same period of time, meet a manager and an acting teacher, Sheila Gray, who made sense to me. I've heard her name before.

She's in New York, she does her own thing. She worked with comics, I think. Probably. Yeah. She has a really interesting mix of clients. This is in the 90s also, so it's been a bit. Yes, because a lot of comics, when they tried to get TV deals would go to acting coaches. One woman named Alice Spivak was one,

but I think Sheila Gray probably coached a couple of people I knew. Probably. Yeah. So you'd never done it before? No. She had a class? So she had three classes, and the first one was like a basic exercise class,

and you would go in, it was two hours, and you would go in on a Wednesday evening and like do relaxation. And then it was basically working on sense memory, on like pulling things from your own life and trying to draw them up. Yeah, do you use that? Less so now. Yeah.

Sometimes, but it was a great way in. It was a great way for me to feel like, what's interesting to me is using my own real feelings. Yeah, feelings, right. If you can access the feelings without the smell, you're like, do you have to go back to something? No, I don't have to do that anymore. I used to have to take time to create the space or like create, fine, remember the smell or you know.

But working with your own feelings happens when you're in relationship with the material in another person. Yes. Yes. I think so, do you do that? Well yeah, but like I, you know, I've tried to extract acting lessons from almost every actor I've had in here. And I even had Martin Landau in here once. Oh my God, what did he tell you?

Well, most of it is listening, you know. Yes, that's true. Yeah, and then I was so funny because I had Paul Dano in here. He's great. And like, I was being- He's very talented. I wasn't being a dick really,

but I just wanted to pull something out of my head. I'm like, do you do animal work? What did he say? He does. Oh, okay. Listen, whatever you can do, whatever you can do, do it. And I think like for the most part,

like what the difference between like an efficient actor and a great actor is it's just genetic. It's just innate. You think so? Sometimes. Yeah, because I know there's definitely people that fit on screen. There's people who don't. I don't know why.

Yes. You know, there's people who fit on TV and not in movies. There's people who are in movies that are kind of like a little too big for TV sometimes. And then there's people that are good, but they just don't translate. Yeah. There's some amalgamation of things that you can have a craft, and obviously there's people who transform themselves into miraculous other people, but then there's just people who, you know, they're great actors, but I think a lot of it

is just a natural thing. You don't. No, I think there's something to that, yeah. So, but let's talk craft for just a second. Okay. Because I'm doing this guy now. I've been hired to do this guy. It's a comedy. I'm working with Owen Wilson.

The guys, they wanted a cranky guy with a good heart. What are you going to play? Exactly. Yeah. It's a real stretch for me. I really had to dig deep now. But I was really trying to continue to figure out why acting is rewarding. Yes. You know, especially TV or film acting.

I can't imagine doing a play now. I did them in college, but it's just so much time. But like, you know, when you're doing these bits and pieces, and it's not, you know, that's your mo- It doesn't matter. I've talked about this a million times. But I put a lot in place for this guy, but I don't know, really know, you know, by the fourth day,

I'm usually like, I'm just, I'm just being me. What is this? But that's okay. Yeah, I can. If that's what that character calls for, if you're doing it in a sort of relaxed way and you're listening and you're like following impulses, then great. Yeah, and I'm just like turning up the cranky, I'm a little guarded, you know, kind of a

sad guy, you know, but it just, I don't know what I'm looking for. I don't know if I'm expecting total immersion. Well, I was gonna say, do you feel like you wanna play a character that's wildly different from who you are? I kind of did that in two, lastly. I played a guy with the, you know, with the slight Texas accent. I did okay. You know, I took a risk, but I thought I did all right. I think you're really good.

Well, that's very nice of you to say. It's true. I think you feel really relaxed and alive and in a great way. I definitely have that. That's, I mean, I don't know what percentage. I was gonna put a number on it, but that's a huge part of it, I feel like.

But when you act. Yes. and they say, we got it, how many times do you think, do you? Well, now I feel like, actually, just because I feel like I got it or didn't get it, that's not necessarily the truth. Yes. You know what I mean? And I have to trust that if the people who are

creating the story, putting the thing together have got it, then... Right. They're not like... My insecurity, it's like if they only do two takes and they got it, there's part of me that thinks like, I don't think they did and I just don't think they know what to do with me. No, no.

I don't think that's true. They've made a mistake and they're just going to ride it out. How are they going to tell me? They don't want wanna waste too much film because they gotta get the other guy in. I don't know. It's fun. I'm just trying to figure out where the satisfaction comes.

I think I'm getting it. If you make solid choices and in terms of, if you're doing a comedy bit, I can know when that lands. Well, that's like a timing thing too, right? And also like Jeff Daniels, the only thing that I'm thinking about in acting right now is I talked to Jeff Daniels and like he's intense.

Yeah. Have you met him? I have met him briefly. And then, you know, he's going on, he's like, you gotta learn how to use your face. Film acting is all face. Wow, what does that mean? It's almost always on your face. Wow. What does that mean?

It's almost always on your face. I know, but what about, use your face? What does use your face mean? Well, I mean, realize that everything here, when it's on a screen. Is being captured. You have to have some control over it. Be aware, in a way, that you're acting with your face.

