WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 687 - Bonnie McFarlane

Episode Date: March 7, 2016

Comedian Bonnie McFarlane has a backstory like no other guest on WTF. That’s probably because no other guest grew up in circumstances that could be described as Canadian Little House on the Prairie. Bonnie tells Marc why she left the Great White North to get into comedy, how she met and married comedian Rich Vos, and why she still has trouble telling her neighbors what she does for a living. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Death is in our air. This year's most anticipated series, FX's Shogun, only on Disney+. We live and we die. We control nothing beyond that. An epic saga based on the global best-selling novel by James Clavel. To show your true heart is to risk your life.

When I die here, you'll never leave Japan alive. FX's Shogun, a new original series streaming February 27th, exclusively on Disney Plus. 18 plus subscription required. T's and C's apply. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing with cannabis legalization. It's a brand new challenging marketing category.

legalization. It's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. Lock the gates!

Alright, let's do this. How are you what the fuckers, what the fuck buddies, what the fucking ears? Welcome to the show. I'm maron this is wtf the podcast how's it going hope everything's well happy monday to you if you're listening to this on the day it is discharged dispatched posted put up if it's entering your head on this monday morning i hope it's going okay it might not but you know we're we're built to deal with it i hope in your life that the possibilities for disappointment are relatively uh manageable and if you're living in a sort of ongoing hum of mild disappointment maybe you should figure out what's the fuel of that energy what's what's fuel in that engine that's what i'm because i

was i was watching uh last night i was sitting in a living room with about 35 people watching jeff tweedy play acoustic guitar and i was thinking about forgiveness in general maybe i'll get back around to that today on the show bonnie mcfarland joins us. That's right, the Bonnie McFarlane. Rich Voss' wife, comedian Bonnie McFarlane. I say that to you because you can listen to me talk to Rich Voss. All right? That was episode 616. And you can get that on Howell Premium at howell.fm.

He's a great guy. Despite how much Bonnie and I bust his balls, he can take it. There's a mutual ball busting. I didn't start it. Bonnie's got a new book out. I'll tell you about that in a minute. Let me get back to why I saw Jeff Tweedy in a living room. Anyone interested in that?

Anybody? Anybody interested in that? I'm not bragging. This isn't a humble brag. I was invited to a party at my friend Jeff Ulrich's house. Jeff Ulrich is one of the great innovators and creators in the world of podcasting. He and Scott Aukerman created the Earwolf Network. And then under Jeff, we get Midroll.

We get Howl.fm. He created all that stuff. He's a very important guy in the podcast world. And he has since sold his interests in all of those ventures and is now heading off, heading off into the wilderness to do something other, some other exciting thing that does good in the world. I believe he's from Chicago and he he was part of his he was at a chicago charity event one of the things offered is a private um living room concert with jeff

tweedy and he got it i guess it was the first time they'd ever done one out of chicago so jeff tweedy came to los angeles we had a nice vegan food it was a non-alcoholic event it was a small he could only invite like 30 or 35 people and the deal was Jeff Tweedy comes and he plays 30 songs on his acoustic guitar and and you have dinner and you sit in the living room and watch Jeff Tweedy play it was unbelievable how does that happen and it goes to a good cause now look I'm not it's not that I'm not a fan of Wilco I love Wilco but i'm old enough to have loved uncle tupelo because i was there's a guy the guy who works for me sometimes uh frank capello was there and he's like you wilco fan i'm like i was big uncle tupelo fan he was like who

and i'm like really i was one of the people that after uncle tupelo uncle tupelo broke up i was like now we got to pick sides now we got it like it's either Sunvolt or Wilco. So I went with Sunvolt for a couple records. And I came back around for a few Wilco records. But I haven't listened all the way through. But nonetheless, Anodyne and No Depression and all the Uncle Tupelo stuff was pretty important to me. So there we were in this living room. And there's Jeff Tweedy. And he played 30 Wilco songs.

And some of the ones that really affected me were songs I'd never heard before. Hate It Here, he played acoustic. A lot of the songs that he played acoustic, you'd never heard acoustic. And he was very self-effacing and very funny. And it was an amazing night. That's all I have to say, is that there was a moment there

where I was watching him. We can't be that much, there can't be that big of an age difference between us. And it was like, this guy's a professional and he's playing all these songs acoustic and he's a beautiful guitar player and he knows how to do this stuff. You know, there was a couple of songs

that he hadn't played in a long time, so he had to find his way through them. But it's just amazing watching someone of my generation who has been at it for as long as I have, working, whatever it is they do, and now we're sort of middle-aged guys that know how to do what we do and do it well. And I was like, there was that,

the part of me that's like, this is beautiful, this is an amazing song, and wow, this is really an amazing event. And there was another part of me that's sort of like, he's a pro, we've paid our dues, and it's great to be in the hands of a professional. Some gravitas there. All right, so here's the deal.

I'm moving into my office, which is, you know, don't go crazy. It's not like it's in a high-rise or something. It's in a two-story building here in Highland Park, just so I have a place to work. So my living room and my dining room doesn't look like a clearinghouse for books and records and, and random pieces of paper. I just want another space. So when I get done shooting my show and I want to start thinking about what I'm going to do next, I can sit in a space and think and, and work. That's my plan. It didn't work out with, uh, when I bought a bike for similar reasons, that bike sits just beside my garage here, just sits there.

It's now just a rusting guilt machine, just sort of like, hey, remember? Nah, yeah, I do remember. It was stupid. You're the wrong kind of bike. I didn't realize how hard the hill would be. Yeah, but we're here. I'm like, I know, I know. I even bought baskets, little baskets for the sides of the bike i had this image of myself you know riding through my neighborhood

picking up uh you know maybe a carton of milk and some phonograph records and perhaps uh some small grocery shopping and packing them into the little pouches on the back of my bicycle and riding around and doing that just getting healthy that way just riding around the neighborhood waving at people with my products in my saddlebags on the back of my little bike and i took that bike out twice and i tried to ride up my hill twice and that was the end of the fantasy of waving mark pouches filled smiling as he rode his bike through highland Park that is a story that never happened but I do have the evidence of the intent rusting next to the garage so buzzing yeah so I'm moving in this office and I got this old receiver and I'm picking up some major interference only on the phono channel I guess I'm reaching out to just nerds who understand this stuff.

Okay, picture me. I'm excited. Yeah, I'm excited. I got this new space. I'm going to buy a console to put records that come into me so I can process them at the office and listen to them in the office. So I've got this old turntable. I bought this old receiver, and I got this nice new console. I'm going to set it up in my office with these speakers I got. It's all hooked up. I can't wait to hear it. Oh, man, the radio sounds great. I'm going to set it up in my office with these speakers I got.

It's all hooked up. I can't wait to hear it. Oh, man, the radio sounds great. I'm going to put a record on. What's that sound? Wait, why is it? God damn it, man. Why can't I just fucking be lucky and get something that works right away?

God damn it. This fucking thing's broken. It must be because I drove it home in the car and it rattled or something then i went and got my other receiver another old piece of shit receiver to see if it did the same thing in my office all right that radio sounds good put it on phono all right so it's not the new old receiver i bought it's some other thing let's chase this fucking thing down maybe i can solve it go online see how hey how do i get the buzz out of the phono channel i don't know well here's some ideas ferrite no choke clip-on loop things all right let's do that plug it all in man this has got to work all right radio sounds good phono god damn it i've done everything I know how to do and what the internet told me. Now what?

Call the landlord. Oh, yeah. The AT&T people were here for a long time and they put the antennas right on top of where your office is. So I'm never going to be able to play records? Is there another way? Is there another way? I'm obsessed. Like, this is the most important part of my office is my ability to play records

that are sent to me by you people and so I can have that other space to do that in how do I get that fucking buzz out of my head out of my life out of my mind took months to chase a buzz down in the goddamn tube amp that I have for the guitar. Maybe I shouldn't buy old shit. Maybe this quest for authenticity through nostalgia and aging artifacts with expectations that I can time travel

through those artifacts is maybe a fucking dream. Maybe there's a reason why things were made more efficient and better over time. I just wish they were made to last. So now all these things that last, that have a specific feel and vibe to them, are a little...

