You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - Phrasing While Comping

Episode Date: July 25, 2019

On today's episode, Peter and Adam answer a particularly spacey SpeakPipe on how to build phrases while you comp. Wanna send a SpeakPipe of your own? Just go to https://youllhearit.com/podcast-contact/Have you been to the new Open Studio website yet? It's the same great taste with a whole new look! It's got all of the great courses from the old site, plus some new ones like Jazz Piano Jump-Start that are exclusive to the new platform. Plus, we've got a more user-friendly interface, faster load speeds, and new course resources - like quizzes over the lesson material. Visit https://www.openstudiojazz.com/ to learn more!Let us know what you think by leaving a ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ review, or head over to our YouTube channel and leave a comment for this episode.Interested in more jazz advice? Go here to browse our catalog of jazz lessons and courses available for purchase.Follow us on Facebook, Twitter & Instagram at:https://www.facebook.com/heyopenstudiohttps://twitter.com/heyopenstudiohttps://www.instagram.com/heyopenstudio See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Peter, I must ask you a question. Yes. Did you just say I must ask you a question? Are you high? High on life, buddy. High on life. I'm Adam Manus. And I'm Peter Martin.

You're listening to the You'll Hear podcast. Daily Jazz Advice, coming at you. Coming at you today's episode is sponsored by Open Studio. Check out Open StudioJazz.com. That's right. You heard me right. OpenStioJazz.com. Our lightning fast new platform, all of our courses are up there now.

It's a beautiful thing. We're getting great feedback because we've got new features like, quizzes, practice routines on a lot of stuff. We still have the same great living notation feature where you can see a lot of the transcriptions scrolling along with the videos. We got all that, but at lightning fast speeds now, open studio jazz.com, check it out. Nice, nice, nice.

Good. Now, what are we talking about today? Well, today we got a, I got another speak pipe from Alex. From Alex, our friend. Hey, Peter. Hey, Adam. Mr. Space, man. Alex from the PNW, not Kaharado. Another question for you, but I got to say,

podcast is great. It's the best thing to listen to changing dirty diapers and you can't practice. I'm sure both of you know what I mean. Anyway, I was wondering if you could talk about one phrasing while you're comping. But I'm not just talking about a Charleston rhythm here or a who parked the car rhythm there. No one talks about who parked the car.

But building phrases in your comping, like you would build a phrase in a solo. I think that's interesting. Yeah. The other thing is how do other people on the band stand? that are in the rhythm section, build those phrases. What are their cues? All right, that's my question. I'm going to do this under a minute and 30. Guys are great.

Keep at it. Take care. Bye. One minute, 25 seconds, Alex. You just made it under the wire. He maximized that time. Who parked the car? Who parked the car?

I don't know that. I know. I know who let the dogs out. Who, who, who, who? Yeah. But who parked the car? The way he said it, though, could have been like, who parked the car? Like, oh, right, walk the dog, walk the dog, walk the dog, walk the dog.

Yeah, that was. But I think he means who parked the car, who parked the car. Bubba, buba. Yeah, yeah. I just never heard of referred to as that. Charleston. Charleston. Yeah, I don't know any of those.

Yeah, I don't want to put a pitch on it. So Alex, okay, I just figured out, he said, I think he said Alex from PNW. And I was thinking, that's what it is. Pacific Northwest. I was thinking like a rap group, like. You know, NWA, PNW. I'm thinking like PNW sausages down here off Kings Highway. Ah, nice.

BNW. B&W, right. So, all right, thank you. Mr. Spaceman, back in the house, back on the podcast, back all up on the speak pipe, all up in your speak pipe. As spacey as ever. As spacey as ever. So, all right, this is cool, man.

I want you to start with this, if you would, Adam. Because I'm a little bit spaced out on exactly. I don't know. maybe because it's phrasing while comping, you know, rhythmic phrasing. I think he's saying not rhythmic phrases, so I'm not exactly sure what he's asking. I think he's kind of alluding to both rhythmic and melodic phrasing.

I mean, that's how I think of comping. I don't know how you approach it, but for me, the deeper I get into it, and the more I listen to great accompanist and both guitarist and pianist, you know, there's less throwing our hands down at the keyboard and more like actual melodic phrases. And of course, rhythm goes with that naturally, right?

Sure. So I would say, you know, what was a real game changer for this for me, Alex, a few years ago, I really worked out my two-handed voicing, five-note, six-note, even four-note, two-handed voicings, that I could play over any chord with any melodic note on top, right? So I really wanted to get that solidified so that I was never surprised if I wanted to make a melody on any chord change, I could do that easily. and it wasn't just me doubling something or moving something around

but actually like thoughtful five-note voicings with no repeated notes I have a whole system I created for myself just to be able to do that and it has been really amazing because I was just I play so much so many trio gigs that I don't come for a lot of people anymore

actually a little bit but I was just playing a quartet gig I played a quintet gig over the weekend a quartet gig last night Like a string quartet gig or? No I wish I could play if I could play viola and a string quartet That would be like life goal. Right for the middle there. Oh, yeah.

I don't want to be on either end. No, but I was playing these gigs where I was having to do a lot of comping, and I was really just so grateful for that work that I put in to be able to comp melodically. Because I can basically listen to what the solo is playing, listen to what the drummer's playing, listen to where the bass player is, and compose my melodies around what's happening. And not that you're always like, you know, I want to be right in there with you, bro, or anything like that. What up, what up, what up. But you want to say what you want to say so that you're not just,

the whole goal of being present in the music and playing jazz is that it's a live thing that's new every time. Is this a live thing? Yes, it is. It's new every time. And you're actually saying something substantial whenever you do anything, including comping, so that I have these melodic voic voic voicings that I can go to at any time so that I can really contribute what I think compositionally to what's happening around me.

Yeah, that's good. I was actually thinking about this as you were answering and that what you said at the end kind of changed up my whole idea about this. So talking about is this a live thing. This is absolutely a live thing. So, you know, you kind of hit on the conversational aspect of comping and the reactionary and the inspirational component of that. I think that that's so important. So whatever we do talk about or theorize about phrasing and, our comping and harmony and like how we're going to do that it's imperative that you know as pianist

or guitarist or drama or anybody who's comping horn players can comp too absolutely sleep on that horn sections can cop totally so comping is accompanying and it's conversational in jazz so let's not get however we phrase let's not let that get so important to us and we're so important and precious that it becomes more important than listening number one first first and foremost the most important part and so I think that the way that we phrase should be intertwined, intertined, and integral to how the soloist that you're actually accompanying and comping behind is phrasing. It should never be, well, this is the way I phrase, however we look at it, you know. And it's so important that we come with that kind of mindset of, you know, a company. And now remember, accompanying, I believe it does

not mean just supporting. I think a great accompany is a great compor. Is that, can we say that? Does that make sense? We just did. We said it. Bam, is someone that supports and inspires and pushes at the right time. That's all about like listening and stuff. And so like how you're phrasing and stuff can't be, you can't separate that from the whole active company, which is really about listening.

That's right. It's not all about you when you're comping, but you absolutely have the right to put, have some input into what's happening and to, and to talk to the soloists. Right. You know, and to guide them. you need to step up more and win less. You have to listen. Oh, I thought it was you Google it. That was what my kids said,

how you can get any answer. Sorry. You Google, no, you have to listen to what's going on. Okay, right, right, right, right. You also have to listen to what's going on with the bass and drums if you're comping, too, because a lot of, you know, I mean, you're obviously you're supporting the soloist,

you're adding your own input, you're there to help the sound. A lot of this has to do, though, too, with helping the overall vibe of the solo reach its, you know, destination that it's kind of going towards. So if you hear it's the end of a chorus and the drummer's starting to do some more

things, you need to do some things to start building tension too. Like, you know, if I hear a drummer, like, we're like, and he starts, maybe the last three bars of the chorus where I know he's going to mark the new

form, right? I'm going to do some maybe chromatic fourth things going into that or some kind of tension building thing that I can release and then let it kind of like fly on the top of that chorus. Right, right, right. Those things are crucial, I think.

When you hear a tight rhythm section, you hear them marking those kind of forms, doing things like that with each other. And, you know, maybe it was the drummer who started taking that. Maybe it was the bass player who started some kind of ostinado or something. And you know someone's like, all right, let's do something here. Let's make, let's churn it so that we could release at the top. That's right. There's definitely that element, I think, with great rhythm sections of, really, it goes

back to collective improvisation. And you talk about like the roots of jazz and New Orleans, brass band playing and stuff, It's like there's a collective comping, but there's a collective improvisation. Now, I think in terms of actual phrasing, we hit on a part of it. I think they can be helpful to Alex and to everybody. And that is that, you know, phrasing in general,

like kind of big picture of just for music and for art even, you could say, but specifically in music is really based upon a combination and a pulling and a tugging between those three basic elements of melody, harmony, and rhythm. Like, that's what really phrasing is about. Like, a lot of times we'll think it's only about melody. But if you talk about phrasing the melody, of course, that's important.

But in terms of comping, how we play the harmony, and you might say, well, that's obviously if you're a pianist or guitarist. It's like whatever the chord is, you're delineating what the harmony is. But that can become a very big part of how you phrase. It isn't just about the melody. And then, you know, how we place that. within the rhythm is huge for I mean because rhythmic phrasing we'll break it down as a as a part of that but that's really just one element to how the overall phrasing is so I think we never want to decouple those three elements especially when it I mean never in music because they're always even if one becomes more prevalent rhythm or are really concentrating in on the harmony or the melody takes takes center stage those all those elements are always there they're always working together and the fun in terms of and really what phrasing is just like when we're speaking you know a great orator or people having a discussion with each other,

how they phrase, it's the vocabulary, it's the timbre of their voice, it's the pitch of their voice, it's the language, all those things come together. So we never can really decouple those, and we shouldn't. And good phrasing, once we have these sort of essential elements, which I agree are so crucial,

good phrasing is not in a vacuum. A phrase doesn't exist on its own. No. It depends on whether it's good or not, or impactful, depends on what's happened before it and what's happened after that. And this scope can widen and widen and widen. So you have the one individual phrase, that's like the small, maybe the small scope is one note.

But let's say we have one individual comping phrase. Let's say it is who parked the car, right? Since we just learned that one today. Who parked the car and maybe it's just one chord you're playing that on. No change in the voicing or melodic content on top. Who parked the car? Now, if I just played who parked the car before that, now we have repetition. Right.

Right. But maybe if I play who parked the car and I play something else like, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, like, hey, where is the car? I guess, I don't know. Hey, who stole my car? Yeah, I'm actually. Hey, who stole my car? No, but you know what I mean?

Like, whatever that is after that. Okay, now I have two phrases. Right. Okay. Where did I park my car and who stole my car? There you go, phrasing. So, Alex, the thought that I think of most that I think affects the quality of my, my comping and the phrasing within my comping is a question of repetition or variety.

Which one am I trying to do? Am I trying to create repetition or am I trying to create variety? A balance of these things is what separates good compers from great compers. Absolutely. When you know when to change it up and when you know to kind of like hammer something home, it's just like playing a solo, right? It's like I'm never going to play, just because of this is my sensibility, I'm never going to play random phrases in my solo.

I will always do thematic things several times and then switch it up. Right. So there's repetition and variety, repetition and variety. We learn from Kenny Rogers. you got to know when to hold them, you got to know when to fold them, hello. That's such a great song for lessons.

For comping. Great comping on that. No, but you know what I'm saying? So you got this scope of one phrase, but it's not in the vacuum. It really matters what's happened before, what's happened after. And actually, you can start planning a whole strategy of like,

okay, by here, you know, like I feel like maybe we're going to be here at a certain point. So I'm going to hold off for now. Well, and the more we refocus and re-center always back to that conversation, With yourself, with the solos, with the rhythm section, the better you can place this kind of thing in terms of what happened before and where you're going and really a strategy that is linear and story-based.

Right. You know, that's what really continues to frame, you know, the whole reason why we're comping and why we're telling these stories and why it's important that it's not just an isolated thing. Man, man, you know. Yeah, not at all. Not at all. And I think, too, even like with the who parked, the car,

you know what we're talking about rhythm melody and harmony there that becomes very much like a rhythmic thing pop-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b. But you can already think about du-dink gu-ging. You like melodies and I'm thinking about voicings that work the harmonic interplay with that rhythm

has such an impact. You know, like you answer your phrases. You can displace that. Da-b-b-b-du-bap-du-bap-du-b-da-car. Yeah, and you build up. Who parked the car, who parked the car. Totally. Me. Exactly right. No, but that's the variety.

And the me is the resolution. That's crucial to all that. That's right. And, you know, like you said that, melody, harmony, and rhythm are the three sort of prongs of the Trident of music. Like, those are all applicable to every part of it. So don't think that it's just about soloing or playing a melody or whatever. I mean, when you're accompanying people, those have to be part of it. Absolutely. Good. Well, thank you, Alex, as always. and what should folks do if they want to follow in Alex's footsteps? They need to go to you'll hearat.com anyway,

just to be hanging out over there because you have, you can leave a speak pipe as Alex did at one minute and 25 seconds. He had five seconds to spare. Right, because we have a 90-second limit. Let's be honest. We're not paying for speak pipe. That's right. That's right.

Oh, we're not? Are we? I don't know. Love you speak pipe. But you can go there for that to leave us a voice message. You can leave us a written message. you can leave us to review on your app on your podcast app. You can get a t-shirt as PM is wearing over here.

It's the top of our heads, thank God. I went to a coffee shop this morning with my lovely wife, Kelly, big shout to Kelly. Keep on yoging. But I walked in. I kind of forgot I had this on and the barista. She looked at me and she said, you've got your own shirt on. And I was like, thank you. But she was kind of like, I'm being facetious.

Yeah. I was like, you're a barista. A facetious barista. That would be a good name of a band. Remember yesterday? Facetious barista. The facetious barista. You guys can happen.

I'm giving you that for free. If you want a band name that no one can pronounce, that'd be great. Cetius barista, nice. But it is a little bit like you're wearing the band. But it's not exactly. You're in the band and you're wearing your own t-shirt. No, but if people know who you are, like, I'm just the brie. This is how much you get off.

Your name's on the top. I didn't see that far. Like, I'm Peter Martin. Oh look, here's my credit card. Can I get my coffee? Yeah, go to you'll hear.com so you can get your own t-shirt of you'll hear. Actually, they're good looking t-shirts. They are.

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