WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 643 - Peaches

Episode Date: October 4, 2015

Peaches defies easy categorization, unless you want to define her as a multi-media event. She takes Marc on her journey, from growing up Merrill Nisker in Toronto through her artistic career as a musician and performance artist. Marc finds out what provokes Peaches and why she enjoys pushing buttons herself. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

It's hockey season, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So, no, you can't get an ice rink on Uber Eats. But iced tea, ice cream, or just plain old ice? Yes, we deliver those. Gold tenders, no. But chicken tenders, yes. Because those are groceries, and we deliver those, too.

Along with your favorite restaurant food, alcohol, and other everyday essentials. Order Uber Eats now. For alcohol, you must be legal drinking age. Please enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by region. See app for details. It's a night for the whole family. Be a part of Kids Night when the Toronto Rock take on the Colorado Mammoth

at a special 5 p.m. start time on Saturday, March 9th at First Ontario Centre in Hamilton. The first 5,000 fans in attendance will get a Dan Dawson bobblehead courtesy of Backley Construction. Punch your ticket to Kids Night on Saturday, March 9th at 5pm in Rock City at TorontoRock.com

Alright, let's do this. How are you, what the fuckers? What the fuck buddies? What the fucksters? What the fuckniks? What the fuckadelics? I am Mark Maron. This is my show, WTF.

I'm broadcasting right now from a hotel room 12 floors up, overlooking I think what might be the first beautiful fall day in New York City. Man, I didn't know if I was going to make it to New York City. It's been a long few days. And I'll tell you, last week, watching the Weather Channel or CNN or anything, it's amazing. The amount of intensity and speculation that goes into bad weather when they've got something to sink their teeth into. I didn't think I was ever going to leave Raleigh, North Carolina, which is where I was at.

I went to Raleigh, North Carolina to see my girlfriend Sarah Kane's big art show. A work on site at the Contemporary Art Museum in Raleigh. It was fucking astounding. And okay, granted, I'm biased, but I'm an art guy. I'll let it in. I'll roll it around my soul, see what moves inside, and then move on or linger, whatever you need to do in front of a piece of art.

I do not condescend immediately. It usually takes a bit of deliberation before I dismiss something in a condescending way or dismiss something at all. Usually I'll blame myself first and say, I guess I don't get that, but that's become less and less as I get older. You would think that would become more and more. But to see that fucking thing inside, I I mean she was down there for two weeks and this was a massive space and she did the entire bit of business the entire painting in all its glory live in that space

inside of like nine days and it was a lot of space I mean I I've tweeted pictures of it but if you're in, if you're down there in Raleigh or in that area within a hundred miles, I would say go to the Contemporary Art Museum of Raleigh and see this piece of work because I've never seen anything like it. And again, I'm emotionally involved with this woman, but when I got there and I sat there with it before people came in for the opening, I got a little teary-eyed and I couldn't explain it. Obviously, I was proud of her. And obviously, I was impressed by her.

But the art moves you. God damn. It's got some power to it. So now I just have to deal with the fact that this woman that I'm seeing and who is in my life, you know, is this fucking genius, which is fine with me. I mean, primarily because there's no way I can do what she does. So I'm not threatened at all. I'm man enough to admit that. Sometimes, you know, you get into those situations where it's like, yeah, you're great at that. But you know, if I could do it, I can't do it. I can't do it at all. And I respect it. So that was pretty exciting. Did I mention the guest today? I did not, I don't think.

Very important guest speaking of art, actually, in a way. Peaches, who I have to be honest with you, I knew very little about, but I'd received her book. I talked to Kim Gordon about her, and I started poking around looking at her work, and I this book that you know had a lot of her performance or photographs of her performances and again very easy to to sort of be like you know performance art that's ridiculous this is this is like you know bad comedy or what kind of clown clown bullshit is this or whatever you're going to do why be a slave to your cultural expectations that are probably ingrained in you without even your permission? Why not push them out a bit and let it in? Why not open your heart to things that you don't quite understand if it is a safe environment to do so?

Art shouldn't be safe at all, but taking it in should be relatively safe. art shouldn't be safe at all, but taking it in should be relatively safe. You know, you shouldn't have to, you shouldn't have to see a piece of art in a free fall without a shoot. If, if you feel that way because of the art, then that's some good art there. But you know, that shouldn't be the opening of the exhibition is, uh, you have to jump out of a plane and it's the last thing you see. Look over there. You see that thing in the sky that's blowing up and spinning around. Okay. Hope you enjoyed that. R.I.P.

The point is I was, I was very taken with the, with the audacity and the persistence and the, the, the, the strange courage of peaches work that I saw, you know, in print in terms of photographs of her performances.

And then I listened to her music and it was fun. It seemed to come from a place. She seemed to have a thing, Peach's work that I saw in print in terms of photographs of her performances. And then I listened to her music and it was fun. It seemed to come from a place. She seemed to have a thing, but she's quite a spectacle. And she does a lot of stuff with prosthetics and costumes and haircuts and penises and things and boobs and a lot of different stuff. So I did a little research. I poked around a bit and learned some stuff about her. And this was the most interesting thing. There's a thing I do that I'm not sure is correct. And that is, there's two things is dismissing people as crazy without

deeply acknowledging my own particular insanity. The other thing is, is assuming people who are uniquely talented in an uncomfortable way are damaged, I think is wrong. I think it might be wrong to assume people are damaged just because of their profession in most cases. Again, look at yourself. Where are you coming from? What's your lot in life? What have you chosen to do with your life? are the reasons what are you hiding from what are the emotional scars that you're trying to solve it was one of those situations where i'm speaking directly about my guest today peaches where i'm like she's got to be out of her fucking mind which is a fairly conservative frightened way to assess something you don't understand without really knowing and And you'll find in my conversation with her, I was amazed at how grounded and focused and sort of deliberate she is in her path to

her creativity and to her actual work. So I learned a lesson. Don't make assumptions, especially negative pathological assumptions about someone's psychological disposition based on their work because you might just be projecting and why don't you reckon with your own shit and hopefully whatever they're producing makes you go that full route and ask those questions of yourself so you can do that. Sometimes art's supposed to do that. Wow, this is fucking nuts. Well, why is it affecting you like that?

Shut up, man. Yeah, I did the New Yorker Festival interview with Khalifa Sana, who I'd never met before. He writes for the New Yorker. He writes a lot about music and stuff. He's interviewed me before about some stuff. But he did a good job, and I want to thank everybody. He writes for the New Yorker. He writes a lot about music and stuff. He's interviewed me before about some stuff, but he did a good job and I want to thank everybody for coming out for that.

That was a fun conversation. I like to talk. I'm always surprised that people want to see me talk in other, sometimes I think like, don't I talk enough? Is anyone going to come to this? Well, how could they, why would they come see me talk more

in a different context? But I'm glad you did because something always exciting happens when I do talk. And tomorrow, I will be at Princeton. Princeton University in New Jersey, my friends. I will be doing a free lecture, part of their lecture series out there. That starts at 6 o'clock on tuesday october uh sixth i will be uh at princeton princeton in the mccosh hall room 50 i'll be there giving a rap you're free to come new jersey people i'm going to be in the same room where Albert Einstein presented

his theory of relativity thanks for telling me that guy who's running the lecture oh man not a lot of pressure I better put something together right I'm glad I made it out of Raleigh

boy that hurricane that didn't happen almost had me buying a house down there so I didn't buy a house of raleigh boy that hurricane that didn't happen almost had me buying a house down there so i didn't buy a house in raleigh i'm in new york the clouds have broken and what i was going to say is i was surprised at how relieved i was to see rain and to experience the beginning of a season because la is slowly drying out on all levels. It's fucking apocalyptic there. I'm getting to a point, people. I'm getting to a point where I'm about to run. So let's now talk to my guest back in the garage.

Peaches, her new album Rub is available now. And Peaches is on tour as well at the current time. Go to peachesrocks.com to see where she's going to be. Also, that lovely coffee table book I got. So this is my conversation with Peaches. an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category,

and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. Calgary is a city built by innovators. Innovation is in the city's DNA. And it's with this pedigree that bright minds and future-thinking problem solvers

are tackling some of the world's greatest challenges from right here in Calgary. From cleaner energy, safe and secure food, efficient movement of goods and people, and better health solutions, Calgary's visionaries are turning heads around the globe. Thank you. Beaches. Want to work hands? Yes. With your mullet hawk? My mullet hawk. I'm kind of like rocking five different hairdos. You got some, what is that, a fade?

I got it. And a mullet. Yep. And a mohawk. And tips. Are those what those are called? Are they called like blonde tips? Frosting.

Frosting. I think that's the old school name. Yeah. And it's all your real hair? Of course. Oh, stop it. Come on. Here's the deal with you and me. Kim Gordon mentioned you.

Yeah. And then you and I did some twittering at each other. Tweeting. Tweeting. We tweeted. Tweeted. And then I'm like, all righting at each other. Tweeting. Tweeting. We tweeted. Tweeted. And then I'm like, all right, I got to reckon with peaches. Yeah, figure out what this is all about.

