WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 708 - Terry Reid / Jim Norton

Episode Date: May 19, 2016

Terry Reid is one of the most talented singers and rock musicians who never had a massive break, but he doesn't seem to sweat it. Terry tells Marc great stories from throughout his expansive career in the music business, and he sets the record straight about the rumor that he turned down a spot in Led Zeppelin. Plus, Marc reaches out to his friend Jim Norton, who is having a problem connecting with people. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Alright, let's do this. How are you, what the fuckers? What the fuck buddies? What the fucksters? What the fuckadelics? What the fuckleberry thins what's happening i'm mark maron this is my podcast wtf welcome to it how's it going i'm okay i saw that film the lobster last night i talked to john c reilly about it and he was in it obviously but thought it was an

interesting movie and i went to see it and it's sort of a mind fucker. It's some serious art film poetry. A lot of things coming at you in a way you've never seen before, and it puts a lot on you to process this abstract, somewhat surreal, but very vulnerable film about something that is not real per se. There's not a lot of commitment to the idea that whatever culture this is that sends away its divorced or widowed people to a hotel where they have a certain amount of time to meet other mates before they are turned into an animal. More time to meet their mates is to go out and tranquilize people who are called loners, people who are off the grid, out in the woods and bring them in to be, I believe, transformed into animals. It's not sure. I'm not sure. yet very basic human relationship ideas about relationship dynamics, marriage are all covered in this, but it's so abstract and so poetic that you just have to sit there and let your

brain get fucked by this movie. Today on the show, Terry Reid, the singer-songwriter who's been around for a long time i'm not sure that you would know him right away unless you know him you he certainly knew everybody else but he was around in the 70s he was one of the great uh white soul singers out of uh the uk had a record in 68 called bang bang you're terry reed and then another record self-titled record in 69 then an amazing record called the river called just river in 73 and a couple of records he's been recording the whole way through but the the the real notorious records are those first three then seat of memory and rogue 78, 79, then a handful of other records throughout 2013.

Well, Light in the Attic is issuing. It's not really a reissue. It is a reissue, but it's called The Other Side of the River. And I think it's got a lot of the takes that are on River, but also some alternate takes. And I talked to Terry a lot about these alternate takes that were found. It comes out Friday, May 20th, remastered, and it's got six never-before-heard tracks plus alternate versions of songs from River.

You can go check that out wherever you get music, but do check out Light in the Attic. Their stuff is pretty amazing. They do amazing reissues and some original records as well. Great label, Light in the Attic. I will tell you that right now. But Terry Reid, most people know him as the guy that turned down the lead singing position of Led Zeppelin. If you know that. If you know that story.

But he knew everybody. And when I got an opportunity to talk to him i knew his first three records and then i was given the uh the um the new one this uh these reissues and never before uh issued stuff in the mid 70s early 70s to listen to and it was stunning and and he's around he lives nearby well he's in the he's in california so i kind of jumped at the opportunity but he was one of these guys that you know had been around england for so long and in the music business so long he's got great fucking stories of all eras but i will give you a heads up on this not a spoiler but um when i if you if you're young enough or old enough or maybe if

you're young and interested i mean what's the first thing you think about when you hear the name Brian Jones? You think like a genius, like the original member of the Stones that defined their sound, a druggie, a guy who died or maybe got killed in a swimming pool that may or may not. It depends on what conspiracy you decide to believe. Maybe you know Brian Jonestown Massacre, which has nothing to do with Brian Jones, really. But nonetheless, he was a Rolling Stone. He was an original Rolling Stone. And Terry Reid tells one of the best stories I've ever heard about Brian Jones. It's not a long story, but you just don't associate a personality per se to Brian Jones. you just associate him with the mythology of the stones that he died that he was difficult that he was a genius that he had drug problem but

but he just becomes this person in one line in the story that terry reed tells so look forward to that you mind if i call my friend jim norton my buddy jim norton is going to be out here i think yeah it's like next week may 26 jim norton Norton will be here in Los Angeles at the Novo. And May 27th, he'll be in Las Vegas, Nevada at the Mirage Hotel and Casino. You can go to JimNorton.com to buy tickets. Jim is one of the most honest, most disgusting, most endearing, most crass and horrible, wonderful little men out there performing comedy. I love them.

And I just want to make sure that if there are anybody that is a fan of Jim Norton that listens to this show and you didn't know he was coming, I want to make sure you know he's coming at the Novo here in L.A. May 26th. And let's get him on the phone. I talked to him in New York. He hosted a town hall thing at Sirius where he interviewed me. Did a great job, and I did Opie and Jimmy's show. I enjoyed that.

But I love Jim, and I'm going to call him. We're going to call Jim, and we're going to talk to him, and we're going to tell you again when his gigs are. So let me get him on the phone. It's hockey season, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So, no, you can't get an ice rink on Uber Eats. But iced tea, ice cream, or just plain old ice?

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Product availability varies by region. See app for details. It's a night for the whole family. Be a part of Kids Night when the Toronto Rock take on the Colorado Mammoth at a special 5 p.m. start time on Saturday, March 9th at First Ontario Centre in Hamilton. The first 5,000 fans in attendance will get a Dan Dawson

bobblehead courtesy of Backley Construction. Punch your ticket to Kids Night on Saturday, March 9th at 5 p.m. in Rock City at torontorock.com. Hello? Jim, are you there? Is that hi mark it is me i'm surprised this worked out these connections never seem to work out properly yeah i i find that with all connections of all guys that's exactly it they sound good in theory and they want to be in shitty yeah emotional connections connections with audiences it's all touch and go you know it's funny man especially with like one-on-one i for you is it hard to have connection with sex like it's

virtually impossible for me to have eye contact during a sexual experience if i if i care about the person is that true because i'm i'm weird like i i don't know what it is about me but i i have to not only i i have to have full eye contact i don't i don't really like closing my eyes unless i don't want to come. Really? Yeah, the only time I'm closing my eyes is to get my breathing in a zone to where I don't blow my load. But generally, I like to look. I like to feel.

I like to see what's happening. I like that. You don't like that? No, I don't mind looking because I's kind of a pornographic voyeurism. But I can't be intimate. If it's someone I don't know or a stranger or if we're behind a dumpster, I can tell her I love her. But if it's somebody I'm dating or that I care about, it's got to be filthy and I can't look at her. And it really messed me up, Ben, the lack of ability to have that connection during sex.

Well, I find that I have that experience right after sex. It's's the don't look at me we did it what do you need now oh okay yeah the the emotional connection is now broken and hit the bricks yeah the the snuggly part you know i get a little squirrely with but uh but the sex part i i like to you know be completely engaged what i do are you with somebody. I mean, it's literally five years. I've dated, I've had a couple of very brief, like, you know, month or two things. But I haven't had, like, a real girlfriend since 2011. And I'm kind of at a point now where I want a girlfriend.

You know, and I'm saying girl in air quotes. You know, just somebody to date regularly. What do you mean? Somebody that is the illusion of a woman might work out? Well, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, someone who's kind of half there. You know what you mean? That somebody that is the illusion of a woman might work out? Well, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, someone who's kind of half there. You know what I mean? Woman, you know, whatever.

Just somebody who I get along with and I enjoy having sex with. It would be nice to see them more than once. And I find that different things fuck it up, man. Like, I'll start to like somebody, and then I find one little flaw. It's like I have to find something in order to sabotage it. I'm sure you know the drill. I do. But like what's a deal-breaking flaw?

It really depends. They're too dirty. They're not dirty enough. Almost like whatever they present, I will crave the opposite. Because the deal, I mean, bad breath would be a deal-breaking flaw, but it's very rare that you run into that. Somebody who is, here's the one that's the worst, judgmental, like for real judgment, you know, because I'm pretty out there about stuff I've done sexually, and if it's somebody

who doesn't know my comedy, and then they start finding out things, and I get that, like, oh, I had one girl tell me, you know, we were having lunch, and she goes, you know, that stuff you told me last night, you can never tell me that stuff again. I mean, I have my idea of what masculine is, and I just can't hear that stuff. And I wasn't even mad at her, but as we're eating lunch, like, I felt every ounce of fucking liking go away. And I just was done with her by the time we were finished with lunch. Well, she basically just— That will kill it for me.

Yeah, well, she just shamed you. Like, it wasn't—you know, it's not, like, helpful advice. It's like, you know, you're not a man to me if you tell me that stuff that you uh obviously have done in your life yeah the shaming stuff get because i don't shame a woman about anything yeah like i don't care like i've had girls tell me that they you know they wanted to fuck their dads and all this other great stuff and some i've had to goad into saying it but they do but uh anything you you come out with i'm okay with like i'm not going to judge anybody's past so when someone does it to me that that makes me instantly like disconnecting oh

fuck you man it just that really is irritating yeah i'm just i what i'm having a hard time with i guess you're a little younger than me but what i what i don't always understand after a certain point like i'm 52 i got no kids uh you know i've been married twice i've been through the the fucking mill with the with everything. It's like I'm not sure what I need right now. Like, you know, what do I really want? Do I want to get married again? No. Do I want someone to live with me? Not really. Do I want kids? No. So so what do I really want? You know, like what what I don't understand what the hell a relationship is is good for sometimes. Yeah. I find it's like being

greedy. like that's exactly it i don't know what i want because i know that there are enough people out there where i can get what i want especially with tinder and bumble and ray and all these fucking dating apps it's not for lack of of choices it's the fact that i'm just a greedy motherfucker and i want everything and then as soon as i get it i throw it. And I want to hunt again of something new. It's like I'm unsatisfiable. It's really pathetic at my age. Yeah, I wish I may.

I think I have a little of that, but I can't. You know, I'm in a relationship, but so I can't really. I was never that, you know, that driven to sort of push the envelope sexually. But I do. I do wonder. It's sort of like, is it is sex? Isn't sex just sort of push the envelope sexually. But I do I do wonder, it's sort of like, is it is sex? Isn't sex just sort of enough? I mean, if you don't want kids, you don't want to be married. You're not really capable of trusting people deeply or having real intimacy. Isn't there a point where you're just sort of I guess this is the way I am. It's not horrible.

So I'll just live this way. Yeah. You you know you start to resign yourself to like all right maybe this is as far as i'm going this is the best as can we get yeah but i just i don't i haven't even fucked in a while like my dick's not even staying hard unless it's an inappropriate thing like it stays really hard through the entire experience i give up kissing a girl my dick is hard to my pants for an hour and then as soon as it touches a vagina it's like whoa just panic and hide so i think i'm having this real like connection thing it's not not necessarily a performance issue yeah i think it represents something and like you know a connection or something really nice and i just you know there's a part of it just isn't having it yeah you're

you're despite whatever you're thinking your dick is panicking yeah it's completely completely panicking my dick is acting like it's been shamed. It doesn't matter who I'm with. It has nothing to do with the partner, how hot they are, what they're willing to do, whether it's loving. It's not about that. I just can't seem to fuck lately. From knowing you and talking to you many times, I can say with confidence that your dick has been shamed. Yeah, it has been. And in in some cases it should have been you know not all shame is wrong there's certain things i've done that a justifiable amount of shaming was given but it's the stuff that i shouldn't be ashamed of right um you know that i am that just seems to uh it just seems to wreck it for me and i can't seem to get out of

the pattern maybe i don't want to you know i mean like you know how they talk about hey liking lust seems weird like i like being that way too. And it's just like, I'm not willing to stop. Well, see, that's something that I've been thinking about lately is that, you know, I think my comfort zone is uncomfortable. That like, like I, you know, I think that the way I brought up the way I felt as a kid and all that shit that I generally felt a little awkward, a little uncomfortable. So that's really what I know. So that's my comfort zone. Like I'm just, you know, an uncomfortable guy in a lot of ways. And, and, uh, you know, to feel comfortable is

completely alien, alien and not, and not necessarily something, uh, that, that, that might, that I can adapt to that well. And that's the way it is sexually and every other way. Like the stuff that might've turned me on when I was 15 or made me feel connected when I was 15 is just so far in the past and my normal level is just so far above where it should be and it just there's no way to satisfy it yeah yeah it's it's horrible the the ongoing hunger then then the relief and then the the shame and then the fucking feeling of emptiness then the boredom and then the fucking relief again you know boredom is the worst of all those things I think the boredom, and then the fucking relief again, you know? The boredom is the worst of all those things. I think the boredom is almost the worst. Because the other stuff, at least, there's like, okay, if I'm ashamed, I know I'm ashamed.

If I'm angry, I'm angry. If I'm depressed, I'm angry. But the boredom, there's really no rational explanation for it. That's the one that fucks me up, because I'll go like, all right, she's a nice girl. She eats my ass. She's a trooper. She'll do anything I want. She'll talk any way I want.

She'll tell me to wear panties. She'll cuckold me. She'll tell me she loves me. She'll tell me to wear panties. She'll cuckold me. She'll tell me she loves me. And none of it feels like anything. And I'm bored. So it's like, what the fuck do you want, idiot? She's giving you all this stuff, and you're bored. I like the list.

Believe me, I cut it short. There's a lot more on that list of great options. Dude, talking dirty and being, you know, I talk about sex so much, and I hate that that's my thing, but it just seems to be the focus of most of my discomfort and my obsession. You know, I just wish I could get out of that mindset sometimes. Yeah, it's hard. So you do an advice show now, too?

You do the Opium Jim show in the morning, and then how often do you do the advice show? What's that called? Well, it's just the Jim Norton show, and it's once a week. And the reason that came about a few years ago is Sirius gave me a raise, but they kind of wanted—you know how they say you've got to work for it? Yeah. So they said, why don't we do a music show on the Aussie's Boneyard channel every night, which you prerecord? Right.

And it's a once-a-week advice show. So it started as a goof. know, it's a goop. I'm like, all right, I'll just fuck around. Some callers will call in. But then people started calling in with real stuff. Like, it wasn't, I thought that I'm sitting here like some douchey guru. The whole thing started as a goop. But then it was like, hey, man, I want to get sober.

I want to do it, like, do it, have, like, legit things. Yeah. So I guess it's kind of, everyone understands that I'm flawed. And I tell the truth about myself. So I think people kind of like that, as opposed to being like Dr. Laura, where you're sitting there like this twat on the mount telling everybody what's wrong with them. I kind of come from the same place that you'd probably come from, which is, look, I know I'm flawed. I know I'm damaged.

I've learned certain things, and maybe this will help. Yeah, I'm not a professional, but I went through this, and this helps me. Yeah, and I think people like that. Yeah, I'm not a professional, but I went through this, and this helps me. Yeah, and I think people like that. Yeah, they do. I think they like the lack of perfectionism in the advice or the suggestions. And I like a list. A lot of times I'll tell them, I don't know, man, I have no experience with that, and here's what I might do, but I can't be truthful.

People like once in a while when you say you don't know, because at least they know that you're not coming from a place of being holier than thou. Yeah, you can say, I don't know. Let me see know that you're not coming from a place of being uh you know holier than thou yeah you can say i don't know maybe let me let me see did you yeah let me see if i can get your phone number or look it up because uh you're fucked up in a way i don't even understand yeah and you by the way let me see if i get your phone number you've actually taken it one step further than i ever you've done more work in that than i've ever done i've always just said google it i have no idea what to tell you i've not my i don't like people ask about kids yeah i don't want to give like first of all, if you take Jim Norton's advice with your

children, you're fucking ridiculous. Like, my baby's choking. What do I do? Like, I don't know what to tell you. You know? Fucking call someone who knows. I don't know how to handle that. You better do something quickly.

Yeah, exactly. Well, you know, it depends on how you feel about kids. You might have to wait an hour and see how it works itself out. Oh, fuck. Well, that's fucking great. So you're coming, you're doing a show here in L.A.? Yeah, I mean, L.A. is always a frightening one for me. What date is that?

It's next Friday? Next Friday or is it Thursday? I think I'm doing the Novo on Thursday and I'm doing Vegas, the Mirage, on the Friday. I should probably know my own dates. I understand the value of a plug, and I understand how it's done and how you should be prepared. And I see these guys, they come in, and they have no idea. And I'm like, what dopes, they don't know how to plug.

And then here I am, it's May 26th at the Novo. Here I am, and I don't know exactly how to plug. I almost feel embarrassed or ashamed plugging, especially with a friend. Like when you're doing it with someone you don't know, it's a disconnected experience. Like, yeah, these are my dates. But when I'm talking to somebody I've known for 20 years, it's almost like, and I'm going to be here. And I just often, I don't know how to do it.

Well, I mean, you're talking to the right guy. So you're in Los Angeles on May 26th in Las Vegas, May 27th, JimNorton.com. But, I mean, I'm the same way. But now, like, I get this weird thing where, like, I don't ever expect that I'm going to sell out or a lot of people are coming. But I do want the people that I know like me to come. You know, like, I don't know how many that number is, but I want to make sure all the ones, you know, that if they're out there and they're, you know, not quite paying enough attention. Like, because I get sick of the thing where you got the biggest fans in in the world, and you promote on every platform available, and then you leave the town, and two days later they're like, I didn't know you were coming.

It's like, what the fuck do you want me to do? Come to your house. Yeah, how can I let every person know individually? Louie's mailing list seems to be the way to go, and I guess if I had one the size of him, that would be a good way to do it. But I don't know either. I get the same ones. When are you coming to Philly?

It's like, I was there two days ago, you fucking non-fan. Where were you? There's no way to do it. But I don't know either. I get the same ones. When are you coming to Philly? I was there two days ago, you fucking non-fan. Where were you? You know, there's no way to tell everyone. So I just try to get out as many. You get out there. You plug as much as possible. And there's so many forms of entertainment. You just hope somebody's interested.

And you're right. The ones that show up, I just want them. The people who like me, I want them to know I'm going to be there. Exactly. And how's the material? Do you feel good about it? Yeah, I'm going to shoot it at the end of July. You know, it's one of those things I get so sick of it.

And my curse has always been it's usually a little bit too topical, so like a year later it doesn't feel as relevant. So I'm trying to keep it. You know, I talk about obviously Caitlyn and my whole opinion and experience in that world, and I'm trying to keep it fairly evergreen so it's not something contingent upon the Vanity Fair cover. You know what I mean?

I'm talking about that, and obviously the Trump thing, I'm trying to keep very, very something that could be watchable in a year or two. Well, maybe what you should do is, because the last special I did, it was almost all evergreen, because you don't know when the hell people are going to watch it and where they're going to watch it. Maybe you should do a scenario with the Trump thing and do a few jokes as if he's president. See how that goes.

I did think of that. I thought it would be funny to tell the audience, this is what I'm doing, because I don't know when people are going to watch this, and then do a couple of jokes of Hillary being the president and a couple of jokes of Trump being the president. Oh, you've got to do that. And just see how it works out. You've got to do it.

Or just be lazy and release a special with both. So I've kind of covered all my bases. Well, I think it would be funny either way. I think you should definitely do that. Do a couple of jokes with Hillary and a couple of jokes with Trump as president. And then leave them all in after. Yeah, and just see what happens. And people go, well, at least he thought it through.

They just got lazy in the edit. All right, buddy. Well, okay. So May 26 here in L.A. at the Novo. And May 27 in Vegas at the Mirage. I love you, Jim. Thank you, Mark. I love you. I'll be out there. I'm actually coming out Sunday, so it'd be nice to see you during the week,

maybe in the afternoon if you want to grab some lunch. Let's do it. Text me. All right, buddy. I'll talk to you soon. Thanks, Mark. You bet. Bye. Once again, Jim Norton, Los Angeles, May 26th at the Novo, Las Vegas, Nevada at the Mirage Hotel and Casino, May 27th. Always enlightening and relieving.

And, you know, what's great about Jim is that, you know, you can always pretty much, if you're like almost any person, you know that you're not as bad as you think you are. And you're not handling as much crazy bullshit that you get yourself into as Jim Norton is. And that's why he's so brilliant. Can I just share with you an email about my show? We're now into, we've now burned through four episodes of Marin on IFC. It's on Wednesdays at nine.

I'll actually plug my Trippany House dates. You can also go to wtfpod.com slash tour. I'm doing those Trippany shows at the Steve Allen Theater Tuesdays through June. Get tickets if there are tickets to be gotten. I'll tell you again how proud I am of this season of Marin. I really think we did a wonderful job making a show that is not. It's the it's a cautionary tale. Is it an allegory?

I don't think so. I think it's a a fictional cautionary tale of of how my life could have gone or may still go, God forbid. But people are responding very well to it and for the right reason. And I'm happy for that. That's the most I can ask for. We did an amazing thing, I think. But I just got this email from Rob. Thanks for this season of Marin.

but I just got this email from Rob. Thanks for this season of Marin. Nine months ago, I had the unpleasant task of driving, in parentheses, dragging my wife to an inpatient facility. I spent a month alone with our kids holding shit together until she got out. She's doing well and after a lot of bitter argument, so are we.

This season gave us a way to really laugh at addiction and recovery from the clueless, quote, all i need is one shot unquote stagger and swagger of relapse to the endless nattering but still strangely helpful journey of recovery you nailed the facts while showing that every tragic situation has a pure diamond of comedy within it your show helped us laugh at ourselves and more than anything else we needed that thanks mark best rob that to me is what the show is for you know it's like in the world we live in now i never ever in my life had any

aspiration or illusions that i would be for everybody and i don't give a fuck that i'm not but i'll tell you you know whatever i am and whatever I fought to be in any medium I'm in, if it resonates with you, uh, I, I am glad to connect and, uh, I, I appreciate the feedback and I'm happy to help out. So look, people, this is a, this is a pretty big deal. This, uh, this interview with Terry Reed, because, you know, I'm not a complete nostalgia freak, but I like people that live the life. I like people that remember the life they lived. And I like people that lived a life in proximity to my heroes or to the people that I always revered. And music is music.

And this guy goes all the way back. And it's a pretty stunning interview. As I said before, his new album, From new album, uh, from light in the attic. Uh, the other side of the river is available Friday, May 20th. Uh, it's remastered and it has six never before heard tracks from this period where he did the river.

Uh, and there's alternate versions of the song on river. Go check it out wherever you get music. So now is, uh, let me bring you my conversation with, uh, with Terry Reid.

There's a type of singing, because I was listening to the new record that's coming out on Light in the Attic. Other Side of the River. Other Side of the River, which is outtakes from the River Sessions. Yeah. Right. And like the River,

like I picked up the other day because I have your first two albums. I have Bang Bang and I have this self-titled record. But. Someone turned me on to you. I think my girlfriend gave me Bang Bang and then another kid's like,

you got to know Terry Reed. Right. So I started listening to this stuff. I'm like, holy shit. Because there's, you know, there's only like, you know,

four of you guys that do that stuff. And you all sort of came out around the same time, like Cocker, right? Well, yeah. Like just this British soul singer. Big compliment. What are you kidding, man? It's great. Everybody was a soul singer in England.

Is that the way it was? Well, nobody went to see. All the white groups only went to see black groups right that way right for lack of whether they'd be blues or r&b yeah more r&b yeah oh yeah no the four tops where'd you grow up um out in the countryside in cambridgeshire so you would go into london to see bands oh yeah we'd go anywhere to see you know hammersmith odium was where the four tops andemptations, they always would play there. And how old were you when you were seeing that stuff?

Oh, like 13. Really? Yeah, 14, you know. And that's what just put it in your head? Oh, well, we got the records, right? So that was it. We were devout. That was it.

That's the only way that we heard anything. Right. You know, you could get mary had a little lamb and we'd turn it into an oak it's ready to yeah but it's interesting because some dudes it seems like you know if i talk to uh you know if you look at i like i guess she's probably a little older than you but maybe not but there was a whole other contingent that was doing blues like the straight up i talked to john mayall you know yeah right yeah mayall in here very good friend of mine is a good guy right oh he's a lovely he's a fantastic guy see we all came up in that i just you're born when you're born and then when you get a little older if you're

into playing music right it's the time whenever you just fall into that whole thing sure you look around yeah or you you look around the paper you look at whatever in the music rags yeah and you see who's doing what well with me it was a bit funny because and some of my mates too like robert palmer and a lot of people palmer yeah another great song yeah oh he's lovely he was a lovely guy you know i mean fantastic songwriter but we were all devailed r b guys and uh when you look you'd look around and when we were all at school and none of us had a clue that we'd end up in the middle of all this.

Yeah. Just by when it was, that early 60s thing, we suddenly looked around and we were suddenly, we were playing and we were on the road and doing this

and things started happening. Who was your first band? Like who was, what was the lineup? What was the first band you were in? How old you first band i was like what 14 15 playing guitar and singing guitar and singing and so you're always a guitar player yeah yeah yeah i always play guitar yeah yeah you know not not not that well at the time but you know yeah you gotta learn sure sure but the funny thing was is uh it was like 13 and 14 and we had a local group

out in the country so I got the red beads the red beads yeah oh yeah you know we all got one did you dress up the same way

did you have matching outfits well little red little sparkle you know like a little glitter yeah not too much

yeah we hadn't got the platforms or anything yeah right they were coming well it went that way for some, you know. But I was never clear.

Yeah. It's not exactly right. Mighty thing, right. So we all get into it. And then I joined a band in London called Peter, Jane, and the Jaywalkers that we'd be supporting all these different groups around. Like, who was around then? Because I talked to, who did I talk to?

Well, I talked to Lemmy, and I talked to Richard Thompson, and, you know, and... Oh, Lemmy's a big Beatle fan. Huge Beatle fan. Huge, hugest Beatle fan in the world. Yeah, and he'd go see everybody, you know, and I'm a huge, like, I'm sort of borderline obsessed with Peter Green.

So anybody... Oh, yeah, yeah. Anyone's going to talk about Peter Green, you know, I'll listen, you know, but it always amazes me that London is, it's one city, and all this shit was happening. Yeah, but you see, not everybody came from London. But they were there, right? Well, all roads led to London.

Even with the Beatles, they were just dying to get out of Liverpool anyway. Right. When you go, I mean, it has a sort of a nostalgic thing for me. Sure. Did you see the Beatles? No, I never saw the Beatles. Well, you guys were almost contemporaries, right? Not quite about.

No, they were the ones that set the stage for what we all love to do. Sure. Right. There's a bunch of guys from way at Liverpool. Right. And they wrote these songs. Are you joking? This is some good stuff here.

What's going on they're from liverpool now they're in london they're making all these records and and they're just fantastic right and everybody wanted to be in a group then yeah right and write their own material thing whether they could or not that's not the point so you were writing material early on right at the beginning well i i think the first thing i i was just trying to scratch my head one day what was the first thing I wrote. Yeah. Which, that writing thing,

I'm not quite sure what that means. Right, right. How do you write a song? It comes out of thin air or something. Right, yeah, yeah. And being musical at that, from an early age in that, I was like a sponge with tunes anyway.

Yeah. So something comes up and you put this together with that and voila, you end up with a sponge with tunes anyway. Yeah. So something comes up and you put this together with that and voila, you end up with a story with it and it's a song. Right. I don't think you really write it. Right.

All that sitting down diligently and I mean, I've done that with songs. But sometimes it just comes to you, you got your notebook and you write a phrase. Yeah, I got a tune and I put words to it. Yeah, yeah. And that's the way it goes. There's one song without expression that I did on that early albums

that you were talking about. On Bang Bang or the other one? I think it's, yeah, I think it's on Bang Bang. Yeah, which song? It's called Without Expression. Yeah, yeah. That was probably the first thing that I got pen to paper and did something, mate.

Yeah, yeah. And that's gone around all over the place. Sure, man. Those are big records. That Bang Bang was a big record, wasn't it? Well, it wasn't just that. pen to paper and did something yeah yeah and that's gone around all over the place sure man those are those are big records that bang bang was a big record wasn't it well it wasn't just that it's a good friend of mine graham nash he he did it with the hollies which i never knew about for years and then he did it with crosby stills and nash right yeah right and then john mellencamp did it right nice and then there's all these people did it. And I thought, well, what about the rest?

Do a few more. No. I mean, to me, Crosby, Stills and Nash doing one. I mean, you've only got like, what, four or five great writers in the band who have got 50 songs each. Yeah. Just baffled me. Well, yeah, it's interesting. Like, even listening to the first records,

they're sort of like, they're very lyrical stuff, and they do, but they all seem to have their own tone, and I couldn't, you know, I couldn't quite place it. It's pretty uniquely yours. I mean, I guess early on there was, you know, sort of the way kind of like maybe Van Morrison wrote stuff where things just kept moving, you know, and you just kept singing over it.

Although Van, I must admit, at a very, very early stage, you know, I remember when he was with a group called Them. Them, yeah. Yeah. I remember back then. See, we all grew up in this thing. So you would see Them. Yeah.

They'd be around. The Hollies would be around. Right, yep. And we'd be like the backing group, backing all these groups, the Animals with Eric. You would play or you were the opening band? We'd play the opening band. You were the opening band with the the J what was the name of your band then Peter Jane the J will yes right so you're a best education you ever had because not only not what to do but to figure out

well what is it that they're doing to get it so right everything the Hollies puzzled me to hell. Graeme caught me one day after the gig. I'm behind the curtain behind their amps. And I'm looking around, you know, behind the amps. He says, what are you doing? I says, well, Graeme, you can't sound that good. You've got some other stuff behind there I don't know about. He's going, that's some magic't know he's going that's the there's some magic somewhere that's what yeah yeah he said that's so that's flowering and do you know what

he didn't have anything nothing nothing just straight amps yeah who the hell knows what the that's depressing but who knows what the magic is right yeah i mean i mean they were unbelievably good live what were you about to say about um uh about van at that point because he's van when he ran always had a very very distinctive style yeah singing wise yeah if you listen to things he even listened to gloria yeah which was them yeah and you listen to things he sings now it's it, I won't, don't get me wrong, it's exactly the same. His phrasing is definitive him.

Right, right, right. And you can't put your finger on, well, where did he get it from? All that thing. No, it's a total blend of everything he likes, which is what I always say. He's never one favourite singer. Yeah, and were you guys friends?

We know each other real well favorite singer. Yeah. And were you guys friends? We know each other real well. Yeah. Yeah. Van's a character to behold, I'll tell you. Always? Well, he don't take prisoners, put it that way. Was he always like that? He's always been that way.

He's very short, short with words and things with people. But we know each other real well. But that's interesting about vocalists is that it's really on you on you guys to it's it's all going to be in the phrasing it's all going to be the interpretation and and the honesty of your own voice so you're gonna find it or you're not right that's it's what fits your it's like i always say as well when people go into studio they say oh uh oh that's a nice mic, I'll use that. Well, over the years you discover that there's the right mic for a certain singer. Oh, yeah? Yeah.

I mean, what is right for one singer will not necessarily work on another singer. Right. There's always one. What's your mic? Well, there's two. There's a couple of different Neumanns that are great if you're singing softer,

right? And if you're slamming it and you really, like this thing we're doing. Belting it out. Yeah. You've got to be careful. A ribbon mic is usually the best.

Now, my favorite mic on that kind of thing is a BX44. Yeah. The big RCA mic. Oh, yeah? Oh, it's the best

because it's warmer and the ribbon moves. Oh, so you can belt it's it's the best because it's warmer uh-huh and the ribbon moves oh so you can belt it out when you add it it doesn't smack you in the face oh yeah yeah like that digestive ad on tv you know when a hamburger beats you up so it's you have to be you have to really learn over years of what's the right mic because you know right away when it isn't, when you listen back. But when you were coming up, like when you're, because your guitar playing is pretty unique as well. You know, like especially those first few records that I have.

Like it's really kind of honest and, you know, it's got a little bit of distortion to it. That was a bit funky then, you know. And then it turned into something else. It turned into a rhythm thing. You know, when I got to like River, and then when it got to see the memory like the wrong albums yeah is there's a lot of things that uh there's one particular man that i didn't want it to influence me that much who was richie havens oh really i got to know him real well and he was so gentle and so nice

and he's one of them guys that will sit down with you and show you things. Yeah. He played open tuning, right? Oh, my God. He did. He got all sorts of raga tunings. Yeah, yeah. Because you would see he'd be going, and you're like, he was only using one finger on the fretboard.

I know. What's going on with that? And his thumb. Right, and his thumb coming over the top. He showed me how you can turn this chord into that chord backwards and forwards and things and i went wow what's that all about yeah yeah and drop d and and then into different open tunings and then one with two octaves and all these different things and then for a while i thought that's nonsense yeah i can't do that. It's too much.

And then as a couple of years went by, for some reason, I didn't forget it. Yeah. You know when you like something, you remember it? Sure, sure. And you integrated it? And it got in there in my whole thing, in my head. And that ruined me. Oh, really?

That was it. Now I remember there was all sorts of tunings there. Yeah. That you worked from. And that opened you up. Yep. Opened me right up and because you're writing a song or like i say whatever you're working on something and you

think oh it doesn't work in this key yeah or it doesn't work in this tuning or it doesn't work and you move around so i have a row of guitars in different tunings and then as i'm as i'm trying to figure out where to put it yeah right is uh i'll I'll go from guitars and then I'll go, ah. Now it's a lot easier in that one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just a sing and play. So that's a whole, over the years and that, it's something you sort of develop.

Oh, yeah. It's a strange way of going about things, but. Well, it's interesting because, you know, when I talked to Keith, he just used that one open tuning. He uses that, what is it, an open G? Yeah, open G with the bottom off. Yeah, yeah. Right.

And like, there's part of you that thinks like well you will you lost a string but and how is that better but it's because there's a tone that's available that you're not going to get with a straight tuning well it's not just it's not just that it's looking at it like a banjo or a uke yeah you know it's like a lot of people that are good on ukulele or string yeah can get all sorts of inversion of chords out of it. Yeah, yeah. From, you know, from Hokey Carmichael days. Sure, sure, sure.

I mean, there's some amazing things when it was the norm. Right, right, right. And then the G tuning, which is sort of like an upside down banjo tuning, really, with the high string, right? Right. So,

pull it up on it. So he just plays backwards. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Pulls up on it. He does just plays backwards. Yeah, yeah, he pulls up on it. He does do it. I learned a lot from him, watching him, you know. I mean, I toured with him like twice. Really? Yeah.

What years? Well, God, well, like we were saying, that group I was in, and things suddenly you find yourself in the middle. Well, suddenly I get, we were playing a club in London with Peter Jay and that, and I didn't know that Mick and Keith were there. But anyway, they're looking for somebody to open up for their tour in 1965. Oh, early. And you weren't kidding.

So we got elected. I got elected on that, and then I end up, I'm on the tour. Yeah. A few days later. Yeah. And so from being on this side and loving it all so much and everything suddenly i'm right in the middle of it right but it it wasn't as musical as that people think you couldn't hear a bloody thing right oh really screaming you know because all

the the it was like the beatles to it right right oh it was pandemonium at that oh wow police and but when you go on how'd the girls were they well anything anything that moved on the other side uh-huh is screamable it was all opening up then it was all new yeah this is the beginning it was it was i'm not sure what you know i mean of course when the stones come on it was pandemonium but it's if you're talking like 65 i mean like you got to figure rock and roll really came about, what, in the late 50s. So it's only a few years old. And this is a whole new British version of it.

So they're the first. And Elvis never came to England. Right. He never played in Colonel Parker. I never could figure out what that was all about. I wonder what that's about. So anyway, what was happening in England, you had a whole series of people. Yeah.

Is he coming in? No, he ain't going to come. Right, right, right. You ain't going to right you ain't gonna get elvis right so you had a whole bunch of really good actual good singers like billy fury and marty wilde and all but and then cliff richard who was cliff richard well he's a tame version of elvis elvis is on fire yeah yeah yeah watch elvis now and you go holy shit still yeah he still puts my hair and he and just a singer, too. That's what's amazing. Yeah.

I think when it is Elvis, you can see right through that. He's just a real nice guy. Yeah, I think so. You'll never hear anybody say a bad word about him. Almost fragile in a way, somehow. Yeah, very fragile. That's what got him. Yeah.

That's what gets everybody. That's what gets you. You can't be too nice in this business. That's why Keith is still alive. It's not going to get him. Oh, no, no, no, no, everybody. That's what gets you. You can't be too nice in this business. That's why Keith is still alive. It's not going to get him. Oh, no, no, no, no, no. That ain't fragile, no. You can spell it different. It might come out.

So you were opening. You opened for them. You opened for the Stones. You opened for the Hollies. Yeah. And when did you go out on your own and make your own band and do those well a bit later

a bit that was 65 and what do you so you learned from you learned from Richie Havens but did you ever did you sit down with Keith did you ever sit down

with other guys and trade tricks or really messing around in a dressing room but there's never really much time nothing you know

Richie Havens I did I spent hours with him because he was he would sit for hours showing me things and i thought i mean you got something better to do what year was this like around late 60s yeah this was early 60s early 60s yeah this was 60s wow 66 okay yeah and he was in he was in england yeah but i remember it implicitly yeah yeah i called him because i was a real big fan of his. He said, come on over. I went,

ooh, now what am I going to do? So that must have, like, because in your brain, because like I said, there's something interesting about the records, your records, in that you know, it doesn't matter if there's a chord progression, and some of the chord progressions are a little odd and a little minor-y, right?

That's a good way of putting it. Yeah. But Richie could play one chord all the way through. Yeah. But he also could play many different things. Yeah, yeah. He just, there was him and one of his best friends is a guy, I'm not sure if he's around. I mean, I would love to think he was, called Sean Phillips.

Uh-huh. I'm not sure if he's around. I mean, I would love to think he was, called Sean Phillips. And Sean Phillips, they all came out of this whole thing of, this whole eclectic sort of musical music. It was like world music, before world music. Yeah, before world music. Right, right. You got it.

I was trying to say that. Yeah, yeah. So they all were on a plane on their own. Right, right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they were drawing from all this intellectual world music, as you say. How did you find that stuff?

Well, I would say they got, I'd listen to what they were listening to going, I've been on the wrong track here. What's going on? Really? Like what? So like the Bulgarian State Chorus, the Sofia District Choir.

So you moved from R&B. You're like, there's this other thing. No know I got more R&B yeah right yeah because you couldn't get the records easily in England right so once I started meeting people that have been to America bringing things back you know I mean then I went gung-ho and I could get the things I wanted right but the other side of me was like the choirs of Bulgaria andgaria and romania and russia and things like that which are all quarter tone eighth tone 16th tone you know it's it's very it's very it was eclectic music right yeah and i the thing is of listening like you have to really get an ear for it you have to immerse yourself into it you can't usually the cat will leave the room

right yeah right but if you if you listen to it over a period of time and start to understand some of these things you develop an ear for it right whereas it's very pleasing yeah yeah it becomes pleasure and then you you take it on in some sense. Yeah, sure. I don't know if that makes sense. No, of course it makes sense. It gets integrated into your sensibility. Then you realize when you start getting a little more educated about jazz and different things, and people like Coltrane and Miles Davis, to mention only two, or Olnett Coleman, that's right,

you listen to what, you see how all that, that's where they're coming from. Right. They're coming from. Something primal almost. Yeah. Yeah. All they, and Duke Ellington would say in interviews, he would say, they'd say, well,

you're the man of American music. Where's your influences? He said, well, I just listen to folk music. Yeah, right. Right. End of script, right? Go figure that one out right yeah because that's the that that is the template that's the template for all of it it's the template for

all of it yeah so it's it's lovely if you can open your mind up and get an ear for things yeah not necessarily the norm but you'll find most of all the people that you you know even keith or mick jack or any of the guys in this this whole rock and roll thing you when you know, even Keith or Mick Jagger or any of the guys in this whole rock and roll thing, when you get down to the bottom of what some of their influences are, they're astonishingly different than what you thought they might be. That's true. Yeah, yeah. They don't just sit around listening to blues records every day.

You know, it's not like that. No. But so, like, because I noticed, like, on some, I don't remember which album it was I think it might be The River there's a couple songs where the chord progressions

are like they're really interesting and unusual I can't remember which song I'm talking about but it must have something to do

with all that stuff going around your head well there's one at the end called Milestones which is based upon like Gregorian Chants and that whole thing

I was just telling you, the Bulgarian stuff. Not that I'm that good at it. No, but you make your own. But humbly I say. And when you were doing all this work, were you more concentrating on the singing or on the playing?

Was it like, you know? I don't like that concentrating thing. Yeah, sure. If it comes naturally. But do you sit and sing without a guitar? Yeah, I could. Sure. You know.

Yeah. A lot of people that are guitar players, singers, you know, you take the guitar away and they stand like that, you know. That's what looks a little odd, right? They never sort of, I don't know, never really bothered me. I just get silly at that point. Right. And start making silly moves and waving me hands around.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then they say, give him a guitar again. Yeah. So, all right, so you're taking all this shit in with Richie and you're opening the band. So when do you make the transition? Okay, so what happens? We do, at that time, we did that Stones tour,

which is like, I thought we were, I was couldn't say. 65. Yeah, I thought 65. I had my were, I was, could it be? 65. Yeah, I thought, 65, I had my birthday on the tour. Oh, really? That was hysterical. Yeah, what happened? Well, I don't know. I don't remember much of it, to be honest with you.

It was all just like, it just all went by. Yeah. But anyway, so we did that, and then we started doing multiple gigs on the back of that. Yeah. And then we toured with... Opening gigs. Yeah, we toured with like Jethro Tull, we toured with the Beach Boys and...

Really? Yeah, and the Small Faces, right? Well, yeah, well, that... That was great, because Steve Marriott became a great fan, you know? Right, right. Well, there's that sort of line of that, the British soul singer,

I mean, you and Marriott. Oh, we just, we met each other, right? And he says, oh, Terry, we're going to have a good time on this tour. Did you go up and sing with him? Did you guys sing together? No, no, not when they were playing. Right, but yeah, but just having a good time?

Oh, we had a lot of riot. Hell of a singer, right? Huh? Oh, unbelievable. Marriott? Yeah. But the funniest guy, them guys were just like a bunch of,

you know, I couldn't figure out where they got the name Small Faces until they walked in the first night and not one of them was over 5'4". I thought,

God, this is like the Yellow Brick Road or whatever again. What the hell's going on? Now, did you open for Fleetwood Mac? Yeah,

I did. We did a couple of gigs but Fleetwood Mac's gone through many transitions. No, but like the first one, did you have, you were with Peter? With Peter. Now, but like the first one, did you have the... You were with Peter.

With Peter. Now, what was he like, dude? He was very quiet, and he was very to himself, you know? Yeah. He was a great guitar player. Oh, my God. What a real heartbreaker. Yeah.

I know. I know. He was great, you know? Yeah. Like, you know... And John and Mick were fun, I bet. Oh, God, well, you know, Mick Fleet was... Oh, yeah.

Just a type of lunatic. Yeah, he is. He comes from the lunatic friends. Oh, God, well, you know, Mick Fleet was... Oh, yeah. Just a type of lunatic. He comes from the lunatic friends. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you opened for Cream as well? Well, that came next, you see. What happened was there was an old thing going on. We'd been touring and touring and touring. How would you say?

We're on the chart. Did you get some hits? No, we never... Most of my records weren't released. They escaped. Oh, yeah. I'm not really sure what that's about. Yeah, yeah.

That's why we're finding them now, you know. No, what happened was Eric heard about us going to, and I knew Eric from John Mayer and all that, and I knew Ginger Baker as well. Oh, what was he like? Oh, Ginger, well. Yeah, yeah. Barrel of monkeys, I tell you.

But you see, some people are how they are. You take them as they are. Sure, of course. He got it. You know, you're going to change Ginger. I wouldn't even try. It could get dangerous. Yeah.

We had mutual friends in that. Right, right. I had another band together by this time, which was just three-piece, a Hammond organ with bass in it and me on guitar singing and drums. No bass player? No, it was keyboard bass. Oh, yeah?

We wired the lower level of the Hammond into the bass player. Like the Doors? Yeah. Well, sort of, but not that different. Right, yeah. So we end up playing with the Doors a lot. You did? Yeah.

And anyway, not to get off so the next thing is Eric heard a bit and they were going to come

over and do their by this time Cream worked its way out you know I mean

they were all done they've had enough we don't talk to each other now that's it

and Eric's hanging out with George Harrison most of the time anyway so he went off and did you know eric did delaney and bonnie and he did a bunch of teas and a day mason and george

in there and it's all over the place right yeah and cream sort of was gonna they were gonna do one more was that blind faith was yeah and blind faith yeah that didn't work yeah no so uh they went off and uh they did one more tour in the States here, right? Mm-hmm. And so Eric called and said, do you want to do the tour? Yeah. I said, well, who else is on it? You know, because usually at that time, like with the Stones and things,

you have like four or five acts on. Sure. Yeah. And he said, oh, nobody. I said, what do you mean nobody? He said, well, just the three of us and the three of you. And I went, well, that's six. Okay.

I didn't mean, I mean, Emily Banz, you know, there's only six people. And they're doing stadiums, right? We did Madison Square Gardens, right? I'm saying, are you sure about this? You know, and he goes, absolutely, Terry. Yeah, come on, let's go. Next thing I i know we're on that tour wow just you and cream yes i was in creed and it's terry reed that's the name of the

band terry reed oh my god it was jesus christ and i'd heard about this manchester square garden i'd seen some good fights there yeah tv sure yeah muhammad ali yeah yeah so we end up getting there and go to sound check and things. And I go, nearly fall over backwards looking up and seeing you. Right. It's just phenomenal. The biggest room you ever played at that time. You know?

Yeah. Right. And I go, oh, Jesus Christ, this is unbelievable. Then when we walked onto the stage, they don't do that anymore. But the stage was where they had the boxing ring in the middle of the place. Right. And I walked on there, and you get this very funny feeling that you're standing, not in the shoes. You're standing right in the spot.

Yeah. You know, we're the greatest. Yeah, yeah. All these people. You get a real tingle about it. Yeah, yeah. I said to Eric, I said, was he over here or over there when he hit sunny liston he was over there he said boy do you feel that one yeah it's just love the fight is it oh yeah you know i mean

they were real fights and they weren't known for a music venue as much no yeah no not at all so it was all fights that's funny so you were in awe of the fact that Sonny Winston and Ali had it out there. You could almost get a picture and double image it, right? As long as you didn't get hit. Right, right, right. So how was those gigs? Fantastic. It was unbelievable.

Sold out? Yeah. I mean, you have to be tough. You can't be sort of a nice guy with them sort of gigs. Because people are all going, cream, cream, cream, cream. Oh, yeah. So it came halfway through one song or something. So you were fighting.

You had to fight. Actually, you've got a good point there. I got halfway through and said, now, look, stop the band. Hang on a minute. They're not even in the building. I said, they never hear of me. I said, they won't be in for another hour yet. So shut up and let me play. I said, they never, they never, they never hear of me. I said, they won't be in for another hour yet. So shut up and let me play.

I said, so it's up to you. I said, now, there's two things we do. I can either just. Yeah, you can say that. I can either split and not play, if that's bugging you too much, right? Or, and you can get a bit of peace and quiet. Or, I don't know what.

I said, the only problem is with that, that I have, is if I do that and leave, they won't pay me. Right. I said, so. Help me out here. So come on, help me out here a bit, right? And it's New York City.

Right, yeah, right. So of course everybody, Terry! Terry! So suddenly I get a standing ovation. Oh, that's great. But that's New York. If you just stick up for yourself. Look at that.

You took a couple jabs in Madison Square Garden. Hey, take it. Come on. You got it. Hey. And they listened. Well, 40,000 people or so. I forget how many it was.

Yeah. Too many to count. Right. And you got to play what? What did you do, like 45 minutes? Yeah. We did 45 minutes. It's tough, you know.

And then after that, working with Cream, we did a bunch of different gigs around the West Coast and did the Forum and we did Florida and Atlanta or something. We did Philadelphia Spectrum. We did as well. Anyway, we did a bunch of them. Then all the festivals that were going on. How was Eric, though?

Was he a good guy? Eric? Yeah. God, nobody's going to work. Yeah yeah yeah good guy it's like nothing's going on yeah i'm going how can you be so calm about all this it's pandemonium going on it might have been drugs at that time yeah yeah well it's a little relaxed don't help all of it yeah yeah can make you twitchy too. Yeah, yeah, sure. Yeah. But he was laid back. Yeah, Eric is just, they're all, you see, the thing is, I mean, I'm very, how would you say, hobbled to get to work early on, you know, as a kid. Yeah.

Working with some of these finite professionals. Yeah, sure. Did you remain friends with him? At that game, at this rock and roll game. Yeah, sure. It's not like a business job. Right. Oh job right oh yeah yeah it's a whole other job and you i'm very you know i'm very lucky to have sort of you know followed peers like you know keith and them when but it's interesting though when you talk about those guys who are singular like when when you work with them and as a guy who plays as well and obviously as a fan and a peer i mean when you watch er them and as a guy who plays as well, and obviously as a fan and a, and a peer,

I mean, when you watch Eric or you watch Keith at these different times, did you feel the, the, the, the presence of how special they were, even though you knew them? Like, hell yeah.

Yeah. Let me answer that. Yeah. It's they, they wouldn't, they wouldn't have got where they got to. Right. When I first read about them. got to when I first read about them

or we first read about them, you know, and all that. You think, well, how good could they be, right? I don't know how good they could be. I like that one. I didn't like that song or whatever. Yeah, right, right. You start being opinionated. Right.

But when you see them, you see the magic happen. Right, right. You see how the Stones, for instance, that first year was with Brian Jones in the band. Sure. Which is a totally different band than it is now it was like a rhythm band right right with him yeah he's a great rhythm player yeah and you'd stand in the wings and listen and you go what are they doing

how can they do that really do that really and hey how can they hear anything yeah keep it all together and be into they would just yeah they just anything and keep it all together and be into... They would just... Yeah. They just roll and they go on instinct and they were just phenomenal. Right. And later on, then when Mick Taylor joined, he was also... He was with John Mayer and he was a good friend of mine then.

Then when he joined, it was a whole other ball game. A whole different band. Total different theory. Those Mick Taylor records are great records. Oh, yeah. Honky Tonk and all this. Yeah, that's all Mick Taylor records are great records. Oh, yeah. Honky Tonk and all that shit. Yeah, that's all him. Yeah.

I mean, like... Oh, yeah. All the bending and all that stuff. He's phenomenal. And I love you on Get Your Ya-Ya's Out. Yeah, yeah. Holy shit. Here we go.

Get Your Ya-Ya's Out. I went on that tour in 69. You did? Yeah, I did that one. Wow. They called me up and said, Hey, Terry, we're going out again. Do you want to go?

I'm going. uh-oh. Yeah. Forty cities or something, you know. And you did all of them? All of them. Well, yeah, except Altamont. You skipped that one. Altamont, you didn't.

Keith says, are you going to Altamont? I said, well, I'm real tired, you know. Was it really just that? No. Or did you know there was going to be trouble? No, we all got winded. Keith says, I don't particularly want to go myself, but I suppose I have to.

Why? Because you heard that the angels... Oh, no, it was a mess the day, two days before. Like what? How? Oh, there was guns going off. Oh, really? Because it was a festival, right?

So was there any... Well, it was a festival with non-festive activities. The angels were going nuts. Yeah. And I'd always got on really well with the Angels. We did a lot of festivals, the Atlanta Festival. God, about five, six. So they were involved with security in a lot of places.

Bill Graham got them involved with security. Right, right. And paid them with things they had too much of. Right, right. Which they were running anyway. Right, right. And I don running anyway. Right, right. And I don't know why. It was, at first it started.

I'll tell you how it started. This is true. Is we'd fly into San Francisco. Yeah. And the freight department would take all your equipment. Right. Your amp, like that one over there. Yeah.

And that guitar. Take everything, right, and you get to the gig and half of it's missing. And you go, and you start, you gig and half of it's missing and you go and you start you know where that you're looking at people yeah what did you do with it you were cute and ain't got it yeah right you're paying them what so this started going on and bill says there's a right in a drain pipe here somewhere yeah and he goes now they'd heard rumors so we investigate the whole thing and there's a big payola thing going at the freight department they got all the numbers on fenders

and les pauls oh really ones yeah and they're selling them off shit so you lost good shit i didn't i lost a couple of amps yeah some big groups you know with the stacks and the marshals and things it was you know this cabinet they didn't take all of it because that's too suspect. Right. When the truck turns up, you're missing about four amps and all the bigger groups had a lot of backups. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it got wicked.

So Bill says, I got it. You know what we do? I'm going to get the angels down here with all the bikes and their trolleys and trucks and pick up the gear from freight and take it up to Mill Valley to move it and put it in their buildings with the bikes. Right.

To protect the ants. Well, yeah. They'd scare the freight carriers. Well, they got dogs up there that look like no ears and one leg. I mean, you're're gonna go in there and steal it out of your mind right right they got guns god knows what yeah never got one thing sold for the longest time after that i mean it all went chill right so that's why he brought him in so it started that's years before when we're doing the film or eastern film or western so by 69

things were getting out of control it It got totally out of control. What it was at that time, the Oakland Angels and that, felt a sense of meaning. Because let's look at it. A lot of them guys, God bless them, were in the war. Yep. And they never got their dudes. They never got treated how they should have been treated. They came back with a real proverbial hair, you know, wear.

Yeah. But they pissed off with the whole system. And I'll be proverbial hair, you know, wear, right? Yeah. But they're pissed off with the whole system. Yeah. I'll be honest with you, I really don't blame them. Yeah, sure. And they just got angry against society, which really screwed them.

Right. So Bill gave them a little self-meaning, which I thought was a great thing in the beginning, but all good things come to an end. Yeah, yeah. And it got ugly. It just got real bad. And Bill Graham in general, you work with him a lot? Yeah, a hell of a lot.

I did Fillmore East in New York probably 15, 20 times. No shit. And the Winterland and the Fillmore West, 10, 15. Was he a solid guy? Huh? Good guy? Yeah, he loved to shout and scream at you and accuse you for something that you might do. Yeah.

Right. No, he's just a very angry guy. But he doesn't necessarily mean it. Yeah. Five minutes later, he's just fine. Yeah. After we did the tour. Yeah.

I get a call in England. I was still in England. And at my house up there, and Mick Jagger called up and said, look, I tell you what, we've been going to all their tapes, you know, sorting out another 4,000, right?

And we found all these master 16, you know, 16 track tapes of the Madison Square Gardens gig. With you? When we did that, of me. Yeah. Do you want them? Yeah. When we did that, of me. Yeah. Do you want them?

Yeah. I said, well, for real? That's great. You know, I said, well, I'll just send them up. So he sent them up in the van. Yeah. And I still have them tapes. Oh, really?

Yeah, I never mixed them down. Well, get Light in the Attic to do those too. Well, you know, it's only a matter of money. I think it's your time, man. Terry, it's your time. Every man got his price. Yeah. Well, I tell you, you know, because like, because like you know i don't know like when i hear you and i listen to you and i in in the the extensive fucking work that you did on the road with all

these guys and all the fucking playing and all the fucking sweat and and and uh skill you put into this stuff like you can laugh i've been trying not not laughing you can swear and i haven't sworn you can swear oh yeah yeah sure't swore much yet. You can swear? Oh, fuck it, dude. Yeah, sure. Absolutely. Yeah, we're not on radio. But when I listened to this, when I got turned on to your stuff, which wasn't that long ago, I was like, holy shit, this guy is like the real guy.

And now this beautiful record that Light in the Attic is going to put out is a beautiful record, even if it's outtakes. But it got me to the river itself, to the yeah you go and it's a new it's a new experience for me because i didn't grow up with with your work and a lot of people like a lot of people in this country i know like they're like you know who is this guy yeah right and this is maybe this is it maybe this is it hi you know it all confuses me i just the point is i say, and a lot of my friends that we've talked about say, if you hang into the game, if you believe in what you do, and you love what you're doing, do it.

If you don't love it, and you don't believe in it, get the hell out of Dodge. Don't even go there, because you won't stand. It'll drive you nuts. I mean, I've still got bullshit that's called me up with boy have I got a deal for you

really oh my god you know how many bullshit there are in this business in music yeah and they're very they're very calculated

how they get you thinking that there's something really going on and I just I said look you got any money yeah and that shuts them

right up that cuts right to the bone well yeah i got money where is it it's coming you want to do all this you want to do that i'll tell you what yeah give me some money this is what's going to cost you for me to listen to it right yeah good you got to put your foot down sometimes but like when i listen to you like i hear like you know i it just it the one thing that came to me is like i i got to think like i hear like you know i it just it the one thing that came to me is like i i gotta think that paul rogers must have just listened to you constantly oh you're caught you ain't gonna like that right i know paul i know paul real well

he was in a band in newcastle free uh no before before that and uh and the funny thing are you guys there... Is he younger than you, though? Yeah, he's younger than me. Yeah, sure. Oh, yeah, yeah. He's quite a bit younger than me. I mean, he must be about, what, six, seven years younger than me.

But it feels to me that you influenced... Well, yeah, he comes from that Otis Redding thing, too, you see. Right. But he was in a... I forget the name of the group. I'm trying to rank me by... It doesn't matter. Yeah.

Anyway, he was playing up there, and we did a gig together. You did. To his band and my band and i thought look at me he can sing right yeah and i happen to be talking to a gentleman who was a very good friend of still is my called chris blackwell the manager and uh and he's you know with island records in that right and i said i saw this thing up north you know me i said i'll tell you chris he can really belt it out he's really he's gone he's the real deal yeah and i told him who he was with this band and everything else and then i know a few months go by and everything and all of a sudden the radio's on and i'm going you know what who's that yeah it sounds like i've heard

that before yeah oh it's a new group called free then when i started checking it out i found it was paul right and i went yes yeah that's it then they played around the clubs in london then i got to see him and that you know and i went back to me there you go it's good to be right about things sure you know what i mean yeah you get a real you get a real rush out of that thinking that you know yeah that it's right because it tells you that you're not totally wrong yourself right well that well there well that's the the story that that that people who like rock know about zeppelin yeah right you know like in like in when i when i read about that or when i first heard about it you know before i listened to your stuff i'm like of course that makes sense and like and then i'm like did did robert plant

listen to you first and there's that whole thing but but you know he said he said he says he did and everything else or or whether we did before or after it's not really put the point was is that when i saw them him and bottom in that band of joy and jimmy was looking for putting a band together i went that's it yeah to me it was just, that's it. Yeah. To me, it was just like, that's it. But why'd you turn it down? No, I didn't turn it down. All right. See, this is the fucking thing that pisses me off.

I don't know. I don't know. I think Jimmy had air up his ass one day. Yeah. Way after Zeppelin was famous. Yeah. And all this, you know. And I think too many people ask him,

why didn't you get Terry Reid in the band? Well, that would piss you off, wouldn't it? Sure. When you've got, you're're famous you're double platinum and you're still going on about this arsehole terry reed you know i said fuck terry reed i don't fucking hear about him anymore right you know he turned it down how about that and of course everybody loves a train crash or an accident yeah you know right and they don't like the good story so i got him the band together it was right so that's really the truth the story was you recommended i was going on tour with the stones yeah and the year right right 69 you know what i mean early 60s yeah yeah so you

think what and i said we'll call keith yeah tell him i'm not going and pay me what he's going to pay me i don't have to do that shoot you in the foot you know but all these guys respected you i mean that's for sure look well the first tour i did with the stones with the yardbirds were on it i'd known jimmy for years yeah for in 65 yeah and i'd known him like with the other thing as well yeah and uh in that band was jeff beck and jimmy page yeah yeah yeah it's crazy they go solo and they both run forward yeah but that's how it started yeah yeah double solos yeah yeah it was horrendous right right they were louder they were twice as loud as the stones were they were the only band that you could hear jeff beck is like a whole oh no he's he's iconic i

billy gibbons in here oh yeah oh he's great he's great and he said that you know they they opened for hendrix in texas yeah and he said that uh that all hendrix wanted to do he would hendrix had them deliver a stereo console to the hotel so he could sit in his room and try to figure out what the fuck jeff beck that's jimmy that's jimmy jimmy jimmy hendrix right yeah yeah jimmy's like that he would he and try to figure out what the fuck Jeff Beckham did. That's Jimmy. That's Jimmy. Jimmy Hendrix, right? Yeah. Jimmy's like that. Jimmy, I was very good friends with Jimmy.

Oh, yeah? I know this all sounds ridiculous. No, of course not. Like I said to you earlier, I was right in the middle of all this. Yeah. And I'd known Jimmy for a while, just before all bused open, you know, and took off. Yeah.

And he said to me before he came he came to england not came before he went to england i keep forgetting where i am yeah yeah so and he says you know what oh he says you know jeff beck right i went yeah i know jeff he says you know eric clapper oh yeah oh yeah you know something you know something yeah all guitar players yeah i can't wait to meet men i love this style i can't wait to play with them. I said, well, Jimmy, just slow up a minute. I said, the way you play,

I don't think it's going to be that easy. They said, what do you mean? I said, well, when they hear you play, I don't think they're going to be too happy. But you know what? That's what happened. The first night he got up, I was there.

You were there too? At the Bag of Nails, right? Or Scotchesson Bag of Nails in London. Yeah. He just got up with a group called The Gas, Billy Gas, right? And he got up and did Wild Thing. Yeah. Right.

The Trugs. Yeah, yeah. I'm going to do a little song. I know it's close to your heart by one of your favourite groups and we're all going like, right? And Chaz Chandler had invited everybody. all going like and Chaz Chandler had invited everybody it was like Chaz Chandler from the animals yeah well he managed

him oh okay so what happened was he'd invited Paul McCartney invited Brian Jones Richard Thompson said he was there yeah there you go he invited everybody right and I used to hang out there with me and Peter Jay we'd go and have a few drinks yeah so we'd be there most of the time most of the time we'd go and have a few drinks there. So we'd be there most of the time.

Most of the time, we'd go there because it was empty. Yeah. Well, there's one night we walked in, going, what the hell is going on? Every musician in London was there. Yeah, we knew everybody, right? What, Townsend was there probably? Yeah, Townsend, oh, everybody.

Jeff Begg, Jimmy Page, everybody. Really? Right. So halfway through, he did Wild Thing, and he said, this is a lovely thing, your favorite group, Wild Thing. Yeah. Everybody went, yeah. Wild Thing?

Are you nuts? Yeah. Because everybody in England, the Trunks are nice guys, don't get me wrong. It was the group you love to hate. Right, right, right. You know, everybody does that, you know. Was Jimmy taking the piss, or was he doing it for you? No, well, you heard him do it yeah i

mean he took it a whole lot he took it to a planet and what happened were people well brian jones comes running back to me and peter j at the table because brian jones does yeah right so and he's hysterical yeah and he's very funny guy yeah so he comes running back he goes oh you can't believe what it's like in the front and i said what why he says oh the water it's flooded in the front i said why what do you mean he says oh the guitar player's crying it's terrible i thought he was just i said what are you going on about right some of them got i won't mention who got up and left no shit yeah it pissed them right off really well they had it all right there in their fingertips right and they were on that whole rock

guitar right blues right second generation right now this brother turns up yeah and just rips up i mean turns it inside out i still haven't heard anybody do what he does. Yeah. I watch him now on TV, I'll tell him, well, come on, I'll go,

you know, you go through and, and it'll be like, we did, I did the, the Georgia, Georgia Festival, you know,

Atlanta Pop Festival, 360,000 people. Yeah. And that one, he had the night and, and everything, right? And I remember that.

And I, it was on, and I, and at first I can't remember, well, which gig was that? Because we did a lot of them, right? With him? Yeah, right. Oh, I did a lot. I did Yale University with him, right?

Yeah, yeah. All sorts of gigs. And he pulled me in on things and that. It would be great. We were good friends. He's something else, and I'd be watching it, and then I'd see myself in the wings. I go, oh, I know that gig.

I remember it now. I usually go by what somebody wears. You remember what somebody wears. Well, you know what's interesting is that like, you know, in talking to you about it, like one of the things you forget about these guys who are long gone and, you know, mythic figures. Yeah, I know. Is that you guys were out there doing the job. I mean,

like gig after gig after gig. Oh, hell yeah. Oh man. It never stopped. Right. Years. Yeah.

Yeah. And it's just like, you forget that that like, it's not just the records. It's not just the idea of the guy. You guys were out there working. Oh, hell.

Well, it's, it's the only, I always say, even now, the only peace and quiet I ever get is when we get on stage. That's the only peace and quiet. That's the only peace I ever get is on stage.

Because it's all the traveling and this and the bullshit. Yeah. And the monitor guy who you want to kill. Yeah. Because he hasn't got a clue. Well, I went to engineering school. Yeah. It was a waste of fucking money.

I can't hear myself. Yeah. That was a waste of money. You shouldn't have gone there. Oh, you're making a record. I see. And we a waste of fucking money. I can't hear myself. Yeah. That was a waste of money. You shouldn't have gone there. Oh, you're making a record. I see. And we're doing a live gig. It's wonderful.

Wonderful. Oh, my God. And it still goes on. I like that idea, though, that the only piece you get is when you get on stage because that's your time. I swear.

It is because you go... It's your space. You go, are we ready now? Yeah. Okay. Okay, everybody. Here we go.

Right. And then once you're in, they're screwed then. They can't do it. They can't go with now? Yeah. Okay. Okay, everybody. Here we go. Right. And then once you're in, they're screwed then. They can't do it. They can't go with it, right? Yeah. So you and Jimmy spent a lot of time together. Oh, yeah.

He used to come and hang out at my house, you know, when it got too busy over at his. Yeah. Right? Yeah. He's such a nice guy. Sweet guy. He could never tell people to leave. Oh, really? No.

Yeah. He'd just leave his health. He'd leave his own house. He'd leave his own house of course somebody got back they drunk everything yeah yeah but whatever he didn't care you know he didn't care so let's talk about these um with a what where did you like because these you did those four or five records early on right and they're great records they're beautiful records they're they're unique records and then're beautiful records. They're unique records. And then sort of, you know, what happens? Like, how did you sort of sustain yourself, you know,

after you just, you know, stopped making solo records? Well, it's funny how things go. Yeah. You had a lot of things happen. I won't say the industry. I made some records I really enjoyed making. Like River, I really enjoyed making. That's a beautiful record. I really enjoyed making Seed of Memory

because I was working with Graham, my friend. He said, let's make a record. And I went, what do you mean? He says, us. Yeah. Okay, you see? His eye was in shock, right? And he says, yeah, yeah, leave it to me.

We'll put it together. It's a different type of record it's a different production sound wasn't it yeah oh totally different totally different you know so but the songs I'd written

I'd played him these songs and he loved them and that's the way they sounded really when I played them to him and he helped me out get you know Ben Keith

and Al Perkins oh and you worked with David Lindley on the River that was another band we had in England, you see. He's a wizard, man. This album that's coming out now.

He's on that, yeah. Well, he was all over River. Yeah. And half of the album was done in England. And then the whole band broke up. David went with Jackson, right? Because Dr. Myers went number one. And we're on Atlantic, so you can't really argue. And Armin Ertegun was really good about it, right? Because Dr. Myers went number one. And we're on Atlantic,

so you can't really argue. And Armin Ertegun was really good about it, right? And then Alan White, right, joined Yes. Yeah. With Eddie Offord, who was producing the album. So I went to Armin and said,

well, we not only lost two members out of a four-piece group, the producer, I mean, he says, oh, don't worry about it. He said, tell you what, lost two members of a four-piece group yeah the producer ain't here i mean what do you mean he says oh don't worry about it tell you what you like you like california right i said i love you said well go you look i'll set it up for you i'll give you i'll find you a place to get on a plane and get out here he said it's miserable over there yeah i went you know what he's got a really good point it's pouring over it's freezing right yeah so it was just me and lee miles the bass player who would put that group together at the time but we fought for like

two years to get it just how we wanted it right and uh we suddenly went oh okay so lee came over first came over yeah and then i said i'm out of here but i packed a bag and boom i'd gone i never went back to Britain you never went back no no I've never lived in Britain since that you know

because Ahmed Erdogan told you to come well to me he was just amazing he was the god of the

business you ask anybody sure mine necessarily appeared you'll never see the likes of that kind

of musical businessman i just don't and he was nice to be around oh he's a riot he's a fun funnest guy ever he called you up come and have lunch with me at the beverly hills yeah i'm going i don't think i'm dressed for it don't worry about that come on just come in come in your shorts don't worry i got the bungalow they don't worry about us like I get there, he's in a smoke. He loved rock guys, huh? All day long, he'd sit there talking. Not necessarily about what you're doing.

He'd talk about music, ask your opinion on some act or something or this or that. Yeah. He's just like one of the band, you know? Yeah, yeah. And did he, like, you know, after, because you worked with a lot of other people too yeah after the the solo stuff right yeah and now i'm working on this whole thing with uh stick with joe perry yeah which is fantastic you know because now from doing ballads and very sensitive things and stuff yeah yeah joe plays me this track that's just slamming to the wall and so we wrote a song on it and then we do another one that's like almost Turkish.

And you're singing? You're the front man? Yeah, yeah. I'm singing it. Yeah. That's great. And writing the lyrics and everything with him. You know, so it's great.

And what's it like to listen to like, you know, this remastered River Outtakes? I mean, what's it like? Oh, it's great. It's like memory lane. Yeah. All I see is 10 brazilians in my house up in the countryside all playing primitive instruments and and a guy who lived in the village yeah go on his bicycle every morning to work yeah he come riding by my 400

year old cottage and he come riding by about seven in the morning and they're all still going yeah yeah it's like i've got a tribe of wild indians from bahia in my house just going huh yeah it started getting around like what's going on over what's he doing now you know yeah yeah and um what what's uh what's the deep purple story if we're gonna do deep purple yeah that wasn't it wasn't my thing i've known richie blackmore for years and years it was just not my my brand paper you know i mean it's hey to those around you know yeah and i said look richie thanks so much i'm very flattered by it yeah and the other singer remember like who left you know and uh i understand i get that i get the gist yeah yeah but let's say that happens to you'll find if you you'll

interview a lot of singers yeah a lot of people at that time in England we call it the dartboard theory yeah everybody was changing bands around yeah and getting to see to get the winning combination yeah yeah yeah yeah and knowing that English rock and roll bands had sort of made a very distinctive impression in America, like the hard metal bands, which became metal. Like Sabbath. It was hard rock and Sabbath. They'd sort of made the mold on that, right?

Yeah, yeah. So they go, quick, quick, quick, let's get it together before somebody over there does it. Now, it's like every metal or whatever. Sure, yeah, yeah. I find it. Now, it's like every metal or whatever. Sure. Yeah, yeah. I find it interesting because now these days, now I've stuck around long enough to watch the young lads and what they do when they put the band together.

Now you've got mileage laws. You can only play here but not for a couple of months in the same area. Right, in terms of touring. New York is like three months. I deal with that all the time. So I can't wait until what happens. The young the young guys go well we'll have this band and we'll call it that yeah then we'll swap a couple of members get another name and call it this then we go well i went ah you crafty buggers i see what you're doing well in my they're all going around well

is it the same will you no it's not the same band it's the same bloody band but two people right so that's how they get around yeah you know but also it's the thing that they're all same thing as i say with the bands back then they also are trying to find a winning combination yeah but who's you know i don't i don't know with that i think one of the best things to do, all the young bands out there, find a bunch of guys that you hate. Yeah. And then make a band, shut the fuck up,

go on stage and play, and the cohesion will get you there. Every successful band I've ever known hate each other's guts. I swear to you, you ask them, they all end up trying to kill each other. Really?

Yeah. Like the who? Oh, bloody hell. Well, he nearly pulled it off a few. Ask Roger. There's a few times he was worried about his own life. With Mooney around, you never knew he was going to blow up. Right, right.

How was that? That guy must have been a... Oh, no, he's dangerous. Yeah. He's a lovely guy. I i know we go out and do things there's hundreds of stories about moon and yeah i'm i'm i'm i've under think i want to write a book because the only way you could do this is yeah the only thing long enough is a book that you can tell stories in why don't you write a book i want to yeah i want to i just got to get somebody who's stupid like me that will listen they understand my wonderful guys they'll do that of course there are i know more idiots than you could imagine yeah i read keith's book keith's books like the bible it's like 500 pages you know

what i mean well once he starts telling stories he's got way more than a whole ever i've you know but i couldn't believe it you know because with that book like you know i grew up loving keith and like you have these assumptions like oh he's just this oh like he's some junkie and then you read that book like oh no he's as quick as a whip oh my god he's bright he's got ideas about you don't live that you don't live that long right without going around the corner that's right that's right so you want to play a song yeah sure so with that okay so the story on the on the new record is all the masters were at warner brothers yeah and whose idea was it now all what happened was i get a call yeah from matt block for warner brothers and he'd been set a task uh to go and get all the masters because Warner Brothers bought EMI.

And it's like Raiders of the Lost Ark right now. I mean, they've got so much stuff. I mean, God bless them. I don't know how they're going to get through it. Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's Jesus. So there's a guy there now just going through shit? I don't know.

Because they sent Matt, who's in Chicago, over there to go through all the stuff that they got. It had all gone back to a locker over there. I'm not sure exactly where. But it's all now Warner Brothers, so it all went to a Warner Brothers-led locker somewhere. So he says, so I went, okay, fine. He gets on a plane, goes over,

and he goes in this big locker, and he looks up at this one shelf, and it said Terry Reid on the third shelf, you know, above the Ark of the Covenant. That's on the other shelf. Yeah, yeah. So I meant that respectfully. Yeah, yeah, sure.

So he looks up, and he goes, and he said, what's, and he said, and he's like, Terry, Terry, Terry, Terry, this whole row right across the whole room of endless two-inch masters, you know, tapes. Yeah. And then a whole bunch with them of half-inch, you know, master mixes. Yeah.

And he's going, oh oh i've got me work here what the hell so he pulls he starts pulling them down looking for the the albums that were going to be on this four box set that they pressed out a four box set right a four album boxer and uh so he found them and as he's looking through he's going what is this right there's another master and another and another and another mixes so he thought you know while i'm at it i think i'll i think i'll go and play a couple of these and see what's on them you know you never know right and he said it went on and on and on and he found 24 pieces of material that he says, I was going, bopping away and groovy going,

this Terry, what happened to this? Right. Yeah. And, uh, so he called me up and said, I put them on a CD.

I'm going to fly out to California. Have you heard them? I went, well, I did what I did them, but that's a long while ago. What are these? Well,

a lot of them were just box titles because we didn't use them, so we never got that far. So he came out and played them, and within a couple of coughs or a breath, into the beginning, I'd go, oh, I know what this is. And it all comes rushing back to you. So ironically enough, he said, well, I tell you what, I think you should put it out as an album. back to you yeah so ironically enough he said well i tell you what i would you know i think you should put it out as an album so we got together and worked it out with light in the

attic in the end right yeah and uh voila so now it's coming out and they're all outtakes this is just outtakes from the river yeah these outtakes from see the memory but not as many not it was a lot more concise working with graham let's stick the cans on let's see if we can make this sound right Is it my maker? Am I the breaker? Has it come too soon? Am I to follow when life gets hallowed by some impending doom? It makes me ache right now

that the love of a life gets lost somehow and his colors fade in the rain he goes down to the river again and wants to see

an opening to the sea Oh yeah A star that shatters In a part that you won't be Unto a river Oh yeah We won't be unto a river Some have been troubled with life at their double Part of being you Part of being you Some say it's hazy

Or just get lazy Some don't know what to do But it makes me ache somehow It's a pattern of life That is a loving vow That only man has power To ordain Every soul that comes in

From the rain And wants to see Find someone Open up a telly Wildest dream To that one That's it Oh, before

That wild Death gets it Through the floor Of a pond, of a river, takes your soul and rolls off it with a never finding it, never really returning to start, find that heart you're really yearning for What you want to dream Seems that your life's a scheme Though you decide no more

I can see the floor even Don't even seem to ever be a part of what can be Or be in a river What's your sin away? Take it day by day Take it anyway Whatever you may You'll see it in a river

that was beautiful man thank you so much for doing it. Oh, no, it's my pleasure. Real honor to talk to you. Oh, no. Good luck with it, man. Yeah. That was exciting.

A master, a great rock and tour, a great musician, a great singer, great life he's living. And I love that I did not sense any darkness or bitterness and I'm telling you even when he was having a smoke out there I got a Mark Boland story I mean I guess it could have went on for a while but maybe I'll have him back Terry Reed guitar solo guitar solo Boomer Lives

It's hockey season, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So, no, you can't get an ice rink on Uber Eats. But iced tea, ice cream, or just plain old ice? Yes, we deliver those. Goal tenders, no. But chicken tenders, yes. Because those are groceries, and we deliver those too.

Along with your favorite restaurant food, alcohol, and other everyday essentials. no but chicken tenders yes because those are groceries and we deliver those too along with your favorite restaurant food alcohol and other everyday essentials order uber eats now for alcohol you must be legal drinking age please enjoy responsibly product availability varies by region see app for details hi it's terry o'reilly host of under the influence recently we created an episode on cannabis marketing with With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talked to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category,

and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative.