You Are Being Unreasonable - 098 - Stealing cakes from robots and catfishing by wearing clown make-up

Episode Date: April 15, 2021

"AIBU to think that maybe my husband is lost in the great abyss of his unending need to be validated?" We're back to provide our commentary on the strangest Mumsnet AIBU threads of the last couple of weeks. This episode, we discuss how to congratulate a husband who can't get enough of that sweet sweet validation, worrying about stealing a cake from a supermarket self-checkout, how people manage to live without bookshelves and what is the worst single book that someone could have, and the frankly terrible take that wearing make-up is a form of catfishing. 

Hello, driving on drugs feels better when their prescription. All I know, the world looks beautiful, the world looks so damn beautiful. I feel fantastic, and I never felt as good as how I do right now, except for maybe when I think about I felt that day, when I felt the way that I do right now, right now. I feel fantastic, and I never felt as good as how I do right now, except for maybe when I think about I felt that day when I felt the way that you right now, Unreasonable, a podcast about people being unreasonable on Mumsnet.com.

With me, Hales. And me, Simon. We're offering colour commentary on Mumsnet friends. Yeah? Okay, colour commentary? Yeah. I don't know what that means. It's a sports term.

I learn a sports term. Oh, you learn a sport. Why? It's when you don't describe everything that's going on in the game, like every pass or whatever, but you describe the mood at the game, the tone of the game, the emotions it evokes. A colour commentary. Oh. You add colour.

Okay. Well, that's good. Where did you learn that? Have you been playing with the boys? No, I'd get arrested. You've been out with the sportssters. Yeah. Learning things so when the pubs reopened, you can be there at the sports pubs.

Exactly. The ones that have got fosters and big sky TVs. That's what you like. Oh, she was miles offside. That doesn't sound like colour commentary. That sounds like... Oh, yeah, that's probably not. Let's do some speed round.

Am I being unreasonable? Repetitive TV about Duke's death? No. It's all that's good. pin on. Am I Being Unreasonable? Radio 2. Why so dumbed down? Why so dumbed down? Why are they playing exclusively sad songs? I know. We know why. We have it on in the background sometimes when we eat and they were playing like everybody hurts, followed by David Gray. It was so weird. You know, throw some an you in there. Then they played some like slow jams from the 90s and that

was eternal. Oh, it's what he would have wanted. That's what he would have wanted. Amma being unreasonable to just shut myself in the bathroom. No. Great way to go to the toilet and stuff. And Am I being unreasonable? To think my neighbours are using my dryer. Your dryer? Like your hair dryer?

That would be, how would they get it? If they're sneaking in from an open window and using your hair dryer and then sneaking it back in and putting it where they found it, but slightly off so that you have suspicions but you can't prove it, I think they deserve it. I think they've worked hard. Yeah, absolutely. Everyone who breaks into a house deserves what they find.

mind. Good take, hells. I just think if you've done a crime, you've clearly put some thought and some effort in. Amma being unreasonable to ask how you keep your skinny jeans up? How you keep your skinny jeans up? Well, they just stay up. Yeah, because they're skinny. They're tight fitting.

The problem's how you keep your baggy jeans up. What bizarre. I'm not going to open it, but I just needed everyone to share my bafflement. The problem with me is that they don't. don't make jeans in my size. So often, I have trouble keeping these inadvertently baggy jeans up. They do make jeans in your size. It's just you won't put the time and effort into going shopping for jeans, so you just pick up any jeans, and then you wear them until they fall apart. Fall apart around me, like my shoes did that time.

I was on Tottenham Court Road, and my shoes literally fell apart around me. Oh, I'm laughing, but exactly the same thing happened to me. not even that long ago and I was on old street. Why are we always on these big streets? Big London streets. These big streets where there's a lot of people to see our shoes just falling off of us. Let's do a thread.

Am I being unreasonable? Running out of ways to congratulate my husband. My husband is doing quite well in his job. He's always been driven and rather disciplined. I've struggled massively to get my act together due to lingering depression. I'm actively working on this. To cut a long story short, he is forever talking

about his achievements, sending WhatsApp message. about articles that pertain to his field, using most opportunities as to inspire discussions that draw the discussion back to him. I could go on and on. He's upset because I don't understand how busy he is. I get it. He's very busy and important, but I miss the man I once knew. I miss him. I'm not enjoying being married to a walking well-aligned resume. The other day he was a bit off and I asked him what was wrong. With a sigh, he stated he was hurt that a colleague of his did not congratulate him on something. By being unreasonable to think that maybe my husband is lost in the great abyss, and this unending need to be validated.

Naturally, there is more to him, but I'm struggling with this issue, and it's tainting my perception of him. I think before we get into the emotional aspects of this, let's brainstorm some quick ways to congratulate someone. You could say congrats? Yeah, you could throw a little party for every LinkedIn update. But might he then come to expect bigger and bigger parties, ever bigger parties? He will, ever longer calling the caterpillar cakes.

Yeah. And... One chunk for every achievement. Where does it end? It ends with like a millipede, collie. But then, if he's got that many achievements, you'll never finish the cakes. I'll just be rotting cakes around you all the time. Especially if finishing the cake is counted as an achievement.

Oh, no. Oh, no. Balloons. Helium balloons. Yeah. A clown. Jelly. You can only have a clown in your garden at the moment, so you'd need good weather for the clown

because I can't think of anything sadder than inviting a clown round and they're sitting in the rain. seeing a clown congratulate a man on business. Raising a glass. That's a classic congratulations. Yeah, I mean, again, it's like the cake problem, but this is more of a liver damage problem. Maybe he's got that many.

I guess just an empty glass. Yeah, a card. A simple card. The humble card. God, but having to make all these cards. It could do special sexy things, fine. Yeah, I think she's struggled with getting her act together due to lingering depression. She doesn't need the stress of...

Well, yeah. Now we're getting into the emotional aspect of it. Or making a card. or feeling somehow compelled to participate in sex acts because he got a new contact on LinkedIn. See, yeah, now we're in the emotional depths, the depths of this relationship where the husband has a constant need for validation. I love this sentence. My husband is lost in the great abyss that is an unending need to be validated. Pure poetry.

That's rough, that's rough. You want to look at the logical end point of that and you see Donald J. Trump. Well, yeah, yeah, that is the logical end point. a man entirely consumed but he's need to be validated stared so long into business that business stared back at him yeah

this husband sounds bad sounds like a bad husband it sounds like his wife is suffering from depression and yet he is focused entirely on himself and his achievements in the field which I don't know maybe he's winning a Nobel Prize

but still even if you're winning a Nobel Prize you have to look after your depressed spouse. Yeah, I mean, I have struggled quite a lot with my mental health. There was a point last summer where I really wasn't very well, and you were really good about it. You didn't send me a load of WhatsApps about your field of work. That wouldn't have helped. Hells, could you tweet about this film review I put out?

Look, maybe you'll feel a little less sad if you just appreciate just how great I am. What? Maybe a little retweet will make you feel better. You can get secondary clout off. my likes. Maybe that will be some damn endorphins. Yeah. I don't think...

He just sounds like an arse. He really does. WhatsApp messages about articles that pertain to his field. Presumably that mention him, otherwise. Yeah, otherwise that's really weird. Using most opportunities to inspire discussions that draw the discussion back to him. He just sounds very self-absorbed and extremely boring. It's role-play that.

We're having a conversation. Oh, yeah. Do you want a couple of tea? Yeah, yeah, I love tea It helps fuel my brain And my many achievements Okay, yeah, no That's great

I'm gonna go and put the radio on now, I think The radio, a wonderful medium Where I could broadcast My many achievements Yeah In the field Just go crank it up Just crank it up

Until I can't hear you anymore People hearing me And hearing my many achievements The guy just sounds He just sounds like the worst man hurt that his colleague did not congratulate on something. What a big baby! Yeah.

Like, it's difficult if you work in an environment where you don't receive recognition for the work that you do, but it sounds like he's receiving plenty of recognition, and he just wants more and more and more. It's a big difference between being hurt because, like, your boss has stolen the credit for something you've done, or being hurt because your colleague is just minding their business, and it sounds like it's the latter, and I think he's a twat. I think the biggest achievement I have coming up is hitting 100 episodes, of this humble podcast. And I don't want my colleagues to congratulate me on it. I don't want

them to know it exists. Yeah, I mean, I submitted two funding applications in one day the other day, and my boss said, oh, get you. But did your colleagues? I didn't tell them. Why would you? Yeah, I'm not going to like message everybody, go on teams and send a message to the whole organisation to say, I've just been doing my job. There's probably some teams that have a stand-up meeting where they talk about the accomplishments who've done that week. Like my old job

Yeah, like your old You used to love listening To the stand-up meetings At my old job And we were working from home last summer In a much smaller home So many stand-up meetings Yeah, we had a lot of stand-up meetings

Mostly sitting down I worked at one place Where stand-ups involved standing up Those meetings that you used to listen to Were stand-up meetings When we were all in the same room But then they became sitting down Online meetings

And they suddenly got three times as long Did this person actually use the phrase busy and important? Yeah. Because that's the phrase you used as a parody of busy and important people. I thought it was a general phrase, is it not? Is it just something I say? I've never heard it out of anyone's mouth but yours.

Oh, yeah, no, they genuinely said their husband is very busy and important. I think we're on the travelators at Waterloo. You talked about the busy and important people try and push past or something. Yeah, the people who, even if you're walking along the traveller, are perfectly really... reasonable pace, they come swaggering in and they overtake you and they just walk at the same pace as you, so they've achieved nothing. Yeah, they just need you to know they're very busy and important. Yeah. They're at Waterloo, so they're probably going to bank, so they're probably in the city. Big city people. Yeah, they've come in from Surrey, is that where the

Waterloo trains go? Yeah. Yeah, they've come in from the Burbs into Waterloo and now they have to get on the Waterloo and City line and they're very busy and important. Yeah, so then someone's replied saying mine can be like this, it's bloody exhausting. And then the O.P.'s come back and said, he'll stumble into bed and spend a good 20 minutes clearing out email, muttering about how busy he is. Oh, so busy. He was cleaning. Maybe you'd clear out email faster if you didn't, if you're focused on it rather than muttering how busy you are. Maybe you would get work done more effectively if you weren't trying to do it in bed. And working from bed is fine, but working from bed if you're actually going to bed for the night is not the same as sitting in bed.

because you have a pain thing or whatever. It sounds like he needs more staff, needs more staff to support him. Well, he's... And that's a problem for his manager. They should bring up with him. I was going to say, if he can't recruit more staff himself, he can't be that busy and important, can he? Can't be that senior?

Just a lackey. Just a hard-working lackey. The O.P. themselves says, I think he'd get more done if he didn't spend so much time talking about how busy and important he is. Well, yeah, quite. His excuse for not attending various social meets is that he's very busy with work, I get it, but how many times

there? Maybe it's a self-esteem thing, a low self-esteem thing, but I cannot fathom describing yourself as important. Even if you were Prince Philip, even if I were Prince Philip, if I were married to Her Majesty of the Queen, I couldn't see myself as important. Well, no. It's a weird way to think of yourself. Yeah, I mean, everyone's just like, he just sounds terrible.

Why don't you tell him he's terrible? God, how tedious, I think it might be time for a frank talk with him. about how he's coming across. Yeah, telling him he's falling into the abyss that is his need for validation. Tell him exactly that on a card. And then the best one, we'll leave it here. Make him a sticker chart.

Today, Dave managed to send 47 emails and spent four hours on teams meetings. Go Dave. Yes, little stickers. Little sticker chart. Great. Shall we move on? Anna being unreasonable,

where are the bookshelves? Inspired by another thread. Do people genuinely not believe it's possible to live without shelf after shelf of books? in a house, or is it, as I suspect, faux naivety or virtue signalling? We've not got many books in our house. Both adults are degree-educated professionals, but feel no need to have books. When I've finished a book, I pass it on, as I have no desire to read the same book twice. We have a few shelves in the study, with a few technical manuals, etc. But these go out of date

so quickly as to be obsolete as soon as they're printed. So we go online mostly. The DC have books, of course, as they don't tire quickly of rereading. But I certainly don't think we're slobs for not having lots of books. What are these books people are so king to keep and tell everyone they must have? One bookshelf in the study with the guide to Perl or Guide to Python or JavaScript or whatever. Yeah, just the little... Microsoft Excel for Dummies 2,000 data. European Computer Driving License Manual.

Yeah. It'll soon go out of date and we'll just throw it away. We'll just go online. We shall read a PDF of Microsoft Excel for Dummies. I, sorry, I chose this thread because I just, I love that this person thinks that someone's saying, where are the bookshelves, is virtue signalling, as opposed to just saying, where are the bookshelves? That's not virtue signalling. Do you think that having bookshelves is virtue signalling? Or is it simply talking about bookshelves, which is virtue signalling?

I don't ascribe virtue to books and bookshelves anyway. No. What a weird, it's a romantic ideal of books, but this person is, subverting it, but they still have the romantic ideal. Yeah, exactly. They still associate books with virtue rather than treating them as items. And then they go to such lengths to explain why

they don't need to keep books, that that seems like they think that there's some sort of moral value to not having a load of books. Yeah, exactly. It's such a weird take. They're putting too much weight on books, and like you say, moral value on books. A lot of people think I have some moral value

about the super-highest feticism of books, because I'm a qualified librarian But I really don't I don't romanticise books When it's time to get rid of them You can chuck them in the bin You don't have to take them to a charity shop

Or a library Your public library don't want them Yeah You can just throw them away You can tear pages out of books You own them Yeah Do what you fucking like

Turn them into art Who cares No one cares There are enough copies Of my bookie-work in the world That you don't have to regard it as sacred Not every item is sacred. I really hope that my bookie book is one of the few books that they have.

I hope it's just some manuals and the bookie book. I've been reading, I've been getting e-books for fiction books because once you've read a fiction book, you're pretty unlikely to have to go back to it, unless it's very good. But I do like hard non-fiction books because often they're reference that you might want to refer to them later. I like physical books.

I just find reading off a screen, even a Kindle screen, much harder to take in. I like having physical books, and I do read books more than once. I have some books that I read once a year. Yeah, yeah. I'm not saying, don't keep, don't keep, don't not keep fiction books. I mean, I've got a big copy of Infinite Jest,

a lot of the rings. Yeah, no, I'm just saying... I'm just saying, like, you know, we're all different. So that's why they keep my books and why you don't keep yours, and that's a very straightforward thing where we haven't had to have a big rower about it and start a thread. Why can't this person recognise that we're all different? Yeah. You know, I have to have bookshelves. Fine. It doesn't make you a better person or anyone else a better person for having books. I've also never seen these people saying

where are the bookshelves, except for like obviously when I was at uni and people would post that you go to someone's house and they don't have books, don't fuck them, no book, no fuck all the time. It's like, mate, no one's fucking you anyway. Like, you're just making excuses now. You're like, no, no, it's not that no one wants to go near me because I'm obnoxious. it's that they simply didn't have enough books like other than that I've not seen people doing this this isn't a thing

now it's weird that more people haven't come forward to say I brought John Waters home for sex and he didn't want to have sex because I had no books like he says this all the time it's all over the internet but where are the people

he didn't have sex with where are they because if John Waters didn't have sex with me I would talk about it he's John Waters Yeah, let's hear from the thread We have a room that has a long wall, floors of ceiling And water wall full of books

These shelves are double deep too So the books are too deep We read a lot and we regularly revisit old books We see them as old friends Some are many decades old And in a few cases, well over a hundred years old It's whatever you love What?

Why are they too deep? I hate that, I hate that they're too deep That's not efficient I hate it That's not how you treat old friends Your 100 year old friend Behind the other friends Your hundred year old friend

Your frail elderly friend Who you've just tucked away behind another friend It's going to be hard to find Hard to find I don't understand this at all This is coming from the warehouse of books That Alberto Manguel used to keep I like books

I like to reread some books Some books are reference books What's with the faux wandering I think that person's summed it up very well This is they're accusing people of faux naivety, but they're actually doing phone naivety to imply that they're more virtuous for not having books. Yeah. But none of this is virtuous. They're just books. Yeah. Like, no one seems to be saying that, no one seems to be saying, but you must have books, O.P. Like, the OPs come back

and said, sorry, I've not explained myself well, I see that. What I was trying to say is, if you want a house full of books, that's grand. If you don't, that's equally grand. What I don't quite get is people exclaiming they couldn't possibly live in a house that's not full of books, as though it's some sort of value judgment. Well, that's not what you said at all. Who? You're imagining these people. It's a classic straw man.

If I went to someone's house and they didn't have any books, I don't think I would notice. Like, I don't think it would register. I don't go into homes and start sniffing out the books. Like, I'd have books out, don't. I want to read a book. Yeah, I'm not a petulant child who turns up at someone's house and just sits quietly reading their books. Why if they had a shelf with just one book on it? And it's Jordan Peterson's 12 Rules for Life.

I would notice that. Is that the worst one book that someone could have? Not great. Possibly. Atlas shrugged. Yeah, bad, bad. Just Fight Club? Yeah.

Like, I'm not dissing Chuk Palaniac, but just Fight Club is weird. Yeah, it is. It really is. Just those three as well. Just those three, and they're all facing out like people do when they go on the news with their bookshel. Yeah, like a bookshop display. Yeah, like the staff recommends display at Waterstones, except it's just those three books, and it's not Waterstones.

I don't know that I'd ever be in a house like that, because that person doesn't sound like someone I would be friendly enough with to go into their home. No, no. But, yeah, I don't think I've ever actively noticed if someone doesn't have books. No. Noticing the absence of something in someone's home seems like a weird thing to do. No exercise back.

Yeah, exactly. You must not exercise. like baffling and then someone's come along and I can't find it now but someone came along and said what would you fill all the space with if you didn't have books a big telly like there we go there's the one person who is being judging no why do you have to fill every bit of space with a telly we're recording in our study we're at a desk that the bookshelf next to us if we put a telly there it would be wildly out of place yeah you'd be too close to it from the desk. There are built-in bookshelves in our living room and then the wall that is adjacent to that

has a TV. So if we took all the books out and put a TV there, why do we have two TVs? This is ridiculous. Let's do another thread. I'm being unreasonable, worried at self-checkout. This afternoon, I was at the self-checkout in Sainsbury's and finished scanning and putting away my items. At this point, my bag was extremely full and I put my birthday cake, £6.50, on the scanner after the machine finished to sort my things. But at this point the cake scanned again, and I thought nothing of it, and collected my things and left. Now, hours later, and I'm actually quite worried. There was a large camera in front of me, and the till was left alone with the scanned cake, as I obviously walked away

with it. I still have my receipt, but I got ridiculously anxious that something bad is going to happen, like someone will turn up at my house or something for this stolen cake. Am I being unreasonable? I feel so unsettled and worried. I let himself check out, and I had so much stuff. So I put the celebration cake that I bought for my husband's achievements to one side on the scanner. Well, I sorted out all the other things I'd bought to celebrate his achievements. The party poppers, the little hats. The helium tanks. The champagne. The jars for calling Caterpillar cake jars. So let's walk through this scenario. Yeah.

Finish scanning, putting away the items. The birthday cake had been on the scales. So the birthday cake has been scanned and paid for, but then you don't have space in the bagging area, so you'd put the birthday cake back on the scanning bit. But had they paid for the items? Well, they don't say anywhere they paid for anything, so... I mean, it's not just the cake that you stole in that case, is it? Because I think unless you get to the point of hitting pay now, and if it scans again,

that's going to register as two cakes. So now you're worried, not that you've stolen a cake, but that you've paid twice for a cake, and you're going to get in trouble. Well, that was my first fork. No, I think that what they've done is they've finished all their shopping, they've paid. It's got to the end of the process. While they've been rearranging their bags, they put the cake on the scanner. It's scanned.

They're starting a new transaction cycle. And then they've wandered off. And so the next person trying to use that self-checkout is going to have to get someone to come over and cancel that. And it's a bit of a fath, but I don't think they've done a crime. Yeah, the next person walks up and maybe they don't notice, and they pay for a cake they never have. And yeah, that person should come to your house and arrest you. They should do a citizen's arrest because you stole £6.50 from them with your negligence. And it's not really a cake that exists, because her cake was paid for.

Yeah. And this is just the ghost of a cake, the ghost in the machine. Yeah. The ghost in the shell of a cake. The cake in the shell. And... It's very funny that it's a cake. I don't know why it's just very funny that it's a cake.

It is. Also that she says, I put my birthday cake. Not a birthday cake. My birthday cake. I went out and bought her own birthday cake. I mean, sometimes you just got it, haven't you? Sometimes you've got to. But it's hard to get a cake in her bag.

I got you a birthday cake, and it's hard to negotiate it with all the other stuff. I don't know how you snuck that birthday cake in either. Yeah, I mean, I hope you Opie didn't ruin her birthday worrying about this. I would also be anxious. Would you? Oh, yeah. You think someone would come around and arrest you?

Yeah. And throw you in jail. Sometimes. those cameras, like you can see yourself on the monitor. Yeah. Like, it's a little mirror. Yeah. I don't like that. Oh. Because I know they're watching then. Oh. But, like, if it's all being filmed and they will have seen what went down,

they will have seen the whole thing. It works in the O.P.'s' favour. I don't trust them to watch all that footage. Yeah, but they've still got the footage. So when someone comes hammering at your door, open up. It's about the cake. Yeah. And say, just watch all the footage, mate. Yeah, and when Sainsbury's edit it, to make me look like a thief. And then release it. it to crime watch, send it to your family who disown you.

Yeah, I say, what's the footage? They roll the footage, and it's not the footage I expect, because it seems to be as edited it to get me. After the time, I accidentally spilt some Taw a kitty litter bag open in the aisle, and then just left it. I've come to get me. I accidentally broke a jar of yoghurt in Audi the other day and didn't know what to do about it, so I just left it.

That was the same shopping trip where I got your birthday cake. Wow, a big day. and I tore the kitty litter, picking it up. Was that also like when you thought it would be a good idea to go to the bigger supermarket because you thought, well, it's bigger, so there'd be more space for social distancing. But apparently, everyone thought that. Yeah, whereas the co-op is empty. That was some strange logic.

That was for no reason that logic irritated me. I don't know why. Turns out in bigger supermarkets, they just, just put more shelves in, not the space of the shelves differently. Yeah, exactly. And it was really close to Christmas, so everyone had gone to the big supermarket so they could buy all of the stuff that you don't need at Christmas that people think you need. It was the worst shopping experience I've ever had.

Oh, no. And then I tore the kitty later, I had to hide this cake. Oh, no. And that's why Sainsby's have edited this footage to come get me. I think as long as you've got a receipt saying you paid for the cake. I'll but the worry is, I think you've had two cakes. Yeah, and I'll be like, this says that you paid for one, can't? Yeah, but you've clearly eaten two cakes.

Look at you. Yeah, I don't think Sainsbury's are going to come round and fat shame you. It's in Sainsbury's best interest that people keep eating. Yeah, especially £6.50K. 6.50 for Berto cake seems very reasonable. I don't know what size the cake was. I don't know. Am I being unreasonable?

Is makeup a form of catfishing? Okay, hear me out. Before I start this thread, I want to say I'm not bashing women who wear makeup. I myself love makeup and I wear it regularly. I'm just really interested in other people's opinions. Lately, I've been thinking about whether a full face of makeup could amount to catfishing of some sort. I myself look completely different when I have a full face of makeup on. In fact, when I wear makeup, I'm constantly cat-called and stared at by men, whereas when I go out with absolutely nothing on, that doesn't happen as much. Sometimes I even think, if only you saw me when I

woke up this morning. I was speaking about this with a couple of my friends who admitted that their boyfriends have yet to see them without makeup? That's crazy to me. What if the person you're with ends up totally not into your fresh face and the makeup kind of tricked them into thinking you look like something that in reality took a bunch of makeup and an hour in the mirror to achieve? Just a thought. You are being unreasonable equals don't be so stupid. You are not being unreasonable equals to an extent makeup can put out a false image. The fun thing about words is that you can put any together and people have to interpret them. People have to try and figure out what it means.

Okay. So you can put together, is makeup a form of catfishing? And people have to try and figure that out. You just thrown those words together. We've no thought about the meaning of words. But people have to figure it out. And you're forced to in their brain.

Okay, but is makeup a form of catfishing? So catfishing is when you pose as someone that you're not online to fool someone into a dating relationship. Yeah. or otherwise mislead them. Yeah. It's popularised by the MTV series Catfish. Yes.

Based on the film, Catfish. Yes. By Neve Shulman. Yes. And what's his name? Max. Max. Max is great.

Yeah, Max isn't in it anymore. Max isn't in it anymore, so I don't watch it anymore. Oh, no, Cammy's even better. Sure. Like, Max did a very good line in just being like, this is bullshit. I hate it. And Cammy does that too, but she does it with the sort of gentleness that is good. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Anyway, the key part here, I think, is online. yeah yeah okay so but no i was going to try to make sense of it but i can't so she's suggesting that by putting on makeup you are projecting a false image of yourself yes how much makeup would you have to have for it to be completely different if you're dressed as a clown yeah if you have a full face of clown makeup then you're projecting a false image of yourself as a clown you have to have your face painting of one of those little eggs that goes in like the clown Academy to be a proper clown, to be an official clown.

Yeah. Stolen Vela. What if when we first met for the first like six months that we were together, I was always a clown and there was one morning, I didn't manage to wake up in time to do the clown makeup and then you realise I was not a clown. You'd be like, no, you catfished me. Yeah. You're clown fished me.

You're not a clown. You clown fished me. What if you have makeup like a clownfish? Finding Nemo Yeah Then you've clownfish fishing Is makeup a form of clownfish fishing? Oh my gosh

But most subtly What if you wear a smoky eye For every date And then The gentleman thinks You just have smoky eyes I thought she was a panda But she's not

Well this is the thing To some extent I think You know It's really on the person that you're dating to understand that you have makeup on and you might not look the same without makeup. Sometimes you can't tell. Like, the guy who played Richard in Lost

always looked like he had eyeliner on. I don't think he always had eyeliner on. That's just how he looked. Nestor Carbonell. Okay. So some people just naturally look like they have eyeliner on. And some people are very bad at knowing if someone's wearing makeup.

When I was teaching English as a foreign language, it was a direct method where, like, you just ask questions and get answers, and that's how you teach it. Among the questions in the book was, am I wearing makeup? And the number of times that people would say to me and my colleague, no, when we were quite clearly wearing, like, colourful eye shadow. Like, what? You need to really, really peer at those eyes.

Like, I'm wearing teal eye shadow, my friend. Am I wearing makeup? No, you are not wearing makeup. No, look at my face. I think also a lot of the men in the classes thought that saying yes would somehow be considered offensive. Rude, rude to point it out Yeah, it's fine I asked This is part of your learning experience

Yeah, you're not attempting to catfish your student That would be very odd behaviour Like, why is this bit as well Where it's like, oh I get cat called when I wear makeup Like I get cat called when I wear a mask Because when I go out with my mask on I think it makes me look a lot younger than I am And people think I'm an easier target

For their pointless street harassment Whereas when I go out without my mask on It's obvious that I'm 31 and I will fuck you up Yeah, the fact that they mentioned this bit about being cat-called makes me think that maybe they think being cat-fished is being cat-called. Cat-called-fished, cat-fish-called. Like, the men are fishing for women, and they do a cat-call to catfish. Yeah, that way...

I just think they don't understand what cat-fishing means. Yeah, it's such a weird thread. And I'm glad that the first response says in my experience, cat-calling has nothing to do with how much makeup you're wearing. It's pure power play to make women feel uncomfortable, which backs up what I'm saying about how I think people do it to me when they perceive me to be younger than I am. This just sounds like you're trying to lay yet more responsibility and blame at the door of women. Yes, that's a very good point.

Someone said no, but I think it's hilarious that you think it is. Yeah, lots of people are saying, well, are you just saying that women deserve to be cackled if they go out wearing makeup? What counts as a false image of someone? Like if someone wears glasses, is that a false image of them? Yeah, is that what they're saying? I guess so. If they wear glasses with a nose and a moustache attached, then that is a false image. That's a party shop disguise.

Often deliberately to pull off a spectacular art hoist. But like if you're wearing glasses, you are changing the look of your face. Yeah, but if you get a different haircut, that changes the way your face looks. Yeah, so he's a haircut, catfishing? We watched You Got Mail last night, and Meg Ryan's hair made me genuinely quite angry. It was such a bad haircut. Looking at her hair, pissed me. off. I didn't see the appeal of Meg Ryan's character at all.

Well, yeah. Also, her character was horrible. Like, Tom Hanks starts the film with Parker Posey. Like, dude. You've won. Yeah. But Meg Ryan's hair was so, so bad. But if she had a different haircut and then she got that one cut in, you couldn't say that she'd catfish you. Like, oh, I thought that she was attractive, but then she got a horrible haircut. She's a catfish. Now, changing your appearance slightly is not catfishing, which is what makeup is. If I put on a shirt and tie, it's not catfishing you because I usually wear sweaters.

Yeah, if I grow a little mustache, that's not catfishing. I don't think that the ends of your thingies are ever colour-changing. False images of my hands. This is nonsense, true nonsense. Yeah, I mean, everyone's just like, oh, no. Someone said you lost me after the second I myself, which they kind of lost me as well. I'm reading this person to be an estate agent. Yeah, I myself.

really lost interest after the first time I saw. Someone said catfishing doesn't mean making yourself look more conventionally attractive. It means pretending to be someone you're not. Well, there we are. That's the crux of it. That words have meanings. Yeah, and then someone else said, is a man in a suit, catfishing. Surely it's different to when he woke up and hadn't showered, brushed his hair, shaved or got dressed. Yeah. Catfishing has a meaning and this is not it. So no, makeup is not catfishing.

And with that, should we do one more speed round? Yeah. Amma being unreasonable to think it's actually insane to take your children to Buckingham Palace at 1am. It's a little weird. It's not like Princess Dye died again. Yeah, because that would have been fine. When it was Princess Die, it was normal. People's Princess.

Okay. Amma being unreasonable? Not to force Dede's friendships? No, don't force it. Amma being unreasonable to wonder if living to 100 will become the norm. Not to think about it, no. Probably will. And Emma being unreasonable, most couples are doomed.

Oh, no. Oh, no. That's a shame. Same for our listeners. I'm sorry to hear that, hells. Yeah. I like it. Well, here we go.

Never mind. I'm going to start a new podcast with Meg Ryan. Great. And you can... You've got Mumsnet. Yeah, you've got Mumsnet where two people meet on Mumsnet. You've got female. Oh.

Sounds like a gender critical podcast. Yeah, it does. Don't start that. Although I would watch a You've Got Mail for the Mumsnet age in which two gender-critical people. people meet on the feminism board, and then they find out that they're, I don't know, both men. Thanks for listening. Thank you for listening. We're coming up on 100 episodes, like I said, and for 50, I put out a compilation of some of our best bits from the 50 previous episodes.

So if you're listening and you have any particularly good bits that you enjoyed, let us know, like, tweet us at Y are being reasonable. And maybe I'll put them in a compilation. Maybe I won't bother. I don't want to commit myself. Yeah, if anyone has any suggestions for threads that they would like to hear for our 100th episode, I might dive into Mumsnet Classics for 100. We might do Pina Speaker, we might do elderly Korean lady, we might do cut it up pair. Classics.

The classics of Mumsnet, the ones that people list to prove that they've been on Mumsnet forever. Then all you need to have done is read one post with that list. Thank you for listening. Thank you. Goodbye. When I think of how I felt that day, when I felt the way that I do right now, right now, right now.