WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 718 - Deon Cole / Dweezil Zappa

Episode Date: June 23, 2016

Deon Cole didn't think he would become a comedian when he was growing up on the South Side of Chicago. But now with a new comedy special, acting roles on two hit TV shows and continued success on Conan, Deon tells Marc how it all went down. Also, Dweezil Zappa returns to discuss the struggle he's up against as he heads out on a new tour. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Death is in our air. This year's most anticipated series, FX's Shogun, only on Disney+. We live and we die. We control nothing beyond that. An epic saga based on the global best-selling novel by James Clavel. To show your true heart is to risk your life.

When I die here, you'll never leave Japan alive. FX's Shogun, a new original series streaming February 27th exclusively on Disney+. 18 plus subscription required. T's and C's apply. You can get anything you need with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs and mozzarella balls, yes, we can deliver that. Uber Eats. Get almost, almost anything. Order now. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Lock the gate!

Alright, let's do this. How are you, what the fuckers? What the fuck buddies? What the fuckineers? What the fucksters? What the fuckadelics? What is happening? I'm Mark Maron. This is my podcast, WTF. Thank you. Thank you for joining me.

Exciting show. They're always exciting. I swear to God, people ask me, you know, which one do you like the best? I don't know. Every time I come into this garage with somebody who is 90% of the time a complete stranger to me in real life, I may know their work. I may be familiar, but I don't know what's going to happen. And it's always exciting. Every time I come in here with a guest, it's like an exciting ride of some kind but today on today's show for instance like dion cole is here the comedian

and writer who i who i met many times but for whatever reason didn't quite register properly and also gonna do a little follow-up interview with uh with mr dweez Zappa, there's some issues at hand between him, his work, his father's music, and the Zappa family trust that is now being overseen by his brother Ahmet. It's an emotional situation. It's a difficult situation. And Jweezle wanted to talk a bit, so that's going to happen. And thank you for all the feedback on the Neil Young episode. I'm fucking thrilled that everybody, including hardcore Neil Young fans,

were so into it. I was nervous about it. I didn't quite, I don't know if I expressed how nervous, because I tried to not diminish or overrun anybody's uh experience with my own dumb emotional expectations but uh i was thrilled that the feedback was so positive and you all enjoyed that conversation because i i sure did i i mean i i really am grateful and i'm one of the luckiest people in the world that that i have like the amazing Neil Young come over to my house, walk through my house, look at my dirty cat box. I try to keep it clean, but sometimes they sneak a shit in there.

Walk past my laundry, which is where the washer and dryer is, out the back door, down the shitty steps, into the barn doors of this place. into the barn doors of this place this now what i believe is a magical place a magical space this fucking garage and sit down with me and and and watch me and feel me try to uh engage in a nice conversation that's what happens here so look look, folks, I want to preface this a little bit. You know, Dweezil Zappa, it's been pretty public. You can sort of look it up in the New York Times coverage of what's been happening with him, his music, his father's music, a sort of protracted legal battle with the family estate, the Zappa Family Trust, which is overseen by his brother. You can catch up on the legalese of all that, but I had a sort of an emotional talk here with Jweazle and the latest development in this horrible situation that's pitting family against family brothers against brothers.

The latest development is that Jweezle can't use the name Zappa play Zappa for his tour. He can't use Jweezle Zappa plays Frank Zappa either. This is the new revelation. So he's changed it to Jweezle Zappa plays whatever the fuck he wants. The cease and Desist Tour. So you can go to DweezilZappaWorld.com for tour info. And this is, Dweezil Zappa is the only Zappa offspring that is the legacy of his father's music in the truest sense of the word.

sense of the word as a guitar virtuoso and as somebody who has spent his life mastering and continuing to try to master and put out into the world the music of frank zappa he's the guy he's the one with the talent and he's the one being being pressed bothers me he's also he also hooked me up with his doc eat that question frank zappa in his own words comes out tomorrow okay uh we talk a little bit about it and i saw it and if you can't wrap your brain around what is frank zappa this is a great montage of actual interview footage that spans probably about 30 or 40 years of frank talking to other people about Frank, about politics, about art, about music. And it's pretty it's pretty fucking great. Frank Zappa is a real American genius.

And now I'm going to talk to his son, Dweezil, an amazing guitar. It's winter and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost almost anything. So, no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs, mozzarella balls, and arancini balls? Yes, we deliver those. Moose? No. But moose head? Yes.

Because that's alcohol, and we deliver that too. Along with your favorite restaurant food, groceries, and other everyday essentials. Order Uber Eats now. For alcohol, you must be legal drinking age. Please enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by region. See app for details. Death is in our air.

This year's most anticipated series, FX's Shogun, only on Disney+. We live and we die. We control nothing beyond that. An epic saga based on the global best-selling novel by james clavel to show your true heart is to risk your life when i die here you'll never leave japan alive fx's shogun a new original series streaming february 27th exclusively on disney plus 18 plus subscription required t's and c's apply player Description required. T's and C's apply. Player.

So, Dweezil, you're back, and I know last time that after we talked, we didn't talk about family matters, but now family matters have become public, and I don't have some sort of perverse fascination i feel like there's some sort of tremendous injustice being done here uh you know here's the deal i mean uh there's no reason for for me to be talking about this stuff in public other than the fact that we're getting nowhere in private yeah with lawyers and all this kind of stuff. And then it became public with the public letter that Ahmet wrote. After the New York Times article that basically, like, what are some of the issues? All right.

So let's sort of set this up so anyone who's listening can kind of follow. Because it's complicated. Yeah, it is. Your mom passed away. Well, let's go back even before that. All right. I started a decade ago playing my father's music because I'm a huge fan of the music and I wanted his music to be heard by new generations. Yeah.

Also the core fans that have been excited about it and supported it all these years. So I was working under the name Zappa play zappa right now zappa play zappa got trademarked by gail zappa who owns the family uh zappa family trust your mother yes my mother uh so she apparently did this under the pretense that anyone with the last name Zappa could, if they wanted to, go out on tour and be Zappa plays Zappa. Right. As long as they paid her. Well, there's that. We can get to that. But the whole thing about that is nobody else in my family really plays an instrument or could perform a complete show in any way under that moniker. So that aside, there was a contract that was created by my mother that required me to pay $1,000 a show every time I played the music of Frank Zappa.

show every time i played uh the music right frank zappa and i was supposed to at a certain point get some of that money rebated back to me uh i don't know why the contract was written that way but she i think tried to write it that way in in the the sense that if she was going to try to charge anybody else thousands of dollars to play the music, she should show that. She's charging her own son. Exactly. And so at the same time, there was a merch, you know, t-shirt merch agreement where she took the lion's share, 60%. And I was to get 40%. Of your shirts.

Of Zappa Plays Zappa. Any shirts that were being sold at the... But even if they weren't like Frank shirts, if they were like your, like Dweezil shirts, she'd get a piece of that because of the name. Exactly. She was just taking the lion's share. Did she get along with your mother?

Well, you can see that it was difficult to get along with her. I mean, she was... I mean, it's like the word solipsism is, you know, something that comes to mind because she lived in this world where it just seemed to be everything about her and only her thoughts and the way that she just didn't seem to care about what anybody else thought about things but but after frank passed you know the way she handled the estate which i imagine went all directly to her well it gets even more complicated but let's get into that part in one second so we'll finish off the off the contract part of it was for 10 years, she didn't uphold her end of this contract. And so at a certain point when I was paying this money, I was getting nothing rebated and I wasn't getting my share of the merch at all. You paid the money to the estate.

Yeah. Okay. That was your responsibility. Right. And she would have taken you to court if you didn't right and the whole thing is after 10 years people say well then why didn't you take her to court uh who wants to take their own mother to court right you know it's it's just not something that i i really wanted to do but uh i certainly was on her case uh every year about hey you haven't accounted to me ever for the merch and

this really isn't okay this this is an injustice as you said i've given them an option of how they can make things right which would be to uh give me all the guitars that gail has repossessed you know i was given frank's guitars and then she repossessed them legally she repossessed them according to her i just don't after a certain point you know how does and this is a psychological issue an emotional issue you know where does she feel in what how are you just an extension of of your father's brand and how did she feel entitled to deny you a livelihood when you're out there doing the work in her mind she wasn't probably doing any of that in her mind she thought she was protecting frank and the brand and all of this stuff but uh if you just really look at what she was doing on a grand

scale across the board uh she ran it into the ground yeah well she sold the publishing to all the music and then tried to get them back. Well, she didn't sell the publishing. What happened is, you know, we have so many avenues to explore, you know, the madness behind the Zappa Family Trust. But if you are the type of individual who has some free time and wants to learn about some of this stuff, one thing you could do is you could go to courtlisten.com, which has the RICO disc versus the Zappa Family Trust legal. It has all the information about the judgment and what happened in the case. Now, here's the thing. I just went there myself and I was horrified to find out the information that was on there. I mean, it's sad and it makes me so upset and angry

to see. She had told us, my mother, Gail, had told the family and so many others that Frank had, uh that frank had uh i'm getting upset about this but she she had told us all that frank had withheld the digital rights uh meaning that when recodisc was to distribute his catalog that he withheld any kind of rights for downloading or whatever the new digital thing because at the time uh itunes and all that stuff wasn't in business yet. Right. So she said, yes, you know, Frank had the foresight to do this and they can't put this up on iTunes.

So of course, when RykoDisc put it up on iTunes, there was this big lawsuit and it lasted for almost 20 years uh and so the thing was if you go to courtlisten.com you can see the judgment and you can see the language in the the contract and it is so incredibly specific that it it it was clear that the that ricICO Disc did have the digital rights the entire time. And here's the thing. Frank actually had a will, and it had a very different outcome in terms of who was to do what.

But that will was, according to our mother, here's the thing. When Frank died, we didn't really know anything about what the procedure is. Nobody came to us and said, okay, here's what you need to know about probate. Here's what you need to know about this, that, or the other. None of that was told to us

because we were told there was no will. Yeah. By your mother. Yes. But she hid this thing and it was sitting there for 20 plus years only to be discovered recently it was discovered yes and and and it had a very different set of of guidelines for how the zft was to go but

see uh the the thing about that i'm not i'm not here talking about oh you know I I didn't get justice on on the will or anything like that it's you know it's frustrating to learn these things that you go through your life and you you're told information by your mother and you expect it to be accurate information only to find that it's just not and I mean there's so many other avenues where this this took place like we were told for years that um frank didn't want to have anything to do with his own family like his brothers and sister and yeah and all that stuff so there was no connection for us with that side of the family at all i I recently met Frank's brother Bobby after not seeing him

for 35 years. Yeah. And he told me a very different story about how he could never get in touch with Frank, you know, because Frank didn't really ever answer the phone. Gail answered the phone. Right. So, he, even when Frank was really ill the week before he died, Bobby came to Los Angeles and he wasn't able to come and see him. And it's just upsetting to me because I didn't know any of this stuff. I mean, had I known, you know, I would have said something.

I would have done something. Yeah, yeah. But, you know, the thing about it is the stories I've heard from him are, you know, it's great to actually see him. And it's like because he's close in age to Frank and he's related to Frank, it's like almost sitting with Frank now. Yeah. You know, you can see him and it's just upsetting that he didn't get to be in touch with him. But he wrote a great book, which I read, called Growing Up Zappa, and it's got pictures of him and Frank. Did your mom try to stop that book? I don't think she had the chance.

It was cathartic for me to read you know, read some of that stuff. But it was nice to, you know, reconnect with him. And it's just, you know. So, but where do you put this? Like, when you contextualize this whole thing, are you able, do you just see your Gail is mentally ill? You know, I mean, I try to look at it as I grew up with really a great childhood. I was not exposed to any kind of stuff that had conflict or any of this kind of behavior that I'm now experiencing. behavior that I'm now experiencing. It was only after Frank passed away that things started to disintegrate within my relationship with my mom, but also within the family itself.

But, you know, it's interesting because some people have written some things that I didn't really know anything about, but I've seen it, especially from people in Italy, which is particularly interesting. They liken the behavior that they have seen in this and what they have gathered from the information about what Gail has done over the years, what my mother has done over the years. And they say, oh, it's just like the Medea complex. I don't know if you know the Medea complex. I don't know it specifically know the Medea complex. I don't know what specifically. It's Greek mythology. It's a character who was scorned by her husband. And because of this deep-seated, deep-rooted pain and suffering that she experienced,

she decided to kill their children as a way to get back to the right the person who scorned her so it's all out of spite against frank well because there's you know when i read that and i think well you know some of that just feels like uh maybe there's a parallel in some way because there was times where uh for example you know i would be asking her i said we need to get some tour dates up on the zappa.com site and it's been weeks and weeks and weeks and we've been asking can we just get these tour dates up there and and she just would change the subject and say to me i'm not just some some groupie your father fucked you know and i'd be like uh what does that have to do with the tour dates you know right so yeah so she had all this fucking

like resentment and hate yeah i just you know at times like that i I was really confused because I'm like, what is the reason behind the delays and all of the obstacles that are created for things? It's not just things that were happening for me. She blocked anybody that really had any interest in Frank's music so frequently. There's so many people in the world that like Frank's music, that would like to play it, and she just wouldn't allow it. So for me, I would have done it differently. So what kind of outcome can we hope to get from this?

At the end of the day, people who like Frank's music are probably concerned well what does this have as an effect on on us how will it affect the music that comes out what we get to hear what we get to see all that stuff and i don't know what the answer is to that i i just know that um uh there are several things that are going on that that are not consistent in the way that Frank would have done things as far as integrity goes. lifetime maintaining integrity living his own sort of personal universe and life you know with with full commitment full creative uh genius and and now like the whole thing has become you know fragmented and and and sullied well you know in in a way the music will in my opinion will never be sullied because it stands on its own.

It does what it set out to do. But the other stuff can confuse people or turn people off if they're like, oh, I don't want to hear about this. Because a lot of people have this idea that, oh, this is trust fund kids that are golden spoon. Do they? Yeah, I think they do. But there is no trust. There is like, there's something called the Zap-Up family trust, but there's no money in it.

But I think most people look at you as a brilliant guitar player that, you know, has done great work in your own career. And I don't really know how, you know, what the public profile, like certainly Moon is remembered and also does her creative work. But yeah, I didn't really sort of, that characterization never struck me. I've seen it before with comments from people that they just think, oh, it's rich kids fighting. Who gives a shit? Let me have the music, you know?

It's not so easy easy it turns out well yeah but yeah that that and you know uh look i i work hard to do what i do my wife is a flight attendant we keep that you know she keeps her job so we have health insurance you know this is you know i'm not i'm not running a lucrative operation here that you're not getting any of your merch money yeah i mean my mom made more money sitting at You know, this is, you know, I'm not running a lucrative operation here. You're not getting any of your merch money. Yeah. I mean, my mom made more money sitting at home than I did going all over the world playing the music. And it's one thing to travel and do all that stuff. But I have all of the expenses of travel, airfare, buses, band salary, all that stuff. I'm paying all those expenses and getting nothing from the merch

right you know the trust doesn't cover any of that no never has so what would you like to happen well basically what what is going on is uh you know i i have a way to to move forward and and continue playing the music that my father wrote that I love and I want other people to know about. And I simply just had to change the name from Zappa Plays Zappa. So I will be going on tour and playing that music and hopefully the name change doesn't affect people's interest level. doesn't affect people's interest level and hopefully all of this stuff that's in the media doesn't change people's desire to want to hear this music and support what Frank created.

But I mean, that's really all that I can do is I just change the name and keep doing what I do. But the funny part of it is that because they don't own this name of this tour they can't make any demands on the merch so they don't get to sell any merch right you know so so it's kind of like cutting off their nose despite their face uh with the way that they handled the whole thing because i could have gone on playing as zappa plays that but we could have made an appropriate merch deal and it could have just been fine yeah but uh it's just not working that way now i've changed the name and i'm going on

guy yeah and how many guitars are there well uh it's hard to know because some of them disappeared over the last few years i know of two that that uh that used to be there that aren't there uh there was a stratocaster that um had a gold floyd rose tremolo system on it and it had the parametric eq stuff that frank was using for several years in his guitars and that guitar went missing um a couple years ago uh and also a telecaster that was a butterscotch colored one that he had custom made from performance guitar and that went missing and i told gail about those. Those don't exist. Like, where are they?

Someone's got them. Somebody has them. I don't know. Gail was allowing people to record in the studio and use Frank's guitars. And someone would just walk with them. Probably. God damn.

Someone knows where those are. But other than that, there's probably about 12 or 13. On the subject of the guitars, when Frank passed, everybody was given some items. I was given the guitars. And then about four or five years later, Gail, my mom, decided that they were hers again. Because they were being stored at the house in the studio where she was living. She just said, they're mine, you know. Yeah.

Upon her death, she decided to give three of them of her choice back to me, but without the cases. Why that caveat? i don't know and i even asked i said well at least with these guitars you know surely you could uh throw in the cases because it's just silly you know the cases are not anywhere near as valuable as the guitars what is the point of not having a case and and uh it was still like nope this is how gail wants it uh oh my god and wasn't there sort of like you better come over and get him now well yeah and i i haven't actually taken possession of those guitars yet because i haven't had i've been touring and and all this stuff i haven't had a chance to go up there

do you not is it too emotional too i mean it it's gotta be fucking heavy to go back up there. Well, I don't even think they're at the house anymore. I think they've been moved to a new location, but, uh, just to see the house. Yeah. Don't you, don't you want to go up there before it goes? No. You know, I mean, the thing is, uh, uh, we, we were told, Hey, put a tag on anything that you're interested in, you know, and I just decided because of this mess, I was like, you know, I'll just keep the good memories that I have. I'm not going to, you know, worry about just random things that are in the house. Although I would like the note that Frank wrote to me that Gail kept.

You know, Frank, you know, my dad wrote a note. He wrote them to everybody. But she kept mine. And I don't know where it is. I never got to have this. On his deathbed, you mean? Yeah. And you never saw it?

I saw it once, but she just kept it. what did it say it just basically said i love you but i didn't get it back i'm sorry buddy i'm sorry you're going through this i really am it's messed up it is um well i hope I hope you get some closure on this stuff, and I hope it doesn't fuck your heart up for the rest of your life. I appreciate it. You know, none of it has to happen the way that it's happening. And at the end of the day, it's like, you know, it's about music. I mean, you know, Frank made great music.

He was an incredible person. Yeah. And why does this stuff have to happen over just dumb stuff, you know? Yeah. I mean, I don't get it. I don't get it. And I certainly don't want to be continuing down a path that alienates people against Frank's music or against the family or anything like that.

Well, I mean, I do believe that with your passion and your respect and your loyalty to the legacy of the music itself, that this will be a time where i think people will will come out more to understand you know because it's such a specific thing frank and and and it's a it's a universe that you know people can enter and spend their life in and and i think that that that they should know that that it's always been a very specific thing for very special people yeah and i and i think that you know what you're doing is is what you were you know destined and supposed to do and i'm just happy that you you still have found a way

to have the freedom to do that well i appreciate it and i appreciate the people that support the music and and uh what we do but uh you But there's definitely going to continue to be things out there for them to enjoy, including that film Eat That Question, which you definitely should see it. It really is. It's kind of like we talked before about gateway records and things in Frank's career. This is a gateway film.

Into Frank. Yeah. There's some really cool rare footage that hasn't been seen of shows performances in the early early days you know great where you see him when he's like 27 years old you know doing way out there shit yeah there's some definitely crazy stuff you know he tells a story about um being in berlin and having um parts of the audience that were as he called them fascists who were they asked him to be part of something where he was asked to help burn something down and he refused so they started creating a problem at the show and frank discusses how he just turned the volume up and created these

waves of terrifying cluster chords that would drive the audience back. But the audience that came to the show thought, oh, this is just what Frank Zappa does. So it's interesting to hear him talk about it. And they have some footage that's not specifically from that exact thing that he describes, but it's cool footage nonetheless of the show in Berlin. Well, it's great.

I'm excited to see it. And I feel, you know, that the music, you know, will obviously and certainly transcend all this shit. I know it already has, you know. And I know that all of this stuff, even in my own life, it will all just be transcended.

You know, I'm the kind of person that is just, you know, I can't worry about the past or the future. I just stay in the moment as best as possible. So, you know, I'm just going to learn some songs, go on tour, you know, have a great time living in that music while I'm on stage. And I hope that people will come and enjoy it. And when's the tour start? First show is July 1st. Where? Taos, New Mexico.

Really? Yeah. Is it a festival? No, I think this one's just our own show, but then we do play a show with Umphreys McGee at Red Rocks in Colorado. And where can people find the dates and stuff dweezil zappa world.com i just i i my hope for you is that somehow or another you you process it you know emotionally you know and and and and get past it i to me i i'm already there you know I just I play the music and I spend time with

my family my wife my kids I still you know I hang out with Moon and Matilda and all that stuff is great you know all those things I can't complain about this other stuff is a nuisance but it's just

also just really dumb and expensive to deal with absolutely just go get those three guitars i would love to do that i'd love to get the rest of them too you know well i hope that works out thanks very much good talking to you that was hard man that was hard for me but it good. It felt cathartic for both of us. You know, it's weird when, you know, I wonder sometimes why I get so connected and so attached to some narratives. And, you know, obviously my own relationship

with my father is difficult and different, clearly, but father stuff, whew, gets me right in the kishkies. Huh? How about a little Yiddish for you how about a little of that go to dweezilworld.com for tour info and check out that new documentary eat that question frank zappa in his own words also i i need to tell you um that we reached out uh to uh to ahmet zappa and asked him if he wanted to offer a response and i got this from his publicist hi mark as publicist for the zappa family trust we appreciate you reaching

out to ahmet about comments for your podcast with dweezil ahmet doesn't have any comments to make at this time best mitch and marcy so now moving on to the next guest, Dion Cole. I got to tell you, I had a great conversation here. I finished this conversation. I had a great time. I had fun.

I got, I had some laughter. We had, we were two comics talking together and I had a cop to the fact that look, I had met him several times. He used to write over a Conan. Now he's on TV a lot, and we talk about his role on Black-ish. And I just never registered him.

And then one night I saw him at the comedy store. I brought him up, asked the sound guy who's next, and he said, Dion Cole. And I was like, who? And then I brought up Dion Cole, and I'm like, oh, fuck, I know him. It was one of those things. And he did an amazing set. And it was great that we connected.

It was just one of those fun comic conversations. And Dion's special cold-blooded seminar airs this Saturday, June 25th at midnight and soon after on the comedy central app okay so that's on comedy central and then you'll get it on the app if you want to but enjoy me and dion cole enjoying each other's company dion cole yes you know i you know i I think I owe you an apology. You owe me an apology. Well, I feel like a lot of times, like, I don't feel like I quite register you. Why? Why not, man? No, I mean, like, you know, I've been doing conan for years and i know you're a writer over there and i and it's like i've been doing that show since the mid 90s so i'd see the writers

come and go and then by the time that like i wasn't on he didn't have me on the tonight show but by the time i got over there to tbs you know you were around and you were one of the writers and i didn't really put it together that you were stand-up and then i realized you were stand-up and then one night at the comedy store i know you who you are and i fucked up your intro like i'm like who the fuck is it because they were like i'm like who's next in the main room they're like dion cole and i'm like who dion what and i like i just fucked up the intro and then you got out there and i'm like i know that guy what kind of fucking asshole do you remember that yeah i remember it i was like wow i was like every time i see him i introduce myself and i said to myself i said i'm gonna keep doing it till you know my

goddamn name i'm just gonna i don't even care okay how many times it takes i don't know what the fuck that that is like because you know what it is is because i didn't know you as a comic yeah and i don't see you you know where i only work at the store so like i just didn't register it but then i like i know you're a conan and then there was also one of those things that maybe in my head it's like he doesn't fit in here what's he doing here what it's like this got to be some sort of thinking what is he doing yeah like but you know because i've known that that that crew for so long and it is really probably you know, because I've known that crew for so long. And it is really probably, you know, one of the whitest shows on television. Yes, it is.

And everybody knows it. All my friends know it. We all know it. Oh, really? I remember when I first got over there, I was like, whoa, I'm going to be lonely as hell over here. I can tell. I can tell. I think that's why there's this

lack of connection yeah because i never really thought about it until like you know and then i thought here's what i was thinking i'm like he must be one of those alt black guys so it must be one of the alternative black dudes what's so crazy is a lot of people think that even black people think that but then when they get around me they'd be like nah that's a that's a real motherfucker right here this is just a real nigga right here they're like what are you doing what are you doing over here then how did you get lost well what what do you say to him nah i just tell him man we just linked up i think it i think it was because of that that conan was like you know what man

let's rock let's do something because i just was who i was and that was it it was no no bells and whistles with it well where'd you where'd you meet conan man i did the i did the uh tonight show when he had the tonight show as a guest oh so they just booked you yeah as a guy yeah as a comic. Yeah, as a comic. And I did like four and a half minutes. So my man JP. Buck? Yeah, Buck. Yeah, yeah. Book me in. Next thing I know, man, about three weeks later,

my manager called me like, I only want you to write for him. I'm like, write what? You write hello? Yeah. I was like, what they want me to write? And I was like, I got to submit something? They was like, nah. They was like, just be here Monday. I was like, what they want me to write? And I was like, I got to submit something? They was like, nah, they'll just be here Monday.

I was like, what? I was like, I got all these shows coming up. Oh, really? That's funny. The comic. The comic. I'm playing some shithole outside of Chicago. Like, I don't know if I'm going to be able to cancel that.

That's $500. I know. What are you talking about? Is this for real? Because I got about $1,200 worth of work in the next three months that I don't want to miss. And while you're bushed, that's exactly what my mind was thinking of. I don't want to get out there and then go like, bro, we made the wrong decision.

Yes. And then I miss these shows. Yeah. And then what am I going to do? I don't know what I'm going to do. I was like, man, that's crazy. So you were living in Chicago when that happened? Yeah, I was living in Chicago.

No, actually, no, I was in L.A., but I came out to L.A. to do some voiceover work. But you were scheduled to? For my voice, yeah. Like I had an interview. You had gigs. I had an interview, yeah, DreamWorks. I had an interview, and they were like, yeah, we really love your voice for animation. We got some projects coming up.

You should move out here. And I was like, great. Where'd they find you? From the Conan show, too? No, I did the showcase in Aspen. The Aspen. It's not the HBO festival. It was.

It was the HBO Aspen. You were at the last one? I was at the last one oh no shit yes and at that that's why i met jp buck and and uh these other people that wanted me to do some animation and when i moved out there they um they there with like a swiss army type of uh tie jacket because it's all like a fort was that i was out there like man like y'all there was no call or nothing so oh you didn't even get the appointment no like no because you didn't have any representation like man i don't know what it was. They just didn't mess with me.

And I just was like, wow. So you moved out here because DreamWorks said they wanted you to do some cartoon voices. I'll do some cartoon voices. And that was enough for you. I'm packing up. And I was like, man, that's good. I'm just going to do it. Because I wanted to leave Chicago, but I just needed a reason.

Yeah. Somebody could have told me I could have did commercial work. I would have been like, I'm out. I just needed that one reason. Yeah, that's enough. And I don't think that was like a big reason enough for me to leave, but I ended up doing it. And I left and jetted and came out and it didn't work.

And I just was like out here. But I was still going back to Chicago. For the $500 gigs? Because I didn't want nobody to know that I lived out in L.A. Because I thought if people knew I lived in L.A., they would treat me like everybody else. So if I look like I visit then I'll probably get better stage time

this that and the other so I wouldn't let nobody let out here so you didn't want them to know because you didn't want them to think like oh you're that guy you big shot yeah yeah yeah you're out here now you're just out so I didn't want to look like I lived out here but yeah I had a place out here that's weird that was the end of the

comedy the the comedy the hbo comedy because i was just telling michelle that when i did it like in 95 maybe the first or the second one because we're talking about chicago a little bit there was this weird thing where like it i i'll never forget it because like not unlike conan on some level aspen is about the whitest place in the world the all this yeah so but that year in 95 they brought out they had a black show and they brought out bernie mac and cedric and a couple other dudes like but no one knew who they were they were just black circuit guys at that time and it was like what's going on and like you and bernie mac was really the blackest guy in the world.

And I just remember watching Bernie Mac on stage in Aspen. None of us can fucking breathe. And it's just all that industry and all those white people. And he's up there just sweating, doing his Bernie Mac shit. And people are like, what's happening? It was one of the greatest nights of comedy I ever saw in my life. Because it was like not, they'd never seen anything like it. I can visualize this right now.

And he was uncomfortable, you know, just being up there, walking around the street. He didn't bring the right shoes, you know. Altitude. Right. It's all evidence stacked against you. And I think that's how he got Ruthann and the Bernie Mac show and all that shit.

That's funny, man. Yeah, it was funny. It was so right up there. I remember Kid Capri had a party up there and no one was there. I think it was just me, him, and a couple other people to the point where he was playing what he wanted to hear. It was yeah. It was like, download songs he never bought and it wasn't even a party. It was just like us

grooving, listening to music because no one showed up. Oh my God. It was so white, no one knew who Kid Capri was. I'm not sure I do.

I was going to play along but I figured, I'll cop to it. Kid Capri is one of the biggest DJs. Oh, DJs, djs yeah like i'd feel bad if it was a rapper i didn't like you know a dj that's completely out of my that's one one one step further to like things i don't fucking know about it's like i see those uh sometimes i see those billboards on sunset for those people who are gonna be in vegas you ever see those i'm like

are they making those guys up? And then someone told me they're DJs. I'm like, I don't fucking know. Just guys with one name. Calvin Harris. Who's Calvin Harris? What does he do? Why is he at the Mirage?

What's he going to be doing there? I guess people just like to dance. So, all right, because I've watched your stand-up, you know, and I've seen you live and stuff and i know you're over at conan but it is sort of a a little bit of a brain fuck and i'm not apparently the only one that was like not able to sort of place you yeah but you you know you got chops so where'd you grow up in chicago man south side south side chicago that's where i started everything got and um is that is at. What's that neighborhood?

I know that, like, is that- Crazy, ill, crazy, ill. Yeah, it's like- That's where all the murdering is? Yeah. They're like Southside, Westside. They're known for that. They're known for pizza and murder. What are we going to do tonight?

I don't know. Get some pizza and try to make it home? That's a sport. Yeah, that's a sport in Chicago. Get some pizza and make it home. Yeah, that's the sport they don't show on TV until after it's lost. That guy didn't win. It's just pizza slices on the ground everywhere of people who didn't make it.

But it is like that. I've grown to like Chicago. I've grown to appreciate it because it's a real fucking city. There's not that many real cities that have a real history and personality to it. But it is kind of like Los Angeles, Boston, and San Francisco, which are clearly fucking like black people are over there. Yes. And this is where the white people.

Most segregated city in the US. Which is? Chicago. Is it? Yeah. It's segregated to the point where the Irish are over here, the Jewish are over here, the Hispanics are over here, and then you have the blacks over here,

and then you have the blacks segregated, where it's like this class of blacks of money, and then this class of blacks over here, and then you have the blacks segregated, where it's like this class of blacks of money, and then this class of blacks without money, and the same thing with the whites. You have whites that don't have money, who's further, further up north, than the ones who have money. Right.

And it's just, and then the Puerto Ricans. Oh, yeah. Then the Mexicans. It's crazy. A lot of food options, though. Oh, you can eat your ass off. You can leave and make it there. Pizza slices.

No, no. Pizza slices. Tacos. Ukrainian food. Ukrainian food. Yeah. No, you can eat your ass off in Chicago. That's some of the greatest.

Well, what part did you grow up in? Man, like 100, like the 100s, 115th, 117th, the Mafia, like way deep in the 100s. And what was your family like? What did your dad do? Man, my father, he worked for the, look at me, I think he was a... What he told us, standard black man stuff.

I think he was a... No, no, he was working for the post office and then he was retired whatever yeah so and you and your mom and him were together the whole time no no no no they wouldn't wasn't together oh i really didn't highly know my father like that i knew i've actually just he just passed like probably like about a week and a half ago oh really yeah it was crazy because i went to his funeral and this other dude like i didn't know him like that but i thought i'd show up but this other dude walked up to me it was like yeah man you know man sorry for your loss of your father

and i'm just like yeah okay he was like he was a father to me too you know he uh taught me how to you know deal with women and change tires on the car. And yo, he really dealt with me. We read the Bible together. And I'm looking at him like, really? You got my triumph. Well, I'm sorry for your loss. Who the fuck are you?

Who the fuck are you again? Why are you taking all my moments? But yeah, man. Who was that kid? He worked with my father. He'd been knowing him for a long time. But yeah, I did not know him. That's a weird thing, though.

That's a weird thing when you hear these people that have these different relationships with your father. Like, I knew my father, and there were people like, he was a great guy, nicest guy in the world. Wait, who are we talking about? That's exactly what happened, man. I was sitting there like, what? What are you talking about?

Must be a different guy. Might be the right funeral. Who they buryin'? We're talking about Napo, right? That's the same father. Yeah, it was crazy, man. So, no, they went together. My mother just raised me on her own.

You know, that was it. Brothers and sisters? No, no. her own. That was it. Brothers and sisters? No, no. Just you? Just only child, but I have a half sister that I finally thought about when I was 30 that my father had. Right, when you were 30 you met that?

Yeah, I met her when I was 30. It was crazy just to see somebody that looked like you. Wow, did you keep in touch with her or nothing? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I always wonder what that's like. Yeah, we was together at the funeral. What was so crazy is when he died, they were coming to us going, okay, you all had to take care of it because we next to can.

And I'm like, I've never even seen two. I got to take care of this? And you did, didn't you? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You did the right thing, right? The family did too. I mean, like his brother stepped up. Yeah. Yeah, everybody got it together. But You did the right thing, right? The family did, too. I mean, like, his brother stepped up. Yeah.

Yeah, everybody got it together. But it was the craziest thing. It's not the time to go like, fuck him. Let's just cremate him. How much is that? But I was like this. Hey, wait a minute. Wait a minute.

What the fuck is going on? But were you sad or you didn't have access to those emotions because you didn't have that much of a relationship yeah man i was sad that we didn't always waited on that moment where we could sit back and you know him him to go yo i see you making it and everybody else told me that he really admired me and oh really everything i did but he just wouldn't tell me because he just lived with so much pride he felt like like, okay, his son is making it, but you know what? I don't want to come around now. Now it's going to look like because he's making it, I'm coming around.

So he wouldn't do that. Then he got sick and he was like, okay, I need his help, but I ain't going to reach out for his help because it's going to look like because I'm sick. His pride kept him away from that. And he probably, a little mixture of shame and pride. All of that, yeah. I hung that kid out to dry. That's a daily combination, Jack.

Right? You should never have that guilt and pride. Yeah, they're married. Oh, and married. You have both of those together. Yeah, pride and insecurity, another good couple. That's another good couple, right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know what you never hear is pride and humility that's not they don't they don't go together they're never dating those two never in the same room no humility sees pride and they're like i gotta go that guy's never gonna show who brought him here exactly get out get out i'm working yeah i'm working that's funny so well then okay so he's that's just a week and a half ago huh yeah that just happened man yep so you know we uh and your mother like she didn't go right

no my mother was like, mm. Mm. That's black women. That noise means so much. Just mm. Uh-huh. Mm. Mm. Yeah.

Okay. Just read into it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just mm. That could be like, okay, or about time. It could mean so much. It could mean either one of those. I feel a bit beginning. I think we've got Dion's new seven minutes.

I think we've got a new seven minutes. Mm, bit. Mm. Yeah. Read into that. That's funny, man. So when did you, did you, so you're just kicking around Chicago. Yeah.

When did you start feeling like, what'd your mom do to take care of everything? What was her job? My mom worked several jobs. She used to work at this place called Harold's Chicken. It was this chicken shack in Chicago that's really well known. They still have it. My mother worked at the currency exchange. She worked as many jobs as possible.

But we didn't put it like this. I was the only child, and we still didn't have shit. Right. Like nothing. We used to put our food in the snow because we didn't have a refrigerator. It was, you know, just. Really? Yeah.

A refrigerator was. Oh, really? A fridge. Yeah. It was snow. Put our food in the snow, man. What about in the summer, man? You just didn't eat refrigerated items?

Summer. Ice. food in the snow man what about in the summer man you just didn't eat refrigerated items ice used to go buy bags of ice yeah and put it in a bowl and then just put a lid on top of the big big bowl and put our food in there like lunch meat and used to be just basically young lunch meat and spam and stuff like that like stay cold But it was that bad you couldn't get a refrigerator? Yeah, yeah. We used to live in a house where it wasn't rented out, but they were trying to rent it out. But until they rented it out, they would let us stay there.

But it had no electricity or nothing. So almost like illegal squatting with the permission of the owner. Yes, the permission of the owner letting us squat in one of his apartments. But not give you fucking electricity. Yes, but would not give us the electricity. It's like you're kind of a nice guy. Yes. Not a great guy. You're doing this for your sake

right now, I think. He's not doing it for us. He's going, eh, I'm going to let them stay here. Make a few bucks. Yeah. But I'm not going to take any chances by turning on the utilities. The fuck, man. We're not going to do that.

And you grew up in that house, so no one bought that fucking house? Yeah, yeah. No one bought it? We stayed there. We stayed there for about probably like six months, almost eight months we stayed there and then we my mother ended up getting another job when we moved so real place yeah with a refrigerator yes how old were you when you got the refrigerator i think we was like i think i was like probably about 12 oh 12 12 years old you didn't have to smell the lunch meat anymore no i had to smell the lunch i ate so many sandwiches man i ain't gonna

lie to you like sometimes i still eat them because i just i love them making comfortable i love of course it's poor shit that i still do i still look on the ground for money yeah who doesn't do you still do it i don't look but if I see something you know I'll pick it up generally even if it's a fucking penny like you know

you gotta do it right yeah and that goes on forever it doesn't matter how much money you got you well I mean sometimes you're going to pick that up

what am I gonna do with that dime maybe someone maybe that's a life changing dime that dime's gonna stay on your mind for a little bit maybe it does yeah because then you judge yourself like what have I become

what kind of it sends you through a whole thing if you don't pick that dime up am I really that big a man that I'm just gonna leave money am I a big asshole where I'm gonna leave this fucking dime I've experimented with throwing money away like I've had pennies just like throw it away.

And I'm sort of like, I don't know if that feels right. You can't just throw away money like that. But no, but like those kind of foods, like comfort food is comfort food. What's the lunch meat that you like? Which one? It was turkey. Turkey bologna. Turkey bologna. Then it was like

this cottage. It was called cottage salami. It was like this cottage it was called cottage salami it was like the cheapest Oscar Mayer with the peppercorns in it the little peppercorns this kid

nothing wrong with that is that in your writer I want Cristal and peppercorn salami in my room white bread white bread folded and some of that shitty yellow mustard I want Cristal and peppercorn salami in my room, goddamn it. White bread. White bread folded. And some of that shitty yellow mustard.

French's mustard package. Packages. I don't want that fucking container. I want to feel like we had to take it from a restaurant. That we stole it from the hot dog place. This is how I feel comfortable. I want all condiments in packages. Fucking jars.

I don't want none of that jar shit. All that squeezable fuck that. No, no, no. That's soft. Yeah. So when did you, like, did you start doing comedy when? Did you go to,

what was the experience? It was like 90, 92. 92 like it looks like you've been doing it a lot like i was watching the stress factor no no i was watching like it was it was a kind of an exciting experience for me because like i know you write for conan i know you're doing the the bits another thing too i used to like write for him like now i just do like freelance stuff while going to show but nonetheless like you know like that's how i was introduced to you right so so like i like i spent like what however long it had been since i started seeing you around thinking like who the fuck is that guy you know and then it's not adding up it just doesn't add up

you know because like you know i'm not feeling the alt black guy from this guy he's not saying much but he's definitely not like one of them black nerds the the rare black nerd guy so like that is great so so then i watch your shit i'm like oh this dude's a real dude this is like this guy's been doing comedy a long time this is not like i'm just starting out shit it's been going on for a while oh snap so but you know what i mean like yeah so then i'm like you know there must have been there's a whole history of of comedy that you came up in because i know the chicago guys that are around your age and you like in that and you're not And you're not part of that thing. So when I watch the stand-up, I'm like,

oh, well, this guy's been at it. But when did you start thinking you could do it? Who was it that you saw? Well, I never thought that I was going to be a comic. It was the fact that I was just very observant. And by me being the only child, I just was observant. And by me being like the only child, I just was observant to things and I would question a lot of stuff because-

You had a lot of time. Yeah, it was just for real. Did you have friends? Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah, good. And they were the ones that kind of put it in me a little bit that, yo, you need to do stand-up

because I would ask genuine questions when they would think like yo just leave it alone but i would work it real it yeah like whatever it was to get the answer to this like if somebody tripped and failed in front of us yeah everyone would laugh and i will be more like why didn't they see that right did they did they trip over a dime because i'm gonna go get that yeah yeah was that a dime they tripped over yeah man i will question that oh that's all i do question shit did you listen to comedy did you like comedy it wasn't i loved comedy but it wasn't like that was something that i was like into like i'm i wasn't into that really like i just i really didn't know what my purpose was but I'm still working on it

yeah I'm still trying to figure out what I'm here for right right right yeah man so I just was like man so when I when my friend bet me he bet me to go on stage because he was just like dude how old were you saying some silly shit. I think I was like, probably like 22, 22 at the time. And he just bet me 50 bucks to go on stage. And I was like, all right, let's do it. Where at? All Jokes Aside in Chicago. It's a club called All Jokes Aside.

And I went down there. On an open mic? Yeah, and they wouldn't let me get on for the first two weeks, then third week. Sit over there? Yeah, sit over there. With the other guys looking all sweaty and waiting. Yeah, just waiting there.

They would never let me on. And then Adele Givens, she let me go on, and she brought me on. Was she hosting? Yeah, she was hosting. And I remember I couldn't sleep that night. After you did it before after i did it how'd it go it went incredible i think i got like a almost like a little standing ovation like it was like a few people that stood up and clapped and that's that let me tell you what that's called

a few people stood up okay that's what it was it was not a standing ovation to me then i was like oh my god what is this there's nothing more sadder than the partial standing oh like four people and a hundred people they're like up they're up and then they and then you just watch them start to feel weird about it like i thought i thought everybody else was gonna stand No, no. So that's what it was. The bullshit. You could thank them personally. Very nice. Yes, sir.

You could point at them individually. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Yeah, yeah. It was that kind of shit. Did you write jokes or did you just wing it? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I wrote down stories. Well, I didn't even know. I just wrote down stories that I've told people before that they laughed about. And then I also wrote down how I felt about certain stuff. that they laughed about right and then i also wrote down how i felt about certain stuff i didn't even know it was joke form i just wrote down how i felt about certain things right but you you you were funny enough with your friends that you knew that had some effect yeah i knew that i knew that that this was funny because i told it to several people like i've told this story to several people and they laugh. So I think if I go up here,

then it'll work. Right, right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It just was like, okay. So that was how old were you? 22? Yeah, yeah. And what were you doing?

Were you working? I was working at this place called Leathermakers and I was selling weed at the time. Yeah, Leathermakers. Yep, and I was selling weed out of the leather shop.

What was Leathermakers? It sold all kind of leather coats and pants and jackets and vests and all of that, like a Wilson's. Oh, yeah? Yeah, it was called Leather Makers. It was on the south side? Yeah, it was on the south side. And me selling weed out of there, the smell of leather,

if you have so much leather around, it kills any smell around. You can smoke weed in a leather store and want nobody smelling it. Make note. Lace your walls with leather that weed doesn't even matter anymore no gives a fuck nobody smoke weed everywhere everywhere but then shit it was great yeah and the weed wasn't as good as it is now yeah so that's 92 it was 92 i'm 92 dude it's a long time man yeah man just been rocking out ever since man and man you go to college yeah i went to college for like a semester almost a year and it's down in arkansas and uh this motherfucker started shooting at me and my friend chris and

what i don't know because we was up north i think that's what it was that was around the time remember this HBO special called Gangbanging in Little Rock it was about just showing all these gangs in Little Rock it was around that time

that that movie came out and it was crazy in Little Rock how they was gangbanging what school was that? Philander Smith I went to school called Philander Smith

and they was just gangbanging so tough down there that it just. Well like it just caught on? Yeah, it was like West Coast, like it was Crips and Bloods down there. And I'm from Chicago so we got like different gangs, like Folks and Vice Lords.

And so that was a whole different experience to me that I couldn't wear a certain color. So you grew up with the knowledge of that? I grew up under, like, folks and vice lords. That was, like, gangsters and vice lords. In your neighborhood. Yeah, and it depended on which way you wear your hat. If you wore your hat to the left or the right,

the bib of your hat. You had to watch how that went. But colors, I never dealt with. But as a kid, you weren't in the gang, but you still had to honor the hat code or no? Yeah. Yeah, if you came out, you better wear your hat straight as a duck bib,

God damn it. You better... Straighter than cat hair. Your shit better be straight on your fucking head. Even if you had nothing to do with gang, you're just a neighborhood kid. If you had nothing to do with gang, you better wear your hat straight

or don't wear it at all. Yeah, so I would go with the no hat option and i did do that but then when i was around other people i'll wear my hat right right i thought it was strength and numbers and we still gotta ask by who by the vice yeah by the gangs other gangs yeah yeah they'll come over there and you know because this is around the time when drugs was popping off, too. Like, this is like 84, 85. So you're like 10? Yeah, I'm young. 10 years old?

I'm young. Young as hell. And so it was crazy how that whole little gang movement was going on. The little gang movement. It's worse now, though. It was more organized then. Now, I don't know what the fuck they doing. But you get beat up, but you wouldn't get shot.

Nah, it wasn't like that. Yeah, you fought with your hands and shit. Yeah, you was fighting with your hands. Like, wasn't nobody walking around with pistols and shit like that? At 10 years old, hopefully not. And if you did fight somebody, it was because you knew you was in their area or whatever. And it made sense in a sense that, you know, it was like organized crime. You knew if you was here, then this was what's going to happen.

But what if you just got to walk through? Yo, damn shit. Better figure out another way. God bless you, yeah. God bless you. Even as a kid? Yeah. I'm just a kid.

Can't I go over there to that store? Nope. No, fuck that. Nope. You better send your sister or somebody. Oh, shit. So that's where it fucking starts, that weird kind of specific territorial thing

gets put in your brain that early that it's important. Yeah, absolutely. And you know, because you know your environment. Right. And it's cool. As long as you're in your environment, you're cool. But once I started like doing stand up

and started traveling and all that I started seeing other parts of the world and shit like that that's when I was like yo this is crazy like it was bigger

than just me doing stand up I started learning about other people it's a very small world that they're protecting like that way of life because

it's a very small world there's like a lot of them, and I'm talking about black people, but not in a bad way. You know what? You son of a bitch. I didn't say those people. A lot of those people are-

But I just think in that environment, their choices are limited, so that's what it's all invested in maintaining that order. Yeah, absolutely. Right. But when you get out of there, you're like, oh it's all invested in maintaining that order. Yeah, absolutely. Right. But when you get out of there, you're like, oh shit. Yeah.

You just walk over there. What? What the fuck? Like, really? Like, I can do this? I can do that? It's crazy. It's a real mind fucker.

And to this day, it's like that. And all over the country, you got motherfuckers here that live in Compton or whatever that have never left Compton because they can't leave that area or they don't have the means and money to travel, and that's all that they know. Right. And so once you get out, you go, wow. Then you start realizing, what am I fighting and killing for

on this block in this neighborhood? The world is bigger than this neighborhood. Sure. And then you try to leave out. So hopefully somebody hear this and put their gun down or some shit. You're helping people. I know. You got gangsters listening

to your podcast. My fuckers are weed right now. True, true, true. That motherfucking mark is true. That's a true shit mark. Oh, that was the funniest thing was, like today I watched a clip of yours from

Laughapalooza or something. It's an old clip, but the funny thing about it was someone had shot the clip. You got to go watch it. He shot it. It's a guy taping it off his TV with his phone. All right, so that's the clip. It's a TV being watched by some other dude. You got two laughs from that dude.

I'm just watching it. I'm trying to be like, why is the sound fucked up? And then I'm just watching. I'm like, I like why is the sound fucked up and then I'm just watching I'm like I guess this song sounds fucked up on the clip and then like about three minutes in

I hear it like that's validation man it was great it was great it was great because then all of a sudden I'm like waiting for because he's alone

you know he's alone so if you're getting actual audible laughs from a dude sitting alone with his phone even if it's just two that means you're getting actual audible laughs from a dude sitting alone with his phone, even if it's just two. That means you're doing something, man.

We should send everyone special to that dude. Exactly. Let you know if your shit work or not. I didn't know it was coming the first time. And then I'm like, oh my God, it's so cute. And then I'm waiting for him to laugh again. He did. He laughed again.

That's so funny so like there was those great tapes of like uh one of the great i don't even know why i loved it so much but when uh when cat williams melted down you know on stage and there were people taming it with their phone right so like i'm watching one of those one of those phone videos like and you can hear it's just these black women you're holding the phone yeah and there you just hear him like oh shit oh shit and then like uh like all that shit's going on on stage. And then Suge Knight comes out. And all you hear is one woman go, is that Suge?

I think that's Suge. It's part of the show. They're just excited to see Suge. It's the best. It's real. Is that Suge? Is that really Suge? I loved it.

That was funny, man. So, all right. So you're doing, like, what is that club scene? Because there used to be the, there was a pretty important black club there for a long time. All jokes aside. Is that what it was? That's where I started at. Because I talked to the guys who ran that.

Yeah. Raymond Lambert and Mary Lindsay. They did a documentary on it right yeah yeah were you in that yeah i was in it's called funny business right i interviewed those guys oh yeah absolutely man so that was that club yeah that was that era man it was great because i mean me being from chicago i thought it was many clubs like that not knowing that that was the only black club like that in the country just to see people in uniforms and they pay you by check and all that shit that shit was crazy well honestly i didn't feel how other people felt what it was like when it came to the clubs in chicago

it was bars and stuff that paid you money out your pocket but working the comedy club there i thought everybody had that kind of comedy club right but it wasn't but that was a specifically black club yeah it was specifically black who were the acts that were were coming up with it was like man i remember we we used to open for like steve harvey chappelle carlos mencia yeah uh cedric it was like everybody that was anybody DL yeah yeah

it was like Chris Rock everybody played the club everybody whoever it was they played that club

yeah it was fantastic and you know it was it was ran like a like a whale oil

ship it was like you do your time if you go over your time you get docked pay and oh really yeah it was it was

and now were you like uh like uh like a regular like opener you came up through the ranks you opened you featured you're like one of the guys the local guys you get the call if you want to feature for somebody and you're hoping you can feature for somebody if you see them coming exactly and you're waiting for the call yeah but but at the time i didn't even like i said i was invested in comedy i liked comedy but i mean i really wasn't invested in it like that. But I didn't know all these acts. All I knew was I liked comedy, and I did, and I knew all the big name comedians. I didn't know all these other guys that were coming through the club.

I just was meeting them as they were coming through. And watching them? Yeah, and building a relationship with them and watching them and learning how, what to do and what not to do yeah yeah yeah not knowing that this was something that was unusual yeah and it was a job it was a job but i but i i didn't know that i thought everyone had this access yeah yeah to these great comics right no right so it was something that that that made us uh you us become who we are today. Right.

No, absolutely. Just watching those dudes. Just watching these dudes. But you didn't come at it like you didn't love Carlin or Pryor. No, no. Ellen DeGeneres is one of my icons. I'm patterning myself after her. It's crazy.

Ellen, George, Stephen Wright. George who? Carlin. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Those are the guys that you're like. Yeah, those are the people that. That you listen to, that made you laugh. That made me go, that's who I want to be like.

And that's, I love that off-putting type of material. I look at comedy like it's magic. Like, if you can't see the punch line coming like well that's but that's interesting because that's different than like you know george ellen and who was the other one uh stephen wright because like that's like what separates you in a way is that you know you got a very kind of like hard disposition up there and your delivery is is pretty like like a like old school black comic yeah but you those are all like joke writers yeah you're not telling stories necessarily you write jokes yeah yeah absolutely and and like what i took from basically

ellen degeneres was taking a little bit of something and blowing it out of proportion she's a queen of that. George was very smart with how he broke down things. Yeah. And that was something that I was like, man, I want to be able to do that. Steven Wright was clever. Right. He was the type of cat that he had a play on words that was like no other can do. And so I thought if I can take all of those bits and pieces and apply them to myself

as well as be a real motherfucker right that i think that i might be in my own lane yeah but it started happening without me even thinking about it it started happening and then when i realized it was happening then i started embracing it more but that's what it was it was like yeah we can talk about some real motherfucking shit on some black shit or white shit, whatever it is. I don't have to have the cadence of a token black guy. I don't have to be like, I can be me

and still be on some clever shit. Right. Well, I saw some of that in some of the older stuff when you were using the device, the list. Yeah. By and large, you pull that shit out. Yeah. You're not really doing a character, but you're just going to try these jokes.

Yeah, because I did it on Def Jam, but it was something that became a part of me by me using my notepad on stage back then because I used to get so high. I used to just really honestly forget my jokes. And so when I seen that that was working that people was laughing at me because in my notes the beat was you know whether it worked or it didn't work where you give it worked if it didn't work where you scratch it off that was the joke off yeah so it became a bit so it got to the point where i would do jokes that didn't work on purpose right because those got bigger laughs right because of the reaction to it the actual written joke so i had instilled it me

to bomb on purpose because that would be funnier right than me right and because the device work it actually enabled you to try new jokes and it actually allowed me to try new jokes yes it was pretty clever thank you very much did much do it on your special no no you know what i do i still do it from time to time i use my notepad but a lot of people a lot of people kind of do that now whatever but not not not like i do no no the alt comics it used to be like they that was one of the reasons why the old timers would get mad at all comics. It's like they brought their notebooks. Janine, I think, really was the one that people remember doing at Garofalo.

Used to just bring the pads up. But Richard Lewis does it too. He's got the yellow pads. But you got the gig on Conan, what, 2010? I got the gig on Conan in 2009. Were you headlining? Yeah, I was headlining. I was headlining.

I was doing shows. Mostly black rooms? Mostly black rooms. But my audience was still kind of like, put it like this, I was never that comic that was, I never was embraced by the black crowd crowd like right right right right because of my material because i came up in the ranks of you know catch phrases and motherfuckers had suits

with 17 buttons and shit you know steve harvey used to wear suits like that but everybody used to bite off steve harvey suits but steve was sharp as shit in his suits yeah he used to look good but it got to a point where comedians started using that shit as a crutch they was like where if he ain't funny at least he was sharp than a motherfucker like so you saw young guys going out like buying suits and shit dude you would be like gangster one day and then all of a sudden i got a hat no hat do i wear the hat or not the hat? Maybe not the hat right away. They used to be so sharp, man.

But I used to always be against that. I used to always be like, no, I don't want to do that. So when I got put on black shows, it would be for diversity reasons. You were the diversity? I was the diversity as far as that goes. He's that kind of black guy. These other guys, we're going to have the fancy black people. And then this guy, he's that kind of black guy these other guys we're gonna have the fancy black people and then this guy he's just gonna dress how he wants to know i would because i wouldn't put an ass in his seats but i would bring a different rhythm of comedy i still

would be i still would be a be a black motherfucker i wouldn't be like no token no no right right but i but the way i delivered my shit was different than the rest of the comics so i used to get booked like that i used to be like a comedian's comedian right right right you know so you're writing this shit you you're you had structure you you weren't you weren't just charming you weren't just pandering exactly yeah i was like doing that work yeah no i was sitting back writing like motherfucker and trying to get my pen together. Yeah, yeah. Get it all together, whatever.

So, yeah, I was like the diversity. That's funny. But you were headlining. Yeah, but when I did theater shows with other people, I would do that. But, yeah, I was headlining because I did Laughable Loser, Def Jam, Comic View. I did a whole bunch of TV shows as far as doing stand-up shows and stuff. So people knew me, and I had a nice following or whatever.

Yeah, yeah. But when I hit Conan, that sent me to a whole nother level. But when you walk in, that's sort of an interesting shift is that Conan had this intuition about when he saw you do stand-up, he had this intuition that you were a writer.

Like he could, he could feel that, you know, the difference. Like, you know, I, I jerk around on stage and like all my shit. I, I, I, it creates itself on stage. You know, no one's going to listen to me and go like, that's a good joke. You know, like that, like I didn't see that coming or whatever. Cause I do a different style. I'm more conversational. But but he must have sensed that. I mean, that's what I think. Yeah. Because I mean, he he always makes moves on vibes and like he just feel like it's a vibe. Like I was told a story when he first had his show on late night.

Yeah. They had him hosting and interviewing. interviewing i mean a whole lot of people as a co-host right and when he hired andy it wasn't even no interview he just saw andy one day and they talked and had coffee and laughed and joked it up and he hired him yeah so it wasn't everybody he interviewed he never hired them but he hired andy and so that was the same thing with me you know but when you when you get the gig like like you had you knew like i i never work in a writer room other than my tv show that was first experience i had so did he bring you in did you start with monologues or sketches well how did you start i went straight sketch like when i came in man it was like when i got there it was like okay i tried to write like everybody and it was like straight

sketch yeah it gave me an office and all this and I just sat back and I was trying to write like everybody nobody gave me no blueprint I've never written for no show nothing I was just there in the writer's room yeah sitting there and they like you'll catch on i remember mike sweeney the hair writer he was like i know him oh yeah came up with him funny oh yes sweet guy sweet the sweetest guy ever one of the funniest dudes i ever met very funny as a stand-up no one could do crowd work no one and no one to this day no one can do crowd work like mike yeah it's amazing and he was like man he was like you'll catch on he was, and if you need any help, just let me know, but you're good. And so I just sat there and I tried to write stuff and it just wasn't nothing landing. And one day they were writing a bit for Andy because Andy's German.

And they was trying to write a bit where Andy's going to Oktoberfest. Right. And I didn't know what it was. Yeah. I was like, what's Oktoberfest? And they was like, it's a drinking day for Germans. And I was like, everybody's Oktoberfest? And they was like, it's a drinking day for Germans. And I was like, everybody got a drinking day. Hispanics got Cinco de Mayo.

Irish got St. Patrick's Day. Now they got that. I'm like, black people need a drinking day. And right at that moment, everybody in the room looked at me and was like, go write that up. And I was like this, what? Sweating bullets. What? They was like, go write that up.

I'm like, okay, I don't know what to do. They was just like, we'll show you. And they showed me this template and they was like, go ahead and write down exactly what you just said. And I was like, okay. And I wrote it down and they was like, Conan wants you to come out. We're going to open the curtain. You're going to come out and you're going to say exactly that.

Right on TV. And I was like, what are you talking about? And they was like, do that. I said, okay. And I did it and it took off. And then after that, it's just one thing led to another. And then the next thing I was talking about, there was no Black Haunted Houses. And then I started writing a bit on that.

And then it just became this thing that we were doing. So you became this personality, like this character. Yeah, I became this character that we were doing so you became this personality like this character yeah i became this yeah so you're almost like doing a sketch it was yeah you were like a recurring i was a recurring sketch character that's how that how it became right and it became this thing where you got this real black dude from the south side of chicago like what are you doing here black dude and you got the whitest guy in America, went to Harvard, grew up in Boston, coming together, trying to understand

whatever the situation was and just bouncing off of each other. And it just became... That was it, it took off. It was, man. People loved it. It took off. And that was it.

And just next thing I know, I had two Emmy nominations and a Writer's Guild, three Knight Writer's Guild nomination. I was like, what? Yeah. That was great to quit. Were you? Because I didn't understand the magnitude of that. I was still thinking stand-up.

Oh, so you were like, what am I doing? When I first got there, yeah, because I'm like, man, if I don't work and I quit. Oh, so you were like, and now like, what am I doing? When I first got there, yeah, because I'm like, man, if I don't work and I quit all these, I let all these. Because that's our whole identity. That's how,

that's how. Right. Thank you so much. My identity was, hey, I'm having shows. I'm a stand-up. That's what this is. Yeah.

So I didn't understand what was going on at the time. Yeah. But then when I did, I was like, oh my God, how could i have even thought that way well but because most of us don't do that like i didn't know for years like i knew

guys would go right and i'd be like the fuck you mean you gave up you know you you know you couldn't cut it you know you can go right you know and and it never even dawned on me i can barely write for myself i'm gonna sit in a room with a bunch of dudes trying to make jokes like i never got much satisfaction out of jokes like if i wrote a regular joke like a structured joke i would look at it and i'd be like that's pretty good i'll do that once because like jokes stop if i keep if keep talking, it doesn't stop. So what I grew to learn as I became more professional about it, and actually after watching, oddly, watching Bill Cosby himself, that it's all jokes.

Yeah. The whole story's jokes. The whole story's jokes. And it's like you're just not looking at it. You're not giving yourself enough credit. Yeah. These are all jokes. So if you can maximize those jokes separately within the story,

then you're doing the work. Yeah, that's real. And yeah, that's great. But you're sort of riding that line now where, you know, like the character you were doing on Conan is not that different from you, really. Yeah, yeah. So you got traction on that. So if people come see you, you're going to be that guy yeah exactly right so they it's not like that's not the guy from the tv show

because it was all luckily that it was based on your thought yeah yeah exactly so now like this so like the the comedy special on comedy central is gonna you know kind of solidify that yeah because it's so many people what's weird is because of me being on blackish and angie tribeca a lot of people don't even know i do stand-up i know it's weird you think like the weirdest well the media universe is so fragmented that when people go like i love you on that show you got to be like wait which one what's your context of me yeah that's real though it is real it's weird i don't question anymore some guy just came up to me in the back of the comedy store i hadn't even gone on stage yet just walked by me and went great job and i'm like okay i'll take it i'll take it whatever it is right but yeah a lot of people, they go,

they'll hit me on Instagram or Twitter, and I'll be like, yo, you're in stand-up? You're doing stand-up? I'm like, yeah. Or a lot of people think that I'm just trying to do stand-up now. That's the best because it's what you do. Yeah, that's what got me on these shows. But you got 20 years under your belt, so these people are like, I just know you from that show. You're like, well, watch this. Yeah, and that's what got me on these shows like 20 years under your belt so these people like i just know you from that show you're like well watch this yeah and that's what

that's what happened even with my special when i take my my comedy special special people were showing up going yo i want to see i want to see charlie from blackish i want to see you know dj tanner or the guy from conan they like and they got there and they're like, wait a minute. This dude is hilarious. Not knowing that. Yeah, for real. I've been doing this for 23 years. Right. Like, man. That's great.

It's almost like you were able to sort of like, it's like surprise. Yeah, because it's like I got these shows. Usually I think people do their hour specials and then they get these television shows and movies and stuff. It's like I got the Barbershop movie and I got these shows and then I went to my special. So it's a different kind of take on this and I can't wait to see the outcome

of this. I just want everybody to check it out and then come out to the show because what I'm doing now is working on a whole new hour so when the show comes out it's cool and I'm close to it. I think I'm up to like 40.

So then when the show comes out and it blows up then you can be like, I'm going to tour with a whole different hour. Yo, that's the plan. And that's where I am right now. Right.

Like right now I got like about 40, 45 like hot, I mean, material that's good. So by the time the 25th, I'm going to keep hitting stages until the 25th and when the 25th hit I mean, material that's good. So by the time the 25th, I'm going to keep hitting stages until the 25th.

When the 25th hit, I should have a whole new... I'm doing that. I'm building an hour. I know, it's so rough though. Because when he started, because it used to be when you're just doing stand-up and doing clubs and shit, you just show up and kind of evolve.

You know what I mean? It wasn't the same crew. Not everybody knew you. So you kind of just kept building the time you had yes and then i when the stakes get higher and everybody's up your ass and knows everything you're doing media yeah and then but then you're sitting there you're like you know i gotta write a new hour yes and then there's that the next moment is like how the fuck do i do that yes and it is all at once and people don't understand that and they come out and they go. Oh, that was great

Okay, what you got next? Yeah, right. What do you mean? What do you mean? Yeah, year to do a year to put that I just I got it polished. I took it out You know, I yeah, it was great. I shot the special and what I got now got throw that shit away And then not every hardly anybody sees your shit and you're playing to these nine people you know that's the fucked up thing is like you know

you assume like everybody here has seen it and then like if you I used to ask I'm like how many people saw the special and if it would be like nine people out of 500

I'm doing that shit yeah man I need nine people talk to me after I'll do a couple new bits for you I'll do a couple new bits for you

just hang around hang around I got some new material i've been working on this i've been working on this shit that i want y'all to see yeah i i've gotten uh like personally i've gotten a lot more open and a lot more friendly and it's uh it's difficult for me to be that way yeah you know what i used to be that way like real secluded and i used to be like i used to real secluded. And I used to be like. I used to be angry. Me too. I used to always be like, especially when I came to L.A.

I used to be like, fuck L.A. Fuck L.A. I'm sick of these lame and these phony people and da, da, da. And this one comedian chick named Dominique came up to me one day. And she was like, well, go home then, nigga. And I was like, what? She was like, go home. I'm so tired.

Every time I see you, you're complaining about L.A. And'm so tired every time I see you you complaining about LA and it's always about Chicago and you complaining about all these lame motherfuckers either play the game out here or take your ass home.

I don't know why that resonated with me more than anything. It resonated with me. I shut the fuck up after that and after that I just like okay

I have to do what I have to do. I can't be as angry. I can't be, I have to just be nice. And I have to, I have to be in this world. And I have to. Well, just do your shit. Do your shit. And that's it.

And that's what I started doing. And soon after that, that's when like I got Conan and all this other great shit started happening. Oh, she saved your life. She saved my life and real life. She was just like, yo, go your ass home. So now, like, so the special comes out and you got, you're recurring on Black-ish? Yeah, yeah. What is that, like, how many episodes you get a year?

Well, it just depends. You know, it depends on the networks and, you know and Kenya Barris and Tom Hinkle. Tom Hinkle is with Angie Tribeca and Steve Carell and Nancy Carell. That's a new show. That's right. And how's that going? It's great. I haven't watched it.

Yeah, it's good, man. I saw the billboard. Yeah, yeah. It's great. It's like Airplane and Naked Gun or whatever. Really? Yeah or whatever really yeah all right well i gotta check that out yeah and so it's so funny because with me like you know i i know about blackish i know about conan but like you know when i'm like getting the hangy i'm like i'm just gonna watch this stand up i know right it's all i need that's all that you need right it's all you need but for the listeners no no no

no they're doing a lot of good shit but you know what i want to trivialize it but you know what no no and i appreciate that but but nowadays you have to you have to kind of link the face with the name sometimes with other things that you know absolutely because yeah like because you know who knows what's watching what who's watching what and then you want people to come see you when you do perform you know and like like uh jj from good times yeah i didn't know his real name until i was 30 oh i just was always i was jj you know what i mean but until you learned his name he's like oh okay he does comedy yeah he does that's how it started but who knew he did comedy i know i I didn't. So now, are you moving out of Conan?

You just sort of occasionally? Well, because of all those shows that I do, I don't have the time to be over there as much as I used to. But anytime I have time, I go over there, and we always knock out bits. All the time. Anytime. And we always stay in contact.

We go back and forth and be like, yo, should we do this and do that? There's a lot of good comments on that. Like Lori Kilmartin's great comment. She's great.

That's fantastic. Kylie. Kylie. That's my man. Me and Kylie used to do bits all the time where I wrote stuff and he would read it for me

because I couldn't read all the black shit I wrote. So it'd be great if this white guy read it for me. Yeah, really white guy. it for me yeah really white guy yeah yeah yeah so Kylie we did open mics together Kylie in Boston man oh and like 90

I was still in college even like right after college like fucking late 80s dude yes I call I call him my sensei he's my sensei and and Jose Arroyo he's a great great writer i call him my sensei and and now is your mom still alive yeah yeah and then how's my mom hey mama how does she uh how's she feeling about everything man she's ecstatic man my mother is she don't work no more man so she she she chilling i gotta work Yeah, it worked out. Yep. Getting that bucket of ice and those bologna sandwiches, it paid off. That fucking salami paid off.

She made it. She is. She kept me alive. Yeah. She fed me. Paid off. I'm going to give her all the salami she wants right now, man. And she's in Chicago still? Yeah, she's in chicago still yeah she's in

chicago she's chilling my son dylan you got a son yeah it's 13 it's my son 13 yeah yeah where's are you married yeah no no i'm not married just had one of them yeah i had one we was i mean you know yeah you know i've heard yeah you've heard. I've heard stories of that whole baby thing. Yeah, but yeah, shout out to my son, Dylan. He's in Chicago, too? Yeah, he's in Chicago, too. With his mom? Yeah, with his mom.

And you get along with her? Yeah, we good people, man. Yeah, shout out to Tamika. That's my girl. Yeah, she's mad. She hold it all down. You know, she holds it down. You know, when I'm gone, yeah, she keeps it together.

But you guys are together or you're not together? No, no, we're not together. Yeah, yeah. But we're just good friends. You're always there for the kid? Always there. We're good friends. We're great parents.

There's no beef, no nothing. Does the kid come out? Yeah, absolutely. He comes out here a lot. He comes out here. I go there. Yeah, we just went to the White House. I took him to the White House. Yeah? Yeah, absolutely. Comes out here a lot. Comes out here, I go there, yeah. We just went to the White House. I took him to the White House, yeah.

Oh, yeah? What did you do over there? Well, Obama had the cast of Black-ish come read stories, Easter egg stories for the kids. Oh, yeah? Yeah, it was great. We sat up. We went in the white house and walked around oh man just with obama yeah it's crazy town that was when uh they had to lock the white house down

there was a shooting going on that same time we was there the guy showed up on the in yeah the easter sunday we was there oh really okay and you were locked down yeah they locked in the white house they locked the whole white house, the whole lawn and everything. Couldn't let anybody leave or nothing. Felt pretty safe, I guess. Probably about the safest place you could be. Man, there was snipers everywhere, Jack. I kept trying to keep all the women from walking in front of the police.

I wanted them to stay focused. I was like, get your ass out of here with your mini skirt on and shit. He's got to focus on shit. And what was Obama like for you? Man, he's real cool. He is, right? He's real cool, yeah. Easy going dude.

Man. Laid back. Super chill, you know. He's very disarming because you're like, that's the fucking president. He's like, what's up, man? You're like, oh, we're that way? Okay. Oh, we're cool. Yeah, we're cool yeah yeah okay i didn't

know we were going to be cool we're just going to talk like people you had him at your house yeah yeah and i was surprised because right away he's like yeah what's he's making fun of me in here and i'm like oh that's how it's gonna go all right cool all right just a guy i guess just a guy that he's the most powerful guy in the world, but you're just hanging out. Talking about us. Talking about me. Yeah, yeah. All right.

Yeah, no, no. He was great, man. And yeah, we all went up there. And yeah, it was great, man. Anthony Anderson and the whole cast and all of us went up there. It was great. That show's doing well. Yeah, Black is just doing really good, man.

Do you have any, are you writing on that too? Or do you have any input on it? No, I wasn't even supposed to be on there. I went over there to write. Oh, really? Yeah, he hired doing really good, man. Are you writing on that too? Or do you have any input on it? No, I wasn't even supposed to be on there. I went over there to write. Oh, really? He hired you to write? No, I was interviewing to write. And the guy that was supposed to play the character I play

didn't show up. And I ended up playing him. That's how it is. Let me tell you something. Anything I've ever auditioned for, I've never got. Never. It's always been all vibes that I had with people with Conan, my Angie Tribeca with Steve Carell.

I wasn't even supposed to be on that show neither. Steve Carell wrote the part for me. He didn't even, it wasn't even a part for me. He wrote me into that show with the blackish. I just went to the world. You went there to interview as a writer, and the guy they hired to play the part didn't show up. Right.

And me and Kenya knew how to. I have no idea. Me and Kenya had an idea of how this character should be because the character's based off of him. And he just asked me, yo, shit. He was like, man, you should do it. Like me, this lady who thought asked me, yo, shit. He was like, man, you should do it. Like me, this lady who thought of me, her name was Tamara Goines,

she thought of me and was like, yo, you should get Deonna right over there and then that's how it all went down and he didn't show up and I went and I played the guitar. Okay, well, I'm not gonna be specific here, but let this be a lesson to those who it concerns

that maybe you show up on time. lesson to those who it concerns that maybe you show up on time. Maybe time. Just maybe. You might want to show up on time. I'm not being specific. You dirty guy.

You are crazy well there's gonna be a lot more parts open I tell you that much that's something that we have a problem with I was lost coming here today you came on time oh god that's so funny well i'm real happy for you and i'm glad we did this it was a good time

it's a great talk man this is great man thank you can people see me on social media whatever go ahead yeah it's at d-e-o-n-c-o-l-e on instagram and twitter yeah good i don't fuck with the facebook you i'm on there yeah me. I don't even fuck with the Facebook. You? I'm on there. Yeah, me too. I don't pay attention. It's like every time I get up some followers, then some new shit happen. Yeah. It's like I get like 50,000 people, and then they go, oh, that shit is whack.

Now we over here. And I go, god damn it. Then I go over there, and I try to build up followers. And then they're like, oh, that's old. It's never ended. It's to the point where i'm like i'm tired of that shit yeah well i'm well i'm happy you're not periscoping this right now and i don't even know what the fuck snapchat is

i hate that i'm on it but i don't like it at all why would you take a picture of something that's only gonna be up for a little bit and then that's it like if i'm taking pictures of something that's only going to be up for a little bit. And then that's it. Like if I'm taking pictures of something, just something that I want to keep. Yeah. I don't, I, you know, I,

sadly, I think most of it's designed for 12 year olds and we're just fucking all immature enough to think we got to keep up with this shit. This is true. Everybody wants pictures and shit. I tell people, you got to learn how to live in the present. Yeah.

A lot of people don't know how to live in the present yeah but how is that how is i want everyone to know i'm living in the present i i want everybody to know i'm living there look at me i'm in the present right now and i'm sharing it with you look at me drinking coffee in the now hashtag in the now mark mirren everybody that's the new show in the now in the now all right buddy thanks man love man good times right funny fucking guy smart guy good stand-up okay and as always go to wtfpod.com for all your wtf pod needs get some posters we made some new uh well we refilled the posters that are there and uh check the tour dates check the catalog get the howl app so you can get the the full archive whatever you need to do all All right? Okay, I'm going to play my Les Paul. Boomer lives! Get almost almost anything. Order now. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details.

Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly.

This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative.