WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 569 - Jason Schwartzman

Episode Date: January 18, 2015

Despite being a member of the Coppola family, all Jason Schwartzman really wanted was to be in a band. But he tells Marc about the chance occurance that got him cast in Rushmore without any prior acting experience. Jason has more great stories about his past projects, from I Heart Huckabees all the way up through his latest film Listen Up Philip and his new series Mozart in the Jungle. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

It's hockey season, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So, no, you can't get an ice rink on Uber Eats. But iced tea, ice cream, or just plain old ice? Yes, we deliver those. Gold tenders, no. But chicken tenders, yes. Because those are groceries, and we deliver those, too.

Along with your favorite restaurant food, alcohol, and other everyday essentials. Order Uber Eats now. For alcohol, you must be legal drinking age. Please enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by region. See app for details. Calgary is an opportunity-rich city home to innovators, dreamers, disruptors, and problem solvers.

The city's visionaries are turning heads around the globe across all sectors each and every day. They embody Calgary's DNA. A city that's innovative, inclusive, and creative. And they're helping put Calgary and our innovation ecosystem on the map as a place where people come to solve some of the world's greatest challenges. Calgary's on the right path forward. Take a closer look at CalgaryEconomicDevelopment.com. all right let's do this how are you what the fuckers what the fuck buddies what the fucking ears what the fucksters what the fuckleberry fins all right i'm mark maron this

is wtf welcome to the show jason schwartzman is on the show today. I like that guy. Nice guy. Do you remember the first time you saw Jason Schwartzman? Probably in Rushmore? Where you were like, who is that guy? Where did that guy come from? He's great. Had a nice conversation with him. So that's happening soon. Hey, you know what I don't do enough? Gratitude. Did I say that? Gratitude. I want to thank all of you people who listen and send me stuff and send me letters and emails and presents and records. I get them. I listen to your records. I listen to them once, maybe twice. And if they stick, I'll say something and I'll enjoy them and I play them more. I do give a listen to the records I get.

I will tell you that and I appreciate it. Gratitude. I'm doing okay. Doing better than okay. I should get up in the morning and go like, you know what? It kind of worked out. It didn't look like it was going to, and it is now,

so you're going to have to accept that and behave properly. Stop complaining and not having a nice time. How long do you think life goes on for, man? Can't keep chasing shit and comparing yourself to other people. Sometimes I just want to split, man.

So last week, it was like, I'm fucking done with Twitter. I'm done with all this bullshit. Just goddamn noise. There's just noise everywhere. Draining, demanding noise. And it keeps poking at you. The noise that pokes, that's where we are culturally. pokes that's where we are culturally just this racket this yammering racket that is always kind of uh pushing its way into you at varying degrees of intensity and volume

how many machines you got to turn off to get some fucking peace of mind god damn it am i getting sick? I got to shoot today. Oh, there's the dog. Sounded like somebody was torturing a monkey up the street just an hour ago. It was crazy. I don't know what the hell it was. Either someone bought a pet monkey or they were torturing somebody. Then my neighbor Adam said he was washing his parrots. That explains it.

I was in the jungle area i was in the i was in the territory i was in i i got the the general tone of the sound correct i made a mistake between a uh complaining monkey and a an excited parrot being bathed i'd forgotten that my neighbor had parrots. And I was reminded of that as I woke up in the jungle this morning. Oh my God. Today's the day, man. 12 hour, not 12 hour, but a 12 page day. I don't know if you guys know how TV works. What happened? Here's how we do it. We're shooting about an episode every three days. And we kind of go back and forth in those episodes every day and shoot pieces of them so you know an eight page day is a pretty hearty day and our first day today of shooting is a 12 page day and that's going to be a lot that's like you're back in man

and my life right now pretty much looks like what'll happen is I'll get my lines in my head last night. Then I get up and I'm on set all day and I'm running lines with my co-stars. We're doing the scenes as many times as necessary. We just jam at it all day long. Different outfits, different scenes, different actors, different angles. Get that coverage. Hopefully, we get some good stuff. The two scripts we're doing this week are great. And then I work 12 hours, 13 hours, come back home,

shower, wait an hour, get the sides for the next day, start cramming those lines into my head. I'm in every scene, not complaining. It's my show, but that's the way it works. So it's pretty heavy, man. So I'm going to be underwater for about two and a half months's my show but that's the way it works so it's pretty heavy man so i'm going to be underwater you know for about two and a half months doing my show and talking to you people won't be a lot of stand-up uh maybe on saturdays but this is it this is season three we're in it i'm excited and uh and i honestly am overwhelmed by the response to season two and even season one on Netflix. I'm glad you guys like the show.

Okay, look, let's do this. Let's talk to Jason Schwartzman. I never talked to him before. I always assumed he'd be a good guy, but he's a very sweet man. And I was thrilled to meet him. We had a nice time. It was one of those situations where I'm like, you're so familiar with a guy, and then he's like that guy. And that's always, it's comforting.

All right, let's enjoy now. My guest, Jason Schwartz. It's winter, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So, no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs, mozzarella balls, and arancini balls? Yes, we almost anything. So no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs, mozzarella balls, and arancini balls? Yes, we deliver those.

Moose? No. But moose head? Yes. Because that's alcohol, and we deliver that too. Along with your favorite restaurant food, groceries, and other everyday essentials. Order Uber Eats now. For alcohol, you must be legal drinking age. Please enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by region.

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When I die here, you'll never leave Japan alive. FX's Shogun, a new original series streaming February 27th exclusively on Disney+. 18 plus subscription required. T's and C's apply. I listened to your first Coconut Records record Did? Yeah I listened to it yesterday Thank you

It's nice It's nice pop music Thank you Very sweet But I can tell you're a gear guy Yeah Because it sounds like Some guy who sat there

And did it I love SM7 Yeah the best It's a great mic You like them? Yeah I really do But I can tell you're a gear guy because it sounds like some guy who sat there and did it. I love SM7. Yeah, the best. It's a great mic. You like them? Yeah, I really do. Do you sing in them?

I've never used this mic to sing in before, but I see lots of people that do. Yeah, I heard Michael Jackson sings in these. Come on. Yeah, SM7s. That's what I heard. Really? In the studio. I've had everybody on these. When I record people playing music in here,

and I just, because I don't have anything. I can't mix. All I can do is ride levels. So it's just going to be a mic, guitar, and that. And I have everybody sing on that. And to hear it with no, to hear singers with no filter, no nothing, this thing does it. It's amazing.

What do you use it for? No, I don't have one. I want one. You do you use it for? No, I don't have one. I want one. You do? Yeah. Just to have? Well, I would like to have a mic like this. This can do anything.

Yeah. And I feel that there's something indestructible about this. There is. I like indestructible things. Yeah, Shure makes a couple of things like that. The 58, too. That I have. You've got to have a few of those.

Yeah, you should have a few of those yeah you should have a few yeah you gotta do 58s but i um uh i love gear but it's sort of embarrassing because you know i uh i would say that i spend like uh any if there is free time at night yeah to just sit there and my favorite thing to do is just look at pictures of gear and read about gear and what things do yeah and then i watch a lot of videos you do i love them but then there is a moment too where because i'm not so so technically minded there's a moment when it goes it crosses way beyond what i'm what i know yeah which is when I'm at home, but definitely it happens like at stores. Yeah.

Where I'm like, oh, is this this keyboard? So like I'll have heard about keyboards or I've read about keyboards that, you know, for years like I've been looking for one just to play one and really get your hands on it. And I get there and I'm talking about it. But I guess, you know, I'm enthusiastic about it, but sometimes that can be misunderstood for deep knowledge about it but i guess you know i'm enthusiastic about it but sometimes that can be misunderstood for not deep knowledge about it yeah and like the sometimes the person will be so it's yes oh i'm glad you know about this it's great and plus we can double connect the oscillators

of the thing and i and then i just sort of like then i'm too embarrassed to say that i don't know you go oh yeah yeah oh it's great can you show. Can you show me an example of how that happened? So it's a little like that. But I love it. And not only that, I love gear. And I buy gear. It's my favorite thing to look for and invest in. I mean, I don't have crazy stuff. You have a lot of guitars?