And then I immersed myself in the music and the world and the book. And then there was that moment where like, where the fuck have I been for the last 15 years to like not be up to speed? But you're not that easy to find, are you? Well, Peaches is a lot of different things, right? Yeah, it's a world. Yeah, I mean, but also it's a fruit. It's a very popular southern name. It's like, you know, R.I.P. Peaches Geldof.

There's, you know, just so... Well, I mean, I was specific with my search. No, but that comes up too. Really? Yeah. Well, why Peaches? It's actually from a Nina Simone song. Oh, really?

Yeah. I just watched a documentary on her. Yeah. Crazy. It's incredible there was a lot of things i didn't know really yeah i didn't know that her music was banned like that heavily when she became very politically active yeah yeah and that it was a threat i i had no idea that you know i knew she was a powerful force right but i didn't realize how much of a threat it

was right yeah during that time where you know there's that that weird uh kind of combination of of mania and activism oh yes that she just took over the top yeah that was i i didn't know her stuff that well and i certainly didn't know her story and it was sort of heartbreaking and amazing yeah did you listen to her when you were a kid um yeah i listened to her a lot but that song for women yeah at the at the end, she says, they call me Peaches. And that's where you got it from? So I was like, oh, I want her to sing that to me. I'm going to be Peaches. She's not going to be like, they call me Meryl.

Meryl's the real name? Yeah. Meryl what? Meryl Nisker. It's Jewish. It's Jewish. It doesn't sound so Jewish, does it? Not really.

I know those SKs with the ER sometimes. Yeah, Polish. Yeah, I'm? Not really. I know those SKs with the ER sometimes. Yeah, Polish. Yeah, I'm part Polish Jew. Uh-huh. Yeah, we all came from the same. What's the other part? I think there's a lot of Polish Jew, and I think there might be some Lithuanian Jew in there maybe.

Maybe some Austrian Jew. Because most of the... Yeah. You too? I think my Austrian-Polish, it's kind of like melded because of, you know, got all. Sure, yeah, all that Eastern European Jew stuff. But you come from Canada? Yeah.

So your family ended up there and mine ended up here. How'd they get to Canada? Half my family went to New York and half went to Canada. Actually, they went to a farm in Edmonton. Really? Yeah. And they were like, what are we doing here? We're not farmers.

But isn't it weird how they end up there? How do Jews end up there? I don't even, I never know like, you know, what the process is. I don't know. But you didn't grow up in. They're wanderers. Yeah, they are. Yeah.

They're on the run is what they, yeah. Wait, what part did you grow up in though? Toronto. Toronto. Toronto. Toronto. Toronto. Is that how you say it? Toronto. Toronto. Yeah. Toronto. Toronto. Is that how you say it?

Toronto. Toronto. Yeah. That's a good city. Yeah. It's a big city. It's a real city. It is.

Well, yeah, it likes to think it's a real city. Well, I mean, it is for a Canadian city. For a Canadian city, it is. You know it's a real city for Canadians because all Canadians from everywhere else hate Toronto. Oh, you're from Toronto. Oh, the big city. It's the corporate city. Oh, corporate city? Yeah, ooh, Toronto. Oh, you're from Toronto. Oh, the big city. That's the corporate city. Oh, corporate city?

Yeah. But it's weird. I try to figure out what the difference is between a Canadian city and American cities. It just seems to be a lack of general fear and terror in the street. You'll just hear a lot of, sorry. Oh, sorry. Canadians will bump into you and

the other person will apologize. Oh, right. Oh, sorry, you bumped into me. But what kind of families did you grow up in, though? Can I ask these questions? Yeah, you can ask me everything. How you evolved into this event. Into the...

This ongoing event that is Peaches. Like suburban Jewish kid. Really? Do you have a brother and sisters? Yeah, I have a brother and a sister. So it's a big little Jewish family. Really? Do you have brother and sisters? Yeah, I have a brother and a sister. So it's a big little Jewish family. Yeah. Conservative Jews?

Conservative. It's just so funny that it's conservative because we were conservative for no reason. But it doesn't mean anything really. Yeah,

it means tradition. It means like I'm still scared of my parents and they were conservative so we're going to be doing that too.

But my, but um, Were you bar mitzvahed? This is the sad part. What? Because my brother um we bought mitzvah this is the sad part what because my brother we went my brother got bar mitzvahed in israel oh the whole thing we all went the big yeah and um we all got dressed up like canadians you know for bar mitzvah and then um it was in like um where because my uncle lives in um the nege Really? Yeah. So we went to their synagogue and everybody else is in like shorts and all the bar mitzvah boys are just like, yeah, another day, you know.

Right, right. And we're all like uptight in our outfits. Dresses and suits. Yeah. And then my, so my brother had that. Yeah. My sister had a choice. Right.

Either having a bat mitzvah. Are they older? Yeah, they're both older. Okay, okay. So my sister's three years older yeah she had a choice to either have a bat mitzvah or to go on a van tour across israel with other 13 year olds for a month the teen tour yeah yeah no no just like in a van not even like i'm not a bus not just like a van with like 10 other kids. Right.

And she took that? Yeah. How amazing. Right. What a great experience. All right. So that's what they got. Yeah.

And when it came to you? Basement party. They were about to renovate the basement. But you had a bat mitzvah. No. You didn't. I just had a basement party. They're like, your brother's DJing.

That's it? That's it. Yeah. That's probably what started your whole career. That was the bitterness from the basement party. Yeah. that's it yeah that's probably what that's what probably what started your whole career that was the bitterness from the basement party yeah i you know well i went to half day hebrew half to english school really yeah so i i really was always like why i can't even learn english how can i learn hebrew too and i was very spaced out very spaced out kid but they were but they were really jewy i mean that's not like you you know, sending... I mean, we all...

Eventually, you get to Israel once. Yeah. No, no, no. Me and my sister both went to half-day Hebrew, half-day English school. She can speak Hebrew. I can't because I just spaced out. I was like, this is too much for me. But do your parents both speak Hebrew?

No. What's your old man do? He's an accountant. He used to be a pro baseball player. Really? Yeah. In Canada? Yeah.

He got discovered in a in a like a small park because you know like when his parents came over you know they'd always bring people over right and they had no money so everybody would live in their house right they basically lived under the dining room table and then give away their room and everything and uh one one person who stayed at their house took my father who was um they had two sons my my father was the younger one and he's like kid i'm gonna show you how to pitch yeah and he would pitch every day with my father and then and your dad became a pitcher yeah yeah he was a pitcher and he was uh a pitcher at the time where you could still be a batter uh-huh so i mean

for what what team was like the Cleveland Indian Farm team. So he never made the majors? No. His mother died when he was like 21. And he was just like, I want to go home to my girlfriend and get married.

And then he became accountant. But he's the most contented man. He's like, no regrets. So happy. He's been with my mother since she was 14 and he was 17 really yeah and they love each other still yeah they're in their 70s they're so in love it's it's it's that's so sweet yeah it's you're just like i'll never have that why do we assume that i don't know it's amazing we're getting up there like i've been through a few i've been through a few i tried i mean i try you know i have a good model so i've tried you know i don't know what what causes the uh the fundamental inability or the dissatisfaction

or the hunger to keep you know to not relax into it or something i think that it seems like there is a lot of compromise that you just have to live with. I think, you know, I was married. For how long? Well, I was with this person for nine years. Yeah. But, I mean, he was 21, I was 24. We got married when I was 28.

Really? Yeah. So you were with him. In Canada. Right. So how long were you with him before you got married? Five years. And what did that got married? Four, five years. And what did that guy do?

He was an artist. Painter? He was a painter and he, a sculptor. He was really interested in making like action figures. So he used to like, and he thought he used me as a model. So he'd like stare at my face and all my moving parts. And then he made an action figure of me with like 13 movable parts and for a year he was just like carving it and staring at me what were you doing at that time um well

i was doing music at night and um my day job doing music with children you were are you like what like how did you play piano guitar guitar I was learning acoustic guitar. And you were 21? Yeah, 21. And this is like when you were getting back to your parents, what did your mom do? She didn't. She. Just hung out? Hung out.

But at 30, she went back to school. Psychology. Oh, really? Yeah. Parent effectiveness training courses. And she started smoking. Of course. Because she had to be intense as a psychologist.

Yes. The smoking kind. Yeah. The thoughtful, intense one. Yeah. She is. That's exactly her. Really?

Yeah. Very thoughtful, intense. And did her parenting shift at 30? How old were you when she was doing that, smoking and being a psychologist? I think I was probably like 12. Right? Yeah. So was there a big shift in the approach?

No, I didn't notice I was too spaced out. Why were you so spaced out? I don't know. I was just spaced out. I just didn't understand why all these... I don't know. I just didn't understand why I had to go to this kind of school or why I lived in this life.

It wasn't more like a defiant thing. It was more like, I just don't get it. You felt out of place? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just uncomfortable around the regular people, around the life. I didn't even know why, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

It wasn't like I was a loner. I had friends and everything. But inside, you were like, I'm different than this. No, no. I wasn't even like, no, I was just spaced out. Really? I was just like, what's going on yeah no drugs no drug i mean i was 12 right well you know it starts young i'm maybe not in canada but here

you know you can get going pretty early yeah it's true you can so so you you're you're doing that you're being a spaced out kid and then you when does the compulsion to create happen in general? Because, I mean, with somebody that does all the things that you do, it's hard to sort of categorize it probably until later, but you seem to be pretty open to creativity in a big way. So was there a specific thing that kind of triggered you? Well, I memorized songs all the time. One of those kids.