They're tired. They're old. They've run current through them for a long time. They were expecting just to rest in the back of a sad store that will eventually close and then find a home on a Goodwill shelf where no one will buy it and eventually end up relaxing in a landfill covered with meat products and other detritus but secretly always able to pick up the buzz of the future will improvise poetry by me mark maron but in all honesty if you do know how I can stop the noise that isn't some of the

suggestions I've told you ferrite rings and plugging all the other RCA holes because it is generating it is coming the receiver is picking it up it's the receiver and the RCA output holes help me out nerds help me out did I mention that last week I worked with the talented and amazingly professional Ron Perlman and the incredibly gregarious and entertaining MC Ganey on my IFC show. Anna Conkle is back as well. She's great. Amazing actress. My man working with Ganey.

I don't know if you know Ganey. Go ahead and wiki him. Go ahead and look up with Ganey. I don't know if you know Ganey. Go ahead and wiki him. Go ahead and look up MC Ganey. Usually plays a heavy or a crazy. And he was also, the funny thing is, I didn't realize this until we'd hired him to play this part, but he was the naked guy in Sideways. The naked guy. Heways. The naked guy.

He's done quite a bit. Quite a bit. You recognize him. But it was a blast working with those two. With Ron Perlman, who you know from Sons of Anarchy and Beauty and the Beast and movies, and you know him, Hellboy,

and Anna. It was great. Okay, so that's going well. So Bonnie McFarlane, folks, is a great comic. I've known her a long time. She's a good person. She's got a book out. You're Better Than Me is available now.

She also hosts the podcast My Wife Hates Me with her husband, Rich Voss, and her documentary Women Aren't Funny is available on Netflix. And don't get too weirded out because we bust on Rich Voss a little bit. It was all in good fun and we know and love Rich a long time. So this is me and Bonnie McFarland. created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talked to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer

becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. greatest challenges from right here in Calgary. From cleaner energy, safe and secure food, efficient movement of goods and people, and better health solutions, Calgary's visionaries are turning heads around the globe, across all sectors, each and every day. Calgary's on the right path forward. Take a closer look how at calgaryeconomicdevelopment.com. our one you know how to do this you have a podcast i'm a podcast of a radio show all right already already with the plugs right out of the gate i don't know i'm married to rich

boss he would oh now you're now you're going back down this way that started off strong and uh i mean i thought he would be dead by now but we're still really that was that was the bet Now you're going back down this way. That started off strong. I mean, I thought he would be dead by now, but we're still doing it. That was the bet. I said this guy doesn't have more than four and a half years. Yeah. I like Rich. He was in here.

Yes. No, he talks about it a lot. He talks about this a lot? Well, he was the best one you've ever had. I think his was the best podcast. That I've ever done? Yes, that you've ever done. Really? It was a good one

he made a list of people and put himself at the top oh did he me Rich Voss Obama yes

and then Obama might have been third or fourth you know it's like what porn stars are like they always say how they have the best job

who porn stars yeah I feel like they always say that because people were like, you're not going to go into porn, are you? People tell you, don't do it.

Then they realize, oh, now I got to just keep this up for the rest of my life. Like, no, I made the right decision. Yeah, yeah. Having a hard time getting work at 50, but I'm making the right decision. It was great.

That's how it is with me marrying Rich. Come on. It's too late to say I made a a mistake no one ever thought that you marrying rich was anything but a nice gesture on your part i'm a good person help that guy but you i didn't watch your doc i remember it came out but maybe i want maybe i watched part of it don't say that what do you mean because that's like the worst. It is? Yes. I could only get through about 20 minutes. No, no, no, no, no.

The truth of the matter is it's a time thing. It's not a matter of, you know, like I'm a busy person. But I know that it was well received and it was a good thing. And what was it called? Women aren't funny. Yes. What was the incentive? Well, I've always believed that women aren't funny.

And I set out to prove it. No, I had a baby and I couldn't go on, you know, after two years you have to start paying for a flight for your child. So I'd been taking her with me and then, you know, financially wasn't working out. On the road, do you mean? Yes. Yeah. They're like a potato when they're little. You just take them around. Yeah. Put her in my pocket. Wrap them up. Yeah. Strap them on. Did you have one of those weird bundly things? No, I never did that. What are they called?

Bjorns or something? Is that what they're called? Baby Bjorns. Okay, so you've got to pay for the kid now. So then I decided I have to do something creative while staying at home. Yeah. And so I pitched this movie idea to Rich because I felt like it was something people would talk about and I could be funny with.

And he immediately was like, yes, what about where do I go? How can I be in it? With a lot more lisping. Yes, he spit on me. No, and then he immediately took control and started setting up interviews. And he got all the, you know, all the big people that you see in the movie. That's pretty much.

What did you learn during that process? I mean, was it really a reaction to this idea, that trope of men saying women can't be funny? No, because I never really bought into that. I never really thought that was true. I mean, of course, I heard it from Guy Comics, but I thought they were just busting balls. Like, we're all looking for your weakness and trying to, you know. But then there was

a moment in the documentary where I was like, like when I was talking to club owners, that's when I started being like, oh, geez. Right, it's real. They really think this. It's institutional. Yeah. And can you get it on Netflix? You can get it on Netflix and you can download it on iTunes. And how much rich is there in that movie?

There's a lot of rich in that movie. He paid for it. He paid for my big feminist movie. Did you guys make it back? Yes, yes. Great. Yeah, we did fine. Because I know that's a concern of riches at all times.

Yes, yes. Since I've been married, I've not ever been allowed to have my own soda when we're out for dinner. But he wants to bring soda into restaurants all the time. Oh, that's a weird. It's exhausting. Well, that's like, you know, it's such, you don't want to, that doesn't make it good for Jews when he does things like that. I know, but, and then he says i'm anti-semitic because i'm constantly like stop doing everything yeah yeah does he bring popcorn to the movies um yes oh no

he doesn't does he he we i have my purse is like if they ever start a policy where they open up people oh god it will be so embarrassing and he thinks he's beating the system right yes the first time i ever went to a movie with him, he smoked in the movie theater because he still smoked back then. Yeah. But he knew he'd be shut down. Was he trying to impress you?

He'd just take two drags and then somebody would come in and look around and not see it. What a pain in the ass. And I said, I'm in love. Oh, God. You know what made me fall in love with him is one time when we were first out.

He said... We were having sushi, and he said to me that he was a genius. And he said... He was, like, really talking about himself as a genius. Wait, is this Rich Voss? Yes. Okay.

Okay, go ahead. And I never... I just want to make sure I know who you're talking about. I never heard anyone talk about themselves like that before. How did he support that statement? He was saying that when he's on the road, it's just magic and no one ever gets to see it. Right, because he just can't do it in the city in a short set. Yeah, no, he needs a little longer.

In an hour, you can see what a genius I am. Yes. And did you go on the road with him shortly thereafter and be like, oh my God, he is a genius? Well, yes, and he would always want me to come watch his set, but I would only go watch his set if he did crowd work because he really is a genius when he does crowd work. Yeah, right. Yeah.

Okay, so this is interesting. I'd like to try to break you away from this rich obsession. No, I don't want to talk about him anymore. No, you can talk about him. I like him. I think he's a very sweet guy. We had a good conversation. Yeah.

He's like a decent guy. He's all right. Solid. And you get, you know, it's not like you didn't try before that. What does that mean? You asshole. What?

I dated comedians exclusively because I like comedians. No, I get it. Did we cover why you thought me and you were... Oh, because you would come into the improv, and first of all, you've always been one of my favorite comedians. The original improv? No, on Melrose.

Oh, back when you lived here that time. Yeah, and I'd watch your set, and I would be like... Then I'd go to talk to you about your set, and I'd realize, like, oh, you don't... It's almost like you're another person offstage sometimes is that true well i back then maybe i think that you know fame and fortune changes people and i think for you it made me better made you better well yeah it's validating i mean back then i'd go on i do okay people like you would like me and then i'd get off and be like well that fucking was bad. And what do you want?

Yes, yes, exactly. But that's the thinking. It's not like, I don't like her. It's like, oh God, I suck. No, I know. And I know, it's like, oh. What? And then like, you would say great, sad.

And I'm like, no, I don't believe that. Yes, you'd argue it. Right. Yeah. But I met you before that. Because we had this tweet exchange kind of about the mistake that some journalists made that you dated me. Right. They meant Mark Cohen.

