WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Ray Liotta from 2018

Episode Date: May 27, 2022

From 2018, Ray Liotta talks with Marc about getting his start in soap operas, the debt he owes to Melanie Griffith, and the emotional filming of Goodfellas. Ray died on May 26, 2022 at age 67. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

I got in under the wire somehow after 25 years in the business. It's horrible, isn't it? The business? It takes forever. Yeah, it took me forever to get started. It is a horrible business. It's horrible. It's a great way.

It's a fun way to make a living, but it's a horrible business. I mean, you got to be crazy to do it and then to expect it to work out. Like, you just, you innately expect it to work out. You innately expect it to work out based on nothing. Well, totally. And when you go in cold because it's just something that you want to try to do, I never wanted to do this ever. And it just happened in college that I didn't even want to go to college. It came time to go to college. My dad said, go wherever you... I walked out of my SATs. It came time to go to college. I dad said, go wherever you... I walked out of my SATs. Came time to go to college. I said, I don't want to go to college. He says, go wherever you want, take whatever you

want. So I got into the University of Miami. This was 1973. So all you needed was a pulse to get in there. I get in there, I'm going to take liberal arts because I had no idea what I wanted to do. Get to the front of the line. They say I had to take a math and a history. I said, well, forget that. I don't want to take math and history. I looked up. It was for the drama department. I took a step over.

And as I was in line, there was this typical actor story. There was this pretty girl. She said, you're auditioning for the play tonight. I said, no. And then she berated me. What do you mean? That's all it's about. It's all about doing the play, blah, blah, blah.

So I go up there, get my classes, and then i go and audition for the for the play yeah and uh it was for a musical and now i'm a jock from new jersey all i did was play soccer basketball and baseball that's it that's what my whole life was about right and then you realize well i'm not fast enough tall enough or or anything enough to to play professionally that's a tough hit right horrible well yeah until junior high school when you're really you know then then when you're a senior in your high school then you realize well it's never gonna happen it's good you realized it so the first thing was uh auditioning for the play and i got into the play but it was a musical so the first thing you had to do was tell a sad story i told a sad story about a dog of mine that got hit by a car true story true story yeah and then uh then

you had to sing yeah so the only i was i lived grew up 45 minutes outside of the city in a town called union new jersey union yeah yeah yeah i'm all jersey so what'd you sing uh we saw pippin they took me to see pippin yeah and there And there was one song that I remembered Magic to do. Yeah. So she went and got the sheet music. There was already a cast album. Yeah. So I'm singing to the cast album, and that's it.

So I got to go the next day to do the audition, and I hand the music and stuff to the piano player, and then I take it from him. He says, what are you doing? I says, what do you mean, what am I doing? I got to sing this. And then he was a real bitchy piano player, if you know what I mean. And I said, I don't have this memorized. He said, just do the best you can.

So I get up there. I start singing this song. And then all I remember is the refrain, we got magic to do. We got magic. And so I'm just going over. And then they say, you got to dance. Now, I don't know if you remember. Remember Freddy and the Dreamers?

It was a youth group. It was for younger kids in the 60s and 70s. A little before me. And there was a dance to the Freddy. And the Freddy was just putting your hands and your arms up. So I'm doing the Freddy saying, you got magic to do. We got magic to do. And believe it or not, I get into the play.

And the first thing I did was I was a dancing waiter in Cabaret. And the first year, all I did were musicals. That's insane. But how terrified were you? Wasn't there fear involved? None. None? None.

To sing and dance? No, and I was really, really fragile in high school, and not with sports, but I just was fearless. I didn't care. I didn't know any of the people i didn't care what they thought yeah and you know in high school you always care what people are saying right so you're not you're on a whole new playing field there was nobody i knew what could they say you know so you grew up all in new jersey yeah you're born there yeah in newark that's what i

say i'm adopted so the adopted paper said uh yeah, I'm pretty sure it said Newark. Yeah. And then I saw something for some other town, but I'm not sure what happened there. Yeah. Oh, you did the research, though? When I was ready to have a kid, my ex thought it would be best since we don't know anything about what was my family history in terms of illnesses and things. So at that time- Did you just assume you were Italian?

It turned out that I'm not. I'm like, there's a little bit of Italian, but Leota is the father that adopted me and he's my father. But yeah, he was Italian, so I was Leota. Yeah. And I asked, so then we found my birth mother just because there was, at that time, there was a time when on every Oprah show or any show that they wanted to locate people, locate family members, boyfriends, girlfriends, whatever. So there was a locator's name at the end of the show. She called the locator up, said who I was, and said I was looking for my birth mother. Next day, he had her number. Really?

Yeah. She gave me the number. So you were like in your... I was 44. And you'd never investigated it before? No. But you knew you were adopted. No, I knew I was adopted.

I wore it on my sleeve forever that you were adopted yeah well just feeling that i was giving up all right so then when you're meeting a girl you know like within three minutes i would tell people that i was adopted and you know you know that was my that was my line thing and they would feel sorry for me or something but did you really feel like did you feel like you Totally. Yeah, all the way through life. Yeah, giving up. Because I never could understand why someone would give up. A baby.

A chip. But your parents were good, right? They were great. Oh, yeah. They were great. I was the luckiest person alive to get the parents that I have. And then you realize, though, once, so I went and met my birth mother. Where did she live?

Well, she was at one of their family's houses, well, one of her daughter, her kid's houses. Yeah. It was on Route 22. In Jersey. In Plainfield. Yeah. It was right off 22. There was this stone driveway and this two family house

woods and train track yeah and and i'm there early i got there fast and i mean i got there early and and and and this this car comes careening around the corner spitting up the the the rocks and everything and there was a dead deer on top of the car. It turned out that that person was my half-brother, and it turned out that I have five half-sisters, a half-brother, and a full sister, and I found all this out when I was 44 years old. Holy fuck. So that's got to be mind-blowing. It was crazy.

It was totally mind-blowing. And like in a movie, so we're leaving, right? It was pretty much like a typical Jersey thing, like olive loaf, pickles, you know. At the place. But what about the dead deer? What about that guy? He just gets out of the car and, you know. And it turned out that that was my half-brother. Did you see a resemblance?

And his name was Ray. Wow. But she raised these other kids? Yeah. These were her kids. Did you see a resemblance? And his name was Ray. Wow. But she raised these other kids? Yeah. These were her kids. Did you see a resemblance right away? No. Maybe just in the eye area.

We had similar eyes. She raised all the other kids. Right. But not you. And the full. The full sister. And what happened was she took me home from the hospital. I said, well, who was my father?

She said, I don't remember. What? All right. You don't remember? I'm here for information, and I don't think it's going to be coming because she doesn't remember who the dad was. And then I got a call from my – I told this story once on Letterman, and I got a call from the spokesman for them, and

she didn't like that I told this story at all. But it's true. The spokesperson for the family? Well, yeah. She was the talkative one, the one they turned to. Some of them were shy. One of them was sick. One of them was in jail.

But this was the other siblings? Right. Yeah. Right. A half-sister. so she's the spokesperson right she's she's telling me all the stories like you don't know how lucky you are because when mom flew through a shoe it could follow you around the around the wall through a door so she was a angry woman she she she talked like this because she smoked so she had this really smoky voice.

And yeah, they were just telling me stories about her gambling and this, that, and the other thing. And when I left, the first thing I said is, thank God I'm adopted. Well, that, I went with my best friend since third grade, to this day,

my best friend, and he stopped, we stopped at a at a in new jersey for some reason they still call it so yeah instead of exxon oh yeah the gas station we started the gas station but as we're driving all of a sudden this this this rain just just torrential rain came almost kind of like if it was in a movie and say things were like cleansed things were being cleansed which it happened being cleansed, which it happened. And we're sitting there. And that's what he said.

So what do you think? Because we're all shell shocked from this whole experience. How many of the people showed up that first day you go over to meet her? The guy with the deer on his car comes. But did they all come? No. No. I think there were two sisters.

two sisters and then there were the the one of the sister's kids and her boyfriend and his boyfriend and her girlfriend and they know you from movies yeah so that must have been weird it was more about that as far as they were concerned and i just wanted to find out more like who who are who who am i like how did this happen so you're at the eso station it's raining it's raining it's pouring and then uh my friend gene says so what so what did you think and i said i can't i'm so happy that i was adopted and he starts bawling i mean crying because he had just adopted two kids yeah two different families uh it just happened at once for him and he was just so happy to hear that because he didn't know how his kids are going to react you don't know how the kid's going to react to you as a parent when you adopt a kid you don't know what's going to

happen and and nine times out of ten people put kids up for adoption for the betterment of the kid right uh but you know it took me a while to learn that. But by the time that I went and did this, I had pretty much stopped using it as the sob story and just realized this is what happened and that's all there is to it. My brother's got three adopted kids. I have no idea what's going to happen. They're all from different families and the oldest one's like 17 or 18. They all know they're adopted.

He knows who the, but in his case, he knows who. Who the people, yeah. Yeah. I guess that's more, it happens more now. That's what happened. Yeah, exactly. Back then, I was adopted through Catholic charities. But what really messed me up was the fact that she took me home.

My birth mother took me home for three months. Yeah. So I'm bonding, getting fed by by my birth mother and then all of a sudden just like taken away and and put in an orphanage and i i have to i can't imagine it not affecting me somewhere deep down or maybe not so deep down that yeah that i was just taken away from my mother. The primal union, the bond. Do you have kids?

No. Oh. No, I never did it. I always wanted to do it because of that, to start a family tree. Not in an ego way, just to have my own blood. Right. But what did you find out about the father nothing never did nothing she claimed that she didn't remember who it was and then the the full sister called me

so she said i think i i think i know who our birth father is she she called the house she explained the you know uh the situation that that that ruth i don't even remember her last name, was our mother. Yeah. And we think that your father had two kids out of wedlock. And the guy just didn't want to hear it. Just said, get out of here. Don't ever call here again. You're crazy.

The father. That never happened, right? No, that was the son of the father. The father had passed away oh so so like that's what your mother was probably real mother was probably protecting the guy because he was married no no no no she was she was no she was used by the guy he was he was the neighborhood kid like she was a mark. He went with her. He goes off to the Korean War.

He comes back, does it again, and then just disappears. And she's left with two kids. And then the rest come later. Then the rest come after because then the birth mother, my birth mother Ruth, she then had the crew of five and one. Right, of right right right so now that you got so you have two kids no one one kid and when did you have how old were you when you had the kids 44 wow and was it amazing yeah yeah yeah for me it was I really really really wanted to have a kid I love being a dad yeah it's just a shame that i did it so late and that i didn't find someone else after i got divorced to have another one but i'm just grateful

that i have uh that i got one kid now because i love being a dad that's great that's great kids okay yeah, yeah, have an image it's either that or it's from a picture of of holding yeah uh she was through i was three years older and we had just gotten her and i think she was just weeks old when when my parents got got my sister lynn and holding her and feeling so proud because they made me think that i picked out my sister that i picked her out yeah and uh it was it was and then everything was just normal and then we just fought like cats and dogs, like most brothers and sisters. And did she ever go find her birth parent?

No, she had no desire. Total opposite of me. She couldn't care less? Down the floor, couldn't care less. She's like, what's the point? Yeah, didn't bother her, didn't affect her, just- But it haunted you. Accepted it.

Yeah, haunted's a little strong, but I was kind of, I couldn't understand how someone can give up a baby. I just couldn't wrap my head around that when I was younger. Yeah. And what was your old man's game again? What was his chain? My dad had a chain of automotive stores called Rocket Auto. And it was like the Pep Boys.

It was exactly like the Pep Boys, but he had five stores. He didn't expand on and on and on like the Pep Boys. Yeah. Exactly like the Pep Boys, but he had five stores. He didn't expand on and on and on like the Pep Boys. Yeah. And he had one in Jersey City on Garfield Avenue, and then one in Bayonne on Grand Avenue, right around from the hospital. They're still there or they're gone? No, they're gone, I'm sure. Although I was filming Copland, and I took a walk.

We were on a break, and it turns out that the house that we were filming at, I walked to the back of the house and looked over, and there was my dad's store. It was still there. And it flipped me out because this is years and years since he let the store go. 10, 15 years when he had it. Right. Still the same name? No. Different name? No. Different name?

No, yeah. It was an automotive store, but it wasn't his. Yeah. That's wild. Yeah. All right. So the two of you are growing up, and your mom worked too? Yeah.

First, she was a stay-at-home mom, and then she was very involved in a pta and then she started uh when we were went into junior high school uh she ran the store in jersey city uh and then my dad watched the store in bayonne so you grew up for in car parts yeah i hate the smell of tires to this day oh yeah because you go in and that's what it smells like. But it's like those stores are so amazing because you usually have like one or two guys working just aisles of pieces of things in boxes. Yeah, and then you had to look it up. Like somebody would come in with a carburetor for a 68 Pontiac and then you'd have to look it up. And I hated it.

I hated everything about it. You worked there though? Yeah, on weekends they made me work there. And then you'd have to look it up. And I hated it. I hated everything about it. You worked there, though? The best thing about it, yeah. On weekends, they made me work there. And little did I know that my dad was kind of hoping that I would take over his store. Right. And there was just no way. I thought I was going to work construction or something for the rest of my life.

But then the drama thing started. And the only reason why it started is after we did the musical, there was an acting teacher. His name was Robert Buckets Lowry, and he was a guy's guy. He directed like a coach. He was on his haunches, and he had these blue glasses, and his hat was on backwards, and he had this gravelly kind of thing. You identify with that guy.

Yeah. And I wasn't somebody who was doing drama my whole life i didn't do it at all but in high school what did you do you just played you had no interest though no interest in in drama not we we took a made my friend gene we took a you're allowed an elective your senior year of high school yeah and we took drama because we thought it would just be easy right and all we did was children's theater and things like that. Yeah. Was that fun?

Not ever wanting to. It was like whatever, you know, like little silly things for the little kids. And that was it. Yeah. And then my senior year of high school, I got into a fight with the basketball coach. Yeah. And I quit. And the drama teacher asked me if I wanted to audition for the play.

Right. I says, what do you mean audition for the play? You already had auditions and everything. And he said, no, don't worry about it. And I got the second lead of a Neil Simon play Sunday in New York. And I hated it. I hated everything about it. The memorizing the lines, the even getting up there and doing it. And I'm sure I wasn't special in the least.

But it was because of that class that made me want to take drama. And it's only because, who knows, what would have, well, no, I wouldn't have taken science or anything else. I don't know what I would have done. So you just were aimless and you would... Exactly. I had the same thing. I didn't want to go to college either but my

parents were just go just go somewhere so this guy so you get there you do the musical and what's the guy's name robert lowry yeah buckets buckets lowry now he's the drama he's ahead it was the acting coach no no no there's another guy who was the head of the department but he was the acting coach right buckets and they called him buckets because he played basketball put it in the bucket he was the acting coach. Buckets, they called him Buckets because he played basketball, put it in the bucket. And he was a trumpet player. And like I said, he was a guy's guy and he wasn't used to a guy's guy as coming out of high school. Usually the people, you know, the kids who are doing it, they have a certain way about them when they come. They're like a club.

Yeah, yeah. And they're just different. Yeah, I know what you mean. Yeah're like a club. Yeah, and they're just different. Yeah, I know what you mean. Yeah, they're theater kids. Yeah. Yeah, and you're not a theater kid. No. And you're a jock, and you've got an edge to you.

Chip on your shoulder, probably. Yeah, I guess, sort of. But he, and then the next year, that's my sophomore, I came back, I said, let me try it another year. The first year, all I did were musicals.lahoma dames at sea uh and you're singing that's all i was doing singing and dancing yeah and i didn't know anything about anything with it but for some reason i just kept it didn't it didn't dissuade me from doing it i just i just well did you enjoy it yeah i must have i stayed with it but i what i

really liked was the acting class with with buckets yeah and you're singing and dancing you must i mean you can't remember if you really liked it i mean i mean maybe it's not your bag there is there is kind of a joy i guess in doing it just the the uh well all i could say is i didn't quit i'm not sure that i love doing it but i love doing the acting class the scenes that you had in class because of buckets so you said i'll do these if i can do that well kind of yeah right yeah and then doing the plays where it was it was it was fun you know one two three kick yeah you feel like an idiot but But I didn't care. I really didn't give a shit.

I like watching musicals. I get very moved by people moving and singing. Do you ever watch musicals? Yeah. It's great. Totally. When I'm in New York, I always catch it. I saw Hamilton like three times.

It's great. It's unbelievable. Yeah. All right. So now you're in the drama department. Right. That's what you're in the drama department right that's where you're that's you you're you're that's what you're studying yes i decided to go back for a second year

and that year i got all all the leads of of of the plays that they had and like what uh streetcar named desire there was a new play that came in. You played Kowalski? Huh? You played Stanley? Yeah. We did West Side Story. Oh, yeah. I didn't play Tony. I played Riff. Uh-huh.

Taming of the Shrew. I was Petruchio. So I was getting, like, the leads in the plays. And I would get, you know, nice praises, like anything. When was the last time you did Shakespeare? What? When was the last time you did Shakespeare? Then.

That was it? That was it. Once was enough. Was it hard? Yeah. I was too dumb to know better. I just learned the lines, and that play in particular, you know, that's a boyfriend and girlfriend or whatever, they're going for each other, and it's just, they're back and forth making fun of each other and calling each other names you understood that

yeah i can relate to that yeah so okay so you do all those plays and now you're you're loving it right yeah yeah yeah yeah and i just i stayed for the four years and then graduated and there was an auditioning class what was it like what was it that he learned from him, though? I mean, you're very compelled by this guy, and obviously he bonded with you, too. What was some of the stuff you learned from him that you still use today? Just the commitment of playing pretend.

See, most acting is taught by you can't do it, so we're going to show you how to do it. Right. He was very Stanislavski heavy. And I had since found a teacher out here in L.A., Harry Mastrogeorge, who to me is the best ever. And he really capsulized. It's just, you know, you're playing a kid's game. All you're doing is playing cowboys and Indians.

Boom, that's it. Yeah. a kid's game all you're doing is playing cowboys and indians yeah that's it yeah and that's why i always get kind of like annoyed or when people think they're special because they act yeah they're playing pretend for a living that's it like get off your high horse yeah it's ridiculous yeah it's true it's true yeah i mean like on some level you realize that a lot of guys a lot of people get into the acting gig because it's it's like if you've got a knack for it it's you know it's it's a hell of a way to make a living that's a great way to make a living count your blessings every day totally it's just the business that sucks right so all right so you do all the plays you graduate i graduate and we had an auditioning

class where we got our eight by tens and and. And the resume, all you're doing is putting down the place that you did. In Florida? Yeah, at the University of Miami. And we got our resume together. Yeah. And I went to stay with this girl, Lenora, Lenora May, who was already a couple years into New York. And she was going to sign her contract at fifi oscar and that was the name of the uh the agent back there at that time yeah and she went to sign

the contract because she just got jaws too and while i was with her the it was like we went up there like six seven o'clock the guy a guy an agent came up to me and said hey you want to you want to do a commercial i said yeah sure and he sent me on this uh on this go-to and the guy said yeah fine you'll do and what i did was they took still pictures of me and this girl yeah and it was for love songs of the 50s or and all it's like you know they have one of those k-tel records sure sure and they just go by you that was the first thing i got but within a month i was screen testing in out here uh because i had moved to new york uh out here for beatles forever it was a robert zemeckis movie and but i didn't get that and then a few months after so then i was bartending at at the schubert

organization right for the theater chain right exactly we're in new york yeah i was watching uh watching plays and and and you know working at the bar or or coat check or whatever just like which theater though which one was it i don't know the different ones my oh really my first one was i love my wife but i don't remember which theater it was at. But you worked at many of them? Yeah, in a lot of them. Yeah. How'd you get that gig?

Everybody from college had an in there. Oh. So I guess we're always looking for people. So not so much actors, just somebody who could be there. But it was great because you could audition at the same the same time and watch plays right and watch plays and then after that with it within six months i auditioned for a soap opera and i just did it just just because i just figure experience well i got it and i said oh no there's no way i'm gonna do a soap opera because then i'm in the 70s it's in the 70s while i'm at college and i'm first getting into this acting

stuff and the plays back at the movies back then were just unbelievable right the uh scorsese was all they're all like you know yeah coppola all these guys are doing their thing and so that's so i said no i don't want to do a soap opera but my dad being a depression baby said look it's money it's money in your hand and and two you've never worked in front of a camera before mine go learn right yeah it's a perfect time to learn why are you living in the city living with them in in the city yeah i live in the city with with with two uh three other people uh that graduated what part of the city uh 92nd west end the ruxton oh yeah where charles groden used to live did he

yeah or probably still does i don't know when you were there you used to see him no i never saw him but i heard later on that he's or through the through the grapevine that he was a tenant in the building that's funny he's a funny guy yeah so you took the gig yeah and i did the soap for three and a half years no kidding and what was your guy what was your character my character was joey perrini the nicest guy in the world i had it was a blue collar guy uh my my mother rose i took care of my mother rose Rose, and I had a sister, Angie, and I proposed to my girlfriend, Eileen. I gave her a St. Christopher's medal when she was in the hospital. She ends up dying in the hospital.

I go to where I proposed to her. It was during the winter. I slip. I fall. I end up in the hospital. There's a nurse taking care of me. I fall in love with the nurse who's taking care of me. And I eventually marry her. Married for months.

And I find out she's the richest woman in America. Whoa. She lied to me. So I got an annulment. That's what this character was. He was like the nicest guy in the world. And then later I said, well, wait a minute. I love her.

So, so. And then I decided that it was time to move to New York. And the only reason why I stayed the half year is because there was a writer's strike, but the only people that weren't affected was AFTRA. And we went off to skiing in Switzerland. Who? Me and the nurse.

Yeah, in the show. In the show. So how many episodes is that? Like, we on a bunch of them? Three and a half. I mean, three and a half years. It's like lots. Lots and lots. We In the show. So how many episodes is that? Like, we on a bunch of them? Three and a half. I mean, three and a half years. It's like lots. Lots and lots.

We were the first. This show was an hour and a half. The first show to go an hour and a half. Yeah. And it was right in the middle of big storylines for me. So I was learning 30, 40 pages a night. It's another world. Another world.

Wow. So you learned how to memorize? Yeah, you learn how to memorize, yeah. And you learn how to be on camera camera and what was great about it is the producer paul roush when he needed a part he would go to broadway houses and watch plays yeah and if there were if an actor was right he'd go backstage and say look if you if you want to uh uh if you want to do the you know make some money, come and do the soap opera. I'll get you out whatever time you want to be out by so you can get prepared for your performance that night. And these people would say, yeah.

So I was working with these great actors. And there's one woman who's probably the best actress I've ever worked with, this woman, Kathleen Widows. She was great. She played my mother. Yeah. And she just had a real ease about it. And they all did. Yeah.

Because they didn't take it too serious because it was a soap. They were doing their whatever at night. Yeah. So they were just having fun and talking about who's illness and who's this and who's going with who. Yeah. Typical soap opera stuff. Like the soap opera behind the soap opera. Exactly.

Exactly. So that was sort of your baptism in the business and like a hell of a way to train for a few years. Totally. In terms of listening. Totally. Being with people, being with actors, doing the thing. No question. Acting like a nice guy.

Acting like a nice guy. Totally. No question. Yeah, but yeah. And this was in the late 70s. Yeah. And I left to move out here in 81. So you're going to Studio 54.

You're doing this. You're doing that. Oh, yeah. You remember that stuff? Crazy, crazy. Oh, yeah. Wow, I can't imagine. There was a guy, the doorman, and he would never, ever let me in.

At Studio 54? Yeah. But if Steve Rubell, one of the owners, if he saw me, he would always let me in. Cut to maybe 10, 15 years later, the doorman, I see him in Century City. And he comes up to me and he says, you know what? I want to let me ask you, I want to ask you some questions about being an actor and everything. And I remembered him as the doorman and he never let me in

and I went fucking nuts on him. You did? I went nuts because it was so humiliating to be in line waiting to get into Studio 54 on a Monday or a Tuesday night, never mind a weekend,

and just him poo-pooing me that I never forgot it. Yeah, of course. It's humiliating over and over again oh yeah drove me nuts so wait he just came up to you out of nowhere came up just came up i was coming out you're already successful and he yeah i was doing stuff already yeah and and i said you never let me in you were the doorman and you never well no i was just doing my job i said no i just kept going and going and

going out of my i just i just held on to it for a long time did it feel better to get it off you it certainly did it certainly did and then did you help him no done over next so i can't like i can't imagine what the hell New York was like, because that was the craziest time. I mean, the late 70s, early 80s, before AIDS became a thing. You said before AIDS became a thing? Yeah. Yeah, never mind that.

42nd Street wasn't Disneyland. It was all porn houses. Live sex shows. That was the first place I ever got recognized. In Times Square? Was it one of those? Oh, in a live sex show? Okay, so I'm going to the Port Authority's right there.

Okay? Lovely place. Wait for my bus. To go where? To Jersey? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And there was a place, so you put the quarter in, the thing comes up, and you see naked

girls dancing. I'm 21 years old so that's like a big deal for me uh the thing closes i put it in again it opens up and this one of the dancers she uh she she looks over at me and and the thing closes as it's closing she says no open it up again i'll put another quarter in yeah so i said all right so i put another quarter up and and then she she went down again and she said no no no let it up again put it up again and then she calls a friend over when it comes up and she comes up and she says look isn't that and she said yeah and they both yell at my name at the same time and it was every businessman in new york there it's all

suits with attache cases and she she goes, Joey Perini. And she starts asking me questions about what's going to happen on the show. And the guy who's in charge is telling them, they're totally naked now, these girls. And they say, keep dancing, girls. Keep dancing. Keep moving. You always got to keep moving. And they're asking me questions about storyline.

And that was one of the first times I said, oh, my gosh, my life will never be the same. Oh, that's hilarious. Those weird, dirty places. Oh, my God. So you do Another World. And what makes you decide to move out here? Because I always wanted to be in movies. Sure, right.

That was the thing. They weren't casting movies out of New York? They were, but I wasn't getting any. Oh. So they said know and at that time new york was down on its luck and i went to the city was yeah the city totally and so i went to uh so i moved out to la and what year is that this is 1981 yeah a friend of mine i stayed at his house yeah uh he was married to melanie griffith at the time and they

took my place in new york i i i was in now uh i was now out here you had oh so you had a place you could switch with him yeah yeah yeah yeah you weren't living with people no it was just me by myself it was on big rock road in malibu i couldn't be further away and i didn't know anybody but the place in new york was oh by the time you did the soap, you got your own place. Yeah. Oh, yeah. The third place that I, the second place I lived in was on 85th between Columbus and Amsterdam. And then the last place was on 72nd and Columbus, right down the street from the Dakota.

Oh, yeah. Were you there when he got shot? So, I come home that night, and there's a bunch of people outside. And where I parked my car was in the parking garage right next to the Dakota. Yeah. And I come out, and I remember it was freezing outside. And they're all singing, all we are saying. And they're singing it and singing it.

I said, what happened? They said, John Lennon just got assassinated and here i was like i walked i walked into it you know just wanted to park my car and here were all these people yeah candles and it was it was intense oh man it was a horrible day so oh so did you own that apartment no he just rent it so you yeah so you went out to malibu and they came and used your place in New York. Right. And you're just out there. Right.

And then they turned me on to Harry, the best acting teacher that I think that's ever lived. What's his last name? Harry Mastrogeorge. So I went and started studying with him twice a week, six hours a night. Because, you know, as he used to say. Six hours a night. Yeah, man. I was dedicated.

I was. By the time I graduated college, yeah i said i'm i'm making it it's like what we were saying before you come out here and you don't really know yeah what's going to happen the one thing you don't think is going to happen is that it's not going to happen right you're just too stupid to think that it's not you know to realize all the odds that are against you yeah Yeah, but at least you had some experience and you probably had an agent, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I had an agent in New York

and they had a sister agent. At least you had some sense of the business. You weren't coming out here going like, where do I start? But nothing happened. Nothing happened. But you took these great classes. Yeah, but work-wise,

I didn't do my first movie until I was 30 years old. And at that time, or even now, that's really late. And the only reason why I got it is because of Melanie Griffith. Yeah. Because she was already cast in the movie. And I went home. I was dejected.

I was 30 years old. I went home to Jersey. And my parents were heavily involved into local politics. Yeah. They said, call her up and ask her if she can get you an audition. Oh, Melanie? Yeah. And I said, there's no way I'm going to call her. I just thought her if she can get you an audition. I know any yeah, and I said There's no way I'm gonna call her I just thought that wasn't the way you do it and but I was so despondent and I just said

Alright, I will and yeah, and I said Melanie. I know you're doing this movie something wild It's actually the guys in that acting class that that that said, you know, you're really right for this party Have you gone up the psycho boyfriend psycho ex-boyfriend, right? Yeah. And she said, yeah. So Jonathan said that she could have a say in who played her husband because she had a bad experience

with somebody that she worked with before. It was the husband, right. So she called him up and he says, Melanie, please. It's been taking me so long to find this guy. I've got it narrowed down to three people. I can't see anybody. And she said, Jonathan, you promised me that I was going to be able to help pick and have say in who's going to play my husband.

I want you to see Ray. I think she just wanted to use that chip, that card, than believing that I could do it. But in any case, I went, and then there's the story. Monday, I meet him. Okay, Tuesday, I get a call. I come in and read with an actress. Come in and read with the actress. Thursday, I get a call.

Come in and read with Jeff Daniels. I'm saying, oh, my God, this is great. I'm not going to be told no by a casting agent. Now if they don't want me, I'm just not right for the part or my acting chops wasn't right. That night I'm watching Johnny Carson. Jeff comes on. He's talking about Woody. He's talking about Jack.

He had just done the Purple Rose of Cairo for Woody Allen. He's talking about Jack Nicholson in terms of the deer movie. He was in both those movies. I hit the floor doing push-ups. I'm looking at the script because I have to read with him the next day. And I just was ready. I just was ready. I did my homework.

And I'm a wound- crazy bastard. Yeah. Yeah. And luckily when, when he said action, that's what came out. Wow. That's great. Yeah. And you were like, and you know, you were at the end of your rope too. Totally. As a matter of fact, it was almost to the day. Yeah.

Because I, my dad being a depression baby, he handled my money, all the money that I made from the soap. I just gave it to him. Yeah. And I was living off that money for five years but i lived in a struggling actor's box on beachwood avenue five blocks up from fountain is that fountain there or franklin franklin yeah and and it was i mean it was brown shag carpeting with dirty curtains yeah and and i know right where that was. It was horrible. So you were about to run out?

Is that what you're saying? Yeah. Well, I had to get a regular job, and I couldn't even imagine. Your old man told you that? Yeah. He said, like, it's down to it. And I remember I was with my sister and her then husband, and we were at Alice's Restaurant at the pier out in malibu yeah and uh

i i think i was supposed to call call them in and like like no cell phones or anything so i was supposed to call in and and and find out what happened yeah and uh they said that jonathan wanted to talk to me yeah and and he called me up and said Ray would you like to be Ray yeah and that's like wow I got it yeah I did and I cried like a baby yeah it's a pressure of five years of not knowing that you're gonna get what whatever it is that you want that you're working for how did you end up starting with with stand-up all right when I in college, I just always wanted to do it as a kid, and I couldn't figure out how to do it. And then when I graduated college, I moved out here.

I was a doorman at the comedy store. I got all fucked up on drugs, went back to Boston, and started doing open mics. Once I figured out, back then, it was like you go do open mics. So I just kept doing them, and I kept doing them. In my mind, though, there was nothing else to do. There was no other thing. But you decided in high school that you wanted to do i think i decided in college i went to college i did a lot of other stuff i acted i wrote a liberal arts and whatever but where'd you go be you oh okay yeah but when i graduated i'm

like i'm going to la i want to be stand-up comic i thought always since i was a little kid i wanted to do it but it's hard to figure out what you do but like looking back on it I don't know over the years how the fuck I stayed in it you know because you just you know you just keep building your time you keep going up there getting beat up until you got an act and then you get you know get someone to book the act and then you know you keep going but the thing was is that you know people ask you about the career it's like if you do this shit you know most of the time you don't have a plan B. It's not like there's no other thing. No.

So it's in your brain. It's like there's no choices. Right. Right? Right. And you figure, look, you watch people doing it and you're saying, I know I could do at least as good as this guy and he's making a living. Yeah.

I was driven by- That stuff kicks in. Oh, yeah, man. I'd say the first decade of my life was driven by spite totally it's the best motivator calling my manager how the fuck did that guy get that exactly exactly no question about it yeah so i still do that i'm still like Yeah, you must have a tolerant agent. I don't know. I call a lot. You play guitar?

I do, yeah. A lot? Yeah, you? I did in sixth grade. Yeah? And I think I played at a dance once. We had one song. Yeah.

But I would sing upstairs, and I had a decent voice from what I hear. And my mother said, oh, I love when you play. And that shut me right down. I never did it again. Really? Yeah. Yeah, it was something I held on to. I did it when I was a kid.

And I just always did it by myself. And it's like a meditation. I got better. I keep getting better. So I keep playing. Every day you play? I pick it up. You know, like if I'm in town, like I don't compulsively practice, but I'll put on some records, play jam with them.

Oh, really? Yeah. I start playing with some people sometimes. I keep trying to get better. That's all. You know, it's a hobby though. Right. You know, like that's one thing I used to do a joke about it, how like I never tried

to be a professional musician. So my guitar isn't haunted by failure. Is that why it looks so clean? Yeah, it's not haunted. It doesn't represent something that didn't happen for me. It's just something I enjoy doing. So wait, so let me just ask you about Harry again, the acting teacher. What was his last name again?

Mastro George. Now, was that a scene study class? Was it a lot of people in there? Because you were with him for, what, four or five years before you got the part, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And after I did my first movie, Something Wild, went back to class. Dominic Nugent, back to class. Field of Dreams, back to class.

Goodfellas, back to class. Really? Yeah, I just kept going because he just said that the imagination is like a muscle. The more you exercise it, the stronger it gets. And I bought into everything he said because it totally made sense to me. What was other things? Just that it's a child's game. Oh, that one, yeah.

You just played with a child's rules, but not at an adult level. Right. And it was as simple as that. And then the things that could throw you off were the things about you're worried about presentation. You're saying somebody else's words. You're saying things on cue. And that could be, you know, that could throw you off. Right.

If you just stick to the playing, you know, pretend. Yeah. You can't go wrong in sticking with the story. Right. It was really simple stuff. It wasn't like some crazy thing. But he was, he came from the platform of you anybody can do it it's just you know and right if you just play the simple game or pretend oh really most

acting teachers saying you can't do it so i'm going to give you the methodology of how you can do it yeah but i think that the thing that really separates actors is i think some people you know you can work and work and work who the hell knows why anyone's going to break I think some people, you know, you can work and work and work. Who the hell knows why anyone's going to break? There's some people that have different talents for it or innately have it. But yeah, you can function as an actor. But, you know, you somehow, I think you're authentically yourself. Right. And always some part of that's going to come through.

Totally. You know, you don't, it's not like you see a part that you play and go like, who is that guy? Right, or like all of a sudden you're not going to get to the point of, yeah, there's a camera there, you're going to know there's a camera there, but you just ignore it and do what you have to do, you know? Sure, right, yeah. You don't forget. Not everybody can do that, it's a weird thing, that once the

camera's there, you know, it is a unique skill. All you got to do is watch porn and you realize like not everybody can do this you know they're just they can fuck on camera but they're not doing the other thing right it's a weird thing so okay so you do something something wild and demi directs you and that's early on it's like his first movie isn't it yeah what was he like then he was great he was great one because he gave me the part and two you, you know, he started.

He said, all right, let's make some movie history here. He was really, really into it, and there's nothing more, Scorsese had the same thing, there's nothing more exciting than working with somebody who is really excited about playing pretend. Yeah. It's very contagious, and it really makes you want to do it and and do it for them but you

know you know that it's that it's that it's pretend you don't have to live there yeah exactly well no at first you did well at first i did i i i was a little too methody because i i didn't trust myself enough oh yeah so not that I went out beating up people, but I kind of kept it always in my head, always ruminating up in my head what I'm doing. The emotions of the character? And it's exhausting doing it that way. I guess it would be.

You show up exhausted, I can't work because I've been too busy being the guy when I was sleeping. You do it because the adrenaline kicks in. But then I can't imagine. It's interesting for me about Goodfellas. It's one of those movies where, especially with Italian movies, especially with Scorsese,

your whole life you got guys coming up to you, right? Now to this day? Sure. That's it. I have kids coming up to me. Right. Because what happens is fathers turn their sons on to it. But sometimes it's like you can tell the kid's only 12 or 13 years old and he comes up and

says, I loved you in Goodfellas. And I'm saying, what kind of parents do you have? You're really too young to be watching it. But because everybody's got their head in these things, they could look up anything they want anyhow. So the kids now are much more sophisticated than we were as kids just because they could google whatever the they want they can do whatever they want without anyone knowing it there's no way to control them because the most adults don't understand what the hell they're doing yeah or how they can get things

yeah but i mean that part like that was your like your fourth movie yeah and there's a huge part it was a huge lead how what was the auditioning process for that? I didn't audition at all. I just kept talking to Marty. Oh, really? It took about a year to get. I was the first person from what I hear that he met. And then months go by.

Dominic and Eugene is at the Venice Film Festival. He was there with Last Temptation of Christ. I took my dad with me to Venice for the experience. And we're standing on the second level of the Excelsior Hotel, and there's this crowd of people moving as one. And from my vantage point, on the second floor, in the middle of it, I saw Marty. So I said, I hadn't seen him in like months. So I just wanted to put my face in front of him before he remembered me. So I came running down.

I come, Marty, Marty. And he had bodyguards all around him because he was getting death threats because of Last Temptation and the controversy of what that movie was. And they pushed me away. And I said, no, no, no, no, no. I just want to say hi to Marty. I just want to say hi. And that's what... You're not Travis Bickle.

That's what... That's when he decided that he was going to cast me. Because the only thing he had really seen is something wild. So he didn't know I was like... And me, personally, to this day, I've never gotten in a fight. So to play these kind... And Henry Hill, the only way he got as far as he did was because he was a good soldier. Yeah.

He did what he was told. Right. But he didn't, he wasn't going around whacking people or things like that. Right. He was just getting them things to eat or whatever. Yeah. So that's how the persistence got him. Yeah, I guess.

You've never gotten into a fight? No. Once in seventh grade once in seventh grade because me and this guy jeff roth we were fighting over what grammar school oh my god better cafeteria food i swear to god i think it was something like that so we went down first we were gonna fight at the path yeah and then said no not the path meet him down at the house yeah so then we went down to the house where you know this big field the soccer fields and baseball fields right we had a fight and it was stupid and i won at least you won that's it that's hilarious because even now even today like i know i'm going to talk to you and like in my mind i'm like oh boy this guy's a

tough fucking guy what the fuck am I going to say to this guy? You know, but that's interesting that, you know, that you get identified with the characters. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It does happen. Yeah. Of course.

Because that's it. How are they going to know you? They don't know you. Right. Unless they saw the Muppet movies. Yeah. And then it's a different guy. Two Muppet movies with the Muppets. Yeah.

Maybe there's a younger generation that just thinks you're a sweetheart. Yeah. Exactly. And the people from the soap. Yep. Oh, maybe there's a younger generation that just thinks you're a sweetheart. Exactly, and the people from the soap. Yep, way back. I imagine do you still get people who recognize you from that? Come on. Sometimes, but yeah,

they're a little older. So when you did Goodfellas, I mean, like that set, I can't like, and if you're tired of talking about it, I can't imagine how amazing it was to be on that set. Was it? It was the ultimate in playing pretend. Yeah. But also, not to bring a downer into it, my mom was sick with cancer during the whole time and passed away in the middle of filming it.

And the Teamsters and Pesci, they all came to the funeral. They came to my house after. So it was really so my thing is like i i can play pretend with everybody my mom's dying so i don't care who you are what reputation you have what movies you did yeah this is something that's really serious all we're doing is playing pretend so let's play pretend and i don't mean that in a cocky way it's just the the mindset that you get when you're good when you're going through something like that. It must have helped you out.

It certainly didn't make me shy. So I just went and had fun. But again, Marty is one of those kinds of people that's so excited to pretend of it all. Right, right. So that, wow, that's amazing. And so like she passed away and then he still had a month or two to shoot or like what yeah the first scene that i had i remember the scene i had a scene with paulie and some other guy yeah uh when they told me for sure to go home

yeah that was brutal yeah uh but we still had to finish shooting. And then she did. She passed in my arms. She waited for me, no question about it. And then I go back. And the first scene back is one of the only times that there's laughing. It's when Karen Lorraine comes at me saying, you stood me up. Who do you think you are? It's Frankie Valli. And way, way, way.

And that was my first scene back. Oh, like the day after or a few days? A few days after, yeah. Wow. Yeah. So you just walked right back in. That's something. Thank God.

Yeah. Thank God to tell you the truth. Right. Yeah, yeah. And your old man was still around or no? Yeah. Yeah. He's still around now?

No, he died a couple years ago at 98. Oh, that's a good run, huh? Yeah. Wow. So what is it do you think, because you've done a lot of fucking movies, and you clearly love to work. Yeah, yeah. Sometimes you have to work.

Of course. Yeah, of course. There's a couple in there that I'd rather not have done, but you've got to do what you've got to do. But Copland, I love that movie'd rather not have done, but you got to do what you got to do. But Copland, I love that movie. That was a really good movie. Right? It was totally a good movie.

So was Narc. Narc is a great fucking movie. Yeah. You're fucking menacing in that. What is it with you and corrupt cops? I don't know. They like me. They like you to do that.

Yeah. So this show, why is this going to be the last season of Shades of Blue? I have my theories, but I don't know for sure. I think really what it is is that Jen kind of had enough. Oh, yeah. And it was really hard. She has so much on her plate. She's doing the Vegas.

Jennifer Lopez? Yeah. She's got the Vegas show. Yeah. She's got a two-hour dance show on NBC every week. She's newly in love, and there weren't enough hours in a day. And doing a series, especially something like this one, it's really, it's draining. It's draining, and it takes a lot of time.

And she didn't have that much time. She was busy with other things. Right. So did they just write a conclusion to the investigation? I mean, what happens? I mean, this is the last season. No, we didn't know until two weeks ago that it was ending. So the season that they wrote was as if it was going to continue on.

I wanted it to go on because it's just a great character. But we didn't know until maybe now it's three weeks, a month, that this was going to be it. So it's not everything is tied up in a bow. It's just over, and that's all there is to it. I was hoping they would keep it going and not not replace jen because jen is jen but they could have brought somebody else in right because it's a good show yeah it's a really good show but it's their ball and bat yeah i uh that's the business you were i we were in a movie together They were? Yeah. What? Flock of Dudes. No. Yes.

With, uh, uh, what's his name? D'Elia. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and I didn't even see the final cut of it. Neither did I. I don't think it ever came out. No, it did kind of come out. Yeah.

Kind of? It's out. You can watch it. Really? Yeah, I played the boss of, uh, you know, those guys. No. That's so funny. That's funny.

Maybe we should watch it. I know I didn't do scenes with you that i know no i had the scenes with the leah yeah i see him all the time at the comedy store so what the what are you working on now you got a movie working i just finished a movie with noah baumbach the public come out this fall and do you play a corrupt cop, I'm a lawyer in this one. Yeah. It's funny, cops love me when I see cops in New York. We always just shoot the shit.

Well, you understand them. I mean, you know, there's got to be, you know, like I don't know what kind of research you do or whether you just pull from the, when you get a part like that, you know, like Copland or even the first season of Shades of Blue or any of them, where, you know, NARC, I mean, do you just stick with the script and then use your own imagination? Or do you talk to cops? No, no.

In the beginning, I think the first time I played a cop was on Lawful Entry. No, in the beginning, I think the first time I played a cop was on Lawful Entry. And I went and did a ride along with a sergeant. And I would go and ride with them. Yeah. As well as talking to them, going to the shooting range, reading books. Right. So I've done plenty of research. Yeah.

Yeah. And I used to really be into the research. I played a heart surgeon where I was watching open heart surgeries for weeks. Really? I was there so much that the doctor asked me, he said, do you want to come up and stand next to me while I'm doing this? And I said, yeah, I would. And he says, all right, come on, stand right here.

And the woman's chest was wide open. Oh, my God. And he said, do you want to touch her heart? Oh, my God Oh, my God. And he said, do you want to touch her heart? Oh, my God. I said, what? He said, do you want to touch her heart? Yeah, yeah. And I went down and touched God.

Boom, touched this woman's heart. Because it's not going up and down because they can't operate, but they got the bypass machine going. And I touched this woman's heart. Yeah, go over there. woman's heart. Yeah, go after them. It was great. Yeah. I played a coroner once, so I was going down to the city coroner's office, and I hate being late.

And there was a lot of traffic. I think it was on the 134, wherever it was. And I finally get there, and I run up. I said, I'm so sorry I'm late. I am so sorry. And the attorney said, no, don't worry i am so sorry and they they turn he said no don't worry about it and he pointed he said it was him and there was a guy with a sheet over him dead he tried to cross the 134 oh my god and that's what the traffic was he he got hit and

died oh my god i mean there's nothing funny about it. No. But it was coincidental. Closure. It's closure. It's closure. So how long did you spend looking at bodies? Just a day on that one. What other weird-ass research did you do? Baseball. I played a lot of baseball. Yeah. When I did Field of Dreams, Rod Dado, who coaches the USC baseball team has more national champions than, than

in any other sport. He's like, he was a 13 time, uh, a collegiate champion. So I went there, uh, and, and worked out with them and Donnie Buford, who used to play for the Orioles. Uh-huh. So. Did you play, did you, had you played in a high school or college? Little league and junior

high school and then i got hit a couple times and i said that's it i'm too chicken oh you have the ball yeah can't be afraid of the ball you can't be afraid of the ball and you just got to stand up there and i don't know how they do it yeah yeah there was one kid who just had in that time it was like heat but he had no control oh and i just i just didn't have him to stand in there. I didn't. No, no. I played Little Egan. That was it for me.

I couldn't. I thought he was getting hit by a fucking ball. Little Egan, first game or whatever, a little ground ball comes. My glove falls off. Boom. The ball hits my finger, breaks it. It's like the first thing.

It's a sign. It's a total sign. I was in center field. I got hit in the fucking face. I fell down. I was under. What do you mean? Did someone hit you, the ball or the grass?

It's a pop fly, and I'm backing up, and I trip, and it bounced right off my fucking face, and I'm like, that's it. If you get hit in the face in center field you're not meant for the game right yeah no we're built for this stuff though yeah oh my god how often you go back to jersey uh if i'm in new york now my sister and dad they were down in florida so i would always go and visit them but when i'm in new york and when i was doing the series we shot it here i would go home just to see some green yeah my best friend gene yeah lives in scotch plains so i would go out there and you guys are still best

friends there too yeah since high school or something that's great third grade third grade and he was in jersey yeah oh that's great yeah and everything grade. Third grade. And he was in Jersey. Yeah. Oh, that's great. Yeah. And you feel good? You feel like you got closure in your life, the adoption, everything else? Yeah, yeah, all that, yes. And you're doing all right? Yeah, yeah.

I still feel I have a lot more to do with this, though. Oh, yeah, definitely. I still feel like I haven't made it. There's still things I want to do. Well, I'm curious about this Bombeck movie. I guess you can't really talk about it, but was it a small movie like he usually does? Like, you know? Yeah, I mean, Scarlett Bombeck movie. I guess you can't really talk about it, but was it a small movie like he usually does? Yeah, I mean, Scarlett Johansson and Adam Driver, two hot people. Those big casts, yeah.

Which, you know. But he shot it like he shoots his other movies? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, great. Noah's great. Yeah. He's really great. And I kind of got the script kind of late, and I really need time now, especially at 63, to learn my lines.

I can't do it overnight like I used to. Yeah, yeah. And he wants every I dotted and every T crossed. Right. And if you don't get that, he'll just tell you again, and he doesn't get flustered. He doesn't get maniacal. He doesn't roll his eyes. He's not looking at his watch. He's just tell you again. And he doesn't get flustered. He doesn't get maniacal. He doesn't roll his eyes. He's not looking at his watch.

He's just doing it again. You do it again. So you feel safe as an actor. And that only happened in one scene. And it was only part of one scene. Everything else I got. But there was one day I would like back. I thought, you know, you finish.

You do a scene. You do your stuff and it's over and then it turns around on the other people but i didn't realize it was still going to be on our side and sometimes after you do your stuff you just kind of you just get it out of there and and you give them the cues they need but the camera's on them right get the words right yeah i you know it's weird because i'm like i new to acting. You know, I'm on this show, Glow, now. And I'm still not 100% sure what's covered when I'm getting my coverage and when it's on them. I know when it's a close-up, but a lot of times in the bigger shots, I'm just going all in all the time.

That's what I did. I agree with that, too. Unless maybe you've got a breakdown and it's right right sure sure back yeah yeah yeah but i i i think mine's will give it to him right do what the deeper gets i that's what i feel yeah yeah yeah just do it i know that's some people will wait for yeah there's some people that shut right the fuck off on their whether it's your coverage it's and it's sort of like come on give me something i've heard of people not even showing up. Oh, they have someone else read for it? Yeah.

A stand-in? Yeah. It's rude. That's fucked up. All right, well, it's great to see you, man. Same here. It was great talking to you. Yeah.

And, you know, best of luck with everything. Thank you. You too. Bye.