I was just like almost in an autistic fashion. Like I remember every song. I used to like New Year's when I was six, I would stay up and listen to AM radio and write down like the top 100. And then I would like have of that year and it would be very important to me to listen to all of them and to know all to know all of them and i'd be so excited if i knew every song or things like that so i was really into music in my head but i didn't

know it meant anything or right and i didn't think you could be a musician if you didn't have training right yeah or anybody else around you that was doing it. Who were the bands that sort of moved you early on? Was it like disco music? Rock music? All of it. Yeah, yeah. I remember hearing Talking Heads on like a classic rock station.

I'm like, this is different. This is it. This is like not classic rock, but it's on this station. I don't understand why, but I like it. Like Psycho Killer or something? Right, right. Yeah. And you're like, what?

I was like, why is this here? Yeah. And also, you know, when I was 12. Yeah. Usually it's always when I was seven, but it seems like today when I was 12. 12 is a big time for you. That was a pivotal year, the 12. Yeah.

Well, we used to have these. Before the basement party. Yeah. Right before. Leading up to. Yeah. But we used to have these um before the basement party yeah right before but leading up to yeah but we used to have uh school dances right this is after i went to have to hebrew have to when i went to the public school which is ironically called zion heights junior high but it was not a jewish no no but we would have school dances and they would play a lot of early hip hop, like first hip hop songs and early funk music and disco.

Right. Yeah. So that was like 70... 78. Right. Yeah. And so there was like a large... Music you can dance to.

Yeah. And I loved to dance. You did? Yes. My dad and my brother made me play hockey because I'm Canadian. You played hockey. Yeah, and all the games were Saturday nights. But I was invited to like bat mitzvahs and bar mitzvahs.

So it was like a big problem for me. I'm not going to play hockey. I don't want to play hockey, Dad. I want to dance to the bat mitzvah. How were you on the skates? Pretty good? Horrible. It was horrible. I wanted a hockey success story.

There's none. What did your siblings end up doing in life in life now um well my brother is a uh editor yeah yeah for a film editor yeah he works on tv right now you have two and i have a sister and what she do um she is living life and she's the most beautiful person ever she She has a debilitating disease. She has multiple sclerosis. And it's a galloping form. And she's just trying to get through the day all the time. But she's so positive and like the biggest inspiration of my life.

Is she in Canada? No, she's in White Plains, New York. Oh, yeah? Yeah. And do you spend time with her whenever you can? Yes, I try to spend a lot of time with her. She's an inspiration because of her determination? Yeah. Yeah.

It's kind of amazing when you know somebody or have somebody in your life that has to struggle with something so real and horrible and they can still manage. She has so much love for everybody because I have Jewish guilt. Sure.

And also with her, because I'm like, oh, yeah, I'm just going to Japan to play some shows. And she's like, oh, my God, you're so amazing. I can't believe it. So excited. But not in a phony way. She's just seriously excited. Right. Because I don't want to make her feel bad.

Right, right. But she loves it. She vicariously lives through know, lives through it. So she's excited for your success. Yeah. I have to, like, when I watch your stuff or when I listen to it, you know, in terms of how it's provocative, at what point did your parents say, like, I guess she's doing good? When they read about it in, you know, the newspaper, you know, then they're like, oh. Because they're friends.

My mother had a harder time. My dad was like, oh, we listened to Donna Summer in my car. Bad girls. I know what you're doing. And then I remember he read an article on Lil' Kim once. And he was like, oh, I read about Lil' Kim. I know what you're doing. I know what you're up to.

Yeah, yeah. Well, so let's get back around to what provoked you creatively. So you're listening to music, but at some point you started to evolve into this performance artist slash techno goddess thing. Provocateur. But it didn't start out that way it doesn't sound like it's all very organic i mean i like i said i didn't even know what art school was like i didn't know what that was you know i didn't but you were 12 you know no but also like even i didn't i didn't i didn't know about contemporary art or any of that stuff no my my know, we had like a Dali print on my wall. Of course.

And I was like, why is that, you know, watch melting or like Don Quixote, Picasso, you know. But, you know, I didn't know anything about that. So something must have blown your mind at some point. Yeah, I mean, it was all blowing my mind. I didn't, you know, realize it. And then there was like a big theater element. So because, you you know we'd go

to visit family in new york and we'd go to broadway shows and things like that yeah and and uh i i it's such a typical there's two really typical jewy stories okay at my uh cousin's bar mitzvah when i was seven yeah i i asked my mom if I could sing with the band. And she said, can you sing? And I'm like, yeah, I think I can sing. So I sang with the band. Did you nail it? I nailed it and I had to sing it at every bar mitzvah and wedding and stuff like that.

So I mean, then the secret was out. Meryl will sing. Meryl can sing. And so every Barbra Streisand album or anything that came out was like, there's a new Barbra Streisand. Can you learn Evergreen? So, you know, I would sing all that. And you liked learning lyrics. So it wasn't a problem.

I loved it. I loved it. I remember waking up one morning and on the radio was like, Barbra Streisand and Neil Diamond singing, like, You Don't Bring Me Flies. I ran into my parents' room like, oh, my God, they're singing together. And you knew both of them? Yeah.

Well, because that's all we listened to, you know. And then my parents were like, yeah, that's cool. And I couldn't believe they weren't as excited as I was. About Neil Diamond and Barbra Streisand? Singing together. So you graduate high school? Yeah. Well, so I was very into theater because that's all I knew.

I was wondering about that. Yeah, so I was very into theater, and then we had this really special program in my high school where in grade 11, see, that's a Canadian thing. Yeah. You guys say like 11th grade. Okay, well, similar though, right? You do this. So grade 11, you were- You go to 12, right? Grades? grade. Okay. Well, similar though, right? You do this. So grade 11. You go to 12, right?

Grades? 13. Okay. Yeah. So in grade 11, they split everybody into actors and grade 12 was producers and grade 13 was directors. So it was a real program. Yeah.

Yeah. So I got really into it and I couldn't wait to be the director. And then. You started as an actor. Yeah. I had to be an actor. And what plays like when you went to New York, what do you remember being like, oh my God. I don't know, like just like Fiddler, nothing.

Like Fiddler on the Roof or like West Side Story and stuff like that. Like the revival of Fiddler with Topol as the main guy back again. Probably. And I think I stood up in the like aisle and was dancing and my parents were like, sit down. Or actually they let me. You're like a dorky Jewish girl. So dorky. Yeah. And then Fame, sit down. Actually, they let me. You're like a dorky Jewish girl. So dorky. Yeah.

And then Fame. You know, Fame was like my favorite movie. And then there's that girl Doris who's singing like her mom's making her sing. Right. Yeah, yeah. She was my favorite. I didn't care what, of course. Yeah, yeah.

So you're in 11th grade and you're acting in shows. I was acting and then I was doing production. And I started to fight with teachers, like, why are we doing this? And stuff like that. As a director? Yeah, yeah. Or as a student and just questioning things. Right. The rebellion started to happen, finally.

Yeah, and then also I started to care about my subjects and actually and writing and literature you know things like that so I started to get into it and then I went to theater school for university for all of it you finished?

no I didn't I actually dropped acid and went what am I doing really you had that experience? I really had that experience I dropped acid and the next what am I doing? Really? You had that experience? I really had that experience. I dropped acid and the next day I was like, I do not want to be in this program. And then I took all arts. I took mixed media courses. But you stayed in school?

Yeah. Yeah. I stayed in school. And you got a degree in arts? I got a degree. Yeah. And you did like what? All painting, drawing, sculpture?

Oh, I took a 101 visual arts class, and it was horrible. I've never life drawn in my life. Yeah. And the teacher would come by and be like, she had this English accent. She'd be like, you're stupid. What are you doing? And yelling at me.

And I'd be like, I don't know. It's 101 drawing. I'm trying. And then um had to do a sculpture and i got scared so i just asked my friend to do it for me because i was like yeah and she she made me really manly with like this big chin and i got in trouble for that for your friend's chin of you she's just like that doesn't look like you you know so they were really sort of strict figurative kind of like the first half of the year and the second half was all like breakout breakout like um conceptual and

then i was like i get it this is you know and we learned about like duchamp and then um i don't know you had to make a monster out of found objects and oh that's the good stuff yeah and then i was like made some blender monster and she loved it she's like now you're brilliant what happened to you same teacher yeah yeah Yeah, yeah, same teacher. That's amazing. Yeah, that was fun. So the acid thing, what was that? How did that happen to a dorky Jewish girl?

Who were you hanging out with that said, do this? Oh, no, no, no. It was just like, you know, Monday nights we would go dancing at this place, RPM. So one night we're like, let's do acid. And that was a tough few days. No, it was just fun. I think I did only like a half. I've only done acid twice. And that was a tough few days. No, it was just fun. I think I did only like a half. I've only done acid twice.

