You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians - Record Deal Do's and Don'ts

Episode Date: August 21, 2019

On this episode, Peter and Adam answer a listener's question on whether or not it's worth it to pursue a record deal.Get your music featured on You'll Hear It! Send an MP3 recording of one of your tunes to [e-mail], and if we like it, we'll feature it in the credits of an upcoming episode.Like those You'll Hear It shirts Peter shows off on the podcast? Want some YHI swag of your own? Take a visit to our store! Just go to https://teespring.com/stores/open-studioLet us know what you think by leaving a ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ review, or head over to our YouTube channel and leave a comment for this episode.Interested in more jazz advice? Go here to browse our catalog of jazz lessons and courses available for purchase.Follow us on Facebook, Twitter & Instagram at:https://www.facebook.com/heyopenstudiohttps://twitter.com/heyopenstudiohttps://www.instagram.com/heyopenstudio See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Hey, Peter. Yeah. I'd like to sign you to a 12 album deal for $100. And I own the Masters. Okay, is that 100 per record or for the whole deal? The whole deal. Okay, sounds good. Where do I sign?

I'm Adam Anas. And I'm Peter Martin. And you're listening to the You'll Hear at Podcast. Daily Jazz and Record Deal business advice? I don't know. Listen, that's just the climate we're in right now. Really? I think so.

That's kind of generous. That's actually not the climate we're in. It is. It's usually you got to pay to play. That's right. It is now. We got a question from Facebook about this from Sunny. But before we get into that, I just want to say that you'll hear a podcast. It's sponsored by OpenStudio. Go to Open StudioJas.com. Have you seen the new platform? Yes. I built it with you. Remember?

It's amazing, man. A couple other people as well. Lightning fast. We got practice routines. We got quizzes. We got all the courses, of course, we've ever produced. I'm going to take one of those quizzes because I dare say I still have some things to learn. So I don't know. Brazilian jazz drumming, which was just released. I couldn't pass that quiz. Adieu Ribeiro. One of the best drummers have ever heard. heard in my life, and he's got an amazing course that we just released here, lots of transcription. Did you know that Adu is from, Fun fact, the largest, most populous city in South America? No, in the Southern Hemisphere, I should say. Actually, I'm not sure if that's true.

South America, for sure. Southern Hemisphere, maybe. South Palo? Sao Paolo. Sao Paolo. Yeah. It really is incredible. And, you know, the cool thing is if you sign up for the All Access Pass, which, by the way, is like super affordable now.

Yeah, we load. Why do we do that? I don't. We added more content but lowered the price. It's always going to get better and the price has gone lower. But if you become a member of the All Access Pass, you know, for the year, you get everything we have ever made. And then you get everything we will make in the coming year. And there's a lot of good stuff in the pipeline, including, well, there's A-Duce course that just got released last week.

There's a composition course from Edward Simon coming. There's an arranging course from Jeffrey Keese are coming. There's a jazz piano technique course coming from yours truly here. Really? Do we agree to that? Okay, yeah. It's happening, man. Let's do it.

Let's do it. The Trello card is already made. Let's do it. Let's do it. Yeah, and look, we consider us, consider us the All Access Passes like the Netflix of Jazz Instruction, except unlike Netflix, we're lowering the price instead of going up. I don't know why we're doing it. No, we're doing that because every other subscription is going up.

So we're trying to get people a break. We want to get people in the middle. We'll meet in the middle. That's right. Yeah, but check it out. When you get a chance, open studio jazz. Dot com. But today we are talking about how you're going to fund all these wonderful open studio

purchases with your big record deal. Your big time jazz record label deal. Yeah. And the big time record deal goes along with the big time records that are still being released on LP pretty much. That's right. Yeah, exactly right. And cassettes. What do you know about cassettes? I know that that was the first way that I purchased music as a consumer was a cassette. I bought Michael Jackson's Bad at Sam Goody. Wow. And what was that probably seven ninety nine or eight ninety nine? I think it was about I think it was under $10. Yeah. It came in one of those big long plastic. You know, like it had like a, a, uh, a guard on it? Not environmentally friendly.

I think so that you couldn't put it in your code or something. That's right. I remember when the cassette, that's what they were so worried about. They're like because I mean, LPs were harder to steal. Yeah. So the cassette,

they were afraid. So they had to put some non-environmentally friendly packaging. So we got a short message from Sunny and asks, you know, is it worth going after a record deal today or is it better to just play well and build your market yourself? Yeah, and look, I think everybody knows

what we're going to answer on this. Actually, no. Maybe nobody knows what we're going to answer. You know what? I would say why one of the other? First of all, that's my first instinct, is why not do both? Yeah. And I think before this, you know, the question is, is it worth going after a record deal today? Or is it better to just play well and build your market yourself?

Yeah, as you said, does not need to be and or or binary kind of a thing. But I think the bigger question is like, let's always put before us, you know, how do we get better as a jazz player? Yeah. How do we get better as a musician? So this is what we're talking about usually, but I've never been one to be like everything else will fall in place. Yeah. Because not everything always falls in. You've got to put some hustle in for sure.

Yeah. There's plenty of people with the right things and everything. So on the business tip, as we would say, I think that you want to leave your options open. You want to double down on the things that you're good and opportunities that you have and stuff. But you definitely want to leave your options open so you don't want to look at this as an or, you know. Going after a record deal today is not like it was 20 years ago. Yeah, the record industry. like it was 40 years.

The record initiative has changed so much in the past 20 years. And I think, Sunny, I don't know if you would consider like how it is today, even, I don't know, even major artists, not major artists, but certainly major jazz artists, you know, they're self-producing their content.

Yes. And if a label picks it up, well, that's great. But that's, you know, I don't think anybody's banking on a label funding the record from the beginning and having an A&R person. You know what I mean?

None of that is really around anymore, especially for more niche genres like jazz and classical and bluegrass and stuff like that. Yeah. I mean, I think, you know, funding aside, we can maybe talk about that some, well, look, the thing with funding and money and all that, that really only comes into play insofar as you have a quality product with an audience that will buy it. Yeah. Of at least substantial of numbers that we're talking about some money that matters. It's amazing to me how many musicians, younger musicians, especially that I'll hear talking about, well, they're going to try to give me this amount. this. I'm like, how many, you know, and for this many units or whatever, like, do you understand

how many units a great selling jazz album actually is right now? We're not necessarily talking about, I mean, it can get into some somewhat sizable figures, but it's only one piece of the beautiful pie that jazz actually can be. And artistic music, improvise, improvise music, music that people want to come. I mean, there's still people, I don't think there's any less. I think if anything, there's the potential for a bigger market right now for creative music. Things are very fragmented in a way in the entertainment world in general. But that really works in our favor because we are in such a niche thing. That's always worked in the favor of the jazz musician.

So it's very easy to look at it and be like, oh, there's nothing there. But look, people still love music. You know, that's never going to change. I mean, there's ups and downs and recessions and all these kind of things. But like people never are like, oh, I don't like music anymore because of the political client. No. I mean, if you have something good to say and you're willing to say and you're willing to to commit yourself to getting better and to understand the rules of the marketplace,

even in artistic endeavors, there's an audience there. For sure. There's 7 billion people in the world. You can't find a couple thousand. All you need is a couple thousand to follow you. And you, I mean, really, all you is, okay, I'm going to say this. So these young musicians talking about, oh, I want to do this and I want to do that. You know, get 10 people interested in what you do.

Yeah. 10 people. Get one person first, then build to 10 people. I'm talking about real followers. I'm not talking about, oh, I bought Instagram followers or I put a stupid thing out. I'm talking about you put your music anywhere from Instagram to making an LP to making a laser. I don't care what it is. But like you're putting your artistic vision out there and saying I want to share.

I want people to consume what I have. And I want to give them more. I want to give them something edifying that's going to uplift their life that they want to pay me money. And maybe I'm giving it to them for free, free, free, free, free. And then I'll ask for something. But they're going to be like looking to give me money for it because they enjoy it so much. You know, so get 10 people, then move to 40 people. Then maybe you don't have 70 people, you know what I mean?

And so, yeah, can that be done with the record deal? Yeah, but the people who I've seen who have the biggest record deals now, they're very much like, they either built up their social media following or they did a self-produced album first or whatever. Like the climate of that's changing a lot of people like, oh, this is bad. That's good. Video. Video. Video is a huge part of this now.

Right. Video killed radio. What was it? Kill the record labels. Kill the record labels. Yeah. But I mean, what an opportunity to be able to go in and with your phone even if you have to just record yourself playing something. It can be out there for the world to evaluate.

And then maybe you get three people through YouTube that like your thing and you collect their email and you communicate with them. But I mean, we have that opportunity. It's whether or not you're going to do it. Can you sit and wait and find a record deal and like practice really hard and get good? And then maybe there's an intersection with a record executive that gives you a deal. Yes. That's a possibility. But I wouldn't bank on a record.

I would have never banked on it, but especially not now. So it can't be your only energy. Yeah, not now. To answer your question directly, the second half your question is, or is it better to just play well and build your market yourself, you can't get a record deal in the current climate without building the market yourself first. Yeah. Like, that just doesn't happen.

Record labels are looking at, you know, things like your social media followers and whether or not you already have a following. There's no risks being taken or artists being developed from a young age without a following already. Yeah. I mean, I would say, maybe not none, but it's highly unlikely. Very, very unlikely. Definitely not something you'd want to plan around.

Really not, no, no. I mean, I'm thinking about like, think about someone like Joey Alexander, started off with a viral video. You know, like that seems to be a trend of people kind of making their own way through video or some other source and then, or social media. Yeah. And then, you know, I'm thinking about this young French keys player Domi, right? Who just has like an insane social media presence.

Yeah. on Instagram and Facebook and she's like incredible technician and she still she doesn't put out a full album yet right she has all this buzz right so it's like and I know what some people are thinking they're like oh this has all been reduced down to you have to be a teeny bopper Instagram follower and everything and the music is too good for that no these I mean if you want to develop you know your product on on real to real and have it delivered by carrier pigeon there's going to be some some hipsters out that they would love that do that there is a service that does that

that. Something similar. Yeah. No, I mean, it's all good. Like, be innovative. It doesn't, I mean, social media is just a cheaper way in. It's accessible. But it's never been about that. And it's never been about the delivery, LP, social media, video, whatever. I mean, I think that it's good to take high quality content and try to deliver it in as high quality way as possible. I mean, I kind of, you know, that's one of my things with like, I don't care about streaming, whatever, but like when the quality level goes down. Yeah. And there's some like higher quality. I'm kind of more interested in that because the product, when it's great, you know, it's great. It's fun to consume it and edifying when it's delivered great.

But that's another stuff. No, I think that's very relevant to what we're saying here. I think the key to this whole thing, Sunny, is to find the medium. Hey, don't call him Sunny. He might be an older guy. That's his name. Oh, it's fine the medium, the delivery. Hey, Sonny, you better listen to me.

Find that platform that fits with you, that fits with your music. Find the audience, whether that's signing to a major label, if that's kind of artist, you are. That's just the vehicle. Or making, yeah, making a self-prudence. produce mixtape and doing it down a tiny hole in the wall, a release and having 12 fans. That's right. Like that kind of, whatever works for you at the time, do that and do it as. And I love that you said, find, because I think, I don't want to pick Sonny's thing apart too much, but he says, or is it better to just play well and build your market yourself?

You don't need to build a market. You don't need to find your market. They're there. There's people out there already. You don't have to build or manufacture. And sometimes record labels will make it seem like they will do that. They will provide that. And sometimes maybe they can help connect you in a way that you need that.

And that can be a great thing. It can still happen. They can't do it all. No. But we don't necessarily need them to do it all. And I think more what we see are successful collaborations with labels now, especially in the jazz world where the, you know, the marketing, if you think about marketing as being as just connecting people to a product that they need that solves a problem that they have, which is like wanting to hear great contemporary jazz. I mean, not contemporary smooth jazz. You know, music that's being produced now.

I mean, look, if all people wanted was great music, and that's all they needed, then we wouldn't, there would be no market for recording anything because there's already a bunch of great recordings out there. And it'd be cheaper to just connect them with people that are dead and somebody else owns the masters do. But people still want to, like, hear something, follow somebody, wow, this up and coming, whatever, and then maybe catch them light. Like, it's all a piece of the puzzle and the story that we have to tell.

And there's a lot of opportunity out there. And I think if you get this kind of a mindset, you start to see what the possibilities are. And then the record deal is a possibility. But building it yourself and marketing yourself is in the meantime or some combination or one of the other. Everybody kind of, you can see examples of your own journey. But it should take some pressure off to know that you don't have to build your market. You just have to find your market. That's right.

And for goodness sake, make sure the music's good first. Oh, of course. Well, we did say that first. You got to have something to say. Yeah, yeah. It's very hard to sell or to market. I mean, look, that's what you, first you have to. market and connect and then you have an opportunity to sell something i think a lot of times

we want to because as musicians and artists like we don't have a full understanding how this stuff works and we don't want to so we want to be like i just want to make the music and the record label will be the ones who sell it for me but generally there needs to be a step in between the marketing is and finding that product and market fit is about getting people like it's so much more exciting when you can connect directly at least with those first 10 people then maybe 50 maybe oh i can't handling more. I need a light label. I need a publicist. I need a manager to do the connections and I'll just produce. That's fine. But at that beginning, you can start to actually understand what, I mean, you did this really good with your group with the four-for-fourth, like you built that as

an organic thing in the audience and then it got kind of bigger and then, but you also got some feedback, right, at those early times, you know. So I mean, it's, it's all about doing this in an organic way and being engaged and being mindful and intentional. Have you noticed that we get very fired up when we talk about the record industry? I've noticed. I've noticed that we're I don't know why they be. Well, because we're kind of launching a record label, too. So, yeah, well, look out for that. Thanks, Sonny, for the question.

It's great. And it's, I mean, the thing with this question is, if you go back and listen to this episode two years from now, it could all be different. You know what I mean? It could be wrong. It could be wrong now. Maybe it'll get right.

It could be. I mean, it's just how the landscape is. It's always shifting. So come back and see us again. But yeah, find those 10 people. That's, that's like the key. That's the hardest, but it's the most, it's the most, those are your loyal, long time.

Like, those are the last. ones that are going to tell you what they like and what they know that you can really build a career on. You know what we haven't had in a while? What? An outgoing song sent to Andrew Kitchen to put at the end of an episode. Do we have time to do that today? I mean, I'm just going to mention it.

If you have a tune that you would like to hear played at the end of a you'll hear episode. It's good. Please don't send us crap. Andrew is tired of crap. Actually, you know, we get more good than we get bad. We do. Send it to Andrew at OpenStudio Network.com. And, yeah, maybe your tune to be at the end of an episode.

Not today, though. You know, today is. We're doing the classic, right? Motion in Motion. That's right. From Peter Martin Trio. Every day I'm making bank from myself. I'm paying myself for this every day.

It's great. Until tomorrow. You'll hear it.