You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - Ideas for Practicing Comping

Episode Date: May 8, 2019

It's comp-city! Peter and Adam answer a SpeakPipe with different ways to work on comping. Wanna send a SpeakPipe of your own? Check out the bottom of the page at http://www.openstudionetwork.com/podcast.Today's episode is sponsored by the Oxford American. The Oxford American is a magazine dedicated to documenting the complexity and vitality of the American South. Its award-winning annual music issue comes with a CD sampler and digital download - a must-have for any serious music fan. Recent issues have featured Nina Simone, Thelonious Monk, John Cage, and John Cage. Visit https://www.oxfordamerican.org/yhi today for a special subscription discount!Let us know what you think by leaving a ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ review, or head over to our YouTube channel and leave a comment for this episode.Interested in more jazz advice? Go here to browse our catalog of jazz lessons and courses available for purchase.Follow us on Facebook, Twitter & Instagram at:https://www.facebook.com/heyopenstudiohttps://twitter.com/heyopenstudiohttps://www.instagram.com/heyopenstudio See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Hey, Pete. What's up, man? Do you ever practice your comping? What is comping? Are you a comper? You know what? I'm going to comp you on this episode. Thanks.

I'm Adam Manus. And I'm Peter Mark. And you're listening to the You'll Hear a podcast. Daily Jazz advice coming at you. Engineered by Adam Manus. I feel like I'm really knocking another park, I have to say. Well, if they're hearing this, then you are. If this turns out that the whole system crashed.

Actually, I'm looking over at the computer there, It is kind of a, oh no, that's a screensaver. Is that okay? My heart almost stopped just now, man. I don't want to mess this up because, you know, I'm technically, I've trained Andrew how to do the podcast, but now he's kind of like taking it over, taking it on it as his own, and now I feel like I'm... The tail's wagging the dog. Now the dog's trying to wag the tail again.

I feel like I'm out of my element, even though this was my thing for so long. That's right. Today's episode of the You'll Hear Podcast is sponsored by the Oxford American. Hey, go to the Oxford American's website. That's Oxfordamerican.org for some great deal. deals. It's 25 bucks for an annual subscription. It's amazing content. Please check it out. Yep. Good stuff. What are we doing? We're still on the speak pipe. The speaking into the pipe party train, aren't we? We're speaking in the pipe. Go to you'll hear it.com to leave your own

speak into the pipe. This is a speak from a speak pipe from Patrick. Hey guys. It's Patrick from Cincinnati. It's been a while since my last speak pipe message, but I heard you guys were asking for some more. So I figured that I was, would throw one into the pod cave for you guys to address. As always, love the podcast and everything you guys do over there. So thank you for that and keep it all up. But the question I wanted to ask was about practicing comping kind of as a whole, because I find oftentimes that I get very caught up in playing new voicings and new rhythms when I'm practicing comping kind of in isolation in my bedroom and then I get to comping for other people in the real world, so to speak, and it doesn't

sound always the way that I would expect it to based off of what I was practicing. So I kind of wanted to ask you guys about how you practice comping more holistically, as opposed to just focusing on, oh, I want to learn all these new voicings or all these new rhythms or something like that, and how you really kind of get to the phase where you're a, accompanying soloists pretty freely, but you're still able to use all of that cool stuff that you work on in practicing. Yeah, just take that and run with it, I guess. Thanks in advance. That's a great question.

Cool. Thanks, Patrick. Big shout out to Cincinnati. Yep. Our Midwestern, upper Midwestern neighbors. Yeah. Kind of. It's like a brother to us.

Yeah. Five hours away. Fun fact on Cincinnati. You've been to the Cincinnati airport before? Yes. Do you know what state it's in? Kentucky. It is.

Yeah. It's weird. I can't pull anything. past can I'm a Midwest traveler that's right you I'm connected on Delta okay so this is a great question because I love these questions that are you know I don't think they're necessary things that we've solved but I remember when these when this was for me how to practice comping how to comp just in general but really how to practice it was such a it was like one of those things that would keep me up at night you know like now it's more like I wake up like

did I pay that bill? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, I mean, this was like, it was just a, it was like a tyrannical kind of thing on me. And, and so it's really, like, first of all, I just want you to know, like, when we identify, I mean, for all the listeners, especially as pianas. I mean, there's like kind of jazz musicians,

you know, all the different levels, but as jazz pianists, you know, there's, what do they call, there's, like, solace in community. Yeah. Because the reason this is an issue is because, A, it's hard. B, it's important. But C, there will be ABC, one, two, three.

ABC, where is it? Where are you going? You know, there is a solution, you know, but it's a gradient thing. And it's like you're going to get to the promised land, but you're never going to just like, oh, it's so hard. It's so hard. How do I do it? And then all of a sudden you open the door. Oh, it was here all the time.

Yeah. And you know what? Man, comping is tricky, right? Yeah. It's not like soloing where it's kind of your own thing. Yeah. It's every soloist you comp for has a. specific idea in their head what they want sometimes.

I think that what we should do is today is just talk about how hard it is, not actually give a solution. Because I could talk for hours on how hard it is. I've struggled with this too. I mean, I work on it probably as much or more than anything else trying to get it. But it is hard because it's like you're supporting someone else. You're trying to do something that is the most interactive without stepping on toes, but with giving something to the ensemble, adding something.

hopefully the soloists can, you know, if not play off of, at least give them a nice, like, you know, pad beneath them, something where it makes everything gel together. That's tricky. There's a little bit of magic in it. Yeah. And I think this thing of stepping on toes, that's going to happen no matter what level. So, like, what do you do once you step on the toes? Just like in real life, if you step on somebody's toes. If you just kind of run away, someone's going to be like, why?

Did that guy just step on my toes and try to grab something on my wallet or what? You know, like, you have to deal with it. And there's ways to turn it around and make it fun. or make it interactive or make it a positive. So, like, this is a tricky thing, but it's a very rewarding thing. And it's such an important part of what we can do and what we can bring to the table as jazz pianist. No matter what, as times change, like, this is where it's at, you know. Oh, it's true.

And I think, you know, we haven't done this in a while, our number one. Listen. Yeah, but this is the time for this. I mean, you talk about supporting somebody. How can you support them if you're not listening to them? And this is what makes it so hard to practice, right? is because you have to listen to what the soloist is doing and you have to react and be there for them.

And it's not like you can practice, I mean, you can practice this with recordings and try to comp for, you know, Coltrane or Miles or someone like that. But the thing is, is when you get into a live situation, that soloist is probably going to react off something you're doing. So it's not the same thing. They're probably not barreling ahead just on their own

or maybe they shouldn't be in certain situations. So you have to be able to react and then re-react to them and be this thing that grows as a, the unit, not just the soloist, the drummer, the bass player. So it's really only something you can practice with other people. And that's the hardest thing. I will say that a few technical things to get out of the way, first of all, is to make sure that you have the voicings that are part of your sound together in every key.

That's got to be just the base level. Like 10 keys or 11? How many should they do? All 13 keys. Come on that. No, you have to have, you have to have. to have these things. This was what haunted me for a while,

so I didn't pay enough attention to this. I just, you know, I had this idea in my head, oh, I can voice and I can figure things out. And then sometimes I would get in a weird key and if you're like, I don't really have anything that sounds good in this. Yeah, yeah. Like I do, I can do some stuff,

but they sound kind of crappy. Yeah, yeah. Compared to my other stuff, an F, you know what I mean? And so I remember spending my 20s, like really trying to tighten this up. Really trying to get everything, first of all, acknowledging the voicings that I loved that were part of me

and then really trying to clean them up. But that's smart. But that was it like when you turn 20, you're like, you know what? By the time I'm 30, I'm going to have all. Did you have that much? No. Was it more like 28? You were like, oh, man, I'm almost out of my 20s.

I better get this together real quick. I just remember certain saxophone players giving me really dirty looks and me being like, oh, snap, I better clean this up. But man, that is, we've talked about this before. That's when you learn. Like when you make a mistake, traumatic situation. And I always want to reiterate to people. And for comping, because it is a long road, you're going to, you're going to,

to have some times that people looking at you funny or where you feel down like embrace that. Yeah. What do they call it? Lean into it. Leen into it. Don't lean into it. Grab it. You know, those situations because that you will look back.

You can already look back no matter what your age is and see that that's when you can have some rapid growth right out of that. So most people want to focus on like the shame of the situation or whatever. And that's really your ego. That's about you. Totally. Nobody cares about you. Yeah.

Like it's about the music. And now you're going to, your ego will be built up. with confidence so that you can play this music once you actually learn to do it. But be glad some saxophone player vibes you back in A2. Because you're right, it's going to happen. But also, you know, make sure that you have those fundamental things like some basic voicings in every key down so that you're not thinking about how do I voice an F sharp or diminish.

Right. I mean, that should come without thinking. Right, right. I mean, we like to put the fun and fundamentals. Yeah. But it's super important, you know. It's like, I mean, we do a lot of basketball. comparisons. But if you can't do a simple layup with your left hand, there's going to be situations where

that gets exposed. Right. They're going to be guarding you that side. You see that. So I think, too, yeah, I was just thinking about when you said, like, going through all the keys, you have a, you have a situation where, you know, you've got somebody that comes over to, like, a plumber and they're really good. You know, like, those plumbers, they can just, like, fix anything. We actually had a plumber that built a bathroom for us in the basement. And it was all we were going to have, like, a contract. The contract is like, let's see what he thinks. Like, he knew where to put it. And he built that. Like, we just went and he's like, I need some tile.

Pick out what you like. I'll do it. But one cool thing was whenever he got, you know, we have an old house. Whenever he got to something weird, he's like, hold on a second. He'd go out to his van. And I saw in his van. It was just like stuff everywhere. But he had like somewhere every size tool or whatever.

And there might be one. He's like, man, I hadn't used this funky metric one in a while or whatever. But if he had come over, they have other plumbers that come over and fix your stuff. And then they're like, oh, I don't have the right wrench. Do you have any wrench? You know, they want to use your tools. And then if you don't, they're like, all of a sudden, they're no good because they don't have that tool. They're great when they're in the right key.

You got to get the tools together. You have to have the fundamental tools. And you know what? I'm going to give a shout out to our blog here. Do you know about our blog? You'll hear it.com? I've heard of it. Yeah.

There's a ton of great voicing information. You know, five note, two-handed voicing, spread voicings, octaves, you know, there's a ton of good stuff. Yeah. Block chords, all good for comping. So go check those out. Like, we have, basically, we have the fundamental voicings that most pianists use available there. And then learn those in every key. Make sure you know a lot of voicings with different melody notes on top

so that you can create melodies. Very important when you're playing with someone who's playing a melody. Which I know that years ago. Thanks for telling me now, buddy. But those fundamentals, I think, that's where you start. Yeah. And I think so the part of Patrick's question about accompanying, you know, comping in real time versus cool stuff you practice.

Now, this is actually a little bit easier. So the things like the resources that you're talking about, the different things that you practice learning in all 12 keys. That's from when you're practicing. That's preparation for when you get a chance to practice the actual comping, which can only be done in some. I mean, you can kind of do it along with the recordings as we talk about, but in terms of, like, you have, it has to be totally,

you don't know what's coming at you and to see how you react. This is actually kind of easy, easy. You don't try any of the cool stuff because you cannot, there's not going to be time to be like, I'm playing cool stuff and I'm listening. Yeah. And being supportive. You have to let that stuff holistically or not even holistically just naturally come

into your seep into it's kind of like the stuff we talk about when you learn a solo a phrase don't come today don't be that guy where you learn that miles phrase and then you got to play it at the beginning of your soul totally wait for it to happen and it might not happen that night and then you'll be like what i learned the solo you know no you do that to develop your ears to develop your understanding to develop your conception your framework for how this music can be it'll come out naturally if you let it at the right time but you got to be patient well this is similar to our thought the other day on soloing and that's to not play anything you're you're not actually hearing.

Right. And that's, it goes. Do we get a little pushback on that from somebody? I don't think so. Okay. Because we're right.

Yeah. Because Chickoria said it. I said his full name. That's right. But even when comping, if you're not hearing it, don't play it. Don't play anything if you're not hearing anything.

Right. Because it's better off than you just playing something by row that's not great. And if we hear of you guys out there doing this, we're going to change the name of this podcast to you don't hear it. That's right. And that's going to be really fussy because of the website and everything, you know. Another couple of practice.

things I think that I like to practice with comping. Wait, wait. Should we say these for the ultimate at the end? Yeah, I'll save one for the ultimate. Okay, all right. But one that I remember, I think it was Hal Galper who taught

this way, which was listen to Red Garland comp. And like 90% of what Red Garland does is on the end of two and the end of four. That's right. Those two, those two rhythms. Yeah. One, two, three, uh, uh, uh,

can make a huge difference in how the band propels. That's right. You know, he's not doing that the entire time, but there's a lot of those rhythms. Yeah. That help just lead into things. Yep. And normally we would think about syncopation of like, how does that juxtapose,

but you're talking about comping over a walking bass line most of the time. So you've got the on the beat. Doong, do, do, do, do, do. So you've got a built-in syncopation all the time between the bass, the ride symbol and the piano. And that can become more pattern-based comping where you're still listening and supportive, but you can be playing through more. It's not as much of playing in between or trying to get super interactive outside of it on a rhythmic kind of level.

If I want the band to sound like it's swinging even harder, I'll start doing that kind of red garland stuff. Something you do, a good rhythm you do is an end of three. You like the end of three I've noticed. I like the number of three. And it's a syncopated thing too. It's usually end of three and then something on the one. Or maybe you displace it. One, two, three.

Uh, uh, uh, um, uh, kind of thing. Those rhythms I remember when I invented that back in 77 You didn't invent anything like that It was the year after the bicentennial of our country No but it helps with swing I've noticed that and of three thring End of three thring

Yeah It really it kind of helps again There are these core rhythms That help kind of pull the thing together Yeah drummers have them too Absolutely yeah Cool all right well thank you for that And a big shout out to Cincinnati

and Ohio as always We are gonna we're gonna have one more tip And I know you got a good one I even think I know what it is I bet you don't. Okay, I bet I don't. Well, I'm looking forward to learning that. We are sponsored by,

honor to be sponsored by the Oxford American. Please go to Oxford American. org slash YHI to sign it for the e-newsletter. You know all the stuff that we say. But we keep telling you because we believe it. We love it. And there's still some of you coming on every day. And the reason for that, do you know why?

We got new people. Have you seen our stats lately? I have not. I haven't either. But I can feel it. I can feel it because we get me a lot of comments. To feel the energy. Go to YouTube, leave us comments.

I've been answering a bunch. Adam has not. So start calling him out. I want to see some people this week. Buddy, I answered comments yesterday. Okay. It was the first time in three months. Yeah, yeah. Call him out because he's a funny, moderately funny guy.

And I don't know. He's a moderate guy and he's funny, is what I mean. And don't forget to go to you'll hear.com, both for the blog, for some ideas for voicings. We have a ton of stuff there. And also to leave us your speak pipe. You can go to podcast and leave us to speak pipe, leave us your voicemail. Ask us a question. We want to answer it.

We do. Unless it's bad. Yeah. We got it. So our ultimate tip on comping. Our ultimate tip on comping is this. Do not mimic what the soloist is doing all the time. Stop with that.

Thank you. You're there to add to what they're doing, to support them, not to constantly being a mirror. A mirror of what they're doing. Nobody likes that. But not only a mirror, like a mirror. You're shoving it in their face. It's like the most basic version of listening.

And it's not cool. Although, don't you love it when the drummer, when you go, the drummer looks here, goes, cac, gack, gack, no, you don't love that. I don't love it. What I love is when I go, dun, d'ant, dana, and the drummer goes, Shugon, shangon, shug, answers me in some interesting way. That's cool.

That's right. Have a conversation. Don't make, don't just say back what the person's saying. Yeah, don't just say back what the person's saying. Don't just say back with the, we could do this all saying. See how annoying this is? Exactly. You'll hear it.