And it was just like sparkly. But then I just went, I am dropping out of that program. That was the inspiration. The life changer. Yeah. When did you start playing the guitar? Probably at the end of high school. I always like dated guys who played guitar instead of playing guitar myself at first.

And then I realized, I'm like, it's me who wants to play guitar, not dating a guy playing guitar, you know? So. Did you date rock guys or folk guys or? The first one was a folk guy who played like. No, he played. It was horrible. He played.

Actually, I was better friends with his brother and then I went out with him. It was like, no, he played, it was horrible. He played, actually, I was better friends with his brother, and then I went out with him. It was like, not good. Yeah. But he played like Piano Man on the guitar. That's wrong. Right. How can you play Piano Man on guitar?

Yeah. But you liked the song? Not really. I was just like, he plays guitar. You know, I was like 15 or something. Uh-huh. And then the next guy? He was more like into African rhythms.

The next guy was? Yeah, yeah. He was really talented. Yeah, what was that called? Juju pop? Yeah, yeah, juju music. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Stuff like that, yeah.

And then the next guy? Then the next guy was a girl who played acoustic guitar. And then I was like, yeah, we should jam together. And then she's like, I only play my own songs. Oh, okay. And I was like, oh, you only play your own songs. And then we ended up having a band together which was my first band what was that called mermaid cafe and that's where it started yeah with uh it was like uh after a joni mitchell song so so you were doing folk yeah we got one gig at this kind of legendary small folk club

where like the bare naked Ladies started and other people. And we brought a lot of people. So he gave us a weekly gig and then we just kept writing songs. And then that's when I was playing folk music. And then another friend joined who had taught me to play guitar. Joseph Greenbaum joined. And then it was only Jewish kids coming to our shows and i was like i'm trying to break away from the scene was the girl you were seeing jewish she was jewish

too yeah yeah but she was she's not jewish her family they weren't very right it didn't matter it's just like you know it's toronto there's like a you know yeah yeah's Toronto. There's like, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, my God. I would not have assumed. Jewy, Jewy Louie. We just make assumptions about people. You know, I did a little research. I knew you were Jewish, but I didn't know how entrenched. Yeah. But I broke away.

Yeah. But did you break away hostily? No, no. I was just, but it was, you know, the folk band was quite popular with the Jewish community. Yeah. Actually, there's a documentary. Like older people would come out? No, no.

It was all like 14-year-old girls like crying to our music. Did you say a documentary? There's a documentary that two of those girls are doing right now about the relationship between queer culture and Jewish summer camps. Really? Because that's where we met, me and this girl. Did you go to Jewish summer camp? I did. I also taught dramage at another camp

where the kids would go home and the counselors would stay over. Sure. And what is the connection between queer culture and Jewish summer camp? Nothing. That's what they're trying. And also...

Oh, they're trying to prove something? No, no, they're not trying to prove it. And also Jewish culture and Jewish summer camps, that's what they're trying and also oh they're trying to prove I didn't know no no they're not trying to prove it and they're also also Jewish culture and Jewish summer camps right that's also like

what is the connection there yeah and then camps and camps I went to camps I went to a Jewish day camp yeah yeah

Kaitana Kaitana I think so not Kaikana Kaitana I have a friend named Kaiki it's very difficult a Jewish friend?

No, no. He's Brazilian. And I was like, I don't want to call you that. I feel weird calling you that. But isn't that weird, though? There is this weird connection that I think Jews feel. And I haven't talked about it in a while. But there's a familiarity there.

When you walk into a room full of Jews, you're like, I get it. Yeah. And even, I imagine, that's the same in Canada. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. There's I imagine that's the same in Canada. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. There's just this thing that we, it's a weird kind of exceptionalism. You're sort of brought up as a Jew

to believe the Jews are insanely special. Yeah. Yeah, and there you are with a bunch of Jews singing songs. Great. But what is, but there's no Jewish culture involved in these summer camps.

It's just hanging. No, really? No singing? No. None? There was none in the ones I went to. I think maybe it was just a plan to keep us marrying each other. This is what they were talking about, the two queer girls.

Yeah, they're just like, and then what were we supposed to do being queer? Right. And then Mermaid Cafe, our big song that people would come and cry to right it was about two young boys who were in love and the mother catches them in bed and one of the boys runs out of the house and gets on his motorcycle and drives away and gets hit by a bus you know so really so dramatic that was your big song yeah who wrote that one? Andy D, the other girl. Uh-huh. Yeah. And did- She wrote a motorcycle.

It was kind of about her. Uh-huh. But not the Park Getty Kid. But you didn't want to make it girls? No, she made it about boys. I don't know why. It was just- But was that the first sort of time you started to kind of push the envelope a little bit

and present that life? I don't think I even thought about it as uh pushing the envelope no but i mean like how was it being received about you know having a song a relationship about two boys who are in love with each other that was like totally the song and i was like all the kid the jewish kids in the you know heteronormative community they loved it it was like they were also like, Auntie and Meryl are sleeping together. There was also that, right?

So the gossip was there. Yeah, yeah, of course. Heteronormative, that's the word? That's the classification? Heteronormative. I've never heard that before. Really? I like it.

No, I mean, I'm not up to speed on the uh classifications yeah of us all it's not really yeah i guess it's not really i guess i'm kind of heteronormative i'm okay with it welcome yeah thanks so how do you get from playing in a folk duo to fancy pants hoodlum how does that happen um because i didn't want to play folk music anymore so i just started experimenting around so with what with other musicians yeah like jazzers or whatever yeah and just like uh using my voice more a la you know i love nina hagen or you know uh-huh d'amanda galas and just like d'amanda galas that was heavy shit man yeah she's amazing do you know her? I do know her. She's a really sweet, beautiful person.

I remember when those first couple records were huge for a while. Oh, the one with John Paul Jones? Yeah, yeah. That was a while. Early 90s, yeah. So you started to get into that. Did you sort of shift peer groups? Yeah, I mean, I was... started to get into that did you sort of shift uh peer groups um yeah i mean i was even before like mermaid cafe i was already living downtown toronto with right you know different friends who i met at uh university yeah yeah and stuff like that so dancers and

musicians right you know yeah who weren't jewish who weren't jewish and now how are your parents like handling all this? No, they're fine with that. It was all good because I was still in Toronto. But wasn't there the fear like, she's going to be an artist? Oh, no, no, no. They didn't care about that.

No, they had a problem with, you know, with me dating a woman. They did. Yeah. I mean, that's how I, you know, stopped living at home. What they'd say? What was their approach like it was just like

are you gay yeah and i was like kind of laughing like oh my god my parents are asking me if i'm gay i don't even know it's like i like people yeah you know and and did they it was funny yeah it's funny because i think my dad was like trying to be angry uh Uh-huh. In my mind, I was like, he's not really angry. But my mother was. Yeah. Yeah. She's come a long way. Yeah.

I mean, she was very open and liberal, but still, you know, when it's your own child, it's quite different. That's sort of interesting, isn't it? Yeah, it's very interesting. I know it's a bad word, but I mean. Yeah, yeah. No, but it's appropriate. Yeah.

But I mean, how did she reconcile that? I mean, and she was the one that reacted. Is it out of fear? Or do they think, oh, your life is going to be so difficult? That's what it is also. I think she's just worried that it's the 1950s still and that life is going to be so difficult if you have an interracial marriage. People are going to judge you yeah you're never

going to be able to go outside yeah yeah things like that so it's weird about parents especially open-minded ones when people get into the arts or have sexual preferences that they don't agree with you know their anger is is is is really this weird concern yeah like you know how are you gonna exist yeah it's like i could basically i couldn't deal with that if that was me you know, how are you going to exist? Yeah, it's like I could basically, I couldn't deal with that if that was me, you know, also. Right, yeah, yeah, yeah. And how did she eventually come around, the smoking psychologist? The smoking psychologist, she'll never like that girl. Oh, that one.

Yeah, she'll never like her. That one girl. Yeah, she'll never like that girl. Because she sees that girl as the one that did it? Yeah, I don't know. So, whatever. It's fine. It's to this day? Yeah. She's not going to like that girl. Yeah, she'll never like that. Because she sees that girl as the one that did it? Yeah, I don't know. So whatever. It's fine. It's to this day?

She's not going to like that. Yeah, even if I play shows in Toronto and if Andy comes in, my mother's still a bit like, hello, Andy. Hello. It's fun. It's fun for me. I'm always like, Andy's here. Oh, that's interesting.

So when did it, because, I mean, when I was listening to the music and filling my head with Peaches material, which I do, and I don't always know. You're rubbing your head while you're saying this in closing. I'm like, was it all right for you? No, it was great. It was great. But like, I started to realize that, you know, probably seeing you live and experiencing, you know, what you do on stage and how it sort of is put together there.

I mean, the music's great, but it seems like a lot of the stuff is a visual experience. I mean, even the videos, the album covers, but then the few live things I was able to see, it seems like half, if not more, of the experience of what you do is the visual element.

Yeah, it could be for some people. For other people, they don't even know my name, But half, if not more, of the experience of what you do is the visual element. Yeah. It could be for some people. For other people, they don't even know my name, but they know songs like Fuck the Pain Away or Boys Want to Be Here. Sure. You know, without knowing me. Right. Like, I've met people, you know, like kids, and they're like, so what do you do? I'm like, oh, you know, I'm an artist on Peaches.

And they're like, oh, yeah. Yeah. What do you sing? And I'm like, electro music. And they're like, oh, yeah. I'm like, you know that song Fuck the Pain Away? They're like, fuck the pain away. That's my jam. Yeah. And I'm like, that's me. And they're like, oh yeah. Yeah. What are you singing? I'm like, electro music. And they're like, oh yeah. I'm like, you know that song Fuck the Pain Away? They're like, fuck the pain away, that's my jam.

Yeah. And I'm like, that's me. And they're like, what? You know, I love that moment. Because to me, that's even the music transcending any image, any message, any, you know. Right.

So that's exciting for me. Or when it's used on certain shows like South Park or 30 Rock. And I'm just like, whoa. It's like beyond anything that I have to feed. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It exists without you and will exist without you forever. And it's just out there.

And people have a relationship with it. That was a hit? Fuck the Playaway? It was, but of course it was never radio or anything. Hard to be played yeah but everybody knew it this was like just before you know internet was right yeah it was like 2000 just missed the cut just barely no yeah but which was great because um i was getting you know attention from a lot of huge artists like loving this song and everything and also yeah just it was going around people are

always like oh yeah that that was my you know i've conceived in that album i've given birth to that album i came out to the song that's my high school song that's you know yeah so many stories yeah what's a powerful message yeah what's actually a breakup song well yeah obviously yeah obviously yeah how are you gonna get rid of heartbreak? You got to fuck your way through it. Yeah, so. Yeah. Does that work?

It was fun. It was fun. It was fun at the time. You feel like the tricky thing about fucking the pain away is that, you know, then all of a sudden at the end of your, you know, your self-therapy of fucking pain away, you're like, oh my God. I think I. I'm tired.

Yeah, I fucked my heart numb. I don't know. I'm tired now. Yeah. I fucked my heart numb. I don't know. I'm tired now. Yeah. But the, well, you hope maybe something will come out, you know,

like you're just trying to be yourself again. Right. Sure. And then maybe something, you know, something will stick, you know, you know,

that theory of like, I'm not going to think about it. Who was the breakup with? What's her name? No, no, no. It was,

uh, with the, my ex-husband. The eight-year guy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So you went from the folky relationship with, what's her name? I want to know her name.

Andy D. Andy D. Just to irritate your mom. So Andy D. Would you consider her the first love of your life? No. No. Robert Morton was the first love of my life. When Ibert rob robert morton was the first love of

my life so you met when the high school relationship yeah and then the husband's name jordan sonnenberg wow he really kept in the tribe yeah well jordan he was not into being jewish at all except for his name yeah yeah yeah and he was the he was the music an artist he was an artist who made action figures. He made incredible things. He also made a model of himself with a big claw and a big heart on. I would really like to relieve myself, but I can't because I have a big claw for a hand. So was he like... Does that mean I was bad in bed? It just was like, oh, wait.

That means he's got some problems. Yes. So he had a lot of issues to work out. But was that an inspiration to you? It sounds like your reverence for the dude in terms of how he conceived of things visually was pretty high. Yeah. He also was like a wealth of knowledge for like, you know, visual arts. And he went to art school.

He'd be reading about something. He'd be like, what's that? He'd be like, I'm reading a book about the situationists i'm like who are they and then he'd roll his eyes so right that relationship okay well because you know that movie with bernadette peters slaves of new york yeah yeah and the boy you remember their relationship and not really and then he's like what is it i hate about you most we used to say that to each other oh that was the tagline kind of like kind of is it I hate about you most? We used to say that to each other. Oh, that was the tagline? Yeah, that's kind of like.

You kind of picked it up? It was kind of right. Yeah? Yeah, how we were just like, there was like a negative kind of thing. It sounds like true love. Yeah, it was true love, so we broke up. But you got married first. We got married.

We were like, yeah, it was my idea. Was it ironic or was it? I was like, let's get married. Maybe we can move to the States. Maybe it'll be easier. We'll get green cards, you know. We did love each other, but it was more like, let's get married. Maybe we can move to the States. Maybe it'll be easier. We'll get green cards. We did love each other, but it was more like, let's get married. Okay.

You weren't thinking about having a family? No. No, just getting married. He has a family now. He does? Yeah. He leveled off? Is he still an artist?

He's still an artist. That's good. Yeah. He hung in there. Yeah. yeah but um when did you when did it start to like when did you start to put together this very versatile stage persona where you were you you kind of found your groove i know it happens organically but at some point you you knew you were gonna you know challenge assumptions well i guess after you know fancy pants hoodlum was fun for me but i didn't really have an audience

right um i was asked by a friend's band spin the Susan you know like a lazy Susan that was the name of their band they were very much like a beyond the valley of the dolls kind of band and the way they were presented themselves presented and the music okay and um there were two girls in in that band and I was like girls making music awesome so we played together and then one of the girls I wanted to start a band with and um i was like i want a girl band let's have a girl band together and she said well my next door neighbor he's a guy and he has like instruments in his basement let's just go over there and jam and there's this other guy i have a crush on let's just get together i'm like girl band no but she's like just come so uh i met these two guys. I didn't even meet them.

We just basically, we all smoked a joint. And then we started jamming. And then we started writing songs about each other without knowing each other. Like with sexual innuendos. And it was crazy. And then we just kept switching instruments, which I'd never done in my life. All of a sudden, they're like, play the drums. I'm playing drums.

And then I'm playing keyboards, which in my mind mind was like rock and roll does not have keyboards right you know i was like that is like number one you were purist yeah no synthesizers and now i'm like synthesize yeah it's like that was the moment i got on the synthesizer and you know on a roland uh no it wasn't a it wasn't the groove box but it was like a mo moog. Uh-huh. Like the real like. Yeah, yeah. And I was like. Yeah. And so after that, we all hung out.

It was like Maki, who's a really good, awesome musician. Maybe you know him. And Chili Gonzalez. After that practice. Yeah. We got together. We all gave each other names. That's where I gave myself peaches.

And we called ourselves the shit. Yeah. And we're like, we're The Shit. Because we were all dissatisfied with our music. And actually, we became pretty popular. And just in terms of you could tell audience liked it and we were enjoying it. It was kind of like art rock and really sexual. So that's kind of where the seeds of it all came. Sexual in just the musical content, not the performance necessarily.

Yeah, no, we weren't like rubbing against each other. We were mostly screaming. In my mind, we were like Pussy Galore. Okay, sure. That was like my favorite. But it was rock in your mind. But it was rock. Oh, yeah.

But it was arty, you know, with keyboards and stuff. Were you into Sonic Youth? Were you into rock bands? Yeah. Yeah, I mean, that's what happened. Mermaid Cafe was like 1989, 1990. Right. And I heard like Pavement and Sonic Youth.

And Bong Water. I was really into Bong Water. She was great. I can see that influence, Magnuson. I can see that a lot in the way you construct songs. Like they're kind of funny and they got big turns of phrase

yeah she was she was really funny yeah and Kramer was sort of a mastermind for a while yeah but Sonic Youth too they were a big influence

yeah I yeah I was I loved Kim Kim Gordon and I loved Pussy Galore and what about Suicide

well cause I the band Suicide yeah yeah well it's funny well not the idea yeah no I always I always say suicide the band suicide yeah well it's funny because well not the idea yeah no I always

I always say and I'm very influenced by suicide and then I'm like god some people don't know what you're saying you have to say the band

yeah yeah I did I just got turned on to them I miss fucking everything okay well wait wait I miss them too because so after the shit

everybody moved away and that's when I got the Roland Groove box and I was like I'm gonna make a band anyway it's gonna just be me moved away. And that's when I got the Roland Groovebox. And I was like, I'm going to make a band anyway. It's going to just be me. By myself. Yeah. And that's why I thought it was being rock and roll.

And then all of a sudden it was kind of an electro. And that became? Teaches of Peaches. The big one. Yeah. That was my first album. Yeah. So it is sort of an organic evolution.

You're with all these art rock people and you're doing this weird shit. And then you're like, fuck it. I need more freedom. Yeah. I need more point of view. And you got that rolling. What is it? MC 505? Yeah, and you're like I can do it all. Yeah, and I was like recording on an ADAT machine So are you gonna say about suicide? Um, what then I I was playing a gig. Yeah, and yourself yeah by myself

It was actually a folk night, but I was playing the keyboard. So you just start with a beat, and then people will be like, what's happening? Yeah, and they'll be like, what is this? It's one person, so is this folk? I don't know. Yeah, yeah. And then my friend, he had this band, Do Make Say Think. I don't know if you know.

He's like, you need this. And he put Suicide, the band's album. The first album. Yeah, under my arm. He's like, you sound like this. And he put Suicide, the band's album. The first album. Yeah, under my arm. He's like, you sound like this. Yeah. And then somebody else in another gig did that with ESG. Do you know that band, ESG?

There's like these girls from Brooklyn in the 80s. No, the Bronx, sorry. Yeah. Their mom didn't want them to be part of gangs, so she got them all instruments. Uh-huh. And they became this great band. Oh, really?

You probably know some of their music, but they're, yeah. I'm lacking. Is it, what kind of music is it? It's, I mean, it's, I don't know. It's its own thing. It's just like, the only boy in the band, I think his name was Tito. Yeah. He's like playing kind of a bit of conga.

There's drums and bass and and very like simplified but really good and um just a singer i don't know when i heard suicide i was like what the fuck i know this and then like i went and looked up a video of vega singing and i'm like what is that yeah i got to sing with them you did yeah frankie frankie teardrops you did yeah they're like please just come on up and sing with us i was like jumping on them and it was so fun. I was just like, this is a dream. And when did that happen? Later?

No, yeah, much later, like after. So you put together Teaches of Peaches by yourself, basically. Yeah, yeah. I just, in my room, I was like, well, fuck the pain away. The recording of it was from a cassette off a soundboard the first time i ever played it right in a club for like 20 people and the sound girl i think her name was marlin she's like i made a cassette of your uh set if you give me five dollars you can have it right and i was like bored five dollars and i took it and then put that song on a demo uh-huh you know as a demo

and then you know recorded a few other and people heard that song on a demo, you know, as a demo. Yeah. And then, you know, recorded a few other. And people heard that song and I thought I would get feedback. And it was like, this song's awesome. Like, it's great. And I was like, oh. Yeah. Don't, you know, if it ain't broke, don't fix.

Sure. So I never recorded that song. That was the recording? Yeah. That that sound girl made? Well, yeah. She just recorded it. I was doing it live. And she did it through the board?

No, no, she just taped it off the board, but I was doing all the sound in the machine on stage. Right, yeah, yeah, yeah. Mixing it and making up the words. And that's the version that's on the record? That's the one that became the big... That's my lifeline. That's amazing.

I love that. So the big hit, the one that everyone knows you for in a way, is just something that happened live and in the moment? Yeah. That's got to be a point of pride. Yeah. That's fucking awesome. And I didn't even realize it because I put it on the demo hoping for like,

oh, I think that guy makes electronic music. I'm going to ask him what he thinks. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So how did the record deal come about? It wasn't really a record deal. think that guy makes electronic music i'm gonna ask him what he thinks yeah yeah yeah so how'd the record deal come about there wasn't really a record deal i mean i went um with uh chili gonzalez yeah he had these like cd two cd players what's his real name his real name's uh jason yeah but um he uh had two cd players uh-huh and um you could plug it into a system. Right. And I had my own

groove box and we went to Europe. We're like, let's go to Amsterdam and smoke weed. That's all we wanted to do. And he's like, but he had a place in Paris

through friends and then we met somebody else in Berlin so we went there too. Yeah. It was just by chance. Yeah. And we would be like,

we have machines. You can plug them into your stereo system and we could play music in your bar. You know, this is before laptops and everything. Right, sure. Now it's like, oh, yeah, just plug it over there.

Like everybody with their phone and, you know. This was a more sort of organic techno experience. Yeah, and it was like 1998. Yeah. Yeah. And then we got to Berlin, and we met some girl named Magda and she's she was like we were telling her oh what we're doing she's like you should go to this place Gallery Berlin Tokyo which was just some weird underground art space yeah um and we went there and there was uh a guy from a very

small label there and he's like oh I'm interested in what you guys are doing we didn't even sing we were just playing like experimental music just the two of you yeah yeah and then i had to go back home i had commitments and then uh i was like i'm gonna move to berlin should be fun or whatever and then i made teachers of peaches in toronto during that time so this is post wall berlin this is open yeah yeah it's the yeah 1999 and later so 10 years later so what was the scene like there? Because I've talked to people who were there early on when it was dark. And, like, who did I talk to? Like, Nick Cave and those people that, you know, gravitated towards the energy.

But was it still pretty vital? I mean, was it still like... It was incredible. You, like, climbed through windows to get into, like, parties where there's, like, five people partying all night long. Yeah. But, like, having the best time of their life you know but what was the art scene like did you see anything that was starting to kind of feed into what you were doing um there was a group the honeysuckle collective they were just making videos and doing performances and things like that um were you considering yourself a performance artist? No, actually I wasn't

You do get labeled that? I did get labeled that Well, I remember like When I played my Because people weren't used to also just like a machine Right You know, they were used to People with a machine looking down

Pretending that it was rocket science Yeah, yeah, yeah, sure So I was like, fuck that I'm going to like put a rock and roll energy I'm going to like perform with I have, like Iggy Pop style. That's my thing. But I'm going to play electronics. So it's going to confuse people.

It's going to confuse people that I'm a girl in little pink shorts. And you see my pubic hairs. And I'm aggressive. But I'm seeing these sex things really positive. So I was just like let's go and people were just freaked out about it and you know

they saw it as art or punk rockers loved it like a lot of the because it was different yeah and a lot of the Berliner punk rock people started their own

like you know electro one person bands after that you planted the seed yeah it was it was pretty but there was also like

Atari Teenage Riot, which was, you know, more of a digital hardcore scene, which came right before what I was doing, which was like more like angry version. You know, and I was like,

let's have fun with it more. So you're not driven by any anger? No, there's definitely, you know, anger and stuff, but it's playful. Right. Yeah.

So was Iggy a big influence on what you wanted to do on stage? Yeah, but even more, like raw power, all the riffage. Yeah, yeah. I wanted to get that into electronics, which is AKA suicide, the band. Sure. But I didn't know who they were. Right. So, yeah.

suicide the band sure I didn't know who they were right so yeah and then of course my dreams came true when I met Iggy Pop at um like some award show where I just ran in and was like hey Iggy and I don't know he was in some kind of great mood and I said to you I love you and then he held my hand and we were just kind of looking at each other like, yeah, man, thanks. And his girlfriend was there and she's like, Iggy, this is Peaches. She's the shit. And he's like, oh, cool. And I was like, where do you live? And he's in Miami.

And I'm like, oh, I'm playing there next week. Want to come? So when I played in Miami, my guest list was Iggy Pop plus one. Yeah. And he showed up. Oh, that's amazing. So he always gives me time.

Oh, really? You know, like if i see him he'll hang out like yeah he'll he'll he's usually eating a steak and drinking one glass of red wine you know he's very you know it's very lucid you know you make assumptions about those guys it's all still in there his memory is so smart clear as a bell and he's a real thinker yes totally yeah it was really uh like surprising to surprising to me to have him sitting here and just lock in. Like Rollins once said, there's sort of this weird difference between Jim and Iggy. Yeah. Like if you talk to Jim, you're going to get a very sophisticated, thoughtful guy.

And then when he becomes Iggy, that's a whole different thing. Yeah, he's like, fuck all that. Yeah, it's a very defined difference. I'm like, fuck all that. Yeah, it's a very defined difference. So when did you start integrating spandex and cocks and hair? Well, yeah. Multiple boobs. Well, this is the thing.

When I started playing, I got a really cheap pink bathing suit because I'm like, I should wear something girly because I was mentioning I was being so aggressive on stage. early because I was mentioning I was being so aggressive on stage. And people started to point at my bathing suit shorts because they would see pubic hairs. And I was like, oh my God, they're like freaked out that they see a few pubic hairs. This is amazing. Yeah, right. And the album cover is a picture of that, which is from a live show. Right.

And then I started to make like crotch galleries and things like that because people would be taking pictures of my crotch because they couldn't believe it that there was pubic hairs coming out yeah it was just that was so that was so uh weird challenging yeah challenging because it's sort of it it kind of i guess the idea is that it undermines the the sexual the the sexual excitement of the shorts. Yes, or the heteronormative. Heteronormative interpretation of what those shorts mean. Exactly. It's like, that's not clean.

There's hair coming out of it. Yeah, so, and I would play on that in armpit hair and stuff like that, which is now. You liked doing that, challenging this heteronormative. Well, I was just lazy. I don't know what I was shaving. Yeah, I really don't want to shave that all the time. No, no, no, no, I know, but you knew that you were on to something.

Yeah, but I was like, oh, that's fine. Let's just do that. Yeah, but then you decided to keep upping the ante a little bit, a little bit performance-wise once you realized that people were like, what?

Yeah, no, it just kept, people were playing into it too. They were making me costumes. Like that, you talked about this multiple boob costume with the barbie heads that i had yeah um that was made by one of my dancers she just presented she's like i made you this my uh the the woman i'm seeing is a painter and she turned me on to uh louise bourgeois oh yes today yes she's amazing and she has like one of those multiple boob right but she

also does all kinds of all those interesting sculptures that are kind of claws, kind of clits, kind of cocks. And you're like, what? And then spiders and like, what? She's incredible. Yeah. It's kind of mind blowing along that front of provoking heteronormative culture. Yes.

I'm getting it. Yes. Give me some other classifications. But at some point you must have realized that there was a following accumulating around, you know, what you were doing with, you know, sort of turning gender stuff inside out and pushing those buttons. Yeah, I mean, I really was speaking about it sincerely. I wasn't like trying to like think about, you know, some kind of, it was just kind of happening. It wasn't an activist movement. No, I was just, you know, yeah. And there was a kind of happening it wasn't an activist yeah no i was just

you know yeah and then there was a lot of there's comedy to it yeah there's comedy because that's the best way to sure let people know what you're thinking you know you know right it's like that's the way you get through to people yeah they laugh and then it goes in deeper sure you know so and and when you do something as as big as some of the outfits you wear and some of the effects that you have and if you you know if you've got a dildo on somehow yeah that there it is hilarious but it's also sort of like what the fuck yeah yeah the dildo is funny because right before i moved from toronto to berlin yeah yeah i. I was seeing this girl who was a leather maker. Uh-huh.