I know who they meant. Yeah. And then someone tweeted something about a teleprompter. And I didn't know what was going on. Then I read that part of the book. And yes, when you got to town, you were funny and you had some swagger too. And I was sort of, like, impressed. And the reason why I kept bothering you about the teleprompter, in my memory, who was your manager?

Was it Sussman? Jeff Sussman. Right. Because you say I called Jeff in there. Yes. Do you remember calling him? Probably. I got mildly obsessed with you immediately.

But I'm not going to, what am I going to do? You know what I mean? I was married and you were too pretty for me and whatever. Oh, that's not true. So you were up for something, like stand-up, stand-up or something. Yes. Right. So you didn't put that in there because I had hosted Short Attention Span Theater.

So I'm like, the whole thing is figuring out how to read that fucking thing because that's going to be your job yeah so i was very concerned about it i know because i wanted you to do well like i was yes like i just got obsessed because you're like well i think when you first start talking about a teleprompter i didn't know what a teleprompter was oh so that was like and then i didn't want to be an idiot well i think i also wanted to spend time with you somehow i don't think like i wanted to have sex with you but i wanted to know you and maybe you know fall in love with you or whatever but i was married so i thought like you know this teleprompter thing's gonna at least get me in it's gonna at least get me a conversation yes right

yes i got but i don't really remember calling your manager i'm like i need to talk to bonnie about this it was It was urgent because... Yeah, he put you on speakerphone. Oh. I remember being like... Oh, really? Like, don't tell him. It wasn't because I didn't want to talk to you,

but I do have anxiety about talking on the phone for some weird reason. We were like kids. Like, that was that whole New York thing, and that was in the middle of it, and, you know, and all the... And also, I think I was completely overwhelmed. I mean, come from canada 23 no i was probably like 24 25 and um so yeah i but but really i'd you know i didn't know what was going on in life in the world that

i well that's what i picked up on and i'm like you're gonna you, you've got to deal with this teleprompter thing. I'm not sure how I thought I was going to teach you how to read teleprompters because I didn't have a job at that time. You would always say, like, it goes faster than you think. I was like, okay. I was very concerned. Yes. Did you get the job?

No, I don't think I ever went in on it. I don't think I ever. But I do remember when the the time when i did use a teleprompter yeah i was like he's right it goes faster than you think and they can control yes you told me that you go they'll can you tell them to slow down i was really i was really you don't speed up for the teleprompter yeah they slow down for you that was really yeah that was my i was just was like i was gonna help you yes and then you dated cohen for a while right off and on for like five years yeah

that was a very sad i i read a little bit about like i feel like i was mean to is this this thing is about writing a memoir yeah you're gonna you gotta really sort of wonder well i was gonna change his name and then the lawyer that goes through the book with you it's like people will know who he is anyway right there's no sense so you have to email him and ask him if it's okay and what'd he say and I didn't want to email him the passages because I'd already finished the book and I was tired of it yeah I didn't want to have to rewrite right he said I said can I write about you and uh I said the lawyer's concerned about some of the pot smoking stuff and he's's like, it's fine.

And then he just said in the email, he goes, say whatever you want. Just be kind. And now I feel like I could have been kinder. Well, I think that what was very telling and the interesting thing about Marcon, who I'd like to interview. I don't, is he here? I haven't, I mean, the email was the first time I spoke to him in forever. I saw him once and like, he was such a sweet and very funny club comic guy.

He was the guy in New York. I remember he had this disposition. He loved working with a crowd. He was very funny. But there was a lot of pot. There was a lot of pot. And I believe that over time, extensive pot smoking can somewhat diminish your will to get out and manifest things in your life. Well, there's a thing called a God complex that you can get from smoking too much pot. Really?

I never got that unless God was terrified all the time. You're a Jew God. And paranoid. all the time you're a jew god and paranoid um where you think like you're you know the greatest and people should just really come to your house and get you right they want you did you is that how you described in the book because all i read was that like he seemed to think that show business was just going to come to his apartment yes he never wanted to leave and go out. Oh, that's so sad. I know. But he's, I feel like I should publicly say, like, he's a great guy. Oh, yeah.

Well, you loved him. I guess I was getting out some aggressions, maybe, from our breakups. Well, you loved him, obviously. Yeah. Yeah. And he did, you know, a lot of people went through a Cohen period. Some very smart, attractive female comics went through a coen period some some very smart attractive female comics went through coen periods but what is it because there are some women comedians i know you know they stay the

fuck away from comics i don't get it i don't get it at all because i think if i was in i think every profession should just date their own profession because why would you want to talk about somebody else's profession for half the time like can you imagine being married to a dentist and having to talk about dentistry? What? Oh, God. So you're saying a dentist has to marry a dentist? Yes. That sounds horrible.

No, that doesn't make sense. And that's what Bernie Sanders wants, too. But wasn't there an issue? Because I married a comic. And then there's an issue of sort of like who helps who and where are you each other in your careers? I mean, like with Mark, it sounds like that had to be some sort of an issue with that kind of stuff. I mean, it's difficult. Well, there's, I mean, there would be an issue no matter what.

Right. You know, there'd be, if you married somebody who wasn't a comic, there'd be an issue with you going on the road every weekend. Right. Well, you're with a dude now that, like, Rich is a great comic and he's a great guy but i i know that legend right i know in his mind he's like i hope she makes money yes like yes yeah because he wants me to make money but not as much as him do you know what i mean he still wants to be so i have to make just slightly less than him but you started in in Canada. How long did you... Well, let's go back. Okay.

Because you have a backstory like I don't think anyone I've spoken to. For one reason, you're Canadian. Right. What part of Canada did you grow up in? I grew up on the border of Alberta and Saskatchewan. What does that look like? Where is that? I should look it up.

It's on the west. It's like... It's in the west. Okay. It's like it goes British Columbia is the most western, most province. That's where Victoria is? Yes. Yeah.

And then there's- Is Vancouver in British Columbia? Yes. Okay. And Victoria's on Vancouver Island. Right. That's actually on there. And then it's Alberta, then Saskatchewan.

Oh, okay. So Edmonton's in Alberta? Yeah. Okay. And what's in Saskatchewan? Regina. I don't know. Nothing really.

Where's Winnipeg? That's going farther east. That's not a happy place, really. No. I've never been there. Culturally, very nice. Had nice, smart people up there. But boy, that place gets beaten in the winter and shit.

Yeah. It's a tough place to live. No, the fucking city of Winnipeg looks like it's just had enough. I've never been there. It's insane. I think that one of their big tourist stops, if you can handle it, is I think that it's the windiest corner in North America. I think that's what it is.

There's a place there. Because wasn't it just built there for trading? Yeah, I think so. For trading. Maybe French people were involved. I don't know. But so what, so how far up north were there people where you were? It was pretty much the end of the line.

Really? And the highway. And I mean, people did live farther north. There was like, you know. But your neighbor was like a mile away kind of shit? Yep. Yeah. And it was, why?

I don't know why they, I mean dad you know his grandfather or his father gave him left him a piece of land there uh-huh or no he he had money and he went and bought that land there because i guess it was cheaper just bought a chunk of land so where was he living like was he living in a city my parents were both living in saskatchewan they were living in a tiny town oh okay like a farming Like a farming community in Saskatchewan. So they're farmers? They're farmers from farmers from farmers from farmers, yeah. Really? Yeah.

Holy shit. All right, so he's like, I'm going to buy this chunk of land and farm it? Yes, so there was nothing on it, and he might have been drunk when he bought it. Was he a drinker? Yes. And my mom was pregnant. That's why they got married. So he's drunk and she's pregnant and they buy a chunk of land.

She was 19? Yeah. Pregnant with you? No, with my oldest sister. How's she doing? She's good. Okay. They're doing great.

And so they had to build a house and take all the rocks off the lands. They did all that? They did it all by hand, yeah. And so I grew up, we didn't have running water when I was growing up so you had a shit in a shack yes i'm sorry i was no no we we shat in a can at night if it was too late to go out to the outhouse what yeah it had a toilet seat on it the can did yes it was like a bucket with a toilet yeah it's like as high as a

seat it was comfortable well when you're a kid it's like it's no i don't we didn't know we didn't have tv so we didn't know how other people oh my god so this is like wood stove hand-built house kind of shit yes we we we melted snow on the stove like for our once a week baths and stuff i still only take a bath once a week with snow yes with. I have it imported. How many kids were there? Norway. There's four kids. Four of you in this, was it like, I'm picturing kind of like a cabin-ish type of house that

always needed repair? Yeah, it was like a rundown. It was like a shack. It was a shack that they built. Well, their first house burnt down. What? Yes. When you were alive? my mom was pregnant with me and so then they lived in a trailer on the land like a like a camper trailer not a not an rv uh and when i was the baby i guess it was too cold to put me

down so my mom had to carry me the whole time what because it was there was no heat there's yeah well there was yeah it's like pioneers. Yes, it's the 1800s. I know, it's so crazy. And it's not even hippie shit, though. It's like he's a farmer in earnest. It wasn't like, we're off the grid because civilization is in trouble. I used to try to tell people I grew up on an organic farm to try to make it seem cooler.

But no, it was just like some guy that didn't know that was what he're supposed to do because well my dad really is proud of being a farmer and he loved living off the land and it's you know so what were you eating as a child just shit you grew or did you have to go to a trading post or no everything was from the farm literally every single thing on the table was from the from the get-go yeah so we made our own butter you know my mom made our our own ketchup which is disgusting your mom made ketchup yes everything was how did you even know about ketchup why would she do that to you if you weren't like this isn't we want ketchup and then it's sort of like i'll try to make you some but how could you have even been i don't know probably

my dad wanted it he wanted ketchup the house So there was a lot of experimenting going on. It's like, I'll try to recreate something that normal people eat from the supermarket. Do you know, like, we weren't recreating from the supermarket. You know, the supermarket's recreating what people have been doing for centuries. I know, I bet you ketchup was probably...

But ketchup is disgusting. How much ketchup is awful? I bet. But I'm assuming that ketchup was not a farm item, that it didn't originate from... Right. You're probably like... Yeah, it was a convenience item that some idiot came up with instead of something else. I don't know.

I don't either. I'm sure we could learn it, but I'm not doing that right now because we're in this. So we can look at the history of ketchup either. But I will say this. Heinz is knocking it out of the park nobody comes close no it's the best yeah it's the best ketchup it really is well yeah because we grew up with it there's like anything any ketchup that you get homemade or otherwise you're going to be judging against heinz and that's what that's the staple i mean

what was the other one del monte no good no not even no that's the. Hunts? No, Hunts. That's the other big one. No, it's no good. But I imagine there's some idiots in the world that are like, I'm kind of a Hunts guy. Yeah, they're fucked up. They don't get it. They do not get it. But wait. Okay.

So what are the ages of all the kids? Because I just want a picture. Were you close? So there's four girls in five and a half years. Wow. And you're the youngest. I'm the youngest. You're the youngest.

Yes. But I also have a sister who's mentally handicapped in there. girls in five and a half years so wow and you're this i'm the youngest you're the youngest yes but i also have a sister who's mentally handicapped in there so my second oldest sister lynn has down syndrome so my mom really had her work full range yeah yeah and so so the second the one above you has down syndrome no two up two up so you guys dealt with that your whole life? Yes. But I didn't know she was until I was probably six, seven, until I realized something's up. But out of the mental handicaps, if I'm not being insensitive, that's functional. And they have a full range of emotions and fun and everything, right?

She's amazing. Well, I've had people say over the years, like, I love Down syndrome people because they're so wonderful and so happy all the time. My sister has a terrible temper, and you have to push her really hard, which we did. We told her one time. I mean, you're on a farm. What else are you going to do for fun? Let's push the mentally challenged sister to the point where she loses it.

Oh God, we were, we were caught. We did, you know, we were mean to everyone at certain points. But I remember one time we, um, called her and, uh, told her she got accepted into college. And, uh, that's horrible. accepted into college. That's horrible. But my sisters and I were in the bedroom laughing so hard at my other sister. Yes, we bullied our Down syndrome sister. Yeah, and I guess that's just sibling shit.

But she got even too because she, I guess my parents set this up this way, is that she owned the VCR. So if we wanted to rent a movie, she would have to give us the okay. Really? That's interesting. Yeah. So she had a little power there.

Yeah. So yeah. And she would hold the line? Oh, yeah. You had to tell her there was a dog or a kid in it. You know. So she'd sit there waiting for a dog or a kid, and you'd say, like, I don't know, it must be a deer.

Maybe I didn't remember it properly. I thought that was in the preview. So this is a very challenging upbringing. And also, you're like the last one, so you're wearing everyone else's clothes. I imagine your mom making clothing. My mom made clothing. Come on! Yes, yes, yes yes and they got in a fight about it once at school because you were wearing a frock that some girl made fun of so your dad did he farm

was he a successful farmer well uh he you know once they got the farm up and running then the house burned down then they got it you know they got the camper they got the farm up and running, then the house burned down. Then they got it, you know. They got the camper. They got the camper, then they finally got a new house. Well, they basically bought an old house and pulled it onto the farm with a dirt basement,

which we slept in. What do you mean he slept in a dirt basement? Yes, my sisters and I, we slept downstairs. There was no walls? No, no. There was walls, but there was carpet over the dirt.

The ground? Yes. And there was lots of mice down there. You could hear mice. All four of you were down there? Yes. In one room? Yep.

And what were they doing upstairs? I know. It's like one of those Irish... There's a lot of words for it, I guess. I mean, it seems primitive, but there's a certain part of me that thinks it's a little of words for it i guess yeah i mean it seems primitive but that but there's a certain part of me that thinks like it's a little abusive in a way you know it sounds like these you know like you were raised in the wild i know it's embarrassing to talk about but were they is it well i mean for a long time i was i didn't talk about it because i was embarrassed but then you

know as i get older i realized like nobody lived like that. It's such a crazy... And you wouldn't assume that you lived like that. Yeah, people... You seem together. You know how to dress properly. Not just wearing overalls. You're not grunting or like... Water in a bottle? What?

What's the world come to? But were you homeschooled? No, no. We went to school. Okay, well, that probably saved my mom my mother was a teacher oh good so so you got proper parenting yes and your father what was he farming so he was farming cattle and and milk cows how many acres did you have you have well i don't remember how many acres we had and then my father got cancer and we lost that farm did you lose the

father no but we all say goodbye to him they sent him home to die and we that that farm. Did you lose the father? No, but we all said goodbye to him. They sent him home to die. That's what they do in Canada? That's the health coverage we all hear about? This was, you know,

many, many years ago. You got cancer. Good luck with it. This was like 40 years ago. You've got your diagnosis. So, but he lived. What kind of cancer?

He had stomach cancer. Jesus, fuck. Yeah. And he just kicked it well the the story goes and i don't know this is in the book i don't know how true this is but uh supposedly his mother came and told him that he couldn't die because he had you know a farm and kids to look after and he better get his ass out of bed and get better and he started he got up that day and took a walk and that and that's the that's and then he just was better that no he you know

is he still around i do remember us always like every day taking him for his walk is he still around oh yeah yeah so he did kick stomach cancer without medication just because his mom well he would he he no he did chemo. Okay. And he had a lot of operations. He was in the hospital for about a year. Oh, Jesus. How old were you? So I was six.

That's horrible. Yeah. And then so when he came back, we had a smaller farm. And then we mostly, you know, we had sort of our own farm animals like chickens and cows and stuff. But the main thing was a market garden so we had like 10 acres of garden that you sold vegetables and that's how you made a living yes that is hard that is some serious manual labor so you had to like you know you had pigs you killed

and chickens you killed yes and cows you killed yes and probably. No sheep. No goats. I don't think we ever had goats. But you had to do the whole thing where it's like, oh, we know that pig and then you just watched a pig get older and then eventually you kill it? Well, you don't name the animals that are for eating.

Right. You don't become friends. That's the rule? That's a rule. And you were taught that? You know, when you're a farm kid you learn like the cycle of life pretty early on i had to kill the chickens i mean that was my job was like cutting the heads off the chickens yeah i've seen that happen once and uh it's not it's not good yeah i think it's like maybe affected me in life you do that might be why i'm a comedian because you had to like whack those chickens.

I had to take life. Yeah. Yeah. But from what age were you? About, I was like nine, 10, 11. And that's where you just, you grab a chicken, it's freaking out, you put its head on a piece of wood and you take a large butcher.

Oh, an ax. Yeah, a hand ax. And you have to hope you hit it right or else it's going to run around with its head off and dangling from a tendon. Well, it will run no matter what. Right. And then my sister Lynn, she would then go find all the chickens and bring them back.

The headless chickens. Yeah, because they'd run and be like, there's one under the car. Oh, really? Oh, no. But there's something very reasonable about this life. Yeah, it's, you know, it's a way. Well, you eat chicken. I mean, I assume.

So people do. They think it's horrifying, but it's just because you're up and, you know, this is how it actually works. This is how you're getting your food. But there's an intimacy and there's a practicality to eating what you raise. Right. to eating what you raise. Right. As opposed to, you know,

this faceless, horrible, you know, airport hangar-sized thing filled with cages of, you know, fat chickens that can't move that run down a conveyor of immigrant labor just hacking heads off. Yes. It's different.

I mean, I'm a vegetarian. Now? Yeah. How long? Off and on for you know since I was like probably 20

so that was one of your big rebellions as you departed the farm you're like fuck this I couldn't find a black guy in Canada so I had to go vegetarian

then I discovered the Jews have you done that joke before? no I would write that down. You want to make note of that? Yeah, no, it's fine. No, I never do anything funny in my act. Oh, I know.

That's like, I just. So, all right, so you're living like this, you know, emotionally abusing your mentally challenged sister and cutting the heads off the chickens. Yes, yes. And at what point, how's she doing, the way she's great you know she's uh she lives on her own uh-huh that's good so she has but she has workers that come and uh-huh check on her and she's is she up are your folks still on the everybody still lives in canada my parents live on a farm nearby but they're gonna move um my sister actually lives on the

the second farm that we we had so you have all this property yes are any of them still farming no my mom still has a big garden right but no but did your dad he got by on the farming oh yeah yeah they did all right in the end did the food taste better though in your recollection comparatively speaking eggs chicken beef whatnot well i you know i used to complain about it all the time because, you know, my mom would make homemade bread and we'd take sandwiches to school and the homemade bread would crumble. So I'd always have like, you know. The mess.

Yes. You're sitting with your friends. Can we please have boughten bread? Just so you won't be mocked for your frock and your crumbly bread. Just so you won't be mocked for your frock and your crumbly bread. And my sister went to, had a sleepover once and they had TV dinners. And she would always, we'd always be like, what was it like?

What were the TV dinners like? Tell us about the TV dinners. So your mom would like make stews and shit, stuff that would last a week that you sort of have to eat out of the same pot for a week kind of stuff? Yeah, I mean, I guess. Like, you know, we'd have to like make butter

and you'd put... But you didn't have a churn. No, we'd have cream in a jar and you put a spoon in the jar and then you just shake it while you're doing your homework or whatever. Oh, right, right.

Because if you whip cream enough, it just butters. Yes. And then you just salt it a little bit. Right. And then, you know, I don't know. This is so stupid. It's not stupid. bit right and then you know i don't know this is so stupid it's not stupid it's completely unique what i don't understand is like how do you get from there to here like what what what moment were you like i got it you

know i'm i'm living like uh like an off the grid person well i hated it you know i mean i was like i fancied myself as i wanted to be be a writer. But where did you learn that? Were you at school and there were other kids that seemed to be living a life that seemed less harrowing? Well, I guess when I started babysitting and then they had TV. So what did you do? And your dad was a boozy? He was boozy? No, not after.

The cancer? Yeah, not after the cancer. Even, you know, they were too broke. He says he stopped drinking because they were too broke to buy alcohol. That usually doesn't stop committed drinkers. Why wasn't he making his own alcohol? You know, they did, I think. They did?

Yeah. I think that was a part of it. Then he got cancer. He still drinks once in a while, you know, but he, you know, it's hard on his system. Who milked the cows? So I milked a cow. I had my own cow. We all had our own cow.

Well, my dad gave us all a cow for our 10th birthdays. And then I don't know why. What was your cow's name? Bessie. It's so cliche. Yes. But my fourth grade teacher's name was Bessie. So I named the cow.

Oh, after. Her. Like I thought it was so funny. Yeah. So I milked a cow every morning and every night. Oh my God. god and i sold the milk my cow's milk at the farmer's market and then i started an ice cream business what and i sold ice cream what we made the ice cream at home yeah and i i made crazy you know raspberries how old were you roman raisin this is like 10 11 12 13 maybe yeah you figured out how to make ice cream from your mom?

Yes. Was it like one of those wooden basket ice cream makers? Like the wooden, like was it wood on the outside and you put ice in it? Yes, yeah. And then you put the thing in the middle? Yes. You were like almost Amish. Yes. I know.

My homemade clothes and churning the ice cream. And were all four daughters at the farmer's market? Well, my sisters didn't, they just took the money for the cow. So my dad would just give them whatever the blue book value of the cow was, I guess, you know, 60 bucks or something. But I actually took the cow. I got a pregnant cow because I picked the fattest one. And so then I had, you know, I had a little business going for a while.

Was there a brand? Was it Bonnie's Ice Cream? No, just ice cream yeah and then my sister Lynn would help me and I wouldn't give her any money I would just buy her

french fries and that was it she was fine with it and but but this was a farmer's market where was it like where

city folk would come well there was an air force base pretty close by yeah so they would come the base people so they were city folk So they would come, the base people. So they were city folk.

To buy ice cream from the strange farm families. It was like a line around the block for my ice cream. Really? People would call the house and order it. Really? Yes. Why didn't you stick with that? I know.

I think I should have just been an entrepreneur. So, okay. So you started babysitting and watching television. And what was the impulse there? And then I couldn't wait to get away, go to a city, you know, sort of. And then I went to college

a little bit. I took radio and television arts. Nate, Northern Alberta Institute of Technology. So you got out a bit like you, like you,

and your parents were excited about that. They weren't like, who's going to take care of the cows? They didn't like that I was going. I think they wanted me to stay. I mean, I moved to Vancouver.

I don't think they wanted me to go that far. Right. And then I was working at an advertising agency. In Vancouver. In Vancouver. Were you going to school? I was done school then. And then I started freelancing.

This advertising agency helped me get a lot of sort of freelance work. Doing what? You know, writing like menus or like, you know, pamphlets for stuff. And then, but I was also waitressing still at the time because I needed money. So you were living in Vancouver with people? Yeah. I like Vancouver. Yeah, it was good. I enjoyed it too. It was a nice city. And you were like 20? Yeah. I like Vancouver. Yeah, it was good.

I enjoyed it too. It was a nice city. And you were like 20? Yeah, I think I was 20. So you're working at an advertising agent, writing menus and pamphlets, and you're waitressing. So where do you grab...

So then I got a job as a hostess at a comedy club. Which one? At the Punchline. I don't know if it's still there. Mark Breslin's place? No, it was independent and in Gastown. Uh-huh.

And it blew my mind. I wanted to write stand-up. So I started writing. You just took the job because you saw a listing. No, somebody at the restaurant had said that they were looking for someone. They were telling someone else. Uh-huh. And I went down there and got the job. I that they were looking for someone. They were telling someone else.

Uh-huh. And I went down there and got the job. I stole it out from under them. And you were like blown away by comedy. That was the first time you saw live comedy. I'd seen it one other time, but I mean, this was- Do you remember who it was? The very first comedian that I ever saw was Stanley Ullman?

I don't know. Is that his name? Anyway- The Canadian guy? No. The first time I was in Anaheim, my mom had taken us to Disneyland. Oh, that was nice of her. Yeah.

In your frocks? Yes. So then, anyway, so he'd been playing poker at our house for years before I realized that was the guy. I said a joke of the first guy I ever saw. And they're like, that's him. Oh, he'd been playing at Mark Cohen's? Yeah, Mark Cohen would have that weekly poker game, and he was one of the first guy I ever saw. And I'm like, that's him. Oh, he'd been playing at Mark Cohen's? Yeah, Mark Cohen would have that weekly poker game and he was one of the guys.

Really? He had a very funny opening joke where he came on stage and he didn't say anything into the mic. He just fixed his coffee and moved his notes around for what seemed like a really long time. And then he goes,

well, when you go to work, do you start right away? And the audience fell out. So you saw Stanley Ullman, then you get this job as a hostess at the Punchline. Yes. In Vancouver. In Vancouver.

