WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 1649 - Josh Homme

Episode Date: June 5, 2025

Josh Homme manifested an 18-year-old dream to perform a Queens of the Stone Age concert in the Catacombs of Paris. Josh tells Marc why it was such a meaningful undertaking two years after he survived a bout with cancer. They also talk about his collaborations and friendship with Iggy Pop, the 2015 terrorist attack during an Eagles of Death Metal concert, and the difference between giving up and giving in. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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You searched for your informant, who disappeared without a trace. You knew there were witnesses, but lips were sealed. You swept the city, driving closer to the truth, while curled up on the couch with your cat. There's more to imagine when you listen. Discover heart-pounding thrillers on Audible. Alright, let's do this. How are you? What the fuckers?

What the fuck buddies? What the fuck, Nick? What's happening? I'm Mark Maron. This is my podcast. WTF? How's it going? Okay, how are you?

I know. I know. I, know, I know. I understand, believe me. I understand how you're feeling. But I'm around and I'm still having the good talks. I mean, today I talked to Josh Homme and it was crazy. It was crazy. I hadn't talked to him in a while.

He's been on before and it was kind of crazy the last time. But you know, it's like people who do things, who create things, he took the Queens of the Stone Age with down into the catacombs in Paris with acoustic instruments and did one of the most stunning a bunch of songs that I've ever seen shot. And it's crazy.

And it's like, where does that come from? What do you, I mean, what, then he'd always wanted to do it. And, you know, obviously he's an interesting guy that's been through a lot of stuff and seriously a fairly expansive and amazing artist. And, but I was, you know, they sent me this stuff. The, his person was like, you know,

they just did this thing in the catacombs. I'm like, what? And no one's ever been allowed down there. And just the inspiration and the need to make it happen. Took a lot of years, but isn't that amazing? Isn't that what we're supposed to be doing? You know, there's been a lot of revelations over the last few days, and I am grateful and amazed

at the feedback and feelings that are coming at me because of our announcement that we're winding the show down over the next few months, and it's very moving it's very moving and there's, there's certainly a sadness to it. And we're not going to make every one of these episodes a reflection on the decision, but boy, I didn't know it had, it would have ripples around the world. And I know, look, I appreciate the part I play in everyone's life and I, I appreciate the part you play in my life. And I'm just going to keep going going here but it's all very exciting. But there is, look, I acknowledge the void and it's weird because we talk about the void

in a general sense that you know everyone's got a void that they're trying to fill at least those of us who know what I'm talking about which is most of you. You know you can't stop moving or thinking or dancing around the edge of this inner void that, you know, there's plenty of solutions, you know, you've got the God-sized whole idea, which is not the one I go with, but it's there, you know, and when you make a big decision in your life or you change your life dramatically or you You know you realize that that something is going to be missing it becomes a little more difficult to not acknowledge and

You know wrecking with the void the void you know it usually you're dancing around the edge and then all of a sudden something happens in your life and in your you're just sitting on the edge and you're dancing around the edge and then all of a sudden something happens in your life and you're you're just sitting on the edge and you're kind of you know inching a little bit toward you're kind of tempting yourself to to fall into that void but I had this realization thanks to you folks and and just thinking about it was an interesting thing. All right so the night before I told you guys what was up, I didn't know how to feel, you know, and I was alone in my house,

and I knew I was going to sort of kind of lay this on you on the precipice of doing it. I had interesting feelings, you know, it's like, it's not quite like a breakup, but it's just a slow sort of, a slow farewell. But I felt things, you know, I was on that void or that feeling or that like, what's going to happen? Where am I going to go? And I realized like, you know, the void is, it can be anything, you know, it's a slight shift to see it as like a despairing, bleak, terrifying black hole of ill-defined but not good. Or you can see it as this world of possibility, you know, maybe even happiness.

That when you take an element out of your life or you're preparing to do that or whatever, it's horrifying and it's painful. But on the other side of that, all of a sudden you open up the life to other possibilities, whatever they may be, whether they're professional or personal or just space. But there is an elevating feeling to that. But it's grounded in all the things, sadness, terror, the things.

But I had another realization the other day that I think I'll share with you because yesterday I interviewed Sarah Sherman from SNL. And I always wanted to talk to her, because I think she's a true blue weirdo who does unique shit. And I just didn't, I don't really know her. And, but you know, I'm a fan.

And, you know, we had a great conversation. You'll hear that whenever we put it up, but it was truly one of the beauties. But she came over with a friend, her best friend, I think her name was Ruby. And Ruby hung out, you know, out on the porch while Sarah and I talking about when, then after the conversation, I went out there and I noticed Ruby, and she's got to be in her early thirties or whatever. She's reading Falkener and not just Falkener, but the Sound and the Fury.

Right. And this is a book that kind of changed my entire life somehow. And I was just so thrilled. I was like, oh my God, someone's reading The Sound and the Fury. A young person is like, you know, is in The Falkner. And I kind of, I lit up and I was like, which section are you on? Are you on the Benji section? Where are you at? Are you with, and she said she's on the Quentin section.

I'm like, oh, Quentin, doesn't end well for Quentin. And then, you know, my brain just lit up. And I was like, you know, we started talking about Faulkner. They had both read Absalom Absalon, and they were just discovering this guy, the greatest writer ever. And then, you know, somehow or another, we got to Bruce Wagner,

and you guys know that I'm a Bruce Wagner freak. And then I'm like showing them my Bruce Wagner books. And then I told her about this book that I had in college by this guy named Clanth Brooks, who was like the Faulkner critic guy. And it was just this feeling of being lit up by talking to people that excite you in terms of what you're interested in

and what things light you up or just to engage on that level, which is something I've done here for years, but it's available to you. It's available to you out in the world. And it's something that is of primary importance in the world we live in and in the lives that we live isolated on our phones, afraid, full of weird panic

and not really knowing what's gonna happen. We live isolated on our phones, afraid, full of weird panic and not really knowing what's gonna happen. But if you have those people, like my buddy Sam Lipsight and I, we talk probably every day on the phone. He's in New York. But you have to have that these conversations I've had in here, but in life, in life, to pursue the conversations

that excite you and just trigger your passions, trigger your creativity, trigger your understanding of the world, make you laugh. I mean, I know maybe it's a tall order, but those people in your life are essential and they've always been essential to me. And I think there's something about me that some of you have gleaned.

Yeah, I was kind of a lost wandering soul for a lot of my life. Kind of, I had a very ill-defined sense of self, and the way I defined that for a good chunk of it, creatively, was through anger. But I was always looking for people to show me the way, to give me the answers, to give me a new perspective, to make me laugh, to make me think, to blow my mind with creativity, to turn me on, whatever it is that that pursuit in life and then to try to hold on to those

relationships that continue to give you that are just essential. And I think that there's something about being isolated and being locked into patterns or locked into your phone or locked into beating the shit out of yourself or locked into fear or locked into a kind of a despair or stifled creatively. It's like, I mean, there are people out there that know how to talk and there are people out there

that like what you like and there are people out there that can spark that excitement about art, about life, about, you know, try to stay away from the politics because that never leads to a good place. But just the creativity and the soul nourishing engagements of other human beings is fucking essential. And if there's anything that I've learned from doing this show, it's that.

But I also have it in my life and now will kind of, make sure I nurture those relationships so you don't fall into that void. You don't sit at home alone on the edge of it, wondering if it's going to suck you in. So look, folks, as I said, Josh Homme is here today, front man of the Queens of the Stone Age and also the band's Kyus. Kyus, the best, the Eagles of Death metal. He was on the show back in 2013 talking about the near-death experience he had after a MRSA infection. Also, the first three episodes of the series Stick are now on Apple TV+.

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Yes. Yes. Oh my God. And all the previous guests and people in my business have been reaching out and congratulating me and Brendan and saying what an amazing run it's been and what we've contributed. And you know, I don't know, man.

I feel okay. I feel like the void is filled with possibility and I've been re-energized to nurture and pursue relationships with people that bring a lot to my life. And I don't know, I hope you do as well. And I've been doing a lot of comedy. It's very funny you know when I when I feel a loss or pain or or a

period of sort of floating like I just lean in and I just go hit the stage go to the comedy store and Get up there and kind of yammer, but I'm sort of in a different zone right now I'm kind of kind of grounded in zero fucky. It's kind of good to be zero fucky, and just speak your mind. I've been kind of going at the, kind of actively kind of trying to wrap my brain around the idea of the manosphere,

and what that means to culture. Obviously, I've done that for years, I think probably ahead of anyone calling it the manosphere and what that means to culture. Obviously, we have done that for years, I think probably ahead of anyone calling it the manosphere. But it's a very odd thing, these just yammering men behind microphones, spending a lot of time talking about how they think women should be or what a woman's role is, and to the point where it's obsessive.

And sometimes I think, why don't you take the women out of the equation and just fuck each other already? Just do it. Do us all a favor. Let it go. I mean, there are dudes that I read yesterday that are shaving their eyelashes off because it's too feminine. I mean, they're doing jaw exercises to make their jaws more pronounced.

And they're flying to Turkey to get hair transplants. I mean, it just feels in there. They're just eating raw meat and getting ripped. It feels like they're just evolving into some sort of gay fuckbot. And I just don't know. I don't know where this all ends up. But I had this idea about, you know, the symbol, there's a symbol, an ancient symbol, the aeroboros.

I don't know if I'm pronouncing it right, but it's a snake eating its own tail. And it's sort of a symbol for totality, I think, for wholeness, for, you know, it represents a totality. And I sort of had this image in my head that I think that the symbol for the manosphere's totality would be the cock eating its own balls. I was so happy about that one.

I was like, oh, this is gonna be great. And then people were just sort of like, what? What is he talking about? Underwear, folks. Underwear. It's something you probably don't think about a lot. You just put them on and go about your day. I can tell you from experience that ignoring your underwear will no longer be the case when you start wearing skims for men. I got the five inch cotton boxer brief from skims and I've got to say they are definitely comfortable. You'll realize that you've been spending most of your

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Let them know I sent you. After you place your order, select podcast in the survey and select WTF with Mark Maron in the drop down menu that follows. All right, look. So this is a great conversation. I always like seeing Josh Homme. He's a very energized dude who just never stops working. And the Queens of the Stone Age,

Alive in the Catacombs is available at qotsa.com. And this is me talking to Josh. Your door to big deals is on DoorDash right now. And this is me talking to Josh. Yeah, that I don't even know where I got that Iggy pillow. But you know, when I interviewed him years ago, I was kind of amazed because I mean, Rollins, Henry said, you know, well, you know, have you ever met Jim? Right, Jim. And I'm like, I don't know what you mean, like well, there's Iggy and then there's Jim.

Yeah. And Jim is a very erudite, smart fucker. Well read. Yeah. You know, just knows the thing. Yeah, and it was funny because he came over, and I didn't really know what to expect. And we were out at the old house where you were at.

And he's out on the porch, and he's like, oh, yeah. Nice day. And then, like, off comes the shirt. I'm like, well, I guess it's going to be half Jim, half Iggy. That's how this is going to go. Yeah. I mean, I think you want half Jim, half Iggy.

In my experience, making a record with him and touring with him and sort of trying to do a hail hail rock and roll thing where we're armored up in suits, you know, this sort of be the Keith to the Chuck, Barry, you know? I think you probably had an easier go of it. I would think so. Yeah. Yeah.

But that was just the visual attempt. I love that concert footage and the video and stuff. I never know how those things happen. How did you get chosen? Did you say to Iggy, like, let's get this down? No, it was the best thing of my artistic life, actually. It was? Yeah, it was.

It was, I got a text and it said something, and, you know, that phone got destroyed and I don't keep things. How does a phone get destroyed? I have a very checkered past. Phone got destroyed? I mean lost maybe, but destroyed. Well, they're the same in my book. Okay, sure, sure, sure. It got lost against a wall.

Yeah, it was completely lost against a completely different, a wall that was unknown to me. Yeah. And, but it was a text that essentially said, I think we should collaborate on something and that would be nice. The text had that tone. Iggy pop. It was from Michigan. Yeah.

And I lost my fucking mind. He's got a Michigan number? No, he had a, it was a, it was a Miami number. Okay, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know? I think he's lost many phones as well. Sure. So you lost your mind?

Yeah, I just was like, you know, I immediately romanticized it to the point where I was like, this means even my mistakes have led me to this spot where I'm receiving this call. I took it as rubber stamping that I'm headed the right direction. Well, it's sort of like from one of the immortals. Yeah. Yeah. Well, certainly because one of the originators, you know, there is no such thing as somebody else like him.

And I do think that, you know, I'm from a small town, like when I was growing up in Palm Desert, the whole place was maybe 30,000 people. Yeah. The whole space, you know. Yeah. And he's from Ann Arbor? He's from Ann Arbor. But you know, in my town, if it's like, man, you're one in a million. It's like, no, you're one in 30,000. And that's pretty good. Yeah, pretty good.

But then when you move with, you know, then you play a gig in Riverside, which is bigger, you know, maybe 150,000 at the time. It's like, you're one in a million. It's like, no, 150,000. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I believe that Iggy is actually a one in a, how many, there's like 7 billion.

He's the only one. You can just say he's the only one. Yeah, it's like one in 7, 6 billion maybe. Right. And it's so interesting to kind of like, well, he's a guy, right, he's a front man. So, you know, how he's gonna come off or what the kind of tone or part of the collaboration with him is it's all, you know, as a band,

it's like, that's a lot of it. Yeah. Because he just picks bands. Well, I think he has gotten to the spot where he can sort of cherry pick these. You know, at the time he was saying, this is my last record, I'm not going to do this, this is my statement.

Sure. And, you know, over the years, I would say, if I was going to play with Iggy, I would do this. It changed over the years. Yeah. And by the time we got together, it was the perfect time in that he was 69, and it was like, what does this 69-year-old rock originator,

music originator, music originator. What is their voice? You don't hear that perspective that much. And he had a lot to say. Yeah, so I can't remember, the album was all new stuff, right? It was all new stuff. But when you did the concert, you did some classics.

What we did is focused on the first two albums of his, which was The Idiot and Less For Life. Yeah, those are the best. And there was a lot of things that never get played in that zone. Really? Yeah, well yeah, like, you know, it's like Sister Midnight or this song called

Mass Production that I really love. It's just all these things. Dumb, dumb boys. Yeah, yeah, and so it was a chance to, and also I treated it like, like, you know, it's like, for a minute I work at the Smithsonian and I'm trying to recreate this thing and restore this thing.

And it felt like that was my role, and this is to try to be as respectful as possible. Well yeah, but also like, you know, lending, because tonally that stuff is, I mean, I think that, you know, the idiot's up your alley. Yo, yeah, it's deep inside my alley. Yeah. So whatever's gonna come out of you is gonna be

you kind of channeling something as opposed to mimicking it. Yeah, well it's fun to do a Rubik's Cube which is not your cube. Yeah, I bet. And just say, I got a side, it's all purple. But I imagine he's like somebody who's just gonna respond to the thrust of the thing was he picky about you know How you were handling the music? No, he you know, he was it was very interesting because and I mean this

As just as an observation without any judgment. Yeah, he's definitely The most loner guy that I know. Yeah, he's he's all alone what he's thinking and What he's gone through, at times, you know, I thought, it's like, the Stooges and Iggy have started and influenced your favorite bands in the world that got huge. Yeah. And it took 30 years for one of the Stooges records to go gold. And when- Is that true?

Yeah. And when this- Oh, because of the Nike commercial. And, and when. Is that true? Yeah. And when this. Oh, because of the Nike commercial. Yeah. With some things like that. Yeah. And, and, and, um, he has the longest time release of, I'm aware of where you put out records and people actively hate you more than they like you.

Yeah. And people couldn't stand the Stooges when they came out. And so it, it, and everyone, you know, it took so, it took 30 years for what he did to be recognized properly and understood. And that is a lonely amount of time in between. It's just, it just is. And, but he made tons of records.

Tons of records, but oftentimes Iggy gives his 100% but he'll collaborate with someone at times where you're like, don't do that. Don't do that. That's not... And so he's putting 100% on top of something that's 40%. But you guys made a great record, and the concert was great. It was just fun. And he is 100% all in all the time. Oh, yeah.

But it's weird because even Lust for Life, that didn't get the attention it deserved until Trainspotting really. Really? Right, the movie, because that was like a big part of that movie. And then I know the story of Search and Destroy showing up on that Nike ad.

That was in movie theaters, because my buddy, do you know John Daniel at Crush Management? No. He's a good guy. Yup. You know, but he was in publishing and he knew the guy. He was, he was just a dude looking at titles. Yeah, right. For a commercial.

Right. You know, on a catalog. Right. And he thought, search and destroy. I didn't know that. That's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Let's hear that.

Yeah. It had nothing to do with Iggy. And then it became huge. Good for him. You know, he had this thing, he also did... Because his voice is, you know, like this. He did some kind of voiceover thing for like a Sainsbury in England, and Less For Life was on Carnival Cruises,

and someone asked him, you know, you've sold your song to a, to some commercials. Yeah. You know, is that selling out and what do you think about that? And he said, well, I, I think three, I think three things. Yeah.

One, I think, uh, the, the, the, the original meaning behind the song exists and cannot be changed. Yeah. Two, anything that funds the arts is a good thing. Sure. And three, go fuck yourself. Ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha. So after working with him, did you guys,

do you still talk? Oh, yes. On the reg. It's funny because I don't call as much as I want to. And I think there's still a part of me that's like, I don't know, maybe just a touch nervous, even though we're buddies and I love them. And we've had all these, we've argued.

You know what I mean? And. Oh, yeah? What'd you argue about? Well, you know, I just, I think, it's not like a legit like, you know, boyfriend-girlfriend argument. It's just, you have disagreements and that's what friends need to have. This isn't an ass-kissing.

Like Chuck and Keith? It's not, yeah. Over the beginning of Carol? And it's not, yeah. But it's not my job to simply be his cheerleader and say yes to everything, and nor his job to agree with what I have to say. And so I think those kind of spats are necessary to prove your friends.

Yeah, are you gonna do something with him again? I mean, I'm always at the risk. Honestly, I could have done that for the rest of my career, just been in his band. Yeah, yeah. And sort of, you know, he was very gracious about, go ahead, you can pick the setlist, go ahead. You know?

But he did that knowing what he was doing. He trusted you. Well, I think so, I'd like to think so. But also he was like, I'm gonna do what I'm gonna do. Yeah. And I just love that. And even though we got quite close and are still quite close, I still have a great respect.

And meeting him and working with him gave me more respect for him. That's good, could have went the other way. Well, he is who he says he is. And this is, I was gonna say this about you as I was driving up here. I was like, you know, the thing about you is that you're like, you're like, I'm this. Yeah, yeah. I'm this.

Yeah, can't help it. Yeah, this is what it is. I push back on it, but I can't. Yeah, well, but you're fighting up a river that is your river. I know, tell me about it. It's my fucking life. But I think the coolest thing you could be is simply yourself, or it's like, as Oscar Wilde said,

be yourself, everyone else is taken. Yeah, that's a good one. And so I think my reverence for Iggy is rooted in that he is who he says he is. That's for sure. Yeah. Yeah, all of it. Where are you at with that?

How are you feeling about you? I feel great, actually. Are you who you say you are? Yeah. Have you arrived at yourself? I are this. You know what, especially, just had such an intense grouping of years these last.

Yeah, no, I can't remember the last time we talked, but I think when we talked, well, you had gone. It was a long time ago. It was, and you were just going sort of public about the dying on the table business. Yeah, and I've since been close to death again. What the fuck, dude? You know, that's my fourth time,

but I gotta say, every time I I always feel really supercharged and... I would hope so. Yeah, I mean, I kept saying this this time. I kept saying, you know, I never felt so alive as I did the day I almost died. I never felt so alive. Well, what the fuck happened this time? When was this?

I had a little bit of cancer for a sec. And... Which kind? Well, I kind of keep that one to my, you know, but I had, it wasn't the fun kind, but I was able to get it so early that surgery was the way to... Would you feel it or did it just pop up?

I was on a Christmas trip skiing with my brother and I coughed blood on the snow. Oh my God. It was like dramatic way to cough blood. But blood on the snow sounds like your next record. Yeah. Ha ha ha. Blood on the snow this weekend.

Where's that song? But it looked actually crazy, kind of cool. The goth side of it. Sure. Like that's, there you go with that. We did it. Yeah, we did it. Finally, finally, man.

But I was very lucky to be able to catch it so early that I was able to cut, just cut things away. Oh yeah, and they got it. Yeah, and they got it, and it was nice and early. How long was the recovery on that? Well, I had some complications with the cut. Oh, there you go. You know, which I, which, which, yeah.

Sepsis? I had a little bit of that, yeah. And that's the other one, MRSA? I had that too once. You know, it's a cavalcade of, I'm trying to do the hometown buffet. Things you get at hospitals. I'm trying to do the hometown buffet of

Oh my God, damn it. I'm trying to do the hometown buffet. Things you get at hospitals. I'm trying to do the hometown buffet of all the aliens. Oh my god, damn it. But those things end up, I'm intense sometimes, and so those things always, they make me pause. Yeah. And in those moments of reflection, I always end up feeling pretty thankful after that.

Well, I mean, does that, when you come out of something like that, because your songs are pretty almost operatic sometimes. Yeah. But, you know, when you come out of what, a second or a third sort of run in with death, because I know on the Catacombs video, there's that song about suturing the future. Right. Was that out of this?

No, that one's, it's an old one. And- Is that a cover of you? Yeah. It's me covering me. So it's an old- It's an old Queen song. Oh, it is.

All of them are Queen's tunes. Oh, they're, none of them are new? I don't- I'm not deep into the catalog. Yeah. They're all sort of versions. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, it's kind of cool to, say, what if we didn't write the tune the way it was and just acted like we're writing it over again. Oh, okay. But did you write coming out of the hospital? Does that stuff move you too? Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. I mean, we're doing some recording now.

With the big sound? Yeah, with everything plugged in. Yeah, yeah. You know? And it does, I think, getting close to things like that, in the moment, it's obviously, it sucks. And there's no other way around it. But the fear of it.

I mean, like, I mean, cause like, I know kind of moving towards this, whatever we'll get of it, I mean, like, I mean, because, like, I know kind of moving towards this, whatever, we'll get to it, the intention was to record in the catacombs, but I mean, when you have these moments, given who you are and what you've been through, do you feel fear? I mean, absolutely. The first two weeks, fuck it.

Well, you know, I've a lifetime of trying to accept things as they are and not be the last guy to hold on too tight to something. Yeah, yeah. You know, and wanting to be that way. Yeah. And it's hard to do. Yeah.

It's so hard to just accept something as it is. Yeah, because it's powerlessness. Yeah, yeah, to have to turn it over. I know that one, yeah. Yeah, and that turning over is a skill that seems like you have to develop and not a talent you're born with. Well, also, like if you have a certain disposition,

if you've been fighting something your whole life, or you just have that personality, and I have an addict's personality and, you know, the idea of being powerless or turning something over, it's like, there's a vulnerability to it, but it's, it's, it's not like you're all of a sudden in danger, but you just feel fucking, you know, soul naked. Yeah. It's that, that fucking nightmare.

That vulnerability where it's like, you know, you drain the ocean and there's what's left. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Of the exposed. Here I am, yeah, I'm gonna be blown away by a wind of insanity. Well, I think I've always been a bit of a, you know, if it's fight or flight, I'm not much of a runner.

Yeah. So I needed to learn to sort of, you know, the word surrender was a big one. Because I was always like, give up. There's no fucking way I'm gonna give up. You know? But someone tapped me on the shoulder finally and was like, no, no, no, give in.

And I was like, oh, no one's gonna say anything. I've been around for 40 some years at the time when I heard this. Nobody else was gonna say, give I've been around for 40 some years at the time when I heard this and I was like, nobody else is gonna say give in. Nobody here. You know? Yeah.

Give in's what, give in's like proactive. Yeah, and a little sexier, frankly. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Like I'd hang that on my wall. Yeah, yeah. You know, I'll take that, you know. Don't give up, give in. I'll take that, it's 5.30, I'm drinking mommy juice

or live, laugh, love and I'll put up, don't give up, give in. I'll take that, it's 5.30, I'm drinking mommy juice or live, laugh, love and I'll put up, don't give up, give in. So that helped you. It's funny how these little twists, these little turns of phrases, especially out of me, I don't know, are you being sober, is that where you're at? I'm not sober, but I'm not in any troubles.

Not spiraling. No, I feel- Into the fucking chasm. But it's funny that actually it's something where I, like, I probably, I'll go and have a drink socially. Yeah. And not, and just have one drink. Yeah.

Which is, you know, free. That's the first time in, you know, that's been my protocol for the last couple years. That's good, as long as it just doesn't, you know, like, you know, awaken the beast. Well, I'm sure there's a beautiful place in the world that I'll be thrown out of at some point. But also, you know, I are who I are.

I look at this as a, it's a bit like, you know, you're talking about, are you recording loud or is it catacombs style? Like, you know, you just keep doing something different because it's interesting and it's, you know. Sure, yeah, I mean, absolutely. You keep changing up what you do. Yeah, well, because it keeps you engaged with it.

Yeah. It's funny because I, you know, Dean, Dean Delray, our mutual buddy, he recorded a special in a cave, and then you went into the catacombs to do whatever you did, and you did the riff at the beginning of his special. Yeah, yeah.