And she made me my first red leather shorts. Uh-huh. And she made me two leather dildos. There were leather dildos? Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Those ones weren't used.

Those were more for show. Yeah. And then so I gave them to my two dancers. Uh-huh. And they wore them. I mean, I wore them. I wore it. I wore it on face mask. I didn't even think it was controversial because I just- I don two dancers. Uh-huh. And they wore them. I mean, I wore them. I wore it. I wore it on face mask.

I didn't even think it was controversial because I just- I don't know if it's controversial. It's just provocative. Provocative. I don't know. I just thought it was funny. Yeah, it's hilarious. Yeah.

Why not? And I almost got arrested, actually, when I opened for Queens of the Stone Age at the Palladium. Really? Because I was wearing that dildo because I have a song, Shake Your Dicks. Yeah. really because i was wearing that dildo because i have a song shake your dicks yeah so me and my um you know gal pal sidekick mignon we're both wearing them and singing shake your dicks and and then after there was like a whole team of people thinking about you know should we call

the police is this indecent exposure they're they're they're prosthetics yeah they're not yeah exactly real dicks yeah so but it was amazing to me that there was even a discussion about it. But the law enforcement is like, I don't know if this counts, if they're not real cocks. Yeah. I would have. Yeah. Yeah. That conversation would have been good.

That would have been real good. Yeah. So, but between Teachers of Peaches and the next album, there's a lot of years. Three years. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Fatherfucker. Yeah. And what were you doing? Well, I always made an album and then's a lot of years. Three years. Yeah. Yeah, Fatherfucker next week.

Yeah, and what were you doing? Well, I always made an album and then toured for two years. Two years? Yeah. And when you toured, did you do roughly the same stage shows, same costumes? Like, was there a show that you hit every time? Because you had dancers and everything, right?

Not Teachers of Peaches was just me. And I'd go through Machine and then sometimes just playback. And it was a lot about interplay between the audience. Right. And by the end of the show, I'd be always like, I don't know, I remember one show like being on someone's shoulders, eating a hot dog in the middle of the audience. People are just dancing around. Yeah, yeah.

Stuff like that, you know. But you never got into drugs? I, no. To work or? No, not for work. Yeah. No, I did cocaine once before a show and there's footage oh really i'm just like if i'm already i'm just like jumping and sweating it's not it's not good

it's not cute yeah yeah but um yeah i'm not i'm a marijuana. Yeah. But do you ever think like, you've clearly had a profound influence on a lot of other artists. And how do you, do you register that? I mean, do you look at people like Lady Gaga or other people that are taking the type of kind of humorous, like it seems to me that you planted a seed of something that she is aware of. Yeah, of course. Do you know her? No, I don't know her. How do you feel about her?

I mean, what she does is quite different because she's taken the greatest influences of the last 30 years and put them all into her show. Meaning Madonna? Grace Jones, Rosine Murphy. greatest influences of the last 30 years and put them all into her show meaning madonna grace jones rosine murphy so you think she's real aware of what she's appropriating yeah she's she's very you know she knows all that for sure yeah and um so you see yourself as a different type of performer yeah i mean i'm just organically doing this thing and it happened or whatever. But, you know, I'm not mad at being like part of this, you know, like let's look at an iconic history and build Gaga. Like Grace Jones, Madonna, Peaches.

I'm like, yes. Okay. John. Okay, cool. I'll be in that gang. Thank you. I guess what I'm asking as a person that has spent a lot of time in my past you know judging myself against others did are you happy with where your career is as you are i am so happy i'm not huge uh yeah i'm so happy i'm not lady gaga right you know it's not

my it's not my goal right now it's even such a good time like with this new album in the book in the book yeah with the new album. And the book. And the book, yeah. With the new album, Rob, now I'm doing interviews and people are like, you're important. Things that you said happened. Like what? Well, because I was always like, I'm not moving towards the mainstream. The mainstream has to move towards me.

You know, with, like, gender issues. Yeah. And, like, gay rights and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Now, how do you feel about, you know, obviously the pressure on someone like Gaga to sort of maintain whatever the hell she's doing at the level she's doing at and then to take the sort of weird courage to change things up and do interesting things

becomes a pressure. But do you find you've been put in the position as an example or a role model or a spokesperson for gender issues? Sometimes, yeah. But that's cool? Yeah, I'll say whatever I need to say about it. And if I can't, you know, I'm not an authority.

Yeah, do people come up to you and go, like, you changed my life? I was locked up in a small town and I didn't think I could get out. I constantly hear that it's incredible it's incredible and what what kind of people are or what usually are influenced like people that didn't think they had a way to express who they were yeah yeah right or coming out or them or or musicians or or feeling like they had to be just feeling my whole thing is like i want people people to feel comfortable in their own skin. Right. Whichever way that is.

Right. And that's the most important thing you can do for yourself. But it's interesting because your journey doesn't seem to involve trauma. And involve like, you know, any real sort of restriction. That, you know, you sort of kind of came to it with with a certain freedom of mind that wasn't sort of like you know i'm gonna you know fuck all this yeah yeah it's funny because i think about that because people are always like yeah and then you know we had this horrible relationship yeah i it's true yeah it's it's it's nice yeah no it's true. Yeah, it's nice. Yeah, no, it's nice.

People are like, oh, she's actually nice. Like there's a place to meet me. Well, you make an album called Fatherfucker and people are like, yeah. Oh, my dad loved that title. He thought it was brilliant. He did? Yeah. He was like, I totally, you know, it was, well, because it's all based on like motherfucker

this, motherfucker that. So it's like. It's a joke. It's a turn on a phrase. That's what it is. Right, right. It's just like, what if we said fatherfucker all the time? Like, oh, no, you know. So it's a joke. It's a turn on a phrase. That's what it is. Right, right. It's just like, what if we said father fucker all the time?

Like, oh no, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he got the joke and he was. Yeah, he loved it. He was like, your beard looks so cute on the cover. So they've really embraced your success. Yeah, my dad cries at shows.

Like, you know, I'm sitting there like whipping my pants around my head and like doing somersaults. And he's like's my baby yeah yeah he loves it but then they they constantly even now more than ever my mom's like we're so proud of you and you're doing really important wonderful things but the thing we love most is that you're a good person that's really sweet that's true yeah it's because it's culturally, me being a representative heteronormative that you. I think you're overusing the word now. No, no.

I'm going to put it on a sign. Milk it. Milk it. No, but I, you know, to classify in terms of our assumptions about like what you do. So like there's always going to be this sort of like, oh, she must be fucked up. Yeah. And it's just not the case. Yeah.

And I think that's an amazing thing. And it gives you a sort of power to come from a place of fun and really creatively embracing all these possibilities comedically and otherwise and challenging from a place that isn't sort of like, you know, that has an ax to grind. Yeah. Some sort of, yeah. Yeah. I just want people to feel comfortable in their body. I swear. No matter what. I swear. No. I just want people to feel comfortable in their body.

I swear. No matter what. I swear. No matter what. Just feel comfortable in your body. Life's too short. Yeah. Yeah. You might as well be whole. Yeah. I mean, isn't that what we try and do our whole lives? I don't fucking know what we're trying to do. Yeah. You're trying to find out who you are. That's right. That's it. That's right. And that's being comfortable in your own body, right? Right. Yeah. Right. And then and then there's you know religion and politics that tell you you have to be this way this way and mainstream this way this way and that's where you know all the problems start and all the hidden secrets and all the republicans going on the you know affair sites and then you find out the truth yeah yeah you know so what repression causes yeah so fear Yeah, exactly. It's all, why are we giving into the repression and the fear?

Right. And it's not like, yeah, let's just fuck everybody all the time. I have my standards, but I just really, really honor yourself that way. And when you did Impeach My Bush, that record, was that, obviously there's a political statement in the title, but other than that, the one tune, did you see it as a political record? I see each album, like now, in retrospect, I see Teach Us a Peaches as a masturbation album in a very positive sense. I see Father Fucker as a role playing uh-huh i see uh impeach my bush as um a call to revolution uh-huh and then um i feel cream is um exploring my vulnerable yeah side yeah and rub which is my new album return to masturbation? Yeah, return to masturbation. Always return to masturbation. Exactly.

Come full circle. But the one I feel cream, your vulnerable side, in what way? When you were putting that album together, were you thinking, like, I'm a grown person and now I have the, I'm grounded enough to do this other thing? I think it was, A, I decided to collaborate with people. Yeah. Like, I was like, I'm just going to collaborate with these people that I want to work with. Which is vulnerable.

Which is vulnerable, exactly. And then some of the songs became very vulnerable. And so, and also, I'm always like, I'm challenging myself, you know, like, so why don't you challenge yourself to also use that side, the vulnerable side. How did it feel? It was great. Yeah? It was great, yeah.