It's also the most aesthetically beautiful stuff to me. Oh, yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah, we were talking about that stuff inside yeah the eye for design on stuff is pretty amazing and most like photos like rock and roll photos yeah i typically don't like live looking photos you know like hendrix on stage i get that it's amazing to me i would much I much prefer seeing like Todd Rundgren sitting at the desk yeah in his studio with his head in his hand not getting it right or so I'm just you can look around at all the amp in the background kind of pencils I love

it exactly yeah yes you got a little stress ball on there I love it yeah does he have this yeah that thing the hand exercise I'm not at this level what I don't know that's true I don't know. Someone sent that to me. It's so embarrassing. It's hard, right? Yeah, I can't even close it up. It's a hard one. But I love it so much, and I do believe in the idea that every instrument,

you write differently on each thing. Some people think, oh, I don't know if that's true, and it probably isn't for everybody, but I think each guitar or each pedal has a thing about it even if you can't even if it's all imperceptible if you if you feel that it has something different I think that it can offer you something well

that's the magic thing you know I mean it's your things do have magic if you invest it in there you want a coaster or you want to put that you're right here okay we'll see what happens is a reverse coaster reverse coaster. Yeah, we'll see if it... I put it on nothing. It floats over. If it doesn't end up in your lap, it's all good. It seems to go... It works perfectly.

All right, well then, I've never seen that happen before. This is a first. You've stacked your coffee cup on the tape. But yeah, I believe that's true. I think that some instruments have... Whatever they bring out of you, it's definitely magic to it. i've talked to people about that before people believing in magic and believing what of course that's going to provoke you each thing's going to have its own power you have a lot of guitars yeah you do yeah yeah well you write the songs why at least on that record they're all

very different so they all have a different feeling to them and you know i imagine that playing different instruments and and getting different groove going with things. There's a little R&B on there. There's a little pop. There's some sad music. Maybe even a country song. Well, that happened. Basically what happened was I had been writing music,

but the way that I like to do it is in pieces. I just sort of write little chunks of things yeah and then later I start to I assemble them and anyway

I usually record music with my friend Woody Jackson who if you want to see an amazing studio yeah if you truly are in the LA if you go

deeper into the LA area on Melrose near Larchmont yeah you should see his studio it's called Electrobox Studio and and it's unbelievable.

I'll show you pictures. Yeah. Actually, the oldest recording studio in Los Angeles. That's his? Yeah, and his collection of instruments and just musical aesthetics has been inspiring. Anyway, so I usually work with him, but I ended up, I had a bunch of songs.

Yeah. But they weren't songs. They were just songs. Yeah. And I, but they weren't songs, they were just pieces. Yeah. And I was, I had been broken up with. Is it 17? No, this was now, when I made my Coconut Records record, it was 25 or 24. Or something.

So you've done some acting already. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, you've been working. And I was in a band called Phantom Planet that began in 1994. How old were you? 14. So was that the first thing that was before acting, really? Was you wanting to be a rock guy?

Oh yeah. Yeah? Yeah, without a doubt. And you were a drummer? Yeah. Can you still play drums? Yeah, I can. I don't, it's such a, at least the kind of drumming that I'm interested in,

and it's such a lonely instrument, because I like to play songs, like, with people. You like to sing? I was never a singer, that was never my, I sing on the records because my little brother actually encouraged me to do it. Yeah. But initially I'd asked him to sing on my records. Your brother? actually encouraged me to do it yeah but initially I'd asked him to sing on my records

he's a really good singer yeah my brother Robert he's a real singer yeah he like warms up and stuff right

and but I had never thought about singing and I also in my band I was in a band that had three great singers yeah

so I never had to sing yeah but I play drums and but I don't play them I have some in my house yeah but if you play for two seconds it's lonely i want to play with people yeah i want to play songs well you gotta play drums to a track or something yeah it's i mean unless you're interested in

pushing the bounds of rhythm right which in theory i am i mean i would love to i would love to i'm not against it but it's not uh it's not like it's to. I'm not against it, but it's not my go-to way to spend time. But you were saying before that writing songs or sitting with a guitar, because for me, it's very meditative. I can't sit quietly. So if I play guitar for a half an hour a day, it really gets me out of my head. It's the best thing. For me, basically, and the way that it's been for the last few years, ever since I had a kid,

I have two children, but my first child came about four years ago. And the way that I used to make music was more loudly. I used to write, walk around and hum things yeah sing them with an acoustic guitar into a tape recorder yeah and such then i couldn't make as much noise in my house so i

um i started to learn how to use my garage band and my computer and and you you can use midi like i'd plug in my midi keyboard and just use the sounds in it and i you know if you were to walk by me you don't you don't really hear anything right probably me humming yeah and um i got into a process of writing and demoing at the same time so i don't sit and make up music without a recording i write i do it i multi-track and i do it like i that's part of the writing but really what it is is it's the meditative thing of like layering things and coming up with a chord progression and it's to me it's the meditative thing of layering things and coming up with a chord progression. And to me, it's the ultimate way to spend time. And at the end of a day, I try to do it every day,

at the end of the day. Yeah? For how long? Three hours is my minimum. Really? So you're abandoning your wife and children for three hours? Yeah, well, they are asleep. They abandon me.

So you do it in the middle of the night. Mm-hmm. That's what I do. And I would do it in the daytime, but I try to do it at night now. And essentially, they'll go to bed, and then I'll go out. And I haven't done it in the last few months because we are a second daughter. But usually the thing is that it's like people who go to a gym or whatever. It just feels so good to think about music.

And also now with technology, what you can do just sitting on your own for three hours, it's pretty phenomenal. It's really fun. And even if it's terrible, it's the best way to spend time. Even if you just are learning how to play someone else's song or covering someone else's song,

it feels good to do music, and I think my brain feels good. Like you say, it's meditative. Yeah, and you grew up with music? I mean, there's music in your family. Yeah, I grew up with music, but my mom's really into musicals. So like that, I grew grew up her picking me up from school and it was like into the woods blasting she pulls up a carpool into the woods oh guys i gotta go sorry um my mom loves it but um never like was like listening to tons of music as a

kid like in the car with my dad my dad listened her father? My dad listened to a lot of talk radio. Right. Wasn't your grandfather a composer? Yeah, he was a composer. Were you around for him? Did you see him? Yeah, well, sadly, he died when I was about 10 or 9. I forget exactly, but...

What was his name? Carmine. Yeah. But you remember him. Oh, yeah, the best. Yeah. And I am bummed that I wasn't into music on a deeper level then, because I would have loved to have talked to him.

But I always felt, growing up, that music was more, I guess, my alley. I didn't think it would be a profession, obviously, at a young age. But movies were so, it was like Lethal Weapon, Ghostbusters, you know, just blockbusters, comedies, all the Bill Murray. And I, you know, I hear people saying that when they would watch movies, they would think, I'm going to be up there one day. And I think that's cool. I never had that experience. To me, it was just the excitement of going to see a movie and loving it. And, you know, what everyone probably does, you imitate the movies on the way home and stuff.

You do the line. But I never, that was where it sort of stopped. You never saw yourself as an actor or wanted to be a movie star. And I don't know if it also comes from growing up in L.A. Where a lot of kids are actors. Where'd you grow up exactly? Westwood. Okay.

But, like, also, like, I mean, you know, you grew up in sort of a movie clan, right? I mean, I don't know how the Coppola family worked, but I mean, was it a tight unit? I mean, were you around? Was everyone eating dinner together at times during holidays and things? Holidays. Right. Because they, my uncle Francis, he lives up in the Napa Valley area. So I see him growing up more during holidays, Thanksgiving mostly.

Was that the congregating place? Was Francis' place? It seemed to be growing up. But great memories, but not a lot of movie talk. No. My experience of growing up was just a very boisterous family, kitchen, a lot of cooking and singing. Yeah. It seems that my mom and her two brothers, one has passed away, the level of musical knowledge is pretty incredible.

Like my Uncle Augie who passed away, his seemed to be very classical. And I think my Uncle Francis do, but my Uncle Francis and my mom have a real musical theater thing. Oh, yeah? Like if you say like, I love this cup. This cup, this cup, he loves this cup. Like they seem to know like a song you say, like, I love this cup. This cup, this cup. He loves this cup.

Like, they seem to know, like, a song about every, like, from a musical about everything. Like, this microphone. The microphone, he talks into it. Yeah, yeah.

And I, it's pretty, it's, like, encyclopedic and amazing, but, so I think I grew up with more around that, like, a kind of boisterous, but never, like, espresso and a deep conversation

about, like, a camera angle. I don't have that. He can do it though. I guess. But the thing is that my uncle and my mom, in terms of them specifically, although they're associated with Hollywood, they're very like not into Hollywood. I mean, he lives up there, first of all. But my mom is like not into Hollywood culture

and she loves movies. And if anything growing up, I think that's what I saw was just like, wow, my mom loves movies so much more than other parents. Right. More like that. Like I'd come home from school and you could hear like echoing in my house,

like a TV on. And I'm like up, down in that room, watching you go in there. And oh yeah, old movie. So I think I saw like someone who loved stuff so much. But yeah, for me,

music was the best. And of course MTV. Yeah. And I just, I felt that music you could do at home. Yeah. And movies, they seem like so big.

Yeah. And yeah, we didn't, I didn't grow up like on movie sets or anything you didn't go no she didn't want anyone there who your mom yeah how's she doing good she's the best i saw her last night about the grant why i mean you got a new she just called me you got a new grandkid yeah she's so excited she loves it she loves it because she grew up with boys yeah Yeah. Two brothers and sons. Yeah. And so to have daughters, she's just like in heaven. She's going crazy.

Oh, my God. She loves it. Yeah. Tap dancing and Esther Williams. Oh, really? Yeah. She goes way back. In the pool?

Yeah. Oh, yeah. My mom goes way. I feel like her knowledge of most things ends at like 1972, movie-wise. So you grew up in Hollywood, and I guess, what was the first movie that you did, Rushmore? Yeah. But when growing, it's always sort of fascinating to me that, I mean, you're younger than me, but there's always these generations of kids who are actors, and you all seem to know each

other, because you kind of do, and it's just like any other town where people grow up but who were your your peers growing up were there were they actors or were they you know did you where'd you go to high school a school called winward high school yeah in culver city who are my peers like did i know any actors growing up when you were growing up yeah i mean were there guys doing the same things creative people that you were that you know you kept in touch with the whole time? The only one that I know, I didn't, because I wasn't in like an acting circuit. But my best friend in high school, or one of my best friends in high school, there was a little group of us. Jake Gyllenhaal was his best friend growing up since they were like four.

Right. So I knew Jake. Right. Since I was 12. Yeah. Not much has changed. Yeah. He's always like the handsomest, biggest guy. Yeah.

I was like, oh man, that guy's got it. Yeah? You're still friends? Yeah. I am still friends with him. Haven't seen him in a while, but you know. Yeah. But yeah, I feel like, you know, I remember going to dances, sitting on the wall.

Yeah. Looking at him just dancing sitting on the wall. Yeah. Looking at him just dancing with like eight girls. Yeah, right. Going, holy shit. How does he do that? It's just natural for that guy. How do I begin? Where do I start?

So much is different about us. You were awkward? I felt awkward for sure. Yeah? Yeah. I think I was awkward. I mean, I don't know. I think everyone's

awkward yeah in high school but um junior high the worst yeah yeah but um but yeah i felt that my school i didn't go to a big enough school where they were like to your left you will find the people that are the misfits yeah slightly over to the right those the jocks yeah it was a small enough school where you know it was like jocks yeah it was a small enough school where you know it was like eight man football it was a small thing and like

we just got everyone knew each other everyone knew each other but within that they were like micro you know there's like micro micro click of three sure

yeah and like yeah but I was I liked sports and I liked music and but definitely

I think I felt I was definitely not doing well with girls specifically yeah that would that was so what do you attribute that to them yeah yeah so so like acting really wasn't on your radar until after high school I mean what what compelled you well what happened was that um so I was in my band, and my band was like. Good.

Well, that was what I was trying to do. Was it popular? You were popular? In L.A., I mean, yeah, for sure. In L.A., we would play. We didn't really tour much because we were 15 or 16 and stuff, but play in the L.A. area and sometimes San Francisco and San Diego. But, yeah, we would play, and lots of people would come,

and it was the best. And then we got signed, and trying to make records. Who signed you? Geffen. Yeah? Yeah, Geffen Records, before it folded. And how did that happen? We got our demo tape to this guy, Luke Wood,

who worked at Geffen at the time. And we had made a demo and he came and checked it out and we got signed yeah and how many did you do? records?

yeah well we did we did one we did two on Geffen and then then we moved over to Epic Sony

and then we did a few more there and I left did you jam? with them? yeah no with anybody? no

you're solo yeah that not that's not my code like that i'm sorry you guys want jam no no you don't know about me i'm a lone wolf yeah just me and my gear sorry you're talking to the wrong guy you're talking to the wrong gunslinger i uh no i uh no i just what am i gonna do where am i gonna go how am i am I going to go? How am I going to do it? But I want to, too. I don't play the kind of music you play. I'm just sort of a dirty guitar player. But I wish I could do that.

I wish I could solo and stuff and play dirt. No, I can't solo. I play chords. Yeah, I know, but do you know a lot of good chords? You know, like, all the good minor Beatles chords and things? You know them, too. You just got to move the fingers around a little. I just got to learn them. Yeah.

You learn that. I'll learn that a solo and then we could like. I could show you some licks. You show me some chords. I wish. But you can just get a place. I mean, I've been beating myself up about it. And I know guys that play.

I'm like, why don't we just do a weekend thing and go to a place and just play. But then that becomes its own thing. And then you have arguments and you got to decide what songs. Truly. And then you always end up too loud and then it just becomes this horrible blues jam for an hour

you know one guy goes to the bathroom and someone else is like sitting on his amp yeah yeah rolls down the volume stops the buzzing and she's like

yeah that's it so sad get a gumball from a gumball machine that's part of it that's part of the rock and roll experience I always think

the gumball machine is the worst but the best do you know Adam Goldberg? Yeah. Why don't you guys get together in the middle of the night and play some shit? Who else do I got? I don't know who I gotta work.

But he does the same thing you do in a way. He's up all night, sitting alone in his house. Well, first of all, I gotta change the up all night thing, and I think I've been doing a pretty good job about it. Once you got two, it's like, you know, there's no, I can't. No time. No.

If they're awake. If they're awake and at night, it's, you know, I got to get rest. Yeah. Got to be rested because I got to, you know, there's two of us. And it wasn't like I was off the hook the first time. Don't get me wrong. Yeah. But I was, I definitely, um like could push my body a

little bit harder but i think also you know it's interesting to me like people's creative habits yeah and um i don't know how much i can you can just be at the whim of your own like i think with two kids you gotta change your body around and And also you've got to schedule a little bit. Sure. You can't be as impulsive. Exactly. Well, that's the thing is I don't like the impulsive thing. I like the regularity of doing three hours a night.

I have all these weird rules. Three hours a night and then the next day never listen to what you did. Always do a new song. And then at the end of four months, I put everything into iTunes and then I make playlists and I walk around and listen to them. To what you did. And it's funny because you'll notice weird things like, oh, for that for those two weeks, everything was in A minor.

Yeah. What was I thinking? You know what I mean? You start to see what you were kind of writing the same thing. Yeah. So that's kind of fun. The thing is also, it's rewarding in a way that, you know, if you just put it on, you've created something that exists outside of you. It's true. Which is different than acting.

You've got to wait a year. It's true. And it's very immediately satisfying. That's the thing about it is last year I was trying to write something and sat down. I was sitting there for days. And it's a way more complicated and hard feeling because music, even if it's terrible, as you say, you can hit it

and play it for someone even if it's bad. It's sound. It's right there. But a longer format type thing, especially reading, which just takes longer anyway for anyone.

Music is so fast. Yeah, it's harder to communicate. It's much more frustrating. It's easier to second guess you. I admire someone who spends eight years writing a novel. It's crazy. Unbelievable to me. It's much more frustrating. It's easier to second guess you. I admire someone who spends eight years writing a novel. It's crazy. Unbelievable to me.

It's crazy. Unbelievable. And also, there's so much more room for insecurity. When you're writing, you're like, that's terrible. I know. I know. And I think much more room for totally losing perspective.

Oh, yeah. Because with music, you can be listening to something, your ears can get burned out, but I feel like you can reset it pretty quickly, and you can also play it for people. Right. But if you've written like 400 pages of something, how do you ask someone to, oh, I would.

And what a chore. You have to be pretty close to that person. I admire that and fine art so much. You admire the ability for someone to say, here's 400 pages. Well, first of all, I admire anyone who can just read 400 pages. I know.

I can't read very well. I'm so slow. Fine arts too? Well, anyone who can like draw something. Or paint. Oh, amazing. Paintings, it's mind blowing. How do you know when something's done?

I don't know. Did you ever see the movie, The Mystery of Picasso? No. Watch this movie. Documentary? Yeah, it's him painting. Showing him painting. this movie. Documentary? Yeah, it's him painting. Showing him painting.