For him, that was nice. But it's funny, because I recorded a HBO special last weekend, and I put a band together, and I wrote a riff, and I was was heavily my head was full of kias Head full of kias is a sentence. I haven't heard in a long time. I had a head full of kias, dude Mean I don't know if you can identify last time me Yeah last time you you I came here you had ZZ top te house on and I remember being like, oh, yeah This is gonna go well

Fuck yeah, man. That was like 15 years ago or something like that. I'll listen to Tejas. I'll listen to what's that? What do I got on my pre-show list for for when I'm performing? Oh, I've got just got paid Yes, I think from real grande mud. Yeah, hold on. Hold on. See if I can like, I don't know I can't believe I'm playing this for you, but I think it's important. Right? Yeah, that's great. That's got, that's definitely got some of that in there. Oh, I'm very happy. Yeah, dude. Yeah. Like it's funny about like, I don't know what that is. Like, I mean, I listen to Queen sometimes, but I'll fucking go back Yeah, I like it's funny about like I don't know what that is Like I mean, I listen to Queen sometimes but I'll fucking go back to I listen to Caius a few times a month, dude Yeah, really? Yeah, I like being the Vegemite on your toast. I Mean come on dude, so like now did you like I was wondering when I was watching the catacombs

like I don't are you close with your buddy from I was wondering when I was watching the Catacombs, are you close with your buddy from Eagles of Death Metal? Oh yeah, Jesse, yeah. Cause they went through that shit in France, that was horrendous. Was there any sort of connection to that, that drove you to the Catacombs? Yeah, I mean, my, yeah, I mean, you know, that, that, uh... That was in the 2015, there's a terrorist attack in the venue they were playing at,

killed a lot of people. The Bataclan, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And, uh, you know, I... Were you supposed to be there? I was, yeah. I, I, my, my, my, um, my ex-wife was pregnant with our third child. Yeah. And she was like, please, I was doing the American tour. Yeah. With the Eagles.

And I'd done some of the promo tour in England and through Europe. Our record was just out. And she was like, please just don't go on the European tour. I'm pregnant and we're about to have a kid any week now. Yeah. And so two nights before I was to leave for Europe, yeah, I found our replacement drummer and he just, no rehearsal came and watched me play.

Yeah. The last day was in San Francisco at the Great American Music Hall. Yeah. And then I waved them goodbye and they went. And it was, I think two or three shows into the tour. Yeah. Yeah, and it was,

it's a very, you cannot be prepared for a geopolitical event when you're in a, and you cannot be prepared for what? You cannot be prepared for what, you cannot be prepared for being on the ISIS website, which is what Jesse and I were on, you know. Was that after? It turned out it was before. I didn't know they had a website.

Why were you targeted? You know, they were going to do, they were going to, you know, they were going to do something specific to us, you know, that's part of the reason. That was all part of a calculated. But why you? Why the Eagles of death medal? I think that, you know, if I'm just guessing here, and there's a lot of things that we were told that everyone else was not told. Yeah. which I'll probably keep that way, but you know, I think they had an issue with the Bataclan

in the same way they had issue with Charlie Hebdo and the French president was- So the venue. And we were the perfect symbol of what was not to happen for them. Oh, so you represented American Satan. Yeah, basically. And the Batac Vatican has a history,

was it a Muslim holy space? No, it's a Jewish owned venue and had held many events and protests and free speech things. And was that why you guys chose it? We chose it, it was chosen because it's one of the good venues. Right, okay.

It's that simple. So they do rock shows. Yeah. Oh, yeah all the time and and the French president was having dinner next door And they also attacked the soccer stadium which was all within a small area And so it was a coordinated attack and just gunman Yeah assholes, you know, oh my god and so many people got killed. So many, so many. So, but your pals got out, Jesse got out. Not all, everyone in the band made it out, and not all of my pals made it out, and so many of my fans did not make it out.

And you know, I was at the studio with a guy who named B.O.C. Brian O'Connor, also played and toured with Eagles of Death Metal a lot. We were just recording some of his thing. I wasn't on tour and I got this call from my friend Scotty. And there was all this noise in the background and he was just, you know, saying, you know, they, you know, they're shooting. I got, that's not my blood, is that my blood all over.

And I was like, what, what? Yeah, yeah. Oh my God. And I, and I, so it was happening and no one knew yet. You know, I was getting the call in real time. And you know, it's funny in those situations how you just turn off. You know, you... Detach.

Yeah. Or you kind of go into a trauma, immediate trauma reaction. I'd quit smoking at the time. Yeah. And so, there was this other guy there that was smoking. So I just grabbed his pack of cigarettes, a box of, you know, a box of something I think was like vitamin powder and my motorcycle helmet and got in my car. And I remember looking over like, why did I grab this? Yeah.

What did I, what am I, and I just drove to my manager's office and we began the process of sifting through whatever the fuck that was. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Did they do any more dates or that was it, right? No, we actually went back. You went back? In fact, in fact, you know,

and I appreciate you skipping over that, having to skip over the detail, I would rather skip over lots of those details because it's fucking terrible. But one of the amazing things about my bandmates and the situation in Paris was that we went back to finish the show and I went back with them. Yeah, it was on, I flew out on Valentine's Day, right?

So to finish the show, which was in a very short succession. That's interesting. So they had gotten through part of the show and then the shit went down. And how long, how much later? So it was November 13th that the attack occurred. And then we went, I flew back on Valentine's Day.

Of February. And my son was born on November 13th at 11, 15. I had a flight on Valentine's Day at six in the morning. Yeah. And my son was born at 11, 58 on the 13th the night before. You left. And I left at six in the morning. Yeah. And my son was born 1158 on the 13th the night before. You left. And I left at six in the morning the next day because I was like, I need to, I mean, with the full support of everyone.

Sure, sure. I was, I saw my son, I held him, and I did, and I got on the plane and went to Paris and we finished that fucking show. At the venue? It was not at that venue. It still was still at the time, it's open since. Yeah, but it was still like an active crime scene. It was definitely still in the process

of being combed over completely. And you know, I mean, and doing whatever was necessary there. And how was Jesse's head? I mean, it's impossible to unsee what my beautiful friends went through. And so I know that they all, each in their own way, have had to deal with what is sort of impossible for

me to do anything but empathize with. Yeah, I can't even imagine. And I mean, I know it's like I had all kinds of just things that are unimportant to the story. Yeah. And that ultimately... What, reaction-wise? It just was hard to...

It was hard to have sent someone to my place. It was hard to get my head around. My main concern was bringing everyone home and bring them home in a safe way. Right. But party was like, I should have been there. It took me a while to like feel good. Yeah, sure. You know, and I've so many people that, which I knew and like, you know, it's like,

so you had people that were in the front row for years. Oh, so these were fans that you had a relationship with. Yeah, and it's like a relationship that's like, oh, I see you, I see you. Right, I remember, yeah, yeah. And I'm like, you know, a crew of girls that always would dress the similar and that met each other because of it.

And it's like, you know, I wrote down all their names and there were so many siblings, you know. And they're gone? Yeah, they're gone. And so it just took me, it just, those are the sort of emotional blockades Those are the sort of emotional blockades that you're just like, what do I do? The grief gets just, it's the other thing about powerlessness and about what your own place, you know, in the world is, and then how to deal with whatever, you know, grief and regret and, you know, anger, all that stuff.

In fact, this is the only time and the most I've ever talked about this. And you did this to me last time. I somehow you got, you have me to talk about, like, you're getting off drugs and shit. And it was, I, but I, you know, I think, you have all these strange, they're completely unique to a situation like that,

feelings which you've never had to deal with. Where you're like, I should have been there. But outside of that, none of it is about you. Like it seems like a- But that's the hard part too, is you're like, I need to shut the fuck up and never talk about this ever. Well, I don't know. Because it's my story doesn't fucking matter.

You know what I mean? I see what you're saying. Sure, sure, but like, and that's sort of contrary to your story always mattering, because you're the one who put the main character in your own thing, right? And you were the one that caused a lot of your own fucking misery before.

Sure. So now all of a sudden, you know, you have to reckon with something out of your control that involved your friends, your fans. And you watch your friends and your fans and the people that were lost. It's fucking terrible. You know, it's like go to shake someone's hand

which does not have a hand. And you go and you just think like, I, you know, you, and you say, I have no right to have any, I have only the right to have any, I have only the right to shut up and listen. Yeah, and be empathetic and gracious. It does not matter.

What I realized actually is that there are situations which occur and it does not matter if you like them or not. They are here and you must not get hung up on telling yourself if you do or do not like them. Right. That's interesting. Yeah. You must.

This is where I'm so appreciative of like my grandparents and my parents. They're just great people. Yeah. And like where it's like there's no time for you to be thinking about you right now. It's like, you need to move forward. Yeah, hardship is hardship.

Yeah, this is actually a massive part of everyday life for many people. That's right. Just you need to, this is a great time for you. You can feel and cry later. This is the perfect time for you to just be quiet and move forward, let's go. And show up.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Don't go anywhere. Don't you fucking move. So when you went back to finish the set, was that just like, that must have, at least you felt like you could connect and honor, you know, your fans, yourself, you know, and try to help in the healing, right?

Well, there are so few, it's almost like maybe there's near enough moments where you get to show who you really are. Yeah. And where the opportunity for you to be yourself and show who you are and rise to that moment. Yeah. And where it's like, are you gonna do it or not?

Don't say anything, just do it or not. Yeah. What are you gonna do right now? And so I feel really thankful for the opportunity. Like, it sounded a bit like Tony Robbins or something, but I really was like, I'm honored to do what I'm honored to do what I'm about to do right now.

Sure. You know? And so it really felt like I cannot, it's the same thing I tell my kids and stuff, it's like when you have sad feelings or you're, I cannot make this go away, but I will sit with you. Right. I'll sit with you. Sure.

I don't have to say nothing. I will sit here until it subsides and then we can stand up together Well that that's like, you know that you know, I said that about grief after you know, my girlfriend passed away is that Is that is that? You know all anyone has to do is is sit there. Yeah, you know, like people are like, I don't know what to do. How do I handle this person's sadness? It's like, just show up and just be present. Yeah.

And that's it. And whatever comes from that, comes from that. Yeah. But there's nothing you have to do other than be present. Well, I think you've nailed it. And oftentimes people do not know what to do. And so they naturally stay away or they make that mistake, which I think is ultimately.

Selfish. It's just a, it's a mistake and it's a mistake of anxiety and uncomfortability. And I understand the mistake. Sure, okay. Maybe it's not selfish, it's fear. It is. And it's like, oh my God, I don't know what to do. And I'm like, oh, I can't. And not wanting to Maybe it's not selfish, it's fear. It is.

It's like, oh my God, I don't know what to do. And I'm like, oh, I can't, and not wanting to face things yourself like that, you know. But that, it's the most human of things. It's just that the fact that- It's the most guaranteed thing, right? Well, death, yeah. But also the fact that there's no language around it and culturally it's something we all try to avoid.

And individually, our entire mode of existence is to deny that that's going to happen, or at least not think about it. But it's going to happen to everybody. It's going to happen to people around you, right? So because there's not any sort of logic or not logic, but language around it, people just freak out. Everyone's freaked out about death. The entire capitalist system is driven by that.

Avoid it. Eat some stuff, buy some shit. Yeah. Get on board. Well, you know, as somebody that I don't, I don't care about left and right and all that shit. I don't care. I'm a, as someone that's driven by escapism and the value of art, making your world

better and creating like an escapist moment for you away from all that. And then ideally that allows you to make a better informed decision because you've gotten this little reprieve from all of it. Yeah, but also like art, you know, the weird thing is that I don't know necessarily that, you know, the way you approach music and your evolution, you know, within it and sort of like how much you've grown over the years in terms of being an artist and also lyrically, it's not really, it may be escapism, but music is informed by feelings

and poetically creates a space of emotion for those who listen to it, that is really there is to do what they're going to do it. There's nothing like music in the sense that once it's out there, it could get people through any number of things. Yeah. And you have no idea who got it, where it went to, and what they did, how they used this tool.

Right, how it helped them. Yeah. Or what it helped them. Yeah. You know, or what it helped them process emotionally. Yeah. You know, so like, it's weird because I do draw some sort of strange line in my head now that we're just talking about it and thinking out loud between something that is inherently escapist and something that is, you know, a true expression of art or whatever it is that, you know, comes from a place that is informed by one's own struggle.

Well, I do, for me, the entryway to this escape is, the entryway to this, you know, journey of emotion starts with all the marketing out front is like, escape, quick, take a minute away. That's my way to get you in the door. I will turn the lights out and you and your best friends, I'll make the music loud and you guys can conspire together. Sure, sure. You can make, like, that's my, to me, that's the old like, PT Barnum side of this.

Oh, sure, sure. It's like, I will lure you in with escaping the escaping norms and trappings. Yeah, I get that. And then, ideally, that's just the worm on the hook to get you in, but now walk where it gets dark over there. Yeah, exactly. And that's where I am. I make music for the 50th listen, not the first listen. And I know that some people listen to music on the way to the bank, listen, not the first listen. And I know that some people listen to music

on the way to the bank, and that's not my fault, and that's okay. But that's not where I'm at. I want someone, when they're out there worse, to be like, I know what to play right now. Right, right. And I guess that's escapism, but I guess I'm drawing a hard line.

You know, like obviously, let's enter this world that isn't the world is escapism. But, you know, once you're in the world, like, we're going to do some shit. Oh, yeah, it's going to get, it's going to get dark and dirty. Yeah, but it's not mindless. I guess that's the distinction I'm not making is like, you know, there's some part of my brain that thinks escapism is mindless, but it's not. Yeah, I think that's why I love, you know, I always thought like marketing, that's what the devil would do. Sure, that is the devil.

You know, and, but I thought, well, okay, what if I re-engineer that to my purpose? And it's funny to me. That's the deal you made with the devil. Yeah, it's like, it's like, come on in now. You wouldn't, you know, I'll give you an idea you'll never remember. Yeah, yeah. All that shit. You with the face, get in now. You want to, you know, what I'll give you an idea. You'll never remember. Yeah. All that shit. You with the face, get in here.

Yeah. Right. And I love that carnival barking attraction. Sure. You know, I, I, because it has taboo and danger and, you know, but so much of rock and rolls about that too. You know, yeah, but that's really only the facade of this and it's not, it's a facade, but it's not fake.

It's just the front entry away. Yeah. It's a fine line between, you know, carnival barking, a snake oil salesman, and preaching. Right, right. They're, they, they, it's really the same guy. Totally. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Right, and so, because that is the way, but the other, the, the, once you've wormed that hook, and I also like the teasing and the tricking and the releasing of little things. It's fun to tantalize. Put on a show, man. Right, show biz. Yeah.

But it must end up sitting down around a fire, playing the best version of Kumbaya that you actually cry when you hear the fucking. Sure, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, that's like music's magic, you know? Yeah, it's the only medium that I know that's never wrong. Yeah. You know, you cannot like someone's music, and that's totally fine. But, you know, you show me the worst music in the world,

and I'll show you 300 people that are ready to die for that. Sure, they love it. Yeah. Well, that's... It's just never wrong. No, because it has... music is different than anything else because it exists in the ether and it never goes away. And you can just pull it out of the ether and it works its magic every time for you. Yeah, and much like ether,

it's got this intoxicating effect. Yeah, totally. Where you're kind of like altered by it when you really focus in on it. Yeah. You know, I mean, there is a feeling that you get that is akin to like leaving a first date where you're like excited and you're like,

oh my God, what is that? Yeah. Do it again, right? Yeah, and you can. Right, yeah, and you can. I'm like a first date. I'm like, you're gonna play this song all and you can. I'm like a first date. I'm like, I'm going to play this song all night long. And it feels like the first time.

Yeah. Until it doesn't, and then you wait a couple months and you kick it on again. I'm fucking, you know, I'm like, wait, this is Foreigner. It feels like the first time. Yeah, yeah. Which, you know, some people love that. Some people are replaying that song. I just wish Foreigner wouldn't.

Foreigner live at the wall. No, no, please don't do it to yourselves. I had a very bad moment with that, with, you know, seeing some of the reels of Angus now. Oh yeah. And it's sort of like, oh, come on, dude. Well, I do think this is the toughest thing for music is the how to age gracefully in a way that when I look at Willie Nelson, I'm like, fuck, and look at Willie Nelson. It's amazing.

Yeah, but he's one of the only ones and you get... It's the hardest thing to possibly do for music. Well, because his type of music is like you eventually you can sit down and play that shit, dude. Yeah, it's pre-olded. Yeah, it's ready to age. can sit down and play that shit. Yeah, it's a pre-olded. Yeah It's ready to age. It's been pre-aged for you, you know, and now like I saw who does yeah, I saw X You know Billy's rooms. He's he's just sitting right now, you know and and egg zine somehow or another You know is still kind of menacing and sexy guys like knock it out

Yeah, but and even like within the Stones, I mean Keith is doing okay. Yeah, Keith is fucking great. But Mick is sort of like, okay, yeah, you keep doing it, buddy. If you're a fan, you want to keep rooting them on, but there's a line cross for him like, it's getting a little sad, fellas. Yeah, well, you know, I think there's guys like Leonard Cohen, which where you saw at the end, where you say, wow, this is still just...

Sure, but he's a guy who stands still. And the music lends itself to it. But I think that's what's, you know, I look at a musician's career as something that's like planetary. It's spinning on its axis, and it needs to keep changing and preparing itself for that next thing. Well, yeah, and I think I'm probably being a little ageist. Well, not really because the truth is

sometimes you watch some old fuckers on stage and you're like, for God's sake. Yeah, like give me a rest. Please don't. Yeah. Can you hand out these don'ts I just made? And I get it because it's actually the most dangerous game for any musician is how will you age and what will that mean? And and will you baton pass into the next phase of your thing correctly? Yeah in a way that's still that's like that's becoming

Yeah, but I'm sure but oddly if they can still deliver the goods sure it'll lift it Yeah, yeah, you know, but there are moments like, you know guns is out there if they can still deliver the goods, it'll lift it. But there are moments, like guns is out there, but they're not as old as like the stones. They still seem to be delivering. And sometimes I just don't know, part of me, because I don't live in the world of that type of competition, but part of me is like,

don't you, you don't need the money. You can't need the money. So what is it? And then it's just sort of like, well, this is what we do. Yeah, I suppose it's, but it's like comedy in that there's not a real reason to retire. The reason to retire would be like, shit, no one's here. Totally.

You know what I mean? Yeah, or else like they're starting to go away. Right, right. But there's an exception there. It's like, you know, your relevance diminishes. Right. You know, and you? Yeah, or else like they're starting to go away. Right, right. But there's an exception there. It's like, you know, your relevance diminishes. Right. You know, and you're going to play smaller halls. Yeah.

But like Bob Dylan, like Bob Dylan, I think he just wants to die on a bus. Ha ha ha ha. I was, you know, I'm, there's worse ways to go. Sure, man. Yeah. But like, I think he sees himself as, like, I've kind of reassessed that whole guy recently. Yeah. Because I don't know why I didn't realize it.

You know, he's almost like this, you know, like, almost like a, he's like a savant, but he's, you know, he's a cipher. He's like this, you know, brilliant vessel that things move through. It's almost like a spectrum character. I think you also have to be willing to be a bit of a cunt, which I think he also is probably too.

Yeah, but that's just to protect his vulnerable genius. Sure, but I think you have to have a willingness to be like, no, no, go fuck yourself. Like one of the funniest, one of the funniest, yeah, the willingness to say no. So interesting thing, I never went and saw a doctor and right before the Iggy record that I made was the nine or 10 years ago now,

I went to this doctor for the very first time as an adult. And he was kind of a merging holistic, Eastern Western philosophy. And it was all of a merging holistic, you know, Eastern Western philosophy. Sure, sure. And it was all based in blood work. Yeah. Right? Now I know one of these guys. Was he down off by the highway?

Yeah. He put his sign down and took my blood. And then you go back and he's got a stack of papers? Yeah. Yeah, that's the guy. You've been there. I have. And he's like, well, this's the guy. You've been there. I have. And he's like, well, this is not good. This might mean we should do this. Did you have to do a shit sample? No, but I'm still willing to.

He told me, he was like, you know, I didn't know what type of blood type I had. And he was like, you have O positive, right? And I said, and I said, fine. And he said, does that mean anything to you? And I said, and I said, fine. And he said, does that mean anything to you? And I said, absolutely not. And he said, do you find yourself doing things for other people?

He's like, you can give blood to anyone, but you cannot receive it from anyone except O positive. Right, oh, interesting. So he's like, you're a universal donor, but you cannot receive anything but this, right? Yeah, that's your nature. I am a rock. And he, but he was like,

I think that somehow you are someone that has said yes to things that you probably didn't want to do, and what I want you to do is, my diagnosis is I want you to go home, pick five things you've said yes to and cancel them. Yeah. You know, and... And cut to your living in apartment.

Yeah. And cut to your listened to this advice and I, there were five things which I'd said yes to, which I just was not, just was doing it as a favor. And I canceled these things and a week later, Iggy called me. Wow. And so I, because I don't have any other empirical evidence, I was like, god damn it.

I have no choice now but to believe this motherfucker. Yeah, yeah. I mean, what am I gonna do? Yeah, why not? There's no other evidence based in what he just said. Right, but you know, if you break it down, that's, it's not, it doesn't have to be relative to your blood work.

Right. What do you got? Sure. These are just these nicotine pouches. I'm on everything now. I got the pouches, I got the ons, I'm back on the losses. I noticed you had a sticker over each nipple. Yeah. these nicotine pouches. I'm on everything, man. I got the pouches, I got the ons, I'm back on the lancet. I noticed you had a sticker over each nipple. Yeah.

The nicotine patch. Yeah, yeah, no, I got some patches because I'm tired of these. And you can't get the flavors anymore in- You have to go to a smoke shop. No, I know, but I know one that'll sell you the flavors. Yeah, I love that. I love that that's a thing.

But it's illegal. Yeah, isn't that why the good part of it? Do. But it's illegal. Yeah, that's why, isn't that why the good part is? Do you know where it is? Well, there's a bunch. There's, you know. What, they have the flavors? Oh yeah. They have like peppermint, spearmint and everything else?

Oh yeah. Oh good, yeah. I got one in Hollywood. Yeah. I got a guy. I got a guy. Yeah. I got a guy.

You gotta have a guy. You gotta have a guy. The fucking problem is, man, you go out of state, they're like five bucks a tin. If you go to your guy to get the flavored one, it's like 12 bucks. I don't give a shit. But I'm just saying, it's funny when I go on the road, I'm like, give me two rolls of the peppermint. But it's interesting, you're on the threes and you're pretty hardcore.

If I do a six, it knocks me out, dude. I want to keep the low milligrams so that I'm not yeah woozy. Yeah. Well, it's just so that I'm not like, huh? Oh, yeah, yeah, I'm trying to like not feed the monster beavis. Oh, yeah, but but I'm already there I'm on I did it. I'm doing them mid-set dude, and I'm a comic I can't go turn my back to the fucking amp and have a drink. No, I've got to be like I'm doing this I think it's great to just put it in. Yeah, I say look I'm an addict and if I can just have one little thing to keep the big empty away. I'm good Cuz like you know, it's like once the nothingness comes and then yeah

Then some people are like well, you should be more Buddhist and embrace than nothingness. I'm like, I'm not there yet. I'm at the edge of the void with my nicotine as my shield and my ego as my sword, swatting at nothing. Man, I'm more booty-ist. I want to get everyone to shake their ass. Yeah, oh, booty-ist. There you go. But, okay, so what I was going to say is that that advice is not, it doesn't have to be

relative to blood work. That guy's PT Barnum-ing. And it just worked on you. It worked though. What choice do I see? I've lived my life by sort of trying to notice the positive signs along the road and that sort of thing, you know?

Yeah. All right, so going back to get to the catacombs. Now, when you went and finished the concert in Paris, it must have been moving, but was there closure there? On some level? Did you feel for the fans, for yourself? Or? Yeah, I mean, you know, as I said before,

that realization that there are just things that you have to deal with that doesn't matter if you like them or not, they're here. And like I said, this is the most I've ever talked about. But I realized that the reason I don't talk about it is because it doesn't make me feel better or worse. It doesn't do anything.

It's just, that's just a sucking sound that's like, that is like tinnitus. It's just a ringing that I hear that if I look at it, I'm like, fuck. And I, so I try to just live with it. Yeah. And honestly, in general, I try not to talk about it because, as I said, it doesn't, I never feel no better.

It's not your story, necessarily. Yeah. And it's not my story. I, and it is my story at the same time. And I don't know how to explain that. And when I do explain it, I don't feel better. Right. But the concert was good, going back.

Absolutely. Yeah. It was, because it was something else. Yeah, totally. Yeah. It did not close or fix without what happened, but what it did was it showed the willingness of everyone who attended.

Yeah. I'm willing to do this. I want you to see my will. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm here. Yeah. And that's the most that someone can do. And we're together.

Yeah, I mean, what's the most important things other than your time and your energy? Right, and creating and honoring the community that was affected and also showing up for the community that you are part of and created. Yeah, and yeah, because you say things like, everyone's here, we could, you know. Yeah.

Well, so from that, is this desire or this winding up in the catacombs of the same city part of that trajectory? Well, it is because you start to develop, you know this from touring for so many years, you start to develop a relationship with cities and towns. Yeah, sure. And you start to have this kind of romantic connection

to these things. And sometimes it's a bad breakup of a city and sometimes it's just a love affair. Like my brother married his husband in Paris and that was a big moment for me. I just loved that moment so much. And the Bataclan. And then it was, you know, I've had so many moments in that city.

Well, it's a notorious city for moments. It's set up to do this thing and it works. And to be fair, I romanticize. I'm looking for something romantic to cling to because I don't want to, you know, touring and things like that, and it can burn you out and make you feel bitter and unappreciate what's going on sometimes. And make you a shell of yourself. Yeah, and I sometimes turn into an animal,

I regress, you know, because I don't know what to do and I feel lonely. I know, it's like for some reason, the loneliness, like even if you're only away for three days, you know, that second if you're only away for three days, you know, that second day in a hotel, you're like, who am I? Yeah.

What am I doing? Yeah, what am I doing with my, I feel like I ate too many edibles or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's just the worst. And you're just at a hotel near a mall. Yeah, well, but that's part of the problem and part of the solution too. And because it's all about outlook

and because the sacrifice of saying, why do I leave everyone I love and care for to go do something all by myself? And like, what am I, to stave that off. I need the romantic side of it. Oh, I get it. But you also get to that point where you're like, I like hotels.

Yeah, of course. I just why it. I just- Quiet, I don't have to clean up. Exactly, I just leave myself behind here. Quiet, but the romantic element. So what was your relationship with the Catacombs? Well, this is all connected is the thing, is that I remember seeing photographs

of the Paris Catacombs as a boy. Yeah. And instantly having thoughts that were new to me and that were like, you end up like so, and you can end up here and this is, and also instead of the taboo of death that I'd understood as a boy, it was like, the catacombs, nobody does that because they're like,

I fucking hate these people. It's a, you know, a mine which was dug for coal and things like that. And then with so many bodies and so much happening in Paris, they decide to move six million people there. What is the history? Was it different? Was it the plague and then the wars? Or like, when did they stop using it functionally?

They stopped. I believe they stopped using it dug out in the 1500s, but there's accounts of it dug out as early as 1300. Right. And then, in, I believe, 1700s, they start moving this overflow that's been piling up for years. That's, that's, that's, I mean, uh, and, uh, this just kind of finally come to a head. You know, you talk about floods and, uh, just like all the, everything that's happened and so they start to.

Stacking skulls. Right. But stacking them lovingly. It's not, it's, they're not like, fuck these people. It's people that are doing this with such a reverence and a respect. Yeah. And you know, because your initial thought

is stacking bones, that doesn't seem respectful. But it is. It's just like, you know, like massive monument to the inevitable. Right, the inevitability of death. Yeah. Which is which is life. So death is inevitable. And this is like on some level a celebration of the inevitable. But those of us who are alive, you look at it with awe, you don't look at it with horror. You would think it would be horror.

And don't look away. Yeah, yeah, you can't. You're surrounded by skeletons. And I think, well, figuratively, literally, and not just in there, and, you know, in what we're talking about too, it's like this need, I've just had this need, and I think I've romanticized it to help me look, it's like, what am I trying to say? That when things are tough, don't look away. Like, stare into this thing, you know? If you're afraid of 10 things, nine times out of 10,

if you look into this thing, you won't, you realize I don't need to be afraid of it. And that 10th time when you should be afraid, now you fucking know you should be. Yeah, that's right. And you understand that you should be. Yes. And I want the understanding. You want to know when to be afraid. Yeah, that's right. And you understand that you should be. Yes.

And I want the understanding. You want to know when to be afraid. Yeah, for real. And when to like, not, if I don't need to fuck with being afraid, I don't want to. And also somebody like you, who has like, you know, cheated death several times and, you know, had a certain amount of, you know, kind of self-destructive propulsion. Yeah. And, you know, there's no, like, there's no, I mean, look, there's something about death that is essential to, you know, certain strands of rock and roll.

Yeah. And you are part of that. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. You know, and while I think, too, that, that in the last bunch of years, facing a lot of, you know, I've lost a lot of people. You know, we're at that age where it's like you just. They start dropping, yeah.

Yeah, and in music they drop earlier, so they're dropping in when I'm in my 50s here, in my early 50s instead of growing old, you know? And going through lots of other things, which at the end of the day, it's like in the last five or six years, I've never grown so much so fast because growing is painful. Well, yeah, and sometimes it's like,

it also moves quicker when you get older. It's like you're growing, but like a lot of what's happening is, you know, a certain amount of zero fucks is taking hold. And a lot of stuff is falling to the wayside that used to sort of drive your life. Yeah, for sure. And it's a natural occurrence.

So that growing happens naturally, but also time is running out. Right. Well, but this is one of the great things, is when you say, I've just no time to waste, I must move forward, I definitely can't sit here and, yeah, yeah, yeah. I definitely gotta deal with this.

Sure, or you can be like, well, you know what, I'm just gonna sit here. But then there lies the escapist trip that I love too. But like, if you've got your shit settled and you wanna sit down, go ahead. Yeah, in the zero fucks given aspect of getting older. But so how, because like I'll tell you man, watching that piece in the catacombs

of you doing those tunes and not being familiar with the other versions of it, there's something about the ones you chose and also your sense of melody has gotten very sophisticated. So, you know, when you do that acoustically, it really kind of showcases not just the singing but like, you know, the kind of like elaborate melodies. And then like because of fucking, you know, dude, like, when Laura first sent it to me, I watched a few minutes of it, and I'm like, all right, well, all right, so he's in the

catacombs. And then I'm like, dude, just watch the whole thing. And I watch the whole thing, I'm like, oh my god, this is so fucking, it's hard to even explain the natural weight. That starts to happen in there. Yeah, right. But it's not heavy. It just is, but also the space itself,

because of low ceilings, anything where you can't help but see the ceiling, you know, there's something kind of, it's not mystical, but you know, you're beneath it. Yeah, you know you're down, yeah. You're down in it, but the sound was so good, all the instruments sounded good, but also just, there was an element that happened,

even when you're cutting away the skulls and all that, that was not dark. No, it's not. The funny thing is, well, there's a few things. One, it became a bit like improv, it became a bit like improv because you know what's the rule of improv? Yes, you say yes and. Yes and, yeah. Right? And so we hadn't, I think I had a little bit of a vision that it would be cathedral-like

in there and very echo-y. Yeah, yeah. I don't know why I have that all side point to no. It's like dead, literally. It is very dead inside the room. It was like my old garage because of the low ceiling and because there's so much stuff in the walls. Moisture, stone, the floor is wet,

but there's gravel on it. And also the bones are absorbing all that fucking noise, dude. Absolutely, and so what happened is you descend down the stairwell. That's like 132 spiral stairs. It's one spiral staircase. You just keep going left or keep going right. Excuse me.

And you get down in there and it became improv because it was when we did the walkthrough the day before. I'd never been in there. I just only have heard of it and dreamed of it and dreamed of it and dreamed of it. Oh, really? Yeah, because I'll back up a sec. This 18 or 19 years ago when I went to Paris, I had a day off.

I was like, let's go to the catacombs. The line was like three and a half hours. And so the impetus of this is like from an entitled spoiled place, if I'm being honest. I was like, how do I skip the fucking line? Yeah, yeah. It's funny. How'd you get permission?

It took 18 years, really. Really? I mean, too bad the French don't have a word for bureaucracy. Yeah, yeah. No. You think it was bureaucracy? I mean, it took forever. It was like, don't ask me, ask this person.

Oh, right, right. And there was a guy, the French, to their credit, they have all this great stuff on telly. It was like, they had a show called Album of the Week and you simply play your album, start to finish live. And it's not on anymore, unfortunately, but was on for 40 years. And the produce, one of the main producers

and directors of the show is this guy, Stephane Sainier. And he knew how to play Cupid to actually close the deal. And it's better that it took this kind of time. It's better that there were failed attempts, close calls that didn't happen. Yeah. You know, because when we got there this time,

we're sort of like emotionally ready to do this. Sure. So like an improv class, we went down into the catacombs. Yeah. And with the director, we're like, OK, we could do this. Yes, and we'll do this. We can't do that over here. But yes, and we can go over here.

And we just improvised what this would be. They only gave you access to a certain part, right? Yeah, I mean, we had pretty far far-reaching access sort of unprecedented access Yeah, you know and because we're the first people to legally play in there, right? No, they're right. There's lots of tales of so you could really produce it Well, so and but you can't plug anything in right? So we had an electric piano, but we had to hook it up to a car battery Okay, right. Yeah, so you have a car battery with fucking, you know, clips. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And it's like, okay, piano's working, right? And so, but what became really apparent is that, you know, it felt wonderful to, you can't have plans and then implement them, go down there and implement them. You are told what to do by the space. Yeah. We were not the stars of that show. I'm glad you were able to watch it all the way through because it starts to do its work as you watch the whole thing.

It really does. It really does. It's not MTV unplugged. No, it's not like anything because, you know, because of the nature of cordlessness and no electricity outside of a car battery, which doesn't matter, is that there's no way that space is not going to play a role. And it's the whole thing.

It's the dominant thing. Yeah, and it's not haunted, it's not scary, and it's like, you know, living, breathing, you know, people making art in a space that is like probably the greatest monument to reverence for the dead, you know. Pete It's the largest monument to the dead in the world, you know. Pete Yeah. And yet, you know, you guys are all finding, you're negotiating your space with that space. Yeah, and there are just so many weird discoveries.

Like, as you said, first of all, it is the dominant character in this. Yeah, but not in like, we're trying to, it's not a spectacle. No. It's all very intimate. It's not possible to, it doesn't allow for that to occur.

Right. And as you said, it's not sad or depressing. No. And it's not fun. Like we're tossing the beach ball around. No. It's intense. It's intense, but it's very, you know,

it's deep and it's, you know, there's a poetry to it. Yeah. And it makes your songs different in meaning and the way you're playing them for, that's the only time you're ever gonna play them like that. Yeah. Well, no way to recapture any of that. And there's no need to as well.

It's okay for things to simply be this right now and nothing more and nothing again. Yeah. And it also, even for picking the songs, we didn't pick sort of our hits of, it wasn't, that wasn't. No. And also even down to things like,

like I like the acoustic guitar just fine, but we've heard it a million times. So the strings and alternate instruments, like glockenspiel. Strings down there. Oh yeah, in that space, geez man. Those things. So good. And like down there. Oh yeah, in that space? Jeez, man. So good.

Those things and like. Ancient instruments. Yeah, yeah. In a way. Yeah, they are. Not primitive, but old. Yeah, but of that period as well. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And even down to like, John, our drummer was like, what should I play? And I had been to the hardware store. Yeah. And I was like, I just handed him a chain. I noticed that. That was great. And I was, I just handed him a chain. I noticed that, that was great. And I was like, try this, you know. Because like it didn't, like when I noticed that instrument,

cause you do, there's one shot of it, it's not an instrument, it's a wad of chains. And he's using it percussively, but like, it's not, you know, chains are associated with ghosts, but it didn't do that. It gave it a sort of like, ancient industrial sort of thing, like medieval. Had him two pieces of wood and I'd nailed a,

or I'd stapled a sandpaper. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it was like, try this. Yeah, yeah. And then I went and got Chinese, so I had him some chopsticks. And I was like, try this. You know, things you find around the place.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And because this is one of those moments where it was like, not just less is more, but much less is much more. And I think it helped to reveal words more. It helped to reveal melodies more. Yeah, totally. It helped to reveal melodies more. How'd you choose a song? We picked about eight things and it just became kind of,

like the first thing was a medley of two, an old song and a new together. And it started to become more about family and things that were emotionally driven. Yeah, yeah. And things that were about, like the suture up your future is about acceptance. Yeah. Like, I'm going to sew this up and let it go.

Yeah. And so it felt, and those choices ended up being right. And also we didn't, like you're hearing take two of three. You're hearing take one of two. Right. We didn't. It wasn't a whole week. No, it was one day and it was, you know,

because I again had a serious health thing. What was that one? It was a complication sort of based in the same of the surgery. Troubles I'd had, yeah. And I had a tear internally. Oh God. And so by a tear internally. Oh, God. And so by the time, four days earlier, I was in the, you know, two days before the catacombs,

I, we canceled our show in Venice, and I just said, you need to pull the bus over at the next hospital, I can't, I can't do fucking. Oh my God. And so I'm in the emergency room. She could have died in the catacombs. Well, but I will say this again. It changed the show because I've been working on this for so long.

And I was only two shows away. Yeah. And I started to get a fever. Yeah. So once, and it held at 102 for a couple days. Fuck. And I had this Italian travel agent who's amazing, her name's Sarah, and I said,

will you pick me up outside the emergency room? And so I took the gown off, got dressed and bailed. Yeah. And she took me to Milan. I played, I don't remember the Milan show, but I played in Milan. And then we flew to Paris and I was like, again, this was like, this is my chance

to show who I really am. You know, you don't get that opportunity, you know, to do this. And I had a cot, so I was laying down in between takes and I, and even, you know, the opening is laying on top of this altar, but I just crawled up there. I was like, can I just lay down while you guys are setting up?

And the French, he's like, don't move. What if we start, you know? And the French director, he's like, don't move, what if we start here, you know? And it was like, I could do that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I can lay down. Yeah, method acting. I could lay down. So these things just fell into place. And what it did is it added this,

it added this intensity to the music, to the moment. It was like, are you gonna do it or not? You know, it's very much what I would call a shut up and fuck me moment. Yeah, sure. And the other thing, another interesting thing that we did is that we decided to 20, 30 seconds before each take and after, no, he would say, action. And then it was just silence and everyone staring at each other. And then it was like, go.

Yeah. And those looks exchanged, then it was like, I'm doing this. I'm doing this. Yeah. And this is the, you know, I always love this about Iggy too. It's like, I always feel like he's seeing these moments

and sort of stealing them out of the sky and making them your moment. Yeah. This is what I'm here to do. Yeah. I've lived my whole life up to this moment, and here I am. And I'm going to fucking do it. Yeah.

And being, just feeling really alive and in that moment, I'm supposed to be here. Yeah. And you definitely, you feel it. And you feel that, you know, that is a singular thing, not unlike we were talking about before, that that is the only thing of its thing. And this moment won't last. That's right.

It's gonna be gone so soon. Clearly, surrounded by skeletons. Yeah, well, you know, the funny thing is that, like, the French love lunch, you know? They love lunch. And so everyone wants to break for lunch, and they go up, you know, to go across the street, they go up the fucking stairs, and I just couldn't do it again. I couldn't. And so I said, I'm just gonna lay down here in my cot, which was in front of this long, dark hallway

with one light at the end. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I thought, I'm so deep in the catacombs, I'm like 350 meters, you know, horizontal, and I'm however many meters down. I was like, if the lights fucking go out, this is gonna be the longest army man crawl I've ever done in my life.

No kidding. But I also thought the six million people here, Jean-Paul Stratter is there and amongst others. And I was like, there was ever a moment to be haunted by something this, go ahead and do me. I'm ready. Oh yeah, yeah. I'm ready.

But I didn't, I felt so comfortable. Yeah. And so sort of like embraced by the moment. Yeah, and also like the fact that you weren't available to be haunting means you've arrived at yourself. You thought I'm supposed to be there. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah.

And so I said, well, I'm just gonna try to drift off to sleep and I slept like a baby for 40 minutes and then I'm late in the dark and I hear these two French kids, these intern kids crunching on the gravel and they walk by me and they're speaking French and I just sat up and said, what time is it? And they went, ah! And was able to scare the shit out of,

like the heart attack that was there. So at least there's a little comedy. But yeah, but even the way it ends with you kind of, like the suggestion is that it's your point of view moving down the hallway just singing to yourself. Yeah. Yeah, the whole thing's beautiful. And it was really kind of moving.

And it's good to see you again, pal. Good to see you too. All right, man. Thanks. ["Darkness"] There you go, deep dude. Intense. Queens of the Stone Age, Alive in the Catacombs is available at qotsa.com.

Hang out for a minute, folks. Your door to big deals is on DoorDash right now. Sign up for DoorDash and enjoy a free Big Mac on your first McDonald's order of $20 or more. Only on DoorDash now until June 15th. Terms apply. Okay, hey listen, if you want more details about the reasons we decided to wrap up WTF later this year, Brendan and I did a bonus episode for Full Mehron subscribers, where we explain everything. Well, I keep saying to you,

I've been saying to you for many months, like going back to you talking about doing the Apple show and this and that, that I've been like, this is the time where you need to start thinking about what makes you happy, right? Like what are you okay with? And like what would you be okay with doing on a day where you weren't working?

What would make you happy about that? And I think you've actually, you know, put some effort into thinking about that. Sure, you know, there are things, there are places I've wanted to go there, you know, to sort of, like if I can get my dread down just to the basic existential dread of mortality, as opposed to every other fucking thing I have to do in my life, that might be relaxing.

And I've never been able to take a real vacation in any way without it being work or worrying about getting the podcast in during the week. I mean, that might be interesting. I mean, there's a whole world out there that you know, that I'm just gonna have to get out from under whatever the core anxieties are and try to live my life a little bit. That episode is available with a full Marin subscription. To get bonus episodes twice a week,

sign up for the full Marin by going to the link in the episode description or go to WTFPod.com and click on WTF+. Might be worth it just to do it, you know, even for a little while for the duration of the show just to hear that episode and a reminder before we go this podcast is hosted by Acast and this guitar is brought to you by John Lennon. I'm gonna be a good boy So So So So So So So So Boomer lives, Monkey and LaFond the cat angels everywhere.