Oh, god. Sorry. No. Sorry. No. It makes sense though, right? It does, I hate acting with my face. Like if there's something like no lines, it's a reaction shot and like I've done the thing

and the camera's still rolling, I'm like, shit. I feel my face. I don't wanna feel my face. How are you with your hands? Fine. All right, good. Probably do, you know what? I'm fine. All right, good. You know what, I think I clench them a lot. I use mine too much and like sometimes I'm like, dude, I mean, but that's what I do in real life. Right. You know, but sometimes like I'm acting and there's

my hands are going and I'm like, that's going to be on camera. Your hands are going to upstage your whole head. I know we shouldn't know our own behavior so intimately. But I've been doing a lot of reacting work. It's like crazy. Like, because they're like, all right, I just... Isn't that hard? I think that's the hardest thing, reacting work. No, because like, at least, but at least like, it forces me to think about, you know, a subtle

thing. Using your face? Yes. That's all I'm thinking about. So what are, give me an example, like, of using your face. Oh, like, in a scene, there's a scene where, you know, the guy, Owen's playing. Yes.

Who is my best friend. I can't wait for this movie. Yeah, but it's mostly about him. It's a golf show, you know, he plays a washed up golf pro who finds a kid on a driving range, this cocky little kid who he wants to make Tiger Woods. So I'm his old caddy, so he wants to drag me on the road

in a recreational vehicle to do tournaments with this kid to get him in shape. And he's got the kid's mother there and we pick up another teenager. So there's five of us in this underdog family. Oh my gosh. But in the beginning shows, the mother is with us.

She's great, Mariana Trevino, Mexican actress and she's great. She was in that last movie with Tom Hanks where he plays the cranky guy, Otto or something. Oh yeah. Yeah. But the moment is like she's talking about her kid to Price. Price is reacting like, why is he doing this or that? And then, you know, she says, well, if you ever had a kid, you would know that. And he had a kid that died. And I know that, right? So,

you know, Dobkin, the director is like, all right, I want you to clock that. We're? So, you know, Dobkin, the director's like, all right, I want you to clock that. We're gonna, you know, I want you to clock, you know. Right. That exchange, she's brought up this thing. Yeah, and it beats with my face. You know, so I'm sitting off stage like... You know?

Working my face a little bit, trying to figure out, what am I gonna go with? You know, I kind of went with, and then looked at him. Nice. Nice, nice work. Nailed it. Ha ha ha.

But then when I think about it, but then you can get carried away, so I'm doing too much face. Of course. I remember in that show Entourage, somebody calls the actor, he just calls him an indicating motherfucker. And that is like on a loop in my head,

a lot of times when I'm doing like reaction stuff. When I feel like I don't have the feeling anymore, but the camera's still rolling and it's like, you just gotta keep doing whatever the thing is you're supposed to do. Yeah, I don't like that feeling where, like, you know, hopefully by the time they're doing coverage on somebody else

and you're just kind of, you're just doing the lines for them, you can get a little more self-conscious, you can disengage a bit. But there are times where I'm doing business, where I had to be cleaning up a table and I'm coming around and I got a line over there. While I'm throwing the cups away, I'm like, that line is, I remember it. I got 12 seconds to make sure I remember where I'm going. Take my time over there.

But you're right, they're connected to the feeling thing. Because I think if anything, I'm feeling that. Because I'm feeling a little better about the time I do spend on screen, on camera as being satisfying. Great. Because that's true. And I think if anything, when somebody says, you spend on screen, on camera, as being satisfying. You know? Great, great. Because like that's true. And I think if anything, when somebody says,

you know, I prepped and I put it inside, and then you just gotta trust it, I think that's real. Yeah, I agree. Yeah. And it sounds, I mean, we've heard it before, but then you really just have to be in the moment and listen. And I think not having preconceived ideas

about what's supposed to happen is a good idea. What about, how are you with the, with like, okay, so when did this happen, this scene? Oh yeah, I do that. Yeah, of course. So did I kill him? Yeah, is this after the bloody thing? I know, it's bananas.

So much also is, it's done after the acting. It's done in editing. It's done with the music. It's done with like the other actors face. Like it's not all on us. Like taking that pressure off yourself is I think helpful also. Yeah, no, I feel that. The thing doesn't like live and die on our faces.

It's like it's a whole thing. I also like when like, I don like when, there's this idea, sometimes I think this could be better, this bit. Yes. Sometimes it is. But a lot of times they're like, you'll lay down what they wrote. I'm like, I think we should try it like this.

They're like, oh yeah, go ahead. Sometimes I think they know they can just use whatever one they want. Yeah. But some people actually mean that. They do on this one. They want it to be funny. That's, yeah, great. And then if you have something to say,

it's, I mean, nine times out of 10, probably gonna be. So when you did Mayor of- Easttown. Oh my God, so good. Thank you. You won a prize, right? I did.

