You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - Instrument Spotlight: The Bass - #55

Episode Date: March 26, 2018

Today, we spotlight the glue of any any good rhythm section: the bass See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

I'm Adam Menace and I'm Peter Martin. And you're listening to the You'll Hear It Podcast. Today we're going to do something a little bit different on the You'll Hearer podcast. We're going to start what we hope is going to turn into a series of instrument spotlights. And today we are going to focus on one of my favorite instruments, the bass. The bass, yeah, truly the foundation of many jazz ensembles. And I'm excited. No, do not be...

No, sound that excited. No, I'm getting there. I'm getting there. I mean, you know what? A great bass player is very calm and calm. collect. That's true. Not easily excitable in terms of personality because they have to hold everything together. I'm trying to get in the mode here. It's kind of solid and boring is what you're going for. Exactly. Now, do non-basis need to press pause or skip of this episode or can they stay on?

No, I don't think so at all. I just wanted to make sure that we talk about the role of the base. We talk about players we love, recordings we love, and hopefully that'll inspire some people to maybe think differently about the base or get into a lot. I like it. Now, I would say if Christian McBride or Ruben Rogers or Robert Hurst or Rodney Whitaker, any great bass players are listening. Please stop listening now because we don't want to contradict you. We are not bassists. We're just say that. But we're going to do our best to talk about the bass.

Yeah, maybe this is be titled the bass from a pianist's perspective. I like it. I like it. Okay. So I think the first thing, you know, to really understand and appreciate about the bass is that foundational role it has in the ensemble. And I think that emanates not just from, you know, the register of the instrument because, yes, of course, it's low, but I mean, a piano goes a little bit lower than the bass.

But I think it's from traditionally how within jazz and really just sort of modern music, groove, music, whatever we want to call it, like the bass, you know, forms the foundation of several important aspects of the music. The groove, you know, along with the drums, but really the bass, that rhythm section, I mean, that's the bass and the drums. But then the bass is also playing, oddly enough, the bass line. I don't know how that happened. So the bottom of the harmony is that that foundation of the harmony really comes from the bass. We always think of the piano because we can play or the guitar play all the harmony.

But the bass, that establishes that bottom note that all the harmonic changes and progressions and everything rests on top of. So they change just their one note. That totally alters what we should be doing as harmonically as pianists. It's kind of one of the cool things about the bass specifically in jazz. It's kind of, it's the thing that sets jazz apart, I think, from other genres in the bass's, you know, pantheon of music is that how, what other form of music does the bass have that much control over the harmony, have that much control over the time and the groove?

I mean, all, all bass parts in all music, pop music or whatever, classical music, help inform the harmony and help inform the grooves. But not so much as in jazz where they're playing either a two-feel or walking for and getting into extensions. I mean, you know, hopefully not too much from his perspective so that we have a little freedom. We got that. We got that. We got that. We got you covered. But it really is the tone and the the palette center of the color of the rhythm section. Palette Center. Do you like that? I love it. I love it. Right. So I think, you know, what goes along with that, you know, control and kind of really foundational domination almost that a bass player can provide.

what I've noticed, it's interesting, is the personality of great bass players in jazz, they're very dependable. They're like rock steady. They're like the designated driver of the band. They're always there for you. And even personally, I mean, I think about like Christian McBride and Esperanza Spalding, Robert Hurst, all these great bass players that I've got a chance to play with and be around. Like, they're actually, when you go and hang out, like, they're the ones you can depend on.

They're not going to, like, drift off or whatever. they're going to be there for you. Right, right. And that's just sort of a part of their personality, and they're usually able to kind of fit that in with, you know, the band situation in a really natural and organic way. Drummers can, you know, well, we're going to do a separate episode on that. Yeah, we will do, we'll do drummers and everybody else.

But it is one of the, I mean, it's the characteristic of the instrument and its role in the music, right? Like, it's such, it's the most supportive instrument. Yeah. Just by definition, by its role, It is such a supportive castmate of the music that it's no surprise that the personalities that are drawn toward it are stable and supportive themselves. And actually, it's one of the things I love about it and what I kind of like envy about

bass players. Like I was talking to this drummer friend of both of ours, Montez, about, you know, this bass player we knew from a few years ago. And I won't say his name because now he's like really, really good. But at the time, he was just starting out on the upright bass. he didn't know any tunes he couldn't solo at all but he had a quarter note that felt

so groven and so good that I mean he was getting all kinds of work because you know that's all people really wanted from him right like it didn't matter if like it kind of became a train wreck when he would ever solo so whatever you just don't let him solo that much but like

the music always felt awesome right and he wouldn't drop a beat wouldn't drop a beat I remember that still doesn't It just sounds like how it should sound all the time. Fits the role. Fits the role perfectly. I definitely envy that part of that supportive element of it. Well, I think that, you know, for musicians, no matter what instruments you play,

the closer you can align that part of your personality with the personality that's kind of needed or has developed, you know, within the role of your instrument within jazz, the closer you can get to that, the better you can. really exploit the possibilities of yourself in this music. It's not to say that you can't create something new, and you think about bass players like Jaco Pastoris, who really went into another direction, but he also had that foundational thing,

and he definitely had the time and groove thing, but then he took it to another place personality-wise. Well, think about those mega bass stars. You just mentioned Christian McBride and Bob Hurst and all these. I mean, they have that thing, first and foremost, right? They have that hump. They have that feel. that makes them who they are.

Right, right. Another thing I was thinking about that kind of specific to the bass within jazz that I love and have always admired is, you know, I think the bass has been developed within jazz and then later, you know, within R&B and pop and funk and all the things that kind of came out of jazz.

You know, this music has used the bass in greater detail and exploited it in more ways than any other music. I mean, if we think about classical music, I mean, there's great music written for the bass, but it's much more limited, and the role is much more limited. I mean, it's certainly used

in orchestras, and it's a wonderful thing. But, I mean, it's really come front and center in jazz. Whereas, as far as being one of the European classical instruments, whereas if you look at the piano, of course, it's done amazing things within jazz, but it's been really exploited within classical music, amazingly as well. Exactly.

Or like the trumpet. There's been many, many different things. But like the bass, it seems like it's kind of hit its highest peaks within jazz. And that's a cool thing. I totally agree.

I mean, I can't think of a genre where the acoustic upright bass is used in a more effective or more leadership or more equal role to all the other instruments. Yeah.

It's amazing. Yep. Yeah. So let's get into some of our favorite players and recordings. I mean, for me,

when I think about the sound of the bass, I think about really, three people from sort of, you know, the 20th century as far as feels that I connect with. And that's Ray Brown, Paul Chambers, and Ron Carter. And those to me are, I mean, I know they're kind of like three sides of a very crazy feeling coin.

But like those to me are like the Mount Rushmore base sounds. Well, and probably the three most influential, what you said, Ray Brown, Paul Chambers, and Ron Carter. Yeah, probably the three most influential of all these younger bass players. we talked about. I mean, there's many more, too. There's tons more. Yeah. Oscar Pedersford, Jimmy Blanton from right here in St. Louis, I believe.

But that's really going back to the origins. Mingus, obviously, you know, Jocko. Well, that's what I'm talking about. Like, in jazz, I mean, like, we've really, you know, connected with the bass in a way. I'm very proud of this music and what it's done with this really difficult. I mean, in a lot of, you know, in classical music, it was just, I always felt like until later, and, you know, jazz kind of informed this back to classical. music in a way, it was almost this feeling from the repertoire that the bass was just a limited instrument. You know, like there's only so far you can take it.

Whereas jazz players, and I mean, you talk about Jimmy Blanton, maybe was the first one that, I mean, I'm not an expert on bass history, but from what I've heard and read to really technically and solo-wise and in terms of lines, really start to go crazy on the instrument in a way that people thought couldn't be done. Do you have any favorite recordings of the bass that come to mind, like, I'll slap your head? Well, there's a bunch, you know, one, as soon as you mentioned Ray Brown, I was thinking, like, you know, I love these recordings that are not necessarily, I mean, you know, his trio recordings like in the 90s, you know, with, you know, like Greg Hutchinson and Jeff Keiser and Benny Green are amazing. And then, of course, the recordings, you know, like, Night Train with Oscar Peterson. You know the record he made of all the bass players or whatever? What's that, like Christian?

Base players are my best friend. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's great. On Tellark. But for me, Ray Brown, like, what really comes to mind when you say favorite recording is one, he did it on Pablo. a duo recording with Duke Allington. And I want to say it was like 1974 or something. I had to check. But it was, it's called This One's for Blanton. And they did a lot of, you know, the stuff that Jimmy Blanton originally recorded. But I mean, Ray Brown, and it's duo, so it's no drums.

And first of all, Duke Allington is just like, it's one of my favorite just piano recordings. I don't know this recording. Man, we're going to listen to it next. You'll hear it. Don't worry. But podcast's not over, though. So, no, I mean.

I mean, like, it's some of the just clearest, most mature. I mean, you can't even say it's some of the most in-tune Ray Brown, because he always played in-tune. But it's just the recording is great. Like, his soloing is just masterful. Yeah, yeah. And it's so precise, but so inspired at the same time. You know, to me, Ray Brown, it's kind of like Ele Fitzgerald. You know, they were married and had a son.

And they were married for a little while. And, like, they remind me of each other in some ways in that Ele Fitzgerald, the only thing I've ever heard criticize about her is that, like, well, she sang too much in tune, and she was too perfect, and her time was too good, and her diction was too good, and she nailed the lyrics too well. I was like, wow, sounds like a pretty good singer to me. You know, like, well, you know, Billy Holiday had more of a vibe. So it's like with Ray Brown, it's like, okay, yeah, he always played in tune. And some people, like, he was too clean. But you don't even hear that from bass play. Like, I've met, not even a bad bass player tries to say that about Ray Brown. It's funny because people try to,

people sometimes say that about Oscar Peterson, right? Yeah. It's like long time collaborator. Like, oh, it's too clean. And what is it? The Jazz Olympics, or I've heard, you know what I mean? Yeah. But it's like, yes, he won. And he won the gold medal. Yeah. But I mean, Ray's playing on, this one's for Blanting.

Blanton is just, I mean, it's just incredible. We're going to listen to it right after this, though. Do you have any favorites as far as, like, Ron Carter. You're talking about Ron Carter and Paul Chambers? Yeah, I mean, you know, for me, that whole Miles second quintet with Ron and Tony, the feel of, I mean, it just feels so airy, that groove of those two together. Yeah. And, you know, Ron doing those.

like double stops all the time and creating these like harmonic vibes. To me that is the peak of how the bass could be recorded and a part of a modern jazz rhythm section. Just an amazing, amazing musician, amazing person. Yeah, I mean, I think Ron Carter actually with that, I mean, everybody in that group had their, you know, their big influence on the sound, of course. but a lot of people give credit to Herbie for harmonically opening things up in Wayne and I mean they were amazing

but I think in a lot of ways Ron like if you listen to his progression from like you know Four and More My Funny Valentine that period up to like live at the plug nickel yeah like he's kind of opened up almost more than everybody like he seems like he opened it up for everybody Imagine the plug nickel without Ron Carter

it would be totally different I mean it would not at all feel that way and like on My Funny Valentine for and more that concert he's very very like, I mean, very suggestive with some interesting things and substitutions, but keeps it pretty close to the best in terms of, like, you know, harmonic movements and stuff, like really logical, accurate baselines and stuff, whereas Plugged Nickel, he's really expanded things and opened things up for everybody.

And, I mean, his harmonic interplay, he talked about the foundation of what he does underneath Wayne playing, like, with Herbie's laying out, is just incredible. Who are your favorite base players that are doing it today? Oh, man. I think this is a great kind of golden age for bass. There's a lot of really good bass players and Ben Williams who I just heard the last few nights. He was so swinging.

Yeah. And I mean for the young players although he's not young anymore but I mean he's great. I love Jamal Jamal Nichols. Jamal Nichols from here in San Luis playing with Gregory Porter. I love Esperanza Spalding. I think what she's doing both in terms of her playing and the different ensembles. She's a mega talent.

The theatrical things that she does. But then I've heard her playing like with Joel Livano and real like trio without, like just swinging and old school stuff. I mean, you know, Christian McBride is, you know, we've been friends since I first met him when he was 14 years old and I was 16. And so I've been hearing him and playing with him on, you know, well, pretty much constantly since then in some form. So that's like, I always say he's like my big brother in the music. But then I'm like, wait, he's two years younger than me. How is he like my, it's like my father, you know, it's the weirdest thing. But I mean, he's got that kind of understanding. I mean, forget about just bass playing,

just music, just an encyclopedic knowledge of jazz and beyond. And so, you know, of course, I love his playing. I love Bob Hurst. I play with him a lot. I'm naming a lot of people I play with a lot. So there's other great play. I mean, Chris Thomas, Ruben Rogers. Good music.

I mean, I think Ruben is, you know, among that, our generation of bass players in a lot of ways is the most, he takes the most chances in super interesting musical ways. So, like, he really knows and understands. understands the tradition, but he's constantly, I mean, you know what, all those guys and gals are, though. I can't say that. But I mean, it's cool to hear their personalities. That's right. Yeah. No, I was just going to say, like, there's Larry Grenadier, who is like the same generation as Ruben kind of, but like has such a unique voice on the instrument. Oh, my God. Yeah. I mean, this is a great. Matt Brewer, who's still, you know. John Patitucci. I mean, you know, just a little older,

but the same. I mean, him and Bob Hurst, you know, I mean, I really think. think, I don't know, see, this is good. We haven't done any bass player jokes this episode. And we really shouldn't, because now we just named all these masterful music. There's nothing to joke about, man. I know. There really is nothing to joke about it. When we get to our viola episode, maybe.

But for now, I would just have to say, with the bass, you'll hear it. Dang. Thanks for listening to this episode of the You'll Hear It podcast. You can go to you'll hear it.com to get more information, submit a question, or just say hello. You can do that. Absolutely. All right, and if you like what you heard, please leave a review and a rating below. Thanks.