You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - 7 Biggest Jazz Myths - #84

Episode Date: December 20, 2018

On today's episode, Peter and Adam debunk some common myths about jazz. See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Hey, Adam. Yeah. Do you like mythology? I do. Greek mythology is fascinating. Yeah. What about Egyptian mythology? I don't know anything about that.

What about jazz mythology? Let's talk about that. All right. I'm Adam Maness. And I'm Peter Martin. You're listening to the You'll Hear podcast. Daily Jazz advice. And just to warn you, possibly a little controversy coming your way daily.

Have you read any Greek mythology, actually? Yes. I was actually in sixth grade. I had a great, I guess it was in English. English or social studies, whatever the class was. Great teacher. Shout out to community school in Lidu, Missouri. Hey.

That we read that, you know, Greek mythology. I don't know, it was one of the little paperback. I know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, yeah. It's great, man. Like foundation for Western storytelling. Yeah.

And I think it might have helped me with the modes of the major scale, but I'm not sure. It most certainly did. Ionian, Doric and all that stuff. Whoa. All right. All right. All right. My seat just went down.

Oh. Hello. Hello. Let's go back up. Hades dragging you down. Let's dive in. We've got a list of seven here. What are we talking about today?

Talking about our seven biggest jazz myths. Right. Should that have been the largest? Seven biggest? Seven largest? No, it's biggest. That's right. Yeah, I think that's right.

Okay. Okay. Do we, first of all, do we get a chance to order these? Or we're going to do them in no particular order. No particular order. All right. All right, good. So why don't we start with, as we say that, I'm going to reorder it?

Number one is for our seven. seven biggest jazz myth. You need to go to jam sessions every day to get better. Is that a jazz myth? I believe it is. It is a myth. Now, I think I grabbed this one off the internet when I Google, because most of these we came up with, but a couple I threw in there.

That's good. A little research. Yeah, a little research. But this one's a little bit funny because if you go to jam sessions every day, you actually will get better. Yeah, you will. But I think the myth part of it is that in general, like, just go to jam sessions, be around the music.

and that's how you get better. When that individual practice, studying, listening to recordings, all the things work together. Jam sessions are just a part of it. Plus, if you're going to kind of the wrong jam sessions, i.e. bad players or bad tunes and stuff like that, you're not really going to get anywhere.

You might even get worse. Yeah, I mean, your time is always a consideration. So if you're going to jam sessions with a ton of bad players or something and you're waiting for three hours, whatever, that time could probably be better spent practicing at home. You know what I mean? But, I mean, you still need to go and get it. yourself out there for sure with the community.

Good. All right, what's number two? You have to be a jazz professor to play jazz well. Now, I know that Monk had three doctoral degrees from Julia. Oh, no, he didn't. No, he didn't. Yeah, interesting. So what do you try to say? Myth, man.

Okay, myth, right. Sorry, I got confused. I never was a double negative there. Yeah, you don't have to be a jazz professor. Now, this is not to say we love the jazz professors. There's plenty of jazz professors. I mean, like Joe Livano comes to mind. of Herbie Hancock

is a jazz professor I mean there's plenty of jazz professors it's not about that but the main thing about this is we're saying you don't have to be a scholar of jazz in order to play well no no and you know historically that's never

been the case until very very recently that there was even this opportunity to like study jazz at this you know secondary education level I mean it's just really it's really such a huge part of the part of the music now but yeah man you don't need that at all all. Right. And I think it also speaks to just like you don't have to talk about music in a scholarly, be able to talk about music. I mean, it's a cool thing if you can do that. And like, you know, Wint Marcellus definitely comes to mind that like he has such a great ability to go from being a jazz professor to really a jazz scholar. Yeah. To sort of an American history and how jazz fits into the American story scholar as well and then a great player and everything. But that's a very rare separate skill set. Yeah, but think about someone like Roy Hargrover, Miles Davis or someone who didn't want to talk.

about the music like that for the fear that it would ruin the mystery of it, you know, of, for them. Right. You know, I think, I think there's, I might be a little irked this morning with some jazz professor. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Sounds like you have a little, yeah, exactly. So, all right, so let's move on. Let's move on. Let's move on. Let's move on. A little less controversial. And that is, uh, you have to suffer or do drugs or be African American in order to play jazz well. Less controversial. That was a little joke. All right. Okay. So I grouped all these together because basically

it's all things. that really don't have anything to do with the music, but that either popular culture or the media or the movies or just ignorant people have associated with the music, sort of socioeconomic things and whatever. And really what this is about is that, you know, it's not to say that there haven't been jazz musicians that's just like there's been, you know,

attorneys and doctors and stuff that have done drugs that are successful or good. It's just that it has nothing to do with that. And so it makes an interesting thing in certain movies and that kind of thing. But you have the vast majority of great jazz players that don't partake in that. That kind of stuff is sexy or to suffer as, you know,

like you're always this brooding artist or whatever. And that's a lot of times associated with the blues. And I think that there's certainly an element to that. I mean, a huge element to how the blues, you know, was born, how it came to influence jazz, really the foundation, one of the big foundation points. And how that came out of the African-American, a lot of suffering, slavery.

in this country and in this music and there's certainly that historical link there for sure. But when you talk about I almost think it's kind of what do you call it disingenuous when that's attached to the music. Now it's like saying that's only what it's about. So I think you have to understand the foundations

and the historical implications of the music but you don't have to be from Mississippi and suffer in that way or even geographically be somewhere or racially be of a certain race in order to play this music. this boils down to me to you know we were talking about this yesterday to authenticity yeah you know what I mean like whoever you are bring that to the

music right you know what I mean if you do drugs bring that to the music that's right if you're straight edge bring that to the music you know so it's like the authenticity is the I have to say that word twice apparently every time I say is the most important part that's right good all right number four if you transcribe solos you'll automatically get better what actually is that a myth that's real. That's got to be totally real, right? Well, okay, this is, yeah, okay, I decided to put kind of a little, but what does automatically mean?

Exactly. So technically it's not true. You're not going to get automatically better. But by this one, what I just meant was, sorry to steal this one back, but I think I wrote this one. You could take that one. No, the thing was, and this was another one I got off the internet. Oh, that's right. That's why I put this in there, because this is literally on a list of things of the top miss. And I'm like, no, it's actually not a myth. You will get better as long as you're doing the some other things that, it required to become a great musician as well.

Yeah. I mean, if we sell you on anything of this podcast, it's transcription as a means to become a better player. Well, you see, I wrote on there. This is actually not a myth in all caps. So there you go. Can I do the next one since you hijack that one? Right. Well, what's a myth? So go ahead. You have to be a member of the jazz police force. Jazz Police force. You added force. I didn't know there was a whole force of Jazz Police. Jazz Police Task Force. To play jazz well.

That is a myth I mean It's so much of a myth I don't know if you can be a member Of the Jazz Police Force Are there any members of the Jazz Police Force That are really good players? Yeah

Okay let's call them out Man we got a lot of Well Ethan Iverson He's a great player And he kind of Is he on the Jazz Police though He might be on the Art Police Yeah

But no he just has a very strong opinion Yeah and actually We can't put him on the Jazz Police Because he's very articulate And there's like writings and stuff So But it fits with he's too good Yeah, he's good. Well, that's what I was saying. I mean, could you be, but the whole thing is what we're saying is you don't have to be a member of the jazz. So if there's a couple that have slipped in onto the force, you definitely do not. I encourage you not to be part of the jazz police. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. And you definitely don't have to be part of it. Yeah. But there's many on that jazz police force that think, I mean, it's kind of stupid though, because what they're trying to enforce, they realize that all the, the group of many of the great players are not on the police force. So that's great. Let's move on. All right. Number six, you have to know the entire.

history of jazz to play or listen to the music. So I realized we were starting to get into, you know, the biggest jazz miss and it's all about being a great player. You don't have to do these things to still be able to play. But there's so many myths around the music. So to be, to listen to the music, to enjoy the music, whether playing or listening and being a part of it, there really is this myth and this kind of doctrine that you have to do homework, that you have to know the history.

Like, how can you enjoy Thelone Smunk? If you haven't, I've actually heard people say this, if you don't know Scott, to O'Oppelin to Earl Father Hines to Mead Lex Lewis. I mean, you're going to be enhanced if you know that. But if you just sit down and listen to a monk and you don't know anything else and you enjoy that, what a great thing. Yeah, for real. So I think that this, you know, placing the music into this museum and to the universities

has kind of done a disservice when we get this better, you know, holier than thou attitude, well, you don't know the history of stride piano. Then you can't be a great player. Of course you can. There's a lot of great players that don't know that. Yeah, I hear you on this one. I'll hear it. You're sure?

Yeah, no, I do. You seem a little skeptical. No, no, no, I'm thinking it through a little bit because I do. I mean, you're right that whatever you put into this, you're going to get back, you know, tenfold as far as like digging deeper into artists or in the history of music. It really does enhance your whole experience. It's so much more fun to listen to modern stuff, knowing the history of it and where it came from in the lineage. But like you said, you can still put on, if you've never heard a monk, you still put on a monk record and hopefully enjoy it and not have to be. be vived by the jazz police.

I love how, like, you know, Monk is like the latest thing they were. You know, something modern like Monk. You don't have to go all the way back before a Monk, you know. A good 50 years ago. All right, we got number seven? Yeah, this will be a good one for you because it's topical to yourself. All right.

Go ahead. Oh, you have to wear jazz hipster clothes to play slash listen to jazz. Barre, piano. Now hold on a minute, buddy. You are wearing a scarf indoors. It's cold. Come on, man. But this is not jazz hipster clothes.

I'm wearing like a blue sweater. I know. I didn't say this applies to you right now. The only, the hipster part did. But actually, this is two different things. So I probably shouldn't have put hipster because, but I put jazz hipster. Okay. So I'm thinking more like, you know, going back in the day to like Greenwich Village in the 50s, the beatnik thing and whatever.

I don't even know what I'm talking about. But you know, like the guy who shows up, you know, with the, I was going to say the long cigarette. No, that's something different. This one has really gone off the rails. The beret. The beret. That's the one. part around the world. That does make you look jazier. That makes you look jazier. And the piano

tie, you weren't feeling that? You know the guy who shows up and is like, hey, what's up, man? The cats are all here, you know? This is definitely a myth. Yeah, this is the seven biggest miss. And we're all number seven. This whole episode is a myth. That's right. So you're not feeling this one? No, this is fun, man. I like, I like the lighthearted you'll hear it fairs. Not everything has to be all about block chords and triad pairs. That's right. Well, you know what? So if we missed mark on a couple of these. Why don't you guys go to YouTube. Check out today's episode. Leave us in the comments. Miss the mark. We missed the whole target. I don't think so. If technically, let's go back and do a quick recap. Okay. That's good. So here's the seven again. And this is what you guys

can refute. I think number four is the only one. We have a little bit of legal exposure. There might be number seven. Yeah. Number one, you need to go to jam sessions every day to get better. Myth. Number two, you have to be a jazz professor to play jazz well. Myth. Number three, you have to suffer, do drugs, be African American, et cetera to play. It's a jazz well. Myth. Number four, you have to transcribe, no, if you transcribe solos, you'll automatically get better. Not a myth. Number five, you have to be a member of the jazz, please force to play jazz well.

Myth. Yeah. Six, you have to know the entire history of jazz to play or listen to the music. True. Not myth. No. Myth with caveats. Right. Okay. Seven, you have to wear jazz, hipster clothes to play or listen to jazz. Well, that's it for today's episode. So leave us in the comments on YouTube If you know number one through seven If you disagree or agree with any of these Or maybe you have some other jazz myths

That would be interesting for us to hear a comment on right? Yeah Yeah and go to you'll hearth.com to leave us a question Or a voicemail there Yeah Also pick up some you'll hear it swag You know we have T shirts We're still working on these seven star t-shirts

Yeah they're coming soon But we've got some of the OG logo You'll Hear T-T-shirts available now They're like two months old How can they be OJ? Well, men's stuff We've done like 500 episodes since then. That's true, actually.

All right. Well, till tomorrow. You'll hear it.