In the black and white? Yeah, that's the one. Yeah, I've seen bits of that. It's great because you see, I mean, he does a painting many times and each time I'm like, that's done. And it keeps going and makes it even better. So how did you get into, I know while we're on the music, so on the solo music, you did some stuff that was, you know,

kind of got some airplay and was used in movies, and you track some stuff in some of your shows and things? Sure, yeah, yeah, for sure. Is that part of the deal, or you just kind of throw your hat in the ring? Like, can I do it? I did the theme song for Bored to Death. Yeah. And I'm not sure, I feel like I i i said like let me have a whack at it

but don't it's not right wasn't other people yeah right but it was that was a really fun experience i have been the trip he's the best yeah my best was my best friend is he yeah yeah yeah he married my wife and i did he. He gave a speech that was so beautiful. It was unbelievable. Yeah, he's a special guy. Yeah, he's the best. Yeah. But no, with that song, I just like,

I kept lying in these emails saying like, yeah, I've got an idea and it's got, I've got an idea for a song. And they're like, can we have it by this day? I won't have it, but I will tell you that it's got this walking bass line. I kept throwing out to hold you over phrases, and then it was time to

write it. I had to look at all my emails and see everything I had lied about already existing. And then it was pretty easy to write it because I had all these constraints, like walking bass line, some of these lyrics, this thing. I was like, okay. What happened to that show? It got cancelled. Just like that

yeah it was you know it was a unique show it was a fun show who knows why these things get cancelled and I will say that I loved working at HBO

they were really cool and if they were like we would like to do it again I would totally do it and it was the best because Zach and Ted and Jonathan it was

you know those hours are pretty hard but they're so much more enjoyable when you've got these guys that are just pros and literally oh like my face would just be hurting and i know like after some 18 hour days i'd go home so tired go to bed and wake up so excited to go see those guys like almost like when you've got a crush on someone yeah yeah it's the beginning and it doesn't matter and right just the bet you know the bet like what are they gonna say today yeah and i loved it and uh it was it was sad and it was not to say because um jonathan was telling me all about season four yeah so i had this he had

kind of had it all figured out and then when when it got canceled, there was no season four, and then I was so confused, because what do I do with this information in my brain? It's like I've been fantasizing about something, and I know it was going to happen. But I'm happy we even got the chance to do it. It's such a one-in-a-million chance to get the thing, to get the script bot, to get the pilot.

Oh, yeah. The process is insane. Yeah, so even that, and I truly mean that. It was like I'm so thankful we even got it. Yeah yeah i would have loved to have had more how'd you so how'd the acting start it started um in a very odd way which is that um uh a few years before i was in my band i mean uh before rushmore i was making records with my band um but i also had written a play because I liked I liked plays and um my my uncle Francis has this like a this estate in Napa and um he's just a fun person who decided one summer we would have creativity camp yeah so he put out this open invitation to

everyone in our family anyone who wants to come up paint make short films do plays anything i was so excited and i was i was going into my ninth into ninth grade and i was yes great i wrote a play and um went up there and i we had like props and stuff and i got super into it anyway my cousin sophia she directed a play yeah and i was in i had like a small partner play it was just all of us having fun right it was the best who was the audience just family or did people come in from napa oh they came they came yeah at the final how long yeah it was one night but you were up there for a week or so or what i was up there for uh 10 days okay yes doing prep yeah like prepping and directing and it was just for fun and it was really cool and now who was involved so sophia directed a play she did one and my uncle did one and my cousin christopher

was in my play yeah and um my aunt ellie made a short movie now where does does where does nick come into the family thing he wasn't he wasn't there yeah he's older. Like, he's... Yeah, he's a little... Yeah, he's older than me, but that's not why he was there. I think he was probably working. Was he around? Was he around when you were a kid? Sometimes.

Not as much. I think he was really... I mean, he was really trying to make it happen. So, you know, obviously, it's hard to... Do you have a relationship with him? Yeah.

Yeah, really. Yeah, I love him so much. And growing up yeah he was older than me and it's like that that guy's your cousin i was like wow that guy i didn't really know no one at the time fuck this guy's the coolest yeah you know what i mean and also his um you know that's his his boisterousness and his um for life and words, and that's my family, and that's how everyone in my family talks, is loud and thoughtful. So I just thought he was the coolest.

Anyways, but... So you go up for the camp. So I went up for the camp. Now, fast forward to, that was when I was 15. So when I was 17 years old, I was in the middle of making a record. I was going to my senior year of high school, So when I was 17 years old, I was in the middle of making a record. I was going to my senior year of high school.

And my grandfather, Carmine, who had passed away, had written a score for a movie. And my uncle, to celebrate it, was going to have the score played live in Napa. And he was inviting lots of people from San Francisco. It was a charity type event, I believe. I'm not totally sure, but I wasn't supposed to go. Anyway, my mom was going, and last minute, she's like, you've got to come. It's my father's music. You've got to hear my father's music.

And this score. So I rented a tuxedo, and we went up. And at this party, there was a woman there named Davia Nelson, who was a local casting director in San Francisco. And because she's from San Francisco, my family's from San Francisco, she knew Roman, my cousin, and Sophia. Anyway, they were friends, and they were talking, and my cousin said, what are you up to?

And she said, I'm the san francisco wing of this of the casting for this movie uh rushmore and my cousin said what's it about and she said it's about an eccentric 15 year old who writes plays and is a crush on an older woman and she said oh it's funny that sounds kind of like my cousin jason and um she said really and he said yeah he's right over there and i and i had rented think, like a tuxedo with tails. Yeah. And I got a hat and a cane maybe. I was just like a clown.

I was a classic type of clown person. And she invited me over. She said, come meet, this is Davia. And then she walked away. And then Davia started telling me that she was casting for this movie and what i like to um audition and i said well i i'm a drummer i'm not an actor and she said well no but sofia said you were in her play and that you might have some things in common with this character and i said yeah but and also there's a little bit of a drummer mentality in full effect at this time which is

are you sure you don't want to talk to the lead singer? Yeah, right. That was sort of my, like, and in general, that was sort of my high school experience. Right, right. Was the middleman, the broker. Yeah. For a lot of, for the other guys, for the girls.

Yeah. Yeah. So, there was a little bit of that residue on me of, I think you might have the wrong guy. Right. And she said, no, no of i think you might have the wrong guy right and she said no no i think you should audition i said i'm not an actor never auditioned anyways i mean it's silly that i would even but i so i i she said i said i live in la she said well that's where the casting office is what's your address we'll send you the script this was on a

weekend yeah i got home and on monday this manila envelope arrived with Rushmore. It was the first script I'd ever read, and I remember reading it thinking, holy shit, like, this is everything that I love.

And at that time, I hadn't really seen a lot of movies that were what I was into. Right. It was more music that I was,

I loved movies. And I saw a lot of weird movies and I had a really instrumental, my friend, Brett Berg, who helps run

Cinefamily now, went to high school with me and he was always bringing over like Human Highway, the new young movie, Listomania,

there's fun movies since we were in eighth grade, we were watching weird movies. But I had never seen like a movie that was like,

that got me like the way music did right that kind of fuzzy feeling yeah when i was reading the script i was thinking holy shit this is like a everything that i that i that i think yeah about i really connected to it when i called the casting person i said my name is jason schwartzman i met davia nelson in san francisco and she goes yes we have you down for friday i said so what do i do i've never been to audition what do i what do i wear yeah and she said you wear whatever makes you feel comfortable okay and um because i was a clown and because this was such a it felt it didn't feel like a goof i didn't think of it as like this is a joke yeah but i definitely thought of it as i'm not gonna get this right so what's the you know yeah so i um i decided to like get fully into the wardrobe of the character so i

got some khaki pants i got a blazer my friend and i mike we made a um patch yeah velcroed it on i got really into it like a shield thing yeah and um anyway i i basically my attitude was like I'm not going to get it but I will be remembered how old were you? 17 and I went in and there were a couple other kids dressed up in the same kind of outfit which was definitely a bummer can't even make my big show I guess we all know this party trick

and I sat in a room with a bunch of kids and it's definitely a feeling that I did not like which is these other kids kind of sitting there everyone's looking at each other i'm like this sucks yeah um it felt like every man for himself right which i don't like i don't like competition and i'm very competitive with myself but not i don't like to compete and so i thought why do you have a feeling like there's like you're gonna lose yeah right right. Why am I even here? Yeah.

So I was like, so anyway, yeah, like my wife, for instance, she loves to compete. Like she would say like when she was little, she'd be on the way to like a soccer game and she'd just be like, I can't wait to get there and get on the field and kick their ass. And I remember being a kid like on the way to baseball games. Dad, I think I might have a stomach infection. You know, like, I'm trying to weasel my way out of anything. I'm the same way, man.

Yeah. I envy people that have a healthy sense of competition. Yeah, because they don't beat up on themselves. You're given, like, with your kids, make sure they play soccer. Well, I'm trying to definitely, that was a big thing for me in my life was to not display that for my own children since they've been born i've been trying to say yes to things that i

typically would say no to right a lot of stuff which is kind of like fear-based right stuff because i i guess i you know it's just basic stuff i don't want them to overhear me saying i can't go to that i'm too too afraid. What if I mess up? Right. I don't... Right. You think about it, I mean, in a way

that I never had before. But you were forced to play Little League? Well, I loved it. You did? I loved it once it started, but I didn't love being over there on the way to the game,

and you get out of the car and the smell of the grass, and you hear, like, the sound of a ball hitting a mat, and, like, a coach going, Johnny! Yeah.

Try and hit the... I just, like, not into coachesny yeah try and hit the i just like not into coaches yeah like the whole thing was just even now thinking about it makes me feel terrible yeah but uh i guess i also loved it too you know cleats yeah juice boxes there's something about it too i love yeah yeah um i just didn't like have the pressure you know like that ball's coming i know oh god i know What position were you? Catcher. Oh, so you were stationary, kind of. Yeah.

But it was a big job. Yeah, it sucked. I was in center field, and I just sat out there hoping nobody hit the ball. Yeah, I know. I know. I didn't like batting. I don't know. That's the thing.

That's the thing I really didn't like. You didn't like it? No, batting. It's a ball. You're going to get hit by the ball. I was like, geez. It's a ball. You're going to get hit by the ball. I was like, geez. It's terrifying. Why am I going to get hit?

Why am I going to do this? I know. So what were we doing? What did you like about it? The juice box? I think that I liked, I think that I did love the camaraderie. Right, right. And I mean, I'm a solitary, I like lonely activities.

Yeah. But I also love, like I love to be on a movie set because I love everyone helping each other. Right. So I think there was something about that, that looking around, like, all right, third base. Yeah. Shortstop. Yeah.

Second base, first base, pitcher, myself, we are the infield. I think there was something nice about that. As long as all the pressure's not on you, I think. Yeah. It's my feeling. It's like, I hope that the other guy. No, even recently, my cousin got married. We had a family softball tournament.

Our family against their family. Yeah. And I had to be catcher. And a ball got hit way out in the outfield. Someone was rounding the base. And all I was thinking was like, please, please let this guy beat the ball. Yeah, get out. Please don't even let it be an issue with the boss to come in at the same time as this guy trying to cross the baseline.

And what happened? It came in right, and I missed the tag. Yeah. So the worst happened. It happened, but it was okay. We won. Oh, good. We won.

All right, so you're sitting in this room with a bunch of guys in blazers. Anyways, yeah, I go in, and finally, one by one, they go in. I go in, and Wes Anderson was sitting in there. He's 27. And I remember instantly seeing he had Converse sandals, which I had never seen before. It's hard talking about those. And then this was 1997.

In 1996, Pinkerton came out, the Weezer record, and that was a huge record when it came out. Someone had an advanced copy of Pinkerton hearing it in a car and it just I love the blue album and that record blew the lid off my roof yeah Pinkerton was it was it yeah and um for me and um talking to Wes about Pinkerton for like 20 minutes really yeah and it took my mind totally off the audition. And then he was like, should we read it? And I think I might've said, let's not.

This was so good. It was so nice meeting you. Let's just leave it. Good. And I'll leave. And he said, no, let's read. And then anyway, we read it. And because it was my first audition,

I didn't know if it was good or bad. And then we started to improvise and then he said why don't you stick around for a little bit I'm going to read some other people and then he actually

had me come in and be Bill Murray and audition people to play the Bill Murray's kids part and I went home my mom said how'd it go

I was like I think it was good I spent a few hours there a few hours that's good but she didn't really you know she helped me by the way

for that week like owning my lines and stuff. And then I got. Did she give you any acting introduction? Just she tried, you know, to like help me with stuff. But I was so, it's so overwhelming. Did she teach? No, but she should.

Yeah. She's good with the teaching. She's a great teacher. And anyways, then I got a, then I guess it got narrowed down to myself and a few other people. Because I was unknown, I had to do a screen test. Right. And I did a screen test. Yeah.

And I got the part. And it all happened pretty quickly. And they were saying, yeah, you're going to be in this movie with Bill Murray. And it just felt like a dream. And I started my senior year of high school thinking I was going to finish my record, which I did. But I did not expect to be in Houston with Bill Murray at the start of the school year. And you grew up watching his movies. Yeah.

And he's a pretty amazing character. Yeah, he's the one. Yeah. He's the chosen one. He's the golden child. And you got along with him pretty well? Yeah, I think so and um and then um but i went back and i didn't actually think well now i'm an actor i went back and i didn't have an

agent after you shot yeah i went back to school kept kept going on my record and um that was it you know trying to finish the the record in school yeah and then like what and it happened and it basically happened that i finished my record and then rushmore and my album came out within a few months of each other yeah and it was a little frustrating at the time because any press would say ah an actor with a band uh with a band and i was thinking isn't it the other way around right you know i'm for me i didn't care but it's probably probably hard on my band. But that's basically how it started. It was such a weird defining role. I mean, when you watch the movie, it's a weird movie.

There's no movie like it. No. And you're this guy no one's ever seen before. Yeah. And it's so defined in such the intensity of it. Yeah. But it took a while before someone said, said like let's put him in another movie well uh i don't i don't fully remember how it all happened but i just know that i didn't have

an agent for a little while and then i got an agent and started to get scripts and it seemed like okay so is this like what what is this plan now what is the game plan yeah you know and um i really was adamant about i wanted to do another movie because I loved it so much. I also really wanted to make my band, like to get the album out, to go on tour. I mean, these were things that I dreamed of since I was little. So I was really trying to do both. And I think arguably I did both. I mean, I toured and I was able to be in movies.

And me leaving my band had nothing to do with wanting to pursue an acting career more um obsessively it just it was just its own timing it ended but um yeah that's was it sad to leave yeah for sure yeah for sure um because i loved i love i loved the guys i mean i love the, and I loved being in a studio and making music. And I think the thing that helped make it a little bit better was knowing that, oh, just because I'm leaving doesn't mean I'm leaving music. I'm just leaving the situation. Right.

Where, honestly, the touring thing was pretty, it was not the best lifestyle for me in terms of that, you know, being on the road and a lot of time during the day leading up to just 45 minutes on a stage it seemed odd and I couldn't get I couldn't get into a rhythm yeah I'm much more of a homebody and I think I'm also more productive when I have my things around me and I'm trying to make stuff there's a loneliness that happens out there we're just sort of for sure at a shitty hotel

in a part of town where nothing is. That's the truth. You wake up, you're going to walk out in a parking lot, you're like, where am I? Sad. Yeah, and I also, I grew up with brothers and I'm pretty good with sharing, but I think also it's just a thing of,

well, whose cereal is this? Can you move this? But I just wasn't into it. You know, like, who ate my cereal? And just like socks and stinkiness. Cereal problem. Just like waking up wet and not knowing with what and how.

One time the singer of my band told me when we were on tour, he said, I woke up this morning covered in broken glass. And to me that summed up the existential conundrum. He's like, I don't know where it came from. There's nothing else broken in broken glass. Yeah. And to me, that summed up the existential conundrum. He's like, I don't know where it came from. There's nothing else broken in the room. I don't know why I have broken glass. And I was like, this is not a good life.

Were you guys drinking? This is not what I was intended. They were, we would drink, yeah, for sure. For sure. But not too crazy? You don't strike me as a drug guy. No, I mean, I drink. Yeah.

I love to drink, but more like at home. Yeah. More alone. That's good. You drink alone when the kids are asleep, when you're recording. Or, yeah, I don't like to have a drink if my kids are awake. That's the truth. But after, I have a nightcap and watch SportsCenter and do music and stuff.

But I'm never a beer person. No. What do you drink? I like tequila, vodka, or gin, just straight. Yeah. Nice. I love it. All right.

So now, okay, so you're out of the band. You're an actor. Mm-hmm. But let's talk about Bill Murray for a second. Yeah. Because you had to learn on the job, right? Yeah. Did he help you?

Did Wes help you? Yeah. I mean, what, because you have this sort of defined style, which is who you are. I couldn't have done it without Wes. He was my, he's my mentor, and he's my best friend, too, and we still work together, and he definitely, it was just like great timing, because I think, you know, he really was asking me about what I thought about things and showing me movies. Like what? I was 17.

I saw, like I had never seen, I had never heard of Francois Truffaut. Right. And that, you know, it's just like that mentor comes into your life and starts showing you stuff and and you're that young too sure very impressionable yeah and it's just like someone who really comes in and is just enough older than you that that that they're a mentor and just and they're not young enough that they're yeah and just showing me movies and he showed me books he showed you truffaut yeah truff you Truffaut? Yeah, Truffaut. And, you know, like just watching Martin Scorsese movies and all kinds of stuff. And just kind of getting my mind blown, opening up a whole new world of real like cinephile stuff.

Like that there was a whole world of this stuff out there that that i could i was i really felt like where was this well it's so funny because your your uncle's got to be one of the biggest cinephiles in the world sure yeah but you don't have that relationship with him and he's your uncle yeah i mean now we talk about stuff all the time but it's not like uh but not really even i mean i don't even it's yeah i don't uh it comes up just because he loves movies but i don't go hey yay or nay true foe you know i don't you don't get comes up just because he loves movies but I don't go hey yay or nay true foe you know I don't get into that stuff I saw I saw your but he loved movies when I was in college

I went and saw his reissue or the re-edit of that Napoleon with your grandfather's score that's the score that I was going to see in San Francisco I saw it played live with the movie. That was the same thing.

Yeah, that's amazing that you saw that. Oh, yeah, with the triptych, with the three screens. Yeah, three screens. Yeah, it was crazy. Yeah, it was beautiful. Yeah, I mean, I was very into it when I was in college. So what a weird connection. Yeah.

That's exactly the thing. That was 1997. But that's interesting. So it took Wes. Because I guess when you're with your family, it's your family. But I mean, you had seen your mother's work. You had seen the Godfather. I only seen,

I saw the Godfather first for the first time when I was 16. Yeah. Not before. And I'd seen Rocky, but, and I loved it. Yeah. And,

and I was, my mom's very shy and I, it was probably weird for her. Like, you know, we'd walk around and the idea, yo, Adrian was such a big. Oh, so they, people would she's oh thank you you know she's very embarrassed and I remember thinking a young age why is everyone saying this to her it's not who they might have why

they always confusing her and you know then she taught me about it a little bit but she's a very private person and um yeah but i saw like going to my uncle's you know like he showed uh i saw like he showed apocalypse now once and to us and uh to to our family a bunch of people like a new print of it or something and yeah we watched movies like um we watched yellow submarine when i was little and this movie a prick up your ear which was yeah i saw that when i was like very old yeah i was like what the fuck and um so there were definitely things like that floating around but more older movies yeah i'm talking specifically like these kind of 60s 70s sure no i know right and that whoa and you know then you

start to get into it but um french new wave movies that yeah for sure that must have helped you with huckabees yeah that's a sure that's bizarre. It just got me into the world of paying closer attention to those things. Art films. Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Was that the next big movie you did, Huckabees? There were a few in the middle. Yeah.

But I would say that I really loved. Right. But that was, yeah, that would, I would say, would be the next bigger one. And like Murray, did he, like when you were. So Bill Murray, yeah. He was like, so when I met him, it was very intimidating. Yeah. And as you can imagine.

Yeah. And in the beginning, I think it was, he was trying to get his footing and I was probably freaked out and starstruck. Right. But after a while, I think that we, he really kind of, he really kind of got behind me and really helped me. And I couldn't have done it without him either, you know, and his support. And for sure, Wes. I mean, Wes did a thing where I was in Houston. I was 17.

He was two doors down from me in the hotel, and every night he would have dinner with me. And we would talk about the scenes the next day. I mean, he really helped me he's like a very specific like as he evolved as a director like I it's like every frame is a jewelry box or something like that it's like you're looking at something meticulously organized he has a vision you know totally a vision yeah completely visual in a lot of way very much and it's it's it's mind-blowing yeah I've never seen anybody construct something like that.

Nor have I. But it's really a beautiful thing to see. And he has an emotional kind of similar thing where he has an idea for a tone that he wants to try to get. And I love him so, so much. And I'm glad to say that our friendship and our working relationship to this day continues to evolve. And I think it's, you know, great when you can find someone that you can work with and that you want to work with over and over again. Because I think that there's less chit-chat every time. Right.

You just get more deep or go to the work more quickly. Right. Oh, yeah, because you have a shorthand. And you're less embarrassed. And there's a whole crew of those guys that come from Texasxas isn't there sure the wilson brothers yeah andrew yeah we how many new movies have you done with them four three or four with west with west i don't know oh let's see if we can figure it out darjeeling rushmore um darjeeling limited fantastic mr fox mr fox grand budapest hotel moonrise kingdom yeah so five Rushmore, Darjeeling Limited. Fantastic Mr. Fox. Fantastic Mr. Fox.

Grand Budapest Hotel. Moonrise Kingdom. Yeah. So five. Oh my God. And I did a short film, Hotel Chevalier. Yeah. Five and a half.

And then you worked with, so you worked with David O. Russell on that thing. That was amazing. Was it? It was the best, yeah. It's a crazy movie. Yeah, it was great. Yeah, it was so fun. I mean, I like that movie.

Yeah. I'm not sure I understand how someone decides to make a movie like that. Yeah. Do you? Well, it was an amazing experience. And the thing that I always feel so deeply thankful and or just blown away to David about and for was that before that movie, there was another movie we were supposed to make. Yeah. Right after Rushmore, I met him.

And he said, I've got a movie idea, and I want to talk to you about it. And we sat down, and it was this super in-depth movie about an ensemble movie. And it was going. I mean, it had a crew. It was a script. And I was prepared to do it. And we were talking about it, meeting about it, having these meetings. And a few weeks before we started it, he called me on the phone really early in the morning. And he said, Hey, I'm just going to give

you the call first before I call everybody else. I'm going to say that we're not going to do this movie. I'm going to pause this movie. Because it just doesn't feel right. And I don't want to do something unless it feels right i promised myself i wouldn't do it but i promise you the next thing we do you will be in it i i promise i thought okay well thank you i i was heartbroken because i was so ready to do this movie and did that movie ever get made no and um and uh what was it well maybe he'll make it one day so i don't ever want to like say too much but um i i it involved a lot of um a lot of music i had written a lot of music for it and um and uh anyways i still i stayed in touch with david but i had gone on tour and a little while had gone by and then one day i get a call from him saying, where can I send you something?

And then this package came. I opened it, and there was a script. It said, I don't know if it said I Heart Huckabees. It might have just said Untitled David Russell Movie in a little note that said, Lovingly Crafted for You. Love, David O. Russell. And I read it, and it was I Heart Huckabees, and it blew my mind. And thus began our venture on that

together and it was about a year of me going to his house almost every day and we'd go on hikes together and I would sit he's so busy that it was hard to get like to schedule a meeting on the phone to talk about it so I figured what I'll do is I'll just go to his house every day and I'll sit in the other room and I'll work on this movie and if he has ten minutes free he can come in and we can talk about and he can go back and I'll just be there and that's what I did he was okay with that yeah he was he loved it yeah and so it was great for me I would just go to his house and I'd set up like in this like den TV room yeah my

script and notes and I would make questions and then if David is like I got 45 minutes won't go for a walk we just go for a walk and I kind of go over what I was thinking about and that was how it evolved it was amazing and to this day I kind of liked the idea I just like being close to the project yeah that's very cool extremely you can moved in with him but I loved it and it was the best I have so many great experiences from it. And, you know, I met Mark Wahlberg, who is, I don't know. He's great.

He's the coolest. He's really solid. He's amazing. He is. I love him. Isabella Huppert. Isabella Huppert, who is amazing. I mean, everybody was great.

Naomi and Dustin. Yeah. Hoffman. Yeah. And Lily Tomlin. Yep, Lily Tomlin, who, as you know. Dustin Hoffman. Yeah. And Lily Tomlin. Yep, Lily Tomlin, who, as you know. Dustin Hoffman. How was that?

And Jude Law. Jude Law, yeah. The best. It was a crazy movie. It was the best. I had such a great time. And to me, it wasn't crazy because I guess I just knew it so deeply at that point. Talking to David about it.

What were the talks about, though? I mean, like, because it's a, what would you call that, a farce? I mean, what is that movie? That's what Dustin would always say.

He's like, hey guys, it's a farce. Remember, it's a farce. Is it? I never saw it as a farce. Well, what did you see it as? I saw it as, you know, I mean, you must know what it as? I saw it as, you know,

I mean, you must know what it's like when you get so hyper-focused that you don't see everything. Right. And those are my favorite kind of movies anyway.

It's my life. Yeah, well, yeah, exactly. So, yeah, I just,

I thought it was about this guy who was at a breaking point who was starting to see all these coincidences and thought that it must have meant something more and who

could he go talk to he needed guidance and he found these existential detectives to help to help him sort out his life and um it made total sense to me and because we talked about it every day and we talk about coincidence and love and disaster and being confused and lost and sharing stories with each other and by the time we got to to shooting, it was a very serious movie about a guy going to existential detectives. For you, it was. Yeah, for sure. For sure.

And working with people like Hoffman, having, you know, like, again, even more so than Murray, that he had this guy with this kind of catalog of experience. Yeah, isn't that... To see his process, what did you notice about him? Well, you have all the kind of typical young actor stuff that's really funny. Like, for instance,

Dustin Hoffman means a lot to me on many levels. I hadn't seen The Graduate till I was about to go do Rushmore. My mom read the script of Rushmore, and she said, I'll be right back. She went to Blockbuster, came back with three movies, Harold and Ma, The Graduate, and Dog Day Afternoon.

I'd never seen them. And my life was changed instantly. Another mentor moment. Seriously. What was it about those movies? My mom tour. Mom tour. Dustin Hoffman and The Graduate.

I couldn't believe it. I could see how that would have an impact. He'd inform Rushmore. Yeah, it was just, I had never seen a lead character like that. Yeah. And anyways. And Dog Day Afternoon? And Dog Day Afternoon was just insane because to me it was so funny. Yeah.

He's so funny in it. Yeah, he's so vulnerable. I know. It's like the last time you saw him like that. I mean, when he's like trying to jump up and put like put something on the camera and the way he if you watch the movie like there's a way he goes to the he like takes out his gun he looks like he's holding a box of fire so he's like he's crazy i mean it's just insane it's like so unhinged what was the other one harold and maude oh yeah bud court yeah and so so i I love Dustin Hoffman, and when he told me he was going to be in it, I just, oh, my God.

What about these young actor things? Well, so one is that I got this documentary that David had that was the making of Tootsie. Yeah. And I saw that he was wearing a blue Lacoste shirt, and he had this binder, like a binder with a script. And I said, I'm going to wear a Lacoste shirt and have a binder, too. And it's great. You saw that in the Tootsie documentary? Yeah, and I said, I'm going to become that.

That's what I'm going to be like. And I remember... For your process. Yeah, like just trying to figure it out because I'm not a trained actor. So part of it's emulation. Right. And also my father, he passed away when I was 13.

Yeah. 13, 14. And so I learned how to shave from watching The Graduate. Right. Because he shaves in it a lot. Yeah. And so that's being a fan, you put a lot on people's thoughts. I do that, yeah.

I remember Dustin came for this table read and I went in the bathroom. I locked myself in there. I couldn't come out. I was shaking. But these young actor things are things like I I was so nervous I got so into it I was like going to uh I flew I like flew out to Paramus New Jersey that's where the movie was originally set and I stood outside of like a Home Depot and read poetry to see what that would feel like because that's what the character does and have people people yell at me. And I filmed it. I put a camera on a car. Like, I did all this, like, dumb, not dumb, but stuff that was, you know, I was looking for an answer.

Yeah. And that was the way that it would help me. And I would tell Dustin stuff like this. And he'd go, really? You don't want to just do it like that? You know, it seemed like everything you'd heard about him wasn't true anymore. And I was, like, kind of embarrassed. He was so easygoing, and I remember kind of being hurt.

I saw this on the iHeartUccabees. You've done all this method stuff. All this crazy stuff. On the documentary for iHeartUccabees, there's this moment where Dustin's talking about every actor in the movie, and he's like, Jude is just fantastic, and Naomi, and of course Mark is a revelation. And Jason Schwartzman is so obsessive. And I'm like, oh my God.

Obsessive? What the fuck? I'm just trying to do what you were doing. I learned, you know do what you were doing. I learned, you know, you taught me everything. It was a little like that. But I wasn't like emulating him, but it was, but I was. You were just looking for a method. Yeah, I was looking for something, and he seemed to be like a good answer.

Oh, it's so sad. But it was really funny. It was the best. And he's so sweet, and he's so goofy, and he really is. He was such a, he taught me so many things. For instance, the first day of shooting, David O. Russell wanted to change some lines around. Yeah. And he told me a new line and then I went up to Dustin and I said, Dustin, just so you know, David told me to do these new lines.

I'm just telling you. So then he's like, well, that's okay. So later at the end of the day, my first day of work complete went to his trailer and i said mr hopman i just want to say i'm so so uh i want to say thank you for letting me mess around out there and yeah and travel those different things and he said are you kidding me a take is the one place in life you can fail yeah and uh it was so sweet yeah because it was you know i mean it was he's saying, don't worry about it. Just let it rip. And he just, you know, he was so free and he loves trying things.

And every take he's messing around and he's really trying to help everyone. And I remember there's one take, there's one scene in the movie where he said to me, he like asks me if I want something. He's like, do you want this? Is this what you want with your life and i said yeah i couldn't get it right and then but earlier that day he'd walked in wearing a really cool button-up shirt yeah and then we were doing these takes and it was my close-up and then he he said do you understand what i'm saying yes do you really understand yes

and he held out a shirt he took out a shirt from behind his back he said do you want this shirt i said yeah and he said then come get it and i walked off but they they used the take of me saying yeah about the shirt oh really for like me so that kind of stuff like he's very helpful oh that's great so your father passed away when you were young yeah and he was in movies no he was a entertainment lawyer and then a movie producer but you have good memories yeah yeah you weren't so young for sure no yeah memories are a tricky thing i they're not i don't seem to have i don't know really what people's memories are like my memories don't seem to be as uh they're they're vague and then some are super detailed yeah like i can remember what a pattern on a shirt was right but

in one memory and then i have no recollection of something else of like bigger memories it's interesting yeah i wonder how that was loaded up emotionally in your head just yeah in general in one memory and then I have no recollection of something else. Of like bigger memories. Mm-hmm. It's interesting. Yeah. I wonder how that was loaded up emotionally in your head. Just, yeah, in general it seems to be that way. With everything. Yeah.

Like, you know, there could be huge events that are just gone. Yeah. But you remember some shoes. Yeah, like, or I'll remember like, like what the layout of a room and where the bathroom was. Right. With the exit sign was. I can remember weird things like that sometimes. But then I can't remember

someone's like, yeah, remember we talked all about this? I'm like, no, I don't remember that. I don't remember you at all. Yeah, so I don't know what that attributes to. I have that too. So I watched the new movie. Obviously, I think we could probably talk forever.

I thought it was great. Thanks. It was kind of an abrasively... Yeah, abrasive is the word. But charming somehow. I think that you have a natural amount of charm that's going to carry even the biggest asshole through an entire film. Well, I appreciate you saying that.

But no, it was fun to play. I mean, this character was a guy who definitely never has a moment where you're supposed to like him. Listen up, Philip. Yeah, Philip. Philip is in Listen Up, Philip. He's a pretty abrasive, relentlessly mean person at times. But he never has a moment where he tries to be nice or tries to say, just kidding. where he tries to be nice or tries to say, just kidding.

Which, honestly, I think I've done that in the past where it's just the way things work out. It's like there is a redeeming moment or an attempt at a redeeming moment, and I like this because there wasn't. He's very unsympathetic and hard to like. It's a weird little movie in a way. It seemed to be shot very cheaply. Yeah. Well, it's funny you say because I haven't ever done a G.I. Joe budget movie.

Yeah. But compared to what I've done before, this was very low budget. For this director, this was like eight times the budget of his last movie. And how did you get a script like that? The director, what's his name? Alex Ross Perry. Yeah. He approached you? No. the budget of his last movie and how bigger how'd you get a script like that why he's you the the director what's his name alex ross perry yeah he approached you um no i got i was sent the script um through my agent and it came with a dvd and um i was kind of taken by it honestly because it was so much bigger than a normal script. It was way thicker.

And I know it's an odd thing to have catch your attention, and I flipped through it when I first got it, and it was so descriptive. It looked almost more like a book. And I thought, someone took a lot of time to write this. I'd like to read it. But when I read it, it was the character comes out of the gate saying some pretty harsh stuff. And he's not treating the people around him very kindly.

And it kind of like rubbed up against me the wrong way. I typically, you know, I love humor that is fucked up. You know, I love humor that is fucked up. Yeah. But I typically will gravitate towards someone who is not mean to other people. He just messes up situations because he's got some problems. You know what I mean? Like, I don't gravitate to as much as, like, hey, look at Fatty over there. Yeah, yeah. As much as, like, Fatty trying to not eat bad, and he eats bad and he's like food all over you know like i i like

um more when it comes out of there so these characters doing that i was like whoa but there was something it was so elegantly composed like really the script was so beautiful like he would describe everything in the room and full of all kinds of details that were really odd like he would say um this you know he walks in the room it is all kinds of details that were really odd. He would say, he walks in the room and is filled with this. It is his birthday. But you never hear it's his birthday in the movie. Just weird details.

This is a peculiar piece. But I definitely felt like after 30 minutes of reading it, I'm going to put this down. It's too claustrophobic for me. This is too much. This character has got too much venom. But after 30 minutes of being away from it, was thinking what's going on with him i couldn't like i was addicted so i went back and i read another d pages i said oh my god i can't believe he would do that yeah put this away and that kind of went back up and back and up and back

for the whole day and at the end i thought man i really i love this thing and i love that it never has that redeeming moment. And it has some cool stuff. Like, it's all about Philip, my character. But then all of a sudden it becomes about his girlfriend. And Philip drops out of the movie. And then all of a sudden it becomes about Jonathan Pryce's character. And we drop out of the movie.

And that was unusual to me, like, shifting the narrative like that. I mean, you see it sometimes, but it's rare. He's a hell of an actor. Oh, my God. Yeah. Amazing. Yeah, like, it was surprising to see him. Like, I was like it sometimes, but it's rare. He's a hell of an actor. Oh my God. Yeah. Amazing. Yeah. Like I had,

it was surprising to see him. Like I was like, oh, it's that guy. Yeah. I was definitely very intimidated because Yilto, because I'm not trained

and he's, you know, he just come from doing King Lear. I just, I wasn't sure if it was like, like, I wasn't sure if it was like, I,

I have a car shop in a small town i do my best but there's no one really in this town who's gonna question me yeah you know like yeah you need a new this and they're like okay and all of a sudden here comes like the guy who's like you know works designs cars he's coming into my his car broke he's coming in and he's like, like, is this the guy that's going to like call bullshit? But yeah, he's amazing and to watch him work. And also, you know, he was in G.I. Joe and our budget was smaller. And I was thinking, how's this going to be for him?

There's no trailers. Yeah. There's no comforts. Well, they like to act. They like to act. That was what I was going to say. Yeah, he likes to act, and it was a real lesson in always being agile. Yeah.

Like, he didn't need anything. Yeah. He doesn't need any fancy food or anything special, and I think the less you need and the more quickly you can go to work and just pick up and leave. Yeah. Seems maybe the better. I mean, that was what I learned from him.

How long was the shoot? 25 days. Yeah, so he was in and out. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I liked the movie, and there was, like, it had sort of a Huckabee's kind of tension to it. Yeah, yeah, for sure. It's tense, and we play this,

the whole movie is sort of about these people in the worst part of their lives. And that was sort of always the idea was let's just show nine months in a terrible time for these people. And I think that was freed it up to not have a cathartic moment at the end. And, you know, it's in the spirit of those types of movies where the person at the end really isn't all that different from the person in the beginning. And, like, Alex was talking about, like, American Gigolo. Like, that movie opens with a guy driving, you know, this convertible, and it ends with him in jail. And in a way, it's a similar thing of a guy.

Like, he doesn't, like, we're not condoning the behavior. Right. Because he doesn't end up, I mean, if he had a cathartic great moment and he learned something at the end, it'd be like, well, then it's okay to be this way. But really, the girls are the only ones that get out alive. Yeah, that's right. You know, like the guys end up really screwed up. And it was a real, there was something so nice about doing that.

And also playing, like, I don't confront people really in my life. I never had to do it. I think that I always got away with humor, which led into a passive-aggressive type thing with people. With my family, I could say, like, that's bullshit. Right. But this character says exactly what he's thinking all the time, and that is not really me. And it was fun to do it all right so all right before you go here i was over at amazon yesterday uh pitching and then i told him i was talking to

you today and they're like why isn't he gonna be here today are they or something like yeah you're gonna talk to him yeah you're doing a thing with them yeah how many of you shot i'm doing uh i'm executive producing um and um writing a few of a TV show called Mozart in the Jungle. And we have 10. That's including the pilot. So we're shooting nine. And next week we start the final one. And you're a podcaster.

Well, I play a part. It's all about classical music in New York and the scene and different levels of it and the high and the low and trying to get into it. And so then I play, Malcolm McDowell plays this guy named Thomas Pembridge who's the former maestro superconductor of the New York Symphony, as we call it. But he's now on the way out. But he's there as this kind of like, like a, like a leftover king or something. He's not really sure what his job is. And in my scene with him, he's excited that he's getting an interview.

And he's putting on makeup and all this stuff. And I walk in and he's saying, so we can put the cameras over here. I was thinking we'd set the cameras here. You know, the BBC did it like this. And I think the light's very good. And I'm saying, oh, there's no cameras. Excuse me. This is a podcast. And, oh, wonderful.

That's what he says. And thrilling. And I sit down. I have a podcast called Be Sharp. Yeah. And because that's a note that doesn't exist. And my name is Bradford Sharp. Yeah. And, cause, cause that's a note that doesn't exist. And my name is Bradford Sharp. Yeah. And,

I'm a very quiet talking classical music podcaster. Yeah. Who's, but who's really like, you know, I wanted to be kind of cool and stuff. He wears a leather vest. And,

it was really fun. It was amazing to work opposite Malcolm McDowell. You're getting a couple of good English guys. We wrote this, we wrote this scene, we wrote this scene where it's an interview, but he said, can you just interview me for real? Just let the cabbages roll.

And I talked to him for 15 minutes, and he answered all these questions as this character. It was amazing. Wow. It was a thrilling moment. I mean, I was like, has he really conducted? It seemed like he had really conducted. I was like, tell me about conducting Mozart. Oh, my God, it's the best. I mean, of course like, does he, has he really conducted? It seemed like he had really, I was like, tell me about conducting Mozart. Oh my God, it's the best. I mean, you

know, of course you're in touch with God. It was, it was amazing. So yeah, it was really cool. That sounds fun. Yeah. It's been, it's been hard, but fun. What's your relationship with New York? Um, I don't live there. I know. I live in LA, but my relationship with it is, is I've never lived there, as a matter of fact. But I hear it in your music, too, a little bit.

About New York? Yeah, something about it. Well, I love it. Both my parents were from there. My dad was from Brooklyn, and my mom was from Long Island. Yeah. And it's still because I've never lived there. When I'm there, everything is beautiful to me.

It's amazing, right? Yeah. I'm like, oh, look at these buildings. Look at that. The pace. Yeah. So I'm definitely like, It's a romantic idea.

It's still romantic to me. Even when it's not romantic because for Bored to Death, you know, we'd be there for four or five months. Right. And, you know,

at the fourth month, I'm like, oh, I could go home now. Right. But it's still amazing to me. There's nothing like it. Really there's not.

When you get within the city and you're like, holy shit. Yeah, it's amazing. And the community of people that seems to be there it's really good but it's funny because i have such a positive thing alex the director of our movie it's funny because he was saying to me he's like yeah new york you know i want to show it's like cutthroat and it's claustrophobic and people walk slowly and you feel like shit and you want to get out it's loud and

you know people will take you down if they can and you want to get out, and it's loud. People will take you down if they can. I love it, and I'll never live anywhere else. I was like, wow, okay. That's how he sort of feels about it and sees it. I love it there, but I love Los Angeles because I'm from here, and I think there's, I don't know, just cheesy stuff. I like the light and the way it feels when it starts to set and I like the space

and yeah it's cooling down a little yeah I love it so what do you do today what's going on now today I'm gonna go do a few lines for

most of the jungle some ADR lines yeah and then I'm going to Chicago today you're going yeah oh well have fun it's a great city

yeah it's the best good talking to you I love Chicago it's great I really appreciate it yeah it's fun man you're a great one. I appreciate it.

All right, see, he was a nice guy. What a pleasant conversation. I love that guy. So what do I got to tell you? Go to WTFpod.com for all your WTFpod needs. Get that app. Why not? 500 plus episodes. episodes, 550 something.

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