And what is Rub? What is it? It's just a, what do you think? Rub, it just sounds good. It's lazy. No, I like it. The music, though, is different? It's very classic me.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Classic peaches? Yeah, songs like Dick in the Air, a song called Rub, of course. And in terms of making dance music, that's a whole other world in itself. Yeah, what is dance music? I don't really...

No, but techno gets its reputation. I'm not techno. No. Yeah, no, for techno people, they'd be like, ha, ha, ha. Right, right. Kindergarten. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I have to say it in a German accent. It's kindergarten music. No. It's nice yeah. I have to say it in a German accent. It's kindergarten music. No. It's nice, but I wouldn't say it's techno. I mean, there's a place in Berlin called Berghain. Yeah. I don't know if you ever heard of this place. It's like the Mecca for techno.

Yeah. And everybody goes there. You go there on a Thursday and leave on a Monday morning. And everybody's just naked and the music's like. It's like a crazy movie. Maybe I'm thinking electronic dance music. How's that? Is that better? Like EDM? Yeah, is that? That's what it's like a crazy movie. Maybe I'm thinking electronic dance music. How's that? Is that better?

Like EDM? Yeah, is that? That's what it's called. Yeah. No, that's like, yeah. But you do make music. I call it electro. I don't even know what to call it.

No, but it is sort of like music that can transcend boundaries because of the beat. Like, I noticed that. Okay, that's a good way to put it. you know, boundaries because of the beat. Like I noticed that. Okay, that's a good way to put it. That there is certain music that has a sort of international feel because it's catchy and it is danceable

and it can go on for, you know, anywhere from four to an hour, minutes. Yeah, yeah. And it doesn't matter what culture is listening to it, they're going to have the same reaction. They're going to be like yeah i'm dancing yeah yeah but and then i and then i'm putting in these lyrics and so they're dancing then they're going yeah i'm singing along what am i singing along to i just said that yeah yeah exactly so okay

the other question i have what was this jesus christ superstar business yeah are you a fan of that musical yeah i am actually i saw it when i was younger i saw the movie and like i there's there's certain parts but i can't ever get out of my head and i love them well i like king harrod song oh yeah and i just thought it was uh you know great you know so you are the christ y'all and so gay yeah yeah yeah so good and uh and I liked um what's the the Mary Magdalene song Yvonne Elman

who is like her and uh Irene Cara they're my they are my favorite right I think Yvonne

I don't know how to love him is that it yeah yeah Yvonne Elman's voice and she was also a Saturday Night Fever she sang she wasn't in it

but she sang like if I can't have you I don't want oh yeah yeah yeah but her voice is just so creamy and beautiful. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So you did the musical.

Yeah, well, because, you know, people our age know it more as a rock album, I think, you know. Sure. And so I wanted to honor it as that, like more than like, let's put a big production, you know, and everything. So I wanted to sing all the parts, which I think a lot of people, our generation, probably sat in their room and sang along to. Oh, yeah, definitely. So that's what I wanted to do. If you had that double album.

Yeah. So that's what I wanted to do in front of people because I was like, I think I can sing all this. And you did it. Yeah. Where? Well, I had two runs in Berlin and then I did it in LA. I did it in San Francisco and Toronto and Chicago.

So you toured with it. you were well-received. Yeah, yeah, and Chilly Gonzalez played everything on piano. He's sort of a wizard, huh? Yeah, he's a wizard, and actually we didn't even know, I didn't even know, and he didn't know we both loved this musical. I was just telling him what I was going to do, and he's like, oh, I'll play piano, let's do it. I still do it, but he's not my piano player. I still do it, but he's not my piano player. But I got asked to do it at a national state theater in Munich as a season this year.

Yeah. Like, you know, the UF5. Part of the run. Yeah, part of the run. So I would have done it twice every month. But I would screw up my album cycle, so I'm not going to do it. I can't do it. But I'm not going to do it. I can't do it. But I'm going to go do it once. In Munich?

Yeah, in Munich on October 10th. How is it different? How is it staged? What do you have up there? It's just me. Just with no props? I have a whip for the second half when I have to give him 39 lashes.

Give myself, him, whatever. There's a piano, there's's me i have a very simple costume on the first half and then the second half i have more of a augmented like big gold costume uh-huh and that's it what are the pictures i saw of you being crucified oh with the big dick dick that also is like another this russian artist came up to me he said i bet you need a cross for this show i'm to make you one. Yeah. And I had no idea.

I didn't give him, and I was like, okay. Yeah. And he made me this like. It's a giant cock cross. I don't even know, like 30 foot long. It's all muscle and there's a heart in it. People don't realize like all the like body organs in it. And then at the head and the head top is a penis.

Is that, do you use that in the show? I did on the Berlin run, but now I just become the cross. Oh, okay. I just like roll down some extra gold. So I am the cross.

Yeah. Yeah. Mostly because I couldn't travel with it. Right. Where is it? And I think it was like an unnecessary, like. Why hit him over the head with a cock at the end?

Yeah. I mean, I, I mean, some people that was to them they were like finally it's a peaches version yeah but um i i don't think it's essential to the show right but it was there and this artist made it and it was great so where's the uh where's the cock cross being housed now in in a place called how theater yeah where we did the original production

it's just under there and the russian artist every time I come back to Berlin, he's like, where's my penis cross? And where are you with religion in general? Like, how do you feel about it? I'm pretty mad at it. Oh, yeah? Yeah. I think they screwed up. Uh-huh.

Yeah. So you don't have any practice, spiritual practice? The spiritual practice, I'm not mad at. I'm just mad at, like, you know, organized religion. Yeah. So you don't have any practice, spiritual practice? The spiritual practice I'm not mad at. I'm just mad at like, you know, organized religion. Sure. You know. But spiritual, I mean, I want to meditate. Yeah.

Me too. But do you? No, I don't. Yeah, I don't. I want to. Yeah. So we'll do it sometime. Yeah.

Yeah. Five minutes. Why can't you do five minutes a day? Why is that so hard? That's something you get asked. I get asked that. It's like, it's really easy. No, that's why I ask myself. You do?

Yeah. Five minutes. Just sit and breathe. Clear your mind. And then all of a sudden, what time is it? Where's my phone? Yeah. But people who do it are like so sort of like, it changes your life.

Yeah. And I don't fucking do it. Yeah. I don't need to be in, you know, part of a TM or part of a group of it. I just want to do it. A couple of them have hit me lately. Yeah. The TM people. Yeah. They're like, it's not a group of it. I just want to do it. A couple of them have hit me lately. Yeah. The TM people.

Yeah. They're like, it's not a cult. Yeah. You just have to pay some money. Yeah, you just pay us. Yeah, pay them once. You just pay once. A lot and you get a mantra.

Right, like three grand or something, right? No, it's ridiculous. Fuck it. Yeah. What are you doing in LA? Videos? Living. You live here?

Yeah. I didn't know that. Yeah. I live here in Berlin. Yeah? I have a house here. Where do you live? What part of town? Silver Lake. Oh, you're right here? Yeah. I didn't know that. Yeah. I live here in Berlin. Yeah? I have a house here. Where do you live? What part of town?

Silver Lake. Oh, you're right here? Yeah. You're down the street? Hanging out? Yeah, going to Amara Kitchen. Did you ever do any of those performance art pieces in museums? I tried.

Well, you know Cynthia Plastercaster? Yeah. So she plastercast my breasts. And I asked her- It's a change for her. Yeah. No, she started that in the 90s she's like well i gotta do girls i gotta do boobs enough cocks yeah so a lot of cocks yeah so um uh when i was in chicago i said can we do it as a performance and um i was playing like a little show at a weekend records this i don't think it exists anymore. But we like did a performance. So my friend had to do one of the castings, you know, and she was really nervous

because she's never done it live. So we tried to make it like a live performance. And it worked? One, the boob that she did worked and my friend was so nervous. My friend Malcolm is kind of like, yeah, yeah. He's like, I'm really close to your boob, help.

That one didn't come out as good no but it's okay got one good boob out of it yeah that's all you can

that's all you can ask for one good boob out of it one good boob nice talking to you nice talking to you it was great thank you

you feel happy very happy alright well good luck with the new record thank you wasn't that great go check out her work it's mind blowing Thank you. Wasn't that great?

Go check out her work. It's mind-blowing and mind-fucking. All the good things art's supposed to do. She'll mind-blow you and also mind-fuck you. That's me. Okay? I'll keep it personal. I don't mind.

All right, so you can go to WTFpod.com for all your WTF pod needs. As usual, get on the mailing list check the episode guide check my calendar I'm coming to Australia what else oh for those of you who noticed that we didn't get a Boomer Lives in I spent so long trying to play Happy Birthday on my guitar that it actually

eluded me so thank you for noticing Boomer lives! Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed,

how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. Terrio Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. Calgary is an opportunity-rich city, home to innovators, dreamers, disruptors, and problem solvers. The city's visionaries are turning heads around the globe across all sectors each and every

day. They embody Calgary's DNA. A city that's innovative, inclusive, and creative. And they're helping put Calgary and our innovation ecosystem on the map as a place where people come to solve some of the world's greatest challenges. Calgary's on the right path forward. Take a closer look out at calgaryeconomicdevelopment.com.