In Gastown. Yeah. And so you're seeing all the Canadian dudes? Yep. Like who? Like Ian Bagg, I remember, was one, Craig Campbell was another guy. These guys were,

they'd been doing it maybe like between two and four years, but I thought they were amazing. Right, well, Bags are like our age. Huh? right well bags like our age huh bags like our age yeah you're young so he was the one who told me like you can't because i was like trying to sell jokes to comedians i've been writing these jokes and yeah and he was like that's ridiculous you can't that's not how it works are you friends with him still yeah he's a great guy yeah and uh very funny yeah he's really amazing at crowd work if you ever know i know he's a crowd work guy and then because i was

the hostess i took the calls a lot people would call and they'd say who do you got coming in and you'd say something like are they american and you'd be like no and they'd be like well when you got an american guy coming in they they only wanted to see americans who was the first american you saw like because now you work with these guys i mean now you see them a lot of them like remembered me as the hostess of course they did they're on the road they're like who's that chick i didn't have sex with any of them that's what you well no but i'm sure they tried uh i i mean there was a lot of partying a lot of drinking really in comedy yeah it's crazy and then i eventually started doing it and uh well like at the open mic i went

to the yuck yucks open mic because if you did stand up you know that was the rule was the punch line that you couldn't date one of the comics and you couldn't do stand-up really yeah it's probably worked out better if in terms of yuck yucks being some sort of you know strange monopoly of the entire canadian landscape to get started there got started there so you start doing open mics and what did you then i won a contest that was like uh funniest new comic in canada i won the whole thing uh-huh really early and like how many years in maybe like six times doing it what yeah no not i hadn't done it a lot for sure six Six times in?

Well, the reason I went into the contest was so I could get more stage time. Uh-huh. And you started touring? And then after that,

I moved to Toronto. What was the name of that place? The Laugh Resort in Toronto? Yes, but I worked for Yuck Yuck. Right, of course.

You're in. You're part of the studio system. I'm part of it. Yeah. Yeah. And then... And then did you meet a lot of those other dudes?

The... Yep, met them all. The crazy Yuck Yuck comics? Yes. So then I called Caroline's... In New York. In New York and asked who books the show.

Louis Ferranda. Louis Ferranda. Hi, hi, hi, Bonnie. I got him on the phone and he... I was like, I'm a comedian and I want to do your show.

Uh-huh. And he was like, what do you mean? What are you talking about yeah i don't know why he entertained this but he said okay i have workmen in my office that are fixing the ceiling if you could make them laugh i'll put you on the show so i had my notebook out and i you walked in or this was on the phone this was on the phone so he put you on speaker yeah that was your audition that was my audition i got the show well he asked me if i was cute

was it oh for the tv show yes cal ryan's comedy yes and one of the first, I think before I even did the stand-up, he was like, are you cute? So he puts you on speaker and what did you do? I just did my jokes that I had in my notebook. I didn't think it was weird. I honestly, when I called, that's what I thought might happen. I didn't think like. That you'd have to do your jokes on the phone? Yeah.

Was there no videotapes then? Yes, there was. But I just, I was naive. I didn't know. Did you hear yourself getting laughs from the workers? jokes on the phone yeah was there no videotapes then what i know yes there was but i just i was naive i didn't know did you hear yourself getting laughs from the work yes and i started doing a little bit of crowd work with the uh the workman that's the best audition story i ever heard then i went and did the show and bombed really bad it was not easy room i don't think caroline's that one the one none of them were like caroline's in times square it gets so huge well that one the one none of them were like Caroline's in Times Square it gets so huge well that's the thing unless it's

filled it's hard yeah but then eventually they built that curtain so like they could close up make you feel less shitty makes you feel more shitty it does but like that curtains coming because there's like there's all tears yes and then

they leave a little open for four comics or five comics to sit at that one table so they could look through the curtain. Yeah, yeah, I remember. I never played it that much. I never got along with that guy. But surprise.

So that was, you moved to New York after that? And then I moved to New York, yeah. Because it went so well? Well, Jeff Sussman sort of, so I didn't know Jeffff sussman and um he had written me a letter yeah uh he's you know i after i won uh best comic in canada he knew about it somehow and he'd seen a picture of me so uh he asked me if he could manage me but i just ignored

it because i don't i didn't know what a manager was or anything and so then when uh lewis ferranda said who's your manager yeah i just said jeff sussman yeah i'd had a letter from him yeah and then i called jeff sussman and i said i told him i was your manager and he goes because i am really yes he was excited so then he convinced me to i stayed are you still with him no no jeff s Jeff Sussman, for people listening, is a New York-based manager, I think famous for, I think he still represents Kevin James and Joe Rogan. Yep. Who else? That's enough. He's living large.

He's doing fine. I always had respect, even though him and I were not pals or anything, but I knew him and I was probably a dick to him. But those guys that stayed on their own and bet you know, in bed on a couple of lucky horses and made a life, I have respect for those guys. Well, he had a good eye. Yeah. I mean. Yeah.

Who else would, do you remember who else he had? I can't remember. I just know. Brian Frazier. Do you remember him? Sure. He was one of his clients. What would you do if I sang out a key?

Yeah. And then he'd spit a key out. But yeah, I've interviewed. Look at my wingspan. Yeah. Didn't he? It was funny. Yeah.

I interviewed Brian he started with me actually in Boston he's here he writes things he did a one man show about anxiety he wrote some books

yeah yeah some books so he had Frasier oh Ted Alexandro oh yeah I wonder if he's still with him I don't think so alright so

so now you're rolling you're in New York you got a manager and then I met you right after that right and then you just started a long string of fucking Jews.

Yes. And then Jew comedians, please. I'm sorry. Jew comedians. It's a smaller. Yeah. Was it because you just never experienced Jews before? Well, you know, I've always liked Jews because Jewish men, in my experience, are verbal,

which I like. I like having that exchange. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that was part of it. I was like the- They never shut up. Yes, I love it. They're needy and verbal. in my experience are verbal which I like I like having that exchange yeah yeah yeah so so that was part of I was like the they never shut up yeah they're needy and verbal you know who wants to cuddle I don't you just want to talk yeah and and or even just listen in Rich's case I just listen yeah and help them feel better about themselves that's what you're about listening to Jewish men talk and help them feel better about themselves. I'm used to struggle.

So I feel like we come together on that. But how long was it like, because you did, like we were all sort of, you know, did those basic cable shows and make those rounds. I imagine you were auditioning,

but what was your experience on the road? How long did it take? Were you headlining? When did, where did it? Well, I did the road in Canada,

but I didn't, I hardly. As a middle? Yeah. Uh-huh. But I hardly, and I think back, what was I doing? How was I middle? Yeah. Uh-huh. But I hardly, and I think back, what was I doing? How was I doing?

Yeah. Half an hour. I have no idea what that is. Yeah. I didn't hardly ever go on the road. Once I got to New York. Yeah. It was, you know, city clubs.

And then I went to LA. I got a deal right away, and then I went to LA. Oh, you got one of those $250,000. $175,000. $175,000 development deal. What was your agent, Ruthann Secunda? No. Who was your agent?

That's so funny. Everyone wanted Ruthann Secunda. Ruthann will get you that quarter million dollar deal. No, it was Jeff Sussman got me that. Oh, you didn't have an agent? I did after the deal. I got William Morris. Which one?

Who was it? James Dixon. Dixon. In August, Mike August. Mike August. Yeah. Dixon is another one of those independent guys now who i'm very impressed with and who like i i insulted somehow but he's all right he was always he's a character dixon i loved him yeah he's great his roster is john stewart colbert kimmel and uh corolla corolla yeah but dixon just had these guys yeah he was he's such a guy though

too he loved hanging out with them and yeah he was a little character he's almost like an old hollywood style character yes yeah but he's on his own now he just he just has kimball and colbert and john stewart and that's what else he's done he's good right and then what happened after all that you got your agent you got your your deal. You did a pilot, right? I did a couple of TV shows that actually made it on the air and a couple that didn't. And then it just got worse and worse. It just went down.

No, I really just, I did want to be a writer and everybody would talk me out of it all the time. But I ended up supporting myself by all these writing gigs that I had. Like for what? Game shows and- You're one of those people that just, they pulled in. Yeah, I just always knew somebody

that was writing on something that would, are you available? Well, you did Tough Crowd too, right? Yeah, I did Tough Crowd a couple times, like five times or something. And did you write for any shows that stayed on the air kind of thing? Well, I wrote for two years.

That was probably my longest thing was for Spy TV, that hidden camera show, which I loved working on that show. So was writing better for you than stand-up? I mean, did you prefer it? Do you like doing stand-up? Well, I do. Well, I have such a weird relationship with stand-up because I am not as good as I want to you prefer it do you like doing well I do I well I have such a weird

relationship with stand-up because I am not as good as I want to be and it frustrates me it really I can't I can't you know you know it's like one day you think I've got it I know what I'm doing now and then the next time it's like it doesn't I don't know I I've never come to terms with it I've never been able to just like well Well, the thing is, is weird is that, you know, I think that if you have the mindset where I don't do anything else, like at some point you just cross over into this thing where you're like, I'm a comic and that's, you know, I'm going to go up no matter what and just fucking deal with it.

You know, it becomes different, but it seems like, you know, you had success with other things too. Well, I have a lot of shame around standup. Like I'm embarrassed. I don't want people I know to come see me. Still? Yes, even more so now because I'm a mom and neighbors and, you know,

I don't want my people that like, you know, that I stand outside and wait for the bus to come with the kids and we small talk. Well, what is it about your stand up? Well, I don't know. I just feel like I don't know. I just don't think they won't like it. I just think they won't like it.

Do you think it represents you honestly? Is it that you're like, oh, that joke's old or that? Well, I think it does represent me honestly, but I think my real life doesn't represent me honestly. Like I pretend I'm somebody else in my real life. Do you know what I mean? It's almost like I'm like a closeted gay man, you know, who's married. You know what I mean?

Who's living a suburban life. Yes. You're down low as doing a set at the comic strip. Yes. Like I didn't, when I moved to suburban New Jersey, I didn't tell anyone that I was a comedian. For years no one knew. What did you tell them?

I, you know, just would avoid that. knew what did you tell them I you know just would avoid that but when did you do Ask Comic Standing I mean at some point they knew no because I'm Bonnie Voss there nobody I don't know nobody ever asked nobody ever said anything nobody recognized me you're Bonnie Voss in New Jersey yes like I have a separate Facebook I have separate you know what I mean there's a Bonnie McFcfarland facebook and a bonnie voss yeah so the bonnie voss people you know that's like pictures of my gym and people from you know my kids uh friends moms so you're living a double life i'm living a fully double life yes and occasionally it'll and this is all because of shame and insecurity yes yes. Yes. Yeah. Because I think I'm like too dirty or okay. I did a show at the Village Underground recently.

And when I was, and it went really well, like it couldn't have been better. Yeah. And there was my neighbor was in the audience. She came up, she goes, you never tell me where you have set. So I came, you know, and I was like, I was reeling. I couldn't handle it. Like you've just been caught with it. Yes.

Like doing something horrible. I'm 69ing it. Like you'd just been caught with a... Yes. Like I... Like doing something horrible? I'm 69-ing my... Right, right. But yes. And then all I could think about that night was like how dirty, like the dirty jokes that I'd done. Like is she... I think I said I sucked a thousand cocks in that set.

I'm sure she got a kick out of it. Maybe. I don't know. She never said. But now do you look at her going like, Oh, kick out of it. Maybe. I don't know. She never said. But now do you look at her going like, no, she knows. Yes. Yes.

I'm like, can you not tell everyone else in the neighborhood? That's rough. I know. It's like stupid. What do you track this? Well, your book's called You're Better Than Me. Yeah. So you have this fundamental shame thing.

Yeah, I guess so. About? About the, I guess so. About? About the way I grew up. It's all me trying to spin it out of like, you know, like for these people, they can know this. For these people, they can know that. But this is the memoir, which, you know, where, you know, you talk about. Yeah, it all comes out because. Cutting chickens heads off and fucking Jewish men.

Right. Comedians. Yes. But that's the other thing is like now I'm in another situation where, you know, they found out I wrote a book and they want to read the book and I don't want them to read the book. But you've had such a more interesting... I don't want anyone to read the book.

I want them to buy the book. You just don't want your neighbors to read it. That's all. I mean, you'd like... But don't you think they'd be like, wow, what a life as opposed to like, what a pig? I don't know. Come on.

I don't know. I maybe, I don't know. I know it sounds crazy. What was it? Well, what do you want to do? Because Rich has none of that. Rich is like the exact opposite. He's Rich Voss no matter what situation he's in.

Rich Voss wants more people to he could not like like i remember doing a show in um vegas once and they had my face on a billboard and i was humiliated i was horrified that people were going to see that billboard because you don't think well this is just primarily because you don't think you're good enough yes as a comic yes yes and that you're not going to live i'm going to be like i always think i'm like i've never made a cd because i think I'm going to be like, I always think, like I've never made a CD because I think I'm going to be a little bit better soon. And then I'll unleash myself to the world. I understand that.

You know, like some people just aren't like that. But like there is this idea where it's like, I wish I had a better tag. You know, that idea, you know, like that's a good idea, but I don't think it's, it gets a laugh, but it's not a full joke. Or you do, you put something, you know, like that's a good idea, but I don't think it's it gets a laugh, but it's not a full joke. Or you do you put something, you know, you do something on TV and then you think of a better tag later and you're like, oh, yeah, I'm on there. Yeah, but but no one's paying attention.

I know. I know. That's that's the real truth of it is that. Well, yeah, that's the thing is like really the pressure is only on, you know, when people have expectations and are familiar with you i mean like for me to get successful doing this thing you know after doing you know spending 20 years of my life trying to be the best comic in the world and then you know getting you know popular because i'm interviewing people it was sort of a tough pill to swallow because it made me it reopened all that sort of like weird insecurity of like maybe i'm not a good enough comic you know maybe

you know that wasn't you know and then eventually you just accept it like well i'm pretty good i'm about as good as you know i can be right now and there are some people that enjoy it and that's that i you know i've never been better and i always think that i was pretty good but i was not you know i was alienating that's what i am i feel like i don't think you are maybe maybe you have that thing that i had then which is sort of like you know i don't like me so why would they i will try to defy them to not like yes i have that thing that I had then, which is sort of like, I don't like me, so why would they? I will try to defy them to not like me. Yes, I have that lots of times.

I go on stage with the attitude like, fine, I won't like you either. Exactly. Well, that's fixable. What the fuck is that? I have no idea, but I think- Time's up. I think that means I had a breakthrough. Oh, good.

I'm glad you didn't go with time's up. I'm sorry. I'm glad you had a breakthrough. Oh, good. I'm glad you didn't go with Time's Up. I'm sorry. I'm glad you had a breakthrough. You're about to. Don't you think after all these years that that timing is everything really did turn out to be true? Definitely. I fought that for so long. I was like, it's not everything.

It's just one of the things. Well, there's a lot to it. well there's a lot to it but no but i think i've seen people that that were completely socially awkward and and had no timing in life at all who were great joke writers learn their timing yeah like i don't it makes a huge i don't think i don't think it's always natural is what i'm saying right i think it definitely can be learned as you figure out who you are on stage right but some people have a very pleasing oh yeah no some people like especially jews they're good at their timing they're very good at the timing you know like there's a quickness there's a some people like because you seem very enamored with crowd work and that is all timing like you have to be quick-witted but for crowd work to really work

well sometimes you don't want to say the thing you think of you know your instinct is to say it as fast as you can but really let it sit there for a second. Uh-huh. It's time, like, that's where you really see, you know, guys with great timing and quick wits is with crowd work. Right. And there's only a few guys that do it great, you know, and it's really something to watch. Yeah. I mean, I know how to do it, certainly, but if you're a really good crowd work guy and you do that in your regular set,

you've got to figure out how to pace your written material because it's never going to balance out. It's hard to go back. Yeah. So either you save it. But like a lot of people, I imagine it's like, this isn't going well. What are you doing? Where are you from?

Well, that's how I do it because when I'm on the road, I have to save myself a lot of times. They prefer the crowd work from me than my jokes a lot of times. Well, that's because you can do it and if you're good at it, it's a crutch. Yeah. Well, the thing about crowd work, though, I think is that I don't think people realize that it's like a developed skill. Oh, no. There's some guys you can't do it

we won't do it he won't mmm-hmm haha when was the last time you saw him be like he used to actually be sort of like just I don't it's like he doesn't want to deal right right you know well that's the thing though is that there's comics that will just do what they do regardless of they don't care and I've always been a person that like, I'll just cave in. I'll just start talking about my vagina if I have to. Like, you know, I'll have, I'll just, I just got to survive up there somehow. What do you mean?

My pussy? Here we go. You know. Yeah. I mean, I always, I don't, I was never, I never could quite be like, cause me even going like, all right, because me even going like, all right, let me give you what you want, it was wrong.

You know, like, what do you want? Well, that's what I always think about comedians that are so good at, like, being relatable. Yeah. Like, I could never do, people would stand up and be like, no, we don't do that. Yeah, exactly. No, we don't want to hear about

your masturbation thing for an hour. It's not relatable. So I never had that. I never could fake a regular life. Well, you know what I always admired about you was that you could take teeny tiny little things and make them into stand-up. Big, big problem.

Yes. Break them open. But that's like a really hard thing to do. Well, not if you spend a lot of time there. Especially lots of times you're talking about the inside of your brain. Well, that's, yeah, that's where I live a lot of times.

That's like a hard thing to do. That's my home. Yeah. But all right. So, well, we got to get you over this hump. So, when did you have that baby? How old is that baby? Eight.

The Voss baby? Eight. The Voss monster is eight? I'm pretty sure she's eight. Yeah? And she's a great kid? She's, yes, incredible. Wow.

She's an incredible kid. So, what was that? Was that on purpose and everything? Yeah, we did it in the front. We said, you know what? Let's try it this way. No, she, you know, I wanted, that was one of the things, you know, when we knew we were going to get married, I was like, well, I gotta have a kid.

And he was okay with that. He's got an older one. He's got two older daughters and he told me everybody gets along you and his ex-wife we all get along that's great yes i mean his ex-wife was married and had a uh maybe the the baby was like two when i came into the they wanted they were happy to get rid of rich you know what i mean right please. Please take it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He was hanging out at family dinners and whatnot. So, yes, I was like a welcome. Uh-huh.

Yeah, because he lives just, you know, they've moved now, his ex-wife and her new husband. But we used to live like just a mile from them. Yeah, so everyone was around. Even when I had the baby, I didn't know who to show the baby to, so I took it over. Took it. That's how had the baby, I didn't know who to show the baby to, so I took it over. Took it. That's how good of a parent I am. I took this thing over there, and I said, look what I did. Yeah.

And she would come and help me with, you know, she'd had three kids at that point, four kids or something. Two of his. Yeah, so she came over and helped me. She knew what you were up against. Yeah. She gave me a little. Did she teach you about him? What you're up against?

Yeah. She gave me a little. Did she teach you about him? She, I remember we started to get along really early on because she said, if I'd known you, I like you, so I would have told you what a horrible person he is. I would have warned you. But he got better, I imagine. Well, you know, everyone bonds over their mutual distaste for Rich. It's like a fun thing.

It's like sports. Well, that's a weird thing about his presence in the New York comedy world and comedy in general is that he's a very sweet guy and at the core of it all, he's very sensitive, but he's this weird mixture of overly sensitive and very defensive, which I guess is normal but like he lets his sense like you can really you know get a good shot in with him and then like you know at him you

can bust his balls and sometimes like it'll take him a few seconds to regroup around it because he's like you know i don't know what it is about him but the there's a humility to it that's very appealing yeah well people are always like, you know, making fun of him that I'm going to leave him or whatever. But the truth is that, you know, he, out of all his friends, you know, he's the only one that like married someone as challenging

as me. Like, you got to give him credit. You know, I'm not the easiest person in the world to be married to. You know, he stepped up. He's like, I'll take it on. But also, like, what I learned about him is that like, him is that in all his insecurity and his insanity or whatever he is, I remember first seeing him when I was still in Boston. And he had this weird ponytail. It's like greasy.

Yeah. Okay, but can I tell you, I saw a video of that, him doing a show like that. Okay, but can I tell you, I saw a video of that, him doing a show like that, and it was so sexy because there is something really sexy about a man who doesn't know, like he doesn't realize, that is more confident than his looks. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. You couldn't tell if he was Italian or not at that time. But he's a stand-up guy. It seems like he's come through a lot and sort of taken responsibility for himself.

He's very responsible. Yeah. That's not bad. Not bad. I mean, you know, there's trade-offs. That's on the plus side. But you don't feel compelled? He wrote this book.

You don't feel compelled to do a one-person show about this life? No. So wait. I mean, I got paid to do a book, so I had to write a book-person show about this life no so wait so wait i mean i got paid to do a book so i had to write a book so i wrote the book and uh i you know hopefully it's good and uh people like it but i um i still i'm you know people are like oh now you're gonna talk about it in your act and stuff i i'm not really that kind of biographical autobiographical comedian i don't but do you even like do you want to work as a comic i would love to get good no i would love to to it's been 20 years i know i i you know it's a hard thing isn't it it's like golf you never can master it but i want to put an hour special yeah

i want to do the hour special and then either one of two things will happen i'll just hang it up or it'll get easier for me like i'll get my own audience to come out i know but but you you know you gotta be stopping so hard on yourself i mean yeah that's the other thing is that i wish that i could just not care well it's not a matter of not caring it's like giving yourself a break right you know and it's like and if you don't think a joke is working right, you live with a fucking comic who's a genius, right? Yes. So,

tag it up. Hey, Rich, I need a tag. Yeah. How often does that happen? No, it doesn't. Huh.

Well, he doesn't, you know, Rich is a sort of one-sided in that department like we can talk about his act for a long time yeah like like i'll watch his set but i enjoy doing that too like i like breaking down comedy i like talking about comedy and figuring it out and so i'll watch his

set and then on the way home we'll talk about his set and yeah and then when you're going to bed and then i'll be like what about mine mine? He was like, it's fine. But that's, you know. What if you paid him as a writer? For his time. Yes. Yeah, to sit down. It's hard.

It's really hard to get involved with each other's act. But what was your experience with that last comic standing business? Horrible? Yeah, no, I didn't enjoy it. I just, I'm not not that that's not a good thing for me for some comedians it's great i was really bad at doing the interviews yeah i wanted to be funny in the interviews and they just want you to like

you know yeah to play it up to whatever and they took stuff out of context and you know whatever but you like being a mom i love being a mom and you're now like at some point your neighbors are gonna they must know what you do. They do know now. I mean, they used to always introduce me. They'd say, it's Rich Voss's wife. Do you know who this is? This is Rich Voss's wife.

And now they say. Now they sometimes will say, I'm a comedian. So I'm getting there slowly. I just say it bothers me that you're hobbled by this insecurity, this self-flagellating insecurity. Well, it comes in waves. Well, I'm excited for you. The book is funny.

And My Wife Hates Me is the podcast. Is that weekly? Yep. How's it going? It's fine. Is the podcast that weekly? Yeah. How's it going?

It's fine. Are you active with your kids' school? No. I don't do that stuff. Well, what do you do? What are you doing? What do you mean? When you sit at home?

I just wrote a book. Does that sound good enough for you? I do stand up a lot. I write a lot. I have writing jobs. Where do you work? Is that a cellar mostly? No, mostly at the stand. Okay.

Yeah. So people can see you at the stand? Yeah. I've always liked your comedy. I think you're funny. Thank you. It's quite an endorsement. What are you talking about?

Are you being sarcastic? Yes. Why? I guess. I have a hard time taking compliments. So thank you. Fine. It's nice talking to you nice talking to you too

that's it that's it that's all isn't Bonnie great isn't she great I want her to be more confident god damn it so yeah go get her book go watch her movie go Go watch her movie. Go listen to her and Rich on their podcast.

Also, as I said, the new WTF mugs are available from Brian Jones today. They go on sale at 12 noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Go to BrianRJones.com. Go to WTFPod.com. On Thursday, I got Dweezil Zappa coming in. Yes, I did date his sister. And yes, it was a great talk. What else?

Hal.fm for the archives. I don't know if you guys know this, but no ads in the archives, people. You can go to WTFpod.com for the links to that. Also watch my special more later on Hulu and Amazon. Look, I try to tune my guitar. I do tune my guitar before I do this. Thank you. Boomer lives! anything. Order now. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category.

And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative.