WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 692 - Al Lubel

Episode Date: March 24, 2016

Comedian Al Lubel stopped being a lawyer in order to start doing stand-up. But he never stopped putting himself on trial. Al tells Marc how his desperate search for an identity was coupled with a never-ending barrage of crippling self-judgment, even after he won Star Search and became a favorite of late night talk show hosts and fellow comedians. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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T's and C's apply. Lock the gate! All right, let's do this. How are you, what the fuckers? What the fuck buddies? What the fucking ears? What the fuck wads? What the fuck nuts?

I don't know. How's that one? I did get an email though. Right out of the gate. Small request. I don't know if this will get to Mark, but here it goes. Hey Mark, first off, thanks for the weekly pods are a great list.

And when I'm walking to class studying or just hanging around in your podcasts, you say hello to people, scientists, people driving, et cetera. I was wondering if you could give us struggling college students a shout out on a pod. Thanks again.

P.S. I think I've listened to your interview with James Taylor 20 times. Sweet baby, James. Thanks for everything, Ben. Ben, Ben, I don't know what you're up to, dude. I don't know what you're up to, but you struggling college students, this is your very special shout out, Ben, to you and your peers. Don't waste all four years of the time you're spending with money you've borrowed that you may never get to pay back because the system stinks.

Don't waste it all just smoking weed and drinking and not going to class or focusing on what you should be doing. This is the time man here's how i fucked up yeah this is one of the great fuck-ups so like i went to college and you know what i majored in i didn't know i didn't know for four years i was able to cobble together some fucking major because uh you know i just i just went with my interests so i was able to cobble together a English major with a focus in romantic literature and a film studies minor, which you know what that allows me to do in the world? This. So I guess for you struggling college students, don't waste that time. Don't waste that money. I know there are no guarantees in life, but learn how to amplify what you want to be great about yourselves.

You know you got interest. If you're just there buying time thinking they're going to wire your brain with some shit that you can use, no, sir. No, ma'am. Pow. Look out. Just shit my pants. Just coffee.coop. That was a classic ad brought to you by me and copy written by me. So Ben,

yes, I am getting a cold. Thank you for asking. Thank you for noticing that my voice is a little compromised. Just a little tired, I think. Picked up a cold. Also had Daniel Klaus in here who was coughing all over my garage. Still a genius. Still a great conversation. But nonetheless, garage still a genius still a great conversation but nonetheless did cough a bit so i think i've got graphic novelist cold virus germs uh coursing through my uh system probably being very creative within my uh within my veins and my brain and my lungs if they are the same ones that found their strength within the great daniel clowes who will be on a show in the near future. Today's guest is Al Lubell. I didn't forget about you, Ben. I'm going to get back to it. Al Lubell, comedian. Yeah, Al Lubell was a pretty important comedian to me and many others

early on. He's got, let me just say, I want to make sure I get his dates right. Friday, April 15th, Al Lubell will be at the Throckmorton Theater in Mill Valley, California, doing his solo show, Al Alone. And he will also be at the Clubhouse tonight here in Los Angeles on Vermont at 11 o'clock tonight on Gangbusters. That's a show they have over there. I think it's an improv or sketch show that Al will be doing some time on. And I think that you should take the opportunity to see Al Lubell.

Al Lubell, I'm going to work with this name, a lot of L's, not my specialty, L's. Al Lubell is a very unique and singular comedian. So singular and so self-involved he might have just uh fallen into himself completely to generate this one-man show he's doing but but let me talk a little bit more about al later but let's get back to ben ben you wanted this attention you wanted the struggling college student attention please please if you're in college please study something you're interested in get Get in it.

You know, there's a lot of teachers there that can probably fucking, you know, show up for you if you know what you want from them. This is no time to be figuring out, you know, how to vape while you sleep. Okay? There's no time to be, you know, necessarily, you know, doing mushrooms for nine days straight and then forgetting your name and winding up in water somewhere. You can do that, but I'm just saying don't waste it, man. If you're not going to get a degree that means anything, at least get the education that will broaden your mind

and get you interested and creative about other things. That's old Mark talking to the young people in the only way I know how. Look, I'm not saying don't do drugs. Knock yourself out. Just don't knock yourself out of the game. Dig, dug. Okay, so Ben, are you happy? Struggle away with all your friends.

I appreciate you listening to the show. I'm going to a concert on Friday. i'm going to see joanna newsom joanna newsom was mentioned right here on this podcast uh by andy sandberg her husband and it turns out oddly she doesn't do many interviews but she's going to come talk to me at some point so i had um i've been sort of immersing myself in her in her uh records and she's one of those people where me at some point. So I've been sort of immersing myself in her records. And she's one of those people where you listen to her once, and you're like, oh, man, I don't know. But then you're like, but wait, she's touched.

She's touched by genius. She's some sort of savant of sorts playing her harp. And then you kind of sit with the record a little longer, and you're like, holy shit, this is the best thing I've ever heard so i've been listening to a lot of joanna newsom and turns out my girl sarah kane the painter knew her back in the day they were buddies so sarah kane the painter had a self-published cd of joanna newsom's that she found for me and i got that i don't even know if it's available on iTunes. I don't think so,

but I was able to rip it and listen to the, the pre blossoming material of Joanna Newsom. But anyways, long story long going to see Joanna Newsom tomorrow night. Okay. So let's get down to brass tacks or turtles or whatever it is that I mentioned. I will be at the mission Creek festival at the Englert Theater in Iowa City,

Iowa on Friday, April 8th? Did I mention that I will be at the Rococo Theater in Lincoln, Nebraska on Saturday, April 9th? Or did I mention I will be at the Arvest Bank Theater at the Midland in Kansas City, Missouri on April 10th? Come on, Kansas City. Let's make this happen. Can we? Huh? Huh? Let's

make it happy. So from here on out, it's just me and you talking. I'm going to ease right into Alubel, okay? I'm just telling you that right now. I want to talk to you about the buzz because now we're involved in this. We're all together in this buzz narrative that is the um yeah that's coming through my phono when i want to play a record in my office so i pestered my landlady yolanda who then called at&t because as i told you before i'm basically sitting inside a cell tower that I didn't know about. But then I started to think like, well, is it safe? Is it safe to be in a cell tower? And I asked Yolanda about the woman who had the office before me,

and she said, well, she was sort of a conspiracy theorist. I'm like, when did that start? How long was she in that office? What's going on? You know, to have that many people's conversations plowing through your synapses every day through radio waves in the in your personal electronics how are the electronics outside affecting my personal wiring so at&t sent electrician over today i went over there today or yesterday would be if you're listening to this on Thursday.

And I sat with him. He's like, we're going to track it, man. Let's track it down. And he was able to isolate all the different frequencies that actually go through that cell tower where the machinery is above my head. And we just sat there with the fucking buzz going, seeing if anything changed as he sat there and shut things off and turn things on again from his computer to the cell tower. So I guess I need to apologize a little bit to anybody who has AT&T and might have had a little erratic connectivity around 930 Wednesday morning, yesterday morning in the Highland Park area. I apologize if you missed any important calls or any calls dropped on you, but I was

trying to resolve my problem with my inability to play records clearly through my receiver. So I hope I didn't lose any jobs for anybody and nobody missed an emergency call. But here's the deal. After about an hour, I uh happy to say that i was right uh it was at&t's noise coming through i don't know if anything's going to be done about it he's going to recommend that they replace that particular transmitter um you know i'm going to keep troubleshooting a bit but that's what's causing it in the meantime i got myself a few rolls of copper tape and uh some aluminum fabric and i'm waiting on some copper mesh so you know i'm gonna fucking nail this shit the faraday boxing is still viable but it seems complicated because i'd have to make the entire room a box

that take that would take a lot of copper tape and aluminum foil and people would come to my office and think I had a meth problem. And I don't want that. I don't want that. So right now, Al Lubell is a very unique performer. He's a very talented man. Very interesting comedian. I did one of my first weeks working ever back in probably the mid-80s. Whenever the hell he just was touring

after he won star search i think he won the third season of the new star search and i was in tucson arizona in my recollection and i middled for him and i was like this guy's got balls he is so introspective and neurotic in such a specifically uh specific and charming way that if you're a comic if you're self-centered at all and you watch out you're like oh my god you know he's really nailing all this stuff and then but at some point you're like oh my god he's nailing it too much like i you know and then you kind of crave him just to talk about ice cream or something or something outside of himself but that's not al's style and then i'd run into al sporadically over the years wearing different

forms of you know sweatpants and hoodies and carrying uh stacks of yellow pads and there were times where i'd be like concerned for al be like what's going on you're right buddy and be like uh yeah got a room up there and yeah i'd see him in new york then i saw him and then i ran into him out here in la on the patio of the comedy store where he was doing some work on his computer looking a little unshaven but looking well and um i said well let's talk let's do it you okay he's like yeah i'm okay so again you can see al before i talk to him here you can see al up at the throckmorton theater in Mill Valley on April 15th doing his one-man show, which we talk about. Al alone tonight at the Clubhouse on Vermont at 11 tonight for the Gangbusters show. And right now, enjoy a slightly tortured, painful talk with Al Lubell,

but an honest talk with Al Lubell. So here's me and Al Lubell. You can get anything you need with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So no, you can't get an ice rink on Uber Eats. But iced tea and ice cream? Yes, we can deliver that. Uber Eats.

Get almost, almost anything. Order now. Product availability may vary by region. We can deliver that. Uber Eats. Get almost almost anything. Order now. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Death is in our air. This year's most anticipated series,

FX's Shogun, only on Disney+. We live and we die. We control nothing beyond that. An epic saga based on the global best-selling novel by James Clavel.

To show your true heart is to risk your life. When I die here, you'll never leave Japan alive. FX's Shogun. A new original series streaming February 27th exclusively on Disney+. 18 plus subscription required. T's and C's apply. Bell.

I feel canless. You are canless. It's your choice. Right. Your choice to go canless, Al. Right, but I also can become canful at any time I want. Yeah, in a second, you can just can yourself. Right.

So that gives me the option. I have less anxiety because I know I can... You can can yourself. I can put the cans on. Is that a term that you've created have less anxiety because I know I can, you know. You can can yourself. I can put the cans on. Is that a term that you've created, canning? I've never heard that, put the cans on. No, they're called cans. I think it's old timey radio talk. You want to wear cans? You got cans? I think canning in that context is not used that often. I wouldn't say that someone wearing headphones is canned. I think that we might have explored that today for the first time. Well, you did.

You brought it up. I never heard it. But did you just create the term? But it's an old radio term. Because I've asked before at radio stations, why do I have to wear them? Do I have to wear them? No one's ever said put the cans on. Well, I don't know.

I believe that. But it really is a term. Yes. And how do you know? You've looked it up? I worked in radio for a year and a half. I didn't know. Oh, that's right. And in radio for a year and a half i did not know oh that's right with the and it somehow year and a half two years and i think it somehow became yeah a known thing you got cans yeah no it's definitely a real thing i got okay so yeah this sounds cool it sounds like something radio people would come up with

it's like a cool sounding term like a jazz sounding yeah yeah your cans exactly buddy so what what is this record you have in your car? 30 years ago, I had this song. You ever seen me sing a song, I'm Al Lubell? I'm Al Lubell. I think everybody has seen Al Lubell sing he's Al Lubell at some point. America witnessed that at some point. Did they?

Yeah, I did it on Evening at the Improv or Comedy Club. Yeah, yeah. Did you do it on Star Search? No, because they only give you two minutes and the song's 30. I've seen you do that song for 30. I think I've seen you. I think there's some of us out here have seen you do the Alou Bell song. When it's working, it can go on for a while.

Yeah, it's funny. One time I was playing Montreal and a comedian friend of mine, he was up there. It was the closing bit, the song. Yeah. And he was watching me. He got tired of watching me. We up there it was the closing bit the song yeah and he was watching me he got tired of watching me we just left he went downstairs to the bar came up from the bar i'm still doing the song yeah because i added clothing i started taking clothing off during this oh really i added that piece yeah you're just gonna stretch that out till it could

have taken up the whole set yeah and in theory them theory, thematically, it is the whole set. I'm Al Lubell, painfully Al Lubell. Right. Everything I process goes through Al Lubell head, and I have to place myself at the center of everything that is happening. Right, but don't comedians do that? Oh, right, I just go a little further.

Everyone goes through everyone's head. Sure, right. But I decide to call attention to the fact that it's me. yeah yeah and how how does everything implicate al lubell right what's the song it's just sitting out there on a record or on a cd on a 45 it's 30 years ago a 45 a 45 i like vinyl uh yeah i know he's coming back into vogue and like an idiot uh i have a huge storage i can't throw i'm a hoarder i can't throw things away are you really a hoarder yeah yeah it's bad i mean i i could barely sometimes i you know i hold old new york times uh editorial pages because i think someday i might read it yeah i used to do that because you can look around i used to do that but now like there's really this weird deliberation around

stuff like that like print stuff like even if it's, like even if it's about me, like after a certain age, I'm like, what am I going to do with this? I mean, what's really going to happen with this? What do I think, what extension of my narcissism is this feeding? Because like, is somebody going to find this stuff and go like, ooh, good, here's an article written

in a St. Louis weekly arts paper about Marc Maron that he kept. We'll put that in the library in the archives with the... What is that stuff? If you really need to find most of it, you can just go online. Yeah, but a lot of it isn't. And in your situation,

they may put it in a library. Yeah, I know, but it seems ridiculous. There's part of me that's sort of like, why not not put that in the library? But also, let me say, I have little old pieces like that too that I can't throw away.

But it's almost the sentimentality. Like, this was written about me. Right. And it's the sentimentality. It's horrible. I wish they didn't write it, because then I'd have to keep it. Right.

But I do think it's garbage. But I have a problem throwing garbage out. Well, where is this stuff, Al? It's in public storage. Yeah. And it's getting to the point where I can't afford to keep it. Where is it?

We're in what state? Here. Oh, it's here? Well, I have two. I have stuff from my mother's place in Florida, a little facility, because. Where in what state? Here. Oh, it's here? Well, I have two. I have stuff from my mother's place in Florida, a little facility, because she's in assisted living.

Yeah. But I have a big thing. I went to England like a year and a half ago to do stand-up. Yeah. And I put all my stuff in storage. Right. And it's all still in storage. I'm staying at a friend's house.

He's letting me stay there. That's nice of him. So it's all stuff. It's still in storage. And with all my tons of boxes of 30 years of crap yeah you know yeah and i gotta start throwing stuff out i have some of that i i don't know how to deliberate that stuff i have a fantasy of just getting rid of it i think it'd be liberating to get rid of it but there's part what do you think it is what you know what what do you what's your fear around getting rid of it uh well the fear is that

i'll never see it again yeah when was the last time you went through those boxes i never hardly ever a year isn't it weird like people there's a saying which is like if you if you don't use something for a year yeah get rid of it oh then the whole facility could be gone you'd save yourself some money oh totally i know but uh yeah i know i know the saying but you know there's other sayings too which is i haven't heard them but i'm sure i there's contrary saying contradictory let's go on google we could like hold on to all your shit for as long as possible you never know when you're going to need that editorial actually i've said that so when it when are you afraid to go down there and pull those boxes out yeah well it's like a day my hip hurts and my back hurts i should get hip

replacement by the way have we we've started right how old do you know is this have we started yeah yeah isn't that kind of wordy how old am i now as opposed to how old am i then no i understand that i mean obviously implied in that question is now. Are you evading the question? Am I evading it now? Yeah, now. Are you evading the question? Yes, I am.

I didn't want to talk about it. I don't like the whole concept. I'm embarrassed. The concept of age? I feel age-wise I've let myself go. I can't believe I've let myself get this old. Oh, well, I don't think I have much control of it. I but i know i will say you look pretty well i've heard that but i look well for an old guy well well yeah but there's some of us who have known you i mean you just told me you did a 45 30 years ago yeah this is true but you don't

know how old i was when i did it. Were you three? No, but you're saying I look well for me like you've seen me at other ages. You're saying? Yeah, I've seen you at other ages. I've seen you

with different lengths of hair. Right. I've seen you in the streets where I've been concerned. I know. Yeah. Just like, there's been

Al Lubell sightings. There was a period in the Lubell timeline, I think, where many of us were like, where been Al Lubell sightings. There was a period in the Lubell timeline, I think, where many of us were like, where's Al Lubell? And then you'd show up. There he is. He's wearing sweatpants and he's got some Wiggle pads. I hope he's okay.

And then you get on the stage and you just nail it. You just do your Al Lubell thing. I must say, I'm impressed. You have a good sense of a person being in trouble how can i help how can i help al right no but you you're good at picking that up yeah that's very i was impressed i was impressed with your ability to uh see me in union square that time oh yeah whole foods or yeah around there like no i think i ran into you like actually in the area like walking on the street and you i think you said and i you know we don't have to talk about i don't know where you were at but i said what are you

doing and you were like you were living at an sro i think yes at that time yeah right yeah and i was concerned and then i i think i went back down to like boston comedy club or something like i just ran into al right does what's going on with him and people are like how lubelle yeah he's like in an sro he's walking around with his sweatpants right and like comics are like ah what do the comics say oh poor al that al no i think that many of us, you know, those of us who, you know, you're particular, like what I the guys that I know, and I don't know if I can name names, but we

loved watching you because there's something about the honesty of your self-involvement that makes, you know, comedians specifically sort of squirmy. It's like, I think we're all him inside. I think that if we just you know if we were really honest with how self-involved we are that would be us so i think there's people that always loved uh watching you and they're always happy to see you

i i don't know like the in my mind there's a i obviously don't know you that well but i i know that like i when the hell was that it must have been in the late 80s when i middled for you i featured for you in tucson and that must have been on like that first tour or so after star search right uh yes and like so you were you know you had that juice like star search there was fewer shows like that fewer tv stations in a lot of ways so it meant something you got a lot of momentum you won it right what year 88 you'd won star search you had short hair you were you were an entertainer you were you were uh you know you were being an

entertainer right in what sense like uh like i mean you you were to you were you together you had an act you're moving towards something towards something. You know what I mean? The Al Lubell closer was fresh at that time. Right. And all I remember hearing is like, he used to be a lawyer. That was what it was like. Really? He just left being a lawyer to do this?

And he won Star Search? That's a wild story. I never thought of it that way. Well, I was. Yeah, I was a lawyer. Yeah, well, I've known there's been a couple. I don't of it that way yeah why was yeah I was a lawyer yeah well there's I've known there's been a couple I don't know if they were full-on lawyers but you know Geraldo I think went to law school and then that guy Mike Platt I think was actually a practicing lawyer wasn't he I don't know why I remember that guy right well he might be a lawyer again I don't

know but where did you come from where Where'd you grow up? Queens, New York. Really? Like what part? Flushing, Fresh Meadows. Oh, really? I don't know if you know. Union Turnpike, St. John's area. Uh-huh, uh-huh. Yeah, right around there.

You were just a kid in Queens? A kid in Queens. And I was reading that, you know, Wayne Dyer, Dwyer, how do you say that? He died recently? Yeah, Dyer, I think. Dyer, yeah. He wrote that book, Your Erroneous Zones and stuff. And also, did he write I'm Okay, You're Okay or No?

Another guy? I don't think that's him. There's another guy. But he wrote that book your erroneous zones yeah and also did he write i'm okay you're okay or no another guy i don't think that's another guy but he wrote tons of books yeah about about you being about uh mental uh spiritual sort of affirmative health stuff right you don't read that stuff or no right i don't touch it i read some of that stuff like i like eckhart tolle you know him someone gave me the library you know and they were like just just listen to it you know while you're on the train or whatever and i listened listened to about 10 minutes. I'm like, no, I can't, not gonna. Interesting. Yeah, no, I can't, uh, you know, I'm on my own journey of, of self-realization. Right. That's right. I don't want it to get cluttered with, uh, cause like, there's always part of me that's like, who the hell is this guy?

Right, right, right, right, right. What gives him, you know, am I going to believe the mythology of this guy? Right. And that's very healthy, I think. Because like, well, you see, you have male energy. I have female energy. No offense, I'm not attacking all females. But I'm just saying I was raised by females mostly. My mother and grandmother.

My father slept a lot. And so he worked nights. Yeah. So he was sleeping during the day. Yeah. So I have this female kind of energy. I remember a friend of mine traveled. We traveled cross country when i graduated law school we both left law school and came to california yeah and immediately i had you know whenever we needed directions uh i wanted

to stop at the gas station when we lost and he wants to figure out himself right he's driving yeah we could figure that you know i could figure it out no let's stop and ask yeah right you know i'm the helpless guy so essentially i cartola i'mlle, I'm stopping and asking. Uh-huh. Eckhart Tolle. I look to anybody for the answers. Right. I have this weak, clingy, codependent. Yeah. I'm no one with, if I'm not leeching off someone's energy, I'm nothing.

Well, I think maybe that's why I relate to you, because I feel that. Like I, no, I think that, like, I think you might be too hard on yourself because. Yeah, just as I said that, I'm exaggerating. I mean, there are other elements. No, no think that, like, I think you might be too hard on yourself because. Yeah, just as I said that, I'm exaggerating. I mean, there are other elements. No, no, right. But like, you know, I feel like there's, that's the sort of emotional vibe I pick up on. But for me, like looking at you, you're a very well-defined human. Like I, yeah, that's because you probably think like, oh, I'm floating.

I have nobody, I'm not connected. But like, I see, you know, Al know alu bell you know as this very defined guy like a unique guy but you're like you know probably feel like you're disappearing half the time yes but in the sense if you see me walking on the streets in an sro now how defined am i there look we've all had problems right that's true you know what i mean i mean things you know go off the rails at different levels for different reasons for all of us over and over again. Right. I mean, you're not unique in having the train go off the rails.

That's true. But I guess I'm just kind of jealous that you don't need Eckhart Tolle, and I do. You've decided that. No, I don't necessarily need. But I just like hearing him talk. I like him. He's not pushing. He's relaxed.

And I like what he says. I haven't listened to him in a while. I read some of his stuff. Well, my thing has been that, like, I think there's a lot of things that make you feel good in the moment. But actually addressing core issues around how the brain works or how we're wired emotionally, I read other stuff. It's usually clinical. Some stuff I read. I've read books on codependency.

I've read books on love and sex addiction. I've read books on practical things. You mean like John Bradshaw? No, no. I don't read those kind of things. I don't read the sort of like broad-based tomes. Right. Like I read either clinical books or books that have action in them.

You know, like Pia Melody's book on codependency, you know, sort of, you know, breaking it down on how the emotional dynamics work and where they come from and what to do to to cognitively behave differently. I say, what do you mean? How does that book have action in it? Well, I mean, there's there's sort of like, you know, there's questions that are asked of you to to help you define whether or not you fit this profile. And then there's sort of like, you know, there's questions that are asked of you to help you define whether or not you fit this profile. And then there's sort of things you can do to start, you know, cognitively changing your behavior and mental patterns. Exactly. You're a man of action.

Well, I'm a recovery guy. So, like, I'm wired like that. Like, you know, that's where I get a lot of the basics is because I've done some recovery work. And I'm a recovery guy, so I'm wired like that. That's where I get a lot of the basics is because I've done some recovery work. I'm sober. And that method of self-awareness and self-actualization and action, there's different applications to it. Codependency and other compulsive behaviors. Well, I'm sure I have codependency and uh ocd and big narcissism but there's always been a big part of me that doesn't want to change that's afraid to change that's the

that's the most horrible part that's the hardest part right because you don't really have control over that of wanting to or not right you can't you can't force yourself to want to well no it's not i'm sure you want to, but you know. Yeah, but I don't want to do the work. And also, I'm afraid of it. Right. Who would I be? Right.

Without my bag of shit. And can you imagine? I don't want to be anyone but Al Lubell. Right. So that's a big problem. Well, maybe you could, like, maybe whatever, wherever you stopped emotionally. Right. You know, you could keep, you could start moving from there.

You know, it's never too late, Al al you might be 14 i know right but you could well shrink once told me i'm emotionally pre-adolescent not even adolescent i was like 35 at the time and i still feel i'm kind of pre-adolescent i mean adolescence kind of the thought of adolescence kind of scares me a little i mean it seems kind of adult but anyway my point is that, no, I am afraid. But yeah, I could be, you're saying I could grow emotionally, but it would be a different me. Who I am now is who I am now. If I change emotionally, yes, I'm still me, but it's a different me. I mean, I wouldn't get hung up on that.

You know, even people that evolve a little bit, it's not going to be like, who is that guy? You know, it's just going to be little things where you're like, look, I'm eating by myself. No, I know. But it's not. to be little things where you're like, look, I'm eating by myself. No, I know. But I don't care about other people looking at me saying, who is this guy? I'm thinking, I don't want to say. I myself don't want to say who is this guy. Well, you won't get that lost, I don't think. No, you're right.

I mean, I have grown inadvertently only through the pain of life and having to. And it's not been that bad. I'm different than I was years ago. Oh, yeah. And I've gotten over it. Yeah. I mean mean there's a sadness for i feel sadness for the person i was heavy heart yeah that guy's dead a lot of that guy's pretty much dead i feel sad for me yeah at that point you're grieving that loss of you yeah oh yeah well so all right so you grew up in queens you got what sisters no brothers no you're the only. That's wild. I've talked to only children before.

Have you? Do you think that kind of put a zap on your head somehow? Sure. Like how? Well, you know, just being wild, my mother wildly, it took them like 12 years to have a kid, you know, and my mother was like 31 and my father was 41. And so my mother was wild, everything, me, me, me, me, me. And you could sense that my father was a little angry.

Unconsciously, I could sense it. Because of your relationship with, her relationship with you? Yeah. He was being. Totally neglected. Yeah. Usually that happens anyway in a marriage. But this was such an extreme me, me, me, me, me.

And I remember one time he tried to spank me or something and she almost killed me. She was furious. Don't ever touch my son. Don't. Oh, wow. Yeah. That kind of thing. So it created this awkward kind of, he used to sarcastically call me the king.

Mm-hmm. Oh. And, you know, I mean, it was extreme. Part of me hesitates to tell some stories. They're in my one-person show. I didn't want to say one-man show because that sounds adult. Uh-huh. But you can't say one-boy show.

I mean, you can't say anything you want. But yeah, one-person show. You can tell stories. Yeah. Well, yeah, I could talk. I mean, I'm not, you can't say anything you want, but yeah, one person show. You can tell stories. Yeah. Well, yeah, I could talk about, I mean,

I'm just saying one of the stories. She used to serve me food in bed until I was 17 and also turned my TV channel for me until I was 17. And it only ended because I went away to college. But, you know, but until seven, I go channel seven,

channel seven. This has really got to stop, Alan. This has really got to stop. I got channel nine, channel nine. I that says, really gotta stop, Alan. That says, really gotta stop. I go, channel nine, channel nine. Just change it to channel nine, Alan. Dr. Schwartzberg says, I shouldn't be giving in to you like this, Alan.

And then it keeps going, channel 11. I keep pushing her. Keep pushing. And she'd go, go fuck yourself. Really? Storm out. Would she? Yeah.

And the next day, the same thing would happen. So I tell that. You keep pushing her during this channel changing ritual until she, you know, like, so there was part of you that wanted to detach. I guess to get her so angry to break away. Yeah. Oh, sure.

I'm sure I felt that. I don't, consciously I didn't realize that. But yeah, that's a way of pushing her away. Well, yeah, trying to have a boundary. Right. Right. There were no boundaries right yeah so like because i i can relate to that you know i do that too it's just sort of like a

wow i didn't know maybe that's another similarity we have because of my my mother and father were not overly attentive but i think the relationship was weird i felt like i was like you know when you said before using someone else's energy in a way that i think i think like my mother was sort of like completely you know had a shaky sense of self and kind of used me as an extension of her so the boundaries were you know what i mean it wasn't about me or letting me have my own life because she was so worried about everything all the time she just sort of i just became sort of this emotional appendage that she would process things through do you know what i'm saying and i used to fight with her like that you know like there was like there's nothing else you can do

like you're it's almost like a fight for your own you know identity right right so this went on to you were 17 but like what were you doing in school and stuff for you do were you like a ostracized were you a freak were you have for you do it were you like a ostracized were you a freak were you have did you have friends i had some friends but i remember there was a cool group a kid of the cool kids and i was not in their group uh i don't think i wasn't a nerd because i didn't study that much i wasn't uh i wasn't really in any group yeah me neither yeah and so i wanted to be with the cool kids yeah and i And I got myself into it by having them laugh at me. Yeah, I know that one.

Yeah. Well, because you were so adaptable and without boundaries, you could sort of like charm or humor yourself into almost any group. Right. But the sad thing was, looking back on it, I would make fun of myself or I would do the stupid thing and have them laugh out oh lubell so it was like i had low self-esteem even though i was happy i was accepted yeah i was accepted as

the clown and not even the good clown not even the smart witty clown yeah the idiot i was accepted as the idiot into the group oh no yeah so i got low self-esteem i remember one time thinking when i was leaving like it was springtime vacation or something, that I'm going to come back different. I'm going to be a different person. And of course I couldn't come back different. I never changed. What was your plan at that time? Do you have any recollection how you were going to be different?

Oh, I remember one time, not that spring one, but I had a plan one summer when I was 17. I'd get really in shape and I would jog because I was overweight. I was husky. I was like a little heavy. You too, yeah. Because I ate too much. I used to eat a host of snowballs all the time I remember those with the pink ones yeah yeah I was

total my mother would just give me whatever I wanted I remember one time I'd come home she used to have I call them goodies where are the goodies yeah and she had to have them in the refrigerator waiting for me and if she and one time it wasn't in their fridge I wear the goodies and I forced her to take me to the bakery to get the goodies how old were you so that went out till 17 so you're but you're characterizing yourself as this weird little monster child oh yeah i was a total monster but but yeah but the other thing is i remember you asked me how i decided to change i remember so it was the summer of i went out to way to a bungalow colony with my mother and grandmother and i was 17. Like an adult summer camp. No, a bungalow.

What is a bungalow? It was next to the hotel. Kutcher's was a hotel in the Catskills. Up in the Poconos. Yeah, yeah. The Catskills. And the bungalow colonies were people just rent

like a bungalow for the summer for two months. Right, and there's activities. There are some activities, yeah. So were you guys very Jewish? I mean, that's a very Jewish thing. I think it's become more Jewish now.

I think it's just the Orthodox Jews that go there. No, but even back then it was like middle class. Yeah, it was middle class Jewish thing. I think it's become more Jewish now. I think it's just the Orthodox Jews that go there. No, but even back then, it was like middle class. Yeah, it was middle class Jewish. We were conservative in the middle. But community, you were part of it. The Jewish community. I was bar mitzvahed and all that stuff.

Yeah, yeah. But it wasn't, I wouldn't say very Jewish. I mean, people looking at us probably thought we were very Jewish. Yeah, I feel that now looking at you. Right, right. With the hair. No, but no, I grew up uh you know conservative jew but like i wasn't new york but that's like a pretty specific you know going to the hotels

at all or up there to the catskills right did you see comedy uh yeah i remember i saw who did i see i can't remember the names of the nothing's coming to mind but i know that's why i think i got the idea i wanted to be a comedian because it was the only one of the few times that was like seeing people happy. Right. Anyone in my family

seemed unhappy. Right. Arguing, yelling, and not even that much arguing and yelling. There was not even enough communication on that level,

enough clarity of yelling. There was just occasional yelling. Yeah. Awkward silence and me yelling. I was yelling, demanding. Yeah.

I remember I once, I hate to admit it here, but this has already started, right? Yeah. Okay. Because you never actually said, welcome to the podcast. Yeah, I did that. I'm kind of joking, but I mean, I like your technique of just sucking the person right in. I do that later. Yeah.

I can tell you. Clever. So what were you about to say? Well, it's kind of embarrassing to say that this is your thing this is you love this and i believe if i ever had it i'm trying to have a nice conversation i'm just didn't why i'm just trying to talk to al lubella this is the first time we've ever sat and talked i imagine this is probably the first time you've ever sat and talked for for a while with somebody no i have talked for a while a lot of people because

i've said i'm a kind of a leachy kind of guy and i just want to try to get people to help me so i've done that but i'm a little offended this is the longest you talk with me that you have to have me on a show to have a conversation with me i don't see you that often when i when i see you it's like a happening like a a weird some sort of happenstance where you just you wander in from somewhere i don't even know if you have a car or you have shoes on yeah but i do and then we talked briefly and what happens you wander away we ow ow we're kindred spirits i know that like if i don't wander away and i never wonder and then you'd be living on my couch you once did did an offer in New York. I was impressed by that.

You did say, if you ever need a place to stay. Yeah. And I didn't even ask you. Yeah. And I didn't need a place to stay. Yeah. But I was impressed.

Dodged a bullet there. But once when I feel bad, I had a good point to make. No, you're about to say something. Oh, yeah. Oh my God, I feel bad. I reminded myself. Yeah, it can't be that bad. Oh, yeah. Oh, my God. I feel bad. I reminded myself. Yeah, it can't be that bad. It's not that bad.

But I wanted fake sideburns. Yeah. Oh, my God. That was the big... So you were like, what? 14, 15? No, I was 17. I was 18. And you thought that you wanted fake sideburns? No, I was 18. I was a freshman in college. You wanted fake sideburns. Because I wanted to look older.

I hit puberty late. I started having hair under arms at like 15 or something but i nothing in the testicles yeah and i was afraid to take showers in front of people because they would see i hadn't hit puberty yeah uh looking back on it now kind of in a way i never played with how great a moment was when the pubic hair came you're like thank god no really i never really wanted it because ideally i wanted to see a kid really i always wanted to say that's another bad thing that set me back i never wanted to grow up even when i was like four i remember being jealous of a girl that was one no yeah that's a memory you have yeah she's so lucky yeah and but but you wanted fake sideburns nonetheless yeah well because i wanted to fit in in college i want to look older so i wanted i

researched i don't remember how i researched it, but I found out it was $75. For fake sideburns. Yeah, you go to a cosmetic kind of, they do theater supplies, theater supplies. Yeah. So I needed the money. I had no money. I didn't work.

You know, I had no, so I demanded it from my mother. I want the money. For fake sideburns. For fake sideburns. And she didn't want to give me the money. Yeah. And I do remember being outside in a parking lot outside of a restaurant and pushing her against the wall demanding fake sideburns. And she didn't want to give me the money. Yeah. And I do remember being outside in a parking lot outside of a restaurant and pushing her against the wall demanding fake sideburns.

Really? Yeah. Pushing her. Yeah. I want fake sideburns. And you're taking me there. Yeah. Because it was down the street.

Yeah. In Queens? No, this was in Maryland. Uh-huh. We had moved to Maryland. And so I pushed her. Not incredibly like wildly. Right.

But I pushed. Right. And I got them. You got the fake side but I pushed. Right. And I got him. You got the fake sideburns. I got the fake sideburns. But this shows, as an example of my fears, I'm like a halfway kind of, I go halfway. I wore them, but I had long hair like this. Yeah.

Because I wanted to cover up my face so people wouldn't see that I wasn't shaving. Right. So I wore them underneath, but I didn't have the guts to pull my hair back to show them. So I wore them underneath, and what happened was the glue irritated my skin after a couple of days, and I was breaking out into pimples, so I stopped wearing them.

But ironically, the pimples made me look a little older. It was the pimples. Because I didn't even have acne. It was a gift. Yeah. It was a gift. What was a gift? The pimples.

Like, you know, the sideburns didn't work out, but the pimples came, and you thought they made you look older. Yeah, but the pimples didn't last. Like, you know, the sideburns didn't work out, but the pimples came and you thought they may do a good job. Yeah, but they came up with pimples and last for like, you know, last for two, three days. And I never, you know, it took me a while to get pimples. Yeah. But real pimples. Right.

They were real pimples. Yeah. They were from an artificial source. Yeah. But my point is I never did wear the sideburns. Yeah. Yeah. So what's my point?

So when you call me a monster, it reminded me. Oh, that you're a monster? I was demanding. You know, I got gotta have it fake simon but to remind me you asked me how did i once try to change and right exactly yeah so i was i'm gonna get in shape because i was overweight you know i used to play basketball with the cool kids but i was never as good because i was overweight and pudgy and and but i was a decent player later but anyway my point is i used to jog every morning to try to get in shape. And I remember an old guy used to smile at me

as I was jogging by his house. And I saw him at a party at that bungalow colony one day and he goes, you jog really good. And I was proud. I said, thanks a lot. He goes, yeah, you jog really good for a girl. And I go, well, I'm not a girl. And he goes, yes, you are.

He was older. He was like 75. And he felt threatened like his eyesight's failing. But I felt I had to defend my gender. Sure. He wasn't just taking a shot at you? No. Like a bastard?

No, I don't think so. He really didn't see well. Because I had, but also I was pudgy. You were that heavy. Right. No facial hair. Yeah. And I could see.

And when you're pudgy and you have little breasts, I could see how you could think I was a girl. Right. So my point is, I came back, I was the same guy. I didn't change over the summer. I was afraid of girls. I remember they tried to, I didn't kiss a girl until I was like 20. And I was scared of girls.

And when I was 17 at that bungalow colony, some 15-year-old girl set me up with a 13-year-old girl on a date. And I remember holding her hand. How old were you? 17 is that illegal? I was holding you no

not to hold hands no yeah I was just holding her I was just terrified I was just terrified anyway I never you know weird things happen at camp

yeah right I think I was walking down the street holding I think I was holding her I was scared of her I was scared of a 13 year old girl when I was 17

yeah so I was just terrified of everything. Fear has been my biggest problem. And your father, did he have his own pharmacy in Queens? He did for a while. He owned a pharmacy with his uncle. And then when I was like five or six, they sold it. And see, up till five or six, my father was present a lot in the house.

I mean, he worked till like 12 at night there yeah but he had self-esteem he owned a pharmacy yeah but then he started working in a night shift in manhattan and uh he was home at like two or three and he wasn't the same guy anymore i was a kid so i didn't know what was going on he had lost his own pharmacy he had sold it they both sold it uh-huh but he didn't own one anymore and i think that depressed him and he was always trying to buy another one but he never did. And so that changed with my father.

I saw him less and I think he was less of a, he was depressed because he didn't own one anymore. He worked for somebody. Is he gone now? Yeah, he died years ago. But your mom's still around?

My mom is, yeah, assisted living. Is she cognizant? Yeah, she's got Alzheimer's but it's, oh, I hope she's not listening. She doesn't think she does. Yeah.

People with Alzheimer's don't think they have Alzheimer's. That's sad. I'm sorry you're going through that. You go down there? Yeah, I do, but she knows who I am still.

She's got the kind where she knows who you are. Oh, that's good. Does she yell at you? Do you yell at each other? Not that much. You know, I'm okay when I'm around her.

She's annoying, but I'm, you know, put your jacket on. Put it on, Alan. Your jacket. Your jacket. She'll say it like six times. Your jacket, Alan. Your jacket. But she do that all the time You know, I'm okay when I'm around her she's annoying but I'm yeah put your jacket on put it on out in your jacket your jacket She'll say it like six time your jacket out in your jacket, but she do that all the time or is this a new thing? You know, she's always done

Not even an Alzheimer's thing. No, no Right. Yes. No, she sounds terrifying to me. Yeah is but not really I mean she's very if you met her you'd really like her I mean, yeah, he's likable but and actually when I'm around her her i'm okay it's i don't like talking to her on the phone uh but uh yeah it's uh i don't know uh yeah so so you're up there at the colony at the bungalow and you see a little comedy and it resonates with you uh i see a little comedy uh yes it did resonate you can't remember the guy you probably know the old time ago there was yeah i remember like back i saw the guy like six years later when i was in law school he was playing some club locally schaefer something eddie schaefer or something like that he was like

a catskills comic uh-huh i don't know if i saw any fame i don't think i saw any famous comics the only i remember tony bennett uh-huh was there at kutcher's see kutcher's was not like the concord right gross, the big ones. Kutcher's was a little below. Yeah. So it didn't get the big. Right. Jerry Lewis had his own hotel called Brown's.

So I never saw those famous guys. But I remember from Ed Sullivan, I liked, I remember Larry, what's his, Alan King was probably the first comedian I ever remember. Yeah, from the island too. Yeah, from Long Island. Yeah. Right. Yeah. And so that was an influence. Yeah, from Long Island. Yeah. Right.

Yeah, and so that was an influence. Survived by his wife. Right. What a great bit. He did that on Letterman. Uh-huh. Sure. He did it forever.

Really? He did it right till the end. Right. Sure. He'd throw that in. I wonder if his wife did survive him. I don't know. I don't know. I think he had a couple.

Maybe I'm wrong. But so how do you decide to go to law school? Is that something your mother compelled you to do? By the way, just one quick, when you look at the board, are you looking at time? I'm just making sure the levels are good because sometimes I got to adjust the levels. Okay. So what was law school? What was the grade level?

Well, how did you decide to go to law school? I mean, you sound like a guy that couldn't do anything. Right. Well, I got good grades in school. I was probably 90 plus average. Oh, good. Yeah. I wasn't much of a studier.

I was a last minute kind of person. But you're a bright guy. I guess I was bright. I didn't ever think of myself as bright. Where'd you go to undergrad? First year, University of Maryland, because my father was sick and I didn't know it. They lied to me. So my mother wanted us to be close to my aunt, my mother's sister, that family.

And that's why you moved to Maryland? Yeah, for the freshman year. Yeah. And then I wanted to get away from the family. So I decided I wanted to go to the University of Miami, Florida. Oh, that's a party school. Yeah, it was. And I wasn't ready to party because I hadn't hit puberty yet.

You hadn't hit puberty yet? When? Well, I don't know what you mean. I mean, I hadn't played with myself until, I didn't start playing myself until I was like 20. What? I didn't know about it. I didn't even know what it was.

What? Did you grow up at the Bates Hotel? Right. Yeah, I think so. The way I do my mother and my act, people say it reminds them. Alan, my life, Alan. That's how I do her. You're my life.

I live for you, Alan. life Alan that's how I do it you're my life I live for you Alan someone a reviewer described it as the baits like I didn't even know I was doing oh so you didn't jerk off till you were 20 till I was 20 oh I'm so sorry well it's even worse than that uh a guy who turned out to be gay convinced me to let him uh by the way this story is my act. So I feel like I'm doing my act. I feel like weird. I feel like, should I feel like I'm raping my act? No, no. I think that in a best case scenario,

there'll be a few people out there that'll be like, I gotta see this show. All right, that's true. Yeah. But not if I do it word for word. But no, you're right. You're not really quite doing it word for word. Okay, well, to make a long story short,

I was such an idiot. Like, I told my shrink the story. This guy convinced me to let him put his mouth on my penis. Yeah. And I thought I was gay. Years later, I thought, maybe I'm gay. I let this guy do that. Because he convinced me.

He said, Al, if you're going to play with yourself. He was my best friend. He was three or four years older than me. And he said, look, you've never played with yourself before. You really should start doing this. And I got a wanto. And he says, Al, if never played with yourself before. You really should start doing this. And I got on Wano, and he says, Al, if you play with yourself, you'll stimulate the, what's it called,

the hormones, and you'll start shaving. I go on Wano. He goes, just pull your pants down. Start playing with yourself. And I did it. I couldn't do it, because I'd never done it before, and I was scared. So he says, I'll put my hand on it.

And I was not in it. I said, what are you, gay? And he goes, no. So I go, okay. And to me, I guess words speak louder than action anyway my point is so and uh so uh he puts his hand and make a long story short i won't do the bit word for you want me to do the bit is essentially i'll do the bit i don't care at this point uh okay so he puts his hand on it still nothing happened yeah it was he goes look I don't want to do this. You think I don't want to do it, but obviously you need stimulation.

What I'll do is I'll put my mouth on it. And I go, look, I'm not a moron. Just admit to me you're gay. If you admit you're gay, I'm not going to let you touch me, but don't lie to me. Just admit you're gay. He goes, I'm not gay.

So I go, okay. How was that? And so he put his mouth on it. And I'm looking at this thinking, you know, he's either gay or a really nice guy. Were you guys friends after that? And yeah, it's a whole long story. I mean, yeah, I was his roommate.

I became his roommate at his house. And yeah, it was like, I never, you know, it's a whole long story. Did that happen again? It did, like two other times. He convinced me. you know, it's a whole long story. Did that happen again? It did, like two other times. He convinced me. It's a whole long story. He convinced me.

He took me to Jamaica with him. And we were playing in the pool, and I dunked him. And he said I gave him a heart attack when I dunked him, because I dunked him too long. Because I gave him a heart attack, he said, you're going to have, let me put my mouth on it. At that point, can I not realize he's gay?

Like, I still didn't think he was gay, but I felt guilty. I gave him a heart attack and my focus was almost killed him instead of this guy's gay and, you know, he's manipulating you. Who needs to put their mouth on a penis because you've had a heart attack? Is this some kind of resuscitation I've never heard of? You know, I mean, it didn't even occur to me me that's how mentally damaged i feel i was from childhood so gullible if the whole world was going to give into me my do anything for me like my mother would do yeah you know like everyone's looking out for me yeah even straight guys will suck my dick yeah you know because it's all about alabama yeah whatever al needs my gift i did the

world oh boy yeah so what was your oh so i never mastered so anyway that's i began masturbating uh i remember the first time i came it was huge amount yeah uh was it must have been exciting not really because uh well how how intricate am i going to get in this story i mean when came, he was there. So it's not, that was the first time. Yeah. And he had taken his, do I get into incredible detail?

I don't do this in the show. He had already taken his mouth off. He just started, and I didn't like it. Yeah. And I didn't want him to do it, and he stopped. Then on my own, I imagine, and I came. Did he clap or anything? He didn't clap,

but the point is the fact that he's in the room, I think it ruins that feeling. Again, talking about boundary problems. Yeah, you definitely had, yeah, you were definitely in a little bit of emotional trouble and confusion, and this guy seemingly took advantage of it. It seems like that whatever insulation and emotional sort of inappropriateness you had with your mother didn't prepare you for the world at all.

Exactly. So I don't know how long that relationship lasted or if you still talk to that guy. No, I haven't in years. And it lasted. I got my first girlfriend. I had one president of the student government in college. Oh, really? I had won president of student government in college.

Oh, really? So despite yourself, it sounds like you had a way with people that you could at least get out in front of people and talk to people. And I imagine that when you were able to connect and be funny, that it made you feel empowered in a way. Yeah, I was a good speaker. I guess I gave good speeches. And yeah, i won the president student government i remember feeling pressure like i'm now president and i'm never even i did

kiss a girl once so how'd you meet the girl it was uh i was running for president oh my vice president the treasurer the guy was running my treasurer yeah he knew the girl he was a ladies man so he introduced me to her and that was the first girl you kissed? No, I had kissed a girl previously. One time when I was 20. This was late 20 when I met her. But mid 20, I kissed a girl previously. How'd that go? It was brief and it was okay.

But nothing there. And I do remember, and I did kiss another girl. And I do remember actually, I didn't have sex with her, but I do remember kissing her down below. Are you allowed to talk about these things on this show? You can talk about whatever you want. I don't know what I want. I know. I feel I'm being abused here in a way.

Really? Because I have no sense of self. I don't, no offense against you. I mean, anyone talking to me is abusing me. It's interesting. That's an interesting idea al but you know you you're not gonna get away with that shit with me however however much you don't know who you are you do i don't think no i don't do know who you know you don't and you must admit there's uncertainty to everything no one knows i know but after a certain point now, well, you got to

pick it apart all the time. The question is, when is that point? Well, no, but you... At a certain... When is that certain point? When you're exhausted and your life becomes difficult

because you destabilize yourself constantly. Right. This is true. That, you know, with self-doubt and insecurity, you know,

the more you shovel coal into that fire, it's just going to keep burning down, you know? Yeah, and it is. Yeah. And it's almost done. Really? What does that mean? Well, you know what that means.

Yeah. This is a cry for help. I know. Your entire career has been a cry for help. I know. I wouldn't even call it career, necessarily. It's a quasi-career. Well, let's get into that. Let me finish this was the point with the girl but the question of uh i don't know if i should say well i went down on her it was the first time i ever did it and

it's not even a good story it's not even interesting but the point is she confided me later it was a urinary tract and not her clitoris that i was licking and because i don't know what i'm doing sure well you got to learn got to learn. It's a hard learning curve, that one. Takes years. Right, and I haven't spent the time at it. That's okay. I haven't done it much. Did you have a relationship with a woman in college?

Yeah, that girl at college. Yeah, there was a girl. I'm afraid to mention names. You don't have to mention names. So you had sex with her and stuff and it went okay? Yeah, it's so funny the way you're talking to me now because you realize you're dealing with a mental patient. Yeah.

I knew that going in. Yeah. You knew it going in, but it was a little more intense than you thought. A little more. It's exciting. It's exciting. I feel like I'm being like, you know, like I'm not a professional and, you know, usually I can sort of move people through their narrative, but there's definitely a point during this

one where I'm like, i don't have the chops this guy thinks any one-on-one situation is some sort of therapy i don't know if i can guide him with my own experience right right yeah well you've been the codependent route you you've read all the damn books you you've read these action books mark yeah well no i action for you i relate to you like you know and i know you know like it's an extreme but i know that discomfort i know that the feeling of not having a defined self of not feeling uh like like your whole without having somebody else acknowledge you or or want you or or want to engage with you you know i know what it's like to be to be painfully possessive out of emotional needs that I don't understand.

I mean, I've been through a lot of that stuff. Right. What I envy you is that we're, I don't know, I guess envy is the nice word for jealousy. But you have more male energy than me. And so you're able to do things and take action. I don't even have that part. Well, that all comes from anger. Most of my male energy is anger based right and steven wright's great got a great line i think i read is something like depression is anger without enthusiasm yeah right and so you

got anger i got depression right and so that's why i have a hard time getting things done yeah depression i beat myself up i'm exhausted yeah i do a little of that you do a little of that but you also have anger i want your anger well i'm angry that i don't have you well you have to just you know start turning it out onto other people i know but that's not a good therapy point it's like here's how you can help yourself stop beating yourself up and put it on other people i know well yeah but she's too afraid to do that i'm a timid see i was we did that with your mother ah i'm comfortable with that and i was then that i was only comfortable beating her up because i was the umbilical cord was never cut so uh i was connected and she was my slave and i was her slave it was the master

you know i was also a slave she created she forced me into masterhood yeah forced me to be her master yeah and so i'm only i was only comfortable you know i was power i was king at home the you know whatever i wanted but in the real world i was was this timid, shy, frightened, furious, angry person that I was such a wimp. Yeah. All that's going inside. Yeah. So where'd you go to law school?

University of Miami. And you graduated with a law degree. Yeah. And you went into practice. I was a lawyer. And I came out to California to try comedy, but I figured I'd do the law too. You'd never done comedy before and you came out. I dabbled in it in law school.

I won this best comedian contest in the whole university. Like there's some kind of comedy. And they flew me out to California here. And I performed at the, I was supposed to perform at the Comedy Magic Club. Yeah, in Hermosa Beach. And, but I played basketball. I hosted a gong show when i was out there in miami and i carried the gong to the gong show yeah and the gong pulled my back out and when

i played basketball here when i got to california i i had a spasm and i couldn't perform i didn't get to perform at the comedy magic club my point is i dabbled in comedy a little in while i was in law school and so i came out here and I was too afraid again to move to LA, so me and my friend moved to Newport Beach, an hour south. Yeah. And so I started being a lawyer there, and I started getting some spots at...

You just got a job at a firm? Yeah, in Newport Beach. What kind of law were you doing? It was a small firm, and I mostly did drunk driving cases. It was mostly drunk driving cases. I didn't feel good about it, because, you know,

can I say this after the fact? You get the feeling everyone did it. Yeah. Is that illegal that I would say that? It's after the fact. I think you're fine.

Okay. You're not a lawyer anymore. Right. But it didn't feel fun for me, you know, and so at night I would do comedy. Where?

At the Laugh Stop. There was a club called The Laugh Stop in Newport Beach back then in the 80s. And so yeah. And you were getting your chops. Doing jokes, getting laughs, going over.

Yeah, I bomb a lot too. Just horrible. I remember a bomb that comes to mind was, I thought this was funny for some reason. I walk on, I don't walk on stage, I crawl onto the stage and I'm crawling, crawling to the microphone and I slowly get up to the microphone. I go, hi, I'm a struggling young comedian. I got nothing conceptual. I guess.

Right. And that scared me. I got nothing. So then I start rushing into my jokes. And because back then, you know, when I got scared, I'd rush, you know. And so, of course, even my jokes that I had back then didn't work because I'm rushing. And also this awkward moment that I didn't even acknowledge. Yeah.

I don't even acknowledge. Boy, that didn't work. Nothing. Because I got scared. I have the guts to take that chance. That takes a gut to, I hadn't been doing comedy long either, six months. It takes guts to crawl for like a minute. Yeah, but eventually it seems like you learned how to pace yourself exactly how you want to.

I mean, that's just part of starting out, the panic. Right. Sure. So then what leads to you pursuing it as a career uh what leads to me pursuing it as a career well some i wanted to be a comedian and comedians that i would mc for at the laugh stop some of them like me so you took some gigs going out with comedians yeah not with them but they would recommend me to the club for feature act yeah featuring and i'd run around middling And they didn't pay for travel. But if you got connected a few of these things in Texas, you middled.

Right. You make something. And you were doing all right? Yeah, I was doing okay. One of the first, it was kind of cool. I middled for Seinfeld. I couldn't believe, like, normally I don't take action and do things. But someone said, call this club.

They might give you a date. I ended up calling him. And the guy goes, yeah, I have a week opened. Yeah, and you can open for Jerry Seinffeld i go wow this is uh so i middled for him and i got to know him a little and this was like the summer of 85 and uh played racquetball and with jerry yeah out there on the road yeah yeah yeah it was interesting nice guy very nice guy that's nice he liked you he liked me i think and he was uh he let me ask him all his questions. I remember one time, my questions. I remember he said to me, any more questions, Al?

Yeah. He liked answering questions. Yeah. And I had a lot of questions. Yeah. And then he had to say, like, Al, it's two in the morning. Can you get out of my room, Al? He never did say that.

He might have felt it. I remember being in his room. And he might have felt it. I remember we were watching Ronnie Shakes. Remember? Yeah, yeah. On the Tonight Show. He's funny.

Yeah, very funny. I remember one of his jokes was, I remember we were watching Ronnie Shakes. Remember? Yeah, yeah. On the Tonight Show. He's funny. Yeah, very funny. I remember one of his jokes was, I bought a watch, very cheap watch. It just says now. Yeah, he was funny. He passed away. Yeah, I know. Well, that's interesting. So you're working as a comic and you're no longer doing law.

Working as a comic and no, right. I dabbled in law still a little but then I realized I was taking a case with me on the road I'm in the funny bone working on a law case right I didn't feel right it was too much I couldn't focus I could barely focus on one thing right not two things so I quit the law so that was like 86 and uh and then I started uh and then I got good in that one year. I was on the road for like 48 weeks in one year. Constantly, everywhere. And my friend started out with comedy with me, Dan, and he quit. But he saw me a year later.

He couldn't believe, in New York I was doing a spot, and he couldn't believe I had an act after a whole year on the road. Yeah, I think, what year was that? That was when he saw me in 87. Right, right. And I suddenly had an act. Right. So, like, I was just kind of starting out then. was that that was like when he saw me in 87 right right and i suddenly had an act right so like i was the you know i was just kind of starting out then so we probably did the evening at the improv

around the same time well the evening i think i started doing evening at the improv maybe after i won stars like 89 like there was a big push where it just was on all the time they were constantly taping and there were all those shows yes caroline's comedy hour evening at the improv comedy on the road yeah mtv half hour yeah all those we were all doing those and you're all in that but so when did you so you did star search what year i did star search i won in the fall of 87 so i was called the winner of 88 and that's a big deal then it wasn't so much and it was kind of but not that much it was the fifth year of it. And you made some money, though. I remember the first year was the big deal. Brad Garrett won it that first year.

Right. So, yeah, it was $100,000. I ended up blowing it. I bought a house I shouldn't have bought. I didn't trust my instincts. I could have bought a house. I had made the offer. It was accepted.

And then someone told me, you're not the homeowner type, which is true. But I backed out of it. And now it's worth millions in the Hollywood Hills. And then I bought this house in the Valley with the money like an idiot and that went down in value and i lost it all anyway so and but you were touring as a headliner yes but i wasn't really ready to be a headliner uh you know i mean i on good nights i was and on bad nights i wasn't and uh i didn't have i had the material but things had to go well. I had to, you know, they had to get me. I remember one time this club owner,

and it really is, to this day it's kind of true. I'm better at what I'm doing, but I can split a crowd. Oh, no, yeah. Well, you're a unique thing. Oh, thank you. But it's hurt me on the road because, you know, as you know, if you're not well-known, they really want the guy just to do the job

and have a lot of dick jokes and do the job and make everyone love you. And so I'd get in trouble if everyone didn't love me. And so tons of clubs didn't want me back because there was always a few people that just hated me. Right. So that's been a problem. But is that what sort of started to chip away?

Yeah, me? Yeah. Yeah, the lack of work. And then at the cellar, the comedy cellar in New york i started doing well yeah i remember yeah yeah but then i started losing that because i started like trying things out you know you have to try yeah and also i was being pretty clean i i wanted i was challenged by being not saying fuck never saying fuck and trying to be really having smart jokes and and i would get in trouble with a later night crowd that had heard a lot of sexual stuff and then i'm sure i didn't know that one yeah were

you like how am i going to follow that yeah going up how am i going to make them think and then esty was like you did not do well right yeah exactly so i lose spots that is totally depressing it went from being one of the guys that got every spot to nothing but you did letterman and stuff that came years later. Yeah. I mean, I did the Tonight Show with Carson. I got on right before he quit. That was really good.

And then I did a few with Leno. Yeah. I did like six with Jay Leno. Yeah. Up until like 96. Uh-huh. And then I tried to get on Letterman. I finally got on Letterman in 2001. Yeah.

And you did. And I did five of them. Yeah. So you did like a lot of big, important stand-ups. Did you ever see me on Letterman, by yeah and you did five of them yeah you do i mean so you did like a lot of big important stand-up did you ever see me on letterman by the way yeah okay because i was curious one time you said to me i saw you on uh i didn't think maybe you liked it no i always like you no because one time you said can i say this sure no i well no of course you're gonna kick me off the show no okay i've look I've been an asshole before.

How did you interpret what I said? Okay, because also I interpret everything negatively. I know. So it might be me, it might be you, and it might be both of you. And I'll tell you exactly what I meant. You said to me, oh, I think this is what you said. I had just done Letterman. Yeah. And I had done, really, it was the first time I ever did it.

And I found out Letterman said to someone that it was one of the best he had seen. Right. Anyway, I'm not saying that means it was the best but you said i saw you on letterman i go what'd you think of it i said i said i thought it was pretty good he goes you went really was i joking no oh i think i was joking maybe not, but I didn't take it. I took it like, I took it, now this could be my negativity, but I took it like, you're a guy giving shit to, you're a guy that doesn't want me to be confident

and is looking for an opportunity to, maybe this could be my narcissism, but it could be, maybe you're a guy intimidated with how well I did and wanted to put me down a little. That's probably right. I was probably jealous yeah yeah i mean you know you were doing great i mean why wouldn't i be doing you were on letterman i couldn't get on letterman at that time ah i see there you go you know what i mean like i you know i didn't do the tonight show with carson you were a big act

to me and then i loved what you did so yeah i was probably a little jealous and i probably was being a little bit of a bully and I'm sorry. Okay, no problem. So I was right in my intuition. Yeah, but it wasn't, but it had nothing to do with you. I was just being a dick. No, okay.

You know, like you did a good job. You were great. Sure. You thought it was great? Yeah, I always think you're great. Which is a good job or great? You said you did a good job, you were great.

Those are two different things. I thought you killed, I was always happy. Like I had a lot of friends that did Letterman and I was the guy going like, why the fuck can't I do Letterman? So you coming up to me and declaring that you did a good job. No great i thought you killed i was always happy like i had a lot of friends that did letterman i was the guy going like why the fuck can't i do letterman so you coming up to me and declaring that you did a good job no wait a minute i didn't know you said i saw you on letterman i said and you said how did you think how did you think you did i said you asked me i didn't know i

don't know that doesn't sound like i would do that no i think you said how did it go doesn't it sound like you could say how did it go every comic says how did it go well yeah so i was just being a dick and that's not unusual okay and i'm sorry for that that's i think i've made up for that you have and Doesn't it sound like you could say, how did it go? Every comic says, how did it go? Well, yeah. So I was just being a dick. And that's not unusual. And I'm sorry for that. I think I've made up for that. You have. And also, you're also not being a dick by kicking me out right now. But of course, yeah, I've heard.

I'm going to kick you out. No, I apologize. No, that's nice of you. So what ultimately happens then after this wave of success and doing all these things to get you to like SRO? The, well. I mean, it doesn't sound like you had a drug problem or anything else it just sounds like you had no choice but to be exactly who you were and you don't give yourself enough credit for that you're a very defined act and you're a very defined person even in and a lot of it comes from your insecurities and whatever weird you know

emotional wiring you have but but, but you like, not unlike me, you can't do it any other way. Right. And, and that, that's sort of the curse of an artist on some level. And, and, and, you know, and it can go either way. And there had been times like before I started this podcast where I was the same way. I couldn't get work at clubs. I was definitely not for everybody. And I wasn't even as articulate as an act as you are, you know, I, I was not that together I mean you were a very together act I mean you were very deliberate you you hadn't you had jokes you knew where you were going like I didn't even I was chaotic and but I I had the same fate that

you had in that like you know I was definitely not for everybody I made a lot of people uncomfortable for different reasons and you know by the time I started this thing, I was pretty desperate. So is that ultimately what happened? Well, it's kind of funny, but I'm jealous of you. Again, that's great. You have male energy, you have action. I had an idea of when I was living in the SRO of wanting to do a talk show from my bed in this little SRO and having people come up. But again, it's hard for me to get guests. Like no one is going to, who's going to be my guest? Well, I only have action out of desperation. I mean, I think you're overestimating my male energy.

I mean, like, you know, the, what I did with my charisma or what I did with my talent, you know, was push myself out there in a sort of over the top way. You know, I was a very angry act. I was a very sort of like provocative act, but that's not really who I am. I'm a hypersensitive insecure guy just like you i just like and obviously you figured out a way to get

in front of people and and and make people reckon with you i just did it differently but i don't think we're that different i think you're over estimating my masculinity i mean i do whole bits about like i call myself an alpha doormat you know like i i don't i don't think i'm like some alpha dude i think we have more in common than you think it's just my act is my act both in life and on the stage at different points where i was a lot more aggressive but i think it was out of desperation sure i just wanted to connect when you have gone to your oh but not money wise you could have gone to your parents for money not Not really. After a certain point, they blew it. Oh, they blew the money?

They had no money? Not really, no. I mean, when I got divorced, I had to ask my mother for money. My dad hasn't had any money for a long time, but certainly when I was younger, they had money,

but I haven't really asked them for money except once when I was in the middle of a divorce, I had to ask my mom to get me over the hump, and she helped out but I I really somehow or another you know found a way to make a living doing this but see

that's that's I am jealous of that because you have the dignity to not to just ask when you desperately need it I would always ask my mother for money yeah and she would give it to me she wasn't wealthy but she would give me and now she has no money. Now I'm desperate. Yeah. But it's hard to be desperate when you are older and you can hardly move. Yeah. Yeah. So what are you doing?

I don't know but what was your earlier question? You had a question. How did I end up in the SRO? Well, I mean, it seems fairly self-explanatory. The work dried up. Oh, yeah, right.

The work dried up but you know, get back to your earlier question. You said, how did you make it to the SRO? I don't like to leave any question unattended because these questions are about me. Okay.

And I feel I'm being neglected when you leap over a question. I'm sorry. No, but, no, what's my point? My point is, how did I get to that SRO? I don't know. Do I need to answer that, really? I mean, like, I don't even know how. That was 2002, 2001.

Again, no work. I just transferred. I'd transfer i'd go from la no work to new york get a little work no work go back to la a little work no work i keep moving around to no work no work yeah just nothing i couldn't headline clubs i tried cruise ships that don't work because they want you clean yeah i'm clean but they never say clean and not dark right I'm clean and dark. Forget talking about my hatred of my mother. It's clean. You can't do that. I mean, I remember I have a joke out of nowhere.

I go, I guess what I'm really trying to say here tonight is that I hate my mother. It gets left because it's out of nowhere. I got a decent laugh, but an older guy comes up to me at the cruise ship. Our women here hated that joke that you hate your mother. We don't like that, that you hate your mother. And so I wouldn't get back if just a few people complained on the cruise ships forget that so that's uh yeah so no money uh and also i guess i must say in my defense i didn't go to my mother for money so that's why i wasn't an sro i wanted to suffer because i have this masochism and self-dislike a lot and also you wanted to maybe you know act grown up yeah try to be grown up

and live in an sro and it was literally i have a joke i'm active but literally five feet by ten feet yeah literally five by ten i found out later rooms legally cannot be below eight by ten it wasn't even a legal room and jail cells are eight by ten it wasn't even and so i was living in this five by ten for like six months and uh how did i get into it yeah no work and i wanted to get writing where i never wanted to write for others because the narcissism i don't like to give up my time the same way dude I mean I like we're very similar and I've always you know liked you a lot and I knew that there were times where you in trouble and then you started doing the one-man show which I believe I saw I don't think you did I don't know I think I did somewhere really maybe in New York where'd you do in New York yeah I did

in New York did you come sometimes people came out I didn't know they were there. I feel like I came. Well, I started doing it in 2009. What's it called? It was Al Alone back then. Yeah. Al Alone. But, well, thanks if you came. I started doing that,

and then I did get on this, Edinburgh, I did that a few times. Yeah, right. So I got some work in England. I did get some work, you know. You spent a lot of time over there? Yeah, I hung out, yeah. But I was running out of work there.

And so I came back here and I'm getting no work here, virtually nothing. And I'm something, I hate saying that because I've got a few gigs coming up. And what if these gigs hear this and figure, oh, this guy's not getting work, we'll cancel his gigs. No, we'll hold on to it. We can take anything you want out.

But do you feel like you're bouncing back a little bit? Yes, because I must say I think a little. Because why? Well, some guy's helping me with, wants to sell my one-man show, wants to try to put it on. He's taping and wants to sell it. Oh, great. So that's a good thing. Yeah, yeah.

So I feel in that sense I'm bouncing back. And I must say, I think say i think you know i must admit i don't like to admit i've grown up a little but i think i've grown a little so i'm a little more of a person even though uh where i'm at is pretty dangerously bad i'm more of a person and i think i'd rather be more of a person this way than rather a less of a person with money yeah but and also i think look dude it takes time sometimes it takes what it takes and you had a difficult go at it you know emotionally all the way through but it seems like your self-awareness is a little a little more expansive in in a in a more proactive way than just sort of like you know it's hard like when you hit the skids and you hit bottom you got no choice but to look at your fucking self in a way like i can't go

to my mother for me. She has no money. So I actually can't. I've never been in the situation where I couldn't. Yeah. So that's waking me up.

Okay. Well, I'm happy to see you and I'm glad we talked. Okay, thank you. You good? Yeah. Well,

I don't know. That's a stretch. Are we good? Are we good? How do you define? Yeah, we good. We good? We're good, yeah.

All right, Al. Thank you. Right now, I would like to sing you a song about myself. How you doing? My name's Al Lubell. And I'd like to sing you this little song about myself. little song about myself. I have arms.

I have legs. I have hair. When I go to bed at night, I fall asleep. I have blood vessels. vessels When I make toast I use bread Whenever I go out on a first date

I always ask the girl where she's from Originally And then she tells me And I say Oh Oh, whenever I play basketball, the veins in my ankles start to bulge out. And I'm always scared, I'm always scared that they're gonna break. But they never do. Lucky me.

Sometimes, sometimes I get severe chest pain. And I think I'm having a heart attack. I'm having a heart attack But then I burp And I'm okay I'm really embarrassed to admit That I'm a sexual human being cause every time every time I'm French kissing with a girl

I keep thinking if she disappeared I'd look like Mick Jagger I'm Aloubel I'm Aloubel I'd look like Mick Jagger Whoa, whoa I'm Al Lubell, I'm Al Lubell I'm Al Lubell, I'm Al Lubell I'm really glad my first name's Al And not Lou Cause then my name would be

Lulubell And that would be Lulu Bell And that would be so depressing Arms and legs and head That's what I have Arms and legs and head I don't like to break No, no, I'm selecting it Whoa, that's me

I'm Aloubet Whoa, I'm selecting it Whoa, that's me Who am I? Aloubet Oh, that's me Whoever had Lupe Oh, I'm two legs in hell That's me Lupe Lou Bell Lou Bell That was it. That was Al Lou Bell. That was the al lubell song i think it's called um 700 frequency beta sector of the 4g on the roof of my building by the roof of my office building

be damned i will i will win through shielding my hope is in copper now my hope is in copper Boomer lives! Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category,

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