That's fucking exciting. That was exciting. Oh my God. I know, I know. Finally. Ha ha! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha She's got some crazy access to like, I don't know, honesty or something. There's a part in that show where she sees my son on the screen, like makes the connection, and she just goes like, makes the sound,

just like, ah. And I wrote to her, I was like, that's bananas. Like it was just so, she was looking at a blank screen when it happened. Like it wasn't, she had to like make the whole thing up. So I don't know, I think she's amazing. I think she is so generous. I interviewed her once and it was during COVID on Zoom

and I was sort of like, oh my God, I'm talking to her. And she's like, so brings you right in. Totally. And you're like, oh my God, this is the best being seen by her. I know, I know. She's incredible. Right?

Yeah, huge fan. And when you act with somebody that you respect and at that level, you... It ups your game, right? Yes. That was also really nice because we knew each other a little bit. Not deeply, but it was really fun because we had history,

and so that was really helpful to creating that. And then sometimes you just have a nice connection with a particular actor and you feel like you go deeper or something because of that, which is also like a little pixie dust or something. You can't predict. And a lot of times it's odd because Owen and I, I don't know him, I didn't before, but I get it.

We're supposed to play best friends, so we hung out a few times, I'm like, no problem. Yeah, yes. And you create a dynamic. Yeah, when you hang out before, when you take that time to do that, it goes a long way, I feel like. Yeah, because you understand how you as you

engages with this person emotionally. And if it needs to be deep, you can kind of choose to do that in a way, right? Yeah, you have that there. But you've done a lot of television, and you like doing that work? I've done a lot of television. Yeah, I do.

It's also where I make money. Yeah. Are you sad that there's not more film work? No, I wouldn't say sad, but I like being able to do both. Yeah, when was your first big break? I feel like there's been so many of them along the way. Over the time, but like initially when you were coming up in New York.

So I had a back to back, I did a Stephen King mini series called, oh gosh, now I can't remember all of a sudden, but I did a Stephen King mini series, Storm of the Century. Yeah. And I went up to Toronto for like three months, so that felt like a big deal, because I could put my shifts on,

could get somebody to cover my shifts at the restaurant, because I worked in a restaurant for 10 years in New York. Oh, because you're doing the real work now, finally. Yeah, but then I came back from that and went back to the restaurant and- That's rough, right? It wasn't great. And then I remember one time I was like,

maybe I'll, maybe I'll try to get unemployment. And I went to unemployed, I signed up for unemployment and then when I had to go to the, you know, city hall or whatever it is to do like, you have to do meetings, Storm of the Century had aired, like the night before, and people were like, I was signing the back of people's resumes, autographing.

I was like, oh my God, this is so surreal. And then I was like, I'm not doing unemployment. I'm just gonna work at the restaurant. It's all good. So that was the first big TV break. Yeah, so it was that. And then I did a movie, DreamWorks movie called The Love Letter, which felt like,

and after that, then I stopped working in restaurants. And then I did another TV show called The Others, which was, DreamWorks movie called The Love Letter, which felt like, and after that, then I stopped working in restaurants. And then I did another TV show called The Others, which was for DreamWorks. And then it's just been like, it's trickle. So Spielberg liked you? Yeah. Did you hang out with him? When we were making that movie, yes,

because Kate Capshaw, his wife, was the lead in The Love Letter. Oh, okay. So I knew them a little bit. Was that daunting? Yeah, I mean, totally. Actually, I saw him. I went to the AFI luncheon a couple years ago for Mare of Easttown, and this guy was like, Julie Anne, and he had the mask on.

He's like, I don't know if you recognize me. And it was him. And I hadn't seen him in like 20 years. I was like, I do, I do. And then he introduced me to, who wrote Angels in America? Tony Kushner. He was next to him and I was just like, mind blown. That was like a...

Did you do a lot of theater? Not a lot. I did some, I didn't right away. But then I started and I did like a little run of it. I loved it, but as you say, it's a ton of work for no money. And it's like, I want to do it again, but it has to be like very something,

particular, good, interesting. Now let's talk about Annie Baker. Yes. Because I love that movie. Did you watch it? I did, yeah. That's so nice. Why wouldn't I watch it?

You're kind of, I don't know. Who are you gonna talk to? I don't know. Janet Planet. Janet Planet. Janet Planet. Well, I interviewed her years ago, and I went and saw her plays, and she's kind of a really

interesting writer. Totally. Because she doesn't overwrite. She writes significant pauses in her dialogue, which to me is like, all right, well she knows exactly what she wants. Like she's got, it's in the scripts, like it's coded. I know. Like long pause, short pause.

I read that and she even writes a note saying, if you don't adhere to these, you're not doing my play. Meaning that's not the play that I've written. If you don't even like for the time that she's suggesting, if you like barge through, time that she's suggesting. Yeah. If you like barge through that, not the same play. It is, was the movie like that? No, I mean.

Did she have pauses in the script? Well, the script was only 70 pages. So she knew, we all knew going into it that a lot of what the film was going to be was like finding like moments between and around the words. That was her, that's the way she, she knew she had leeway. Yeah. Because she's directing and she's making a film. Yeah, she knew what the story was,

but she didn't need every detail of what was gonna happen on paper. Now, when you say she knew what the story was, I mean, I can see what the story is, but what did you see the story as? What was that movie about to you? When you say she knew what the story was, I mean, I can see what the story is, but what did you see the story as? What was that movie about to you? I just thought it was a beautiful exploration

of a parent and child that I've never seen before. The sort of, the combination of knowing someone so intimately, so deeply, and almost not knowing them at all is like a huge and common experience. With children. With children. And it's big. Yeah.

And so I thought, and I'm a huge fan of Annie's because I saw a bunch of her plays in the park too. I think she's amazing. I think she's so smart and so particular and an original. So I was excited to. Yeah, there's some, like that, the character, like, you know, when you live a certain life, you know those people.

Well, growing up there, I knew a lot of those people, knew people like that. Growing up like in Western Mass? Yeah, in Western Mass. And what kind of people are they exactly? You know, because there are people that live, you know, that decide to live relatively secure lives with jobs and you can sort of see that.

But then there are these other people that don't quite fit in and either they get lost or their aspirations buckle or fail and they have to figure out another thing that no longer enables them to really fit into society anymore? Yeah. I think, I think people, I think a lot of people are lost, right? And I feel like this, our story takes place in 1991, but that part of the world feels sort of unchanged. And I was there in late 70s and 80s

and with my mom starting to practice with herbs and my stepfather was a woodworker. So in- A woodworker. Yeah, he builds houses, carpenter, woodworker. Well, what was your mom before? She went to school to become a nurse actually, and then ditched that and was more interested in-

Eastern medicine or? Just more holistic approach, yeah. And she still studied like Ayurveda and all sorts of things. She did study that? Yes. Yeah. So it was familiar. So it was familiar, not her, because they were married,

they were raising a family, they didn't smoke pot, you know, maybe they were like eating lentil loaf. Like being a vegetarian used to not be delicious. I don't know if you know that. Well, you used to be very heavy. Heavy, a lot of like loafs and. Yeah. A lot of loafs and alfalfa sprouts.

A lot of sprouts. A lot of sprouts. A lot of wofes and alfalfa sprouts. A lot of sprouts. A lot of sprouts. A lot of sprouts. But I just remember people in their lives, some people that sort of came in and out of their lives. My mom actually is a very beautiful woman and would attract people. People would get a bit lachy with her.

Like an empath kind of person? Yeah, a bit empath and just she's very beautiful and sparkly and it just like people just are drawn to that. Especially if they don't have things going on. Right, but does she have good boundaries to where she didn't get exhausted by? I think so. That's good.

Yeah, yeah. Because that's sort of the psychology of your character in the movie is kind of like this chronic codependency thing. Totally. She's seeking to fill that void from outside with other people. And it's exhausting. Yeah.

But there is- You know what's funny? When you read about yourself, like I read two reviews and when people talk about how weary your character looks, I'm like, was I weary? I think there's a difference between weary and sort of like the vulnerability of not being able to fix patterns. Yeah, she is weary also. I just mean it's funny to read about yourself sometimes.

But it's interesting because it's, but like I didn't really see it as weary as much as, you know, when somebody is trying to change as a grown up or has to make a big life, you know, shift that, you know, you're in some sort of unknown thing and an unknown space. And there's a vulnerability to that that's kind of crazy, but you have to sort of unknown thing and in unknown space. And there's a vulnerability to that that's kind of crazy, but you have to sort of commit to this life that you built to yourself. Even though you're not entirely sure of it, right? Yeah, I feel like she's literally at this moment in her life,

just still trying to like put one foot in the other, in front of the other and hoping that it's gonna bring her somewhere okay. At some point she got the, what is she? She's a practitioner of, what is she? She's an acupuncturist. So like at some point she's like, I'm gonna do that. Yeah. And whatever the life was before that was not going great.

Yes. Yeah. Correct. Change paths. I don't know what she did before. But acupuncture is a big commitment. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, she had to study and practice. Did you?

I did, I worked with an acupuncturist and they brought Will Patton in and I was like putting needles in him on her table and then in the movie, it's like, Will, don't move. Yeah. Don't move. That guy's so good. He's amazing.

Like everything he's in, it's crazy. He's incredible. He's a really interesting man and to sit across, talk about listening, you just know like he's just paying attention when you're sat across from him. There's no difference in, you know, before action and after action. He's just all ears. He's amazing. And that character like barely talked. I know.

And you know, when he's howling outside, you're like, you know, that guy. I know him. Seen it. But that was the interesting thing, there was like, and I, the one moment in the movie that I think about a lot for some reason is when you're with, you know, your friend who's in the cult.

Sophie, yeah. That- Regina. Regina. Yeah. Great actress. Yes. But there's a moment where, you know, you kind of feel like, okay, she rescued her and she's getting back on. Regina. Regina. Yeah. Great actress. Yes. But there's a moment where, you know, you kind of feel like, okay, she rescued her and she's

getting back on. But then when she's gone and other cult members come to clean out the bedroom, and that just goes by. Like, there's no describing anything. Yeah. There's just people taking the pictures of her. Next. Right.

But then your character dates again. I know. Because you're that lost. Yeah, I think so. I think she's, yeah, yes. But you didn't buy into it. No. And that's the moment that gets me,

is where you realize when he's reciting his poem that he's a fucking child. Yeah. This is not gonna help. This is not gonna help. This is not gonna help the situation. And why would you? Yeah. I know, I really feel like there's a shift

at the end of this story, at the end of this summer that like, it's not an immediate fix, but like maybe they are gonna make little changes in their lives, maybe they are gonna be okay. Well, I think the little girl is great. She's amazing. And also those kinds of kids that are put in a position to be more grown up than they are going to be okay. Well, I think the little girl is great. She's amazing. And also those kind of kids that are put in a position to be more grown up than they're

supposed to be. Totally. Well, parenting was different in 91 than it is now. Wow. I can't even like, I can't isolate 91 as a significant. Well, that time, I mean, how were you parented? I bet differently than people are parenting. Barely. Right. That was more of the vibe, you know, and I feel like we've just gotten more and more and more sort of intense with our kids. And it was much more free flowing, I think, in the 90s and in the 80s.

Yeah. Well, yeah. And you're saying things like, I just, I remember my mom asking her if I could do something and she would say, well, you know, well, what do you want to do? And then you'd be like, well, I want you to tell me what to do so I don't have to live in this anxiety. And then she'd say, like, do you want me to say no? And then it'd be like, what a head trip. What's a negotiation? Forget it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm just, I'm not even going to think about it. I'm not going to go. I'm not going to even respond to whatever I was asking you. But that was, yeah. But that kid seemed like had been through enough of your relatively bad decisions to kind of find a sense of self, right? Yeah, I think so. Yeah. That's the other thing where you have these, you know, I mean, and I know Annie must have known that, that these are, as they're presented, they're strong women, really. But for some reason, they're suckers for-

Still making bad choices. Right. Yeah. Because of whatever. Yep. And what do you think that was? Or is? Well, I think that-

When you think of the woman you were playing, what are they honoring? I think that was also a different time. I think, you know, if it's- I think she was raised with the idea that you find your happiness or, you know, being complete with a partner, with love, and which I feel like, thank God, is not still, I feel like that narrative is changing. I don't feel people are still feeling like they have to, that being with a person is the end all be all, thank God.

Or kids end all be all, thank God. You can make a choice and that doesn't mean anything. You can live like how you want. Exactly. Yeah, for now. It's not expectation, exactly, for the next couple weeks. I know. But you're in England.

Yeah, but you know, no one's safe. I guess that's safe. I guess that's true. But I will be happy to go back to England and at least not have the like constant. Oh yeah, even in Canada. Barrage. When I go to Canada, right when you get off the plane, you're like, oh, it's not here.

Yeah, it's different. It's really different. Totally. Yeah, I can feel, I can't wait to go back and just my like cortisol levels can come down a little bit. Well, that's because everything's jacked here. You're kind of- Fucking jacked.

Driving here, it's like, oh my God, it's so intense. I know, I'd say that when I'm in Canada, when I do stand up up there, I'm like, you know what, the menace isn't here. Whatever that is, that psychic chaos, it just isn't up here. Yeah. And they come by and go, but we got our, no, you don't, just isn't up here. Yeah. And they come by and go, but we got our,

no, you don't, you don't. Not the same. No, nothing's like this. No, I know. And even England, I know people were like, well, the politics here. I'm like, yeah, but England's been through everything. My husband compares it to,

it's like depression versus psychosis. Right. Like it's not great in England, but it's kind of like, it's like depression versus here, which is just like, yeah, like madness. Yeah, but like in England, you can go look at a wall that was there before Christ. Yes, they've been through it.

Yeah, everything. And you feel that there, I think. Totally. Yeah. There's like, you know, there's just this, like, I just watched that Hitler documentary, you know, the six parts of it. Oh, my God. And just like two generations, three generations ago, Britain, England was deficit, leveled. Yeah. And there's still family memories of that. Yep. Here we can't even get through 200 years. I know. But I don't know what's gonna happen.

But it's not, it's just like, it's just the fucking this, the phones, it's making people crazy. I agree. People interface with it and they don't realize that this is like a hundred times more powerful than your dumb brain. And you're just letting it rewire it. Yes.

And I'm guilty of that. Of course. I scroll. Of course, everybody does. Now I think at least they're sort of making, they're coming out against phones for children. And in schools, there's at least some arguments for that, which is like, hallelujah.

How you can get those kids whose parents just throw them an iPad when they're four? I know, it's so bad. How'd you bring up your kids? Not like that. They didn't have phones until they were teenagers when we moved to England. My daughter was 13, my son was 14 when they got phones.

So now, do you get to be a citizen over there? No, I have a visa. Oh. I think, don't you have to give up citizenship to get- To marry into the other citizenship? Well, or not, I mean, I'm married. But you don't get it, you have to, I don't know, apply for it.

Yeah, learn things. Maybe give this one up. I don't wanna give up my US citizenship. I applied for permanent residency in Canada like about two and a half years ago. Just so like, you know, I could be the refugee with his papers in order. Yeah, you're ready for the big one.

Yeah, when I'm at the border, you know, in British Columbia or whatever is at the borders, well, Washington up there, you know, I'll be there with all the other LA Jews who are holding their pilot scripts and I'll have my... You'll get fast-tracked. Yeah, I'll have the nexus of refugee visas. But it's like you don't give up your residence, you don't give up your citizenship.

But if you live there a certain amount of time in five, like two years every five, you can work and get health coverage and be on the path. In Canada. Oh, that's good. Yeah, I mean, it's like, I don't know. I just did it because I wanted to feel better. Learned that I'd done some prep other than buy a gun. You know what I mean? To go down shooting.

God, I know. I feel sad though a little bit about that because I know so many people were making their exit plans and I just feel like, shit. Are they really? I mean, I know a few people who are getting their citizenships in other countries that have- Like Portugal, they're buying their way in.

Portugal, Italy. People with Italian relatives. Through family. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Where it's- Well, I think then you can carry two passports, I think. Yeah, you can. Yeah.

Yeah, well, I guess that's- I guess it's the idea of people jumping ship, even though I've already done it. It just, I find it a little sad and worrying. Well, I mean, there's only a certain type of person at a certain level of economic ability that can do that. True. My fear is it's like not that,

I don't think most people will jump ship. They'll adapt to whatever, you know, they'll just shut up. Yeah, I guess that's worse. Yeah. I mean, it already happens. You know, you go to some states, you're like just, you know, it's like the fucking 60s only, you know, you know... Don't mind the concealed weapons.

Amplified. Yeah. You know, it's just like maybe, you know, don't, you know, don't wear that shirt here. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. But I mean, I guess, I don't know why we're talking about politics, but there is, but to bring back, coming back to the movie, is that like there's, the thing that scares me the most is that there's so much real and good art still happening.

You know, that engages in, you know, taking creative risks and vulnerability, both in acting and screenwriting plays and theater and stuff, that sadly because of the way the media landscape is and the way that culture doesn't have a center anymore, I just wonder if it has the impact that it could. There's some part of me that thinks, I was going to watch the movie. How are they going gonna see the movie? You know, how is it going to, you know, bring a message to people who aren't, you know, kind of insulated in the type of people that would see that movie?

Right. You know, how's the poetry gonna work? I know. You don't have an answer? I don't, I'm afraid. No, I, yeah, I get that's a valid question. I'm sorry, you don't have an answer. Well, God damn it. I know, but I agree.

How do people even find out about certain things? I mean, we don't have to live in this, but like, you know, with the phones and just we're fed only the things that, the algorithm and all this. So your mind is not opened to other people's experiences, other movies you might not have seen otherwise. And-

Or any sort of collective experience that is beyond your particular bubble. Totally. Yeah, I mean, like I've been working on a bit about how, like if you're in a relationship, you're really probably in some sort of, you know, there's probably four emotional entities involved. There's you and your partner and your phones.

And where you're getting your emotional relationship, you might wanna think about it. Yeah. You know, cause like I can lay in bed and scroll for 10 minutes. And by the time I've gotten out of bed, I've cried twice and I'm exhausted. I know.

I know. I'm thinking about doing a tech-free day over the summer. You're planning that far in advance? Well, it is the summer. Basically when this job stops, which is Wednesday. Then it's like tech-free Friday. Like everybody, for me and my kids and my husband, like everybody put their phone down. Fridays, call the same home. It's so funny because it's such a drug addict thing to say. Of course. I'm just going to have a little.

Well, no. Or like, next month I'm going to stop. At least I I'm just gonna have a little. Well no, or like next month I'm gonna stop. You know, at least I'm gonna, you know, take a week off. Right, exactly. I'm gonna try this on Friday. Yeah, I've gotten scared about it because like I'm so compulsive with it and it's gotten worse. I find it's bad when I'm not at home, when I'm working because I'm lonely also. Like you have more time to yourself. And it's also like when you spend so much time not with your people after a while, like cumulatively, it's, I'm suddenly, it was great in my twenties, even thirties and now I'm like,

am I having another fucking dinner out by myself? But what about- And I like my company. I'm very, very happy on my own. I love like my own time, but it just, but there's an accumulation of just like new cities. But what about your head? I mean like- My giant head. We're coming back to that.

What do you mean? I mean like, because I'm experiencing that, the detachment, right? And I don't mind being alone. I travel a lot, but I don't usually stay away for this long, you know, from just the patterns of my life. Yes. And then, like, I find that my brain starts like, oh, let's go over it. Let's look back. You know, who are we?

Like why are we here? Well, not we as a collective. What about this? No. Me. Right. Right. What, you know, what is your life?

Yeah. But I think probably if you have kids, it's a little more substantiated, but like I get a little drifty. Yeah. And then like, I'm like, oh, I gotta fix that. I know. I gotta do that. But you don't, but that's how it makes you feel.

It's wild. Yeah. Yeah, that's why like I immediately, I'm like, I have to buy all the things up here. And you realize how small your life is, like all you need is a coffee cone and some chickpeas. Yeah. And a place to get-

And a cheese grater. Oh, no, you're vegan, so you probably don't want that. I'm vegan right now. But no, but like, just these basic weird things. You really realize how small your life is. When you travel somewhere else, do you have to set up? I used to love Whole Foods. I don't anymore.

But when I would go to other cities, Whole Foods would be my happy place. I just like in Atlanta. I'd be like I'm home. I do that too. I was so excited to find the good Whole Foods in Vancouver. Like I went to one near me. I'm like, this is not a good situation. They don't have all the stuff. It's not and there's some stuff I don't recognize. Yeah, and but then I found out there's another one across the bridge And I'm like I walk in I'm like, I walk in and I'm like, okay. Here we go. This is all familiar. The people look a little different. They're close to what I'm used to. Yeah, you look for those things. All I think about is, you know, nicotine and food.

Because I'm back on the nicotine thing. I don't know how that happened. Do you ever smoke? Because I'm back on the nicotine thing. I don't know how that happened. Did you ever smoke? I did. Yeah. For a minute. You're hiding something. No, I did.

I didn't start until like, well, I quit drinking. And then I used to like dabble with cigarettes, but I never was like a smoker smoker. And I worked in restaurants in New York and all the waiters would be smoking. I'd be like at the computer and they'd be like blazing cigarettes at the grid and I wasn't. Yeah.

And then when I stopped drinking, I did smoke for a little bit. And then I had to go to a hypnotist to stop. Really? In Boston or New York? Here. Oh, here. In LA. And it worked?

It did. Oh. Yeah. Yeah, I haven't smoked in years, but I do like something. Of course. Can we not be sober for a second? Can we have some? So shaky, the sober thing, totally with nothing. But well, the loneliness thing is it's real.

I don't usually when I'm here, like I like being by myself. Same. But then when you really, there's something about not having the multitasking life of just doing shit around your own house where you're like, ugh, watching a lot of TV, but that's where you get into the phone,

you do the scrolling. Yeah. For me, it's always like, oh, they saved a cat. I know, I know, or someone's reunited with his father after 30 years, forget it. Or like, that guy couldn't have lived. I know, it's a nightmare. Yeah, yeah, and now I'm noticing

how many of them are just fucking fake. What do you mean? Yeah, sorry. A lot of them are fake. So you know it's gonna make it easier for me to put the phone down on Friday. Well then, good. I saw a shark save a turtle,

and I was so excited about it. He pushed a turtle to the boat, because it had a net around it, and then someone was like, nope, that's a mashup of two or three videos. And I'm like, God damn it, jerked me around. There you go. That's what it is now, right?

There's a lot of that. People making stuff up. A lot of that going on. You want to believe. So this project and then what? You're going to be done, how long are you here? Wednesday, I mean, I leave in a couple of days. Are you psyched?

Yes. Do you not like LA? Do you not like show business town? No, no, no, no, no. Got friends here? Wednesday, I mean, I leave in a couple days. Are you psyched? Yes. Do you not like LA? Do you not like show business town? No, no, no, no. Got friends here? I do. That's been actually the nice thing. I've reconnected with people that I haven't seen

in a long time and been able to see them. That's been lovely. I did a BBC series before this in Cardiff, Wales, and so I've just been away a lot this year. Oh, yeah. And that's not normally, that's not been my experience. And so I just miss, I miss my family desperately. Do they come out?

They did, they came and I went back twice, but it's still just, it's just the like, it's that thing of like one show would have been fine, either show would have been fine, but the back to back thing, I just feel like I've missed this whole school year. Right. And it feels bad, because they're teens

and they're only around for a few more in the house, like school thing for a few years. I don't know how you guys do it with kids. It's really hard. I was concerned this morning whether my cats would know me or not. That's all I got to deal with, I got no kids. Yeah, of course they do.

As much as you can recognize excitement in a cat. Right, they're happy to see you. For a second. And then it's just back to usual. But it's just, they're not dogs. excitement in a cat. Right. Very happy to see you. For a second. Aww. And then just back to usual. It was like. But it's just the, they're not dogs. You just, you have to project a lot onto cats. Yeah, I know I had one when I was growing up.

Yeah? You don't have any pets now? No, it's too hard. And your husband's an actor? Yeah. How's that? Good. I mean, it's good and challenging. Yeah. Yeah. Do you, have you ever worked together? We met on a job. Oh. On a, on a know. Yeah. Do you, have you ever worked together?

We met on a job. Oh. On a pilot that did not get picked up. Yeah. Called Marriage for HBO. And how are you now with like, do you, like I could never really pursue acting because I just couldn't handle the, you know.

What do you mean? Aren't you pursuing acting? Yeah, but I'm 60. Yeah. So it kind of came about later. I always wanted to do it, but I didn't set out to do it. Yes, yes. I kinda did, but I just couldn't handle

the rejection or the auditioning or reading other people. I'm like, how is this something someone would say? Yes, yes. Yeah, okay, all that. But like at some point, you developed a pretty tough skin around that or what? I guess, I don't know. I must've. It seems like people who just know it? I guess, I don't know, I must have.

