WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 991 - Anderson .Paak

Episode Date: February 4, 2019

Long before Anderson .Paak was getting nominated for Grammy Awards, well before his collaborations with Kendrick Lamar, Snoop Dogg and Q-Tip, before he was releasing solo albums to critical acclaim, he had already walked away from the music business and had to be talked into returning. Anderson tells Marc why it was such a struggle to establish himself without conforming to what the record labels wanted him to sound like and why he didn’t really see a place for himself in the industry until Dr. Dre told him, “You’ve got that pain in your voice.” Anderson also explains what the dot in his name represents. This episode is sponsored by Aspiration, SimpliSafe, and the New York Times Crossword App. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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18 plus subscription required. T's and C's apply. Lock the gates! all right let's do this how are you what the fuckers what the fuck buddies what the fuckadelics what's happening i'm mark maron this is my podcast wtf welcome to it how's it going how was the game for you yesterday i I have to be honest, and I've said this before without condescension, it means nothing to me. I should say it meant nothing to me, but I am recording this Sunday, hours before the big game, that many of you spent your day enjoying, yelling about, eating things, judging commercials, armchair quarterbacking, whatever. Doing opioids and missing half of it.

I don't know. I don't know what your Super Bowl day looked like. But I spent the day cooking. And if everything went as planned yesterday, because it hasn't happened yet, I, uh, had a little birthday party for Sarah, the painter here at the house. And I cooked a lot of Indian food during the day. I like to cook, man. I, I mean, I, I know, you know, that I do, if you listen to this, if you're still with me, but, uh, I like to, when you, you have to cook for people and you want to try something

new and you, the whole, the whole process of reading recipes putting them together in your head figuring out how they are supposed to work what it's going to look like what it's going to taste like it's very exciting because you can spend hours doing that and if you make a very complicated recipe and you spend hours doing it and you're very excited about it and then it doesn't taste quite good, the intensity of the disappointment is profound to the point where sometimes you just throw the entire pot of whatever you made right in the garbage or disposal. You know, like you're getting back at it.

I've had that happen. Did I mention Anderson.Paak is on the show today? Anderson.Paak is a hip-hop artist. As you know, hip-hop is not necessarily my thing, but I have nothing against it. If you look in my music, back before Apple Music, where you actually had to upload all your shit, I've got a lot of hip-hop in there, but it's pretty mainstream stuff. A lot of Kanye, a lot of Jay-Z. I've got some pharrell in

there but i got i go back i got some cypress hills some ghetto boys i got the wu-tang you know i got uh you know i i've got i definitely you know have stuff you know i had a open mic eagle here to sort of school me on the uh newer kind of alternative hip-hop i i'm not adverse to it i enjoy it i listen to it i've got all the kendrick records yeah i mean i listen but it's not fundamentally my go-to stuff i've got some gil scott heron not theoretically not class not hip-hop but inspirational right kind of moved in that direction kind of you know you know i'm saying but like as you know when i talk to the beast beastie boys i don't know my history i don't know any of you know where it came from or or how but i enjoy it so anderson pack i uh i actually did a thing with

him i had to apologize to him for that he was at an event that i hosted for uh flea over at the silver lake conservatory he was the headlining act and I didn't know who he was, and I believe I brought him up as Andrew Pack, so I'm going to set that straight with Mr. Pack, but the fortunate thing about having Anderson on or having the opportunity to have him on, I mean, he is nominated for Best Rap Performance at the Grammy Awards, which is this Sunday, February 10th, for his single Bublin, and the new album Oxnard is out now. But he's only got like four or five records out. So I was really able to get up to speed and enjoy it and get it. And he's great.

He's a great artist. And he's a guy who started out as a player. I mean, like a player, like a musician, like a drummer. I was excited to talk to him. And I never know how it's going to go. I didn't really know him, but we had a great conversation. So Anderson Pack is my guest, and it was fun. I need these conversations, man. I've been shooting glow, and if I go without talking to people,

like I did a couple interviews yesterday, and I just, I need them. I can get way up into my head. I can really spin some shit. I can really spin, you know, existentially spin myself, corkscrew right into the dead center of the dark earth. And, you know, it's just the nature of who I am, you know. And I don't want to bring anyone down with me. And, you know, sometimes I'll do that in my personal life. So when I just talk to new people and engage in these things,

I'm thrilled to be out of myself and into somebody else's life and stories. So it's been good lately. I actually had a weird thing happen. There's weird decisions we make. I'm sort of hung up on a couple of things like i was like i was interviewing someone in here the other day oh before i get into that i first of all my dates uh coming up at dynasty typewriter are almost sold out uh i have you know dates coming up on the february 10th are Sundays, the 17th, the 24th, and March 17th at the Dynasty Typewriter here in L.A.

But they're close to selling out. You can go see if you can get tickets. But I think all those shows are about sold out. I don't know about the shows in Aspen, March 23rd at the Wheeler Opera House. I don't know where that's at. Or Boulder, the Boulder Theater on March 24th. I don't know where those are at. But all the Boulder Theater on March 24th. I don't know where those are at, but all my UK dates are selling very well. If you're in the UK or Ireland, those are coming up and they're on sale now.

The Lowry in Salford, England, Royal Festival Hall in London. The Lowry is April 4th, Royal Festival Hall, April 6th. The Rep Theater in Birmingham, England, April 8th in the Vicar Street, Vicar Street in Dublin on April 11th Royal Festival Hall April 6th the Rep Theater in Birmingham England April 8th in the Vicar Street Vicar Street in Dublin on April 11th they're selling well but I think there's still tickets so so go grab those so that's done what else oh I'm not trying to hide anything from you people when you read about me being attached to something a movie or or or something you just you never know until these things are real when they're real.

Like I know I was in the Joker movie. I know that I did that. I know that I walked down a hallway a few times with Robert De Niro talking to him into a room where Joaquin Phoenix was. And I know that happened. I know I was on that set. I don't know how much of that will make the movie.

You never know these things, but I know it'll happen. There was an announcement about a movie that I don't even necessarily need to draw attention to because I don't, you know, I don't know. I don't know if it's going to happen or it's not. So I'm not holding back. I'll let you know when I know it's for real. One thing I do know, and I don't want to give you too much information, uh i did i had someone on my show on this show coming up and i did his show and that was a very big deal it's a very big deal and it's exciting uh there might be some hints of it out there but i'm not able to promote it yet but it's very you know it's sort

of uh it's sort of a big fucking deal and And that's all I'm going to tell you. I don't want to give it away. And that's coming up. And that reminds me of what I was going to tell you. So I had a guest in here. And it's weird how, you know, sometimes you're trying to do the right thing and it could turn into a disaster. I had a guest in here and I finish up with her in here. And right as I turn the mics off, I hear my fucking fire alarm going on in the house. So I'm like, wait here.

Let me go check this out. I run into the house. I run all over. I smell for smoke. No smoke. I run all over the downstairs. I go upstairs, look for smoke, smell. No smoke.

I run down into the crawl space in the basement where there's a smoke alarm, smell, no smoke. I'm like, what the fuck is happening? I turn it off with my finger. The fire trucks are not, I don't think they've been dispatched. I have no idea how long it's been and I can't figure it out. I say goodbye to my guest. I go back into the house and then I go into the bathroom downstairs and I realized I had used it. And out of respect for the possibility that my guests might need to use it, I lit a candle. And that's what could have had the entire fire department at my house. The fact that I went to the bathroom and I wanted to be nice, it could have cost the city, you know, thousands of dollars to dispatch.

It cost me a taxpayer and caught, you and i just have to it didn't happen they didn't show up at my door all ready to go and i didn't have to say yeah yeah i'm sorry i just i well i i took it yeah i took a shit and uh i just lit a smelly candle to because i'm sorry yeah but i feel better and i think i did the right thing, but you guys, I hope you, I'm sorry. Yeah. So you can just get back on the truck, but didn't happen. The other thing I was thinking about, if I could, is a denial. This is what I'm sort of hung up on this because it seems to be a problem in the culture we

live in. I'm trying to assess these larger problems through my own lens to understand myself, that people will buy what they believe, even if it's bullshit, despite facts. We all have the mechanism for that. And I got a little obsessed with this the other day because I bought some fish. I bought a nice piece of steelhead, wild steelhead.

I ate half of it. And then a couple of days later, I was looking forward all day to cooking the other half of my slab of steelhead fish. And I get home and I don't have anything else to eat. That's going to be my dinner. And I open it up and it's a little discolored in some places. This is fish.

It's a, you know, steelhead is almost a salmony looking fish. And it was kind of gray in one area, you but i was like is that fat i mean that's probably fat i don't remember noticing it and then there was a little spot that seemed to be growing like it was something on the fish and i'm like that's probably i don't know it's probably all right so and i smelled it and it didn't smell to me in that moment to be terrible so i'm gonna follow through and cook this fucking fish because i want to believe it's okay and i'm cooking it and i like i slice off the little the little patch of weird thing on it you know the the spot that is something it's fish it's not cheese but i'm like you know it didn't smell bad and

there's a gray patch on it i mean what the fuck is wrong with me i wanted so badly to eat that fish and for it to be good that i cooked it all the way through i put it on a plate i took one bite and i spit it out and threw it away and i said what the fuck is wrong with me? Why would I let myself do that? I knew in my heart that it was bad right when I opened the goddamn wrapper that I was wrapped in, but I wanted to believe. But fortunately, today I do not have food poisoning because of my belief, or worse, some sort of botulism could have fucked my whole brain up. I could have botulized my brain into complete stupidity.

And next week, I might believe Pizzagate. The other thing I was thinking about in talking about false equivalence, I'm a little obsessed with the idea of that too, on a personal level. You know, false equivalence is a tactic that, you know, primarily shitty people use or powers that be, you know, to to justify shitty behavior. It's like if a factory is polluting a river and the townspeople are trying to shut it down and the factory owner is like, wait a minute. There are bums that that that live near the river and they pee in the water all the time. Why isn't the town doing anything about that? Right.

False equivalence. Or Trump saying that the people who were beating up Nazis were just as bad as the Nazis. Right. Or another example, Al Gore wants to stop climate change, but he flies on a plane is another classic of false equivalence. A plane is another classic of false equivalence. It is a way somehow to get regular people, again, to feel like they're making a point and that they're smart in condemning progress or doing things that might save us, as opposed to siding with monsters, both corporate and human, for the ongoing destruction of all things that we've grown used to. But again, I'm looking at myself, and where does the appetite for that come from? And I think we all use some version of it in the form of rationalizing our place in life, that if you're dissatisfied about anything, which we all are on some level but you know it can get big it

sometimes it's small sometimes it's big i think people do it every day it's like i could have you know i could have been a rock star if i just you know you know bought an amp you know i could have been a rock star if i just spent a little time with uh you know with an instrument of some kind i could have been a rock star if i knew how to sing you know they're somehow self-jilted or slightly entitled or bitter or or cynical or or lazy or you know dumb justifications for our own failures we all do it like i could like i could have i could have been a painter if I'd just taken those classes in college. But now I don't do anything. I don't do anything.

I just like I sit around and see other people and I judge myself against them because I could do almost anything that anybody else can do. You know, even billionaires. If I just applied myself somehow somehow you probably couldn't have done it there's no reason to make those comparisons if you're not going to do it or you didn't do it you know other than to justify your own anger misery cynicism or bitterness but those i think that kind of mindset if you live in that stuff false equivalencies are very satisfying even if you're on the wrong fucking team or you're fighting for the wrong shit it's like yeah fuck that what about the bums who pee huh dummies still a lot of emails coming in about the steely dan business

yeah i again you know i i've listened to i, Hey 19 stuck in my head for a couple of days, but I'm not in a rabbit hole. I'm just integrated, integrating it into the things I no longer judge and now understand and may even enjoy a little bit. But this is an interesting one. Cause maybe I don't know what I'm putting out in the world. I got an email that a subject line. What the fuck mark dot, dot, dot. If only I'd known you didn't like steely dan the last two years and then the email this changes everything really not really from a 65 year old regular listener

who is over all the hand wringing about aging you're kind of boring us with it at this point katherine am i hand wringing i feel like feel like I'm accepting aging rather well. And how is this connected to the Steely Dan thing? I'm not wringing my hands. I'm experiencing it. And I'm not freaking out about it. I don't know what you're projecting, but you are 10 years older than me.

So maybe you're seeing something I'm not seeing. I hope when I'm your age that I can be where you're at. And if it's too much, Catherine you know i do like steely dan now and i'm okay with my age seriously all right anderson pack it was great i i again like i never know how these things are going to go and and um i was excited because i enjoyed the, but I didn't know how he would be. I didn't, you know, you know,

I never know how anyone's going to be. And, and, uh, it was, uh, I thought it was a great conversation. Uh,

as I mentioned before, he's nominated for the best rap performance at the Grammy awards of Sunday, February 10th for a single bubbling and his new record Oxnard is available wherever you get music. It's a good record. Malibu is a good record. Venice is a good record and he's a good record. Malibu's a good record. Venice is a good record. And he's a good guy. So this is me talking to Anderson Paak.

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Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. or an unhappy customer suing you. That's why you need insurance. Don't let the, I'm too small for this mindset, hold you back from protecting yourself. Zensurance provides customized business insurance policies starting at just $19 per month. Visit Zensurance today to get a free quote. Zensurance, mind your business. You know, honestly, I think I owe you an apology. Why? Do you remember we were on a show together at the Silver Lake Conservatory?

I was hosting that show. Chili Peppers. Yeah, a couple years ago. Uh-huh. And I brought you up as Andrew Pack. Story of my life. But I'm a comic, and I know that's the worst, when you're just waiting there to go on,

and some guy just mangles your fucking name, and you're like, oh, man. You got to work your way up from there. Just disrespect right out of the gate. I am a Grammy-nominated SoundCloud artist. Andrew Pack, ladies and gentlemen. And you called me Andrew Pack. Andrew Pack.

It's better than, man. Yeah. No, I guess, I don't know if you've gotten, it wasn't. I missed it, man. I was going through a lot that day. You were? Yeah. My newest son, he was born that day.

That day? Yeah. So, okay, so you didn't give a shit. Yeah, I didn't give a shit. You didn't even notice me. I was just, you know't give a shit yeah i didn't give a shit you didn't even notice me yeah i was just you know happy to be out out of the hospital for a second and oh how many do you have i have two okay yeah he he's uh he's one and then my oldest is eight oh and that happened that day and he still showed up for the benefit i had to do it man did you mention that i

don't know if you i don't think you did i think you just got in it i think you got on the drums pretty quick yeah i got on drums real quick and uh how'd you get involved with that organization i met flea uh you know of course i'm a huge fan of the chili peppers and uh i think i reached out to flea one time on twitter or something and he was a big fan and oh really started chopping it up from there yeah and then we met over in in south america and we partied with them and you met in South America Yeah, we're on a tour and at Lollapalooza Oh South America. They have a Lollapalooza in South. Yes Every time I hear about shows in South America

There's always like 900,000 people there my god like you do a show and there's a million people talk about real fans Yeah, I mean was it like that. Where were you in? Boys in Brazil Argentina yeah fans yeah i mean was it like that where were you in buenos aires i was in uh brazil argentina yeah uh chile and they come out they come out man they were waiting at the at the uh hotel with you know the whole thing yeah playing arenas uh no was like these this big outdoor situation uh but yeah i've been playing arenas lately though that's crazy i'm in that weird weird uh middle ground where that's a middle ground? Well, no, no, no.

What's next? What do you mean? Entire states? Well, no, yeah, seriously. But, you know, it's like they can't put, they can't hold all the fans in like a, you know, 4,000, 3,000 seater. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You can't necessarily go to the 10,000, 12,000.

So you kind of have to, you're in this kind of- Oh, so what's an arena? Well, I guess it is. I thought arenas were like, you know. 18, 20,000. Me too, but I think they kind of, you know, arenas, whatever. You're in the smaller arenas. Yeah.

Okay, so you're not, you're working up to large arenas. Yeah, like 10K, you know, we're working it up, man. It's like, I do small theaters, like 800, 900 seats. You're like, I'm in small arenas i'm i'm more into miniature arenas yeah um are you we're doing a miniature arena i noticed it i noticed on the new record that you did you sampled rodney dangerfield yeah are you i love that kind of comedy out of nowhere i'm just listening to it i'm like holy fuck that's rodney that's right man one of the best like how do you come up with a Rodney sample?

I just added, like, what? You're just sitting around? I mean, I, like, came up on that. Like, I grew up watching, you know, like, MTV, and I remember he would be on MTV sometimes. I remember he had that movie, Ladybugs. Oh, did he? Where he made his son dress in drag to win the soccer tournament. I don't even remember that.

I remember back to school his son was a sick soccer player but yeah i can't remember the premise but somehow he made he put his wig on his son yeah yeah something so that can they can win the and that that's stuck in your head yeah and then i just remember like you know just we just love watching all the old clips of him and like comedians like uh andrew dice clay yeah it's just no setup it's like boom you know yeah jokes bing bing bing yeah well i think they were i think andrew dice clay was on the rodney dangerfield like uh young comedians show oh he put him on yeah but like you know you're just sitting around the studio and you decide like no it's this we need a rodney joke yeah

yeah yeah i mean i'm always looking for little pieces like that to put in between the songs, but the thing that came in with this album was sample clearances, which I had no clue what was until I got on a major label, and now I just can't throw little clips of surf clips or little random excerpts because they want publishing or they want 30,000.

Shouts out to Rodney Dangerfield's wife. She liked the song, so she cleared it, you know? But that was the only one that fucking ended up making the album because everything else, you know, was so expensive. Oh, really? So you actually, you had to send her the song? Yeah, yeah. So I got all these people, you know, when you're doing your album,

you know, once it's done. Which song was it? It was Trippie. Oh, okay, okay. Featuring J. Cole. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I put that on there um i love what he's saying because you know i can relate to that you know he's oh he's talking

about he's no ladies man like right you know one time a girl told me come over there's nobody home i went over there was nobody home that was fire and then and then a soul song comes in. I think it's so awesome. And the J. Cole's on that song. And I remember when we were making the song, he was talking about how when he went to, in high school, he was the big man on campus. He had all the ladies.

And then when he went to college, this big college, he was a nobody. He didn't play ball or nothing. And all the other guys were getting all the girls and, you know. And he knew the feeling. Yeah, we could relate. So it set the tone. Yeah.

I just love that Rodney's wife had to sit there and listen to it. Yeah, she's like, I'm feeling this. All right. Go ahead, man. Use them. 30,000, we'll give it to you. 30,000! Nah, nah, nah.

That's the most that record's ever made. And you know, he was on the- Carson? Yeah, it was on the- Carson? Yeah, it was a Carson. You didn't have to clear it with NBC? I hope they cleared it. I hope they did due diligence. I'm pretty sure no one's coming after me.

So that's a real problem, though, in terms of like you really- It can be a problem. You used to not worry about it and just take the hit? I mean, didn't people come after you? Well, we weren't making any money enough for people to really care. It wasn't really on the radar enough. Which records like before venice malibu venice oh even those even yeah those were those had all kinds of little excerpts and samples and stuff and some some people came back but what happens if you don't make the attempt to clear it that's when people get pissed

so you don't clear it and you put it out and you put out for sale then that's when you have people coming out the woodworks like uh i want all my bread yeah you made a lot of money from them and all this stuff so they you know not everybody has stamina to go to court and all this stuff and sometimes you can work it out but it's just so much easier to do that stuff before but then it takes time and these are all the new things i never thought about i thought didn't you have some hits on malibu you did oh yeah oh yeah yeah but you didn't have any samples in there i mean uh we we definitely definitely had some samples um but we were the clearing process was just you know we we did a lot of the clearing after the fact hey man what's up i gotta ask you something i mean don't get mad exactly exactly man so my lawyers i've all been a fan of your shit and uh i use some of it is it

cool man i mean three tours later i just got back from south america everything's lovely on this end but i just want to know it's like but i guess that like i mean you don't you don't lean too heavy on it i mean you do like you got a real band yeah that's what we're about yeah yeah i mean it's like a different like because bringing the bands back to hip hop. Is that happening? Is that a movement? I mean, I'm pushing for it, man. You know, there's no one playing an instrument, really,

that's coming out of hip hop, per se. Yeah. And, you know, rock and roll, God bless, you know, its soul, you know, and it did so much for years. But, you know, now the biggest genre, everything is revolving around hip hop now, you know, its soul, you know, and it did so much for years. But, you know, now the biggest genre, everything is revolving around hip-hop now, you know? But you're saying that this is relatively new to just use a full-on band?

Well, I think hip-hop in the core of its foundation was built off of not having instruments, not being able to afford instruments, so working with what you have. So we want to make a song, but we don't necessarily have keyboards or anything, so we're going to make loops from vinyls, and we're going to put two turntables together

and literally make our own loops in the park and have a party, and we're going to start busting over that. So I think the foundation of it was always live music because they were rapping over these breakbeats, funk and soul, and even like new wave and all kinds of different stuff, whatever was out, you know? And so all those are real instruments. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Right.

So, but I think now it's like, you know, people now when they see instruments, it's almost like, yuck. Really? They want to see light shows and they want to see like. They just don't care they just content yeah and they want to make sure you look cool and and you know what was he dressing like and is he sexy or she wasn't that i don't think all music is like that but i'm saying like that's a big part of what we're competing against you know big music well i mean there's not that no one's really that interested in the guy stepping up doing a guitar solo anymore they don't care just like you know yeah how many years did we do that though you know like it's I mean, there's not, no one's really that interested in the guy stepping up doing a guitar solo anymore.

They don't care. It's like, you know? Yeah. How many years did we do that though? You know? Like it's blues, it's, you know, like you said, you're a blues guy, you're a rock and roll guy. Those dudes ran the industry forever. Yeah.

No, I get it. But there's a limit to guitar solos. I'll admit there, there, there comes a point where you're like, all right, let's move on a bit. Yeah. Yeah. But there's a limit to a dude just, you know, screaming on a mic in front of a dj too yeah so uh you know that's that's where i'm at with i'm like i come from i i started playing drums first that's my foundation so

but you grew up you grew up in oxnard so they take you it took you through you know two cities to get to your home city yeah you had to make some money first. And you decided that. I couldn't come back broke. No, but I mean the titles. You thought. Oh yeah, yeah, that's what I mean.

You thought, well Venice and Malibu, people are going to want, they're interested in that and then you're going to throw Oxnard in when you're a little more comfortable.

Let's see. I got more eyes on me, so you know, I got to put the city on. It is like Venice, Malibu, Oxnard. Yeah,

but like, so you grew up that, how far, I don't even, like I don't have a, Malibu, Oxnard. But like, so you grew up there. How far, I don't even, like, I don't have a, is that by Irvine? Where is it? No, absolutely not. You go to a one-on-one north and you just keep going until you start saying, where the fuck am I? You still. Until it starts to smell funny. Oh, sorry.

Yeah. That's all right. Yeah. So you just, yeah, you hit the one-on-one. Until it starts to smell funny. Yeah, yeah. What the hell is that smell? And that's where I'm from.

That's Oxnard? Yeah. Why does it smell like that? It's produce. It's ran by produce. So you got cilantro, strawberries, onions hit the one on one. Until it starts to smell. Yeah, yeah. What the hell is that smell? And that's where I'm from. That's Oxnard? Yeah. Why does it smell like that? It's produce. It's ran by produce. So you got cilantro, strawberries, onions. Oh, that's it? Anything can grow there.

Well, that's good smell. That's not terrible, right? No, it's great. It's, you know, but if you're used to, you know. But if they're manuring it, then it's bad, right? So you get some cow shit smell too or no? Yeah, absolutely. You're better.

How'd you end up in Oxnard? How'd your folks end up there? Oh, man. Well, our story starts in Korea. Oh, is that... We're going to follow your tats? We're going to follow your arm. You got your whole life story tattooed on your arm?

Oh, so far. I got it up to a certain point. Looks like he's been there for a while. He's going to have to add some. Yeah, right? He made it look kind of vintage, right? Yeah. Son of a bitch.

It's not vintage? He charged me fucking 5,000 to make it look old. How old is that? I just got it. Come on. Yeah. Oh, I'm sorry. No, no, no, no, no.

I'm just cursing out the tattoo artist, I guess. It looks like that sort of old sailor style green there. Like you've been there for a while. Like I did spend a couple trips. Yeah. It's weathered. So it starts in Korea. Starts in Korea.

The yin yang, that's a flag? That's a Koreanorean flag yeah uh my mom was born in korea during the war so she was an abandoned kid her and my my my uncle were um they pursue maybe like an uh someone in the service and my grandmother oh so your grandmother swept with the american gi kind of perhaps maybe a sailor right and raised up my mom and my uncle for as long as they could and then abandoned them and from what i hear there was a mass like uh i don't know if it's not genocide but they were going around and kind of getting rid of all the mixed breed kids at this time that the that the americans left behind yeah really in south korea

yes well this time this is during the war so So it was, you know, things- Not for grabs. Yeah, exactly. Got it. But yes, so then there was a dude that went around and actually found my mom and my uncle and got them to an orphanage. In Korea? In Korea. At which point my adopted grandparents adopted my mom and my uncle and got them back over

to Los Angeles Compton at the time uh-huh and so my grandmother and my grandfather were also in the military so they were you know flying around and traveling uh-huh and picked up some kids did you have a relationship with them she they both passed before you were before I was born um but Compton that's where your mom grew up the Compton she grew up in Compton Los Angeles 50s this is when Compton's that's where your mom grew up? So the Compton, she grew up in Compton, Los Angeles, 50s. This is when Compton's pretty much just like farm territory, suburb. Right. Wasn't even connected to the waterline.

Unincorporated. Yeah. It wasn't even, I don't even consider Los Angeles. Right, right. Primarily African American? No. No. It was a suburb.

It was whites, you know. Really, no one was really out there. It was like farms. It was farms, yeah. But it was a suburb. And if you were out there it was like farms it was farms yeah but but it was a suburb and if you if you had if you were out there you you were you know you were doing pretty good yeah um and so uh she stayed out there uh and pretty much was raised in la up until her teens and then eventually moved to to oxnard ventura county on her own um yes with with her

with her with her dad and her mom oh so they all moved out of compton were they in the farm business my my uh my grandfather was a pastor he started pastoring after he got out of the service and started church in oxnard so they all moved out there that's where he found his flock yes lord he found his flock he found his congregation if you will you can tell you never been to church it. Oh, who calls it a flock? I didn't make that up. You knew what I was talking about. Yes, I did.

Yeah, his congregation. That's right. He found a place where he could peddle his God wares. Peddle. Yeah, so they're in Oxnard. Work the Jesus hustle. Work the Jesus in you and me. Spread the good word of the gospel.

Uh-huh. He also wrote poetry. He had some poetry books as well. Yeah. Was he good? He was good. He had a way with words. Yeah.

Do you have those books? I do. Yeah? I do. Was it good? It was good stuff. Was it religious? Yeah, it was.

Uh-huh. But it was, you know, smooth. Yeah. Did you put any of that in the songs? Yes, of course. Any of that on Oxnard? Are you kidding me? Are you kidding me?

So they got to Oxnard and you know she was out there she met my pops yeah now my pops is also in the Navy that's the other side of your arm

my pops used to work up on the fighter jet so I don't know if you see that he's got the fighter jet right there yeah it's fighter jet I got it

so you got Korea on one side of the arm and this one my pops was a twin from Philadelphia and Philly from Philly yep so twin from Philadelphia. Philly. From Philly, yep.

So he grew up in Philly. Was he flying them or fixing them? He was fixing them. Fixing jets. During Vietnam? Uh-huh. Yes, I believe he was. Yeah.

In Philly. Well, he was stationed out in Korea as well for a little bit. And then eventually went back to Port Hueneme, which is the base where I'm from. They met out there. Oh, so it's on the water? It must be. Yes. Yeah, it's a beach town.

I didn't realize that. I'm an idiot. So it's a beach town. I mean, I should know a little bit. I don't even know where the Inland Empire is really. IE? Yeah. I'm not even sure.

Okay. All right. There's not much going on. I don't go west. I wouldn't leave this house if I was you. I would take mushrooms and I would stay here. Well, the mushrooms are behind me, but maybe, maybe I'll leave it open. But I've done them before, it's just not here.

But I think I saw this years ago. I saw this house when I was on mushrooms. Yeah? Yeah, come full circle. Isn't it crazy how God will show you a little glimpse of your life? Are mushrooms part of your process? No, I put that behind me as well. You did?

Nah, I mean, I'll do, you know, it just depends. The natural stuff, yeah, you know. Some people will do it just to clean out the pipes. Yeah, it's called like a reset. Yeah, yeah. When you take it, it's like, oh, yeah, I needed that. But then I meet these crazy cats who are like, you know, some of these dudes are doing these micro doses of acid.

No, that's too much. Well, but they say they don't feel it, but they're doing it every day and they look a little jangly, you know, kind of these dudes are doing these micro doses of acid. No, that's too much. But they say they don't feel it, but they're doing it every day and they look a little jangly, you know? Yeah. They're kind of wide open. They're fried. Yeah, a little bit. Yeah.

But they're like, I'm not depressed. I'm like, yeah, but you're not even here, bro. Exactly. Like, you know what today is, man. So you, okay, so how many kids in your family? You're growing up in Oxnard. Your dad's like out of the military, on the pension. Yep.

My mom, this is, by the time she got to me and my little sister, it was her second one. Her first husband, she had my two older sisters. And then she said, done with you. Boom, boom. He's out? He's out. Got this dude from the Navy from Philly. Boom, boom.

Had me and my little sister. And then she was done with him and I had a stepdad for a little bit. Oh, yeah? Yeah. And that didn't last too long. What happened to your real dad?

My pops, he died. He passed away, I want to say 2006. Did you have a relationship with him? I didn't have the... I had... When I was seven years old,

he went off to prison. He got really addicted to drugs and went to prison for assault and battery on my mom. And he went off to prison he got really addicted to drugs and uh went to prison for assault and battery on my mom and he went he went away uh after that for about 14 years do you remember that did you have to live through that i did remember it um i don't remember anything other than um uh the act when it actually happened i i was getting a babysitter we were chilling and we heard screaming and

went outside and he was on top my mom was blood everywhere in the streets yeah and uh he was really back in the house oh yeah ran back in the house and that was last time i saw him go back in the house but he's doing out in the front yard yeah yeah he wanted the neighborhood to see but not you i guess he thought he didn't know that his kids were there so when we came outside and we're just like dad what's going on because before that i thought everything was straight like my mom was really good at keeping the business away from the kids you know what was he on what was he strung out on um you know i think uh what my mom uh it was like it was she was really bad alcoholic and i don't know exactly what drug maybe i'm pretty sure it might have been like you know maybe crack maybe cocaine maybe some other shit but i think honestly it was just the wrong influences you

know yeah bad bad uh bad crowd blues the blues man you know he he went straight up bad crowd you know and then when you and then when you got the blues you're gonna blame it on the it really was man he got kicked out of the the navy for for weed or something honorable or you know they they honorable just started so he had them. So he had the blues. Yeah, he had the blues. Yeah. And so after that. Philly style.

Philly style, man. So he was, it was downhill after that. He, if he couldn't work on the planes and stuff, he wasn't. Right. So he went to prison. Went to prison. And then you didn't see him. I didn't see him after that.

And then when he got out, we kept in touch for a little bit, but I think he knew he was about to pass. So he was really adamant about trying to get in touch with me. But I was, you know, doing my thing doing my thing yeah and and just getting into music but i was i was talking to him we talked a few times did that feel like closure i mean it did it did yeah on both of ours on both our parts so you had that yeah i was just like you know i love you man and i'm i was older now so i kind of see like how it is when you when you grow up and anything can happen like in life so it's like yeah once you know if you up and anything can happen like in life so it's like yeah once you know if you're still alive you're like damn man you know sorry about that

whole shit i was thinking about this today like how many lives i've lived like you know you got one life but you know if you've lived in a couple different places you start to realize that you have more than one in a way so is your mom still around yeah oh that's nice yeah she gets to see your success she's got a crazy story too yeah yeah your stepdad was all right yeah my stepdad was cool it's kind of a twisted situation with that too but my mom and my stepdad ended up going to prison as well now for what uh so when i was in my senior year they both went into prison for security. Fraud? I don't know if it's security.

It might be security fraud. What is it? They got caught up with it pretty much long story short. They weren't paying taxes. They owed a bunch of money. Right. Blue collar shit. Yeah. In Ventura County.

But they gave them a crazy sentence like 15. And this is the first offender. But they had to serve seven and a half. Holy shit. Exactly. So one of those situations. They to serve seven and a half. Holy shit. Exactly. So one of those situations. They both served seven and a half years? My stepdad served one year or less, and it's because he started running his mouth and trying to get deals and stuff.

Throwing your mom under the bus? Yeah, pretty much. Yeah. So we lost connection after that, during that whole time. I think that's earned. He earned that, for sure. Yeah, he did. For sure.

But, you know, fuck it it you know um i've never been to prison well good and so you don't have to go i don't know what the fuck's going on in his mind but i don't think that was the best choice i don't talk to him too much but i love him you know like i love him for for what he did for being around you know for that time when my pops wasn't there and then he then my mom got with him and then he was he was a male figure that was around i thought he was an asshole but he was around but they both go away when you're like in high school yeah so who's who's watching my sisters oh you got they're older yeah my two older sisters um were married are still married and they're they they quit what they're doing they come back and and uh take me and my little sister and we all kind of live together for a

little bit until i turn 18 and then I go off and... And do the thing? Yes, and I started my flock. I joined my flock. You found your flock, your congregation. Yes. When do you start with the music? Because you started,

you weren't doing old style hip hop when you were in high school, right? You were playing? Hip hop was everything since I was six years old. It ran my world. It did. It was everything.

Yeah, like Snoop Dogg, Dr. Dre, Tupac, all these people that was, along with Nirvana and Offspring and Foo Fighters. I'm 33, so I'm like an MTV kid. So you got it all. This was the music of life. Right, everybody. There's no color lines.

Yeah, when you went to school, it's like who knew every word of the song? That was what we did for Hobbies. Whatever song. It wasn't like you didn't have to pick sides. No, no, no. We were all listening to the same thing. Isn't that weird?

That's what MTV did, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. It really sort of brought everything together. It was the channel, if you will. This is the portal. If it's coming through here, it's lit. It's dope. We're playing stuff. Now there's coming through here, it's lit. It's dope. We're playing stuff.

Now there's all kinds of different channels. Right. But at that time, I never really thought about it like that. You have R&B people. You have rock people. But it seemed like when I was a kid, before MTV, you had your rock people. You had your disco people. But they were different worlds.

And it seems like I never really thought about it but mtv sort of brought it all together i mean whether you agree with the the premise of the thing or yeah it was in your face yeah but it was all different so you could you were exposed to everything yeah i also grew up in so like socal west coast kid yeah you know the the people around me were into a lot of listening to everything sure chili peppers yeah uh these these like the my teachers you know like even in school like you know what's counting crows like you know yeah rem like people these are what my teachers were listening to you know like and they would play the shit and those were the cool teachers yeah like let me put you into some shit do you know rem yeah yeah yeah everybody hurts now fill out your scantron and turn it in.

That was the English teacher? You thought that was English? No, I mean like. Oh, English literally. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it was. Seriously, man. I don't see no math teacher giving you the REM.

Nah, the English teachers were the ones. Sure, sure. History maybe. History, but yeah, yeah. The classes that required a little individuality in their presentation exactly they you get to see a little bit of taste with it with the working way so when'd you start playing drums though i started playing drums in when i was 12 so yeah i was i was i was uh in the hip-hop doing stuff beating around on the tables and just beat boxing

and break dancing everything and then eventually i was like i want to play drums and i got in the middle school and they had that was the only thing like, I want to play drums. And I got into middle school, and that was the only thing that they had left to play. I joined a school band. I wanted to play sax. No more saxophones. So then I just saw the... That's interesting.

So you wanted to play like the old style... I wanted to serenade and I wanted to get some cheeks. Yeah, with the saxophone. The sax, dude. I could pull up anywhere, play. What was being played in the house? Frankie Beverly and Maze, Earth, Wind & Fire, Curtis Mayfield. Yeah. sax dude i can pull up anywhere play what was being played in the house uh frankie beverly and maze earth one and fire curtis mayfield yeah uh uh new edition michael jackson stevie wonder

oh yeah stevie wonder was huge in my house uh prince a little bit but it was kind of like you know that box that you that room you go like don't ever go in there yeah you know that was the that was like prince in my mom yeah like he's weird oh really but but she liked it yeah you know yeah it was it was like dang it was kind of like you don't go there but it was there you can see the cover for sure yeah yeah and my stepdad that that was one thing though he was for sure good for he was a prince fanatic so that was how i introduced the prince so and that was unique for the time the way he put music together prince yeah are you kidding me it's great right dude nothing like it i i didn't get hit too older though i didn't i didn't i wasn't you know i

wasn't more michael jackson you know sure wonder yeah my palate. But when I got older, I saw him like, oh, this is actually the dude. He is the golden child. How he came in? Like, he came in the game young as fuck. Yeah. Doing it his way on the androgynous tip. Yeah. And you see everybody was like, there was no rules.

You know, you're dressing with the makeup, tight, everything. But black dude coming in, I don't give a fuck. I'm prettier than your finest girlfriend and I can play every instrument and I'm producing and I'm telling the label fuck off

I'm doing this shit you loved him dude punk he was punk knew everything everything and he was only

three inches tall just a little guy and that's why he was that talented all that condensed talent had a lot to prove man you got a lot to prove man

you ain't taking no shit when you're that short you're riding motorcycles Yeah, you know your long purple coats exactly man and man I just I trip out on how experimental and how like New wave and rock his early stuff was like, you know, it's just I trip out on some of the The content as well what he was talking about he's got a song called Sister where he's talking about getting turned down by his sister

and fucking his sister and that's how he got so weird yeah that's what did it she's the reason for my sexuality is that a real story

my sister never gave a shit you need to play that song I don't know play music on it I got it it's a song on Dirty Mind yeah classic album I don't know if that's but it's a song on a dirty mind yeah classic album one i don't know

if that's but it's one of those ones where you're like is that true it might be it makes a lot of sense because i learned like i always assume that when i talk to to songwriters which i do sometimes you know uh that every song they write is about them and then i learned it's not it's not a dude down the street yeah dude down the street a dude i made up exactly you know some you know other point of view that was trying to explore yeah so principal your mind still does yeah yeah it still does so you start playing drums start playing drums and the school i was about to quit because it was boring i didn't want to read music then my then i get to the house my stepdad again he's on the on has a drum kit at the house randomly and i'm like what

the fuck and and i see the drum kit i'm like oh okay a drum kit it was oh so he just had it there and you never you never you just knew it was out in the garage or something he knew i was no no he just got one and he knew i was playing drums yeah uh in in the uh school band but it was like single drum snare and then a bass drum right and he knew i was playing so he's like i'm gonna get a kit and you know show him show him what's up so when i got home from school he was banging on the kit yeah i was like oh yeah and you know um he he was on the kit playing some some drums prints stuff yeah and then so he could play pretty good he could he can he could fool around, enough little basics. And he let me get on the kit.

And I just started messing around. And I've never, nothing ever had ever came that natural to me. It was just like, boom, right away. Like, oh, yeah. You felt it. Figuring it out. And then, boom, I was playing a groove. And then my mom comes out.

She starts dancing. I'm like, okay, this is what I'm going to do. Right then I knew, you know. She never danced like that she just workaholic yeah she came out in her pajamas and was like what the fuck yeah you play drums you play drums now that's exactly what she said I'm like uh yeah it's like all right I got some records I want you to learn how to play this and she started telling me yo play this Archie Bill and the Drills play this you know if you're going how to play this you can play and that's all what other ones a bunch of james brown stuff um uh what else did i play i uh i played a lot of soul and a lot of

whatever was on the radio until my god sister came over and was like you need to go to church and that's where the that's where you're gonna learn how to play those james brown records are good though so good i mean there's like a hundred of them like i keep picking up these old james brown ones and you look at those covers, and you're like, what the fuck is this one? Yes. Just called Hell or something. That was the thing, too.

People could just put out music, like so many, and then the cover art. The best. That's how you pick records now. It's like, this looks sick. You do your own cover art? In a sense, I'm very involved, but I work with artists.

Yeah, yeah. But I'm very into it. Yeah, I worked with Dewey Sanders on the first two, and then this other talented artist, Simone Chilar from Germany. Yeah. I like collage artists. Yeah, yeah. I like mixed media artists.

I love it. I like putting effort into the artwork, because that's how I used to look for music, you know, or even books or anything. You're flipping through those bins. It's sick this can't be corny like look at this shit

pull you right in yeah yeah but you knew when they were corny but even sometimes hell yeah you know but sometimes the corny ones you're surprised

well I mean everyone gets the the laying down the laying down you know that one everybody was doing that so you kind of have to you have to check those out

but that was the thing to do the hey baby covers hey what's up baby cursive writing chest hairs out yeah yeah yeah You have to check those out. That was the thing to do. The Hey Baby covers? Yeah, Hey Baby. Cursive writing. Chest hairs out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you're playing with the James Brown,

then your sister says you got to go to church? You got to go to church. That's where you're going to learn how to play? You're going to find the best of everything there. So I was like, all right. I've never been to church. My mom never really took us like that. No?

And her dad was a pastor? Yeah, that was probably why. He scared her away. Enough of that shit. But she was very, she still is very religious, but she was just a workaholic, honestly. She was never home.

What was her gig? She ran her own produce company. Really? In Oxnard? Yep. Yeah, she started it. Somebody handed it over to her. You want to run this strawberry stand?

Yeah. She was like, fuck it. Yeah, she was dropping out of college and didn't really know what she was going to do. She had kids and she was like, fuck it. Yeah, she was dropping out of college and didn't really know what she was going to do. She had kids and she was like, fuck it. I'll do this. And then it just got bigger and bigger and bigger. Like what?

Berries and? Strawberries. Just strictly strawberries. All strawberries? Yep, yep. And she went and just distributed independently to all the restaurants. And she was doing, at one point, doing Ralph's

and the Cocos and Carol's on it. Oh, really? But yeah. And it was her company? It was her company. No shortage of strawberries in the house? No shortage, you know, but then again, you know, we never had it. We were just like, fuck strawberries, man.

Oh, really? We're done with strawberries. I don't want Cheetos. I want, you know, a cup of noodles. So you go to church? Go to church. She takes me to church and I'm hooked. I'm set on the Lord.

My mind was set on the Lord. That quick? That quick. Really? Yeah, I was like. Had nothing to do with the music? It was the lord my mind was set on the lord that quick that quick really yeah i was like had nothing to do with the music it was the music it was music yeah but then i knew i was like okay how do i get in this you know what's going on okay i gotta get baptized okay i gotta gotta believe gotta believe okay oh yeah okay let's do it yeah yeah and i was just like whatever it takes because i want to i want to be here every day so i can get better at the drums i want to learn these songs i want to play you played in the gospel band in the church.

Yeah. Old school. Yeah, it was contemporary gospel music. I went to like a Southern Baptist church in Oxnard, where Oxnard is mostly Latinos and whites. Yeah. But where I was going to church was probably where all the black population is in the whole city.

Uh-huh. And so we were going and playing you know gospel music standing up and clapping kind of shouting yeah you know people screaming and and running around and dancing and some of the most intense music and energy ever like you know yeah you have your old you know old-school kind of sound and stuff but yeah modern gospel stuff forget about it yeah you'll go through like five genres in one song. Yeah.

You know, switch ups and all these different hits and breaks and grooves you have to hit. Uh-huh. People know what's up about gospel for sure. And so that's where I came up. And you got all that Jesus energy going through it. Got all of it, you know? Yeah. All that spirit. Yeah.

Because you're not supposed to do it for no form and fashion. I remember D'Angelo said that. But it's not supposed to be about you. You know what I'm saying? It is the opposite of like rock and roll like it's like no I need to open myself up let God flow and it's a miracle this is not me y'all your vessel I'm a vessel for God you know that was the whole you know that's how I came up so it was like all right you know like and he felt it you got it I felt it man and also to was it was dope because I got to play with musicians I were like you when you're feeling it too much you know hey calm down yeah

do this they they touch they they have the pocket on their shirt and they play the pocket bro yeah and that's that was like the main thing so to stay in the pocket yeah stay in pocket bro yeah nobody wants to hear all that shit like she used to tell me you're the groove guy not the show off yeah okay you let me go off on the keys all right on the fills drug right you hold down you hold me down all right we need you to hold it down and i'm 12 years old you know so it's like i got all kinds of puberty i got all kinds of shit going on i want to just rock out and that was cool for me it was just like kept me you know gave me that foundation to like work you know follow direction and stuff and working with other people yeah like to you know to get that the unit going right

absolutely the drummer's like so fucking important like there's some guys that can't swing exactly to save their lives it's weird right yeah like and you can you can feel it and stuff but you know i can't play when i try to play like alternative rock, like the white boy type of like more stiff song or like any like that kind of feel, it's hard for me to do that shit. I'm too much swing. You can't help yourself. You know what I'm saying?

It's different. You find the pocket. If I try to play a Metallica song, you know, it probably wouldn't work. Yeah, you're going to play it with a little swing. It's going to have a little too much grease on it. And so it's like, I have a lot of respect in that too. You know, it's like, you know, everybody's got their own groove. Well, it's like the swing, like the rock is you're ahead of it.

And then the swing is you're behind it, right? You're kind of pushing it along. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, even that early rocks. Yeah, exactly. That shuffle. That's a shuffle.

That's blues, you know? Well, yeah. But that's what. Yeah, but that's a shuffle that's blues you know well yeah but that's what yeah but that's totally it you know but it's like even though even the rock stuff you know like especially the old stuff the classic rock that shit got grease to it man it's like oh yeah i'm not playing like oh yeah oh yeah if it's like even like like it was no rolling stones you know like because like because charlie watts is on top of it but like he can really fucking swing he's digging in, bro. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, all those dudes, man.

That thing, that clapping, you know where I saw that? I had to learn how to do that? Yeah. I was watching an interview with Dizzy Gillespie. Okay. Right? And he was just talking about it. And he just started doing that with his hand.

I'm like, I've got to learn how to do that with my hand. Yes, man. I love that, man. Yeah. Do you listen to jazz stuff? Yeah, I do learn how to do that with my hand. Yes, man. I love that, man. Yeah. Do you listen to jazz stuff? Yeah, I do. Yeah. Like, it's wild, right?

It really is, man. It really is, dude. Like, that kind of music. Who's that cat you work with that's sort of a jazz legacy? He's related to Alice Coltrane, and he's a producer. Fly Lotus? Yeah, yeah. Fly Lotus.

Yeah, Fly Lotus. What a Fly Lotus. Yeah, Fly Lotus. What a weirdo. Yeah, I got it. I was poking around stuff that you worked on, and I was like, who's that guy? Yeah, yeah. Because I've talked to Kamasi, and his bass player's name, Thundercat? Yes. It's like, what the fuck?

That's my bro. Yes, Thundercat is a, yeah. Have you worked with him? Yeah, I work with him too much. Honestly, he's one of my best friends. That five-string bass? Mm-hmm. That last record, the double record, the 10-inch,

it's like a funkadelic record? Drunk? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Holy shit, man. He's a maniac. And he's like an anime buff. He watches all the superhero movies. Full-on nerd?

Full-on nerd Full on nerd. Black nerd jazz. Just crazy freak. Well, there's that whole crew of those guys from over there in South Central, right? Yes, yes. Like Kamasi and that whole gang. Their dads are involved. Yes.

They got a whole jazz crew over there. They're like trying not to like get shot at and they're playing jazz music. Yeah. And they're in the anime. Yeah. Can you imagine those cards being dealt to you? Yeah. Well, I mean, it's good. not to like get shot at and they're playing jazz music and they're in the anime yeah can you imagine those cards being dealt to you yeah well i mean it's good it's good it's amazing well i think they think they you know they not unlike you're bringing uh the instruments into hip-hop they they

are fighting for the survival and relevance of jazz absolutely and they single-handedly brought it back they did it's great yes I mean, those Kamasi records, I mean, to put out a record called Epic and it's three fucking records and it's your first record. Pure jazz. Right, but it's sort of like, deal with this.

That's really what it should be. It's like all or nothing. I think so. You know, if you're going to be all the way that, do it. If you're going to be all the way this, do it that way. So did you play the drums all the way through then?

So when you started doing your first stuff, like when were you starting to make records or at least make tapes or whatever you made? Well, in high school, around high school, I made my first demo. By the time I was a senior, I had like my own mixing board, mic, and like a little studio of my own. Like an 8-track mixer? it was a it was one it was

uh a digital rolling mixer so this is like this is around the time pro tools was just coming out there was no real software stuff so it was that in between time so it was actual hard uh board gear like a mixer and you could print straight to cd right it was digital though oh so you had a cd burner uh-huh, yeah. And I was making my demo, and I sold it around school. To make a cover? Yeah. Yeah.

And you were the guy with the stack? I was the dude. How much? Three bucks? I was the ladies' man, you know? Three bucks, you know? Two bucks for the ladies is nothing. Or just give them away.

Actually, here, take this. Yeah, drop them off at some radio station. Exactly. Yeah. A local radio station. What was that one called? What was the first one you made? Oh, my first tape was called Have You Seen My Uncle? My sister was having all these kids.

By the time we were already in high school, I was in high school, but she was older, but she had kids, and they were always at the house. Yeah. That's what I went with. Have You Seen My Uncle? Have You Seen My Uncle. Yeah. Yeah, it was- Was it a big hit at high school it was a big hit you know it was rave reviews then this high school paper yeah wrote a great review on it did they yeah oh that's

nice so you felt it you felt that i was buzzing hard yeah you know i felt it i could feel myself bubbling i knew i was gonna get signed at any minute. Yeah. And I was taking meetings, you know, I was going around and I was going. Were you? Yeah. It's funny because right when my parents got put down, it was like I was getting some, you know, meetings with labels. I was going to Atlanta and I was meeting all the big labels and stuff. Who were they then? Who were the big labels?

It was like Arista and I was meeting with the big labels and stuff. Who were they then? Who were the big labels? It was like Arista, and I was meeting with BMG Publishing, and Atlantic, and all these different, you know. And you were like 18, 17? Yeah, 17, yeah. And they were like, we got one. We got one, yeah. We got a little sucker that we can work and take advantage of pretty much. And, yeah, I was doing all these meetings but

i was very distracted like my both my folks were in prison um my sisters were breaking their necks to try to figure out how they're gonna take care of me and my little sis and i didn't i didn't want to stress them so i was very anxious to move out and try to i thought i was gonna get signed yeah i'm about to be famous i'm about to take care of my family. It's all good. Why didn't you? 10 years later, nothing. Heartbreak, man. The heartbreak. It just wasn't time. It was a timing thing.

I think it was, this is in 2004. And I was in this transitional period of the music industry. From what to what? From CDs and from the way people were hearing music and receiving it, it was all going in a more digital direction. So now it was going into MySpace music. People were downloading.

That was a big thing right back then i remember yeah people are legally downloading oh shit you know like now i can't charge people 30 for you know double disc cds or anything like that you know like they're making a lot of money for the labels are freaking out everything's free yeah but nobody was you know the labels weren't they didn't they could have made a dsp back then you know but they i don't think they were really taking it serious right so all these different companies were coming up what was the big one the because i are known a napster nap yeah napster was going on all these different things you know so um i was just like you know someone that was making beats and making my music and stuff but i wasn't a gangster rapper i didn't have

anything um you know i was really just making youaps about... You weren't a character. And I didn't have anything that they could really market. He wasn't a thug. Right, right. It was boring for them. And this is when, like, in the height of, like, crunk music, Little John and all this stuff. And that's really what they wanted me to make music like.

And I immediately just got turned off by that. Well, it still seems that even, like, on the new record, it seems like almost on a couple of your records you kind of draw this distinction between people who are pretending to be that and people who are really that and you know like in like doesn't even matter anymore right right right exactly exactly man everything's everything's changing absolutely man like uh so you didn't fit the mold and you weren't going to make yourself fit the mold. You just stuck with your own shit or did you actually? I quit. Really?

Yeah. I was like, fuck it. You were done in high school? I was done because I was like, if I'm not signed now, what the fuck? I'm a loser. I'm 18 years old and I don't have a million dollar record deal. It didn't happen. It's not.

It's over. It's over for me. So what'd you do? I got a job. Doing what? A few things. I sold Vans shoes. At a Vans store?

Uh-huh. Uh-huh. And then that didn't work. I worked at a library. Got some free shoes though, right? I got free shoes. I got free everything wherever I worked for sure. I was getting out with the whole thing for sure.

You worked at a library? I worked at a library. It was like a warehouse actually where they sold, it was an online store and I worked at the warehouse where the books were at. So I had to just go around. That's not good, great. Came up on some books though.

But were you bitter? I was a bit bitter. I was a bit like, damn. The times they were hurt was when i was working these shitty jobs and that my boss would be like dude like they would catch wind that i was like did music or yeah and they were like you're talented what are you doing here yeah as they're giving me my schedule you know right and then i just feel like what the am i doing no music you weren't doing anything i wasn't i was like that i'm done i'm just gonna get a job my parents are in prison i want i want some i want some stability

how did music come back uh this girl i was dating yeah she was like you can sing like what are you doing like she was she's a singer as well where'd you meet her church uh-huh yeah uh she was a bit older than me and you stopped playing at the church too i got back into playing the church so i was i was working a job and i ran into the old organist player oh yeah he was like where the fuck you been i was like dude like you know what's going on like it's crazy and then so he's like dude come come back to the church i know you still hopefully you can still play you know and i could always still play drums you know so i went back and started playing and i got back into it like you know at least playing drums right and i was shedding back in with him and it was just me and him and then the girl came back from college and she saw me also too i was really fat growing up

and i had lost a bunch of weight that's that's i put kind of now i'm thinking about i put all my energy towards that losing weight losing weight getting a job how fat were you um i was i was at my heaviest like maybe like 270 that's oh man so yeah and i was short and i'm you know lugging around a lot of weight lugging around moving the weight from state to state and uh yeah i was just over it yeah by the time i got out of high school i was like i haven't gotten laid i was like nothing was i was like everything must change fuck this and you lost all what you was 100 pounds yeah. Lost a bunch of weight, changed the diet up.

I just had bad eating habits. Yeah. I thought it was normal to eat fast food every day. A lot of people do. That's what keeps that industry alive. I just thought

it was a normal thing. Yeah. Never drink water. Yeah. So you lost the weight, got back on the drums. Got back on the drums. College girl comes.

I met the girl. Yeah. She starts giving me a little confidence. Yeah. I'm feeling myself. Boom, I'm back in it. I knocked the dust off the old The girl. Yeah. She starts giving me a little confidence. Yeah. I'm feeling myself. Boom, I'm back in it. I knocked the dust off the old mixing board.

Yeah. I start writing again. But I'm doing it my way. I'm not trying to chase no sound or anything. I'm just writing songs that I've been keeping to myself. Were you singing a lot then, too? I was starting to experiment. So I was finding my voice.

I guess you can call it singing. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And I started singing more. She was giving me a lot of confidence boost to sing and she was a musician as well she was yeah she sang in the church i played drums she was in the praise team uh-huh and she was an excellent singer and so she was like yeah man you need to sing you need to get back into it what the fuck are you doing yeah what happened with that she went to law school and then um i was kind of still like on the fence yeah and i went to culinary

school first cut myself the first day and was bleeding everywhere i was like okay fuck that i'm just gonna go you're gonna be a chef i thought i was gonna be a chef uh-huh i thought i was gonna get a nice job with olive garden figure it out wow that's where all chefs go you know earn my keep go through the the garden yeah if you will and you cut your finger and that was it that was is why it was like you it was like the the one that i mean when you didn't get your record deal you're like i'm out i cut my finger done i take everything as a sign you know fuck this not meant to be yeah and my teachers told me that even the even the teacher at the culinary school he's like get the fuck out of here dude like you cut yourself the first day like so i was like all right bet

i'm gonna go to music college like at least at the very least i can get a job playing drums right what the fuck am i doing so i went so i went to music college musicians institute oh yeah and where's that at it's in hollywood in the middle of hollywood boulevard is it good it's dope it's like itt tech for like two years yeah yeah, about two years. I was working there longer than I actually attended there. You worked there as well? Yeah, I was working there as a TA. So I couldn't afford it, I had to drop,

and then the teachers called back, and they were like, why don't you work here as a TA? You can play drums for the students, the vocal students. We need people to play for the classes, you know? So they must have thought you were good and believed in you and they didn't want you to go. What happened to the lawyer girl? The lawyer girl went off and to go to UCLA Law School.

We split up. She ended up actually dating one of my buddies. And they ended up having a kid and living happily ever after. Oh, still? You guys weren't married, though. Not still. Not still.

You know I know that. We're not together anymore. Did you guys get married or you weren't married? No, we didn't get married. I'm married now, though. Shout out to my wife, my beautiful wife. My only wife. I don't want to cause any trouble.

Yeah, exactly. Okay? Let's just say I have one wife. That's how it always been. That's how it always will be. Okay? Wow. That's just my friend.

Okay, good. She's got you. Good. Good for you. She's got a grasp. It sounds like it. Yeah. But it was cool.

And then I got back into music. Where'd you meet this wife? Fully on fire. At the school. She a musician too? Straight from Korea. She it was cool. And then I got back into music. Where'd you meet this wife? Fully on fire at the school. She a musician too? Straight from Korea. She was coming in. She's Korean. Mm-hmm.

And she was going there for vocals and piano. And we met in one of the classes. She still sing? She still sings. On your records? Not on my records. How's that? She has her own group.

We're one of those kind of like, you do your thing, I do mine. Oh, yeah? Yeah, yeah. It's better that way? We're complete opposites. It is. It is. Oh, that's mine. Oh, yeah? Yeah, yeah. It's better that way? We're complete opposites. It is, it is. Oh, that's good. And we have our common grounds, you know?

That's great. All right, so now you're teaching kids, you're playing with the kids. Yeah, I'm teaching them. It's building up. You're still making your own shit? Yeah, making my own stuff. And I started my own band now at the school. So I'm like getting the connections.

I'm like, you know, learning a bunch of music. How many pieces? Like what kind of band? It was like five of us. So it was breezy lovejoy band breezy love breezy was my nickname since i was in high school breezy lovejoy and i added that tacked on the lovejoy and uh when i got to the college i was uh scouting out musicians to play the demo that i had this new demo of like new songs that i've had and i got with a bunch of musicians, and they loved the songs, and we started playing dive bars and pay-to-play in Hollywood

and playing for other artists, which is how we made Innsmeet. Backup band? Mm-hmm. Cover band, backup band. What kind of stuff are you playing? We were playing for a lot of singer-songwriters that have money to blow. Okay. They need a backup.

You recorded with some people then? Yeah, we did a lot of session work for the kids at the school and then a lot of session work for these kids that got record deals and they needed bands. So you're really jumping right in. It's good because you're learning how the business works. You're learning how to lead a band. Exactly.

And to orchestrate compose put shit together yep going getting you know making my way around the city as like you know we were the the band that if you needed a band you could pay us 150 bucks and we learned your whole catalog yeah you know really like what kind of acts any kind a lot of a lot of hip-hop a lot of soul acts a lot of singer-songwriters right a lot of people that they just got in record deal. Right. And they got these showcases that they got to play. That's the kind of gigs we were getting.

And then there was clubs like the Little Temple Bar. I don't think it's called that anymore. But there was these spots where the promoters would hire us. And we played for all kinds of bands all kinds of groups we were just like the house band for open mics and stuff right right is that where you got the idea to do the covers record yeah yeah pretty much yeah we were always playing covers so that was just like yeah fuck it let's let's play these these interpretations and put them what was on that record you can't find it i couldn't find cover art was uh we did seven nation army by uh white stripes we did

heart of gold by neil young neil young we did the beatles blackbird how come i couldn't find the record it's on you got to go to band camp or soundcloud or something okay one of those and it's called cover art under which name cover art on anderson pack oh okay yeah one of the first um projects i did under that. Now I got to listen to it. What we did was we flipped. The idea was that we're going to take all these songs by white artists and put the soul and grease on them because in the 50s.

Get in the pocket? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was just like kind of spinning that whole thing where how in the 50s, you had a lot of white artists that did black music, and then when they did it it went straight to radio and became huge records that's right so i wanted to do the opposite of that in a way and so that was the whole idea with them black up the white stuff yeah pretty much i never left soundcloud but you know i was early on it wait how could they not be

released now hey it's it's never too late i got i gotta like uh get the mechanicals and all that shit because they're not my songs and sure but i mean but it's not it's not hard i just gotta none of those guys really mind if you make them an extra buck you know what i mean except for neil oh no he might be a little particular i would think that maybe he'd be i don't know you know i talked to him once he's an odd guy yeah i would be a prick if someone tries to do my shit over. I know, but it seems like it happens all the time and if those guys own the publishing,

what do they care? Exactly. I mean, yeah. I mean, it's not on you. It's on the label. That's how I got my first plaque.

How? I put out a song on Venice called Might Be and it did what it did and then another kid took the song and remixed it yeah took our version and then out of his made a version his version of our version pretty much a remix you know yeah a cover if you will and then put put that out and it started booming and then started getting radio play right and then my label calls me like you know this kid

i'm like no what the fuck shut it down it my song. And they're like, well, you're getting all the publishing and like, we'll let it go because it's number one at radio. I'm like, fuck that. Damn. And that's when you learned how to write songs for people. You got past your pride and you're like, how much? There's more than one way to do it, man. Do it.

Any way you can hey i love it so how do you like uh wait how many records did you do under that breezy lovejoy moniker shit i did um i think it was two projects and those were three projects maybe and they were all with the full band um yeah i was yeah working with my band. I was working with producers and stuff. I was doing a lot of beats too. How does that work? Because I noticed this is one of those areas where I'm not educated. I had the Beastie Boys in here a couple weeks ago,

and I just felt like an idiot because they're going through the whole history of what they grew up with and the music that moved them. I'm like, who? Like an idiot. Because you get into your own thing thing and you know what you know. But when you work with all these different producers, because even on this record, it seems like every song is a different crew.

So how does that work in hip hop? Because it seems like the producer is intrinsic to the sound. Whereas with rock, they'll do their thing, but it's usually on the artist. But it seems like it's more collaborative. Right. You're working with them to get what they their their sound right absolutely yeah i mean i like to think on this album probably the main producer my co-producer if you will on this album was dr dre um we worked with a lot of different musicians my band included a lot of different

producers and everything but one thing we did was all the songs were, most of them were done in one room with me and Dre there. For Oxnard. Uh-huh. And we're utilizing whoever's in the room. And you're on his label now? Yes. But did he work with you on any of the other two or is this a new relationship?

No, this was the first one. Oh, yeah. Yep. Malibu was pretty much like halfway done by the time I was working with him. And then he dropped his project before and that's the One I was he put me all over Compton and then I was like, oh shit I'm all right. I think I should drop this project now

It's probably a good time and I wasn't signed to him. So, you know, I was able to drop it independently So after you okay So after you do the the lovejoy stuff and you're doing the cover album and you're back and like, you know What was the big break? What makes you sort of, before you meet Dre, let's get like, just like what, why Venice?

And what, what are all these albums? Do they have themes or are they just, so I switched over. I made a decision to switch over and go by Anderson pack. So I gave up breezy, lovejoy, my mentor at the time,

Brian Lee, who told me that I should actually come on this podcast. And then like, he, he hit me to you pretty much. And now I'm like a huge fan now. Oh, thanks. Um, he was like, fuck all this other shit, then he hit me to you, pretty much. And now I'm a huge fan now. Oh, thanks. He was like, fuck all this other shit, man.

You need to go on that motherfucker's show. And I'm like, all right, bet. And then I started listening, and it's great. But he's totally that guy. Put me on a bunch of different shit. But he was the one that was like, dude, screw Breezy Lovejoy. That shit's corny.

Just go buy it. You should switch it up. You've been doing it for six, seven years. And one of the things he was like, you really going to meet Dr. Dre and tell him your name is Breezy Lovejoy, that shit's corny. Just go buy it. You should switch it up. You've been doing it for six, seven years. And one of the things he was like, you really going to meet Dr. Dre and tell him your name is Breezy Lovejoy? I mean, Q-tip is Q-tip. Yeah, true.

That's really true. I mean, I don't think it doesn't seem like the hip-hop world is that judgmental about silly names. I'm very influenced. So I was like, you know what? It's out. Breeze Ledger is out.

Well, you might as well use your real name. I'm Anderson Paxton. No name, no real name. So, and we started going in. And so like I spent like six, seven months with Brian and his apartment. And he- He's a producer.

He was not a producer. He was really on the tech side and on the business side and knew a lot about YouTube and how to blow artists up on YouTube and make viral moments. I get it. And he was working with another artist, Dumbfoundead, that I was like, I was like. So he's like a tech consultant.

Yeah, yeah, so he saw things from that side, so. A brand master. Yeah, a brand master. He's like, you're really talented, but it's gonna take a lot more than that, you know? So he's like, you need a work ethic. You need to get in a room and just work on you. You He's like, you're really talented, but it's going to take a lot more than that. So he's like, you need a work ethic. You need to get in a room and just work on you. You're playing drums.

You're trying to do too much. Right. And you should simplify your life and just get in a room and make it easier for yourself. Yeah. So you can make better decisions. So he turned his extra room into a studio, just one computer and a keyboard. And he was like, you can do everything yourself. And if you can can't learn how to do it and then he locked you in that room locked me in the room well i was waking up early and i was doing music and i had that's the first time i started working with like whiteboards and like drawing out what i wanted for myself and

really serious would i never never done that what Setting goals and shit. So whiteboards, huh? Yeah. Like with the markers? Yeah. And what would you put on the whiteboard? Lyrics or ideas? So first I would brainstorm. So I'd be like, what do I want to sound like?

What are the artists I even like? What is my ideal definition? And who came up? So I went back and I went through like the 60s and I looked up Sam Cook and I looked up like Stephen Wonder and I went through Marvin Gaye's and I looked up like people that had like these real distinctive voices because I knew I had like a unique voice but I didn't have like if you will like a pretty you, singing kind of voice. Did you listen to any of that Soulster stuff, the Sam Cooke, the old gospel stuff?

Yes, yes. Soulster, yes, sir. It's so wild with his voice because like even when he was in that gospel crew, his voice was so unique. Even when he was singing with three of them. It just cut through. It's wild, right?

Beautiful melodies. Uh-huh. Otis Redding, you know, James Brown. Yeah. So I just started to listen to all those guys and then um I started uh you know checking out the new dudes you know even like you know the dudes that were killing it in in my era too you know like like the like the Bruno Mars and Kendricks and you know people that that I saw that had integrity that were musicians

you know that I wanted I knew that that's the lane I wanted to go in. So, uh, but what about all that early, that mid period hip hop that, you know, tribe called Quetzal? Oh, of course. Yeah, of course. So that was just there. That was, that was, that was like, you know, engraved in me, you know? So, um, I was, I was just more so like what the stuff that I miss, you know, the Beatles, you know, as simple as I never, never was gotten into them and then I got hit to them later, you know, and, uh, you know, as simple as I never, never was gotten into them. And I got hit to them later, you know, and, you know, then that opened up a whole portal, you know, so. So that's what was on the whiteboard. Yeah, it was just influences. What do I want?

What do I want? I want a Grammy, of course. You know, I want, I would love to have my own studio. I would love to have a car. I would love to have health insurance. I would love to get my own place to live. I didn't have. That was one column. Yeah. Place to live, health insurance, I would love to get my own place to live. I didn't have it. That was one column?

Yeah. Place to live, health insurance, Grammy. Yeah, Grammy, million dollars. Or actually, it was just like $1,000 back then, realistic goals. And so that was it. And it was like the people that I wanted to meet and you know what how i wanted to look and yeah everything so that was all the things you were putting yourself together yeah i was putting it up i was putting it together and then i just go in there and uh one thing he told me too was like

learn how to do it you're by yourself you know like let don't try to be as less dependent on people as you can because when you know even when you get to the point where you don't have to do it yourself you at least can tell people how it's done you know right you know yeah and so that was that and so i did that six months came out of it okay i'm down i want to change my name anderson pack yeah i'll keep the dot there so i always remember that um it takes work ethic and detail to get anywhere it's about the things you say no dot yeah that's what the dot represents the dot before the p so but when you but what were you recording at that time what did that i was i was recording what would later become malibu and what would later become um was malibu

first or venice venice was first so you'd already done that yep so i had came out of that whole thing it was like six seven months of that right yeah maybe a year or so and and i had i had the bulk of malibu done after I came up with that. So I was hesitant, though, to put that out because I didn't think people would receive it well. What, Malibu? Yeah. Why? It was different for me.

It was very revealing. It was more personal, and a lot of the songs were very understated and not overproduced, and the stuff that I was listening to at the time was very dance in like heavy bass yeah and I wanted to get people turned up yeah and I know people are gonna turn up to the bird or you know all these songs and I didn't really realize that these were actually the songs that really that you should be doing but I wanted to I noticed that with the bass in my car like even if I don't

have it turned up that much yeah yeah I wanted my little nieces I wanted my the homies to like it you know

and then they're like what the fuck every time I played my music for people they were like this weirdo shit you know like and then they turn back on

whatever the fuck they're listening to really I don't like see I guess I don't listen to enough hip hop to like it doesn't

I didn't listen to anything you did and think like nah this stuff's out there't, I didn't listen to anything you did and think like, nah, this stuff's out there. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

I mean, because you grow up, you know, you have a different palate, you know. Yeah, yeah, but I mean,

but it just sounds like, you know, good music. Yeah, yeah. Like, but what are they judging on? I think that at the time,

like my- This is the time of Malibu or Venice? This is, my music in general, like when I used to play for my family members and stuff like that they just they're like you're talented you're great you're gonna make it one day you know they weren't bumping my shit you know but they're like you're great my sisters were my biggest fans

you know but i could tell they didn't always understand where i was coming from because you were being too honest no i just think it was like i think my influences were just a little different and my music was left to them i think you know like uh my early demo stuff yeah i was doing a lot of weird stuff i think to that to their ear like like what what made it different you know like you know structurally or sound wise and then what they were used to like what what elements i guess it was maybe too lo-fi or the and even the topics that I was pulling from. My brother-in-law listens to people like E-40 and C-Bo and real heavy gangster rap. You know what I'm saying?

So it's too soft for him. Yeah. You're a little too like, what are you? Are you a fucking weirdo? That was pretty much it. You're talented. You're great. great it's gonna work for somebody you know we'll let you know when the shit starts to slap and you know we'll let you know you know and you know and by the time i got to dre now they're like fucking ah you know right so but yeah i was doing all kinds of stuff and so but i myself wasn't confident in what i was doing malibu at the time so and also

too i had been locked in this room and i wanted to just work with other people you wanted a band i wanted to yeah yeah i want to band want to work with producers i want to just talk and be you know yeah get out of the cave yeah yeah well if you're in a cave too long you're gonna do weird shit you'll stir yeah exactly but i needed that you know i needed to get ugly and do weird stuff to get comfortable with what at least what i could do as an artist and find my voice. Right. You took a risk. Yeah, it was great.

And you put yourself out there and people said like, all right. Yeah. And also too, yeah, we got that album done and then we took it to places and they were like, exactly. All right. Well, and everybody was scared. Nobody was. But they liked Venice. No.

No. I couldn't buy a deal, bro. Not until I got to Dre. He was the only one. And this is midway through Malibu that you met Dre? Yes. Yeah, I had already put out Venice. And I went back and worked with producers when I went and worked with Venice.

And I wanted to do like a heavy hitting sound, more modern sound, if you will. And so I went back and did Venice and then put that out. And then I was like, that's why I started calling it The Beaches, because I was like, okay, I'll give it a location so I can build up to these places. So Venice is kind of gritty. And you open with beach sounds. Yeah, yeah, it's SoCal, it's the beach,

and then we'll work our way up to Malibu. That's a more mature sound. Got it. And then back to Oxnard. And then we'll go north, keep going north, and we'll take it home, you know? So how do you meet Dre? You're working with pretty big producers already, right?

I was just working with, yeah, I thought they were the biggest producers to me, you know, because they were the producers around in the city that were killing it. You know, people like Knowledge and people like low and taku toki monsta and in a k trinada pomo these are people djs and producers that we that's what we listen to right you know and they were moving the needle yeah for us so i was i was excited to work with them but dre could give two shits you know yeah and so everybody was was trying to get the music to dre yeah you know from what i hear now you you know, whether it was Ty Cannon or F. Gary Gray, the director,

or my manager at the time, but honestly, until you get in the studio with him and he sees that you're capable and you see that fire, that's when you're gonna make him a believer.

How'd you get in the studio with him? So I finally got in the studio with him because he was making Compton. He was doing the Straight Outta Compton soundtrack.

And his two writers that he was working on the album out of Compton soundtrack and his two writers that he was working on the album with King Mez and JT we're working on a song and they and they said we got to get this kid in here so they got they got tired to get me on the line and Carrie Lynn I was working with her and she'll see they got me over there and I was you know skeptical I didn't think it was gonna work and I got in there in the first two people I meet were Dr. Dre and DOC. They gave me a handshake and they're like, dope, okay, cool. Were you freaked out?

I was a little freaked out just because of how tall and big they were. Other than that, everything felt good that day. Everything felt like it was supposed to happen that day for some reason. I was feeling good. I was like, all right, cool. I'm finally in the building. All right. They go back to watching the game and I go in the studio and I meet the writers

and they're like, yo, you're dope, man. We love your song Suede and this and that. I'm like, oh, cool. I had this song called Suede out and I was like, dope. They started playing me the music. I'm like, this sounds crazy. They're like, Dre's really going to put an album out. I promise this.

And I'm like, cool, man. Let me get on something, you know? And so they're like, hold on. Before we get you on this, let's play the song. Let's play Suede for Dre. And I'm like, wait, he's never heard the shit yet? He didn't. Fuck.

He just on there in a recommendation? Yes. I'm like, let me get on the mic first. Let me get something. Because what if he doesn't like it? I don't want to get kicked out. Yeah, yeah. Not now.

They bring him in the studio. They play him the record. And he plays the record three times in a row, and he's like, let's work. Oh, really? Yeah. Was it heavy? Yeah.

You're just sitting there? Yeah. And he's playing it again? Yep. Again. Because, I mean, I watch the documentary, so I get a sense it must be wild just to see him thinking. Like, listening and thinking.

That's hard right there. Yeah. He does a thumbs up ap that's hard that's gangster that's gangster right there play that again yeah so the third time goes around he's like all right let's work and i'm like cool so they play the beat and i love it this is like this crazy infectious bass line yeah it's great all in a day's work is what it ended up being for compton uh-huh and i'm like cool's do it. Let me get on the mic. And they got the mic set up just like this.

There's no booth. Yeah. And everybody's in the room. So he's like, oh, you want to just hop on the mic? I'm like, yeah. Throws on the beat. I close my eyes, and I'm just like right out of a movie. Just like throw my headphones on.

Yeah. The room gets silent. And I black out, literally. And when I open up my eyes, I see Dre. I see the whole room just going crazy. And I've been working with him ever since. And was it just freestyle? Yeah, it was freestyle, not really thinking about the words,

just getting melodies and cadences and stuff and just speaking in tongues, if you will. Yeah, yeah. And that was it. And he loved it. He just loved the tone of my voice. He told me, you know, you got that pain in your voice. Like, no one sounds like you.

See, finally the weird thing pays off. is yeah that was it yeah be confident be confident in what you do in yourself and that was it and uh i knew i could do me at a point and like nobody else so it was fun because you'd already pushed yourself out there yeah i was like he i was already you know i have music out plenty of music i was i wasn't getting called in to write him a verse for him or anything like that they were like they wanted me to do what i did you know and uh thank god i wasn't like chasing some thing or something like something else i had no choice but to just do me nobody wanted to right sign me or do anything i was just i was just the weirdo kid right so that paid off the weirdo it really did man so did he do half of malibu then no so then he we ended up i

ended up camping out there finishing up the rest of his record yeah and i didn't know what was gonna come out or anything i know i was gonna be on it or anything and then then all of a sudden i look on itunes and the record's out compton and i'm on six tracks and they're like he's the new snoop and he's the new neat dog and this and that and um it's just blowing up and so I'm like I was probably like 50% done with Malibu at that point and now everybody's hitting my line so now I'm like all right cool I'm about to finish my fucking record now and uh now I want I want to work with Knife Warner and Malibu all these different you know high tech all these I got all this I access now yeah yeah he's Dre's kid now and I wasn't signed to Dre granted

at this point and now all the labels are coming but he loved you hey what's up blah blah blah he loved me and he told me I don't know what you got going on

but I would love for you to come over here to Aftermath and I was like no question you're the only one that took a chance on me so that was a no brainer but I had

one more album to go with this independent contract that i had with uh steel wool and um with my own label yeah and an art club yeah so i had malibu left to go and so i finished it up i got songs like come down and uh hard to stand a chance and all these different the second half of the records um came later because i was you know i had the access now i had the juice yeah and i finished it up and i put it out and then i was on the i've literally been on the road ever since yeah that album came out and it was just like everyone loved it and i

never would have thought it would do the things that it did man and then it did like really good in the licensing world so we didn't have any real per se radio hits but then like people were snatching it up for google and then like espn and all these movies like it became that album and that just is another part of the business to you you don't have any problem with that no i love it yeah man get it out there it doesn't matter yeah i love it man you did apple commercial with uh what's her name uh fk twigs. That album, her album's wild. Yeah, she's a wild artist. It's like she's only got that one record out. Like, I got it a few years ago, and I saw the cover, and I'm like, what's this? With her on the cover?

Yeah. And I'm like, what's this? And I listened to it, and I was like, mystified. Yeah, dude. That's some left field shit. Yeah. That's the shit I was listening to, you know, like, when we were doing all this stuff, you know?

Yeah, yeah. And I was like, they were saying my stuff was left, and I like listen to this shit you know it's real it's beautiful yeah dude i gotta pull that out again i i it was one that because i used to get a lot of records sent to me from different labels you know because they because of the show and i didn't know anything about anybody but that's one of those times where i'm looking at that cover i'm like who's this what's she up to absolutely that artwork man that's gets you in. You can tell if he's a douche right off the top with the artwork. So this record's with all you and Dre. Yeah.

And you got big people with you. This is the big major label debut album, you know? This is like, boom, we got the budget. It's doing great, man. I mean, it was a landmark. What is a milestone for me, you know, as far as like, if you want to talk about commercial success or whatever, like I charted, you know, it was like, you know, it was a landmark uh what is a milestone for me you know as far as like if you want to talk about commercial success or whatever like i um i charted you know it was like you know it hit you know top you know 20 or whatever on billboard it sold what it sold um and i think uh that the core fans that

wanted malibu too are probably a little upset about the album i I think. Why? Because it's got more of an edge? You know, because, no, I think it's just because maybe it wasn't what they were expecting. You know, it's so much, and we took like two,

almost three years to come out with the next one. So you, people build all these expectations up, and that, that I don't know who's going to live up to it. Right. So they were there early, and they had this relationship with you,

and they understood you. A lot of people are eager to hate, you know? And they see that- Or be disappointed. To be disappointed, yeah. He doesn't need any help, you know? I think that was the consistence from a lot of people.

So they thought you got overproduced or sold out or whatever? Sounds forced. He's shallow now. It's all about the money. I've always been shallow. Always talked about pussy. Always talked about money.

Always talked about these different things. You guys just. You were just a little more sad. Exactly. You guys could be happy for me. I'm happy. You be happy. Yeah.

I'm happy times now, guys. I'm not melancholy and longing. Yeah, exactly. So that's what this album was. I'm having a good time eating calamari. Yeah, man. You know? And it's not.

It's like. Talking about tinting your windows with Kendrick. Tinting windows. I mean, my friend is Kendrick now. Texting Dr. Dre, like, this is my life now, guys. You got to let it go. Yeah. And so, no, it's just like embracing that, you know?

Like, that whole deal. Like, how do you make a record when you have everything now and you're traveling and just embracing those ideas? Am I remembering right? Did Kendrick come out with you on Saturday Night Live? Absolutely. Right, right, right. Absolutely. Came out. What a stand-up guy. Comes out. How'd you meet him?

I met him, I guess, somewhat through Dre. After Compton came out, he ended up texting me from, you know, I didn't have the number. He sends me a text. No. At the very end of the text, it says that. But he says, you know i didn't have the number and he said hey he sends me a text no yeah at the very end of the text it says that but he says you know it starts off the text starts off with life's a trip yeah i i i got uh introduced to your music a long time ago but you're going under a different name and i saw one of your videos and it made me want to get more on top of my shit oh really and it's so crazy to see how you were able to turn around and to see your journey. Sincerely yours, Kendrick Lamar. Wow.

And I was just like, oh, shit. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And then after that, we just, you know. You've been friends since? Mm-hmm. Because he's like a totally unique voice. Absolutely.

My girlfriend loves him. Man. Yeah, those records are great. Amazing, amazing artists. But then like Snoop's in the- Snoop. Like Dre just called Snoop up and said, come play with this kid? How does that work?

Hell nah, man. You know, shit, dude. I think me and Snoop, I'm trying Snoop. Like Dre just called Snoop up and said, come play with this kid? How does that work? Hell nah, man. You know, shit, dude. I think me and Snoop, I'm trying to think when we first met, but Uncle Snoop, man, he took a real liking to me, man. He's this off top nephew. I love you, man. Yeah. I got you, man.

Whatever you need, man. He'd be hard to get a hold of after that, but man, I sent him that record and he was like two minutes after I sent it to him he's facetiming me yeah from the gym which one like the one he's on yeah that song yeah nephew you know I want to get on that come on man when we doing it if you start writing it now it'll go by faster so if you start writing it man you know so I started writing the verse and he come in and just laid it down right away you know saying it ain't nothing dude and he come in and just laid it down right away. You know what I'm saying? It ain't nothing, dude.

And he came in there and just, ah. You got to have something about yourself in this industry. That's what he said. It's got to be something about yourself. He's like a real Zen dude. He is, man. Can you think? Dre, too, to go through that, like you said, all those lifetimes and still stay down to earth.

Yeah, and they are, huh? Man, that is the most down to earth dude, one of the most down to earth dudes. And how does Q-Tip get involved? Q-Tip, you got to go to him. He's one of those cave master senseis. Oh, really? You got to go up the hill and travel up

and go fight through the jungle. The jungle, and finally, I'm here. Here's the tape, Master. Is it good enough? No. It is trash. Come back again. Yeah, that was Master's Q-tip.

He reached out to me to work on the last Tribe Called Quest album. The new one, the Resurrection. Yeah, the last Tribe Called Quest album and uh the new one the Resurrection yeah the one that last one that came out yeah and uh I went over to uh Jersey and and got over into his lab and we just right away just like the connection was there yeah you know we just like got along you know real genuine relationships and then you know we spend a lot of time just talking and listening to music and and yeah of course we made a bunch of time just talking and listening to music. And, yeah, of course, we made a bunch of records. But it was more so just, like, picking his brain and, what you think of this? And, you know, just chopping it up.

Well, you're an open dude, you know, and you're not coming at them with the attitude. So, you know, and you come at them with respect and your own specific talent. They must love it. Yeah, yeah. The old dudes are a certain way, you know. Yeah, yeah. They don't have to work. They don't have to do shit they don't want to do.

They don't want to do anything that they don't want to do. So when they get fired up about something, it's dope. Yeah, it's great. I like that cut to the sweet chick one. Who's that guy? Yeah, you like that one? See, some of my Malibu fans are upset about that. Yeah, yeah.

Too dirty? Yeah, I love that one, dude. That's weird. It's not even a deal with the devil, but you got that loyalty that you build up initially because people think they found you. one, dude. That's weird. It's not even a deal with the devil, but you got that loyalty that you build up initially because people think they found you. Yeah, yeah. And then holding on to them when you make a bigger jump, you know, they'll bitch at

first, but you'll probably hold on to 75%. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But it hurts, you know, as an artist when you see them like, oh, you know, like you're not the darling anymore. You can't, you can't, right? Yeah, no. Do you read the shit?

No, I can't do it. I can not the darling anymore. You can't, right? Yeah, no. Do you read the shit? No, I can't do it. I can barely do Twitter anymore. I'm barely on Twitter because, like, the weird thing in the brain with your ego is that you see one fucking negative thing on any of them. Comic board, you know, Reddit, Twitter, whatever. In your mind, immediately, it's like the whole internet hates you. Yeah. But it's just one asshole. It really is.

Even if it's 20 assholes. Exactly. Who cares? Exactly. And a lot of times times it's the same 20 assholes yes making it over and over again and it fucks your head up and then when you really look at if you look at a comment board it's like 12 people over and over again and you're like what am i that's so true what i'm my whole day's fucked up exactly because you think like all these people don't like me but go back and look it's like even if it's 30 people

right exactly you know compare that to the number of records sold exactly like what are you doing with your head exactly

you're fucking yourself and doing a wrench in your whole shit that's right yeah and they got you and then throws you off of your confidence

and shit so you can't read it yeah that's right yeah I don't have that shit on either and it seems like your audience is pretty broad. Yeah.

You got all types of people. Just people with good taste. Yeah. That's it. I think if anything, that's how you narrow it down. My audience, I've seen all kinds. The nerds, the gangsters, the nine-to-fives, the internet, the whatever, the hypebeast. I just listen to blues, but I like you for some reason, guys.

Me? Yeah. Real talk, man. the whatever the hypebeast the i just listen to blues but i like you for some reason guys me yeah yeah real talk man and that's that's what when i think about when i was coming up like that's really what all i wanted was the respect man and and now your family's coming around because now they're finally i got something for my nieces and my brother-in-law to bump yeah and your mom my mom loves it yeah my mom loves my mom love malibu she loved venice you know she loved yes lord album um my mom based it to me mom loves my mom loved malibu she loved venice you know she loved a yes lord album um my mom laced it to me straight for sure oh really yeah i wasn't feeling that and why did you say that what did you say on this part she's fact checking and everything no shit well no you know that you know yeah she's she's on it man but she's gotta be proud yeah for sure man

she's super happy and proud well it's great talking to talking to you, buddy. Man, that was one-by-quick. I loved it. Thank you. Great talk. Good dude. As I said, Anderson's nominated for the Best Rap Performance at the Grammys this Sunday, February 10th, for his single Bubblin'. And the new record Oxnard is available and out now.

You can get it wherever you get the music. I plugged in the Telecaster through this Echoplex pedal and into the old Fender amp, and I realized exactly what the Echoplex pedal and the Telecaster and the old Fender amp, what sound exactly they were supposed to make. This is that sound. Thank you. Boomer lives! So no, you can't get snowballs on Uber Eats. But meatballs and mozzarella balls, yes, we can deliver that. Uber Eats, get almost almost anything. Order now.

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