You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - "Hard Groove" – The RH Factor

Episode Date: October 6, 2025

The RH Factor’s Hard Groove might sound uncontroversial to modern ears, but in the early 2000s it was revolutionary. With this record, Roy Hargrove broke away from the straight-ahead jazz revival of the Young Lions era and created something entirely new. Hard Groove blended Roy’s trumpet with the voices of R&B and soul heavyweights like D’Angelo, Erykah Badu, and Common, artists whose platinum-selling albums (Voodoo, Mama’s Gun, Like Water for Chocolate) already featured Roy’s melodic horn playing and orchestral arrangements.With Hard Groove, Roy flipped the script: instead of lending his sound to the hip hop and neo-soul world, he invited those artists into a jazz record. The result was a landmark project that blurred genres and redefined what jazz could be in the 21st century.Less than 24 hours left to vote for You'll Hear It in the Signal Awards! Help us win a People's Choice Award for Best Music Podcast: https://vote.signalaward.com/PublicVoting#/2025/shows/genre/musicWant more neo-soul? Check out our Voodoo episode: https://youtu.be/AYqmFNF2s0U Watch the documentary "Hargrove": https://youtu.be/liK1u6DQQ4M?si=SZ83SNHazZX2JMImStart your free Open Studio trial for ALLLLL your jazz lesson needs: https://osjazz.link/yhi 

Yo, Adam. What's up, Peter? I am so excited about today. Interesting. I need to be shown something good today. Oh, I got something for you. No, no, no, I got something for you. I'm not staying unless this is good.

We're going over one of my favorite albums, and I brought it with me. You know what this is? What is that a, is that a cassette tape? No, it's not a cassette. Is that like an LP? It's not, well, it's like a tiny LP inside of it, yes. Okay, so you can stream from that. You cannot stream from it.

Is it a Tamagachi? It's not a Tomogachi. It's Roy Hargrove's hard groove. On CD, compact disc. Oh, okay. A CD, like a money market account. No, sir. Okay.

It's music. Because it's hard groove, then I'll stay. Okay, good. And I'm Peter Martin. And you're listening to the You'll Hear at Podcast. Music Explore. Explored. Brought to today by Open Studio.

Go to Open Studio. Justo. Oh. Your jazz lesson needs. real quick. Did you know that we're up for two major awards? You know what? I heard about this.

Now, define major. Could you define it in a monetary fashion? I think we might get like a lamp in the shape of a leg for a major award. Do you remember that from a Christmas story? No, I don't. Ralphie and the dad gets the lamp and the, okay. Anyway, more on that later. In fact, there might be a gala involved.

Is that because of the podcast, you mean? Yeah. Or just because of our general humanity contributions to humanity. Because we've got one coming for that, too. Well, I know that, no, you're up for Nobel. But no, the podcast... Ding! No bell! The podcast is up for a couple of words,

which we'll talk about at the end of the show. Stick around for that. Might be associated with a gala, perhaps? It will definitely be associated. Yeah. Well, today, can we talk about what we're going to do today? And then I want to set the scene. I'm going to take you back.

Are you ready to get in a time machine, my friend? Yes, I am, but first I have a question for this. Is it a big day? It is a big day. It's a big day. Well, I thought your question was going to be, what is that I'm holding my hand? Because I usually have an LP.

I don't know if you remember what this is. I know exactly what that is. Did I back into CDs. Have I told you this? No. I bought for my car a 50 CD carrier, old school style, fits right in there. Did you just buy a brand new car? No.

Yeah, recently. This is it? Well, no. But they still come with CD players. But no, no, I'm starting to get into like buying you CDs. You know, you can buy great CDs for like five bucks, four bucks. I know. I got this.

I have a friend online named Jeff Bezos, and he's gifted me a prime. account and so I can just like the next day a CD will come because of my personal friendship I have I'll hook you up if you want no I mean I'm just a little bit more in touch with my community so I go down to I know I do that too vintage vinyl shout out vintage vinyl um but yeah I love a CD by the way can I say they sound awesome and I'm just I'm on a little break from my phone right now I know there's no more phones here I just got to get off I'm definitely off that but I'm actually like I think we love we know we love LPs I mean if if if if there was an avatar if there was like a a doll or a what do you call a pet associated with this podcast it would be an LP right that we could bring

around on a leash but are we fetishizing LPs a little too much in our culture now perhaps perhaps yeah and also you know this is from what year was this album from 2003 2003 there weren't a lot of LPs in 2000s in no this didn't in fact come out on LP until a couple years ago it's like a it might come out in 20203 it's like a 20 year anniversary it did not come on LP it came out on CD that's right and it was in that sweet spot early 2000s I think you remember that time too where CD, like, where there wasn't really, I mean, there was streaming. I guess there was like Napster kind of and stuff. I mean, there was not really streaming.

It was jankety, yeah. And it was like iTunes store maybe, like just barely. Yeah. But I mean, CD was still the thing. And so this is the OG form factors, we like to say. And this is none other than the RH factor, a hard groove. One more thing on CDs before we get off of it. Okay.

Just so in case. Well, they were my big introduction. Thanks a lot, buddy. Well, no, no. In case the kids don't know. When you were a musician, you used to be able to carry these things around with you. Oh, yes. And you could sell them at your shows. Yes. And you could sell them at actual record stores. A record store was a place where you would go and you would spend $60 on three albums.

Yeah. And hopefully people would buy one of your albums. And then you would get paid like pretty good money. Right. Fun fact, we did a gig. This must have been like 1992. Tower Records, New Orleans, on South Peter Street in New Orleans in the French Quarter. Great old, big old tower records. Brian Blade, Chris Thomas, and myself did a trio gig. I don't know why we were doing it.

I mean, they used to have gigs in the... Yeah, they used to have people come play. Yeah, but part of the deal was, like, we didn't get paid, but they were like, just go get whatever CDs you want. Come on. As much as you can fit into a bag. The manager, the general manager there said.

And so we went and just, like, had our things filled up. I was getting like box. I think they rejected that one. It was like a Riverside Monk box said. They were like, no, no, no, it was like $400. They can't do that. It was like it fits in the back. But it was the Halcyon.

Halcyon days. Halston? House did. Yeah. It was a good time. Man, so but 2003, holy hell, what a year for music. It was a great year.

Man, but we don't talk about that enough. You know why? Because we're stuck on 1971. Well. I think 2003's about to be on a new 1971, right? You could spend a lot of time in 2003. But it is. And I love like having this form factor.

This is Roy Hargrove. The R.H. factory, in fact, was the name of his newly formed band at the time. Roy Hargrove presents the R.H. Factor Hardgrove. This was such a cool record, especially for like young people, I think younger than me and maybe even younger than you at that time, super influential. I would almost say that this might have been for a generation, like for my generation where like Black Coats from the Underground maybe, especially because of my connection with Kenny Kirkland and stuff like that, had that kind of a meaning. But it was, oh, look at this, man. So great. Look at this. That's another great part.

You can't find a lot of this information as in who's playing on every track on the internet. You have to get the CD. It's pretty awesome. So let me be talking about all that. Let me ask you a question. Where were you at in 2003? What were you doing? Man, dude, I was so stuck hardcore jazz.

Well, no, actually, I wasn't. I mean, I was doing like really heavy touring during that time. And in fact, I was going back in my notes. And I realized in 2003, I actually did a gig with Roy Hargrove. The same summer that he premiered this band after this record came out, he was a special guest with Diane Reeves at Jazz Baltica in Germany I believe it was in Hamburg Germany

somewhere up there in northern Germany I remember we did this wonderful gateway Roy Hargrave he was special because I was touring with to answer your question touring with Diane Reeves heavy that year and Roy was a special guest with Diane Jazz Baltica in Germany Vince Mendoza did some beautiful arrangements I did a couple arrangements too

we had an orchestra but I still remember I believe it might even be on YouTube we'll link to it if it's out there he played you go to my head with Diane with the whole band. James Genus was on bass. Nothing better than Roy playing.

Oh my God, behind Diane singing and stuff. And also, by the way, you said Vince Mendoza wrote some beautiful arrangements. I think Vince Mendoza only writes beautiful arrangements. Yeah, I should have just said

Vince did some of his regular arrangements. Because they're all good. Yeah, yeah, it was good. But, so, yeah, that was sort of 2000. But I want to just, where were you in 2003? I'm sorry, 2000. I was still living in New York,

and I was making a go. Same block as Deborah Harry? Same block is Deborah Harry. Actually, no, at this point, I was living up in Washington Heights. Nice. And making a go of it up there. And just started working with the singer Aaron Bodie, who was based back here in St. Louis, which I would eventually later in that year, late in the year, move back here.

But I was, this was actually kind of right in my wheelhouse, man, because that was 22 years old. Yeah. And I remember when this album came out, it was a big deal. It was a big deal, too, because it was kind of a hit. Like, it was a... Yeah, it was all the billboard pop chart, like, way high, but I mean... No, but still, any jazz record that makes it. The billboard charts is a good thing for us.

And I just remember, too, like, you know, voodoo was on everybody's ears, right? All those common albums were on everybody's ears. Roy was already, you know, this crossover artist for all of us who was like, you know, into this, you know, the electric lady scene, the Seen. Yeah, he was like our jazz ambassador to the hip-hop world. For sure. And a young Robert Glass would be starting to dip his toes into that scene, too. But I just remember, like, when this came out, I was like, oh, this makes sense. Like, now they're coming over to our side.

of things. There are like all these artists who we've heard on DeAngelo's records, on Commons records on Eric Badoos' records. Now they're here on this Verve jazz album. This is amazing. Yeah. And I mean, maybe I'll sprinkle this in some stories as I remember as we listen to this great record here at a second. But I remember going back to even like when I was playing in Roy Hardro's band to 94, 95, and then a little bit beyond that, but those like the heavy years. Like he was already talking about and by talking about he didn't talk a lot, talk with his trumpet. And we had a few discussions about doing this kind of project. And like, Like, actually, I realized we were testing some of this material back then,

especially a couple gigs we did in Paris at, like, this discotheque. That's how they say discotheque. Does their voice go up like that? Discoate, le discotheque. Sorry. But, like, we kind of got in there and, like, people weren't really wanting jazz, and Roy just started calling, like, Parliament tunes and different things. And, like, I started to see his conception of, like,

how you could approach groove-oriented music without it being schick, right? Without, like, with a kind of authenticity that I think kind of awoken. Put the big two on it. Yeah, not like, let's jazz it up, you know. And so that was really fun for me to kind of go back and reverse engineer and kind of see where this came from. Can I say something too? Just as a 90s jazz kid, see this little thing right here? Verve record.

This little thing that says Verve. Yep. In the 90s, that meant it was probably going to be pretty good. And pretty straight ahead. And pretty straight ahead. Because remember they had Verve forecast, which is more the... A little bit more like progressive. But Verve in the 90s and the early 2000s was chef's kiss.

Really good. Also in the 50s. Also in the 50s. They were doing all these great reissues. Yeah, the Shirley Horn and all the... And they were also bringing up new artists. Yeah, there was a ton of good stuff. Yeah, I mean, they were the...

I mean, there was balloon note, of course. For sure. But Verve was right up there with them. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, and Roy had been on Verve, I believe, since when he was like 19, when he first came up to New York. I think he was at Berkeley briefly, maybe.

But anyway, by the time he's here, so Roy is, this is 2003, so he's like 34. You know, he's seasoned, well-seasoned, even beyond your normal kind of early 30s players, because he'd been playing so long. Since the teenager. Since the teenager, touring so much, had so many different experiences, play with so many different great artists. It was just so damn good, basically, to be honest. For sure.

So anyway, just in case, that was great. So just a further place, especially for the youngans or the oldens that might not remember precisely 2003, these were some big records that I was thinking about and found just to sort of place us back during that time period, they'd either have some jazz or hip-hop or some cross-pollinization. First, we've got this. Get that sound. Whoa. It's frightening it in the place to be with J-D to the L-I-M-A-L-I-B.

So that's J-L-Lib, which is collaboration with Madlib and J. Dilliv for the champion sound. That's a killer record. Unbelievable. And then, of course, Jay Dill is going to come up as an influence with a lot of this stuff and a connection with a lot of this music. But, I mean, a lot of people look back and, like, Roy's the one who first fused, you know, hip-hop and jazz. He was far from the first.

He's seen definitely as an ambassador for sure, but I just wanted to shout out this. This was in 2003 as well from Russell Gunn, East St. Louis's finest at the Musicology Volume 3. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, this is so good. Russell Gun underrated. Yes, I'm sure.

We're doing a lot of great things during that time. And then also, this was a huge record in 2003. This was Madlib's Bluna when they gave him the archives. This is Distant Land by Donald Byrd from Shades of Blue. There's a lot of this kind of sound going on there, though. A little bit of LP. I'm such a sucker for this stuff. I know, yeah.

Oh, God. Welcome to the club after this, man. Let's go to club, man. My wheelhouse had a wheelhouse. But also in 2003, we're going to go a little different direction, but talk about influential, right? Of course. Yeah. Yeah.

What do I look like? 46-year-old white jazz musician, come on. But I mean, like, we forget this was like, people were like, what? Like, this was influential. Super. Yeah. Super. And also, 2002.

Yeah, hell yeah. Yeah. He said, hell yeah. Sam, yeah. Yeah. Samia, hell yeah. This is Joshua Redmond, Elastic Band, for the first record. Jazz crimes.

This was a criminal offense in some states. Yeah. Brian played. Before we get too far, though, I just want to give Russell Gunn some flowers because I feel like we've never really talked about him. I just played him. That's what I'm saying.

I'm so glad you did. If you don't know Russell Gunn's music, go listen to Russell Gunn's music. He's still making great music. And I think he's probably one of the best musicians of his generation. Even if you haven't checked out much of his stuff, it is worth your time to go on deep dive.

Yeah, and came out of the Lincoln High School Jazz program. At this exact same time, I was in the U-City High School program, and we were always very envious because, like, we had the two best bands in town, but we always kind of got our asses kicked by them because they were so good during that time. They had so many great players.

For sure. Led by Russell, in fact. And, of course, and another one, actually, we're going to hear on Hargrove. Yes, exactly. Okay, and I just want to play one more thing before we jump into Hargrove that was happening. And this is Roy in 2002.

So this is just for you to understand, like this was not, like Roy had his feet in a lot of different places. This was a record that came out that was very influential. 2002. Wait, what is this? Live in Massey Hall. Directions and music. Brian Blade.

Roy Hargrove. Yeah. Kirby Hancock. Mike Brecker. Yeah, yeah, yeah. John Patitucci. Wow. Boy was at the top of his farm.

What he stated. Well, I mean, everybody in this band. Yeah. Yeah. So that's what Roy, that was the record, you know, They came out right before this record, so that's where he's coming from. We used to be a real country. Listen to that. Good, great.

That's a great record. We should maybe cover that one sometime, Jeremy's and music. That would be awesome. It's interesting because I knew the record, I saw that band play live a couple times when the record came out. They did a fantastic tour. They played here, Powell Hall. I didn't hear that because I wasn't here then. But it's like they, that was a great band.

I mean, Mike Brecker and Roy Hargrove, that was, I mean, it's like one of those like front lines where you're like, well, that will probably work. And if it does, it's going to be incredible. It was incredible. Well, and then the rhythm section, too, of just everybody's first chair. Yeah, yeah. Essentially. I mean, the pianist, yeah.

I mean, Herbie was available. Yeah, anyway. All right, so should we, I'll just give you a little bit of background. He's kidding, Herbie, by the way. That's a joke. Rohr-Hager, I think his story is, it's generally known. He started playing trouble when he was nine,

from a cornet, actually, that his father used to have. He was apparently just, like, super dedicated from, like, a young age and just, like, he had the musical aptitude, but he also just had like this drive and this sort of will to practice that was legendary. He's to practice in a closet because his mom would be like, it's getting too loud.

Why don't you stop for me? And then he'd go in the closet, just practice for hours more. He was one of those kind of. And, you know, new piano, knew a bunch of instruments, kind of a savant in terms of not only his abilities, but his work ethic.

You know, I very much saw that when I was around him. I mean, you need both. Yeah. You need both. You need extreme talent, and then you need the right personality who can cultivate the most out of that talent. Right.

It's always those guys. And then he went to Dallas Arts Magnet, which was a legendary school, similar to Lincoln High School here that produced a number of great musicians, some of which we're going to hear like Erica Badu on this record, Norr Jones, I believe. No, that was Houston. That's another legendary school. What was that Dallas?

I think it was Dallas. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Number of great musicians from that school. Can you imagine? But, I mean, just those three names from the same place. I know, I know, I know. And interestingly, so right around this time when he was there, it's looking here.

He met Winton Marcellus when he was in high school. What Winton used to do during this time. So, like, Roy and I, I think Roy was one year ahead of me in school. And somehow 10 years ahead of me in terms of, like, musical aptitude. I did figure that out later, too. But the same time, and I went to a really good university, shout-out University City High School,

great band program. Go-Lions. Yeah, Go-Lions. We were the Indians at the time. That was rectified. Yeah. But Winton would travel. traveling around was touring heavy, classical.

He came here and played St. Louis Symphony. That's when I first met him through my dad who was playing with him. But, you know, people don't understand like in the 80s. There was no internet, okay? There wasn't. Little Adam, you probably never had a life without an internet, did you?

Of course I did. Oh, you did? Or a fax machine? You have a fax machine when you were a kid? We lived in High Ridge, man. We were lucky if we got a telephone, honestly. But like, in the 80s, Winton was like the internet for jazz.

He really was. He was his connector because he was traveling around. And not only would he do gigs. And Winton was young then. he was in his like mid-20s or whatever. Yeah. And, but he would go around, like, he would call around or have his managers say, what high schools want me to come?

I want to do a clinic for free. And so, like, he came to our school. He went to Lincoln High School. And he went to Dallas Arts Magnet. And that's when he first met Roy when he was in high school. And, of course, was like, okay, this dude can play. Yeah. But, like, Winton was going around and identifying players and then connecting us.

So the way I met Roy Hargrove was, Winton said, Winton had given me his number and I met him so you ever have any questions about anything. So that was like dialing up on the internet

to like how can I meet other jazz musicians So he literally gave you Roy Hargrove's number. No, he gave me his number. Oh, Winton's number. Okay. And then I was talking to him

one time and he said, hey man, you need to look out. He would tell me different people. He's like, there's this guy, Christian McBride. You're going to be hearing about him? You were like, ever heard of him? Yeah, I was like, no, I've never heard of him.

He was like, no, he was a couple years younger. He's like, he's 14 years old. I just heard him in Philly. He's killing. I was like, wow. I'm like, I used to write these names now because I was like, you know, I was like, and I remember he said, and Roy Hargert, do you know about Raw? I was like, no.

And I remember writing that name down. And he's like, he's in Dallas. And he's like, he's killing trumpet player. And so that's all I knew was like Roy Hargrove. Our high school band when I was a junior, no, when I was a sophomore, I think Roy was a junior. We went to the NAJ convention in Dallas. Shout out. Jazz Education.

Yeah. Formerly, well, now it's called the, I, No, then it was the IAJ, and now it's the Jen Conference. The Jen conference. Yeah, and you know, they'd invite different high school bands. Basically, if you paid the application fee. We took a bus overnight, like one of those academy buses. Yeah.

And got there, and it was like at the convention center by the Dallas, Fort Worth Airport. We weren't even in Dallas. Welcome to the ballroom, buddy. Yeah, we're like, four people per room at, like, the Marriott Airport Merritt. And so I remember I had Roy Hargars now. I was like, I got to find this guy, Roy Hargrove. And I kind of asked around, and I looked on the schedule. And I saw this thing, Dallas Arts Magnet, High School.

school band was going to be playing at this time. I was like, man, he's probably going to be there. And so I went over and I saw the band. I heard this one guy that was just like killing. He was playing lead, but he was also coming out and soloing. But he looked like this little kid. He was actually, yeah, a year ahead of me, but he looked really young then. And I was like, damn, he was small too, you know, or average size, as I like to say.

Wait, hold on. Let me raise my chair here. Hold up. I like doing these shows at 10 o'clock at night. This is fun, man. So I went over to him after the thing. I was like, are you Roy Hargrove? And he's like, yeah.

And I say, hey, I'm Peter Martin. Like, this was kind of actually, well, it wasn't really bold for me at the time because that's the only way you could read. And he was like, oh, Peter Martin. He's like, Wint Marcellus told me about you. I was like, wait, Wint Marcellus told me about you. Crazy.

And so, like, that was the connector, you know, and that's when I met him, we kind of kept in touch. And then he kind of went on to big things. And then, you know, once we were up in New York at the same time, asked me to join his band and stuff. But like, Winton was a really important. And then when the internet came, we didn't need Win anymore, basically.

Yeah, I'm going to say, like, Instagram solved that. Yeah, if this is today, you both would have, like, massive Instagram followings as teenagers and be like... Roy definitely would have. Making some, like,

short, prodigious shorts or whatever and following each other, you know? Yeah. But, yeah, so Winton was playing at the Caravan of Dreams, this is performing arts center. It was not, it was a club there. It was a club there.

And in Fort Worth, and he invited Roy after he heard him that day at his school, and he came and sat in with him with him. He was 17. And then it was kind of Off to the race as Marsalis played the venue a few times in high school. And then he also played with Dizzy and her. Yeah, Dizzy was still around.

So, like, Wynn wasn't the only one that took note of Roy. He was a little bit of a minor superstar by the time he left and went up to Berkeley. And as we mentioned, he went to high school with Erica Badoo. He was a couple years behind her. So she's going to, she said a really nice quote here. I just wanted to read. She said, Roy was the first person I met in high school. He in the musical department and jazz band, me in dance right next door.

We danced to that band's version of John Coltrane, Miles Davis. That helped me understand what jazz was and how to interpret it. It was a subtle rebellion. Yeah, I mean, I love everything Eric Blandtuce says, man. She's just enchanting. She really is. Yeah, I mean, she's a vibe. And I have the feeling she was a vibe back then.

Every time I see her, I feel like I've just been to church or something, you know? Yeah, for sure. Okay, so then Roy goes on, makes all these great records for Verve, mostly really kind of of the straight ahead vein, although we're going to have a little Easter egg at the end. He had some groove and kind of hip-hop forays much earlier than this. But I think to most people, it was really the year 2000

that people outside of like the hardcore jazz world, outside of like musicians, jazz or classical or hip-hop probably, or R&B would have known about him. But like to the general, the GP, the general population, Roy probably, I mean, as much as playing a bunch of hip horn lines in the background you can get on people's radar, but these were some big records he was part of huge records

three records in particular do I have I've got two just some little excerpts from two of them because we're going to get to the actual record don't worry but the biggest of which was of course and we've covered it here before DeAngelo's Voodoo which came out in 2000

Roy is all over this record this is a little bit from Play up play up so those lines that Roy did layering them piece by piece writing them we could listen to that stuff all day we're going to became legendary

and like he was known for being, like, he'd hear the track and be like, okay, I know what I'm going to add. Let me do it one pass at a time and he would just knock him out, knock him out, like a choir. You know, he was doing it like he was layering vocals or something. And with the rhythms, he's arranging it on the spot, you know, so he had, obviously the jazz chops. We heard him play with Herbie. I played with him before and I heard it every night and was like, wow. But he had this an uncanny ability without, like, changing really who he was or his musicality of being able to jump into this world. with these different vibes and just put the placement with a trumpet, you know, in a way that's just uncanny.

Roy, and at this time, speaking of like the choir effect, he and Nicholas Payton on Josh Redmond's, you played that Elastic Band album. Like, Nicholas Payton does that on a couple tracks. I think on the second one, the second elastic band. Yeah, right, the second record, yep. Unbelievable. Just both of them, so good at that. Yeah, they were like, you know, brothers in trumpet. arranging artistry cross genre they always have been you know kind of separately but in their own sort of similar ways it's super

interesting the other thing this was from commons like water for chocolate 2000 as well you know part of the whole so-called sulquerian situation but this is just a little bit of raw cold blood that's Roy trumpet I mean

Peter if you think that this doesn't have anything to do if you think that this doesn't have anything to do with 1971, you're out of your mind. Yeah, because we love it. No, but it's all over this music. I know we're probably going to hear a little bit of funkadelic later. Yeah. But, like, you can hear everything you've played so far.

It has that early 70s, mid-70s, James Brown, Funkadelic, Parliament, Sly and the Family Stone, all of it is in there. Marvin, yeah, I mean, it's all there. I mean, that's the influences that these artists were listening to, and Roy's thing, like, with his ability like to know the placement, the arrangement, the writing, you know, so great. So basically we're back to 1971.

So let's listen to a little. I was going to play. We're going to get into the, back to talking about Winton and sort of coming out of the hardcore jazz stuff. We've got to listen to some of this record. We're going to start with the first track called Hard Groove, much as Voodoo. It kind of just very colloquially slides in. Cornell Dupri on the guitar. Yeah, the legend.

Both guitars on this album might steal it a little bit. So it's Reggie Washington and Pino, Palladino, on bass. I think that first little thing was Reggie. I don't know how it's broken up, but Jason Thomas on drums, killing it. Cross-stick and full effect here. Yeah. He's in their way into this record. Chris David Glose.

He was playing right. Open up the CD. That's, yeah, Keith Anderson on Alto, Jack Schwartz, Sparts on 10. Bobby Sparks on clap Yeah so the thing that I think is super interested about this track Don't stop it I mean no

Do what you need to do Man that feels great It doesn't feel great Like this is a very patient opening To this record It just it invites you to live in there for a while It does and this is a long record We're gonna probably talk about that a little bit

Yeah it is long And so that's why it kind of starts to make sense Why it's such a patient measured beginning Because like this is not the most banginous I mean it's banging But it's not the most like banginous of the first track. We're probably going to get to that.

You know what? Is in here a little bit? I don't know if this is intentional. But there's a little bitch's brew in this too. Yeah. You know what I mean? There's a little like... Especially on this and there's a couple tracks where it's like bitches brew,

which we got to do bitches brew. We got to do Biches brew. But albums like that and like this. We're going to beaches brew. Bruchess brew. Yeah. Album's like bitches brew and albums like Biches brew and albums like hard groove just invite you to like,

oh, you want something to, you want me to, tell you a story real quick, like a real tight story, it's not going to happen. You need to settle in. You might smoke a little something and just like sit down on the couch. Right. And just get ready to just get your mind blown a little bit. But you mean light up a little incense for the vibe. Right. We're going to take our time is what we're saying. Like, we're just going to vibe for a second here. Yeah. And it's once you lock into that, man, there's nothing better. There's nothing better. Because it slows you sort of slows your whole body down. Right. You're not like, you're not waiting for like the next killing, woo moment. You know, you're just

like in the zone or in the pocket with the band. Absolutely. Absolutely. So we're going to listen now to the second track. We're not going to get to every track. I apologize. There's like 74 tracks on here and apparently he left off like 17 that he couldn't fit on. It's a long record. It's already like an hour and 20 minutes.

But he had some amazing guests on here. We played some from Commons 2000 release like Waterford Chocolate earlier. But Common is featured I think this was kind of like the biggest well I guess the Erica we're going to get to as well. This was the one that really got a lot of people's radar. All the vocal features on here are so well done.

So well done. And I mean nothing but like knockouts too. Yeah. And so this is common on common freestyle featuring. This is cool. This is Willie Jones third actually on drums. Oh. Rigin to bass.

Reggie Washington on bass. Kenny Washington's brother, by the way. Really? Yeah. James Poiser. He's. Classic Roy right there. Well, James Poyser.

That's a great. is maybe one of the most influential keys players ever. Bad dude. Right? Bad dude. What can I do? I build a destroy. Always at the right place, the right time.

It's funny how I keep happening. Lucky guy. I guess so. Nucks. All talent. I started to carve in my own spot. Oh. I'm at Roy and make me hot, but we say it cold in the go.

The brother comments since never stop with a flow. My flow keeps going on and on it. I like to do it because I'm D in the horns in. I'm not the type of beat like that. But when it comes to this. Empire yo I strike back you I like fat raps What might be that type What can I do I like spit on the grave of those who never been a slave

Don't understand about the reason When they see the brother Connonsense through the dough Ask about the dreads they ask about the flow We asked about different questions Question like brother quest love this is what I do I suggest love Many penny for your thoughts brother conscience yo I'm never taking choice As to I come through just with my crew With a little trees and a little bit of brew but we can chill

It just came to bill. Brother Jay Poys on the keys. Jay's poise on the keys. They want to freeze. When they see the brother, common sense, go against him. Yo, we got a system. We can break it down for Roy's hard grow. Come on.

You know what it is? You know, everything Roy's doing here, it actually kind of reminds me a little bit of, like, all DeAngelo's backing vocals on chicken grease. I know Roy's on there, too. But, like, all of those DeAngelo, like, Improves and also the BVs that he puts in the layers throughout voodoo.

Right. And actually all three of his. latest records, but, like, there's, they just, they just add these, like, this perfect tapestry of melody. And Roy, we talked about this on Voodoo, actually. Like, Roy is one of the greatest melodists of all time. Like, he could have been, like, a tin pan alley songwriter. He's so crafty with his melodies. Like, they're not just, like, um, uh, it feels good or whatever. Like, they're well composed as he's improvising. Yeah. And it's, That's incredible.

As he moves along, like answering it. Dude. I'm glad you said Tim Pan Alley because the last track we're going to listen to. I've got a direct connection to that. Since you're talking about what he just did on this, let's just check out a little bit of simple, right? Huh.

Phrasing. Blues. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then when you check it out with, check this out just with the drums. Like you see it. Wonder what's going on like Marvin. My man Roy may God, but we say cold in the go.

The brother common sense never stop with the flow. My flow keeps going on and on it. I like to do it because I de in the horns and I'm not the type of beat like that. Roy's given all the rhythm there. Yo, I strike back. Yo, I like fat rap. I might be that type. Be da.

What can I do? I like spit on the grave of those who never been the slave. Don't understand about the things they misbehave. When they see the brother conscience through the dough, ask about the dreads, they ask about the flow. They ask about the flow. I'm sorry. This is like brother quest love.

This is what I do. I suggest love to many. Penny for your thoughts. Brother concerts, yo, I'm never taking choice. I'm sorry. This era of hip hop too. I know. This is like 10 years stretch.

I know. Golden age? I mean, the emcees here were like, unbelievable. I'm not, I know, this is definitely old man on TikTok going on right now. But like, man, common. So fucking good. But they all were, like, all those, the top level rappers at that time.

Oh man, the way he voices those fours and thirds. That's all trumpet. I also love like... So I'm free, so I'm C. Like Roy, obviously no stranger to Gil Evans and Nelson Riddle and some of the, and Duke Allington is some of the great arrangers of all time, orchestrators.

Those little cluster chords he's putting in there. Straight up like Stan Kenton style. It's incredible, man. Yeah, man. his, it's like that intersection of just like big ears, talent, the taste and like phrasing. That's not, boop, beep, bit,

beep, da, do. He hears it all. He hears it all. It's really great. 10 out of 10. I've actually been foreshadowing for you. Okay, so let's get back into, okay, before we move on, so that's common on there.

There was a little bit of controversy, like not necessarily directly related to this record, but just in general with Roy and some other jazz arts. We talk about Russell Gunn and stuff, especially with some of these trumpet players, because like, it's hard to underestimate or to fully understand now in this time, like, where we have this tapestry of, like, so many different ways to play, and there's all this commingling with jazz and all this is great. Like, at this time, like, what an influence that Winton Marcellus and others, but really spearheaded by Winton for the so-called sort of traditional young lions, neocom,

whatever you want to call it, all-acoustic straight-ahead jazz movement. Yeah, I don't know if if maybe young people appreciate that it was a lot different in this era and especially like right before this. Again, back to Russell Gunn. I remember the first time I heard him play was here at the Sheldon Concert Hall. And he came out in like, I think a basketball jersey. Right.

And even that, I was like, I've never seen a jazz. Not a suit and tie? Yeah, like it was just so, it just felt so fresh and young. Yeah. And yeah, but it was so unexpected too. I don't know, you know what just didn't happen very much. Well, I remember even like in the, you know, mid-90s when I was playing with, with Roy and even before that, like, he was the,

I don't say he was the first, but it was the first time I noticed, like, we would all wear suits and stuff. Then we started kind of rebelling a little, but Roy would wear a suit and some Jordans. Yeah. You know what I mean? He was kind of like, first of all, he had great style. Great style.

Great style. So, like, that was part of his thing. Like, he knew how to put stuff together. But it was also, like, kind of like saying, no, I can do both. Watch me, you know? And he always did that. And it wasn't like, schick.

It was, it was organic and authentic. But Winton was like, this is no shade on Winton. It was just like this was the system. Like I said, a bunch of us wouldn't have, I wouldn't have met Chris, maybe I would have anyway, but I'm like,

I met these great musicians that I would go on and play with and learn so much from because of Winton. And then countless others, like Winton created a scene. I think Winton is a really interesting character in the history of this music, man. I think there's,

he's going to talk about a long time for all of this stuff. I mean, not just the music, which obviously we're going to talk about, but. Well, let me play a little something and just get your reaction to that since you just said.

This is Winton talking around this time, maybe a couple years before, on the Charlie Rose show. Are you still on your campaign against hip hop and? You know, I don't so much a campaign against it now. I'm knowing so much a campaign against hip hop. I'm on a campaign in favor of the best in American culture. And hip hop is not in your job.

There's no question about that. Hip hop or a lot of directions we have gone in in popular music. The musicians themselves have said it in their various books. It's something that we all recognize, but I try to liberate people from the notion that it has something to do with how old you are. I've been saying these things since I was in high school. And I spent a long time teaching American kids. Education is the best deterrent to being bull.

And many times it's just what's being sold to our kids. We need to do a better job. And it doesn't make it terms with names you put on it. Certain messages, certain ways of approaching younger people's sexuality is not going to yield a positive result. Then we end up with all of our kids in high school. We start giving them drugs, Zoloff and everything else, red linda this is not the direction we want to go with it.

Okay, this is another time. Was that PBS? Yeah, I think so. So, I mean, to put it in context, we have to. And it's not to say he's not right about some of this or wrong. It wasn't Newsmax. It was, I know. It was a different time.

But, I mean, that was kind of the climate in terms of, like, Winton. I mean, he was, I wouldn't say he was ever, like, oppressive in terms of, like, you know, he didn't, I mean, he had a lot of power. And he was always super generous, like, in terms of as an educator. Still is. Still is. Yeah.

So, I mean, this is just one data point. This is not. But, I mean, he always has been, I would say, to put it, kindly, maybe skeptical of hip hop most. And, like, a lot of the really so-called conscious hip-hop artists that were interested in collaborating and did with jazz musicians were always a little bit off-put by Winton. I mean, there's a great interview with Most Def talking about how, like, you know, once we got Roy, I mean, I'm paraphrasing here, it was basically like, once Roy came into our world, like, that was, what we always wanted because we want to be connected he's like Winton Marsalis we could never with the suit in the tie he didn't want to have anything to do with us

we weren't like smart enough or worthy I'm sorry I'm going I'm paraphrasing but you can check out the interview so I mean there was that sentiment there now has Winton you know given the flowers to hip hop at some point probably too but I mean like there was this climate of that and so you know and for Rory as a trumpet player coming up under you talk about Nicholas Payton you talk about

Russell got all these trumpet players like you have to at a certain point like assert yourself and it wasn't the easiest thing to do, I think. But Roy wasn't a kid. That energy, though, is probably from the 90s, I'm guessing. Late 90s. I think late, but it might have been early 2000. Early 2000.

We're not journalists here. I mean, that's still like we're 20 years into it, but it's so different now, too, than it was. Like, we were just talking about it. And it was different now. Yeah, everybody changes and the culture changed so much. So this was Roy's at around the time of this record coming out, I believe, talking about, this is. I don't think of them as anything different.

To me, they're one and the same. because rhythmically speaking, if you take the eight bars of somebody rhyming and if it's like on a high level, it's kind of very similar to some of the drum patterns that people like Kenny Clark and Philly Joe Jones and then we're playing back in the day. Hip-hop is jazz's great-grandson, granddaughter.

I'll laugh. That was always the voice. Go transcripps and buster rhymes. It'll blow your mind. Yeah. And then this was Winton on Roy. I didn't like it. And your jazz musician is very difficult. It's not going to evolve out of hip-hop musicians.

But we had a deep conversation about it. I said, man, you know, you can play. It's hard to keep faith in playing. And he said, look, man, you know, I like playing for black people, man. People are not coming to this form of music. You know, this is just what this is. And I can't just be isolated like that. And I respect them.

Yeah, so that was Winton talking about conversation. he had with Roy specifically about RH factor in doing these kinds of projects. So I know there was a lot of love between them all the way to the end of Roy's life. I witnessed that firsthand, so I want to point that out. This was no ongoing feud. It was just, you know, difference of opinions in terms of approaches.

That's how art should be. And the artist should have these conversations. Yep, yep. And I actually, I mean, I don't know, I like that Winton kind of sticks to his guns a little bit on this too. Yeah. Because no one else... Could you imagine if Winton come out with like a hip...

Like, I was wrong all these years. I'm going to do a hip-hop, a collaborative. We'd be disappointed at this point. I think it's good for everybody to have to have someone kind of pushing back against like, well, what are we doing? You know? Even if I don't agree with it. Get to the point in his life when he's 34 years old to make this record without meeting when he was in high school? I don't know.

No. I don't know. You know? So there's that too. That too, but also people want to make music that they, that affects them. Right. That they love. Right.

And so Roy's doing that here. Yeah. Authenticity. Authenticity. There's nothing, like changing that would be a real shame. It would be a real tragedy. Yeah. Okay, let's go on a track three.

This is Al Stay. This was a big one, too, because it's featuring DeAngelo. So we're going to ease our way in on this one, too. This is so killing. And the original is so killing. I think that's DeAngel on the Worley, too, I believe. Why? Yeah, De Angel on the Worley.

Pino, of course, on the bass. I might have to change some stuff. This is George Clinton, right? Yeah? Yeah, see that's Clinton. Charmler's Alford on A.K. Spanky on guitar. I got to grab a pencil. Here, I got a pen point.

Change in my desert island. A very patient intro again. Hallmark of what's happening on this record? Swampy, huh? Engineer there. Oh, shout out Russ Elavada, who co-produced and engineered this record, as well as many of those other soul querying. This might be the best sounding track on the wall out.

Something about E minor, too. Roy's playing on. A lot of open strings on the bass. Now the melody starts, two minutes in. By the way, that's layers of D, Angelo. Who is the modern day equivalent of George Clinton? Oh, there's some Roy background. I was like, somebody else's not back.

That's Roy. Roy's a good singer. Oh. Is there a modern day equivalent to George Clinton and the P-Fund? Pardon me. George Clinton. I know. George Clinton's still with us.

Are he parts of DiAngelo? Hey, yie. Man, I'm shouting out of Russ Alavado, too, because that sound on Roy, only he got, there's some, you could record Roy just straight up, and he's going to sound great, but this is a very distinctive sound.

I'll be honest. Some of this album, I don't love everything, the way it sounds, the production. Are we in quibble of it, sir? Almost, but this is it? This one is... Oh, this is killing.

Perfect. This is perfect. And you know what? When you're in these silent sections, I always say, that's when the engineer, you tell... I don't know if I can find this. Check this out. What happens when there's silence? Whoa, whoa.

The bozzy. Don't hurt the bozzy. Yeah. I'll stay featuring DeAngelo. Do we get everybody else out there? Bernard Wright on the B3. There's some great B3 on there. Jason Thomas, who's just killing it all over this record.

Yeah. Jason Thomas sounds so good. Pino Paladino, just, you know. Pino, I mean, we haven't talked about him yet, because it's like, it's kind of like, yeah, it's just Pino. But I mean, a big connector on the record. He's really got his Pino stuff to get. He's such a big connector with the Voodoo record to this record, like him and Roy. A huge connector.

That's a great point, actually, and worth emphasizing, like, the base. And some others, too, but mainly them, I think. The bass brings the vibe to everything. And, you know, you got Pino, you got that voodoo vibe. So if we stay in order here, I think we're going to get to, you. one of your tracks. Is that cool? Yeah, absolutely.

Your Desert Island maybe? No, no, no, no. Let's keep going. Okay. Oh, this is my desert island. Sorry. This is your desert island. I mean, let's talk about it now.

Let's get to the categories because we're about there anyway. Yeah. This is your desert island. I've got 17 more tracks lined up. This is your desert island. And this is my... Oh, yeah, your Apex moment is...

That's right. Roy's playing on this. Roy's solo on this. Oh, that's from the very beginning. It's the whole track. But he... This is a tour to force. This is like...

The best playing on the album. It's my favorite track. That's why it's my deadline, but it's an apex moment too. It's not quite in the middle of the record, which is interesting because we always talk about placement. But it's, you know what it is? It's in the middle of what would be a normal length record. It really is. It's the fifth track.

Like for a 55-minute record, we'd be halfway through that. We'll talk about that. So this is Pastor T. And this is one of the great, again, shout out. So this was co-produced by Russ Elvado, who's also the engineer legend, Roy Harger. and maybe somebody else, I can't remember. You got too much text in for me, bro.

You know what I'm saying? We're not journalists, we always say, but we're starting to... Oh, and Jason O'lane. Shout out Jason O'Lane, who I've known for many years. We've got to be better, man. We're award-nominated for this.

But I think Roy and Russell... I mean, like, the way they're working, Jason's great, great musician, great businessman, the whole thing. But this is like one of the great... It's a subtle thing, but check out, and this is not going to be me messing with the volume.

The way this track starts... It is subtle. It's a phase. in which is rare and it's a quick fade in but it really sets the tone for it I think yeah you're like wait it's like you're opening a door and like there's a party in there you know some of the greatest syncopation ever so I think this is Pino on Reggie watching on acoustic and maybe Pino on a Lex there's a lot of two bases I love the melody it's like two bars line then it's jam it in terms of

structure this is very much like influenced by James Brown and groove too but like where you're just solo over one chord And then the soloist, take it to the bridge, which he's going to do, you know. Come on. It's some of best Roy's playing ever recorded. It's really good. Bridge, take it to the bridge. Yeah.

It's some of the most authentic Roy playing. Like, this is Roy. Yeah, Keith Anderson. Okay, I hate to even do this. I want to switch over because I just want to hear, because we got Reggie Washington and. Who is that so good. Isn't that good? You like that?

You like that? Oh, the Apex moment's over. So there you go. Right? Yeah, yeah. It was just a solo. There's just this killing asshole. I want you to check this out, though.

So here we can do a little bit of crispy. But I want to check out the bass. There's an acoustic bass and electric. Man, when stuff grooves that hard without... But check this out. Just Roy, it's grooving. It's dancing. So much minor pentatonic.

Doesn't matter. Oh, man. It's got that Miles-esque. Like, I'm going to go for it. I'm going to skimp in there. I'm going to bam. I'm going to hit it. like just oh it's got but it's not like he's not super influenced by miles and like you're here

in those little moments but not like he's definitely influenced by winton like a lot of that 80s went and stuff i know but then he's got that layer of like lee morgan but then he's got all this like parliament funkadelic kind of rhythmic approach james brown james brown groove is all over this track and we need james brown now we need another we need more james brown that's right hot take adam nice we need james brown dynamite that's somebody else okay now we're gonna Where'd he go? We need James Brown here. Well, he was frozen until recently.

No, he's not here. We don't know where he was. Shoot. Okay, we're going to move on now. Poetry, track number six, featuring Q-Tip and Erica Badu. This was a banger. This might be my favorite feature.

I think Q-Tip crushes this. This is Erica Baudu. I'm on one of his albums called Art Groove. R.H. Factor. And what song are you on in R.H. Poetry. That song, Poetry, was monumental to our relationship, too. In fact, I was very intimidated because I can't read music.

I don't even know if I hit the right notes when I sing. I just know how I feel and I express the way I feel. It's intimidating to play with such a gifted musician, even though we were great friends. And I remember him calling me into the studio. He said, just freestyle it, just whatever you feel, just be an instrument. I was petrified. So that's Erica Badu talking about. It's a great interview.

Part of that, shout out to the Roy Hager of documentary. We'll link to that as well if you want to go on a deep dive. This is such a cool. It's a bittersweet move. The structure of this song is so cool. Let's check it out. Can you picture how a melody gets started to existence? Q-Tip, that's another connector for us, right?

Connecting all of it. Yeah, for real. Yeah, Michelle is on the joint. You mean Missendegeo cello's on bass. Yeah, Michelle Mdegeo cello's on bass. Or awards you'd be given to these heroes for their efforts of revealing and bring it forth the feeling I'm reeling Poetic I say a great proportion I hope my little nuance is correct for this distortion But I say why I say and who is to say?

Cause Roy makes the tune what it is today Rhythmically we in this lake of jeans know what I mean Gene Lake on drums The overtone of funk is being driven by the students the benevolence of Roy issue me this jurisprud Jurisprudson I put it in a hippatermin I'm just a humble little germ Just a hip aversion

Poetic I mean truly Indeed her every seed It sprinkles with the essence of life To form our breed Think about it, sweetie Why we give this to the needy The musical expression Is important for progression

Is that Mark Carey on the Worley? Mark Carey's on Worley With the single line stuff And Roy's playing keys on it Before we get the browns We got to reach with the ball Before we get old show We had to get to a crawl

Check it out now And don't you dare Bobby Tim is there Bobby Tim is there A joint called that day Yeah I love that laugh now and do you do Ronnie Foster did a joint called

Mr. Brew So good It's how we go Check it out when we're being Roy Hart broke To the Hey Genealoo

Great How you live on stage So good Yeah So, so good It's like a little steely van moment there Yeah, it was

You know? Gene Lake here Gene Lake here Just like You know, you know. Influential. Michelle and Degliocelo on the bass? Yeah. Playing super simple, which she can do a lot, like, just the perfect, you know.

Oh, that sustained. This is a heavy hitters on this one. Where's that pencil? Yeah, this is a deep, deep, deep track. I hate to even, like, fade it out like this. Shoot. This really is, like, kind of the meat of the record. Man.

It's so hard to pick a Desert Island. track on this album. I know. I know. I'm changing it twice. I might change it to this. I'm already committed on mine. I'm committed. Okay, I'm committed. Okay, I'm committed. Okay, so now we're going to move on. We're doing good here. We're not going to get to every track because we don't have seven days. But the whole record is just, the progression of this record's great. We're breaking up a little bit, we're going in order at least. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So this is a really cool tune. This is Forget, Regrette featuring Stephanie McKay. This is track number eight. This is by the saxophone player, right? Yeah.

Jacques Schwarz. Oh, Roy just... I love the production on this one. The front trumpets in the back chamber ones. It's like a room mic trumpet. Yeah. That could even just be the reverb channel. On the Harmon one.

The trailing guitar. Such a good song. Yeah. That's Jacques on guitar as well. What does this remind me of? Put in the comments. What is this song? I know.

I was thinking that earlier. I was like... It's something. I've been on Love Jones soundtrack. I do love this song. All right. I don't need the pencil.

That's a nice little steely-esque interlude tune. Second verse. I'm sorry. We're going to get past fair use in a couple of seconds here. It's like some 70s rock anthem,

I think, is what I'm thinking. Gotcha. That could be wrong with that. But put in the comments. What is forget regret? Yeah. Where am I hearing that from? So now we're going to jump to number 10.

I love this track. This almost made it on... I mean, this is kind of a sleeper one. There's something about this, though. It's so like Roy, it's probably the most like understated kind of... I have no idea what the meaning behind this is called Liquid Streets, but I just think it's... It's just like a little vibe segue tune, right? It's like how they wet down the streets in those Ridley Scott films.

Liquid streets. Liquid. It's just that same repeated, simple form. but then it goes to one of the plays and you talk about Roy is the melodist melodist. I mean this is classic maybe the greatest ever

you know what it is man you can tell he loves melodies so much like you could feel the love to him he loved he loved melodies too safe you know the way he's playing it very simply you feel that he doesn't put any bullshit on melodies ever right straight from the heart yeah

that's so fun one like in a if you want to go deep-dye. And it's really cool where it's placed on the records and once you get here, you're like, ah, this is the vibe. Finally. Finally.

Can we go to the final track here? It's not the final track of the album. Well, it is the final track of the album, but it's also the five-tenth track. Yeah, this is a good one. And this is, we talked about, like, the Tin Pan Alley thing. This is a great representation.

Yeah, so this is Roy, like, this is the closest, I think, on this record to, like, the way that he wrote some beautiful, like, very, like, from a harmonic and really structure standpoint, very much like A-A-B-B-A-T-P-A, Pan Alley, George Gershwin, kind of, but Duke Allington, like, just very beautiful stands with beautiful melodies.

But on this one, like, you really hear that harmony come across. And this can become really just, like, schlucky. Is that a word? But he's so genuine. It's so genuine. But placing this in a hip-hop or, like, a groove situation can be very like, ugh. But we heard him say in that interview, he doesn't think there's a difference between, like, for him, there's no difference.

This is just music that he loves that he hears. And you can tell, like, it's very, very authentic. He's not trying to put in any airs that aren't real. Right. So this is like that, yeah, not putting on it. It's like the opposite of what's that show that I can't stand. Okay, I'm going to get flame for people saying. The Beniggins, the Beginnings, the, you know, the British one where they're all dressed up with the queen and the, everyone goes crazy over on Netflix.

The, who are you looking at? Oh, Bridgerton? Bridgetton. The Beginigans? Peter. Bridgerton. That's putting on airs. I feel like that's maybe Kelly Martin's favorite show.

and it's a little triggering for you. She's very triggered. But I'm saying that whole show is about putting on airs, right? For sure. This is the opposite of this. I've never seen it. This is the stroke,

the anti- Beginnings. Okay? Bridgiggins. Sounds like something my kids would listen to. Band. Oh, they were the beginnings. I used to go to eat it,

Beneggans. Like a high-end apple piece. I love this. I'm such a sucker for the sound, too. A little three vibe. It's implied three. Right there. It's like Benny Golson. Yeah, right. Totally. Yeah, totally. Great call.

I got the bluesy sass on it. You know a little, uh, little gosh, a little Sunday morning. Little East St. Louis's own. Oh, that's right. Shout out Tony Suggs. On the organ on this, man. I was so delighted when I saw that thank you liner notes. This is the only appearance on this record. Sugs. St. Louis's own, East St. Louis's home, Tony Suggs by way of.

Don't mind. I got told him Tokyo Japan. My way of Japan. this bridge. My Roy's greater writing bridges. And then standard harmony, but there's always something a little unusual in there. Like there?

Yeah, we're a fantastic songwriter. I mean, in the classic songwriting sense. Gorgeous, man. Yeah. Doesn't get any better. So that's it. That's it. That's the record.

Let's get to some categories. Yeah, Desert Island. What do you got? So I have Pastor T. We listen to that already. You've got Forget, Regret. We listen to that. I did have forget regret. I might change it to I'll stay. But I'll, you know what? I'm

to keep my original instinct. Forget regret. I really, really love that melody a lot. Oh, it's great. I mean, there's so many I could have. I think Pastor T to me is like, that would be the thing if I'm stuck somewhere with just, it would remind me of everything else, but it would mostly remind me of Roy on this. I mean, just the vibe. Yeah, for sure. I listen to that every day. I could listen to it. I do listen to that a lot. What's your apex moment? Apex moment. So there's a track called The Joint, which is killing. on here that we didn't

have to come off because we didn't have time. But I just want to go to some of the killing as Roy stuff. This is to me the apex moment of this record. Like you could pick a lot of people but I'm like, this is such a quintessential Roy production and record. I'm like the apex moment has to be featuring and playing the trumpet, right? Yeah. Okay. So I mean, you know, DeAngelo

I do what you want to do, but mine was. This is that this whole thing is a vibe too. Okay, we got to wait until we get to it at one minute. Bernard Wright, of course. No, that's Bobby Sparks on the ARP Of course Another patient song

You could see Pinot Piano Island You know what's this? Big tall dude Big Tall Welshman Speaking in English but Sounds like a different language Yeah, sir Okay, we're almost there We said at the beginning, you gotta settle in

Yeah, you got to settle in Killing That's Roy. The sound is killing Russ Elvado, shout out Oh Oh But I mean This is good

That's a great, great reduce. But I mean, like, just the way he plays and where it's placed in there. It's the apex moment, but it's like, it's also just, it's the most understated. But to me, it's just, it's like the most beautiful part. Like, you, even if you didn't know, like, you know Roy, if you hear him play that, you know. My apex moment was Roy on Pastor T, which we've already listened to. He was just, I mean, he was firing. That's Roy too.

I mean, Roy just, like, firing with all that classic, incredible funk syncopation. What about, what do you got any better? What do you got for? bespoke playlist. I'm calling this collection of jams, bonafide, bonafide, bonafide. Bonafide jazz fusion. Okay. Like this to me is jazz. I know jazz fusion is supposed to be only be rock and jazz, but fusion means bringing, this is hip-hop and jazz, right? Well, and R&B. Yeah. And soul. Well. Can't be, we can't fuse more than three things. You can, but I think fusion is it's, I'll let, I'll allow it.

Yeah. Well, I got it. Yeah. Uh, mine is, this. This. This is the age of soul querians. It's like we're going towards an accident. I don't want to, I can't get out of the car, though. Let's keep going. Quimovitz, what do you got? Man, this was a hard one for me because I love this record. And kind of diving back into it from beginning to end.

I've never stopped listening to this record over the years. Like this is kind of rare for me for a record from this period. That's how much I love it. So, you know, if I'm forced to say, are there too many guests on here? because I want more Roy. But they don't get in the way, and I love the way he plays behind him, but maybe a little bit.

And there could be a case to say the record's too long, but there's nothing I would take out. You know, it's a long record, though. I think that's valid, though. It's 72 minutes. Do we want a little bit more Roy? Like, maybe.

Yeah. And also... But there's not... I bet there's great Roy, I think. It's some of the greatest Roy. But, yeah, are we being greedy. We are being greedy, for sure. But that's, I mean, these are quibble bits.

These are not meant to be like, nah, this is a complaint. It's literally a quibble of a bit. Just a bit of a quibble. You know, for me, too, I think it's also, like, it is an hour and 12 minutes long. I think it's just a little too long. If this were 50 minutes long, 55 minutes long,

what would you cut out then? Give me a list. Don't give me that. Which Roy Solos would you like to? Well, how about DeAngel? Just get rid of him, huh? Maybe if it was two albums, double up. Right.

You know, maybe then. But also, you know, I do have, again, we're really quibbling here. Yep. But, like, you wrote it. I wish there was more cross stick and less open snare drum. I know. Shots fired.

Rim shots fired. Rim shots fired. I, it's not my favorite. You're not crazy about the sound of that. It's not my favorite. The outtoness of it, right? Yeah, there's not my favorite snare drum sound. It's somewhere in between of what I really wanted to hear.

And that's very quibble. Because it's really, like, just listening to it now. I think it's groovy as hell. I know you do. I'm going to put that out there. And again, this is like a super mega quibble of a bit. And he's talking about... What would this sound like if it was like a deep metal lug wig sound of a snare drum?

Just be clear. I think you're not talking about the sound, the engineering of the sound of the snare. You're talking about the intonation, the pitching of the snare. Maybe it's a smaller snare, maybe it's tight, it's a higher pit, it's a tighter snare sound.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's not that I, like, I actually think, I actually think if I were hearing this band live, I would want that and I would really like that. But there is something with the way it's recorded, or something with the way it's mixed where it's like, especially he's playing like those kind of cack rim shot stuff,

should be louder somehow. It doesn't feel as loud as I know it would feel in the room. Interesting. Maybe a little gate on it. Maybe a little suppression or something or it's just lower in the mix. I don't know. There's something about it that and again, total knee jerk, but if I really have to quibble a bit, it would be that.

Okay. Honestly, listening to it again here today, which we listened to it all week leading up to this, but even hearing it again today, most of those tracks, I'm just like, this is so well produced. So it's really not like, you know, it could have been produced any better. It's not like I was getting your way of it.

That's a real hit pick from me. Snobometer, what do you have? I have two. Why? It is not snobby. I think this is a very snobby record. Who made the billboard pop charts? What are you talking about?

Oh, bear on like a little bit. But I mean, that's... So, okay, so is that the new definition for the snobometer? I'm just trying to see... I'm saying for jazz people. Common. No, to say that you love this if you're a jazz person.

DeAngelo. C-tip. Okay, we're going five then. We're going to average it. Don't go five. That's nothing. I had eight. You had two.

Better than kind of blue. No. No. Okuchamance. I go nine. I go ten. I was going to say, this is a close 10 for me.

I'm not going to do it just because... This shit looks amazing. It's amazing. But it wouldn't be... Like, if I wasn't able to open it up and stuff, I don't know, I'm comparing it to LPs, but it's great. And also, like, you know, having...

I'm so glad you brought in the CD too, because like, look at this. Shout out Jeff Bezos. Look at these notes. Look at those liner notes, everybody. Get in, get in tight there. Oh, and Roy writes a great little... There's a great blurb in there.

Yeah, it's incredible. The thanks. I love the thank yous. This is all we want. I used to read that way. It was like thanking people. We want original art that's incredible. That gives a vibe to the music.

And we want some like detailed notes. Who's playing on what? We want this. We would have known Tony Suggs was on the B3 on the final track. Imagine not knowing Tony Suggs is playing B3 on the final track. What would be up next for you? Like what do you want to hear after this in a Spotify play? Well, we don't want to hear this.

You got your 500 CD changer. What do you want the next CD to be? There's a boring answer, which is voodoo. there's a less boring answer, which is Dr. Fankenstein. Those are good things. You could sandwich these. You could put this as a compliment sandwich

in the middle of those. We'll go with those. Okay, I'm going to take it back, and then I want one more little thing to play as we go out. Well, we've got to talk about our gala. We've got a gala, yeah. Since we're about to become an actual award, possibly, please help us out.

You've been saying we were award-winning for years, and we actually might be this time. Right. But I'm going to say up next is a record called Buckshot LaFunk. Brantford Marcellus, a band that he had. That's a good call.

10 years nor nine years before this. Check out a little bit of this. Because we think about this record, and this was groundbreaking. But I want to give some flowers to Bramford Marcellus. Friend of the pod, hopefully still friend of Peter. We have a history.

Love him. I love you, Branford. Come back home in case you're listening. You guys been a little standoffish lately? Not me. I'm just, no, no, I love Bramford. I've got a chance to play in, hey, I love Bramford.

A little inside joke we have. If you're watching this, Bramford, put that in the comments. But this is his wonderful project, Buckshot LaFunk. He's definitely not watching this. From 1994. I just think it'd be embarrassing with it.

Buckshot LaFunk, 1994. Check this out. This is a good call. We're talking about hip-hop and jazz. Who's that on trumpet? I don't know. Roy Harcrow. 24 years old.

Good get, Peter. Good get, man. Maybe get some little ideas? I forgot about this. This is a good call. Great take. I remember it because this is when I was playing where Roy, when his record came out.

Same year. Awesome. Yeah. So it's still Roy, but he's a little younger Roy, right? Sounds great, though. Yeah. So we got to give out a shout-out to Brandford for at least this had to have some influence on Roy in this project. Buckshala Funk is a killing record, too.

And similar, that's what I'm saying, this is an influence, had some guest vocals, some kind of lesser known at the time that were incredible. Okay, so hard group. DJ Premier is kind of like, you know, all over that in terms of like production. So not groundbreaking at all this one, that is what you're saying. Well, no, it's like everything when they say, when, you know, when they're like the iPhone came out. Everyone's like, this is incredible. like Microsoft and what was the company in Canada, Rim. They'd had the blueberry, Blackberry thing, you know,

Beginigans. They had the BlackBerry from years. They're like, what do you mean? We got a smartphone, but everyone's like the iPhone was the first smartphone. I put myself through music school in Benegans. Okay, we do have a gala. So if you don't know what a gala is, Peter, hit the folks to what a gala is. We worked at a gala.

Well, you worked from afar a gala last, a real gala last year. I did an arrangement for a gala, but you put in the West Coast. Yeah, what's the, you'll hear it gala. This is the gentleman and ladies agreement. And this is whereby... G-A-L-A-K-L-A-K-L-A-K-L-A-K... Yeah, whereby if you've made it to this point of the podcast, even if you haven't made at this point,

you actually are part of the agreement. It's one of those agreements, you know, like when you pull into a parking lot and there's a bunch of small print, a paid lot, you never sign anything, but you, it's like you hereby agree to this by entering. Yeah. That's what this is.

So you are agreeing in this case... So if someone steals the CDs out of my car, you'll hear it's not going to... It's not going to cover it. It's not going to cover it. Okay. Sure. Normally we say the gala is

gentlemen and ladies' agreement, you agree to give us a rating or review or a comment on YouTube. In exchange for us providing you this beautiful, blusterous podcast. Not a word. But today it's a little bit different

because today, Peter, we are nominated for two, not one, but two Signal Awards, which is kind of a big deal. This is like a big deal in the podcast space. So if you...

Hold on. I got to get that app signal. Is that how we vote on? Yeah. Signalgate. We are finalists in the best music podcast category and the best, sorry, the most innovative video podcast category.

Hells yeah. And as finalists, we're also in the running for People's Choice Award in both those categories, which is where we need your help. This podcast gets the most, or the podcast that gets the most votes wins. Yeah, that's called a contest. I know. So if you like what we're doing here, please consider voting for you'll hear it. Peter, this is a huge deal.

Yeah. If we... Can we vote multiple times? No, you can only vote once, but we are in those two categories. But you can open up a private browser, a separate company. I'm just saying, do whatever you want. We really appreciate your support. It's a big deal for us.

Of course, it's an honor just to be nominated. We're in the categories with like some big people. I know. We need your help. We do need your help. I think we need your vote. It's not like a pay-to-play situation, but it could be. But if I know something about our, you'll hear it listeners, our dear listeners, they are kind of ravenously loyal.

They are. They will come through. Especially the ones that make it this far. I'm looking at you, Brand for Marcells. Until next time. You'll hear it.