You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - Greatest Jazz Piano Solo Ever?

Episode Date: June 5, 2023

Join us on this episode as we dive deep into the legendary legacy of McCoy Tyner, one of the most influential jazz pianists of all time. Brace yourself for an awe-inspiring journey as we unravel the sheer brilliance of Tyner's unforgettable piano solo playing with the legendary John Coltrane quartet. Check the video out for yourself here! Have a question for us? Leave us a SpeakPipeCheckout courses from Adam, Peter and more at Open StudioLet us know what you think by leaving a ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ review, or head over to our YouTube channel.Follow us on Instagram

Hey, Peter. Hey. How's your coding? It's not great. How's your recoding? Recoding, not great. My recorder playing is pretty good, though. You're recording.

We're going to decode that. All right. Oh, I'm Adam Manus. And I'm Peter Martin. And you listen to the You'll Hear a podcast. Music advice. Coming at you. We're having a real morning this morning.

We're having a good time here. I've already given you a look that you gave back that I think you've never seen me give. You know, it's kind of like, remember the game of telephone when you're passing along? So I gave a look. I'm going to try to approximate your version of me giving it to you. Okay, do it. Go ahead. That's what you look like.

That's exactly. I never look like that. Have you ever heard of the term triggered? Triggered. You triggered. You looked triggered. Like, I triggered something in you that you, for, like, we, you know, we like to mess around with the intros and we, you know, we love to. By mess around, we mean by screw them up.

We love to give Caleb a bunch of options. Don't use any of those. Don't use any of those. for the intros to the podcast. And I did one where it really messed with you a little bit. And we're not even going to talk about why. Because it might trigger me again. Anyway, no.

But it brought out this look of you. Of humor that I rarely, I've seen it with you before. I know. So that was worth it. That was worth it. Yeah. Folks listening might be like, is this worth listening to all these inside jokes?

We're going to try to make that up for you today by decoding. So, yeah, we're decoding an amazing. solo from McCoy Tyner. But part of why I think that your look triggered my laughter is could you put my screen up on on so the people on YouTube can see what I'm looking at. So I'm looking across the screen straight at Peter's face. Peter made this exact face. Oh, did I? At me. Well, I wasn't seeing that. Yeah, he doesn't see this. But it was like Coltrane and Peter just making this squinting like what are you talking about face for different reasons. Well, and actually as we were

getting re-familiar with this great video, this might still be at the point where Coltrane and first of all, big shout out to the John Coltrane quartet, of course, but big shout out to Raise the roof. Raise the roof for JCQ. Wow. No, but I mean, big shout out to YouTube and just the times we're living in. The fact that like we were just talking about McCoy Tyner and how we wanted to delve into something that was maybe a little bit lesser known, although it's a YouTube video with, you know, quarter million views, so it has been seen. But what a great time we live in where we can pull up this genius stuff. There's certainly a dark side.

There's a lot of horrible things that you can pull up too. But let's celebrate greatness. If you wanted to see live footage of the John Coltrane Quartet, you would have to drive to a boarder's and hope that they had those Ralph Gleason jazz casual series. Right. At great expense. That's right.

Like $30 per tape. That's right. And now you can just search it. And then you had to make sure the tracking was correct on your VCRA. Your VCRA. Remember when the tracking got off? That was weird. The young folks now actually go to great lengths in their video.

video editing to simulate bad tracking. Tracking filters, yeah, that do bad tracking. That's hilarious. So we're listening to this live version of my favorite things from a live performance in Belgium from 1965. And it's the classic John Coltrane Quartet. Obviously, Train is on soprano saxophone. McCoy Tyner is playing piano.

We're going to be focusing mostly on McCoy's solo, which is long and beautiful. And Elvin Jones, Jimmy Garrison, round out the rhythm section. of course. And this is, some of the comments in this are incredible in the, in and of itself.

And one commenter says that this is perhaps, in their opinion, the greatest jazz piano solo of all time. Right. And I, it's the goat,

he's saying. We're going to listen to it and, you know, that's a bold claim, first of all. Yeah. I don't actually like, and it's a ridiculous claim.

It is. There's no. It might be right. It's just ridiculous to come from that mindset, I think. That's why we're focusing on it first.

Like there's one of the best. Like you can quantify that. This is the number one. But it is fun to go through. What's cool about this solo is, or like listening to these types of solos where there's quite a few versions live and then of course studio of this. And this would be, you know, John Coltrane quartet playing my favorite thing. So over several years, there's different examples of them.

But to see that kind of commonality between it, I think for McCoy, you can really get a great sense of his concept and how it was really fully. versed at this point for sure, but like the variations, it's almost like variations on a theme between different solos. We got a chance to talk with the maestro, Ron Carter, about this a little bit over the specific tune Autumn Leaves and when he was playing with the Miles Davis Quintet, you know, in the early 60s and the different versions.

And, you know, he has such clarity on how things would sort of evolve from night to night over the same tune. And, you know, what a great thing for us, certainly to be able to hear from the masters talking about this, but to be able to also hear actual versions of this from live concert footage and to be able to make some some, you know, kind of informed, I would say, analysis of things that say McCoy Tyner always did over this tune. That's what's kind of interesting to me.

Like there's what happens in the moment, of course, that's amazing on that particular night, something that was in the water, something that was in the air that day, but kind of like what his concept was in approaching this, playing with Elvin Jones, playing with Jimmy Garrison, playing with Coltrane from a piano standpoint. Yeah, and so this is from 1965. So this was, I was just looking up,

this is such an iconic song now, even just the original version from the film. But it's easy to forget that, so Coltrane recorded this in 1960. It was released in 1961 on the album, my favorite thing, yeah. Atlantic record. It was published in 1959.

Wow. So like, that's how new this song It would be like, so now at this point. This is from the Julie Andrews? Yeah. Yeah, from the Sound of Music. Sound of music. And so it should be noted.

That would be like us, I mean. Covering Taylor Swift. No, but that's 10 years ago. Yeah, I was going to say Hamilton, but that would be older than what this was. Bad Bunny. It would be like Bad Bunny or some, what's a like a huge hit Broadway thing that's just two or three years old? It would be like that. Cats.

Cats. It would be like doing memories. It would be like us covering. If this was 1984. 20, 23. Yeah. No, but it is so, you know, such a, it was at this time still such a fresh song. That's crazy.

I'm really glad you brought that up because that's a, that's an important kind of perspective to think about, you know. So 1960 to 1965, they're playing the song. It still was just, the movie's just out. Just out. It's still really in the zeitgeist. But what's so cool is they took, you know, this Broadway style song, this musical song from a musical film. And they turned it into this. modal masterpiece right into this one chord incredible tension and release and nobody's better than

this particular band at that one thing no i don't think there's a better band at taking one chord or two or three chords and running it through tension and release than these four human beings at this point absolutely yeah let's hear it okay so one thing to just note about McCoy's like you can hear this on the recordings but getting a chance to see this and i was just thinking back to the many time I got to see Mr. Tynar live, and that is the finesse, kind of combination of finesse and force with which he plays, you know, these fists. It's such an iconic thing that he didn't create. He gets some height, but I mean, yes, there's some height, like, there's this agility, there's the finesse, but there's also, like, it's never banging. And I remember used to, like,

trying to play like McCorke's, I love that sound, and it would just come out like kind of a sloppy banging mess. Yeah. And I think if you look at what his technique, is and how he forms those shapes and then how he attacks the piano, but also brings out the sound. Always big muscles. It's always with the big muscles. You have to use the larger muscles. You have to use the muscles in your arm, your shoulder, even in your torso. Yes. It gets such a better sound than trying to just use all fingers to like force your way to it. Right. And so like he's coming from it kind of, it really increases the degree of difficulty is the only thing with being in terms of accuracy. So like you kind of see how focusing he is and you have to

be in order to make it accurate when you're coming up from higher and stuff. But it's so cool. And this angle is just incredible. And I love like he's hitting. So, I mean, there's all these great variations on, you know, that he's Dorian, but he's always willing to leave that and go into that frigging, that sharp night, even from the very beginning. Yep.

He's already kidding. It's really, and this is interesting because a lot of other versions I've heard of this. McCoy will go into this later on in the solar. It's not even really, is that, is that, yeah, I guess that's Phrygian, right? Yeah, yeah. Right, so it's all C major diatonic, but like the little places that he's leaning into altering from that are, you know, major third is kind of that. Like a lot of times to go into this later. Adding that major third is actually, you know, part of the tune because that tune goes between E minor and E major.

Right, exactly. E major on the bridge. Right, even when they're going through the form, of course, here they're just vamping over that E. And he really set that up, you know, both with that. Which kind of brings it more back to the, you know. The origin of an E. Burno. Of what? Yeah, it really is.

And they always talk about, you know, for sure, you know, Herbie, Miles Davis Quintet, Ron Carter, Tony Williams. There's a lot of elements in that, supposed you get into the plug nickel and stuff. But I mean, really from a one chord, how can you play around with the harmony, sit in an area and move to another? It's here.

Every single four. Great 16. notes. Ah. A specific tension that knows you can put in there. Like, how long do you want to extend it? Every time.

And there, so. Yeah, that moment there. That's really, that's drawing the rest of the band in, you know, like giving them something. It's a trigger kind of, right? A trigger. Like, you guys take this for a minute.

Right. Start spinning it somewhere. Yeah. And I mean, it was really built up not only rhythmically, but harmonically in terms of what he did so much, you know, with that flat six, with that C major, and then so now he's like, and then he's also going to the major.

So it's almost like that's been there, boom, boom, boom. And then you're sitting there, and then that becomes the new tension. That started out as being the tension. Because really, that's a different too. But I mean, you know, it's like that's sort of the home base, the Dorian sort of sounds. So anything that leaves that.

He hasn't really gone into Dorian, He did a little at the very beginning before he started soloing that. He found the Phrygian and now he's finding that sort of melodic minor attention. Yeah. Yeah, that's very cool. And just a little bit on the rhythm of his left hand has been pretty consistently dotted quarter notes. Yeah.

And that's so, yeah. I feel like that's so driven by Elvin. You know what I mean? Gak, that kind of thing. Yeah. And then like, you know, when McCoy goes into that more with the left hand or more demonstrative, or going down to those more often, it kind of frees up elven them to fill in in between

and then to come back and rejoin with that. It really turns three, four, more into like a 12-8 thing where, you know, the triplet is... It kind of has that lilt to it as opposed to just like... Yeah, you know... Right, right. Something corny, it's something...

Yeah, that's what you say. ...that potentially corny and makes it super good. And then all of those Those little slides that he's doing there is taking Like dominant chords and moving them Around in half steps or whole steps even That kind of vibe Yeah, I mean that

And it, you know, later on We'll get there, we'll get there That tune that he wrote, you know That's just such a part of his concept About how you can move things around That whole step movement? Yes Yeah

Elvin Jones too, by the Steaming game, dynamic. I mean, it's just such a balance with the whole rhythm section. Really, it's a great lesson too. He's not, there's a lot happening, but he's not overplaying.

There's not a lot of like 16 notes or big long runs. Like this is going to be a long solo. It already is, you know, over three minutes, four minutes. And it's, he's letting it come to him, though. He's not trying to make things happen. It's kind

of just like writing this groove out and seeing what happens. And that's the way to go on these big open things. It's not to try to force all of this down your audience's throat, but just let the music come to you. Right. And I mean, yeah, there's such a patience in the way he's playing. Even though he did, you know, it's such an interesting thing because he, when he did

play a bunch of 16th, though, rounds, it was at the beginning of the solo, actually, which is interesting. So it's like, don't be stuck in thinking, oh, I have to slowly build this up, build it up, and then start playing fast. and then play some crazy tension and then end it because you'll lose out on the chance of the music comment coming to you.

He's telling a whole epic story in this solo. And it's interesting because you hear the way these live versions of this tune they're different. Sometimes it's like Train is playing this epic solo and McCoyle come in and do something shorter. It's all part of a balanced approach

to the entire tune. I wonder, have you ever played on a, been on the road, and you get kind of a not great piano at one of these theaters or whatever? Right. And you're like, well, it's not going to be my night for speed

because this thing is like, like a brick. Right. You know? Right. It could be one of those situations. You're like,

I'm just going to let this happen. I'm just going to lay in. Yeah. Yeah. But I mean, too, what he's, you know, McCoy, Tyner's such a,

you know, such a lyrical player, so much harmonic imagination. But then when you talk about just sort of the intelligence of constructing a solo, a lot of that is just understanding

what Elvin Jones and Jimmy Garrison bring to the table and playing things that invite that to make him sound great, to make the whole thing sound great. I mean, it's never, you can't decouple these different elements,

but never underestimate just the supreme musicianship of a McCoy Tyner to be able to like invite all these different elements in. Because we think, oh, it's Elvin Jones. Of course you're going to sound great with him. It's like, no, it's actually harder to play, especially if you're not a great player within Elvin Jones. You know what I mean? Because you got to be on your A game, which obviously McCoy is,

but you've got to bring your A game mentality to be able for all that greatness to come in. And this whole part, like when he's hitting just, you know, measure after measure of those dotted corner notes and like just listen to what Elvis is in. Big old e-bombs too, like every two or three bars. But it's like the drummer's just playing that with you. You can't just sit on that. You know what I mean? Like he's playing stuff to invite Elvin to play all around that. And then when Elvin comes back to it, he starts breaking it up towards the end.

A lot of cool, subtle things that really add up to an exciting thing. You can't necessarily tell from the audience. They look a little bit placid in there. But who knows what's happening in Belgium that back. They've only had a couple years of this sounds. They're in Belgium, so they might not even have that. Maybe the first time they're hearing something like this. I get it to that is not Jim Hederson's face,

and he probably did not have a lot of time on it. Amazing. But he's still giving it that Suss 4 sound on it. I mean, it's still a little bit of attention with it. This whole solo, this piano is just a big drum set, isn't it? I mean, he's a big pitch drum. So much great riffing, too. I mean, it's not a big.

McCoy is great at playing in two different keys at the same time. Like these left-hands stayed in that. But then he's leaving that. I know. He's leaving the left hand too. Left-hand and right hand decoupling. Oh, the symbol he's playing. It's like every four bars he drops one of those.

Like E-flat over E major. Man, there's like the independence of what's going on between the drums and the... Between the two hands of the piano and the limbs and the hands of Elton Jones. This is us four. I've never heard of extended this. D flat Man, what is happening? I know it's going to go

Pretty much, is that pretty much? That one, eight minutes straight of this Dotting quarter notes in the left hand? Yeah. That one might be that George Clooney wanted to put him under, remember in the movie? He had a big one there. They made it out, though.

Be fool. Man, when you set up that rhythm one way, you can change it. You don't have to do a lot. It's a little mini bombs he's dropping now. Great stuff. Did we decode that? I didn't go for a walk around the block, man.

Man, it's such a, what a gift that this music is, but to be able to get inside of it and see, like, when you have a relatively simple form, you know, lesser players look at it. And it's nothing wrong. We've all gone through this. It's like, you panic because you're like, oh, I don't have any, I don't have any changes to go through, even though there are some. But they've got these extended, you know, vamps, right? There's E minor and there's E major. That's pretty much it. And then there's the cue to go to the bridge.

of course there's a lot of different harmonic or several different harmonic areas that they go through and that they would have at their disposal. This version I think is the most that I've heard in terms of just going up anywhere potentially. But to great players and great artists, I think the art of possibilities, right? Like you're just sitting on one vamp. That can be anything. It could be anything. But that doesn't mean it has to be everything all the time.

There's a reason for it. You think, oh, it's just one or two chords. It must be easy. but it really takes a lot of training in functional harmony. You know, McCoy is a functional harmony master. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Like when you hear like with Johnny Hartman and the ballads album.

Yeah, it's not really like a randomness there. No. That if you drop the needle in the middle of this, you'd be like, wait, what's going on? And it's still why, you know, when we learn how to improvise, especially, you know, in this realm, you start with things like bebop and swing

and stuff that has like a lot. And even, you know, the real book or jazz standards or whatever, you start with things that have real easy, functional harmony so that you can understand that those principles to wrap your hands around something to wrap your hands around and then you go to sort of modal music which is more difficult because you have to a you have more freedom more more possibilities but great freedom comes great responsibility right you've got to you got to know how to handle all that

what can happen is if people just play one chord you know and then don't know what to do with it right you know as evidenced here McCoy's not playing one court no it's one chord but it's whatever you want right and you have to learn how to build that tension. For me, rhythmically, that was incredible. Just the entire... Yeah, leaning so 80, 90% on that one rhythm. All that stuff, you know?

Incredible. Yeah, absolutely. Good. Well, thank you, McCoy-Tynor. Thank you, Elvin Jones. Thank you, Jimmy Garrison. Thank you, Peter. Thank you, John Coltrane.

Thanks, Adam Manus. Until next time. You'll hear it.