It seems like people who just know it's a job, they're just kind of rolling through it. I always thought like, okay, if I did good work in the audition or I felt good about the audition, then like I could be disappointed, but it wasn't a reflection on me if I didn't get the job. Oh, because you knew that you'd show that. I mean, yeah, I didn't always,

I didn't always feel good after an audition, but that was sort of the goal. And I felt like I'm going to work with the people who want to work with me. That's who I want to work with. Yeah. I don't know. I had some sort of mental.

Yeah, yeah. Are there people you want to work with now? Yeah. Like who? Yorgos, of course. You'd be good in one of those movies. I know. We should tell him.os, of course. You'd be good in one of those movies. I know, we should tell him.

Yeah, tell him. Inaritu, I think he's amazing. Oh, yeah. Did you watch Triangle of Sadness? What's that? Yes. What's his name? Yes, I don't know his name. Wra, oh, it's so bad and my memory is awful,

but Triangle of Sadness was my favorite movie that year. I think he's amazing. Yeah. Yeah, you could bring the heaviness. I bring the heaviness for days. Please, please, can I just show up and giggle somewhere? That's maybe my next job. Yeah, do a broad comedy.

Love it. No, you don't want to do that. No, maybe not. No, something in the want to do that. No, maybe not. No, something in the middle though. Yeah, no, your gift is the... I thought Janet was funny though. There's moments of humor in there. It's not a comedy also.

I mean, the movie, not necessarily. No, there's definitely moments of comedy in there. Did you see it in theater or home? No, I had to watch it on a screen. Right. I feel like it benefits from a theater viewing because I feel like, I think all movies do actually, but I've had this before where it's like you get permission

or like that shared experience sort of informs what you're watching. It happened with August Osage County, speaking of Tracy Letts. Yeah, you were great in that too. That's a hell of a play. Thank you. That play was amazing.

And so it premiered at the Toronto Film Festival and like the audience was howling, laughing, because Meryl's hilarious in it. That character's hilarious. Yes. And then, but then I think when you watch it at home, I had a number of people be like, that was depressing. Like they don't know. It's like you need to be sort of.

Well, yeah, because the comedy's woven into balance of things. Yeah. But if you can't read it as comedy, because there's no one laughing around you. Yeah. So did you get to know Tracy? Was he around?

He was not around then so much. He was there for the read-through, but he was doing Virginia Woolf on Broadway. So I met him at the read-through, which was a thrill, because I saw that play on Broadway, and it knocked me out. He's a powerhouse. He's amazing. And then actually, I was thinking about him

because we filmed, I played his wife in the Knicks show, winning time, and we filmed in Pasadena. So I was over, I was just thinking about him a few minutes ago. Like when he acts, it's like, like that scene, did you see Ford versus Ferrari in the scene where he plays Henry Ford III? I didn't, I didn't.

And they take him for a ride in that Corvette and he's just crying. Okay. Is he face acting? Yeah. I didn't, I didn't. And they take him for a ride in that Corvette and he's just crying. Okay. Is he face acting? Yeah, gotta be aware. It's all about the face. It's all in your face.

Good talking to you. Nice talking to you, thank you. ["Jannet Planet"] Janet Planet is playing in theaters now and I love talking to her. Hang out for a minute, folks. I'm Sarah Milroy, director of the McMichael Canadian Art Collection in Kleinberg. If you love impressionism, you'll love what we have on view this summer at the Gallery. River of Dreams Impressionism on the St. Lawrence features more than 150 sublime works by some

of Quebec's most beloved artists. Join us for a journey down the St. Lawrence and see how Impressionism flourished in this country a century ago. Buy your tickets today at mcmichael.com, home to the art of Canada. Working in the trades is intense. It can be stressful and painful. Some guys use drugs and alcohol to cope. But when we ask for help, we see someone struggling with addiction.

Our silence speaks volumes. See how you can help or get help at Canada.ca slash ease the burden. A message from the Government of Canada. To hear more of my conversation with Monday's guest, Paul Scheer, sign up for the full Marin. We've got another half hour of conversation between me and Paul posted exclusively for subscribers. Again, I had a great experience with Nick Cage. When I was working with him, he would do things where he'd be like, ah, I was over at the Home Depot this weekend

and I was buying some paint and I was like, and I'm just trying to be, oh great, and talking to him. And then the director's like, action. And I'm like, oh, you were acting. Like, you were playing this character, talking about going to home. So I was so lost at certain points. I'm like, but then he would talk to me about his son, which I knew was real.

But then sometimes we're talking to his character. And I'm like, I just never knew what footing I was on. I was like, I'm just going to keep it in this level, where I'm just going to be always friendly asking questions, but I don't know if this is Nick or this is this guy. To sign up for the full Marin and get bonus episodes twice a week, go to the link in the episode description

or go to WTFpod.com and click on WTF+. And a reminder before we go, this podcast is hosted by A-Cast. I'm gonna play Rolling and Tumbling again. I think you have to revisit it. So So So So So I'm gonna be a good boy. So I'm gonna be a good boy. Boomer Lifts, Monkey and La Fonda, Cat Angels everywhere.